talk to the hand If that were paulie who won you would saying he was the best. Now you only can blame and put down the man who showed paulie how to debate. A typical republican blame everyone else but not your guy. Its like its Joe's fault your guy can't debate.

It was the Joe Biden Show. You are correct. And Ryan was a cold fish. Which makes him a perfect role model for greedy rich people who want more and more and more at our expense. Great job Joe. Let's keep the passion going President Obama. All the way to victory in November.

Ryan reminded me of Tom Hanks in Big, in the last scene, where he is suddenly a little boy in a grown man's suit. Ryan's real life son, who came onto the set after the debate and cockily sat in his seat did a prety good immitation of his immature father.

Biden was Biden. I loved it when he replied to Ryan trying to equate Romney's videotape rant to a Biden gaffe "I always say what I mean." Romney says what he means in private, but in public he says whatever it takes. Romney is untrustworthy.

 It will be interesting to watch Obama try to finesse Biden's admission that "we didn't know" requests for more security forces in Libya had been made.  It does go to the heart of the incompetence of this administration.

 Fora year, requests for additional security team members were sent to Washington, and routinely denied, because their "risk assessment" indicated there were plenty of security personnel on the ground.  In fact, The Obama administration thought there was so much redundant security there, they cut it back.

Here is the statement from under Secretary for Management at the State Department, Patrick Kennedy:

     |"We regularly assess risk and resource allocation, a process involving the considered judgments of experienced professionals on the ground and in Washington, using the best available information."|

Maybe, in hindsight, they might have moved some of the Marine Embassy unit deployed to such "hotspots" as Paris,France to Libya.  

Another great Biden line was the administration's total cluelessness about the cause of the protests and attacks.  Hey, Joe?  If intelligence briefings bore you too much, try reading a newspaper.  On September 12,2012, USA Today had an article that clearly showed that the Cairo Embassy attack was announced on August 30, and its purpose was the demand for the release of the Blind Sheikh- not some video nobody ever heard about until our own Embassy personnel put out a memo apologizing for it.

That must have left a large number of Salafists scratching their heads.

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/world/story/2012/09/12/libyan-officials-us-ambassador-killed-in-attack/57752828/1

Not that they needed to wait until AFTER the attacks to know the purpose- the New York Times reported the demand back in June

http://thelede.blogs.nytimes.com/2012/06/29/just-off-tahrir-protesters-demand-release-of-blind-sheikh-jailed-in-u-s/

So, is the entire Obama administration that clueless-

Or are they all just blatant liars?  

I suppose each person will draw his or her own conclusion.

Joe was simply too good on substance and style.

Amy--I thought that "I always say what I mean" was a devastating shot at BOTH Romney and Ryan. Both caught on tape saying things that they later deny meaning.

uaw a reregger gets no credit here. Go home troll. Take your lies with you!

Talk to the Hand

He just had a whole lot of talking points lined up and very little time to say them. He thought he was going on The Joe Biden show and didn't realize they were actually going to let someone else share the stage. And in his mind, he was the only person in the whole place with any brains. I do think I saw some seeping out one of his plugs.

Talk to the Hand

Well, you have to admit Paul Ryan might as well have been an empty chair since Ryan could not provide any answers!!! HAHA

4 more 4 44

Obama/Biden 2012

Feisty Biden is a true statesman -

.

Biden won easily by knockout ... in the first round.

.

Ryan...a kid..suffered too much abuse from an adult. Too mcuh awe for Ryan the elementary school kid.

.

hahahahahahahahahaha - as our Joe was having a hearty fun during the debate.

.

and as I predicted yesterday...the Feisty One won.

Yep gang you can always tell who is winning an argument or debate - it's the guy talking the loudest and interrupting all the time.

I see this all the time in court - you have the facts on your side, you argue the facts. You don't you pound the table and raise your voice.

In fact there is a proverb about this very thing: 29:9 - when a wise man has a controversy with a foolish man, the foolish man either raises his voice or laughs, and there is no rest.

I thought it was funny when Ryan tried to show off how he had paid attention during his Afghanistan briefing by claiming troops had been withdrawn too early "in the east." And Biden corrected him: American troops were withdrawn and REPLACED by Afghan troops in the east. Obama has communicated to Kabul, security is THEIR responsibilty now. Just like Obama said to Iraq: stand up for your own freedom, we won't do it for you.

Romney/Ryan trying to criticize the Obama administration on Afghanistan is laughable. Their criticism on Libya is just painful, considering pre-revolution they couldn't decide whether we should keep the devil we knew, or invade with boots on the ground, and just went with criticizing whatever action the Obama administration took.

And good golly but between Biden's 'we didn't know they [Benghazi embassy] wanted more security" and "that was the intelligence we had at the time" - both proven conclusively false, as reported by Andrea Mitchell no less,

AND

Steph Cutter saying the only reason the murders of Americans in Libya is an issue is political,

Obama has already lost the third debate.

