For the gun industry, gun death is just the price of doing business.

We know what and who Wayne La Pierre represents. He is a lobbyist for the gun industry profiteers. We know what they $want. So why was La Pierre even at the Senate hearing, serially refusing to answer questions?

La Pierre was at the table with Police Chief James Johnson, who represented 9 leading police organizations! Every day, our law officers face the consequences of La Pierre's disregard for the lives of ordinary people. La Pierre's only loyalty is to gun masters like Kollitides (made the Bushmaster), Potterfield (high capacity magazines), and gun manufacturers.

While the gun capitalists count their ill-gotten gains, it is WE who pick up the pieces after the latest killing atrocity. It is WE who have to deal with the 34 deaths per day from illegal and 40% unregulated guns, including weapons that massacre as many people as possible, as quickly as possible.

WE want to hear from Police, parents, children, communities, schools and legislators. WE want to make a concrete plan to make 300,000,000 Americans safe, and enact it before the next mass killing breaks what is left of the American heart.

We the People must take control of the gun conversation-solution, not hand it over to mouthpieces for the gun mogels like La Pierre.

There was some lefty liberal MORON (yeah, yeah, I already know that’s redundant) on FR yesterday calling MSDNC the “truth, justice, and the American way” channel.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

MSDNC is the official cable network of the Democrat party and will spew whatever lies it is instructed to spew by the loony left.

Would one of you goose-stepping FR lefty liberals tell me one of my favorite lefty liberal fairy tales??

You all know it: The one about how you “think for yourselves”.

Can you say “lying sacks of sh!t”?? Sure you can.

Morons.

Life is good.

Enjoy.

(or, if you are a lefty liberal, at least try to be less miserable)

MSNBC's Sandy Hook 'hecklers'

MSNBC ran a video clip yesterday that portrays the father of a Sandy Hook victim being "heckled" during a legislative hearing.

Martin Bashir, an MSNBC host, ran an edited clip from the hearing, which omitted the father's request to hear from the audience. Bashir then referred to the audience members as "hecklers." But the full tape, provided above by Media Research Center, the right-wing watchdog group, shows that the father had solicited the audience members' participation. The father then said, "We're all entitled to our own opinion, and I respect their opinions and their thoughts."

MSNBC has been dogged by accusations of selective editing before. In June of last year, the network edited footage of a campaign event at which Mitt Romney was discussing touchtone screens at a local chain store to illustrate the advantages of competition in the private sector. Instead, MSNBC depicted him as being naively amazed by the advent of touchtone screens. (MSNBC's Andrea Mitchell later aired the complete, unedited footage.)

MSNBC spokesperson Lauren Skowronski did not immediately respond to requests for comment regarding Bashir's video. An MSNBC source has told The Washington Post's Erik Wemple that the network is "reviewing the video in question."

UPDATE (1:18 p.m.): The Associated Press also labeled the audience members "hecklers," but reported high-up that the father had solicited their comments. The AP referred to these audience members as "advocates for gun rights." MSNBC referred to them as "gun nuts."

UPDATE (4:50 p.m.): MSNBC addressed the Sandy Hook video edit in the same manner as it addressed the Romney video edit, running the full video but issuing no apology. From guest-host Ari Melber:

On Monday on our program, we aired a portion of a hearing where we heard from Neil Heslin, whose 6-year-old son Jesse was killed at Sandy Hook Elementary School. We have received a number of comments over the past two days, so we are going to play the relevant portion of that testimony in full.

Yesterday Jay LotsaNumbers trashed the ACLU and said all their clients should be put in prison and the key thrown away.

Aside from the usual reminders of due process, I told him he lacked empathy. He protested that he does have empathy, and gave two examples: he has empathy for his mother, who has Alzheimer’s; and himself, because he’s suffering from arthritis.

(Let’s pause here a moment to allow the RWNJs to nod emphatically, Jay’s the man! Jay’s the man! . . . . . . . . . . . . Finished? Okay, onward.)

Gee, Jay, does your empathy extend only to your nuclear family? I mean, if your aunt had polio, would you feel for her? Or is that too far a reach for you?

Such is the miasma of today’s RWNJs. It’s expressed in their disdain for meaningful immigration reform, health care for all, the extension of unemployment benefits, the right of workers to bargain, government regulation of the private sector, the need for the wealthy to pay their fair share . . . .

Not to mention their pernicious racist streak.

And their contempt for women, gays—or anyone who is not male, pale, and carries an AR-15.

From them you hear a persistent, frenzied, Me! Me! Me! Mine! Mine! Mine!

From there it’s but a short step to the Mein-set of a wounded German corporal post-WWI.

First Read: As the saying goes, there are always second acts in politics. And it’s interesting to see the two VERY different paths Kerry and Gore have taken. The other aspect of watching these two men who both came so close to the presidency: Kerry appears to be the same guy he was in 2004. Gore, on the other hand, seems quite different.

_____________

What an interesting "take" on these two gentlemen. I hadn't given it much thought, so it was a really interesting read. Thank you!

Dark Money Groups Have Ulterior Motives for Opposing Hagel

This weekend, the New York Times reported on efforts by dark money groups aggressively working to defeat President Obama’s nomination of former Sen. Chuck Hagel (R-NE) to be secretary of defense. Not surprisingly, however, some of these groups aren’t telling the public all their reasons for opposing the nomination.

The Times highlighted the role of the American Future Fund (AFF), an Iowa-based group that spent nearly $26 million benefiting Republican candidates during the 2012 election cycle. “Post election we have new battle lines being drawn with the president; he kicks it off with these nominations and it made sense for us,” said Nick Ryan, the founder of AFF, of the group’s decision to fight the Hagel nomination.

What Mr. Ryan didn’t say: AFF was formed under section 501(c)(4) of the tax code, a status for tax-exempt social welfare groups that allows them to keep the names of donors secret. The primary purpose of such groups, however, cannot be influencing elections. So, AFF and other dark money groups need to spend money on programs to offset the millions of dollars they poured into the 2012 elections. Ads opposing Sen. Hagel’s confirmation help because they don’t count as political spending.

In addition, many of these groups are funded and dominated by a small number of large donors whose names never become public. For instance, in 2011, AFF reported receiving nearly $2.6 million in contributions from 11 donors, with more than $1 million of it coming from a single donor. It is clear donors see the large checks they write to these groups as a way to influence policy from the shadows.

The Times reported Sheldon Adelson, one of the biggest donors to super PACs and 501(c)(4) groups supporting Republicans during the 2012 election cycle, is directly contacting Republican senators and urging them to oppose Sen. Hagel’s confirmation. Given that Mr. Adelson spent more than $100 million on elections, it seems likely incumbents will take his call. As election law expert Richard L. Hasen pointed out last year, the real danger of unlimited money in politics is that it may “skew the legislative process” in favor of large contributors — such as Mr. Adelson. Members of Congress know that if they say no to megadonors, they’ll face an onslaught of negative campaign ads the next time they’re on the ballot. Correspondingly, assisting Mr. Adelson and his ilk could result in money spent on ads against their opponents.

The campaign against Sen. Hagel’s nomination is just one more reason why Congress must address the Supreme Court’s disastrous Citizens United decision. Until dark money groups are forced to disclose their donors, the public has no way to know who is influencing members’ votes — or why.

http://www.citizensforethics.org/blog/entry/dark-money-groups-have-ulterior-motives-for-opposing-hagel

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

GOP are into cannibalism; eating each other like people in North Korea.Americans see it!!

Baltimore Police Chief James Johnson testified that he believes we can make our country safer.

He is for:
-Comprehensive background checks.
-Banning high capacity magazines & the sale of assault weapons - that are killing police, firefighters and first responders.
-He said in tough areas like New York, 80% of guns are coming from the outside dealer process.

He had answers for La Pierre:
La Pierre (and Graham) made the phony "lack of prosecution" excuse. Chief Johnson said the accusation that criminals "aren't being charged by Police" is wrong.

La Pierre admitted that the N.R.A does not support background checks. He said criminals won't submit to background checks - they go to illegal means. Translation: terrorists go to gunshows for their illegal guns.

Chief Johnson replied saying that is why we must keep guns out of hands of criminals from the BEGINNING.

Dayum Floyd!

Coffee & tears what a combo to start the day...

My skin is still crawling from some of the comments the knuckle draggers were leaving about Gabby Giffords yesterday.

I've figured out that their "plan" is to become as vulgar & vile as humanly possible in hopes it will turn average people off the reasonable gun control debate!

Warning - I'm buying me a haz-mat suit and soldiering on!

Not content with their lock on insanity, gun strokers are now going for the gold in stupidity. News story after news story details more than a thousand gun deaths since the Newtown bloodbath.....More than a thousand. Too abstract? Picture a thousand corpses in your front yard; children ripped apart by gun fire, lifeless bodies of mothers and fathers, sisters and brothers. Those are the dead. One month's worth of gun violence. One month.

The living victims bring tears to your eyes. A former Congresswoman, Gabrielle Giffords, with a traumatic gunshot wound to the head, offers a halting and heart- wrenching plea for an end to this insanity to our United States Senators. Yes, there are living victims of gun violence; thousands of them, tens of thousands of them, some consigned to lives of unimaginable pain and suffering.

At the same hearing, the same United States Senators listen to another woman, this one a shameless liar, telling them why women need M-16's and what the hell, why not RPG's? She cannot show one single case where a woman needed an assault weapon. Indeed, in the one case she cites, the woman protected herself with a shotgun, a weapon that is by every definition a legitimate hunting firearm, and is not part of the current gun debate.

Next to her, the psychopath and draft-dodging "patriot" - Wayne LaPierre - who sees his government as an enemy that must be destroyed, demands unrestricted firepower that will take down the evil government. Yes, the government of the people, by the people, and for the people. You remember the people, don't you? That's us. That's you. That's me. And up until a month ago, it was those thousand corpses that now litter your lawn, courtesy of the gun violence that Wayne LaPierre sees as a nasty problem that just might force him to register his gun.

The overwhelming majority of the American public AND the National Rifle Association want background checks. Paranoid gun strokers know that is the first step towards their emasculation. THE GOVERNMENT, we the people, you and I want their manhood. This goes beyond paranoia. Plainly, they're crazy or they're abominably stupid.

There's an upside here. They continue to show us exactly why we must have some sort of regulation. In the face of a staggering body count, these people deny that firearms are the common denominator in gun violence. Anyone who is that mentally challenged simply should not have a firearm. They are the very best reason for insisting on regulation.

You don't justify bodies littering our national landscape as a product of our culture. You don't justify it by saying we are a violent nation. As a matter of fact, you call it what it is, sheer insanity and/or stupidity, and you fix it. And we will.

Hey, Joe! Take a long walk off a short pier! Maybe, you'll find some salmon in the water when you fall in!!

Jack in Portsmouth, to echo what you wrote, today's republicans expect you to conform to their messed up ideals. We have seen this in the past, with horrific results.

Their idea of what the United States of America should be is not ever going to be.

Not again. Never again.

And if they don't like it, they can pack their bags and leave. They won't be missed. Let them go and create their hell on earth somewhere else. It won't EVER be here.

I have no doubt about Hagel being confirmed for Sec. of Defense. Who's more qualified? The Repugs will bitch and scream, roll around on the floor and tear their clothes, but, in the end he will be confirmed. Live with it guys.

And LaPierre. Get this disgusting "thing" off television and out of any Congressional hearings. He's a disgrace to the human race. Ice water in his veins and pure greed in his heart. (If he has one.)

Defend this scum that sits on top of a committee. Crickets late last night as this cowardly network posts the story.

