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Subscribe to RSSMore GOPers coming to the conclusion that they should fold their fiscal cliff hand to live another day… What a Tuesday in the battle for the heart and soul of GOP (rejection of UN treaty, Bush speech on immigration, speeches by 2016ers)… 2016 and going in the opposite direction: Rubio focuses on middle class, Ryan implicitly criticizes “47%”… DSCC gets their guy (Michael Bennet) and keeps the other Guy (Cecil, that is)… And meet Krysten Sinema.
With a little over three weeks to go, NBC's Chuck Todd weighs in on the state of negotiations and the difference between the two plans proposed by Republicans and Democrats as the fiscal cliff deadline looms.
*** Know when to hold’em, know when to fold’em: More Republicans and conservatives are coming to the conclusion that they have a bad hand to play in the fiscal battle with Democrats and the Obama White House (see John Podhoretz in today’s New York Post and the Washington Examiner’s Conn Carroll). And what does a smart poker player usually do when holding a bad hand? You fold to live another day. It’s what Rep. Tom Cole (R-OK) pushed for last week, which got universally poo-poo’d by the GOP leadership. Now? The New York Times reports that GOP members and leaders are considering extending the Bush-era tax cuts for the middle class -- but resuming the larger fight over the budget and spending when it’s time to raise the debt ceiling. “There’s always better ground, but you have to get there,” Rep. Michael Burgess (R-TX) told the Times. The good news here: If you don’t want to go off the cliff, then it’s clear Republicans won’t dig in; they are talking about a way out. The bad news: Such a move only postpones the real fight. If Republicans do pursue this path, they’ll have a stronger hand to play politically than they currently do now (because the middle-class tax cuts would be off the table). But the White House would also still have some cards to play (over the eventual tax rates in any kind of tax reform, the estate tax, and a willingness to budge on entitlements). Remember, the debt ceiling standoff in July 2011 was bad of the president, but it was worse for the GOP’s brand.
*** Playing to the base, Part 2: We wrote yesterday that the initial fiscal-cliff offers from the White House (last week) and House Republicans (on Monday) seemed more like efforts geared at the bases than at real negotiating. But there was one big difference between the two offers: Democrats and liberals mostly cheered the White House’s proposal, while some Republicans and conservatives criticized the House GOP one. Example: "Speaker Boehner's $800 billion tax hike will destroy American jobs and allow politicians in Washington to spend even more, while not reducing our $16 trillion debt by a single penny," Republican Sen. Jim DeMint said in a statement, per NBC’s Mike O’Brien. In Reason, Peter Suderman had a good take on the two offers. “Both opening bids are best understood as positioning statements rather than actual stabs at putting together a viable deal. They tell you as much about how the parties want to be perceived than they do about what might actually make up the substance of an eventual agreement: Obama wants to be seen as strong. Republicans want to be seen as reasonable.”
Alex Wong / Getty Images
Speaker of the House Rep. John Boehner, R-Ohio, speaks during the lighting ceremony of the 2012 Capitol Christmas Tree Dec. 4, 2012 at the West Front Lawn of the U.S. Capitol in Washington, DC.
*** What a Tuesday in the battle for the heart and soul of the GOP: Yesterday was a pretty amazing day in the fight for control of shaping the Republican Party going forward. So you had the pragmatists (as mentioned above) urging GOP lawmakers to fold on extending the Bush tax cuts on income above $250,000. You had Senate Republicans rejecting a U.N. treaty banning discrimination against those with disabilities because of concerns that it would impact America’s sovereignty. (Essentially, a bunch of Senate Republicans were running scared of the Tea Party/Ron Paul crowd. Just one GOP senator up in 2014, Susan Collins from Maine, voted for the treaty, but every other 2014 GOP senator voted no. And one of them, Thad Cochran, voted yes at first and then when he saw it was going down, switched.) But you also had George W. Bush urging Washington to soften its rhetoric on immigration. And then you had addresses by potential 2016ers Marco Rubio and Paul Ryan, who tried to distance themselves from the image and message of Romney’s failed presidential campaign (more on that below).
