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Subscribe to RSSThe White House tries to flood the zone with its legislative priorities… Hagel on track to win Senate confirmation… McCain and others oppose filibustering him -- a move which would have been unprecedented for a cabinet nominee… Cantor to deliver 1:00 pm ET speech to redefine his party and himself… And on drones and executive power: NBC’s Isikoff uncovers DOJ memo justifying drone killings of U.S. citizens believed to be operational leaders of al Qaeda.
*** Flooding the zone: Exactly one week away from President Obama’s State of the Union address, the White House has spent the early days of the second term flooding the zone with its legislative agenda. Last week, the president delivered his big immigration speech in Las Vegas. Yesterday, he spoke about gun violence in Minnesota. Today, he’s meeting at the White House with progressive, labor, and business leaders to discuss immigration reform and the budget situation. What’s going on here: The Obama White House wants to overload Washington’s political circuits in an effort to see what it can get through Congress -- without letting Congress define what issues get addressed. After all, Republicans want to solely talk about the budget before the March budget showdown (see yesterday’s multiple coordinated responses by House Republicans on the White House’s announcement it would be late with its budget). Yet by flooding the zone, Team Obama -- with the bully pulpit and the State of the Union at its disposal -- wants to widen the political dialogue beyond that one issue. This “flooding the zone” concept is how the Obama White House operated in the first six months of the first term, and it’s where he got most of his legislative achievements. When the White House got bogged down on ONE issue (health care, debt ceiling, etc), officials determined they lost some of their political capital.
Ben Garvin / Getty Images
President Barack Obama speaks before a crowd of local leaders and law enforcement officials at the Minneapolis Police Department Special Operations Center on Feb. 4, 2013 in Minneapolis, Minn.
*** Hagel on track to win Senate confirmation: Despite his rough Senate confirmation hearing last week, Chuck Hagel appears to be on his way toward becoming President Obama’s third defense secretary. Why? Because John McCain and other GOP senators say they won’t filibuster Hagel, meaning that all he needs is a simple of majority of U.S. senators to win confirmation (and there are 55 Democrats in the Senate). The New York Times: “Several Republican senators — notably John McCain — said Monday they would oppose a filibuster of former Senator Chuck Hagel’s confirmation as secretary of defense, moving the nominee much closer toward approval.” However, as one of us wrote yesterday, a filibuster against Hagel would have been unprecedented: No presidential cabinet nominee has ever been required to attain the 60 votes necessary to overcome a filibuster. Nine have lost simple up-or-down votes -- the last being John Tower’s 1989 nomination to be defense secretary amid accusations of womanizing and alcohol abuse. Twenty-one nominees have been withdrawn by presidents, most recently former Sen. Tom Daschle (taxes), who was Obama’s pick to head Health and Human Services in 2009, and Bernard Kerik (undocumented housekeeper) before that in 2004 under George W. Bush. But while confirmation for Hagel is in sight, the bigger question (as we asked yesterday) is whether Hagel has the credibility and stature to work with the GOP on issues that matter to the Pentagon.
*** Cantor’s effort to redefine GOP and himself: At 1:00 pm ET, House Majority Leader Eric Cantor will deliver a speech to the American Enterprise Institute to begin branding his party -- and himself -- beyond the divisive budget debates. As National Journal previewed yesterday, Cantor “plans to ask Congress to require universities to warn students when their academic majors lack employment opportunities; to repeal the tax on medical devices, a provision of Obama’s health care overhaul; and to shift spending from political sciences to ‘hard’ sciences such as cancer research.” According to excerpts of his remarks, the GOP leader is expected to say: “Our solutions will be based on the conservative principles of self-reliance, faith in the individual, trust in the family, and accountability in government. Our goal – to ensure every American has a fair shot at earning their success and achieving their dreams.” More: “Government policy should aim to strike a balance between what is needed to advance the next generation, what we can afford, what is a federal responsibility and what is necessary to ensure our children are safe, healthy and able to reach their dreams.” As Politico points out, this is not the first time Cantor has tried to rebrand himself and the party.
*** On drones and executive power: As NBC’s Michael Isikoff first reported last night, a confidential Justice Department memo “concludes that the U.S. government can order the killing of American citizens if they are believed to be ‘senior operational leaders’ of al-Qaida or ‘an associated force’ -- even if there is no intelligence indicating they are engaged in an active plot to attack the U.S.” Isikoff adds, “The 16-page memo, a copy of which was obtained by NBC News, provides new details about the legal reasoning behind one of the Obama administration’s most secretive and controversial polices: its dramatically increased use of drone strikes against al-Qaida suspects, including those aimed at American citizens, such as the September 2011 strike in Yemen that killed alleged al-Qaida operatives Anwar al-Awlaki and Samir Khan.” The publication of this memo will likely: 1) add fireworks to John Brennan’s confirmation hearing on Thursday to head the CIA, and 2) spark a public debate about this issue. There hasn’t been much of an outcry about this beyond the civil-liberties community, because the public wants to go after bad guys (like al-Awlaki). But the story does raise important questions: What are the checks on this power? How much faith do you put in executive branch in not abusing this? Expect these questions to come up at Brennan’s confirmation hearing. Congress has been surprisingly silent on this issue, very few members have demanded more transparency or oversight. Perhaps this memo will spark more Congressional interest.
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frist, twice
So Barry’s new plan to provide free contraceptive coverage to self insured religious organizations that don’t qualify for the ClunkerCare ACA exemption is to make insurance companies issue a separate contraceptives-only insurance policy that would be provided to those organizations employees free of charge. The Barry admin is proposing to pay the insurance companies for this coverage by waiving ClunkerCare fees they would ordinarily have to pay to sell insurance on health exchanges.
This simply amounts to using federal govt funds in the furtherance of a particular religious belief against the use of contraceptives. It is a CLEAR violation of the principle of separation of church and state, and is therefore unconstitutional.
Not that the Barry admin has ever worried about complying with the Constitution. I don’t know what’s worse: Are they too stupid to understand these concepts, or are they so arrogant that they think they are not subject to the Constitution if it gets in the way of what they want to do??
I think it’s BOTH.
Morons.
Life is good.
Enjoy.
(or, if you are a lefty liberal, at least try to be less miserable)
SeekingSanity – Yesterday you wrote:
Agreed. The government is taking away my guns is a ruse. Ironically, those who say this are the victims of the ruse, and are not bright enough to realize they’re being duped. There is a lot of overlap between the groups below, but some people fit rather neatly into one category or another.
The Gunslingers, Wild West mentality. They’ve seen too many movies and imagine themselves as heroes, ready at a moment’s notice to shoot up the bad guys. They present as much of a danger to the public as the crazies who are doing the shooting.
Macho Men. Typically, the ones who get drunk during hunting season and go out in the woods and shoot each other—or worse, shoot responsible hunters. Their masculinity is dependent on their guns. Take away the latter and you literally strip them of the former. The women who ride with them are as pathetic as they are because usually these guys are anti-feminists as well.
The Warriors. Rush Limbaugh “Chickenhawks” who have never been to war. They’re the first to rattle the sabers—and the first to condemn troops who turn against the war. They don’t have a clue.
The Victims. A broad group that feels powerless in the face of an ever-changing world they don’t understand. These are the ones who are prone to blame the government for real or imagined ills. They are manipulated by a slim percent of the One-Percenters, like the Koch brothers, whose wealth increased last year from $50B to $64B. The Kochs and their fellow rapists wouldn’t ride so high if Victims understood who their real enemy was.
The Tea Partiers. In NH in 2010, they were elected in droves, took over the State House, and rammed a bill through allowing legislators to carry concealed weapons on the floor of the House when it was in session. In 2012, the voters rammed them out of office and the new Democrat majority repealed the bill. Other states tell similar tales.
Militiamen. The craziest of the groups.
Is there a group I missed?
Question; What do supposed "bad-asses" like PePe LaPierre, Rush Limpballs & Sean Insanity have in common?
Answer; They all surround themselves with armed bodyguards! lol
I would have beat you Johntho if my computer would have cooperated.
The presidents agenda is ambitious, but are things that have been neglected too long. Gun restrictions, (background checks) are something most of agree is necessary and immigration reform are has been bantered about for many years and date back to at least Ronald Reagan who give amnesty to millions of people but never go the reforms needed to control our borders. We are faced with the same types of questions today. What to do with people who come here for an opportunity and do it illegally. Hopefully with the economy going in the right direction he will have time to do the things that will make our country great again.
Dr. Seuss meets Barack Obama
From the article above:
Last Thursday night, John Stewart did a shtick on The Daily Show called ‘Skeet Fighter’ about President Barack Obama’s revelation in an interview with The New Republic that he goes skeet shooting at Camp David “all the time”.
In perfect Stewart sarcastic tone, he raised the question, “Why won’t the black man half the country lives in fear of release a picture of himself holding a gun?” The picture which followed was equally hilarious and spot-on in mocking the 47-percenter’s media-manufactured paranoia of this two-term President.
The sixteen-time Emmy award winner Stewart concluded the segment with a Dr. Seuss-like parody book entitled “Oh, The People Who Hate You”, addressing the President in a ‘fire side chat’ like moment “that no matter what he does, his critics will never be satisfied”.
As always, John made me laugh myself silly by pointing out our nation’s political folly and the tiresome, constant, negative barrage Obama has endured throughout his Presidency. No matter what this President does, he will always be viewed by his critics as (fill in the blank).
This writer has no problem accepting the fact that almost half this country hates him, but I for one think President Obama is one of the most intelligent, decent, and honorable man to have ever occupied 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue.
We now interrupt this program to bring you the following message:
This little old lady calls 911. When the operator answers she yells "Help, send the police to my house right away! There's a damn Democrat on my front porch and he's playing with himself."
"What?" the operator exclaimed. "I said there is a damn Democrat on my front porch playing with himself; Please send the police!" the little old lady repeated.
"Well, now, how do you know he's a Democrat?" "Because, you damn fool, if he was a Republican, he'd be screwing me!"
Anonymous
Salud
Mo, being frist is my joke to me. It is more to silence those individuals that are jealous of feisty for being on the ball and Little do you know it is a communist conspiracy, or maybe its because its kind of fun to be frist. I am surprised no one has condemned me to a life in solitude for my sense of humor and my misspelling of the word first.
Why so violent, Mo? Actually, I believe that most of us here have had that same thought regarding Johntho...
:O)
Quick Joe! Buy some condom stocks!
Our solutions will be based on the conservative principles of self-reliance, faith in the individual, trust in the family, and accountability in government. Eric Cantor
What a condescending jerk he is. Conservative principles are and have been for many many years a Republican Party based on abusive BS - towards just about everybody that doesn't conform to their 18th century ideals. White, rich, male.
You listen to "conservative principles" on AM radio and it is racist, it is divisive, it is full of hate & lies; you watch the way the conservatives vote in Congress and you know damn well their first priority is what the lobbyists want them to do. Conservative principles? They haven't spent 10 minutes on jobs.
Have you seen what "conservative principles" means on election day? It ain't pretty.
This party will never ever change. They are an abusive bunch and always will be until they clean house with younger, more progressive candidates.
It's the only way they can win. Cleaning house. And first to go should be Karl Rove.
They have no conservative principles. It's just made up rhetoric to believe they do. They have never wanted to fix the economy while Barack Obama was our president. Where are the principles in this?
_________________
As NBC's Michael Isikoff first reported last night, a confidential Justice Department memo "concludes that the U.S. government can order the killing of American citizens if they are believed to be 'senior operational leaders' of al-Qaida or 'an associated force' -- even if there is no intelligence indicating they are engaged in an active plot to attack the U.S."
_____________
I would like to know more about this in the upcoming days.
Congrats on being frist and holding down the prime parking spot! lol
You must of missed them yesterday!
They're as predictable as the sun rising in the East! lol
Hi Pat:
Eric Cantor is a jerk. He is not interested in changing conservative policy, just repackaging them.
Guess Senator McCain's temper tantrum is over and decided not to join Mitch McConnell in filibustering former GOP Senator Chuck Hagel's nomination to be Secretary of Defense. Smart move but then McCain had to repair the damage he's done to himself the last couple weeks, not to mention the demeaning tweets.
Rove's Big Move. Yesterday, we learned that Karl Rove plans to focus on weeding out far right GOP candidates, keep them from running for office and mucking up the possibility of winning the primary for whatever office. Just how Rove plans to accomplish this task remains a mystery. Last check of primary procedures shows that any person who obtains the required number of signatures to run, pays whatever fees are required, and announces he/she is running for office is a legitimate candidate. This is not something Karl Rove can stop.
