Bali Bob ...

Can the Republican Party hear it now?

We can certainly hope (it is the season!), but I'm sure little jim-#'s will be around shortly to tell us how it isn't a mandate, the poll is skewed, and the sky is surely falling!

Repeating the same news again...but we know that one good way to learn is to repeat ... if you are capable of learning.

Sometimes, some RepubliCONs show their inability to learn anything...even from their fresh defeats last month.

.

Speaker Boehner...time to heed the public opinion..the opinion of the people, not of your corporate masters.

Still, twice as many Americans say they trust the president more in handling this fiscal situation (38 percent) than House Speaker John Boehner and the congressional Republicans (19 percent).

Gee, could this be one of the reasons that Americans voted to re-elect president Obama to a second term? You bet your ass it is!

Layton: I think there may have been a love connection between jim and iowaretiree yesterday! They may be off in their own little love nest ignoring the world's woes. :)

Unfortunately............this poll won't convince the right wing of anything that the poll on November 6th didn't! The truth has a liberal bias!

*chanting*

CLIFF, CLIFF, CLIFF

*hurrah*

Raise taxes on the rich, what a plan. I can see another Nobel prize.

I would be the first to admit that all of the Hitler/Nazi comparisons are a.) WAY overdone, and b.) totally off-base anyway... but I am an amateur historian, so I tend to view current events in their historical context.

Watching Boehner and his Gang That Can't Shoot Straight since the elction, I can't help thinking of Moustache Boy in his bunker, after the General's Plot of July '44, issuing orders to armies that no longer existed and ordering companies of schoolboys and Franco- Prussian War veterans to attack Soviet 'shock divisions.'

The common dynamic is a complete disconnect from reality, an unwillingness to accept bad news- in this case, the news that a clear majority of the American electorate are fed up with Republican obstruction, filibustering, and jamming the gears of government.

We Progressives do not view government as some kind of malign occupying force; we see government as a tool, as the means by which we get bridges built, children educated, natural disasters cleaned up, and in the wrong hands, getting brown people who weren't bothering us killed.

We view government as being as good or as bad as We The People decide to make it, and we tend to feel that we each of us has an obligation to our government, "and to the Republic for which it stands", that goes well beyond just going out and voting every other November.

The fundamental difference between us and the Forces of Darkness is that we want our government to be accountable, transparent, responsive, and moral. They want government "drowned in the bathtub" so they can replace government power with corporate power, having none of the qualities enumerated above. If the Republicans and their billionaire patrons got everything they wanted, I believe that (historical frame of reference again) our country would in very short order look like Czarist Russia.

If they're that keen on actually living out their Randian fantasies, they ought to be allowed to try it out on a small scale. Very soon, they'll be asking the question that came to my mind when I read "Atlas Shrugged" at age thirteen; Who built the water and wastewater plant and hauled away the garbage at Galt's Gulch? Where'd their electricity come from?

"65 percent say leaders in Congress should find a compromise to reduce the budget deficit"

They need to poll the 35% who disagreed and find out what mental illness this 35% suffers from.

The House Speaker has turned a deaf boner to public opinion.

OK...the congressional holiday vacation starts on the 23rd and back in session at noon on the 26th.

Redhead:

"PPS: 53% approval rating for the President! OUCH! That has got to sting!"\

Your math says that 47% do not agree.

PPS: And it is congress's job to represent this 47% if need be. That's the idea of checks and balances in government set forth by the founders. OUCH! That fact has got to sting. Unfortunately that;s the way it was setup over 200 years ago.

I do not agree with the House or the Senate however. Both houses should be fired and replaced. Their list of failures has little to do directly with the president. Both sides are too far left and right and are clouded by party ideals and loyalties and cannot do the right thing in a 21st century global economy in which Dem and GOP customary ideals do not apply.

Let the spin and conspiracy theories begin from the mathematically challenged!

Ding! Ding! Ding!

We have a winner here folks, hand the man a Kewpie Doll! lol

PPS: And it is congress's job to represent this 47% if need be.

Sorry pal, in this country, majority still rules! ;o)

Both houses should be fired and replaced.

Too bad... so SAD! We just had an election and America sent a strong message whether YOU like it or not!

Don't like it here?

I've heard Somalia is lovely this time of year... maybe you should check it out!

Yet another reminder to the GOP that YOU LOST!! Even some of your 'party faithful' have had enough. Keep it up, and yet more of them will join the party of fiscal sanity (Democratic) in the next election.

By the way, great post FoxTrotsky. It never ceases to amaze me how the RW can ignore/revise history so readily. It's like they got their propaganda playbook from Orwell's '1984'....

For trying out their 'Randian' theories, may I suggest Texas?.... LOL!

The Framers of the Constitution actually set the document up to force sides to compromise. The Constitution itself was a compromise.

Read books about the Framers. Get educated.

The only reason the right wing won't compromise is their irrational but deep hatred of Barack Obama.

They make no sense, and anyone who can't see how their obstructionism, is hurting our democracy, needs to take a constitutional law course.

feisty --------- well.... somewhat of a mixed message, since the republicans gained 2 states they lost in 2008, and gained a governor ---- and obama received 2 million fewer votes in california than in 2008, and fewer votes overall than in 2008, while romney had more votes than did mccain.

... and Oceania has always been at war with Eastasia, right Crazy Steve?

"Sorry pal, in this country, majority still rules! ;o)"

Ah redhead, and therin is the problem, no member in either house of congress is required to vote according to the majority. Their job is to be free thinkers, before their party majority and is supposed to be what is right. The GOP is guilty of this as well as the Demsand voting according to their majority party lines. That is why there is a deadlock.

It is not congress's job to follow a majority, Do you understand this? Had they not followed the Majority they would never have let Bush wage war or Obama pass his healthcare reform around the back door? We would never have been is a fiscal mess, which traversed several presidencies both democrats and republicans alike.

And you are correct Chandler. Their job (both sides) is to compromise, not say that we all have to follow the majority rules. If that were the case then there would be no need for a congress. Are you educated?

chandler ---- last i checked , we had a representative republic, not a democracy.

Obama won a second term with a resonating re-election victory.

Yet, many in the GOP cling to the party's ruinous past policies.

In the Republicans' own words:

"Conservative leaders to GOP: Stand firm in this period of testing"

...conservative leaders are publicly urging Republicans in Congress to resist pressure to compromise. An open letter circulated on Wednesday and signed by more than 100 conservatives ...warns Republicans that they are "entering into a period of testing." It says they have "a mandate to fight for conservative principles" because they maintained firm control of the House on Election Day....the letter appeals to Republicans to stand "united" and not vote with their Democratic colleagues...It also warns of possible primary challenges for Republicans who might consider compromise.

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/ticket/conservative-leaders-gop-stand-firm-period-testing-231102396--politics.html

Our citizens voted for Obama to move this country forward.

65,249,700 voters, voted against the GOP's backwards and hostile agenda.

The right is out of touch with the majority of our citizens.

The Republicans are coddling their extreme political platform. Deservedly this archaic faction is earning another presidential lost, 2016.

“If the increased eligibility age were in effect in 2014, the costs to individuals, businesses, and states would be twice as large as the federal savings. In effect, Americans would pay $2 to save the federal budget $1—thereby increasing overall health spending.”

Ah redhead, and therin is the problem, no member in either house of congress is required to vote according to the majority.

WTF are YOU talking about? They are required to vote their constituency wishes...

You know, represent the people who gave them their J-O-B-S?

Sorry you flunked out of your basic "evil gubment 101" course!

Keep your head tucked snugly up where ever & keep whistling past the graveyard...

There is a reason dead beat daddy Joe Walsh and two other neighboring tea baggers were sent packing here in IL in November, even the 10th district which is very right leaning said; ENOUGH!

Americans are sick and tired of the gridlock and have already placed the blame squarely on the tea baggers shoulders!

It will not get any better from here on out for the obstructionists... but by all means... carry on! lmao

I say, "Don't give in, Mr. President. Let's all hold hands and jump!"

FoxTrosky,

We Progressives do not view government as some kind of malign occupying force; we see government as a tool, as the means by which we get bridges built, children educated, natural disasters cleaned up, and in the wrong hands, getting brown people who weren't bothering us killed.

Well said!

The GOP just can't work for the American People, they absolutely, absolutely refuse!

They have reserved themselves to be beholding ONLY to the Top 2% wealthiest Americans.

That is correct Redhead. And the GOP are doing just that, voting according to their constituency wishes.

I have been to Africa, Asia, and Europe and much of what I say here is based on these experiences.

Have you ever been to Africa and seen the result of Majority rule there without balances?

Also, have you been reading my posts that I disagree with aspect of both sides that they are not pertinent to 21st century global economy that we are now in, or just profess in sly and insulting correspondence?

