time to leave ... an immediate, full, fast withdrawal.

But then Afghanistan will go back to the stone age, with donkeys as main transportation, not the American supplied helicopters and other modern toys.

"If the Afghan capacity continues on positive glide path and we reach our goals in terms of the development of the army, the police, then you can imagine they require less support,” he said.

Please define "positive glide path." American lives depend upon it.

Afghanistan has the the reputation as the 'graveyard of empires', related to the falling of the mighty empires of (1) Alexander the Great, (2) the ancient Romans, (3) the British in the 19th and 20th centuries, and (4) the Soviets 1979 to 1989.

.

The first win in Afghanistan is finally achieved by an outside empire - the US.

Let's Pop the Champagne.

Yeppers, Time to leave and bring em all home ASAP.

They for the most part don't want us there anyway.

Now! I want them home NOW! We've lost too many fine men and women to this war and the fiasco that was Iraq. Bring them home!

decisions on troop levels would be determined by the atmosphere on the ground, and how well-equipped Afghans are to defend themselves.

The Afghans have had over 10 years to ready themselves. It is way past time that they stand on their own. I really wish we would accelerate our timeline and have them out by the end of this year, or no later than late spring of 2014. I say this because it does take time to extract our military and our "things". Enough is enough.

Guess we have to guard those poppy fields a little longer......

Recently Afghans have started a sporadic national effort to organize donkeys in preparation for US exit. Donkeys are among the most important resources both as a means of transportation (equivalent of trucks in the US) and a source of meat.

Donkeys have been traditionally relied upon navigating the rough terrains of the Hindu Kush Mountains. In the last decade, Americans introduced to Afghans the most advanced technology and advanced trandportation vehicles and helicopters.

Now the party is about to be over ... for those Afghans who have just been getting used to advanced means of transportation.

Pig, pig, pig....

Donkeys are among the most important resources both as a means of transportation (equivalent of trucks in the US) and a source of meat.

So....if the donkey becomes stubborn it will end up as dinner?.....yikes!....that's tough.....no seriously, really tough meat?

All we need is a place to launch drones... aircraft carriers will do. Time for the Afghans to step up. Mullahs or freedom, their choice. Bring our troops home now!

Pig,

I normally agree with most of your post, but, on this one I have to disagree.

"Afghanistan has the the reputation as the 'graveyard of empires', related to the falling of the mighty empires of (1) Alexander the Great, (2) the ancient Romans, (3) the British in the 19th and 20th centuries, and (4) the Soviets 1979 to 1989.

.

The first win in Afghanistan is finally achieved by an outside empire - the US."

Myself, and many others, don't think of Afghanistan as a win. The Taliban is regaining a hold, and when we leave; the country will go back to being a tribal country with a makeshift government that is ineffective and in name only. I'm afraid terrorist will eventually take hold and start hiding there again. Maybe not, but I really don't think America won anything over the course of our stay there, plus America has lost thousands in blood and treasure.

Oh, goody!!! Best news I've heard all day.

That's because he wants to have his own wars in Syria, Iran, and whoever else is ripe for a Sunni Islamic fueled revolution in order to give them total power in the middle east.

I have to ask; why is Obama creating a 4th superpower of Sunni Islamic extremists ? The Muslim Brotherhood is run by a few mullahs who now decide who will run all of these countries, and everything about Obamas Islamic past is Sunni Islamic.

There was stability and balances of power over there. The way is being paved for either totalitarian Sunni Islamic control over the entire middle east, and/or a 4th superpower whose guidelines will be that of Sharia Law.

Just GTFO and quit making excuses!

Rocky,

You can't blame Afghanistan on Obama, and the conspiracy theory of the muslin brotherhood uprising. President Bush started the war up back in 2001, after 9/11 and then took his eye off the ball regarding 9/11 and went into Iraq. Obama was left with 2 wars that started with Bush. Obama got us out of Bush's Iraq, and is leading the way out of Bush's Afghanistan. The muslin brotherhood crap is from the conservative religious nuts who also believed in the end of the world on 12/21/2012. Armageddon didn't occur on 12/21/2012, and their isn't an uprising of the muslin brotherhood, Sunni's, and Islamic takeover of the world. Been listening to Glenn Beck too much.

Can't think of any reason not to leave NOW! End this madness, it's a waste of money and lives.

Put the money to use in this country and if the troops need something to do during peace time, put them on the border and have them help clean-up the mess left from Sandy on the east coast.

The zero option sounds like a winner to me. Dear Hamid, best wishes and rotsaruck, Uncle Sammy.