Oh and why in the world did Biden lie about his votes on the wars?

That was just stoopid.

Amy, dear, are you really saying there are no longer American troops in the East part of Afghanistan?

Really?

SO Amy - Libya was all good? No problems at all?

Huh. That isn't even the consensus on the libbie side.

The Dems are anxious to accuse Romney and Ryan of being the liars, but lets see who, by nature, is a compulsive liar. I'll give you a hint, it starts with B and ends with iden.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/history_lesson/2008/08/the_write_stuff.html?fb_ref=sm_fb_plugin_activity

We did find out that Paul Ryan could be President

The only presidential position he could fill is that of his local archery club, where he is the only member, and his shaft is taxed just the right amount.

http://halfempth.blogspot.com/2012/08/cutting-those-arrow-shaft-excise-taxes.html

Spanky-

Yep gang you can always tell who is winning an argument or debate - it's the guy talking the loudest and interrupting all the time.

so according to your assessment, Romney lost the 1st debate?

The only presidential position he could fill is that of his local archery club, where he is the only member, and his shaft is taxed just the right amount.

OK, really? You know you are desperate if you have to somehow turn a tax on arrow shafts against the VP candidate. Look at the article I posted, its a lot more condemning than your arrow shaft tax.

The desperation is almost palpable.

spanky I've asked this before. I never get a answer. Maybe you can answer this. Your quoting the bible.

Is god real?

Is god something man made to control other men?

so according to your assessment, Romney lost the 1st debate?

Biden's childishness does not even come close to the way Romney handled himself. Romney was aggressive, Biden was childish. There is a difference, and Biden demonstrated that difference.

Nope bayllie Obama plain lost, all by himself.

So your point is Mitt talked loud, laughed out loud while Obama was talking, and interrupted continuously?

Interesting. Not remotely true, but interesting perspective.

So Gang - you all get a load of today's polls from Florida and Virginia?

Oh my.

Amy B. Portland, ME

Ryan reminded me of Tom Hanks in Big, in the last scene, where he is suddenly a little boy in a grown man's suit. Ryan's real life son, who came onto the set after the debate and cockily sat in his seat did a prety good immitation of his immature father.

You should be ashamed of yourself for bringing Ryan's kid into this discussion. He has nothing to do with politics, nor with his father's campaign for vice president. There would be a hue and cry if we did the same thing to the Obama kids.

You also spelled imitation and pretty wrong in your malicious diatribe.

Simply put, you need to grow up.

But then again, we already knew that from the candidate you support for President.

DEMOCRATS FOR DECENCY, DEMOCRATS FOR ROMNEY 2012!!!!!

WHy shoot smitty I am touched that you would care at all about my religious beliefs.

Don't take this the wrong way, but I have no such concern about yours, or anyone else's.

And perhaps more importantly for this discussion - I have set forth my position of religion and god here many times.

The proverb quote was given to demonstrate that the proposition I put forth is very old. Why I bet we could find a similar concept in Budd ism, Hinduism, Judaism, and so on.

So smitty, why on earth do you care?

Amy B. Portland, ME

I thought it was funny when Ryan tried to show off how he had paid attention during his Afghanistan briefing

I noticed it, too. Ryan was trying so hard to insert himself in all the "big boy" briefings to gain some credibility with the voters. Yet, he came accross as someone who memorized the lines but didn't know how to apply them in real life.

I especially loved when Biden kept correcting Ryan that the reason why we have fewer troops is because as new Afghan troops are trained they replace Americans.

Finally, Biden asked Ryan: you'd rather Americans be going in and doing the job instead of Afghans, and that shut Ryan right up. Ryan couldn't say 'yes, we want to send more Americans to Afghanistan.' Ryan got cornered in and he lost.

What's scary is the old bafoon we saw last night is only a heartbeat away from being our President.

Biden announced his candidacy for President in June 1987, and was considered one of the potentially strongest candidates in the field. However, in September 1987, newspaper stories stated he had plagiarized a speech by British politician Neil Kinnock.

Other allegations of past law school plagiarism and exaggerating his academic record soon followed. Biden withdrew from the race later that month.

John Doe-2241225

Biden's childishness does not even come close to the way Romney handled himself. Romney was aggressive,

spankMe's argument was "loudest and interrupting" which Romney was both. Romney was loudest out of the two and Romney interrupted out of the two...

so take up your disagreement with Spanky. He wrote it. I'm simply applying spankster's logic to last week's debate.

Ryan only has dogMa, no substance...woof...oink?

RedDev: "The only presidential position he could fill is that of his local archery club, where he is the only member, and his shaft is taxed just the right amount."

Which I guess proves once again that "Size does matter". Or maybe that's a question for Mrs. Spanky.....