Alaska Girl ...

Layton: I think there may have been a love connection between jim and iowaretiree yesterday! They may be off in their own little love nest ignoring the world's woes. :)

You may be on to something! After all of their whining yesterday, they are noticably absent. Probably trying to find something new to say.

Back to the convo at hand ....

Wouldn't it be fantastic if Congress actually listened to their constituents? What a NOVEL concept! You'd think someone might suggest to them that it's actually their JOB to do JUST that!

Glen-1484791

Redhead:

"PPS: 53% approval rating for the President! OUCH! That has got to sting!"\

Your math says that 47% do not agree.

Glenn - it's called a majority. I know it stings to hear the word majority since President Obama won by the Majority popular vote and electoral vote. He even won in every swing state. He also won on the platform that the top 2 percent need to pay more. Even now the poles show that the "Majority" want this to happen. Also if you look at the House pole, shows them way down in the 25% range of aproval while the President still enjoys the majority approval rating. This being said, then the top 2% need to pay more. That does not mean we stop there. That means we should automatically get it since we won on that platform. It's called a mandate. Once we get that out of the way which will happen one way or the other by Jan 1 2013, then we can do what the republicans want and cut spending. Not sure if i would match dollar for dollar, but I would come close. Either way it happens though, the House is going to come out looking like the bad guy if they let the fiscal cliff happen. They already are starting to stink for making us wait this long.

Jeez...same old names here, time after time.

"Mandate", right- Red One?

In case you didn't read it ALL, (and why would you) that "Mandate" included reducing the deficit, and deficit spending, by CUTTING SPENDING on entitlements...

That means now, not the usual Dem mantra of "we'll TALK about it next year...maybe....naaahhh...."

Because you get all your news from NBC, you're probably ignorant about the fact that the UK just tried the "Millionaire tax"....

How about you do a little research, and get back to me on how well that worked out on the other side of the Pond....

Glen,

I have been to Africa, Asia, and Europe and much of what I say here is based on these experiences.

Oh, big deal! I've lived in 4 different countries (all "Third World" countries but one), spending at least 2 years in each, and I've got a different tale to tell--a national health care system is the only sane way to go!

Brenda..I agree that the top 2% have to pay more...but listen to this...

During the market crash of '29 the richest people in America could have paid off the national debt. Now they cannot even keep the fed gov running for a year. This build up has occurred over the decades on both the dem and gop watch, even until just recently that taxes have been at historical lows. You can tax the boogyman rich and take everything and it will not fix the problem. International companies are not paying taxes in the global economy nor making jobs. All you are going to do is sap any of the remaining taxpayers trapped here. Do you understand this?

Jack I will email you and we can talk about this more. I would like to share experience with you. I did not see it successful in Canada, and most places like Kenya and Tanzania, you had to go to a private organization like the Peace Corps (guess who) the red cross, and private organizations to get help. Otherwise for the most part the health care was disease, starvation, your fellow citizen robbing and killing you, or a bullet from a soldier.

Australia is a different situation. We can talk more. I am open to finding a solution and not interested in political parties at all

And here we are discussing the fiscal cliff and our gov'rs aproach to it like the gov't cares what we think.

The elections are over they no longer care about our opinions or wishes. They got elected, theres no need to worry about John Q Public for another 4 years, then it will be "its the republicans fault- no its the democrats fault-no its the republicans fault- no its the democrats fault-no its the republicans fault- no its the democrats fault-no its the republicans fault- no its the democrats fault-no its the republicans fault- no its the democrats fault-no its the republicans fault..."Elect us , we promise to fix it" " we have a plan but just cant articulate it" until the election is over then it back to the blame game.

No wonder this country's economy is phuqed up.

REVOLT

REFORM

REMOVE POLITICIANS FROM GOVERNMENT!!!!!

NO MORE POLITICAL PARTY AFFILIATION, MAKE THE INDIVIDUAL COUNT!

TO: Glen-1484791 who wrote:

"Brenda..I agree that the top 2% have to pay more...but listen to this...

During the market crash of '29 the richest people in America could have paid off the national debt. Now they cannot even keep the fed gov running for a year. This build up has occurred over the decades on both the dem and gop watch, even until just recently that taxes have been at historical lows. You can tax the boogyman rich and take everything and it will not fix the problem. International companies are not paying taxes in the global economy nor making jobs. All you are going to do is sap any of the remaining taxpayers trapped here. Do you understand this?"

Yes, now pay up!

Why, in your mind, do you think it's ok for me to pay taxes, but not Shell Oil?

Why, in your mind, is my measley paycheck better to use to pay bills with than Shell Oil's $4 billion dollars, or whatever amount their tax liability should be?

If $4 billion dollars won't help, then certainly my little money isn't helping either, so if they don't have pay, then why should I?

Now do you understand that there is no logical or sensible argument anyone can make against taxing the Top 2% wealthiest, which they should have been doing all along!

And guess what, the Top 2% ain't complaining, Republican trailer dwellers are the ones complaining and neither the trailer dwells nor the Top 2% are paying any taxes!

And the voters also voted the republicans in the majority in the house. The house controls the purse strings. The voters sent a strong message that the democraps can't be trusted with money.

I remember Pelosi, " you have to pass the bill so you can find out what's in it...", yeah, right.

The only problem I see is spending so out of control, promising everything to everyone, playing Santa Claus, advertising in Mexico for illegals to come to the US and telling them how to get benefits (more free stuff that us WORKING people have to pay for), with no thought whatsoever on how to pay for promising everything under the sun to everyone they can find.

Playing the class warfare game. Pitting American against American. No American has the right to take from another American anything that they have worked for just because some people think they have 'too much'.

Here's a suggestion... Get a JOB and work for what you receive. Quit mooching off of the people who get up every day and go to work. Pull your own weight.

You don't have any claims to what I earn or anyone else.

This country has always been founded on independence, standing on your own, providing for yourself and your family.

There is no way possible to tax the people enough to pay for all of this spending. And the additional spending required when Odumocare kicks in.

You want to see the real fiscal cliff. Just wait until a year from now.

Glen,

The 2 years in a First World country were in Canada, two decades apart, and both times I needed medical care for sports-related injuries. I received first-rate treatment at a fraction of what I would have paid in the U.S.

I've been sewed up by a local doctor in a peasant's house in Nicaragua, by a local doctor in a small hospital in Costa Rica, and received treatment on several occasions from local doctors during 3 years I lived in the Republic of Kiribati (Kiribati was one of the three Third World countries I lived in; Costa Rica and Nicaragua were 2-week vacations)--and on every occasion I received proper, good care.

I also received health care treatment in the other 2 Third World countries I lived in.

There's nothing to talk about. You had a different experience. End of story.

TO: ronpal who wrote:

"feisty --------- well.... somewhat of a mixed message, since the republicans gained 2 states they lost in 2008, and gained a governor ---- and obama received 2 million fewer votes in california than in 2008, and fewer votes overall than in 2008, while romney had more votes than did mccain."

You still lost.

Republicans showed big losses in every demographic category and you still want to pretend like you won something?

Democrats won the White House, gained 2 Seats in the Senate and gained 6 Seats in the House.

I just can't see how that's any kind of a "win" for Republicans.

Trying to skew the numbers to try to make an issue of "how close" Republicans got is akin to being "almost pregnant".

Mjtt Romney lost the election based on one issue! When he said "I will put America back to work"!

Fifty one percent said "f==k that" and immediately voted for Obanination!

This GOP Clown Circus has to end.

They are the party of NO and due to the Tea Party and have produced the WORST HOUSE OF REPRESENTATIVES IN AMERICAN HISTORY

a DUE NOTHING CONGRESS THAT HAS ACCOMPLISHED NOTHING other than say NO and make the situation worst with their BS.

Feisty red head is a typical Union entitlement grabber,just ask how she makes a living???? Maybe Il. will wake up and join Mi.and become a right to work state instead of a entitlement state run by Demodogs???? That is the only way red head will learn what working People have gone through losing jobs in Il. while she gets high wages and bennefits living off of the tax payer.

BS poll The top earners and monopolies own and control everything and it's time to pay up. The serfs deserve to give up nothing. The masses have been screwed over the last 30 years. It's time correct the progressive tax structure and go after the crooks and greed barons. The GOP is just trying to get something for nothing and lay the burden again on the poor. The distribution of wealth and services to the top is abhorrent.

TO: Koldwindblows who wrote:

"And the voters also voted the republicans in the majority in the house. The house controls the purse strings. The voters sent a strong message that the democraps can't be trusted with money..."

Not true. In fact, Democrats are the only ones I trust to even touch my Social Security and Medicare.

We just couldn't get all the Republicans out at the same time, but we'll take care of that come the next mid-term congressional elections.

