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Subscribe to RSSWrapping up Obama’s trip to Myanmar… The politics of Gaza… Optimism in the fiscal cliff negotiations?... Republicans pile on Romney… Disagreement over Benghazi… Marco Rubio in Iowa… And Autopsy 2012: White voters in the South vs. the Midwest.
At a Buddhist monastery on Saturday, President Barack Obama joked that negotiations on the fiscal cliff may require a little help from God. NBC's Mark Murray reports.
*** My, my, Myanmar: Overseas, President Obama is now in Cambodia, the third and final leg of his Asia trip. But the centerpiece of his travel took place earlier today in Myanmar, the country formally known as Burma. Obama became the first U.S. president to visit that nation, and he was greeted by thousands, including uniformed school aged children who were waving U.S. and Myanmar flags in near unison. The president then proceeded to the home of Nobel Peace Prize winner Aung San Suu Kyi, and the drive there displayed a very poor country getting its first taste of capitalism. Afterward, Obama formally addressed the people of Myanmar in a speech at Yangon University, where he justified his trip to this still not-yet-free country. “When I took office as president, I sent a message to those governments who are ruled by fear. In my inaugural address, I said, ‘We will extend a hand if you are willing to unclench your fist.’” The visit to Myanmar wasn’t just ceremonial -- Obama brought an aid package worth $170 million. Meanwhile, the Myanmar government announced it was inviting the Red Cross back to resume prisoner visits, and it pledged to have a process that could lead to the release of even more political prisoners by the end of this year.
Jason Reed / Reuters
President Barack Obama and Secretary of State Hillary Clinton tour the Shwedagon Pagoda in Yangon Nov.19, 2012. Obama became the first serving U.S. president to visit Myanmar on Monday.
*** The politics of Gaza: In other world news, a full-blown ground war in Gaza is not good for anyone, obviously. Politically, it could become just one giant hot potato for the president. Here is where things stand right now: The primary players are Egypt (which negotiates with Hamas), Turkey (on speaking terms with both sides) and the United States. There is a sense in the White House that they need to get some sort of cease fire negotiated ASAP. Can Egypt convince Hamas it is in their best interests to stop the missile strikes? How much pressure will this new Egyptian government apply to Hamas? If Egypt can get something stopped, then can U.S. talk Israel into accepting? This is a real test of the fragile relationships this new Egyptian government inherited.
*** Optimism in the fiscal cliff negotiations? “Capitol Hill leaders emerged from their meeting Friday with President Barack Obama sounding optimistic about their ability to reach consensus on vexing tax and spending issues and avoid the impending ‘fiscal cliff,’” NBC Mike O’Brien wrote. Said Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid: "I feel very good about what we were able to talk about in there. We have the cornerstones of being able to work something out." Added House Speaker John Boehner: "I believe that the framework that I've outlined is consistent with the president's call for a fair and balanced approach." And here was Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell: "We're prepared to put revenue on the table provided we fix the real problem, even though most of my members -- I think, without exception -- believe we're in the dilemma we're in not because we tax too little, but because we spend too much." As the New York Times noted, “The … congressional leaders emerged from the West Wing round table together and in good spirits — a far cry from the 2011 negotiations, when they generally left separately and, once back at the Capitol, circulated competing versions of the private discussions.”
*** Piling on Romney: On the Sunday shows, Republicans continued to pile on Mitt Romney for his statement to donors last week that Obama won due in part to “gifts” he gave to African-American, Latino, and younger voters. “We're in a big hole. We're not getting out of it by comments like that. When you're in a hole, stop digging. He keeps digging,” Sen. Lindsey Graham said on “Meet the Press.” Here was Newt Gingrich on ABC: “I just think it's nuts... I mean, the job of a political leader in part is to understand the people. If we can't offer a better future that is believable to more people, we're not going to win.” And conservative writer George Will added on ABC, “It's been well said that you have a political problem when the voters don't like you, but you've got a real problem when the voters think you don't like them... quit despising the American people.” Ouch.