Spanky-

Nope bayllie Obama plain lost, all by himself.

yeah but you said those loudest and interupting lose so Romney would qualify as a loser under your ctiteria.

so it's not ALL who are loudest and interupt after all Spanky? Is it only those you dislike?

Pick one:

1. it's the guy talking the loudest and interrupting all the time - applies to all

2. it's the guy talking the loudest and interrupting all the time - excludes Romney

3. I was wrong

which one is it, Spankster? This is really simple stuff, Mr. Big Lawyer.

spanky Well shoot spank, to answer your question I don't care. Your bible quote has been used allot today. Is it because Joe took it to your guy to the woodshed. Also spank I have never heard your set forth position of religion and god here.

Well,

the debate did one thing, it took all the attention away from the 1st debate...

Which I guess proves once again that "Size does matter"

@JoAnne - oddly, he didn't propose a 'tip tax'. I guess he thought a reduction from 12% to .39 centimeters covered the shortfall. Interestingly, 1 centimeter is about .39 inches. Ya think that is a conversion coincidence? I'm sure Spanky could argue that case to his wife.

What's scary is the old bafoon we saw last night

Ah Oh - watch out .. our resident barnyard buffoon (baboon?) is scared. She's gonna start running around like a chicken with her head cut off.

RedDev -

Look, I don't want to ruin my reputation as a nice girl any more than I already have. So I'm not touching that "tip tax" with a ten-foot-pole.

(Oops....)

Rd Dev - LOL - I'm sure Spanky HAS argued that case to his wife!

Isn't it funny how belligerent the radical righties are today? Biden wiping the floor with lying Ryan is really upsetting them. Apparently they thought - after his gym photos yesterday - that Ryan was fit to take on Joe. WRONG!

Actually Ryan isn't fit for much - just the usual lies of the Romney campaign. I particularly liked it when Martha kept pressing him about their tax plan then said "so, no specifics, right?" You just can't deny he looked totally ignorant!

Class will tell and clearly Joe Biden outclassed Ryan at every turn!

Obama/Biden 2012

I'm call it "The Joe Biden Beatdown"!

Loved it!

Obama/Biden 2012

that Ryan was fit to take on Joe. WRONG!

I thought the photo-ops were perfect - a set of dumbbells.

@JoAnne - I'm howling!!! As Feisty says, that one needed a 'warning' sign.

We can say that Joe gave Lyin Ryan a good old fashion bitch slapping.

All blowhard Biden could do was laugh...laugh at dead soldiers comment...pretty classy guy...but what would you expect from a guy with dementia... The only thing he got right last night was his name...

Gotta agree Ana.

And speaking of debates, we got to see the differences the candidates offer. One named Ryan, an elitist Rand-ian punk who thinks entitlements are for his benefit only, and one named Biden, who thinks entitlements are for the entire nation. And since politics is a contact sport, it was a pleasure to see Biden smack that punk in his proverbial pie-hole. Hope Ryan's elitist healthcare plan pays to replace his teeth.

And speaking of teeth - Man Joe's got some fantastic chompers.

AH but I do so love when a libbie like RedDev gets off on someone the smacking of a pie-hole.

Violence is never the answer Reddev. Plus, what happened to toning down the violent talk?

gets off on someone the smacking of a pie-hole.

Speaking of pie-holes, it has been a whole 3 whole days since we've heard you bitching and blaming democrats about 5.00 gasoline to fill your ginormous gas bag tank. Shouldn't you be out at the local filling station and wrapping your pie-hole around a feeding nozzle? Maybe you can convert to methane, I'm sure Jersy and her herd of twit - ters will be glad gas you up.

DaNoid,

Read that announcement this AM.

You are so right... enough wars have been started over economic issues in the past.

Congratulations to the European Union for winning the Nobel Peace Prize.

Shhh Noid .. didn't ya hear, the US of A has a large contingent group that doesn't want to end up like 'them' - you know, winners of a Nobel Peace Prize, or owners of the largest global economy, or any of those other indicators of excellence. They prefer playing in the dumpster with other 4th world countries, as evidenced by their enthusiastic support of GOPTP candidates Romney/Ryan.

Oh my.

Yeah Europe is awesome. Nobel Prize? Why not.

Christ gang, many parts of the EU want out of that awesome-ness.

Maybe that'll all change now cause they get to share a Nobel Prize.

Biden laughed? Our future is at stake and Biden laughed at the answers of a right wing empty head who wants to be our vp.

Romney has been making deals with the teaparty gang for two years. That is who we will get in the White House. The far right.

Biden laughed at the absurdity of Ryan's lies.

The lies themselves aren't important? The fact that Ryan showed no leadership or intelligence is not important? Again?

Okay.

Spanky: Yeah Europe is awesome. Nobel Prize? Why not.

They should have just given it to Obama again. Then he'd have bookends to hold those two books he supposedly wrote.

On the plus side, at least the $1.2 million dollar prize can be used to further the bailout Greece.

O: Michelle, I won another Nobel Peace Prize!