Morning Jolt – January 31, 2013

By Jim Geraghty

The Words 'Underage Prostitutes' in a News Bulletin Can Ruin Any Senator's Day

So, I guess Senator Bob Menendez will be canceling his http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/01/29/v-print/3207543/fbi-raids-west-palm-beach-office.html#storylink=cpy">Miami Herald subscription, huh?

Stringing up crime scene tape and using a locksmith, the FBI on Tuesday and Wednesday raided the West Palm Beach business of an eye doctor suspected of providing free trips and even underage Dominican Republic prostitutes to U.S. Sen. Bob Menendez — who has denied what he calls the "fallacious allegations."

Agents hauled away boxes and bags of evidence from the medical-office complex of Dr. Salomon Melgen, a contributor to Menendez and other prominent politicians, to start hauling away potential evidence in several vans.

On Wednesday, the FBI agents were joined by an inspector from the U.S. Department of Health and Human Services, indicating the search-and-seizure raid has ties to a possible Medicare fraud inquiry. Melgen has also been the subject of a parallel federal investigation into his relationship with Menendez, D-N.J., who was first accused of improprieties in the conservative Daily Caller website.

"Dr. Melgen has been a friend and political supporter of Senator Menendez for many years," Mendendez's office said. "Senator Menendez has traveled on Dr. Melgen's plane on three occasions, all of which have been paid for and reported appropriately. Any allegations of engaging with prostitutes are manufactured by a politically-motivated right-wing blog and are false."

Funny how when "the office" starts talking, "the office" can http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/politics/2013/01/30/menendez-denies-prostitute-allegations/1878175/">get things wrong:

Menendez's office did not say whether the three trips were to the Dominican Republic or elsewhere. The statement also did not say how the trips were reported or how Menendez paid for them — with his own money or through his senatorial or campaign accounts.

The Associated Press reported it found no records reporting payments to Melgen or trips aboard Melgen's plane in six years worth of office and travel-related expenses for Menendez's Senate office, or in six years worth of campaign expenses on file with the Federal Election Commission.

Care to revise your statement, Senator?

IR---thanks for sharing this eloquent statement. I honestly don't understand how those parents are able to get up and get out of bed every day, let alone have the strength to try to make something positive come out of this tragedy.

How is it that Senate hearings on this legislation featured paid lobbyist Wayne LaPierre of the NRA but NO ONE from the Sandy Hook community?

IR---thanks for sharing this eloquent statement. I honestly don't understand how those parents are able to get up and get out of bed every day, let alone have the strength to try to make something positive come out of this tragedy.

How is it that Senate hearings on this legislation featured paid lobbyist Wayne LaPierre of the NRA but NO ONE from the Sandy Hook community?

IR---thanks for sharing this eloquent statement. I honestly don't understand how those parents are able to get up and get out of bed every day, let alone have the strength to try to make something positive come out of this tragedy.

How is it that Senate hearings on this legislation featured paid lobbyist Wayne LaPierre of the NRA but NO ONE from the Sandy Hook community?

To the Hudson River Know-Nothing.

At least MSNBC has some Republican representatives showing up on their disussion panels and Joe Scarborough, a former GOP Representative, takes to the airways every morning for three hours.

Ah feel the warmth of the summer of recovery. Actually it is the worse recovery since the Great Depression. How do you like those words lefty liberals ROFLMAO. And now job claims go UP.

Nationalreview.com

Morning Jolt – January 31, 2013

By Jim Geraghty

Can you believe January is almost over already?

Here's your Thursday Morning Jolt. Enjoy!

Jim

Can't Wait For That Next Recovery Summer!

As Scooby-Doo would say, "Ruh-roh!"

U.S. economic momentum screeched to a halt in the final months of 2012, as lawmakers' struggle to reach a deal on tax increases and budget cuts likely led businesses to pare inventories and the government to cut spending.

The nation's gross domestic product shrank for the first time in 3 1/2 years during the fourth quarter, declining at an annual rate of 0.1% between October and December, the Commerce Department said Wednesday.

It was the first time the broad measure of all goods and services produced by the economy contracted since the recovery from the financial crisis began. Economists surveyed by Dow Jones Newswires had expected 1.0% annualized growth.

The Neo-NeoCon wonders why we're being told, so repeatedly and emphatically, that this economic pitfall is so completely unforeseeable:

How long can the media continue to be surprised by negative reports on the economy? And why are the rest of us not surprised?

Or is the media only feigning its surprise?

Now, I understand that this is the first quarter since the 2008 crash that the economy hasn't grown at least a little tiny bit. And I understand that most economists had predicted at least modest growth this quarter. Thus, the "surprise" of the experts.

But I still don't see why they've been so surprised. How could the economic climate be good with the uncertainty of the fiscal cliff negotiations, the debt ceiling fight, the very real problems of unemployment and the deficit and looming Obamacare and payroll tax raises for all (even if they're technically the result of the end of a temporary cut)?

The proximate cause of this particular downturn is thought to be defense cuts, and some other indicators seem okay. But nothing looks what one might call good. And why, pray tell, would it?

Does it all come down to reduced defense spending, as some folks on the left insist?

Less spending from the Pentagon, for one. Government defense expenditures plunged by a staggering 22.2 percent between October and December. According to the Bureau of Economic Analysis, the Pentagon spent significantly less on just about everything except military pay. Had the Pentagon not cut back on spending, the economy would have grown at a weak but positive 1.27 percent pace.

Was this big plunge in defense spending unusual? Yes and no. To a certain extent, it's part of a pattern: Defense spending often rises in the third quarter of a year and drops in the fourth quarter . . .

Yet the ups and downs were especially sharp in 2012 — soaring 13 percent in the third quarter and dropping 22.2 percent in the fourth quarter. Part of that is due to the fact that defense spending is shrinking overall, thanks to budget pressures and the drawdowns in Iraq and Afghanistan.

If "war drawdown" is the primary reason for the negative GDP, shouldn't we expect the next few quarters (at least) to be similarly lousy?

And if this is the first "post-war" economic quarter, what does it say about how war spending has driven the economy since 2001? All that military spending that liberals told us was bankrupting the country, war profiteering, etc. . . . how much has that been keeping the GDP numbers looking a little better than they otherwise would?

Either way, expect there to be a lot of . . . bitterness in our political debate in the year ahead. Donald Douglas offers an assessment that I think will be shared by a lot of folks on the right, and I think the center will start to assent to this cynical assessment:

The economy's shrinking and the Democrats are doing everything else besides working to fix it. That's not what we were promised during the campaign, but you already knew that. And that's Rick Santelli at the clip below, ranting away like only he knows how, apparently. As noted, I feel that populist insurrection rising, and it's not just over the libelous gun control narrative. The permanent political class is systemically worsening economic conditions to further cement its grip on power. Think about it.

That Santelli reaction — "when you act like Europe, you get growth rates like Europe, and our discussions with economists sound like we're in Europe!" — can be found here.

Foes of current immigration-reform proposals and current gun-control proposals have a new counter-argument: "We have 22 million unemployed or under-employed, and the economy is shrinking. Why are we discussing this when our top priority should be the economy?"

92% of Americans want universal background checks.

Eight out ten N.R.A. members support universal background checks.

So many folks like Joe in Albany see that the majority of the Country moving away from their way of thinking. For whatever reason they are scared to death of the Progressive movement and they are fighting to deny it.

However, no matter what, it's been long overdue in coming, and their only defense is to bash/trash talk the President and we Progressives.

Morning Jolt – January 31, 2013

By Jim Geraghty

Emotional Manipulation, and Inconvenient Facts, on Guns

So after Obama unveiled his gun-control "executive actions" — remember, not quite "executive orders," and full of Post-It note reminder fodder such as "appoint an ATF director" — in front of a bunch of schoolchildren, the Senate began its consideration of gun-control legislation with testimony from former congresswoman Gabrielle Giffords.

Look, anyone with a heart loathes what happened to Giffords, and takes joy in her recovery. But our sympathy for her as a victim of gun violence doesn't mean we outsource our own judgment when it comes to evaluating policies. It's very transparent to use victims to make policy arguments, then cut off policy critics by accusing them of attacking the victim.

And of all places, the http://www.nytimes.com/2013/01/30/us/strict-chicago-gun-laws-cant-stem-fatal-shots.html?pagewanted=all&pagewanted=print">New York Times is pointing out the inconvenient truth — that the places in America that have the strictest gun laws often have the most gun violence :

Not a single gun shop can be found in this city because they are outlawed. Handguns were banned in Chicago for decades, too, until 2010, when the United States Supreme Court ruled that was going too far, leading city leaders to settle for restrictions some describe as the closest they could get legally to a ban without a ban. Despite a continuing legal fight, Illinois remains the only state in the nation with no provision to let private citizens carry guns in public.

And yet Chicago, a city with no civilian gun ranges and bans on both assault weapons and high-capacity magazines, finds itself laboring to stem a flood of gun violence that contributed to more than 500 homicides last year and at least 40 killings already in 2013, including a fatal shooting of a 15-year-old girl on Tuesday.

To gun rights advocates, the city provides stark evidence that even some of the toughest restrictions fail to make places safer. "The gun laws in Chicago only restrict the law-abiding citizens and they've essentially made the citizens prey," said http://www.isra.org/bod/richardpearson.html">Richard A. Pearson, executive director of the http://www.isra.org/">Illinois State Rifle Association. To gun control proponents, the struggles here underscore the opposite — a need for strict, uniform national gun laws to eliminate the current patchwork of state and local rules that allow guns to flow into this city from outside.

I'm still waiting for one of the barrel lickers to explain to us why the NRA has fought vehemently against gun violence research..?

What are they so afraid of?

Perhaps the thruth that the majority of these gun nuts are using their size of their "pieces" to compensate for other areas they are seriously lacking in?

Ben lotsanumbers writes:

So, I guess Senator Bob Menendez will be canceling his http://www.miamiherald.com/2013/01/29/v-print/3207543/fbi-raids-west-palm-beach-office.html#storylink=cpy">Miami Herald subscription, huh?

That's right Ben.....you guess. You speculate. You cast aspersions. You take cheap shots. But in the end, you guess.

Let the investigation proceed, and if Menendez turns out to be the scumbag you so desperately want him to be, don't expect anyone from the left to defend him. The best you'll get is some lightweight who points out that Republicans do this crap too.

On the other hand, if Menendez is cleared, a lot of us will wonder why you are jumping to conclusions, rather than waiting for facts. Maybe some will GUESS you are a right-winger.

While Claiming Only Fox News Gives Him Fair Coverage, Sean Hannity Tells 10 Lies About Obama

Jan. 29th, 2013

1). Obama’s inaugural address was the most liberal speech of his left wing career.

2). Obama’s engaging in an all out assault on the Second Amendment.

3). Obama is targeting the First Amendment.

4). Barack Obama was anointed not elected.

5). Obama has failed on the economy.

6). Obama has failed to create jobs.

7). Obama has failed to rein in radical extremism.

8). Obama is the reason why Washington is divided.

9). Obama wants to silence all voices of opposition.

10). Obama’s rhetoric has polarized the country.

Hannity’s bizarre Obama bashing is the reason why he is losing viewers to Rachel Maddow on a regular basis. Outside of the right wing fringe, this kind of programming appeals to no one, but Hannity’s job at Fox News is to keep the true believers believing. He has to keep them convinced that Fox News is the one source of truth on this planet, or else the cult might wise up and stop tuning in.

The fact that Sean Hannity claimed that Fox News is the only network that gives Obama fair coverage while completely lying about the president highlights the absurd rabbit hole that FNC has fallen into.

