David Gregory needs to go. Anyone could do a better job at MTP than this clown.

....and somehow Ryan is hoping to turn the theme from "the party of no" into "it's all the democrats fault"...........by saying no.

"Ryan offered a familiar answer about his own potential ambitions, saying he doesn't think about running, and that he was currently focused on his job serving his constituents."

Oh, sure, he's not thinking about it at all.

Actually, he ought to be thinking about the 2014 midterm elections next year and how the GOP is on the list for extermination unless their party escapes the clutches of their hijackers, the Tea Party.

(They would also do better if they denounced Fox News media and came on back to the real world.)

Gregory questions Gangnam Style !! He is not really all that credible, which unfortunately makes him quite good at getting politicians on the show who want to say stuff but don't want to actually answer questions.

Does he know that the American people have, to use his words, "moved past" the Republican Party. No thanks....you guys got nuthin' for us. Let your rich 1% elect you suckers.

If they aren't for increasing revenue, then their first step should be a drastic cut in the Congressional budget, then figure out where they will cut all other departments, agencies, and programs. Congressional staff should be reduced by a minimum of 50% or $4 for every $1 of any other budget cuts.

"I don't think that the president actually thinks we have a fiscal crisis," Ryan said.

And obviously Ryan thought when he voted for the Bush tax cuts, the unfunded socialist bailout of Wall Street/banks, the unfunded socialist Medicare Part D, and the two unfunded trillion dollar wars and nation building in Iraq and Afghanistan, that cutting revenues and running up the debt "because deficits don't matter" that America wouldn't end up in a fiscal crisis! So, if Ryan is unable to see the results of how his actions and voting record have contributed significantly to the the economic disaster of 2008, and is not willing acknowledge his own culpability in bringing this about, then he doesn't understand the cause and is least qualified to offer recommendations on solutions. Ryan continuously demonstrates a positional view rather than a rational assessment of the root cause and an equitable solution!

More now than ever we have evidence that austerity has not worked in Europe and their GDP continues to slide as unemployment increases.

So Ryan's plan is to more than double the budget cuts that he proposed just a year ago that was soundly rejected by the voters in their official and by larger numbers in exit polls.

While Ryan won't get into details his plan clearly attacks Medicare and Medicaid with cuts rather than other reforms. Republicans continue to insist the only answer to saving entitlements is to cut them so that they become so weak that no one will fight to keep them in another 20 or 30 years.

Sure you betcha...let's let the whole country go down the toilet to protect the big boys....wouldn't want to cut into their cushy lifestyle would we ????

Serve his constituents? That would be nice for a change. Does Lyin' Ryan know that 2 of the cities in his district typically have the highest unemployment rates in the state of Wisconsin? He would have had the 3 highest except in the last gerrymander Beloit was taken out of his district so more Republicans in Waukesha county could guarantee that he would keep his job.

While you are at it Paulie, you better find some revenue to pay the bills for the 2 unfunded wars and Medicare Part D you voted for.

They should give the kid Luke Russert a shot a MTP, he could not possibly be worse than Gregory.

@the republican party

You know it is pretty simple really, if you spew BS constantly for four years, people will finally decide that you are just chock full of BS.

Please,

Paul Lying Ryan is an embarrassment to the state of in, to Rock Co. and to Janesville. This right wing nut case couldn't explain his tax proposals at his town meeting I went to and walked out. He's a fool and in the last election which he usually wins over 70% of the vote I think it was 56%. Maybe next time we can sweep him under the rug!

As a former YR ( Young Republican) many years ago I can assure you that is why I'm not one today. The whole party is BS.

The only thing that Ryan and the Party of No want to "raise" is Cain.

Ah yes the TSA, It would be easier now to just go to the airport in your bathrobe and slippers, stupid terrorists, they should of had a bra bomber that would have made the extra half hour in the security line worth it.

the only reason Gregory does not take a job with fox is the fact that he wants to be considered as a fair and balanced news commentator a job at fox would make him show how unbalanced he really is .. what the dems need to do is eliminate every loop hole and tax break for those earning over $500,000 and send that to the house as a budget ..the way Ryans budget wants to eliminate every tax break the middle class receives

.

It's like Gregory has his list of questions to get through and doesn't care if they get answered. On to the next question! I don't want to hear the list of his questions without hearing real answers.

All you dumbasses keep on praising the party of spending and raising taxes.

Better look in the mirror when you use that term. It's pretty damn near impossible to live without spending and as far as your cut proposals go, the defense budget is the biggest waste of federal money there is.

Heck of a job, Party of No.

Ryan clearly explained to us that he and his mother are not takers while they partake of Social Security, rather it is all those other people living on Social Security and other entitlements that are the takers. That was the most disgusting divisive statement made. We shouldn't be surprised; when he draws a government paid salary as a Congressman, he is a giver, as opposed to all other Federal workers, which he describes as takers, living of the guvment teat!

Mr. President,

Please cut the Pentagon and Defense spending in 1/2. That will easily help balance the budget! Raising revenue is not over! Get rid of tax loopholes for the rich and it will also held balance the budget!

Many in Ryan's district are farmers. Remember farmers make up 2% of Americans and get 14% of the entitlements. They also complain the most about give a ways yet they take far more than their share. (Set aside, Crop price supports, help with government low cost loans for farm purchases, etc!)

"Paul Ryan, said Sunday that the Republican House of Representatives has already moved past the question of new revenues."

How about, the Republican controlled House of Representatives has moved totally past all logical reasoning and compromise.

Or, how about this: "I don't think the president actually thinks we have a fiscal crisis," said Ryan.

I would hope that after the president has, for the last four years plus, repeatedly stated that we must get our 'fiscal house' in order and our spending under control, Congressman Ryan would actually use his ears and eyes and pay attention to what the president actually says instead of what the political landscape dictates he says. (See Direct White House Quotes Below)

http://www.whitehouse.gov/the-press-office/2011/04/13/remarks-president-fiscal-policy

HELLO, the next lie will be forthcoming from Rep. Ryan soon!

The only thing I have to say is I feel sorry for the people of Wisconsin that they have a Clown like Paul Ryan !!!

Paul's mother says her son is so beloved buy the Koch boys !!!

OHGuy

Dear Mr. President,

You got your Tax Increase now it is time for you to do some CUTTING…..

He's already done some "cutting." $1 trillion of it, in fact. We need MORE tax increases along with more spending cuts; if you don't think that than you are an idiot with no understanding of basic math.

Dear Congress,

1. Filibusters have to be continuous and filibuster must be present....

2. Majority must be present to be in session

3. No more Super Majority, You know 51 % is majority 60 % is BS.....

Well, at least we can agree on that...

4. Quit the Pork, 1 Bill per item.....

I hate pork too, but that is impossible. Pork is an inevitable part of democracy; you didn't think it was all flowers and chocolates, right?

Yes, cuts are in order. However before you touch your so called entitlement programs lets address some additional costs.....

1. Runaway spending by Home Land Security - The GRANTS they are going are really worthless. There are too many agencies duplicating the effort.

I'd prefer sending the priorities back to the Defense Department (isn't the DoD the organizer of defense in the U.S?).

2. Runaway cost of Public Sector Workers - This group is way Over Paid & the Benefits are out of line.....

Actually, public workers seem to be getting lavish benefits (and in some cases might be, although not in all cases) because private sector benefits have gone down the tube thanks to the decline of unions.

6. Runaway cost of EPA - Way to many restrictive rules.....

So apparently our children's future (aka a planet where NYC, Los Angeles, Shanghai, and St. Petersburg aren't sleeping with the fishes) isn't worth a little short-term pain. Well done. Maybe you can explain that to your grandchildren after New York gets flooded and the Statue of Liberty lies several dozen feet underwater....

Paul Ryan isn't what he's cracked up to be. Instead of a serious deficit hawk willing to tackle any problem and accept any option, he is nothing more than a right-wing ideologue interested only in "starving the beast" and destroying what remains of the New Deal and the social safety net. If he was a serious deficit hawk while also a realistic pragmatist, he would have thrown away the Medicare voucher program and the privatization of Social Security the first time it failed. If he really understood the dangers facing our nation today, he would have thrown his support behind the Simpson-Bowles commission (something I would accept, even as a progressive) and propose spending cuts and revenue increases. If he really understood how the widening gap between rich and poor destroys economic growth and taints our democracy, he would eagerly promote the protection and enhancement of the social safety net and raising taxes on the wealthy, not cutting their taxes and dismantling every welfare program so that the "free market" can ride on a white horse and rescue the poor. Essentially, this guy is an fake, and all his policies are nothing but right-wing extremism packaged as pragmatic deficit reduction. Paul Ryan knows nothing of moving to the center; if he did, he would have accepted the notion that tax increases are necessary and that the welfare state in this country does not make us a nation of takers but instead enables us to care for society's disadvantaged, which is a key part of the social contract between us and our leaders. This bastard shouldn't be anywhere near a budget committee, let alone its chairman.

So many of you make great points but lose your argument due to your name calling and disrespect to fellow Americans. Some insight-
1. For close to 40 years the amount the US Govt spent on the defense department was closely correlated to the amount of tax revenue from american corporations. This is statistic is now far out of balance and defense spending should be lowered to bring it back closer to being in line.
2. The yearly deficit is borrowed money, more importantly its unsterilized printed money. This is equivilent to a disproportionate tax on blue collar and lower middle class workers. Please see food and commodity prices and the upcoming yearly expectations.

3. This whole discussion comes down to power and authority. Many of you feel its a war between the Republicans and Democrats when in truth neither party has half as much power as you believe they do. The real power lies in the Banks (including the Federal Reserve). Since 08 the largest banks have increased in size & scope of their businesses and now have complete control over our legislative and executive branches of government. When ZIRP ends no amount of rational tax increases will cover the interest on our (current) national debt.

4. The argument over SS needs to end. Obama saying the SS reciepents will not recieve checks if we do not expand the borrowing authority of the govt is akin to theft. The SS fund is a seperate account from the general fund. The SS fund is currently well funded (the future is another story), Further the money that goes into the SS fund is then lent to the govt to pay its general fund obligations at an interest rate below inflation. This is simply the theft of your hard earned retirement funds to fund todays daily expenses. To keep SS solvent we will have to raise contributions to cover the Baby Boomer retirement or the boomers will have to accept smaller monthly payments.

5. The farm bill- This bill is designed to benifit large corporate farmers while minimizing and outright hurting the small local producers. The (paying people not to farm) goes back to 1930's and is called the Conservation Reserve Program. It was ment half as an environmental bill- To take the least productive farmland and make it (wild) again and further to limit supply so that farmers could make a profit. This program has run its due course and is in needs of retirement. (i will note- that if not for the farm bill you could expect to pay anywhere between 25-40% more food your monthly food prices).

6. Medicare- Lastly, this is a subject that is completly open. We will soon see if Obama's state run exchanges can make healthcare affordable. As a small business owner it would be great to see less power in the hands of the insurance company though I personally hold little hope as there were no provisiions to lower the cost of care. If your interested in a well rounded govt run healthcare look to New Zealand where they instituted both sides of the coin.

To fix the budjet all we need to do is remove the 110K payroll tax ceiling. In Wa the people vote on what we want done. How about letting the people vote on if they think its fair that someone making 600M pay thes same payroll tax as someone making 110K

Arthur, waaaa, waaaa, sniff, sniff, I bet you can hardly afford the mix drinks that make you delusional. After all $250,000 is the edge of poverty and asking someone that makes that kind of money to pay 3.5% is going to break them.

Let me put it this way, if the rich do not create the jobs that the republicans say they do when they get a tax cuts maybe its time to tax them a bit more and get some of the work done that is needed here at home. Instead of building schools in lands far away it would only seem intelligent to build them here. Of course common sense is not a GOP trait.

It is funny tonybeeerm! I said those same things when we had that clown bushwhacker in office.

Not to mention a privileged party frat boy who never had to exert himself in his life. No wonder he was so out of touch with the common American. He did have fun playing war with his best buddies Cheney and Rumsfeld though. Too bad our justice department doesn't take the initiative and go after these war criminals. I would love to see all three of them spend the rest of their days in a federal prison.

Cut all taxes on the rich.

Cut all spending on the poor.

And lo and behold - you have a balanced budget.

But what about the unbalanced society that would create ? And what would happen when poor disenfranchised hungry sick angry masses descend upon the streets to tear down your palaces and your rightie edifices to greed and evil ? Where will you run to then ?

It's time for austerity and we need to start by taking away the life time pension for every single member of congress. We need to force them to pay for their own health insurance, every penny of it! We need to slash Congressional pay now and force members of Congress to pay office expenses out of their own pocket. Most of all we need to stop giving my tax dollars to this crypto-fascist piece of garbage, Ryan.

Well, now... Looks like Eddie Munster is more delusional than we originally thought.

I wonder if he, and his Greedy Obstructionist Party cronies really understand how economics and math works, or if they are only experts because Faux says they are.

Let's see what the Congressional Budget Office has to say, shall we?

Social Security and Medicare are sometimes called "entitlements," because people meeting relevant eligibility requirements are legally entitled to benefits, although most pay taxes into these programs throughout their working lives. Some mandatory spending (such as Congressional salaries) is not part of any entitlement program.

The United States spent 20 percent of the federal budget on defense in 2008. According to the CBO, defense spending grew 9.8% annually on average from fiscal year 2000-2009.

Much of the costs for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan have not been funded through regular appropriations bills, but through emergency supplemental appropriations bills. As such, most of these expenses were not included in the budget deficit calculation prior to FY2010. Some budget experts argue that emergency supplemental appropriations bills do not receive the same level of legislative care as regular appropriations bills. During 2011, the U.S. spent more on its military budget than the next 13 countries combined.

All told, the U.S. government spent about $718 billion on defense and international security assistance in 2011 — more than it spent on Medicare. That includes all of the Pentagon’s underlying costs as well as the price tag for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, which came to $159 billion in 2011. It also includes arms transfers to foreign governments.

- U.S. Congressional Budget Office, An Analysis of the President's Budgetary Proposals for Fiscal Year 2010, June 2009.

Very interesting!

What about a recent analysis by the Washington Post?

Defense Spending in 2011

United States: $718 Billion

China, Russia, Great Britain, France, Japan, India, Saudi Arabia, Germany, Brazil, Italy, South Korea, Australia, and Canada combined: $692 Billion

¢27.8 of every tax dollar goes to Defense spending. ¢20.1 goes to Medicare, and ¢12.2 goes to Social Security.

As the economy has tanked, the banks have been bailed out, and America lost its jobs, the defense budget continues to grow.

For the past 13 years U.S. military spending has increased 114 percent.

That's 8 percent higher than at the height of Reagan's presidency and the Cold War.

The money is used to buying sophisticated weapons that often don't make it into production, and when the do they're expensive to maintain.

The U.S. must spend a full 1 percent of its GDP just to maintain its arsenal.

- Washington Post analysis of US Defense Spending

Wow, who would have thought?

What does the Office of Management and Budget have to say?