M: That's nice dear. Wash up now, it's time for dinner.

JoAnnaSmith1

O: Michelle, I won another Nobel Peace Prize!

M: That's nice dear. Wash up now, it's time for dinner.

wow, your posts are getting desperate...you should start writing for the 'reality' TV shows like Moonshiners, you'll do great with them fake, boring scripts.

ursula,

I happened to be in the car last night so heard most of the debate on the radio.

It was so revealing. Biden had a great tone, voice and spoke clearly when he was presenting the facts.

Ryan speaks fast when he is trying to present his numbers or "facts" and has an irratating speech impediment. He drops parts of his words.

Sorry Domenico,

but I will listen to the next debate on public radio.

I saw Bide laughing when talking about Benghazi. Very sad.

NorthstarDFL, I noticed the rapid speech as well (plus he drops the first "S" in business). But if Romney/Ryan's elected, you best listen to NPR while you can - I'm sure that's on their chopping block.

JERSY GIRL - You're a damned liar - nothing less. Joe Biden DID NOT laugh about the Benghazi incident.

You really show no class or integrity. You're a true Republican - nothing but low life garbage.

Obama/Biden 2012

Ah SS - go easy on Jersy girl .. It's got to be hard to churn milk into cheese while typing incoherent thoughts. The poor things brain gets all scrambled.

OK Sanity - why did Biden lie about his war votes?

Why did he lie about what the WH knew about the murders?

Flat lies, plain and simple.

Why I bet even you know it.

Ah, who am I kidding.

But I do so love the personal attacks. Yep, you all must be winning.

You mean like when Old Joe was laughing as he was lying about Benghazi?

You really show no class or integrity. You're a true Republican...

Yep, a bona fide Tea Bag. What debate were you watching JG?

You've got nothing so you cook up some nonsense. Wait a minute is that you Mitt?

Get over it the "Budget Boy" Lost.

JG1! Spanky! Do not gang up like that on my gal SS. She gets very upset.

SS, I got your back dearie! Two days in a row.

Obama/Biden 2012 - You don't have to have a sense of humor when you watch us in action, but it sure helps

spanky,

You seem really pleased with your "useful idiot" answers last night.

Ryan has always been a good foot soldier for Bush then the tea party folks since 2010 and now Romney.

Wonder if he will lose his congressional seat after he loses on the Romney/Ryan ticket?

JAS - You couldn't argue for Ryan on anything becaue he showed he is almost as clueless as you.

You are totally out of your league. Go back and play with little spanky and WCA - they're much more your speed - S L O W!

Nothing upsetting about you guys - humorous in a lowlife kind of way - but not upsetting in the least!

Obama/Biden 2012

Congressman Ryan still gave no specifics on loopholes and deductions for the tax plan. He has no idea what to do about Syria (when asked what he would do his answer was simply what he wouldn't do). He claims he and Mr. Romney have a plan to create 12 million jobs but doesn't say how or by when. He ran away from the 47% comment (you remember, the one cheered on by the Conservatives hanging around this blog). He almost gleefully called for another war in the Middle East while ignoring what economic sanctions are doing to Iran. He disagreed with the timetable for Afghanistan withdrawl but hopes to abide by it.

That's not leadership.

You can clearly see that Biden enjoyed being there, almost as much as I enjoyed watching it. Yes it was therapeutic.

So nice to see a debate where Ryan was pressed for details by the moderator and asked about inconsistencies. Good to see Joe call out Ryan and stop him from misrepresenting Obama's positions.

In boxing they would say Joe has a lot of heart, old and experienced but he was able to best the young amateur. Ryan showed a tough chin as he was hammered all night with the truth.

Hypothetical, boxing debate match - Biden vs. Romney: Synopsis Biden wins by knockout. After wobbling Mitt throughout the early rounds, Biden scores multiple uncontested, unanswered shots and Mitt is dropped in the seventh.

Obama vs. Paul: Synopsis A defensive, tactical fight lacking show boating but with lots of jabs and counterpunching. Ryan would try to slip and move and duck and cover his true positions. However, after scores are read Obama would win on points after exerting a workmanlike effort.

I dont get any thing from ryan or romney, they lie about every thing, so i dont and wont watch any more cause i hate a lier. i had a cousin that lied all the time .You can not talk to a lier, they always grt the last word, i would like for some one to tell me. how do you to talk to a lier.

No, you would prefer a President who refused additional security because he was trying to look like a good guy to Libyans while our Consulate was attack and our Ambassador was killed and then lied to cover it up. Then our Vice President lied about it all the while he was laughing last night.

If you say a lie long enough and loud enough... Eh JG?

Actually a lie is just that. So stop it already.

Paulie got trounced by Joe. Yeah the same Joe you guys think is inept.