If you want to know why congressional Republicans sound like they are on another planet, all you need to know is that they get all of the information from watching Fox News.

http://www.politicususa.com/claiming-fox-fair-coverage-sean-hannity-tells-10-lies-obama.html

Obama, AGAIN, ignoring the real reason behind Chicago's gun murders. Why? Because HIS policies and were he learned them ARE responsible for thier deaths. I thought he was supposed to be this genius from Harvard. The Union pension disaster Democrats caused, stealing 96 Billion, has caused education to be raped of 400 MILLION this year alone. Uneducated minorites with no hope or jobs are doing what Democrats have set them up to do. FAIL. There Mr. president is your answer! But taking responsibilty has NEVER been your strong point.

Congratulations MSNBC

Obama’s Popularity Surges FOX Loses Viewers

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/wp/2013/01/30/president-obamas-popularity-surges-to-three-year-high/

Fox News Ratings Hit 12-Year Demo Lows In January Cable News Figures

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/29/fox-news-ratings-lows-cable-news-january_n_2576689.html?utm_hp_ref=fox-news
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Times are a changing. Keep kicking ass MSNBC. We liberals got your back. No one intelligent eatches Pox news

Hallelujah: 6 thumbs up

Posters like Backhouse are amazing contortionists and liars. Of course majority -- me included -- support universal background checks. It's not that LaPierre doesn't support them, it is the effectiveness he is questioning. If we can do this, surely we can get a data bank of registered voters as well -- don't you think?

Oh and Beverly and others -- Before you drool on yourselves any more, Fox is still kicking butt in the ratings and each and every statement from Hannity is the truth. Again contortion and lying with is a progressive trait. Read Politico and then go change your diapers.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2012/12/fox-news-ratings-down-but-not-disastrous-153051.html

Last evening Lawrence O'Donnell had a segment showing one of the Sandy Hook parents giving testimony to a sub - committee in Hartford Ct. Following is a portion of what he had to say.

A Sandy Hook parent gives testimony the Senate ‘should have heard’

Evan Puschak

Today, another Sandy Hook parent advocated for stricter gun laws on behalf of his murdered child. David Wheeler, father of victim Ben Wheeler, spoke Wednesday at the last of four public hearings by the Connecticut legislature’s Bipartisan Task Force on Violence and Public Safety. In his testimony, Wheeler called for a “comprehensive system of identifying and monitoring individuals in mental distress.”

In Wednesday’s Rewrite segment, MSNBC’s Lawrence O’Donnell lamented that “no one from Newtown, Connecticut, testified at today’s Senate hearing, which would never have occurred were it not for the massacre of 20 first graders and six educators in Newtown, Connecticut.”

O’Donnell ceded much of the show to play Wheeler’s testimony, which he said “the Senate Judiciary Committee should have heard today.”

Speaking in front of a 52-member task force, Wheeler decried the inability of agencies to share relevant information about at-risk individuals’ personal histories, mental states, and proximity to firearms. He also advocated a ban on military-style assault weapons, saying they “belong in an armory under lock and key,” and for annual registration of personal firearms.

Finally, Wheeler invoked Thomas Jefferson’s inalienable rights of “life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness” from the Declaration of Independence. “I do not think the composition of that foundational phrase was an accident,” he said. “I do not think the order of those important words was haphazard or casual. The liberty of any person to own a military-style assault weapon and a high-capacity magazine and keep them in their home is second to the right of my son to his life.”

http://tv.msnbc.com/2013/01/30/a-sandy-h...

I echo Mr Wheeler's observations, the right to be safe in our daily lives, in schools, in movie theatres, in shopping malls or any public/private gathering place. And that Right far out weighs any selfish, irresponsible, irrational and or paranoid desires by individuals who feel they can have whatever they desire at the expense of the rest of us, whether or not we own guns.

Joe in Albany.........

http://www.omh.ny.gov/omhweb/facilities/cdpc/facility.htm

Consider this a referral. Your volatility is increasing.

Ben, you're a breath of stale air.

Walking Angel

Courtesy of U.S. News on nbcnews.com

Teen slain after performing at inaugural: 'Happiest day of her life and then she's gone'

By Tracy Connor, Staff Writer, NBC News

A 15-year-old Chicago girl gunned down a week after she performed during President Obama's inaugural festivities was remembered Wednesday as a "walking angel" – the last person her family could imagine dying by a bullet.

Hadiya Pendleton was an honor student, a marching-band majorette, and a doting big sister who thought about becoming a journalist or a pharmacist or even getting into politics after she witnessed history in Washington last week.

The biggest trouble the insatiable reader ever gave her parents: running up their credit card buying books on Amazon.

"I couldn't ask for a better child," her mother, Cleo Cowley, said through tears at her Chicago home. "She didn't give me any hard time at all. She had a heart of gold."

Read more at U.S.News on nbcnews.com

We now interrupt this program to bring you the following message:

"Too many children are dying,"

Former Rep. Gabrielle Giffords

God Bless

Beverly in Chicago

He has to keep them convinced that Fox News is the one source of truth on this planet, or else the cult might wise up and stop tuning in.

Thank you Beverly for your great column.

The longer Faux sNewzzzzz is around, the more destruction they will keep doing to America.

Salud

Gingerbread Mama, so glad you pointed out David Wheeler's testimony for those who missed it covered on Lawrence's program last night.

The liberty of any person to own a military-style assault weapon and a high-capacity magazine and keep them in their home is second to the right of my son to his life.

I do hope more of the country takes the time to listen, really listen, to what Ben Wheeler's father said.

@David Walker -- You are an ignorant jerk (quotes from SS storm trooper Seeking Sanity). I didn't guess, it was the author. Your reading inability astounds me. I have a good friend that is a GED teacher I could refer you to. Menendez is a scum bag by just accepting "free" plane rides from a donor. That's a fact and he paid it back. As to the other -- this is just another "top-tapping" incident from a low life scum -- wink, wink.

Tom -- Thanks and your breath smells like what has been described to me by others from the progressive left as a hog fart. Now onto the economy instead of spending more time as to how you are adding to global warming.

Kudlow has nailed this failing economy to a tee. Brilliant man and all should take heed.

Big-government Keynesians think big spending provides big growth. They are wrong. This has been a 2 percent recovery — the worst in modern times — dating back to 1947. So let’s try something different. Let’s shrink government. Let’s let the private sector breathe and generate entrepreneurship and risk-taking.

Spending is the true tax measure of the economy, according to Milton Friedman, Friedrich Hayek, and others. Even a modest sequester spending cut of maybe $60 billion in 2013, and perhaps more than $1 trillion over ten years (most of which will come from a slower spending growth rate, not real reductions), will be the best thing to inspire business and market confidence as well as international credibility. And it maybe even shave a point or two off the spending share of GDP.

http://www.nationalreview.com/kudlows-money-politics/339294/spending-sequester-will-grow-private-economy-151-don-t-back

Beverly, so happy to see you here.

People are now looking at Hannity, the former construction worker - and finally figured it out - he's full of ****.

Too late for me though. Way way way too late for me.

Your name-calling is worth zero-zero-zero.

In 1999, La Pierre supported mandatory background checks at gun shows. Asked yesterday, La Pierre said "We do not".

Then he blamed his crazy lack of logic on "lack of prosecution".

"...Wayne LaPierre favors prosecuting anyone who purchases a firearm, then sells it to a criminal, but also favors allowing the actual criminals to purchase firearms from private sellers at gun shows, which eliminates the need for straw-purchasers." (Tommy Christopher)

Pat, are you so blind not to see what liberism has done to the inner cities? Do you ever get out of your lily-white neighborhood and drive through these Democratic created wastelands? Horrific results? Open your damn eyes! Why, only in Democratic strongholds are bars and steel gates protecting thier owners? Try to find a grocery store that will open due to the violence. Destroying a race of people is ideal? The closest place to Hell in America is were the Democrats have governed the longest!

Wow, the NRA they can seize control of the country?

Change comes form action. No Action No Justice!!! Suck on that; craaaazy ass Wayne La Pieree

The liberty of any person to own a military-style cannula assault weapon and a high-capacity magazine high capacity syringe with a spinal needle for injecting life killing fluid and keep use them in their home as their right of choice is second to the right of my son to his the unborn to life.

http://www.abortioninstruments.com/

geo-1957883.........you said:

Quote......The closest place to Hell in America is were the Democrats have governed the longest!.......EndQuote

(Southern) democrats held sway in the South from right after the Civil War until the mid-1970's.

Now, THAT was "Hell".

Then, on account of Kennedy/Johnson civil rights initiatives and Nixon's "southern strategy", the southern segregationists became Republicans and have resumed their rule there.

Republican party worries more about Israel than it does U.S.A., they are afraid Hagel will try stopping the 50 Billion Israel gets in welfare foreign aid every year, time to stop supporting Israel and put America first !!!

Enough with these war mongers sucking our Country dry, Hagel is what this Nation needs !!!

A teen who performed at events around President Barack Obama's inauguration was shot to death in Chicago this week, and now her story has become part of the debate in Washington over gun violence nationwide.

The shooting death of 15-year-old Hadiya Pendleton came up in a U.S. Senate hearing and a White House press briefing Wednesday.

"She was an honor student and a majorette," said Sen. Dick Durbin, D-Illinois. Performing at inaugural events last week "was the highlight of her young, 15-year-old life," he said.

Speaking at Wednesday's Senate Judiciary Committee hearing on gun violence, Durbin mentioned Pendleton's death as he argued that more must be done to stop gun crimes.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/01/30/justice/illinois-teen-shot/index.html

No assault rifle, no high capacity magazine. Feinstein's legislation is meaningless. These are side issues to the real problem of gun trafficking. If it all comes down to background checks and gun shows then start policing them.

Republicans legislators for those big cities, have blocked Democrat attempts at gun crime prevention.

Pointing fingers at Democrats is facile.

In cities like NY and Chicago, 80% of guns are coming from outside the legitimate dealer process.

Ben-636050

Kudlow has nailed this failing economy to a tee. Brilliant man and all should take heed.

Kudlow is a RW psychotic, lying Fascist. Only and idiot would listen to him.

Salud

Good points, Ian.

And now maybe geo can tell us what "liberism" is. Apparently it has done something horrible to inner cities.

Pat Boston MA.

Beverly, so happy to see you here.

People are now looking at Hannity, the former construction worker - and finally figured it out - he's full of ****.

Thanks Pat, My dad did it. He made 93 years of age. We threw him a big shindig. He wore me out.

I'm so happy to see Rachel is kicking Hannity's ass. I think FOX POX NEWS hired Dennis Kucinich to get their ratings up. Or could it be to replace lip smacking Sarah Palin. LOL

One thing for sure.. Dennis won't be in slap fight with the "baggers" over who loves the Constitution the mostest.

Ben-636050

Kudlow has nailed this failing economy to a tee. Brilliant man and all should take heed.

Except for when he is not so brilliant ...

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/224378/bushs-r-right/larry-kudlow

"The recession debate is over. It’s not gonna happen. Time to move on." 2007

http://www.nationalreview.com/kudlows-money-politics/2452/recession-debate-over

Ian Emdee - Live in Fiesty, Bev, and Seeking Insanities West side of Chicago for a month, and you will know what Hell the Democrats have created! Backhouse - There are NO Republicans in Chicago! Next excuse.

Tomas -- HAHAHAHAHAHA. You are sooooooooooooooo wrong and you are showing your ignorance more and more each post.

TomasGrande

Beverly in Chicago

Thank you Beverly for your great column.

The longer Faux sNewzzzzz is around, the more destruction they will keep doing to America.

TomasGrande,

Somehow t think the more "toxic" they talk the "toxic talk" the less the American people will be watching. After all, most of their audience is old, white, people who won't be around the next generation and people like that laughing, idiotic, hyena, Joe in Albany. It's fair to say FAKE NEWS has a dying audience!

