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Subscribe to RSSIn an apparent reversal from his past statements, former Florida Republican Gov. Jeb Bush said Monday that his immigration reform plan would "fall short" of offering a path to citizenship for illegal immigrants living in the United States -- a key provision being put forward by the bipartisan group leading reform efforts on Capitol Hill.
The former Florida governor talks about his new book, "Immigration Wars," in which he offers his own prescription for comprehensive immigration reform, and says Republicans need to work harder to appeal to fast-growing minority voters.
“Our proposal is a proposal that looks forward, and if we want to create an immigration policy that's going to work, we can't continue to make illegal immigration an easier path than legal immigration,” Bush said on NBC’s TODAY Show.
Bush -- an outspoken proponent of GOP outreach to Latinos who has previously embraced a path to citizenship -- said that he backs measures to allow illegal immigrants to become residents of the United States if they meet certain criteria. But he argued that the possibility of full citizenship would merely encourage more illegal immigrants to make their way inside the nation’s borders.
“There has to be some difference between people who come here legally and illegally,” he said. “It's just a matter of common sense and a matter of the rule of law. If we're not going to apply the law fairly and consistently, then we're going to have another wave of illegal immigrants coming into the country.”
Related: Jeb Bush: I won't rule out 2016 White House run 'but I won't declare today'
Bush’s rejection of that goal appears to be a turnaround for the possible presidential prospect. In a June 2012 interview with Charlie Rose, he acknowledged that his support for a path to citizenship placed him at odds with many in his party.
“You have to deal with this issue. You can’t ignore it,” he said during that interview. “And so, either a path to citizenship -- which I would support and that does put me probably out of the mainstream of most conservatives -- or a path to legalization, a path to residency of some kind.”
In a January op-ed in the Wall Street Journal, Bush and Clint Bolick, his co-author on a new book about immigration, wrote that opportunities for citizenship strengthen America.
Former Florida governor Jeb Bush talks with TODAY's Matt Lauer about the sequester cuts will have on the economy and national security and strategies for improving our immigration system.
"America's immigration system should provide opportunities for people who share the country's core values to become citizens, thereby strengthening the nation as have countless immigrants have before them," he said. (In the same op-ed, the pair also wrote that "amnesty promotes illegal immigration.")
Bush's voiced opposition to full citizenship rights also puts the former governor – and brother of former President George W. Bush – to the right of Republican senators like John McCain, Marco Rubio and Jeff Flake, all members of the Senate’s bipartisan “Gang of Eight” currently tackling immigration reform legislation.
That group’s proposal would offer “probationary legal status” for illegal immigrants who register with the federal government, pass a background check and pay back taxes and fines. After certain border security criteria are met, those individuals would become eligible to apply for green cards and – eventually – the ability to seek full citizenship.
Bush appeared on the TODAY show to promote his book “Immigration Wars: Forging an American Solution,” which hits shelves tomorrow.
NBC's Mark Murray contributed to this report.
This story was originally published on Mon Mar 4, 2013 1:18 PM EST
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Isn't this the guy that just all but announced he will run in 2016? Someone really ought to cue him in that the Romney strategy of feeding your base with rhetoric you don't believe doesn't get you elected to the presidency. Just ask the 47%.
That's the way the GOP Cult operates by giving into the tea bag terrorists, and why they will continue to lose the office of President.
RedDevPS
Yes; Red
He is also married to a Latina. There goes the "Party of the Stupid" so much for re-branding. I'm surprised I never thought Jeb would go the way of the dinosaur.
It almost worked for Romney, remember when everyone declared he won his first debate with President Obama, by completely reversing himself?
@Bev
Perhaps he is going to try a blend of the Romney strategy and that of his brother - tell the base lies and lie about WMDs. Do two wrongs make a right? I believe they do - they make right-wing zealots.
I swear, all of the Bush's are brain dead at birth. George Bush worked with John McCain on a proposal that included a pathway to citizenship when he was in office. Jeb wanted basically the same program - until now. The GOP is totally the most ignorant group of idiots in existence! You have to fail basic IQ test - very badly - in order to be accepted!
I see the GOP will be even less relevant in 2014 than it was in 2012! And, yet they'll wonder what happened!
I swear it's in the GOP handbook to make sure that you flip flop as often as possible.
After watching the 2012 race Jeb knows that he must start out far to the Right or never get the nomination … he must be much more Conservative than either his brother, father or Mitt Romney.
The question is, if he wins the nomination, can he move to the middle fast enough, soon enough to get the independents, Regan Democrats, Hispanics and not lose the Right?
Of course he is actually hoping that immigration reform is over (law) before he has to run because no matter how it gets done he can say … I would have done it differently.
I seldom agree with anything said by any of the Bush's, however, I totally agree with his comment:
This was true when Reagan made it easy and the belief that it will happen again is no doubt a motivating factor in illegal immigration today.
Bush is using the Bill Clinton strategy of going way over to the Kool-Aid base to get the nomination, working his way back to the middle to get elected and move even further from the base to govenor. That worked out pretty good. I like it when he stabbed the base in the heart at the state of the union and told them '"The era of big government is over".
What happened to rebranding of the GOP? Next he'll be in favor of self-deportation.
His last name is Bush. That tells you everything you need or want to know.
Its a lot smaller now, than when any Bush was in office.. By far..
flip-flopping so that he can pander to the right
Bush’s rejection of that goal appears to be a turnaround for the possible presidential prospect. In a June 2012 interview with Charlie Rose, he acknowledged that his support for a path to citizenship placed him at odds with many in his party.
So this means he is running. Another Bush....
Well Jeb....I don't see a path to the Presidency for you then.
You're the illegals! Moment Native American confronts protesters fighting immigration
Native American Shuts Down Immigration Protest
http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&v=2utsjsWOWUA&feature=endscreen
I think that Bush's wife Paloma might make a big difference in winning over hispanic voters. If Bush happen to win she would be the first Hispanic first lady.
Jeb says:
Do tell, Jeb. Your wife Columbia was born and raised in Mexico.....her path "marry a moneyed, preferable politician"........
There's the path!
This is why Republican immigration reforms are all doomed to fail. None of them will acknowledge the absolute necessity of making legal immigration quicker and easier. Without that, none of their efforts to "secure the border" will amount to anything, and there will continue to be a constant influx of immigrants crossing the border outside of the system.
You can't fix this problem without addressing the cause and the symptoms together, and you are delusional if you think you can solve the cause by just "completing the dang fence". The only solutions are either to remove barriers and make the legal process much more open, or remove incentive by helping to invest in Mexico and make life south of the border comparable in opportunity, security, and affluence as life north of the border. The Republican base and party are fundamentally opposed to any movement on either approach, which means their proposals just amount to maintaining the status quo.
Sorry, Jeb's wife is named Columba.
Jeb Bush is making the distinction between citizenship and residency, which I'm not sure most Americans understand. Right now, the U.S. has neither. It's not just a mess, it is a costly mess, since taxpayers support this insanity, either directly through half measures of a myriad of freebies and welfare social services subsidies or through law enforcement and all it takes to deal with 20 million illegals. That millions of illegals submit a 1040 every year, using a tax ID # instead of SS#, and then get money back from the U.S. Treasury/taxpayers by simply claiming litters of kids via Earned Income Tax Credit ought boil the blood of every American citizen. There is nothing about the current system that works for America and everything about it that works for broken countries like Mexico and those in Central America. It is dangerous and stupid, lowering the quality of life throughout every city and town in every state.