BTW It is the VP's job to bash the opposition and if you didn't know that your party has made it an art form... Does Spiro Agnew ring any bells? Not that Joe is anything like that clown Agnew.

devie - JERSY GIRL is the perfect Republican. She lies just like Romney and Ryan. It's all they have - lies - and she believes if she repeats them enough so low information voter - like herself - will believe them.

Obama/Biden 2012

Ryan showed how emotionally ill he is over the topic of abortion.

Those zealots need medical treatment.

newdayDAWNING...RETURNED Those zealots need medical treatment.

But thats Obamacare. They would rather die than say its a good thing for America!

"My religion defines who I am, and I've been a practicing Catholic my whole life. And has particularly informed my social doctrine. The Catholic social doctrine talks about taking care of those who -- who can't take care of themselves, people who need help. With regard to -- with regard to abortion, I accept my church's position on abortion as a -- what we call a (inaudible) doctrine. Life begins at conception in the church's judgment. I accept it in my personal life.

But I refuse to impose it on equally devout Christians and Muslims and Jews, and I just refuse to impose that on others, unlike my friend here, the -- the congressman."

Vice President Biden just summed up the Liberal/Progressive view of faith. My faith is between me and God. Your faith is between you and whatever God you believe in (even if it's no God). For that reason, you are no position to impose your beliefs on me and I am in no position to impose my believes on you.

Thank you, Mr. Vice President.

Da Noid - I loved the closing comments Biden made. It clearly shows the man he is.

I also liked - after Ryan recounted yet another time Romney supposedly was a the bedside of a dying person, Biden talked about how he has had his own tragedies and he has met with others since then who are suffering. He made his comments without naming anyone or trying to make it a political statement. He did what people I know who actually help those who are suffering do - they are private about their help. They don't have to flaunt it. It goes to character. Clearly Biden has character - Romney just uses people.

Obama/Biden 2012

newday, I would like to have seen Biden tie Ryan to Akin more solidly and hit him harder on how his budget would devastate the most needy among us.

Da Noid, very good points there. Ryan just doesn't understand that religous freedom is not violated if an employer cannot impose the tenets of his religion on his employees.

Seeking -

My older brother - who I'll admit is far more objective than I am - picked up on that little bedside anecdote as well. Except his question was - "Was he saying Romney's going to do that for EVERY American who's sick or dying? Is that how he's going to replace healthcare reform when he gets done repealing it? I mean, it's a nice story, but WHERE ARE THE FACTS AND FIGURES?"

JoAnne - I'm just so tired of hearing Romney "use" the people he supposedly helps out of compassion. There is a big difference in consoling someone because you care or sitting with someone because it's required.

Obama/Biden 2012

I was so glad to see VP Biden make a basic statement about separation of church and state. It is one of the founding principles of our country yet the right shows no respect for the religious views and freedoms of anyone who disagrees with them.

I don't see how you people can actually believe Joe Biden is a Catholic. He can't have those views and be Catholic, and he can't openly accept birth control and be catholic. It is just impossible, Obama and his buddies are trying to tear down the church, If Joe Biden was a real Catholic and not a lap dog, he would stand up for his believes.

Bob, you're nuts. Are you saying that Catholic women who use birth control aren't Catholic? How on earth is that impossible? In your brain, if that is supposedly true, I would guess the only Catholic women in your view are nuns.

I do not like religion - but I like Jimmy Carter - he is against abortion for himself - but he has some insightful thoughts - read his book or excerpts on abortion -

This is the man Biden is: Biden announced his candidacy for President in June 1987, and was considered one of the potentially strongest candidates in the field. However, in September 1987, newspaper stories stated he had plagiarized a speech by British politician Neil Kinnock.

Other allegations of past law school plagiarism and exaggerating his academic record soon followed. Biden withdrew from the race later that month.

Bob - Joe Biden recognizes the separation of Church and state. He is a very good Catholic and lives his life as such. However, he realizes that he had no right to make others act according to his beliefs - they must act according to their own. It is part of our freedom. It is one of the beliefs our country was founded on. Too bad you missed that in your classes.

It is the difference between being an American and being tied to a country that espouses one religion - like Iran.

Obama/Biden 2012

Bob #,

I am a practicing Catholic.

You sir. do not know what you are talking about.

Just how in the hell do you now who is a real Catholic or not?

both Biden and Ryan are Catholic.

Both REALLY have received the Sacraments of Baptism, Confirmation and Eucharist.

Of course Catholic women and men use a variety of birth control .

Hey Bob this is 2012 not 1912.

NorthstarDFL - see that's the problem. People like Ryan and Bob want to take women back to 1912 where men had all the control. It's the only way they feel like men because they can't keep up with smart, strong women.

Obama/Biden 2012

Bob-1711646

.... Catholic Church against birth control ???? abortion ???? ..... is that why soooo very many priest are being charged with sexual assault and rape of pretty little boys .... no need for birth control or abortions ?????

