Frankly they owe her an apology!! Time for McCain to just retire - I mean not to attend the meeting on Benghazi because he had to talk to reporters was insane. But hey wouldn't you like to be a fly on the wall for this event?!

Ditto that, Feisty! As for Kelly Ayotte, could someone, anyone, tell the woman it is okay if she shows some kind of emotion? A smile? I hope Ms. Rice gives McCant the smack down he so rightly deserves. Now, as for Ed Flanders(Lindsey), that man is a very evil and vindictive soul if ever I saw one. It is no wonder that he and McCant are such allies, and now they've got that wench in on it. I think the three of them need to stop believing their own press. All three need to go!

I wish this was going to be a televised event! I have complete faith that Susan Rice will take all three to task.

Elise & Alaska Girl,

It's to the point not only is McNasty's conduct embarrassing, it's painful to listen to!

Bitter... party of ONE... your table is ready for your pity party!

It's painful to listen to, he is painful to look at, but I am enjoying every single minute of a man who has lost nearly all credibility and respect of the American people, go down in flames!

but I am enjoying every single minute of a man who has lost nearly all credibility and respect of the American people, go down in flames!

You & me both!

*popcorn*?

Saying that Susan Rice "is not very bright"......McNasty!....Well, well, well, let's see...this ignorant charge from the loser who chose you know who as a running mate!

...that reaks of being not very bright..McNasty should retire...just go away quietly, quickly!

Rice will sail through the Senate - that's my prediction ... McCain softened his rhetoric lately ... Rice won't be burned by the confirmation process...I hope

.

best of luck.

.

She is VERY qualified....

Thanks for not saying the name! Bile rises in my throat at the mere mention of her name and I practically projectile vomit whenever I see her face and she opens up her mouth and speaks, sounds like nails on a chalk board!

Susan Rice is more than capable and that is what really burns Lindsey and McCain. Another woman who can and has run circles around the little boys. They truly hate smart women!

She who shall be nameless!

.........and for McNasty, I guess memory fails him, AlaskaGirl!

Geez, I saw Lindsey Graham on the Sunday News program and he was just horrible to watch.

He totally creeps me out!

Now McCain is saying Rice is not the problem - the problem is President Obama. McCain has become a bitter LITTLE man - at best!

American - didn't Lindsey look like his head was going to explode?????

Most notably, Republicans have seized on her appearance on Meet the Press days after the attack, in which she said the administration believed an inflammatory video had been at least partially responsible for the violence in Benghazi

They just can't let this go, can they? Like a child with a pacifier or a security blanket. Just keep trying to catch those butterflies Republicans, and before you know it, 2014 will be here and your exit will be welcomed.

An Ambassador who reads in a London tabloid, and tells the U.N., that Gadafi is giving his troops Viagra is totally incompetent, and made us look like idiots. NO Way Rice. We don't run this country on tabloids.

Gil - source please!

I don't think McCain will ever get over the fact that he lost to President Obama in 2008. I also don't think he will ever get over the embarrassment he must have suffered after picking Alaska Barbie as VP. Picking "she who shall remain nameless" was proof how little regard or respect he had/has for women. The thought that picking a woman - any woman - would be enough to placate the ladies. He is a bitter old man holding on to his former relevance like grim death. How sad.

Susan Rice is very capable and bright, but that is beside the point here. The old Man from Arizona will find something wrong with either Her or the President. His buddy, the SC turkey neck, will come away expressing the same faults as McCain. The two may as well be Edgar Bergen and Charlie McCarthy. Don't know enough about the NH lady to make a speculation. Collins though, will be fair. Gotta respect Susan Rice. Most people wouldn't go into an outhouse trusting a gang of republicans assertions that they had indeed stocked the cob bucket.

Gil-2872519

An Ambassador who reads in a London tabloid, and tells the U.N., that Gadafi is giving his troops Viagra is totally incompetent, and made us look like idiots. NO Way Rice. We don't run this country on tabloids.

First of all Gil, the initial claim was not made by a London Tabloid, it was made by a opposition Libyan physician. The tabloid picked it up later. Also, it seems to me there was another lady by the name of Rice who claimed unless we attacked Iraq "the smoking gun could be in the shape of a mushroom cloud". Where was your outrage for that comment? ...and the 4,000 Americans and 100,000 Iraqis who died for those words

Rice is no more qualified to be Secretary of State than Kerry, who claimed a purple heart over a wound that required little more than a band aid, is qualified to Secretary of Defense. Neither one of these two belong in a senior level position in our government. Anyone who blindly repeats something they read in a far from reliable source as if it is a fact is not qualified to be in a senior level position anywhere. What other idiotic things will she read in somewhere like The Onion and repeat as if they are facts on the world stage if she is given the position. Rice's idiotic repeating of the party line about the Beghazi attacks being because of the video were inexcusable for a senior diplomat. Anyone with a brain could look at what happened, including the weapons used and precision of the attack, and know that the attack was not a bunch of protesters getting out of hand, but an orchestrated attack. Four days after the attack it was clear to everyone that it had nothing to do with the video yet she went on national TV and kept repeating that idiotic assertion. To be in a senior level position you need to be able to think for yourself, not just blindly repeat the talking points you are given from higher up. Do we really want a Secretary of State who is going to do nothing more than parrot whatever Obama tells her to say. As much as I dislike Hillary, at least she speaks her mind and can analyze situations, I do not think Rice has anywhere near the same ability. As for Kerry being Secretary of Defense, or anything else, it would be a complete joke. Not that I think Panetta is all that well qualified to be Secretary of Defense, but he is far more qualified than Kerry. There are far more qualified people out there for both positions, even among Democrats.

American - didn't Lindsey look like his head was going to explode?????

I can only imagine that the blood pressure of Republicans has gone up significantly since the election. "It wasn't supposed to turn out this way!" Well, it did and now all of you "one and done" idiots have to live with the motto "none and done" for your failed candidate. Keep needling them folks, soon they will all have heart attacks.

Not that I think Panetta is all that well qualified to be Secretary of Defense, but he is far more qualified than Kerry

I wouldn't talk about who's qualified since that Rumsfeld fellow did such a bang up job. Resigned, didn't he?

SeekingInSanity: Google "Rice U.N. Viagra". Where do you think her source came from. It was in the the English tabloids days before.

As much as the Dems would like this to go away it isn't going to. What is so hard to see here? Something went horribly wrong and people died yet this administration doesn't have the balls, as Feisty would say to let the American public know what really happened.

McCain, like it or not is an American hero and it sickens me to hear you call him names simple because he does not subscribe to your way of thinking. You want to talk about having balls. There aren't many of you out there that have the courage to endure what Sen. McCain has as a prisoner of war. If you for a minute think that Susan Rice intimidates McCain you are more delusional than I first thought. Slap McCain around as some suggest. Let me tell you, he has endured more physical abuse than Rice could ever imagine. It is too bad that he endured what he has to protect America and ALL of its citizens, frankly most of you don't deserve it. You are a pathetic group that can't accept anyone who may think differently than you and you call your selves liberal, what a bunch of moronic clowns!

JS in SD-

First of all, the big objection here seems to be that no one was running around screaming the word "terrorism" every 30 seconds. So what?

The best intelligence to date still asserts that the video and the reaction to it were what caused the group that attacked to consulate to do so when they did. So your comment that the video had nothing to do with that attack is not accurate.

Ambassador Rice was given the talking points she was given because, at the time she went on TV, our intelligence operatives didn't want the people they were investigating to know how much they knew. Have you ever heard of withholding information during an investigation? It's an old tactic used by police and intelligence agencies for decades.

And regardless of how well one can think and reason, the ability to stick to talking points is a key talent for any public official. It helps avoid "gotcha" moments, words being twisted and taken out of context, and confusion caused by mixed messages. The existence of fake news organizations like FoxNews and BeckTV make sticking to talking points even more critical.

As to John Kerry's Purple Heart, anyone who has ever served in the military or known anyone who did knows that on one "claims" a Purple Heart. It is awarded to them after someone higher up nominates them for it. I'm sure from reading your comments that you bought into that whole disgusting swift boat smear campaing, but come on, really? He claimed a purple heart?

Mark-

I agree with you that McCain is an American hero. I even voted for him for the Senate once.

I also agree that there is little chance that Ambassador Rice will intimidate him or his lesbian friend Lindsey. I also doubt that she thinks she is going there to intimidate anyone.

But he has become so bitter since losing in '08 that the time has come for him to retire. He is nothing more now than a mouthpiece for the extreme right. He has nothing more to add to the debate. He thrives on making inflammatory comments and then standing back and waiting for the fallout.

and Casey-

What exactly do you think is being covered up? The big objection is that FoxNews didn't have a chance to dig up their "Terror Alert Level" banner and put it on orange, right?

If Obama and Panetta and Clinton had gotten the American public all worked up and terrified, then everything would be okay, right?

Yeah, that worked so well before, right? That was one of Karl Rove's main campaign ploys in the '02 midterm elections: push, push, push the terror threat, because everyone knows that republicans can protect you better than democrats. That's why the folks at FauxNews were pushing so hard on the Benghazi thing, they thought some of that old Karl Rove magic might work again at the eleventh hour.

But it didn't. Get over it.

The Republicans ARE the terrorists. GOP terror level orange.

Casey-

Yeah, it was a terrorist attack. Everyone gets that. No one is saying it wasn't. Why is that word so important to you righties, anyway?