Here is the problem for Karl Rove, and it is huge. The GOP owns the wacky because they encouraged it, kept shifting GOP policies further and further to the right to woe the extreme, had FOX News and other right-wing media outlets feeding the wacky lies and falsehoods, telling them not to trust any other media source.....thus dumbing down its GOP voters. FOX and Limbaugh have had 20 years to successfully create a large voting block of controlled-ignorance in the GOP, republicans who no longer live in a reality-based world.
How does Rove and the GOP now prevent the monster they created from running for elected office? How does the GOP tell those who the party thinks are a brick short they cannot run for elected office? How does the GOP prevent another Christine "I'm not a witch" O'Donnell, Sharron Angle, Todd Akin (who was a US House representative for years), or Dr. Keith Ablow from running for the GOP nomination? The GOP is no longer a political party of merit, it is a wholly-owned subsidiary of FOX News. Its candidates and spokes people repeat the misinformation FOX feeds viewers as fact. We saw that in the Benghazi and Chuck Hagel hearings where several GOP Senators repeated lies from factless opinion articles which were circulated as truth by the talking heads on FOX.
If Rove wants to have a viable GOP again, he better first look at the crowd of yahoos already elected to the US House and Senate, plus the State Congresses. These people were elected with the help of the GOP, the RNC, the State Republican Parties and the money changers who hold the puppet strings.
Advice to Rove from a liberal who prefers at least two viable parties: 1) It isn't how you express your views that turns off voters, it is the policy behind those views that Americans reject. The GOP's views are 19th century at best, they are anti-women, anti-minority, anti-government, anti-gay, anti-peace to name a few. 2) Stop funding the elections for the wacky yahoos you already sent to Congress; and turn off the money spigot to the next batch of wacky yahoos who call themselves republicans. Stop embracing the Tea Party which is nothing more than the old John Birch Society dressed up in 3-corner hats; tell them they can form their own party. 3) Denounce the conspiracy theories, the lies, the nonsense; show respect for President Obama and democrats even when you disagree ("you lie" isn't acceptable). 4) Embrace science, education. 5) Stop using FOX News as your Corporate Headquarters; the station isn't helping, it's hurting the GOP.
Jack in Portsmouth, I believe you have identified a few subspecies of the genius, gun nut. Good job, those especially dangerous are the ones with a pickup truck and live in a trailer and consider Jerry Springer a communist. The gubment is out to get these people and take away their guns. Just ask them. ( - ;
Joe, I admire your beer expertise. Your expertise on the constitution, not so much.
Does Hagel have the credibility and stature to work with the GOP? You've got that question reversed. By the way, Hagel IS GOP!! Or, at least, he was when they were saner. The GOP having a battle of wits with Chuck Hagel is an example of taking a knife to a gunfight.
Cantor going for a re-brand? By talking to the American Enterprise Institute? Good luck with that!! Here's some free advice; talk to the American people. You know, YOUR BOSSES!! THAT'S where your problem lies. You're going to try to sell the voters by talking to a conservative think (?) tank I'd wager most people have never heard of and which doesn't give a sh$t about the 98%. And what's this excrement about majors lacking employment opportunities? There was no such animal when I graduated (admittedly, Socrates was still a graduate assistant). There were jobs with no connection to a major, but none where a degree wasn't considered desirable. I know psych majors who have prospered in the insurance business. If you DO need further education for a job, at least you'll never be a freshman again. You're not completely starting over.
And from NBC of all places. Props should be given where props are due. This is what journalism should be.
Repackaging is an apt description Ron.
Their overhaul has nothing to do with Cantor making a ridiculous speech. It has to do with tearing down the house. They have no choice; their reputations are ruined. Too little too late for Mitch McConnell, etc.
They have to start over. Getting rid of the Rush Limbaughs would be a good start. But it's only a start.
...and Bush was a war criminal because of torture?
...and lets remember it's not only the the target that is killed
I don't think I've heard a more callous statement ever (and that includes Dick Cheney).
Pat Boston MA.
Is that a liberal's way of saying "I'm going to ignore what was actually revealed in the memo and wait until Obama tells me what to think about it"?
Anybody out there still want to claim Obama is the dove you all imagined he would be?
Eric Cantor, (the Vampire we alway see lurking behind Boener on all television shot just waiting for Boehner to "screw up" so he can swoop down and steal the Speakers spot. The man's discussing.
On a happier note, it would appear that Hagel will get appointed, (told you so). Now that McCain and Lindsey had their fun and showed everyone how tough and important they were" they folded and will not fillibuster Hagel. Get these guys out of Congress along with the other nuts like Ryan and Paul.
Jody,
That is just an excellent post, an expansion of something newday said yesterday.
I particularly liked this part because no one has really been making the connection: "Stop embracing the Tea Party which is nothing more than the old John Birch Society dressed up in 3-corner hats"
So true, so true.
Dingle, is that right?
Did you march against the War in Iraq or did you just bow down to Cheney and GWB and Rumsfeld like just about everybody else?
Not if Rick Santorum has his way. I received this request for a donation from his right-wing group Patriot Voices (I wouldn't ever ever donate a dime for any of his initiatives..just keeping tabs on this nut):
Santorum has no other way to make a living, apparently, than to obstruct the agenda of the POTUS in any way that he can. He's probably diverting the donation money for his personal use. Here's hoping Ricky runs again so we can kick him to the curb again!
The theme song for this event will be, "Still Crazy After All These Years."
Can I ask a question?
What is this fascination with being first?
Pat Boston MA.
Simple minds at work again. It isn't as simple as right vs. left, Democrat vs. Republican. The real fight should be the people vs. the state.
To answer your question, I was as vocal in my opposition to Bush and Cheney's war mongering as I am Obama's war mongering.
Nice attempt at deflecting any blame away from the current administration though.
Dingle, did I say I was deflecting blame?
If I was, I wouldn't have brought it up, now would I?
Alan, isn't it amazing what you can get away with when you're not getting 4,500 of our troops killed pursuing non-existent weapons of mass destruction? Short version; enough of the GWB pity party!!
If the we get all the nuts out of congress, there won't be enough republicans left in congress to count.
It's fun watching the republicans get mad because they can't be "frist" Pat.
Pat Boston MA.
That is exactly the reason people continue to bring up Bush, Cheney, Rumsfeld, etc. To deflect blame.
Totally agree, Tomas! And thanks for the joke!
My favorite (don't know who said it) is "If President Obama walked on water, the Republicans would say he couldn't swim."
I'm reminded of right-wing loser Bill Frist, the senator/ medical doctor who totally botched his diagnosis of Terri Schiavo and stuck his nose into what was her family's personal business. Whatever happened to him?
I'm surprised that you are the only poster to comment on that part of the story, Dingle. I haven't read all of the comments on the DOJ story itself, but my first thoughts on the subject was why we haven't started proceedings against these American traitors and revoke their citizenship. I guess maybe drone attacks are a much cheaper and sure bet for ending their traitor acts against this country while living on foreign soil. If they are so against this country, they should have renounced their citizenship when they left the country. I guess they think they deserve all of the benefits of American citizenship while doing everything possible to destroy us from their new homes in African/Middle East countries.
Al-Qaida declared war on the US and killed thousands of Americans. They continue to attack us in different locations around the world.
We were attacked, and now we must defend ourselves. Al-Qaiada has no country, no unforms. The rules of war must be adjusted to deal with this type of threat.
IMO if you are an active member of al-Qaida it is no different than wearing the uniform of an army we are at war with.
Jody, Iowa
Unkle-Karl needs to fade into the sunset.
Nice column, Jody.
Salud
I wonder too, Pat.
First is the worst, second is the best, third is the one with the treasure chest. ;)
Dingle, what's wrong with bringing up GWB? You yourself just wrote you were against his war mongering.
Johntho, "frist" two days in a row means you must be on the FR/MSNBC payroll....according to the naybobbers anyway.
Jack, Tomas, Pat, great reading this morning.
Jack, I think you covered the groups. The only sub-group I'll mention are the gun-totting women like Gayle Trotter who think they need to carry AK47s around while taking care of their "babies". Instead of soccer moms, we might call Bushmaster Moms. While I have no problem with women owning and having access to a gun to defend themselves, the idea of a home with small children and an AK47 in the same sentence is off-putting.
I have no pity for either the President or the Vice President of the previous Administration. Their decision to invade Iraq was one on the most despicable acts I have seen in my lifetime. However, I also remember that many called for their prosecution in the Hague. I am curious to see if they are hypocrites or partisans. I suspect the majority are hypocrites, or will argue that Bush did first or worse, ignoring the fact that two wrongs do not make a right.
These are atrocities being carried out by our government in our name and I for one am against this policy regardless of the person occupying the Oval Office.
Because we are 100% confident our intelligence has identified the right person to kill? I refer you to Iraq, re: Weapons of Mass destruction. They were spot on there? I seem to remember as well that they didn't see the end of the cold war either. So identifying the correct target should be a breeze with this track record.
For liberals it is all about being first. First to scream racist. First in the number of welfare recipients. First in the number of food stamp recipients. First in annual spending for a president. First in total dollars added to our national debt for a single president. First in most time passed having not produced a budget. First in the highest average cost for a gallon of gasoline during a presidency. First in dollars wasted on a failed stimulus plan. First to blame others. First to toss out insults. First to dump the Constitution. First to believe ObamaCare is free. First to believe every word uttered by our president. First not to question anything done by our president. First to blame the gun and not the person for a murder. First to blame Bush. First to accept no responsibility for anything. First to blame Bush. First to blame Bush. First to blame Bush. First...
anti-trust proponent
The problem with that (its only a problem with whomever happens to be in power at the time) is that those types of proceedings are subject to judicial review. The whole point of assassinating a U.S. citizen is to avoid due process.
As a progressive I am outraged at the kind of power this administration has given its self when talking about killing Americans. Criminals or terrorist, at the very least, if it is an American I believe that the country has a duty to try and bring these folks in alive and have them stand trial. Even if the penalty is death, there still needs to be a trial.
As far as Cantor goes,
If Cantor would really be truthful in his speech he would end that sentence with, "That is, except regulating what people do in their bedrooms, who they choose to love, and the decisions women make about their own bodies. Other than that… the feds need to be out of our personal lives!”
"(or, if you are a lefty liberal, at least try to be less miserable)"
Yes, of course. We've all been SO weepy since Nov. 6th, you'd think we were related to that one orange-hued guy from Ohio.
" First to blame Bush. First to blame Bush. First..." ...to actually care enough for their fellow Americans that they came up with Social Security....
Jeekers, Rick-lotsa numerals- try to take Joe's advice, and be a little less miserable, will you??
Son of one gun, another dimension of ignorance from the Albanian idiot.
The First Amendment says in part, "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion,..................."
Congress does have the expressed duty to regulate commerce. Yes, Congress may make all the laws it wishes respecting an establishment of BUSINESS.
It seems we might have a problem when a church sees its mission as making a profit.
Expect these questions to come up at Brennan’s confirmation hearing. Congress has been surprisingly silent on this issue, very few members have demanded more transparency or oversight. Perhaps this memo will spark more Congressional interest.
==============
In an earlier article it stated that information on this memo was provided to the Senate Intelligence and Senate Judicial Committees in June of last year. I realize it's always cute to point squarely at the WH, both in this Administration as well as others, but the ignorant thinking that the Congress is out of the loop, especially on things of this magnitude are absurd.
If members of Congress do begin to speak out, it will be telling to see who does and does do the talking.
Spoken by a sore loser. Yes, we liberals are first! WE WON THE ELECTION.
Sucks to be you.
That is how it's done folks. You all should try it some time.
Like the President or not there's no denying that he has fundamentally changed the dialogue. As the always enjoyable Charlie Pierce writes;

That about sums it up. The Republican Party has walked into a trap of their own construction for no other reason than a centrist Democrat FINALLY has the guts to spring it.
Mr. President, I have an idea: why don't you focus "like a laser" on jobs and the economy?
1) You are now the official title holder as the WORST economic recovery in U.S. history.
2) We are 4 years, that's right FOUR YEARS!!, into an "economic recovery" and GDP in the last quarter was negative as we head into a second recession.
3) Unemployment rate is the SAME as when you took office at 7.9%
4) From election day Nov 2008 until the end of your first term you actually have LESS people working at the end of your first term than the day you were elected.
5) You are now the proud title holder of the HIGHEST percent of people on Food Stamps since the program started.