The GOP waited until the last minutes so they could take a big dump on the American people! They figured the longer they waited the bigger the turd would be! American people zero - the wealthy 100! Score another victory for the rich - like they need it!

why is anyone so amazed that John Bohner came out with his proposal. Hid did it the day after the election. If you really look at the republican proposal it is the same as Romney's. Cut "loopholes" and "deductions" un-specified (the revenue) and cut spending "unspecified. I was amazed that the republican's position 1 day after the election was the same as Romney's. did they not get it? Guess not. They are still trying to run an election that lost. That was the mandate. NOT to chose that. Watched Norquist on PBS (yeah big bird!) What a bunch of crap. He has little to defend his platform on. Squarming eel.

and tax this bitch

Consider yourself taxed, bitch.

America is dead the dream is gone and rich people should pay more in taxes so your lazy ass can sit around and bitch on msnbc.

Me back to work another 10 to 12 hour day.

rgsdca1965

and none of you know what it's like to give someone a job.

And you don't know enough about any of us to make that assertion.

Plus, you're calling us "retards" when you can't even write a coherent, grammatically correct sentence?

Me back to work another 10 to 12 hour day.

Aww, poor baby. As if you're the only one who puts in long work days. . . .

You sound like an unusually bitter, unhappy person.

All I see is the same incessant BS that is started by the usual suspects. Ok... so let's tax the 2%... THEN WHAT? It is interesting to see the amount of gloating that continues to go on even a month later. Obama won and what... do you want a cookie? How about coming up with ideas that will get this country back on track which does not involve bankrolling the freeloaders. Put in a stipulation that if they are receiving government assistance then they must fulfill 40 hours of community service.

The most ironic thing is that these threads are tossed up YET not one of the above Obama-ites have visited the thread that " Democrats seek a delay to one of Obamacare tax increases". All they are worried about is the 2%... WTF!?!

Get with the program.

RedDevPS

and tax this bitch

Consider yourself taxed, bitch.

LOLOLOLOL you sorry ass

Jack,

Yes I was in Costa Rica in '93. Once of my roomates in collage lived there his entire life before moving to the states for a time and back. We talked a lot about the differences between the two countries.

It was not quite 3rd world but had its share of third world problems These are excellent stories of individuals helping you I agree. Not sure about what you point is on state funding with these stories of individuals helping you.

I agree on Canada, basic health care is much cheaper, (Mexico is superior for the cost as well) primarily because the government does not have to pay liability and is for the most part immune from prosecution. Also many of these third world countries do not have liability in health care. This is one of my huge issues with not taking the first step in health care reform in the US: getting the price down since 40% of it is liability or related to fear of liability. Step 2 is making it available to everyone.

Advanced healthcare is dismal in these places.

Chandler W.:

They make no sense, and anyone who can't see how their obstructionism, is hurting our democracy, needs to take a constitutional law course.

You need to take your own advice. So, the Democrats voted for everything the Republicans wanted???

That is the only way red head will learn what working People have gone through losing jobs in Il. while she gets high wages and bennefits living off of the tax payer.

After trying to read that, I smell a welfare queen in the room. And this one thinks they are employable.

After Obumocare tax increases kick in on EVERYONE and people who bought the 'we can all receive free health care' line finds out all the negatives that come with it, you might just be surprised come next election.

Hey, Joe Thomas. You have that worthless scumbag thing down pat don't you. If we want to be subjected to disgusting people we'll go to a Young Republicans meeting.

the first step in health care reform in the US: getting the price down since 40% of it is liability or related to fear of liability.

Maybe, but I'm not so sure that it's 40%. The number one step in health care reform is getting rid of the health insurance companies. As long as there is a profit motive in place, we will never get the cost down.

No, Costa Rica isn't quite 3rd world, but when you're out in the sticks in small hospitals the facilities don't look much different from what you'd find in 3rd world countries. I don't spend time in big cities, so I don't know what San Jose's hospitals are like.

Koldwindblows,

After Obumocare tax increases kick in on EVERYONE and people who bought the 'we can all receive free health care' line finds out all the negatives that come with it, you might just be surprised come next election.

And suppose you're the one who winds up surprised? What then, smuck?

Consider yourself taxed, bitch.

Short, simple, and to the point. Very well stated!

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL:

Well, if it is not Ed from the 'The Ed Show' on MSNBC. I see you are spreading your liberal good cheer.

53% approval rating...when you consider the undecided and the margin of error, Obama could conceivably be below where he was before the election.

This poll is merely an attempt by the liberal media to paint a picture of an improvement of this president's ratings AND to belittle the Republicans for not giving in to a president that continues to try and lead in a partisan way.

Smoke and mirrors and a complete waste of time and effort.

If you're a Democrat, this will make your day.

steve-605134:

Mjtt Romney lost the election based on one issue! When he said "I will put America back to work"!

Fifty one percent said "f==k that" and immediately voted for Obanination!

So true!!!!!!

The polls also show that 48% are pessimistic and that 48% are optimistic. This Poll has nothing to do with the eb and flow of a President's approval rating, this is a nation divided! The Democrat's won the election but we're all f^^ked. The "we" being the blue collar and Union workers in particular. Those not effected or not feeling the pinch have Gov't jobs, those pricks are reeling. The American worker under this administration hasn't "won" a damn thing.

Obama can not get one lousy vote from his party on a budget yet America thinks he can fix our economic problems.

WOW

Hello folks, do the American people even care what direction in which they are led. The "fiscal cliff" what a joke! The rich, the “job creators”, might have to pay the lobbyists to have their lackeys in congress pass additional tax loopholes to cover their additional taxes if that even occurs. For the most part the rich shelter all their tax obligations or sit them in off shore accounts while the middle class as usual is the backbone of our society. Nobody is b!tching about the unfunded wars or bank bailouts but in order to protect the tax cuts for the rich the middle class are being told that they will have to endure austerity measures to Social Security and Medicare. These programs by the way are funded through the payroll tax unlike the unfunded wars and bank bailouts. I take it back the taxpayers, their children, their children’s children, etc, will unwittingly fund the wars and bankster bailouts in perpetuity.

The Federal Reserve in their infinite wisdom is ramping up its stimulus to the economy on Wednesday. The central bank replaced a more modest stimulus program due to expire at year-end with a fresh round of Treasury purchases that will increase its balance sheet. It committed to monthly purchases of $45 billion in Treasuries on top of the $40 billion per month in mortgage-backed bonds it started buying in September. That’s right folks, 85 billion a month is needed for as far as the eye can see to keep our economy afloat. If the dollar loses its reserve currency status when you walk into Wal-Mart you will think you walked into Neiman Marcus. It’s not a matter of if but when we crash and it will be spectacular!

The Fed said it will likely keep official rates near zero for as long as unemployment remains above 6.5 percent. They also repeated a pledge to keep buying bonds until the labor market outlook improves substantially.

Under the “Operation Twist” program that will expire at the end of the month, the Fed was buying $45 billion in longer-term Treasuries with proceeds from the sale of short-term debt. The new round of government bond-buying it announced on Wednesday will be funded by essentially creating new money, further expanding the Fed’s $2.8 trillion balance sheet.

Back in September, the Fed predicted the U.S. economy would expand at 3 percent in 2013, but even that modest rate is looking rosy.

While we keep bailing out the banksters who caused this mess to begin with, to add insult to injury, we have to endure the daily corruption the banksters perpetrate on our society.

Let’s recap. The international banking elite with tacit approval from Democrats and Republicans has given the world 1.4 Quadrillion in derivatives fraud, the HSBC drug laundering fraud, the MF Global fraud, the PFG fraud, the high frequency trading pilfering and stock market fraud, the manipulation of the precious metals and bond market fraud, the MERS mortgage fraud, nearly countless individual frauds from both Goldman Sachs and JP Morgan, and the international 800 trillion LIBOR interest rate fixing banking fraud, just to name but a few recent FRAUDS and breaches of Bankster credibility and trustworthiness.

And today we find out that Five hundred police officers raided Deutsche Bank offices and other private residences in Frankfurt, Berlin and Duesseldorf on Wednesday.

According to the prosecution, 25 Deutsche Bank employees have been suspected of serious tax evasion, money laundering and attempted obstruction of justice, including Co-Chief Executive Officer Juergen Fitschen and Chief Financial Officer Stefan Krause.

As if there weren’t enough reasons to get your money OUT OF THE SYSTEM – the FDIC Insurance that currently covers all Temporary Unlimited Coverage for Noninterest-bearing Transaction Accounts FDIC Bank deposits is expiring in 3 weeks!

What will it take to get the American sheeple out of their stupor and stand up to these criminals? The banksters all but boast that they get away with privatizing profits and socializing losses and the sheeple chant USA, USA, USA.