The group that attacked the consulate is a bunch of Al Qaeda wannabes. They had all those weapons that they had scavenged after the civil war. They decided to attack when they did after watching the demonstrations in Cairo on TV.

That's from an FBI report and I heard Petraeus confirm it as well.

This wasn't some big, global conspiracy. A bunch of thugs with nothing better to do that were trying to make a name for themselves. But yes, they were terrorists. Feel better?

No, Casey, you're misreading my intent.

I don't think the president needed to lie about anything to keep anyone from getting all worked up. Look at you, you're all worked up anyway.

What I'm saying is that nobody lied about anything. You're all excited because they didn't use a certain word enough to suit you.

Terrorist, terrorism, terrorist, terrorism, terrorist, terrorism. Does that help?

Oh, CaseyHater, you are attributing the characteristics of previous Republican Administrations to President Obama's Administration. While we are on the subject of embassy attacks, did you know there were hundreds of embassy attacks under George W. Bush but I did not hear the self-RIGHTeous screaming about those. And how about those terrorist attacks on 9/11/01, I mean sheesh, W had forewarning that we would be attacked on our own soil MONTHS prior to that! And how's that COVER-UP about the weapons of mass destruction. Oh, right, Bush came out and spoke to the American people on faulty intelligence and where was your self-RIGHTeous indignation then?

I really feel sorry for Ambassador Rice since she was the scapegoat for this administration's and the Secretary of the State's screw up on defending our Ambassador and three other AMERICANS.

Spin it all you want, Progressives......this administration FAILED in protecting Americans, especially one who was the VOICE in Libya for Mr. Obama.

The "Teflon" President continues to have folks take the fall.

Guess we will never get answers to "Fast and Furious".

BTW: Islamic extremists killing folks are "TERRORISTS".

Casey,

22 January 2002
Calcutta, India
Harkat-ul-Jihad al-Islami gunmen attack Consulate
5

14 June 2002
Karachi, Pakistan
al-Qaeda truck bomb detonates outside Consulate (more details)
12

12 October 2002
Denpasar, Indonesia
Consular Office bombed by Jemaah Islamiyah as part of the Bali bombings
none

28 February 2003
Islamabad, Pakistan
Unknown gunmen attack Embassy
2

30 June 2004
Tashkent, Uzbekistan
Islamic Movement of Uzbekistan suicide bomber attacks Embassy
2

6 December 2004
Jeddah, Saudi Arabia
al-Qaeda gunmen raid diplomatic compound
9

2 March 2006
Karachi, Pakistan
Car bomb explodes outside Consulate
2

12 September 2006
Demascuc, Syria
Gunmen raid US Embassy
4

12 January 2007
Athens, Greece
RPG Fired at Embassy by Revolutionary Struggle
none

18 March 2008
Sana'a, Yemen
Mortar attack against US Embassy
2

9 July 2008
Istanbul, Turkey
Armed attack against Consulate (more details)
6

17 September 2008
Sana'a, Yemen
Two car bombs outside US embassy in Yemeni capital
16

working for america....."The Republicans ARE the terrorists. GOP terror level orange."

Your break time is over....time to get back on that "picket" line in front of WalMart.

You want to talk about having balls. There aren't many of you out there that have the courage to endure what Sen. McCain has as a prisoner of war

Your right. Yet irrelevant to the subject here.

It is sad to see McCain chase a goose. desperate to find some hidden 'truth' that somehow will do what exactly? When all is said and done its likely that security at consulates, embassies and other diplomatic outposts will need to be reorganized or re-thought entirely. I'm sure they will find lots of Republicans who voted down security funding that could have helped, I'm sure they will find that communications broke down somewhere in the Intelligence change.

It was a terrorist attack. There was also a region-wide protest over a video. Both are true. And both occured in the same time frame. According to testimony, Rice was sent out with what the Intelligence community gave her to say. And if she did somehow have inside info that it was a terrorist attack, why would she violate what the Intelligence Community (by protocol) gave her for official information?

So either you blame her for saying what the intelligence community told her to say (regardless if they knew otherwise) or you blame her for not violating the protocol, implying she had some inside knowledge of it being a terror attack and stuck with what they told her to say .

Both ways, people like McCain and Graham start from a stance that someone must be lying. And then McCain's hypocrisy; missing a meeting on Bengazi to go on camera and ...you guessed it...accuse someone of lying about it.

The investigation is ongoing and the issues leading to the tragic deaths of 4 people will be brought to light. The trouble with the GOPers is, many of them just want it to somehow be on the President for whatever reason. They didn't get their pound of flesh on Fast & Furious and they LOST the election.

Watch how fast the GOP could care less about Bengazi once they find out it isn't the President or Rice's fault.

ldo, we will get the answers and in the meantime, if you and the GOP would be patient and not release names and locations of Libyans who have assisted the US, the answers may just come a bit faster. One of the problems that we Progressives know about your ilk is you are nasty when you don't get what you want. Too bad, you lost (again) and that black man and his family are still in the White House, they will remain in the White House until the end of his term, and he will ALWAYS be the 44th President of the United States so stop your bellyaching over the timing of when all of the facts are out. Of one thing I am certain where this President is concerned, once he knows the exact identity of those responsible for the deaths of the 4 U.S. citizens, he will deal with them swiftly with the least amount of American lives being placed in jeopardy! No doubt about that. He may not speak loudly but when you hurt us, he will take your butt out faster than you can say Cheney!

John McCain could be rightly called many things, most with some degree of accuracy, but, to my mind, and His service record, "hero" doesn't fit with anything about the little Man.

@Mike from AZ: Don't mean to meddle, however, arguing with such people is akin to paying a $3.00 prostitute with a $100.00 bill, then waiting for Her to return with your change.

SeekingSanity

Now McCain is saying Rice is not the problem - the problem is President Obama. McCain has become a bitter LITTLE man - at best!

What SeekingSanity said is soooo true. That old goat does not have the never to go after President Obama one on one. So he does it indirectly through Dr Rice.

RMAOFL

McCain said UN ambassador is not bright. Here's a guy who graduated a low class rank 894 of 899 from the Naval Academy. Plus, he planes he crashed twice and once collided with power lines.

Dr Susan Rice , a Rhodes Scholar, was the class valedictorian at National Cathedral School, a prep academy in Washington, D.C. She also graduated summa cum laude from Tulane University’s School of Chemical Engineering.

edit: should read:

That old goat does not have the nerve to go after President Obama one on one. So he does it indirectly through Dr Rice.

The NEWS STAINERS @ FOX are a disappointingly, embarrassing for what they pass off as news.

FOX NOISE is on Dr Susan Rice like white on rice.

A new report appears to exonerate Susan Rice for public statements following the Benghazi attack. Will John McCain apologize for his reckless crusade against her? Don't bet on it.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/11/25/michael-tomasky-on-how-john-mccain-humiliated-himself-on-susan-rice.html
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
FOX NOISE is a low down dirty shame!!!

CaseyTruth

You are totally full of sh!t. I could say much more but that about covers it.

Three repulsivecons meet with Rice? Hardly seems like a fair fight. They'll need help.

The fake outrage over Benghaze is really getting old and tired, it's been played children. Go back to fox scews for some new marching orders you brain washed morons.

Hey, American Girl-724855 who writes -

Geez, I saw Lindsey Graham on the Sunday News program and he was just horrible to watch.

Politics is showbiz for ugly people...

The Sunday news shows is the wrong place to look ...if you want a boy friend, or girl friend, for that matter.

I agree with you that McCain is an American hero. I even voted for him for the Senate once.

I also agree that there is little chance that Ambassador Rice will intimidate him or his lesbian friend Lindsey. I also doubt that she thinks she is going there to intimidate anyone.

But he has become so bitter since losing in '08 that the time has come for him to retire. He is nothing more now than a mouthpiece for the extreme right. He has nothing more to add to the debate. He thrives on making inflammatory comments and then standing back and waiting for the fallout.

Well, given that NO ONE is buying McStain's and Graham-crackpot's "spread democracy around across the globe" krap anymore, they'll have plenty o' time to go to their rooms, suck their thumbs and play with their GI JOES instead. The rest of Congress will have REAL issues to address HERE AT HOME.

There aren't many of you out there that have the courage to endure what Sen. McCain has as a prisoner of war.

Senator McCain justly deserves to be commended for his fortitude as a POW... but sitting in a cell in Hanoi didn't make him an expert on foreign or military affairs, did it?

McCain has shown by his own words and actions that his judgment on these matters leaves a lot to be desired. (Sarah Palin...really????) He might have a bunch of medals, but his days of glory are far behind him now.

A true statesman would be able to recognize when his time has come to leave the stage. McCain has outlived his relevance and should retire gracefully. Or will he have to be dragged away, kicking and screaming?

Don't Republicans have anyone who is truly an expert on military and foreign affairs to take his place? Is that why McCain continues to make himself look like a foolish old fossil?

Every time I see John McCain, I think, boy, did we ever have a good miss in not having him elected in 2008.

He has long outlived his time in the limelight, any respect I had for him is long gone. I just wish the media would let him be, as clearly he is not in full use of all his faculties.

And I am not hung up on the word "terrorist" I'm hung up on an attack perpetrated by an enemy that Obama by all accounts says that he has defeated or had on the run. And even though they knew immediately that they had committed this savage attack they blamed it on an unruly mob and insinuated that a YouTube videographer in California needs to be held into account for it. The totally completely misrepresented what went on less than two months before an election.

Says you. The real "truth" Casey, is that matters of public security are not always appropriately disseminated to an ignorant and hostile public that would use (and is still trying to use, even after losing the election) an unfortunate incident for political gain.