6) Lowest labor participation rate in nearly 50 years
7) Highest percent on Welfare since the 70's
8) Highest percent unemployed 6 months or more since the Great Depression
9) You have borrowed more money in 4 years than what was borrowed by this country from George Washington through Bill Clinton (even with the incredible borrowing by George Bush President Obama still borrowed in four years about 50% MORE than Bush borrowed in EIGHT YEARS!!)
10) You are now the proud title holder of the FIRST president in history where the median income actually DROPPED from the day you took office until the end of your first term
So my suggestion is to do something you have never done before: BE A LEADER!! LEAD THIS COUNTRY!! Don't be a Community Organizer in Chief. Don't waste time on gun control, same-sex marriage, immigration, gays in the Boy Scouts, and all your little "agenda" items that mean nothing to the country as the country is collapsing economically.
FIX THE ECONOMY!! Get your focus right!! Quite blaming others!! Be a leader for ONCE IN YOUR LIFE!!
I sincerely hope Obama doesn't "flood the zone". Congress can only effectively work on a small number of big issues at once. By trying to do too much, he runs the risk of failing to get key legislation passed, and congress creating rushed legislation that is poorly written and causes more harm than good. This approach is similar to what he did when he first got into office, and I think it's part of the reason the economic recovery has been so slow.
Please remind us, LosMan... which American citizens have been killed by the government?
Names, please.
LosMan123
Ahh the hypocricy of the mainstream, establishment GOP. "Limited government" does not tell us what to put in our bodies, who to marry, and how to plan our families.
I agree. The congress, like the one in 2003, has been too compliant with the WH wishes. I have a great fear of the expansion of executive power regardless of the President. Bush and Cheney walked all over congress and I have deep reservations of at least two expansions by the Obama administration, Libya and the use of drones against American citizens.
On Congress being silent the problem with memos that go to the Intelligence Committee is that they are usually classified and I am not sure what an individual member can do. It will be interesting to see if there is any outrage from other members now it is in the public domain.
kaybeetoys
Anwar al-Awlaki and Samir Khan
Both were U.S. citizens who had never been indicted by the U.S. government nor charged with any crimes.
http://openchannel.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/02/04/16843014-exclusive-justice-department-memo-reveals-legal-case-for-drone-strikes-on-americans?lite
Any other questions?
Kaybeetoys,
Even if nobody is killed, the precedent is very bad.
Also, if we have a government that believes they can kill Americans on American soil without due-process, do you really think they also feel they have to tell us when they kill someone?
Put another way, what would your reaction had been if the GWB administration implemented these procedures?
Not that the Barry admin has ever worried about complying with the Constitution. I don’t know what’s worse: Are they too stupid to understand these concepts, or are they so arrogant that they think they are not subject to the Constitution if it gets in the way of what they want to do??
=================
@Joe in Albany - Joe, everyone has a perspective and everyone has a right to agree or disagree with the Government, I'm there...I get that...but for as open as I am to hearing differing perspectives etc., I have the most difficult time reading your post beyond "Barry".
Have complete disagreement with the Administration or even the President himself, but for a person who otherwise projects that care so much about the Constitution etc, you do nothing but show complete disrespect for the person who holds the Office. He is the President of the United States. Like him or not, it is the position he has earned by vote of the American public.
Maintain your positions, but if you want credibility in the area of respecting the Country, Constitution etc, there is nothing wrong with adding a few more key strokes and referring to him as President.
Jody, Iowa:
Nothing to add to what you wrote about the quandary Republicans face. They broke it. They bought it.
Pat Boston MA.
"Can I ask a question?
What is this fascination with being first?"
Haven't you ever wanted to be frist? I mean frist at anything, we are Americans, right. I think my motivation is somewhat to take the heat off of Feisty, seems like when she post frist, it brings at least a half a dozen post that are nasty at best and down right vile in the worst. Matter of fact she is a magnet for the uninformed. Like I said, it is my joke on me. Even if I am the only one to get it. I never cease to amuse myself with one of life's little indulgences. Somebody some where will get jealous, as they do with Feisty. "Why so violent, Mo? Actually, I believe that most of us here have had that same thought regarding Johntho" Predictable, Feisty, you betcha'. I don't know how the Chi town redhead handles it. Personally I just consider the source.
By the way Pat, I enjoy reading as much as I enjoy stirring the pot. Your post are excellent and are usually one of the most interesting on the page. Keep up the good work.
After President Obama made his offhand remark about skeet shooting in response to a question about ever firing a gun, a reporter at a White House press conference badgered Obama's press secretary about the lack of evidence for Obama's claim. Glen Kessler, the Washington Post's so-called "fact checker," also criticized Obama for not providing evidence of his gun usage. But after the photo was released, Chris Celizza wrote a blog post in the very same Washington Post criticizing Obama for releasing the photo as being over reactive to questions of minor importance. Chuck Todd also criticized the president for releasing the photo and spending time on such a trivial matter.
So, the beltway media demanded proof of Obama's gun use, and then when he provided it, they criticized him for wasting time on a trivial issue they themselves manufactured. In other words, the beltway media "journalists" are insane. Either that, or they really are out to assist the Republicans in damaging the President in any way they can, no matter how stupid it makes them look.
Jack, Tomas, thanks for the shout out. David W, yep, the GOP owns its own monster.
As for the Drone strikes memo, kudos to Michael Isikoff for his excellent job of digging and reporting. I have mixed feelings on Drone strikes regardless of who is President. Perhaps that comes from being older and the need to adjust to modern warfare by robot.
While my feelings are mixed on using Drones, it has nothing to do with whether or not the target is an American traitor or some other nationality, it is probably more a basic response to war in general. I also recognize that I am not part of the WH daily intelligence briefing, I am not responsible for deciding if threats are credible or not and if stopping that one individual could prevent another 9/11. I do know this, that President Obama is a man of great integrity who believes war should never be the first solution as the Bush/Cheney and the neocons believe. I know that ordering the strikes which kill has to be one the most difficult decisions he makes; I do not envy him that nor do I condemn him for it.
I do, however, find it ironic that republicans here and elsewhere now criticize President Obama for Drone strikes yet for years have been singing a different tune; these same critics had no problem with the US and its allied air strikes which killed an estimated 100,000 innocent Iraqis and many thousands of Afghan civilians not to mention the thousands of American troops dead and wounded. It is hypocritical of the right to criticize when frequently they complain that President Obama doesn't use the words "War on Terror" enough to suit them yet now complain about Drone strikes used to fight that "War on Terror".
Does this answer you question?
You nailed it, Jody. Lie down with dogs (right-wing nuts) get up with fleas (reputation for moderation, shot.) Doesn't help when you invent the term RINO to describe moderates in your Party.
Johntho- you are OUTED, you SCOUNDREL!!! You two-faced, twisted QUISLING!!!
I know perfectly well that by posting "Me frist", you are revealing your TRUE COLOURS- you are an agent of BILL FRIST, Republican of Tennesee and former Senate Majority Leader!!!!
My profligate use of CAPITALS and EXCLAMATION POINTS proves the TRUTH!!!! of my accusations!!! You are nothing but an AGENT of CONSERVATIVE CONSPIRATORS!!!!
AND FURTHERMORE-- !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(Sorry if everything is still spelled correctly; it's bloody difficult to jettison the habits of a lifetime on a moment's notice. Next time I am called by the Lord to 'out' a phony Liberal, I will drink a large glass of cheap hooch
firstfrist.Maybe a few Sam Adam's too.)!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!As I said the hypocrites will justify it by Bush did it first or worse. So the drones strikes are legitimate because of Bush/Cheney
Can I ask the opposite question Jody, if you criticized Bush/Cheney why are you not a hypocrite for not criticizing these drone attacks?
Rick lotsa # At least try to learn to spell frist.
Funny Amy calling people wing nuts, this coming from a person who would walk over hot coals for another human. Pretty nutty. You idolotors have the nerve to mock Jesus (those that worship him) and in the same breath have your little altar and religious site (NBC) to King Hussein, the living God.
I think Alan in NJ and Albany Joe kindly pointed out the lefty hypocrisy but dont worry, carry on lock step like the partisan hacks that you are.
and to keep in tradition with one who irks you lefties
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Ironic isnt it Jethro
John, I think you missed my point. I wasn't going after YOU or Feisty for being first, I was just wondering why all the talk about being first.
To those who don't like it, they should just be ignored.
That's all I was trying to say.
It's getting crazy.
"Despite his rough Senate confirmation hearing last week, Chuck Hagel appears to be on his way toward becoming President Obama’s third defense secretary. Why? Because John McCain and other GOP senators say they won’t filibuster Hagel, meaning that all he needs is a simple of majority of U.S. senators to win confirmation (and there are 55 Democrats in the Senate). The New York Times: “Several Republican senators — notably John McCain — said Monday they would oppose a filibuster of former Senator Chuck Hagel’s confirmation as secretary of defense..."
================
So all that silliness last week. It is a simple question Senator McCain, either Chuck Hagel is the right or the wrong guy to lead the Department of Defense. A simple yes or no is needed and then you can add whatever you want afterwards.
If he is the wrong man for the job, you filibuster...history be damned. You know w/o the filibuster he has the votes to be SecDef. Because you are not filibustering his nomination only goes to show that last week's display was solely for your need to have someone perform 'pennants' to you in the public square and nothing about the safety of the Country and/or the care of the men and woman who serve in the DoD.
Jody, Iowa, you get it.
UPDATE, Thursday,
January 31, 11 a.m. PT: ABC/Univision's Ted
Hesson weighed in today on the guest worker divide, writing that
business and labor—specifically, the CEO of the US Chamber of Commerce, Tom
Donohue, and the president of the AFL-CIO, Richard Trumka—are meeting to hammer
out some sort of deal. Unions are looking for a program that allows for visa
numbers to fluctuate each year based on need. They also want the immigration
bill to include an economy-evaluating commission that will make suggestions
regarding yearly visas issued—a plan unpopular with some conservatives. "I
think we can come to a working conclusion very soon," Trumka said.
So if your a gust worker and your belong to the AFL-CIO you will get a visas
to work in this country.
Johntho
Johntho
Johntho
Johntho
From yesterday to me:
Let's face it, when it comes to McCain vs Hagel all it amounts to is the bitter old man on the corner demanding his right to yell at those snooty kids as they cut through his yard on their way home from school.
caesar, how did your ass-reattachment surgery go? Any complications? You got it handed to you pretty bad by David and Jack last Thursday, and you scurried away like your tits were on fire.
Remember:
Less LMAO and more "infrastructure"... ;)
if he wants to flood something why doesn't he get to chicago his supposedly home town and do something about his bros and the gangs we need someone in office who can do something besides stir up trouble we need leadership and he aint got it get busy getting rid of the crime and educate these fool gangbangers
Pat,
It's been an ongoing conspiracy theory on the right for years that I:
A.) Work for First Read/MSNBC
B.) Am sleeping with the moderators
C.) Am actually Jen Psaki
D.) Am actually Rachele Maddow
E.) I have NO life and sit around waiting to pounce on new threads
F.) All of the above
Chose your answer wisely! lol
John,
Like water off a ducks back... ;o)
I enjoy drawing them out of their basements and into the sunlight for everyone to see!
Kaybeetoys, I'm pretty sure it was Hillary Clinton who made the comment about walking on water because he couldn't swim.
Johntho, yes I get it.
Obama will say something about gun control. And he will likely again invoke the "if only one child is saved" line. It sounds so powerful doesn't it.
“The state must declare the child to be the most precious treasure of the people. As long as the government is perceived as working for the benefit of the children, the people will happily endure almost any curtailment of liberty and almost any deprivation.” - Adolf Hitler, Mein Kampf
Mickey, like you, David and Jack off you wished you could hand me my ass....ripping the PHD's off today Mickey? Speaking of surgery, how did your gender reassignment go?
Hey do need some advice. in the event you want to meet up for Burning man, what kind of piss should i wear? Deer or Elk or just good old fashion tree dog piss? HAHAHAHAHA
I wont bring my guns I promise. I'd hate to hurt your feelings and all
You have that big project you have to oversee with those dumb Phd's so hop to it sport.
Kaybee,
you read the article right?
Dingle,
I dont understand your post. Are you saying republicans do not want to regulate the things i mentioned in my post?