Incumbents to Congress were re-elected by a whopping 88% from both parties. Yet this same Congress only has a 9% approval by the same people who put them back into their Senate and House seats. So with all due respect, everyone who voted to keep these people in power needs to sit down and SHUT UP. YOU own it, whatever they do, or don't do. It's on YOU.

Now for you others saying people who are saying negative things about Obama (who only won with a 51% populate margin victory) are haters, racists, and sore losers, you people too put a sock in it. Dissenters are not going anywhere, not shutting up, and not disappearing. Deal with dissent in this nation. We survived 8 years of Bush with dissent and we WILL survive 8 years of dissent against Obama, unless he bankrupts our azz first...because taxing the "rich" at 100 freaking percent would not pay for his socialist dogma for more than three weeks.

We continually elect "leaders" who do exactly the opposite of what is in our own best interest, "leaders" who manipulate us like puppets to increasingly devolve our liberties, our own self-sufficiency in exchange of more safety, for comfort and dependence. They speak in well, scripted tongue that the masses hold on to. They feign compassion and righteousness while whittling away independence. They invent legislation to usurp our responsibilities that we are all too willing to surrender. We have been conditioned and manipulated to be good servants. Democrats being the worst offenders of the two, to be sure.

Redhead

"I worked for a self-insured Canadian company for 10+ years..."

Interesting...so you basically worked for privatized healthcare carrier in Canada that gave excellent treatment? We can have an intelligent conversation perhaps?

That is interesting...we should talk more. I believe there is a compromise between what obama is proposing and what I know does not work in other countries and this might be a solution.

Where the treatment centers private or state run, and what was the typical waiting period for critical treatment. Advanced treatment?

I correct myself: I should say what he believes will work and what I know will not.

Pretty heavy assumptions on what the Public wants considering only 1,000 people were interviewed for their opinion. An office building can hold 1,000 people which, ironically, is also the standard by which polls are claimed to be conducted as their database.

Once again we stoke the fires of Public discontent... with each other. NEXT!

It's 'Tax the rich'...what are you bitching about??

Hey rgsdca1965 who writes:

RedDevPS

and tax this bitch

Consider yourself taxed, bitch.

LOLOLOLOL you sorry ass

jack-1792739 ...

your insanely expensive, wrought with fraud, entitlements must be cut.

Why don't you explain to me, without being obstreperous, why my entitlements (which I've paid into since I was 14 years old) should be CUT? I certainly agree with outcomes and better handling of dollars going out. But Medicare and Social Security are NOT entitlements. Get it straight. I would suggest you take your obtuse butt out and read up on corporate entitlements and the pork that the GOP cannot seem to bring themselves to cut because if so, they just might lose a few campaign dollars. God forbid they actually do for their constituents what they promised to do. Lose the pork and corporate entitlements. And divorce your sorry asses from the lobbyists that continue to pay for your vacations.

gotta love the Feisty comment: We just had an election and America sent a strong message whether YOU like it or not!

And that strong message would be...?

Obama won by the second lowest margin of victory by an incumbant president in US history. Beating out GWB's reelection by 2/100th of a percentage point.

Let me clarify: Medicare and Social Security were earned by those who paid into it for years. That is sacred. And the GOP isn't going to cut people from this, regardless of the 24/7 liberal biased media saying otherwise. I agree, lobbyists should be eliminated, term limits should be imposed and I would like to see individual bills be presented without pork. All should stand on their own merit. I'm not obtuse, nor am I being obstreperous; I'm being practical. It's a two way street; if you raise my taxes from 37% to 39% great; but the total generated from taxing this select class won't amount to as much as a rounding error. Cuts must be made; and that's where our joke, novelty act of a President won't budge.

Yes Jack my grammar sucks bad I know that but I can turn a buck and pay a bitch like you to work for me any day of the week.

Sure, let Bozobama and his fellow socialists have their moronic way on this demlib-created fiscal cliff, and when the economy continues to tank, as it will, let the demlib socailists OWN it, as they already do. Bozobama will go down as the biggest two-term failure in modern history. Oh, and who is bozoboy going to cry about inheriting this mess of an economy now, hmmmmmmm?

Wow, I can't believe it; I have to admit Feisty is right.....there is a clear mandate. The voters elected 242 Republicans to the House, to only 193 Dems; now, that's a clear mandate, Redhead!

Glen-1484791

Brenda..I agree that the top 2% have to pay more...but listen to this...

During the market crash of '29 the richest people in America could have paid off the national debt. Now they cannot even keep the fed gov running for a year. This build up has occurred over the decades on both the dem and gop watch, even until just recently that taxes have been at historical lows. You can tax the boogyman rich and take everything and it will not fix the problem. International companies are not paying taxes in the global economy nor making jobs. All you are going to do is sap any of the remaining taxpayers trapped here. Do you understand this?

Not true. Clinton had 39% tax rates and the economy did just fine. In fact, it was the best economy in several decades. So to say if you increase taxes on the rich will cause a loss in jobs is simply not true. They may reduce the amount of people working to show President Obama that they are upset, but they don't have to. In fact, you won't be increasing taxes, you will be returning them to Clinton era before Bush came along and lowered them and started this free fall in the first place.

This is why NO one should ever be allowed to sign a pledge to a private organization, they are compromised and biased how they make decision in the best interest of the PEOPLE .... These A-holes are bought and paid for by the RICH.

Wow and I thought feisty redwig was still in rehab with that Southern Comfort problem....

I see the Fed wont raise interest rates until unemployment gets down a bit, which poses a question. Prior to the election the unemployment rate dropped... yet the number of families getting food stamps rose! How can that be, unless the pre election job numbers were wrong?

Food stamps must be paid no matter what... if the gov't has no money to pay for the increase in food stamp requests, then by law they have to borrow the money... exactly what obama wants! You fools voted him in and were cheated! But in reality we all were screwed!

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL---Can you say propaganda. Liberals repeating lies like a car salesman.

jack-1792739 ....

Cuts must be made; and that's where our joke, novelty act of a President won't budge.

I appreciate a good discussion and I liked most of your post. However, when you lower yourself to the comment I noted above, you lost it. The House and Senate need to pass bills prior to the President signing them. You stated you weren't obtuse. However, not realizing that and thinking that the President is the only one in the game ... is very obtuse. We have a President. Not a dictator or king as much as the RW would like to portray him as such.

I didn't care for Bush or Cheney but I certainly respected the office and held my tongue as far as calling them names. I used my vote to silence when the time came and will do as such in the future. I'd suggest the same for you.

Ya see what economics can do. The President started talking about how it's going to cost the average family 2000 dollars a year more and now a lot of the Republican voters now have changed their minds and favor a compromise. Idealim and stubborness fall before the pressure of the mighty dollar. As soon as you make it clear what it's going to cost the decision is made a lot easier. Now our compromise may not solve all our problems but it's a good start. We do have to find a way to cut costs and since I don't think Social Security and Medicare (Medical) should be significantly reduced then the only thing left is to cut way back on our Military spending. We can't afford to police the world. And while we're at it let's cut all aid to Israel, Pakistan, Egypt, etc. etc.

George Hayduke Sr ....

I see the Fed wont raise interest rates until unemployment gets down a bit, which poses a question. Prior to the election the unemployment rate dropped... yet the number of families getting food stamps rose! How can that be, unless the pre election job numbers were wrong?

Food stamps must be paid no matter what... if the gov't has no money to pay for the increase in food stamp requests, then by law they have to borrow the money... exactly what obama wants! You fools voted him in and were cheated! But in reality we all were screwed!

Sure ... let's start with cutting food stamps because God knows, people don't need to eat! The food stamp program is actually one of the best run in the government and eliminates fraud as quickly as it is found. But you're so right. Don't let those children eat because by God you can't pay an extra buck or two a month.

Read once in awhile before letting your fingers run away with your tongue ...

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=3239

Layton, take off your rose colored glasses... obama refuses to cut spending, so there will be no deal... despite the concessions made by the Republicans. Barry's plan wont increase revenue enough to reduce the deficit, ergo taxing the job creators but not cutting spending won't accomplish anything!

Barry has never negotiated a deal in his career, and it seems his record is safe for the next few years... we all suffer in the meantime, but he will still find money to entertain him at the WH and go on those famously expensive vacations....

Sally ... cork it. Boehner & Co want to impress Grover (concessions my ass!). Calling the President Barry and not recognizing that when Bush was in the White House he took more vacations in his first term than President Obama did? Stupid post. Get out of your bubble and read a little bit.

For George regarding foodstamps from the article as I'm sure you won't read it ..