Where'd the money go?

A significant reason for the current budget deficit were the tax cuts instigated by President George W. Bush. but President Obama also pushed through Congress a payroll tax cut intended to pump money into a moribund economy. Tax cuts accounted for a further $2.8 trillion of the $11.7 trillion discrepancy. The biggest component was Bush’s 2001 reduction in income-tax rates, which alone accounts for about $1.2 trillion in revenue foregone over the decade.

There were increases in outflows unpredicted by the CBO. Between 2001 and 2011, increased discretionary spending amounted to about $3 trillion. This category includes defense spending related to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, homeland security upgrades in the US, spending on food stamps and other hard-times safety net programs, and other general budget categories that are supposed to be approved annually by Congress.

Edmund Volkshull, a former economic official in the Bush White House, explains that the majority of the discrepancy came from decreased revenues. (in other words, tax cuts) 32 percent went away due to projection inaccuracy (we guessed wrong) 49 percent went to tax cuts, (Congress and Dubya gave breaks to the wealthy) and 19 percent can be accounted for by various forms of increased spending. (Congress spent money on unfunded and illegal wars).

- Office of Management & Budget

I don't know about you guys, but a reading of the facts, analysis of economic data, and reality shows that Ryan and his Grotesquely Obsolete Party hacks don't have the first inkling of what tanked the economy (other than their stated intent to do so) and they clearly don't understand that the Middle Class is the economic engine of this nation.

They're committing treason right before our eyes, and their constituents are stupid enough to let them get away with it.

If you believe Government is too large …

While government spending increased over the last decade the actual size of government has been relatively stable both in the actual number of employees and as a percent of the population.
In fact we have fewer government employees than in the 80's with a huge drop as a percent of our population.

Number of Federal employees (excluding military)
YEAR - Fed Emp (000) - Population (000,000) - % of Population
2010 - 2,841 - 309.3 - 0.92% - Obama *
2009 - 2,839 - 307.0 - 0.92% - Obama
2005 2,702 295.8 0.91% Bush
2001 2,704 285.1 0.95% Bush
1997 2,787 272.6 1.02% Clinton
1993 3,014 259.9 1.16% Clinton
1989 3,124 246.8 1.27% Bush
1985 - 3,066 - 237.9 - 1.29% - Reagan
1981 - 2,860 - 229.5 - 1.25% - Reagan
1976 2,893 219.8 1.32% Carter
*= Includes temp Census workers, Last year data available
http://www.opm.gov/feddata/HistoricalTables/TotalGovernmentSince1962.asp
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_the_United_States

Wow! Gregory is a real lapdog isnt he? I knew his wife is a (R) lobbyist but this is ridiculous. He is supposed to be an impartial reporter. I will never watch him again. He asks the hard questions when a dem. is on but when any repub. comes on he does everything but hold their coffee cups for them. How can Ryan expect to solve all our deficit problems without raising any revenue? he cant and he knows it. He lives in fantasy land and he thinks we are all real dumbsh1ts! and are buying his Horse sh1t! He doesnt even believe it but he thinks we are so stupid we are gonna just take his word for it. Tell us your plan Ryan...break out the chart and show us how this is supposed to work...then maybe you can convince me..until then just STFU! you lying dog. You and your partys only intention is bringing down the government and throwing us all back into the 1800's and turning us all into your slaves. You and your new Repub party are traitiors. He11 your not even real repubs. and should be thrown out of the party. The real repub. party has some dignity and respect for the job they do and they seriously care about the people and the country. You work for yourself and your own gain and for corporations.

Gunga - the "unbalanced society" would look very much like a recent and very popular movie just out last month, "Les Miserables". Author Victor Hugo was to France's dreadful economic times as Charles Dickens was to England's - horrible socioeconomic disparity and misery. And for those who care - the undertrodden were mostly "white" - the elite did not discriminate - beware.
Maybe the GOP won't be happy until those "good old days" for an elite class return, the poor be damned.

Arrogant and immature. A majority of people want one thing, he throws a tantrum because he's in the minority. He has not convinced a majorityof the people that his way is better. When you can do that, then have it your way. There's got to be compromise, sir.

Looks like Paul Ryan is having a cup of tea with his Party !

I need a shower after watching the Lyin Ryan love fest on MTP!

Ah Feisty - watching those baby blues gaze into those baby blues was rather intriguing. Thank goodness they waited for the cameras to quit rolling before they stripped off their shirts to compare their big P90X guns, mano-a-mano style <<snark off>>.

Yes let's keep spending. How many personal budgets do you know spend more than take in and keep their heads above water. Economics are economics.

Oh Gboy, don't you know, a liberals mantra is in name calling, then when they can't make headway with their point it's 'I don't want to talk about it', so it's best to just ignore it. It doesn't matter who is on this committee, they have their work cut out, google the last few years income, and expenditures for the federal government. What you will find is if they completely zero out the expenditures, it still won't come to a negative balance. That means if they spend nothing, completely shut the government down, it still will have a deficit, it won't reduce the national debt, we are too far in debt, the interest, combines with a lower revenue due to loss of GDP is eating us alive. How to we fix this? Well, a lot goes back to LBJ, it was fairly stable during the Kennedy administration, but when LBJ took office, there was a emphasis on Vietnam, and the War on poverty, two wars, on two fronts, and it has left some residual affects, like Medicaid, where people get benefits without paying into the program. I can remember before this, there was the USDA commodities program, where agricultural commodities were delivered to communities, and distributed by churches, or civic organizations to those who needed a hand up to help them put food on the table, not everyone got it, and the mentality was different from today. As A child I helped measure the commodities out, and people that needed a hand up would come it on a Saturday, once a month, hat in hand, asking for help, not demanding a hand out. Times have changed, my 84 year old father volunteers at the local food bank, and people will almost try to push him aside trying to get something free. His morality hasn't changed, it's about helping people get back on their feet, not about providing a way of life, but it's society's morality that has changed, I won't be following in his footsteps, so when he is gone, they will need to depend on themselves. Mind you, I have no problem with giving a hand up, but a hand out is just that, something for nothing, go get a job, just like I do.

The GDP has been low for a while, it goes back to Clinton giving trade status to China, and we can see how that worked out. Everyone likes a bargain, but at what cost? When we are not protected by trade tariffs, our manufacturing sector suffers. Raw material doesn't, those are sold overseas, and returned as finished goods, sans the labor costs, and American jobs in the process. People flock to buy the bargains, but don't think that those bargains they got just cost an American their job, which eventually trickles down to their job, because the person producing the product, isn't working and earning, paying taxes, and have become a liability rather than an asset, and can't afford what the bargain seeker produces. So, we need to stimulate GDP, and to do that we must enhance the domestic market, even if protectionism is required.

Next is, the federal government owns a lot of property, much of which isn't used, in storage, land that sits vacant, or is leased for little to nothing. At the end of the War for Southern Independence, aka Civil War, the government also had a lot of property, wagons, horses, mules, weapons, clothing, etc. Congress in their wisdom, commissioned auctioneers as Colonels in the US Army to liquidate those assets at public auction. This created a revenue, and reduced to costs associated with maintaining and storing this property, as well as getting it into the hands of people that could put it to better use. We have far too much government property, it would be wise to consider liquidating it. That is one of the things the Russians did when they dissolved the USSR, if a Russian was living in a house or apartment, they could offer to buy it, it gave the Russian government some revenue, and the citizen got housing.

As you can see, it is not a simple issue, or issues, and nobody will make everybody happy. But running a deficit, adds to the national debt, which requires the interest be serviced, and that has become a problem. We need to reduce the interest we pay to the bankers, and foreign interests, or we will never dig ourselves out of the rut. And that will require reducing the national debt, which will be painful.

After many years, I had to leave the GOP and move to Independent, because of this type of thing. To fix this mess, we need to reduce wasteful spending, raise taxes, and, unpleasant as it is, engage in some shrewd and well-considered investment spending for long-term growth. We're spending too much in some areas, not enough in others, and borrowing instead of raising taxes. No fiscal prudence whatsoever. Despite my disagreement with the GOP's trend to engaging in social issues, a stance I frequently was in opposition with, if they had held to true fiscally wise policies, I would have stayed. But the leadership appears more focused on social issues such as abortion and same-sex marriage, in contrary position to a party that promotes small government.

This increase in revenues he speaks of, was the first time taxes have been raised on the rich in about 20 years!!! Revenues ARE NOT off the table!! Taxes need to be raised even higher on the richest people, who have taken advantage of this country to make their fortunes!! The average person CANNOT keep getting hit with cuts!!! If you want to cut, start with oil subsidies, defense, corporate welfare and greed!! If you want people to get off of so called entitlement's pay them a decent wage with benefits. THAT would solve the problem AND raise tax revenue!!! Paul 'Lyin' Ryan, is a fool!!! He is the worst of the worst! Him and Eric Cantor, need to just go away and never come back!! The sequester will only hurt the already hurting! Obama needs to use the 14th Amendment and get it over with!!

I am not going to bother defending Ryan or the GOP today, but I do have something to say. I would like to ask a question of all of you posting today, how much is enough? How much of a tax increase will be enough to pay for all the agenda programs the democrats want? How much income is enough to take from those making over 250k? How much should the country be able to borrow before paying the bill? How big should the debt be allowed to become? How much should Obama and Democrats be allowed to spend every year? How much should Congress be allowed to spend? All I see here are people to concerned with who won the election and who lost. People who are more concerned with ideology than with reality. What happens when the money runs out and there are no more rich to tax? Where will the money come from to pay for the food we all need? Who will be left to protect the US when the military budget is gutted and used to pay for the ever growing social dole? When the wine and cake are gone how will the mob react? You all foolishly hide behind the thought that everyone is rational and civilized in the world in which we live. Hide behind the idea that there will be someone there to step in an help if we should stumble. That is not how nature works, in nature the weak fall pray to the strong. Nature selects the least able to help themselves for extinction. It may sound like an alarmist view, but it would be much easier to turn the tide now than when it is much stronger. It would be much easier to find a way out of debt now than it will be another 10 trillion in the hole! Every time there has been a revenue increase, there has also been an increase in spending that is bigger than the revenue increase. If this was not true, taxes and the national debt would never have to increase!

Thanks for the heads up on MTP, which I think I'll skip. The media is so lame in this country when it comes to the Teapublicans and asking hard-hitting questions with follow-up.

Paul Ryan is such a punk. Like Reince Priebus keeping the RNC chairman job, it appears Paul Ryan is being kept in a "rising star" role. Hahaha, the GOP continues to be the Stupid Party.

The Teapublicans painted themselves in a corner by kicking the debt ceiling can down the road for three more months with the demand that they balance the budget in 10 years! Punk Ryan couldn't balance the budget in 30 years -- Did they overlook that fact? And the twerp thinks he can do it in 10 years without revenues?

The sequester is even more of a rock and hard place for Teapublicans. Because they refuse to take a balanced approach with revenues, they negotiated big cuts to defense spending. Trust funds of Social Security and Medicare and other social contract programs are not on the sequester table. Only a few of the cuts would be unsavory for the Democrats. Go ahead Punk, make our day and threaten the Dems with the sequester. Hahahaha!

And revenues are a topic of the past? The recent federal income tax rates were ONLY on income above $400 to 450K (what Ryan makes), so it was a tax cut! These revenues barely catch up to the spending cuts that were made in the 2011 budget -- Oh but the president has gotten everything he wanted, riiiight. But regardless of the rightwing spin, there's NO way to balance the budget in 10 years even with a sh!tload of revenue.

And now Punk Ryan can't even mention trust funds of Social Security and Medicare, not even other programs like Medicaid -- Because Republicans, especially seniors would have him tarred and feathered and run out of town on a rail. And rightfully so! His back-peddling in circles away from his earlier "makers and takers" comments was mind-bending. Heck, even Jan Brewer in Arizona is expanding Medicaid in the Obamacare roll-out because Arizona already learned the hard lessons of not participating in it.

But getting back to David Gregory and MTP, how pathetic. He and others in the media need to ask Punk Ryan and his ilk why not raise the cap on payroll taxes for Social Security and Medicare from $110k up to $400k since the Bush tax cuts on income was kept for the first $400k in earnings. Fair is fair!

And of course closing loopholes like capital gains, or ending corporate welfare subsidies, etc. -- this is increasing the tax base not rates, and supposedly the Romney/Ryan plan was going to do that. Now Teapublicans just want the worst parts of what the voters clearly rejected in the 2012 election? Wow, just wow.

We have to get out the vote in 2014 to rid ourselves of these yahoos, starting with Paul Ryan's district.

Someone should research ALL the bills Paul Ryan voted for between 2002 and 2010 that were NOT PAID for and nail him each and every time he shows up for an interview.

Dennis, Columbus, Ohio

Great post. Unfortunately the rightwing only gives lip service to limited government. In reality, the Teapublican leadership is all about Big Government when they are in control--in fact they ar worse because the just spend instead of taxing and spending. But they are Big Brother specially when it comes to privacy, whether wiretaps or imposing the Moral Minority theocracy on the rest of us. The Teapublican supporters just have their panties in a twist about Black Helicopter tyranny that only exists in the figment of their imaginations of their alternative universe.

Economics are economics.

Brilliant, deep, and so profound (not), but it would fit on a bumper sticker. This is a great example of what's so wrong with many folks in the country.

In regard to economics 101, try this one -- supply and demand means it's not just supply but also demand. Same goes for balancing any budget in which there must be income and not just tightening the belt. Gawd!

Common sense tells you, the drowning victim needs to be pulled out of the water before you can start effective CPR! The United States government needs to save the economy before anyone can consider budget cuts and increasing taxes. (Except for those who live on estates and are far from danger. Yes, the rich!)

I want to see money poured into our infrastructure, our educational system, our health care and to help those who are the working poor. What is so difficult about the facts? As a country we have to help those who are at the greatest risk for failure.

One would think our number one priority would be to educate our children and those who are able to do the work but do not know how to preform tasks, for a job. Nursing, electricians, plumbers, computer specialists, all kinds of crafts need to be taught, to get our country back on track. Speaking of tracks, how about a viable railroad, that runs north, south, east and west? Not only will a viable railroad create jobs, it will also cut down on pollution and make transportation less difficult, to obtain.

Once our govenment gets, our people decent, well-paying jobs, the economy will be stimulated and then home sales will go up. That is, if we bring our manufacturing back home. Plus we need to charge higher import taxes, to build our wealth here at home. I really believe the key to many of our troubles, is lack of education. I think stupidity is a source of crime and poverty.

It is rare to find products stamped, "Made In the United States." It is time to manufacture our merchandise at home. And to manufacture people with usable skills, as well.

What is that saying, give a man a fish he will eat for a day. Give a man a fishing pole and he will eat for his life. So, I paraphrased. I didn't put quotes around it!

Paul Ryan is continuing to let the his party of "no" guide his principles. That is if he had any.

I have heard of David Gregory. That is about all I can say on that subject.

I have to go lie down again; fighting a sinus infection. Or is it an allergy to tea?

