"During a heated exchange with NRA Executive Vice President Wayne LaPierre on Sunday, Wallace played a clip of a now infamous NRA ad criticizing Obama for relying on Secret Service to guard his children and asked if the organization believed that every child in America faces a threat similar to that of the Obama kids. LaPierre said that they do, leading Wallace to forcefully push back against the gun chief, saying, "that's ridiculous and you know it, Sir!".......................................Wallace went on to note that armed guards in school will not protect children "in the shopping mall, in the movie theater, on the street" and shamed the gun lobby for seeking to use class as a wedge in the gun debate. He noted that LaPierre himself relies on armed security guards and asked, "Does that make you an elite, and out-of-touch elite, because you have security?" (Volsky)

Here we have Chris Wallace, debunking the NRA-promoted fallacy/fantasy that more guns will keep us safe. A gun in the home is 22 times more likely to harm the owner than an intruder. Half of all suicides are firearm suicides. Over two-thirds of all homicides are firearm homicides. La Pierre, neither President nor child of President, has his own Security Guards. As Wallace points out - even if a child is guarded in school - what about when she/he leaves the grounds? For all of our sakes, Police are for banning the sale of assault weapons as well as (the majority of N.R.A. members want) universal background checks and magazine limits.

Now is the time to stand up to the gun industry, in the name of our children.

Paul Krugman: ‘NRA Is Now Revealed as an Insane Organization’

http://abcnews.go.com/blogs/politics/2013/02/paul-krugman-nra-is-now-revealed-as-an-insane-organization/

I so agree.

Joe:

If you want to live like a Republican, vote for a Democrat.

“In effect, the establishment is taking steps to fight back against Tea Party groups and other conservative organizations that have wielded significant influence in backing candidates who ultimately lost seats to Democrats in the general election,” the Times said, adding that the Conservative Victory Project’s first effort could be in Iowa, where conservative Rep. Steve King is mulling a Senate bid.

____________

Well isn't this rich? Karl Rove, the same Karl Rove of let's steal elections, let's exploit the southern states, let's exploit the religious among us, let's exploit the white working class guy against minorities - all the while kissing the backsides of the wealthy -

That Karl Rove wants to distance himself from the Tea Party?

He created them.

Johntho, congrats! It isn't easy to be first but watch out, conservative posters will be weaving conspiracy theories about you soon.

Ron, terrific post.

The GOP Establishment Fights Back. Well, too bad, the GOP establishment let itself be engulfed with the radical right in the first place; didn't see any of them calling out the crazy birthers, the wild conspiracy theories or the insults hurled at President Obama and the outright disrespect shown him by the too many of the GOPers including Karl Rove, and House and Senate beginning in 2009. However, despite the surface chatter, remember this: the establishment GOP pretty much shares the same views as the extremists they now claim to be fighting, they just prefer talking softer and nicer. The only difference is the establishment isn't totally stupid when it comes to playing reckless with our economy.

Republicans want power but they have no soul.

Beautifully stated Ron. They sold out the United States of America a long long long time ago.

Now is the time to stand up to the gun industry, in the name of our children.

Backhouse, that is exactly what this comes down to. The future of our children is at stake and it is our responsibility to take care of them. They're depending on us to do just that.

Thank you!

Good Morning Pat:

Karl Rove is such a loser! And your Ravens won. Congratulations.

Feisty, when I first heard about that story, I just assumed it was an accident.

Ron, Backhouse and Beverly, good post, and I am sure Feisty when awakend will have one too.

Lets examine how the NRA has changed from a gun advocacy group to a group that promote gun violence in order to strike fear into common every day folks so they can advance their real agenda of selling guns. A lobby for the gun manufactures is what the NRA has turned out to be.

"I do not believe in the general promiscuous toting of guns, I think it should be sharply restricted and only under Licence" NRA president Karl Frederick 1934

How has this organization evolved to one that has a sole purpose of putting fear in men's hearts and selling more and more weapons capable of shooting 20 first graders multiple times in a short period of time. If you cannot see that guns make violent people more effective there is no hope for you.

Congrads Johntho, your number one.

Let's hope we see a lot of questions and issues answered and settled this week. As a Nation we have more important things to discuss and settle then "little" political fights. Confirm the Presidents appointments, deal realistically with gun control, and lets move on to a better place. The economy looks stronger, better employment numbers and it looks like we're moving ahead. Let's hope so and keep up the fight.

Congrads Johntho, your number one.

Let's hope we see a lot of questions and issues answered and settled this week. As a Nation we have more important things to discuss and settle then "little" political fights. Confirm the Presidents appointments, deal realistically with gun control, and lets move on to a better place. The economy looks stronger, better employment numbers and it looks like we're moving ahead. Let's hope so and keep up the fight.

"Why??

So they can tax the sh!t out of me and use my money to buy Democrat votes"

No Joe, you don't have a deep understanding of democrats at all. Democrats when spending on people, pay for that. Republicans when spending on big money borrow for it. Two wars and a drug benefit that quite frankly benefits the drug industry but does very little for seniors that have chronic health problems. This law was so costly that it has ran up nearly a trillion dollars in debt over the last decade. The wars about 3 trillion and all on borrowed money that you now don't want to pay for. Joe, I consider you a ignorant azzhole, that doesn't have a clue about the world around him and only knows he wants to freeload on the rest of us and not pay his fair share. If you hate America so much, please find a country where they don't have a government and you would pay no taxes and go there.

frist, always wanted to be frist.

Well slow down there little buddy. Your brain lost track of your fingers.

Just one thing to say this morning: HOW BOUT THOSE RAVENS!!!!!! :-)

Gremlins in First Read again. Sorry for the double post.

Well, if Rove's new action plan is as effective as the fiasco Victory computerized phone bank plan, the Tea Party folks won't have a single thing to worry about.

And your Ravens won. Congratulations.

Nope. Nope. Nope. Nope. Nope. Nope.

Forever a N.E. fan.

Who lost to the Ravens.

President Obama argued that more tax revenues – as part of closing loopholes, etc. -- would have to be party of any budget deal with Republicans

As a Democrat I would love to see the President push hard for TAX REFORMS. That would put the Republicans in a bad position of having to fight for loopholes welfare for corporations and the rich.

First Thoughts: GOP establishment strikes back

Why is the GOP always so stark raving mad, they have to go to war. The latest War On Hagel has been hysterical. They have moved from Wars on Women, to Wars on Undocumented Immigrants, to Wars on Gays, to now having the entire establishment declaring a War on Hagel. It seems their targets just keep getting smaller and smaller, along with their base.

As to the Albanian and his story and some dumb ass claim that Money Can't Buy You Love. One has to ponder the following: If Betty owns 3 houses without mortgages, has $2M in the bank, has a credit card balance of $1k, and only gets $61 dollars in stock dividends; and if Bev owns 2 companies worth $10M, has $500k in the bank, owns 2 homes free and clear, gets $6.10 in dividends and has a credit card balance of $2K; does it suck to be Bev or Betty? Just curious.

Pat Boston,

It will be so fun to watch Karl Rove take on the Tea Party folks.

The GOP is a complete mess and this will just add to their internal paranoia

Ron, I went to a talk at the library Friday night by our former Representative, Tom Allen, who just wrote a book called Dangerous Convictions, about the partisan stalemate in American politics.

The premise of Tom's book is that Republicans and Democrats have settled into different world views. He says Republicans put self-reliance above all other virtues, and regard Democratic values as a threat to liberty. Tom's a nice guy, but to charitable towards the Right, in my opinion.

Personally, I think it's just that Republicans are backed by people like the Kochs who are intent on raping the nation for their own profits, modern day robber barons without even the interest in the arts, science or humanity Carnegie and Rockefellar had.

Northstar, and we're all going to be sitting in the front row seats watching. haha

Northstar, and we're all going to be sitting in the front row seats watching.

I've got plenty of *popcorn* for the @!$%# show! lol

Ron excellent post, one thing I've observed about most republicans, is their inability to care how others view them, they seem to lack the ability to be embarrassed or even feel shame for some outlandish or inappropriate word or deed. So they always fee justified in the actions. Perhaps its a lack of humility that makes them devoid of compassion, whatever it is, it certainly makes them less attractive human beings.

It's sad that the GOP is now a Cult.

That Karl Rove wants to distance himself from the Tea Party?

We have come to expect that from the anti-abortionist party. They create them, then leave them in the dumpster, for the rest of us to take care of.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kRj-S8Aklcw

Personally, I think it's just that Republicans are backed by people like the Kochs who are intent on raping the nation for their own profits, modern day robber barons

Amy, how right you are. Where would Karl Rove be without the aspirin-knee guy, the casino guy, and the toilet paper brothers. The only thing Rove is good at is sucking money from those other rich guys so he can play politics. If those spigots were closed, Rove would be nothing but trash in a gutter.

If you can read this thread and not see Republican stupidity in full bloom, then you're a Republican. Here we have Karl Rove saying Republicans need to invest in his strategy - the strategy that led to the pounding of his party just a few months ago. Invest in failure.

Then comes the Albanian idiot who has gone so far off the deep end, it's almost impossible to believe that even he can believe the crap he writes. President Obama is so bad, so horrible, so awful that anyone with a lick of sense made money in the stock market. This is an indictment of President Obama in this inane idiot's world. Making money in the stock market is a result of the President's horrible failures.

This weekend, I was out and about in our little town. To say that this neck of the woods votes Republican is to say water is wet. They too hate Obama, no matter that the economy is booming here. He's screwed up everything don't you know. Besides that, he's going to take all their guns.

In his post above, Ron notes the chasm between left and right, between Republican and Democrat. With all due respect to my friend Ron, a far kinder man than I, the difference is not merely one of compassion. The stunning truth is that Republicans embrace unimaginable levels of stupidity and insanity. Democrats reject wanton ignorance and stupidity, and cling to the notion that insanity can be treated and that ignorance can be thwarted.

Stamp out Republicans. Educate children.

The Obama haters finally have a reason to blame his administration for some bad economic news: the 0.1% contraction of the GDP last month. But unfortunately for them, the GDP decreased because DoD spending went DOWN by 20% in January. That's not exactly the wild spending spree they accuse the imaginary Obama that exists only in their deranged little minds.

the Karl Rove-backed American Crossroads organization is creating an offshoot, called the Conservative Victory Project

If this doesn't work out for him, he's a shoe-in to play "Fat Bastard" in the next Austin Powell's sequel...

If this doesn't work out for him, he's a shoe-in to play "Fat Bastard" in the next Austin Powell's sequel...

And if that fails, as it surely will, he can always reprise the role in Jake and the Fat Man. Hint, he is no Jake!!

In effect, the establishment is taking steps to fight back against Tea Party groups and other conservative organizations that have wielded significant influence in backing candidates who ultimately lost seats to Democrats in the general election.

Will it work? Whatever, it will be interesting to watch the GOP at war with itself. With Karl Rove as spokesman the new GOP is already off to a limping start.

...how about the democrats trying to steal elections (see this last Nov 6th and the situations at some voting places), how about exploiting minorities through welfare/unemployment, and this administrations war on Christianity while bowing down to muslims? Your party isn't any better than the other.

How about taking your delusional, disrespectful rant elsewhere? Reading such drivel is no way to start the week.

