Looks like Grover's number has dropped to 21 ....

Twenty-one Republicans voted against the bill.

Maybe a few more will grow a pair and vote the way their constituents want!

Not necessarily, Layton. The 21 may have voted no regardless. These may be 21 who are absolutely against any tax hikes whatsoever. Of course you could be right. I would like to know who the 21 are then we may get a better idea as to which way the wind blows with them. Are they tea bangers or are they just Conservatives who did in fact sign Grover's pledge and are not willing to compromise. At the end of the day it almost doesn't matter as the president will veto it should it appear on his desk. I think this was just more of our money being wasted on grandstanding and a way to run the clock down. I think Boehner's strategy is going to backfire on him and I just hope we get to see it in all its glory!

'Dog & pony show'? LOL. An excellent description. It's all GOP symbolic position taking, no substance at all.

DOA - dead on arrival - for the Senate where Democrats are in charge. American political system of checks and balances working its magic. The GOP majority in the Hose has no chance of imposing ts majority tyranny on America.

BTW, the a margin of 215-209 is not even majority. Speaker Boehner has no control of its own ranks. A simple majority is 218 votes. Epic failure by Boehner, the worse speaker of the House in US history.

Maybe a few more will grow a pair and vote the way their constituents want!

Layton,

Are you as fatigued as I am with this bull@!$%# posturing?

As an American, this fiscal cliff fiasco is downright embarrassing!

A clear and concise message was sent on 11.6.12, about time House Republican'ts start to recognize it!

Time to cut defense...

But this news piece says:

The approved spending legislation replaces automatic cuts called sequestration -- which include heavy slashes to the defense budget

The military-industrial complex still has total control over the right-wing-nuts in Congress. They would rather give corproate welfare to defense contractors and weapons manufactirers to create new weapons to destroy innocent people around the world than to make bread and butter to feed hungry Americans who can't afford lobbyists and can't afford to make campaign donations to these right-wingers.

Epic falure by Speaker Borhner, the worst Speaker ever.

CNN Poll (12/20/2012):

53% of people, including 22% of Republicans, said the GOP's views and policies are too extreme. The number is up dramatically from previous years. In 2010, fewer than 40% thought the party was too extreme.
57% consider the Democrats to be main stream and only 37% see them as extreme.
61% of Republicans would accept raising taxes on the wealthy in order to avoid the "fiscal cliff."
http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2012/12/20/cnn-poll-are-gop-policies-too-extreme/?cid=sf_twitter

Feisty, I know I am! I have also stopped looking at comments to articles pertaining to guns or the Sandy Hook massacre. There are people in this country that are downright evil and rotten. Anyway, I am taking a two week sabbatical to anything electronic(except t.v and cell phone), so you, Layton, Mickey, BlackCat, Fox, miss piggy, Al, Bali Bob,kaybee, chilled, Dennis, jodi, bayllie, SeekingSanity, Steeler, Bruce, and I know I am forgetting many, but you know I adore you all! So, Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to you all! May we all give blessings that we will be with our loved ones. To the families of the 26, may the love of friends and family get you through at this time especially. My heart breaks and brings tears to my eyes imagining the pain you all have. It should not be this way. Peace.

Christmas is what we the People have had in mind; but

Cliff-mess is what the GOP wants to push us into.

We have thought that We The Voters have made our decisions in November, but these GOP looney tunes have not learned anything from their triple losses....in the Senate and House races, and in presidential election as well.

These people really are amazing. The House of Representatives is the furthest thing from.

By itself, up or down vote to extend the Payroll Tax Cuts. By itself, up or down vote to extend/make permanent the existing tax rates for the 1st $250k of earned income for 100% of tax payers.

The President expressly stated at the end of 2010, ran on, and decisively won on the letting the upper end tax rates expire. Sequestration was a lawful consequence of broader inaction by the Debt Commission, let them take effect.

This stuff isn't rocket science.

No one can and/or should speak about Reagan w/o O'Neil. No one can and/or should speak about Clinton w/o Gingrich. No one can and/or should speak about President Obama w/o Boehner. It has not been the Presidency of Obama that has been the issue with the Country, but the inept, childish, leaderless, foolish and petty House of Representatives, specifically under the helm of one John Boehner, period.

The vast majority of the GOP appear NOT to be Legislators. Governing is an action they don't understand. They are divisive, epitome of partisan and represent the classic definition of "moochers" they they constantly portray on all others. They sit around, spending more energy looking for a mic and a camera and memorizing the days talking points, mooching off of the Public dime and add nothing but sh*t to the discourse.

I am so tired with these people!

Anyway, I am taking a two week sabbatical to anything electronic

You are a wise woman AG! ☺

I wish you the Merriest of Christmas's and a Happy, Healthy & Prosperous 2013!

I too will be scarcer the next few weeks, my amazing daughter came home last night and we have some serious mother/daughter bonding time scheduled!

Peace be with you GF!

Sarge,

I love polls and I believe they are very useful and DO reflect the public opinion and should be used by Congress, not as a final decision but a guide. Sometimes the polls show that the public may need to be better informed on the policy.

Plan B:

– Cuts to food stamps that could knock millions of low-income Americans out of the program

– Cuts to Meals on Wheels, a program that delivers meals to seniors or other individuals who are unable to prepare their own food allowing them to stay in their own home

– Cuts funding to health exchanges that will be created under Obamacare and funding for Medicaid included in the same law

– Cuts to the Dodd-Frank financial reform law that will yield no cost savings, but will make bailouts of big banks more likely

– Denying the Child Tax Credit to the parents of American children, if the parents are undocumented immigrants.

Breaking:

There will be no vote tonight

Boehner could not get the votes

I see the House just cancelled the vote on Plan B until tomorrow, which means the Republicans don't have the votes. Close congress down, all Senators and Representatives should go home, let Obama go to Hawaii. Let's take this whole thing up next year under a new Congress.

Now that the Boehner's nuts are in the clothes wringer, I hope that Nancy raffles-off the opportunity to give the crank its first full turn and gives the money to charity. Democracy at work!

Hey, Dennis, Columbus, Ohio who writes:

Breaking:

There will be no vote tonight

Boehner could not get the votes

Boehner...epic failure...the worst speaker. Thanks for the update, Dennis.

Boehner could not get the votes

Couldn't happen to a BIGGER @!$%#!

So much for all his bravado and cock walking yesterday!

So Boehner shelves it because of lack of votes! Why am I not surprised. Didn't those clowns listen to the voters in November? You know, the ones that voted the President a second term. Apparently not. If we go over the cliff, which it looks like we will, this will be on their backs. 2014 can't get here fast enough.

Boehner has wasted TWO full days on this with nothing to
show to the Whitehouse, the Democrats or the voters.

Only 10 days for the Republicans to save face and help
the American people and businesses.

Cantor said ... we will be back after Christmas, if needed !!

I just saw a clip of Eric Cantor walking out of the vote with that creepy grin, being asked by a reporter if there will be another vote tonight:

Cantor: No

Reporter: Will there be a vote tomorrow?

Cantor: No

What the reporter should have asked him is why he has that creepy, @!$%#-eating grin on his face, and what he thought was so funny.

This is almost as pathetic as watching that ever-so-clever McConnell fillibuster his own bill. Neither Boehner nor McDufus seem to know the first thing about getting legislation passed. The've taken the party of NO to the party of nevuh.

They are making a mockery of the wishes of WE THE PEOPLE..... because of a guy named Grover.

Hey, Mickey, NY #1.21

Cantor is a joke....

Can'tor is a little GOPeep who can't

His slogan - No, We Can't.

Can you believe that the Tea Potty put these clowns in power in November 2010? Sometimes democracy can be hijacked by morons.

And what the GOTP don't seem to have the intelligence to understand is now they really ARE totally SCREWED because they REFUSE to do what the public has DEMANDED they do, NOT what Norquist demands.

GOTP - you're answerable to US, not Norquist!

Dennis, you and I both know that a lot of things are put in bills knowing that they will, or should be, negotiated by changes (amendments) prior to being resolved in a joint committee reconciliation and those changes voted on by both the Senate and House. My point is the House and Senate should have started doing this months ago, but both sides were worried about the election. It is up to the House and Senate to pass tax and spending bills not the House and President, if the President don't like it he can veto it and give his reasons why he vetoed it, then Congress can vote to over ride the veto or make changes. Put everything out there for all to see what is and isn't being discussed and who is recommending what.

Dennis - I daresay they will be back after the holidays absent several republicans.

That sound that you hear is the republicon party falling into the abyss of irrelevancy.

See ya.

Fiesty, long time no see. Merry Christmas. Now about those jackasses, the Teapubs, they have become the biggest joke, jerks, etc., in the history of our nation. I'm so sick of their BS. They are ruining our nation, and I call them traitors to America.

Feisty and Alaska Girl ...

Are you as fatigued as I am with this bull@!$%# posturing?

I swear all they do is change the color of their ties! The rhetoric is the same and NEVER changes. When do they ever listen to their constiutents?

AG - Merriest of Holidays to you sweet girl! I hope Santa brings you all that you want! May you be surrounded by the love of your family and have a heart full of joy! <3 (can't figure out the heart thing, Feisty!)

A party in disarray.

Sarge,

Republicans are the ones that several months ago wanted to do this after the election because they believed that if they waited till after the election they would be dealing with a lame duck president and a Senate that would soon be Republican controlled.

Once they allow the negations open then all the lobbies and special interest will get involved.

Members have been advised that the House will return "when needed" before the end of the year.

Greet your Republican Congress person at the airport.... and Keep them there until they get their damn act together.

LOL.....Did Boehner the pro-lifer just abort his pregnancy named "Plan-B?"

I think Cantor just pulled a coup (you know he wants that job) against the old dog Boehner, come January 3, 2013, Boehner will be shown the floor, oops, I mean door.....LOL!!!

Boehner is pregnant by the Mad Hatter and knows he can't get Plan B over the counter. He will step over the curb rather than make a deal with House Democrats now - so that he can remain Speaker of the House in the January Vote. Otherwise (he is making it clear), he'll seek an abortion (duh, or a razor blade and a length of rope!).

I placed a call to Mr. Cantor's office today and gave the woman answering his phone an earful. I detailed WHY he was wrong and how he is in violation of his Congressional Oath of Office when he places a "pledge" to Grover Norquist ahead of his Oath to Uphold the Constitution as well as there being PLENTY of bloat, fraud and waste in the DOD budget that can be trimmed EASILY without putting our troops or our ability to defend our nation at risk. I then told her that I grew up IN THE AIR FORCE with a career AF Father. I pointed out that the majority of the people in this Congressional district are NOT millionaires and ARE middle class - that eliminating the Child Tax credits would HURT his constituents.

So...How long until we can vote Boehner & Cantor out of office?

Both of these political parties are screwing the American people. Both parties support free trade which is the main reason why our manufacturing jobs are shipped overseas. Sorry to break it to everyone, but it is the only way manufacturing companies can survive when the average American worker is 10 to 20 times more than the cost of a worker overseas. The jobs that were shipped abroad will never return. This has destroyed the middle class and has permanently ruined our economy. We play fair with a country like China that does everything it can to screw us (manipulate its currency, places high protectionist tariffs on imported goods). All of these "representative crooks" should be tried for treason for what they have done to our country. BTW, they should also be solely responsible for repaying our national debt.

They can't even pass their own plan. They're wasting our time and our money.

Vote every republican out of every office every chance you get!

Ahahahahaha!

I said it before and I'll say it again!

The only people Republicans hate worse than Democrats is... other Republicans!

They can't even come together to make Obama look bad! Ahahahahahaha!

The reason Boehner did not have the votes is because what few spending cuts Boehner got were heavily weighted in the future instead of now. The spending cuts in 2011 were a mirage that the Republicans fell for and they are not interested in falling for that crap again.

Every time the Republicans do this, the cuts somehow never happen.

What a tremendous waste of time... thank you, GOP, for once again showing us that you are incapable of doing one single god damn thing.

But I have to hand it to you, at least Boner didn't filibuster his own bill like his buddy McConnell. I guess you can consider that an improvement.

Hah!. Hah!

I told all you white-racist-gun-nut Republicans and you crazy-wacko Teabaggers,

that the REPUBLICAN PARTY was going to END-UP up on the "DUNG HEAP of HISTORY",

and today COMPLETES the PROCESS.

You REPUBLICANS have been CASTICATED, NEUTERED, and GELDED into true SHEEPLINGS,

and you're POWERLESS to STOP US.

With our "Stealth" MUSLIM-MARXIST President RE-Elected, it will be CHILD's PLAY to now

"TAKE AWAY your GUNS and BIBLES" and RE-Install the "OBAMA-SNITCH-LINE", so we can

Keep detailed DOSSIERS and INTELLIGENT FILES on all you TEABAGGERS and REPUBLICANS.

Ain't Life Grand?

That should teach you Teabaggers and Republicans, a "Thing or Two about a Thing or Two"

about Voting in those War-Criminals, George Bush and Dick Cheney in for a Second term.

Paybacks are H#LL

Plus to put MORE SALT on your WOUNDS, Obama was VOTED Again "TIME'S MAN of the YEAR"

This waste of drunken breath is WHO the right wing nuts want to hang their hat on as a LEADER?

Laughing my @!$%#ing ass off at YOU & Agent Orange!

Take Toto (Eric Can't nor won't even try) with you, the loser of the house! lol

The TWO of you jag-off's have wasted enough of OUR time!

Put the ADULTS back in charge!!!

I still believe that the "cliff" is the most non-partisan way for this to happen. It accomplishes many things without lobbyists having a say. It will increase taxes on everyone who lives in this country and should be responsible for paying down the debt. It also will cause cutbacks in government that need to happen, across the board.

Yes, it will hurt, but is necessary, and everyone will feel the pain as they should. After all, we all voted idiots into Congress that originally caused this mess.

The GOPhers are still singing the same old song NO, no, no, no, no, no! After all that hard work they go on vacation. Pitiful, just pitiful.

It makes no difference what the GOP does, neither side is going to give much, we are going to go over the fiscal cliff. BTW, some of you have posted saying the public spoke on 6 Novemeber, the GOP did not learn anything. Guess what, the votes on 6 Novemeber hardly changed a damn thing. We still have a congress that cannot come together on a single issue. We the People are screwed as long as both sides will not talk to one another and see what they are doing to the country. We the People need to make our voices heard by our so-called representatives, quit bickering at one another, send your bickering to Washington via what ever delivery system you favor, email, snail mail or the telephone.

WOW ALL...you just got a perfect example of how ineffective this House of Representatives has been.I remember in the past the House and Senate working thru the night and on holiday to get important policies and bills passed.Wow.I hope you all out there take note of this.This is a perfect example of democracy inaction.We all are NOT getting our money's worth no matter what party is there.Calling a recess 5 days before Christmas means we have a House that does not consider the American people even worthwhile.They need to be fired....all of them.