*** 2016 and going in the opposite direction: After losing a presidential election, it’s only natural for a political party to begin looking in the opposite direction. So in the wake of longtime Sen. Bob Dole’s defeat in 1996, Republicans eventually turned to a relatively young governor with new ideas for the GOP (George W. Bush). After John Kerry lost in 2004, Democrats later nominated an exciting and history-making figure (Barack Obama). And on the heels of Sen. John McCain’s defeat after the economic collapse of 2008, Republicans this year turned to a former governor with management experience and a business background (Mitt Romney). This is the context to understand last night’s speeches at the Jack Kemp Foundation dinner by potential 2016ers Marco Rubio and Paul Ryan, both of whom tried to distance themselves from the image of Romney’s campaign -- even though Ryan served as Romney’s running mate.
*** Rubio and the middle class: For his part, Rubio focused much of speech on re-building the middle class. “The existence of a large and vibrant American middle class goes to the very essence of America’s exceptional identity. Every country has rich people. But only a few places have achieved a vibrant and stable middle class. And in the history of the world, none has been more vibrant and more stable than the American middle class,” he said last night. “Government has a role to play. And we must make sure it does its part. But it’s a supporting role… It is not the ever expanding reach of government, but rather having access to the benefits of thriving economy that allows the poor to rise into the middle class. Not by making rich people poorer, but by making poor people richer.” Why is this messaging significant? According to the exit polls from last month’s election, Obama beat Romney by 10 points (53%-43%) on which candidate was more in touch with people like you. In addition, 53% said Romney’s policies would favor the rich (versus just 10% who said the same about Obama).
*** Ryan and his implicit critique of 47 percent: Meanwhile, in his first public speech since losing the presidential contest, Paul Ryan praised Romney, per NBC’s Alex Moe. “And though I wish this election had turned out differently, I’m proud of the campaign Mitt Romney and I ran. He would have been a great president, and it would have been an honor to serve this country at his side.” But Ryan also appeared to distance himself from Romney’s infamous “47%” comment, as well as the GOP presidential nominee’s analysis that he lost the election because Obama showered “gifts” on African Americans and Latinos. “Both parties tend to divide Americans into ‘our voters’ and ‘their voters,’” he said. “But Republicans must steer far clear of that trap. We must speak to the aspirations and anxieties of every American.” And Ryan also said this in his speech: “Losing is part of politics, and can often prepare the way for the greatest victories.”
*** DSCC gets their guy (Bennet) and also keeps their other Guy (Cecil, that is): Also yesterday, Democrats announced that Sen. Michael Bennet (D-CO) will chair the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee next cycle – as the party tries to hold onto its majority. And current DSCC Executive Director Guy Cecil, who headed Bennet’s successful 2010 campaign, will stay in his post.
*** Meet Krysten Sinema: NBC’s Carrie Dann has profiled 10 fresh faces to watch in the new Congress, and we’ll be previewing one of these each day. Today’s profile: Incoming Arizona congresswoman Kyrsten Sinema. Dann writes: “Fresh off a nasty campaign in which opponents painted her as a hippie who enjoys the occasional ‘pagan ritual,’ Arizona freshman Kyrsten Sinema is no stranger to tough campaigns. The first openly bisexual member of Congress, Sinema -- who served as an Arizona state house member and senator -- can also boast leading a 2006 effort to defeat a same-sex marriage ban ballot initiative in Arizona. The 36-year-old social worker, who once quipped that she's a ‘Prada socialist’ in a magazine interview, jousted with Gov. Jan Brewer on education issues during her tenure in the legislature, warranting a hefty contribution from the governor's political action committee to Sinema's opponents. Education policy, jobs, and addressing foreclosures will be her top priorities as a federal lawmaker. Sinema's spokesman recently told The New York Times that the new congresswoman, who was raised a Mormon, supports a ‘secular approach’ to government.”
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Leave a Comment:
If republican business owners could hire illegals to work for 4.00 an hour provide them with no benefits and pay no taxes would that make them happy?
prog. do you ever get tired of being a douche bag??
it would me at least they work and dont cry about how much money i have
joe explain please?