But this isn't about the GOP or Democratic Party. This is about how corporations and businesses have been the ones to create a system that openly allowed in waves of ready made unskilled low wage labor since the 1960s in order to undercut U.S. workers, unions and overall keep wages low. Both the GOP and Democrats are backed by the Chamber of Commerce and Wall St. That's who has profited from this insane system that no other country on the planet would tolerate.
HEY JEB . . .
(1) try running (against Hillary!) on that platform! you thinking you're going to spend the $100,000,000 it would cost to deport 11 million people, some of whom have been here 50 years, and many of who are the abuelos of the Dreamers? good luck with that.
(2) We've had more enough of the Bush Dynasty, so on second thought, you can just stay in FL for the next 10-20 years or so.
.
FORWARD! HILLARY 2016! (and meanwhile, exile the Tea-baggers in '14!) :-)
With Jeb Bush's sudden embrace of the TP after having the opposite view for years, the implosion of the GOP is nearly complete, there's not a moderate left in the bunch.
What a ridiculous statement Jeb Bush made, that allowing illegals who have been law-abiding, hard working contributors to our economy to become citizens will encourage more to come here. Plenty came here before Reagan was president, during and after. The whole point of total Immigration Reform (which Reagan did not do) is to put in place laws that make it easier for people to come here legally.
Instead of shipping jobs overseas to a communist enemy, it makes more sense to invest in Mexico to help a democratic government become more economically sound.
My current theory is that both Palin & Romney were only intended to be "fluffers for the base" while the sha-bow-pow script was being finalized and the stage set for the big scene... "Jebediah Does Washington" is the working title until they come up with some clever way to work in his last name.
They're already strategically leaking scenes to excite the lackeys.
If you think this post is "out there"... consider that you also live in a world where a rampantly racist white minority would actually proffer another Bush...
America his no pathway for Jeb, personally I think hes the biggest loser of the Bush clan !
Illegal means illegal.
I say we seal our borders, build a much bigger, better fence, kick out all the illegals, and just deal with legal immigrants who did things the right way.
No one will remember these comments in 3 years. especially if major immigration reform is dealt with before then, which seems likely to be the signature accomplishment of Obama's second term.
Jeb WHO?
His Jebberish ... I never pay attention to.
So when Democrats change their mind/position, it's called evolving, but when a Republican does it, it's flip flopping. Gotta love the hypocrisy!
There is no conceivable path to the Whitehouse for any Republican in the next 20 years.
The demographic shift that is coming is huge. And the incomers are going Democratic by a 2-to-1 margin.
The GOP is going to be the last of the Whigs.
.
(Sound of calliope playing carnival music in the background)
"Heya, heya, heya! Step right up, ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls! Step right up and win, win win!
"Guess Jeb's position on an issue and win a prize! Everyone's a winner, 'cuz everyone's right, no matter what you guess! Yowza, yowza, yowza, only a quarter!!"
Jeb Bush?
Was he the Floridian who disappeared in a giant sink-hole under his bedroom? So he re-emerged?
Pigotry - LOL - I believe the one who disappeared in the giant sink-hole was Romney and unfortunately for all - he did reappear - but hopefully he'll slide back into the deep dark once again! (My sympathy for the man who actually DID disappear. How frightening for everyone around!)
Seeking...
I agree with you...on this point.
He'll never see the president's office, the last thing this country needs is another Bush in office.
This is why Republican immigration reforms are all doomed to fail. None of them will acknowledge the absolute necessity of making legal immigration quicker and easier. Without that, none of their efforts to "secure the border" will amount to anything, and there will continue to be a constant influx of immigrants crossing the border outside of the system.
Obama's immigration 'reform' sure makes it easier. "Hey, if you make it across the border, we'll give you citizenship!".
While I absolutely despise the Bush's, I do agree with his statement that illegal immigration should not be easier than legal immigration. Too bad he doesn't have to balls or fortitude to stick with that concept though, he's just pandering.
Illegal means illegal.
I say we seal our borders, build a much bigger, better fence, kick out all the illegals, and just deal with legal immigrants who did things the right way.
American Girl, we're actually in agreement on something! :) I work with about a dozen LEGAL immigrants from India, and they are pretty unhappy about this 'immigration reform' that's being talked about for the illegals. These men and women have taken the time to learn our language, get green cards, and go through the (way too) lengthy program to become legal citizens. I honestly do feel for those trying to do it right, the process does need to be streamlined a LOT.
On the issue of immigration, I am a bit more in agreement with GW Bush who has been more progressive than Jeb of Jebbrish Fame.
TO: AlexM-3929653 who wrote:
[Illegal means illegal. I say we seal our borders, build a much bigger, better fence, kick out all the illegals, and just deal with legal immigrants who did things the right way.]
Who woulda thunk it!
That's why I'm an Independent, because I have views that cross the line of both parties.
Tomorrow we'll probably be arguing again.
First, I saw this morning Jeb Bush saying
My immediate reaction was to cringe in horror at the thought of another Bush in the WH. Then, I saw the following enlighted statement:
My reaction to this second statement is to make me think completely different about JB. It is encouraging that someone has the courage, integrity, and decency to offer something other than a rank and insulting pander to the immigration lawbreakers and their insufferable advocates!
A recent Reuters' poll found that the majority of Americans want either most of all ILLEGAL FOREIGN NATIONALS DEPORTED! We simply cannot afford to support ILLEGALS, who are largely poor and uneducated. Further, it is insulting to LEGAL immigrants to create a scheme by which ILLEGALS have an easier time breaking the law that the LEGAL immigrants have in complying with our laws! Rewards and special treatment for immigration lawbreaking is WRONG and UNACCEPTABLE. This scheme, continuously promoted by the Obama Administration, is patently unfair and objectionable to fair-minded AMERICAN CITIZENS.
A GOVERNMENT WHICH REFUSES TO ENFORCE ITS OWN LAWS IS INTOLERABLE!
Why do lilberals support criminals and felons so much?
Are you bashing Bush because you are ignorant liberals, or because of his position on immigration?
They are illegal aliens for a reason... they BROKE the LAW sneaking into the country.
What is the point of Homeland Security and Citizenship & Immigration Services, if we allow people to simply bypass it to enter the country???
Why would liberals care that illegal aliens ROB children of their education budget and non-taxpayers of health care and other benefits and ROB taxpayers of their hard-earned money? Why would they care when they don't work or contribute to the system.
These people are LEECHES. They are sucking our tax revenue. A lot like liberals... I guess that is why you support them so passionately. Rather than solve the problem, you want to allow more in which screws the immigrants that followed the rules and waited years for a chance to enter our country.
Our lack of enforcement with illegal immigrants puts national security at risk, hurts our economy, robs Americans of jobs and benefits, health care and education, welfare and other resources.
States waste 85B a year just to allow a bunch of felon illegal aliens to stay in the country for FREE.
And you are the same morons that cry about 85B in sequester cuts. Send them home!!!
DHS has already released thousands of illegal aliens, some of them with multiple felony counts. If you are going to release them, why not drive them to the border first???
There is no way the illegals will pay back taxes or fines. Some of them are making 1K a week tax free. Suddenly, they are going to take 1/2 to become citizens??? No way. They will go home and live like kings.
Arrest them all. Put them to work building "The Great Wall Of Texas". Then deport them all. No more citizenship to babies born in the US.
To Pig and Beverly, I'll agree to allow one illegal to become a citizen for every two liberals to leave this country
Jeb, you should go away and stay away. We know what you did. You will never be Persident.
Yep...Jeb Bush has no chance because he wants to follow the rule of law. Was it Obama that said "We are a nation of laws"...HA HA HA HA HA HA HA HA...