Time to petition to add a new word to the dictionary: "boehner": n. an act in which somebody holding a normally influential or respected position reveals their utter incompetence. e.g. "Epic fail, dude. The speaker just pulled a total boehner."

Now THAT is embarassing. When you can't negotiate so you pull out a joke of a bill to make it look like you're being reasonable... but your party won't even agree to a joke of a bill because it raised taxes only on the top 0.05%? THAT... is embarassing. Are you guys finally feeling bad for Boehner, yet? I told you, the man is smart, he's intelligent, and he's trying to save a dying party. He must feel like the great Papa Bush, watching his son toilet the country.

"Lacking support, House pulls last-ditch cliff fix, heads home."

Latest in a never-ending series of blunders by The Gang That Couldn't Shoot Think Straight.

This is pathetic!! Those sounds you hear are the founding fathers spinning in their graves. It will not be until the Ultra Red States fell the pain that we finally get a House of Representatives that does more than represent a @!$%#ing moon of Jupiter!!!

Why the hell is anyone going home? They DO NOT deserve the break! Break from what? Doing NOTHING?!The Republican party is a joke! They do not care what the majority of the country thinks! They don't care what the world thinks!! They are still in denial about the election and continuing the same obstruction they've done for the past four years! I can't wait to vote them out of office in the mid terms! This is ridiculous!

Party of NO..they should get coal for X-mas and...."NO" X-mas party!

Should be a wall with all the Republican names on it that they turned their backs on the will of the American people in support of the wealthy. Traitors to our country. Is there any legal way to have these Republicans removed from office due to failure to represent the people?? All the while, they went home for the Hollidays and the debt gets worse and worse.

Dump the Republicans in 2014

So much for voter's representation. Go on and enjoy your Christmas vacation on taxpayer's time you worthless clowns. In fact, take the whole next year off! See you all on 2014.

Hard to believe they are heading home. The doors should be barred until they hammer out some sort of agreement on something. And for sure their paychecks should cease until then.

Is it just me or did the article above change? First it was about a vote and now they're going home? NICE! NOT!

But it was ultimately brought down by conservative Republicans reluctant to raise tax rates on any Americans, even the nation's top earners.

Hey Teabaggers! You've earned yourself yet another point downwards in your already abysmal approval rating! Way to stand up for the citizens of this country! Hope Grover bought you all something lovely because the American people sure as sh!t aren't getting anything thanks to your efforts!

Dennis, There is plenty of blame to go around. I agree, Congress and the President both wanted to push this past the election, and now it is going to bite all in the rear end. I really hope that the House takes no further action until after the New Year. I really laugh at all the liberals on here that think this is a great thing and is going to work in their favor. It's not going to. We will go over the cliff, the world will not end and no one is going to die from today's action. Obama does not want to be President, he wants to be King or Supreme ruler and feel he should get everything he wants.

As I said before, let the tax cuts expire, there were only TEMPORARY anyway. All the left wingers think the Clinton tax rates were so good, then let's take them back there. I am willing to pay a little more in taxes, remember it was VP Biden that said something like "it is patriotic to pay more in taxes".

I heard Grover Norquist gave his approval to John Bohner's Plan B... and yet Plan B will not pass the House???? Hmmmm, early Jan is the election for the House Speaker. I wonder if John is trying to save his job or are his party Lobbysts threatening?

At this point, I'd rather deal with the so called "fiscal Cliff" rather than deal with the GNOP. It's game over for Boehnor and his cronies. They lost on all fronts in the last election, their approval ratings are dismal and they are making a last ditch effort to appease their corporate masters and grover norquist. He can't even rally his shrinking republican buds to get behind him any more. Pour yourself a double johnny, it's going to be bumpy ride for you going over the cliff...........sniffle, sniffle.

thturd

I doubt that being the Speaker is doing his career much good. If I was him, I would have left the post a couple of years ago because it is futile.

61% of Republicans would accept raising taxes on the wealthy in order to avoid the "fiscal cliff."

That's an excellent point, Dennis. Rank and file Republicans ought to pressure their 'leaders' to work for them for once. The only thing that motivates the GOP members of the House is the fear of losing elections.

Republicans, call your representatives and tell them to stop d---ing around if they want to keep their jobs. There are plenty of people willing to step in and take their places, with all that time off and salary and benefits most of the rest of us can only dream of.

Then, if they don't do as you request, VOTE THEM OUT.

The GOP appears to be on a suicide mission intending to take the American people down with it.

Ithink the funniest thing ever would have been if the dems voted for the thing to bring the vote to the floor and forced the gop to vote against it on the floor. Man that could have been a laugh. This house is a joke. They don't even know they are the ones that are supposed to initiate this work.

kaybeetoys

This is a rhetorical question.

Why shouldn't your taxes go up too, you live in this country and take advantage of it's blessings?

I'm working tomorrow.....they should, too.

Get these clowns back to Washington to fix their mess.

.

They are willing to take us over the fiscal cliff cause they are all wearing parachutes. We'll see who gets the last laugh next election.

Oh, btw, wasn't there another country in the 20th century where the radicals swore an oath to an unelected official... and the world paid dearly didn't they.

Maybe the world really is coming to an end. The republicans just want to go home to be with family.

witchrunner: You gotta' be kidding!!! Business is showing record profits. What kind of a rube are you? Or are you paid to spread mis-information and carry the piss bucket of your masters.

So, all you middle class folks, just be prepared to contribute more towards your benefits, work harder for no greater pay, or even less pay.

witchrunner, this has been happening since the last conservative administration took office in 2001. Plus the American taxpayer paid to socialize the losses!! We've been living this way for 12 years now. What's the big deal? More of the same. Just like the public sector workers in Wisconsin! Same ol' tactics, same ol' results, thanks to conservative leadership.

Meet the cliff. Embrace the cliff. Love the cliff.

@JW, they are still working, they have offices in the respected States. They will still be working on options, just nothing can be done soon enough.

The Political process does not have to start with them either. The Senate could offer up a proposal, vote on it in their House and then send over to the House of Reps, who can be recalled for the purpose of a vote.

The President could also figure out that he has some people that do not agree with him, adjust him proposal (kind of the basis of negotiations and really it is in his job description as "Executive").

Sad part, many of the American voters are placing it on Congress, the responsibility to arbitrate with the President, when it is actually designed the other way around.

I am just wondering, where is the diplomacy at? Clinton ran into a stubborn Congress, and got the job done.

Which business " blearyeyed " ? ALL business ? What about small business ? Your generalizations show that you truly don't know.

The GOP is useless. For Christmas I wish that they all get voted out of office and not return until they can display some semblance of human decency and compassion. That alone would take some kind of a miracle!! Why even bother coming back after Christmas?? You are incapable of getting the job done. Stay home.

(Ahem!) Actually, Swallow, if I'm reading you right, that guy was elected... they did pick him and give him the job, legally.

Now, it's true that he built his power base by attacking trade unions as Communist stooges. It's also true that he made a point, very early in his political career, of enlisting the support of his country's wealthiest men, all of them big industrialists.
(Sound a little familiar? No? Let me sing you another verse.)

This canny fellow used social divisions and religious prejudice expertly, as well as stirring up resentment of different ethnic groups and/or nationalities (they called them 'races' back then), in order to convince his people that they were under attack, and that only he and his loyal deputies could effectively mobilize the nation to resist them!
(Oh, you know the words to this song, dont'cha?)

Then, shortly after his election, crisis! A major building with enormous symbolic value to the nation was destroyed by fire- allegedly set by 'terrorists'! A frightened and shocked country quickly granted this man the unlimited 'emergency' authority he asked for- and their march to Damnation began that way, with hungry, frustrated and fearful people rallying against a (non- existent) 'threat' from 'others'.

A big difference is that, that guy didn't have f****n' nukes available to him. A President Perry or a President Santorum would. Cheerful thought for your holidays, innit?

tjohn... Question, the current tax CUTS being debated where put into place under WHICH Administration? Oh yeah, a Conservative...

And from 2007 to 2009, there wasn't enough Conservatives in D.C. to pass gas... so there goes your theory of 12 years... we have been under a Liberal Administration for 4 years and all we have heard is "it's their fault"... first rule of leadership (to leader) YOUR fault... now own it, like every President before.

Clinton inherited a financial mess, had GOP control in BOTH Houses... and ran in to budget approval issues, yet he got it done and got credit for it, too... even though it was the negotiating that did.

So for anyone claiming "Clinton left the Office is great shape", only way you can apply the same logic is to point on who really ins't getting the job done, again.

kaybeetoys

Republicans, call your representatives and tell them to stop d---ing around if they want to keep their jobs. There are plenty of people willing to step in and take their places, with all that time off and salary and benefits most of the rest of us can only dream of.

Unfortunately the districts are so rigged that it is almost impossible to get those republicans out...what a sad day in our history

ljstauth

"Sure hope the Welfare bunch appreciate it."

Surely by now, you do realize the election is over and Citizen Romney lost, n'est ce pas?

Time for some fresh rhetoric from the right wrong wing. s'il vous plait. Your attempts at polarizing invective have become stale as a 4-day-old baguette.

67:

Micheal Moore WANTS his taxes raised.

What woman are you talking about? You must excuse me because I haven't heard this story. Why do I think this is coming from Beck or Limbaugh?

When will you understand that Obama has increased the debt by a miniscule amount - the budget is honoring the debt run up by previous admins and supporting programs started by previous admins. Cell phones was Reagan, upgraded to include cell phones by GWB. What other lies would you like debunked?

BTW, govt is not run like a household - more stupidity spread by TPers who don't know their bunghole from a hole in the ground. They're not politicians and they don't understand govt.

It just amazes me to see how much Republicans hate the United States of America.

Republicans only prove to everyone what lowlife POSs they are.

And again Boehner tries to screw the whole thing up in the last minute. Plan B my butt, it should be called Plan F for fail. Then after that fails, instead of going back to the talks with the White House, Boehner goes home for the Holidays?????? If I have to work through the holiday's, he better damn well get the house in order and work through it as well to come to an agreement with the White House. He has had how many years to work on a plan and he waits till the last minute, drops an F bomb called plan B and tries to hail marry it through, doesn't work and his solution is go home for Christmas. Wow, and the Republicans think he is a smart choice for speaker of the House????

I have a bill I'd like to have presented for a vote - since Boehner and the TP'ers can't seem to get any action on theirs:

"Be it resolved that in honor of their extended disservice to the citizens of the United States of America, the GOP be formally renamed and referred to as the ICP - Incompetent Clown Posse."

The Breeze ...

Witchrunner... spot on. The Dems do not understand what 16.5 trillion in debt means

Really? We had it under control under Clinton and we're trying to now. Your party of SPEND and pay later (WMD - Bush - Cheney - Haliburton) did this country NO favors! Getting out of the hole the GOP put us in is VERY understood by the Democrats. Wake up and realize the GOP is the problem and created the damn thing!

"After a cancelled vote on a contingency bill and a dramatic defeat for Republican leadership, United States House members will head home for the Christmas holiday without legislative action to halt a mix of automatic spending cuts and tax increases set to take effect in just 11 days."

That's not really true, because the House already passed a bill to extend the tax cuts for everyone - That bill is sitting on Harry Reid's desk, and he refuses to even allow debate in the Democratic controlled Senate.

Personally, I think Congress and the President should do what they do best - NOTHING.

Let the 'sequester' cuts begin, and let the tax cuts expire - they will merely return to what they were under Clinton, when everyone seemed to think they were 'fair'.

History has shown that the sooner we start 'austerity' during a debt crisis, the less the pain will be in the long run.

The Republicans in the House ran on cutting spending and reducing the Deficit, and they won decisively, so the American people have spoken (sorry for using Obama's rhetoric).

Besides, it's not really a 'fiscal cliff', it's more like a gentle 'slide' until the economy stabilizes.

Harry Reid wasn't going to let Plan B come to a vote in the senate anyway, so what does it matter whether the House passed Plan B ?

tjohn... Question, the current tax CUTS being debated where put into place under WHICH Administration? Oh yeah, a Conservative...

ljsauth, yes, and that same conservative leadership that gave us the tax breaks also started two unfunded wars, unfunded Medicare Part D, and an unfunded socialized bailouts of the losses on Wall Street for outrageously bad behavior, unfunded nation building, and doubled the size of government. So what's your point?? That conservatives are fiscal hawks and their record reflects effective management our economy? Do I hear you saying that "trickle down economics" doesn't work? But hey, just blame the Dems and convince everyone that they "own" it. News flash - most people aren't buying it -- based on personal experiences, not rhetoric!

"Meet the cliff. Embrace the cliff. Love the cliff"

I love the panic from you folks. My family is one of the 'pay my fair share' households according to what BO has spouted about for 4 years......I can handle the economic aftermath of everything expiring and auto cuts going into effect and it would be worth it to watch all the weazle democrats scurrying for cover.

LOL!

Total incompetence from Bonehead and the republicans!

Why shouldn't your taxes go up too, you live in this country and take advantage of it's blessings?

Personally, I am not opposed to paying higher taxes. But why should I pay a larger percentage of my income in taxes than a multi-millionaire or a billionaire pays? If people like Romney paid the same percentage I pay, I would not have an issue with his effective tax rate.

The uber-wealthy get a lot more benefit from our economic system/ tax structure than the other 98% receive. They can well afford to contribute more too.

Ignorant representation of, by, and for, the religiously happy ignorant. Until the people in their districts learn some sense, these illustrations of raw stupidity will continue. Tea Party folk can't help it. They view everything, Science, other peoples morals, formal education, different ethnicity's, and political governance through their personal prism of scriptural dogma. HALLELUJAH! CAN I GIT AH AMEN HEAH? SOMEBODY KIVER LUCY OVER THAR! HALLELUJAH! SHE"S AH FIXING TO COME...... THRU! HALLELUJAH!

As a youngster growing up in the south I never thought, while listening to the congregation singing "steal away" that, "some day yonder" It would come to mean, "git to congress and steal hit all away from everybody else".

Gwaddamn!!! Merry Christmas and happy New year everyone.

breeze: It's useless talking to these people. They have no interest in the truth. They actually believe that the rich people who say "raise my taxes" actually mean it. It never dawned on them that they could be lying. Of course, it never dawned on them that if they meant what they said, they'd just have been voluntarily paying more taxes all along. I suppose blearyeyed is looking forward to his taxes going up so he can spend more money, even though he would have less in his pockets.

blearyeyed: How is taxing the top 2 % going to help you out? Have you donated more of your money to the government? If not, how come? Does it only help if it is someone else's money?