To PROG1. You think Dems. are truly right and just? If you do, you are living in Lala land. I don't see where Dems. have a monopoly on integrity. I remember reading articles on the Kennedys and how cheap they were towards their help. There are benevolent people and those that are users on both sides. So don't demonstrate a holier than thou attitude.
prog.1, let's try, do you ever weary of being a retard!
My comments only point out how inconsistent conservatives are in their logic. Generally speaking conservatives have been aganist the end of slavery, civil rights for blacks, equal rights for money and anything else that makes this a country that tries to include everyone in the dream that it is a country for all the people.
All of you right wingers can rant about Obama to your heart's content. The fact is that he won the election, the Dems picked up seats in both the House and the Senate and the writing is on the wall. Voters are sick to death of your slanders and lies, sick to death of your hatred and conspiracy theories. Come 2014, your House majority will be history and the rebuilding of America will begin in earnest.
The voters are going to take their country back. They are going to tax the rich and rewrite the code to eliminate the loopholes for the rich. They are going to put in laws against keeping your entire workforce on part time hours and they are going to bring manufacturing back to the US, with or without the help of the rich and the right.
You rwnjs are an anachronism, the death throes of the neolithic mind set of the hatred and bigotry are unfolding in front of us and you refuse to see it. There is no good reason for a multi-billionaire to be given the keys to the kingdom. There is no good reason to believe that we must submit to the greedy extortionism of the Koch brothers and their ilk. They are going to have to step up and pay their fair share. They have been taking from this country for years. Now they are going to have to put something back.
You remind me of the playground bully. He isn't content to have nine of the ten blocks. He demands to have them all, and when others suggest that he is being selfish he accuses them of being jealous of his good fortune. Never mind that he bopped a bunch of kids over the head and stole the blocks in the first place. He wants them all, and he gets indignant if anyone dares to question his right to hoard all the toys.
So enjoy your last gasp. Your time of rampant greed and theft is coming to an end. You will have to put back the toys that you stole. You are going to have to learn to play well with others. You are going to learn the rules of civilized and compassionate behavior or you are going to be relegated to the dusty back closets of history.
and yet we have the house and usama cant do sh*t unless we let him
I have one thing to say "BRAVO" !!!!!!!
I tip my hat to "W" for his recent remarks on Immigration splitting from the neo-nazis dominationg the GOP
I'm sure that makes him proud.
The GOP should be punting..and after that it will be first down and goal to go for Obama! A few weeks later...TOUCHDOWN!!!
There was a artical that discussed that we as Americans had it too easy with taxes, well if you think about it the artical was right. We want ALL the perks but do NOT want to pay for them. Sorry folks you can't have it both ways, although there are some that would lead you to believe that you can. We have two wars, tax cuts and a medicare law ALL unpaid for. Now when someone tells us that we have to stop the wars, downsize the tax cut, put the brakes on wall street and so on. Some of us, say that will not work. We need to fight terrorism, the wealthy produce jobs and wall street has the answers to all of out ills ! I say yes we need to fight the terrorists, the wealthy do NOT produce jobs in the 21st Cen. IT and supported fields do, and as for wall street they have done enough damage. Do NOT let them out of their present box.
Can we please notget into a partisan pissing match? Why don't you people actually come up with
ideas? I'm a left-leaning independent, but here are my ideas to solving the
fiscal cliff, pushing the economy forward, reducing poverty, and forcing politicians
to be responsible.
1)Limit congressional terms to 2 or 3 maximum per person.
2)Allow voters across the united states the ability to vote on whether or not individual
congressmen receive their pensions and health benefits based on whether or not
the people sees them as productive. On a side note, limit those benefits and
pensions to 5 years after their congressional careers end.
3)Scrap the entire current tax code and start over with the basics of a tiered (graduated) rate
system with few deductions except for disability, children/dependents, or being
a college student. Alternatively, scrap the income tax altogether and create a
universal federal sales tax split into 2 categories: necessities and luxuries.