Backhouse

Here we have Chris Wallace, debunking the NRA-promoted fallacy/fantasy that more guns will keep us safe. A gun in the home is 22 times more likely to harm the owner than an intruder.

The Republicans have already solved the problem of that shocking statistic. They banned the funding of all scientific studies of gun violence. It's not the guns causing the problems, it's those pesky scientists.

I love watching Republicans eat their young. Let the games begin. Feisty, please pass the popcorn ;)

To reduce the chances of extremest candidates, have open primaries 2 highest vote getter's move on to the final election.

And who represents moderate, sensible Republicans? You know, those who gave us presidents like Eisenhower (that communist who championed the largest public project in the history of mankind, the Interstate Highway system; that hippie who warned us against letting the military and gun manufacturers absorb our government) and Nixon (that liberal progressive leftist tree-hugger who proposed the creation of the EPA and, in blatant disregard of the Constitution, created it via executive power; that appeasing weakling who sat with Mao and Brezhnev)? Where ARE the sensible Republicans? Where were they the day they were supposed to vote for Jon Huntsman in the primaries? Why aren't they even making an effort to take their party back from the hands of the ignorant and the lunatic?

When Karl Rove......KARL ROVE...... is repositioning himself as the establishment's venerable voice of reason for the Republican Party by attempting to distance the party from the more radical and insurgent voices of the Tea Party, don'tcha think there might be something amiss in the message and the philosophy of the conservatives.

We are talking about KARL ROVE here folks. He didn't get the nickname "Turdblossom" by happenstance.

Good, with enough in-fighting maybe they will annihilate enough of each other that they won't matter anymore....LOL

While Obama was reelected, the Republicans retained control of the House with a comfortable margin,

And do you know why they did? Do you know what "gerrymandering" is? Do you even know that House Democrats received more votes in total than House Republicans? Don't tout the fact that your party retained control of the House as "proof" that the American people are still siding with them. They got fewer votes and the only reason there's still more of them is because your party redrew districts in 2010 so as to ensure that Democrats couldn't make their voice heard.

but has not cut any spending

Is that why deficits are going down and why in the summer of 2011, he proposed tax increases AND spending cuts and settled for spending cuts only?

Don't be so disingenuous, please.

Like the NRA, the GOP has an enemies list. The problem is, once you take away the crazy right wingers, you don't have anyone left.

Why is Rove still in the news, didn't he made himself look like a complete fool on Election Night. Even Fox News done got tired of this guy.

One thing I found missing from this article is the fact that some liberal groups (ex: Move On) are actively supporting ultra-conservative GOP candidates in the primaries because they think they can beat them in the general elections.

It doesn't surprise me to hear about the GOP establishment fighting back against extreme elements in their party. Personally, I think this is a good and overdue. While I like some of the TP politicians, many of the candidates they've put forth have been a bit on the loony side... (but, keep in mind, some of those only won their primaries due to help from liberal groups)

In reference to Rove backing away from the extreme right, all I can say is, where's the popcorn? And I thought 2013 wouldn't be fun. Maybe we'll throw in a little beer for the party while we're at it.

This sets the stage for bruising GOP primary battles in 2014. If the Tea Party candidates lose to establishment Republicans in the primaries, they are just crazy enough to form their own party and put up their own candidates in the general election, i.e. a three-party election: Democrats, Republicans, and the Tea Party (or whatever they wind up calling themselves). This will split the conservative vote and ensure a Democratic sweep.

I love it when silly minded folks like Roy say, repubs still has control of the house. Wow!! thats 1/3 of the government between congress and the white house, meanwhile Democrats control 2/3. But hey, if holding on to just the house makes you feel better, knock yourself buddy.

They got so much control that Democrats received more votes in the house on Nov 2012. How is it that democratics receive more votes but republicans still control the house. Oh yeah, that "Gerrymandering" thing.

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL

Who in their right mind believes it's a good idea to allow veterans suffering from PTSD access to GUNS?

Another gun nut, apparently.

We must remember, Feisty, it was not the gun's fault. Guns don't kill. They do more good than harm. (According to the Second Amendment fundamentalist crowd.)

When will this madness end???

When they're all done shooting each other?

Just try to stay out of the crossfire.

Rove vs Tea Party = The Dumb and Dumber are fighting...

What a load of clueless peckerheads... just quit being whores to the rich, you morons!

HAM ROVE...as Stephen Colbert calls him is living HIGH ON THE HOG..pun inteneded, on his SUPER-PAC money. The GOP dummies keep shoveling it to him faster then he can spend it...IDIOTS!!!

Hi Ihara - There already is a third party of Independents. But things should continue to get interesting.

The GOP was so distraught in 2008 that they resorted to unthinkable things, like McConnell just about going all out to destroy Obama along with his 13 friends known as the "Obstructionist 13," and they are still up to it with the 2012 win of Obama, they are so busy trying to destroy this man that they will likely destroy America in the process.

Here's the GOP's cry, it didn't work in the first term, and probably won't work this time:

2009 = OEO, Obstruct Everything Obama!!

2013 = OEO, Oppose Everything Obama!!

American 2 party system is a total racket. Without a viable truly nationalistic 3rd party this Nation is doomed. The Reps and Dems have sold us out to international capital holders several decades ago.

DB,

[The results were a slimmer bill that money only went to victims of the hurricane.]

What ?? The total of the 2 bills that passed was $60 Billion, the same as the original bill that passed in the Senate last year that was defeated in the House by Republicans.

Only 49 of 233 Republicans in the House voted for Hurricane Sandy relief that passed this year thanks to Dems.

Both bills (Flood Insurance and General Relief) that passed this year met strong Republican opposition … not for the reasons you state but because they were not paid for with reductions to other programs.

this seems to be a good development. the head of the republican snake has found its tail and is devouring it. now, if we can somehow get the democrat coyote to chew its body off about mid-section, perhaps we will find some citizen statesmen as intended by the founders to replace all the entrenched criminal political cronies of these two irretrievably corrupt parties, and we can somehow re-discover america. well, it's a nice thought, anyway.

@Joe in Albany-1902257

Loved your 1st post dude! With your attempt at pissing on some libs, you managed to point out that things ARE improving, AND that Obama gets the credit for it. I'm glad a Republican like yourself is finally admitting that re-electing Obama was a good thing. And you point out, more and more of us will be smiling as we keep up the recovery.

Thanks!!

Let the games begin. Feisty, please pass the popcorn ;)

Brenda,

Extra butter? lol

I love it when silly minded folks like Roy say, repubs still has control of the house.

Jason,

It's amazing they're able to control their bodily functions at this point! ;o)

kkwilson, ever occur to you that liberals like Ron don't hate republicans...they just hate what the GOP has become? I'm a democrat, used to be a republican until the middle of Reagan's first term. Gave up the GOP when it became obvious they no longer were the party of fiscal responsibility while having compassion but instead the party of unfunded spending by the trillions with no heart.

Roy Wilson -- While I am no fan of QE I do hope these guys can wind it down with little impact.

Why do you desperately WANT and WISH for the opposite?

A perfect example of the hypocrisy of the right can be found in Roy's statement below:

The Chinese are no longer buying our Debt

That should please you righty tighties. You've been complaining about them owning 10% of our Debt for years.

"the establishment-backed candidates haven’t always succeeded in general elections, either. After all, folks like Denny Rehberg in Montana and Rick Berg in North Dakota also lost winnable races last year." [from the article]

Of course, perhaps the reason the "mainstream" candidates lost was because the Tea Party nut jobs made all Republican's look crazy, especially since so many of prominent Republicans refused to openly and clearly disassociate themselves from those views. I used to be a Republican until it became too embarrassing. It is a shame that the GOP is imploding because this country NEEDS two viable, vigorous parties. Neither party should think that it has a lock on power.

Chris - I always enjoy reading your posts and decided to finally mention it. You have a way with words. :)

"If you want to live like a Republican, vote Democratic!"

President Harry S. Truman actually coined this clever phrase back in the Forties.....But who has the better record when it comes to the economy while controlling the White House?

The truth (Are you ready for this?) is that prosperity favors the Democratic ticket from an historical basis. Republican presidents have had more recessions while on their watch, too, but for some reason, once again, this message may not resonate across the entire political spectrum.

A recent Bloomberg study analyzed stock returns for the past 50 years, carefully segregating results according to which party controlled the White House over the period. Investing $1,000 at the beginning would have been worth $10,920 in today’s terms for Democrats, yet only $2,087 for the Republican side of the ledger.

What about jobs? Who was superior performer on that front? As a follow up, Bloomberg was curious about the same question and produced a sequel that addressed the job creation front. During Democratic tenures in office, private-sector job growth exceeded 150,000 per month, while the Republican record stood at a paltry 71,000 figure. What about federal, state and local government employment? It was a dead-heat tie, dispelling the myth that Republicans are somehow tough on government, while Democrats are wild “tax-and-spend” aficionados.

http://www.allvoices.com/contributed-news/13212071-if-you-want-to-live-like-a-republican-vote-democratic

And have voted in every election since then: both midterm and presidential. Always voted Republican even when I had to really hold my nose to do so.

Hmm...too bad that you had to hold your nose. That should have been a clue. Had it ever occurred to you that perhaps you should have become more involved in your party's choice of candidates? Too late now...but you still have the ultra-right-wing Tea people. They are destined to disappear from the political landscape like the dinosaurs they are, but you'll always have memories of the glory days. ;)

I supported my candidate, Barack Obama, with heartfelt enthusiasm not because he was a Democrat but because he's smart, level-headed, forward-looking, and puts the good of the country ahead of his own power and glory. Maybe you should look for a candidate who does the same.

You won't find that person in the ranks of the GOP or TP.

Did anyone see the picture in yesterday's paper with Barry firing a shotgun??

Has anyone seen any articles in the papers yesterday, banning the ownership of shotguns? Thought not.

Nice post, DF. Let's see Roy Wilson try to skew that DATA. Ha!

Ah hell! What a pot full! Rove is a sorry son-of-a-bitch out hustling. The difference between "branch rinsed" or "Stump whupped Chitlins", is relative only to where the residuals are stuck. Doesn't matter if the harvest came from slop suckers or corn crackers, you eat 'em you gonna get some sh^t. Republicans are republicans. All of 'em are crazy as hell, with the only break in commonality being differences in origination. These being topographical particulars relative to hells north and more slovenly southern neighborhoods.

lol and what do you call what you post here? But thanks for making my monday morning, is a cheery way to start the day knowing that I got under you skin with facts!

You flatter yourself.

It's amazing they're able to control their bodily functions at this point! ;o)

...except they aren't. That's why ProBusiness has to hold his nose. ;)

GOP didn't vote against the victims in Sandy they voted against all the pork stuffed in the bill that had nothing to do with recovery or storm damage. The GOP as inept as it has been lately is the only thing stopping this coutbry from already collapsing under a no budget spend it all mentality. Money does not grow on trees and the media would have you believe. The stupid people watching and believing the news don't own businesses and don't understand you can't spend and spend with no money coming in. THose who receive checks form the government will soon find out what 'un-sustainability means' and those poor folks will come knocking or kicking your door in for those things which the Gov. can't give them anymore. Parasites will be parasites. Knowledge is power...hence...the lack of knowledge that permeates our culture these days. Democrats and Republicans are both parties of corruption I just voted for the lesser of the two evils IMO. This two party system and elitist manipulating needs to fail so America can be successful again.