*** Disagreement over Benghazi: Another big topic on the Sunday show was the attack on the U.S. consulate in Benghazi, especially after former CIA Director David Petraeus’ testimony on Capitol Hill on Friday. “Disagreement ranged across the Sunday talk shows on the question of whether the administration had intervened to excise references to al-Qaeda involvement in the CIA’s assessment of the Benghazi attack when it offered its first lengthy public explanation of the incident,” the Washington Post says. “The White House and intelligence officials have said the terrorist assessment offered by Petraeus was both classified and still tenuous and that to reveal it at the time of [Susan] Rice’s interviews would have compromised their secret sources of information.”
*** Rubio in Iowa: Politico: “Thirty-eight months before the next presidential vote is cast, Marco Rubio on Saturday night became the first of the potential 2016 contestants to swoop in to this first caucus state and test the GOP’s new rallying cry to broaden its appeal. Seven hundred people turned out to see the Florida senator at the annual birthday fundraiser bash for GOP Gov. Terry Branstad. Rubio had the spotlight all to himself — he said he was merely here to help the governor mark his 66th birthday, but no one believed it for a minute.” More: “In his speech at Branstad’s party, Rubio said he understood Republicans’ frustrations over their electoral loss, but insisted that the country needed to return to its traditional principles to remain a power and global role model.”
*** Autopsy 2012: White voters in the South vs. Midwest: In a Sunday New York Times op-ed, University of North Carolina-Charlotte history professor Karen Cox argued that political opposition to Obama in the 2012 election wasn’t necessarily rooted in the South; instead, it was based more on a rural-vs.-urban divide across the country. “In other words, before our liberal allies in blue states point their fingers and scoff, they might want to take a look in their own rural backyards for evidence that their states actually have something in common with the supposedly backward ones in the South,” Cox writes. But that analysis ignores this evidence from the 2012 exit polls: Obama’s support among white voters in the South was VASTLY different than white voters in the Midwest. In fact, in all former states of the Confederacy -- including Florida and Virginia, which Obama won -- the president’s share of the white vote was less than the national average. That includes Mississippi and Alabama, where Obama got, respectively, just 10% and 15% of the white vote. But in all contested battlegrounds in the Midwest, Obama’s support among white voters was higher than the national average. Note: Not all states had exit polls, including Georgia, South Carolina, Tennessee, and Texas.
Obama’s share of the white vote, per the 2012 exit polls:
Mississippi: 10%
Alabama: 15%
North Carolina: 31%
Florida: 37%
Virginia: 37%
National average: 39%
Ohio: 41%
Michigan: 44%
Minnesota: 48%
Wisconsin: 48%
Iowa: 51%
*** Happy Thanksgiving: A final note: This will be our last morning First Read of the week, although we will update the web site as news warrants. Have a safe and happy Thanksgiving. And we’ll be back next week.
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Funny, no coverage of the large amount of unpaid taxes by Obama aides! How is Israel defending itself a bad thing? How is Ms. Rice innocent oh, it's the Presidents fault actually. What a moronic political ploy. NBC and MSNBC is a joke of a "news" agency, closer to a comic book mentality!
Why do watch MSNBC and NBC? Are you a child and have no control over what you watch or are you like too many republicans who want to cry and whine about something they can control?
What exactly is it the Dems, (you) arre in control of?
Charles is complaining about MSNBC and NBC and I just suggested that as an adult he might choose to watch something else rather than whine and cry. The Dems are in control of the Executive Branch and the Senate and this was by a choice of the American people.
Prog.1...some people watch a variety of networks so they can weed thru the bs...listening to only one point of view is a form of brainwashing don't ya think...change the channel dude once in awhile and get a prospective.
Try the BBC, Al Jazeera, NHK.
I say let the democrats have their way...give them all the rope they need to hang themselves. That way they can't play the blame game. Let them rack up the debt and tax the rich and give all the freebies they want to the poor and then we will see where America is in 2016.
The libs always have someone to blame. That's the way it works with liars. And they seem to have a strong enough base that it works for them. It should be an interesting ride. Benghazi anyone? The Pres is sucking face in Burma while Israel explodes? Maybe Burma can loan us some money.
First Thoughts:
My, my, MyanmarWhat the Hell is Obama doing in Burma?I have the pen, Class Warfare, It's all the Republicans fault, Lets go get some Thai!
I wonder how he is going to pay for the Economic development help he promised?
That's right I forgot silly me he will just raise taxes on those evil rich people.
"The president is sucking face in Burma while Israel explodes"?
"What the hell is he doing in Burma?"