GOP > Are we working for Americans? No, we're not. Are we for equal rights for all? No we're not. Are we ever going to cooperate with Democrats to solve America's problems? No, we're not. Are we going to win in 2016? No, we're not. Lie in your beds, f*ckers.

Obama keeps talking about a 'balanced approach' to deficit reduction, and the need for 'compromise'.

Well, Obama got his $600 Billion in tax increases on the 'rich', so when do we see some 'balance' and 'compromise' from Obama on the issue of spending cuts?

It seems that Obama and the Democrats are stuck on the same old 'Tax and Spend' policies that have gotten us into this financial crisis.

If we don't get this debt under control, we will soon be in the same quagmire as Greece, where they are suffering from an austerity 'depression' with an unemployment rate at 30%.

If all you folks who regularly infest this board (both left and right) would get off your collective lazy asses and (instead of crying about how the other side is wrong) go do something productive like contribute to the GDP or do some charity work the country could actually move forward instead of sideways.

But no, you won't do that. It's much easier to be a political gadfly than actually be a contributing member of society.

I don't post often, usually because I'm too busy. But it's Sunday and I only had to work a half-day, and that allows me the comedy relief of reading what most of you nitwits have to say.

The budget problem is really pretty easy.

Revenue:

Everyone has to pay more in taxes. Everyone. And yes, I know the high-income earners will have to pay proportionally more, I don't like it any better than the next high performer. I probably pay an order of magnitude more income tax than most of the people on this board and I'm just resigned that to get us out of this mess I'll take it more in the shorts than Joe Workingguy. But I'm willing to take one for the team. Are you listening, Boehner and Ryan?

Spending:

In manufacturing, we learn right away to go work on the big problems first, and the small ones afterward. Soc Sec, DOD, Unemployment/Welfare, Medicare, and Medicaid (in that order) account for roughly 75% of what we spend our money on. Fix and reform those 5 and we're done. Social Security? Sorry. Retirement age has to go up. At least 68 or 70 (and no, I'm not far from that now and I think it's fair). Military? Across the board cuts. We don't need enough of a standing military to take on the entire rest of the world. Make some of our "allies" shoulder the burden of their own defense. Most of 'em hate us anyway. Unemployment & Welfare? Cut back on number of weeks allowed, and put welfare recipients to work for the state. At least we'd get something out of 'em. Medicare/Medicaid? Tough sledding here. No easy solutions without making a lot of people mad, and probably some dying as a result. But tough times, tough measures. Do you have the stones to propose a budget like that, Mr. President?

Now everyone is pissed at me. Good. That's usually a sign of a good compromise.

Yes, yes, I know I just don't understand the complicated nature of these things, I'm only an engineer with a 160 IQ. But guess what? The basics just aren't complicated. The idiots you've elected to the presidency and congress just tell you that and you believe it. But math is really easy, especially the accounting kind. No 2nd order partial differential equations, just add, subtract, multiply, and divide. But I forgot, most Americans aren't capable of even that. Or are just too lazy to do it.

Wise up, America. Tighten your belt, open your wallet, and make the tough choices. Or else your kids will wind up doing what you limp-dicks couldn't.

In defense of David & MTP

These newscasters are given talking points that they agree to talk about to have someone like Ryan on.

The Ryan camp would have never allowed MTP to just ask any question.....Remember folks...The GOP likes control.

Every once in a while a newscaster will slip one by and get the guest pissed or catch them in something.

I wish this would have been one of those times...damnit.

Mr. Tom-2709947

As Rocky & Bullwinkle would say "Thank You Mr. Know-it-all"

I would agree with those who say we need to cut food stamps, Medicaid and other programs IF, and this is a bit IF, wages kept up with the cost of living!!!!!!! Corporate profits and CEO bonuses have skyrocketed for the past 30 years!!! Wages have been stagnant!! Completely stagnant! Minimum wage in most places is $7.25 an hour!!! Even at $10 an hour, you cannot support a family! Even with two jobs!! When pay keeps up with costs, I will agree to stop asking the rich to pay more! Until then, suck it up and do the right thing!! This country and it's workers made you rich, why can't you pay them back with a decent wage???!!!

Dennis, Columbus, Ohio "More now than ever we have evidence that austerity has not worked in Europe and their GDP continues to slide as unemployment increases."

Obviously, making unsustainable 'entitlement' promises does not work either. The reason for Greece's 'austerity' is that NO ONE WILL LEND THEM ANY MORE MONEY.

Their unrealistic attitude on government spending has led to a 'Greek Depression', with unemployment at 30%.

And the answer of Liberal Democrats is - MORE DEFICIT SPENDING, along with more 'entitlements' like Obamacare.

Some people never learn.

@True Patriot: You're correct. Paul Ryan is a "Punk" of the most golden order. All the son-of-a-bitch ever talks about is, in effect, bringing further punishment and hardship on the American poor and Middle class. He will also, along with His counterparts do everything He can to get His hands on the Social Security/ Medicare contributions, and turn 'em over to His wealthy investment class. I don't believe the bastard even knows the country must hold and sustain an economy outside the investment sector. This requires "FULL EMPLOYMENT". We don't cut spending that will prohibit full employment, especially to pay debt that was caused by HIGH UNEMPLOYMENT. What a gwaddamned foolish proposition! We must attain and maintain "FULL EMPLOYMENT" to afford genuine entitlements and manageable deficits and debt. These sons-ah-bitches will never change. Those that aren't there for the wealthy take the word of those who are since they know nary a gwaddamn basic principal of Arithmetic. Regards

Notice: Harry Reid! Go to hell!

In the first place, I can't imagine why there's such energy spent here, or this level of frothing hatred for the GOP.

This is an organization, which if not already dead, is in mortal danger of expiring anyway. And one of the ways they have demonstrated that was to nominate a corpse to represent them in the last national election.

Seriously, how can they possibly be a threat to anything? As long as 'the majority' are willing to exchange the blessings of liberty for 'decrees and executive orders', you know, like what a king does, a congress as well as a senate are phenominal waste of time and money. Let's get rid of them both and start saving money right there.

Folks - if you don't know the difference between taxes and revenues you shouldn't be commenting here. This was a poorly written and misleading article title. But then, what else would you expect from this source?

I'm serious about Boehner - if he and his cronies will neither stand on principle, nor find a way to intelligently articulate their cause and the Constitution to the voters, they need to stop pretending, shut up and go home.

"Democrats and Republicans are like a bowl of ***t looking at itself in the mirror." ~Louis Black

________________________________________

And the answer of Liberal Democrats is - MORE DEFICIT SPENDING

Roy Wilson you are entirely correct - It's like your doctor telling you that the best way to fix that broken leg is to .......break the other leg.

BOYCOTT MEET THE PRESS

I stream Up with Chris Hayes and Melissa Harris Perry on the weekends, and those two highly informative programs leave no time for garbage like MTP.

Mac Forrester -- Good to see ya!

Paul Ryan tries to convince folks that he is a wonk. Those who have attended Paul Ryan's Town Halls know he's full of sh!t (per a post above), and probably spending all his time at the gym and looking at himself in the mirror. I would love for this PUNK to go up against a real wonk like Ezra Klein, for example, and have his puny arse handed to him for all the world to see.

Mr. Tom-2709947 "Wise up, America. Tighten your belt, open your wallet, and make the tough choices. Or else your kids will wind up doing what you limp-dicks couldn't."

Amen to that.

Look, this is really simple.

If we want to have all of these 'free' services from the government, then PAY FOR IT.

We are currently spending about $3.8 Trillion per year, and we are taking in about $2.7 Trillion per year, which leaves a Deficit of about $1.1 Trillion per year. If we want to keep spending at that level - THEN PAY FOR IT, and then the real cost of government will not be hidden with borrowed money - sending the bill to our children and grandchildren. It's GROSSLY UNFAIR to hide the real cost of current spending with 'Borrowed Money'. It doesn't work with our personal finances, and it doesn't work with the government (just ask Greece).

It will cost the average family of 4 about $14,000 per year in new taxes ($1,165 per month) to finance the current extra spending, but hey - if that's what you want, THEN PAY FOR IT.

ROY,

Apples & Oranges …

The retirement age in Greece was 55 with a higher annual percent of their average income and 12 years sooner than here in the US.

Their Health Care was 100% paid for not 80% or less (average) as it is here.

The money paid into their social programs was more than 10% less than here in the US when measured to their average salary. They also had a guaranteed 5+ weeks paid vacation annually, a dozen paid sick days and more paid holidays than most here in the US.

If you want to stop entitlements, PAY A DECENT WAGE!!!! THAT is the solution! Until then, cutting from the already poor is ignorant, callous and fiscally irresponsible!! People on welfare SPEND that money! What are you going to replace it with if not decent paying jobs!! Why can't we start with raising the minimum wage to $12.50/hr? Corportations could suck up the wage increase for a while WITHOUT raising prices and then people COULD spend to buy their products!! THAT is a WIN, WIN situation. Corporate greed will never bow to common sense though, will it?

BTW, my far-Right Teapublican mother on Social Security and Medicare is very unhappy about Paul Ryan and his ilk attacking these programs. She doesn't even like the way they use the word "entitlements" to infer a hand-out.

If Dems want to get seniors like her to contact Teapublican representatives, just get Ryan to start talking about things like the CPI Chain and holy f'n cow he will go home to a Town Squall like he's never seen. The REAL media just needs to get rightwingers like Ryan to admit to their beliefs as was done with rape. Step aside David Gregory, and let the real reporting take place.

Dennis, Columbus, Ohio "ROY, Apples & Oranges …The retirement age in Greece was 55 with a higher annual percent of their average income and 12 years sooner than here in the US."

Nonsense. The process might be a little slower, but the outcome will be the same.

Our Debt Ratio (Debt as a % of GDP) under Clinton averaged 64.2%.

Our Debt Ratio under Bush averaged 62.6%.

Our Debt Ratio for 2012 was 104.8%.

We will likely be at 120% by 2016.

The banks stopped lending to Greece when their Debt Ratio got up to 120%, and they are a mess right now, with a literal 'Depression' and unemployment at 30%.

PS - Public employees now can retire at about age 55, with about 90% of their base income, with health care paid by the taxpayers, as well as a TON of holidays. It's only PRIVATE sector employees that have to wait to age 67 to retire on about 30% of their base income.

THERESA-532036 "If you want to stop entitlements, PAY A DECENT WAGE!!!! THAT is the solution!"

What's 'A DECENT WAGE'? If we paid everybody more, we would lose even more jobs to our foreign competitors.

Johntho, #1.11- Have to wonder how the 16th Amendment plays into all of this because Congress has the Power "ONLY" to lay and collect taxes on incomes, [from whatever source derived]. They have NO POWER to cut or exempt taxes. No?

"Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived; without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration."

Yeah, you betcha!! Let's listen to this worthless twirp who has really done nothing substantial in his career except pickup a paycheck,collected all the perks and cadillac health insurance that us taxpayers are paying for. Big mouth on a nasty $hit. His usual target of killing off what's left of the poor and middle class and bending over for the rich. This worthless turd needs to lose his job and quit living off the government, which would be us.

"Millionaires and billionaires = familes and small businesses who make 250k"

...and as you damned well know- well north of 250K. WELL north of.

The House using Ryan as their spin-master to turn the "House of No" into the "House of It's Them" is a prime example of grade school antics. How can anyone believe this chump after his flipping and flopping on policy issues not to mention getting his facts entirely wrong. If the "House of No" really wants to cut spending then they must look to DOD.

There is no other agency within the Federal Government that wastes more money than these guys do. Take for instance have multiple IT networks not including the VA which is another bureaucratic waste basket of funds. If DOD and the VA would combine their IT network and software this alone would save the taxpayers a few billion dollars overnight. Who are they trying to fool with this rhetoric of entitlements? Save the sound bites for when the midterm election comes to town.

Roy Wilson

THAT is the GREED I am talking about!!! Why shouldn't American companies that make a fortune in this country, pay a decent wage to the people OF this country? WE are supposed to set the standard aren't we? If we set that standard, wages around the globe would rise as well!! People are wise to the world now, not like back in day when no one knew they were being screwed!! Greed is what sends jobs overseas, because a CEO will be devastated if he only gets $9 million in a bonus instead of $10 million!!! Your argument is a bumper sticker for what is wrong with the corporate mentality!! Costco is a perfect example of what a business should do for it's employees. They pay a decent wage, give benefits and have almost zero turnover. They also make a record profit every year!! How much profit is enough profit before you do the right thing? Really, have you never needed help from anyone? You will probably deny it, but I bet you have. Aren't you glad someone was there to give it? I bet you were.

While I'm at it- just saw a headline in the Des Moines Register:

"Ryan: GOP must choose fight with Obabma wisely."

A refresher- ours is a represetative form of government. President Obama is US. WE elected him in open and free elections. What Mr Ryan is saying, then, is "GOP must choose fight with Americans wisely."

Bring it, you little pr!ck.

Paul Ryan flapping his jaws

to

increase revenues

from the GOP BASE.... for his next campaign.

ROY,

[PS - Public employees now can retire at about age 55 with about 90% of their base income]

False … 30 years of service will get you about 50% of your pay. The amount is the average annual salary for the 3 top-earning years multiplied by years served multiplied by
1.7%.

If you worked 30 years and the 3 years equals say $60,000 then your retirement would be $30,600 - 40 years gets you $40,800

And, for those of you saying to increase the Social Security age, NOT EVERYONE HAS A DESK JOB!! Tell the waitress, construction worker, landscaper or other manual worker that they have to wait another 2-5 years to get off their feet!!! It's not the retirement age that is the problem, it's corporate greed and corporate welfare!! Why are we giving subsidies to companies that are making record profits and then considering an age increase to those workers to keep from paying them?

Mr. Tom - again with the far right lie that only Republicans work or do anything. I and all of my friends work full time and most of us volunteer to help those less fortunate. My guess is you don't but you'll gladly talk about it. Stop the Republican ignorance - "you're all living off the government" - even the top Republicans agreed that that kind of nonsense helped them lose the election.

Lyin Ryan looked as out of touch today as he did during the entire campaign. I thought I would choke when he said Romney would have been a good President. President of what? Ryan STILL has no clue.

His indication that he and the rest of the Grumpy Old Perverts will continue to block the President shows why the GOP is a dying party. NO ONE wants to be part of the obstructionists. Most Americans want the parties to work together and actually get things done.

Wisconsin, what WERE you thinking when you re-elected this guy? Was he REALLY the best you had running?

60 Minutes should be VERY interesting tonight - Obama and Hillary. Definitely a must watch!

@Mr. Miller-lotsa no's#1.72: No. Wilson and Ryan are telling you, if you can't pay, then the best way to fix a broken leg is to let it rot off, and hope to live "one legged".

Hey Paul Ryan -- where was all this concern about spending and debt when you, your fellow Republicans in the House and Senate along with George W. Bush were turning the largest surplus of all times into the largest deficit of all times? Strange -- between 2001 and 2006, you didn't seem to fins a single spending bill you didn't like. Paul Ryan -- you're another on the long, long, long line of Republican hypocrites.