"Its mission: to spend money in GOP primaries to make sure that candidates like Todd Akin, Richard Mourdock, Sharron Angle, and Christine O'Donnell don't become the nominees for key Senate contests."

Someone in Republicanland finally realized that it is important to listen to the American People.

They must have hired a Democrat because there's no way a Republican would listen to anyone but their stock broker.

GOP Civil War? Talk about an MSNBC wet dream.

California Tom

Gremlins in First Read again. Sorry for the double post.

Typical lib. It's always someone else's fault.

American Girl -- While I hope more reasonable and moderate Republicans will emerge from that battle, my fear is that the true crazies will just hide their brand of 'craziness" until elected.

@dangerfield,

Your entire post is based on the theory that whatever happens during a president's term is strictly due to what he does during his term. This false with the fact that what happens in the country during a president's term is 'usually' due to the policies of his predecessor, and his predecessor's predecessor. With somethings, such as social security, that issue is due to quite a few administrations and previous congresses due to them using it as their personal piggy bank. This recession that going on now is not just bush's fault, it's the fault of three or four presidents and the policies they put in place.

You flatter yourself.

Ah don't get snippy. I'm not depressed after reading your drivle on a monday morning, so why should you be depressed with my facts? There's plenty more days to have your usual personality, pick today to break from the norm and be happy!

Joe in albany walks around every day filled with piss and vinegar, what a sad exsistance.

"The GOP as inept as it has been lately is the only thing stopping this country from already collapsing..."

Short memory. The GOP are the ones who collapsed the entire United States Economy, and they're also the ones who are stalling our economic recovery.

I think Republicans need a great big dose of Ginko.

TO: Colorado-Man who wrote:

Typical lib. It's always someone else's fault.

Republicans won't win any elections so long as they keep on with the lies.

TO: Dont_carry_it_all who wrote:

"American Girl -- While I hope more reasonable and moderate Republicans will emerge from that battle, my fear is that the true crazies will just hide their brand of 'craziness" until elected."

I thought of that too, but I think these wackos are too far out there to hide anything.

Thank you First Read for a fun headline.

However, without Darth Cheney directing the GOP, can it truly be the Galactic Oppressive Party which appointed George W. Bush as President and the stole the election in Ohio in 2004?

You have to know that the Republican party is in for a long fight. The "rising stars of tomorrow", Marco Rubio and Rick Santorrum, have repeatedly given the Tea Party faction their full endorsement, and vice versa, so they owe their positions to the Tea Nuts.

With the super-ultra conservative fleas wagging the GOP dog, electable moderates like Jon Huntsman have no opportunity. Even Ronald Reagan would be rejected by this Republican party.

Until the GOP fully rids itself of its total rejection of anything that is not totally socially and fiscally conservative an decides that compromise is part of governing, it will not win the White House.

The latest political balloon floated, eliminating the winner take all in certain states, would ensure the end of electoral college and the end of the GOP. Americans truly don't like to have people win by cheating. That is why George W. Bush will never be seen as a legitimate President.

Seems Albanian Joe can never seem to find anything positive to post on here each day. Hey, Joe- let me help you out with two words this sunny morning: Chris Wallace.

There y' go, sport! Enjoy!!

Gov Bobby Jindal was onto something with stateing, "We havta Stop being the STUPID Party"!

Timeline for RNC 2009-2010, Micheal Steele presided over the BIGGEST gain in Congress in American History, $hitcanned for Reince Prebus 2011-to present(just re-elected), who presided over giving back the Gains from Steeles rein, to LOSSES in 2012!

Then the GOP brings back TurdBlossom to resurrect Days gone By. Just the premise of whats to come in the Near Future for the GOP brand is enough to bring Tears to Stewart & Colbert, with endless possibilities of Comedy Shows for the forseeable Future.

As someone above posted" Pop the PopCorn Fiesty", this is gonna be Absolutely Hillarious.

You Betcha!

Occupy SoggyBottom!

This article talks of the "shellacking" the GOP took in 2012. They lost the presidency 51% to 49%.....that's a "shellacking"?????? Gotta love lib "journalists"!

Money does not grow on trees and the media would have you believe.

@Jedi - that is a silly idiom, because when it comes down to the fundamentals of monetary system, it does indeed grow on trees. A monetary system is only as good as the backers of said system, whether it be supported by government, bankers, the mafia, or the Knights Templar.

I think Ron in Indiana is one of those low information voters. I think it was Ben Franklin that said "They that can give up essential liberty to obain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety". I live in Indiana and believe one Mourdock is worth 10 Lugars. Compromise has gotten us where we are we need Republicans who can stand their ground like Ted Cruz, not wanna be Democrats like Lugar.

I'm so sick of this gun control BS the states with the strictest gun control are the states with the biggest problem doesn't that tell these people anything? Crooks are cowards if they know that they won't be challenged they have problems in shooting you.

hey lost the presidency 51% to 49%.....that's a "shellacking"??????

Considering Karl Rove guaranteed 53% of the vote, I'd say he was shellacked when he only got 49%.

"This recession that going on now is not just bush's fault, it's the fault of three or four presidents and the policies they put in place."

AlexM, Yes it is, when Bush took over he had a balanced budget, actually a budget surplus, and a robust economy. Didn't take him long to fall into the republican borrow and spend philosophy that has us where we are today. Both Clinton and Obama had and has put policies in place that correct the republican corruption.

Johntho

Democrats when spending on people, pay for that. Republicans when spending on big money borrow for it.

As a percentage of GDP there is more publicly held debt (which means China) under Obama than any time since WW2. He has literally borrowed more money than every other President combined. Do you guys ever let any actual FACTS influence your opinions at all? Seriously, how do you guys fail to notice how stupid this @!$%# makes you look?? Or do you just not care as long as their are other idiots out there patting your back??

TO: spider-737231 who wrote:

"This article talks of the "shellacking" the GOP took in 2012. They lost the presidency 51% to 49%.....that's a "shellacking"?????? Gotta love lib "journalists"!"

Keep it up Spider, so long as Republicans continue to refuse to get the message, they'll continue to lose elections.

Actually red devil, Romney only got 47% of the vote, it was a good ol' fashion republican slapdown.

And backcountry, if you were honest, which not very many right wing nuts like you are, you would know that the spending is paying the bills run up by Bush. Not new spending as you stinking fascist would like to make it. Speaking of stupid, run to a mirror and point a finger at the azzhole in in, he is stupid.

spider-737231

This article talks of the "shellacking" the GOP took in 2012. They lost the presidency 51% to 49%.....that's a "shellacking"?????? Gotta love lib "journalists"!

In point of fact, eightlegs, Obama beat Romney 51% to 47%.

Having a hard time breathing under that coat of shellack?

I think it was Ben Franklin that said "They that can give up essential liberty to obain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety"

Well, either it was or it wasn't Ben Franklin. Let's help the prima donna out.

They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety.

• This was written by Franklin, within quotation marks but is generally accepted as his original thought, sometime shortly before February 17, 1775 as part of his notes for a proposition at the Pennsylvania Assembly, as published in Memoirs of the life and writings of Benjamin Franklin (1818). A variant of this was published as:
  • Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety.
    • This was used as a motto on the title page of An Historical Review of the Constitution and Government of Pennsylvania. (1759); the book was published by Franklin; its author was Richard Jackson, but Franklin did claim responsibility for some small excerpts that were used in it. http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Benjamin_Franklin

And for the donniechallenged, here is a great interpretation of the context of the statement.

The quote is of Benjamin Franklin, in a reply to the Pennsylvania Governor in 1755, and is often taken out of context. We were a part of the British Empire at the time, fighting alongside them in the French and Indian War, and in no way considering independence or a Constitution. Franklin was quite serious in arguing that the colonies needed to unite themselves in common defense against the French and native tribes, however.

In the modern day, the quote is usually used as a clever warning against sacrificing individual freedoms for more security, as often times, the security is an illusion and the freedom valuable. So you lose in the exchange.

You can also find the quote inscribed on a plaque inside the stairwell of the Statue of Liberty (little trivia for you there). http://www.enotes.com/history/discuss/what-does-this-quote-mean-they-that-can-give--84001

Crooks are cowards if they know that they won't be challenged they have problems in shooting you.

Donna, you have contradicted yourself.

Please tell us you do not own a gun.

In point of fact, eightlegs, Obama beat Romney 51% to 47%.

Yes, we all know it was 47%, but the counting system on the part of the GOP always rounds it to 49%. Either way is was a shellacking, so I let them keep thinking it was 49% to help soothe their shellacked egos.

Johntho

And backcountry, if you were honest, which not very many right wing nuts like you are, you would know that the spending is paying the bills run up by Bush. Not new spending as you stinking fascist would like to make it. Speaking of stupid, run to a mirror and point a finger at the azzhole in in, he is stupid.

ROTFLMAO!! Gee and what "bills" are those EXACTLY?? The tax cuts that Obama has extended the past 4 years? Seriously, I want some details so that you can prove you're not just another parrot with no clue what the @!$%# you're talking about. I dare you to prove that you're not the idiot you appear to be! But I won't be holding my breath as I'm sure all I will get in response is more inept blathering.

And btw, I'm not "right wing", I'm a libertarian which means I can see the BS in BOTH parties unlike you lemmings who are actually stupid enough to buy into the con that it is just the "other guys" causing all the problems.

Thanks RedDev!

Turdblossom vs. the Tea Party? Oh my.... this is going to be good. Looks like D'oh boy has decided to take on a rival he might actually be able to outsmart for a change. :)

Ron Indiana

how do you feel about these Democrats? Hearts of Gold Huh?

Hr-2206. Aid for Katrina victims.

Democrats that voted against helping them

Boxer CA, Clinton NY, Dodd CT, Whitehouse RI, Feingold WI, Kennedy MA, Kerry , Wyden OR, Leahy VT, Obama IL.

McCain presented an immigration reform bill in 2007 so you saying he has just become interested is false.

I think it's been clear for some time that the "Republican Base" wants to 'stand ground' that the majority of Americans don't even remotely consider 21st Century. "Allowing" women the vote sent firestorms of outrage at the time - even now there are those that just don't see the sense in such a policy.

Carl Rove lives in his own universe - one where the tail should rightly wag the dog. The dog is an immoral, ignorant mass that neither deserves to determine its own fate, nor recognizes the wisdom of the tail. His rant on Fox on election night was profoundly embarrassing, denying that the American voters had either the sense or the right to elect a candidate not of his personal choice. He has no idea what America was intended to be, let alone what it is.

Those hysterically concerned about a 'runaway government' should focus on the Rove's, the Koch's, and the Norquist's. They've demonstrated, frightfully clearly, they prefer to purchase candidates that will pursue the agenda's of hidden puppet-masters, rather than those of the the great, unwashed, American electorate.

Backcountry -- Collectively Republicans "own" more of the Debt.

11 trillion dollars worth.

HEY, LOOK, IT'S FIRST READ!

"Blah, blah, blah, blah totally off topic one party vaporhead nonsense."

Now, to the article:

Its mission: to spend money in GOP primaries to make sure that candidates like Todd Akin, Richard Mourdock, Sharron Angle, and Christine O’Donnell don’t become the nominees for key Senate contests.

This, right here, is good news for everyone.

