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UPDATED 11: 40 AM ET: There is an emerging deal to avert the fiscal cliff, led by negotiations between Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell and Vice President Joe Biden, but the key sticking point remains the sequester and deficit reduction, aides say.
Biden and Republican Leader Mitch McConnell exchanged phone calls until about midnight last night and aides continued beyond that, aides tell NBC News. Democratic Leader Harry Reid left Capitol Hill in the evening Sunday and was not directly involved last night.
NBC's Chuck Todd weighs in on the chance of a fiscal cliff deal just hours before the deadline, saying it "really depends on the political motivations" of the people at the negotiation table.
Aides say the Vice President and McConnell spoke at 12:45 am and again at 6:30 am this morning. GOP sources say the inclusion of the vice president has made a favorable difference in the talks, given his understanding of legislation and his personal relationships.
Two senior aides to McConnell continued with White House representatives overnight and again today.
GOP aides say they expect their party to likely defer its biggest fight over deficit reduction when the debt-ceiling debate takes center stage in the new year. Republicans say given the time left, there is limited, if no chance, to secure specific detailed alternative spending cuts right now.
Republicans would like to see the "sequester" across the board cuts kept in place to drive down the deficit, but Democrats are resisting that and offer a two-year delay.
But Democrats caution that the "emerging deal" which "creates another cliff in three months probably would not have the votes to pass the two chambers." That is a reference to the looming fights over the debt ceiling and the overall government budget deadline in March.
Rep. Barbara Lee, D-Calif., talks about the latest developments on the fiscal cliff, and why she thinks Congress hasn't come to a resolution.
Democrats also argue the new revenue generated by tax increases, especially if reduced from the Democrats' earlier targets, should be used to cover the costs of delaying the automatic spending cuts for two years and protecting the long-term jobless with extended benefits.
Cuts that would go into effect as a result of the sequester would be deep and across the board. The discretionary cuts were signed into law in an effort law to compel Washington to address the long-term deficit. So far, the parties have been unable to agree on replacement cuts that would be targeted and therefore less arbitrary.
The most recent Democratic offer on taxes, presented on Saturday night, is setting the new income threshold at $450,000, sources say. That represents an increase over the president's original $250,000 threshold for higher rates and Obama's later offer to Boehner of $400,000.
Rep. Jeff Flake, R-Ariz., opposes any delay of the sequester, when steep, automatic spending cuts will slash budgets at the Pentagon and other government agencies. Flake says he'll take any fiscal cliff deal that prevents a tax hike for most Americans.
Senior Republicans say the GOP is looking for a figure at about $550,000, down from House Speaker John Boehner's $1 million and retaining current estate tax rates. That could mean, say various members, a split-the-difference deal at $500,000.
Significant progress has been made on the income tax threshold and estates taxes, but the figures will not be set in stone until all details are resolved, including unemployment benefits, preventing a scheduled cut to medical provider's Medicare payments (know as the Doc Fix), and a fix to remove millions of middle class taxpayers from the "alternative minimum tax."
The taxes being discussed, by the way, would be made permanent and not given a "sunset provision" in law, which is unusual. There would be no expiration date like the one that forced this debate.
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Keep your filthy hands out of the pockets of our children and grandchildren. NO debt limit increase.
Unlike what the GOP did EVERY single time BUsh requested it.
The debt limit ceiling is a joke. We are obligated to pay our debts, with or without a debt limit ceiling. All the posturing around the debt limit ceiling is just that, posturing. The money is already spent. The money is already owed. The debt ceiling is just a legal device to allow the US to pay those bills.
You can look at your own finances and decide that you owe too much money on your credit cards, but that doesn't mean you can stop paying those credit cards by setting an arbitrary limit on the amount you are willing to spend on paying those credit card bills.
Mari Visaya
Obama could be president for 100 years he would still blame someone else for his problems..
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Reply:
CORRECTION:
Obama could be president for 100 years and they Republicans still would be unwilling to negotiate.......because he is a n e g r o.
But that won't happen. The Republicans will only be around another 2 years, tops.
Larry-nc... Your spelling is deplorable. But I'll fix it for you. "Obama could be president for 100 years and they Republicans still would be unwilling to negotiate.......because he is i-n-c-o-m-p-e-t-e-n-t." There, it's all fixed now. You're welcome.
I'm sure you voted for the i-n-c-o-m-p-e-t-e-n-t Dubya....T-W-I-C-E!!
Actually, no, I didn't. But thanks for playing. Johnny, what departing gifts do we have for Rosso?