Not as long as the liberals support criminals....illegal immigrants, dope smokers, etc.
And people wonder why America is failing and our kids are stupid and falling behind other nations. Just look at the changes in society. It tells the whole story. No one has to follow any rules or laws. If someone says anything to you, just scream racist, bigot, or Teabagger at them. And if you really want to insult them, tell them they watch Fox News!!!!
Not another Bush......please!!!!!! jeb is just another con-servative nut job.
It goes 100% against common sense to give illegals any kind of reward, citizenship or any other kind of legal status. Last time we were told about 1.3 million illegals would be rewarded. It turned out to be about 3 million. That gave the incentive for the estimated 11 million, and that's likely a minimal number like before, to break in to the country and wait for your reward.
Doing this again will only start the cycle over again.
Was it Einstein that said insanity is doing the same thing over and expecting different results?
Streamline legal immigration. Make it flexible so that we allow in what the economy can absorb without affecting American's jobs.
A report I heard on NPR said only 1/3 of immigrants coming to this country are coming here to work. The other 2/3rds are getting in via fast track immigration designed to keep families together.
The U.S. cannot save the third world.
cjbak... and conserving in this day and age is a bad thing?? Stupidity is way worse, buddy... way worse...
Gee, someone who actually wants to enforce the law, instead of the clowns currently in charge.
.
Bush's voiced opposition to full citizenship rights also puts the former governor – and brother of former President George W. Bush – to the right of Republican senators like John McCain, Marco Rubio and Jeff Flake, all members of the Senate’s bipartisan “Gang of Eight” currently tackling immigration reform legislation.
So much for his possible run in 2016. The guy already is in "has-been" status.
We don't need more people taking opposition to bipartisan politics in D.C. We need to have more people toward the center of the spectrum rather than full blown pegged to the right/left. Gridlock in D.C. has become the norm in D.C. because we have so many too far to the right or left.
There should be more middle ground so these politicians can get things done that benefit the people that elected them and those that may vote for them the following time around.
We need another Bush in the White House like we need another hole in our economy.
So any comment on the actual issue? Oh wait I forgot. Posters like you just hop on here to bash the person and don't actually like to discuss the issue in a logical and reasonable way.
FYI I posted about the issues further down. Feel free to actually debate the topic.
nomoresameo, well said.
Bush's comments shows that he supports creating a permanent second class group of people living in this country; one which can never really become Americans and participate in the democrtic process. In my view Jeb Bush joins the ranks of the rest of the GOPTPers who see citizenship of minoritiesas as a threat to the GOP; conservatives also talk about repealing the section of the Constitution which says that any baby born in this country, regardless of the citizenship status of the parents, is a US Citizen.
BostonAccountant, I believe that Jeb Bush the person becomes as much a part of the topic as does his flip/flop on the subject of a pathway to citizenship. Bush was for it before he was against it. The last thing this country needs is another Bush in the White House; just the name itself reminds us of his brother who was a total disaster for this country.
For some reason I just can't see Jeb in the White House with that crazy Mexican wife of his, what a boozer !
Jeb Bush's next idea: Bring back indentured servitude.
If you grant a "pathway to citizenship" for illegals they won't have any respect for American laws.
They don't anyway. They broke the laws getting here.
If we really want more immigration, increase the immigrations limits, make it easier to apply and get approved.
As I understand, the path to citizenship means that once that person becomes a legal resident in this country, he or she would have to wait 5 years to apply for citizenship as any legal resident in this country. By eliminating this clause for illegals we are creating a second class of citizens, those who cannot apply for citizenship. So, now we are going to target them again, those who can or cannot become citizens. You want to clear the issue? Simple, pay the back taxes you owe the government, and once you get your permanent residence, then you start to count five years (which is what the law requires) to apply for citizenship. I don't understand how people think that we're going to skip the process and given them automatic citizenship.
TO: justiceforall-2038290 who wrote:
I would think that someone who commits a felony could not be eligible to be a United States Citizen.
Entering into the United States illegally is a felony.
Not to worry, there are enough Latinos who want to come here so that there'll be no shortage.
I just don't believe we should award illegal behavior because, as we saw with Ronald Reagan when he granted amnesty, it only doubled the number of illegal aliens coming into the country.
American Girl: Then you are creating a new class of people, those who are residents but are denied their opportunity to become citizen. What about those who were brought here as a child and had lived their entire life in this country? Should we punish them too for the fault of their parents? There are 11+ million illegals in this country and not all the stories are the same. We cannot stereotype a group (And believe me we do, we think that all the illegal immigrants come from south of the border) and punish broadly all of them. I am not talking about amnesty, I am talking of filing up the proper paperwork, to pay the fines and restitution in taxes owed to the government, and once they pay what they owe to the US, only then they can become permanent residents. The minors fall under a different category, because they did not commit a crime themselves, they did not have a choice whether to move or not. And allow them to become citizens when they are really willing to adopt this country. I saw many 'legal residents' (who came with all their paperwork in order) applying for citizenship only for fear to lose the benefits they had...
But see therein lies part of the problem.
A good majority (last study showed 78%) of illegal immigrants are on some type of social service program.
They can't afford to support their family what makes you think they will EVER come up with the money to pay back taxes, etc? Especially those that may have been in the country 10 years or more?
Never going to happen. These people will register, and the clock will start ticking and no one will keep track (just like they don't now) and these people will still be here in 15 more years, never having met the citizenship path and still sponging off of our government without paying tax dollars in to support the programs that they live off of daily.
And while I understand that "all situations" are different. I have little empathy for what illegal immigration has done to our country. Unfortunately children pay for the sins of their parents. The parents chose to break the law and everyone involved is illegal, no matter how you slice it (unless they were born a US citizen).
They go back where they came from. The influx of illegal immigrants (and I realize they are not ALL from Mexico) has resulted in parts of our country being turned into exactly what they fled from--poverty, crime ridden and welfare supported. In some southern states (California, Texas, Arizona, New Mexico, parts of Florida, etc.), they have bi-lingual signs, are being overrun by people from other countries who are not here legally and refuse to assimilate to the country that puts food on their table and a roof over their head--that's just plain damn disrespectful. They would feel the same way if I invaded their country and then didn't even bother to learn the language.
They have become a dredge on our society and an anchor on our social service programs to the point that native citizens are suffering.
Sorry...I support US first. They can move back to where they came from and try to better their own country...they are only dragging ours down.
@ Kimbo47
As the illegal immigrants have ignored & disrespected our laws by coming to the U.S. illegally, what makes people think they will respect and abide by our laws and pay back taxes, fines and/or whatever else that may be expected in order to apply for citizenship? They've been laughing at our laws for years, have blatantly marched in protest against laws some of the states have passed, or tried to pass and will continue to do so while draining our social service programs and their kids getting free education.
And don't expect them to learn to speak English. What you can expect is our having to learn to speak Spanish which is already a requisite for employment for some jobs in places where there is a heavy influx of Mexicans.
I have nothing against any particular race, born in the US or not, but if the illegals can so blatantly turn their back on our laws & becoming a legal citizens, which they've done for years, then they should just turn around and go back to their native country. As stated, we don't need them dragging our country down.
@Justice You say that we cant apply the rule of law so broadly in the case of 11 million illegals. I pose this question, is not our law written in black and white? Is justice not supposed to be blind? I don't care if a kid was brought over here illegally the day after he/she was born. It is an illegal entry. If my dad stole a car and gave it to me, am I allowed to keep the car after he is arrested? No. The law was still broken and even though I am innocent because I didn't know the car was stolen, its still a crime and I should not be able to benefit from that crime. Its only logical.
justiceforall...you have a very short-sighted view of the situation. Take Mexico, where the majority of illegals are from, for instance.