Looks like D'oh boy has decided to take on a rival he might actually be able to outsmart for a change. :)

I've got some serious doubts about that. Witness Rove's election night meltdown and subsequent drubbing for taking donations from low-information voters, as well as the big money donors. It was always about the money, wasn't it, Karl?

What the Tea Partiers lack in brains, they make up for in sheer meanness. Beware, Ham Rove, or you'll be devoured by the cannibals.

Dont_carry_it_all "Roy Wilson -- While I am no fan of QE I do hope these guys can wind it down with little impact. Why do you desperately WANT and WISH for the opposite?"

It's never happened in the past, but I guess "Hope springs eternal".

I don't 'WANT and WISH for the opposite', but I think people should be aware of the consequences of Obama's current policies.

Don't you find it interesting that Obama increased spending DRAMATICALLY with his $860 Billion 'Stimulus' bill and his $411 Billion 'Porkulus' bill right after taking office to 'stimulate the economy, but he has not reduced that 'emergency spending' at all over the last 3 years - Spending is the same now as it was during the 'stimulus' period - which means that we are continuing to have new 'stimulus' spending year, after year, after year.

That's the REAL reason that Harry Reid has not passed a Budget for the last 4 years - it allows him to continue spending at the same elevated levels year after year with 'continuing resolutions' that authorize new spending at the same old elevated levels - no cuts required.

'Big Spender' Bush authorized spending for 2008 of $2.983 Trillion (The Democratic Congress refused to give him a 2009 Budget to sign or veto, so that was approved by Obama in March 2009). Over the last 4 years, Obama has authorized spending at the average level of $3.529 Trillion - an increase of $2.185 Trillion over the last 4 years. Combined with structural problems with entitlements, that has resulted in an increase in the National Debt of more than $6 Trillion over the last 4 fiscal years.

Dont_carry_it_all

Backcountry -- Collectively Republicans "own" more of the Debt.

11 trillion dollars worth.

WTF are you talking about??? The debt wasn't even 11 trillion when Bush left office?? So how exactly do you figure 11 trillion of it was republicans? Is there any bit of BS that you won't believe or do you just have some issues with math??

Bush Doubled the debt like an @!$%# and we heard dems (rightfully) bitching about it the whole time (including the President btw). By the time Obama is done he will double it yet again and the roles have predictably reversed. Now all of a sudden republicans care about spending and debt and it's the democrats that don't. Utterly pathetic on both counts!

Joe in Albany-1902257

Interesting Joe. The Republican Party is about to tear it's self to pieces and you post an "opinion" piece discussing how the economy is improving just not enough. It's almost as though you are saying in effect; "yes our ship is sinking...but yours has rust on the bow.

Deflection only works if you have something even remotely as interesting to point to...

Who in their right mind believes it's a good idea to allow veterans suffering from PTSD access to GUNS?

The military, when it suits their purpose.

Well Gee Joe since you are making so much money since Obama took over after losing a boat load when republicans had the oval office I would think you would have a little praise for the Obama economy. For a president who is pegged at being so bad for the business community the market certainly disagrees with that view, by every measure the economy is better under Obama than the previous 8 years of a republican in the Oval office. I am no investment adviser Joe, but the midcaps in the nasdaq is where the real action is, I am kicking tail, and yes I am a democrat with now over cool million in the market, after losing $480,000 thousand under Bush. The Nasdaq Joe, jump in, and you will not have to eat that Tuna fish everyday, and give the President a little respect Joe he has made your life much better by your own admission.

This stuff with the GOP is analogous to a team getting clobbered by their perennial rival for the upteempth time, and then telling themselves they are headed in the right direction because fist fights are breaking out on their sidelines and injuring their highest priced players.

Beware, Ham Rove, or you'll be devoured by the cannibals.

Poor Rove - he never did get his head wrapped around the phrase, "Eat Me!".

dangerfield "The truth (Are you ready for this?) is that prosperity favors the Democratic ticket from an historical basis"

Perhaps there is a logical reason for that - Under Jimmy Carter, the money supply increased dramatically, resulting in inflation of 14% and interest rates of 18% in Carter's last year (1980). The Federal Reserve (under Paul Volker) had to reduce the money supply to wring rampant Inflation out of the economy and bring interest rates down, which resulted in the severe recession in Reagan's first few years.

Democrats have a tendency to 'spend us into oblivion', and leave the subsequent Republican administrations to 'clean up the mess'.

It is no different under Obama, except the coming 'correction' will be HISTORIC because of the historic nature of the increased spending and debt. The increase in the money supply under Obama makes the increase under Jimmy Carter (and resulting Inflation) pale in comparison.

I love it. It's like watching a snake swallow itself. May both Rove and the TP get destroyed so some semblance of rationality can be restored to the GOP.

americangirl: "A nod is as good as a wink to a blind horse". "You don't need a weatherman to know which way the wind blows". I don't get it either. Haven't they heard the one about "beating a dead horse"?

I, personally, couldn't believe the headline. The Republicans appear to hate each other more than they hate 'limp-wristed', 'libtard' 'commies'. We need a two-party (at least) system in this country. When one party is as fractured, confused and reactionary as the Republicans appear to be, a legitimate 'Independent' party would be a far more useful alternative to the American public than the current GOP.

Yes it is, when Bush took over he had a balanced budget, actually a budget surplus, and a robust economy. Didn't take him long to fall into the republican borrow and spend philosophy that has us where we are today. Both Clinton and Obama had and has put policies in place that correct the republican corruption.

Honestly, don't mention clinton and obama in the same sentence. Clinton also rolled back regulations and worked with the republicans. Obama has done neither, in fact his regulations are part why this recovery is so slow. As far as obama's policies, I'm not seeing any good ones. He's major into corporate cronyism with the green companies, GE, Citigroup, etc. So he's no different than Bush on that. In fact, aside from his socialized medicine, his dislike for non-muslim religious groups and his class warfare, he IS no different than Bush, which makes me wonder why you libs support his policies but didn't support bush?

We need a two-party (at least) system in this country. When one party is as fractured, confused and reactionary as the Republicans appear to be, a legitimate 'Independent' party would be a far more useful alternative to the American public than the current GOP.

Yea, but you have to have the money to break against the mainstream media and the parties. It's really frustrating to not really have a voice in politics, and not have it strictly due to money.

Backcountry164

Here are the National Debt figures for the last fiscal years in office for recent Presidents;

Reagan (thru fiscal 1988) = $2.601 Trillion, an increase of $1.692 Trillion

Bush 1 (thru fiscal 1992) = $4.002 Trillion, an increase of $1.401 Trillion

Clinton (thru fiscal 2000) = $5.629 Trillion, an increase of $1.627 Trillion (about same increase as Reagan)

Bush 2 (thru fiscal 2008) = $9.986 Trillion, an increase of $4.357 Trillion

Obama (Proj. thru fiscal 2016) = $20.369 Trillion, an increase of $10.383 Trillion

Source - Obama White House 2013 Proposed Budget - Historicals.

Sarah, nice philosophy but after the past many years... I'm thinkin' "no hope for the wretched" applies to the rethugs

Obama has done neither, in fact his regulations are part why this recovery is so slow.

AlexM, please do share with us the regulations that have hindered this recovery. For 4 years, it has been a talking point of the GOP and Faux News, yet when probed, Virginia Governor style, we can't seem to get a single regulation that has stopped the economy from growing.

The Tea Party is highly reminiscent of the Nazi Party. It came on like gangbusters with nationalistic fervor, fear mongering towards those different than themselves; blaming all their ills on some scapegoat class of people; vowing to restore the country to it's former greatness. Eventually, it's true intentions came forward -- insult and ridicule anyone not of their beliefs, ideological dogma, intolerance, suppress freedom, and finally dictatorial rule. Leave them to their will and the Tea Party will reestablish gas chambers and furnaces.

Fortunately, just like the Nazi Party, the Tea Party is doomed to extinction. The hope is that they extinct before they cause any real damage. The GOP needs to take immediate action to not only separate from the Tea Party, but to refute it in the most outspoken means; otherwise, the GOP will also become extinct.

For Joe in Albany, you remind me of the dinosaurs -- extinction is inevitable.....

Roy Wilson -- When in history has the US implemented QE previously?

What other country's economy mirrors our special blend of a "mixed economy"?

On reducing spending. Why are we still spending at "emergency" levels? When things stabilize and the foundation is sound, then temporary measures will be no longer needed.

You're speculating Roy. In other words, you got nothing.

Backcountry -- I rounded a 10. something number to eleven. Do your own homework.

I think it is great they are spending all that cash against each other, good job GOP. The GOP trying to defeat the GOP, that should put some wind at democrats backs in 2014. The truth is Rove is not as stupid about politics as we wish him to be, he is doing what needs to be done if Republicans are going to win in national or statewide elections and not just hold heavily gerrymandered Congressional districts. It does not take a political genius to see the damage the far right wing of the republican party has done to the party as whole. The brand has been severely damaged, however what they need to do to redeem themselves cannot be established with adds, they need to accomplish something in Congress that the majority of the nation will see as valuable to them, but they seem to fight the will of the nation at virtually every turn, until they correct that course action, they are doomed to a shrinking number of people willing to put them in office. They know this, but just can't quite bring themselves to fix it, because if they do they lose the far right, and then can't win anyway. Ah yes the far right wing, republicans can't win without them, can't win with them. When you lay down with dogs, you get up with fleas, why not call your new PAC "Flea Powder for Republicans", Karl.

ROY WILSON-336103

Democrats have a tendency to 'spend us into oblivion', and leave the subsequent Republican administrations to 'clean up the mess'.

Quite the opposite has been a well cited fact for a very long time. It's strange that Republicans are still using the "projection" and "Orwellian" method of political discourse. You take an attribute of the other party perceived as positive and try to identify it with you own party. Then accuse the other party of the sins you commit.

Yes...GW Bush definately cleaned up that messy Clinton surplus.

The FIRST step in Mr. Obama's agenda to "decimate" the opposition.....and he has the Progressive media watching his 6.

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL

Who in their right mind believes it's a good idea to allow veterans suffering from PTSD access to GUNS?

Who wants to volunteer to take their guns away?

AlexM, please do share with us the regulations that have hindered this recovery. For 4 years, it has been a talking point of the GOP and Faux News, yet when probed, Virginia Governor style, we can't seem to get a single regulation that has stopped the economy from growing.

Dodd Frank for one. After that, take a look at all of the EPA (past and upcoming) regulations.

Clinton loosened regulations to encourage growth, obama has increased regulations which have constricted growth.

As much as I didn't like clinton, he was head and shoulders above obama as far as being a president (aside from not hiding his carnal needs as well as most presidents).

ldo

The FIRST step in Mr. Obama's agenda to "decimate" the opposition.....and he has the Progressive media watching his 6.

The Republican Party is digging it's own grave. All the President needs to do is refrain from taking away their shovel.

Kaybee I haven't contradicted myself at all. Crooks will always be able to get a weapon, while the government wants to make sure innocent citizens can't. Another low information voter. Enjoy your toys.

TO: ROY WILSON-336103 who wrote:

"... Democrats have a tendency to 'spend us into oblivion', and leave the subsequent Republican administrations to 'clean up the mess'..."

What a stinking lie.