Right on kaybee and clwyd (as usual). When the economy stabilizes, if all rates need to increase - then we'll address the long term debt as need forces. But why force hardship upon hardship by using all the ways which hurt people and the economy the most - first. Social security shouldn't even be part of the conversation, and raising the Medicare participation age doesn't save much money for the pain it may cause.

I am grateful for the threat of this "Fiscal Cliff". It will shortly drive the extremists of both parties to the center of the table in perspective of the American people. The American electorate spoke clearly on Nov. 6, 2012. They will not be denied or heads will roll in Congress. I'm not surprised that this lethal game of "Chicken" continues today. I will not be surprised if it continues beyond January 1, despite the havoc it may cause in the financial district (and resulting set-back in our hard-earned gains of economic recovery).

This foolish game will definitely end shortly after the new Congress convenes simply because it must. This nation and the world's economy can not survive another economic plunge into the depths of recession likely to end with the "Greatest Depression". Only a fool would believe otherwise. House Speaker Boehner knows this well. He and Joker Eric Cantor(with that huge painted grin on his face) as well as Cantor's fellow court jesters will soon be swept to the bottom of the deck until 2014 when they are swiftly discarded forever by the electorate.

Their fate is well deserved for the pain and grief they have already placed at the feet of the American people. The great threat of this fiscal cliff will certainly be retroactively reversed. We will overcome the temporary ill effects. There truly is a silver lining in every dark cloud. The despicable acts of today will make it that much easier to throw out the trash in 2014.

The leaders of our country are proving to us all they are NOT leaders, regardless of which side of the aisle they reside politically. I'll bet that the "fiscal cliff" is something that both sides hope happens because it raises taxes on ALL OF US and cuts spending across the board. Austerity in disguise!!! They set us up for this crap last year!!!

Can you say recession?? Or maybe (God help us all) depression!!!

Merry @!$%#ing Christmas!

this is not a victory for the Democrats. People need to follow the money...

... There are plenty of wanna be leaders in the Republican ranks, but few have the ability to reshape a fratured party. Yes, the Republican party will be fractured starting next year, because they play checkers while the White House plays chess... John Boehner save much Republican asses, and these Republican rats will turn on him cometh Jan, 2013. The Republican will loose the majority of the House in approximately 6 years. Sooner if John Bohner is not elected Speaker in Jan, 2013.

I secretly wish President Obama to be a little bit more mean in the coming 2013...

Were these nut cases, Cantor and Boehner , actually re-elected last November? what doe that say about their constituents?

The complete incompetence of the teabag led HoReps is staggering. Their singular desire to dissolve government and IT'S PROTECTIVE REGULATIONS FOR ALL OF US should be as evident as the nose on your face. BONER is a joke and his leadership is abysmal. What we voters should do is require incompetent lawmakers relinquish ALL SALARY AND BENEFITS when they do not work FOR THE AMERICAN PEOPLE, and I do not mean corporate America and their cronies. WE spoke to the obstructionist teabag republicraps this past election and WE DEMAND THEM TO WORK WITH DEMOCRATS TO DO THE BUSINESS OF OUR COUNTRY, HONESTLY!!!!!!!

This is getting to be interesting. I have structured my business affairs so that I am pretty much immune to whatever may happen, and I'm moving my family (wife and 7 year old daughter) to Costa Rica next month, where I will enjoy basking on a nice warm 'La Playa' (beach), so from my perspective, I quote Bill Murray's famous phrase in the movie 'Meatballs', to wit;

"It just doesn't matter".

Freshman lawmaker and public Boehner critic Rep. Tim Huelskamp, R-Kansas, called the measure's defeat “a victory for Republican principles,”

So...what are these republican principles.... principles of defeat....principles of defeating Americans?

Now Christmas is officially over because GOP (Grinch Of Pigotry) has tolen Christmas.

Cliff-Mess will be celebrated in its stead.

Note: Pigotry - to describe GOP controlled House as government by pig, for pigs, of pigs.

So a big bunch of political theatre. Then our "representatives" decide doing nothing is best and go home for the holidays, and then let the measures they made so they'd be forced to agree happen.

Nothing like them making a situation that they thought would force them to make a deal and then deciding "Meh, forget it. Christmas time!".

This is honestly the best we can do? How can anyone see this as a victory?

ROY WILSON-336103, when was the last time you picked up an American history book? Particularly the period shortly before, during and at the end of "The Great Depression". Republican austerity is responsible for the first Democratic American President elected to four consecutive terms. Republican austerity is responsible for a 20 year ban on Republican majority leadership in the United States Congress at that time. History does indeed repeat itself for those that fail to heed it's lessons.

BRAVO TRUE CONSERVATIVES FOR NOT VOTING FOR THIS SELL OUT LEGISLATION!!!!!!
It's about time someone showed some cojones in this government.
We real Americans don't want any of this Liberal/Progressive social and economic justice nonsense.
We don't have a revenue problem, we have a spending problem.
It's just so sad to see the useful idiots on the left submit to willingly to the class-warfare/envy meme.
I just find it so degrading that an alleged American president tells the American people that the best they can aspire to be is middle-class.
Greed isn’t someone wanting to keep more of what they earn, its people demanding a greater share of money that someone else has earned.

House GOP, the ball was in your side of the field and you dropped it. Can't decide on a play at the 11-yard line huddle ...and you doofuses fumble the ball? YOU GUYS SUCK! ...COACH, THROW THE BUMS OUT!

David Puddy ""Meet the cliff. Embrace the cliff. Love the cliff"

Let's sit back, have a nice glass of wine, and enjoy the 'ride'.

I can't wait to see Obama's 'Legacy' in 4 years - Ran the National Debt from $9.986 Trillion at the end of fiscal 2008 to almost $25 Trillion in only 8 years, had the slowest economic growth in 80 years, the highest average Unemployment Rate since FDR, and presided over the collapse of the American economy. He's going to make Jimmy Carter look like a genius.

Obama managed to mess up the economy so bad in his first 4 years that the American voters said - "Let's give him another 4 years to finish the job". At least it will demonstrate that Liberal policies really do NOT work.

Brother, sister, can you spare a dime? Happy days are here again. 14 percent in taxes out of Romney's 22 million a year would be about $3,080,000 in taxes a year. Okay. I earn about $50,000 a year and pay about 30 percent, about $15,000. As a provider with a good income, I'm bringing home about $35,000 for my extended family to live on. The Romney's have a household budget of about $19,000,000 a year. In this area I am considered well paid because the average income is about $16,500. My take home is what the average household with two wage earners brings home. These working people feel that the wealthy are put upon, objects of pity, endangered persons that must enjoy special legal protections to maintain lifestyles that frankly boggle my mind with waste and stupidity. Have you seen the golden palace Trump lives in? I'd like to see his bulldog head sticking out the low door of a dog house. But that's just me. It would take me 61.5 years to earn the $3,080,000 that Romney pays in taxes in one year. And over the course of a lifetime of difficult labor, I would contribute about 30%, $922,500 in taxes. Blah, Blah, Blah. I understand that $3,000,000 or $6,000,000 in taxes is a lot of money for an individual. But at 30% the same rate I pay, they would have to live on $16,000,000 a year. I could make it on that. I could live the rest of my life and keep my family very comfortably with a single dose of $16,000,000 - if I never earned another nickel as long as I live. So no, I could care less how the rich "feel". The rich are different, and I don't really think they need special protections. For example, I hear McAfee is back in the US, stinking up the joint. Blah, blah, blah.

Obama proposes Social Security cuts

20 December 2012

By Patrick Martin

The cuts in Social Security and other critical social programs proposed Tuesday by the Obama White House as part of negotiations with House Speaker John Boehner over the so-called "fiscal cliff" mark a watershed in US social policy.

Obama has publicly proposed to cut future benefits for Social Security recipients, underlining the bipartisan agreement that the working class and the elderly, not Wall Street or the super-rich, must pay for the crisis of American capitalism.

According to press reports Tuesday, the White House counter-offer to Boehner calls for reducing future cost-of-living increases in Social Security benefits by adopting an inflation index that is deliberately distorted to underestimate the amounts that the elderly will have to pay for the essentials of life. The new inflation index, called a "chained" Consumer Price Index, will cut as much as $225 billion in spending over the next ten years, half of that from Social Security recipients and the rest from the pensions of retired federal workers and other benefit payments.

There are other reactionary features of the White House proposal: limiting the expiration of the Bush-era tax cuts to families with incomes above $400,000 a year, up from the longstanding Obama position of $250,000; allowing the partial payroll tax holiday to expire, effectively imposing a two percent tax on the wages of every American worker; and maintaining the 20 percent rate on dividend income, which goes overwhelmingly to the wealthy, instead of allowing it to rise to 39.6 percent as provided for in current law.

Providing $1.2 trillion in tax increases and $1.2 trillion in spending cuts over ten years, the White House proposal embraces the Republican demand for a dollar-for-dollar equivalence between tax increases and spending cuts. This supposed "balance" does not take into account the $1.2 trillion in spending cuts, to be phased in over the next nine years, that were enacted in the August 2011 budget deal between Obama and the House Republicans.

All told, the White House plan would cut $400 billion from spending on federal health care programs, mainly Medicare, $122 billion from Social Security, and another $400 billion from other domestic spending, as well as saving $290 billion in interest costs.

The historical implications of a bipartisan deal on such a basis were spelled out in a New York Times analysis by Eduardo Porter, who wrote: "The truth is that both the president and House Republicans have agreed to shrink a critical part of the government to its smallest in at least half a century. This is regardless of which trillion-dollar proposal gains the upper hand."

The White House has proposed to cut discretionary domestic spending from 3.1 percent of US gross domestic product in 2011 to only 1.7 percent by 2022. House Republicans, using a somewhat different definition, would cut domestic spending from 4.3 percent of GDP to 2.1 percent over the same period.

"To put it in perspective," Porter continued, "this would cut the government's civilian discretionary budget to the smallest it has been as a share of the economy at least since the Eisenhower administration—when a quarter of the population lived under the poverty line, thousands of children still contracted polio each year and fewer than one in 12 Americans older than 25 had a college degree."

In other words, what is being worked out in the talks between Obama and Boehner is nothing less than the terms of a social retrogression of unprecedented dimensions. Using the concocted threat of a December 31 "fiscal cliff," when some $600 billion in tax increases and spending cuts are scheduled to begin because of previous Washington agreements, the representatives of big business, Democratic and Republican, are proposing to begin the dismantling of the social reforms enacted in the 20th century.

The White House decision to propose cuts in future Social Security benefits is of enormous political significance. Social Security has long been characterized as the "third rail" of American politics—touch it and you die. Obama and Boehner are seeking to break this taboo and create a new political framework for imposing brutal austerity measures on working people.

Whatever the immediate outcome of the talks in Washington, whether or not a deal is reached before December 31, the overall direction is clear: entitlement programs like Social Security, Medicare and Medicaid are to be gutted. The only significant area of federal spending will be the military-police agencies required to defend the interests of the financial aristocracy—overseas against foreign rivals and revolutions, at home against the American working class.

http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2012/12/20/pers-d20.html

ROY WILSON-336103

In response to your post 1.104 on this vine ("I'm moving my family... to Costa Rica next month...") please allow me to be the first to wish you bon voyage!

Well, actually, more precisely, owing to your mindset as shown in your posts, make that bon débarras.

Taxing people who make over $250k more won't make a pimple on a bulls ass bit of difference in the national debt. obumbo acts like it is the only way to pay down our debt and he is simply full of @!$%#. It's the SPENDING stupid!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Commonsense101

ROY WILSON-336103, when was the last time you picked up an American history book? Particularly the period shortly before, during and at the end of "The Great Depression". Republican austerity is responsible for the first Democratic American President elected to four consecutive terms. Republican austerity is responsible for a 20 year ban on Republican majority leadership in the United States Congress at that time. History does indeed repeat itself for those that fail to heed it's lessons.

History??? Haven't you noticed, the only history they remember is very recent Democratic, well, maybe a bit about Reagan (but nothing about how he actually governed). 'Shrub'? His legacy went into a black hole, never to be seen or heard again by GOP eyes or ears. To go back to the 20s, you have to be able to read....

ROY WILSON-336103

That's not really true, because the House already passed a bill to extend the tax cuts for everyone - That bill is sitting on Harry Reid's desk, and he refuses to even allow debate in the Democratic controlled Senate.

Absolutely!

I'd like to know just what has the Democrat run Senate done for the past 2 years? What proposals, debate or compromise have they offered.

Hairy Reed has two votes for everything sent to the Senate:

1. Dead on arrival

2. Table it

We real Americans can see who the real Party of No is.

No budget for 1,331 days.

No effort to compromise.

No debate or committee.

No offer of any spending cuts or entitlement/social program reforms.

Yep, the Democrats, the real Party of No!

Does anyone on the vine work in the airline industry? If so, maybe you could help me with this question:

When Speaker Boehner travels home for the recess with his pig (you know, the one he keeps trotting out with a different shade of lipstick, under the guise of putting forth a plan), does he have the option to pay full fare for the pig's seat, or will Porky be confined to the baggage compartment?

ROY WILSON-336103:

This is getting to be interesting. I have structured my business affairs so that I am pretty much immune to whatever may happen, and I'm moving my family (wife and 7 year old daughter) to Costa Rica next month, where I will enjoy basking on a nice warm 'La Playa' (beach),

Wow,that's quite a move; all the way to Costa Rica from your Mom's basement.

Should you ever find yourself jetting around The Continent, drop by for a visit; I'll be at my Villa in the South of France. It's the one with the Ferarri out front.

gcooper8,

Costa Rica must be the only place in the world to remain standing tall as the rest of the world crumbles under economic collapse. I have a feeling that all of that planning and all of that money, despite abandoning his native country, will likely hold it's value as toilet paper while the rest of us must resort to corn cobs or fallen leaves. I can just imagine the look of pride as such a man stoops with his trousers crumpled at his ankles. He can run, he cannot hide.

Merry CLIFF-MESS..everyone....courtesy of Boehner's EPIC FAILURE.

I honestly believe that, void of any policies and the will to do anything for the benefit of the nation, the President and the Senate Democrats would love to go “over the cliff” and allow the auto fix to take effect. This is the only way they can get everyone to contribute, through tax increases, to the recovery and make significant cuts to the WH spending binge. The President, innocent that he would like everyone to think he is, can blame the Republicans for it. Very clever Mr President!!

Commonsense101

I would count some of us with corn cobs and leaves as lucky. Pity those in the evergreen or redwood forests, with nothing but bark, pine cones, or (shudder) bark.

Pigotry

"Merry Cliff-Mess." I like it. I really, really like it!

Teasuckers purse their lips and swoon as the rich sing:

We are your
Overlooahahahoords.

thturd

Yes, Norquist did say that he would not consider plan b a violation of the pledge. Shows how little power Norquist really has.