Salud

Watch closely for the traitors who will try to torpedo Hagel's nomination to benefit Israel and military industrial complex. Make sure that scum is not reelected.

To Chuck Todd and Kelly O'Donnell and any journalists I may have missed at NBC/MSNBC.

How can you you continue to work for MSNBC? This is not the first time the "news" has been doctored to fit an agenda, and it won't be the last. The hosts from 10 am onwards are a joke as are their sycophantic guests. (I have no problem with them pushing an opinion or agenda but now it has moved into out and out lying). In particular the host Toure is a disgrace.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articles/2013/01/31/msnbc_criticised_for_editing_of_gun_hearing_video_116869.html

Republican Geography 101

Local Geography –

Church – Where to go to show love and devotion for Baby Jesus[i] but only on Sundays and special occasions. Our preacher tells us how helping the sick and poor isn’t the American way and Jesus wants us be rich! Also, God hates fags…

Mosque – Enemy territory. Possible secret terrorist meeting place. Won’t be there after me and Billy Bob drink a few more beers and get the gas can…

Militia compound – The safest place to be when the government comes to take away our guns. Nothing bad ever happens in these sacred places.

Prisons – Low income housing for minorities.

Walmart – Where else can you buy guns, beer and beef jerky all in one place? It’s like heaven on Earth! Good thing Walmart showed up right when it did, thirty local stores went out business last year after the Grand Opening. Damn economy… This is all Obama’s fault! Ooooh look! Turkey jerky!

Synagogue – If we keep playing nice with the Jews, they’ll finally rebuild that dang temple in JEWrusalem. After that, Baby Jesus will come back to Earth and get his vengeance! Just you wait and see…

Courthouse – Where the Ten Commandments should be prominently displayed right next to the Constitution during the court hearing to keep them Muslims from building a new Mosque.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2012/12/22/republican-geography-101/

Bev - Please tell us what Chicago Neighborhoods you stay out of, due to out of control Democrats?

Ben lotsanumbers:

Your ranting does not alter the facts. The article you cut and pasted here specifically addresses an eye doctor who is "SUSPECTED"......

Menendez denies the "FALLACIOUS ALLEGATIONS" associated with the eye doctor.

The article goes on to speak of "POTENTIAL EVIDENCE".

There are accusations. There is not one shred of proof to support those allegations. Menendez' office has done nothing that would indicate any wrongdoing on the part of Menendez.

None of that means means Menendez will not be shown to be a criminal. By the same token it does not show him to be a criminal.

As I stated you have simply once again shown that you are a partisan hack. You have shown that a lack of facts is not going to stop you from engaging in worthless, unsubstantiated, and unproven allegations.

Good Christian that you are, you might want to check out that commandment about bearing false witness.

Our Daniel was a constant source of laughter and joy. He was intelligent, articulate, incredibly affectionate, fair, thoughtful toward others and unfailingly polite. Daniel believed in holding doors open for strangers. He talked to the person sitting alone. He loved to help clean up a mess, and he made sure there was enough milk for everyone before adding it to his cereal.

His kindergarten teacher recently wrote to us: “He is the kind of student that should come wrapped in ribbon because he is a gift to his teachers. I can remember leaving notes for our substitute to ‘ask Daniel’ if she or he needed help with anything.”

Thank you for your comment, IR. Read it, folks. This is what it is about: our children.

Those who believe that having unfettered rights to deadly weapons is more important than the life of a single child, let alone twenty, YOU are the problem. YOU are responsible.

Hey, Joe! Take a long walk off a short pier!

________________________________________

Auntie: May I suggest you go to my website and fill out my complaint form.

Scroll down on the right side and click on Form FU-2.

Moron.

Republican Geography 101

National –

California – Jews and homosexuals control this area. San Francisco is a modern day Sodom and L.A. is obviously Gomorrah. One day, God is going to sink the whole coastline. It’s real science! I heard it on the 700 Club.

Southwest – Under constant threat of being reconquered by Mexicans and Socialists. They already stole all our jobs, now they want the land, too? Finish the dang fence McCain!

Northern States – Our last line of defense against creeping Canadian Socialism. Although Sarah Palin says it’s OK to cross the border and use their universal healthcare as long as we don’t bring Commie Cooties back with us.

Texas – King of all states. A beacon of hope in a benighted land, where evolution is ignored, teenage pregnancy runs rampant and oil tycoons get rich. When the Second War of Northern Aggression is started by us patriots, Texas will lead the charge.

Alaska – Queen to Texas’ King. Where blessed oil stains the pristine landscape, charging women the cost of their rape kit is perfectly normal and a half term Governor can’t possibly be a “quitter,” she’s got her own TV show! Also the first line of defense against the Commies. We can still see you from our house, you damn Reds!

Mid-West – God’s own country. Where fields of wheat and corn[ii] sway in the breeze and where all REAL Americans come from. “Real” defined as “White Christian heterosexual conservatives.”

New York – Jew capitol. Also home to millions of scary foreigner types what don’t speak no proper English like we does. Redeemed by blessed Wall Street where the rich gather to find ways to share their wealth with all of us via a gravity and liquid based metaphor. They’ve been trickling on us for over thirty years so we should all be rich any time now!

Washington DC – Where all those damn politicians get together to steal our rights, our money and our future! But it was an awesome place from January 20, 2001 to January 20, 2009.

Hawaii – May or may not be a REAL state due to its un-American, exotic nature. Known entry point for illegal immigrants from Kenya. Local newspapers suspected of posting birth announcements that violate the laws of time and space.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2012/12/22/republican-geography-101/

Bev,

Hannity’s bizarre Obama bashing is the reason why he is losing viewers to Rachel Maddow on a regular basis. Outside of the right wing fringe, this kind of programming appeals to no one, but Hannity’s job at Fox News is to keep the true believers believing. He has to keep them convinced that Fox News is the one source of truth on this planet, or else the cult might wise up and stop tuning in.

Excellent Post!! I've been saying the same thing for awhile now. Since the election is over, some of those die hard hannity fans won't be tuning in because they believe everything hannity told them and thought Romney was going to win. Them tea party nuts feel real stupid now.

I'm still waiting for one of the barrel lickers to explain to us why the NRA has fought vehemently against gun violence research..?

Anyone other then the *crickets*?

U.S. economic momentum screeched to a halt in the final months of 2012, as lawmakers' struggle to reach a deal on tax increases and budget cuts likely led businesses to pare inventories and the government to cut spending.

_________

First thoughts - Yet what appeared to have slowed down the economy in the last quarter was a decline in government spending-- especially defense spending and this was PRE-sequester. And that has thrown a wrench into everyone’s talking points. Obama and the Democrats want to point to a steadily growing economy, which the GDP news complicated. And Republicans want to say that cutting spending is the path to economic prosperity, which the GDP news also complicated since it’s clear it’s the LACK of government spending that slowed the economy last quarter.

______

Ben 6350 - How do you explain the decline if not a direct relationship in the reduction of government spending? Yes the constant Fiscal Cliff noise might have dampened confidence and Sandy definitely hurt GDP. As the article states, everyone's talking points took a wrench. I think Kudlow is not looking at the full picture. As I discussed with Alan, NJ yesterday if we implement the full sequester haphazardly we do so at our own peril.

RE: GDP news complicates everyone’s talking points:

And Republicans want to say that cutting spending is the path to economic prosperity, which the GDP news also complicated since it’s clear it’s the LACK of government spending that slowed the economy last quarter.

When the GDP decreases due to a cut in government spending, it doesn't change the fact that fiscal conservatism is the right path forward. Government spending alone isn't a net benefit to the economy (see broken window fallacy). Deficit spending by adding new money into the economy can temporarily stimulate the economy, but the cost is too high. The cost is devaluation of the dollar and debt service payments. Whether the economy contracted due to a decrease in defense spending or not is irrelevant.

Hey, Bev. You're on fire this morning! Great posts at #1.52 and #1.57. Got me chuckling in sympathy.

I think this gun battle, and it is a battle, will turn out in favor of responsible people that own guns. Hunting and sporting is one thing, and even self-defense can have a justifiable place in the conversation. But when we talk about weapons of war on our streets, there is no justifiable argument as to why they are even there in the first place and cannot be justified in any way. It is not a 2nd amendment right. It is like trying to justify that these 20 children and 6 adults being killed is collateral damage to our rights to own weapons of mass destruction. I have ask this before of gun nuts and I will continue to ask until I get an answer. When does your rights as an owner of one of these horrific weapons stop and my right to life begin? You, or one of your own could be the next collateral damage to the next crazy, that goes off their rocker and opens up in your crowd or a crowd of one of those that you love. How will you justify it then?

It can't happen to you. Ask the folks in New Town, Connecticut

Hey Joe, ain't enough of Sammy's in the world to render me more brain dead than you are!

I find it "ironic" that the progressives on this site knock the rural "redneck" as clinging to their guns and religion. Why I find this ironic is because most gun homicides are carried out in urban environments by minorities against minorities. Why do you never make jokes about urban residents lifestyle and educational accomplishments?

I admit I have very little in common with a rural lifestyle having spent my life in urban and suburban environments. However, I would no more knock their chosen life style than I would an inner city rapper with gold teeth and tattoos who has a much right to the first amendment as the rural resident has to the second.

Synagogue – If we keep playing nice with the Jews, they'll finally rebuild that dang temple in JEWrusalem. After that, Baby Jesus will come back to Earth and get his vengeance! Just you wait and see…

New York – Jew capitol.

_______________________________

Ah, Yes. Bev the lefty liberal racist is also an anti-semitic piece of brown human turd matter.

C'mon, all you FR lefty liberals: Are YOU going to call Bev out for her discriminatory post.

Yeah, right.

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I see where Jack-off in Port's mouth has signed onto Bev's anti-semitism:

Jack in Portsmouth

Hey, Bev. You're on fire this morning! Great posts at #1.52 and #1.57. Got me chuckling in sympathy.

Dear Independent Redneck,

I just now read your entire post. Twice.

Just so so so sad.

Thank you for bringing the article here.

And thank you for all you bring here to First Read.

The overwhelming majority of the American public AND the National Rifle Association want background checks. Paranoid gun strokers know that is the first step towards their emasculation. THE GOVERNMENT, we the people, you and I want their manhood. This goes beyond paranoia. Plainly, they're crazy or they're abominably stupid.

Excellent comment (as always), David Walker.

I'd like to add that the rabid gun nuts are also lazy and cowardly. They're too lazy to learn how to defend themselves by means other than a gun. And they're too chickensh!t to live without a ready means of deadly force at their fingertips.

Turn off Limbaugh and Beck, America! They are ramping up the fear and loathing rhetoric for one reason alone, same as what the gun manufacturers want: $$$$$$$$$$

The almighty dollar rules here, folks. Our children's lives are simply the cost of doing business to these people.

The most contentious questioning today is likely to come from GOP Sens. Jim Inhofe, John McCain, Lindsey Graham and Ted Cruz.

And this is a surprise? Do McCain and Graham just oppose EVERYTHING the President nominates just to please EACH other???? What a little bromance those two have going on!

Johntho

But when we talk about weapons of war on our streets, there is no justifiable argument as to why they are even there in the first place and cannot be justified in any way.

What one person claims another needs or not isn't sufficient reason to ban something. By that logic, we should be able to ban anything that causes harm that isn't needed. Alcohol is harmful and isn't needed. Tobacco is harmful and isn't needed. Soda is harmful and isn't needed. Etc, etc. In order to compel people that a ban on assault weapons is right, an argument that goes beyond what you think I need is necessary.

And before anyone claims I'm comparing guns to soda, I'm not. I'm simply highlighting the absurdity of banning something just because it isn't "needed."