Sounds like solid ideas to me. My sister is a University Professor, and is one of only a handful of professors on that campus that is outraged about the ever increasing cost of a college education, something the Obama administration has said NOTHING ABOUT in 4 years. Why?, because it his voting block, and God forbid he tackles the robbery that is happening to this generation, he's only concerned with placating the perps, and kowtowing to teachers unions, and the tenured class. The fleecing of our kids by academics is happening as I write this, and not one of you on this post says a damn word about it EVER, you to busy on your hate rails.
Pat, I knew it wasn't a personal attack, either on me or Feisty that would not be you. It is hard to tell emotion on a printed page. Mine is one of humor. Nothing else. Go read FoxTrotskys rant. He has it nailed. I will think about his/her post today and will laugh. That is what it is about. Your post are always thought provoking and that is good. So is humor at times. Especially when dealing with most modern day conservatives whose size two hat size shows in their post. Sometimes it is fun to just poke fun.
Feisty, perhaps I don't see all the hate pointed towards you, since I have most of them on "ignore". They aren't worth my time I'm sorry to say.
John, I enjoy your posts as well.
Johntho..."The presidents agenda is ambitious, .... immigration reform are has been bantered about for many years and date back to at least Ronald Reagan who give amnesty to millions of people but never go the reforms needed to control our borders.
The 1986 amnesty was Ted Kennedy's idea, and strictly enforcing existing immigration laws from then forward, promised by the Simpson-Mazzoli Act, was supposed to be part of the deal. So Reagan (who later said it was the biggest mistake he made) and Congress (Dems and Repubs alike) went along and gave amnesty to almost 3 million illegal aliens, sending the message, that if you can steal in and stay long enough, the Americans will reward your illegal acts by giving you amnesty. How strong was that message? We now have 4 times as many, or more, wanting amnesty.
So, let's give these 12 million illegals amnesty and in another 20-25 years it will be 48 million wanting amnesty. Does that sound like a good idea to anyone?
“In 1986 Senator Kennedy said, ‘This amnesty will give citizenship to only 1.1 to 1.3 million illegal aliens. We will secure the borders henceforth. We will never again bring forward another amnesty bill like this.”
Well guess what? Here we again with another amnesty. "Never again" my backside.
And if this one passes, you can rest assured the borders will not, in the long run, be enforced.
Drones - There hasn’t been much of an outcry about this beyond the civil-liberties community, because the public wants to go after bad guys (like al-Awlaki).
But the story does raise important questions: What are the checks on this power? How much faith do you put in executive branch in not abusing this?
_________
This is what the gun nuts, the believers that think they are losing their constitutional rights should be up in arms about. While they wail about sensible restrictions on assault weapons and clamor for the chance to rise to arms against a future tyrannical government, they don't mind the drone order clarifications.
Why no outcry? "because the public wants to go after bad guys..."
So hs, are you telling us that it is the lack of care Republicans have for children that separates them from the Nazis?
Thanks for Godwinning the argument when was so clearly unneeded. By surrendering early you now have the rest of the day to yourself.
Ummm, maybe because universities are run by the states or private entities? Why doesn't President Obama do something about that dog next door that keeps me awake by barking all night?
Hey Mr. President, why don't you "flood" us with some economic news or how about a budget?...oops that's right you've passed another budget deadline and no budget.
What happened to "Priority One" "The Economy"???..... What a joke.
Let's just distract everyone with a whole bunch of side issues while the unemployment numbers start to tick up again.
Sounds just like healthcare but that didn't stop him. As to the barking dog that was Son of Sam's first symptom, when he starts talking let me know.
Thanks Feisty, I wonder if I can be all of the above, or will I never achieve the honesty that it takes, that you provide daily by the way. That I think that is the rights problem with you. Being too honest. They simply cannot handle honest.
I see Dingle B has an issue with honesty. Maybe you had that coming Ding., don't know, that was yesterday, and today is only yesterdays tomorrow in my land.
John B, great article, thanks for sharing. Cheers for the added thought: "The Republican party has walked into a trap of their own construction for no other reason than a centrist Democrat finally has the guts to spring it." Perfect description.
The vine cut me off...
Don't write your reprentatives about protecting your 2nd amendment rights. They are not under attack. Don't sign a petion or send a check to the NRA. Gun reform and sensible regulations are not a slippery slope. They don't see the forest for the trees. This is the slippery slope. Call and write to your representatives tell them you believe in due process. Tell them you do not agree with "Judge Dredd" tactics. With our voices we can change this, make them aware that we will not accept it.
This civil rights violation with its nebulous meaning of "association" can allow government lawyers to become jurors on potential "death panels". Call me a liberal but unless the person is tried and convicted he should not be killed. He/she should not be killed unless he is apprehended in the "act" of commiting a terrorist act ie. cops/justice officials shoot him before he shoots or utilizes a bomb.
Alan, the SCOTUS affirmed the right of the Federal government in the 1945 decision "South-Eastern Underwriters vs U.S" and modernday federal regulation of the industry also began in 1945 with the McCarron-Ferguson act, so the Obama Administration has plowed little new ground there...other than the novelty of adopting the mandate first proposed by the Conservative Heritage Foundation and first made law by Republican Governor Mitt Romney into US law.
Ironic how virtually the only really unpopular part of ACA came directly from a Conservative think tank, isn't it?
You should learn how to spell before you claim something - also two days in a row.
"Let's just distract everyone with a whole bunch of side issues while the unemployment numbers start to tick up again."
I agree. I think it's time to pass another resoluiton condemning abortion again, don't you?
"I enjoy drawing them out of their basements and into the sunlight for everyone to see!"
And for this, Red, we are greatful and appreciative. Keep 'em yammering!
Hs321, that was then and this is now. You do realize why people risk life and limb to come to America don't you?
I too am hooked up on the word illegal, However, we have an estimated 11 million people here who have assimilated into our economy already, these for the most part are productive people doing the things that most Americans take for granted. To try and deport that many people would be a nightmare and I don't think giving them a pass is a good idea either. The answer is someplace in between and yes the border issue needs to be addressed. If not to stop undocumented people from crossing it. It is also a matter of national security, and public safety. I think the Obama administration does have a grasp on the problem and with the work of congress to define the principles I see a path to citizenship for these people would be a benefit to all. Not an easy path or a pass. But a path. I also think that the immigration laws should be strictly enforced at the employer level, dry up the opportunity and perhaps the bulk of the problem will take care of itself.
John,
Reach for the stars my friend! ;o)
Helps that the truth tends to have a liberal bias!
JCB#'s, the first place to start in looking for blame regarding the higher tuition costs is state and federal government republican tax cuts dance we've watched for 30 years.
That constant decline in state and federal revenues has resulted in less and less money given to state's for education including public colleges and universities which means tuition costs rise. For 30 years, it has been an annual dance that we must cut income taxes (which mostly benefited the richest), we must reduce the property taxes on businesses and lower their tax rates despite the fact those businesses have been in a state for years and made big profits. We must spend lots of taxpayer money to bribe corporate businesses with incentives to expand or build a new factory in a state (cheers to the highest state bribery winner). While taxes can be too high (they haven't been since JFK dropped the high earner rate to a sensible level), this steady drumbeat of "taxes are too high" is baloney and it starves the very programs States need the most; it also has been the biggest contributor to the outrageous tuition costs we see today. State governments have reduced the amount to its public universities and colleges yearly because they lack the revenues to do anything else.
Buzz,
Better yet, maybe they can throw another 30 million down the toilet and try to repeal ObamaCare.
I hear the 35th time just might be the "charm"!
I realize I am in the minority amongst my Progressive friends, but I really do not have any issues with the drone attacks on al_Quaida targets outside the US.
I am not naive enough to believe that 'Black Ops' have not been authorized under every president, and that there are a lot of things that go on every day around the world that we don't see.
When we elect a President I think that is one of the things we vote for - that we trust that person enough to make the hard decisons.
I trust President Obama enough to make the decision to use a drone strike if it would cost too many American lives to go in and extract that person, and if the risk of them remaining alive is too high.
How do drone strikes differ from the cruise missiles launched by previous Presidents against terrorist targets? Were those missiles launched with the expectation that no one would die? The difference is collateral damage is minimized.
Why is the use of drones different from GW Bush authorizing the invasion of Iraq? No loss of American lives, and much less collateral damage.
Well finally! Looks like the Administration is going after McGraw-Hill's S&P rating agency for their role in the housing fiasco. Of all things idiotic, S&P is claiming their thievery is protected under the 1st amendment. Hope the Fed doesn't overlook "Moody's and "Fitch". They likely are culpable too. Need to get to the bottom of all this and jail those guilty. On another note, it appears early humanoids and Neanderthals did not interbreed as early as had been reported. Likely also, the extinction of the Neanderthals was caused primarily from being screwed to death by the Cro Magnons. Really messes up the establishment of my family tree. Appears now, my particular tree was inhabited by a group of ring tailed monkey's, all of whom but one, preferred playing with themselves rather than expending the energy of sexual intercourse. Well, least I can be thankful there was that one, but I haven't yet figured out how He/She did it.
Yes it is. That's the part that you have to pay for isn't it? No wonder that part, where the young and healthy have to pay for insurance, is the unpopular. All the other "freebies" are very popular because they're being paid for by someone else.
http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2012/09/rising-health-costs-undermine-obama-pledge-to-curb-trend/
The far-left is out in force this morning since Obama seems to be on a roll......per Chuck Todd.
The intelligent know better.
KKwilson#1.103: I take it one of 'em you trust told you? I'd watch it. Even intelligent people can have a mean streak. They will sometimes mess with weak minded folk.
You know you've won when you get this:
Now back to work, I can hear the whip cracking from here...
"...I'm in infrastructure..."
LMAO!
Yep, Mr. Obama is gonna "flood the zone" with numerous legsilation submitted by his Progressive surrogates:
Independence Trust," which would borrow from the federal treasury to provide low-cost financing to private-sector investments in "clean energy. "
And, if the legislation cannot "muster" support in the Congressional Halls, then off "On the Road again" campaign tour to garnish Public Opinion, sign another Executive Order, or just have his Progressive Cabinet members change regulations to meet his agenda. Meanwhile, it is the "Republican's fault".
BTW: if you cannot change an attitude about something, your just "REGULATE" the change you want.
No Micks you won the argument when you said Jack off and Davide on High handed me my ass. You do take this 'I type therefore it's true' bit a little too serious.
Perhaps you can tell me how skewed my interpretation of the 2nd amendment is. Better yet take it up with S.C.
Now Mickey you work with those lack of common sense Phd's, so you say. tell me which is it? you have a Phd too and look at your peers as beneath you (God Complex) or you're just an average joe, jealous of their choice in life to be ambitious and you view them beneath you as well (budding psychopath prone to narcisstic rage).
Both are as "American" as John McCain is Panamanian.
Both are traitors who were never assimilated into America, either culturally or politically. Both were killed with a minimum of danger to others.
Is there a War on Terror or not, because if there is, then those two men were clearly enemy combatants.
This is modern warfare, like it or not. Or do you believe we should return to fighting our battles in regimental ranks, wearing scarlett uniforms a la 18th century British soldiers?
If you were honest, you would admit that these traitors you're defending would have been thrown to the wolves under the Bush administration, and you would be among the first to defend that policy.
Well John, "pell grants" that are payed for by Federal income taxpayers, as well as "low interest" student loans, which are paid for by people like me, have everything to do with me dude. Especially when those "loans" are never paid back. Go ahead with your moronic blind following of ripoff institutions that are bankrupting a generation. States recieve FEDERAL dollars John for educational purposes, and that is a fact. Obama thinks we need to spend MORE on education when we spend more on education than any country but Austria. If the ripoffs are a democratic voting block Obama shy's away from holding them accountable because he would sell his soul to keep Democrats in power, he is a ideologue, not a statesman, and damn sure not a real leader, or he would start a campaign to find out why Universities can get away with raping this generation. College tuition has outpaced inflation by 10 fold, yet no one, including this President says a damn word about it. sell stupid elsewhere pal, we're full up on here already.
Kaybeetoys - In your mind it's o.k. to use drones to kill U.S. citizens abroad/or in the U.S. if they are judged to be enemies of the United States? Yet I see no outcry from the liberals posting on here about the President over stepping or violating the laws of the land, but I sure remember the outrage from the left over the Bush Administration water boarding 3 captured terrorists to obtain information.
I have no problem with drone strikes in foreign countries to take out members of terrorist groups, however if these people are U.S. Citizens then there has to be some kind of proof or even a trial in absentia.