I think I've figured out why Republicans lie so much. It must be because the truth doesn't help Republicans.

If Republicans ever started telling the truth, all they would be doing is heaping praise on the Democrats.

Alex M.

Are you suggesting we DON'T regulate Wall St? Because that's worked so well in the past. Personally, I think Dodd-Frank has been stripped of any real protections and was hoping for a reinstatement of Glass-Steagall, but hey I guess those credit default swaps, too big too fail banks, leverage at 40:1, among other things worked well for you.

Donna,

And murderers will never follow homicide laws. Perhaps we shouldn't have those either?

TO: ldo who wrote:

"The FIRST step in Mr. Obama's agenda to "decimate" the opposition..."

No need, Republicans continue to "decimate" themselves and don't seem to inclined to stop.

AlexM-3929653

Dodd Frank for one. After that, take a look at all of the EPA (past and upcoming) regulations.

Please provide a list of companies who have suffered from Dodd Frank. Also specific regulations that have caused companies to suffer might be nice...otherwise these are simply FOX talking points...and old ones at that.

Clinton loosened regulations to encourage growth, obama has increased regulations which have constricted growth.

And yet the Republican Party did their best to remove him from office.

As much as I didn't like clinton, he was head and shoulders above obama as far as being a president (aside from not hiding his carnal needs as well as most presidents).

You people have proven time and time again that you can get elected but have no ability or inclination to actually govern. A great example are the Tea Party Congressman. It's probably good that your party is tearing it's self to pieces. It's time to let the adults take care of the Country.

Any comments about the excerpts and link to the article I posted should be directed to the AUTHOR.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

as to the BS posted above vis a vis Katrina aid vs. aid to sandy vics...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/U.S._Troop_Readiness,_Veterans%27_Care,_Katrina_Recovery,_and_Iraq_Accountability_Appropriations_Act,_2007

The bill cited was;

U.S. Troop Readiness, Veterans' Care, Katrina Recovery, and Iraq Accountability Appropriations Act, 2007

The Real aid bill was approved 97-0...

Just a day after Bush's request, the House voted 410 to 11 to approve $51.8 billion for relief, and the Senate followed suit hours later 97 to 0, bringing the total approved in the past week to $62.3 billion,

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2005/09/08/AR2005090801081.html

http://www.propublica.org/article/the-58-representatives-who-voted-for-katrina-aid-and-against-sandy-aid

TO: donna426 who wrote:

"...Crooks will always be able to get a weapon, while the government wants to make sure innocent citizens can't... Another low information voter..."

Wierd. Republicans read the United States Constitution out loud in the well of the Senate, and STILL don't know what it says. Talk about "low information".

joe in albany, every comment you have made so far is irrelevant and ludicrous.

Sarah -- The other problem we have concerning regulating Wall Street and the "banks" that are too big to fail is that the regulations are too narrowly defined. More broad based regulations would go a long way to seeing that those that cause harm or steal go to jail. A blanket caveat should read first and foremost DO NO HARM. That would put these guys on notice and make them more cautious when drumming up business.

This thing about Karl Rove is an exaggeration MSNBC and the rest of the media bias who are following the marching orders from the White House, divide and conquer, divide the Republican Party and take back the House. Amaze me how many Republicans fall into this game. Kar Robe want to get the best candidate to win the election, nor a politiician who open their mouth and and say silly things that Democrats will use to defeat him/her. Don't fall into their game.

donna426

Kaybee I haven't contradicted myself at all. Crooks will always be able to get a weapon, while the government wants to make sure innocent citizens can't. Another low information voter.

Re-read your own sentence, then come back and tell us you didn't contradict yourself. Quoting you:

"Crooks are cowards if they know that they won't be challenged they have problems in shooting you."

Enjoy your toys.

Put away your guns. They are not toys, and anyone who cannot write a coherent sentence has no business owning one.

More floundering death throes from the party of old irrelevant white people. Rove and Limbaugh will drive the GOP off the road to die in a whimpering crash.

Forward >

@Roy Wilson-no's#1.129: If anything, the streams out of Its banks due to the progressive republican dumping of "mud, blood , and bullsh^t. While that's a fact, the water volume for most people has been reduced to half a pitcher a day, and now, people like you claim the only way to put it back in Its original banks is to break our pitchers. That'll be the gwaddamn day!

Dont_carry_it_all "Roy Wilson -- When in history has the US implemented QE previously?"

History is replete with examples of countries increasing the money supply to try to pay for things they can't afford - and in EVERY CASE in history, the result has been massive inflation.

Some extreme cases have been in Germany in 1923, when the value of the Mark went from 4 marks to the Dollar to 4 TRILLION Marks per Dollar in a matter of months. Other recent examples have been Zimbabwe and Brazil. In fact, Milton Friedman (considered the most influential economist of the last 5 years) won his Nobel Prize in Economics with his demonstration that Inflation is directly related to the Money Supply - essentially, if you double the money supply, it will ultimately lead to roughly a doubling of Prices within a few years (the other factors involved are V = Velocity - the turnover rate of money being spent, and Q = the quantity of goods and services available, which changes very slowly over time w/ productivity). The Quantity Theory of Money is taught in every beginning economics class.

I see no reasonable alternative to the following scenario;

1 - After a few years or less, the increased money supply (about 80% in recent years) will lead to dramatic inflation.

2 - The increase in inflation will lead to dramatically higher interest rates, as the Federal Reserve moves to counter inflation and lenders demand a REAL (inflation adjusted) return on their money.

3 - This will result in a recession, along with a significant increase in the unemployment rate.

4 - Because of the dramatic increase in the money supply and Debt, the recession will be historic.

5 - Politicians will try to blame any number of things for the inflation and resulting recession (greedy business, greedy unions, greedy foreigners, etc., but the real reason will be the increase in the money supply). They are able to fool the public because of the lag time (several years) between the policy change (print new money) and the resulting effects (inflation), masking the real cause.

The historical proof of the above scenario is rock solid, but the exact timing is fluid (in a recession or slow growth period, the effects can take longer, but are inevitable). It happened here in the early 1980s, and it will happen here.

Mittens didn't get 49% of the popular vote,...he only got 47%. That's about 6% OFF from "the brain's" prediction. Of course, why anyone would listen to 'the brain' now after his head exploded on National Television last election night is surely beyond me.

PS. Where were all the Good Guys with guns at the shooting range in Texas Sunday? This one's a real stumper for the Gun Enthusiasts. I can't wait to hear the explanation.

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Back Country, please read post #1.88 slowly, for comprehension. There will be an open note quiz. Don't be late.

Ido, the article is not about Obama trying to "decimate" the opposition, it is about one faction of the republican party trying to decimate the other. Ha so I guess Karl Rove has finally found something he can agree with the president on and really get behind.

SDN I guess republicans in the house will spend their time in the next Congress naming a few more buildings after Ronald Reagen, fighting abortion, and birth control, and this will boost the economy. BTW when the stock markets are at all time highs nobody really considers that to be an economy that is in the tank.

And murderers will never follow homicide laws. Perhaps we shouldn't have those either?

Laws do not keep decent people from murdering others; just as laws do not prohibit those inclined, to murder.

The only necessity of the law is the ability to mete out punishment when someone has been harmed. The ownership of a gun does no one else harm, thus no law is necessary just to own a gun. The only law necessary would be if someone were harmed by that gun, which I believe we already have on the books.

If Karl Rove was a captain of industry his performance in the last election would have resulted in his being shown the door. My question is why anyone in the Republican Party has not dismissed him given his lack of bang for the buck? I know twenty year old "kids" who would out perform him dollar for dollar in every category. So again Mr. Rove, in the words of the members of your party "your fired" and please sit down and let someone else take over.

Karl Rove...living proof that evolution is a myth.

Next

AlexM-3929653

@dangerfield,

Your entire post is based on the theory that whatever happens during a president's term is strictly due to what he does during his term. This false with the fact that what happens in the country during a president's term is 'usually' due to the policies of his predecessor, and his predecessor's predecessor.

That's a good point, Alex.

How many times have we heard the loons on this site (and even Obama himself) blame GW Bush for the horrible economic issues we have faced (and continue to face) since Obama took office.

When discussing THAT they always want to blame the predecessor.

They flip-flop on this all the time... when it's bad it's Bush's issue, when it's good it's Obama's.

What hypocrites!

American Girl-724855 "TO: ROY WILSON-336103 who wrote:"... Democrats have a tendency to 'spend us into oblivion', and leave the subsequent Republican administrations to 'clean up the mess'... What a stinking lie."

FYI - It's CONGRESS, not the President that sets the level of spending and the resulting Debt.

Who's REALLY best for economic growth, and who's better at job creation and controlling Deficits?

Since I'm neither a Democrat nor a Republican (I didn't vote for Bush or McCain), I decided to try to find the answer to that question. I started with the premise that it's Congress that sets the Budget each year and determines the level of spending in any given year and the laws/policies that affect revenues, deficits and job creation (As President Obama recently said to Congress “It's not MY job to pass a Budget”). The President is not allowed to spend a penny that has not been authorized by Congress. Congress also is the branch that is able to pass any legislation that might affect economic growth and job creation – The President can only sign it, or veto it. The analysis covers a relatively long time period (31 continuous years) so short term fluctuations are negated.

So let's take a look at the results for who controlled Congress over the last 31 years (1981-2011) (15.5 Congresses of 2 years each, during which time the Democrats had control for 12 years, the Republicans for 10 years, and there was a 'split' of the House and Senate for 9 years. The results, when looking at average growth rates for the economy, average debt increase, the average unemployment rate and the number of jobs created by political party are interesting. Here they are, for better or worse.

ECONOMIC GROWTH RATE (Average per year)

Democrats = 3.73% per year

Republicans = 5.56% per year

Split Control = 6.28% per year

TOTAL DEBT INCREASE ($13,892 Billion or $13.892 Trillion – 94% of total Debt)

Democrats = $7,601 Billion ($633 Billion per year) = 55% of the Debt

Republicans = $3,238 Billion ($324 Billion per year) = 23% of the Debt

Split Control = $3,052 Billion ($339 Billion per year) = 22% of the Debt

TOTAL NUMBER OF NET JOBS CREATED (40,630,000)

Democrats = 8,605,000 (717,000 jobs per year) = 21% of Jobs Created

Republicans = 23,239,000 (2,324,000 jobs per year) = 57% of Jobs Created

Split Control = 8,786,000 (976,000 jobs per year) = 22% of Jobs Created

AVERAGE UNEMPLOYMENT RATE

Democrats = 6.61% per year

Republicans = 4.96% per year

Split Control = 7.56% per year

I'll let you draw your own conclusions as to which party is best for economic/job growth and controlling debt, but these are the FACTS from official government sources over a fairly long period of time - 31 years – not a few 'cherry picked dates' to develop a 'spin'.

Sources;

Economic Growth Rate – Obama White House Historical Tables (2012 Budget)

Deficits and Debt – Obama White House Historical Tables (2012 Budget)

Jobs Created – Official Government Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS.gov)

Unemployment Rate – Official Government Bureau of Labor Statistics (BLS.gov)

TO: Jane?Doe who wrote:

"...McCain presented an immigration reform bill in 2007 so you saying he has just become interested is false..."

McCain represents Arizona, the State where Jan Brewer wants to "profile" Latinos and deport them on the spot if they're not carrying their "papers".