Mexicans getting into the U.S. is of vital importance to the Mexican government and is the reason they openly and overtly encourage and assist the illegals. The vast majority of those crossing the border are uneducated/under-educated, poor peasants that the Mexican government does not want to be responsible for. By dumping their poor peasants in the U.S., they get multiple rewards. They no longer have to take responsibility for them in the form of welfare or medical or educating their children for free. And one of the primary rewards is the tens of billions of U.S. dollars the illegals send back to Mexico every year to take care of their families.
Tell me, what incentive do the citizens of Mexico, or any other 3rd world country, have to fix their own country when the option to bail and go to a better country is openly available? Do you not realize that by allowing these illegals to be rewarded that you are condemning future generations in their country of origin to the same fate? Why do you only care about the illegals here and now and not future generations?
Countries with the widest gap between the rich and the poor - By Michael B. Sauter and Charles B. Stockdale (http://bottomline.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/12/07/9276634-countries-with-the-widest-gap-between-the-rich-and-the-poor)
Mexico has one of the highest rates of income inequality. Among all OECD countries, Mexico has the lowest amount of public social expenditure as a percentage of GDP. It also has the lowest unemployment benefit recipient rates. Finally, the country has the lowest minimum wages as a percentage of average wages.
Jeb Bush, by virture of his last name is screwed up. No one should listen to him or care what he has to say.
Adler, that's brilliant. Guilt by family inheritance. It's like shooting the czar's children as punishment for the abuses of the czar. Jeb is not W. Far from it. Get you mind out of the partisan gutter.
The problem Jeb has is he doesn't have a brother in office to rig the election outcome for him!!!
Jeb sounds like W....to me.
Good ole Jeb....He really should think hard about getting in....the name "Bush" brings back a host of evil actions.....starting with Gov Jeb handing his state, FL, over to his brother Dubya!
Obama sounds like Carter to me.
TO: joe mota-7760501 who wrote:
Jeb wasn't far enough from George "Curveball" Bush to disenfranchise Florida Voters in order to pretend his brother had an edge he didn't have.
And Jeb was so far from his brother to not use his office to help GWB overthrow the election.
When the final count came in, we learned that Bush didn't win Florida at all so he actually lost the election, but was appointed by the United States Supreme Court instead.
sorry American Girl that's all bull sh!t I live in Florida and remember what happened. First the dem. pigs sued so our overseas military vote would not be counted. Fact!!!They lost every recount, even to this day!! Then they wanted a recount in only heavily dem. counties. They tried to go behind close doors to steal the vote but the people busted in to stop the thievery. It was the scousa who sealed the deal. If only Al could have won his own state he would have won!
TO: scottyconner who wrote:
I still have the front page newspaper articles.
There were also several groups who continued the recount even after the time to do so had expired.
Trying to say that Bush won the recount is just an outright lie.
The 2000 The Election Dispute: November 8 - January 20 (long ...
Several early edition newspapers had gone to print after Florida had been .... (where Gore narrowly won) if Gore did not withdraw his challenges. ... Gore would eventually be declared the winner of the state by some 5,000 votes. [Google]
In a June 2012 interview with Charlie Rose, he acknowledged that his support for a path to citizenship placed him at odds with many in his party.
______
Breaking news Bush brother will run. Jeb is courting the right fringe now for 2016. Sure won't help his chances once you get past the Fox moderated bash festivals that they call GOP primary debates.
_____
In a January op-ed in the Wall Street Journal, Bush and Clint Bolick, his co-author on a new book about immigration, wrote that opportunities for citizenship strengthen America.
"America's immigration system should provide opportunities for people who share the country's core values to become citizens, thereby strengthening the nation as have countless immigrants have before them," he said. (In the same op-ed, the pair also wrote that "amnesty promotes illegal immigration.")
___
Big change for Bush brother in only one month's time. His previously reasonable approach must not have been testing well in his fundraising schemes. Really unfortunate that this guy may put pressure on Rubio, Graham and McCain to balk at real comprehesive reform. I respect this guy less now, even his bumbling brother was right about immigration reform. Another win for the small minority who wishes to live in the past. Another loss for everyone else.
Well, I was just saying that I thought Jeb was pretty moderate on some of the issues and then like New England weather...
I too believe someone got to him explaining the realities of playing ball on the Republican field.
Hey guys, do not take any lessons from the previous election! Thank you...
Finally someone with the balls to create a significant penalty for those who KNOWINGLY broke US laws!
If you are in the US illegally and are not a child that was brought here by your parents, then you should NEVER be allowed to be a US citizen. With immigration reform you should be able to get permanent residency, but citizenship should not be granted to people who knowingly broke our laws.
If you are in the US illegally and you CHOOSE to identify yourself, leave and then come back via legal means, then the restriction can be lifted.
It's about time that law-breakers had a meaningful consequence for committing their crimes.
While I was not a GWB fan and would not want another Bush in the White House, at least the idea has some merit.
Agree 100%.
So now we create another group: You will have the legal residents and 'those' who can reside here but never apply to citizenship? Really???
@justiceforall-2038290
It's called compromise. The Left gets what they want because they'll be protecting the immigrants from prosecution and deportation, and the Right gets what they want because they'll have a cheap, newly-legal workforce without the privilege of citizenship.
The exploitation of an disadvantaged underclass is an unfortunate but time-honored tradition in Western culture going all the way back to at least ancient Greece.
The Bush family has got to be one of the greediest of families for power. They have more than enough money, but all they want is power, power, power because they're one of the "aristocratic" families who believe they deserve to tell America how to live because they have money.
Go away, Bushes -- all of you -- including the one running for office in Texas....
Kinda like the Kennedys?
Nope, nothing like the Kennedys. And how come W is the only one in his entire family that talks like a hick?
Exactly like the Kennedies. Ted Kennedy, rest his soul (FINALLY - THANK GOD!!!) was so greedy that he clung to his Senate seat knowing that he had brain cancer instead of stepping aside. He would not let it go and an equally evil man, Deval Patrick, had to push legislation through to change the laws in MA so that he could appoint an interim senator just to help push the healthcare legislation through that big fat dumb drunk greedy murderous Ted Kennedy almost screwed up. If you want to talk greed for power, look no forward than the arrogant drunkards known as the Kennedy clan, a family that built their fortune on illegal activities and who have skirted the law ever since. Robert got himself killed by double crossing the mafia who helped get him in to power. If ever a family deserved to be wiped out of existence it is the Kennedies!
SJ23 - if ever a person was the embodiment of evil - it's you. What a disgusting post. Shows what a total low life YOU are!
Really SeekingSanity? The type of lowlife that votes their own post up?
FACT: Ted Kennedy left a woman behind in a car that he had crashed off of a bridge
FACT: Ted Kennedy refused to relinquish his senate seat. This nearly impacted the vote on healthcare reform which was supposedly his baby. It caused the governor of MA to need to change the law because Kennedy did not step down.
FACT: The Kennedies got their money bootlegging alcohol.
FACT: Several members of the Kennedy family have had legal problems due to abusiveness towards women
How does speaking ill of such people make me evil? You are the embodiment of stupidity.
Oh yeah - I voted up my own post - 3 times. Tell me exactly how I did that? Again, you're disgusting!
Ted Kennedy was LOVED by the people of his state which is why he was re-elected. He did exactly what the people he represented wanted him to do.
Bootlegging alcohol - wow! We just all want to hang onto that crime, right?