A Tax-and-Spend budget of democrats beats a Borrow-and-Spend budget of republicans any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

Borrow-and-Spend: Iraq war. Afghanistan war. Prescription drug coverage which allows no price negotiation. Turning the Clinton budget surplus into a massive deficit within 2 years. No corresponding revenue to pay for any of it.

Tax-and-Spend: Saving a million automobile industry jobs. American Recovery Act. Debt reduction provided by Patient Protection and Affordable Care Act.

Hey did anyone else get the "new" RNC code book and decoder ring yet?

Paul Ryan using code book and ring:

Cut spending= Screw the little people....I'm set for life.

Get the other side to work with us= Why won't they drink the kool-aid, it only has LSD in it.

Balanced Budget in 10 years= Who gives a rats ass...my money is safe off shore.

"If you keep raising revenues, you're not going to get decent tax reform."=I'm still not sure how to do math.....Someone else does it for me....I'm an idea man.

Everyone needs to order the code book & decoder ring set today!!!!

But wait...There's more!!!!

Theresa and numbers, Roy lives in a bizarro world of entitlements. He really don't have a clue as to how it all works. I was born in the age of prosperity after World War l l, Matter of fact I am a pioneer baby boomer. Jan. 46. I have seen the American dream fall from one parent working, being able to afford a house, two cars, two and a half kids and a dog to one of, the very rich getting all the perks. The working poor of today if single have to share expenses to and live in an over crowded apartment, if married both parents have to work and they live week to week oft times failing as big corporations abandon them, even if we as a people are the hardest working, most productive workers on the planet. Roy's way is failure for this country. He is the type to tell you how successful Ronald Reagan was when in the truth he created tent cities and soup kitchens for the working poor. Supply side economics's is the problem, and people are now waking up to it. Hopefully with the last onslaught of the tea bags in 2010 voters will reject them in 2014 as they did in 2012 and we can get back to some semblance of prosperity for all, not just the chosen as Roy obviously thinks he is.

And that is the reason why Ryan and were soundly handed their rear ends in the last election. The republicans have no plans of retreating from practicing their brand of extremist right wing politics. And since they know that the rational thinking majority of Americans will reject them whole heartedly time and time again, they will now attempt to rig the elections by changing the college electorate. This is the only way they will ever be able to win an election again. Basically, the gop/teabags are washed up and it was of their own undoing!!

Seaskip,

thank you for the apology for us having Lying Ryan in Wisconsin. I accept your apology with thank you for our unfortunate situation.

party of the rich not for raising taxes on the rich says republican spokesman ryan for the rich.and they wonder why thye lose elections.there will never be enough poor and middle class people that envy the rich to support the republican platform and win elections.

Reagan cut taxes on the rich 50 percent and it raised more revenue because the rich stopped reinvesting in America for the tax deductions.thats how we got to the place we are now

See all the FR regulars are on overtime today. And they have even recruited a few newbies to the fold. Or, as I like to see it, another flock has joined the herd. Baaaaaaaaaaa. Baaaaaaaaaa

Dennis you have to remember that Roy probably gets most of his facts (propaganda) from FOX . Therefore he hasn't got a clue what reality is like!

ROY WILSON-336103 -- Usually I ignore your posts. but in follow-up to THERESA-532036 in regard to a decent wage, a few things...

Henry Ford said it best -- that he needed to pay his employees enough that they could buy his product (automobile). This gets back to the demand part of supply and demand. In reality, when the middle class does better, everyone does better including businesses and the rich.

Fast forward, the reason the working poor have tax credits that allow them to pay zero income taxes is because Republicans suggested this instead of indexing the minimum wage to inflation. If the minimum wage was indexed to inflation, it would be about $11/hour now. Add to this Equal Pay for Equal Work (women are more than half the population), we would have disposable income for huge demand over night.

Fast forward again... Because sh!ty companies like Walmart and Papa Johns pay such low wages and no benefits, the taxpayers must subsidize Corporate America via food stamps and Medicaid. Where is the Teabagger outrage about this?

It's bad enough highly-profitable companies like GE not only pay zero in taxes, but are given additional subsidies on top of that. And worse, corporations currently receive tax breaks for shipping jobs overseas. Thanks to Teapublican treason, the Bring Jobs Home Act and other efforts to correct such absurdity has been obstructed.

The bottom line is companies like Costco provide far better compensation to their employees compared to Walmart yet Costco is just as profitable. It is NOT necessary nor prudent to have a Race to the Bottom. In fact, if squeezing labor like blood from a turnip is the only way a company can stay in business, then the business needs to go under.

The only fair topic IMO are some regulations, with the highest cost of operation being insurance (not Obamacare) but liability coverage. And this is due to private insurance profits, not just that the government requires it.

There is NO excuse for not closing loopholes such as capital gains/carried interest, or not reinstating transaction taxes on Wall Street, or ending subsidies to Big Oil -- in other words privatizing profit and socializing debt that is corporate welfare. Enough! We need revenue to invest in this great nation, and any person or company that refuses to contribute is unpatriotic and is lying about concern for future generations.

Talk to the Hand

I see you got your copy & ring....I'm sure because your a member you got a discount on yours, if not for free.

Using Code book & Decoder ring:

Baaaaaaaaa. Baaaaaaaaaa= boo hoo we didn't win.

Ro Mar,

I moved from conservative republican to Liberal Democrat! They (the Do Nothings) made me do it after trying to work with the nut cases for years I said, Let me out of here!" It seems like a lot of people are doing that now after the extreme right turn the party has taken!!

Mystery Rhee, you should leave the interpretation of the 16th amendment to those that where robes to work. Your interpretation certainly isn't near correct. Of course congress has the constitutional authority to cut and/or levy taxes. The so called Bush tax cuts, and as they are now called the Obama tax cuts are authorized by congress and signed into law by those presidents.

Steve aren't you late for a reunion rehearsal with the Village People?

johnQcitizen -- Good reminder. Taxes on the rich/corporations actually provide incentive to invest in the United States. Yeah, do some research on that one rightwingers -- From credible sources of course, not propaganda outlets. It's making your hair hurt just seeing this...

Talk to the Hand

Steve aren't you late for a reunion rehearsal with the Village People?

Using Code book & ring:

Damn your fine..... wanna date?

Thank you....But I think my husband wouldn't approve.

To EvilTessmacher,

Your post #1.49 is a great analysis of runaway spending on Defense.

The cold war is over, the war on terror is does not need a huge agency like Home land Secruity. Let the FBI and CIA keep track of the bad guys.

I say put a surtax on every defense contractor business to pay for the unfunded wars by taking this tax and applying it to reduce the debt.

Let the squestration cuts coming in March happen.

Dennis, Columbus, Ohio "ROY, [PS - Public employees now can retire at about age 55 with about 90% of their base income]........False … 30 years of service will get you about 50% of your pay."

I have a fireman friend (Paramedic) who is retiring next month with 32 years of service at age 55. He will get retirement pay of over 90% of his base pay - plus health insurance.

Too gwaddamn many people in this country labor under too many silly and false assumptions. EG, Greece. The problems of that nation are not relative to the US debt and deficit situation in the least. Greece and all the EU SOVEREIGN nations became an economic union under a "COMMON CURRENCY". Had Greece retained Its own currency It could have put itself into a much better economic position by now. Do well to notice those who did, English for instance, are doing much better. Same with the ACA relative to overall US healthcare. Without government subsidized healthcare ( Medicare, medicaid, Veterans adminstration, various state named programs for Children and the indigent, etc) the country would have very small, and likely, quite ineffective healthcare for all. Those between the ages of 16 years and 50 years, even those with great private insurance, visit doctors very infrequently and generally require damn few medical procedures, certainly not enough to sustain the building, maintenance, and staffing of our present healthcare infrastructure. To ensure the existence of this great (Arguable) system we would do well to further enhance it by structuring a more comprehensive system over and above ACA with a "single payer, universal system" for all. Most health care professionals who have sense enough to be such would love to see this, and agree, it would be much cheaper, and yield much higher quality care. We need to quit worring about balancing our budget. Can't anyway. Never have. Anyone, such as "Roy Wilson" or "Paul Ryan" can put pencil to paper, and create numbers and sums relative to any claimed meaning, especially when one doesn't give a damn about what one is really doing.

and I have a friend who lives under a bridge because he likes camping out in below zero weather Roy.

THERESA-532036 "Roy Wilson WE are supposed to set the standard aren't we?"

No - We are not the 'center of the universe'. We have to compete in a World economy, so the prices we can charge have to be competitive, which means that our costs also have to be competitive.

Why do you think that we are losing so many jobs to overseas companies? Because our wages cannot be sustained.

Arbitrarily raising our wages will just result in more lost jobs.

dear fellow readers remember roys position.hes rich and has left america for a new perment home in Costa Rica.his interest in america is purely academic or nostalgic.is his pro republican stance surprising.if i was rich id be a republican too

roy would like nothing better then to see americans wages lowered to what he pays his house boy

ROY,

I gave you the Federal Employees' Retirement System (FERS) formula … but go ahead and believe whatever floats your boat.

I'm sure there are some rare exceptions from the norm … have a look see …

http://www.opm.gov/retirement-services/fers-information/computation/

So, if Ryan is unable to see the results of how his actions and voting record have contributed significantly to the the economic disaster of 2008, and is not willing acknowledge his own culpability in bringing this about, then he doesn't understand the cause and is least qualified to offer recommendations on solutions.

Precisely, tjohn! That's the Republican way. They bury themselves so deep in their ideology that they can't see beyond their own B.S.

Ryan is still worshipping at the shrine of Ayn Rand, that godless pal of Joe McCarthy.

He'll ever amount to much, that chimp-faced boy. Try harder, GOP.

Johntho, #1.103- Thanks for answering the question.

TruePatriot-445959, #1.100- Much is EXCELLENT! (there and in others, above, too!)

Why do you think that we are losing so many jobs to overseas companies? Because our wages cannot be sustained.

Oh, so American workers should be happy making around $2/hr because that's the equivalent to what workers in China, Thailand, Vietnam and Mexico make, right? That's stupid. And we are not losing jobs to overseas companies, we're losing jobs because American companies are importing them to fill their pockets.

xxxx

That should have been: He'll NEVER amount to much. Chimps can be dangerous though.

Thats right Tony, CEO's and other heads of the company certainly haven't lost any jobs nor pay to move production off shore. That is the problem, greed, like Roy Wilson personified.

Why do you think that we are losing so many jobs to overseas companies? Because our wages cannot be sustained.

Whose wages?

American corporate CEOs average $10 million in annual salary and benefits. Look at them for an answer as to why our jobs have been moved overseas.

What's 'A DECENT WAGE'? If we paid everybody more, we would lose even more jobs to our foreign competitors.

Why can't wages be sustained, and why can't we afford to pay more. Are you suggesting the greeters and cashiers at Wal-Mart are going to be outsourced to Bangkok? Not likely.

A decent wage is a living wage. And Roy, higher wages lead to stronger purchasing power, leading to more spending, leading to increased revenues to Government and Business, leading to more R&D, leading to new products, leading to economic improvement, leading to lower unemployment.... yadda, yadda, yadda. But you know all that right?

Employee productivity is at an all time high, corporate profits at an all time high, and if the equation were working, salaries should have increased proportionately. But, what has happened is all those gains have been pocketed into the bank accounts of a few. Well, the wealthy have two options .. they pay upfront in higher salaries, or they pay at the back end, with massive tax increases, to pay for all those working folk relying on assistance to make ends meet.

Everyone needs to order the code book & decoder ring set today!!!!

But wait...There's more!!!!

If you order today you will get not just one, but two tin foil hats!

So who out there heard Lyin' Ryan claim that the American people DIDN'T vote PBO in again? He insinuated that he cheated or stole the election to my ears.

And Ezra Klein cleaned Ryan's clock this past week and you can find it on HP...........a thing of beauty!

His last budget didn't balance the budget until 2030, BUT 'now' he can balance it in 10 years?

What was that lame a%% chart he half hid? What was that supposed to prove? Almost as bad as Mitten's dry erase board!!

Don't get me started on boot licker Gregory and Russert would be almost as bad as Chuck Toad or Jake Tapper.

One of the biggest drains on human society and a complete waste of time......he can't do anything but spout talkjng points and lie, lie, lie..........love his recalcitrance on revenue increases.......what a tool!

Obama and the Progressive agenda:

1. Tax
2. Spend
3. Redistribute
4. More regulations
5. No National Budget
6. No Debt Ceiling Limit
7. Simple majority to pass legislation in the Senate (50.0000001 %)
8. No Social Welfare cuts while increasing Social Welfare recipients
9. Cut the DOD's budget (only receives 20% of the National Budget but will receive 50% of ALL sequestered budget cuts)
10. Another Stimulus for "Obama Go Green" initiatives run by his special interest and campaign groups
11. Amnesty for ALL Illegal Aliens (Immigrants)
12. Extending unemployment benefits to 20 years

Yep, the Progressives are looking out for all Americans.

Roy, How sad you are!

Hey did anyone else get the "new" RNC code book and decoder ring yet?

I've been waiting 40 years for that other gimmicky ring they sold, the Underdog Ring with the magic "voodoo economics" pill. When taken as prescribed, your economic woes trickle down to everyone else, leaving you feeling mighty powerful and rich. Obviously, Donald Trump and a hefty chunk of the GOP party got theirs.

Ido - as usual you don't have a clue. Related to Roy are ya?

Watched the BOOMTOWN special on Hannity. That was interesting. Now I feel BOTH sides are against the rest of us.

Neither side want to shrink government, I see it as the republicans are trying to make sure they can keep there greedy hands on the BENNIES of the LOBBYIST and control some of the wasteful spending, And the demorats are in it to spend as much as they can get there GREEDY hands on.

When are the rest of us going to get pissed about these A$$HOLES in washington. GE spends over 100K per day on LOBBYIST to get FAVORS from these polititions that are makeing the rules so they do NOT have to pay any TAXES.

More proof that the, 'Smaller Government' GOP Tea Party of NO, doesn't govern, they just OBSTRUCT.

nd last year, I received this text message from my friend that's majoring in Law, in Eau Clair, Wisconsin:

"If the government was a corporation, the GOP Tea Party have proven they would run it by stopping sales, ending incoming revenues, withering away its workforce, and cutting the business so that it wouldn't grow -- preventing it from meeting the needs of all of its customers. Stockholders would surely respond in their company's annual meeting by voting these guys out of management."

Let the sequester happen, let Ryan get the republicans used to the idea, that their precious defense budget will be cut deep, and wide, let him blame the democrats for not offering what he thinks is a palatable substitute for those cuts, meaning cuts to SS and Medicare, which the electorate soundly rejects.

While I agree with your points, Social Security will not be hit by the sequester. It only affects discretionary spending.

I am entitled to my government benefits.

The Obama said I should keep getting them, so the government needs to pay them.