Are these supposed to be the comments of adults? They're so lacking in substance that nobody can even read any implications into them. What exactly would you like Obama to do? Where should he BE? If he were in Washington, you'd be asking, "What the hell is he doing in Washington while Israel explodes?" If he were in Israel, you'd be demanding to know why he wasn't at the Gaza border. If he were at the border, you'd wonder why he was spending so much time in the Port-a-Potty. If he solved the problem and brought peace to the Middle East, you'd call it a public relations trip.
It's impossible to discuss anything of importance when everything Obama does and says is pre-defined as "evil" -- a lie, a mistake, a cover up, a grave danger to all of us.
Here Bob I'll type real slow so you can keep up.
With this Country in the shape it's in what the hell is he doing in Burma?
Get it.
And as far as Israel exploding it's not my comment but I'll opine, it is his failed Foreign Policy and the snub of BB that has emboldened the Muslim Brotherhood and Hamas and caused the attacks on Israel.
Now that's an an idea send him to the Gaza border and let him give another speech the one he gave in Cairo didn't really work.
You are delusional Obama's failed foreign policy tore the Camp David Accords to shreds.
If he could come up with a solution that secured peace for the next thirty years like Carter brokered I would give him a standing ovation.
It's impossible to discuss anything of importance when everything Obama does and says is pre-defined as "evil" (No one said anything about Evil Stupid and Incompetent yes but Evil No)-- a lie (the Spin they put on the Benghazi debacle was a lie plain and simple), a mistake (Solyndra and other billions of the stimulus funds that took the money out of this country was definitely a mistake), a cover up (Claiming Executive privilege for operation Fast and Furious gun running to the Mexican drug cartels), a grave danger to all of us (Allowing Iran to get closer to developing a nuclear capability is a danger to the world).
Do you really believe what you spew?
Obama and his minions have said the Benghazi tragedy was about another Cairo demonstration over a video. They lied for political reasons because it didn't fit Obama's narrative for Libya during a presidential campaign. Then came the coverup. Nixon was forced to resign for lying and covering up, yet no one died.
And the Mainstream media continues to ignore this travesty.
IMPEACH OBAMA!!!!
Kevster huh?
Conjecture, conspiracy theories, supposition, innuendo, and a call for the impeachment of a sitting President long before we have all the details. Makes good sense to me! Lets just hang the Niggar!
Right on...
Yep, they were very good at that coverup.
I, for one, am glad the GOP moved fully to the fringe. For too many years they hid their true agenda by which they fooled the voting public and harmed America unawares. Now, we know who they are. We have seen what they are capable of and we now know the truth about what this racist, woman hating, fear-mongering, back-stabbing, gay rights hating, right-wing-nut-job of a Party; is willing to do in order to be in charge of a country that is desperately trying to heal from its financial woes as well as its past social/racial indiscretions. The last thing we need at this point is more John McCains or Sarah Palins.
America is suppose to be united; therefore, let us unite in our never-ending battle to live in a land free of hatred and back room conspiracies. Let us at least move toward the light rather than away from it!
Right on...
It is good to see that Obama is visiting 3rd world Asian countries, getting the experience he needs to run the 3rd world country he is making right here!
The conservatives seem to think that Obama's failed policies (they have yet to produce any evidence that ANY of his policies have failed) are at the root of the Israeli-Hamas conflict. I guess for them, everything bad in the world DID start in Jan 2009. What a bunch of whiny illiterates with no sense of history. Guess they forgot the last incursion/exit of the Gaza and the thousands of rockets fired into Israel over the years. But, no. As far as they are concerned, the Egyptian self determination was Obama's fault, the rebellion in Libya was Obama's fault (in both cases the GOP DID support those dictators) and the rocket attacks on Israel were instituted by Hamas because Obama failed to meet with BB.....what a bunch of morons.
President Obama is asking everyone to give because of the
recession our country is in, and I think he needs to participate as well. President Obama could make significant
contributions to reduce the federal deficit.
He needs to do his part and help make things better for the country as
he has promised.
My ideas are as follows to reduce the deficit. He should cancel the upcoming Inauguration parades,
lunches, and all night balls, and put that money on the deficit. This can allow more time to negotiate, and
extend the fiscal cliff deadline. After all, the Inauguration is all about him, and he is being selfish to ask Americans for more tax dollars and he is not giving it.