Jack in Portsmouth - I believe you covered the subject well. My hat (if I wore one) is off to you!
sfcret, let me spell out my position very clearly:
Whether or not the criminal/ terrorist is an American citizen, if this person has been identified as an imminent threat to our life and/or property by the CIA/ Homeland Security/ the FBI, I do not have a problem with a drone strike to take him out.
What is the alternative? Sending in hundreds of thousands of troops to stop one man who has been identified as someone involved in planning/ assisting/ carrying out a terrorist attack? Did we hold a trial for Osama bin Laden or Saddam Hussein in absentia?
Let's get real, shall we?
Excuse me, but I wasn't aware our government was 'murdering American citizens on our soil'. I will have to have some solid evidence for that, please.
I hope I didn't get any of my 'liberal bleeding-heart' blood on you.
Johntho...I agree with part of what you said, but not all of it.
This however, "I also think that the immigration laws should be strictly enforced at the employer level, dry up the opportunity and perhaps the bulk of the problem will take care of itself." I agree with 100%.
However, I don't see it happening because the politicians, both Democrat and Republican, are firmly in the grasp of many lobbies that want cheap labor. Similar to ethanol produced by corn. It's clearly been demonstrated not to help the environment as first predicted, however, ADM is making a fortune off of turning food into fuel. And ADM owns DC.
kaybeetoys - I didn't know that Saddam Hussein or Osama Bin Laden were American citizens since the subject being discussed is if the U.S. Government has the right to kill AMERICANS they suspect to be members of Al Qaeda or other terrorists groups with out a trial or some other type of legal proof. I don't want the FBI/CIA/DOJ or the President deciding which Americans can and can not be killed by drones or by other means.
According to you Major Nidal Hasan should just be taken out and killed because he committed a TERRORIST ACT upon the U.S. (even if the Obama Administration calls it a work place incident). Also you didn't answer the question which was you one of the liberals that were offended about President Bush water boarding 3 known terrorists?
kaybeetoys
"Spoken by a sore loser. Yes, we liberals are first! WE WON THE ELECTION. Sucks to be you."
Lets see where would kaybeetoys response fit in my list?
For liberals it is all about being first. First to scream racist. First in the number of welfare recipients. First in the number of food stamp recipients. First in annual spending for a president. First in total dollars added to our national debt for a single president. First in most time passed having not produced a budget. First in the highest average cost for a gallon of gasoline during a presidency. First in dollars wasted on a failed stimulus plan. First to blame others. First to toss out insults. First to dump the Constitution. First to believe ObamaCare is free. First to believe every word uttered by our president. First not to question anything done by our president. First to blame the gun and not the person for a murder. First to blame Bush. First to accept no responsibility for anything. First to blame Bush. First to blame Bush. First to blame Bush. First...
The people who post on here are either blind,deaf or in denial. The Economy is not getting better, the stock market numbers are misleading as are the unemployment figures, the creation of jobs in the private sector is weak at best. As a small business owner sales are off and there is no additional capital for new hires, and I will not even get into the tax code,Obamacare and the rising costs of well everything. People are making less,working more and the genral public sentiment among us Independents is Obama has had enough time,we are tired of his rhetoric, start leading and stop campaigning.
The Strangest NRA Story Yet
by Michael Tomasky
One of the sure markers of the paranoid mind is the urge to keep lists. In particular, lists of enemies, subversives, no-goodniks; the pestilential nuisances, as Sir W.S. Gilbert famously put it, who never would be missed. It virtually goes without saying that the keepers of such lists are always the bullies who survive by fomenting hatred and making sure that their constituents stay in a state of constant agitation. And so it was no surprise to learn over the weekend, via Josh Marshall, that the National Rifle Association has a little list of 497 people and organizationswho are in some way, shape, or form anti-gun. It makes for hilarious reading, although it’s sort of frightening to think about the demented minds of the people who assembled it.
The list consists of 141 organizations, 228 celebrities, 27 “national figures” who are somehow different from celebrities, 37 journalists, 41 corporations and/or corporate CEOs, and 23 media outlets, all of whom are out to pry that Bushmaster from your warm, live hands. Some of the organizations make perfect sense. The American Civil Liberties Union. Sure. The American Trauma Society. I have no idea what precisely they do, but okay, it stands to reason that if trauma is their racket, they’re probably not big on people amassing large numbers of automatic weapons. Women Strike for Peace. You don’t say!
The celebrities section is a hoot. I get George Clooney; he’s a famous and influential man who dabbles frequently in the political arena and makes no secret of his liberal views. Ditto Ed Asner and Martin Sheen and Russell Simmons. I’d allow that an NRA that wasn’t at least Googling people like that occasionally to see what they’d said about guns lately would be an NRA that wasn’t doing its job.
But … Sandy Duncan? If you’re not 45, I doubt there is any chance that you have the remotest clue who Sandy Duncan is. Musician John McDaniel, apparently best known for conducting the orchestra on The Rosie O’Donnell Show? “Interior designer” Margaret Kemp? Vinny Testaverde??
On it goes in this batty vein. Tara Lipinski. Mike Myers. Mike Myers’s wife! Now, if all of these people are indeed on record as saying they support gun control, then so be it, I suppose. But really. What is the point of tracking Mrs. Myers’s sentiments? (By the way, these list compilers aren’t even good paranoiacs—the list is sloppy and old; Myers and Robin Ruzan divorced in 2007, and the NRA posted this list on its website last September.) There is no point. To a rational person. To the NRA, though, the point is that vigilance has to be unceasing and eternal. Enemies are everywhere, and who knows, it just might someday be loose talk from Robin Ruzan or Margaret Kemp that brings the walls of Jericho tumbling down on Wayne LaPierre’s delusively coiffed head.
It’s funny, isn’t it, how it’s always people on the right who keep these lists. Gilbert’s list keeper was Ko-Ko, the Lord High Executioner. Joe McCarthy had his list. Dick Nixon his. I may be wrong, but on a few moments’ reflection here I can’t think of a liberal or Democrat known for having a bizarre list of real and imagined foes (by the way, I refrain from calling the NRA’s list an“enemies list” because a) at least it’s public and b) there’s no evidence the group is doing anything to any of these people). I’m sure Greenpeace keeps track of the political groups on the other side of the fence, but I doubt the group is monitoring the utterances of Delta Burke. No—the swamps in which these fevers have arisen in our history have been almost entirely right wing
Conservative readers will have started in that last paragraph muttering about Obama’s“enemies list.” This, if you’ve never heard about it, is a story or a series of stories right-wingers made up last year because an Obama campaign website listed the names of eight men who were donating large amounts of money to anti-Obama efforts. Apparently they got hassled by some bloggers, and this constituted Chicago-thug-style politics, you see. In truth, as I wrote last year, Republicans tried to hype the story of an Obama’s enemies list for the very specific purpose of trying to build public support for nondisclosure on campaign finance.
The good news is that paranoid psychotics usually do themselves in. McCarthy and Nixon certainly did. I know everyone keeps talking about how powerful the NRA is, and that’s true. But the more they’re in the spotlight, the worse they look. Americans get it. It just needs someone to give the boulder a push. Vinny
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2013/02/04/the-strangest-nra-story-yet.html
Look for yourself Friends and Neighbors:
http://nraila.org/Issues/FactSheets/Read.aspx?ID=15
___________________________________________________________
You know there’s a damn good joke in there somewhere.
Only I reckon ‘Ol Pepe La Pew and his Merry Band of Yahoo’s are it
Seriously Lists. Damn Pepe get with it this is the twenty-first century. Hell there’s an app for all that or so the children tell me
You know I can’t wait till about 5 years from now when ‘Ol Pepe and about 10% of the NRA members and Board of Directors are fading in the 90% of good NRA folks that just want to hunt and fish and be peaceful and accommodating to their neighbors Mirrors. Bet we will all get a good laugh out of this then.
Kinda like Sarah Palin and ‘Ol Willard and ‘em. This too shall pass. You Betcha.
Let's hope they'll all be at the Funny Farm by then IR.........we have a serious problem in this country with paranoia.
It's bordering on a full blown epidemic on the right...
Great post, IR. You made me realize that the group I missed in my post is The Lobbyists. . . .
Yeh Jack don't forget the Lobbyists because that is 'Ol Pepe driving interest in all this. All the rest is just so much smoke screen, Nothing else matters much to him as long as he can keep himself in the style to which he has become accustomed. Including the interests of The Majority of NRA Members.
oh stuff
Really, Sandy Duncan? I imagine all over Hollywood today people are firing their publicists because she's on the list and they aren't!
IR---thanks for sharing this. You are right that most of the members of the NRA just want to hunt or shoot recreationally in peace. I can't believe they stay a part of this organization that seems to exist to make money for gun-makers.
Maybe a new group can be formed to challenge the NRA for the memberships.
Perhaps, The SGOA (Sensible Gun Owners America).
Independent Redneck Va.
"Help!!! The paranoids are after me!!!"
Salud
The NRA has become a twisted, grasping-at-straws organization. The only real agenda they have is to support weapons and ammunition sales, as if 300 million plus guns (which, like diamonds, are forever) are not enough for Americans to have stockpiled in their arsenals.
Over 70% of NRA members support universal background checks. The NRA is out of touch with its own membership.
Fiesty, they need You on the article about our government killing US citizens without due process! You know, like when Cheney was torturing prisoners, and You were screaming like a little biatch ! Why aren't You over there raising bloody hell You worthless Hypocrite !
I laughed when I saw You lack of participation, was really interested how Your liberal Illinois Arse would spin that one! Ha, You just didn't show up, typical liberal !
kay-whatever, As an NRA member, you don't speak for me. Sucks to be your husband, my guess.
When all is said and done,it will be the only time Obama leads as president is the second civil war
that's coming too this country.
we have a serious spending problem in this country we need to stop so much overseas spending and take care of the needs of all the uneducated baby makers and their gangbanging daddies we need leadership not more campaigning flying all over the country wasting taxpayers money
Duly Noted stanboy I guess we can put you with the 10 % of Yahoo's then. Because the NRA don't speak for 90% of it's membership either. Or was this just a comment on Kay's state of martial bliss which I'm going to ignore as not germane to our discussion today.
King Fish Your talents for erudation are simply amazing. Amazing I say. (My second grade teacher taught me to say amazing instead of bullsh!t)
It's good that Conservative leaders keep telling us their movement isn't friendly to racists, xenophobes and other assorted bigots...otherwise it might be hard to tell.
What the ACLU, NAACP, KKK, AARP, Local Government, County Government, State Government, Federal Government, SAG, Greenpeace, and others don't have lists? I know this is the computer and app age, however, I've seen more paper now than I ever did before they became available. What a revelation. Where can I apply for a patent?
@joel-989818
And you expected the Obama myopian's to actually have a shred of intellectual honesty?
Professor Jonathan Turley who would hardly be mistaken as a FOX(Faux) News contributor as he was highly critical of Bush's record on civil liberties during his administration stated on CSPAN last week "Obama is the imperial president that Nixon wished he could be"
There won't be a second civil war, because the gun nuts would not last a week. Remember, the President controls the predator drones.
hhmmmm the President controls predator drones? I just knew he had been training somewhere between 2008 - 13. And those skills of controlling drones. Video games are working just fine (snickers)
Sandy Duncan? That's too funny. I'm showing my age because I do remember her. Sandy Duncan played Peter Pan on Broadway....which is probably why she's on the "list"; everyone knows Peter Pan is one of those evil perpetual boys who thwarted Captain Hook without a gun!
I see the naybob trolls are back today. Hey, naybobbers, liberals commented above perhaps you should spend more time reading instead of stalking. And by the way, it isn't a simple yes or no opinion; it is quite complicated. My money says the conservative whiners yelping about how terrible it is for Drones to kill terrorists would be the first to demand those Al-Qaeda Americans be shipped to Gitmo for a permanent vacation, no trial, no hearing, no mercy, just lock 'em up and throw away the key. Never occurs to them to think about the fact that those few Americans denounced their country and are traitors of it. For the right-wing whiners, their view depends on which way the wind is blowing.
Let LaPierre speak for you if you so desire, stanboy. We get it. That speaks volumes about you.
I'm at a loss as to how anything I've posted on this topic pertains to my husband. He doesn't have any masculinity issues that lead him to play with assault weapons.
How about some intellectual honesty...if this was Bush or any other republican you and the rest of the "liberal" regulars would be screaming from the rooftops. I thought liberals cared about civil liberties or at least they did when the guy with an R after his name was President.