The first win in Afghanistan is finally achieved by an outside empire - the US.

Yea great more "Mission Accomplished" BS

Are the Taliban going to make Karzai's government fold like a cheap suit?

Will women be treated like property?

Will girls be denied education?

Will the country become a haven for Al-Qaida again?

Will the Afghan's Pakistainis, Iranians, and Indians all get alone?

Do the Afghan's have any ANY economy to continue any progress? (drugs don't count.)

Has the illiteracy rate changed?

The promise during the election (Biden- Ryan debate) was a full troop withdrawl by summer of '14. Now it's after that at some non-specific date. Another promise yet to be fulfilled!

Withdraw all troops (including those of our NATA partners), but more importantly stop giving them money and start recovering the funds that Karzai and his cronies have looted.

Pigotry, you know so little of what you are talking about here its almost sickening. For once I have to agree with Devils Son. They will go back to abusing women and plotting terror attacks like they did before the invasion. This gives them free reign. So if you see more death and destruction on US streets dont complain about your little victory dance at our withdrawal.

Riley,

I agree with your post, right up to your last sentence. What does our withdrawal have to do with more death and destruction on U.S. streets. We still have the hatred of America going on, whether we are in Afghanistan or not....still plotting attacks even as we speak. It will continue after we withdraw...I would rather our troops were back home and protecting America here, than in Afghanistan where they are still targets and shedding blood.

"White House South Asia advisor Doug Lute said decisions on troop levels would be determined by the atmosphere on the ground, and how well-equipped Afghans are to defend themselves."

When peope fantasize too much, they never understand or see realities.

That was the Afghan war story since 2001!

But don't worry: there will be more of our tax monies for reconstruction, encouraging moderate elements and so on, on..

Despite all the backstabbings right in Afghanistan, Pakis still get economic aid. There is something basically wrong even in spending tax monies.

At home: tax cut, benefits cut, financial cliffs and so on for each dollar!

White House open to full Afghanistan withdrawl after 2014

Good. Follow through, President Obama. Please. Pull out EVERY LAST ONE. Let those stone aged cretins over there wallow in their own filth.

The first win in Afghanistan is finally achieved by an outside empire - the US.

Let's Pop the Champagne.

I can only assume you were being facetious with THAT Remark, Pigotry. Lolz!

Pigotry, of course Afgans will go back to donkeys as main transportation. They were savages when our leaders decided we gotta go into Afganistan and Iraq, and they'll still be savages when we leave. Anyone who thinks it's ok to kill someone else for some stupid religious reason are savages, and the world would be better off without them!

What? We're still in Afghanistan? And some troops still in Iraq? After the campaigning in 2007-8, I thought we would have been out of these places a long time ago.

Yes it is time to get out of the two GOP wars, Enough Blood !

catch44 says "Yes it is time to get out of the two GOP wars, Enough Blood !"

Got to love the constant labeling of wars. Liberals like to refer to Republicans as the party of war. Yet they forget that it was the Democrat President Truman that first sent troops to Vietnam. It was JFK and Johnson both Democrat Presidents that escalated that war, in which over 58 thousand US troops were killed. More then every conflict the US has been involved in since. Combined. Stop living in glass houses, there is a rich history of war mongering from both parties.

This selective liberal ranting machine is really getting old and boring. Selective blame, endless excuses, and as short a history lesson as proves their selective point. Everything was Bush's fault when he was president, and now everything is the fault of the House under Obama. How convenient for you. The problem with liberals is that you refuse to share in your part of the blame. As such you can never be part of a solution, because the new liberal definition to compromise is we get our way. The liberal definition of debate is finger pointing, blame, and excuses. How pathetic.

Afghanistan - the biggest waste of American money and lives since Iraq.

Bring everybody home NOW! (that includes 100,000 troops now stationed in Japan, Korea, Germany, and other places where our soldiers don't belong)

Hey Rick, it could be worse, if Romney got elected we would be bombing Iran now !

GOP are war mongers, starting one war is one thing, but starting two wars at the same time is another, even a moron would know this would bankrupt a nation !

And Gitmo is suppose to be closed by now ....

Those, who talk of wars in Syria, Iran and other places where Sunni rulers of Saudi Arabia, Qatar, Kuwait, UAE and other Sunni Arab League nations point, must at least remember how worthless Afghan and Iraqi wars were.