OBAMA / BIDEN 2012

troy d. kite Like I say republican/tea party folks always blame someone else for their mistakes! Thats pathetic!!!

Smitty, just goes to show how little you know about the Tea Party. There are many Independents and Blue Dog Democrats in the Tea Party.

jersy girl 1 From what I've seen & heard of the tea party I don't want to know anymore. Its like a bad movie that won't end. One just ends up leaving saying that it just about made me puke it sucked so bad.

I would say the same thing if my candidate got beat like that!!

Vice-President Biden kicked Ryan's butt!!

yes - we are - the vice president takes over if something happens to the president - could Palin have made the decisions that Kennedy did when the Cubans tried to start WW3 - You promise more piplines in America - who is going to enforce that when farmer Joe says he likes his open fields and the beauty of nature and doesn't want them to drill on his land - where is Ryan going to draw his decision making from - Ayn Rand - she does not believe in government - then who is going to get old Joe off his land if there is no government?

Oh yes we are, the Vice President is a heartbeat away from being President. To think of Biden as President of this country is a VERY scary thought.

troy d.kite Nobody takes you seriously to.

Biden was laughing when he really wanted to be punching the liar next to him, I think we all know what that feels like. What else can you do, it's like when you watch FOX noise and your blood pressure rises in rage - all you can do is turn on Jon Stewart or Steve Colbert and laugh as they satirize the nutjobbers.

There is no reasoning with Ryan/Romney, they want to win in the worst way - by distorting their positions, saying anything, running out the clock with lies.

I suppose Obama doesn't want to win in the worst way? Maybe that is why Obama isn't working so hard to cover-up what really happened in Benghazi. BTW it was disgusting to watch Biden laugh when talking about Benghazi.

Domenico: Troy makes the case. They have to prop Ryan up somehow!

I wouldn't hire Joe Bidden to walk my dog. He is an idiot and a second grade politician. He is damn lucky to be VP...... just a fact.

Troy - V.P. Biden doesn't have time to walk your dog but your dog would probably like him better than you. Biden's clearly smarter!

Obama/Biden 2012

Get a job! I am tired of supporting you!

troy d. kite Now thats real original.

Anyone want to guess who Mr. Kite is a re-reg of?

Please don't feed the re-regs!!!

Smitty, I don't have to hide behind a catchy title...... I'm the real deal!

Troy, perhaps Biden should have not pointed out all of Lyin' Ryan's lies. Perhaps he should not have drawn attention to LyRy's hypocrisy in asking for stimulus funds. You'd have liked that, but Biden doesn't play that way.

For each of Ryan's fabrications, Biden laughed and he laughed a lot. Biden clearly wanted to signal each Ryan lie and he addressed many of them, leaving Ryan looking hesitant and struggling to remember his talking points..performing only slightly better than Palin. Not good, Troy.

If you people hate America so much why are you still here? I think I hear Greece calling your name.... please go. I'll pay your way if needed. I have a great paying job and I am tired of you freeloaders.

Again silly liberals... let me remind you that we are not voting for a vice president......... just saying... I don't particularly like Ryan myself. He is a little smug for my taste, but he is on point more than Biden.

troy d kite So your a reregg. You have no credit here. Go home troll.

By the way I love my country! Its the best country in the world!!!

Troy - on the contrary - we love this country and refuse to give Romney/Ryan the opportunity to destroy it.

The ignorant "freeloader" comment is so tired and stupid. Most of us work. I believe some are actually retired. You're not paying any of my bills - but I probably foot a lot of yours

Grow up! You picked the wrong horse in Romney/Ryan!

Obama/Biden 2012

yep, Troy -you are a true republican - platitudes and hate - that is all you have to offer - but if you get tired of your dog - just tie him to the roof - or go entertain yourself by bullying someone who is not rich or who does not look like you

No Seeking you want Obama to have the pleasure of doing that.

Troy D. Kite

I wouldn't hire Joe Bidden to walk my dog. He is an idiot and a second grade politician. He is damn lucky to be VP...... just a fact.

YEAH .. GET ROMNEY TO CARE FOR YOUR DOG .. .HE'LL BE TIED TO ROOF OF HIS CAR ... A MUCH BETTER CHOICE ...

OBAMA 2012

Biden may have please all the Liberals last night, but from what I have heard so far today, he did nothing to please Independent voters.

JERSY GIRL - again with the lies. Polls showed that Biden won over the Independents who were listening 60% to 33%. 7% had no opinion. In every category Biden won - leadership; facts; trust; who would be most ready to be President. He won them all.

You are a good Republican - you lie about everything!

Obama/Biden 2012

but from what I have heard so far

Yeah .. you told us already - you heard that from your fellow twits.

Paul Ryan comes off like Prince Joffrey from Game of Thrones--a smarmy, bratty, power-hungry control freak.

BINGO!