McCain's home state, Arizona, is also where they continue to have drug wars along the border, and where that so-called operation "Fast & Furious" took place.

So, what kind of a "immigration reform bill" did McCain "present", the same one as Jan Brewer's?

Donna426- "Crooks will always be able to get a weapon, while the government wants to make sure innocent citizens can't."

Now just how does a background check prevent an innocent citizen from buying a gun?

Dear Carl,

I believe that the time has come fom to get a life! It seems as if you are more interested in seeing your name up in lights than anything else. You haven't accomplished anything positive for this country in over 12 years to date, if anything you added to he separation of this country over that of Uniting US as One.

The time has come for you to put aside your personal agenda and find a life with your family as you have grown too old in many ways to be an authority on anything. Such you have proven in the past!

Please retire now and turn your self-made light off as you and it burned out over 4 years ago! Go and Live your life with your family outside of WA. DC. Please.

Please know that you are no longer a valuable asset in WASHINGTON anymore, in fact you hurt your affilation more than help it.

You are no longer welcome there as Jesters have been dismissed!!

The far right now has "Rove Rage".

They jump up & down about gun control and Barry's out shooting his own! The debts is over $16.5 trillion and has risen more over the past four years than at any time in history. Yet this is blamed on the prior administrations as if they are still in power. Go party of contradictions! Keep up the hypocrisy!

TO: ROY WILSON-336103 who wrote:

"ROY WILSON-336103 wrote:"... Democrats have a tendency to 'spend us into oblivion', and leave the subsequent Republican administrations to 'clean up the mess'... What a stinking lie."

FYI - It's CONGRESS, not the President that sets the level of spending and the resulting Debt.

Who's REALLY best for economic growth, and who's better at job creation and controlling Deficits?"

Hey, I grew up in a very political family, and most of my family are Republicans. I used to be a Republican myself.

Being that I'm at least somewhat politically aware, no amount of Republican lies can replace what I've seen with my own eyes or what I've heard with my own ears.

Here's an interesting Historical Fact about Inflation according to the government's Consumer Price Index.

One Dollar in 1970 has the equivalent purchasing power of only 17 cents today because of Inflation.

I am glad to hear Albany Joe is doing so well, he talks about eating Salmon so much I was worried he might be one of those old people living on cat food, who the republicans want to cut more from to pay for tax breaks for the wealthy. But that is not the case, Joe has made a lot of money since Obama was elected, his investments have soared, what I don't understand is his voting, and railing against the President under which he has had so much good fortune.

Roy Wilson -- You wrote:

History is replete with examples of countries increasing the money supply to try to pay for things they can't afford - and in EVERY CASE in history, the result has been massive inflation.

Again, what other country's economy mirrors ours?

American Girl-724855 "Being that I'm at least somewhat politically aware, no amount of Republican lies can replace what I've seen with my own eyes or what I've heard with my own ears."

When inflation hits and interest rates and unemployment rates skyrocket, don't say you weren't warned.

By the way - I have a question - Just what was the so-called Republican War on Women supposed to deprive women of? And please, no campaign 'rhetoric' from the Democrats - exactly what policies were proposed by responsible Republican leaders that were going to cause such devastation to women?

The far right now has "Rove Rage".

And they all sit behind the wheel of their Rage Rovers.

TO: ProFreedom-5130956 who wrote:

"They jump up & down about gun control and Barry's out shooting his own! The debts is over $16.5 trillion and has risen more over the past four years than at any time in history. Yet this is blamed on the prior administrations as if they are still in power. Go party of contradictions! Keep up the hypocrisy!"

You ought to be completely happy, as they say ignorance is bliss.

If Republicans were so worried about "debt" why is it that Republicans never paid a stinking bill in their entire existence, and never paid back a penny they borrowed from China?

In fact, World War 2 has never even been paid for. I think Republicans' only reason for complaining about the debt is because they don't have darn thing else to complain about.

Dont_carry_it_all "Again, what other country's economy mirrors ours?"

Silly question, because we both know that ours is the largest economy in the World, but if you want a 'comparable' example, we can just look at our own country in the late 1970s and early 1980s.

The money supply increased dramatically under Jimmy Carter, and it resulted in a dramatic increase in Inflation and Interest Rates within just a few years - for example HISTORY SHOWS;

Inflation averaged over 14% for 1980.

Consumer Interest Rates were over 20% in 1980.

We had a severe recession in the early 1980s because of the Federal Reserve (under Paul Volker) reducing the money supply to combat Inflation, causing interest rates to soar.

The current increase in the money supply under Obama makes the increase under Carter pale in comparison.

If you have a problem 'connecting the dots', you might consider revisiting Kindergarten.

Forrest Grump

Joe has made a lot of money since Obama was elected, his investments have soared, what I don't understand is his voting, and railing against the President under which he has had so much good fortune.

The driver of the disparity is central bank intervention, with the Federal Reserve, the European Central Bank, and Bank of England, and the Bank of Japan all flooding the financial system with cheap cash. Much of the impetus for the market rally of the past two months has been indications the Bank of Japan is about to throw conservatism to the wind and indulge in even more aggressive monetary stimulus. The value of our currency is going down and the purchase power goes along. Dollar in 2009 dons not have the same value one dollar in 2013.This is why Obama can't call China a currency manipulator, because he is doing the same. This is all an scam , and the poor get screw, the same people that Democrats say they defend.We never live before in an economy so screw, were the unemployment is going down and welfare , and poverty goes up.

Are you suggesting we DON'T regulate Wall St? Because that's worked so well in the past. Personally, I think Dodd-Frank has been stripped of any real protections and was hoping for a reinstatement of Glass-Steagall, but hey I guess those credit default swaps, too big too fail banks, leverage at 40:1, among other things worked well for you.

I could honestly give a crap about wall st and big businesses, in fact I'd be happy if they fell flat on their face. I'm concerned about small businesses, the businesses that these regulations hurt the most.

Personally I avoid big banks, my checking/savings is at a local bank (I absolutely despise BofA, the most anti-american bank around.). My wife and I avoid wal-mart, safeway, fred meyers, any of the large store chains. We purchase everything we can from local businesses, the ones hurt the most by regulations. But that's been getting harder and harder since they are being forced out of business.

Wall Street regulates Wall Street.

Problem?

:D

Same sheep, new wool.

We feel powerless to corrupt government, biased Supreme Court and the powerful "too big to fails".

The "too big to fails" are being totally empowered by "we the people".

If Americans would have the courage to join forces and shift whatever is left of their remaining dollars to small business, the too big to fails would have to listen and change, or they would fail. Aside from jailing each and every one of, the government and their corruptness, could do nothing.

I'll let you draw your own conclusions as to which party is best for economic/job growth and controlling debt, but these are the FACTS from official government sources over a fairly long period of time - 31 years – not a few 'cherry picked dates' to develop a 'spin'.

And SickOfTheBickering already pointed out the following:

How many times have we heard the loons on this site (and even Obama himself) blame GW Bush for the horrible economic issues we have faced (and continue to face) since Obama took office.

When discussing THAT they always want to blame the predecessor.

They flip-flop on this all the time... when it's bad it's Bush's issue, when it's good it's Obama's.

What hypocrites!

So, as you can see, according to his own logic, the gains that we had in Republican-led years should be attributed to Democrats and vice versa. These are yours numbers, and this your conclusion - this all came from your side.

AlexM-3929653 "My wife and I avoid wal-mart, safeway, fred meyers, any of the large store chains.We purchase everything we can from local businesses... "

Good for you - they need all the help they can get.

As for us, we shop at WalMart and Food4Less, and I estimate that we save about $3,500 per year, which allows my family to enjoy nice vacations each year and some of the other 'niceties of life'.

This site is getting bogged down - time to try something new. Bye, and have a nice day :)

Maybe Obama should park his ace in one of the two oval offices, and work on getting people back to work

As opposed to laying off people? Unemployment remains stubbornly high because while the private economy has been recovering, government has been laying off people. The slight contraction of 0.1% we had in the economy was due to DoD layoffs. Smaller government. That's what you want. When you get it, you blame Obama for it.

Sarah-3043284

Are you suggesting we DON'T regulate Wall St? Because that's worked so well in the past.

I've yet to hear anyone, anywhere suggest NO regulation. And you do realize that the last time there was no regulation of Wall Street was the early 30's right? Rich people move their money to the Cayman's because the SIMPLE regulations keep their money SAFER.

Here is the problem with the SEC, the regulations are so complex they are easily manipulated by those who are smart enough to do so. And the reality is that the smart people are NEVER the one who write the regulations because they can make more money playing the game. Regulators are always fighting the last battle, constantly trying to play catch up. The SEC with all of their regulations couldn't stop Bernie Madoff even though everyone was furiously waving red flags. They investigated him numerous times to no end. Ultimately it was his own kids who dug up the dirt that got him busted. No major monetary scandal has ever happened in the Cayman's or anywhere else where regulation is simple and straightforward.

Only government cries for more and more of something that is proven time and again to not work

And backcountry, if you were honest, which not very many right wing nuts like you are, you would know that the spending is paying the bills run up by Bush. Not new spending as you stinking fascist would like to make it. Speaking of stupid, run to a mirror and point a finger at the azzhole in in, he is stupid.

ROTFLMAO!! Gee and what "bills" are those EXACTLY?? The tax cuts that Obama has extended the past 4 years? Seriously, I want some details so that you can prove you're not just another parrot with no clue what the @!$%# you're talking about. I dare you to prove that you're not the idiot you appear to be!

Please don't try to pretend that you are so stupid that this needs to be explained to you. Those bills are the two unfunded wars, and the unfunded 1/2 trillion Medicare part D mandate. Obama is not a spender. He has no personal bank account or any government credit card. He only spends what Congress authorizes him to spend.

Our current deficit is due to the fact that the economy crashed under President Bush's watch. When it crashed, our government spending stayed the same, whereas tax receipts plummeted. This led to the ballooning deficits. As Obama has put into place policies that have helped the economy recover, over fierce Republican opposition, tax receipts have gone up and therefore the deficit has shrunk, and continues to shrink.

But I won't be holding my breath as I'm sure all I will get in response is more inept blathering.

This is a perfect example of why we think you live in a fantasy world. When you argue with obvious facts as "inept blathering", what hope do you have of ever achieving anything worthwhile, either politically or economically?

The turd has lost his blossom.

Only government cries for more and more of something that is proven time and again to not work

I have half a tank of gas, and each half tank of gas can only get me halfway to where I want to go. So, by your logic, I am stupid to aim for a full tank of gas, because half a tank of gas didn't work out for me.

As for us, we shop at WalMart and Food4Less, and I estimate that we save about $3,500 per year, which allows my family to enjoy nice vacations each year and some of the other 'niceties of life'.

Walmart isn't as cheap as they used to be. Between competitive prices elsewhere, and actually being able to understand the help, and not having to deal with rude illegals blocking the aisles at local shops, the local shops will win us over every time. Not only that, we completely don't agree with walmarts business practices.

As far as food, we do well by purchasing locally grown vegetables to compliment the ones we grow, and getting our meat from the local butcher.

For the day to day life, there really is no reason to HAVE to support the corporations.

AlexM writes: They need to worry less about this 'assault' weapon ban, and worry more about keeping ALL guns out of the hands of the mentally ill, criminals, gangbangers, etc.