What I said earlier is the concensus that was building on the republican side. They don't see spending cuts now, just another "framework" for tax cuts to take place.

The only real cut I heard from the Obama side was changing the formula for COLA's. While this changing the formula for COLA's would help the debt problem, it may be more harmful to those dependent on SS years down the road when it creates a snowball effect of cuts that become out of control just like the increase is snowballing today.

The real solution is increasing the size of the base being taxed. There is only two ways to do that. Have an economy that is expanding at a rate that creates far more jobs than people entering the workforce AND increase the number of people who pay taxes. I mean geez, if we think the rich should pay 4 points higher, why can't the rest of us pay a minimum of 1% or 2% After say our number of exemption times the exemption amount?

This would eliminate a whole lot of people that only will work only until they must pay federal taxes and quit to live off.

You have no idea how hard it is to stand in a checkout line and watch people who obviously make less than you do have a shopping cart with steaks, bacon, ribs, pork and then whip out a food stamp card. I watched one the other day pay for $70 in food, and then hand a $50 to the cashier for the couple of dollars the Food stamp card wouldn't cover for.

I think that if I am making ends meat by making pasta with half the meat in the sauce, then they should be able to afford to pay some taxes if they have a $50 in their pocket when I'm luck to have a couple of 20's in a week.

• WORST HOUSE of REPS EVER!

Proof positive that Republicans CAN NOT govern!

Roy Wilson, glad to hear you're moving. Please don't take your computer with you. Why don't you go out and play with the wildlife while you're there. You may make a few friends...

"…The Libor scandal has laid bare the rampant criminality in the operations of the world's major banks and exposed the fact that the so-called “free market” is rigged by the most powerful banks and corporations for their own profit…"

UBS Libor-rigging settlement exposes pervasive bank fraud

By Andre Damon
20 December 2012

UBS, the largest bank in Switzerland, announced Wednesday it had agreed to a $1.5 billion settlement with regulators in three countries, admitting that between 2005 and 2010 it intentionally manipulated the London Interbank Offered Rate (Libor), the most important global interest rate.

A report issued by the British Financial Services Authority (FSA) on the settlement provides voluminous documentation, in the form of emails and instant message exchanges, of the falsification on virtually a daily basis of UBS' submissions to the British Bankers’ Association (BBA), which oversees Libor.

The settlement comes six months after a $450 million deal between regulators and Barclays, the fourth-largest global bank, to settle charges that it similarly manipulated Libor.

UBS and Barclays are among some 20 major financial institutions under investigation for colluding to manipulate the benchmark rate, including HSBC, Royal Bank of Scotland, Deutsche Bank, Credit Suisse, Bank of Tokyo-Mitsubishi, Sumitomo Mitsui, JPMorgan Chase, Citigroup and Bank of America…

….The settlements with both Barclays and UBS—expected to be followed by similar deals with other banks under investigation—enable the banks to pay a small fraction of their revenues and avoid any criminal charges. Not a single leading executive at either bank has been named or indicted for his or her role in defrauding the world.

In the case of UBS, the US Justice Department made a point of not criminally charging UBS itself, instead obtaining a guilty plea only from its Japanese subsidiary. Only two mid-level UBS employees have been criminally charged.

This is in keeping with the policy of shielding the global financial elite pursued by the US and governments around the world since the Wall Street crash of September 2008. That meltdown, triggered by reckless and illegal speculative activities, plunged the world economy into slump and devastated the living standards of tens of millions of workers in the US and internationally. Yet not a single leading banker has been prosecuted, let alone jailed…

…The report cited specific exchanges, such as an email from September 18, 2008 in which a UBS trader told a broker at another firm: “if you keep [the Libor rate] unchanged today… I will f___g do one humongous deal with you… Like a 50,000 buck deal, whatever… I need you to keep it as low as possible… if you do that… I’ll pay you, you know, 50,000 dollars, 100,000 dollars… whatever you want ... I’m a man of my word.”…

…On Wednesday, the Financial Times published internal emails at the New York Fed from 2008 discussing the rigging of Libor by banks.

The president of the New York Fed at the time wasTimothy Geithner, Obama’s treasury secretary.

http://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2012/12/20/libo-d20.html

usa1967, what you fail to understand is that it doesn't matter if raising the taxes on the top 2% does or doesn't make a big difference in our budget. What does matter is that it'll bring about some fairness in the system. It'll bring about the situation where the top 2% are paying the same percentage of taxes as the middle class are. And I don't know about you, but I do know that it'll make me and a lot of other middle classers feel a lot better.

Our only hope to get America back on track is to replace the tea-baggers. They are afraid of the rich who bought them and will never risk their lives by removing the tax breaks for the rich that the rich paid so many millions to the Republicans to get.

Do you think the rich paid all those millions buying Republicans over the years without demanding their monies' worth?

I still believe that the "cliff" is the most non-partisan way for this to happen. It accomplishes many things without lobbyists having a say. It will increase taxes on everyone who lives in this country and should be responsible for paying down the debt. It also will cause cutbacks in government that need to happen, across the board.

Raising taxes and cutting government spending is the wrong thing to do during a recession. And, across the board cuts don't make sense. Not every program is over-funded. Do we really want to cut programs and agencies that protect our health and safety, such as the CDC and the FBI? Should every budget item in the defense budget be cut by 10%, or should some be cut by less and some by more?

Goodbye Boehner! I don't want to see your face until after New Years. By then, we shall have a few less Republicans in congress. Over the cliff we go, and people will want to throw even more Republicans out of office.

I couldn't count the number of Christmas holidays I have had to work in my long career to get an important job done. That's what having the responsibility means sometimes. These slime tea bags can get their asses back on the job and take care of business.

The Republicans are such losers right now.

The blood is in the water.

And Boehner's water wings just got punctured.

Cantor's got his grin going.

"Oh, the shark has pretty teeth, dear.

And he shows them, pearly white.

Eric Cantor has the switchblade.

To use when your back's in sight!"

Mayan apocalypse won't save you now!

A ha ha ha ha!

JoeCal

usa1967, what you fail to understand is that it doesn't matter if raising the taxes on the top 2% does or doesn't make a big difference in our budget. What does matter is that it'll bring about some fairness in the system. It'll bring about the situation where the top 2% are paying the same percentage of taxes as the middle class are. And I don't know about you, but I do know that it'll make me and a lot of other middle classers feel a lot better.

BRAVO JOE!

Ladies and gentlemen, here we finally have proof of the pathetic Liberal/Progressive ideology. It’s not often the limp-wristed Libbies will come right out and confess their complete indoctrination and submission to the statist mentality.

They have no desire to fix our economy and save our great Republic. This is all about their sad little bleeding heart Liberal emotions. It’s about how they “feel”. It’s about their convoluted “fairness” that Barrack Hussein has brainwashed in them.

This is not unusual in the weak minded Liberals/Progressives. They have been told all their life by their dysfunctional parents, family, peers and now the president, that the best they will ever achieve is middle class. They know they will more than likely never be successful in life so their envy consumes them and now they just wish harm on others.

As Joe here tries to rationalize that raising the top two rates will somehow make things fair, he doesn’t realize that anything taken from the productive in our society will just trickle down in higher prices to him and his lemmings.

But he’ll “feel” better!

Joe, I hope you don’t mind if I save your post and use it on other sites to show the rest of America what a pathetic circus your ideology has become. I know the real Americans will get a big kick out of your bizarre thinking.

You may want to hope that even if the top 2 rates do go up that there are dramatic changes to the 75,000 page tax code. If not the armies of accountants, consultants and tax lawyers are just going to move all the rich money around until rates come back down.

Remember, the rich have all their needs taken care of, you’re just denying them a few wants. They can survive just fine that way.

Thanks for the proof Joe. It’s not often you Libbies expose your delusion so completely. I figured California would be the state to find it in.

Nice job Spanky!

i look at boehners picture now and the theme song to benny hill starts playing my head.give the rich a tax cut he says and the rest of the country starts to chase him.but seriously we just dont vote for republicans anymore and he knows it

I have spent a little time studying the sequestration rules and what actually happens after going off the Cliff. For one thing, returning to the Clinton rates reduces deficit spending by $3.3 trillion over 10 years by increasing revenues by that amount. That is between 2.5 to 3 times more of added revenues that Obama was asking for.

The spending caps initiated under sequestration will serve to reduce deficit spending significantly more too. Interestingly enough though, almost all entitlement programs are exempted from cuts for the most part.

There are a number of discretionary programs that will see some arbitrary caps on spending, however that does not necessarily mean that they see cuts immediately. The biggest single cuts will occur in defense spending. Most likely these spending reductions would occur almost immediately. Note that Veterans programs are seperate from these defense cuts and remain for the most part untouched.

The fiscal cliff in fact favors Obama policy very closely. The biggest thing that goes against his approach is the raising of taxes on those earning less than $250,000 annually. That said, it is unlikely that payroll taxes would go up immediately. They could delay that by at least several weeks or more, the only downside being that the remaining months would see slightly higher withholding in order to balance out by the year's end.

What this means is "advantage Obama" in a very significant way, with a breathing room period to re-negotiate before any lower end impacts are felt by the middle class. The added revenues and the initiated spending cuts will also push back the time at which a government shutdown is triggered. The thing is that it also puts Obama in the driver's seat for those negotiations. Republicans have just given away about 80% or more of their negotiating power here. Obama gets most of what he wanted while giving up relatively little. The only real downside being the increase in middle class taxes.

Market will initially probably take somewhat of a hit, however when they realize just how significantly more the cliff addresses the debt, they may get comfortable with it very quickly. Economic growth will suffer as the new tax rates for the consuming public begin to take money out of their pockets, but how much of a hit it takes is a matter of some debate. All the while, any negative effects will be very clearly on the backs of the Republicans. This little stunt just pulled by the House will just solidify that blame. Politically speaking, the defeat suffered by the Republican Party will be far more significant than what they suffered in November.

This really is an astoundingly significant development. The only way this could have gone better was to actually take the vote to reveal exactly which Republicans stopped any chance for a negotiated position. Remember that they were rejecting a plan so far from what the President asked for, that it was going nowhere anyway. Yet even knowing that, these people could not even agree to to smallest degree of compromise from just a symbolic standpoint. Of course I think we all know where this rejection of any compromise came from.

Boehner will not get these players to ever come around, it just won't happen. But what he did do, which I believe was a mistake, was provided some very small amount of cover for these idiots by not taking the vote. He missed the opportunity to crush the rebellion within his party. Had he taken the vote and left absolutely no doubt that the extreme right wing Tea Party members are the obstructionists. He would have taken quite a bit of their future political influence away and he would have actually set the stage for a coalition with Blue Dog Democrats. I believe Boehner thought he could swing some of the far right and some of the Democrats. Both rejected him. his bill was going nowhere, but he had a chance at a slight symbolic victory. He failed to even get that. Members of his party basically said that they would rather self destruct than ever agree to even symbolic compromise.

ForePlinger

A true poet that didn't know it? I think not. Edgar A. Poe may have been proud of you.

So we go over the cliff... Big friggin deal. So what if we ALL pay more taxes . Obama says we need the money right?. many of you on here are all for increasing the taxes on other people for the good of the country. Put your money whaere your mouths are. Rather where your fingers are. Push the responibility too someone else but don't raise my taxes .. Oh no !!! the rich people can afford it more than me. I read what you people are really saying. Same ole same ole. Do it too the other guy and leave me alone.

Lets let this imaginary travesty called the "Fiscal cliff " happen . It is the only way to get a fresh start. The economy will tank fully because of the tax increases. unemployment benefit extentions will end and some handouts will end. People will have to fend for themselves for a change.

Both sides of the ilse have thiere feet dug into the sand and nothing short of real fiscal bankrupcy will cause either side to move. The President DOES NOT HAVE A MANDATE. This President was put in office by buying votes from people who have never read a newspaper. many of them can't even read. Many have never worked a day in thier life yet because obama gave them pre paid cell phones the voted for him. The mandate is that the 47% number Romney is quoted as saying isn't that wild a number.

gcooper8

Does anyone on the vine work in the airline industry? If so, maybe you could help me with this question:

When Speaker Boehner travels home for the recess with his pig (you know, the one he keeps trotting out with a different shade of lipstick, under the guise of putting forth a plan), does he have the option to pay full fare for the pig's seat, or will Porky be confined to the baggage compartment?

Uhh.....What?

The Republican Party is dying from the inside out. It affects We the American People and the people of the world. Where are the Republicans of character, of integrity, of statesmanship, of country-over- party? There must be none left because no one hears or sees them...anywhere! on any subject! Repubs waved the American flag all over the place for Bush's Wars, but they cannot hold it up now because they place their party over country. They are too busy playing personal politics to be concerned with our country. Their religion is based on their greed for money and power; they walk the way they double-talk now.

I will never vote for a Republican again. They walk in lockstep while putting party over country. We are seeing who they are by what they say and do, but we are speechless because it is hard to belileve. The old if-it-walks-like-a-duck routine works here and we need to become honest with ourselves and call them out on what they are doing: Republicans are trying to overthrow our government by weakening it! America is dying from the inside out because of the RepubliCONS. Get it yet?

(Read Richard Evans' well-researched and well-documented historical trilogy about the WWII era. You will see history repeating itself via Norquist/the Republican Party.)

Dear Mr. President,

Please Sequester Congress do not allow any House or Senate Member to go home..... This issue is too important to allow these Clowns any more excuses.....

Congress we need to Raise Taxes and Cut Expenses,

1. Raise Taxes on all income over $ 400,000

2. Make the Tax Rate the same for all Income

3. Cuts need to start with you - There is no way you are worth your Blotted Pay & Benefits, Defense, Foreign Aid (Pay Offs), The High Cost of all Public Employees.....

Merry Christmas to all and get ready to the Long Fall off the Cliff, because it is sure evident these Clowns will never agree.....

OHGuy-better yet, as long as Congress is empty, how about 535 honest citizens with their family and friends as advisers go down to that cesspool of greed and corruption and take over the offices and jobs and put them back into the people's hands, where they once belonged.

tbrownjt

The problem isn't that you don't have some honest citizens in the house, the problem is because of media influence and their own bias's they don't know what a honest citizen looks like for the most part.

Because ALL news media has their bias, to get the whole news I have to read between the lines to extract what is fact and fiction from the bias.

There is a very under reported fact that Boehner allowed the democrat version to be voted on. It was defeated 243 - 179 I believe. Boehner pulled the Plan B vote because the straw vote in the party said he did not have the republican votes, not reported is if he even polled democrats.

In the House under Pelosi, Republican measures never got voted on unless there was a Democrat sponser AND only if Pelosi would move the measure to floor. I don't ever recall one Republican measure reaching the floor.