Pigotry and others feel that these people are just donkey riders. I guarantee they could outflank, outmanuever and outfight just about every unit the US has with the possible exception of a RCT or a Ranger Battallion and even those units have lost considerable men in skirmishes with the Haqqani Network, Lashkar e Taliba, Mesuds TTP, etc. These men are fanatics and now will have a country free of obstacles to plan and push attacks.

no kidding...really gonna finally do it? only took you idiots a decade to find out what the Russians did years ago.....and you killed thousands of young lives and wasted billions and only succeded in making the warmongers rich...good job ...what a bunch of complete fools our leaders are!!!

I agree, the Rich got Richer on our boys blood, sad !

catch44 says "Hey Rick, it could be worse, if Romney got elected we would be bombing Iran now !"

So you read this fact? Or did you write it down, read it, and you believe everything that you read? What an incredibly ignorant statement. It is simply no longer possible to take the liberal party of convenience serious. They can justify anything with blame, excuses, and simply making stuff up. Liberals simply do not allow morals or ethics to get in their way.

catch44 says "GOP are war mongers, starting one war is one thing, but starting two wars at the same time is another, even a moron would know this would bankrupt a nation !"

More in the way of amazingly stupid liberal logic. So if we had only started one war that would have been fine? Apparently it is not about the number killed but the number started. Democrats started Vietnam which was fine because it was only one war, and Bush started two. We had troop levels over 500K in Vietnam, and the most in Iraq 165K and 100K in Afghanistan. Apparently it takes a moron to find that only the number of conflicts determines the cost. This is the sort of liberal idiocy that defies comprehension.

Rick, aren't you doing the same thing you are blaming Democrats of doing? Finger pointing. Hypocritical much? Don't care for either party but yes, we do need to get out of Ratinfestedstan. The sooner the better.

Rick, Eisenhower was the first President to go head first into the Vietnam Conflict !!

Check it out: www.vhfcn.org/stat.html !!

Stop with the Pork stories, your turning ham into baloney !!

Got to hand it to Mr Obama's propaganda squad "Truth Team" at nbcnews.com to be proactive preparing the sheeple voters/taxpayers that Mr Obama has lied "evolved" and will not be keeping his campaign promise to America regarding withdrawal from Afghanistan.

No Chuckster I am not doing the same thing. Both parties have a history when it comes to war which was my only point. Time doesn't change that fact, or a selective history. Just as both parties share equally in the condition of the country and the tone in Washington. But it is this endless blame game that really stands in the way of progress. My real complaint with left wing liberals and right wing conservatives is that they refuse to hold their own party to the same standard they demand of the other. There is always justification because of what someone else did, or said, or started. When all that is really be proclaimed with that logic is that no one has the ability to be the bigger man, as two wrongs will never make a right.

catch44 says "Rick, Eisenhower was the first President to go head first into the Vietnam Conflict !!"

You continue to put your ignorance and lack of education on full display. So don't let the truth get in the way of your sole effort just to bash Republicans. But here are the facts about when our involvement in Vietnam began. Truman was a Democrat right? But it was JFK and Johnson that really escalated our involvement.

In September 1950, US President Harry Truman sent the Military Assistance Advisory Group (MAAG) to Vietnam to assist the French in the First Indochina War. The President claimed they were not sent as combat troops, but to supervise the use of $10 million worth of US military equipment to support the French in their effort to fight the Viet Minh forces. By 1953, aid increased dramatically to $350 million to replace old military equipment owned by the French.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_Assistance_Advisory_Group

Riley how you agreed with me and totally missed my point is amazing. We have done all there is to do there. It's time to get out. All we did was part the waters with our hands. If we stay in any numbers it will be for a 100 years. (67 years and counting in Germany and Japan) We are playing Wack a Mole (Muslim) with them. They have been damaged true but we haven't gotten Mullah Omar and a bunch of others. Their life expectancy is 44 years in a country that has been at war for 34 years. We can never win with the Karzai government coruption and drug dealing. Add to that the majority of Karzai's troops can't read and switch sides at the drop of a dime.

Truman only assistance the French with equipment, Eisenhower was the first President to start the war, go to the website I gave you, Rick take some time out you are getting very upset, calm down ???

We are not winning in the East nor anywhere else in the Asian nations.We started Colonisation in the 16th century and they have been heading toward their Independence ever since. We will never change them.. The only ones that can or will change them is themselves.We should be spending our limited treasures in protecting and advancing the health and economic welfare of our own nation,not wasting it on this fallacy of defend it overseas or we will have to defend it here. It will always be to defend it here.

AlaskaGirl-759554

The Afghans have had over 10 years to ready themselves.