Another idea is to reduce most of the parties and special events
at the White House that are not required.
Many events, such as Halloween for kids, and special concerts for the
president should be on hold.
Finally, I think the president should stop taking so many
unnecessary rides in the motor cade to get hamburgers for himself and his
staff. If he is going to lunch, it
should not be on taxpayer’s hard earned, middle-class money. The wealthy should not have to pay for his
unneeded rides in the motorcade as well.
He can walk to eat at his own home/job.
This will save millions of dollars and put money back to reduce the
deficit.
If the president thinks we should reduce military spending and
national defense, he needs to start first in his own pockets.
The president has asked the banks and mortgage lenders to
cut back. He asked the auto giants to
cut back. He asked teachers across the
nation to cut back. Wall Street to cut
back. He asked the wealthy to give
more. Middle class to give more. When will he cut back or give more?
This post is actually too silly to reply to so I will keep this very short. Pres Obama is willing to do his part in that his tax outline includes himself! He intends to levy heavier taxes on those making more than $250,000 per annum; the office of the President pays $400,000 per year so he is effectively adding himself to the roll of those who are in the upper echelon of the + $250-K. I don't care how you slice the pie or cut the cake; Pres Obama is leading by example! Its just that people like you can find no good in a man who is black so he is wrong in your eyesight because YOU are racist and among your kind, he can do NOTHING right!
Right on...
It is so sad all obama supporters cant even read an article and appreciate how PREPARED Romney would have been. Enough with your emotional rants--your boy is in office--he has NO excuses (although if I remember right the dems had total control the 1st 2 years of his presidency?!, hmmm...). Why must you bash and hate of the rest of us. I CANT WAIT to hear all of you sing the praises of your pres. When your taxes (yes the middle class) go up this year. Congrats--you were the ones who voted for it!!! Your big government needs to keep spending, enjoy!
Hope the Fiscal Crises is Solved First. More has to spent on Infrastructure so that more and more Jobs are created in the USA and there is more spending and savings. This has a multiplier effect. This will lead to more loans for the industries which in turn will again create more jobs. Outsourcing of Manufacturing and other Important Jobs must be stopped and the Jobs must be brought back to the USA so that the USA manufactures more and exports more. More thrust on services jobs so that the services industries also prospers. And more and more High Posts and Positions must be given to the Americans so that Americans can control their own Government companies and other Private Companies. Indians from India are coming to the USA and Europe in Huge numbers to take over all the High End Jobs and the Top Jobs and Top Positions by playing politics and telling lies as the Indians from India have done in the Past. Indians from India United in the Past in the USA and even tried to make differences and start a war between the White Americans and the Black Americans by writing Books and Propaganda and Indians from India Ate the Moolah and the top jobs. But the majority Americans saw through this game and Elected President Obama even though some Americans fell for this game. In the elections in 2012 the Indians from India again tried to make differences between the Black Americans and the White Americans by writing books and making False Propaganda and wanted to Eat the Moolah and take all the Top Jobs in the USA. Though some Americans fell for this game a Majority of the Americans saw through this game and Re-elected President Obama. Well the Black Americans, the White Americans and the Hispanics have made America What it is today by their sheer hard work. It is obvious the fruits of their labour should be shared by them. So all the Power, Top Jobs and Top Positions must be shared between the Black Americans, White Americans and the Hispanics. Well the Indians from India were hardly there in the USA until the last 60 years. Since the 1950's the Indians from India have been immigrating to the USA to take up the Services jobs and other jobs and take High Positions and Top Jobs in the USA and thereby control the American Companies and thereby influence the American Government. Check the facts. GOD Bless the Americans. GOD BLESS THE USA.
Kevin Valentine Moraes
Mira Road (Thane)
Since Ryan will push the entitlement changes, will say what I think are talking points the dems can discuss:
1. Welfare, food stamps, unemployment, disability - if you have conservative relatives/friends you certainly have heard they really hate anyone that abuses those and does not want to work when they can physically do that. Don't have a problem with that, we need plans to get the long-term/chronic unemployed/welfare folks being as productive in life as they can which will help their self esteem and their kids if they have any by showing good work ethics. So get some implementable plans to focus on the abusers of these programs, keep our old conservative relatives/friends from shouting how much they hate all those welfare abusers, sick of hearing them.