Let's talk about the little GOPers who are still serving but who abused their wives - in one form or another? Oh, but that doesn't fit your agenda, does it?
Again, you are total filth. Oh, and I don't need to vote up my posts! Try again!
Oh, and Robert was killed because of morons like you who don't believe all people should be treated equally! It WAS NOT because of the mafia!
Once again, you're the embodiment of stupidity. As per voting your posts up, you are voting it up as soon as you post. No one is logging in and liking your left wing ramblings that quickly. I live in MA, dumb dumb, and I don't love Ted Kennedy. I'm glad he's dead.
As far as their fortune, they shirked the rules of society to make it. Bootlegging was illegal at the time, and by making their money doing so, they showed they did not care about the law. It would be as if crack were legalized some day. If you are dealing it now, you are still breaking the law and still show that you don't care about following the laws of the United States, but you aren't seeking any sort of logic, you are seeking to serve your own points with your liberal stupidity. As far as right wingers that are abusive toward women, me condemning a piece of crap like you or Ted Kennedy does not mean that I condone what a right winger does, but you are too stupid to grasp that because you are only interested in your own self serving logic. Let me ask you this, how well did Kennedy's dream of universal healthcare serve Mary Jo? Are you aware that the Kennedies fought the wind farms off the coast of Massachusetts (which are BARELY visible) because they said they ruin their compound's view of the ocean? Oh, but I guess the environment doesn't mean @!$%# to a dumb ass liberal if it goes against their multi million dollar view. The power needs and the help they could bring to the environment are outweighed by rich dumb liberals.
SJ23 - sorry to burst your very small little bubble but once I post I move on to the next thread. You apparently are soooooo insecure you stick around and try to vote yourself up. That's on you bub - not me.
Again, you post nothing but your own ignorance but go ahead - it's all you've got!
Seeking Sanity why don't you read up on your Liberal Hero Kennedy since your ignorance is apparently enormous
http://www.snopes.com/politics/politicians/tedkennedy.asp
TO: BostonAccountant who wrote:
Only 1 Kennedy was POTUS, whereas there have been 2 Bush presidents already (father & son), both were bad, so now Republicans want to try a 3rd Bush just to see if Republicans keep doing the same thing the same way, maybe they will come up with a different result.
Typical Democrat politician.
Jeb is absolutely right on here.....
~We can't continue to make illegal immigration an easier path than legal immigration.~
Did Jeb change his mind? Of course he did and you call that 'flip flopping.'
Let Barry change his on gay marriage and he's applauded for 'evolving.'
What a bunch of party blind tools here.
Lest - yes, you are a blind tool! Nice to see you admit it!
Lame reply, try again.
Obviously you haven't achieved your handle. Keep working on it.
Lest - Jeb only changed his position to appease the hard core right wing of the party so he could get the nomination. If he gets the nomination he will immediately tack left and agree to the current immigration reform. Surely you can see it.
Just like Obama changed HIS mind to get votes....capiche?
Lest - yes, seeking sanity in the Republican party but as you and others prove daily, there is absolutely NONE to be found!
He didn't evolve. He is appeasing the Tea Party. You don't really believe him do you?
Lest and Damnyou:
Nice try, but not quite. Obama evolved. Jeb either devolved or his mind was changed by unintelligent design. I think its the latter.
The GOP's new strategy to win more Hispanic votes. Good luck with that, Jeb.
A President that evolves WITH his country over time as opposed to a politician that evolves along with his own partisan wind of the minority... ANd of course a bunch of staunch lackeys that can't tell the difference.
One serves the Nation
The other serves your handlers.
Chick Binder,
You and the rest of the left wing media make me sick. Romney kicked Obama's ass in the debate and the best anyone can come up with was "well...Romney said binder full of women..." So nit-picky it is ridiculous. If you actually started analyzing every word Boomboom says (especially those that he managers to stutter out without his teleprompter) you'd see what sort of a boob you voted for. What boomboom did in terms of gay marriage was to pander to his party, no different than what you are accusing Jeb of here. Boomboom is the worst president in history. He's judged kindly now by his lazy constituents that want hand outs, but he's getting this country in to a historic mess.
SJ23 - Romney beat President Obama in ONE debate - only one. The best man won and is our President. Get over the fact that Republicans only run loosers - one after another.
The teleprompter nonsense is just that - nonsense. Every modern day President has used a teleprompter. You couldn't tell George Bush used one because he had so much trouble reading the big words.
And, the WORST President is and will continue to be George W. Bush. I wasn't aware he was referred to as Boomboom but it's the perfect fit!
The stupidity about handouts is precisely why Republicans are losers - you fit right in!
They run loosers? Really? They run people that are more loose? Should we start running tighters instead, you dumb lib? And how is condemning the state of this country and that every liberal loser, like yourself, is looking for a hand out. This country was not founded to be one of hand outs. It was founded to be one of opportunity, and for every loser liberal that gets a hand out that they did not work for, an opportunity was taken away from someone that did work for it. The stupid liberals looking for and wanting to give hand outs are the downfall of this country. If people like you make up 51% of the population no wonder this country is going to hell in a hand basket!
Sorry guys.
But Obama has flip-flopped on so many issues over his tenure that he reminds me of a catfish on a dry dock.
Go ahead and turn a blind eye and deny what's in front of you - but Obama has turned into someone just like every other politician/President...his will goes where the wind blows and what will keep him in the news and keep him popular.
I'm going to step out on a limb here and say that Obama may just be the WORST President we've ever had in office.
And you idiots voted him in for a second term, so you deserve whatever happens. I just can't wait until he's out of office, I'm not sure there could be anyone worse at this point.
SJ23 - I don't know any liberals who get handouts. However, I don't begrudge people who are having difficulty during the worst recession since the GREAT DEPRESSION from getting assistance from the government until they get back on their feet. They are not losers. Often they work 2 jobs to keep a roof over their head but still can't feed their families.
Your concept of losers must be from your own personal experience. I'm sure your situation is not because you are a total loser - just that you're less intelligent than most.
Now, run along little boy. You're Mother probably wants the computer back. Oh, and of course you know that the states getting the most government assistance are Red states, right?
SeekingSanity,
Thought you don't hang around threads? You are like a turd hanging on to the edge of a sphincter. Look at the demographics of everyone that voted for Obama. A bunch of pro-handout losers like yourself. And don't comment on my intelligence as you've not made one intelligent argument. I've stated facts on this board and all you've done is babble the incoherent opinions of a half-wit. I would pit my intelligence against your stupidity any day of the week.
Jeb's biggest liability is that he's W's brother. The two are very different. If Jeb wants to succeeed he is eventually going to have to prove that he's not like W. On immigration, I wouldn't take a few comments made on the Today show as the definitive word on immigration policy. His statement that there has to be a difference between legal and illegal immigration is a breath of fresh air in a debate that has become overtaken by political hype, and probably a lot closer to the mainstream of America than either the self deportion program advocated by tea partiers or blanket amnesty advocated by liberals. Keep it up, Jeb. Broaden the debate. Keep your mind free of the partisan gutter.
Hard move to the right to appease the teabaggers/racist elements of the republican party. Same move McCain made two years ago during his senate re-election bid.
Well, this 'teabagger/racist element' hopes this man will run for president:
https://www.facebook.com/DraftDrBenjaminCarsonForPresident
Sorry to blow you and the left's well worn moniker.
Lest we forget - oh yeah! Run a brain surgeon who has NEVER held any elected office and never done anything else! Please run him! It would be more fun than MItt!
Let's see.....Dr. Carson has run a MAJOR medical facility for over 25 years and has made critical life and death decisions on a frequent basis. A huge philanthropist and a TRUE role model.