If future generations get screwed, nobody cares. I want what I'm entitled to from the government.

Bear Cat - your post shows you are as out of touch with reality as the majority of Republicans. The lie you post is old and dumb - so I guess you're old and dumb!~

THERESA-532036

And, for those of you saying to increase the Social Security age, NOT EVERYONE HAS A DESK JOB!! Tell the waitress, construction worker, landscaper or other manual worker that they have to wait another 2-5 years to get off their feet!!!

The rich who have sweet jobs that they actually like is only part of the equation. The rich who only contribute to Social Security on their first $110,000 earned are the only ones who live long enough to collect it too. The working poor die much earlier, and collect for a shorter number of years if at all.

Not only does Social Security have nothing to do with deficits, increasing the age on programs like Medicare merely shifts costs elsewhere, and accomplishes the exact opposite of what is needed. If folks think it's hard to find affordable insurance after age 50, imagine waiting until age 70 for Medicare. If anything, we need Medicare for all, and the increased pool would make Medicare solvent.

The rightwing are arse-backward. That research we talk about should include studies on rightwinger brains and why they lack Rule of Reason.

ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!

I see the poor little limp-wristed Libbies continue to struggle to get their heads out of Barrack Husseins a$$ to see the reality of the world.

We have enjoyed the continuing nonsense of the ridiculous Keynesian disaster Barracks fiscal and monetary policies have become. His "focusing like a laser" on jobs and the economy can be interpreted as nothing short of embarrassing.

Of course what do the little Libbies here on First Read dwell on?

Emotions.

As usual Liberal Progressives were drooling on their bibs hoping that meek and mild David Gregory would pull up his panties and break out the big guns against Paul Ryan. Fortunately for Gregory he didn't. Paul Ryan would destroy the defenseless host and embarrass him more than he already does himself. Especially when it comes to fiscal and economic matters.

The Democrats, in their ignorance once again went for the emotional, or more appropriately symbolic, course of just raising the tax rates on the upper incomes. Of course every intelligent person on the planet knows this will do absolutely nothing to improve the economy, deficit, debt or jobs. This was purely a pathetic effort to show the uber-Left that Barrack Hussein and his incompetent economic staff still have no idea how to fix our economy but they think they hurt the ultimate bogeyman that lives under each Liberal/Progressives bed, the mean, nasty, spooky, fat-cat, rich!

As history has shown, yet Libbies refuse to accept, when tax rates go down revenues go up. Especially when you deal with capital gains and dividends. This screams at the soiled panties the Libbies were having when Romney and Buffet were showing their tax rates.

The biggest sound-bite was when Barrack Hussein said, “Warren Buffett pays a lower tax rate than his secretary — an outrage he has asked us to fix.” And the nonsense began.

As Buffet exalted that his federal income tax in 2010 was “only 17.4% of my taxable income” — less than $7 million on a taxable income of about $40 million. He then made the ridiculous statement that other “mega-rich pay income taxes at a rate of 15% on most of their earnings.” Actually the average income-tax rate of those earning between $1 million and $10 million was 29.5% in 2010.

Barrack Hussein used Buffett’s uniquely low 17.4% tax as proof that “a few of the most affluent citizens and most profitable corporations enjoy tax breaks and loopholes that nobody else gets.”

Bull$hit!

ANYBODY whose income is primarily made up of capital gains and dividends would pay income taxes at a rate of 15% on most of their earnings. This did NOT exclude moderate incomes either. As a matter of fact the rate changes will mostly affect those on fixed incomes, we all know who that entails.

This rate will go up to 18.8% on everyone under Obamacare also.

It’s interesting to note that prior to 2003, when the tax on dividends was made the same as the tax on capital gains, Berkshire Hathaway was a handy way to dodge some taxes. It was a simple way to own dividend-paying stocks without paying taxes on the dividends. Buffet is famous for investing in stocks that generate a generous dividend yield without Berkshire itself paying any dividend. The dividends Berkshire receives are reinvested in buying more stocks, so the holding company ends up with more assets per share which results in capital gains that would be taxable only if the shares are sold. I’m sure even some of the smarter Libbies have some of their portfolios invested in Berkshire shares. If not we understand it’s just typical Liberal fear and ignorance.

I never said Warren Buffet was stupid. Tax avoidance, and to a degree evasion, is a significant reason that Buffet is worth over $50 billion. Increasing the tax rates on salaries and interest income would barely affect him. He only pays himself $100,000 in salary. He has dodged the estate tax by donating his wealth to the Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation. He further reduces his taxable income with other donations to charity, this explains why he repeatedly refers to taxable income rather than adjusted gross income.

The problem is, raising tax rates on dividends and capital gains sounds easier than it is. Nobody with substantial wealth can be forced to realize taxable gains by selling appreciated assets. A realized gain is no more valuable than an unrealized gain, on the contrary, it is less valuable by the amount of the appropriate tax. No one can be forced to hold dividend-paying stocks either, instead you can buy Berkshire shares if the tax on dividends goes up.

Buffets biggest lie is when he claims, “I have worked with investors for 60 years and I have yet to see anyone — not even when capital gains rates were 39.9% in 1976-77 — shy away from a sensible investment because of the tax rate on the potential gain.”

At the end of 1977 the Dow was at 831, down from 970 at the end of 1965, so somebody was having trouble finding investments that looked sensible after paying a 39.9% tax. Regardless, for Buffet to focus on the act of buying stocks or property is all wrong. The capital gains tax is NOT a tax on buying assets, it’s a tax on selling assets. If you don’t sell there is no tax and when the tax rate is high fewer people are willing to sell.

In 1977 when the capital gains tax was 39.9%, realized gains amounted to less than 1.57% of GDP.

Between 1987 and 1996, when the capital gains tax was 28%, realized gains were 2.3% of GDP.

Since 28% of 2.3 is larger than 39.9% of 1.57 the lower tax rate obviously generated more revenue.

Between 2004 and 2007 when the capital gains tax was 15%, realized gains were 5.2% of GDP.

Since 15% of 5.2 is larger than 28% of 2.3 the lower tax rate ONCE AGAIN raised more revenue.

It’s also important to note that between 1993 and 1997 the economy grew at a respectable but not robust 3.3% annually. We’d love to see that growth today, wouldn’t we? At the same time real wages declined, despite claims of great growth.

It wasn’t until 1997 when Clinton slashed the capital gains tax rate from 30% to 20% that the economy truly grew. Business investment soared after the tax cuts. The economy grew at a 4.4% rate and wages grew by 1.7%.

It makes no sense to raise these taxes, especially on those most likely to pay it. Of course the Liberal/Progressive doesn’t care about fixing the economy, this is all about their adolescent obsession with class-warfare and envy of the successful and wealthy that create jobs.

Buffet further confuses himself when he stated that, “In 1992 the top 400 had aggregate taxable income of $16.9 billion and paid federal taxes of 29.2%. In 2008 the aggregate income of the highest 400 had skyrocketed to $90.9 billion, a staggering $227.4 million on average, but the rate paid fell to 21.5%.

In 1992 only 39% of reported income of the top 400 came from capital gains and dividends because the rates were so high. By 2008, 67% of reported income of the top 400 came from capital gains and dividends because both were taxed at the 15% Bush rate. This diluted the average tax rate but nevertheless resulted in much more taxes paid.

The big change was not in actual income but rather in what the IRS counts as income. People were hiding much more of their wealth in 1992 than they did in 2006-2008, and they were hiding even more in 1977.

It is very easy to promote a higher tax on capital gains, but it’s even easier to avoid paying that higher rate. Simply hold onto assets that went up and sell those that went down, and never realize gains until you have offsetting losses.

With the exorbitant 1977 tax rates of 39.9% on capital gains and 70% on dividends and salaries, federal revenues were 18% of GDP. In 1992 revenues were only 17.5% of GDP. In 2007, with a 15% rate on capital gains revenues were 18.5% of GDP.

To hold out the tax policies of 1977 or 1992 as examples of effective ways to raise more revenue is ridiculous.

It didn’t work then, and it won’t work now.

But like I said, the Liberals/Progressives don’t care about fixing the economy, as a matter of fact they most likely prefer it to fully collapse.

Four years without a Constitutionally mandated budget obviously exposes how much the Liberals/Progressives don’t care about our great Republic. As I’ve said before, Libbies don’t care about how well or poorly our tax system works, they simply look at taxes as a reward and punishment system. This is their ignorance on parade.

And they wonder why no real Americans take them seriously.

I have been told, by someone who has spent a considerable amount of time with him, that Paul Ryan is a psychopath. That he has no conscience, and lies pathologically.

Your friend is right. We in Janesville area know all about his lies. Yet, the robot republicans keep following the lemming and follow FOX to re-elect him. This time it was a lot closer than other elections so maybe next year we can get him and the rest of the teabuggers out?

ldo

I see you got the decoder ring & code book, with the special bonus tin hats from the RNC.

Congratulations!!!!

1. Tax= Screw the poor....As long as we keep our GOP contributors happy who cares.
2. Spend= fill as many bills as you can with pork for your red state.
3. Redistribute= Send your money off shore
4. More regulations= Hooray! We get to use our paper shredders for our paper machete elephant for the next RNC convention.
5. No National Budget= Thank god we don't have to worry about math anymore.
6. No Debt Ceiling Limit= Turn in your check books all GOP members can now have a credit card with unlimited spending limits.
7. Simple majority to pass legislation in the Senate (50.0000001 %)= We must do more about taking care of gerrymandering those district lines.
8. No Social Welfare cuts while increasing Social Welfare recipients= We are going to have to give up biweekly poker matches....Well maybe just cut the dancers.
9. Cut the DOD's budget (only receives 20% of the National Budget but will receive 50% of ALL sequestered budget cuts)= Oh boy we can get that raise we put off during the cliff, & we can double it.
10. Another Stimulus for "Obama Go Green" initiatives run by his special interest and campaign groups= Get ready boys here come more money for my red state.
11. Amnesty for ALL Illegal Aliens (Immigrants)= Your maid, housekeeper, grounds keeper, pool man, nanny & cook are all going to want raises.
12. Extending unemployment benefits to 20 years= Boo Hoo we won't have the White House for 2 election cycles at this rate.

See how easy that is boys and girls.....And fun too says Boner.

Hurry today don't miss out on your chance to own a RNC decoder set today!

Dennis,

The Austerity programs put in place in Europe have been a combination of spending cuts (10% on wages/benefits and other programs) and 30% tax increases on the Rich. Sound familiar? It should. We just raised taxes on the rich by 12% & increased the capital gains by 58% for those over 450,000 and by 25% on those making over 250,000 & 200,000 (single).

The last time such silliness was done in the US was 1920 when the federal budget was cut from $18.45 Bln (1919) to $6.6 Bln while taxes were increased by some 40% on the rich for a meager increase of 25% in revenue. Unemployment that year jumped from 4.9% to 9.5%.

The bulk of the cutting of the federal budget was cutting expenditures to rebuild Europe and no further money to seed the Failed League of Nations which we shouldered the cost for.

After going through such a drastic cut and tax increase the following year the unemployment dropped to 7.9% despite cutting taxes and spending by 20%. 20% more cutting in taxes and spending brought unemployment down to 6.3% and more cuts the following year brought unemployment down to 4.9%.

Uncontrolled Government taxing and spending is the problem, not cutting spending and taxes.

The tax increases Obama won are going to hurt about 8 months down the road. How do I know. I followed the Clinton Tax on the rich in August 1993. It wasn't felt initially until it was first paid in April 1994. The decreasing unemployment stopped for 3 months, then declined for 4 months only to shoot up by .5% in February 1995. From Feb 1995 to april 2006 Unemployment bounced between 5.5% and 5.7%. In April 2006, Tax Bracket indexing was restored and unemployment began to decline again, just much slower than earlier.

In August 1997, Republicans and Clinton agreed to decrease the capital gains from 28% to 20%. Unemployment double in decreasing until it reached 4%.

Steve - you're hot with the lines today, baby! Great material. If you didn't have a husband (and I was your type), I'd ask you out on a date myself!

@Jim Spence#1.134: As per your post, if you have your hands around anything of substance it's some dead persons ass, which of course, is of crosseyed consequence here. Low taxes on Corporations and the wealthy, along with accompanying low domestic spending will soon kill the hell outta this nation.

Thankfully the republicans recognize the scourge of the democraps out of control crazy train approach to spending and taxation without regrads to the future ramifications it will cause.

Reactionary- seems to be the key word that describes most every approach they take. Gun control, for example- let's just ban assault weapons! Yeah, that didn't backfire (no pun) with thousands of people rushing their local gun shop and stockpiling weaponry, with back orders as long as a year!

GreenTimer

A Tax-and-Spend budget of democrats beats a Borrow-and-Spend budget of republicans any day of the week and twice on Sunday.

Bingo!

Steve-3564331

Hey did anyone else get the "new" RNC code book and decoder ring yet?

Why yes I have. I'm registered Independent in a Red State so I tricked them. Let's see what we have here. I'm supposed to sign a pledge, then get a lobotomy. And if I don't, I'm supposed to drink the fluoridated water in the decoder ring that is laced with something that smells like almonds.

I would add this to Ryan's list: Before destroying Social Security, set-up a fund for Mom so she will still campaign with me in Florida.

Didn't Bo-Dumbo say NO tax increases for the middle class? I guess he changed his mind (flip-flopped or lied) AGAIN!!

The LUNACY of this protracted "debate" is that the US Treasury would already have a half trillion dollar$ more per year in tax revenues from an improved economy from the millions of additional jobs, if it weren't for the inability of the two parties to reach consensus and compromise. American businesses have been BEGGING the US Congress for 4-years to get its act together so that they, businesses, can do long-range planning and begin investing in their companies rather than sitting on growing capital reserves. Trillion$ and trillion$ of surplus dollars are just sitting on American corporations books, not creating jobs nor spurring economic growth ... because Congress dawdles!!!

All the Congress is doing is ensuring that individuals and families will continue to delay large purchases, and not buy things they don't absolutely have to have, and business will continue to delay replacing aging equipment and buying new equipment to improve productivity, and municipalities and state governments continue to delay infrastructure improvements and repairs ... and the US Economy leaves tens of millions of Americans unemployed or underemployed as a result.

This protracted, churlish and juvenile "debate" IS what is keeping the US Economy in the critical care unit on on life-support, when it could be booming. Instead, the markets will suffer yet another large retreat this Spring as the Congress fights this silly battle again until the last minute when they will once again just kick the can down the road and set the stage for another identical fight months later. And the US economy may THIS TIME be thrown back into recession.

What a disgusting bunch of parasites we have infesting the once hallowed halls of the Legislative branch of our US government. If we have ever needed an exterminator, it is now!

And we have no one to blame but ourselves. As disgusted as the American people are by the US Congress, we sent these same misfits, rogues an rascals right back there ....to continue to do NOTHING!

We get the government we deserve.

Robin's Serendipity 1

Kisses....Your too sweet...Thank you.