According to projections by forbes in 09, a universal sales tax on all products
of 16% would have made up more than 50% of Bush's deficit for the previous
year. I propose a less stringent 12-13% on necessities such as food and toilet
paper, and a 20-21% rate on luxuries like private jets. We have the tech such
that almost all work even executives do can be done via video conference.
Private jets do not a business expense make, unless you are a distribution
company and those jets are your method to transport goods.
4)Slice 10% of military spending, as CBO and others have concluded at least that much of the
budget is lost in middlemen and frivolous expenses.
5)Limit welfare to 60 days after unemployment, limit food stamps to food, increase the penalties
on using them for other items, and create a private industry system which
employs the unemployed after 60 days for an annual salary of $20,000. If people
want better, they can go looking for it/get educated for it. Given the current
rate of unemployment, this plan will only cost 240 billion each year, and the
increased GDP due to (in my head a manufacturing operation) production will
partially cover the loss, which is already less than our current welfare
system.
6)Scrap 95% of "No Child Left Behind." Teachers and school admin should be held
accountable, but it's time to stop catering to the lazy and willfully stupid.
If you have a mental disorder such as ADD, you do the work/therapy/medicine to
keep it under control. If you have anger management issues, get them fixed.
Parents, your role in this is crucial. Bottom line: we must start demanding
excellence from our students again. I propose we go the way of China and Europe
in this. Actual college professors, not the goons hired by the college board,
should be given charge to write tests which gauge students' mastery of basic
content at a certain age (various countries differ on exactly when) to separate
the stronger learners from the weaker ones and put them on two separate tracks.
6-B) Partially to make warmongering politicians more responsible, reinstate the draft so they are
forced to swallow the fact they are now toying with non-volunteers' lives. Now,
those students who fall into the lower track and remain there to the end of
their schooling, will be the ones forced to serve in the military for, let's say,
2 years minimum, 4 maximum. At any point these students may do independent
study and voluntarily test back up into the higher track if they so choose. But
the incentive to do well would now be in place.
7)Reform capital gains taxation by penalizing practices which have made people rich by betting
on companies to fail (aka Bain Capital and most of wall street today) such as
mass short sales and leverage buyouts, as these practices in the end destroy
business and layoff thousands of people just because big sharks don't like to
play nice. Reward practices which stimulate the economy such as maintaining
investments. Most of the normal trades business can remain as is.
8) The healthcare debacle: I point you to Germany, a country ranking above our own in healthcare
internationally. That means they beat us on availability while maintaining our
quality. This means: single-payer, public-option, socialized healthcare. I know
socialism generally is a bad idea economically, but this happens to be the one
place it belongs. You pay as you go, buy what you need, everyone pays in, and
premiums go down (because you already pay the insurance companies to cover care
for those without insurance, so socialized healthcare does not make you pay for
other people's healthcare). Drug companies are forced to bid for government
contract and be competitive, not just lucrative. This will incentivize cures,
not just treatments like we see today with big pharma. I'd bet you the cost of
my college education the cure for HIV currently sits somewhere locked up within
the CDC, Phizer, J&J, Bristol Meyers Squib, et al.
Newly added
since this morning:
-On elections: limit campaigning to 30 days before the election, just like
the UK does it. This means the runners don't have time to flip flop on issues
and must have a damn good platform to run on the first time out. Dissolve
Citizens United and the Super PACs (via repealment) in order to move those
billions in ad campaigns to a useful area of the private sector.
These ideas submitted by a left-leaning independent with 8 years of college education (3 at
Miami University in Oxford Ohio, 5 at Rensselaer Polytechnic Institute in troy
New York).
Please offer constructive feedback and collaboration, not partisan rhetoric. Let's get a
plan together and force those hacks in Washington to really compromise.
1) Why term limits? So you lose the experience of wise legislators? Remember that money=power, and money can line up would-be congressmen to do its bidding more easily than we can find an honest man.
2) Punishing congressmen by limiting perks is trivial. Many in congress are millionaires, and many more expect their real profit to come when they return to the private section and their corporate backers reward them. In fact, cutting congressional pay just cuts out those of modest means, and does nothing to combat the corruption of having big money donors run our system.