Despite the recent rapid caseload growth, USDA reports that states achieved a record-low SNAP error rate in fiscal year 2011 (see Figure 4.) Only 3 percent of all SNAP benefits represented overpayments, meaning they either went to ineligible households or went to eligible households but in excessive amounts, and more than 98 percent of SNAP benefits were issued to eligible households

Wow! Look, look Sally! The President's plans actually WORK!

Sure ... let's start with cutting food stamps because God knows, people don't need to eat!

Layton dear girl, you've missed the point (again!), I wasn't complaining about the food stamp program, was only questioning why the unemployment numbers are Dropping! Yet food stamp reciepients are growing... which in a normal economy wouldn't happen... unless a lot of people have stopped looking for jobs because obama is making joblessness attractive!

Funny how Fox news shut down the comments section on their website. I think it's because they didn't want their republican voters to really hear the truth and they are actually afraid of comments that would shake the very foundation of their lies. Even after the election they still have the comments shut down. Now, Republicans are forced to come over to msnbc to post because they can't on their own site. Just goes to show that the Democrats are not afraid of criticism like the Fox news Republican website seems to be.

Sally Rocks classically

Layton, take off your rose colored glasses... obama refuses to cut spending, so there will be no deal... despite the concessions made by the Republicans.

What concessions are you talking about?? I guess you didn't hear that Obama went from 1.6 trillion tax increase to 1.4 trillion and also went from 400 billion cut in spending to 600 billion. Meanwhile Boehner just sends back the same offer he sent before. Then you want to tell us that President Obama is unreasonable and that Republicans are giving concessions? Wow, suck much on the fox news juice tit?

George ...

was only questioning why the unemployment numbers are Dropping! Yet food stamp reciepients are growing...

Could it be that *gasp* everyone is for RTW states and having people employed but NOT giving them a decent wage so that they can afford food? The unemployment numbers are dropping because roughly 10,000 baby boomers turn 65 every day. People are looking for work and taking what they can. When the 2%'rs invest in companies like WalMart, PapaJohns, etc., and refuse to pay a decent wage, well then, food stamp need is going to go up. Did you miss my point, again?

Irvmani

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL---Can you say propaganda. Liberals repeating lies like a car salesman.

Isn't that funny. Irvmani you make me laugh. It's like the pot calling the kettle black. The ones spouting propaganda are the Republicans. I guess you republicans have short memories, because you where all saying how the Republicans where going to take the Senate, keep the house, and win the Presidency. Fox news and Rush told you so and so that made it true. Only to find out that you have been spouting propaganda fed to you by the Fox/rush juice factory. Fox news even shut down its comment section so that you wouldn't read any negative comments on its site. Oh p.s. in case your short term memory is in full bloom, President Obama won the popular vote, the electoral vote, all the swing states, The senate is stronger then ever, and the House lost seats. Basically the republicans got a butt kicking. So before you come on here spouting Rush juice, think again, we know what time it is.

Oh Brenda - The only thing you don't mention in your post is that's it Bush's fault in you delirious dribble... If you would only stop watching (and drinking) the lowest rated News organization on the USA then maybe you can begin to think for yourself..

So pray-tell brenda1964 what's your monthly stiffen food stamp (Obama Money) allowance? Can I see your phone bill or do I pay that every moring when I go to work?

Can we get an "Amen" for what happened in a midwest state today...

american girl how is that free health care working out for you since the rest of us will have to pay for it. In response to you post, we all lost Obama was re-elected.

I say let the socialist Democrats have their budget and run us as a country in the ground like they did in Wash. DC and the Peoples Republic of Calif. The American public deserve these thugs for voting them in.

Chelsea Clinton had a "get out the vote" ad that had 3 proposed actions. 1. Register to vote. 2. Get informed. 3. Vote. Unfortunately, the majority of the voters only complied with 1 and 3. An informed voter would have never voted for Obama. The left wants to blame Bush for everything. Yes, he got us into the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan. I was involved in both. The lack of WMD found in Iraq was the thing that the left uses to claim we should never have been involved. Now, those WMD seem to be surfacing in Syria. Imagine that!! Maybe the left needs a geography lesson. In Obama's campaign in 2008, he promised to balance the budget. He has been in office for 4 years and has not even proposed a budget. He (Obama) promised a 'transparent' administration. He won't even release his academic records, while bashing Romney about his tax records (BTW, Romney released 10 years of tax records, more than required by law). Romney paid about 30% of his income in taxes. Warren Buffet, a huge Obama supporter, who said he should have paid more in taxes, employed tax lawyers to reduce his tax liability to the minimum. The cost of those tax lawyers was more than the average American worker would make in wages in his life time. If he (Buffett) was so convinced that he should pay more in taxes, why did he spend so much money to reduce his tax bill. A flat rate, with no deductions, would do far more to even up the tax burden for all. I make over $100K a year and I have no problem paying my fair share. The problem I have is those who pay nothing. I have always given a good portion of my pay to charities. Now that Obama has been re-elected, I figure there is no reason to continue this. I will give to my church and to 1 or 2 other select charities. Otherwise, I will assume that Obama will take care of the rest. I certainly will not donate my money to help those in the NorthEast who suffered from the Sandy Storm. Those residents obviously supported Obama, and they can wait for him to come tho their rescue.

Romney-Ryan and the TEA-Republican's took a severe thumping and now are in denial.

The TEA-Republican leadership didn't learn one %&#@ thing! It was a decisive win and exit polls showed 60% wanted taxes increased on the top 2%. The hardening on the right will pale when the people enter the voting booth in 2014! That can be taken to the bank! Raising of the "Debt Ceiling" and extending the Payroll tax for wage earners should be accomplished first! Social Security(FICA), Medicare, Unemployment benefit extension(FUTA) and the Dream Act should be passed before any other laws are implemented before year end! Failure to do this will tell the voting public exactly who is behind the middle class and who protects the top 2%! All the Gangnam dancing around taxes and debt ceiling is pure hubris on the part of TEA-Republican's.
Call them and tell them to stay away from our Social Programs:

John Boehner's office in Ohio: 513-779-5400
Eric Cantor - 202-225-2815
Mitch McConnell 202-224-2541
John Boehner 202-225-6205.

I have a novel idea, how about the first cut: House, Senate, & any other person (not including the Presidents, past & present) that get goverment entitlements like health insurance & pay for life. Once they leave they have to get their own insurance & pay for it & also lose there pay (maybe a reasonable serverence pay if they do what they are suppose to do & help all the people), why should the tax payers (us) have to pay their entitlements. How about they take responsiblity for themselves & live like most people do.

Another reminder for you Tea Party and Republicans, since you all have SEVERE cases of ROMNESIA:

YOU LOST THE ELECTION BIG TIME!!!! YOUR CRAPPY, MAKE THE RICH RICHER, POLICIES ARE NOT WANTED BY THE REAL AMERICANS. GET OVER IT!!!

Adolf Obama needs to pull his head out of his ego and really look at what the people want, democrats and republicans alike need to compromise. And as for Social Security being an entitlement pay me back what I paid into it for the 45 years I paid in and let me invest it and I can guarantee that I will do a better job than the government. Social security is not an entitlement it is money we paid in out of our hard working dollars got the Barry!!!! Stop giving the social security that I paid in to the illegals and stop giving them medicaid and watch them run back across the border and the medicaid bills go down. Same should be for food stamps not a legal American no food stamps and if you are you should be limited to how long you can be on them UNLESS you are physically or mentally unable to work. People in Washington we hired you to do a job pull your heads out and do it and that includes the EGO IN CHIEF.

m54-- I like your idea. think stright 306257-- I do believe the dems have been willing to compromise, the republicans, well they don't call them the party of no for nothing. let's hope the republicans break out of that mold.

If they are gonna have to compromise they better get a large stock of kleenex for cry baby boehner.

http://www.dropshots.com/GCaplan#date/2012-12-02/14:48:19

http://www.dropshots.com/OldCrow2#date/2011-08-07/09:35:21

"….Obama's pretense of “fairness” and concern for working people, against the backdrop of the supposed looming disaster of the “fiscal cliff,” is a cynical sham. It is a cover for a calculated and ruthless assault on all that remains of the social reforms of the 20th century—most centrally, Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security—combined with a restructuring of the tax system that will cut taxes for corporations and the rich and increase the tax burden on working people…"

Leaked “grand bargain” document details Obama's plan for cuts in entitlement programs

By Barry Grey
15 November 2012

In his first post-election press conference, President Barack Obama on Wednesday reiterated the claim that his focus in deficit-reduction talks with the Republicans is to provide jobs and help the struggling “middle class” recover from the economic crisis.

To this end, Obama declared, he is determined to reach a “balanced” compromise that will require the wealthy to “pay a little bit more.” In practical terms, that means, at most, slightly raising the income tax rates of the richest 2 percent of US households—those making more than $250,000 a year—by allowing the Bush-era tax cuts for this income group to expire on January 1st.