Remove the current President from the equation...are you comfortable with the Executive Branch having the power of judge, jury, and executioner? From Professor Jonathan Turley who by the way voted for Obama in 2008 and hammered Bush for his civil liberties transgressions:
To be fair, the rapid erosion of civil liberties began under Bush 43 and the hope was that President Obama would reverse that tide but so far that has not been the case.
We will never achieve a state of perfection regarding our civil liberties. There will always be a push and pull, depending upon the current situation. George W. Bush opened up a Pandora's box and that is not easily closed without letting plenty of evil out into the world.
Obama's policies have not further eroded our civil liberties. Just speaking for myself, I'm not a traitor bent on death and destruction. I didn't protest for his civil liberties when SEAL Team 6 shot bin Laden in the face. If that makes me a bad person, so be it.
@kaybeetoys
I just want us to have equal outrage regardless of the letter after the name. I speak from experience as I'm a recovering Fox News "conservative" who wholeheartedly supported Bush 43 during his Presidency. I've since evolved and believe we need to hold our leaders (D or R) accountable for any constitutional transgressions rather than be rubber stamping cheerleaders.
Point taken, jinsd...and welcome to the light!
My attitude has been colored more than a bit by having lived in some of those terrorist rat holes and having had the experience of wearing a bullseye on my back. I have family members and friends who are in harm's way living and working overseas.
R or D, it doesn't matter to me. I might be a pacifist at home, but when you're in a third world country surrounded by people with guns who hate America, there is nothing more beautiful than the sight of a U.S. Marine.
@kaybeetoys
I'm former US Army infantry who served in the former divided city of Berlin 1986 - 1990...suppose we had targets on our backs as well :0 I know our current situation isn't easy and I wouldn't want the Presidents job...Question everything is my point. I read "How Do You Kill 11 Million People" and after reading that book is when I really started to pay attention and question everything.
I'm with you, jinsd.
'Question everything' is a good motto to live by. As long as you don't get paranoid. ;)
Just wondering... does the 'sd' stands for a certain U.S. state?
OK...good...black helicopters just flew away so I can reply ;) Seriously though I'm not into conspiracy theories, truthers, birthers, skeeters, etc...
San Diego
San Diego, of course. Beautiful place. Enjoy your weather while we northeasterners freeze our toes off!
Global warming is one theory I do believe in, despite the icicles.
So much for posting that someone has a list. lmao. Clearly a dumb post
The Republican Party caved on the fiscal cliff deal. They got very little of what they wanted. They wanted big spending cuts, they got zilch. They wanted the tax cuts for the rich to be permanent, they did not get that either. What they did get was the same thing that the Democrats wanted, tax cuts for low and middle income folks are now permanent.
What a Hoot!
J. Willard Marriott,
Maybe the GOP will have better luck with ending Oil subsidies? Romney certainly was for that.
So Boehner, Cantor, join President Obama and Dems in ending this taxpayer subsidy, a spending cut everyone can agree upon!
" The actual amount of federal subsidies to the oil industry is $4 billion per year. This means an elimination of the subsidies would net $40 billion in savings over a decade. This may seem like a drop in the bucket, but as a practical matter it makes no sense to give taxpayer money to an industry that turned an $80 billion profit last year." - Politicusa
J. Willard .....So you are happy ...no spending cuts? Wow ...Greece sounds good to you.
Also ...look again....99.5 percent of the American People now have permanent Bush tax cuts...I didn't know you were all about the Bush tax cuts. Is that what you voted for? Is that the class warfare Obama was preaching? I would brag too... Our Economy just receded in the last quarter and unemployment increased. I am not sure if you read other news other than MSNBC....If we have another quarter like the last one we will be an official Recession.....again. I guess you would be Happy with this... I guess the Left can keep living in their own world ...Reality is what is ....
I'm perfectly happy with the balance that's been achieved so far...$1.3T in new revenue, $1.9T in spending reductions, NOT INCLUDING the savings in interest that would have been paid on that spending. http://www.offthechartsblog.org/program-cuts-far-exceed-revenue-increases-under-latest-obama-offer/
The job isn't done yet, but it's a good start, and a pattern that both sides would do well to emulate in the upcoming negotiations.
Anyone ever heard of quantitative easing. What it boils down to is the government printing money to buy back bonds, or pay off debt if you wish.
Every dollar printed makes every other dollar worth less. Including the dollars of seniors, women, children, the poor and the sick. It is a tax on everyone.
This country has some $60-85 trillion in UNFUNDED liabilities and the pathetic spending cuts made aren't going to put a dent in that. You can't tax people enough to pay all of that. Unless significant spending cuts are made, this country is going to be just like Greece if we have a big economic crisis.
John...Look at the Debt Meter...it is not slowing down. Where we are headed.... has to be dealt with now! Taxing the Job Creators ...will not work in a very,very ,very...weak Economy like we have now.
The accusation was that we have seen only tax increases, not spending reductions. I've proven that untrue so you seque into the debt meter and the imaginary spector of uncontrollable inflation without ever bothering to debate the initial point which I've disproved.
Thanks for your acknowledgement.
I've already stated that we aren't done working on the debt, but you've already admitted that the bigger issue is increasing economic growth. The GOPTP austerity measures would only increase the debt problem through the Paradox of Thrift. The debt is going to take time. Right now the bigger issue is not drawing down government spending so precipitously that it makes the debt even larger through falling tax receipts.
Job creators where Mike-Pa? Certainly not in America, we have cut taxes for the very rich (your so called job creators) who have not produced one American job and as a matter of fact have a net loss. Its time to tax those that can afford to pay more and get some work done in OUR country not in so many others.
j willard; you really do love having all the people to get robbed so that THE ANOINTED ONE, can piss it away. remember our founding fathers were the gun toters of their day. they realised that sometime in the future government would sell the country to the highest bidder. taxasion without
repersanitation. we are getting closer tothe same serino now when they had to become traitors to establish the united states of america. even THE ANOINTED ONE. osama does not believe he should have to follow the constatution. all you jerks votes were bought and paid for. this is the most unlawfull regeme in my lifetime. for the first time in our history we have an administration that is above the law. it sorrows me that at least half of the people in the usa would drink the cool aid if offered by obama, just like jim jones. you poor sad excuses of usa citisens.
To bad about you Jerry, Lets see what the NRA president said in 1934. " I do not believe in the general promiscuous toting of guns, I think it should be sharply restricted and only under licenses". Karl Frederick NRA president 1934. It seems like you and the NRA has lost your direction, I have a standard question that I ask people like you that think their rights are being taken away.
When does your right to own a weapon stop and my right to feel safe from YOU start? The constitution belongs to everyone, not just you and the NRA, and there are plenty of more provisions in it then the 2nd amendment. The conflict as I see it is not about guns in your case it is about your unreasonable bigotry toward this nations progress.
Johtho...which is it? ...Obama said in the last two years the Economy produced jobs...are you saying that is not true.....If it was not true ...Why the hell did you re-elect this idiot? So did they produce jobs or not?
So Obama ran on a lie according to you(That is not surprising). He said ...Jobs were created....Now you are saying no jobs were Created....NOT ONE JOB according to you.....Are you one of the Genius's that voted for him if you actually believed that?
Did you drink too much of the Class warfare kool-aid???
John...you did nort disprove anything....that is your acknowledgement. Why isnt Debt meter going backwards then? Because it isnt and with the plans on the table it won't. There I disproved your theory. Reality trumps your feelings.
John B, Johntho, nicely done!
Pretty sure North Dakota and South Dakota have two of the best State Economies in the Union....Pretty good point ....Nicely done ...thanks for pointing that out.
Makes you kind of wish every state would use this as a model of Success!!!!!
Or do you think we should look closer at ILLINOISE, Nevada or California?
mike, are you really so simple you don't understand the difference between deficit and debt, or are you just trying to confuse the issue. Here are charts showing the deficit DECREASING over time. http://www.usgovernmentspending.com/federal_deficit_chart.html
Particularly note the chart that shows the deficit decreasing as a proportion of GDP. Not only is that one very dramatic with 2017 projected at barely more than 25% the level of 2009 (Bush's last budgetary year) but it's also the most significant. I've already acknowledged TWICE that the job isn't done yet, but you're pretending the situation is getting worse instead of better. Sorry, you're entitled to your own opinion but not your own facts.
Sorry John typical of the Left to be name calling. Making an argument or an accusation that is not true.
Just because you understand we want to do a little more than slow down "Deficit Spending " ...The Right wants to stop Deficit spending. Just because you slow the "Flow " of deficit down....does not mean we are headed in the right Direction... If you go on to read Chris Cantrill's graphs a little further ...you will see Debt at 20 trillion plus by 2015.-2017.....again ...No..that is not acceptable...and to any "Simpleton" such as yourself you certainly understand ( I would Hope)...that to increase Taxes on the Rich is not going to reverse Deficit spending......Just slowing it down does not solve our problems.
John ...not pretending anything......
Fact ....The Economy Receded this last quarter
Fact....Unemployment has gone up....
Try not pretend this does not exist!
Well ...John did you read the article published by the "Extreme Left Leaning Media outlet today MSNBC"?
You should try reading it....It has a lot of good fun facts in it....Pretty much saying ...although there will be slight improvement in the Debt in 2013. The Improvement will be merely temporary: in the next several years , an aging population will drive entitlement spending higher at the very same time that rising interest rates increase the Government Debt Service cost.
The important part...which tells the real story on your GDP COMMENT ..You know where I said you didn't prove a thing.....The CBO said debt held by the Public will be bigger by 2023 than in any year since 1951 and will be at 77 percent of gross GDP by 2023 , far above the 40-year average of 39 percent of GDP.
I think you would agree this article shoots down your little Economic theory on how balance Obama's approach to the Deficit and Debt ....and disputes any of your comments made on this Blog......Again ...you did not prove a thing in your post....Today's article in MSNBC ..TITLED "CBO Forecasts Growing Debt even as Economy Recovers" just pretty much makes your blog a hopeful Left Opinion.
Aaaaand...you've just confused the deficit with the debt once again, while still providing no proof of anything.
Good luck at Glenn Beck University. A degree from there isn't worth anything but I hear it's a great party school.
ahhh...No I didnt John...read the article published by your favorite Left Leaning Media Outlet MSNBC.
The proof is in the article...go ahead and read it .
Yes, the article you don't link...probably because it shows the flaws in your argument.
First of all, you CONTINUE to use debt as a proxy for deficit. In fact you've yet to even ACKNOWLEDGE that the deficit is falling even though it's in the article to which you refer;
THAT'S WHAT I SAID BEFORE. Either you don't comprehend what you read or you're deliberately misrepresenting it...which would explain why you made anyone interested go out looking for it.
Secondly I said well up above that we weren't done with the problem, but we were making progress. We can't just stop spending money right now without creating severe disruption to the economy and to the lives of regular Americans. We got into this mess thanks to 30 years of failed Trickle Down economics, it's going to take a while to get it under control.
http://nbcpolitics.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/02/05/16854897-cbo-forecasts-growing-debt-even-as-economy-recovers?lite
What's YOUR solution, btw? I see you throwing bombs, but I don't hear any suggestions for improvement. It certainly wouldn't be the Ryan budget, that would actually explode the debt and not bring the budget into balance until the 2030s.
John the article was posted yesterday on MSNBC ...titled "CBO FORECASTS GROWING DEBT EVEN AS ECONOMY RECOVERS by Tom Curry
No flaws at all ...no secret snap shots...... it pretty much tells you that the decline in Deficit spending is temporary....and in 10 years the debt held by the public will be bigger by 2023 than in any year since 1951 and will be at 77 percent of GDP. Far above the 40 year average of 39 percent of GDP. There is no Silver Lining to this ..as you indicated you were happy with this progress..... This article pretty much tells you the "CBO"...does not agree with you at all ....The link you provided with your graphs indicate the exact same thing...as I stated before the article came out in yesterdays news.
John ...what is my answer?
Reform SS... The Baby Boomers are retiring and will over heat the system. We need to reform it so that we all will have these benefits as we retire as well.
We need to provide incentive for the Dead Beats to go back to work...we are not doing that by continually extending Unemployment benefits. I get it... we need to take care of the People that need to be taken care of., not the people that can take care of themselves... ...
Definitely get rid of the Loopholes in taxes....I believe that is common ground. I am in no way shape or form a believer of raising taxes during a very weak Economy. Lets face it... The rich people need to stimulate the Economy...if you raise their taxes ..you raise their cost. Maybe they will not hire. Maybe they will not buy new Equipment every 3 years..they may but now it may be every 4 years now. Maybe they cut their discretionary expenditures...Gym Memberships...eating out...Vacations etc.