3) Everyone wants a better tax code. The problem is that right now, you don't have honest debate in congress over even the simplest of matters; there's no way we could improve the tax code with the current divide. Maybe if you got supermajorities of Democrats in both houses, but can you imagine Boehner and Reid agreeing on any change in the tax code?
4) Cutting the military budget is a great idea, but recognize that each dollar cut is a dollar lost from the US economy. Massive cuts mean unemployment and manufacturing jobs lost. A wiser approach is what we did in the 1990s, which involved mostly an end to expansion. Hold spending constant and no jobs are lost, meanwhile the GDP grows and the %GDP spent on the military comes down.
5) Welfare is a distraction. It amounts to $20b and it does good for the least among us. We Americans do the worst of any industrialized nation at caring for our poor, and it is a big cause of our shorter life spans and greater crime rate. There are better ways to combat poverty, I will agree, but I'd spend more in this area to have lower costs in the long run.
6A, 6b, 7 and 8 all sound good to me. But again, sudden changes are bad for the system. I think we have the perfect guide in the experience of 1993 to 1999. Raise taxes a little, hold spending to be near constant, and wait for the economy to grow. It works. It worked for the 1950s, it worked for the 1960s (and in fact, in those decades, we had way more discretionary spending because of the cold war), and it worked in the 1990s. We know how to get our budget under control and have national prosperity. We've done it time and time again.
All we need to do is listen to the moderates. Right now, that means vote Democratic.
The greatest number of rich in the congress are Democrats? not so? Kinda funny they hate the rich--themselves?
Rich democrats are more willing to share their money and pay a higher amount of taxes witness the rich Hollywood types who in great numbers supported Obama. To a democrat more money means something different than it does to republicans. Republicans want to keep their money and hoard it or use it just to make more money.
prog. more lies huh. Try looking up to see who gives more to charities and you will find out the real answer. Again, more ignorant comments from a douche bag
they have the right to pay extra if they want
Joe, according to the IRS, registered democrats made 56% of all charitable donations last year.
Charitable contributions aside if you are rich and a candidate tells you he will raise your taxes and you vote for him then it is obvious that you agree with him.
Patrick, I didn't know the IRS asked what party you are affiliated with?
Ozzie, the IRS has access to all of your basic information, including voter registration.
Patrick, you are a liar. Google "who gives more to charities, repubs or Dems" and every article clearly states REPUBS. Everyone knows you liberals are a bunch of phony, hypocrite cheap ba$turds.
Oh, so they put out a list by party affiliation? Never seen or heard of such a thing can you direct me to it?
Those "conservatives donate more" studies are hopelessly flawed, because they count donations to colleges and churches as equal to donations to things like the Red Cross and disaster relief.
It is almost impossible to say who donates more to real poverty relief, but I think anyone who votes in favor of programs like welfare, healthcare for all, extending unemployment, etc., is going to have an easier time getting past St. Peter. And that is clearly liberals.
Yeah Joe, but i think these dems consider giving money to the government the same as giving to charity since they don't oppose taxation like repubs do. How freaking crazy is that?
noncoms, so you think creating a permanent dependent class will get you into heaven easier?
The Republicans should just walk and let this piece of crap figure it out He owns it and he will destroy all of you liberals along with the rest of the country. Face it he is a socialist and doesn't give a crap about the American way of life
Now, if it turned out the republicans walked and the problems ended up getting solved, you would all be eating crow and humble pie for centuries to come.
Conservatives have been predicting the destruction of western civilization for the past 2000 years and it has not happened yet. 2000 years is a long time to be wrong about something.
Get over it you lost you Winny little Bitch*es UGH ! Republicans ??? What are they worth ??? Nothing
Patrick
You are one of those who is fooling himself into thinking that Barry gives a crap about the middle class. He wants to redistribute to the "poor" so if you are not within his definition of "poor" watch out
yet you cant do sh*t because we have the house ....lmao
buff, I never claimed obama is a messiah, but when bipartisanship means either party completely gets there way on any individual issue, it's not bipartisanship it's a pissing match. Now, a truly socialized healthcare system (single-payer public-option) would have sliced medicare costs down nearly 66% by forcing drug companies to compete for contracts from the only pay supplier instead of simply back-room dealing with insurance companies while we maintained our quality of care and increased availability and lowered premiums further due to more people paying in. Had we gotten that instead of the ACA, we'd be in a much better fiscal situation, but not, partisan idiocy on part of the republicans got in the way.