Your husband is a VERY observant man! ;o)

"he looked very uncomfortable"

I would feel uncomfortable too if some man I was trying to debate was laughing, interrupting and smiling the whole time. Biden had little substance and was more satisfied with the fact that he was talking the entire time than actually saying something important.

We can only hope that Rep. Ryan loses his race for the House as well---I'd like to see him try to earn a living in the real world. Oh wait---he would just become a lobbyist. Or go on Fox. Still---our government would be better off without him.

SailorGirl---I'm having a hard time understanding how anyone calls the debate anything other than a win for Biden.

Bob - Biden outsmarted and Ryan at every turn He stated facts and called Ryan on his and Romney's constant lies. You're just sore because your boys were shown to be the liars most of us have known they were!

Biden was all substance while Ryan was all fluff!

Obama/Biden 2012

Maybe your side would like it if Biden had let all those lies go unaddressed or patted LyRy on the head and given him a lollipop? Ryan gave it a good shot. He *sounded* more knowledgeable than Palin, but that's not a particularly high bar.

You're just sore because your boys were shown to be the liars most of us have known they were!

Oh look at that, Another Liberal lying! (am I surprised no) Ryan continuously tried to defend himself, but whenever he attempted he was met with "Lie, Lie, Lie, malarkey, I'm just going to smile as big as possible so everybody looks at me" as he was trying to talk! Like I said before, it would be flustering to try and talk, only to be met with disrespect and as Ryan said: "Mr. Vice President, I know you're under a lot of duress to make up for lost ground, but I think people would be better served if we don't keep interrupting each other."

Biden's lying last night may have cost Obama the race. Benghazi is NO laughing matter. Obama will do anything to turn attention away from the fact that he screwed up big time with that one and now the blood of four Americans is on his hands.

SailorGirl ...

Paul Ryan comes off like Prince Joffrey from Game of Thrones

Now there's someone who is totally punch worthy! Great analogy (and I do love Game of Thrones!)

Obama/Biden 2012

Troy dear - wait for the polls that take into consideration this debate. Also, the SMALL bump Romney got from the first debate has been fading - fast!

I can see why your original post is missing. It probably was as worthless as the rest of the ones you've made today!

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I like your SeekingSanity........fits you well as you obviously are insane if you think Obama's agenda of socialism is right for America.

I guess those moral repubs will then have to bring out the cheating machine again

Troy - as I always say, "seeking sanity in the GOP but idiots like you prove daily there is absolutely none to be found."

What a pity the Republican party has sunk so low.

Oh, and the "socialism" idiotcy shows you've got no game - just tired stupidity!

Obama/Biden 2012

I hope the Obama campaign uses the clip from the debate where Paul Ryan looks like a frustrated twelve year old whose Dad won't let him ride his bike without a helmet. I was trying to imagine Ryan "acting out" in a meeting with Vladimir Putin. Yeah, that would be effective super powery stuff.

Amy---I guess Rep. Ryan doesn't like to be challenged--he was pretty rude to the reporter who asked him a question he didn't like---walked off and got snippy.

Steeler Fan,

Ryan is like Peyton Manning. (I know, after the game last night, perhaps a football analogy is unwelcome). Manning is a timing quarterback. Throw off the timing and he makes mistakes. Ryan is the same. He doesn't expect to be challenged on anything. Push just enough and he reveals a lot.

Troy! Have you ever eaten crow? I'll be looking for your comments on November 7th here!!

Troy! Have you been watching the news (other than Fox) for the last couple of years? How many of the products from China have been found to be way below par or dangerous? The latest are faulty airbags! Why are some companies who have done business there coming back here? Are you aware that while Romney is criticizing President Obama about China that he has financial interests there?

I'm sure when you hear these things you just say "they are all liberal lies"! Oh well, live in your little cocoon! November 7th will be an awakening!

So instead of trickle down you feel we should just all be slaves to the government and let them control every aspect of our lives....... seriously, what is wrong with you people! This is America and it's suppose to be the land of the free and the home of the brave. Clearly, some of you fail to measure up! So, do us all a favor and move to Greece or Europe as their "socialism" is working out so well t your liking.

I thought Joe Biden showed great restraint in using words like "Ryan's lack of candor" or "stuff" and "marlarky" instead of "the Representative is a liar and a cheap little snot."

Honestly, I don't know how President Obama and Vice President Biden can stand to share a stage with these little draft-dodging hypocrites as they attack our foreign policies of that last four years, aka massive clean up after the last Republican fiasco.

Amy, I think Joe held back. LyRy gave him so much material to work with:

1) LyRy dodged the questions about budget math...again, despite repeated prodding by the moderator.

2) Our troop levels in Afghanistan

3) The Afghanistan timetable

4) Abortion

5) The fact that Ryan had govt help when his dad died. The Ryan budget will devastate families in need.

6) Refusal to allow jobs bills to come to a vote

and on and on

Joe didn't hold anything back, the entire world saw what a baffoon we have as our Vice President.