What makes you an expert on security at our foreign missions?

Look at what the GOP has done and continues to do! What gave Romney the right to criticize the diplomats in Cairo who, while under attack, were attempting to diffuse the anger of the mob outside their embassy walls? There are thousands of American diplomats working and living in some very dangerous places, places your ilk wouldn't have the courage to visit, let alone live.

There was a CIA safe house in Benghazi which is no longer a secret. Susan Rice was not sent out to spill state secrets. Maybe you'd like it better if we publicized to our enemies all of our security and intelligence secrets and put our diplomats even more at risk?

It's time for McCain to grow up or get out. His attacks against the President are transparently specious...anyone with an ounce of common sense can see that. Instead of chasing after yet another 'conspiracy', why not do the job he's paid to do and get to work for the American people?

Rice is owed no apologies. If anyone else, inside or outside the government, relied “solely and squarely” on information provided by staff without checking it out and it turned out to be wrong, they would lose their jobs. The fact that she claims she didn’t take the time to review the material she was presenting with such absolute certainty begs the question – what else will she rely “solely and squarely” on without ensuring that she is giving accurate information. Critical thinking skills are necessary for the job she wants. She needs to prove she has them. If she doesn’t, she has no business being Secretary of State.

Besides, if she has to hide behind the fact that she’s a woman and the color of her skin (as the dems and the liberal media seem to think she does), then she would be better off not climbing into the big kids ring.

MarkMO said:

McCain, like it or not is an American hero and it sickens me to hear you call him names simple because he does not subscribe to your way of thinking. You want to talk about having balls. There aren't many of you out there that have the courage to endure what Sen. McCain has as a prisoner of war.

mike from az said:

I agree with you that McCain is an American hero. I even voted for him for the Senate once.

kaybeetoys said:

Senator McCain justly deserves to be commended for his fortitude as a POW... but sitting in a cell in Hanoi didn't make him an expert on foreign or military affairs, did it?

Mac Forrester said:

John McCain could be rightly called many things, most with some degree of accuracy, but, to my mind, and His service record, "hero" doesn't fit with anything about the little Man.

Thank you, Mac Forrester!

John Mccain is not viewed as a 'hereo' to many Americans. I found out his reputation as 'decorated war hero' was somewhat under question while exchanging messages with Vietnam era vets, one among whom was a former intelligence analyst active during Vietnam, and he told me that John McCain was never tortured for information, he traded information for medical attention. Per McCain's own words:

They wanted military rather than political information at this time. Every time they asked me something, I'd just give my name, rank and serial number and date of birth.

I think it was on the fourth day that two guards came in, instead of one. One of them pulled back the blanket to show the other guard my injury. I looked at my knee. It was about the size, shape and color of a football. I remembered that when I was a flying instructor a fellow had ejected from his plane and broken his thigh. He had gone into shock, the blood had pooled in his leg, and he died, which came as quite a surprise to us—a man dying of a broken leg. Then I realized that a very similar thing was happening to me.

When I saw it, I said to the guard, "O.K., get the officer." An officer came in after a few minutes. It was the man that we came to know very well as "The Bug." He was a psychotic torturer, one of the worst fiends that we had to deal with. I said, "O.K., I'll give you military information if you will take me to the hospital." He left and came back with a doctor, a guy that we called "Zorba," who was completely incompetent. He squatted down, took my pulse. He did not speak English, but shook his head and jabbered to "The Bug." I asked, "Are you going to take me to the hospital?" "The Bug" replied, "It's too late." I said, "If you take me to the hospital, I'll get well."

-US News and World Report, May 14, 1973

Th military code of conduct, according to the intelligence analyst I spoke to and my own research, is that no special favors are to be accepted in exchange for information. Yet the passage above, which he wrote himself for a newspaper, indicates that he did. Then in his book Faith of Our Fathers, McCain himself admits that he did so:

"Demands for military information were accompanied by threats to terminate my medical treatment if I [McCain] did not cooperate. Eventually, I gave them my ship's name and squadron number, and confirmed that my target had been the power plant."

-Page 193-194, Faith of My Fathers by John McCain.

And then there's this from US Veterans' Dispatch:

Nov. 9, 1967 (U.S. government documents) Hanoi press began quoting him giving specific military information.

One report dated read, "To a question of the correspondent, McCain answered: 'My assignment to the Oriskany, I told myself, was due to serious losses in pilots, which were sustained by this aircraft carrier (due to its raids on the North Vietnam territory - VNA) and which necessitated replacements. From 10 to 12 pilots were transferred like me from the Forrestal to the Oriskany. Before I was shot down, we had made several sorties. Altogether, I made about 23 flights over North Vietnam.'"

In that report, McCain was quoted describing the number of aircraft in his flight, information about rescue ships, and the order of which his attack was supposed to take place.

That would be a violation of the Code of Conduct. Now, as I was not there I can't judge, but dislike of him is pretty clear among many of the Vietnam-era vets I've had the privilege of speaking to and the shadow of controversy is enough to raise doubt (for me.) While I would not go so far as to call his actions in Vietnam 'treason', as many of these veterans do, I respect their right to consider him a traitor in their eyes.

But on a completely separate note, the Constitution of the United States declares that 'no person' shall be deprived of life, liberty, or property without due process of law. It doesn't differentiate between legal or illegal, citizen or not, terrorist or innocent, it simply says 'No person'.

Section 1028-1031 of the NDAA for FY2012 states that the US military has the authority to detain any person suspected of terrorism without any charges being filed, indefinitely, until the War on Terror is over. If the suspected person is not a us citizen, detention is mandatory; if the suspected person is a US citizen, the detention is discretionary after an interrogation session. The original wording of the section as John McCain and Carl Levin wrote it stated that detention was mandatory for everyone, whether USC or not; President Obama said he would veto it until the wording was changed to 'discretionary'.

(However, note that it had already passed the House by a vote of 96-32, and passed the Senate 93-7. President Obama could have vetoed it and it still would have passed since it had the 2/3 majority vote in Congress required to override a Presidential veto. There was nothing President Obama could do to stop it.)

Indefinite detention without charge or trial is blatantly unconstitutional,and in my opinion anyone involved with writing and passing that travesty is a traitor to their oath as public elected officials to uphold the Constitution of the United States. Therefore, John McCain is in my eyes, a traitor.

Caseytruth said:

Oh and of course it's probably a good idea to find out why the security structure there was so failed. And no it has nothing to do with funding as the state department has said publicly. And it's a good idea to find out why there was an order to STAND DOWN when our people were being slaughter. And no there was an order to STAND DOWN.

Panetta and General Ham appeared together and said as much. Remember Panetta sitting with General Ham saying "myself and General Ham felt strongly that you don't send in support without knowing what was going on". I sure remember it.

But just because they said that was what they felt doesn't mean they didn't. According to what I've read, there was support sent:

About 9:40 pm (local time) large numbers of armed men shouting "Allah Akbar" descended on the compound from multiple directions. The attackers lobbed grenades over the wall and entered the compound under a barrage of automatic weapons fire and RPGs, backed by truck-mounted artillery and anti-aircraft machine guns. A Diplomatic Security agent viewed on the consulate's security cameras "a large number of men, armed men, flowing into the compound." He hit the alarm and started shouting, “Attack! Attack!” over the loudspeaker. Phone calls were made to the embassy in Tripoli, the Diplomatic Security Command Center in Washington, the Libyan February 17 Brigade, and a U.S. quick reaction force located at a second compound (the annex) a little more than a mile away. Ambassador Stevens telephoned Deputy Chief of Mission Gregory Hicks in Tripoli to tell him the consulate was under attack. Mr. Hicks did not recognize the phone number so he didn't answer it, twice. On the third attempt Mr. Hicks answered the call from Ambassador Stevens.

Diplomatic Security special agent Scott Strickland secured Ambassador Stevens and Sean Smith, an information management officer, in the main building's safe haven. Other agents retrieved their weaponry and tactical gear from another building. They tried to return to the main building but encountered armed attackers and retreated.

The attackers entered the main building and rattled the locked metal grille of the safe haven. They carried jerrycans of diesel fuel, spread the fuel over the floor and furniture, and set fires. As thick smoke filled the building, Stevens, Smith, and Strickland moved to the bathroom and lay on the floor, but they decided to leave the safe haven after being overcome by smoke. Strickland exited through the window, but Stevens and Smith did not follow him. Strickland returned back several times but couldn't find them in the smoke; he went up to the roof and radioed other agents.

Three agents returned to the main building in an armored vehicle; they searched the building and found Smith's body, but not Stevens.

A quick reaction force from the CIA annex arrived and attempted to secure the perimeter and locate the ambassador but were unable to find Stevens in the smoke-filled building. The team then decided to return to the annex with the survivors and Smith's body. While en route back to the annex, the group's armored vehicle was hit by rifle fire and hand grenades. The vehicle was able to make it to its destination with two flat tires, however.

Diplomatic security officers informed their headquarters in Washington about the attack just as it was beginning at about 9:40 local time (3:40 PM Eastern Time). By 4:30 Eastern, Pentagon officials informed Defense Secretary Leon Panetta about the attack. The Pentagon ordered an unmanned aerial vehicle that was in the air conducting surveillance on militant camps to fly over Benghazi. The drone arrived at 5:11 and began providing a video feed to Washington. At 5:41, Secretary of State Hillary Clinton telephoned CIA Director David Petraeus to coordinate. The CIA, which made up most of the US government's presence in Benghazi, had a ten-member security team at its annex and the State Department believed that this team would assist the consulate in the event of an attack.