In other news, we have ACA that will be forcing all GPs to hand over our medical history to the government. I know for a fact that I haven't signed a HIPPA waiver to allow the government to see my information. In fact, the only person (besides my doctor) that is allowed to see my medical history is my wife. The government needs to step the hell out of my life.

Alex, so like the true Republican you are (et al Charles Krauthammer), you first say "they" (I'll assume the government) need to keep ALL guns out of the hands of the mentally ill.....then you say in the very next sentence how "they" should never be able to find out that someone actually is mentally ill.

Are you saying we should leave the experts out of the decision? I guess you think we should have the public turning in their crazy neighbors (you would get my vote). Of course, if you have enough money, you could always pay enough to have even "experts" say you're sane.

BTW, the gangbangers aren't the ones committing mass murders.

@ Roy Wilson#1.168: In 1940 a dollar held the equivalent worth of fifteen dollars in 1970. By the end of 1973 after the Arab oil embargo it was more like one to 40 from 1940. Actually the Fed needs to raise interest rates up, within a range of 4 to 6.5 percent now, along with some targeted inflation.

Dont_carry_it_all

Backcountry -- I rounded a 10. something number to eleven. Do your own homework.

So the republican are responsible for every penny of debt up till Obama?? That was the point I was making, are you honestly admitting it went right over your head? I've done my homework, you are the one who appears to have no clue what the hell you're talking about.

Joe in Albany-1902257:

As usual your posts (This one 1.4)are full of misinformation and hate. You don't even possess the decency to call the POTUS by his name. You drop the label liberal like you know what it means which you obviously don't. before you type a bunch of easy to dispute garbage, educate yourself on the topic and then try again or better yet just leave your bar stool ranting in the bar.

Roy Wilson -- History is there to teach and learn from.

It's a dynamic world and I'm hoping that's exactly what pulls us through these tough times.

The monied interests behind the GOP created and funded the Tea Party to further their own interests, primarily to lower the pay of workers, especially semi-skilled workers. But it is becoming apparent to most Republicans that they have created a "golem."

In Jewish folklore, a golem is an animated anthropomorphic being, created entirely from inanimate matter. The word was used to mean an amorphous, unformed material in Psalms and medieval writing. Not having any inanimate material lying around the Republican Party, the movers and shakers instead used the non-thinking Fox watchers and Limbaugh fans that are as close to inanimate matter as a voter can be.

In modern Hebrew golem is used to mean "dumb" or "helpless". Similarly, it is often used today as a metaphor for a brainless lunk or entity who serves man under controlled conditions but is hostile to him under others. "Golem" passed into Yiddish as goylem to mean someone who is clumsy or slow. All of these terms seem to fit the Tea Party membership quite well.

Most golem stories revolve around the creation of this being for purposes of good (debt reduction, strong national defense, etc.) There were holy words on the firehead of the golem (show us your birth certificate) that made it strong. But as the golem grew and began to get more and more power, it came to be seen as an ugly creature than could not be controlled and served no master. Eventually the golem became so wantonly destructive that it had to be destroyed. Good luck with that, Karl!

I could honestly give a crap about wall st and big businesses, in fact I'd be happy if they fell flat on their face. I'm concerned about small businesses, the businesses that these regulations hurt the most.

Alex, please give us 3 regulations the Obama Administration has put in place that "hurt" small businesses? Do not include Obamacare because it has no effect on any employer with less than 50 employees.

All I know is that I can get a Federal ID number from IRS online in about 15 minutes and be in business. I may have State licensing requirements and/or payroll requirements (again, applied for in combination, online in 15 minutes). I also have additional issues if I'm dealing with any hazardous materials, or working in the child-care or elderly care industries (obviously).

America has to be the easiest place on earth to start and maintain a business.

So, again, give us some examples of those terrible regulations that are "really hurting small businesses".

Alex, so like the true Republican you are (et al Charles Krauthammer), you first say "they" (I'll assume the government) need to keep ALL guns out of the hands of the mentally ill.....then you say in the very next sentence how "they" should never be able to find out that someone actually is mentally ill.

First, I'm not a republican. Second, back in the day, if you were @!$%#ed in the head, you actually got the help you needed. But you liberal human rights people took care of that so that they're all running the streets now.

There's a difference between recording to the government someone with mental conditions, and the rest of us normal folks that are semi-sane. So no, I'm not contradicting myself, but obviously reading comprehension isn't your forte. Blame the DOE.

Are you saying we should leave the experts out of the decision? I guess you think we should have the public turning in their crazy neighbors (you would get my vote). Of course, if you have enough money, you could always pay enough to have even "experts" say you're sane.

Really not even sure what this has to do with anything that I said.

BTW, the gangbangers aren't the ones committing mass murders.

Ah, so we're only concerned about mass murderers. We're not concerned at all with chicago's homicide rate, or any other city with high murder rates. You do know that more people are murdered by gangbangers that by mass murderers? That also includes kids... You sound like a true low-info liberal.

Roy Wilson writes:

If you have a problem 'connecting the dots', you might consider revisiting Kindergarten.

Words written by someone who has shown us that problem daily.

This site is getting bogged down - time to try something new. Bye, and have a nice day :)

Smartest thing I've heard you say yet.

Probusiness,

Based on your comments, I take it you’re Tea Party or similar in politics. If so, you’re showing us the future of the GOP.

McCain & Romney didn’t lose because they were too moderate; McCain lost because his politics were a continuation of Bush’s and the economic melted down on Bush’s watch. He lost by association with Bush. Romney lost because he was too conservative during the primaries. But then he had to be to get the GOP nomination. And Reagan was a lot more liberal than today’s GOP: He raised taxes, he supported some gun control, he compromised with the Dems. I would wager that if the Reagan policies of the ‘80s were tried today, they wouldn’t get GOP support.

You’re showing us the future of the GOP as we will see this same scene play out.

The GOP leadership understands the demographics are changing. They will change policies and platform accordingly or will lose more members and elections. My guess is they’ll change and the far-right members will leave the party, just as you did.

Eventually, fiscal-and-social conservatives will stop being a subset of the GOP. They’ll become their own separate party with about the same clout and effectiveness as the Green Party. And just as the Green Party tends to take votes from the Dems, the new social-fiscal conservative party will take votes from the GOP.

Frankly, I’m glad the GOP will shed some of its socially conservative dogma. I’d like to have a fiscally conservative alternative that doesn’t wrap itself in God and Patriotism as a substitute for reasonable discourse.

So many excellent posts today there is really nothing to add to the wisdom already shared. Good job everybody.

Please allow me to strongly suggest you all read TEAM OF RIVALS by Doris Kerns-Goodwin. A tiny, tiny part of the book was the inspiration for the movie LINCOLN, but it is really so much more than that.

Given the Civil War erupting in the GOP it's worth reading ToR to understand just how far the GOP has fallen.

The GOP rose from the ashes of the old Whig Party. Lincoln was a Whig before he joined the GOP.
In 1860, when Lincoln became the first Republican President the GOP was the party of abolitionists. They wanted to end slavery. It was a mixed bag. Some wanted emancipation, citizenship and full voting rights for former slaves. Other wanted the slaves freed but thought they should all be deported to Africa or South America where they could form their own colony.

In 1860 the Democrats were split. In the South they were the champions of slavery. In the North they were for appeasement and the status quo.

My, how far we have all come since those terrible days.

On January 1, 1863 Lincoln signed the Emancipation Proclamation. Only 60 years later the GOP had gone from the party that freed the slaves to the party that supported "keeping the blacks in their place" as second-class citizens.

In the early 1920's the popularity of the KU KLUX KLAN swept across the country like a prairie fire. They were estimated to have more than half a million members. They staged a march up Pennsylvania Ave in Washington and 40,000 robed Klansmen participated. The State of Indiana (sorry Ron) was dominated by the GOP and nearly 60% of the elected officials were Klan members or endorsed by the Klan. That's right, the party that freed the slaves had become the party of racists in just over 50 years. Amazing.

It was the GOP who refused to provide funding for the military in the 1930s and they were the principal cause of our lack of readiness when World War II started. It's tempting to blame Pearl Harbor on the cutbacks in military spending caused by the GOP in Congress.

From the late 1930's the Klan became Anti-Communist as well as racist and as the Klan went, so did the GOP. Now communism was the great threat and many GOP members found ways to link Communism with Civil Rights. The infamous Billy James Hargis, the Tulsa-Based evangelist built his CHRISTIAN CRUSADE on racism and red-baiting. It's believed by some that Hargis is the true founder of the modern TEA PARTY. In fact in the late 60's or early 70's he held "T" party really decrying Taxes and Treason and other "T" threats to our freedoms. Hargis is credited with leading the faithful to the GOP and vice versa.

He was the religious wing of the John Birch Society.

What a strange, strange road the GOP has traveled in the last 150 years. There's a hell of a book there waiting for some bright young man or woman to write.

We may be seeing the last days of the GOP. Maybe, just maybe, the Grand Old Party will return to the values of Lincoln and Teddy Roosevelt (without the sabre-rattling). Wouldn't that be nice?

Well Karl Rove -- after the 2008 election you along with Crying Speaker Tan Man, Mitch NoConnell and a bunch of other Republicans welcomed these crazies teatards into your tent. So now you have to live with them. As the old saying goes -- be careful what you wish for because you just may get it.

the government wants to make sure innocent citizens can't. Another low information voter.

That would be you donna. NOBODY is trying to take your guns away. Get a grip. You are being manipulated by the the gun mfgs and NRA to hype their sales of weapons. Meantime, would you pass a background check?

After reading all of this all I could think of was election night on FOX news and Karl Roves meltdown.

First, I'm not a republican. Second, back in the day, if you were @!$%#ed in the head, you actually got the help you needed. But you liberal human rights people took care of that so that they're all running the streets now.

Alex, First, if you state Republican opinions, I'll call them that way. Second, I didn't know we've been having a problem with mass shootings since "back in the day". Third, I believe the mental health hospitals were closed, in large part, because conservatives didn't want to fund them. Reagan closed them in California when he was Governor (and cut funding when he was President). Gulliani (and others) threw all the crazies in jail (until they got overcrowded and put them back on the streets), and on and on. It takes money to make things happen, but it won't keep the NRA from deflecting any responsibility they gun lobby has.

There's a difference between recording to the government someone with mental conditions, and the rest of us normal folks that are semi-sane.

Not certain what kind of logic you're using here. So, you're saying that it's ok to look at anyone with mental conditions, but it's not ok to look at you (or someone like you) because you tell us you're semi-sane? And we can trust you on that......but not someone else....because they are crazy.......but you are not crazy.

So no, I'm not contradicting myself

Yes you are...you just don't want to admit it.

Ah, so we're only concerned about mass murderers. We're not concerned at all with chicago's homicide rate, or any other city with high murder rates.

Yes we are, at this point in time. You aren't because you can cloud the issue of mass shootings by bringing up red herrings like gang shootings.

I understand that Karl Rove intends to drill holes in bottom of the Republican Ship of State to allow the tea to drain out. Meet the New Boss.........

After losing 70% of the Hispanic vote, John McCain now believes our immigration laws need to be reformed. Not because he is concerned that 11 million people live in fear of being deported, but because 70% of undocumented workers will not vote for Republicans.