"Biden" and "restraint" in the same sentence with regards to last night's debate??????!?!? Ah ha ha ha ha!!!!! He couldn't even define "stuff" when asked what stuff he was referring to. Like I said, when you can't stand on your own record, you make stuff up in a mocking and codescending manner. Too funny.

Jersy, your boy was overmatched. He struggled to remember which talking points to use and it was SO obvious that he was out of his depth.

Your guy couldn't even grasp the concept that if we draw some American troops from Afghanistan and those troops are backfilled with the Afghan troops we trained, then the numbers of troops in Afghanistan remain the same. It's only that the number of American troops that's gone down.

Maybe it's more of his magic budgetary math that he can't explain, but it works because studies (from the AEI and other con think tanks) say so.

Ryan could have done worse, a lot worse, but he was exposed...big time.

The fact that Ryan had govt help when his dad died.

Funny I thought survivor benefits from SS was a fund his father paid into most of his life and his family was to collect upon his demise. Government help? So what you are saying is that you DO think SS is a GovCo entitlement?

I think that Joe Biden did everything he needed to do to get his points across last night. I believe debates are better when they are structured, especially when the moderator was as good as Martha Raddatz, who was a breath of fresh air when compared with Jim Lehrer, but at the same time the stiff format allows little room for expansion when needed. A lot of people have commented on the fact that Biden came off less than professional because he interrupted a lot. And truthfully there was a lot of interrupting on both sides.

The telling difference for me on this point is that Biden appeared much more passionate about the subject matter than Ryan. In my opinion, for the most part, Biden's exuberance was an outcropping of his genuine belief in what he was saying. In short, his heart was totally invested in everything he said. That's part of what makes him a candidate of the people. Politics isn't a job to him, it's a way of life. He wants to help the middle class, because it is in his nature. I know a lot of people like him myself, and I think perhaps if you stop assigning so much value to his outer shell and instead, pay more attention to what drives him, his values and convictions, you might learn something of import. He is simply a good man and an excellent representative of the people.

Ryan in contrast, while I agree, was probably more poised and unflappable, he still seems uncomfortable when not surrounded by an audience that isn't composed entirely of his own mindset. And therein lies part of the problem. He was too poised, too stiff, too automaton and by the book. It was almost as if he'd drawn a circle around himself before he sat down and had made up his mind that he would never vary from the script. To me, he cared little about what he said, he was just there to get as many points out as he could in the time allotted, and that was it. Certainly no show, and very little substance.

The only hint of a true personality I glimpsed from Ryan was when both Biden and Raddatz were attempting to get him to lay out exactly what exemptions and loopholes Romney/Ryan would eliminate/close in order to pay for their (on again/off again tax cut, because it seems to change daily), and he just wouldn't do it. If he is good at anything, it's avoiding details, and actually in that department, along with Romney, he excels.

That moment pretty much sealed the deal for me. I truly thought, especially with the enormous prep time his campaign was given, that there would be no way they could possibly give their formula - "we'll have to wait to work with congress to see exactly what will be cut..."

Boy was I wrong, because there it was again, in all it's politically wrapped generic subterfuge form.

Well, at least it wasn't as bad as Romney, who during his first debate, outright denied that the five trillion tax cut plan, 20 percent across the board, that he'd been campaigning on, ever existed in the first place. It was a shocking tactic to be sure, but in the end, it did get him out of explaining how it would be paid for, and I'm sure that was the goal. That Obama didn't jump on this mile wide opening was his own disgrace, so I am not giving him an out on this either. I hope it will be addressed somewhere in the next two presidential debates.

So now, not only before the debates, but incredibly, during them, Romney/Ryan are still refusing to give details. I've noticed that a favorite buzz word of theirs when they are in full denial mode is "framework." We've completed the framework" is an example. Be on the lookout for it. I, and I know many others just cannot fathom voting for candidates who refuse to clue their constituents into their plans. And add into that, keeps changing what side of the issues they are on. If you are willing to vote for something that vague, why not simply sign over your power of attorney while you're at it, if indeed you are that blindly trusting.

As a last point, while Ryan might have scored a "obviously practiced" zinger alluding to Biden's prior gaffes, it was certainly an apples and oranges example if ever there was one. Biden might be guilty of a little foot in mouth every now and again, but it certainly doesn't compare to Romney's 47 percent disaster. Unless you would have us believe that Romney simply "misspoke" for well over hafl an hour of recorded statements. Pretty much everything he said before and after that 47 percent comment either led up or confirmed its authenticity. And Romney's been trying to walk it back ever since. He does a lot of walking in that direction.

So again, at least for me, I'd much rather have my candidate come off as a little less than polished outwardly, but have some backbone, show some grit, compassion, and belief in what he is saying, than have one so stiffly on point that you have to check every now and again to ensure that there is indeed a heart beating in there somewhere.

Obama/Biden