Elizabeth Warren is the best that could happen to American Consumers. The $$hit heads in the GOP blocked every effort to put her in charge of the Consumer Protecion Agency. Now the mercenaries have todeal with her as a Senator in the Finance anfd Banking Committee! Hooray mudafackers
I am impressed by E. Warren and right now she is in a position to accomplish some meaningful reform and maybe punish some of the most gross violators and this is very fitting.
You crack me up thinking that your dems are not in the pockets of the wall street tycoons!
Ozzie, the point is less dems are. Both parties are guilty of bending over for wall street, but you are blind or willfully ignorant if you don't see just who bends with 0 resistance (aka the republicans).
Ozzie, the financial industry predators have been all over Capitol Hill pushing back against this woman. She knows the outrageous practices of the industry and where the skeletons are. Even some Democrats fear her intellecy, zeal, and integrity. You should feel better about her, regardless party affiliation. Do you think Scott Brown was a straight shooter?
We voted for our President to raise the taxes on the rich! The ignorant republicans just do not get it THEY LOST!!! We need to get rid of the weeper of the house !! Now all republicans are wha wha wha Crying like little baby's.
Also we are paying congress to much money for nothing and for only working part time !!! Its time to shuffle the sh*t
Bob, ever think about getting a job.??
@joe that made me laugh ...thank you
BOB, People didn't vote for King Obama to raise the tax on the rich. They voted for him for the continued freebies period. Just because Obama created class warfare doesn't make it right. If we always went along with what the majority wanted then we would still have slavery because that is what democrats wanted to keep back then.
If everybody learned how to outsmart the system like joe from albany, we wouldn't need to worry about funding the military or other necessary government expenses because the government would go broke. Now with no defense, would you be willing to pick up a gun for no pay to defend the country that allowed you to be so smart??
If the Bush Era tax cuts expire do we pay more taxes on this years returns? Or does it start next tax season? And what about if the deal doesnt get reached until after Jan 1st? I mean how are they going to send out tax forms if they dont have them made up for whatever the taxes will be?
bobby, it would be on the upcoming bills. And trust me it takes no time to print those forms. A good printing press can get 340 million printed in maybe three days.
So they dont take enough out of our check and just keep it all?
Bobby, if this were the clinton era you might have a point, but the reality is almost all of our current taxation rates are at their lowest in decades and are very low compared to history. We have as much a spending problem as a revenue problem. Both are big, but neither unsolvable.
For all you tax experts. All Bush tax rates were valid in 2012 so that is how 2012 tax returns are filed.
Well they should keep the tax rates low and make cuts to programs that arent necessary like letting the rich donate to charity and write it off. They should want to give to charity without a writeoff. They are rich afterall. I know a guy that got a grant for a truck driver training school for 4,000.00 and could have got it paid for from a number of trucking companies. He didnt want to be on the road for 6 months so he had the tax payers send him to school. Those things should not happen. Too many people use programs that they dont need. More verification needs to be applied for everything instead of just giving it to people!!
Now that bobby is an intelligent comment. Thank you. Buffarilla, not necessarily depending on how the tax hikes are written. You can make legalese do anything.
Christians say at the end of times the people not trust the government and people will be blinded by greed, looks like were here GOP. Praise God!
Lets go over the cliff now and be done with it. It will probably end up fixing the whole problem easier than the piece mealing going on today.
Everybody takes the hit, the rich, the middle class, and the poor. We all know they can't leave it broken for long so there is no real down side.
Sometimes it is easier to build a new chair from scratch than try and fix the old one.
exactly. those who just want the rich to pay more tax should also pay more tax themselves. that's only fair.