It appears as if this addictinginfo website is a hyper insensitive Colbert/Onion wannabe. While I appreciate the use of satire by Colbert the Onion etc. The website and the one liners a regular poster chose to post are pretty disgusting and not even funny.

Kudlow has nailed this failing economy to a tee. Brilliant man and all should take heed.

Big-government Keynesians think big spending provides big growth. They are wrong. This has been a 2 percent recovery

Kudlow must not be to brilliant. Big-government did not spend big, thus we did not see big growth. Big-government Keynesians have consistently said we did not go big enough. Remember, the stimulus granted to Obama was less that Bush received for that teensy-weensie recession in 2001. Our 2% recovery rate is what we should expect, given that the GOP refused to spend money on a real Keynesian recovery.

Backhouse

Baltimore Police Chief James Johnson testified that he believes we can make our country safer.

Backhouse, That is a sharp and intelligent contrast to the moronic policeman saying we need guns .

Then there is this Drama Queen

Lindsey Graham: GOP-Forced Budget Cuts Will Mean Fewer Cops, So People Need To Arm Themselves

http://thinkprogress.org/justice/2013/01/30/1516431/lindsey-graham-gop-forced-budget-cuts-will-mean-fewer-cops-so-people-need-to-arm-themselves/

Lively First Thoughts this morning! Washington's buzzin'.

This Republican backs Mr. Hagel.

There are accusations. There is not one shred of proof to support those allegations. Menendez' office has done nothing that would indicate any wrongdoing on the part of Menendez.

He has already committed an ethics violation. I would consider that an indication of wrongdoing, and anybody with some common sense knows that his office claim of "sloppiness" is a lie. The fact that he got caught is the only reason he is paying this money now. The bigger question is what did the owner get for the his contributions.

Sen. Robert Menendez (D-N.J.) wrote a personal check of nearly $60,000 to a donor to reimburse the cost of two round-trip private flights he took to the Dominican Republican three years ago, according to reports.

Menendez paid $58,500 to a top Florida donor to pay for two trips he took in 2010, The Associated Press reported on Wednesday night.

“This was sloppy,” Dan O’Brien, the senator’s chief of staff, told NBC News regarding why Menendez didn’t pay at the time. “I’m chalking it up to an oversight.”

O’Brien also said that “we can assume the Senate Ethics Committee is looking at the allegation,” according to NBC.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/story/2013/01/report-robert-menendez-reimburses-58k-86979.html#ixzz2JZM7SPys

Remember that his office did not even know how to check if an employee was here legally (and was also a known pedophile), while pushing for illegal immigrant legalization, with a strong employer enforcement mandate. You can't make this stuff up.

Joe in Albany

_______________________________

Ah, Yes. Bev the lefty liberal racist is also an anti-semitic piece of brown human turd matter.

C'mon, all you FR lefty liberals: Are YOU going to call Bev out for her discriminatory post.

Yeah, right.

Albanian idiot you've always been a moronic, laughing, hyena; but you've never accused me of being a racist; at least I don't recall. Is this a new low for you?

On second thought, I retract that statement. You have such a low IQ I doubt if you even understand your accusation.

A voice of reason. Welcome to the Congress. You will make all Hispanics and Latinos proud.

Tea Party winner from the great state of TEXAS brought some much needed common sense to the "GUN CONTROL or VICTIM ENHANCEMENT" hearings in Congress yesterday. A little glimmer of light in a dark time on the Hill.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wi6gZU01yF8

geo-1957883

Bev - Please tell us what Chicago Neighborhoods you stay out of, due to out of control Democrats?

geo,

That would be wherever there is a lunatic T-BAGGER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

DingleB, you justify the killing of 20 first graders, and 6 adults not to mention the other mass shooting by comparing the weapons to soda. Right. One more time, no one, at least no civilian is in need of this rifle and its extended capacity, which only has one practical purpose and that is to kill as many humans as possible in as short of a time as possible. To take this gun out of civilian hands is justified by the deaths it has inflicted. There is no comparison to the uselessness of this gun except for the purpose so described.

Thanks to all of you. Reading some of the Yahoo's yeterday is why I made it a point to bring this to you'll this morning. All I will say is that when folks make such a point to show their ignorance and a$$ in this manner only serves to make yourselves more and more irrelevant to the discussion. Somethings going to Happen. 85% of America says so. You can either spend the time demonizing the Messenger or get busy (and sane) and make sure that what happens is something you don't like. Because once it happens your going to play Hob making them take it back. 'Course you can spend the rest of your lifetime Bitchin' like some you always do. Me personally I've got better things to do than Piss and Moan about the unfairness of it all but that's just me

Alan, NJ

I find it "ironic" that the progressives on this site knock the rural "redneck" as clinging to their guns and religion. Why I find this ironic is because most gun homicides are carried out in urban environments by minorities against minorities.

A large proportion of gun crimes in big cities are committed with guns that move though what the NYC police call the "Iron Pipeline," originating mostly in Southern states with lax gun laws that enable straw purchases of guns to be made with ease. Universal background checks and stricter laws against straw purchases are clearly needed. If you can't understand that, then you're a prime example of why Republicans are referred to as the "Stupid Party."

Ted Cruz is nothing but a hardcore Tea Head.

He can’t see anything beyond the tea bags hanging off his NRA baseball cap.

Jack in Portsmouth

Hey, Bev. You're on fire this morning! Great posts at #1.52 and #1.57. Got me chuckling in sympathy.

If you think that's funny; Jack, check this youtube out when you time. It'll have you in stitches. It is hilarious.

Nobody on FOX NEWS could report the news correctly even if one of their asses is on fire. All the monkeys over @ FOX NEWS entertainment do is LIE, DISTORT, & START WARS ON EVERYTHING!!!

Chaser War on Fox News

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8ib8ZnqwYzY

Backhouse

92% of Americans want universal background checks.

Most of the right wingers on this forum obviously are members of the 8% of Americans who are extreme loonies. Probably 90% of the 8% are birthers, too.

Johntho

You missed my point completely.

And before anyone claims I'm comparing guns to soda, I'm not. I'm simply highlighting the absurdity of banning something just because it isn't "needed."

Let's just move on assuming that since we allow other things in this country (that are not needed) which cause far more damage than assault rifles do, that banning something simply because it isn't needed is not logical.

What then is the argument in favor of banning assault rifles? A previous ban was completely ineffective in limiting gun violence. Let's say that a ban would have prevented Lanza from obtaining an assault weapon; he had several other guns with him, with which he could have inflicted just as much damage. Are you suggesting that an arbitrary ban on one style of firearm while allowing another which is used in over 30 times more homicides each year is logical?

Ted Cruz does not make this Latino proud.

I didn't watch the youtube clip, but know he has made news by besmirching the records of two Vietnam war veterans simply because they don't share his jingoistic views.

Not only that, I find it condescending to think that a Latino would support Mr. Cruz simply because his is a Latino. No I support the person best fit to lead and shares my ideals. In the case of the senatorial race I voted for Paul Sadler. Sadler was for immigration reform Cruz against, Sadler was for the stimulus Cruz against, Sadler was for health care reform Cruz against, Sadler was for reasonable gun reform Cruz against. On state issues Sadler was for funding education Cruz against. I can go on. With a myriad of other issues Sadler a suprisingly liberal democrat for Texas was the person I chose to support. I lament that Mr. Cruz will supposedly represent me.

Albanian Idiot,

Only you would have interpreted Bev's comment as being anti-semitic. It just shows how simple-minded you are (from eating all that Hudson River carp, apparently).

Since you don't seem embarrassed by your posts, I'll be embarrassed for you.

Johntho

By the way, I in no way tried to justify the Sandy Hook killing as you claimed I did. Overly emotional drivel such as that is offensive and poorly serves all other arguments you attempt.

Take away the Spanish surname and Latino voters look a great deal like many other Democratic constituencies. Low-income households headed by single mothers and dependent upon some form of welfare are not looking for an excuse to join forces with Paul Ryan and Pat Toomey.”

And they are still wondering why they cannot win the LEGAL Hispanic constituency when it comes to voting.(I had to put the word legal in there cuz I know folks on here still dont know the difference between a Latino American and an undocumented Latino when reading an article)

They can win us over, not because of the crap the consistently say like "self-deport" or the stuff i quoted above. When will these people learn.

And I gotta give up to Rubio. Without doing something like this, he might as well forget about 2016 and focus on 2020 when Hillary Clinton is up for re-election. The only thing he has done so far is co-sponsored the Blunt amendment. And we all remember how great of a proposal that was!

Alan, NJ writes:

"I admit I have very little in common with a rural lifestyle having spent my life in urban and suburban environments."

I have lived in both rural and urban areas. I have always been impressed with the kids in rural areas with respect to firearms. They grow up with them. There is nothing odd about seeing a kid with a gun rack in his truck.

The thing is, as a rule, these kids are given their first firearms as a gift. They learn gun safety as a matter of course, and because there is so much varmint hunting, they see what a bullet can do. They are also quite proficient with shotguns. They love their pheasant hunting.

I'm pretty sure that's what most of us want. Responsible gun users. However, the absolutely indefensible and intransigent position of idiots like Wayne LaPierre is what drives the debate to extremes.

There is absolutely nothing wrong with background checks. There is everything wrong with a defense of gun ownership that turns on killing government representatives. Not more than three months ago we were having some rather serious arguments about our government, fought with ballots, not bullets. That's how we do it here, and as you can see, there's not a whole hell of a lot of citizens who advocate election by gun.

As far as Menendez, I do not condone ethics violations. However, that is actually an internal matter of Congress and has been satisfied. Kinda makes the tummy turn, but that's the way it is. I'm not ready to buy the notion that his office didn't know how to check for immigration status, either. As far as the pedophile issue, I doubt one in ten employers check for that, and the database is notoriously inaccurate.

Again, I'm not defending this guy. But I do get tired of the constant witch hunts and in Ben's case, absolutely unsubstantiated allegations. This is more of that Benghazi BS. Investigations take time. I'll wait. When and if a crime is alleged AND supported, I want Menendez gone.

A large proportion of gun crimes in big cities are committed with guns that move though what the NYC police call the "Iron Pipeline," originating mostly in Southern states with lax gun laws that enable straw purchases of guns to be made with ease. Universal background checks and stricter laws against straw purchases are clearly needed. If you can't understand that, then you're a prime example of why Republicans are referred to as the "Stupid Party."

I refer you to 1.41.

I agree with you that gun shows should be registered/policed whatever you want to call it and that gun trafficking should be targeted, but that doesn't explain why the gun homicide rate is higher in the cities. The gun ownership/availability in rural areas with all these "rednecks" is probably higher, but for some reason minorities kill minorities and your only solution is to try and ban the instruments. You think that will reduce inner city violence?

Progressives should take a look in the mirror before they make jokes about other lifestyles that are not the cause of gun violence.

Jack in Portsmouth-

Albanian Idiot,

Only you would have interpreted Bev's comment as being anti-semitic. It just shows how simple-minded you are (from eating all that Hudson River carp, apparently).

Thanks, Jack. That gave me a good laugh.

Salud

DingleB-

A previous ban was completely ineffective in limiting gun violence.

That depends on which study you reference. The Urban Institute studied the data and concluded:

The few avail­able stud­ies sug­gest that attacks with semi­au­to­mat­ics – includ­ing AWs and other semi­au­to­mat­ics equipped with LCMs – result in more shots fired, more per­sons hit, and more wounds inflicted per vic­tim than do attacks with other firearms. Fur­ther, a study of hand­gun attacks in one city found that 3% of the gun­fire inci­dents resulted in more than 10 shots fired, and those attacks pro­duced almost 5% of the gun­shot vic­tims.

http://www.logarchism.com/2013/01/30/did-the-assault-weapons-ban-work-part-2/comment-page-1/

I would argue that although a ban on assault-syle weapons and high-capacity magazines may not reduce the number of 'gunfire incidents' it would make them less efficient and potentially less deadly.