TruePatriot-445959

So that's what that stuff in the ring was....Hmmm... my elephant got a hold of it and...I guess he's sleeping now?

Be careful them reds are everywhere.....I had someone bootleg my copy of the book and smuggle the ring into my blue state.....They are illegal here.

I am entitled to pay my employees so little that they qualify for food stamps. Why shouldn't the government help me keep my employees trapped in my worthless company by telling them they're going to lose their foodstamp benefits if they quit the crappy job I provide?

"Deficits don't matter." Dick Cheney 2002

& Obama 2013.

Freaky,

Income Taxes have NOT increased on the middle class

Steve - just call me Robin. And I want a decoder ring for my collection. I hate it when I laugh so hard I snort. Not very lady-like, but oh well.

I'm going to have to finally concede that Paul Ryan (not to mention 'freaky') really isn't ever going to 'get it'. Some things can be overcome, some things are forever.

Barack Obama - Wearing his pants "easy access"

Such an idiot - sending fighter jets and hundreds of tanks to the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt - even after the $450 million he sent them last year - and after their people were throwing shoes and tomatoes at Hillary

We know who's driving this Crazy Clown Car - Barack with Chuckles Biden riding shotgun - and Hillary in the back seat reading the map

"What difference at this point does it make?"

Incompetence and failure - leading by excuses and using the Bush BandAid for cover - pathetic and sad

Cut the out of control - government spending

jim spence: Got halfway through your first sentence. All pretense of objectivity and credibility gone in an instant. Congratulations on the most verbose chunk of nonsense I've never read.

And while you're at it jimmy - let us know what the dictionary (Webster, Encarta or ?) tells you about the word 'liberal'. We'll be waiting.

RedDevPS "A decent wage is a living wage. And Roy, higher wages lead to stronger purchasing power, leading to more spending, leading to increased revenues to Government and Business, leading to more R&D, leading to new products, leading to economic improvement, leading to lower unemployment.... yadda, yadda, yadda. But you know all that right?"

Nice 'theory', but any company that pays substantially more in wages in the 'hope' that their employees will spend the extra income on THEIR products/services is heading for bankruptcy if that makes their products/services non-competitive.

This may seem shocking to Liberals, but businesses are established to make a profit for the owners - not to provide jobs to their employees. If you want to start a company just to give high wages to your employees - be my guest.

Dennis, Columbus, Ohio "ROY, I gave you the Federal Employees' Retirement System (FERS) formula … but go ahead and believe whatever floats your boat."

Federal employees can probably afford to save a lot for their retirement, since they get paid more than twice what private sector employees get. I guess $123,000 per year is some people's idea of a 'living wage' - here's an interesting link to an article on the subject that was in USAToday;

http://www.usatoday.com/money/economy/income/2010-08-10-1Afedpay10_ST_N.htm

Marcus D-4300696

"What difference at this point does it make?"

What is the rightwing obsession with taking statements out of context?

Whether the attack in Benghazi occurred during a popular uprising or was pre-planned, the very next day President Obama called it a terrorist attack -- And why Romney will forever be remembered for the "Proceed Governor" face plant in the debate.

And aside from the many attacks during prior administrations under both Parties in which far more lives were lost, why is it that rightwingers can't come together the same way liberals originally supported Dubya after 9-11? As Hillary went on to say, where are the rallying cries to bring the terrorists to justice or to provide funds to the State Dept. for better security?

Because rightwingers are ignorant Haters who have been brainwashed by FAUX Noise and Hate Radio. Pathetic.

SDN -- jim spence owes me a new scroll bar -- Gawdammit it took a friggin' hour to get past Bullsh!t Mountain.

Ok Robin....What size ya wear...We have to keep this on the low down if your in a blue state, that way FOX will have some material about us libbers hiding something for tomorrows news ( fair & balanced of course).

If your in a red state it's ok...Fox will make something up.

(((Hugs)))

SDN - You got halfway through Spence's first sentence - that's way too far. When he pulls out the "limp-wristed" garbage you know exactly what his problem is. He doesn't have the backbone to come out of the closet and deflects it onto others - although I have gay friends and they are not limp-wristed. Apparently it's Jim's problem

And, he clearly believes if you post a L O N G post people will confuse your idiotcy for intelligence. Nah - we don't!

ROY,

That 2½ year old article was debunked shortly after it was published. Most Federal employees are compensated less than 20% more than private sector employees on their total compensation – NOT “more than twice”.

Also don't forget that Federal employees have been under a pay freez for the last two years.

http://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2011/03/06/us/public-private-employees.html

TruePatriot-445959

I'm waiting for one of these neocons to admit that a veil in their head just popped, and that is the explanation for the total lack of fact & taking things out of context......I can forgive that

I think...

yeah..

no..

yes, I can definitely forgive that.

(psst..... ya think they get what I just did?)

And why Romney will forever be remembered for the "Proceed Governor" face plant in the debate.

The only thing Romney will be remembered for in the debates - and you know it - was the butt dusting he put on the President in Debate 1 - It shocked the entire world for days

It forced Obama and team democrat to resort to the old "he's lying" defense - remember

Mac Forrester

Low taxes on Corporations and the wealthy, along with accompanying low domestic spending will soon kill the hell outta this nation

So Mac, tell me how well is our having the highest corporate tax rate--35% federal rate and over 39% with state taxes included--in the world is working to keep our corporations and jobs here?

Now, before you start with the typical dysfunctional argument about them not paying those rates. How long will it take the Liberal/Progressive cabal to realize a 76,000 page tax code will negate any tax bracket manipulations?

As far as your moribund complaint about low taxes on the wealthy, lemme ax you a question.

Show me a 10 year period that had consistently higher revenues as a percentage of GDP than the 50 year average of 8.4% with higher tax rates and capital gains/dividends rates than we have right now?

Our spending is currently at 24.6% of GDP. This is in contrast to 19.5% during the last 2 years of Clintons administration when the Republicans caused the dramatic austerity changes in welfare and spending. Just how much more spending will it take to satisfy your Liberal/Progressive needs?

SeekingSanity

Hey now let's not go giving limp wristed or the people with out backbones people a bad name now.

It's hard to control your wrists without a backbone. It's the 1/2 cell creatures that know how to type I worry about. How the hell do they do that anyway?

LMFAO....I've had way to much coffee today.

Okay Steve - I live in Florida (yes, that state) - but that's all the information I can pass on without the public or press poking around too much. Thus, a red state. I think my ring finger size is 5.5 (I'm petite). Can't wait to get my ring! I should say decoder ring - can't have people thinking the wrong thing! XOXO

too bad romneys butt dusting wasnt enough to make up for his 47 percent crack.if your going to denigrate nearly half of america better make sure no ones recording it.what do you expect from a corporate raider pagan

Steve-3564331

TruePatriot-445959

I'm waiting for one of these neocons to admit that a veil in their head just popped, and that is the explanation for the total lack of fact & taking things out of context......I can forgive that

I think...

yeah..

no..

yes, I can definitely forgive that.

(psst..... ya think they get what I just did?)

I forgot to tell you that the pledge in the code book requires me to donate a sh!tload of money before I get the lobotomy. Good thing, or I would send it to the paper machete elephant. Those Teapublicans are too cute by half, aren't they?

Marcus D-4300696 -- The GOP is trying to forget Romney as fast as they can. The only thing Romney did in the first debate was prove he lacked authenticity -- zero, nada, zilch. And as someone who just received a butt dusting yourself, it's obvious you wouldn't recognize one if you saw one.

SDN

And while you're at it jimmy - let us know what the dictionary (Webster, Encarta or ?) tells you about the word 'liberal'. We'll be waiting.

ROTFLMAO!!!!!

So, you don’t read the post but your question to me is a definition of liberal?

I understand you little Libbies live on your emotional turmoil that consumes your lives due to its dysfunctions and delusions so we’ll leave the definitions you want in the dictionary.

We real Americans also know you Libbies don’t like to read much but rather just have your talking points provided to you by your comrades at the DNC or from Debbie Whatsername Slutz.

Try to keep up and read a little in life, you may actually learn something Spanky.

steve/robin: Should I just go ahead and ask where I can get a ring too? Would that be giving away too much, do you think? I wouldn't tell anyone else - you can trust me. Until I change my mind. No one would notice, would they?

SDN - I'm thinking Steve just hit on a good money maker here. But he's the go-to guy.

Hey guys, got a great idea. Let's start a business making these decoder rings. Free beer too - Steve's buying. ;) Just joking - BYOB.

jim: Still rolling on the floor and calling everyone 'spanky'? Great stuff, jimmy.

"...so we'll leave the definitions you want in the dictionary." Nice try jimmy. Forgot to attach the definition - you know, the one provided by those with the authority and credibility - not some out of sync, out of touch, online hack. There is a reason for standards in language, you know, so we all know what an 'orange' is - or a 'liberal' - or a 'conservative' - or an 'idiot'.

"..so we'll leave.." Who indeed, jimmy, are 'we'? Only one thing worse than a no-talent troll - check your mirrors.

We're still waiting, jimmy.

Robin/Steve: Considering the potential client base....................yeeeeeeehaaaawwwww!

True Patriot,

Do you know who owns "hate radio"? AKA Clear Channel.

Wait for it.......

Bain Capital.

So you see, Romney may not have won the Presidency, but he didn't lose on the deal as a whole. Clear Channel's 900 stations soaked up a lot of those extra campaign dollars provided by the Citizens United decision.

Like I said I got my copy bootlegged from the RNC winter fest....we had MSNBC operatives inside...But don't tell anyone....It's for this coming weeks show. Now I could be wrong but I think Chris Mathews or Rachel Maddow may be the first to offer these on TV to everyone. Free beer...Woohoo. Thank you Mr. President that's what I have been waiting for...My freebie... HOT DAMN!

Dearest TruePatriot-445959 they will be building into Ryan's budget plan the funding for every-ones lobotomy, however it has to be done with a paper clip and a tooth pick and no you can not stay over night....It's like fast food you drive thru....BRING TISSUE as your nose may run for days. It won't belong before your drooling with the best of em. ;-)

Steve - think I'm in love with you too! LOL You're right on target with JimSpence! Love the hat by the way!

SDN - don't make me start snorting again. It's not a pretty sound.

Hey Seeking - I saw him first. ;)

Steve - I love Rachel Maddow. My daughter and I like to watch her with popcorn. She's so cool.

ROY,

Oops my link @1.158 was about State and Local, not Federal Government jobs. Here is more on Federal employee pay …

However the USA Today study compared pay for more than 216 occupations that exist in the public and private sectors. It found that average federal salaries exceeded average private-sector pay in 83 percent of these occupations in 2008, the most recent year Bureau of Labor Statistics data were
available. On average, federal workers earned almost 13 percent more.

http://www.suntimes.com/business/2767130-420/federal-workers-average-private-percent.html

ROY WILSON-336103

Roy, trying to get a definition of a "living wage" or a "decent wage" from a Liberal is like asking them what they do for a living, they don't know.

So, what is this mythical "living wage"? How much is it? $7.25/hr? $10.25/hr? $25.25/hr? $100.00/hr?

Is it based on renting a 900 sq/ft apartment or buying a 2,500 sq/ft home? Is it based on owning a Ford Taurus or a Mercedes Benz? Is it based on someone who can cook and prepare most meals at home or someone who eats at Olive Garden every day? Is it based on a vacation locally or a one week cruise in the Caribbean? Is it based on shopping at Walmart or Macy's? These are all huge variables to your standard of living and will affect what YOUR "living wage" will need to be.

Is this "living wage" to be guaranteed immediately upon graduating high school (is a high school diploma necessary), college or from graduate school, and how much different is each level worth? Is it based on whether you can perform what the company needs or just because you work there? Is it based on whether you are a good problem solver and it helps the company or you just show up and perform what the problem solvers deem necessary? Is it based upon your research finding the cure for cancer or just performing the necessary tasks that the researcher requires? Is it based on merit or tenure/seniority? If it's based on tenure, what motivation is there to achieve more if not merit motivated? You'll notice all of these things are based on free-market principles. What is your ideology based on?

My suggestion to all the social and economic justice worshippers is to get your degree in business/corporate management, work your way up the corporate ladder, become CEO's, upper management or Board members and make the appropriate changes you feel necessary so everyone can live in the mythical Liberal Shangri-La "world of fairness".

Good luck!

Dennis,

Did you bother to check and see if the pay in those private sector occupations was keeping up with inflation? Didn't think so.

It is not that the public sector employees are getting more and more, it is that private sector employees are getting less and less with respect to inflation. The systematic destruction of Unions since Reagan was elected, has resulted in the destruction of the middle class. They graph identically.

Jim,

What you're really saying is, be like you.

Psychopathy for fun and profit.

umm,yea Jim we do know about taxes on realized gains,I remember my mom teaching me how to do the math for that on my own taxes back when I was single and had enough cash to own stocks and yea I remember the 28% on capital gains on sold stock.Jim,realize too we're now in a spot that we did'nt need to be in to begin with thanks to GW in 2001 GIVING AWAY A SURPLUS IN REVENUE or do you remember the $600 you got from GW then for just being an American citizen.Oh yea,forgot your memory does'nt go back that far.So yes,now we havea dilemma,now we need to compromise or your party will be fading away in anger..

(((Winks))) Thank you both.

My husband wants to watch a movie with dinner...So I'm off to sit and cuddle with the love of my life.

Night all. ((hugs))

Remember be careful those reds left smelly land mines in here and it's not in the budget to clean it up.....get it..... they cut @!$%# and run....LOLOLOLOL

The only thing Romney did in the first debate was prove -

that Obama was a straw man - incapable of handling himself and answering questions on his on - and made to look stupid in front of millions -

LOL - no far using that Avitar!!!! But, I totally understand. Getting ready for dinner with my guy!

Marcus D - the only ones who believe Romney EVER made President Obama look stupid are low IQ individuals like you! Romney couldn't take a stand on anything and hold it for half a day. And, his constant faux pas showed him to be the idiot most of the country saw he was.

@Jim Spence#1.161: Taxes Jim? Taxes had nary a thing to do with overseas outsourcing. It was, and remains overall greed. Specifically though, it's labor costs, along with many other ancillaries. If you'll look you'll find US spending to GDP, has, at times, been much higher than now. Hell Jim, at present, Japans debt is 240 percent of Its GDP and Its just begun a half trillion national stimulus. In 1945 this country simply XXXXed out a national debt that was about 130 percent of the GDP at the time. Actually, allowing for inflation, that total amount, and the ratio of debt to GDP was much greater than today. US has an economy waay too big, and too involved globally, not to mention natural disasters, to really ever be able to attain and hold a balanced budget more than 25 minutes, even with the best efforts of non partisan, speculative prognosticators. All we can fruitfully do is attain full employment with wages appropriate to costs, and hopefully, some for personal savings and discretionary spending which will keep the "Whole" much more wealthy and healthy than the recurring smaller debt. Gwaddammit Jim, the US debt doesn't mean a helluva lot in relation to the nation as a WHOLE.