Look at where 'politicians' have gotten us where we are today.
Hillary has a nervous eye on this guy.
Geez, are you that blanked? Please keep up here...
World reknown brain surgeon vs. community organizer? That's like comparing Queen Elizabeth to a tupperware party host.
Make him look bad? Dr. Carson life is well documented. When asked about a possible attack on himself from the usual liberal media jackals, the good doctor replied: BRING IT ON.
Obama just won't let anyone forget that he's black. Dr. Carson will first remind you that he is an AMERICAN.
Lest - LMAO - Hillary has NOTHING to fear in Dr. Carson. He is not going to run for anything. But, if he loses his mind and runs - he'll lose. And, no I'm not "blanked" but clearly you ARE if you think Dr. Carson should run for President! You truly are delusional!
Idiot Lest - President Obama was elected to and served in both the Illinois Senate as well as the US Senate. He was a trial lawyer and a Constitutional Law Professor at University of Chicago. His credentials are just fine!
Our President is not the one who won't let people forget he's black - it's idiots like you on the far right who can't forget it. And, he's as good an American or better than ANYONE the Republicans have or will run! Get over it - you're a loser!
Soooo delusional.
What has been released of Obama's records (not MUCH mind you) is that he was a border line run of the mill attorney and professor.
Pity.
Read your last post and then remember this:
~When the debate is lost, then slander becomes the tool of the loser. Socrates~
Lest...Dr Carson at the National Prayer Breakfast is running in the background as I reply. Thank you for posting the link. My thought watching was about how the National Prayer Breakfast really says much about the ideals of the American Government as visioned by the founders. There are probably even atheists in that room. No one has their credentials or personal thoughts checked at the door. In short there are no politics there in that venue, at least idealy. And I wondered if those ideals of acceptance, of the common good, of common philosophy not common dogma, were now confined to the stage plays of state such as this much like the duties of the queen you mentioned. Rituals to remind us of our now mostly irrelevant heritage. And I thought No, actually they are not. They are not because today in2013 a doctor can go to the capital as an invited guest and speak freely and openly to all. He can in most courteous language call all of them on their bs. The fact that he a descendant of slaves standing next to the president who is not a descendant of slaves shows me how far we have actually come together in resolving the dialectic they left us.....And then it was back to the rough and tumble world of politics and lost ideals as the words and images of fox news and liberal bashing begun in support of this man filled the links and comments. I could only then imagine the left coming on line with their conservative bashing and away we go. So much for idealism. Without it, we cannot stand. The founders were many things but they were idealistic everyone of them. They had to be, they believed in revolution and they believed in education. They created our country and its government as a result.
Lest we forget - actually, if you bothered to do any research you would find President Obama was a fine lawyer and was looked upon as an outstanding Constitutional Law Professor -at an outstanding and very difficult University.
If you want to see the loser, look in the mirror. Socrates wouldn't be in the same room with the likes of you since you give new meaning to delusional!
SeekingSanity,
How are you going to criticize the candidacy of a brain surgeon when Boomboom was nothing but a "community organizer" that has spent more time covering up his school records than he has actually spent toward trying to accomplish anything?
SJ23 - again with the abject stupidity! The President has NEVER covered up his college transcripts. Everyone's college transcripts are sealed and cannot be released without permission and NO President has EVER given permission for their's to be released. Bush's were leaked by someone - HE did not release them.
And, President Obama was a trial attorney; a Constitutional Law Professor at University of Chicago; an Illinois State Senator as well as a US Senator. Try again, stupid!
And, the Boomboom comment is a total characterization of YOU - no one else!
...and yet, lest we should forget, "lest..." has written:
So, the big question would be...Does "lest..." lack the intellectual capacity to understand the very Socrates quote he/she is attempting to use to make the other side look bad, or is "lest..." just another filthy teabagging hypocrite that expects others to live by standards that he/she has no intention of living by.
What actually gives "lest..." away completely is the lack of condemnation for the filthy, dishonest, nasty comments crapped on here by "SJ23".
It's is one thing to attempt intelligence when you lack it, "lest...", it's another thing completely to display such blatant hypocrisy. You can douse yourself with all of the Chanel #5 in the world but, until you pull yourself out of the manure pile, you will always stink.
...but thank you, "lest..." for using Socrates to admit what a complete loser you really are.
Shocked - you can't see me but I am bowing to a very good post! -- YOURS!
Ahhh...Thank you, Seeking! But let's be honest. You were the one that went through the disgusting perils of drawing the cockroach out. I merely stood there with the can of Raid.
We must be careful, however....Lest we should forget the time we made a teabagger poop their bloomers and run away...
shockedandstupid, which post of mine exactly do you want Lest to condemn? Which comment of mine was dishonest? Call it filthy if you want, since that term is subjective and subject to your stupidity, but what did I say that was dishonest?
SJ23...Try re-reading posts #9.11 and #9.13.
It is not my job to correct what your mother failed to do when raising such trash. Simply because I used you as an example certainly does not mean I was in any way, shape or form addressing you. Please do not make that mistake again.
Shockedandstupid,
What exactly is dishonest about 9.11 and 9.13? And just because your mother's attempt at aborting you failed, don't get angry and start talking about my mother.
Again Shocked - deep bow and thank you! Working and posting I often make mistakes and can't stay on top of the mental midgets like SJ23! Thanks for having my back - and the can of RAID!
Yeah, Shocked, thanks for having SeekingSanity's back as he/she does not have the mental capacity to handle themselves. Could you wipe his/her butt while you are it at too, because someone that posts the sort of brain dead liberal drivel that they do, I'm sure they are likely too mentally incapacitated to do a thorough job on their own.
seeking your rant 11.2# sounded like you are talking about your community organizer Obama.
Gosh, what a surprise. He says he might run for president and instantly starts reversing previous positions to makes himself beloved of the crackpots in the Tea Party. Well, it certainly worked out well for Romney!!!!
And it worked for Boomboom embracing homosexual marriage
Reminds me of Erick Erickson over at Red State, telling Americans with a smug look on his face, we'll all just have to "learn to live" with Climate Change, because that's that, which of course is their response when confronted with the proof of their endless lies, that Climate Change doesn't exist.
What I'd like to know is, who put these guys in charge of the country and its policies? Certainly nobody that I can think of, unless it's that disgrace that calls itself the "press" in this country, or those billionaire malignant narcissists like Donald Trump and the Koch brothers, who are so angry with Karl Rove, because they didn't get all that they paid for last time around -- the purchase of the entire US government.
What is this proof of climate change? From what I've read, humans have had nearly no impact comparatively to what the gaseous make up of the core (much like the hot gas constantly emanating from the mouth of a liberal) has caused in temperature changes. Most of Algor's writings have been shown to actually be wrong. All I know is that I wish all Prius driver's would die since they don't know how to drive a car.
What part of 'illegal' are people not willing to pay attention too?
Get out!
Then apply to come back LEGALLY.
No anything unless you leave first.
We pretty much get that. So what part of ILLEGAL TO HIRE ILLEGALS do you not get? Or do you advocate a tough penalty for those who do hire illegals? I'll wait for the silence.
Then enforce the Immigration Laws. Why doesn't Obama want his ICE and DHS to follow the Immigration laws of the US?
slodon - President Obama has had more illegals deported than ANY OTHER PRESIDENT! Stop your lying!!!
I think most of us who oppose illegal immigration, also are in favor of tough punishments for businesses who hire illegals. I don't know where the idea of supporters of enforcing immigration laws not supporting punishment for those who knowingly hire illegals came from.