That team DID help the consulate.

Why have extraction teams? Why have precision missiles? Why were Americans on the ground "painting" giving coordinates with laser pointers of the terrorists (oops unruly youtube protesters) using mortars?

Incorrect.

After the consulate attack and before the annex attack, Libyan government forces met up a group of Americans (believed to be eight reinforcements from Tripoli) that had arrived at the Benghazi airport and went with them to the CIA annex at about 4 am to assist in transporting approximately 32 Americans at the annex back to the airport for evacuation. As they were at the annex arranging for the transportation back to the airport a single shot rang out, quickly followed by RPGs and then a mortar that hit the annex roof killing Glen Doherty and Tyrone Woods while operating their machine gun while Ubben suffered shrapnel injuries and several broken bones. According to Ubben's father, "The first [mortar] dropped 50 yards short and the next two were right on target."

There were two separate attacks that night, one on the consulate and a separate one on the CIA annex which was used as a launch point for the evacuation of the American diplomatic party narly three hours later.

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL

Let's see if McNasty has the balls to be as RUDE to Ambassador Rice's face

__________________________________________________________________

Lets get something straight here,,,,,

,,,,,, this woman, Rice, threw away her credibility when she pandered to the ignorant handling of lack security at the U.S. Embassy in Libia.

She was naive enough to believe the masses would swallow her shallow story that the WELL PLANNED ATTACK ON THE U.S. Embassy in Benghazi "was a spontaneous result of the YouTube anti muslim videos. . . . ( Stupid of her, and she pushed this lie over & over.)

In other words,,,, she was stupid to be a shallow mouthpiece for Obama covering his ass !!!

Now she is rightfully finding she has no credibility.

It is her own damn fault and SHE DOES NOT DESERVE TO BE U.S. SECRETARY OF STATE !

.

PERIOD !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

.

Now she is rightfully finding she has no credibility.

Speaking of credibility, commenting in bold font, excessive !!!!!!! and caps does nothing to enhance yours...

Oh, and, you might want to spell Libya correctly prior to making an ass out of yourself with your opinion piece...

It was stupid to be a shallow mouthpiece for the right wing nitwits

It says... while looking at their own reflection!

LMAO@U little buddy! ;o)

Try some anger management, it's going to be a rough 4 years for you...

PS: I see you "vote" for yourself as well... lol

You know, I read the right wing, republikan bull@!$%# on this thread and I wonder: Where do these raving idiots get this crap. I almost never watch their lords and masters on Fox, but if you would watch Fox, there it all is, all this "worse than Watergate" horse@!$%# and then I'm reminded that they are all just ignorant parrots and ditto heads. YAWN !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Hey Feisty,,,,

,,,,,,, I will write any way I choose.

.

Don't like it,,,,,, tough sh!t !

________________________________________________________

Now she is rightfully finding she has no credibility.

_______________________________________________________

I stand by what I said,,,,,

,,,,,,,,, and your taking up the most space on these posts does not add one bit to your over blown self concept of importance or relevance.

See, that's the king of horse@!$%# I'm talking about.

I've said this before: McCain and Graham are desperately trying to make themselves relevant for the 2014 election. The Club for Growth is already planning on primarying Graham because he is not conservative enough for them (i.e. he sometimes compromises *gasp*).

My take is that McCain is trying to leverage his higher profile to benefit his BFF.

Their stance on Benghazi has absolutely nothing to do with foreign policy or homeland security and everything to do with their security in Congress. Total hypocrites, and you can add Ayotte to that list.

Close thefed said:

She was naive enough to believe the masses would swallow her shallow story that the WELL PLANNED ATTACK ON THE U.S. Embassy in Benghazi "was a spontaneous result of the YouTube anti muslim videos. . . . ( Stupid of her, and she pushed this lie over & over.)

According to what I read, several Libyan witnesses did mention the video;

TRIPOLI, Libya (AP) — It began around nightfall on Sept. 11 with around 150 bearded gunmen, some wearing the Afghan-style tunics favored by Islamic militants, sealing off the streets leading to the U.S. Consulate in Benghazi. They set up roadblocks with pick-up trucks mounted with heavy machine guns, according to witnesses.

The trucks bore the logo of Ansar al-Shariah, a powerful local group of Islamist militants who worked with the municipal government to manage security in Benghazi, the main city in eastern Libya and birthplace of the uprising last year that ousted Moammar Gadhafi after a 42-year dictatorship.

There was no sign of a spontaneous protest against an American-made movie denigrating Islam's Prophet Muhammad. But a lawyer passing by the scene said he saw the militants gathering around 20 youths from nearby to chant against the film. Within an hour or so, the assault began, guns blazing as the militants blasted into the compound.

One of the consulate's private Libyan guards said masked militants grabbed him and beat him, one of them calling him "an infidel protecting infidels who insulted the prophet."

The witness accounts gathered by The Associated Press give a from-the-ground perspective for the sharply partisan debate in the U.S. over the attack that left U.S. ambassador Chris Stevens and three other Americans dead. They corroborate the conclusion largely reached by American officials that it was a planned militant assault. But they also suggest the militants may have used the film controversy as a cover for the attack.

Ol Doc: @1.19 Who cares where the story originated. Our "Ambassador" took the viagra story (rape the women who support the rebels -- a horrible and degrading thing for women in the Arab world) to the UN on the basis of a British tabloid and made a joke of the US before the UN and the rest of the world.

Even the UN believed she was "nuts". We do not need such an idiot.

BTW: I've said enough 9/11 is unnecessary.

close the fed said;

,,,,, this woman, Rice, threw away her credibility when she pandered to the ignorant handling of lack security at the U.S. Embassy in Libia.

The US Military was for the Embassy, not the consulate. The Embassy is in Tripoli, the consulate is 400 miles from the Embassy, in Benghazi. A consulate is little more than a suite of offices used for local meetings.

You know, I've been seeing a lot of people commenting based on misinformation. I'm going to set a few facts straight here:

1) Ambassador Stevens asked for an extension on his SST from the State Department, and he asked it for the embassy in Tripoli.

2) The official US Embassy is in Tripoli. The consulate, where Ambassador Stevens died, is in Benghazi, about 400 miles away. It is a set of office buildings surrounded by a wall. It is not a regularly-staffed office, no people actually work out of it, it is a satellite location for the diplomatic team to conduct meetings with parties on the east half of the country.

3) Stevens and Smith were the only two that died at the consulate; Doherty and Woods, both former Navy SEALS privately contracted by the CIA, were killed in the attack on the CIA annex some distance away three hours later. They were killed while helping 30+ Americans evacuate.

4) Stevens was NOT raped, tortured sodomized or anything of the sort.

5) Part of the responsibility for the incident must lie with Ambassador Stevens himself. He traveled to the consulate that day from the (fortified and guarded) Embassy in Tripoli for some local meetings that took longer than he expected; he decided not to travel back to the embassy, but to stay overnight at the consulate and resume meetings the next day. There were only about seven people in the consulate that night when Stevens saw his last visitor (a Turkish diplomat) out of the building at about 8:30 local time. Knowing the area was full of unrest, and protests had been going on about the anti-Muslim video throughout the day (a Libyan witness interviewed about the incident said he saw a few members of the militia responsible gathering ordinary people outside the consulate to protest the video) in hindsight the decision to overnight in a building with inadequate protection was inappropriate.

6) There were roughly about 125-150 attackers.

7) The Libyans were extremely sorry and there was an outpouring of support. There were demonstrations in Benghazi and Tripoli on September 12, condemning the violence and holding signs such as "Chris Stevens was a friend to all Libyans," "Benghazi is against terrorism," and other signs apologizing to Americans for the actions in their name and in the name of Muslims. The NY Times noted that young Libyans had also flooded Twitter with pro-American messages after the attacks. It was noted that Libyans are typically more positively inclined towards the United States than their neighbors. A 2012 Gallup poll noted that "A majority of Libyans (54%) surveyed in March and April 2012 approve of the leadership of the U.S. -- among the highest approval Gallup has ever recorded in the... region, outside of Israel." Another poll in Eastern Libya, taken in 2011, reported that the population was at the same time both deeply religious conservative Muslims and very pro-American, with 90% of respondents reporting favorable views of the United States.

8) A week after the attack on the consulate the ordinary people of Benghazi rose up against the militants responsible, storming their compound and driving them out while shouting slogans like 'Justice for Chris' and 'Libya Lost a Friend' as they did so. Two days later the Libyan government declared these unauthorized militias illegal and decreed they disband. The decree also made public carrying of weapons illegal; and the next day hundreds of Libyans handed over their weapons. The government also started raiding bases and compounds held by these rogue militia, to the general approbation of the people.

9) On September 12, during press conference in the Rose Garden called in response to the attack, President Obama said:

"...no acts of terror will ever shake the resolve of this great nation, alter that character, or eclipse the light of the values that we stand for. Today we mourn four more Americans who represent the very best of the United States of America. We will not waver in our commitment to see that justice is done for this terrible act. And make no mistake, justice will be done."

Whether he meant that to mean he did view the incident as a terrorist act or not is up to personal interpretation.

Gil said:

Who cares where the story originated. Our "Ambassador" took the viagra story (rape the women who support the rebels -- a horrible and degrading thing for women in the Arab world) to the UN on the basis of a British tabloid and made a joke of the US before the UN and the rest of the world.