Everyone enjoy your evenings. I've got my daughter to spend time with. :)

MarcusD,

And more than 5,000,000 Voters made Romney look stupid after he thought he was going to win the 11 to close to call states. He won 1!

Jim,

A decent wage to my republican neighbors is how they can greedily hire more illegals at low wages so they can live like fat pigs and pay a lower tax % than myself and the rest of the neighborhood!

Roy Wilson says

This may seem shocking to Liberals, but businesses are established to make a profit for the owners - not to provide jobs to their employees.

Finally! A conservative thinker who realizes that businesses are in business to create wealth, NOT JOBS !!! Wealthy entrrpreneaurs are NOT JOB CREATORS !! They are wealth creators.

Labor (i.e., jobs) is just a cost of production, and must be reduced to maintain wealth creation. Increased productivity by labor means more wealth and less labor (not more labor) per unit. Increasing unit labor costs just to create jobs is anti-capitalistic feudalism.

What then does create jobs?? Why Demand, of course. increased Demand that happens when more wage earners have more money to spend on more products.

The private sector has no entity big enough to create jobs without regards to how much it costs to create those jobs. Only the government has the capacity to create the wage-earning jobs that create demand that fuel the investment income for private businesses to increase hiring. That increased hiring by private industry will only occur if it increases the bottom line profit.

The private sector is sitting on trillions of investment dollars that cannot be invested, because of lack of demand. The only way to get increase that demand is spending public money on public investments (like bridges, energy research, sewer systems, parklands, hispeed rail, river dredging, etc, etc) while good bargains can be had during rock bottom prices for materiel during this slow economy.

Roy Wilson, you nailed it. Businesses are NOT JOB CREATORS, any more than they are electricity or waste generators. They are wealth creators, and the lower they keep costs like labor, the better wealth creators they are.

ldo, many of the complaints you have against Obama were done "better" and more often by a Republican, and probably within your lifetime. You should probably stop and read and research and actually think about issues before you make a decision on where you stand.

Sometimes the Republican opinion is 100% correct, but sometimes it's 100% wrong. Most of the time, it's a little of both. Perhaps you should consider that perspective for yourself?

- Feisty says: "I need a shower after watching the Lyin Ryan love fest on MTP!"

Maybe you should have went to church instead of watching MTP and getting your "first post" on FR, then you wouldn't have gotten all sweaty. Read Phillipians for more joy in your life.

@GreenTimer#1.188: Hee hee, wealth is only wealth if someone else wants it and can afford it. When no one can afford it the associated price of wealth goes down. When no one else wants it the wealth becomes junk, often libelous junk.

Rassmussen poll. Only 8% of voters now consider themselves Teabuggers. Down from 24%. Mainly becuause of the nuts speaking for that right wing nut case part of the republican party. 30% view the teabuggers favorably now! Love it! Love to see Americans wise up and even FOX can't stem the tide with their propaganda news reporting!

Jim & Arch,

Excellent posts!!!

The teabuggers are a disgusting piece of Trash! "Tread on Them!"

Disgusting as much as the liberal frothing progressives that want to ban all guns and tax the rich at 100%....so you see? Loonies on both ends of the spectrum...

All credibility as to discrediting Ryan is out the window when the first post is by a FIB.

Ryan will get re-elected, most of us love his work in this part of Wisconsin...just like we voted Walker in.

By the way, nice post Jim Spencer, unfortunately most of the left wingers do not have the factual or mathematical wherewithal to understand it.

Ryan is lyin' again.

Calling him on what he wrote in his budget is not a straw man arguement.

Now he says he wants a strond social safety net, but if you look at his proposed legislation, the net has mesh 40 feet wide. If you're lucky enough to fall near enough to one of the cables, grab and hold on, then you'll have the priviledge of watching 99 others fall through, splat.

SDN, #1.170- Thanks for answering the question that I was getting ready to ask JimSpence. (What the hell is ROTFLMAO?)

GreenTimer, #1.188- Speakin of NAILING IT!!!

Mac Forrester, #1.191- Wow! 2 days in a row. Just finished up helping to babysit 2 Grandkids, ages 2 and 4. A lot good to say, Mac. Just this first thread has seemed like a real and really fun "Coming Out" (come on out) party for Paul Ryan, with a lot-a lot- a lot of GREAT! posts above. Loved the references to pre-requisite "Labotomy" from True Patriot, above!!! Gawd- it's actually tempting somedays, too!!! :)

Fiesty--- as usual you have done nothing but complain about getting your halo dirty by merely watching a news show. Your benevolence is obviously confused by the fact not everyone is in tune with your Obama love cult. Simply put you are nothing more than a paid organizer who has never held a real job therefore have no idea what one is. Mr. Ryan whether you like him or not holds the esteemed position of legislator for the state of Wisconsin. How about you give that a try so we can see your responses to the questions of MTP.

JimSpence - Real Americans know you're not a Real American. Just another Republican!

JK1963 - again, lies, nothing but lies. NO ONE wants to ban ALL guns. That is NRA rhetoric to frighten low IQ Republicans - like you!

For some reason, I keep hearing that little buzz around...like some pesky mosquito...oh yes...it's Seeking...

Lies? Perhaps you should look up a video clip of Feinstein from 1995 to start with... NO ONE is more crazier than that loon...

Steve-3564331 -- LMAO. "They say" the decoder ring was supposed to be filled with Kool-Aid, but the RNC couldn't raise the funds. So then it was supposed to be tea, but only three Teabaggers showed up. So it fell to the John Birch Society who provided the fluoridated water, with the Moral Minority lacing it with the almond ingredient, along with the Birthers who pitched in the tinfoil hats.

Gawdammit (Mac Forrester is rubbing off on me), my dog just drank whatever that was and now he has the runs. If you, Robin's Serendipity 1, and SDN decide to sell knock-offs, skip the WMD part. Mystery Rhee -- Don't drink the "water."

ED-2874315

It is not that the public sector employees are getting more and more, it is that private sector employees are getting less and less with respect to inflation. The systematic destruction of Unions since Reagan was elected, has resulted in the destruction of the middle class. They graph identically.

Exactly, great post! Can one of you rightwingers explain why you want to be paid less?

GreenTimer -- Agreed that demand from the middle class is what creates jobs. However, I disagree that low wages creates wealth, as this is contrary to creating disposable income for demand from the middle class. Those in business who fail to understand this will enjoy only a false wealth with no long-term prosperity for the market as a whole.

clwyd-2621393 -- Marcus D-4300696 is like the Black Knight who has his arm loped off and then his leg, but just comes back for more. President Obama was reelected fair and square -- Per an article from Bloomberg "the first president in more than five decades to win at least 51 percent of the national popular vote twice..." Let's see if MarcusD still wants to talk about Romney's multiple personality theatrics he calls a debate.

RobWI -- You have the brass to post your support of Paul Ryan and Scott Walker here, but that's all the credit I'll give ya. The "factual or mathematical" part is antithetical to your support for these docuhebags.

JK1963 - "no one crazier than that loon." I beg to differ - YOU are crazier than that. No one TODAY is asking for a ban of all guns and most people who can comprehend anything know it. Apparently that leaves you and your ilk out since you keep screaming about something NO ONE wants!

RobWI - apparently your math skills are totally lacking if you think JimSpence posted ANYTHING of value. But of course, we expect NO BETTER from Republicans.

Dennis, Columbus, Ohio "ROY, That 2½ year old article was debunked shortly after it was published"

I looked at your link, and far from being 'debunked', it confirmed that public sector workers are compensated at a higher level than the private sector.

True Patriot-445959, #1.202- ????? Either I'm "dense" or it's just very late and I'm pooped, for this day!

RE: reply to Green Time....isn't "false wealth with no long-term prosperity for the market as a whole" really exactly what we have right now? And wasn't that wealth acheived by the purging of jobs en-hundreds-of-thousands-masse, which not only reduced "payroll" but at the same time reduced wages? 1) by the "lucky" ones to still have a job having to forgo any possibility of their wages increasing to match cost of living with no more "disposable" income and 2) by those same ones actually having to take on "other duties" of the pink-slipped ontop of their regular duties that they were lucky to have been left with? (Not to mention lack of "disposable" income from the Unemployment Line).

Also, I think there's too much emphasis on "tangible" goods in relation to economy-saving JOBS issue and not enough on "Service-oriented" positions.

Please, take your time if you are going to reply because I'm stopping now and won't be able to check back in until the morning. (And look forward to and will) Good Night.

RobWI

By the way, nice post Jim Spencer, unfortunately most of the left wingers do not have the factual or mathematical wherewithal to understand it.

Thanks Rob.

Unfortunately you're right. The Liberal/Progressive cabal will just keep allowing themselves to be minimalized by the statist Barrack Hussein and the Bourgeoisie of Liberals that could care less about them as long as they get to maintain their elitist status over the unwashed massed.

I just don't understand how anyone can blindly follow a leader who keeps telling you the best Americans can achieve is middle-class. I much prefer a leader who promotes unlimited exceptionalism for everyone willing to achieve via the equal opportunities that America provides. But then again the elitists in government just want you to think they give a damn about the Proletariat status we are being reduced to as more of our hard earned money is fraudulently wasted and our Rights stripped.

I recommend watching the special Hannity had on tonight called "Boomtown". It exposes the permanent political class that is being created in Washington. Of course this will thrill the Libbies as they worship at the feet of Barrack Hussein or any other bureaucrat that promises them more "stuff" compliments of the criminal federal government. I never could quite understand the childish submission of so many to people they don't even know and don't care about anything other than their own benefit.

Of course the political class will throw some more "Bread and Circuses" at the useful idiots so they think they are there to help the "little guy". They get their pre-staged photo-ops done, like Barrack Hussein shamelessly promoted by bringing those children out to promote his propaganda and more restrictions of our Rights, and then just go back to their crony-capitalism.

Some of the more interesting points from Hannity's special are the average income in Washington D.C.

Top 5% of DC households earn $473,000 annually.

Top 20% of DC households earn $259,000 annually.

Bottom 20% of DC households earn $9,100 annually.

Washington ranks 3rd in the country when it comes to income inequality.

Funny how that upper 5% wage is so close to the finally agreed upon $400,000 single and $450,000 joint income rates for the new upper tax rate of 39.6%.

Coincidence?

In the last decade we have nearly doubled the spending in Washington from $2 trillion to almost 44 trillion today, and growing. The scariest part is that DC is growing on borrowed money that we, the taxpayers, will be responsible for.

There's a new private airport just outside of Washington that has 70,000 private corporate jets that take off and land every year. A new area at Dulles Airport called the Jet Center for private corporate jets sold out all its spots in 72 hours. I wonder why so many private corporate jets would be coming to such a small and non-production place like DC? Could they be headed to K street?

You betcha!

As they say in the documentary, there is no Red States or Blue States, the only color they are worried about is "green".

For those that don't believe me when I say our government is a corrupt and criminal business, you need to watch this special. Of course, our governments "business" is simply bureaucracy, no profit just overhead. It doesn't make any widgets, gizmo's or gadgets, Washington is nothing more than a massive service corporation with unlimited revenue. The problem is We The People are the revenue. And for the past few decades we haven't been getting much of a return on our investment.

Here's the link:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Yvgt1X1M26k#!

SeekingSanity---So based on your perspective, all those who would question your wisdom are crazy. You also seem afflicted with an intolerance of opposing views. Is that what you call American? What you liberals have turned into a war with dissimilar perspectives could easily be classified as intolerant. Yet you proclaim an exclusivity to the term tolerant while lashing out at the so called Republican, who apparently is also the retainer of the perpetual low IQ. It would be difficult to answer your questions because no matter what anyone said, if it did not fit into your mold of uniformity, it would likely fall on deaf ears shielded by your extremely high IQ. In other words you would not listen even if you were wrong. If no one wants to ban guns then why do they call it the gun ban? Think about it.

Sanity,

Nice deflection...you really think that she has changed her position? You are about as empty headed as she is...once a liberal always a liberal... Why don't you listen to Obama who just today said that you gun control nuts should be listening to rational folks... Hard to believe that even Obama has more sense than you loons...

I recommend watching the special Hannity had on tonight called "Boomtown"

Rather like the "Grapes of Wrath", that pro-socialist film boo-hooing the wealth generators vs. the middle/lower class. Right, Spencie. Watch out now, you are now waging war on the upper class. I thought they were the ones you fancied, being a corporatist lover and all, that you are.

unlimited exceptionalism for everyone willing to achieve via the equal opportunities that America provides.

Well, what an oddity, that is exactly what Obama supports and so do those disgusting liberals. Ya see, it is the viewpoints of the extremists on the right that tell us no one has opportunity unless you have K-Street in your back pocket. In doubt, ask Newt, and that disgusting character, Delay. And don't stop there, why not ask Keeting and Kenneth Lay. Those are the guys of big money behind big ambitions, that when they fail, it is called tickle the losses down, and when they gain, it is the big Kahuna.

So big Spence, what are you for, big business or big government?. They are the titans!! In today's throes, I take government. Ya really thing those 300 big corporate entities are about the people? NOT. They are about profits. You and me, well shucks, we have only one institution to level the playing field, and that is the government. Trust me, when Government overreaches, I'll be happy to jump the other side of the fence. Problem is, that day isn't here and now.

SeekingSanity -- Maybe RobWI should also be given credit for reading posts, especially hiking Bullsh!t Mountain by Jim Spence.

Mystery Rhee

True Patriot-445959, #1.202- ?????

That was in reference to whatever was in the GOP decoder ring. Don't drink it, my dog now has the runs.

Irvmani -- Folks can have their own opinion but not their own facts. Progressives are tired of being PC, because if folks aren't called on their BS right away, then it goes viral and it's harder to contain. Democrats are also tired of having elections stolen and a lot of other things that is now manifested as anger. But intolerance? Nah, that's what Teapublicans are all about -- and Projection Politics.

Nice 'theory', but any company that pays substantially more in wages

Nice theory, so we should pay any and everyone .05 cents a day, right. That is cotton picken' wages. How does that work for ya when rent is 20.00 bucks a day. Roy, your economic models just don't match or meet the reality for economic growth. But hey, you keep after some house cleaner that keeps wiping up your crap for a penny a day. Eventually, you may find him/her. Admit it, that is what you want, a crap cleaner as cheap is a feather duster. Nice to know, that is the value of human life. Well guess what dude, when you take a monster crap, most of us expect you also know how to flush the toilet. And if you can't find someone to flush for a hundred bucks, well, that is not an employment problem.

looked at your link, and far from being 'debunked', it confirmed that public sector workers are compensated at a higher level than the private sector.

Another Roy myth .. over the spectrum of time, public sector workers have always won out on wages and compensation. Not even close. Why just like Roy, I an give you salary examples. I knew a guy that pulled 6 figures that did that same job as a government worker at $50k. So tell us Roy, $700k vs. 50k. Who won that battle?

JK1963

Nice deflection

Unfortunately deflection is all the poor little limp-wristed Libbies have to offer. It's amusing to read their irrational posts and their pedestrian comments as they amuse themselves with their ineffectual wit.