Cellisis, that would be fair if 2% of the population didn't own more than 60% of the wealth, pay less than 30% of the tax bill, and allso made more than 50% of the annual earnings. The poor and middle class literally CANT foot the bill because while corporate profits are at an all time high, no one wants to hire because that would mean lowering their profit margins 5 effing percent.
Obama has a win - win mind set. First, he makes unrealistic proposals (50 bil spending, his own debt ceiling credit card) knowing this won't be accepted and pushes the process closer to the edge. He does not want a deal and would like nothing better than to go over the cliff. He gets full tax hikes on everybody, which will camoflage the Obamacare taxes starting in 2013. He also gets his automatic sequestration cuts to the military which he really wants to weaken the military. When the dust settles, he blames the GOP for everything that has happened due to his poor leadership. Rather than working on this problem, he is still on the campaign trail popping his mouth off or on the golf course with Slick Willie. Then, it's off to Hawaii for a 4 million dollar vacation on our dime. He not accountable for anything, never has been, never will be. FREE PASS PEBO!
No clue vic. Your new name
Vic, sequestration cuts maybe 15% of military spending, the CBO and others have already confirmed that is a conservative estimate of how much is lost to waste. The military will be leaner and just as fit to handle the next 30 military powers combined (of which 12 are european and are our allies).
Wow republicans holding up the middle class again to give to the wealthiest 2 % of Americans?
They are excactly what we thought they were. Corporate puppets who could give a rats arse about the majority of America. They want to raid social security and eventually privatize and destroy it but dont want to dare end the Bush tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans? How can anyone with half a brain support these thieves? Its mind boggling when I see people on this board who arent even close to the 2 % class defend this bunch.
Which thieves are you talking about the ones in the white house, who want a 20 trillion deficit you are drinking too much of obama's kool aid pal.
Top 2% pay 49 % of taxes Johnny. Is that (fair) ? What do you pay you POS ?
Johnny, try getting educated and then a job. The same could be said about the Dems holding the middle class hostage just because King Obama wants to punish the 2%. It's mind boggling.
Rob, they pay maybe 30% and earn 60% of annual wages. You seriously expect a crippled middle class to foot the bill when corporatists with all time record high profits refuse to hire people because they're selfish? Gain a little wider scope of perspective.
Everybody needs some skin in the game, no matter how small.
Obama created this fiscal cliff and put off dealing with it until after the election because he thought somebody else would have to deal with it. Now the idiot is trying to blame somebody else for his own failures and MSN is towing the Obama line like a good little lying child.
Obama destryed the middle class single handedly.
Obama is raisng taxes on ALL of us by eliminating the Bush tax cuts which affect ALL of us.
Obama is laughing at ALL of us as he sucks his cigarettes and goes on another billion dollar vacation.
Completely false my friend. It was the Republicans who refused to deal with that cliff last time around.
Talk about uninformed? Wow
Jonny, talk about uninformed. Who signed bill into law?
You're never going to get any credibility with a statement like that
Go over the cliff and then pin the tail on the donkey and his higher taxes for all.
Who voted into Norquist in office....anybody? Was he on the ticket?Why is one lobbist allowed to dicatate our nations policies? Who gave him that authority and power? Congress? Isn't that illegal? No I'm serious someone show me in the US Constitution where it is proper and legal. Because I voted for a political representation and not a lobbist. Why is he allowed in backroom meetings and dictating the business of the nation? Can I go there and pass my agenda and sit amongst the representatives of the people and make them swear to me what and will not happen? Isn't that missrepreseantion at best and a breach of confidence at worse? I thought US leaders were chosen by a Democracy? Please explain what right this man has to dictate tax reform.....He's a lobbist! It doesn't matter for what group - He's a lobbist!
Bingo. The Republican Party is bought and paid for by a lobbyist. Great Party they have there huh?
Who do you think bought obama's house in chicago fool.