You will never hear what I'm telling you on NBC, I got it from Yahoo News.

I'm still laughing at the total incompetence of the republican led House. They have Cantor and Bonehead Boehner on TV News FOX in the afternoon saying that one supports the other and they have the votes to call a vote on Plan B. Then later the vote is called off. This is the Worst set of Representatives in the House that we have ever had trying to lead us. Saturday Night Live should have fun with these clowns. Which of you nuts uneducated people elected them?

Also interesting that after this fiasco all the networks had it on and before I went to bed late last night, FOX still wasn't saying a word. LOL! Continues.

Well, at least Rupert Murdock came out for Gun Control!

DB Akron,

No they wouldn't report it as they report the news not FOX Propaganda! See my above comment on FOX reporting last night also LOL!

Chapter 1,000,006 in the cascading failure of John Boehner as Speaker. How can we expect anything to get done when the #1 guy in the House can't even get his own caucus on board, let alone the opposition party?

Things were so bad for Speaker John Boehner Thursday night, support for his Plan B tax bill so diminished, the limits of his power with his own party laid bare, that he stood in front of the House Republican Conference and recited the Serenity Prayer.
"God grant me the serenity to accept the things I cannot change, the courage to change the things I can, and the wisdom to know the difference." Boehner nearly cried.

Boehner's Republican Conference has relegated their negotiator to the sidelines. Now, Republicans will see why Boehner was willing to offer Obama so much: The final deal Republicans will now have to swallow will be driven by Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) and Obama.

http://www.politico.com/story/2012/12/john-boehners-plan-b-toughest-hour-85391.html?hp=t1

The House passed a bill in August to extend all Bush era tax cuts and it is still sitting on Harry Reid's desk. The House also passed a budget that would have averted this issue as well. The country is still waiting for the Democrats to put forth a budget. But who really cares, liberals have been claiming Bush era tax cuts caused all our financial problems and liberals should be celebrating the fact they are set to expire.

Going off the cliff is what Obama wanted, his whole presidency is about blame. This is just another opportunity to blame Republicans. Obama feels he can force through a tax break on the middle class in January, and in the end paint the Republicans as the party of the rich and himself at the one cutting taxes for the middle class. Obama doesn't want to win this issue, his goal is to destroy the Republican party and he has certainly outplayed them to this point.

It would be nice to think that Republicans will now decide to take their lumps and refuse to vote on any legislation after we dive off the fiscal cliff. Refuse the debt ceiling increase, and let the chips fall where they may. If it leads to a recession so be it, Obama has the country on a path toward financial collapse so a recession is probably the better of the two evils. The short term might blame Republicans, but in the long run Obama will be the one expected to fix the resulting problems, and so far fixing anything has proven a difficult task for Obama.

On The Record

The Republicans are officially the Party that protects Millionaires

Boy are you people such fools. This is 100% a ploy by both parties to jack up taxes and make cuts without anyone taking responsibility for voting for it. They are in cahoots together. And, you losers have the delusion that any of them actually care about you.

I insult and mock all of you.

Why do you think they didn't address it sooner? Why do you think they pushed it until after the election? Why do you think Reid and the Senate offered nothing? Why do you think Obama offered cuts 10 years in the future?

You liberals blame GOP. GOP blames Obama. And you both look like fools and they laugh at you and sip champagne together while you losers send more money to their campaigns.

It has been easy for Obama and Reid to just stand on the sidelines and say no to every offer by the House Republicans. Well now it is their turn, let us see if Obama and Reid can put together legislation that can pass the House. It is now Boehner's turn to stand on the sideline and just say no. If in fact they every really wanted to get a deal done in the first place, after all it is not as if it was going to solve anything.

Rick

Where have you been! Even FOX has reported the movement and compromise on both sides, mostly on the Presidents side. Where has there only been saying NO to the republican proposals? it is the fact you have been brainwashed by FOX propaganda and you are out of touch with the facts and reality!

Amen Dennis

"On The Record

The Republicans are officially the Party that protects Millionaires"

Another Christmas of weeping into a tumbler of value brand bourbon.

Can Boehner ever win?

@ Roy, I have to give you credit sir, you are at least willing to publicly admit you are one of the "I have mine so to hell with the rest of you" types. I wish you well in Costa Rica, and trust you will be giving up your US citizenship, as you are no citizen, and if you happen to be christian as well, be sure to tell your priest/pastor/minister that you cannot follow the teachings of Jesus, so you will be leaving the religion behind as well.

Now, to saner folks - my fellow citizens, especially my fellow Progressives, the Fiscal Cliff is a media invention. Yes, some taxes will return to what they were under Clinton (you remember, when the US had a budget SURPLUS), but cuts will be phased in over time. In Boner insists on pulling a Boner (as usual), there is still time to fix the issues. I doubt he will be Speaker come the next Congress. Those who have broken with Grover over taxes aren't likely to re-elect him, and neither are those who still cling to Teabagging the US people. If enough of those who have broken with Grover can work together, a more reasonable (still not totally sane) Speaker is possible. So if Jan 1 comes and goes with nothing done, things could still be resolved rather quickly in January. The main concern now is will the US suffer another decline in our credit rating. While the vast majority of the National Debt is held by the Social Security Trust Fund and US citizens (yes, the media has hyped Chinese ownership, but the truth is they don't own all that much of it), having to pay more in interest rates will benefit the average person more, not less. Yes, greedy, heartless people are wailing and screaming about a 3% rise in taxes, but if it means that the Pentagon's incredibly bloated budget is cut, I don't mind an increase is payroll taxes (besides, since it is mostly the Social Security Payroll Deduction, erroneously called a tax since it is an insurance premium, it means that SS will be better funded). Yes, the GOP, AKA Party of NO! has shown the world they can't govern, but hasn't that been the case since Nixon? 40+ years of this and we're still here. Relax, it isn't the end of the world as many of the top 2% and their shills in congress would have you believe, as well as the media who only is interested in ratings and internet traffic. At this point, as Sen Bernie Sanders has pointed out, no deal is better than a bad deal. Once the GOP head home and find angry constituents they are likely to change their tune. The Corporations and the top 2% may fund their campaigns, but they still need people to vote for them. As more people see them for what they are, all the bribes in the form of campaign contributions in the world will not get them re-elected in 2014, and many know it, which is why so many are breaking with the terrorist and terrorist funding Grover (look it up, his Palestinian "charity" has been linked to paying Hammas, not aiding average Palestinians). I wonder why Peter King hasn't had him before his hearings on terror? Hmmm...

Anyhow, the doom and gloom has been over-hyped and isn't all that bad. Under Clinton the US did rather well, with a good economy, Wall ST gains, and a budget surplus. If cuts and minimally higher "taxes" will bring back those days, then great. Something need to undo the Cheney/Bush years (for 6 of the 8 years Cheney was more in charge than Bush - just look at the "energy task force", the wars, the torture, etc...)

Lastly, but not least by any means, Happy Holidays and best wishes for a joyous New Year.

This is what happens when we the people allow the republiturds to gerry mander the h3!! out of the districts so they can maintain power. Repulicans, you lost the popular vote, but keep screwing this country over with your 1950's way of thinking and in 10 years the dems will control the house, the senate, the presidency and have a 6-3 majority in the SCOTUS you a$$ clowns!

There are a lot of comments about the last 12 years being trouble and the time of Clinton was great. Actually, the last 2 years were pretty good because the repubs took control in '96 and brought spending under control. And, I agree with you libs, let's go back to the days of Clinton! Let's go back to the Clinton tax rates and the Clinton spending. That will do more good for the country than anything that Congress is realistically going to do. Whoops, I put the kibosh on that idea. I mentioned repubs in a positive light, so the dems can't possibly go along with it. Makes no difference to them whether it actually works or not, if it's a repub idea it is bad. In the same vein, if it is a dem idea it is good, whether it works or not, and it usually doesn't. The war on poverty is the longest war this country has ever had. We have failed miserably at it under dem leadership, so the dem solution is more of the same.

Arch Stanton, Thank you for your input of facts that are rarely seen or discussed. The "news sites" like this one continue to pit party vs. party grumbling and arguing over non-issues while the Fed and Aristocracy continue to make each American poorer, less informed,dependant and divided. We continue to be fooled by this Administration and the two houses of congress.

clwyd-2621393 "Where have you been! Even FOX has reported the movement and compromise on both sides, mostly on the Presidents side. Where has there only been saying NO to the republican proposals? it is the fact you have been brainwashed by FOX propaganda and you are out of touch with the facts and reality"

Show us the specific spending cuts Obama has agreed too? Not some phoney reduction in future spending increases that are 10 years down the road. What has the president offered to avert the nation toppling the 20 trillion dollar mark for a national debt? Raising taxes is all Obama has put on the table, and no one believes him when he says he will cut spending later. You liberals will eventually have to face the fact that Obama and the Democrats couldn't fix a flat tire much less the nations fiscal crisis. So blame Republicans all you want, but Obama is president and maybe he ought to try leading rather then furthering the political divide. So lets see what the Democrats can offer now that the ball is in their court, and they can no longer just sit on the sideline and say no. Which is certainly all Harry Reid has done.

kaybeetoys

These are the effective tax rates by income at the moment.

• 10% on taxable income from $0 to $17,400, plus
• 15% on taxable income over $17,400 to $70,700, plus
• 25% on taxable income over $70,700 to $142,700, plus
• 28% on taxable income over $142,700 to $217,450, plus
• 33% on taxable income over $217,450 to $388,350, plus
• 35% on taxable income over $388,350.

How exactly are the rich not paying more taxes? If you are married and make $70.000 you pay 10,500. A million maker pays $350,000. Unless my math is wrong, they are paying 33 times what you are, and as a percentage over twice as much.

As far as Romney goes, he was taxed at 15% which is the same as an earner of $70,000 because his income was all investments and that is the tax rate for that. Personally, I think it should be taxed as regular income and that is one thing that should change.

But I really fail to see how you are paying more in any way when as a percentage of income you are wrong. You can point out loopholes that the rich can get, but then close the loopholes, because as percentages go, they are paying more.

This is what all the idiots in Washington don't get. A true compromise would be to add percentages to everyones tax liability over the course of 5 years to absorb the shock until tax rates are back to what they were. Personally, I don't believe the tax cuts should have ever happened. I see them as a bribe to placate the American public to go along with the war in Iraq.

IT’S OFFICIAL!

Barrack Hussein and Democrats are the Party of No!

No budget for 1,332 days.

No plan for jobs.

No plan for the fiscal cliff.

No plan for sequestration.

No plan for increasing growth.

No plan for cutting spending.

Obama has not, is not and will not cut anything from our budget, let alone our debt.

On June 12, Barrack Hussein claimed he already signed $2 trillion of cuts and allegedly proposed $2 trillion more in cuts.

On June 22, he said he was going to reduce the deficit by $4 trillion.

On August 14 he stated he already cut a trillion dollars.

So which is it?

The truth is, none of the above. There has been no cut in spending and the 2013 budget dramatically increases deficit spending.

In 2008, according to the OMB, federal spending was $2.983 trillion. In 2009, after he voted for the $700 billion Bailout and signed the $833 billion $timulu$, spending increased to $3.518 trillion. In 2010 federal spending was $3.456 trillion. In 2011 spending we $3.603. This year OMB estimates our deficit budget will be $3.796 trillion. Since 2010 federal spending has increased by $340 billion.

There has been NO trillion dollar cut in spending.

When Barrack Hussein claims that he already signed $2 trillion of cuts, he means the debt-limit deal from last Augusts debt-ceiling deal. In exchange for agreeing to borrow an additional $2.1 trillion it was agreed to cap the amount of increase in future federal spending, but no date was ever agreed on when this should happen.

This mirrors the 1982 TEFRA agreement that Reagan agreed to which Tip O'Neil later reniged on.

The CBO explained what the deal might mean. If appropriations in the next 10 years are equal to the caps on discretionary spending and the maximum amount of funding is allowed, CBO estimates the legislation would reduce budget deficits by $917 billion between 2012 and 2021. In addition, legislation originating with the joint select committee would cut deficits by at least $1.2 trillion over the 10 year period. Thus we get a total of at least $2.1 trillion over the period.

However, the CBO warned, "Those amounts are relative to CBO's March 2011 baseline adjusted for subsequent appropriation action."

So, in essence, this will NOT cut spending, it would cut the size of anticipated future deficits based on the deficits the government was already planning to run based on previous legislation. This can also change if any new legislation is enacted. It won’t cut any spending in the long-term or even the mid-term.

As per the CBO’s update in March, including the spending caps, it showed that spending would drop by $47 billion. After that it will increase in each of the next 9 years up to $5.520 trillion in 2022.

Under the Obama-Boehner deal, the budget would never balance and the debt would increase by another $2.887 trillion over 10 years. So, not to be outdone by his own ignorance, this years budget would have reversed the debt deals caps on increased spending. The CBO’s analysis concluded that, "the cumulative deficit that would result from enacting the president's budget -- $6.4 trillion (or 3.2 percent of GDP) -- would be $3.5 trillion larger than the cumulative deficit projected under current law."

This is the delusion of the Liberal/Progressive cabal. They believe the cuts in already bloated spending levels will somehow magically reduce the deficit and debt. There is no functional way to accept any of the bizarre offers from the Left. They are not interested in true fiscal sanity.

The question is, why do the Liberals/Progressives hate America so much that they are willing to collapse our envied economy, again, just to save their unsustainable entitlements and social programs?

This is the criminality of Progressivism.

Our elected leaders are enlightened. They believe that:

"if in trouble, or in doubt

Run in circles, scream and shout!"

If all else fails, quit and go home.

Bonnevilleguy: 1.75

" ..all you see is a bunch of frustrated angry, immature liberals taking out their hatred aginst anything conservative. Amazing that they cannot contain their rage, hate....."

Did you read your post?

Fiesty, long time no see. Merry Christmas

Hiya Michelle!

It has been awhile! Hope things are well with you!

Have a very Merry Christmas, may Santa stuff your stocking with tons of good "stuff"! ☺

Commonsense101ROY WILSON-336103, " when was the last time you picked up an American history book? Particularly the period shortly before, during and at the end of "The Great Depression""

Actually, I have studied quite a bit on the 'Great Depression', but perhaps you should study the Depression of 1922, which was more severe than our 'Great Recession', but lasted only 18 Months.

In contrast, the Great Depression lasted about 10 years, and the current Recession has effectively been going on for about 5 years.

The difference in the length of the crippling economic declines has one simple explanation - Government intervention/spending. When normal market forces are allowed to work, the economy makes relatively quick 'adjustments' (ala 1922), but when the government intervenes to 'help' with massive government spending, it extends the recessionary economy for very extended periods (ala the Great Depression & our Great Recession).