Obama spoke, as always in the vaguest terms, of the need to “reform” Medicare and other social entitlements. He made no mention of the scheduled expiration at the new year of federally funded extended unemployment benefits, a cruel cost-cutting measure that will, if implemented, deprive over 2 million jobless workers of cash assistance.

The real social and class interests served by the administration's fiscal policy were indicated by the next item on the president's calendar—a closed-door White House meeting with the CEOs of 12 of the biggest US corporations, including General Electric, Walmart, American Express, Honeywell, Ford, IBM, Pepsico and Chevron. This gathering of multi-millionaires was convened to ensure that the demands of the corporate elite for drastic cuts in social spending and further tax cuts for big business would be carried out.

Obama's pretense of “fairness” and concern for working people, against the backdrop of the supposed looming disaster of the “fiscal cliff,” is a cynical sham. It is a cover for a calculated and ruthless assault on all that remains of the social reforms of the 20th century—most centrally, Medicare, Medicaid and Social Security—combined with a restructuring of the tax system that will cut taxes for corporations and the rich and increase the tax burden on working people.

The far-reaching and reactionary substance of Obama's social policy emerges very clearly in secret documents that were leaked last weekend relating to negotiations in the summer of 2011 between the White House and Republican House Speaker John Boehner over raising the US debt limit. In response to Republican demands for massive spending cuts in return for an agreement on raising the debt limit, Obama proposed a “grand bargain” to slash the federal deficit by $4 trillion over ten years through a combination of cuts in social programs and increased revenues from “comprehensive tax reform.”

Obama proposed more than $2 in cuts for every $1 dollar in revenue increases ($2.8 trillion in cuts, $1.2 trillion in increased tax revenues). However, the talks broke down due to opposition to any tax increases among House Republicans.

This led to the deal to raise the debt limit that set the stage for the more than $700 billion in automatic across-the-board spending cuts and tax increases, beginning January 1, 2013, that are a major component of the so-called “fiscal cliff.” (See: “What is the fiscal cliff”?).

Speaking on NBC News’ “Meet the Press” program last Sunday, Washington Post investigative journalist and associate editor Bob Woodward announced that he had obtained a copy of the secret final offer from Obama to Boehner for a “grand bargain” on austerity and tax “reform.” NBC posted a portion of the document on the “Meet the Press” web site.

Regarding the document, Woodward said, “But what it shows is a willingness to cut all kinds of things, like TRICARE, which is the sacred health insurance program for the military, for military retirees; to cut Social Security; to cut Medicare. And there are some lines in there about, ‘We want to get tax rates down, not only for individuals, but for businesses.’ So Obama and the White House were willing to go quite far.”

In fact, the document, dated July 19, 2011, spells out an unprecedented assault on social welfare programs and a pro-corporate revamping of the tax system that would have been politically unthinkable for Republican presidents from Reagan to George W. Bush.

On Medicare, the document proposed reducing spending by “at least $250 billion” from 2012 to 2021 and “at least $800 billion” from 2022 to 2031. This would be achieved, in part, by “alteration of the eligibility age for Medicare” and “adjustments to premiums collected for services and benefits currently covered under Part B and Part D.” In other words, the eligibility age for Medicare health coverage would be raised and premiums for a range of hospital and clinical services as well as for drugs would be hiked.

On Social Security, the document proposed changing the formula for the consumer price index (CPI) as applied to cost-of-living increases in benefits so as to slash outlays by $112 billion over 10 years. The new CPI would also apply to veterans' disability payments, cutting $24 billion.

The proposal further stipulated: “Reduce the 75-year estimated shortfall of the Social Security program by 0.7 percent… as a percentage of taxable payroll, with a balanced package of tax and benefit changes.” In plain English: increase payroll taxes and decrease benefits.

In addition to these sweeping cuts in the two most basic entitlement programs, the document spelled out a list of additional reductions, including:

* Civilian retirement, i.e., retirement benefits for civilian federal workers: $33 billion

* Military retirement: $11 billion

* TRICARE drug copayments/TRICARE for Life: $16 billion

* Postal reform: $16 billion

* Pension Benefit Guarantee Corporation: $9 billion

* Flood insurance: $4 billion

* Agriculture subsidies/conservation programs: $33 billion

* Nutrition assistance: $2 billion

* Higher education: $10 billion.

On the tax side, the document proposed to “Enact reform that improves international competitiveness and increases incentives for companies to invest in the United States and succeed globally.” This is an open-ended formula for cutting business taxes and increasing profits through the decimation of social programs and the further impoverishment of the working class.

The document specifically endorsed cutting both corporate tax rates and individual income tax rates for the wealthy, with the injunction to “Reduce the number of individual and corporate income tax rates… reducing each rate to the lowest possible level consistent with the overall revenue target…”

This “get richer, quicker” scheme for the American ruling class, whether or not it is enacted in precisely the form outlined by the White House in July 2011, remains the basic agenda of Obama and the Democratic Party. This was underscored by William Daley, a former top executive at JPMorgan Chase who was White House chief of staff in the summer of 2011 and led the negotiations with Boehner and the Republicans.

Last week, Daley told Bloomberg News that there was “80 to 85 percent” agreement between Obama and Boehner at the time and that the “grand bargain” offer should serve as the starting point for new talks on deficit reduction. “It’s logical that that’s where you'd go back to, the points where there was either agreement or close to an agreement, and try to begin there,” Daley said.

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2012/nov2012/aust-n15.shtml

Everyone must have missed the part that respondents said they would blame BOTH sides equally for the failure of a compromise. So exactly where is Obama's spending cuts? Yes...we are STILL waiting....

flash8

Oh Brenda - The only thing you don't mention in your post is that's it Bush's fault in you delirious dribble... If you would only stop watching (and drinking) the lowest rated News organization on the USA then maybe you can begin to think for yourself..

So pray-tell brenda1964 what's your monthly stiffen food stamp (Obama Money) allowance? Can I see your phone bill or do I pay that every moring when I go to work?

Can we get an "Amen" for what happened in a midwest state today...

#1.93 - Wed Dec 12, 2012 7:50 PM PST

Funny how when a Republican is challenged, they say that you are on food stamps and part of the problem in their eyes. I myself make around 60k and do just fine. I just don't drink from the Rush/fox tit. I live in the real world. Too bad you live for the juice. One day you will wake up and say to yourself, wow, i was drinking the wrong juice. LOL.

Brenda...

"Not true. Clinton had 39% tax rates and the economy did just fine. In fact, it was the best economy in several decades. So to say if you increase taxes on the rich will cause a loss in jobs is simply not true. They may reduce the amount of people working to show President Obama that they are upset, but they don't have to. In fact, you won't be increasing taxes, you will be returning them to Clinton era before Bush came along and lowered them and started this free fall in the first place."

Everything I said in that post is true, Brenda. Your points are well taken but never even mentioned in it. I never said anything about not agreeing to raise taxes, I said we had to. I never said it would cause a loss of jobs. What you fail to realize is that the deficit was huge during the Clinton years but halted in growth, because the economy was booming so much due to investment, baby boomers retirement funds and companies heavy investment (umm these were called businesses that are now considered evil) and deregulation by the Clinton Admin (which by the way got us into trouble 10 years later contributing heavily to the S&L crises and the stock market crash) What I am saying, and I will repeat it again...is that you will not see a boom like that again, companies have gone international and are making money and jobs outside the country and will not be paying taxes and creating jobs. In the meantime we are spending like crazy, and that previous tax base is gone. All that remains are the small businesses, middle and upper middle class that are paying taxes and cannot leave. You can take all that money and it will not prevent the spending addiction or fix the problem. The deficit has grown since 1929 well beyond what taxation of a dwindling tax base can sustain. The GOP is right in their fear of continued spending.

Glen,

Excellent post!! People on the left gloss over the fact that Clinton was one of the luckiest presidents in history. No other president in recent history was fortunate enough to be in office during a time of great economic boom. The tech revolution gave rise to unprecedented growth that will likely never be repeated. So just because the tax rates were that high back then and the economy rolling along don't really have a correlation. What one should consider is that raising taxes during this meager recovery is foolish at best. If the intent is to raise revenue, then serious consideration should be given to closing loopholes (as Senator Obama has stated) and spending must be cut.

Obama is like a dog with a bone with this 2% madness, while ignoring the elephant in the room regarding unchecked spending and no plan to reign in that spending.

Frankly, I would like to see President Obama move "Forward" over the cliff. Everyone should share the pain. Why is that so bad?

The Democratic robbed the SSA in Y2010 by reducing the individual's contribution from 6.2% to 4.2%. Now the SSA is in a deeper financial position. This will only cost the USA about three (3) times more in the future.