We cannot go back. The economic structure that existed prior to the Bush years does not exist any longer. The middle class has been hammered. Many of them now fall into the category of "working poor". Taxing them would only result in a significant drop in consumer spending which would result in a double dip recession. In order to stabilize the economy we need a tax structure that rewards employers/corporations for bringing well-paying jobs back to the US, penalizing companies that take jobs overseas, and raises the minimum wage.
We must get revenue up and address the issues of government spending on the bloated contracts of the defense contractors. The right always claims that fraud within the entitlement programs is the problem, and that may be part of the problem, but the bigger problem is a system of taxation that rewards companies for shrinking wages and benefits and shipping jobs overseas. Fraud doesn't just occur in entitlement programs, it also occurs in the tax loopholes created for the rich, specifically to give them excuses for not paying their fair share of taxes.
No..what you need is economic growth..and bowles-simpson plus additional spending cuts would have been the best answer offered so far on that.
The revenue...endless spending route has been tried and has failed in europe..where have you been?
Really have to agree that extended unemployment benefits must be terminated. Infrastructure work should continue though.
Mark Thomas
I suspect that the extended unemployment benefits should go. I know an awfully lot of people who are looking for work and can only find low paying dead end jobs. So they remain on unemployment because it pays more than the crummy job. If you cut them off, they will take the crummy job and be stuck forever in the "working poor" category because that category doesn't usually have an upward career path.
I have a son-in-law working at a job he hates because he is afraid to quit. He hasn't been able to find a job in his chosen field, so he keeps working at the hated job. During the last five years his wages have been frozen and his benefits have been slashed. Upper management cut benefits over the last two years and then gave themselves multi million dollar bonuses. He's smart enough to figure out where they got the money for those bonuses.
He represents a lot of people who have had the same experience. The anger at the ceos and upper management is growing by leaps and bounds. If this keeps up people are going to start arguing that banks and financial institutions need to be nationalized. Are you up for that? The people at the top are creating a vast reservoir of resentment and rage. They need to think about this.
wow such gross ignorance and over generalization in what you have written. First, he should be happy to have a job. Second, you prove that unemployment benefits keep people from taking jobs that are out there..its not supposed to be a permanent source of income but a way station to a job..not to the job you desire....sometimes you have to take what is out there and through effort, work you way back upo..jeez..you posting is so symptomatic of everything that is wrong today..what foolishness
Actually, UNDEREMPLOYED is exactly right...it is everywhere. These companies should be given incentives in the form of tax breaks if they keep jobs in the US, offer benefits, and pay according to the going rate for said job. Too many times now corporations will only hire part time, no benefits, no health insurance, low pay. Yet they still seem to live the grand lifestyle at the top. It is true...where have YOU been Larry...apparently not looking at the true workforce. I suppose you would be one of those at the top collecting the bonus while the part time guy figures out how to get his kid treated for strep throat.
And if you people think the public is not getting free healthcare before the ACA (Obamacare) just walk through your local ER..probably half or more of them have no insurance. So now we as taxpayers pay at least triple for that care than a regular visit to a doctors office. How much savings are we having from that? Because it doesn't matter, if someone is sick enough or in pain enough, they DO go to the doctor, but it's called the ER...and yes peeps, it's free if you don't have insurance...oh they bill, but it rarely gets paid because if they can't afford insurance they CERTAINLY can't afford the ER visit, so it goes unpaid. And the taxpayers pay the hospital....
Much cheaper to give basic prevention and early treatment than wait for them to show up in the ER....and don't even go there with the undocumented...SECURE ALL THE BORDERS. Once you have allowed them to cross in, you now agree to feed, clothe, educate, house, and medicate these people. And they are HUMAN BEINGS..so when they get hit by a car, we pick them and their body parts up and save them all because THAT IS THE RIGHT THING TO DO ! And yes, if your employer offers you insurance you should have to take it or provide your own, because we save them too, and then with no insurance once again the taxpayer pays the bill. Even religious zealots...do you know how many I have treated that don't believe in medicine UNTIL THEY GET SICK, INJURED OR ARE UNCONCIOUS? Basic insurance should be for ALL in the US, if you want to take out additional riders for transplants, choice of doctors etc that would be ok but you have to pay an insurance plan for those things...basic care should be a right in this country. And trust me, a cheap antibiotic or blood pressure med save thousands of $$ if the infection or condition worsens making a need for the ER, OR, ICU, Floor care, and home care. I have been in health care for 25 yrs and have observed some of the saddest things ever, people needlessly suffering and then ultimately in horrific conditions because they had no option of treatment. In the hospital for weeks treating conditions that could have been treated at home with a basic med or treatment plan.