Unfortunately, the DRAMATIC increase in spending under Obama (The National Debt has gone from $9.986 Trillion at the end of fiscal 2008 to $16.352 Trillion today) carries with it the seeds of economic stagnation (ala Japan) as our children and grandchildren struggle to pay just the Interest on the massive debt. Even if Obama gets everything on his 'wish list', he projects the National Debt will exceed $20 Trillion in less than 4 years, and Interest alone will likely increase from the $200 Billion per year average under Bush to about $1 TRILLION per year in 2016 when Interest Rates return to normal. (they averaged about 5% under Clinton).

I see lots of comments about my family moving to Costa Rica, but the actual reasons are quite simple;

1 - Costa Rica was recently designated the Number 1 place in the World for Ecological Sustainability.

2 - Costa Rica was recently designated the Number 1 place in the World for overall Happiness.

3 - It is a beautiful place to live, with great ecological preserves and beaches and a life expectancy significantly exceeding the USA.

4 - They have never had any significant civil strife - in fact, they are one of only a few Countries with no Army.

PS - I DO plan on bringing my computer, so you can still look forward to my occasional posts, like them or not.

john-737278 "As far as Romney goes, he was taxed at 15% which is the same as an earner of $70,000 because his income was all investments and that is the tax rate for that. Personally, I think it should be taxed as regular income and that is one thing that should change."

Lots of people feel that 'Investment Income' should be taxed at regular rates, but keep in mind that people with significant amounts of money are also relatively smart, and have the ability to move their investment capital to other countries with the click of a computer key. Without investment capital, our economy will stagnate and jobs will be created 'elsewhere'. Some European countries have a 0% Capital Gains Tax Rate. I suspect that more than doubling the tax rate will result in a massive 'flight of capital'.

"It's unbelievable, this is horrible," he said. "I'm angry, I'm sad for my friend the Speaker, and I'm sorry for the country. We deserve better."

This is the first statment made by any member of congress that is so true...This is a sorry time for this country..and it has nothing to do with the house speaker at all. The speaker has nor has ever had a backbone to speak up when this country is in need..he and many others have gotten nothing done in congress as a whole in way too many years. Most all bills passed by congress contains benefits for the wealthy and themselves..which of course..most all of congress are millionaires. All of congress is looking to cut benefits to everyone excepth themselves and their wealthy friends.

Social security alone would be helped in a huge way just by doing away with the tax cap placed by our congress as a stoping point for social security..ask yourself why? The only ones who benefit are the wealthy and all of congress. It is our own tax money that congress lays waste too. The republicxcans are pushing to build even further our military..who today is the strongest in the world...yet we have been in many battles or wars in different pparts of this world only to lose....why...because our congress has no backbone..they are all concerned about money...nothing else. Consider too, we are losing jobs to nations who use basicly slave labor...like China...who also has a huge walue added tax on anything we, this country ships there..yet..there are no VATs on anything shipped to this nation applied to any country that I know of. Profits is all it is about. This nation is gradually bering sold out...our jobs and even ideas are being sold to other country's for profit...........and our congress is helping it all along..I have to wonder when or if the general public will ever realize where we as a nation could be headed.

CelticPagan "@ Roy, I have to give you credit sir, you are at least willing to publicly admit you are one of the "I have mine so to hell with the rest of you" types."

I did my best to warn Americans about the dangers of the ultra-Liberal policies of Obama before the election, but they obviously prefer the 'Nanny State' to the industrious America that made us great. I can warn Americans about the dangers of Liberal tax & spend policies just as well from Costa Rica, but put my family in a nice place to live while doing so.

I think the people who voted for Obama because he keeps promising government handouts are the ones that have the attitude of "As long as I keep getting mine, to hell with the rest of you". The margin of victory among those who get 'free' government handouts was about 11 million, while Obama won by only about 4.7 Million, so I ask you "Who are the REAL 'greedy' people - those who live off the labors of other people, or those who's taxes provide the funds for them?"

Adios - Got some things to do before we move.

Rick, Check with FOX since you only seem to believe their propaganda! Oh, they havee done a nice job of brainwashing!

Rick,

The president is doing a lot better job of leadership than the Cantor's and Boehner's. They can't even get their party united so how the H can you expect the president to deal with this bunch of retards who can't vote and once again walkout and go home! I'm a former Nixon, Goldwater and Reagan republican and the party is now a disgrace. Also, the three men I mentioned would now be labeled Liberal by the nuts on the extreme right trying to hold America Hostage! I wonder how this will show in the polls for the already dying or dead republican party. They lost me years ago, my neighbor in November and this will lose a lot more!

Fisty Dreadhead (1.11),

"I too will be scarcer the next few weeks, my amazing daughter came home last night and we have some serious mother/daughter bonding time scheduled!"

OMG, SHE HAS HAD A LITTER OR TWO!!!!!

Roy Boy

Best news ever! You're leaving the country. Since you're packing up your continually negative sorry butt and leaving this great nation please promise us you'll never step foot on U.S. soil again. Like a lot of the older redneck Repukelicans you brag about your money. Unfortunately, fools like you never realize that much of your money was made on the backs of the working class. PLEASE give up your U.S. citizenship when you leave and DO let the door hit you in your a** on the way out. Hey can we talk you into leaving your computer so we never have to listen to your negative, know it all garbage again? Your arrogance wouldn't let you do that unfortunately. Good Riddance

Well! Happy Holidays from the GOTea, as they trot off smiling to enjoy their taxpayer-funded paid holidays.

The great thing about Roy Boy is that whatever numbers he uses they can ALWAYS be counted on to be wrong.

Actually, I have studied quite a bit on the 'Great Depression', but perhaps you should study the Depression of 1922, which was more severe than our 'Great Recession', but lasted only 18 Months.

It was most certainly not more severe;

Libertarians seem unaware that recent economic research has shown that the downturn of 1920–1921 was not as severe as previously thought. The widely accepted definition of a depression is a fall of 10% in output or GDP. In past estimates of the fall in national output, official Commerce Department data suggested that GNP fell 8% between 1919 and 1920 and 7% percent between 1920 and 1921 (Romer 1988: 108).

But Christina Romer has argued that actual decline in real GNP was only about 1% between 1919 and 1920 and 2% between 1920 and 1921 (Romer 1988: 109; Parker 2002: 2). So in fact real output moved very little, and this was not a depression on the scale of 1929–1933 or previous 19th century depressions. Libertarians cannot claim that 1920–1921 was an example of the free market quickly ending a downturn where output collapsed by 10% or more (a real depression). In reality, GNP contraction was relatively small, and the growth path of output was hardly impeded by the recession (Romer 1988: 108–112; Parker 2002: 2).

http://socialdemocracy21stcentury.blogspot.com/2010/10/us-recession-of-19201921-some.html

The difference in the length of the crippling economic declines has one simple explanation - Government intervention/spending.

Wrong again;

Brad DeLong has recently written up a clearer version of a story I’ve been telling for a while (actually since before the 2008 crisis) — namely, that there’s a big difference between inflation-fighting recessions, in which the Fed squeezes to bring inflation down, then relaxes — and recessions brought on by overstretch in debt and investment. The former tend to be V-shaped, with a rapid recovery once the Fed relents; the latter tend to be slow, because it’s much harder to push private spending higher than to stop holding it down.

And the 1920-21 recession was basically an inflation-fighting recession — although the Fed was trying to bring the level of prices, rather than the rate of change, down. What you had was a postwar bulge in prices, which was then reversed:

http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/2011/04/01/1921-and-all-that/

So in reality the 1920's recession was more similar to the recession of 1980, which was a short-term, V-bottomed recession created by the Fed's monetary policy in order to starve stagflation out of the economy.

Good luck in Galt's Gulch, Roy, they actually deal in fiction there.

Oh, you do realize this Libertarian paradise to which you are moving has socialized medicine, right? http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=as29boo9FyVQ

@Feisty- call your boss. I'm sure he could get the Secret Service to drop off a couple bags of microwave popcorn by. You know, the ones with the "White House" seal on them

TO: -usa1967- who wrote:

"Taxing people who make over $250k more won't make a pimple on a bulls ass bit of difference in the national debt..."

Well, if that doesn't help, then why do Republicans think that starving the poor and robbing the elderly is a better plan?

Do Republicans actually believe that Food Stamps are worth more than cash?

john-737278,

Well you are wrong. If you make $1 million in taxable income, you owe $319,139.50, not $350,000. So the overall effective rate on $1 million is actually 32%, not 35%. But hey, what's an almost $31,000 mistake?

And the tax on $70,000 is $9,735. An effective rate of 14% not 15%. A $265 error on your math.

With the rolled back rates, on $70,000 taxable income, your tax bill goes up $265 to $10000.

On $1 million taxable, the bill is $358,620 increasing by $39,480.

The Bush tax cuts saved you 0.38 percent on what you paid under Clinton, but for the guy making $1 million, they saved him 3.95%. More than 10 times the discounted rate Mr. Middle class got making $70,000.

Over ten years Bush got you a $2,650 total break on your taxes. Over that same period Mr. Million got a break of $394,800. In 10 years he got back 40% of his annual earnings. You got back about 3.8% of your annual earnings. But on the plus side, if you both invested your tax savings, each of you got a 5% break on your capital gains. So we'll say you both averaged a 7.5% earnings. (of course with your measly little pittance, you probably got more like 3% in a saving account, but we'll call it equal) So you made about $200 and your capital gains tax break over the 10 years was $10. He made $29,610 and his capital gains tax break was $1480. You gained lunch at McDonalds and he got a big screen HD TV.

But hey, we all got a break with the Bush tax cuts so it was fair right? Across ten years you saved enough to put a small down payment on a new car. He got a new car every year.

So was that fair?

1NewDay

OMG IT'S NOT FAIR!

While you may have looked up some tax tables, You do nothing to dispute that higher income people do pay a higher percentage in taxes. You simply argue that it is unfair that you have to pay any! Get a life! Get a job! And quit holding the rich responsible for your failing in life.

By the way, I am not even remotely rich by any standard, but sure as hell can't blame them for "my" lot in life. Perhaps they have not whined about what they have gotten and actually worked for it? I know it is a novel concept, maybe it will catch on after the welfare state collapses.

Jimmy Spence my boy. The producers in this country aren't the top two percent. It's the workers who do the work. The middle class workers who do the work and pay the taxes and keep this country going. Think about it this way Jimmy, without the workers there is no production. Without the top two or whatever percent you could simply move some workers up to take their place. I notice you use a lot of words Jimmy but you really don't say a whole lot of anything of any value.

Except of course that it is NOT true that the rich pay a lower effective tax rate. In addition to tax decreases having been geard to favor the rich over the rest of us for the last generation loopholes are the same way? Did you miss the extensive media coverage that Mitt Romney paid only 14.1%? How about the fact that Warren Buffett pays a lower tax rate than his secretary, and has a $1M check available for the first CEO who pays a higher rate than his secretary?

The producers in this country aren't the top two percent. It's the workers who do the work. The middle class workers who do the work and pay the taxes and keep this country going.

You can take it a step further. The "2%" aren't the jobs producers ... it is the middle class that actually buys things is the real jobs producer. Without their buying power, we'd have very few jobs. At one time, when the wealthy made their money by actually MAKING things, they understood that, too. The knew that they needed a vibrant, prosperous middle class to make themselves wealthy. But, with so much of the wealthy making their money on Wall Street, the link is broken. The wealthy no longer care about infrastructure and consumers, because they don't need either (except an Internet connection).

John,

Well as it turns out, I am pretty well off, not rich but one who has benefited pretty well form the Bush Tax cuts. I have a great job when I feel like working. Don't need to anymore. Never took a day of unemployment in my life although I could have. Never took a dime from any welfare or entitlement program. The thing is that I didn't ever need to. Lots of reason for that but what it amounts to is that life in this country has treated me pretty well, so why shouldn't I pay back more?

We should all be paying more to keep the country moving and take care of those struggling. But if some on the low end can't really afford to pay more, then those of us who have been more successful or lucky, should pick up the tab.

Barry, exactly. No jobs means no buying power.

Yeah...the GOP has called its position 'leadership' - euphemestically. The RepubliCONs have consistently gone against the wish of the majority of the people. The RepubliCONs only need to serve these corporate interests who have donated enough money to sustain the political careers of these RepubliCONs.

.

I do hope voters continue to teach these GOP looney tunes a lesson in November 2014, pushing the RepubliCONs into House minority again.

Boehner can now 'assume the position' over the crapper and discover that his role as Speaker is about to get flushed rather than tanned. Couldn't happen to a more deserving 'yellow' Republican.

The House will now recess for the Christmas holiday, leaders said.

Really? They've been on recess since Jan. 2011. And they wonder why they have a single digit approval rating. Pathetic!

Boehner can now 'assume the position' over the crapper and discover that his role as Speaker is about to get flushed rather than tanned. Couldn't happen to a more deserving 'yellow' Republican.

Amen! That bottle of scotch will get a good workout tonight.

FoxTrotsky -

You are working under the mistaken opinion that Republicans actaully want to do something for the country! Not true! In fact, as demonstrated so aptly here, they don't want to do anything for the Republican party either!

They don't care for anything except themselves and what they can make out of public office.

2014 is coming. ALL House of Representative seats are up for re-election. If you truly care about America, vote a straight Democratic ticket!

"If you want to live like a Republican, vote Democratic!"

President Harry S. Truman

Trotsky, it's a lame duck Congress with a 39 vote majority for the Republicans until next year. A new Congress will convene early in 2013 and Republicans will continue to control Congress, by 31 votes. The fact that Barack Obama was re-elected cuts little ice if any with Republicans in the Congress. The Democratic minority in Congress, however, is duly impressed.

The Constitution allows all members of Congress one vote each even if others disagree.

Democrats are faced with a Republican Congress, Republicans are faced with Barack Obama.

@Scott - Not a Republican Congress, just a majority (R) House and a majority (D) Senate. The only thing that needs cutting are the Republicant's throats.

All of you partisan hacks are the real problem with this country. Your side is right. Yeah, the Republican and Democratic Parties are the same thing. They both rob the public blind, and reap the benefits for themselves. Perfect example was when Obama did an interview with ABC news, and he was asked if he would give up his insurance to go on Obamacare. His refusal to answer the question was priceless. Don't worry Democrats. No Republicans would give up their Cadillac plan to go Obamacare either. Public servants my a$$.

You guys are great (Fox, EE, Tony etc.), and evidently quite correct. Boehner could find a deal by going with a Bill with some Democratic support, but he won't because it might be used against him on January 3rd and cost him his Speakership. I guess I'd as soon keep Boehner and get a deal in early January than allow Cantor a shot at the Speakership.

Well said...For some reason...people on this board seem to think that their side is the right one. The reality is that DC doesn't care for us regular folks enough to put together a real debt/deficit reducing plan. That might make all of them look bad...like they all could look any worse at the moment.