Please go ahead and cancel the Y2001 and Y2003 federal income tax bracket reductions. Interesting how all of the Democrats and the Media declare if we do not keep G W Bush's economic policies, the country will fall into an economic recession. Four (4) years ago, they declared his policies caused the recession of Y2009 and a world-wide financial crisis.

Next up is the USA debt ceiling... since 1960, the USA has increased its national debt limit on 72 occasions by Congress.

JK1963:

W J Clinton also had a Republican control Congress for his has last six (6) years in office. The first two (2) years were a joke - even Democrats agree with that fact.

G W Bush and W J Clinton both had the same rate of employment at 94.7% for their entire eight (8) years. Plus, Bush had a Democrat control Congress his last two (2) years.

Your points on spending ignores just a few points. The only program Obama created was Obamacare which is fully funded. It's nice to quote the republican line about reigning in spending but republicans never do that. How was a new drug plan initiated by Bush unfunded costing 100 billion a year fiscally responsible? How was fighting 2 wars off budget and unfunded fiscally responsible? Romney shook his finger at all the social programs sucking up money but proposed a 200 billion a year increase in military funding that military leaders never requested. Romney also proposed restarting the space program that could cost 40 or 50 billion a year or more.

People might pay more attention to the republican rhetoric if they practiced what they preached. Telling everyone we can't afford 70 billion a year on the food stamp program but can afford 200 billion thrown at the military just for the hell of it doesn't make me think they're serious about the debt. Bush's last budget that ran from Oct. 2008 till Oct. 2009 had a 1.2 trillion deficit. The deficit didn't hit the 1 trillion mark under Obama, Bush broke it soundly. Trying to go back in history to attribute luck to explain Clintons success and bad luck Bush's lack of same is simply something you'll never sell as you've tried for 5 years. Even if policies created decades ago attributed to our housing meltdown, after 8 years as president you'd never allow a democrat to distance himself from such a failure.

Who had control of congress is a right wing strategy to deflect blame. Congress doesn't initiate any spending programs, the president as leader does. Reagan revamped our tax code and did the biggest peace time military buildup in history including star wars. Congress merely approved the spending. Bush cut taxes 400 billion a year and started a new drug program costing 100 billion a year. Congress merely approved it. Obama initiated Obamacare not congress. Name any major program that was initiated by congress. You people need to quit with the congress blame, it's lame. The reason the debt doubled under Reagan and tripled under Bush is because they spent that much more than they took in. Getting democrats in congress to accept it with fire side chats and such doesn't make them democratic plans.

Larry,

You act like Democrats just sat around and let all this spending happen all by itself. Democrats approved time after time the appropriations for the two wars you like to squawk about. All the president has to do is stop funding the wars and guess what? They're over... You act like the Democrats just blindly went along and approved year after year spending without once thinking where the money was coming from. This whole "off the books" mentality is the left's way of blaming Bush, when in fact the same Democrats that cry now about it "being on the books" were the same ones year after year approving the spending. Don't try and hide behind the Blame the Bush game, ok?

If Social Security is in so much trouble, then how did Congress justify "borrowing" $70 billion from its trust fund in 2011? Congress owes over $4 trillion to the Social Security trust fund. I bet that is on the top of their lists of things to pay back - NOT! Maybe it wouldn't be in such financial trouble if they would keep their greedy hands out of the cookie jar and diverting that money to projects the benefit the wealthy - seriously, who is the real entitlement class? Those who wait for some mythical "trickle down" plan to splash something on their head or the wealthy who pocket our hard earned tax dollars and give nothing back in return? So they are going to make cuts to social programs for the poor and middle class, which in layman's terms means more tax money can be diverted to the wealthy.

You can blame the Republican Party You can blame the Democrats I BLAME YOU SHEEP! We would not be having this problem if you hadn't voted for the sheepherder - a herder of sheep (on an open range); someone who keeps the sheep together in a flock because they can't think for them selves and need to be guided through life because they can't do anything on their own and are led to slaughter because the don't have a mind of their own and can't see the dismal end coming.

It was off the books, and Bush is to blame. Funny how repugs whine about Bush getting the blame when it was his policies that got us into this mess. And you claim Democrats are just as much to blame when the repugs controlled the house, senate, and the Presidency. By the way, Medicare part D was passed when a suprise vote took place at 3 a.m. The Wars were based on lies and faulty intel which the Bush administration knew was false and outdated. As for the Bush tax cuts, I remember many Demorcats saying it was bad idea to give these cuts while DICK cheney said "deficits don't matter". Of course all of sudden the deficit does matter because a Democrat is in office.

It doesn't matter if your Republican or Democrat. It is time that something happens. This country has been in recession for over 4 years and we still still have " a failure to communicate". My opinion remains that we must do something about trade if we are ever to recover from our slow economy. These free trade aggrements have been devestating to jobs in this country. If we were to impose the same regulations on companies overseas that we do here in order for a product to be sold here we would see work returned. Over regulation more than wages has sent jobs offshore IMO. Polution,Safety and labor laws cut profits. Yes wages factor in but on average Wages are less than 8% of the cost of doing business. Wages is simply the easiest to attack is why we hear so much about it. A CEO and his accounts can clamor how much labor cost they can save a lot easier than they can figure out how to avoid the other regulations that are truely hurting the bottom line. It takes too much efforet to find ways to cut costs in the other 92% of the expense sheet although the biggest savings are to be found there.

We need jobs here to support our economy. When NAFTA and other "free" not "Fair" trade agreements were signed they should have included clauses that forced manufacturures to comply with our regulations here or not be elegible to import to the USA. By not requireing the same standards we have given China and India and others an unfair advantage that is well beyond what wages do. If polutions is a big concern here because it is hurting our environment it is hurting the environment worse in unregulated counties and we are still responsible for it because we are still the consumer of those goods.

It is not only time for our leaders to step up and make real efforts to curb our debt but also balance the playing field on the world trade front so we have a fair shot at the jobs that we need to sustain our economy. There is much more to our problems than most are even talking about. The root cause is lack of good paying manufacturing jobs. Al Gore can hug all the trees he wants because he has enough money not to need to work. The rest of us need jobs that pay fair wages. Without them this recession will run for many more years and we will have less and less to work with.

I love the far Right and Left - they serve a real purpose in my life - balance. In order to achieve personal balance, I have to compromise every minute of every day. So why are posters arguing why the parties they support shouldn't have to compromise? You guys & gals are scary - but at least I found a use for you...lol.

We in the majority, many of which don't vote for obvious reasons, know there will never be compromise - in either the government or your personal lives. Post all the facts you want that support your agendas, you are good for the economy, the health industry depends on your strokes, heart attacks, and alcohol rehab.

Chandler W.

The only reason the right wing won't compromise is their irrational but deep hatred of Barack Obama.

Chandler W.

How true. Before the GOP will work with an African American president, this recalcitrant party will allow America to fail. The right is a torch bearer of the worst chapters in this country's past e.g. no Social Security, no Medicare or Medicaid, no wealth for the middle class, no helping hand to lift the poor, voter disenfranchisement, no empowerment of women, racial segregation, unjustifiable wars, polluting coal stack industries and child labor.

In its belief that congress should usurp the powers of the presidency, the GOP mirrors the Whig party.

This poll is irrelevant - it is based on the wishes of the people - look up the word "wish" in the dictionary...lmao.

How many billions do politicians spend every two years to get elected? I didn't give them a dime, and I expect the same return on my investment - nothing. Guess who does expect a big return - from both parties?

Avenger; how old are you? Before regulations; our rivers caught on fire, our cars left a lovely blue trail behind them, our forests didn't get re-planted................. I think I'll pass on your reasoning; my grand children can thank me later.

J_P_PatchesPal_1

I am 59 years old...My point ( appearantly you couldn't grasp it) was that if our manufacturuers must follow health , safety and other regulations for the protection of our environment and workers ,then we should as a county require any country who imports to the US follow the same regulations. I am not for one minute saying we should not regulate some of those areas even though some regulations do cause un needed burden with no real gain. By not requireing imported products to be produced by the same standard we are simply giving an unfair advantage to other counties at our workers expense. If we did this one thing we would see jobs come back because wages are not the bigger cost factor when exporting jobs.

G W Bush and W J Clinton both had the same rate of employment at 94.7% for their entire eight (8) years.

Easily checked. Get the numbers from BLS website. You can download the unemployment data by month as an Excel spreadsheet and manipulate the numbers yourself.

Now it is true that the average unemployment rate for both presidents was approximately the same averaged over 8 years: 5.2% for Clinton, 5.3% for Bush.