I was curious as to what you were referring so I went and looked it up. Here's the news report from April of 2011:

In a closed door meeting of the United Nations Security Council Thursday, U.S. envoy Susan Rice told member nations she had seen reports from media organizations and human rights groups that Libyan forces loyal to Muammar Qaddafi were issued the impotency drug Viagra for the purpose of engaging in sexual violence.

According to a Security Council diplomat familiar with the meeting, Rice made the remark in response to representatives from Russia and India who complained about NATO involvement in Libya and it's defense of rebels.

In addition to citing the reports of sexual violence, Rice pointed out that Qaddafi's snipers are targeting children. Rice was merely defending the stance of NATO, and firing back at "naysayers" who sought to equate the rebels with Qaddafi's forces, this official said.

This official made clear Rice was not officially accusing Qaddafi's forces of using Viagra and sexually assaulting civilians, rather she was citing unofficial reports. "She was not referring to any specific U.S. intelligence," this official said.

And it actually IS confirmed according to Luis Moreno-Ocampo of the International Criminal Court:

Now the International Criminal Court's chief prosecutor says that there is evidence Qaddafi ordered the rape of hundreds of women to spread fear of his regime and curb dissent. And ICC Chief Prosecutor Luis Moreno-Ocampo also said there is evidence that Qaddafi may have distributed Viagra-type drugs to his troops "to enhance the possibility to rape."

Although Qaddafi has brutally suppressed dissent among Libyans for decades, the use of rape as a weapon appears to be a new tactic, Moreno-Ocampo told BBC News. "It was never the pattern he used to control the population. The rape is a new aspect of the repression. And that's why we had doubts at the beginning, but now we are more convinced," he said.

Apparently the charge wasn't included in the ICC arrest warrants for Qaddafi, his son Saif al-Islam Qaddafi and Libyan security official Abdullah el-Sanussi because the evidence of rape was discovered only recently. Charges may be added if ICC judges approve the arrest warrants, the Christian Science Monitor reports.

There is no official figure for how many women may have been raped so far in Libya.

So Ms. Rice was telling the truth when she said this.

My question: Why is this becoming and issue now more than a year after the comments were made and proven? Ms. Rice addressed the UN on April of 2011.

If someone had an issue with her saying this, why was it not brought up then? Why now?

Because it was !!

@Close the Fed#1.61:No; you're not standing by what you said. You are, in fact, standing in, what you said. Feisty, Bluelake and Amanda were merely pointing that out. Course republicans like you, are as much at home with their bullsh^t as bulls are with theirs.

Mac Forrester

@Close the Fed#1.61:No; you're not standing by what you said. You are, in fact, standing in, what you said. Feisty, Bluelake and Amanda were merely pointing that out. Course republicans like you, are as much at home with their bullsh^t as bulls are with theirs.

&

Bluelake

You know, I read the right wing, republikan bull@!$%# on this thread and I wonder: Where do these raving idiots get this crap. I almost never watch their lords and masters on Fox, but if you would watch Fox,

________________________________________________________

For all of you morons,,,,,,,,

''''''' who choose to sling sophomoric insults (like "redhead") , rather than argue the facts, your comments don't merit rebuttal.

To insult me by calling me a "republican", or Faux News viewer is nothing short of stupid and couldn't be further from the truth. That being said, I wouldn't support a liar like Obama either . (I voted, but not for either of those 2 looser's.)

So kids,,,, lets try and stay on the facts and deal with reality.

.

The reality here is Rice has no creditably because she threw it away and there by does not merit an important post like Secretary of State.

.

P.S.

Amanda, thank you for your fine post and staying with the facts as you know them. Well said.

Close the Fed#1.72: As someone remarked about someone else, you are a gossip circles dream. Which is most important to you; Al Qaeda killed the 4 Americans or Terrorists killed 'em? The investigation is yet ongoing. Gwad help you if it turns out the presence of that film in that area inflamed anyone there.

Close the fed:

You're welcome. Please keep that in mind as you post messages...more people will respond to logic and facts. Don't sink to anyone's level and indulge in name calling. Bring them up to your level, don't sink to theirs. Try to educate, not castigate, don't take anything personally, no matter how rude.

You cannot level with people with this type of mentality.
You have to excuse McCain & Graham for they are defeated and they have nothing else to hold on to.

Just think about all of the crazy comments that Republicans have made over the last ten years.
These people do not have any COMMON SINCE.

I don't know how they are elected officials.

everyone whenever a Republican speaks jsut ignore them for it is just "Jibber Jabber"!!!!

So this isn't a meeting about saving Ambassador Rice. This is a meeting about saving McCain.

True DAT, Pat!

Time for the people of AZ to put the angry, senile, old, geezer permanently out to pasture!

McCant and Graham overstepped their feigned outrage and now they know they look like fools so they are trying to do a slow back peddle, trying to soften their criticism. Sorry, fellas, but if this is how you are at strategy, I think we need some new people to talk national security as these three have proven to be a hindrance to our national security.

AlaskaGirl, great great points.

Fesity, McCain will be around for a long long time. He will be mean, he will be bitter, he will continue to be on MTP. He's become the old guy in the neighborhood everybody hated when we were kids.

Pat, MTP on Sunday looked like a show that only attracts the B listers - or C for that matter. Why is Carly Fiorino still on anyone's list? She's no longer anything relevant. Her veiled putdowns of the President were sickening and showed the lowlife she clearly is.

... that only attracts the B listers

OMG, that's it! You nailed exactly what has happened.

It's okay with me though. I watch CSpan weekend mornings and get my fill of great guests. This Sunday morning was a great conversation about the relationship between Truman and Hoover. It was quite enlightening I have to say. (If you like that sort of thing).

Hoover reached out to Truman about rebuilding Europe after the war and Truman wrote him a nice letter that he went out and mailed himself, for fear of his staff finding out. LoL.

Hoover was quite unpopular in those days. But those two had a remarkable friendship while Truman was president.

Carly Fiorino was a guest? Horrible. Just horrible.

I have lived in Arizona for over a decade. There was a time when I respected McCain. I did not always agree with his point of view or but he was once a good man. He has served his country well. It is unfortunate that he missed his opportunity in the 2000 election. Elections do have consequences. And I think we can all pretty much agree that if it was anyone else - anyone else at all - that occupied the white house on 9/11 we would not have go into Iraq. Yes McCain voted/pushed for it. But that was because the Intel that the current administration divulged that implicated Iraq (which we now know was not accurate). The point being - if there was not Bush there would have been not Cheney. No Bush and Cheney - no Iraq. McCain (or anyone) would have had different advisors and they may not have "picked a fight" with Iraq. McCain may have been a good president, maybe not, who knows. McCain used to be a respectable politician but.....in the last many years he has lost heart and has grown bitter. Lost the bid in the election he should have had in 2000; and lost eight years later as the Republican nominee. Many Arizonans fell this way. I think his re-election bid for AZ Senator will be close and I hope my fellow Arizonans put some else in office - Republican, Democrat, or Independent. However, Arizonans often vote party line. If he is unchallenged he may win. It would be best if he retired with his dignity intact.

Joe, if you're really from Phoenix, you've got to know that he just got re-elected in '10', so he won't be up for another election until '16'.

At 80, and the behavior of the past few years, he will be put out to pasture. Poor Cindy... I sure wouldn't want him at my house....

Joe -

"It would be best if he retired with his dignity intact."

Too late for that unfortunately.

Lyn - "Joe, if you're really from Phoenix, you've got to know that he just got re-elected in '10', so he won't be up for another election until '16'." Yes I know - but he has made indications that he intends on staying in office. After all there have been Senators that sereved while much older..... Arline Specter for one....and our "toughest sheriff in America" Sheriff Joe Arpio just won. He is 80yrs old and will be 84 when he is up for election in 2016.

McCain and Graham are an insult to us all, what with their insane and totally stupid attempt to deminish Obama by attacking a person that has high honors in every bit of her life.

I'll grant McCain is owed the same sort of respect as any and all of our fighting men. But, even as he has become a wasted politicians, he was never a good pilot and crashed some planes that were not hit by anything. Metophorically speaking, he is doing the same now.

Graham is so weired and hateful of a black president kicking ass twice he simply can't get over it. Watch what happens to him next time he comes up for reelection.

Lyn, KCMO

Wrong, he cannot run again due to term limits.

What a pity that a woman who has given her life to public service at such a high level, a woman who is highly educated, should be treated in the manner she was treated by long time senators such as McCain. But it's par for the course within the GOP. I have never known them to show respect to anyone who wasn't inside their little men's club.

I agree Pat. It's very gracious of Susan Rice to offer to meet with McCain and Graham.

I'm hoping the reason she's meeting with them privately instead of responding to their attacks in the press is that she'd prefer to rip them to shreds behind closed dooors and help them salvage what little dignity they have left. :)

Why is Carly Fiorino still on anyone's list? She's no longer anything relevant. Her veiled putdowns of the President were sickening and showed the lowlife she clearly is.

Totally agree! Fiorina is a failed CEO and a failed candidate for office...who cares what she 'thinks'? What gives her the right to try to foist her opinions on us? Why does Gregory put those useless chumps on MTP anyway? He has destroyed the integrity of that show and turned in into just another outlet for political gossip-mongering and cheap infotainment.

Joe said:

There was a time when I respected McCain. I did not always agree with his point of view or but he was once a good man. He has served his country well.

No, he has not.