Can you believe these clowns, leaving for the Christmas break without voting on the Senate bill that would stop a tax increase for 99% of American tax payers. I'll bet most of them fly home first class on our dime. Why are we paying these people they don't do a damn thing.

Since the beginning of 2011 America has been cursed by having the worst House of Representatives in the history of our country. We should have a truck dump large chunks of coal on the steps of the capitol building.

I hope these selfish Republican/Tea Party types choke on their eggnog.

Pigotry, you are as confuzed of the facts as you are of the demographics.

First, the facts, where as less GOP got re-elected, more total GOP got elected. Most of the seats lost to the Democrats were by Independents.

The Demographics, while the majority of registered voters are Democrats, they do not represent the constituents of those Representative. They are chosen by their own districts.

More than 50% of the Districts are Republicans... the bulk of the Democrats being in high density locations...

Each Representative is to make decisions based on their Districts, not somebody elsewhere. They actually represent the true "collective" of the voters, versus the Senate, which is only 2 members from each State.

This was the design of the government, so the "collective" could have a say, versus the vast majority. It's also how real change has been afforded. If not for the structure, women would not be voting and slaves would still be a commondity.

Then comes the true civics.... The House of Representatives make up 1/2 of the law makers, and 1/4th the total structure of decision making. Whereas, the judges can't propose measure, the President and Senate CAN.

I do not recall any "grand" scheme proposed by the Senate. The President by all accounts (both Democrats and Republicans), the only real offer the President made was the same thing already shot down.

Then, of course, the POTUS asks Republicans to allow the tax hike with the "promises" of cuts... yeah, like he has carried out every promises so far? Gitmo closed yet? (And no, only the President has the authorization, any excuse would be a lie).

If hte President was serious, he would offer up to serious negotiations. So far, it's been "my way or the highway".. the same junk that got us in the sequester in the first place.

If you were going to be critical, you might want to start with those who are actually suppose to listen to you... the one's you voted for.

But ask yourself, what are YOU willing to give up as a compromise... that is the heart of negotiating.. you have to give up something, to get others to meet you half way.

EEngineer, bless your pointed little head! I keep an eye out for your handle because I've learned that it'll be attached to a comment that is often enlightening, and always worth reading. You're one of the smart people who Rick Santorum knows will never vote for him; but I'm glad to have you on our side.

I've pointed out often in this space that it's now undeniable that the Republican Party has absolutely no interest in the well-being of the American people; they're in it for the 1% Leisure Class, those who. like the lillies of the valley, "toil not, neither do they spin."

The Republicans are perfectly content to see the United States reduced to an economic colony of China and India. They and their ultra-wealthy masters have no conception of building for the future; they are moving our manufacturing base overseas as fast as they can get the equipment dismantled and loaded onto (Liberian- flagged) ships.

They, and their plutocrat masters, are traitors to their country, their descendants, and to the very American Dream itself. In the words of the inimitable Hunter S. Thompson: "These people are swine. They deserve to be f****d, broken, and driven across the land."

Peace and Merry Christmas to you and yours. To the Republicans- I hope all of your Christmas trees short out and burn your *&^%#@! houses to the ground.

It's Do-Nothing-Congress.

GOP has stolen our Christmas - GOP stands for Grinch of Pigotry (Pigotry means Republican House as government by corporate pigs, for corporate pigs, and of corporate pigs)

No more Christmas. Cliff-mess is instead what We the People got stuck with.

I feel that I can't leave my family behind here. My love of the hummingbird might save me. God knows.

Merry CLIFF-MESS, everyone....Thanks, Speaker Boehner, an epic failure.

The poor, yet well tanned, drunken boner can't even get support from his partners in crime.

It would seem that the boner got stiffed, as it were.

We have a front seat at the Republican party suicide.

Their alleged leadership altogether don't have a 99 IQ.

Passing on having this dumb vote is probably the last of their pretending they won the election. It's pretty clear from the feedback they thought they would win.

They need to clear out the trash and get some real Conservatives in their party, ones that understand that being conservative means they need to protect the country from the few that want to make it into a feudal state with a handful of rich guys owning the government and its military.

Any other scenario will not play. We are addicted to freedom and if they try to take it away, we will shed blood to not let that happen.

Giving Obama what he was demanding was going to solve nothing, so solving nothing or doing nothing whats the difference? In the short term the country will take a hit going off the cliff, but in the long run it will do more good then bad. We have a runaway federal government and no one in Washington is offering any real solutions, so let us dive off the cliff and get the inevitable over with. Obama has only been concerned with political gain and not what is in the best interest of the country, or he would have embraced Simpson - Bowles when it came out.

Republicans! Here's a hint: Look up the symptoms of a cult. Quick!!!

This beat-down of Boehner is the American Taliban leader Cantor's doing, he wants Boehner's Speaker job.

Obama should follow Buffet's suggestion of using his executive order to freeze all Congressional pay until a budget is agreed to, if main street America and the unemployed are forced to sacrifice, the same should go for Congress and their staff..............let them share the sacrifice for inaction.

Actually it would have been the job of CONGRESS to embrace Simpson-Bowles. As it was even Paul Ryan didn't embrace it, as his vote helped prevent the commission from issuing any final report.

Boehner brings new meaning to the phrase "epic fail."

"Now it is up to the president to work with Senator Reid on legislation to avert the fiscal cliff.

The Senate has passed legislation to extend the Bush tax cuts on the first $250K of income. Better call a vote in the House before you go over the cliff!

Al ....

Boehner brings new meaning to the phrase "epic fail."

And now I'm sure he'll have an epic "cry" and get tear stains on his self-tanner. Man, but does he need to grow a pair!

CLIFF-MESS is now officially replacing Christmas in this holiday season...as a result of epic failure of Boehner

Merry CLIFF-MESS. NO-THANKS, GOP.

UAW, I hope that's sarcasm you're spouting.

Not one member of the House should get their paycheck until they resolve their obstructionist policies and work out a budget solution. As a matter of fact, they should be fined on a daily basis. If I didn't do my job, and went on vacation to avoid doing my job, I would be fired. It sounds like a congressional pink slip parade is definitely needed.

I agree! Boehner should resign. He can't even get his own caucus to vote on his bill. Unbelievable!

Boehner is the worst speaker in the History of the House. He needs to retire and go home to Ohio. I used to live there and it is a great state with great people. I am at a loss for words.

Its really sad that Bonehead was re-elected unopposed. How stupid are the people in Bonehead's district?

They all are already on a plane out of Washington for the Christmas Holiday,what a bunch of lame-ass lazy idiots..the worst House of Representatives ever...

Mr. President, you might as well spend some time with your family. If we go over the cliff I for one won't be blaming you. I appreciate you caring about all of us but you are up against the worse bunch of Republicans in history. They even turned their backs on Bob Dole a week or so ago, talk about a slap in the face. Have a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.

Dump the Republicans in 2014

Boehner was elected because he chose to call himself a Tea Party Conservative. Now the Tea Party is making it impossible for him to lead his caucus. Sometimes, we reap what we sow. There is something called Karma afoot in Washington. Boehner will not survive as Speaker because he can't lead and he doesn't want to follow them off the cliff. I'm not talking about the fiscal cliff. I'm talking the political suicide cliff.

When you lay down with dogs, you get up with fleas. Couldn't happen to a nicer fella.

CLIFF-MESS has replaced Christmas in this holiday season - as a result of Boehner's Epic failure.

Merry CLIFF-MESS. NO-THANKS, GOP.

Hey, the pulled the "Plan B" bill before vote. The Clowns with millions got the TP weenies in the house REALLY AFRAID!

They should ALL be arrested for treason right now. With Grover being named "Wife to all" when in prison!

Larry. Have you no one in your life that cares enough to keep you from making an idiot of yourself in public?

Larry...still smoking the tea leaves huh? In case you were in a coma on November 6, fiscal matters are subject to the majority and the majority sent a pretty clear message that "we're not buying your trickle-down garbage anymore and it's time for the top 2% to stop ass raping the other 98%."

Spare me with your "communist, socialist, Marxist" diatribe...it's getting old. Find some new material you hypocrite.

Leave the guns

The House, the Senate, and the White House stayed in the same hands, only a handfull of seats changed to Demcrat, and the two in the Senate because the candidates were bad.

That is more akin to saying we want a compromise or no deal. Neither side can move forward on their agendas. This is a standoff, not a mandate.

Add to that 64% of Americans think the wealthy should pay more.

73% of Americans think government should cut more. Having future cuts is like having no cuts at all when you need to cut NOW!

@tex2c - Doesn't sound they found a cure for you yet. Maybe they need to increase the voltage. Just a suggestion for starters.

amused but still stupid....sometimes there is truth in sarcasm.

Hey Tex- An old family cure for all your problems. Eat several pounds of exlax, it will take your mind off of your other problems.

Dump the Republicans in 2014

Michael...I think you are not understanding Tex's comments very well....he's kinda on your side.

well I see our lib friends are still hampered by their mental disorder- liberalism is a deadly disease. And one of the side effects is mental blindness. They cannot think objectively, they cannot see that they are not only enslaving themselves to the state, they are committing others to the same slavery.

larryrobinson..........

liberalism means being liberated. the few rulers that i can think of that didn't want their people to be liberated were the likes of Stalin, Hitler, Lenin, Kruschev. just to name a few.

and please remove your avatar. you are a disgrace to the uniform you are wearing. please take it off. thank you.

shallow minds drown in deeper thought........sorry .............fresh out of life preservers.

Larry,

If the right wing were to win on this, the people who would be enslaved are the 98% whose wealth is being diverted to the richest 2%. There has been a steady transfer of wealth from the middle class to the wealthiest over the past twenty years. This has been done by cutting social welfare and entitlements and grants to states for infrastructure and education and a host of other programs that help to grow the economy. This has all been done through tax cuts for the rich and a loss of services for the middle class as well as a steady erosion of salaries, wages, and benefits for employees so that the Board of Directors, the CEOS and the Wall Street gamblers could grab even more of the pie. They basically want to create a third world dictatorship, a system wherein the super wealthy control everything and the rest of us get nothing and have no say in the matter. The next time you claim that this is a great way to live, I suggest you travel to a few third world countries and see what happens when all the wealth is held by only a few elite. It isn't democracy. It isn't freedom. It's economic slavery. I am tired of you right wing extremists who actually believe that this is free enterprise. It isn't free. You and every other person in the country is paying for it. They will make sure that there is no opportunity for anyone else to create competition. They don't want competition. They want to own it all. That isn't free enterprise. That's the dictatorship of the privileged. Only the super rich are reaping the rewards.

Sorry Larry...but I don't depend on Uncle Sam for anything nor do I ever intend to. Additionally, this has nothing to do with liberalism or conservatism. I'm just someone who is getting sick of seeing the little guy getting continously ass raped by the rich boy who seems to think his voice is more important.

As depraw so eloquently stated, you are indeed a disgrace to uniform and you make me want to vomit. When I served, it was for all of us...not just for those who thought they could hijack the Constitution for their own benefit.

DSP - CAPT/USNR

Merry CLIFF-MESS. NO-THANKS, GOP.

Sorry Larry...but I don't depend on Uncle Sam for anything nor do I ever intend to.

Really? So, you build your own highways, have your own military and go without insurance on your bank deposits? You never listen to weather reports? You never fly in planes that need air traffic control? You'll pay for your own healthcare when you turn 65? Wow .. I'm impressed.

"well I see our lib friends are still hampered by their mental disorder"

Another conservative attempting to describe liberals but in fact describing themselves.

It's funny rev Larry -- you live in this Walter Mitty world where you're a minister, a tax expert, a disabled veteran, a defense analyst, an historian, a NASA consultant, a multi millionaire, a politician and you have a son making over $200,000 as a fireman -- yet you talk about others having a mental disorder???

Ahhh, who are these 'people' you are advising our President to listen to? Exactly what do you mean by-

"Time for the president to stop letting people suffer and follow the will of the people."

By "a balanced approach", do you mean that only the poor, the sick and disabled, and the elderly- you know, those people who can't f*****g afford high- powered K Street lobbyists- should shoulder the burden of spending cuts?

Or do you believe that we could, given the courage and the political will, achieve a 'balanced approach' that has something of a moral compass to guide it?

I don't recognize your handle. Do enlighten us.

Ah, what a joke! 69% of the voters have decided that tax increases and spending cuts are the answer!

Look at the rats deserting a sinking ship! Wake Up! Compromise or die!

2014 is coming! Republicans are gonna loooove this!

PutAmericaFirst, you might want to put the pill down with a glass of water first...

Yes,would you approve of massive cuts in defense spending which accounts for almost a THIRD of all government spending?Thats going to have to be where most cuts will be made..

Increased revenue and cuts to defense spending are exactly why I have always wanted us to go over the fiscal speedbump. The recovery that follows, when it comes, will be a real one.

Merry CLIFF-MESS. NO-THANKS, GOP.

While Nero fiddled while Rome burned, Boehner drank himself silly while the US burned.

And Eric Cantor? Hiding like the little putz he is!

So Obama will be on the golf course putting while "Rome" burns...

SSDD

So Obama will be on the golf course putting while "Rome" burns...

You have proof of this.. yes?

After your EPIC FAIL the beginning of the week, when asked for sources, this would be your chance to redeem your sorry, lying ass...

Don't any of you understand? It doesn't matter! Due to Republican manipulation, Obama has to do NOTHING! And the Bush tax cuts will end, sequestration will take effect, Republicans will get the blame and our national debt will be ~$3T smaller in 10 years than it would have been!

Exactly what effect will Republicans have? NONE!

2014 is coming! Republicans are gonna loooove this!

As long as someone wins and someone loses in the make believe world of politics, who cares what suffering comes from it.

the only sequestration that needs to take place is the sequestraion of congress in a small room until they can approve a budget.

Merry CLIFF-MESS. NO-THANKS, GOP.

So Obama will be on the golf course putting while "Rome" burns...

Does he even play golf? Not that it matters. There's nothing else for him to do since the House can't pass legislation and went home. Might as well play golf.

What i have been saying all along. The system is Soo broken. why did anyone expect anything to get done. We all already know this is the most "Do Nothing Congress" in history. I am not surprised in the least.

Why all the personal attacks from both sides, sickens me.. everyone here points fingers and call names to each other, and meanwhile congress is doing the same thing. The only problem is, it doesn't matter what we do, but they are ALL running this country into the ground!

The system is broken and we are screwed! Sigh

There is truth in what you say, but from where I sit, it looks like the extreme minority Tbaggers have figured out a way to take control of our country. This deadlock on doing anything that might help will last as long as the obstructionists are removed from office by a sane voting population that is not dominated by simple minded explanations of what is wrong.