It is estimated that by 2020 ( seven years from now we will be paying over a trillion from tax revenue just to pay the interest on the outstanding debt estimated to be 24 trillion @ a 7 % interest rate). That is currently 1/3 of today's national budget. We are already spending 400 billion a year in interest on the current debt of 16 trillion. Keep in mind this is money that has already been spent, not on anything going forward and the reason it is this low because of the current Interest rates being set by the Fed.
Keep in mind that the bond vigilantes, China, Japan etc.. are now starting to pull back from lending to the USA because the Fed is devaluing money by just printing like monopoly money. The USA is on a path to destruction, the death spiral and there really isn't anyone can do about. Once we default on our debt , and we will because we will choose to spend on entitlements then on interest payments, then the ponzi scheme collapses There will be no SS ( or little) no entitlements, pensions etc... look at Greece, Spain etc.. and keep in mind they had Germany and Northern Europe to help them out. - there will be no one with size to bail us out who - China, Russia, India they want us to crash. So I say lets party likes it 1999 spend and print because when the party stops get ready for a really nasty time.
ah finally a voice of reason..wait until interest rates climb...that will put the double whammy on the % of the budget that will be necessary to service the debt.
Government plays fiscal policy and Fed plays the shell game monetary policy.
There all pretty much crooks, jestures and jokers - FOS
Self interested Snakes
So. The President WAS “optimistic”?
Yea. Obama ‘optimistic’ about once again compromising on another watered down bull-s h i t- deal.That will do nothing but kick the can down the road and do nothing to solve our immediate crisis.
Obama should have learned by now.
You never compromise with terrorists. You never compromise with Republicans. Both are masters at doing the same thing. Holding a situation hostage until they get what they want and the h e l l with anything else.
I will bet that not one of the clueless babbling right wingnuts posting here would pay one dime more in taxes if the taxes for TAXABLE income over $250k went up.
Like typical uneducated people, they fight against their own best interests!
Izoo, one thing Obama understands completely is that he does not have a vote on any piece of legislation, including spending and taxing bills. Another thing he understands is that the Speaker of the House has lost all influence with his caucus and the Senate Minority Leader is bent on increasing the record number of filibusters beyond the new record he has established.
And all intelligent Americans know that Congress has lost sight of the basic principle of representative democracy: Strive for the perfect, but be prepared to accept the possible.
Obama and his Democrats want to destroy the economy for your kids. They want to put off tough decisions so that they get reelected and your kids experience a Great Depression.
When will you try to finish your GED, you poorly educated little boy?
The GOP LOST in Nov!
Obama and Ried should hold their ground. America doesn't negotiate with TERRORISTS like the Tea Party!
All money should be used to pay down the debt and refund SS.
There seems to be a lot of name calling and vitriol here, but at their core most comments seem to focus on: if we spend more than we take in, we won't be fiscally sound.
It seems logical that we cannot get enough money from the top one percent of earners to pay for our profligate spending. We simply cannot exist on the promise that we can have it all and someone else can be made to pay. First, someone else will resent it and rightly so.
Next, we should not and don't have to eliminate programs and services that benefit the needy. There aren't that many of them and we can afford it.
I think the issue is in the middle. When we create entitlements that most of us want, and can afford, then we all need to pay. Otherwise, let's agree to have our government provide less for us.
luigi, you are obviously in the top earner catagory and therefore it is time to pay a larger share for you are the ones who have increased your income 250% and have paid a pittence in taxes.
get on board, mr america, be an american and pay your total share. why your at it drop the fox noise dialogue.
Luigi Bravo! so well said. How can anyone in the heart really disagree with what you have posted!
Rober
Sounds like a good name for you,,,lmao
deficit? just raise taxes on the top incomes to 50%. their income has increased 250% over the last 30 years, while the majority has suffered with a pittence, suffering through high cost of health, food, fuel, a housing crisis, a labor crisis, unfunded wars, reduction in unemployment, medicade, food stamps, and work place benefits. social security and the social net is needed now, more than ever before, and we have idiots who want to reduce those benifits.we the 98% have made these people wealthy and it is time they pay their full share!
The Republican teabaggers are a fiscal Al Quida. In a month they will be back with the next hostage. (the debt ceiling) America has finally realized that teabaggers are the biggest threat to economic security. Business now realizes now that supporting republican teabaggers is bad for the American economy.
That is what the vote in Nov meant. The GOP LOST the WH, LOST seats in the Senate, and removed 10 tea stains from the House!
BS Report - the issue has become deficit reduction.