Leaving side his being labeled the 'Hanoi Songbird' by other Vietnam era POW's for his giving information to the enemy, he has not upheld his oath as a public elected official to uphold and defend the constitution with his authorship of the NDAA for FY2012's controversial mandatory indefinite detention without charge or trial' clause.

That clause is clearly unconstitutional as the Constitution says 'No person shall be deprived of life, liberty or property without due process of law.'

Therefore, I have NO respect for John McCain and would never advocate for him to be in any public office.

I believe McCain's problem with Rice is that she isn't a Zionist shill, like him. He wants to hold out for someone who will toe the Zionist lines and make policies which favor Israel.Susan Rice is not that person. There is always the possibility that the Secretary of State could be the leader of this country, in the event of some unforeseen tragedy.

When he turned against his own bill ( pulled a Romney so to speak) with McCain/Feingold, we got a great glimpse into the empty space where his backbone should have been. The republikans are more than happy to let this blathering old man be their political stalking horse. I'm surprised we haven't seen the drooling visage of Old Joe Lieberman joining the fray.

I agree Diane. I am sure that bat-sh!t crazy people will be along any second calling her (Amb. Rice) a disgrace to this country and that she should be held for treason!

Diane, I agree. They owe all of us an apology but we'll never see it. Neither will Ambassador Rice.

Steve Benen as usual - nails it:

There was quite a bit of discussion on the Sunday shows yesterday as to why there's so little compromise and even less constructive, bipartisan policymaking in Washington. Doris Kearns Goodwin blamed the role of money in politics, while Bob Woodward blamed President Obama's lack of schmoozing. Soon after, Senate Minority Whip Jon Kyl (R-Ariz.) blamed the media, while the Associated Press blamed the
scarcity of moderates.

There is a more plausible explanation. Maybe this is a good time to reflect again on the thesis presented earlier this year by Tom Mann and Norm Ornstein: "[W]e have no choice but to acknowledge that the core of the problem lies with the Republican Party."

The GOP has become an insurgent outlier in American politics. It is ideologically extreme; scornful of compromise; unmoved by conventional understanding of facts, evidence and science; and dismissive of the legitimacy of its political opposition.

________________

There was also a discussion earlier today on The Maddow Blog about John Meacham's new book Jefferson. We all saw it coming. Now President Obama is supposed to act like Jefferson according to Meacham. Doris said he should act like Lincoln. Chris Matthews said he should act like JFK.

Of course they all had books to sell. I wish these authors would stop with the advice. It makes me not want to buy their books. Seriously.

President Obama is President Obama in 2012 with a Republican Party who are devious, who are back stabbers and who are not to be trusted.

A Republican Party whose claim to fame is disrespect to anyone & everyone, including the President of the United States.

Where's the advice for them? No where. No one expects them to do anything except sit around waiting for their backsides to be kissed.

And these authors think the solution is to go back to the 18th, 19th, 20th Centuries, depending on which president they're selling on any given day.

Unreal.

Uh Oh

Michael Beschloss, NBC News presidential historian will be on Rachel Maddow's show this evening. Which president I wonder will he suggest President Obama behave like?

Martin van Buren?

William Henry Harrison?

James Polk?

Taft?

Ulysses S. Grant?

How about Barack Obama?

Pat - I like it when President Obama is - President Obama!

Diane, that's exactly right. They (gop) cannot get over it. Their Anger has twisted themselves into a pack of Hyenas.

Good afternoon all.

Diane-1871215

Diane, I assume you are talking about the Obama Administration owing the apology to Ms. Rice. They threw her under the bus and left her hanging out in the wind. Why aren't you concerned about finding out the truth about the death of 4 Americans?? I agree that The Administration should stop with the childish behavior and let the Congress get on with their investigations. Over two months later and we still don't have two people telling the same story about what happened. I'm also sure that Congress can do two things at once just like the big O can as you libs love to say. Not to worry though, I'm sure they will find a way for you to continue to collect your government check

BTW Obama won by 3 million votes and he won a plurality of voters making under $30,000 by 7 million votes. Not exactly a landslide.

REB-1013231

Why aren't you concerned about finding out the truth about the death of 4 Americans??

I guess it's a matter of proportion. No one on the right is concerned about finding out the truth about 4,000 dead Americans!

Hey, REB-numbers: This country is sooooo over people like you. We are concerned about finding out what happened in Benghazi, but what people like you fail to realize is that most of us are willing to wait for all the information to be collected. They call it an investigation. I think your type goes for the witch hunt angle instead. Or the "shoot first, ask questions later", you know, kinda like what The Flip Flopper did? How'd that work out for him? Oh, and stop with the government check thing. It only further solidifies your standing as A #1 Ignoramus.

Why aren't you concerned about finding out the truth about the death of 4 Americans??

This in itself... is @!$%#ing PRICELESS!

Tell me again, when dead Americans became a concern of yours? How many died again in 911? How about Iraq and Afghanistan?

You & the rest of the right wing nitwits FAUX concern would be hilarious, if not so sad...

If YOU and others were REAL Americans you would STOP with the politicization as the families have requested on multiple occasions...

Guess Diane can't defend herself.

AlaskaGirl-759554 - why would I stop with the government check thing when it is so obviously true that you have to defend it??

Ol_Doc - What are you talking about?? I believe that 9/11 was investigated to the nth degree. Do you need a link to the report?? And BTW anytime we lose people it should not be a matter of proportion. As AlaskaGirl-759554 says - you have solidified your standing as A #1 Ignoramus.

I don't really know, but I heard a rumour that Reb is batsh!t crazy and probably on food stamps. I'd wait for the investigation to be completed, but why not run the story based on rumours? It's the TPRepublican way.

Oh - and I second Alaskagirls nomination of Reb as the ignoramus.

Maybe not, thetotas. Did you happen to see the clip of Tom Ricks on Fox so called news? Kinda put Fox and the Republicans in their place for politicizing Benghazi.

Diane - what place would that be for them - the garbage pile?

Are you kidding, they are chomping at the bit for a chance to question her, and the media will be right there lapping it up.

SS,

Garbage pile?

thetotas - yes garbage pile. After the way Republicans have acted since losing the Presidency the garbage pile or garbage dump is the appropriate place for them.

SS,

Sorry, that doesn't even make any sense. So much for civility.

Thetotas - it makes total sense. The Republicans lack of civility has relegated them to the garbage dump - or do you give a pass to the disgraceful actions and rhetoric of Lindsey and McCain?

The Republicans lack of civility has relegated them to the garbage dump - or do you give a pass to the disgraceful actions and rhetoric of Lindsey and McCain?

Seeking,

Leave her alone, this dingbat cannot even change her own avatar photo, let alone have a original, coherant comment! ;o)

She reminds me of a spider who lays in her web, waiting for the moment to strike! lmao

SS,

You of all people talking about civility, now that is classic. I think both sides needs to tone the rhetoric down.

OH MY FREAKN' GOSH- here it is again for about the umpteenth time since the election- a Wrong-winger complaining that the rhetoric is getting overheated, and complaining that there's a lack of civility! Jeepers, Dr. Smith!

Would it be at all out of line for me to inquire as to where all this concern for gentility and polite discourse was on November 5th... or any date prior to that in the last three+ years?

You on the right have insulted, excoriated, harangued, threatened and lied about this President, his family (but you know, they asked for it, right totas?), and their supporters in the kind of language that would get one swiftly expelled from any well-run waterfront dive on Puget Sound- probably with a knot on top for good measure. "We don't tolerate talkin' that way in front'a ladies in here, friend!"

The wrong-wingers on this page have called for violence against the President and his family and anybody who dares to speak up against their hooliganistic rantings. Don't waste the audience's time denying it; you know perfectly well what I'm talking about.

For you to now come off all offended and haughty because we vulgar lefties aren't living up to the lofty standards set by Fox Entertainment Nation is worse than insulting; it's simply pathetic. You and your gutless, white- livered compatriots whining that we Lefties are being rude to you remind me inescapably of the schoolyard bully who, after finally being given a well- deserved fat lip by the no-longer-cringing targets of his ugliness, immediately runs off to Teacher wailing, "WAAAHHH! He hit me back!"

You have been sowing this bumper crop of hatred for the entire five decades that I've been alive. You have done everything possible to keep the masses ignorant, terrorized and desperately poor; and now, when you can all see the end of your reign approaching, and the final triumph of freedom is on the horizon, the best you can come up with is, "The Liberals are being uncivil to us!"

As ye have sown, so shall ye reap. The best advice I can give you is, if you want to sit innocently in the bleachers, don't paint a bullseye on your chin.

Reb wrote - "Not to worry though, I'm sure they will find a way for you to continue to collect your government check."

A clear sign of someone with no real argument. If you can't do better than that, stay home.

thetotas

I think he will pick her as a dare to start up again with the McCain bullsh!t.

She is the perfect person for the job. Who else? Should we consider Sarah Palin?

An aside. She would be the fourth woman in a row to hold that position.

Bravo, Al; I don't believe I've seen a better summary of the Wrong wing's revolting exploitation of this unfortunate event. We've known for a long time that there's no depth they won't sink to, no lie that's too ugly for them, and that decency and shame are complete strangers to the Republican Party.

Does anybody else remember when that crazed woman in South Carolina murdered her own children, and that noted statesman Newt Gingrich (lately seen as a serious contender for the Republican presidential nomination) used that horrible tragedy as an occasion to take cheap shots at the Dems, and pimp for votes?

I remember it.