Merry CLIFF-MESS. NO-THANKS to GOP.

No, That honor goes to Nancy"we got to pass it before we can see what's in it" Pelosi

Why take the president's offer. How can they in good conscious take the presidents offer and know that they are damaging our children's future. And why does Obama refuse to compromise or do what is best for the country? Obama needs to get a clue.......the American people want a balanced approach, not taxes only.

Put,

Any examples of what the republicans have on the table for those cuts? I believe the white house has done a lot of compromising....they increased the amount to be taxed from 250K to 400K, they have defense cutting, and added the CPI to the social security. There is several cuts made in the white house deal. Where are the exact numbers of cuts and specifics for the republican side. Plan B held cuts for middle Americans, and nothing to defense.

And the republicans have compromised from nothing to $1.2 trillion or more in new taxes (Obama wanted 1.8 trillion). Obama barely compromised at all going from $250 to 400K. The CPI is part of it. I will give Obama credit for that. Those cuts the white house is proposing are practically worthless compared to where we need to be or where the republicans want. I wouldn't even call that a compromise at all. I also don't consider defense cuts a compromise for democrats. Where are the house specifics? It is hard to have specifics in the house before passing the bills. Obama has the easy job when it comes to that. He can't write legislation, so he can make it look like whatever he wants and not have to back it.

OK....this is a start...but, again, you are complaining about Obama and the democrats...yet won't be specific about the republican cuts. Again, the defense can take some cuts...number one, stop making tanks and planes that the military states they don't need, yet congress mandates it. Number 2, start curtailing the salaries of private contractors. If we need to cut the social services sector, than private contractors in Iraq and Afghanistan need to be let go.

Again, what about corporate welfare. Republicans are gun hoe on stripping social services...lets get balanced and do some trimming on corporate subsidies. I call that balanced...take from middle Americans and corporate America.

Yes I agree,even if it means not paying farmers not to farm,that should stop or be temporarily suspended.Yes,let's stop spending on military equpiment we will not need,there needs to be a shakeup badly in the military-industrial complex in this country.Not spending may free up the capitalist system,have companies either die or do something else.gee I think thats what capitalism is is'nt it?

Forget it, Jackie K. She's bound and determined to make all of this into Obama and the Democrat's faults. Apparently she read somewhere that by using 'dog whistle' phrases like 'balanced approach' or 'compromise', she can try to pass herself off as a reasonable and informed person (like you,for example, if I can judge by what your comments reveal) instead of the tea- drinking, Beck- believing doctrinaire right-wing drone that she obviously is.

Poor dear- she couldn't have known that we Progressives are much less susceptible to 'dog whistle' phrases than wrong wingers are; it's because we've spent our lives looking at facts and evidence and making up our own minds. Matter of fact, that's exactly how we came to be Liberals in the first place!

Those cuts the white house is proposing are practically worthless compared to where we need to be or where the republicans want.

It isn't the job of the White House to propose cuts. The House originates spending bills. If the GOP wants spending cuts, let it propose specific reductions to specific programs. The problem is, it won't. It isn't brave enough.

Obama and progressives want to destroy America. Republicans are trying to prevent it. And that is what Americans want. America can't survive with stupid Progressives running the country. Just imagine Feisty spewing her hate on national TV. No plans, no ideas, just venomous hate. What a dumbass!!

Yes, take the president's offer, it is something that will ultimately be good for the economy of America. Business likes certainty and moderation, not some extreme plan the GOP has for us. Take the plan and we can slowly begin recovery. We know what works (Clinton's economy) and what doesn't work (Bush's tax cuts and wars put on the credit card).

On "Morning Joe" this a.m. they put up a graphic of Obama's plan alongside Bohner's plan.

Obama's chart did have spending cuts, Bohner's did NOT. If Bohner wants spending cuts what are they and why don't they tell us what they are? (Cuz, perhaps they don't have any!)

Dump this guy GOP!!!

Put.

I'm all for a balanced approach too. How about getting rid of corporate subsidies and corporate welfare. Why all the talk of cutting the social safety net for the poor, sick, and unemployed. Why are you so against cutting from big business and getting them to start paying...why do we need the Big Oil subsidies....what good is that doing except lining the pockets of big oil.

Yes I know...kind of what Mitt Romney said about HIS tax cuts too...where were they and what exactly was he going to cut??..Again...no concrete answers,typical Republican BS

The problem isn't the taxes. The problem was with the absence of spending cuts.

Hmmm, then why was the first compromise from $250K to $400K (Obama)? Then why was Boehner's answer to that $1M?

Bullcrap! This is all about Republicans protecting their rich buddies (and their campaign contributions).

It has nothing to do with what is good for America! It has only to do with what is good for Republicans!

Put,

Mind if I call you putz?

You are so full of Faux News coolaid, you can't even think straight.

Money for taxes isn't a complex thing. There is both money coming in and money going out.

It is curious that you think that money coming in is irrelevant while money going out is critical.

Most folks (teabaggers excluded) would see the need to strike a balance.

Especially if the incoming "increase" was to return to levels that existed prior to the previous president.

And don't give me that "less taxes lead to financial shangrila" argument, cuz it just didn't work with Mr. Bush now did it.

Oh Putz, what are we gonna do with you?

put....

every recession/depression that America has faced was the direct result of a republican congress lowering taxes. the USA has NEVER gone to war without raising taxes to fund it. NEVER.

And the bush administration didn't even put the cost of the wars on the books. Obama did put them on the books to reflect our true debt. That is one of the main reasons our debt has risen so much under President Obama.

And the bush administration didn't even put the cost of the wars on the books. Obama did put them on the books to reflect our true debt. That is one of the main reasons our debt has risen so much under President Obama.

Let's be accurate here...

Bush keeping the wars off of the books did nothing to hide the national debt. What it did do was make the federal deficit look lower. The debt still rose. For instance, consider the year 2006. That year, the budget deficit was only $248B. Righties here are sooo fond of quoting this and comparing it to Obama's deficits. What they ignore, however, is that during that same year the national debt went up by $1T!!! Why? Because the deficit only showed what was budgeted. The increase in national debt showed all federal government spending - both on the budget and off the budget!

With that in mind, let's correct your statement:

And the bush administration didn't even put the cost of the wars on the books. Obama did put them on the books to reflect true federal spending. That is one of the main reasons our deficit has risen so much under President Obama.

The Dems are just as at fault. They avoid doing the will of the people and avoid the balanced approach that includes spending cuts. The republicans tried, but sadly the democrats can't find the word compromise in the dictionary.

wrong! Putz, you seem to have a real problem with understanding that your heros just got creamed by their own greed. The Retardican party is a thing of the past, just watch. They just lost the 'most important election in the history of America' according to the corrupt lying candidate they put up to take the hit. LMAO, what a pathetic attempt to take power back from the American people.

Now they are being exposed as the most deliberate obstructionists in modern politics. What a bunch of losers. Americans of intelligence will not forget this sleazy scam by Boehner that threatens the economic welfare of all of us about as much as the economic policies of the last Republican sleaze bag in the WH.

I agree with you, HarleyGuy, but it looks to me like they're hell-bent on taking the rest of us with them!

Fawk liberty ,and free dumb.lets go over the cliff.
The extreem right wing needs a speedy death

I agree! Let's do it! The Bush tax cuts will finally expire! Sequestration (a Republican manipulation in the first place) will take effect. Our national debt 10 years from now will be ~$3T lower than it would have been (less than either Dem or Rep offers so far).

And, according to all polls since before the election, Republicans will take the blame!

Bring it on! I survived the Bush Recession, I will probably survive the Boehner Boner too!

Thats the thing Put.The Dems ARE trying to do what the American people want,the majority of people out there who were asked know they'll have to pay more in taxes down the road and are alright with it.They are not alright with the way the GOP is handling what they consider their fair share of the load.40% on 250,000 dollars still leaves one with a lot of money to live on.40% on someone who makes 40,000 dollars a year leaves one with not a lot to live on.Lets face the fact of scale ok?..

put....

what country do you live in? or is it that you just can't read?

Put America first its @#@#@ idiots like you that is the problem. Chris hardball said it best that we are never going to get anywhere in this country when 47% vote republican to protect the rich 1% of the population. So that means that 46% of you @#@#idiots vote against your own best intrest every @#@#@ election to protect that 1% who don`t give a @!$%# about 99% of the population. it defies logic

Merry CLIFF-MESS, everyone, due to EPIC FAILURE of Speaker Boehner.

I think that was the most impotent move yet by the GOP

The Boehner only had a short time left to ensure he would be the worst speaker ever. Looks like he pulled it off with 10 days to spare.

They went to the President with 2 different plans and he went on television and acted like an @!$%#. Instead of getting together with the house majority and moving towards them after they increased taxes by 700 billion dollars. He had a press conference and decided to act like a bigshot smartass prick. The House had every right to go home when all this president is good at is spending 1.3 trillion more per year then we receive in taxes. If you took 100% from everyone you cant cover that it is more than GDP for the whole damn country. Buy a calculator for Christmas if you are a liberal that is about the best advice I can give you.

Merry CLIFF-MESS....Thanks to Boehner's EPIC FAILURE

What are you talking about? Nevermind the Dems right now. You can't even get your own party to agree on anything. To whom or what did they take an owth? Norquist or the Constitution? The people have spoken. Now fall the heck in line. You'll get your chance in another 4 years ya sore loser.

Are they now?Put America First can you actually give me a chart of exactly where you will make cuts,how much you will save all of us and what will be the result?I bet you cannot.I saw the Democrats chart and it's expected results today on Morning Joe and on NBC News.I look at the GOP...nothing.All your party is doing is making up numbers and not doing anything concrete or at least not telling us what you are planning on doing and constantly changing your stance and quickly throwing in nonsense amendments That IS NOT COMPROMISE.Thats the old way of doing Washington's business.It does not work anymore.Until you all do something about that then expect to get vetoed over and over again,until thist decisions' made for us on January 1st..end of story

The republicans are the only ones that are actually trying to solve our nations problems and taking a long term look at things.

Oh, bullcrap! Republicans are only protecting their rich campaign contributors! If you think this has anything to do with what is good for the country rather than what is good for Republicans then you haven't been following what is going on!

2014 is coming! Republicans are gonna loooove this!

EE, haven't you been paying attention to the socialist agenda purposed by Obama and his minion? Do you want to live in a socialist nation, a government telling you what you need rather than you deciding what you want? I don't, Don't use the excuse " the rich bastards, most of them are the ones that employ you... and me. And Boner is just trying to keep the camels nose outa the tent, but of course you know nothing about that.

EE, haven't you been paying attention to the socialist agenda purposed by Obama and his minion?

Well, kip, haven't you been paying attention to the agenda purposed by the Republican party and their minions? Look, I used to vote Republican. I voted for George W. Bush his first term. When I saw what he and Dick Cheney were doing to the country, I voted against them their second term. The Republican Culture of Corruption fostered during the 8 years these two men held the White House basically defined the current credo of the Republican Party: "Anything, anything, ANYTHING is OK as long as it makes a buttload of money!" The Republican party would like to pretend that the Bush years never happened. Why? Because they want to continue down that same path again - probably with the same results!

Do you want to live in a socialist nation, a government telling you what you need rather than you deciding what you want?

What's the alternative? Do you want to live in a fascist nation, a government telling you what you are allowed to do with your body, whom you can marry and even what sexual acts are allowed? The last great experiment with legislated morality led to about 1000 years we fondly call the "Dark Ages".

I think Newt Gingrich summed it up best (good Lord, I hate quoting Newt Gingrich, but right is right):

I don't think right-wing social engineering is any more desirable than left-wing social engineering...

Don't use the excuse " the rich bastards, most of them are the ones that employ you... and me.

Soooo, I should be thankful that these people deign to give me a job, eh? And I should be grateful that the job they give me pays me anything at all, eh? And when the time comes, I should cheerfully train my replacements from overseas so they can export my job to make more money because, after all, they employ you and me .... wait a minute!

Face it, unbridled capitalism is just as harsh a master as the most despotic totalitarian government. Unbridled capitalism combined with corrupt government makes the cruelest master of all. It took 8 years, a mere 8 years, under Bush with companies writing their own laws, starting wars to benefit specific companies and allowing, nay, encouraging, the worst excesses of greed in certain markets to cause the biggest crash in the American economy since the Great Depression. And when it was all over the government stepped in to bail out the worst offenders. And the American people? Well, the American people should not be "coddled" according to Republicans. If they are out of work, it is their own damned fault!

And Boner is just trying to keep the camels nose outa the tent, but of course you know nothing about that.

Now that is funny! Let's stretch that metaphor just a little further. Under George W. Bush and Republican majorities in both houses, an entire herd of camels was led into the tent. Now, knee-deep in camel dung, Republican leaders are all saying "Smell? I don't smell anything" and insisting that the only way to fix our problems is to let more camels into the tent!

They went to the President with 2 different plans and he went on television and acted like an @!$%#. Instead of getting together with the house majority and moving towards them after they increased taxes by 700 billion dollars. He had a press conference and decided to act like a bigshot smartass prick. The House had every right to go home when all this president is good at is spending 1.3 trillion more per year then we receive in taxes. If you took 100% from everyone you cant cover that it is more than GDP for the whole damn country. Buy a calculator for Christmas if you are a liberal that is about the best advice I can give you.

CLIFF-MESS is officially what We The People got stuck with...due to Speaker Boehner's EPIC FAILURE.

Christmas no more. Thanks, GOP. No thanks.

Well...someone might feel better after the former, but nobody in America will ever feel better while the latter remains in a position of leadership.

Harley,

I agree wholeheartedly. I think they should all have to stay and work because the work isn't over. These people do not care about the middle class at all. nor the American people. They have proven this time and time again.

same goes for odumbo, also clown

td are you reading up on this or just commenting blindly. obama has given away the store to the tea party zealots to such an extent it cant even be called a compromise. Mitch McConnel the other @!$%#ing ass clown repugnicCANT even fillibustered HIS OWN BILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It would be virtually impossible to recall Boehner. When Republicans took control over the legislature in Ohio in 2010, the redistricted the state so that short of armed conflict, there would be no one other than a Republican ever coming from Boehner's district. The redistricting is an absolute joke. If you look at the Wiki page showing Ohio's Congressional Districts you will see what I mean. R's carved the districts in such a way as to be able to push Dennis Kucinich out of the House. The representatives of the people are no longer representing the people. It's a real problem.

I agree, this needs investigating. These people need to think about the future of their "secure" jobs.

I prefer to say, GOP = Great Obstructionist Party. And they've proven that true, once again.

Not so Merry CLIFF-MESS...Thanks to Boehner The EPIC FAILURE.

If the baggers had any honor, they'd commit mass seppuku.

If not seppuku at least bukkake.