To be fair to McCain, he was an early proponent of immigration reform. He didn't suddenly change his mind. What changed was the political environment in which he operated.

Byron Raum

Please don't try to pretend that you are so stupid that this needs to be explained to you. Those bills are the two unfunded wars, and the unfunded 1/2 trillion Medicare part D mandate. Obama is not a spender. He has no personal bank account or any government credit card. He only spends what Congress authorizes him to spend.

LOL! So when it's Bush it is all the fault of the President, but when it is Obama it is all about Congress? How very convenient. Note that the economy didn't crash until the dems took over Congress and that Obama has continued every failed policy of Bush. Bush STARTED two wars in his first term while Obama FINISHED two wars (sort of) and yet Obama still managed to INCREASE defense spending almost as much in his first term as Bush did in his. Obama has continued the "quantitative easing" which literally takes money right out of your pocket. Obama's so-called "stimulus" was one of the largest government spending spree's in history and his "Affordable" (lol!) Care Act is only funded by the largest tax increase in recent memory and it is already painfully obvious that funding will be far short.

Obama is not a spender! LOL! Just like earlier you said the democrats were not borrowers! Jesus, how do you expect anyone to take you seriously when all you can do is parrot BS rhetoric?? Anyone who believes Obama is any better than Bush, or vice versa, is an idiot!

AlexM-3929653 (1.33):

What planet are you from??????

You're way off the mark......

To sum up, stupid.

Rep and Dem are not groups that serve the country. They're a self-regulated hierarchy of liars and thieves. Bring on the Constitutionalists, the Libertarians, the Independents and the Greens, all with the same cap on campaign funding and short term limits. Give some freedom from government back to the country to recover its sense of self and act on its dreams.

It was the GOP who refused to provide funding for the military in the 1930s and they were the principal cause of our lack of readiness when World War II started. It's tempting to blame Pearl Harbor on the cutbacks in military spending caused by the GOP in Congress.

The isolationist mindset of the GOP (and the US population in general) certainly contributed to our lack of readiness. I don't think that the lack of spending, however, contributed to Pearl Harbor as constrained thinking on the part of the military leadership. They underestimated the Japanese because they were Asian, and also fell into the trap of planning for what they thought the Japanese WOULD do instead of what they COULD do.

...this is going to be ugly

Ugly? LOL!

If there's one thing the Republicans know how to do, it's how to do ugly!....

And Bill Maher, Jon Stewart, and Stephen Colbert were worried about running out of material! LOLOL!!!!

LET THE GAMES BEGIN!!!!

SDN who wrote:

"It appears that all the liberal trash came out for this one, too funny. Obama is flying around promoting gun controll while our economy is in the tank, typical of dumb assssssss liberals."

Welll "our economy is in the tank" because that is where the Domestic Terrorists who call themselves Republicans want our economy to be, which is why Republicans decimated our Economy in the first place by taking the thriving economy that Democrat President Bill Clinton left behind, along with every penny of the $450 billion dollar surplus, and turned it all into the 2nd Great Depression.

Why would anyone listen to this guy? All the money that donors contributed during the 2008 and 2012 campaigns to his PAC was because they thought he knew what he was talking about. Clearly, he is a bad investment.

Crazy Steve - I don't think Maher, Stewart and Colbert could ever run out of material as long as the crazies on the right keep cranking out the insanity. It is entertaining.

ProBusiness

The Republican Party is done. It's over. For years the moderate Republican "elite" continued to tell the base they must need a moderate to "win". But then nominate George Bush who did some things well but spent money like a drunken sailor. Us conservatives were YELLING and SCREAMING that we can't borrow $250 billion a year!! (How I WISH it was only $250 billion a year NOW!!).

And where were you and all your "conservative" friends protesting at??? Oh wait-you didn't. You just sat there and accepted it when a Republican did it but went up in arms when a Democrat did, didn't you?

But Bush was nothing more than a "Democrat Lite" in many social issues. Then told we MUST nominate John McCain because we need a "moderate" to beat Obama. Really? McCain is the best the Republican Party can do? And we see how THAT turned out.

The Republican Party doesn't need a moderate to win; they need a liberal. I mean a Rockefeller-style Republican, one from the Northeast that can admit that government is not incapable of doing good things and that welfare and social spending are necessities, not goodies. McCain wasn't a moderate; at best he was center-right yet somehow way more conservative than Ike and Ronald Reagan. Republicans need a moderate from the old Truman-Eisenhower-Kennedy days, one that voted for tax hikes and spending cuts and supported the concept of a social safety net. Unfortunately, if any Republican went back to emulating the pragmatic Ronald Reagan or reasonable Dwight Eisenhower, they would be branded as liberal communists and gotten their asses kicked.

Then told we MUST nominate Mitt Romney. We need a moderate. that is the ONLY way to beat Obama. Really? Romney? THAT is the best we can do?

Mitt Romney wasn't technically a moderate; he was forced to tack on to the hard right in the primaries and never seemed to let go until way too late in the game. He was essentially what you asked for; a supply-side disciple of Reagan, a deregulator, a social conservative on issues like abortion and gay marriage, and a follower of the neoconservative foreign policy team. Problem is, Republican policies like those mentioned above have gone south when it comes to public support ever since the disastrous Bush Administration. Romney wasn't the best you could do; he was the best you wanted to do.

And let's remember in 1980 we were told we can't nominate Reagan because he is too "right-wing". Too conservative. Too vocal. He CAN'T win. Well Republican establishment you were wrong - as usual. If you want to win you must nominate a conservative.

Reagan only won because of the growing pessimistic sentiment of the American people and the harsh economic times that Jimmy Carter presided over. And he wasn't technically a conservative; although he talked tough against government and paved the way for anti-government movements, he governed like a moderate, raising taxes in order to close the budget deficits and supporting gun control legislation (after leaving office) even while being a member of the NRA (which had just began its rightward shift along with the rest of the GOP).

I'm done. Karl Rove you lost me. Republican Party you lost me. Goodbye.

Goodbye, GOP. And good riddance.

The problem with the Republican party is the Koch Tea Movement, they are destroying the GOP and our Nation !!!

Maybe Karl Rove will be the first to step up to Cleanse the crazy Tea people out of good old boys party !!!

TO: ProBusiness who wrote:

"... For years the moderate Republican "elite" continued to tell the base they must need a moderate to "win". But then nominate George Bush who did some things well but spent money like a drunken sailor. Us conservatives were YELLING and SCREAMING that we can't borrow $250 billion a year!! (How I WISH it was only $250 billion a year NOW!!).

But Bush was nothing more than a "Democrat Lite" in many social issues. Then told we MUST nominate John McCain because we need a "moderate" to beat Obama. Really? McCain is the best the Republican Party can do? And we see how THAT turned out.

Then told we MUST nominate Mitt Romney. We need a moderate. that is the ONLY way to beat Obama. Really? Romney? THAT is the best we can do?

And let's remember in 1980 we were told we can't nominate Reagan because he is too "right-wing". Too conservative. Too vocal. He CAN'T win. Well Republican establishment you were wrong - as usual. If you want to win you must nominate a conservative."

I sure would like to know what you think Bush did "right" because Bush's entire agenda was only about "him". Bush kept the rest us under a terrorist threat watch all the time and kept our phones tapped.

Out of all the Republicans you named, Ronald Reagan was the only one who actually was a Democrat and, when he decided to run for President, changed Parties and become a "Republican".

Like I always said, you can count on Republicans getting just about everything backwards.

Mac Forrester " Actually the Fed needs to raise interest rates up, within a range of 4 to 6.5 percent now, along with some targeted inflation."

Be careful what you wish for - at 6.5% and a National Debt of $20.4 Trillion (Obama's projection for 2016) the Interest alone on the Debt would be $1.3 Trillion per year, compared with an average of less than $200 Billion per year under Bush. That would require an extra $11 Trillion over 10 years JUST FOR INTEREST.

That makes the current arguments between Obama and the Republicans over a few hundred $Billion in cuts and new taxes insignificant in comparison.

Laws do not keep decent people from murdering others; just as laws do not prohibit those inclined, to murder.

Debi, that is incorrect. Laws do more than mete out punishment; they define illegal behavior and set a community standard for what is acceptable and what is not.

Don't expect a rational person to buy your argument that laws do not keep decent people from murdering othes. If we lived in a society that did not legally prohibit murder, there would be little to prevent any of us from doing away with a cheating spouse or a mean boss.

The only necessity of the law is the ability to mete out punishment when someone has been harmed. The ownership of a gun does no one else harm, thus no law is necessary just to own a gun. The only law necessary would be if someone were harmed by that gun, which I believe we already have on the books.

Sorry, you've got that backwards. Laws do have a purpose beyond punishment: prevention of crime. There are many laws already on the books (that vary from place to place) which define who may purchase a gun.

It is illegal to shoot someone unless you are shooting to defend yourself or others.

The problem with the Republican party is the crazy tea people !

"Us conservatives were YELLING and SCREAMING that we can't borrow $250 billion a year!!"

No pro business -- conservatives were NOT YELLING and SCREAMING during the Bush 41 administration. They you elected his little boy who spent even more. From Reagan to Bush 43 conservatives proved they are only against spending when a Democrat is in the White House.

@Roy Wilson#1.215: Surely, as long as you've been exhibiting numbers on this vine you've learned, at least some, about the relation of interest to inflation and the consequential movement of value rates of the dollar. Your assumptions are not even close to accurate. Over a period of years the debt would actually decrease substantially.

The Republican Party - eating its own. Nothing more to say. Just sit back and laugh!

Mac Forrester "@Roy Wilson#1.215: Surely, as long as you've been exhibiting numbers on this vine you've learned, at least some, about the relation of interest to inflation and the consequential movement of value rates of the dollar. Your assumptions are not even close to accurate. Over a period of years the debt would actually decrease substantially."

I'll try to address the intelligible parts of your post.

Interest rates typically follow inflation because investors demand a REAL return on their investments. If inflation is expected to be 5%, investors will typically charge about 8% for their money to get a REAL (inflation adjusted) return of about 3%.

As for 'Over a period of years the debt will actually decrease substantially', that is not even close to being true in a literal sense - The National Debt at the end of fiscal 2008 was $9.986 Trillion, and it is now about $16.4 Trillion, and Obama projects it will be $20.4 Trillion in 2016, and about $26 Trillion in 2022.

If you are talking about the National Debt as a % of Gross Domestic Product (Debt Ratio), it was 69.4% in 2008 (Bush's last year), but has risen to 104.8% in 2012, and even Obama projects it to continue rising through 2016 - which is extremely optimistic.

Mr. Todd has let it slip on more than one occasion he leans Republican. But that is ok, we liberals forgive him. Buy the way Chuck, I thought you did a great job on MTP this weekend. Would love to see you do more shows - you certainly brought back some of that Russert sensibility to the show!!

With the likes of Akin, Mourdock, O'Donnell, Angle and Romney, it looks like the Republican Party pretty well demonized itself. No outside help required.

But that is ok, we liberals forgive him

Not me. Not with the make up of today's Republican Party.

Chuck Todd doesn't like Obama, that's been clear to me on several occasions, but I tend to forgive him because I recognize he has integrity. I can tolerate dissenting opinions, what I can't tolerate is ignoring Truth, which is what most media personalities choose to do.