This is what happens when we allow the criminal government to educate the unwashed masses, low-achievement is the best you can ever hope for. Look at the results of the Chicago Public Schools or Detroits embarrassment called education. This is what our great Republic will look like if we allow Liberalism/Progressivism to continue. Of course the Libbies love it, illiterate, stoned and dependent. All we'll need to supply them with is some diapers and penicillin for their,,,,well, you know.

It's amazes me every day that the same miscreants come on here and keep begging for more of what everyone else has worked so hard to achieve. In their small little short-bus minds they honestly believe that just because they are too lazy or insignificant to succeed that we owe them something. It's shameful that their undisciplined parents, peers and teachers indoctrinated them so thoroughly.

I see no one still can answer my question of what this fairy-tale "living wage" is. Because there is no such thing. It's good to know their little confabulating brains are busy trying to come up with some cutesy explanation.

I guess my first post was too involved for them, not unexpected, but I keep trying just in case one Libbie is salvageable from the waste-dump of borderline-trainable they all end up as. As usual none of them debate it, offer their opinion or idea. No, they just resort to their typical Liberal hate, anger, racism, rage and ignorance. And the funniest part is they all just pat each other on the back like we used to do in 2nd grade.

Liberals, so easy.

True,

More with this myth of stolen elections... You would think that you of all people would start dealing with "facts" and not your "opinions". The rest of the country is tired of the "enlightened opinions" of you liberals. You seem to take great pleasure in telling others how to live at the same time slamming those on the other side about how they think they should live. You on the left are not one iota better than the Tea Party people.

Roy Wilson apparently takes no issue with the fact that the whole Republican mantra of businessmen being job creators is about as anti-capitalistic, (not socialistic either) as one can be. Business creates wealth, and demand creates jobs. So job creation is done by increasing demand. Middle class wage earners are the job creators whose taxes should be lowered. Right, Roy?

Wealth is created from trees by making lumber, which is worth more than the trees; making finished roof trusses, stair risers and window frames from the lumber, worth more than the lumber; making houses from the trusses, risers and frames, and so on, each process adding value, thereby creating wealth. That wealth creation requires expenditures in labor, equipment, resources, energy, transportation, among other things. Any reduction in any expenditure allows for more wealth to be created at the same selling price.

Of course, lower costs can permit a lower selling price, therefore increasing demand, and allowing increased production. Increased production may allow for capital equipment expenditures, that lowers the selling price even more, and continues to expand demand.

My main point is that I don't want business men looking out for wage earners. That's like having the fox looking out for the chickens. As long as the capitalists treat labor as an expense, then I know where they stand, and I can laugh out loud when they are hailed a job creators.

@Mac Forrester, a rising demand will drive expanded production, and expanding production generally creates more wealth. So you are correct that without a rising demand, no wealth is created. If it's not a better mousetrap, then wealth is lost not created.

@True Patriot, the creation of wealth solely through the reduction of costs without any increase in demand leads only to a downward spiral of fewer and fewer jobs with less and less demand. However, if an increase in demand allows cost reductions per unit, then that increased demand can drive prices lower, which is an upward spiral of increasing demand and expanded production. Increased wages from higher productivity drives demand higher.

Let wealth creators create wealth, and let the labor force create jobs. The labor force created a great middle class in the 50's, 60's and 70's. But now, income from working is taxed at twice the rate of income from investments - which prevents job creators from creating jobs.

Wilson and Ryan are telling you, if you can't pay, then the best way to fix a broken leg is to let it rot off, and hope to live "one legged".

I'm still with them.

I can tell you this unequivocally - I would Much rather let it rot off than to know I allowed, or had some part in letting a Fearful, Awesome All-powerful Imperial Federal Government use the power of force to steal someone else's property to fix MY personal problems.

The assumption that Government is the ONLY answer is quite franky, vulgar to me.

Our Federal government is an OBESITY PROBLEM.

Digest on that one.

The Liberal/Progressive cabal will just keep allowing themselves to be minimalized by the statist Barrack Hussein and the Bourgeoisie of Liberals that could care less about them as long as they get to maintain their elitist status over the unwashed massed.

This is oh, so true. It never ceases to amaze me that these socialists peasants can fawn in reverence as they stand in line waiting for the mass transit during a snow storm waving at their proletariat hero sitting in a Lear Jet while it warms up on the runway.

From personal experience...actually directly from a sibling who is an avowed socialist (carries her own copy of Das Kapital) and has run a couple times for the highest position in my state, she never actually sees the disparity between her and the minions, just what she thinks will be best for them.

JK,

Where did your sick mind come up with the % of 100%? Your out there fella! We want the rich to be taxed at a rate - to that of the middle class. My neighbor gloats over the fact he only paid 14% in taxes while I, in the middle, paid 20%

Guns need to be outlawed. My step-sister is dead because her drunk neighbor with conceal and carry came home drunk and went to the wrong house. He thought she was an intruder and shot her 5 times killing her. She was even in her wheelchair at the time. We have to amend the 2nd Amendment!

I often wonder what universe Roy and Jim are living in to be so out of touch with the majority of the middle class and what is reality!

clwyd, believe the universe that Roy and Jim live in, is the real world not some fantasy world where money grows on trees.

As you can see by our own political results here in our state this past year, the real middle class is fed up with the largess of the left and it is time to pull our selves up by our own boot straps.

Not saying everything is "honky-dory" on the far right, but at least they express some self determination instead grovelling for a place at the big pork teat.

TruePatriot-445959, #1.210- Thanks for clearing up the question marks. (and for taking it easy on me for asking!)

You know, I share a belief with Others that the beginning of the end (for Consumers) was ushered in right about the same time as and along side of marketing for "The Bottled Water" Market. I don't buy it and drink it out of a bottle, so I don't really see myself drinking it out of a Ring!!! (ROTFLMAO?)

Now, about all statements of mine in my earlier post, I hope to be able to get over to an Article that I looked at yesterday about "Elder Abuse" and how "viable" solutions are to be (and should be/but ARE NOT) found in the HealthCare Field. (BUT NOT IN RYAN'S FINITE $300-TOILET-SEAT-VOUCHERED HEALTHCARE PROPOSALS "FOR" THE UNNECESSARY PRIVATE SECTOR MIDDLEMAN/MINION). Begin with, Pay the Worker $7.50-$10.00 an hour then charge Whomever $32-and-up an hour for that same hour made to look like the Recipient of the Service actually got what THEY, not the Company, needed?, etc....

Thanks, again, for the reply.

Sorry Rob it isn't!

If your WI stands for Wisconsin then you probably believe that Wacko walker is good for the state. Just remember his 6 aides all found guilty or pleading guilty to crimes. If you are do you live in the FOX Valley?

Such hostility from liberals toward Ryan. I was happy to hear he believes the automatic spending cuts will happen on March 1st, after all this country is hemorrhaging money and there has yet to be an actual plan put forth by Democrats. There has been plenty of talk, but talk is cheap and doesn't seem to be solving anything. Republicans have to realize that Democrats are not interested in cutting any spending, and have no plan to address the massive debt or deficits. What is going on in Washington can be summed up with Obama's own words, "a failure of leadership." People need to come to the realization that before anything gets done in Washington now a days, the first question they need answered is how will they benefit politically. Obama and the Democrats have settled on the fact that blame seems to be working better then actually solving the nations problems.

clwyd,

Sick? Really? Then what do you say is a enough for the rich to pay their fair share? You on the left act like they don't pay anything, yet study after study prove that they the pay the bulk of the dollars coming in as revenue. So agian I ask, what is the amount that is "fair"? If you live in California now, for example, the top all in tax rate for the top wage earners (including ALL taxes...federal and state) now stands at 51%. Did you ever think you would live in a country where the government takes more than 1/2 of what you earn? Do you call that fair?

And as for whining about paying 20%, perhaps you should ask your neighbor who does his taxes...

Seeking,

You see? Nutcases on the left like clwyd want to ban guns. Of course it falls on dead ears because of your blind faith to being a liberal...

JK1963

Then what do you say is a enough for the rich to pay their fair share?

JK, it's hopeless to get the bobbleheads on the Left to define anything. Their mindless chatter is just that. I post a detailed explanation about how lower taxes create more revenue and the only question I get is, "what is my definition of a Liberal"?

ROTFLMAO!!!!!

This is the nonsense that runs through their obtunded brains. They have been so indoctrinated in the nanny-state fairy tale they can't see anything other than what they are allowed to by their overlords in the government. Like I've said about the Libbies, it's so sad to watch as they spend their whole life groveling for handouts instead of trying to be real Americans and work harder, get more educated or do whatever is necessary to be independent. They have lost all shame about being on the government dole and just expect real Americans to keep working harder to support them. To allow oneself to be so pathetically dependent must be so depressing for them, maybe that's why so many of them lash out at society with weapons and cause all the problems we see around us today.

As far as "fair" is concerned, you may as well ask a puppy, you'll get a more educated response. Just like my post above about the mythical "living wage", the little Libbies have no answer. None of them can define fair, fairness, a fair share or a level playing field. These are just more of the dysfunctional emotionally charged flights from reality Liberals all passenger on every day. Liberals/Progressives deal with everything emotionally. It's always about "feeling good", or "the right thing to do" or some other bleeding-heart knee-jerk reaction.

Of course they never consider the unintended consequences of their bloviated concerns. Just look at our entitlements and social programs that Liberals worship as religion that is failing miserably, yet they just want more of the same. Einsteins definition of insanity fits the Liberal/Progressive cabal perfectly.

They won't do anything or define anything. They just complain and believe more laws, rules and regulations will fix everything. The Code of Federal Regulations is 146,000 pages long and the limp-wristed Libbies want more.

Liberalism is a disease. Once infected it's impossible to cure it unless the person wants to be helped. Most don't because it's much easier to just live off of hard working ambitious real Americans and still complain how rough their poor lives are. This is the conundrum you and all real Americans are against.

It's a shame so many Americans submit to just being middle-class instead of wanting to do more in their lives. America needs more exceptionalism, not mediocrity. Liberals don't like to achieve they prefer to see America decline.

Remember, it's much easier to accept being average than it is to demand to be excellent.

JK,

I want the rich to pay at least the same % that I pay as they can afford it. The top 5% already own 45% of the wealth, up from 43% last year and 40% the year before. No aristocracy for America or its that what you are working for?

Conservatism is a disease and like their flag says, "Tread on Me!"

Conservatism is like a plague upon our land!

Jim Spence, you are exactly right. A "fair" wage is whatever the market can bear. I would no more want my employer determining my fair wage than I'd want my customers to determine a fair price for my product.

Let the business man set the price for his products and let collective bargaining set the price for labor. Just as the law protects the business owner's private property, the law must protect the wage earner the right to bargain collectively.

The capitalist creates wealth, not jobs. He has no special priviledge to set wage rates, any more than he sets energy rates or transportation rates or tax rates. They are all just the cost of production in the creation of wealth.

GreenTimer

Jim Spence, you are exactly right. A "fair" wage is whatever the market can bear. I would no more want my employer determining my fair wage than I'd want my customers to determine a fair price for my product.

Let the business man set the price for his products and let collective bargaining set the price for labor.

Hmmmmmm, explain to me what makes collective bargaining the authority on wages? Especially when it has no investment in the business. Bargaining for the collective was acceptable when we had many manual repetitive jobs that drove the economy. Today many of those jobs are gone due to innovation, automation or outsourcing. Most of those jobs will never come back and quite frankly we probably don’t want them anyway. Setting a price for the collective assumes that each and every person is worth only that much regardless of their skill level. I worked on the line at Fords Trim Plant in the 70’s and I can assure you all 26 people on our line were NOT equal. This is the problem with collective bargaining. If anything you should look at it as an insult to your ability to negotiate your own worth and value.

You state that a “fair” wage is whatever the market can bear. The determinant of what is a fair price IS the market/customer. If he doesn’t think $500 is a fair price for a new iWidget, he won’t buy it. If my wages are based on what the market will bear as far as my product price is concerned then they are BOTH intimately connected for my business to survive.

What I don’t understand is why you need a union to negotiate your worth? Especially as a teacher. Teachers are some of the best educated in our society, shouldn’t they know what their worth, their value, to our children’s education is?

The question you need to ask yourself is, are you worth your wages and benefits?

If you are, you don't need a union to negotiate for you.

If you're not, you're the reason jobs get outsourced or offshored.

"Conservatism is like a plague."...huh, clwyd?

Without conservatives, who tend to have money rather than being moochers on society, who are you going to tax to support the welfare state that you support?

Without the rich, who's going to pay the bill? Liberals don't get it. You need us. In fact, without us, you would starve. No welfare checks. No gubment checks. No food stamps. You won't be able to function because liberals can't be self-sustaining. That's why all the liberals vote for Obama. They need his handouts to survive. Losers of the American gene pool. In nature, you would be labeled "extinct".

Haters gonna hate.....But, it's always our door that you knock on and it is our feet that you grovel to when you need money.

Hard to have much pride when you have to rely on others to take care of you.

Common Man, the Dems were very up front about the revenue increases. Meanwhile the Republicans want cost cutting but refuse to say what they want cut because it would be a (another) political hit. If Republicans want cuts put up or shut up!

PS - I accidently gave you a vote....my bad.

You are of course completely wrong.

The every working American who makes under 400k-450k got a tax break. Every American making over 400k-450k got a tax break on the first 400k-450k that they make.

How is paying more taxes this year than last year a tax break? I guess with government math anything is possible.

How is paying more taxes this year than last year a tax break?

DUH!

Because the temporary FICA tax expired!

The temporary Bush tax cuts passed with the assumption they would be paid for by revenue surpluses.

"Because the temporary FICA tax expired!"

It expired because the Repubs didn't want that particular tax cut so it was dealt out of the negotiations in the fiscal cliff unfortunately.

That temporary FICA tax should have happened. It took away funds for Social Security. If there any cuts to the military or the farm bills. All of that should go to Social Security & Medicare. Our seniors are more important than some new bomb or paying a corporate farmer not to plant a field.

I would have like the FICA cut to have gone away later on in the recovery personally but in general it was going to have to go.

Hey, libs. How do you like your new and reduced pay checks? Your boy came through for the middle class, as promised.

Oh, my mistake. Middles got their taxes raised.

More taxes coming from the Great Divider.

And by the way the issue of paying for SS and Medicare while tough isn't insurmountable and while the demographic bulge that are the Baby Boomers will strain the economy that bulge will pass through and we won't be dealing with nearly the same problems. Let's see if we can't help those who helped build this country.

hjack, we libs paid attention and knew that our paychecks were going to be reduced when the FICA break was over, we knew this about mid-year, when all the politicians said they didn't favor renewing it. The only people who are whining about their paychecks being smaller are the Republicans because they don't pay attention to anything.

The expiration of the payroll tax holiday is not a tax increase. People did`nt appreciate having it and now are crying about losing it, go figure.

hjack Out trolling today? Please don't feed the trolls.