2. Medicare - that is the biggest difficult to estimate expense, social security can be estimated easily since we know when workers will/can retire in age by and how much that total budget cost needs to increase each year to pay the monthly ss checks. Medicare is a challenge due to predicting the expenses of keeping over 65 folks healthy, that can change a bit year to year just due to types of illnesses that pop up some year in large numbers, plus the costs keeping going up higher than typical inflation. There needs to be a serious commission focused just on senior health care and containing/minimizing the costs, and should involve national experts on issues that control it. This is needed before giving in to a simple and poorly vetted Voucher Program of Ryan's. We need a commission coming up with the best guidance that everyone can trust, not just Ryan and the repubnuts plan.
3. Social Security - repubs want total movement to investment brokers with our 15% of our paycheck that we and our employers pay into SS admin. That is a big chunk and if the brokers were trustworthy and policed themselves and kept us informed of best strategies, it could be a lot of cash to have when you retire some day. However, I thought it was set up to help not only the retired guy that worked but also his wife and family if he dies, plus there is a disability component. Most importantly, it gets down to trust of whether we should let Wall Street/your brokers to basically have control of all parts of your retirement income other than property you may own when you retire and any pensions you could have, and the pensions are connected to Wall Street too but maybe more guaranteed. This is a big philosohpical decision that could give a better retirement than SS, but it could blow up in a great recession or great depression and really hurt a lot of retirees if they have to take reduced monthly checks for a while in a big Wall Stree crash...so do you want this part of your retirement income to be stable with slow growth covering cost of inflation with those small raises every year, or do you want this part of your portfolio fluctuating like your IRAs/401K's, etc.?
Hundreds of posts and..what was the subject? Oh, yeah, Myanmar, which is actually called Burma here in Asia even by my Burmese girlfriend. So, America's HNIC,obama, comes to Burma as an angry black? man. He lectures the people struggling to get their feet on the ground about defending themselves against Saudi backed Muslim Bangladeshis who are illegally occupying Burma. He reminds these awe struck people that "America is the worlds greatest nation". Meanwhile, America is starting to disintegrate. Nero, fiddling while Rome burns. Seen it so much, Benghazi, Sandy, pussygate, etc. Not many golf courses in Burma, maybe that angered him. Get the hell outta here!
Meanwhile, back in the US, all is well under VP Biden. He went to Jersey and told everyone that he's a 'HOMEBOY', a term used by black ghetto gangsta's. Biden is OH SO WHITE, been to Dover, Delaware? So, Susan Rice is still firmly stuck under the bus by black on black Chicago violence, via POTUS.
Hamas is a demented orginization like Al Qeada and the Taliban who thinks that the rest of world is out to destroy the religion of Islam and the Muslims.
This is not true.
Such men have created demented followers who are scared of everything else and have been brainwashed to believe that Israel would simply wipe them off the face of the Earth just because thats what they want to do to Israel.
The only ones that are being looked at are the terrorists who use brutal tactics in keeping a peaceful situation from happening and incorporating Israeli lands and Palestinian states together.
Basically the fight in Gaza is like two states in America fighting each other over who comes into their state.
Both Isreal and Palestine need to enact a no colonizing law where people can move into an area and claim it as their own. Such laws would mean that if a group of displace people move into a certain area the land owner could have the law remove them or the squatters could be put under the tenace of the landower paying her or him a certain amount of money or what they produce for rent.
After a certain amount of time the landower would hand over controll of the section of land to the squatters where the land would be theirs to do with as they please but where the squatters would still be required to pay the land owner a certain rate for another extended period of time until the land owner feels that the tenant has paid for the land in full.
We need to support Israel along with the Palestinians who want Hamas out so a peacefull negotiation can take place between each country.
I really don't understand the complexities of foreign policy, but I do understand business and the economy. I hope Obama can dedicate himself to matters at home before the Christmas recess. I see alot of bashing of the Tea Party going on in these posts. The Democrats have only themselves to blame as the movement wouldn't of even started if the Democrats would of shown a little restraint during the first two years of the Obama administration when he had a super majority. So now we have what we have, a GOP controlled House. Despite where you come down on abortion, immigration reform, and gay rights, there is a great number of the voting public who believes in limited government and fiscal discipline. Most of these people are tax payers not tax spenders so excuse if we are concerned about borrowing 40 cents on every dollar to pay for all those efficient services and policies the government has to offer the "entitled". You don't have to be a rocket scientist to know that promising a senior over $345,000 in potential medicare spending for every $109,000 paid in is a disaster. I am looking for Obama to lead instead of being a bystander to SOME of the idiot Democrats who believe there is an endless supply of money.