Cut Military spending...we are not fighting two wars anymore ...Cut it where we can.
I really feel Obama Care will be an additional Tax in our system and cost us.... not save us.
Nobody really knows the Ramifications of Obama Care... I think the President should have been working on Jobs and the Economy ..not his legacy in 2009 and 2010...Obama Care . This was very Arrogant and selfish of the President.
Immigration Reform will bring more cost on the American people and cause more competition for jobs with our Union Friends( Believe it or not I am very Pro Union)...That is a big concern of mine . I can honestly say there are good arguments on both sides ..I am not sure of the answer.
I am all for Education and the money we need to spend to keep it at its highest Level. I hate that both side use it as a Political "chip". They try to make the other look unsympathetic to our Children...which is played up in the Media.
I like the move to set the agenda for this congress. The teabaggers have been screaming the last few days about why Obama is not talking about the budget when he is pushing gun safety instead. They are confused and disoriented. I saw this a couple of weeks ago and post as such on this vine. It is funny how the teabaggers think because one issue is addressed, other issues are ignored. Not true. Obama and his staff can multi-task, handle numerous issues at the same time. So far so good.
How's your OWS party doing you know the Liberal terrorist/criminals/rapist/gangs. How's the Liberals in Chicago doing sounds like the typical OWS crowd there too
Many teabag people have newer heard of multitasking.
Thanks to viknat for allowing me to expand on the points I made above re; President Obama changing the political dialogue for the better. Again from Charlie Pierce;
Markinbecker, the tea people are confused because they can't figure out how they lost control of the political dialogue. Fact is, they did it themselves. All President Obama did was hold the door and modestly intone "Proceed, Governor."

Reminds me of 2008 when John McCain suspended his campaign to head to DC and focus on the economic crisis, wanted to cancel debating Barack Obama. Candidate Obama quipped about the need for a President to multi-task!
So, P.0bama is having a meeting today with Pro-Amnesty groups.....And invited also are his BFF Labor Union Big-Wigs....Union Membership is at an all-time low and dropping....
Will joining a Union, any Union, become a Requirement for Barry-0's Citizenship Give-a-Way Program ???...
Not that they'll get a job or anything, just pay your dues and get to the back of the line down at the Union Hall...
Gotta keep Trumka and Hoffa,et.al, in Imported Caviar...While they are there, maybe Michelle should give them a talking to about their obesity....
The Citizenship Give-a-Way Program is drying up for the year and many can’t get Federal help, because the Red States Republicans (47% that voted for Romney) have all ready taken all of this year's handout allotments!!!
@job1, don't supposed you've read about massachusetts having 50,000+ people unaccounted for on the welfare rolls?
Hey Mike, shouldn't you be over on the other thread spewing your conspiracy theory about the killing of the former Navy SEAL by his buddy?
Mickey, NY....Keep drinkin' the Kool-Aid...
The truth is that many of the 47% that voted for Romney live in red states and many in the red states are the same ones that don't pay federal income taxes. However, everyone does pay some form of taxes, such as sales taxes.
Source: Tax Foundation):
Top 10 states that got the most back in terms of federal benefits and paid the least in taxes:
New Mexico, Mississippi, Alaska, Louisiana, W. Virginia, N. Dakota, Alabama, S. Dakota, Virginia and Kentucky
The States that give more to the federal government in taxes than they get in return. From 1 to 10, they are:
New Jersey, Nevada, Connecticut, New Hampshire, Minnesota, Illinois, Delaware, California, New York and Colorado.
Ohhh.....the outrage from the right! How dare unions be invited to the White House, along with others who could be affected by immigration reform! Talk about cherry picking; they never mention when big oil and coal, or Wall Street bankers were part of various policy discussions affecting them.
Hmm....North Dakota and South Dakota are probablty two of the best Economies in the Union.
I would think that all States should use them as a Model of success!
Or should we look closer at Nevada..California or how about Obamas home state....Illinois?
Well done Job1...thank you for pointing that out to all of us.
Sure, all Illinois needs is massive deposits of oil and natural gas. What sort of corporate welfare creates those?
Pennsylvania and Ohio have the same thing. So does Alaska , Texas . Louisiana .... They are not 1 or 2. Not sure what the point is...... ILLINOIS...sits at number 47(or around there) ...because well...everybody else has more....REALLY??????
Could the Republicans find a less appealing bunch than Boehner, McConnell and Cantor? I saw a snippet of Cantor this morning and he apparently can't fake sincerity very well. When they start with their "concern" for the future of our children I want to throw something at the TV. They're OK with giving tax breaks to companies that ship jobs overseas, so our children won't be able to earn a decent living, gut education so they won't achieve their full potential, deny them affordable health care so they risk the choice of being unwell or bankrupted by illness and ignore global climate change so they'll be more challenged by environmental disasters. But don't worry folks - they want roll back all the deficits they created in the first place. If they have their way, deficits will be the least of the next generations' worries.
RTFS--how about when they think nothing of holding up disaster relief or in voting for it for their districts but denying it to others, especially blue states? I guess they care about the future of corporations (which are people, too, to them).
Steeler, I really think they have no core principles other than getting elected and doing the bidding of their moneyed donors. Nothing else seems to make sense, unless the entire party is a massively delusional ego trip - as in look, look, I get to spout nonsense on national TV!
RTFS,
Agree, the only useful analysis of the GOP is in terms of psychology.
The words paranoia, delusional, obsessive/compulsive come to mind.
how is that disaster relief going? whats that you say...there are still people without power from Sandy?
Yep ...the Left delayed the Bills by stuffing them full of Pork!!! That is a fact!!.... Boy the President and Fema did a great job!!!!! The people in New York and New Jersy should be real happy with the Left for stuffing the Bills .
If the NRA want us to believe that all we need is a "good" guy with a gun to take down a "bad" guy with a gun.... Then why in the Sam Hell did the NRA NOT go in and take out the "bad" guy who kidnapped the little boy??????
Why didn't LaPierre personally go in and take care of that situation?
Why didn't JUST ONE good guy go in with their guns ablazin' and handle that situation????
Can someone get Mr. LaPierre on the phone...he's got some 'splainin to do.....
RAVENS RULE....ON MY WAY TO THE PARADE.......
Not only did the NRA do nothing, but LaPierre got up in front of the world and said that we need automatic weapons to protect us from tour own government. Think that nonsense in any way feeds the loonies that build bunkers, murder bus drivers, and kidnap children? As Caribou Barbie would say, you betcha.
.
If the bus driver only had a gun, he would have been a hero and still living
A good guy can and does become a bad guy sometimes with the squeeze of a trigger. If they cannot see that guns make violent people more effective there is no hope that they will ever become beneficial to this country. The NRA itself should be declared an outlaw group, however this is America and they too have "rights" beyond the 2nd. amendment
Viknat, or another scenario is a gun fight ensued with children being killed by stray bullets. I personally don't want to live in a country that you envision. More guns, more powerful guns is not the answer at all. Everyone armed means more crazies with guns and a return to the 1800's when gun fights were the answer. We should strive to live in a civilized society not one built on violence. Have you not learned that lesson?
Yeah, because having a gun fight on a school bus is a great idea.
@vitnat,
That's pure speculation.....
What if the driver pulled his gun and a fire fight took place and ALL the children were killed? Can you "possibly" see that scenario?????????
I thought tea people republicans didn't like Frenchmen like La Perrier? Didn't you say the French are evil?
your an idiot
What were the backgrounds of some of the most famous mass shooters of late?
• Fort Hood @ Killeen, Texas: Registered Democrat; Radical Islamic Fundamentalist;
• Columbine High School @ Columbine, Colorado: Too Young to Vote; Both Families Were Registered Democrats and Progressive Liberals;
• Virginia Tech @ Blacksburg , Virginia: Wrote hate mail to President George W. Bush and to his staff; Registered Democrat;
• Century 16 Multiplex Theatre @ Aurora, Colorado: Registered Democrat; Staff Worker on the Obama Campaign; Occupy Wall Street Participant; Progressive Liberal;
• Sandy Hook Elementary School @ Newtown, Connecticut: Registered Democrat, hated Christians;
It looks to me like being a Democrat is a bigger threat than has been previously reported. Maybe we need some laws about THAT!
Like a background check before allowing people to volunteer for campaigns? In this case they embarrassed the democrats.
If any of these guys had been 'Tea Party' , 'Gop' , or Christian the media would be ALL over this stuff
Take your RWNJ chain e-mail roll it up real tight and STUFF IT!
Truth hurts huh Feisty!!!
What about the Oklahoma bombing. Timothy McVeigh, right wing skinhead republican. Vaporized 40 day care children in the Muir Federal Bldg. Why didn't that make the list?
vik2122,
Your logic is very suspect.
but you left out one other commonality if you want to play this game.
They are all white males." Maybe we need some laws about that.."
You folks sure love your lists. We could play Santa and make a list of all the right wing nut jobs that have committed murders but that doesn't solve any problem. Oh, and if you are going to cut and paste a spamming email, you really ought to cite your source. The list was clearly created by someone with the mental acuity of a dull razor.
If that's the case, then this is gonna REALLY sting! lol
And bull@!$%# chain e-mails... don't forget about them! lol
Yes, that's right Northstar. Blackmen don't murder. Racist !!!
Wish I had the time to reply in depth like our friend Feisty but I have to get back to work.
vik: This is the filthy red heads job, she works for the HMIC, and is provided the questions, and answer's in advance! Don't give up your guns! For those of you who don't know, the Ft. Hood killer was a muslim Dem. not white!
What were the backgrounds of some of the most famous mass shooters of late?
• Fort Hood @ Killeen, Texas: non-registered political affiliation; Radical Islamic Fundamentalist;
• Columbine High School @ Columbine, Colorado: Too Young to Vote; Both Families Were non-registered political affiliation;
• Virginia Tech @ Blacksburg , Virginia: Wrote hate mail to President George W. Bush and to his staff; non-registered political affiliation
• Century 16 Multiplex Theatre @ Aurora, Colorado: non-registered political affiliation ;
• Sandy Hook Elementary School @ Newtown, Connecticut: non-registered political affiliation hated Christians;
It looks to me like being a non-registered political affiliation is a bigger threat than has been previously reported. Maybe we need some laws about THAT!
Like a background check before allowing people to volunteer for campaigns? In this case they embarrassed the republicans.
Yes most of these guys have one thing in common with the Tea Party and the GOP Cult. They Hate!
Hey, you right wing PUNKS, word is you don't mess with Feisty!!!
Nice work Feisty and Job1. Don't be too hard on Vik...he can't help that the facts have a Liberal bias.
she is just another premenopausal twit
Neither right wing, or left, just moderate....who would want to "mess with Feisty"...we just ignore her.
They must be raising the troll bridge, so the twit has to go back in hiding.
So, when are you going to start practicing what you're preaching?
Thanks Job1 & JohnB!
Feisty, from your favorite slightly right of center, increasingly moderate Guinness loving blog mate. I am staying out of this fray. For a time at least. Give em hell, I will join in later.
See, we can agree on things! ☺
It's a shame, they appear to have scurried off with their tails tucked... lol
Eric Cantor on morning Joe this morning stated the republicans wanted to propose policies that would help people. When ask what policies they would propose to help people, all he could do is talk about everything he and the tea people republicans are against. The republicans have no policies, even if they did in the end they'd be against them. The only people the republicans want to help is themselves. All the republicans have is "we good" President bad".
Mo, the Republican Party can't propose policies that would help people. It's not how they are programmed as we have seen in our lifetime.
They didn't want to help those out of work, they didn't want to help those who had no health care, they didn't want to help veterans who came home after 4-5 tours. They didn't want regulations so that the banks would be held accountable.
They don't want fair elections. They want to get rid of public educations. They weren't interested in listening to those who were against the Iraq War.
@pat, have you seen how broken Mass is?
have you even heard about 50,000+ unaccounted people on the welfare roll?
Oh yeah, The Romney staff that he skipped out on and not paid.
job -- sure you are not confusing things with obama administration tax cheats?
Did you democrats, progressives know Obama's travels for gun control cost a million and a half of our tax dollars for AFl and protection? They wont tell you that, could have handle it from the Whit house.
Gene, where were you when Bush flew to Fl, to read my pet goat to a bunch of elementary students? Was that important as trying to get a grip on this nations violence>
@ Gene,
If it save "JUST ONE" child, then it's worth it...Doncha think??????
OR, is it, only if it's "your" child???????