Let's say that a ban would have prevented Lanza from obtaining an assault weapon; he had several other guns with him, with which he could have inflicted just as much damage

Again, the data suggests otherwise. Even the few seconds it would take to change magazines may have made a difference. If nothing else, it increases the chances of future victims either avoiding gunfire or surviving the attack.

No one has said that the proposed Gun Control legislation will eliminate all gun violence or gun deaths, however common-sense reforms that offer marginal improvement without any real infringement on Second Amendment rights should be considered.

As far as Menendez, I do not condone ethics violations. However, that is actually an internal matter of Congress and has been satisfied. Kinda makes the tummy turn, but that's the way it is. I'm not ready to buy the notion that his office didn't know how to check for immigration status, either. As far as the pedophile issue, I doubt one in ten employers check for that, and the database is notoriously inaccurate.

I tell you David, here in Jersey we have had an awful track record with our Senators (and Governors until recently). I hope Corey Booker ends our dismal run.

DingleB:

Let's say that a ban would have prevented Lanza from obtaining an assault weapon; he had several other guns with him, with which he could have inflicted just as much damage.

If he had to reload after 10 rounds, someone might have been able to stop him. The shooter in the Tucson incident, who used a semi automatic with a 30-round clip was stopped when he had to reload. As Gabby Giffords husband said during the Senate hearing, if the killer had to pause to reload after he fired 10 bullets, the 9-year old girl he murdered might still be alive.

Houston!

A large proportion of gun crimes in big cities are committed with guns that move though what the NYC police call the "Iron Pipeline," originating mostly in Southern states with lax gun laws that enable straw purchases of guns to be made with ease. Universal background checks and stricter laws against straw purchases are clearly needed. If you can't understand that, then you're a prime example of why Republicans are referred to as the "Stupid Party."

I agree that the focus should be how we go about keeping guns out of the hands of criminals. People that buy guns for criminals are despicable humans and ought to suffer the same consequence as the murderer. The fact is though, straw purchases are already illegal. Imagine a criminal buying guns for another criminal. Is he going require his purchasers to submit to background checks all of a sudden just because there is another law? What the result will be, is that if I want to sell my hunting rifle to another hunter, we will have to go to a gun shop to make the transaction. Fine, small price to pay, but where is the benefit?

LosMan123-

And I gotta give up to Rubio. Without doing something like this, he might as well forget about 2016 and focus on 2020 when Hillary Clinton is up for re-election

Good call.

I can tell you that here in The Land of Enchantment, Rubio doesn't have the staying power as someone like Manuel Lujan or Bill Richardson.

Talk is cheap, and people here like to see action, and if it doesn't happen, then politicians like Rubio are considered "one and done".

The jury is still out on our Governor, Susana Martinez.

Salud

Alan N.J.

I agree with you that gun shows should be registered/policed whatever you want to call it and that gun trafficking should be targeted, but that doesn't explain why the gun homicide rate is higher in the cities.

Crime is ALWAYS higher in poor communities. It has nothing to do with race or ethnicity as you seem to think. The high-crime neighborhoods used to be Irish and Italian. In England, the high-crime neighborhoods were occupied by white Anglo-Saxon protestants in Victorian times.

The gun ownership/availability in rural areas with all these "rednecks" is probably higher, but for some reason minorities kill minorities and your only solution is to try and ban the instruments. You think that will reduce inner city violence?

The solution to the crime problem, with or without guns, is the elimination of poverty. As for the rednecks, I don't think anyone here says nasty things about Independent Redneck except for the usual RWNJ suspects.

Dingleb

We have had the slippery slope arguement before as well as the "not needing" assualt weapons doesn't merit restricting them arguement. We didn't get far. Quick question, how do you feel about universal mental health checks? I've heard you mention, looking at mental health issues in our discussions; knowing your libertarian streak do you support the invasion of civil liberties in this respect?

Alan, NJ-

I tell you David, here in Jersey we have had an awful track record with our Senators (and Governors until recently). I hope Corey Booker ends our dismal run.

I like Corey as well.

I personally think Governor Christie will be the Republican nominee in 2016.

Your thoughts???

Salud

Houston! & TNSEVOL

Do either of you know what size magazines were used in Columbine or VA Tech? They weren't high capacity; they both used several low capacity magazines. The argument that someone is going to jump on the shooter while he's reloading is usually made by those who suggest having are armed citizen present is ridiculous. If we're talking about enabling the population to defend themselves, we can do better than simply allowing a few seconds while reloading.

Yellow Dog

Ted Cruz does not make this Latino proud.

Put me down for that too!

DingleB

The fact is though, straw purchases are already illegal. Imagine a criminal buying guns for another criminal.

The fact is, attempts to pass laws prohibiting the purchase of guns in large quantities have always been blocked in Southern states.

Is he going require his purchasers to submit to background checks all of a sudden just because there is another law?

Straw purchasers DO submit to background checks. As long as they've got no criminal record, they can buy guns for criminals. As well as the absence of laws for blocking purchases of large quantities of guns, the penalties for those being caught doing straw purchases are not as harsh as they should be. Straw purchasers should be treated as accessories to murder.

DinglB

The argument that someone is going to jump on the shooter while he's reloading is usually made by those who suggest having are armed citizen present is ridiculous.

That's exactly what happened in Tucson. The shooter was stopped by unarmed bystanders when he stopped to reload. You're denying reality. Pretending the capacity of a magazine makes no difference is what's ridiculous.

No DingleB, that is exactly what you are doing, you are comparing what is bad for us. I am going to say it one more time. YOU nor I need a gun capable of shooting 20 children and 6 adults plus all the other deaths that these crazy's have done. Think a minute, if one of these crazy's had killed one of yours how would you and those around you feel about your need to own one of these weapons? It is not emotional, it is common sense as these weapons have no purpose, not one, other then to kill as many human beings as possible in as short of time as possible and that is exactly why they have become the weapons of choice for those intent on mass murder. These are military grade weapons, not civilian. Only the military or the police should have possession of them. I think a majority of RESPONSBLE gun owners would agree with me. Not you. Guns for self protection, hunting and target are not targeted by anyone. These guns do not fit any of those things.

Alan,

The gun ownership/availability in rural areas with all these "rednecks" is probably higher, but for some reason minorities kill minorities and your only solution is to try and ban the instruments. You think that will reduce inner city violence?

At least part of the reason for the high levels of "inner city violence" is the availability and prevalence of guns. Domestic disputes, arguments, assaults and theft are all deadlier when a gun is involved. I thought the NRA argued that carrying a gun prevents crime? The facts prove otherwise, in urban and rural areas.

Numerous studies and raw data have shown time and again that there is a direct statistical correlation between the levels of gun ownership and the rate of gun deaths.

David Walker-

I'm pretty sure that's what most of us want. Responsible gun users. However, the absolutely indefensible and intransigent position of idiots like Wayne LaPierre is what drives the debate to extremes.

As Pepe (LaPierre) Le Pew would say;

"I tell you what. You stop resisting me, and I, I will stop resisting you. When have you had a better offer than that?

Salud

Interesting fact -

States with Highest Firearm Death Rates per Capita

# 1 District of Columbia: 31.2

# 2 Alaska: 20

# 3 Louisiana: 19.5

# 4 Wyoming: 18.8

#5 Arizona: 18

# 6 Nevada: 17.3

#7 Mississippi: 17.3

# 8 New Mexico: 16.6

# 9 Arkansas: 16.3

# 10 Alabama: 16.2

Except for the District of Columbia I dont see any states with large urban areas. California was #30, Illinois was #31, and New York was #46.

Yellowdog-Mark D

To answer your question, absolutely not. First, universal mental evaluations are not even possible. Second, the idea that either law enforcement or some other bureaucrat is going to be responsible for denying anyone their civil liberties without due process is absurd. The denying of someone any of their civil liberties due to a mental illness should be decided by the courts only after careful review of medical testimony.

Houston!

Straw purchasers DO submit to background checks.

Correct, but nothing we do is likely going to make the straw purchasers require the criminals they buy guns for submit to background checks, even universal background check requirements.

the penalties for those being caught doing straw purchases are not as harsh as they should be. Straw purchasers should be treated as accessories to murder.

Agreed.

Regarding the mass purchase of weapons, I still think stronger enforcement of existing laws will do more to prevent straw purchases than limiting the number of purchases. If a person buys 10 guns for 10 criminals, maybe he should face 10 conspiracy to commit a gun crime charges, 10 accessory to murder charges, or whatever the case may be.

TNSEVOL-

Interesting fact -

States with Highest Firearm Death Rates per Capita

# 8 New Mexico: 16.6

Every 4th of July or New Years Eve, there is always a death or injury of someone getting hit by stray bullit that's been shot into the air.

BTW, we are also number one in death rates of people struck by lightning.

Too much Tequila.

Salud

Houston!

That's exactly what happened in Tucson.

An exception to the norm.

DingleB

If a person buys 10 guns for 10 criminals, maybe he should face 10 conspiracy to commit a gun crime charges, 10 accessory to murder charges, or whatever the case may be.

I agree. And also have laws that forbid anyone from purchasing 10 guns at a time, or 10 guns a year. for that matter. An ounce of prevention is better than a pound of prosecutions for murder.

BTW: The Columbine shooters did use semiautomatic guns:

http://extras.denverpost.com/news/shot0801.htm

If you or someone you know was saved because a gunman was brought down while he fumbled to reload, you probably wouldn't care if it was an exception to the norm. There is no compelling reason for high-capacity magazines, and there is no compelling reason not to ban them, even if it saved only a few lives in these massacres that have now become routine events thanks to the NRA and the gun industry for which it lobbies.

Bev, you are a racist idiot

agree. And also have laws that forbid anyone for purchasing 10 guns at a time, or 10 guns a year. for that matter. An ounce of prevention is better than a pound of prosecutions for murder.

Ruby Ridge

No DingleB. If you cannot see that guns make violent people more effective there is on hope for you.

DingleB "By the way, I in no way tried to justify the Sandy Hook killing as you claimed I did. Overly emotional drivel such as that is offensive and poorly serves all other arguments you attempt."

That is exactly what you do by trying to bring other forms of destruction into a conversation on guns. Common sense dictates not emotion, and you defending these weapons is offensive to those that have been effected by them.

Houston -

And also have laws that forbid anyone from purchasing 10 guns at a time, or 10 guns a year. for that matter

Virginia had a law limiting purchases to one a month, and the NRA fought against it and got it repealed. Apparently 12 guns a year was not enough.

Sadly there some states like Arizona that hvae no limit on gun purchases. A "straw man" could buy 100 guns or more at a time, then legally sell them as a "private sale" without a background check.

Instituting a universal background check would at least make this a prosecutable offense, and allow law enforcement to make some inroads into gun trafficking.

Dingleb - To clarify, I am not talking about mental health evaluations by the police. What I mean is making a list (try not to become too scared), of people who have been certified as mentally ill by psychiatrists, health care officals etc. Noting on the list which are dangerous to themselves and or others, highlighting which are violent. If there name is on the list then they do not get the right to buy a gun, much like criminals don't get the right to have a gun.

I see we will not agree on this either. What did you mean by we need to look at mental health then?

Houston!

Well at least we have some common ground. Maybe that is where this gun control debate in congress should focus: proper enforcement of existing laws.

Adding more laws is not the answer to this problem.

Yellowdog . . .