And Obama is bought and paid for by Useless unions and the lazy that want everything handed to them. If I remember correctly it was a lobbyist group that gave us ObamaCare because we know that not one member of congress had anything to do with it. Like Nancy said you have to pass the bill to find out whats in the bill. And now because of that we are all going to take a nice f ing
Thanks you democrats
mike, had the republicans not been partisan twats and passed the single payer public option version of the plan ,we wouldn't be having this discussion...
thats just what we need We should all want to be more like Europe right. Is that the reason the ones that can afford health care in Canada come to the US to have surgery and why no one in Europe have good teeth Just what we all need more Socialism
Ah, yes, the estate tax. The tax not inflicted on those those who hold the mass of America's wealth. The one coined by the Republican Party and Fox News as the death tax. In a way they were correct. If we don't come up with a reasonable federal estate tax, it could eventually lead to the death of humane capitalism in America.
One word of advice to the Republican Party. You might want to strongly consider not using the Death Tax BS this go around. The American electorate is showing some signs of having become more politically aware recently and will not buy into the Orwellian claptrap. And to make matters worse for any inclination you might have to revive the stupid term, you'll also have to contend with President Obama who is quite adept at calling BS. The death tax was never going to have any impact whatsoever on the people the Republican Party sold the concept to. However, this was under the old, losing Republican paradigm and should not be expected to be so successful in today's America.
Ron, tell me why the government should be entitled to one red cent of someones estate. Taxes were already paid on this person's estate once. So someone saves his entire life and now the the government comes along and says give me half so we can blow it all on all our lost causes.
Boo hoo Boehner is a weenie. He's up against the brown clown from Kenya who is distroying this country.
I'd like to see you logically qualify your second statement.
So now we know: It takes the average Republican about 2 years to catch up with common sense; 4 years to begin to embrace reality rather than idology; and about 12 years to realize that change is necessary.
That may seem like trivia--but it will help us all have a little more patience with them and the difficulties they seem to have with using information rather than "feelings" to form policy.
They cant even admit that thier last flop of a President is the one responsible for the economic mess we find ourselves in. They are as dim as can be.
Who will Obama blame in 4 years?
We know who the republicans will be blaming. They blame Obama for their dying lawn, for their bad back, for gout, for the pothole on their street---they're STILL blaming him for gas prices (as if he has anything to do with that).
But most hilariously: they blame Obama for their own ineptitude and dysfunction.
There's a reason that republican congress got the worst rating in the history of congress OR rating. All they did was point fingers whilie refusing to do their job---but that's Obamas fault too.
obviously liberals are still in a dream world as to who is to blame for the current state of affairs. let me ask you this...
who is in charge of the executive branch of the government and has been for the past 4 years?
let me also ask you who is in charge of the senate and has been for the last 4 years?
Duuuh, so who is to blame for not getting the spending down? who is to blame for not having a budget done?
the answer is... DEMOCRATS.... so who will be blamed for the sinking ship? right again... DEMOCRATS...
the answer to the first question, the democrats, the second, republicans via fillibuster abuse. And the executive does not have power to legislate, only congress does, and it has been in gridlock mainly on the part of senate republicans. And the deficit has decreased the last two years in case you were unaware. And just as well the house is responsible for producing a budget, not the executive branch. We have near record low tax levels for all of history. We have as much a revenue problem as a spending problem. It takes cuts and revenues, something boehner has not been able to cope with. Obama already put 1 trillion in cuts on the table. The democrats cannot bend the full 180 to make this work. Republicans have to be able to bend at least 1 degree.
Bingo
Patrick for Pres!!
How succint and well put--republicans however will not see the common sense and factuality of your statement. They never do.
Fiesty Redhead will now have Sinema to munch on her carpet, does the carpet match the curtains?
The Gingers do not have souls anyway.
People with money need to stop paying for you POS liberals.
Then disavow your middle class tax cut, pay the 36% and shut the hell up. People with money are paying for POS republicans also and a good majority think this a the way to go. Personally, I think everyone should go back to the Clinton tax rates and the minimum tax for the poor should be put in place. Everyone has a stake in seeing this country on sound fiscal footing.
This is not about the percentage increase you dunce. Did you not read all of the other tax increases in the proposal. It's more than juts the hike on the 250K+. Are you pretending the other tax increases aren;t there? Are you pretending like the other tax hikes will not affect middle class? Are you pretending or refusing?