Part time jobs is what they are doing in Texas, thanks to Perry.

The saying in Texas is, "Yeah, I have a job. Three of them".

Romney is calling on the 47% for Votes, Mitt says he's a new man today and cares about the 1%, "OOPS" sorry about that, Mitt says he's a new man today and cares about the 100% !!!!!!!!!!

smitty, you're just making crap up to fit your little right brain. The fact is that the numbers are revised every month as additional data not available at the first survey are incorporated into the estimate in order to make the estimate more accurate. they are using the exact same process that they used during the Bush admin. How many times did you question those numbers?

Hoover was responsible for the Great Depression and My grand parents called those shantytowns Hoovervilles.

Bush is responsible for the Great Recession and people around here are calling their shantytowns Bushvilles.

If Republicans truly cared about those that were hurt by the Economic melt-down they would have cheered any improvement in the numbers, no matter how slight, and worked with the President to repair the economic damage.

Instead, they've pledged to do everything they can to diminish the duly elected President and make it their number one priority for the last four years to make sure he isn't reelected. Just who are they working for? It sure isn't the American public. I think it's time to let ALL elected officials (and both parties) know that they work for us (That would be the true majority, not just those with the most power and money).

When your mediocre candidate is loosing and there is nothing you can do about it, shoot the messenger and attack the facts. The debate proved Myth Romney is no longer believable, on any level. He has more flip-flops than a Hawaiian shoe store.

Why should anyone trust the right wing either, since under GW, $2.1 trillion worth of incurred debt was hidden in inter-governmental borrowing over his last 7 years in office rather than reporting it, which obviously would have swayed reported economic numbers to the negative side too?

Could that fact be one reason that the 2008-2009 economic collapse was so huge, as that $2.1 trillion of debt suddenly had to be included in our economic numbers, as it was when the FY2008 revision was issued by the US Treasury in October of 2009?

Remember that the absolute worst year in terms of incurred debt in US history was 2008 after GW's reported debt and his inter-governmental borrowing was combined, to yield a single year debt increase of $1.838 Trillion, a figure almost 50% larger than Obama's worst year so far!

So yes,it is entirely possible to falsely sway economic numbers, just as it is possible for NBC to sway poll numbers by calling large numbers of AT&T cell phone customers and including their responses as some kind of fact in polling too, since in order to have an AT&T cell service account, you have to be somewhat on the creditworthy side too.

So maybe NBC is just as guilty of swaying its reported poll numbers as anyone else is too?

The Right are Wrong on this.

Mitt, You Lie.

Silliness talking suddenly about quality of jobs measured-part time/full time - the input into the number has been the same all the time. The right should remember-it is just a number, for some reason they are the ones that put the importance of their campaign and what they've been working for the last 4 years upon keeping this number higher than 8%....just wonder if American voters are smart enough to realize all the work republicans put into keeping this number high. Rick Santorum did say we like the dumb people and must continue to work to make Americans dumber., they will serve us better.

You loopy connies just crack me up. Everything that happens that you just do not agree with you righties claim it's all a huge conspiracy. Is that anything like the Georgia republican governor that states and I quote "the theory of evolution was created in the pits of hell"??? Holy smokes you connies have closets chock full of monsters and they just won't go away will they?? No wonder the new nick name for the republican/teabag party is "The American Taliban". What kinda of crazy constituency would ever vote such a raving lunatic like this into Congress???? And here is just one more example of why the republican majority held congress has the lowest approval rating in the history of our country. And that is why we have to get rid of these idiots in November.

So Mike in sa, You don't believe in science? Or just the science that backs up your beliefs? Or is it a giant cospiracy? You better get your story straight. By the way, do you believe in Human evolution and the ancient age of the Earth? or are you on the GOP side of the issue- you know the Earth is 6,000 years old and evolution is a lie from "the pit of Hell". Speak up and defend your party.

Ever think that there may be fewer republicans out there to get a sample from. Maybe Americans are more intelligent than to be republicans and vote for Mitt and Lying Ryan!

Looks like the GOP is Waterboarding mygirl, how is your friend Sean Hannity doing !!!!!!!!!!

Ah-hah-hah. These Teapublicans have missed their calling. They should have all been preachers, carnival barkers, and comedians.