The police don't do mental health evaluations. It they are called somewhere to assist someone that is having issues, they take them to the nearest hospital for evaluation IF the hospital accepts them (many don't for unfunded clients) and / or call the local mental health state-funded clinic for evaluation. As I noted below, who gets to make the call on WHICH mental health illnesses qualify? Will it be by diagnosis? Will it be on how the client is responding to treatment? Client on/off meds? Will some Congress person or Senator make those calls?

I don't think many people truly understand the mental health system and should be very wary of taking that information into a central database and giving cashiers at WalMart who SELL guns access to someone's health records without their consent.

As my chief programmer used to say, "this is a whole lot bigger than a breadbox!"

States with Highest Firearm Death Rates per Capita

Yes, statistics are very interesting

lmost all of the summary reports on gun violence covered by the media normalize the data to the “percentage of 1,000” ratio. It appears as though they have to, since the unadjusted numbers would be far under 1 percent in most cases. For example, Rhode Island had 16 gun-related homicides in 2010. With a population of 1,052,567, the unadjusted total number of gun-related deaths relative to the State’s population would be 0.0000152.

By using the “percentage of 1,000” ratio, it now shows Rhode Island’s gun-related deaths as 1.52/1K. How it is presented, as a matter of public perception to drive opinion, is very different.

The “percentage of 1,000” ratio is also used to skew the statistics heavily against sparsely populated states. Alaska had only 19 gun-related homicides in 2010; with a population of 710,231, its adjusted total is 2.7 gun-related homicides per thousand (2.7/1K). Meanwhile, in the first two months of 2010, the City of Chicago had 27 gun-related homicides (Crime Summary Chicago 2010, January-February, 2010, Research and Crime Division, Chicago Police Department).

Despite the fact that more people were killed in the first two months in one Illinois city than in the entire State of Alaska for the full year, Illinois’ adjusted gun-related homicide total is only 2.8 per thousand (population of 12,830,632 with 364 gun-related homicides). The “percentage of 1,000” makes densely populated states appear more safe, despite substantially higher gun-related homicide totals, and sparsely populated states as unsafe.

Of particular interest is the oft-repeated 30,000 figure for gun-related deaths. Approximately 18,000 were suicides using a firearm. Also included are people accidentally killed in police action, or through accidental discharge of a firearm. According to the FBI and state agency sources, the actual number of people murdered by a firearm in 2010 was 11,533 (0.0000381). The total number of murders (including knifes, blunt objects, person’s hands/feet, etc.) is 14,504.

http://www.arlingtonvoice.com/story/opinion/12/21/2012/understanding-numbers-gun-related-deaths

Yellowdog-Mark D

try not to become too scared

You lost me at "list" Too frightened to read any further.

Seriously though, I still believe all determinations by psychiatrists, health care officials, or anyone else which restrict ANY civil rights should be reviewed by the courts and a person then adjudicated mentally incompetent by the court. Those who have been adjudicated mentally incompetent are already, under existing law, prohibited from owning a firearm.

Regarding mental health, I would suggest we start treating it like the disease that it is and improving access to care. More access and proper treatment would not only reduce the likelihood of someone going on a rampage, but would allow health care professionals to intervene more often (through the courts) when they've identified a patient who may do harm to self or others.

I personally think Governor Christie will be the Republican nominee in 2016.

Your thoughts???

Too early to tell. He's in the bad books with the Republican right at the moment and that will be an issue in the primaries. I also don't know how he plays outside of the tri-state area. I love him. Not because he took on the public sectors unions but he explained to them that by paying more in contributions, he was saving their pensions. Also, he made the fact that teachers were paying 1.5% for their health care a matter of fairness. I supported his termination of the Hudson rail tunnel because Jersey had a bad deal in that any overruns were to be paid by Jersey, not New York or the Feds. That's what's missing in Washington right now, a bit of sacrifice. We are borrowing 40% of our budget. It's ridiculous. Either cut back and explain why, or raise taxes on everybody (not just on somebody else) and explain why. Right now Washington, the Administration and Congress are bankrupting our country, and using distractions like immigration and gun control to do it.

I wish we had more NE Republicans and southern Democrats in Washington. They might actually do whats good for the country.

DingleB . . .

Regarding mental health, I would suggest we start treating it like the disease that it is and improving access to care.

This is where Congress CAN help. They have drastically reduced funding to Medicaid (which by the way is the chief funding source for the majority of mental health clients who are SPMI). The outcomes that are needed to support the funding take a lot of clinical time away from the patient as the clinicians are so busy justifying treatment in order to satisfy those that are sending the funds. It's a conundrum at best.

Senator Graham is a douche.

This is where Congress CAN help.

Hey alright! Some more common ground! Without changing the discussion to health care funding, obviously funding such improvements to mental health care is going to be a problem. It shouldn't be an insurmountable problem though.

DingleB

Well at least we have some common ground. Maybe that is where this gun control debate in congress should focus: proper enforcement of existing laws.

Too bad the NRA is trying to impede the enforcement of the laws they claim to favor. Like the one restricting the number of guns in Virginia that TNSEVOL cited in #1.117.

Adding more laws is not the answer to this problem.

Adding a requirement for universal background checks requires a new federal law. Only a tiny nutso fringe of 8% of the American people are opposed to universal background checks. Are you?

Alan, NJ

Yes, statistics are very interesting

Yes. And some people could use a refresher course in basic statistics and probabilities, apparently. There's nothing sneaky about using ratios. The probability of being killed by a gun in a state with a million people and 10 gun deaths is the same as a state with 10 million people and 100 gun deaths.

Another school shooting today -

Atlanta Police said a 14-year-old student has been shot at Price Middle School, ... A victim is loaded into an ambulance shortly after the shooting ...

1). Obama’s inaugural address was the most liberal speech of his left wing career.

So what? He won. Your side list.

2). Obama’s engaging in an all out assault on the Second Amendment.

Total BS.

3). Obama is targeting the First Amendment.

Even MORE BS

4). Barack Obama was anointed not elected.

Romney LOST. If you want to win, stop your endless WHINING and find better candidates.

5). Obama has failed on the economy.

The DOW near record high. 34 straight months of private sector job growth. All time record domestic oil production. Fortune 500 companies -- record profits.

6). Obama has failed to create jobs.

34 straight months of private sector job growth

7). Obama has failed to rein in radical extremism.

True -- he's failed to rein in radical extremism of the Republican Party.

8). Obama is the reason why Washington is divided.

Sure -- he's the cone calling people names like Stalinist, communist, etc.

9). Obama wants to silence all voices of opposition.

If that's the case, why are Fox, Limbaugh, Beck and the rest of the right wing whiners till on the air?

10). Obama’s rhetoric has polarized the country.

See point 8

Copy editor missed some corrections, but I've got The Cooch covered. What he should have written, and what I'm sure he really meant:

"One of their favorite ways to increase their power is by creating programs that dispense subsidized government benefits, such as tax credits, deductions, and corporate welfare (farm and oil subsidies, offshore tax shelters and the like) in exchange for essentially unlimited campaign funds and personal kickbacks. These programs make people dependent on government by shifting responsibility for wages and benefits away from employers in order to increase their profits. And once people are dependent, they feel they can’t afford to have their tax breaks taken away, no matter how inefficient, poorly run, or costly to the rest of society...Citizens will vote for those politicians who promise more tax cuts each year, rather than the fiscally responsible politicians who try to point out that such programs are unsustainable and that excessive income inequality will eventually bankrupt the states or the nation."

I want you all to give Albany Joe some slack today...

He just found out that his Mom has taken a part-time job working with his Sister as a fluffer... She said she wanted to do something that would "help make ends meet"... The take-home isn't that great because it's a hellacious commute to the studio and they can't car-pool because they fight over the stick-shift all the time...

Life isn't easy for Albany Joe. When Mama broke the news to him he screamed "PART time?"

Moron.

Any comment from MSNBC about the Menendez and the prostitution ring, another corrupt Democrat and the media bias along with Democrats circle the wagon..............

Maybe if Hagel pled the 5th on every question requiring a YES or NO he would have a chance.

Better yet, if Hagel responded to all the questions with "I have better things to do on Sundays", then he might have a chance.

But do Republicans really pursue a filibuster against their former colleague? Talk about some story if they do. All that said, Hagel also has little margin for error.

The author of this article was obviously watching a different hearing than I watched yesterday. The repubs were effectively filibustering his confirmation as they grilled him. Hagel appeared completely clueless in response to several of the questions. If he does the same thing again today he will be history.

Regarding Cuccinelli and his distaste for welfare - Virginia happens to be one of those states that takes more from the federal government that it contributes: $1.51 for every $1.00 it pays in. Of course, a lot of that's due to defense spending, so he should be working to avoid sequestration at all cost, or Virginia won't be enjoying its low unemployment for long.

"well Senator, I never crashed any planes when I was in Viet Nam".

Great point Steeler. Great great point.

Steeler Fan,

I think the letters sents by old Sheldon Adelson will try to stir up his GOP senator puppets. Maybe he will be paying them by how many words they can give in their speeches when the camera are upon them.

The hearing today will be Vegas style review of loud noise, a chours line of supporters of israel, and in the end Chuck Hagel will be confirmned.

P.S. Sorry for the triple post up above---Newsvine gremlins struck again!

I wonder if TeaPeople Senator Ted Cruz will have to courage to say directly to Hagel what he said behind his back that "He (Hagel), doesn't support the military"!

Cruz is a squeaky voiced idiot!

I heard that McCain probably would not have survived his third crash if the impact hadn't been mitigated by landing on top of the wreckage from his previous sorty... Just a rumor.

LaPierre is so focused on doing the bidding of the gun manufacturers that he can't hear how inane he really is. One of my favorite BS arguments from this guy is that we don't enforce the existing laws. He and his Repug buddies made sure of that by obstructing the mission of the ATF at every opportunity. I can't understand why that little nugget of legislative abuse is never discussed.

RTFS,

LaPierre has only talked in the echo chamber of the gun extremists.

When ordinary citizen heard what he said during the hearing yesterday, he does sound crazy, out of touch and nothing but a mouth piece for the gun manufacturers.

Northstar, the Congress needs to stop giving him a large stage. Since he has gone completely around the bend and obviously doesn't represent the views of even the NRA membership, he's irrelevant. All he does is detract from getting things done. He gets way more press coverage than victims of gun violence.

RTFS,

Good point. I really do not know how a Congressional committee picks the people who will appear . I am sure that both the chair and the minority leader on the committee agree on the list of names.

And the press and cable news can get lazy by only quoting the various paid lobbyists for their pieces. Sound bites are an easy way out instead of a in depth story.

To play devil's advocate, who said this?

"We have a mental health system in this country that has completely and totally collapsed. We have no national database of these lunatics. … 23 states are still putting only a small number of records into the system and a lot of states are putting none. So when they go through the National Instant Check System and they go to try to screen out one of those lunatics, the records are not even in the system. [...]"

Sounds like a rational concrete step to increase, update the mental health check system. Just a hint, although I agree with the above on universal mental health checks, the quoted person vehemently is at odds with me on almost every other issue about gun reform.

That said, surely having a universal gun check registry for the mentally ill is a good idea. I've posted before that not only a criminal check but a mental health check needs to take place at the sale of all guns. This would include guns at stores and at gun shows. A system could be put in place for private transactions as well.

For those interested the quote above came from the NRA VP on a recent Meet the Press taping.