Look at the fools on the left who yell and scream about saving "Just One" child all the while sanctioning the murder of more than 300 thousand unborn babies each and every day in this country.
All Presidents travel on Air Force One. It is mandatory. Bush ran all over the country for about six weeks in the spring of 2005 to try to privatize Social Security. Spent hundreds of millions of dollars and got his azzz handed to him. Then Iraq can unglued and spent the rest of his second term trying to justify his unjustifiable war. What a LOSER!
vik sounds like your sanctioning the mass murder of school children. Sad day for you.
300,000? Where do you get your statistics?
Really markin. You get that from my comment ? Critical thinking not your strong suit.
Look at the fools on the right that promote back-alley coat hangar and/or coke bottle abortions and prom night dumpster babies.
noid -- don't know where vik got his stats but planned parenthood reported more than 325,000 abortions were performed in their clinics in 2010
Some people love to come between a woman and her doctor!
@ Job1
And that is what scares mental health professionals
I consider our patriotic duty to slow down Obama's legislative agenda by whatever means necessary. We certainly don't want a repeat of convoluted and complicated bills like Obamacare which will not have the intended effect. An assualt weapons ban won't get off square one in the Senate or House so I would hope the President would concentrate on meaningful immigration reform where he seems to have some support from the GOP controlled House. I doube the American people are going to have any degree of patience when it comes to the deficit and national debt. Anybody who even got a C in math knows we can't keep spending like we have been over the last four years. Entitlement reform is a must.
Reform your own entitlements stupid, leave your grubby hands off of mine. Tax the rich, make them pay their fair share and our fiscal problems are fixed. Stop taking away from me to give money to them that they really don't earn as it is the people that do their work that makes them rich. Enough of you elitist azzes.
I am afraid the teabaggers are in no position to dictate anything. The election buried them. Obama has set the agenda. Obamacare kicks in full time next year. Boo Yah!
Johntho......the reason people may be rich is the made an investment in education, got out in the workforce and competed, invested and sacrificed. In short, we earned it. People who rely SOLEY on social security and medicare simply didn't plan well. The average wage earner will pay $109,000 into the medicare fund over his/her working life but will have the opportunity to spend over $300,000. We can't keep going like this. So it appears we may have to F#%^& with your entitlements. Too bad.
Well Scholar I am one of the educated rich you refer to. Never have I take a government check in any way. But I agree with Johtho, keep your greedy hands off of my social security and medicare. I have been paying in since my first job in 1973 at a car wash and I have paid in every year since.
markinbecker.....I hope you would be open to raising the eligibility age or modifying the cost of living percentages so we can extend the life of these programs.
You probably wish you'd have gotten a C in math instead of an F Chris.
Mo....you really should quit watching Morning Joe with that dimwit Mika and RINO Joe. Actually, I am quite good at math and my stock portfolio proves it.
so you're fine with taxing the non profits, schools and universities and their professors making 300,000 a year then right?
Johntho..."Tax the rich, make them pay their fair share and our fiscal problems are fixed."
I hope you're just spouting off and don't really believe your own words.
If you took all the money all the rich in America have, it wouldn't pay for the governments expenses for even one year.
"our fiscal problems are fixed." Geeezzz!!!
And that's what we're up against. Pure stupidity. Taxing the rich will fix all our fiscal problems. This president has assembled himself a coalition of dangerously naive and incredibly stupid people.
Still arguing this empty Faux News/Limbaugh talking point, are ya? Here's a challenge for you. Name one time the President ever said taxing the rich will fix all our fiscal problems.
You're right vik2112, but the stupidity is coming from you tea people.
But I thought jobs was number one! What happened to his focus on jobs?
Kind of tough to pass any jobs bills when the Republican's number one priority is to "Make Obama fail". They used the filibuster as a tool of obstructionism over 380 times in his first term alone.
Put the blame for slow job growth where it belongs.
At least we HAVE job growth - 40 straight months of it - despite the obvious and proud obstructionism of the hatriots.
Upset, you cant really think Obama and the Dems have tried to do anything to stimulate the economy and create jobs? They have been so focused on their social agenda, there has been no time for the stalling and sputtering ecomony/jobs.
Upset,
You missed the point. Obama Said that jobs is the main priority, not me. He said it, so that he could get re-elected. The election is over. He has not proposed anything in the way of job creation since the election. Plenty of other stuff, but nothing on jobs.
He lied AGAIN is my point!
Skeptical - You are spending too much time on Fox and hate radio.
Eric Cantor's trying to "rebrand" himself and the Republican Party is like a leopard trying to change its spots. It's not going to happen. The only way the GOP will ever get a new "brand" is for voters to send clowns like Cantor, Boehner and McConnell packing.
Considering the fact that Republicans used the filibuster in excess of 380 times during Obama's first term as a tool for obstinate obstructionism, the President better have an aggressive agenda if he hopes to override the intransigence of Congress. Please support our President over the obstructionism of Congress. If you side with the latter, we'll have continued slow growth, declining educational standards and we will continue to fall behind in the all important industry of the future - alternative energy.
Hating Obama or liberalism is no excuse for such intransigence and I think it is time for the American people to call the obstructionists out for their actions. Their number one priority of "Making Obama fail" didn't work. What it did was slow recovery and prevent progress. Is that a conservative value these days?
upset....I am quite certain that the GOP retained control of the House because the people in their districts were and still are concerned about our economy, record deficits, rising poverty rate, etc. So I do not agree you can label these people obstructionists. We have a divided country. The key is to reach common ground with the GOP so we don't have to resort to petty political tactics. Remember, America is not a dictatorship. We are the united STATES of America.
But what you fail to say Chris, is the Democrats had the majority of votes in the house races. It was the tea people republicans gerrymandering that kept them in control of the house. Not a ringing endorsement of your just say no policy.
Full blown abuse of the filibuster as a tool of obstructionism over 380 times in one term is ridiculous. They filibustered their own ideas for Pete's sake. Saying they are not obstructionists is living in denial.
The republican leadership was very clear - They stated repeatedly their number one priority was to defeat Obama, not create jobs. They only ran on "jobs"- then it became "block all progress in an attempt to regain power". The failure of republicans in Congress has been monumental and the results of the 2012 elections prove it.
More evidence of what a poor leader Obama is. Instead of realisticly taking on an important topic and getting it addressed, he is going to try a shotgun approach. Just throw everything against the wall and see what sticks. It amazes me this idiot doesnt understand how much political clout he would have if he would have just focused on and fixed the economy. He would be so popular he could push anything through he wanted. He and the Dems have wasted a time in which they could have held a huge majority in public opinion.
It really bugs you our President can handle more than one issue at a time doesn't it enough.
He did fix the economy. In 2008 we were headed towards a Depression. Remember the bail outs? He also resisted drastic spending cuts because they would hurt the recovery (see the economy contracting last month due to cuts in Defense.)
President Obama is working with a do-nothing Congress. The last two years were the least productive for the legislative branch in history. All they did was say no to Obama - including refusing to fill positions he had nominated people for, just to be a--holes.
He hasnt handle anything yet Mo let alone numerous things at one time. Again a true leader doesnt just "Flood the Zone" to see what will stick. Im sure you wouldnt understand this because you have never been the leader of anything yourself.
Amy, he hasnt fixed the economy. I know it wasnt a really big deal in the MSM but the economy actually shrank by .1% last month. Annualized that would be a 1.2% reduction in GDP this year. What yall seem to think is a thriving economy just blows my mind.
There weren't any "cuts" in defense last month. Spending was just moved up to the third quarter - before Spet fiscal yr end.
This did two things.
1. It preserved the defense spending - federal use it or lose it motif
2. It bolsterred Obama's numbers on the economy just prior to the election
We need to reign in spending. $16,400,000,000,000.00 is a lot of money to owe.
but the economy actually shrank by .1% last month. due to cuts in Defense spending. The Republicans keep howling for cuts, but the President doesn't want to hurt the recovery by cutting too fast.
Housng is up, the stock market is up, plenty of signs this economy is recovering from the worst recession since the Great Depression.
If not for high gas prices, the GDP would have shrunk even more. Even I was surprised that the economy contracted in the last quarter, especially since that included Christmas spending.
Obama should join the IRA and maybe someone would show him how to hold and shoot a shotgun with smokeless powder. Only if he knew how to be a leader. The ones from down south keep lower their population with drive by shootings here in this Democrat state. WHERE IS THE BUDGET? WHERE ARE THE JOBS?
What is the IRA Shothole? Do you honestly believe everyone holds a shotgun the same way? Besides he shoots left handed, I'd bet you shoot right handed. As usual the LEFT is better than the RIGHT. I also shoot LEFT handed, the way he holds the shotgun looks pretty normal to me.
Mo, your ignorance is coming through again. You are speaking of which you have no experience. That photo of him shooting clays is horrible. Im not saying he doesnt shoot clays, Im just saying whether you shoot right or left handed has nothing to do with proper technique. He is not even looking down the barrel on that photo. He is looking into the magazine/receiver area of the gun. No way to hit a clay like that.
You ever take a close look at Obama's hands. He has little girlie hands. You can tell he has never held a shovel, hammer, or any other tool in his life. Lets hope he takes up smoking again.
Hitler is at it again. When is someone or the other parts of the goverment going to put a stop to this abuse of power. He is over stepping all of his powers and pushing things through.
Why is so hard to pass a budget or just stop spending so much money, heck they are spending over $300 million on White House upgrades, REALLY???!!!! Can we really afford that, I mean we are already $3 Trillion in debt!!!
But yes please focus all your power on taking my guns away that seems like a great idea instead of some real problems we have that he has created.
Just keep abusing your power and spending money like we have it. Great job America for voting this guy back in, GOD HELP US ALL.
Next it will be something that the rest of the people in the world loves, if you think he will stop at the guns your all as nuts as he is.
You say flooding the zone I say baffled with bull@!$%#.
Burning money and wasting time...what about the economy idiot?
Another day of working on anything but the important issues for our country. What about jobs, the economy and reducing the deficit? Are all of you who voted for this President really pleased with his agenda?
but Jim, the government doesn't create jobs...isn't that the Republican Party philosophy? Free markets, and all.
Amy-That's the American philosophy. Free markets, capitalism and our freedom were never intended to guarantee "outcomes" just give everyone the chance to succeed. What the Obama government is trying to do is guarantee outcomes and that has never worked in the history of our planet.
Amy,
Unfortunately, government jobs have been the only ones he has been involved with. What about creating employment by utilizing our energy resources? That would be a great start. The President and his administration has no real work experience and it is showing. Why would you want to give him a pass on his number issue of creating jobs during the campaign? Unfortunately he has been given a job that he is not up to doing.
Amy just let these two tea people argue amongst themselves, they make absolutely no sense.
Amy you got it. The govt cant create jobs on a long term basis. It would be nice if the left ever came to this realization. Leave the private sector alone and things will be just fine. I didnt say always smooth but the free market will always work itself out without intrusion from the govt.
Mo,
How does one automatically become a tea party member by asking why the President and his administration are not working on the most important issues when he campaigned: Jobs, The Economy and reducing the deficit?
Jim, I think we're all wondering how you square the philosophy that government doesn't create jobs, with the demand that Obama create jobs.
.
You lefty liberals crack me up. Barry now has the capability to kill anyone he wants with the drones. This is just another step toward his true colors which, simply put, is just the beginning of taking over this country just like Castro did with Cuba. Warning, Barry is a very bad man.
Ooooooooohhhhhhh!!!!!!! Monsters under the bed!!!!!! I'd watch my @$$, if I was you!!!
OBAMA:
"Our focus is jobs and the economy, right after we tackle immigration reform and take everyone's guns away from them. Oh, and hunters, legal immigrants, citizens and just about every economist on the planet agrees with me. The time is now to do something."
In psychology, the false-consensus effect or false-consensus bias is a cognitive bias whereby a person tends to overestimate how much other people agree with him or her. There is a tendency for people to assume that their own opinions, beliefs, preferences, values and habits are 'normal' and that others also think the same way that they do.[1] This cognitive bias tends to lead to the perception of a consensus that does not exist, a 'false consensus'. This false consensus is significant because it increases self-esteem.
That explains everything!
Winning two presidential elections will do that to a guy.
No surprise here. Or, should'nt be. Obama is doing what he does best.....talk. I am still amazed that, on the face, citizens of average IQ re-elected this, liberal, spending fool.
I understand coming from someone with a below average IQ as you have stanboy.
Mo you are showing all of your intelligence with a post like that. Nice of you to add to the dialogue.