I remember that as being the day when I finally admitted to myself that the Republican Party of Lincoln and Eisenhower (who never voted before 1952) was dead and buried, and its place taken by the party of grave-robbers Armey, Gingrich, DeLay, Cantor, Quayle, etc., etc....

Al in Visalia CA, I think you summed it up quite nicely! I would add one thing and that is the Congressional Republicans are not taking their percentage of the responsibility for what happened in Benghazi. Republicans are the ones who pushed for the cut of $300 million dollars from the security budget for US Embassies and at the time, Hillary Clinton told them that they were making a mistake, a serious mistake!

Al

I agree, a well stated post summary. I would also like to add, why do republicans think that giving the American public CLASSIFIED information immediately after the incident doesn't violate National Security. What part of classified information, the CIA, and FBI don't they understand. We have these departments for a reason....secrecy!!! The way republicans have acted and spoken, we might as well disband the CIA and declassify everything....the general public has the right to know. I for one, think that could be considered treason.

I hope the acting director of the CIA and Susan Rice give them a real talking to regarding national security measures, keeping classified information classified, and that the republicans are damaging the nation's security.

deconnel-3572076

Do you have any...... "well-qualified women"..... as recommendation for the President?

O' please let me not ......."refudiate"..... Senator McCain's VP choice... (are you smarter than a 5th grader)?

Am I stuck in 2008?.......is it just me?......or .....am I experiencing amnesia or Romnesia?

Why should Obama pass over his most qualified candidate just to appease a bunch of sore losers who lost an election? How would that be acting in the best interest of the country?

Why does every thing he does have to be political. You should ask the GOP for the answer to that question.

Why can't he act in the best interest of the country, our country, the USA. By all accounts that is exactly what he is trying to do. Amb. Rice is extremely qualified for the position that president Obama may nominate her for.

deconnel - why should the President pass on Susan Rice who is clearly very qualified - just to appease the Republicans?

@deconnel...I'm sure if you would submit your choice of who should be named SOS to the president he would take it under advisement. Seriously though, the president will probably nominate Rice because she is his first choice and now has a secondary reason...his leadership is being challenged by the RWNJs who were just defeated in the election.

deconnel-3572076

"Surely Obama can do better than Susan Rice. If he is inclined to select a woman, there are hundreds of well-qualified women he can choose from."

Maybe he should ask Mitt Romney for those "binders full of women", yeah, that's the way to run this Country! NOT!!!

so I am curious all those whom say Rice is 'highly qualified' what is you evidence? Highly educated..pffttt...I have a PhD and studied with others that frankly were idiots and they got their PhD so just b/c you have degree does mean crap...also why didn't Hilary go on the talk shows with this info? Is it b/c she knew it was bunk? Why is the U.N. Emb. talking about a National Security issue?

and what all this McCain bashing...he was elected by the people of AZ so some people think he is doing a good job...guess that doesn't count for anything ...yet some how b/c Obama got re-elected does

She lied, Carney lied, Obama lied.....all to coverup that their Mid-east policies were failing before an election.

An election your side lost. Either get over it or keep on sniveling and whining about it and allow yourself to become a pinata on these boards. Your choice.

Al, you voted the most racist President into the White House, and all you can do is say "we won"?? Have you no shame??? She didn't lie, per se, as much as she opened her mouth before she had the facts. Granted, she should have shut up before she knew what was going on, but the White House wanted to make the Muslims look as if they were slighted (and obama letting it be known that is was OK for Americans to be murders is just crazy). Remember, he blamed an f'n video for murder... and seemed OK with that fact (his muslim tendancies coming out?).

Ahhh, gee, hmmmm, Fox News much? You have heard about the study regarding those that watch Fox News haven't you? Apparently not.

Al, you voted the most racist President into the White House, and all you can do is say "we won"?? Have you no shame???

Simple question, do you always post to the Internet after smoking crack?

do you?

Us idiots are returning the country back to where it ought to be - a democracy.

Susan Rice didn't make a mistake. You did by believing the lying Republican Party and Fox, two outfits with no credibility. Same can be said for you.

The man in the White House is the President of the United States.

Your words are disgraceful.

Sadden American 2012 you are masking over the fact just like you Fox fools usually do. When you call President Obama a racist, who is he being racist against? His mother's people (white people) or his father's people (black people) or his sister who is from Indonesia (Asians)? Suffice it to say, the people he loves the most in this world are of different ethnic backgrounds. He has NEVER done anything that even comes close to the level of racism and total lack of respect he has tolerated from the white Republicans (and a couple of Uncle Toms).

The disgraceful thing is the empty suit in the white house.....

People died....Obama and his ilk lied...and then like Fast and Furious they covered it up.....

Now THAT'S disgraceful....

The 4000 you libs keep harping about at least had the means to defend themselves....these 4 were sitting ducks and like the Empty Suit you are want to just write them off....now THAT'S disgraceful....

Where do you get your logic. People died and there are congressional hearings going on to determine why the killing wasn't prevented. Where is the cover up? Susan Rice said it appeared attack resulted from spontaneous mob but that this was preliminary -what is wrong with that. 8 days later the adminisration said they now were sure there were terrorist affiliated members doing the attack--what cover up. Fox news and a couple of senators wanted to scream scandal before election to try and get some votes--didn't work because most people in this country who aren't idiots listen to different news organization and form opinions on facts not b.s. Oh--do you think the president makes individual decisions on the security provisions at every embassy in the world? Get real you bigoted jerk! One last time you yo yo--the president the day after the attacks said" no acts of terror will go unpunished-those responsible will be brought to justice" --how is that writing the situation off. There is a congressional committee looking into how it happened--how is this writing it off? You are a bitter, racist sicko with your fox news talking pointd--how joyous it is to watch your ilk loose the election for the secnd time in a row. Get with the program, the majority of americans don't buyyour hateful angry garbage!

Bigot?? Racist??? Where in the world do you get that from my post.....Oh I understand...when there's no way to effectively defend the Empty Suit it must be racist bigotry. SOP from the left. And those who don't see the Empty Suit as the savior must be Sicko's. Love how it immediately goes to name calling. That's the best you got there Scooter????

No I don't think the Empty Suit makes individual decisions...but his administration does and if these are the best they can do then it calls into question of the qualifications of the Empty Suit appointees.

"how is that writing the situation off."....Why did those who had the ability to assist for 7 hours not do so???

This whole stinking mess is on your Empty Suit...he's the one in charge....he bears the responsibility.

But like the coward he is first he throws Hillary under the bus...and when that won't gain traction he has Rice take one for the team...it's only a matter of time that executive privilege is invoked just like Fast & Furious.

Get a clue pal!!! Your Empty Suit will eventually be seen for what he truly is.....nothing but smoke and mirrors.....

wb said:

The 4000 you libs keep harping about at least had the means to defend themselves....these 4 were sitting ducks and like the Empty Suit you are want to just write them off....now THAT'S disgraceful....

No, the four were not 'sitting ducks'.

Stevens and Smith did of smoke inhalation trying to get out of the burning consulate building. Doherty and Woods were killed trying to hep the remainder of the american diplomatic team evacuate the CIA annex nearly four hours after the consulate attack.

After the consulate attack and before the annex attack, Libyan government forces met up a group of Americans (believed to be eight reinforcements from Tripoli) that had arrived at the Benghazi airport and went with them to the CIA annex at about 4 am to assist in transporting approximately 32 Americans at the annex back to the airport for evacuation. As they were at the annex arranging for the transportation back to the airport a single shot rang out, quickly followed by RPGs and then a mortar that hit the annex roof killing Glen Doherty and Tyrone Woods while operating their machine gun while Ubben suffered shrapnel injuries and several broken bones. According to Ubben's father, "The first [mortar] dropped 50 yards short and the next two were right on target."

"She was Ambassador to the UN and had nothing to do with the Benghazi attack. She may have heard of it the way the rest of us did, on TV news."

Then she should have kept her mouth shut........

wb52: You should take your own advice.

she is a puppet and a liar

You are a fool and an idiot.

franz, I don't think you have your facts right about Susan Rice.

What she said had the full backing of those involved with the facts.

Fox News wasn't involved in this situation so they naturally decided she lied.

Ask Fox News about their role in pushing for a war in Iraq. I wonder how many lies they told on behalf of the GWB Administration? They're assuming Susan Rice is as sleazy as the GWB Admin and themselves.

Fox News lies. McCain treated Susan Rice in a manner unbecoming a long standing United States Senator.

If anyone has any explaining to do, it's McCain and Fox.

You might be right Pat...maybe we do have our facts skewed about Rice...but if "What she said had the full backing of those involved with the facts.", then those who had the facts were in fact the liars. People of the Empty Suit administration and his minions. You can't have it both ways...either she lied or they lied...which is it?

Sen. McCain is doing what any person charged with confirmation should do...question the appointment of a person to one of the highest offices in the Government.

This whole thing stinks....and all you want if for it to be swept away like Fast and Furious. I truly hope that it isn't and these liars are exposed for what they are......Chicago con men/women......

wb52: She, and the admin, relied on the DNS, CIA, and FBI for the accuracy of their talking points. How many times does this have to be repeated before you understand? They relied on the intel. The intel agencies were being cautious about throwing accusations around while they were investigating the event. Let them do their job and stop being a monday morning quarterback.