Chris, it seems to me that you have a very short memory. The first two years of the Obama administration they were struggling to keep our country from going into a depression. Hardly a time to cut spending since government jobs were the only ones being added at the time. Now we are seeing a reverse where the private sector is picking up and government contracts are going down.
I agree that Obama does need to focus very hard on the Fiscal cliff over the next month, but I am not very optimistic that both parties can put the politics aside to come to an agreement.
As for the TEA Party, I consider them to be terrorists that regularly hold the country hostage to get their way and they need to go.
@Ron
"4. The future looks brighter for the unemployed. Government projects to improve our roads, bridges, a newer, stronger power grid, and clean energy to reduce global warming will create more jobs. Manufacturing products, including jobs to rebuild our infrastructure are on the horizon."
Are you kidding me????? Seriously??? Come here to the Kansas City area where people are losing their jobs daily and say that. I work for a company that deals directly with the government on roads, bridges, etc. Guess what....there are no new projects on roads, bridges, etc. In fact, there are rumors that our health care plan will get cut because it is cheaper to pay the penalty than the premiums. Seriously, you and Feisty (her"things are looking brighter" comment makes me want to puke) need to get a reality check.
Once again, the naysayers rant stupidly! It takes time to move gov't; it is not at all like instant coffee. Pres Obama does have a plan to move this nation FORWARD by adding more jobs throughout America but as always, he must deal with an obstructionist Congress who WILL NOT pass his jobs agenda.
There is money available for infrastructure initiative simply by virtue of the fact that the troops who were in Iraq now provide a considerable amount of additional resources now that the Iraqian conflict is over; that savings could be used to beef up this nation's roads, bridges, etc;. It is the GOP leaning House republicans that are sitting on this money and who REFUSE to allow it to be spent in accordance with the President's plan to get the ball rolling again. The Republicans cry that the Pres is over-spending and wanting to spend even more but those same House Repubs didn't make a sound when Bush LIED us into the Iraqian fiasco to begin with. NOW...SUDDENLY THEY ARE CONCERNED ABOUT OVER-SPENDING; NOW THAT PRES OBAMA WANTS TO USE THAT MONEY TO HEAL THE NATION!
Do you understand that the Pres cannot just spend money on his own? Do you understand that?!? Congress must approve his spending and for four years they have blocked his every attempt to jump start the country's economy simply because they want him to look bad in the eyes of people like you!
It would appear that their method of madness is working very well on the lame!
Right on...
The problem that I see with this statement is the largest and most wasteful thing in our budget is the military spending, which the Republicans oppose cutting with an amazing resolve. Having served in the military I know how inefficiently the military spends its money and the biggest problem with this comes from the fact that the system punishes commanders for not spending every dime that they ask for. Coming in under budget in the military is considered a very very bad thing. Fix this and you could probably cut the military budget by 10% or more without even a hiccup in readiness. It might even go up. The problem is that the military contractors wouldn't get paid $500 for a toilet seat.
I have very little confidence that Congress will be able to solve the problem with the Fiscal Cliff because they are blowing the same horns that they were blowing a year ago. Partisan politics will rear its ugly head long before this is over again.
Why do exit polling on how many white people voted for Obama. Why not be balanced and also show how many Afro-Americans or blacks voted for the white man? Of course, liberalism and racism had nothing to do with the refusal to share the second exit poll.
The republicans are looking for the reason they've lost to president obama ??? let me help you guys , first thing , drop MORONI , and turn back to JESUS CHRIST !!! drop the GREED , drop the LYING , drop the HIPOCRICY , drop the SELFISHNESS , drop the SELF RIGHTEOUSNESS , drop the WELFARE ENTITLEMENT FOR THE RICH , drop the ARROGANCE , drop the OFFSHORE TAX DODGING , drop the OBSTUCTIONIST. IN OTHER WORDS , '' DROP THE TEA PARTY '' , AND IT WILL GIVE YA'LL A FIGHTING CHANCE !!!!!!!