@SeekingSanity: When are they going to deport Obama's illegal Aunt and illegal Uncle?
Maybe boomboom should start by deporting his criminal aunt and uncle who are living in tax payer subsidized housing. Oh, but the news doesn't like to highlight stuff about them.
NO AMNESTY and No Pathway to US Citizenship for illegal aliens. We need to deport all illegal aliens living in the United States. Change the current laws to make the employers liable for the entire cost of deporting their illegal alien employees and their families. That would make it a lot harder of illegal aliens to get or keep and job and they would go home on their own.
Now that makes a lot of sense. Punish children for the acts of their parents.
Galactus - thanks for providing that realistic and practical solution. Please tell us how to solve global warming and cancer.
Job1,
It isn't punishing them, it's putting them back where they should be. If a couple of illegals ran in to your house, murdered you, humped, had a kick nine months later, by your standards, should the baby be allowed to stay in your house because removing it would be punishing the parents for their actions?
With the Shi&ty economy we have right now and we have some fanatics thinking that eliminating 12+` million potential consumers from the economy is going to solve this nation's problems. No wonder why the education in this country sucks. Please, supply and demand...
If you remove (let's say hipotetically that you could do it) all the illegal immigrants we have, you will remove from the economy more than 12 million consumers. What do you think is going to happen when the sales go down on groceries, gas, utilities, clothing, services, etc? with such a hole in the market?
Well, personally I know that if my insurance could go down (both health and automobile) because insurance companies and hospitals don't need to account for the unpaid premiums of illegals...and then when the price of groceries and gas, which are commodities and will always be in demand, but if the demand goes down, the price will drop (haha yeah right, I'm sure they'll drop...), then I would spend more of my freed up money on clothing and services. But I guess you forgot that if demand for supply drops, then the price will drop to a point where consumers will demand it...my question is what about all the police officers who will be out of work because they are not solving the crimes brought on by the shady dealings of the illegals. I guess they can work at the GAP and Best Buy instead where other people will be spending more money due to having money freed up for lower taxes (no money spent by government programs supporting illegals), lower insurance rates, and cheaper gas and groceries.
SJ: Yeah, right. Like if the insurance industry or the gas companies are going to drop the prices... heck, more profits for them. You still don't realize that prices go up on the elevator and come down by the stairway? When you remove those consumers, the companies will not drop the prices, more likely they will reduce costs, and you well know that the first cost they can manage to maintain profits is... yes, labor. I have not seen a single company saying that in order to increase revenues, they will reduce their profit margin to make it affordable for the public, yet I have seen them reducing personnel to cheapen costs.
justiceforall - hint, talking to SJ is like talking to a brick wall - only the wall would absorb more facts!
I still haven't seen proof that Mrs. Jeb has the paperwork to be here...
RIGHT ON - Lets just do an effective job with the laws on the books.
For us to create new laws when we can't even effectively enforcement the current ones is nothing more than
public relations ploy, waste of government time and money - ineffective governing.
Eric Holder and the administration are NOT Doing there jobs.
They need to be held accountable to enforce the laws of this country!
Under the Obama administration more illegal aliens have been deported than under any other President.
Uh....how many thousands of illegals being held for deportation have been RELEASED in the past week?
A couple of thousand but that happens anyways. The system is so slow it is too expensive to house them.
That confirms it, he's running and in order to get the teapublican parties nomination he now has to hate immigrants, women, gays, blacks and birth control.
Legal residency rather than citizenship seems like the responsible way to deal with current illegal aliens. Legal residents could live and work in the US legally, but could be deported if they committed serious crimes. Legal residency would not reward illegal aliens with the right to sponsor as many relatives to come to the US as citizenship would. And legal residency would also not reward illegal aliens with the right to vote in national elections.
But what about the people who filed their paperwork and are following the process to come here legally? Why should people who decided that the law didn't apply to them and just snuck in get preferential treatment over those who are respecting our laws and waiting for their turn? If you're here illegally, you should have all assets seized to pay for your deportation. When you get home, you can file the appropriate paperwork and apply for citizenship like the rest of us.
However the current plan from the Whitehouse and the group of Senators is to have all illegals that want to stay here and become citizens register so they can stay and work then pay a fine and back taxes.
Once those steps are completed they then get at the end of the line for citizenship which can take many years.
What is wrong with that?
Because their are people who have filed the paperwork and are still waiting their turn to come here legally. Analogy time: your at your favorite coffee shop and your waiting in line for your daily joe. The line is about 20 people long but your waiting your turn. All of a sudden a family comes in and cuts to the front of the line without even a sideways glance or a hint of shame. When they get to the front they just pay an extra 20 cents and get their coffee before the rest of the people waiting. How is that fair? Send them back and they can start at the back of the line like the rest of us.
But after they do everything I listed then and only then does the clock starts for them.
Everyone that has filed paperwork will be and remain ahead of them.
Dennis, Columbus, Ohio Excellent post.
@Dennis
but the people who are waiting and filed the paperwork and are ahead of them in line, don't get to live in the US and take advantage of all the benefits that living here entails. They stole that spot from a person who was applying for legal immigration the right way. Illegal immigrants have effectively trespassed in this country. I have cousins over in Europe who are patiently waiting for their paperwork to go through and to be chosen to receive citizenship. Why should an illegal get to live here and wait while they can't live here and wait? Why should illegals get preferential treatment for breaking the law?
Path or no path to citizenship they are not leaving so secure the border and allow them to apply for citizenship if/when they meet the requirements.
Or is it that you just don’t want them here ever ?
No it is like you are Mexican standing in line for coffee and an Asian Indian whip out three masters degrees, Asian from China whip out three suitcases of cash and cut in front of you and they get their coffee in two or three years and you are told to wait 20 years for your cup of coffee while you wait knee deep in sewerage in your favela slum watching your children die of diseases.
TERRI - forgot your meds today, right?
Accountant: I don't know where you have your cousins, but actually there is a quota allocation for people living abroad. Depending on the percentage allocated to that country (I am giving you the link on how DOS allocates visas per year - http://www.travel.state.gov/visa/bulletin/bulletin_5885.html) is how many people can immigrate to the US.
Second, they did not steal nothing, your cousins did not have anything secure, so stop the argument right there. And many of them were brought here by American nationals in order to pay them meager salaries while engrossing their profits.
Terri: Is there another INDIA outside of Asia????? Is there another China outside of Asia???
I want to see someone grow a pair in the Beltway and put forth a bill to AMEND the 14th amendment of our Constitution which allows foreign children born in this country to have automatic citizenship.
This BS needs to stop.
Problem solved.
If they are born here they are not foreign children, they are American children, same as you Lest - You are no better.
Obviously you and your ilk don't know how many have died trying to cross the border being 9 months pregnant to have their baby here in the U.S.
It's well documented and I do hope you indulge yourself in looking it up. These women are forced into cattle cars and crates with no ventilation to cross the border only to be found dead. Others attempt to cross over the border by the Rio Grand only to either drown or die of exposure.
It's not about being better, markin. It's about senseless loss of life and the way to stop it.
Bill Richardson (former governor of New Mexico) became an American when his daddy sent his mother north - food for thought.
I have a good friend in Santa Barbara Ca. - an 'illegal' from Manchester, England. Deported twice - to Nogales Mex. Still has his boat shop in gringoland. My point is, even when the gov't. gets it right, they're so disconnected they get it wrong. And the Bush family has more in common with Louis XVI than any American. What event in history gave us the bumper sticker/sound bite "the election ain't over until your brother counts the votes" Anybody remember the other Bush brother? Neil Bush - convicted in '91' in the Silverado Savings & Loan scandal. When is he gonna step up & run?? Still lookin' for all that documentation on senseless loss of life. Everytime I google those words, all I get is an illegal war in Iraq.