But that is not the whole story. Let's look a little closer:

Clinton started with 7.3% unemployment. He ended with 3.9% unemployment

Bush started with 4.2% unemployment. He ended with 7.3% unemployment (and unemployment was rising faster than Halliburton's profits!)

Pretty interesting, eh?

We view government as being as good or as bad as We The People decide to make it, and we tend to feel that we each of us has an obligation to our government, "and to the Republic for which it stands", that goes well beyond just going out and voting every other November.

Excellent comment, Fox!!

@Sally Rocks classically

Layton, take off your rose colored glasses... obama refuses to cut spending, so there will be no deal... despite the concessions made by the Republicans. Barry's plan wont increase revenue enough to reduce the deficit, ergo taxing the job creators but not cutting spending won't accomplish anything!

Sally, take off your dark glasses and turn off Fox 'News'. Obama has already made spending cuts and has proposed further cuts. Quit rocking and start paying attention.

It has been amply demonstrated that tax cuts for the rich do not create jobs. WAKE UP!!

Barry has never negotiated a deal in his career, and it seems his record is safe for the next few years... we all suffer in the meantime, but he will still find money to entertain him at the WH and go on those famously expensive vacations....

haha...that's so ridiculous it's not worth commenting on. Your side lost the election. Now put on your big girl panties and deal with it like an adult.

How come all you liberals are not posting on the other article where Democrats want to delay taxes because it will kill jobs in Obamacare? I know you saw it.

I would think you liberals would be very upset with your Democrats stopping taxes in Obamacare. Yet, hardly any posts at all.

Why are you not blasting those Democrats because taxes doesn't kill jobs?....Or, do they?

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL

Oh Dear!

There is that "C" word again!

Why does Boehner sound like a cat *coughing* up a hair ball every time he attempts to utter it?

Compromise is a 2 way street and should be approached in this case by what is best for all Americans, not just to meet party ideology or campaign promises.

I would blame Bonerhead and his Tea Loonies in Congress, the President is the Voice of the American people, that's why he got voted in, "Majority Rules" !!!!!!!!!!!!!

So the gop is resistant to change: People voted and got who they wanted. Now we wait to see how the dems manage the resistance. So the votes are counted now let's see what we voted for. Results please!

I prefer to go off the cliff to raising the age of retirement for hard working people. There is no evidence it will save us much money, as the expense for people is when they die. Some will die in the time gap but if they have no insurance it fall back to the taxpayer. Many may just delay going to the doctor, which just raise the cost. The tea party idea of defaulting of our loans is crazy stupid. But me may need them to do it to get rid of them.

american girl ---- obama won the election with only 1/2 million votes in the only 4 states which mattered ------ you can call 1/2 million votes a mandate if you wish, but i do not.

I read all these post and I see the conclusion I have reached all along: WE GOT HERE BECAUSE OF CONGRESS not doing its job, both Dems and Gop alike. You cannot blame any president in office for all the whoes of the nation since it is congress's job to prevent him from doing anything stupid or not in their constituents (the people) best interest. Their own party lines or majority be damned.

And for those of you who think Bush is not heavily responsible for excess spending, he was.

And for those of you who think Obama is no responsible for excess spending, he is.

And for those of you who think that Obama care is funded...IT IS NOT. Look up the laws...the IRS can do nothing to really collect the money if you as an individual decide not to pay. It is a joke, and if you do not want to pay and do not have anything to lose, everyone else must pay the insurance companies (which we are all doing now) and the premiums are going to skyrocket because if 50% of the people do not pay and other 50% must pay for themselves and the others if they are to be covered OR if they are paid for by the governments which is done now. If the policies are not covered privately then the insurance companies would not take the loss to stay in business and still raise the premiums. Choices are: government pays OR it is run through private insurance and the taxpayers pay for the premiums directly. This is not "funded". It is a forced shell game imposed by an inefficient and bankrupt government with a track record as such, both Dem and GOP alike

I saw a piece the other night on the news where a report asked random people on the streets about the "fiscal cliff" and what they knew about it and thought about it. Almost NONE of the people polled had ANY IDEA WHATSOEVER what it even is! Some thought it was a real cliff. Most had ZERO knowledge of it. Most Americans have no idea what it is. SO when you poll them, how can the results have any bearing on reality? Yeah, most will blame the republicans because Obama travels around the country telling the news stations that he's put forth a "balanced" approach and all the republicans want to do is give tax breaks to the wealthy. So that's all they know (and they don't even KNOW that. They've just heard it.)

If people were engaged enough to learn about the issues, they would understand that the rich are NOT getting a tax cut. In fact, with Obamacare, everyone is getting tax increases. Even the rich. But why should we let facts get in the way?!

ronpal

american girl ---- obama won the election with only 1/2 million votes in the only 4 states which mattered ------ you can call 1/2 million votes a mandate if you wish, but i do not.

Only four states out of fifty"matter"?

I think the voters in those other forty-six states would be very offended by your dismissive attitude.

As far as the word 'mandate' goes, the POTUS has whatever mandate he can muster...and it sure looks like the Republicans are the underdogs at this point in history. If you disagree, that's fine. You don't have to agree with everything Obama does. You just have to live with it, the same as we had to live with the decisions Dubbya made.

Have a nice day. :)

Kaybee,

Why can't you show the same amount of respect for former president Bush as you show for President Obama? Perhaps you would be happy me referencing Obama by his middle name? So the more balanced comment would be "You don't have to agree with everything Hussein does. You just have to live with it, the same as we had to live with the decisions W (Dubbya) made." There....much better!

Democrats left and right are begging for waivers from Obamacare for the tax increases.

Liberals everywhere must UNITE against these Democrats who are trying to keep their 1% lobbyists from paying their fair share.

Why are Democrats asking for tax increase waivers from Obamacare?

YOU MUST STOP THE DEMOCRATS!!! PAY YOUR FAIR SHARE!!!! GO LIBERALS GO!!!!!

american girl ---- as to those house races ---- 13 of the seats the dems won were by an average vote margin of only 4260 votes, and the republicans defeated one house incumbent. ------- doesn't sound like much of a mandate to me. ------------------------------- kaybee ---- thanks to the electoral college, many people's votes do NOT count for much --- in lop-sided states, your vote doesn't mean much because the state is already going either red or blue. ---- there were only 4 states that decided the outcome in this election.

I've got a different tale to tell--a national health care system is the only sane way to go!

When will the US have a national healtcare system? Whatever Obama engineered, I'm not eligible for it. And I'm a US citizen. So it's not national healthcare. It's a farce.

PPS: 53% approval rating for the President! OUCH! That has got to sting!

53% for a President that was elected just weeks ago....impressive. <sarc>

TO: spider-737231 who wrote:

"Wow, I can't believe it; I have to admit Feisty is right.....there is a clear mandate. The voters elected 242 Republicans to the House, to only 193 Dems; now, that's a clear mandate, Redhead!"

How did Republicans make out with taking over the White House?

Yeah, that's a "mandate" too!

Tea Party refuses to compromise and is just an obstructionist, destructive force in our country.

Wouldn't it be More Productive if Our Elected Leaders Started Working Together as AMERICANS for AMERICANS and AMERICA, instead of just bickering, stalling and posturing for the next election as democrats and republicans! The American People have had it with this unproductive BS! The way that both parties having been operating for years just stinks! Neither party has really been looking out for the best interests of the US Citizens who elect them and who they're supposed to represent.

Both parties have sold out the bulk of the American citizens, who they're supposed to represent, by allowing the "out-sourcing" floodgates to open wider and wider without taking any sensible measures to stem the tide.

It shouldn't be all about Democrats or Republicans! It should be about Americans, especially our elected officials, doing the right thing for our country and its citizens. All the single-minded, left versus right, ideological one dimensional bull has got to go!

Both parties need to start working together and actually start doing something to fix the real problems in our country like "out-sourcing", illegal immigration, the out of control costs of health care insurance and our reliance on foreign fuel. If they don't start working together and actually start making progress by the next election, then American citizens should run a nation-wide campaign to vote out all incumbents regardless of party to send the message.

And yes - I'm Angry - As are most American Citizens right now!

The ONLY REAL FIX is to Raise Revenue, by Bringing Back Jobs to US Citizens who Pay Income Tax.

Massive cutting just puts more people on unemployment, which just depresses the economy even further.

Returning private sector jobs to American Citizens will provide income tax revenue to OUR Government versus our government having to pay unemployment benefits to those who would be jobless instead. We need our elected officials to Start Protecting American Jobs and do whatever it takes to bring back the jobs they let go. We need leaders who will actually stand up for the American people.

The bottom line is that “Our Government” has to protect domestic industry and the jobs that those industries provide. If they do that, the rest will take care of itself.

We may have to pay a bit more for products made here in the USA by US citizens, but at least we'll still have jobs and a future for our children.