Exactly right! American military and police would be half way through their careers by now. If they can or won't defend their country...oh well, not our problem.

riley-1759556

Pigotry and others feel that these people are just donkey riders. I guarantee they could outflank, outmanuever and outfight just about every unit the US has with the possible exception of a RCT or a Ranger Battallion and even those units have lost considerable men in skirmishes with the Haqqani Network, Lashkar e Taliba, Mesuds TTP, etc. These men are fanatics and now will have a country free of obstacles to plan and push attacks.

I agree that they are fanatics, at least the Taliban. Otherwise while they are very experienced and obviously familiar with the terrain, I suspect you are giving them a little too much credit. And even if you're not, no one is going to change them. The options are, to my way of thinking; kill them all, every man, woman and child or leave and let them kill each other...which they will do!

2014??? Are we nuts? What's wrong with rightNOW? How about some spending cuts?
What's that flea bitten country costing us? A billion dollars a day to keep our military there and for what?

So it can slide back to Taliban rule? Why postpone the inevitable? Let’s GET OUT NOW!!

What will happen in Afghanistan when the United States pulls out? Does anybody doubt that everything we have done will be in vane. The Billons of US Dollars spent in vane. Thousands of US Soldiers deaths will be in vane. Will the United States learn anything from this. I DOUBT IT.

Dan....Agree. We have spent trillions of dollars fighting 2 useless wars in the last 10 years. We have tens of thousands dead and maimed. We will have to spend billions over the next 60 years taking care of all our wounded and maimed. What did the US accomplish? We turned Iraq over to Iran and we turned Afghanistan over to a dictator who's family has gotten filthy rich off the US taxpayer. I mean billions to this guys family. Afghanistan is now our biggest supplier of heroin to boot.

Thank God we now has a President who is smart enough to stay out of these quagmires. Lead from behind if it saves American lives. My problem with Obama is we are still supporting Karzai in Afghanistan. Leave NOW.

I just delete a long speech about what the last 10 years of my life have been like in these two wars. If the last 10 years were not worth it to you then you would not understand and your not worth my time.

We bleed for you because you the people asked us and now you throw it away.

This isn't as much about "bringing the troops home" as it is about obama downsizing the military - part of his personal agenda.

Spending cuts will result but were not part of the consideration.

were the u.s. soldiers who participated in this war drafted? so they joined by choice knowing what a soldier is? i thank them for their service but they do not get to cry foul that their job sucked. you JOINED the armed services of your own free will. you didnt flip burgers, or continue your education, you joined the u.s. military at a time when we are actively involved in war. my family has military ties going back to the very begining of this country. my grandfather and father were both drafted which means they legaly had to go to war no choice. i understand war is different today but at the same time the people that chose to join know so much more about what is going on then any generation before. why were we in afghanastan? to disrupt al qaeda training facilities and destroy as much as possible of the orginzation. when we leave they just come back, and the locals hold no loyalty to other groups. the u.s. attempted to create a strong central government for a area where the people dont even identify themselves as afghani. good luck have fun with that, keep a few forward operating bases open with drones and keep intelligence agents working in small groups throughout the country. large scale delpoyments do nothing when attempting to draw out and kill small parts of populations.

2013 would be much better, before we loose any more fine people !

@Adler and myvote,

A full withdrawal will take time logistically.

The point is, we are heading for the exit door... at last.

Jeez, WW2 was shorter than this.

Too True Bali Bob, too true !!

"“The two leaders will be discussing any potential support for Afghanistan from the United States beyond 2014,”"

Here you go!

One leader is Karzai, President of Afghanistan presidential palace. Of course, palace has to be guarded by NATO forces, preferably US soldiers!

Mind you: Karzai has to be given charge of spending our tax monies.

Just watch how the things go on and on!

Get out and pay down our debt with the money saved, also stop all foreign aid "ENOUGH" !

May 2, 2011 would've been preferable.

I agree!

But will some change their mind after seeing killing of children and women after we leave?

In Syria's case, there are many jumping up and down just like before Iraqi wars and Afghan war.

At least, some give big lectures on how the humanitarian aid should be given to Syrian rebels.

In Afghanistan, Pakis have backstabbed the US and NATO forces big time. Half of NATO forces deaths are due to ungrateful and backstabbing Pakis.

When the NATO forces were entering Kandahar in 2001, Pakis airlifted key al-Qaida, Taliban, ISI and others militants by back door from Kandahar.

This includes Mullah Omar, Osama and many including Paki Haqqani militant network leaders.

Hope people remember about Pakis sheltering Osama.