Brian,

Did you flunk math.? Typical republican can't get their facts straight. 8.1%

-7.8%

.3%

Many Romney supporters question numbers favoring Obama

Let's see. What's the simplest way can I put this?

Oh yeah; "Er Duh!"

Like I'd expect liars wouldn't stick to the same story. Er Duh... (~;

Brian ,

If you read the full story it said that the figures were updated with 300,000 jobs being added the last 3 months. Just like the figures were down graded the three months before that by 150,000, but Democrats didn't say it was fishy like you crying lying republican'ts!!!!!

It absolutely has to be a grand multi layered communist/marxist/liberal/gay/NBCnews//Rachel Maddow conspiracy bordering on a coup d'etat!!!! (sarcasm) It couldn't be something simple like all the retailers are adding their xmas extra help now and people are actually being hired?

When Obama is re-elected the Republicans will say the voting numbers were faked.

Typical of 21 st century Republicans ---when you don't like FACTS -- make up facts. Don't like what the polls say -- make up polls. Don't like the numbers --- make up numbers. People don't like what you say - tell them you never said it even thought they can see it and hear it. Republicans -lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, lie, the lie more.

mygirl1

You don't cheer manipulation of numbers for political gain.

and I'm sure you have proof to support that idiotic statement. Show me a shred of eivdence that those numbers were manipulated.

COinFL

When Obama is re-elected the Republicans will say the voting numbers were faked.

I'll second that motion!

Charlie-1915998

Typical of 21 st century Republicans ---when you don't like FACTS -- make up facts.

Romney camp motto: we won't let facts get in the way! That's one thing Romney is consistent on.

COinFL

When Obama is re-elected the Republicans will say the voting numbers were faked.

it started with them claiming that Obama's birth certificate was fake, now unemplyment numbers are fake so I agree with you. That will be their next claim.

Did Obama get caught off guard not knowing that Romney would come out of the blocks lying like Romney (Freudian slip) confessed that his five sons do ... I think so ...........

Sad but true ... Obama will for SURE come fully prepared to face a bold faced liar in the next debates .......

Birthers and flat-earthers..... GO GOP!

The GOP stays wrapped up in their political positions based on neurotic mistruths for sake of political conveniance to align with their ideology. Then, they (GOP) feel conspiracies run rampant if their neurotically political positions aren't fulfilled. It's ridiculously absurd.

Unemployment figures are the gospel to the GOP if bad, and rigged if good. National Budgetary deficits have been shrinking since Obama entered office (2009 $1.4 trillion, 2010 $1.35 trillion, 2011 $1.32 trillion, 2012 $1.2 trillion). Yet, the GOP says his (Obama) spending is out of control. The GOP is purposely delusional and will say anything except the truth to get elected.......

It's was funny how Romney shot down studies because they lie like his 5 sons ... and then went on & on quoting studies that suited his purpose ...

Thought Mitt Romney won debate over Obama. He comes out looking well, but what he said was pretty bad. That will end up glossed over. I for the life of me cannot understand how people can support Romney. He has zero credibility. There isn't a better candidate to run? Republicans/Democrats/Americans still totally screwed by either Obama/Romney. We need a realistic third choice. Here are the false claims made by both sides.

Arthur66

Rasmussen Reports, consistently the most reliable polling service

hahahaha

just like Fox News viewers are the most informed

hahahahah

The right can't do arithmetic... they apparently only know what arithmittic is, which is to change the numbers as much as you can.

Sorry Mitt, but if there was a third side of your mouth to talk out of, you'd be doing it.

Youtube the phrase "Is Mitt Romney a Liar? Please share."

Rick Perry, Newt Gingrich, and even Mr. Frothy himself seem to agree with the LEFT on this issue.

bayllie - you're obviously a Democrat.

Because you refute MATH.

Probability and statistics are proven and finite mathematics. Just like scientific polling.

Obama has overseen the only four $1 trillion dollar deficits in our nation's history.

He doesn't seem to know that 4 minus 5 is a negative number..... ?

@STexan,

Perry is in charge in Texas. The lowest number of insured people in the US. At least Obama's going to get you health care.

Perry is your failure in Texas not Obama.

mygirl1

In terms of mediocrity, one can truly say that Obama is the poster child. Need a vote eraser here.

Think about how mediocre McCain was that Obama beat! These career politicians are not the answer.

the Bowles-Simpson Deficit recomnedation commission Report was out 3 years ago, and the career politicians finally look at 3 years later?