You know nothing. You have the viewpoint of a biased infotainment organization and the oxicontin king - nothing else. You are not interested in the REAL facts. You only want to believe that which fuels your hatred for the guy who kicked your candidates butt. You want to find something - anything - that might cause enough of a falderol to start the impeachment conversation - because that's all you have. The birth certificate didn't work. The Saul Alinsky and socialism ploys didn't work. "He's going to take away your guns " didn't work. Obstruction of everything to make him a one term president didn't work. So Benghazi is your last, desperate, futile attempt to discredit Obama and get him out of the White House. And that won't work either.

wb52, u sound just like Hannity from Fox News. No facts behind anything you just said. Chicago con men/women. What is that suppose to mean. Another code word for "Thugs". You just proven to be another simple minded moron. Stop drinking the Hannity kool-aid.

Would you be willing to wait long enough for "justice" until we find out who did it?

They expect the answer within the hour - like an episode of Law & Order.

And rerere is a liar, or listens to Limbaugh or Beck to get his/her Benghazi fix. If he/she didn't watch Fox News or listen to Limbaugh/Beck, this would not be an issue for him/her.

I wonder if he is aware of the polls that show that viewers of Fox News not only know less than those who get their news from other sources, but that they know less than people who watch no news programs at all.

(http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/05/23/fox-news-less-informed-new-study_n_1538914.html)

Bob 336, were you frightened with Bush's Administration when they "overlooked" the August 6, 2001 daily brief entitled “Bin Laden Determined to Strike in U.S.”? Now something like that is "pretty frightening." As for responsibility of the job, it was not Susan Rice's responsibility to know everything that occurred in Benghazi and as far as I am concerned, I don't really need to know until they get all of the facts. We will know enough when President Obama comes out to the mic and advises us that those who killed our ambassador and 3 other Americans are dead. Until then, I really, really wish you would learn to be patient!

Babythalmann. Patient! Why was Susan Rice not patient. She was not only not patient but wrong. Not good for someone at her level of responsibility. By the way Bush was wrong also. When do we expect our leaders of both parties to be better at their jobs!!

Bob 336:

You're kidding. Being wrong and being cautious are two different things. If she had said it was Al Queda she would have been wrong. If she had said the UTube video had absolutely nothing to do with the attack, she may have been wrong. Until you find out who was behind it and interview them, you have no idea what motivated them.

The security info she got was what she reported. Where have you been? The CIA and FBI gave her the talking points. If she can't trust them, who does she trust? Fox News? Hahahahahaha.

Blearyeed. I am assumming you are employed by the FBI or the CIA when you said where Susan Rice got her talking pomts. Or did you read that somewhere. I thought we were going to be patient and wait for the whole truth to come out. I recently have forgot about my idealogy and began to "think" about what is going on. I suggest we all do the same and then ask our leaders from both parties to do a better job. The world will be a better place.

Cindy. What level of security. Are you in this security circle. Go back to the premise of what I said. Why go out on these programs if you are not exactly correct in what you are saying. Millions of people watch these shows. There was so much information at the time that was of contradiction of what she said. Why would she risk your credibility!! I somewhat feel sorry for her. She needs to protect herself better.

Bob 336, are you kidding me after that 2-year fiasco of the Republican party coming out on television day in and day out with faulty information. By the way, they don't have to tell the public everything until they are certain there is no danger in divulging the information and it doesn't take a mental heavy-weight to figure that out. Susan Rice did not risk her credibility with the majority of Americans, only those betchas that want to shoot first and aim later, sorta like Willard Romney.

Ah, 20-20 hindsight is a wonderfull gift.

I just simply do not understand how one allows themselves to be so misled and become so confused over fact and fallacy to the point that there is no difference.

Perhaps if Rice wasn't so hungry for Hillary Clinton's job she would have had the balls to state what was known and obvious instead of sucking Obama's schlong and playing the game.

had enuf, why shouldn't Susan Rice want to move into a higher position? White men have been doing that for centuries but I guess because she is black and a female, something is wrong with her wanting that also? Your comment about her engaging in sexual behavior is sexist, racist and crude. And for the record (one more time) she reported exactly what she was advised to report because there is an ongoing investigation by the intelligence community. I am assuming you are a man (I am guessing a white man) and you obviously are suffering from "penis envy" and that would explain your obsession with President Obama's.

NamVet,

Sorry to burst your bubble, but your version of events has been debunked by the CIA...Ambassador Stevens was NOT tortured, he died of smoke inhalation. Stop with the conspiracy theories...the CIA gave Susan Rice the talking points and she followed protocol. Since when do we give classified information out within a week of an international event. What part of secrecy with the CIA, classified information, and National Security don't you guys get.

Don't forget the part Mr. Romney had in jumping the gun to make political points. Why aren't people going after him? That was basically ignored. A presidential candidate jumping the gun to make political points instead of first finding out what happened and second being respectful about it. And 3rd being patriotic about it. He learned his lesson maybe on that and didn't criticize Obama for creating the hurricane Sandy to help win the election. He probably thought about it though. It seems to me that McCain really really overreacted and has really made a fool out of himself talking about this over and over and over. And trying to block someone from some future job over something they reported on tv. McCain himself did much worse years and years ago but that was supposed to be all forgiven. And then he had the gall to run for President. To me it makes McCain look ready to retire. He also has never apologized for inflicting the unvetted Palin and the teaparty that she brought into focus on us. He has had a large negative impact on this country and has never even thought of apologizing. Time to retire McCain.

Namvet said;

How fast the Un-Patriotic Left Liberals forget about, Amb. Stevens, Mr. Smith and Mr. Doherty and Mr. Woods, how they pleaded for help at the start of the 7 hour Al-Qaida attack in Benghazi, waited for help and never got it and were tortured, suffered and died a violent death.

Smith and Stevens were the only two that died in the consulate attack, and it was from smoke inhalation.The attack started about 9:40 PM local time at the consulate. Ambassador Stevens arrived at the Benghazi hospital at about 1 AM local time:

Diplomatic Security special agent Scott Strickland secured Ambassador Stevens and Sean Smith, an information management officer, in the main building's safe haven/panic room. Other agents retrieved their weapons and tactical gear from another building. They tried to return to the main building but encountered armed attackers and retreated.

The attackers entered the main building and rattled the locked metal grille of the panic room. They carried jerrycans of diesel fuel, spread the fuel over the floor and furniture, and set fires. As thick smoke filled the building, Stevens, Smith, and Strickland moved to the bathroom and lay on the floor, but they decided to leave the safe haven after being overcome by smoke. Strickland exited through the window, but Stevens and Smith did not follow him. Strickland returned back several times but couldn't find them in the smoke; he went up to the roof and radioed other agents.

Three agents returned to the main building in an armored vehicle; they searched the building and found Smith's body, but not Stevens.

At about 1 am the body of Ambassador Stevens was found by local citizens and taken to the Benghazi Medical Center. At the hospital Stevens was administered CPR for 90 minutes by Dr. Ziad Abu Zeid. According to Abu Zeid, Stevens died from asphyxiation caused by smoke inhalation. A 22-year-old freelance videographer, Fahd al-Bakoush, later published a video showing Libyans trying to extract the unconscious ambassador from a smoke-filled room, where he was found unconscious.

Some of the Libyans who entered the compound tried to rescue Stevens after they found him lying alone on the floor in a dark smoke-filled room with a locked door accessible only by a window. A group of men pulled him out of the room through the window, and then placed him on the courtyard's stone tile floor. The crowd cheered "God is Greatest" when Stevens was found to be alive. He was then rushed to the hospital in a private car as there was no ambulance to carry him.

Dr. Ziad Abu Zeid was the Libyan doctor who treated Stevens. He said Stevens died of severe asphyxiation, that he had no other injuries, and that he tried for 45 minutes to revive him. The doctor said he believed that officers from the Libyan Interior Ministry transported the body to the airport and into United States custody. State Department officials said they do not know who took Stevens to the hospital or transported the body to the airport and into U.S. custody.

Doherty and Woods were at the CIA annex that was assaulted around 4 AM that morning--three hours after Ambassador Stevens'death.

After the consulate attack and before the annex attack, Libyan government forces met up a group of Americans (believed to be eight reinforcements from Tripoli) that had arrived at the Benghazi airport and went with them to the CIA annex at about 4 am to assist in transporting approximately 32 Americans at the annex back to the airport for evacuation. As they were at the annex arranging for the transportation back to the airport a single shot rang out, quickly followed by RPGs and then a mortar that hit the annex roof killing Glen Doherty and Tyrone Woods while operating their machine gun while Ubben suffered shrapnel injuries and several broken bones. According to Ubben's father, "The first [mortar] dropped 50 yards short and the next two were right on target."

Both Petraeus and Panetta have now sworn, they all knew it was a terrorists attack, right away.. Their CIA report was changed, to the mob attack story, to protect Obama's election and the left liberals still bow, bend over and blindly support those Administration, Traitors..

According to an AP article, a reporter interviewed Libyans at the scene, here's what they said;

There was no sign of a spontaneous protest against an American-made movie denigrating Islam's Prophet Muhammad. But a lawyer passing by the scene said he saw the militants gathering around 20 youths from nearby to chant against the film. Within an hour or so, the assault began, guns blazing as the militants blasted into the compound.

One of the consulate's private Libyan guards said masked militants grabbed him and beat him, one of them calling him "an infidel protecting infidels who insulted the prophet."

The witness accounts gathered by The Associated Press give a from-the-ground perspective for the sharply partisan debate in the U.S. over the attack that left U.S. ambassador Chris Stevens and three other Americans dead. They corroborate the conclusion largely reached by American officials that it was a planned militant assault. But they also suggest the militants may have used the film controversy as a cover for the attack.