These Paki Islamic religious Nazis don't bother about their people and they are into reckless killing games in the name of jihad.

Drone attacks are not enough. To reduce NATO forces losses, carpet bomb Paki militant areas just like 1991 Iraqi war.

Or else just get out right now.

Please remember: no if and buts while leaving and it should be bye, bye once for all!

Great point, why wait.....Can you imagine your loved one going off the that $hit hole and being killed for a exit strategy in 2014.

No matter when we leave people will die. American soldiers will die during the withdrawal. No better time to attack the enemy then when they are withdrawing. Afghan civilians will die. Afghan children and women will be among them. More likely than not the Afghan government will become more and more fundamentalist Muslim. That was the nature of things before we arrived and it will be the nature of things when we leave. Folks, people kill people. Ignorant people kill lots of people. Fundamentalist people kill lots of people for god...it is what it is.

Are you concerned how Iran feels about anything?

...why?

PS. It sounds like you are lamenting the fact that president's don't have more power...why?

Because they, (presidents) don't have much power.

The power comes from the people who have been in government for career lengths.

Not any possible two term wonder.

And, IRAN is the main objective of Afghanistan.

Why do you think so many countries for decades have fought for that rock?

Let it sink in, and if you need further explanation, I will be glad to help out.

wahoo21,I am with you on this one.

It was decided months ago that the US would keep a presence in Afghanistan until 2024.

Guess you forgot about the West Point speech back in 2010, when the surge started for Afghanistan, with the republicans backing this up; and talk back then of withdrawing down of troops in 2014. There was talk of increasing the withdrawal, but only with the same aspects as Iraq....when Afghanistan soldiers could stand on their own, and the generals in the field felt it was acceptable.

Obama has taken flack for not withdrawing sooner, and now. I agree, we need to leave as soon as possible, and let the chips fall where they will.

I'm certain that when Obama ran for his first term he stated that he was going to bring our troops home A.S.A.P

He campaigned that he would get out of IRAQ ASAP and put the fight where it should have stayed from the beginning, Afghanistan.

I feel sorry for Pigotry.

To either blame or praise the current president for withdrawal is meaningless. As Things pointed out, to some extent it was in the works. Having served in the military for more than a few years my objective observation is that Obama has handled the withdrawals in a pretty standard way. There is also a lot of people blaming Obama for the draw-downs. Folks, you can get as emotional as you want and as partisan as you want and in the end, it has absolutely nothing to do with who the president is. This is the third Reduction in Force I've observed, survived two in uniform. The two I survived were initiated by Republicans. It had nothing to do with their party, they just happened to be there when they happened. The country can't afford to be on a wartime footing constantly.

The withdrawals are pretty much the same thing...it's time, not politics. If Richard Nixon hadn't been elected and it had been a Democrat elected, then the Democrat would have ended the Vietnam War. It was time then, it's time now.

Jim,

That wouldn't affect much of anything, just who pays. The President and other top Government leaders would still use the military health care system for the bulk of their care but DoD would be reimbursed by the ACA Insurance Companies. Heck, retired military 65 or over are required to sign up and pay for Medicare. They can also sign up for TriCare Plus and pay premiums for that to cover what Medicare does not cover. When retired military on Medicare receive treatment at military hospitals and clinics, Medicare pays DoD up to the Medicare limits then TriCare Plus kicks in.

What would change is that the President and top Government Officials would pay the ACA Premiums but the way the law is written, if your employer offers health care, that meets the requirement of the ACA so in reality, they would just keep purchasing the same Federal Healthcare Plan they do now.

Jim, there is no universal health care system, at least in this country. If you understood the ACA then you would understand it's a whole bunch of private insurance companies with their own plans that have to meet minimum government standards. Since all of the elected government officials you mentioned have a choice of standard government healthcare plans (like blue cross/blue shield, etc), they are in effect participating in what you chose to call "universal health care". But by all means start a petition.

Hey Mikey, don't look now but TRICARE is changing significantly starting with the Western Region...and it ain't pretty.

I'm sorry, I couldn't read your post without William Shatner's voice in my head. The multipe ellipses (sp?) really take away from your message.

steve,

Obama was left with the mess in Afghanistan by Bush....Obama didn't start this war, it has been going on for 10 years now. Not sure what your rant is about,....Bush is the one who left Afghanistan for Iraq...and Obama is trying to extradite out without leaving it worse than when we went in. I think it is a losing proposition, but republicans are the ones stating that we need to stay indefinitely. I think you need to put more blame on the neo-cons in the republican party than on Obama.

Steve, nothing could be further from the truth.