"give me your tired, your poor, your huddled masses yearning to be free...." kinda' rhymes with Hypocrisy.
@ ghost
Silverado Savings. He is the worst guy there is, next to Jack Lew
Typical teabagger. They love the Constitution so much that they have to rewrite it. Lucky thing none of you are smart enough to complete a coherent paragraph...
Concerning your tragedy on the Rio Grande. Would you please be the first to to provide verifiable documentation from legitimate sources? Your silly attempt at being sentimental would be more believable if you threw out some new crap instead of regurgitating the same old crap the nazis at Fox have been pumping into your brain cell for years.
Does Socrates have any quotes about being a thoughtless propagandist, or do we have to move ahead to the Germany of the 1920's and '30's to adequately describe the phenomenon that is your personality disorder?
What sense does it make to give illegal aliens citizenship? How do you stop millions more from coming to our country if they know they will eventually become citizens and what would make a person follow the legal channels instead? There isn't a country on this planet that allows people to walk in and become citizens. Even Mexico enforces their immigration laws better than we do.
More people equals more competition for jobs, more money needed for Social Security, Medicare, Medicaid and welfare. At some point, we have to consider what's best for our country and stop buying votes to stay in power.
We don't need imigration reform. We need the current laws enforced. Round them up, send them back across the border.
What the Brain Thrust of the Left can't stand is, He is a Bush and He Is Right. Until you make Illegal mean Illegal and not reward it, you repeat the mistake and increase Illegal Immigration. I believe it was Einstein who said something along the line of repeating the same action and expecting a different reaction is the definition of Insanity. The Left would like to repeat the Mistake of Ronald Reagan, Amnesty doesn't work !
Seems everyone is just content with attacking Jeb for moving further to the right on this issue without actually debating the issue itself. My family and I immigrated here legally in the 80's. Why should the people who came here illegally get to bypass the whole process ahead of those who are still waiting to enter the country legally? I don't understand either the moral or fiscal rational of telling 11 million illegal immigrants that, even though they broke the law and cut the line to enter this country illegally, we are going to make concessions to make sure they now get their citizenship and all the benfits afforded by it? Not to mention that we have illegal immigrants collecting welfare and running up emergency room costs. It is just smart policy to only accept foreign individuals who can prove that they can provide for themselves and their families and to ensure that they will not need assistance from the public coffers. I'm waiting for a well thought out response that is devoid of personal attacks, but I anticipate that I will only hear crickets.
In many instances your correct but you can't use one brush stroke the deal with 11 million (or more) people. Many of the illegals have US born children living with them. Also, many of these illegals have lived their entire lives here. The issues are far too complicated to deal with on a vine like this. In fact, many of the illegals won't be offered citizenship. Lastly, this does not stop the normal path to citizenship.
While I completely understand that many of these illegals have US born children, what I don't understand is why this is our problem. Either the child can stay with legal relatives, go into foster care, or return to their parents home country with them. True it's not the childrens fault that their parents decided our laws don't apply to them, but should the fact that they are innocent completely exempt their parents from any reprocussions? If we start to make excuses for illegals who have children in the US, it will only embolden more illegals to try and sneak over when they are 9 months pregnant so that we won't kick them out. The law is black and white and justice is supposed to be blind. Illegal aliens should be sent back home, no exceptions, and they can then reapply with everyone else who decided to follow the law. We should not be rewarding individuals who spit in the face of our immigration policies. I cam here legally, they can too.
Why do people that have lived in the Americas for centuries (natives) get denied while Europeans (immigrants) are the preferred people?
Ricardo,
Are you talking about Native Americans (Indians)? If so, what NA do you know that has been denied American citizenship? When you say "natives," are you talking about Mexicans that do not live within the borders of the United States? Maybe they are getting denied because we have so many here already, as a result of them sneaking over, illegally. Maybe furthermore we'd like to take Europeans, Asians, and Indians (from India) who have historically offered something to this country as opposed to the Mexicans that sneak over and try to turn our country in to as big of a toilet as the country they have already screwed up. Seems like a fair enough reason to me. If an immigrant has something to offer this country to better it, bring them in. If they want to come in, not learn the language, suckle at the government tit and turn our country in to a bigger @!$%#hole than the one that they fled, then I say let them stay where they are!
Accountant: Maybe because legalizing 11 million plus illegals makes them tax payers? Think in terms of how much tax is not being paid by either the employer (who pays them knowingly of their situation), or by the employee. It is a matter of simple economics.
@Justiceforall
I don't assume that all of them won't be taxpayers just like you shouldn't assume that they will all be taxpayers. I'm guessing that since they didn't bother to come in legally, we are probably looking at low skilled workers coming in to the tax pool if we do offer them citizenship. They most likely will not help in offsetting the costs they will pose to the government. I commend you for fighting so hard to help those less fortunate, but we need to be realistic. America is the world's soup kitchen and we cannot continue to allow low skilled workers to sneak over the border and take advantage of tax payer funded services. We should prosecute any employer who knowingly hires an illegal immigrant as that is a position that could be filled by an American citizen. With unemployment just under 8%, I think we will be able to find pair unemployed individuals with jobs. No more free rides. They can go home and apply legally. If the government denies them because they can't contribute to society on a significant level, then that is just too bad. We can hardly take care of our own citizens, let alone those from other countries.
Accountant: This is like the drug trade... they supply the labor that some greedy bastards pay willingly in order to improve their profit margin. In 2003 Walmart was fined for using illegal workers on their stores (as part of their cleaning crews) 11 million, out of which they paid 4. Do you think that was enough punishment? Let me give you another example: Not long ago the state of California placed an ad for farm workers, only condition: US Citizen or Legal Resident. Of the 1800 jobs they were looking to hire, only 236 applied, and from those I think they hired 33. That gives you a pretty picture that it is not that easy. Unfortunately most of the illegal workers here do so in a field where other labor hand don't want to work. I don't see an illegal immigrant applying for CEO or CFO of any Fortune 500 company.
But Boston Accountant,
Why should we have Americans working the less desirable jobs that illegals are filling now, when instead that American can just sit at home and collect an unemployment paid out of the paycheck that I earn. Wait....GASP...are you suggesting that Americans sitting around taking and taking and taking may actually be forced to go out and GIVE by filling the positions that would no longer be worked by non-tax paying illegals?
@SJ23 Exactly. It seems like this is a very alien idea to some. Everyone who is collecting unemployment can work a job that an illegal was working before and we kill two birds with one stone.
@Justice Its definitely not a severe enough penalty. I am for very strict penalties for businesses who knowingly hire illegals. If they don't check to see if a prospective employee has a SS number, steep penalties should follow. If the illegal used a stolen SS number, throw their behind in a work camp for a few years and then deport them back to their home. That California example makes me sick. I'm sure that CA has more than enough people on the unemployment rolls that they could pull from to work those positions. You should be obligated to work if the state has available positions that you meet the requirements to fulfill. If you don't take the position, you should be taken off of unemployment. No more freeloaders!!!
The State of Florida needs a minority governor.
The State of Florida has a moron gover... oops, sorry, I didn't have my glasses on.
I believe Rick "Zippy" Scott is more of an alien than someone from Mars! Big bald head, beady eyes, forked tongue, pale white skin!
Hey... I forgive you to talk like that about uncle Fester... (with my apologies to the cast of the Addams Family...)