This has been the issue for years our FAT PORK BELLY GOVERNMENT.
The other issue is poor leadership - over entitled and compensated government, Congress, Senate and Many others.
You're not going to read this on MS/NBC
President Barack Obama issued an executive order to end the pay freeze on federal employees, in effect giving some federal workers a raise. One federal worker now to receive a pay increase is Vice President Joe Biden.
According to disclosure forms, Biden made a cool $225,521 last year. After the pay increase, he'll now make $231,900 per year.
Members of Congress, from the House and Senate, also will receive a little bump, as their annual salary will go from $174,000 to 174,900. Leadership in Congress, including the speaker of the House, will likewise get an increase.
A country lost is a country that is so apathetic that it does not know what it's leader really is.
Wake up, democrats dont know how to negotiate.
America doesn't negotiate with Terrorists, like the Tea Party. Send them to gitmo!
Where is the news on the big raise the slug squatting in our white house...AGAIN... gave Congress?
Thanks again to the imbeciles that voted for this narcissistic, incompetent, communist POS!
I hope you are living under a bridge now.
Republicans have no respect. Thats a big reason why President Obama cleaned your clocks. AGAIN!
Its also why America has rejected you. No Respect
In all the furious bluster here at the precipice with the clock ticking, have the words " Simspon Bowles" even been uttered ?
Everyone knows taxes are going up. Any deal must contain significant, real and immediate government spending cuts otherwise go over the cliff.
Lets SLASH military spending so that it's equal to the send largest military spending country in the world. That would only be a 60% cut!
Sambo wants this to be class warfare because his supporters are just TOO STUPID to see this
is all wasted time before the big crash. Take everything everyone earns and it won't fix a
thing without cuts.
Herron, cut military and all other spending.
Take everything the rich have and sell their children if you want
but what Pig face and fisted dead head are too stupid to understand is at the current rate
of spending the amount collected would last 2 friggin weeks.............
The welfare slime needs to be cut off, If a few (million) starve the others may decide
to get a job.
Obama has the lowest rate of spending increase seen since Ike.
And Reagan DID RAISE TAXES 11 times!
And GW increased the debt limit 18 times!
Desoto, no one claims reinstating the tax rates to where they were 10 years ago will solve all of our problems, only that it is one part of the solution.
Why does the right wing consistently make the stupid statement that it's intended to solve all our problems?
Go back to Clinton tax rates AND spending rates!
You can't go back to the Clinton spending rates because we now have two wars we have to pay for. Thank Bush.
Desoto Kim:
It seems you're in serious need of a history lesson, considering some of the language you've used when posting your comments. For example:
It's possible that some of the comments you've submitted regarding a variety of posts may be accurate
and (dare I say) intelligent. However, I find that unlikely, considering that YOU HAVE REFERRED TO OUR PRESIDENT (yep, he's your president, too) AS "SAMBO" 11 TIMES IN THE LAST 4
DAYS! To use such an inflammatory and disgusting phrase to refer to any human being, let alone the President of the United States is repugnant and speaks volumes about the person you are.
For what it's worth, thank you. You've made it clear, beyond the shadow of a doubt, why the North won the Civil War (also in 1865). Here's wishing you a far more enlightened new year.
car -
Then perhaps Obama should treat all Americans equally instead of favoring blacks and Mexicans over the rest of the country. Evidently, you do not understand that racism is a two-way street, it is not just caucasians who can be racist, Obama is a huge one.
There is also nothing racist about getting the financial matters of this country in order - whether liberals choose to think so or not. We cannot continue to pay for the entitlements at the current rates.
Boehner says, “Fiscal cliff deal up to Senate leaders”
This is a typical Boehner tactic. He can't close a deal so he passes the buck.
John Boehner has not passed a single bill since speaker. He is lousy at his job.
Say what you want about Nancy. She could close a deal. She got bills passed.
Boner can't get anything done with his own party. He is as useful as teats on a bull!
why do you post..you have nothing of substance to say..just a waste of space
Why is so hard to get everyone to agree if we take in more revenue that the revenue be targeted to pay down the deficit versus to add dollars to the budget?
Sorry, but it makes no sense to give the government more revenue when they have proven they can't manage the income. Anyone who thinks we should just add tax revenue and not make busget cuts is not real bright. I don't make more than $250K a year, but I a have a brain and realize just because it would not effect me does not make it a great idea to raise taxes on the top 1 or 2%.
I don't know what Obama and Reid was thinking that these Republicans in Congress would actually negotiate in good faith with them. Let's go off the cliff then they can go running to their dad Grover Norquist why taxes went up.