RTFS -

In a way, I'm actually glad that Wayne LaPierre is getting so much time in the spotlight lately - because short of the low-life poster here yesterday who referred to Gabby Giffords as "some drooling brain damaged sympathy case" - or short of bringing back Charlton Heston and his cold dead hands - I can't think of a better poster boy for everything that's wrong with the NRA. Every new chance he gets to come off like a responsible, thoughtful leader who's willing to make even some token compromises to make his membership seem like the good guys in this debate, LaPierre instead ramps up the "we're the victims here" mentality and doubles down on whatever his last idiotic argument was. If you notice, even the most rabid gun proponents here don't have any praise for him, but if anything, seem to go out of their way to avoid even mentioning his name. No pun intended, but he's one of the best weapons there is out there against his own campaign.

He's kind of getting to be the Mitt Romney of the gun debate. Or perhaps more accurately, the Rick Santorum.

Turn up that spotlight, I say.

Mark D,

Taking the point you bring forth further -

Advocates for unrestricted weapon ownership often rely on the Slippery Slope argument to support their viewpoint. Yet many of these posters also support massive government involvement in mental health, without acknowledging the Slippery Slope nature of this involvement. If one is to carry a consistent argument one must concede that the possibility of the government abusing the concept of mental health in subjugating the people is just as real as the government confiscating the people's weapons.

Oh how the NRA has changed, from a gun enthusiast lobby to a gun manufactures lobbyist and no they are not the same thing.

"I do not believe in the general promiscuous toting of guns, I think it should be sharply restricted and only under Licenses" Karl Frederick, NRA president 1934

My fellow Mark, ah yes the slippery slope argument.

Not you but those who propose the slippery slope/give and inch take a mile argument are hard to reason with.

They see a proposal about gun reform like a computer language line of code "if, then, go to" abolish the 2nd amendment. Or if A happens then B happens. If certain guns are restricted then all guns will become restricted. The worst case fallacy is when they jump further if A happens then B happens and five years later Z happens (guns are confiscated, people put in work camps).

LaPierre could be Mitten's twin brother of another mother given both of their habits of flip-flopping on rather large issues. LaPierre in 1999 . . .

LaPierre’s position is a complete reversal from his 1999 testimony, when he told the House Judiciary Committee Subcommittee on Crime, “We think it’s reasonable to provide mandatory instant criminal background checks for every sale at every gun show. No loopholes anywhere for anyone.”

http://www.nationalmemo.com/lapierre-flip-flops-on-background-checks-during-contentious-hearing/

Mark,

I fail to understand how those who vehemously oppose a national registration of guns are in favor of a national database of the mentally ill.

So we should register the mentally ill but not firearms? I, too, see agreater chance for abuse of this registry than of a firearm registry.

Tnsevol - Perhaps you were speaking to Socal?

How can a mental health registry be abused? People with mental issues should not be able to buy weapons, for the greater safety of us all. The registry would only be viewed when/if they are buying a weapon. It would not be shared or accessible in any other circumstance, such as during hiring, applying for credit (purchases) etc.

Mark & Tnsevol . . .

a national database of the mentally ill.

That indeed is one VERY slippery slope. Who will be making the call as to what mental illness is "worthy" of being on the "list." The mother taking Prozac to get through her day? The Bipolar student who with medications has stabilized symptoms but is now labeled as mentally ill? The schizophrenic who refuses to take medications? Or even those with severe substance abuse issues that are in treatment - heavy sustance use can definitely mimic and or mask mental health issues. In fact, many mentally ill clients use substances to control their symptoms as they refuse to seek treatment. It is definitely a larger debate and one that Washington should not legislate. What will drive it? The diagnosis given? The entire HIPAA act has caused enough grief for the medical communities. Sure, there is some good in it but it is so full or pork that it makes it difficult for many providers to offer treatment.

Yellowdog -

The registry would only be viewed when/if they are buying a weapon

I would hope that would be the case, although I could see potential for abuse if it was found out that certain high-profle people like celebrities or politicians were found to be on the list.

The information could also potentially be used against you in a divorce hearing, etc.

My point is I can see a higher chance for abuse of a mental illness list than of a list of guns & gun owners.

Layton and Tnsevol - I see your points, however without a comprehensive approach gun reform/control won't be successful. To speak to your point about some people with mental illness may be unfairly deprived of the 2nd amendment right, aren't there reformed criminals, non violent criminals who are deprived their 2nd amendment rights?

As for who decides, pyschiatrists decide. Surely people like the "Batman" movie shooter should have been on such a list.

Perhaps it is not PC or you are coming from a purist libretarian view point. However, at some point the greater society's safety is at risk. You can't argue for banning assault weapon for society's greater good but then ignore it when discussing mental health background checks.

Good thoughts shared. Lunch time.

Fancy this too,

I agree.

Last night I wrote both of my Senators and urged them to pass a gun reform bill.

They need to hear from ordinary citizens.

But, hey, they also legalized the sale of fireworks, so folks can spend money they don't have on pyrotechnics.

...and blow off their own hands with M-80s...meaning they'll have to travel to those big hospitals that are so far away that required them to pay more for health insurance.

THIS DERP'S FOR YOU!!!

Gee, THERE'S a great combination for you!! Fireworks and no proximity to a hospital.! 4th of July must be a real carnage fest!!

M-80s are banned under FEDERAL law.

http://www.maine.gov/dps/fmo/inspections/fw_federal_state.html

M-80s are banned under FEDERAL law.

...and yet people still get their hands on them.

(I guess that means we shouldn't have that law because it doesn't work?)

Reminds me of something Jeff Foxworthy once said; if one of your relative's last words were "HEY, Y'ALL, WATCH THIS!!", you might be a redneck!

M-80s are banned under FEDERAL law.

...and yet people still get their hands on them.

so following Wayne La Pierre's logic, we all need to carry M-80's to protect ourselves. you know good pyrotechnics vs bad pyrotechnics

Auntie Fascist, Fourth of July IS Maine's entire summer. LOL Sorry Amy.

'S Ok, Johntho, don't we know it!

Job, as a resident of a donor state, I'm sick of having my wealth redistributed to the yahoos. Ironic that Alaska, the home of that moronic Palin who's always yapping about socialism, is in the top three of the "takers".

Honestly, I don't mind that people who need assistance get it. I'm just sick of them being so hypocritical about it.

Pat,

What is with these old wealthy guys?

Man, even the old robber barons of yesterday , when they got closer to the end of their lives, turned to spending their money on a positive legacy, ie. Carnegie libraries across the country.

Northstar, I can't answer that. It's a different type of party now. Selfish, successful - throwing it in everyone's face - to let us know we are worthless. But as you said, yesterday's robber barons at least invested in our nation for future generations. They gave a lot back. You don't see that too much any longer. No one wants to spend a dime. Who was it that said yesterday - if we don't move ahead, we will fall behind.

Instead we see white old men taking joy out of attempting to humiliate people day after day after day - Republicans of today. Cheap labor, divisiveness, bigotry, racism, voter suppression. All the usual crap.

History will not be kind to them. Not that they care. They don't. They don't think for one minute what they themselves can do to make a difference while they are here on planet earth.

They decided that it is their job to just humiliate. Just about everybody.

Hey, Pat, who are the Democrats going to run for Kerry's seat? Heard anything yet? I don't want that jerk Brown winning again.

Hi Jack. Rep. Markey seems to be gaining steam in the polls. We need to keep Stephen Lynch out. He will let us democrats down time and time again if he were to enter the Senate.

I believe Rep. Markey could beat Scott Brown handily if Brown so chooses to run.

Pat, That's good to hear. I don't know much about him. Thanks.

Jack, I do have to say though - these never ending Senate campaigns here in MA are taking on a life of their own. haha

Pat, you guys certainly have some senatorial shake-up action there in MA.

Not so much here in CA. I think we could use some shaking up of our own but the GOP just can't seem to field a viable candidate.

Pat,

There is a diffrent tone and drive coming from mega donors like Freiss and Adelson than an industrialist like Carnegie .

Maybe it has to do with the modern enpenuir who made their money not building things but providing a service are just doing what they are good at. Both Friess and Delson are motivated by their religous views, one a born again evanelical who say God is the CEO of my life!? And Adelson, a Jewish supporter of Israel, who as an American wants to shape American politcs for his religious ends.

But both of these modern day elites leave the road that Carnigie staked out in his "On Wealth" essay when he speaks about giving away your wealth while you are still alive to promote the common good of society.

http://www.swarthmore.edu/SocSci/rbannis1/AIH19th/Carnegie.html

Adelson and Freiss have a need to protect their narrow view of God, country and use the power of their fortune to achieve their ends.

Hi Mark, shake up is no doubt a good thing, particularly now as the country is moving fast - there is so much new legislation coming this year out of Congress, which is terrific.

The GOP will no doubt have to tone it down, otherwise, they're going to be lost for a while. I'm happy to see those such as yourself willing to sit out the party until it gains its sanity back.

To their credit they are getting the message. I want two parties, but it seems to me that it is the GOP who believe in only one party - their own. They have got to change that mindset.

Starting with the air waves.

Northstar, thank you so much for the link. I've printed it out and will read it this evening on my way home. I love what you have written about the differences in today's wealthy v. a century ago. Wonderfully put and again, thank you for the link. I'm looking foward to reading it.

Pat Boston MA.

Remember this guy? The bayer asperin/contraceptives guy?

Pat Boston MA.

How can anyone forget that nut????

I'm happy to see those such as yourself willing to sit out the party until it gains its sanity back.

I am a die-hard Dodger fan. I am used to sticking with loosers!!!

Mark, I'm in the midst of reading Terry Francona's book on his time as manager of the Red Sox. It is a complicated job, keeping a team together with all the different personalities and ego's throughout an entire season. Like you, a die hard fan here until recently. I don't mind having losing seasons at all - I've certainly seen my share through the years - but something is terribly wrong when you have ownership here in Boston who decide to bring in sexy baseball players, which will help bring in the ladies which in turn will help gate receipts.

I guess since steroids left the scene, things have become a little - boring? LoL

Ha ha Bev! Too funny.

...as if Israel isn't doing a good enough job of that on their own?

...and, by the way, Mr. Hagel is the nominee for "Secretary of Defense for the United States" and not "Secretary of Defense for Israel".

I have had enough of Israel dictating defense policy to us. Without us they would not exist, they should be thankful for that.

Hagel will be the U. S. secretary of defense. Let me know when Israel becomes the 51st state.

@Auntie Fascist#13.3: Happened May 14,1948. 49th state.

is rahmbo the leader of this mayoral group? let's make more laws that wont work. murder is illegal but people still commit murder -- what can we do to stop murder? make it more illegal with more laws against murder?

billybob,

Just because you've taken the argument down the reductio ad absurdum path doesn't mean it adds value to the discussion. Quite the contrary. It adds nothing because it doesn't address the issue.

How does Oklahoma keep sending him back to Washington? Ransom Stoddard, he ain't!!!

Oklahoman's do it with the greatest of ease. Too, would be too time consuming and costly to teach 'em to read another name.

And Breitbart and O'Keefe's motto is....? Speaking of doctored video.

auntie -- so you are fine with media distorting stories to meet their own agenda?

No, but I was addressing "Reality" Man. I'll be happy to acccept your answer. Speaking of no whining, O'Keefe bitched about not being allowed to go to the Republican convention. It was couched in terms of "little me against big government". Uh, you're on PROBATION for a misdemeanor pled down from a felony! Just be happy you don't have to worry about dropping soap in jail!

The CEO of GE did create some jobs, all in China.

And yet, this tells a completely different story. Haven't you heard, Insourcing is the new Fad in manufacturing.

The Insourcing Boom

After years of offshore production, General Electric is moving much of its far-flung appliance-manufacturing operations back home. It is not alone. An exploration of the startling, sustainable, just-getting-started return of industry to the United States. http://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2012/12/the-insourcing-boom/309166/?single_page=true

If it's really their fate, then so be it. It's better than a Hillary leadership.