It went no where because it raised taxes, and enough politicians were smart enough to know that raising taxes will kill what little recovery we have seen. 2/3's of our govenment (Senate and President) refused the only viable alternative - CUT the spending!

Been warning everyone for years now. Republicans get control of the outhouse, they'll relieve and feed themselves from then on.

Look at "Brianb" up there. Squealing like a constipated hog with hemorrhoids.

Why would you go out of your way to fake voting poll results? It would only serve to rally your opponents supporters. I hate partisan politics. Anything that favors the other party MUST be lies and deception. Ugh.

Biggest drop in unemployment in 29 years? Yeah right. But even if it is true, is 7.8% unemployment cause for celebration? Didn't Obama promise unemployment to be at 5.6%?

As long as he can show it is getting better. If he cannot, he can blame it on the do nothing house. Its such a transparent game hehe. I'd like to know which of O'bama's policies are creating this fabricated fall in the unemployment rate. Maybe its his smile?

If you listen to Welch closely he is talking about the GDP numbers and the unemployment numbers. It doesn't make sense.

It's like a lady saying she can fit into a size 2 dress and her weight is 200 pounds. It simply cannot happen.

Republicans are never happy. They say they are leading. What's the problem?

Kornny

I supposed you quit reading before Welch said he did not have "any proof".

all birthers are vultures of a feather?

these angry vultures of a feather also don't like Big Bird just because Big Bird is a Democrat..15% funded by government and the rest by corporate doners.

I want to make one point very loud and clear. The GOP assertions that somehow the labor statistics are bing falsified, that somehow they are out of line with past recession recoveries and that they are liable to political influence is complete and absolute LIES! The BLS numbers are put together independently by economists and demographers from both the Dept of Census --- who does in-person household interviews and the Bureau of Labor Statistics who does phone calls to a sample of employers. But these are just to get the "rushes" --- the preminimary numbers. The final numbers come from Census Dept questionaires and BLS legall--required data from the states. They are put together independently and there are a number of "blind spots" in the analysis, meaning that the analysts do not actually know what numbers they are looking at. That prevents cheating but more importantly makes errors more easily detectable. The final numbers, about 70% of the time, show lower unemployment because there is much more under-sampling error than over-sampling error. That is, it is easier to underestimate employment growth than unemployment.

There are a number of measures and a great deal of adjunct analysys rather than just one number. Here is a link to the BLS site: http://www.bls.gov/

The BLS numnbers are extremely transparent because they are intended to be the best information available at any one point in time. They way they are collected is fully documented as are the analysis techniques and the built-in protestions against tampering or error. It's worth a read.

But the GOP liars are desperate because Romney is losing badly and they are counting on dumbwads who won't take the time to try to read and understand something that is pretty easy to understand. Prove them wrong. Go read for yourselves.

Romney has demonstrated that he is willing to abandon any principle, repeat any lie, ignore any truth, and pander to any extremist ideology to win the presidency. He expects the voting public to believe he will change when he is elected. Fat chance! Romney will be obligated to special interests, and guided by their schemes to make money at the expense of people who he says, don't count.

The Reichwing sure trusted these numbers when they were above 8%.

Go figure.

Since when has the GOP ever accepted any facts that do not directly benefit themselves?

Let me get this straight ... according to the GOP and TP, when the numbers are against the President, they are correct, but when the numbers are in favor of the President, they are manipulated.

What a hoot.

The TP has hijacked the Republican Party and turned it into a political circus act.

"This is desperation by Republicans who want to believe what they want to believe despite data to the contrary".

Anyone believing this is a fool with their head stuck in the sand. This could just as easily be said of the Democrats, or any other party. Politics and Corporate American can make any polls / or numbers - say what they want. They will be twisted to meet their own personal agendas. It is nothing more than corruption.

Democrats are NOT the only ones capable of "arithmetic" or anything else. Government is a "divide and conquer" game involving the American People. The more strive, division, and contention they can create – the less attention it brings to them while their corruption continues to manifest.

Until the American people decide to wake up and pay attention to the "game" – this country will continue on its fast decline. It is not about "We the People" or "For the People" or "By the People". You have been taken out of the equation. They just LET you think that they work for you.

So, keep fighting amongst yourselves. That will solve everything.

After all- you have NOTHING to lose, right?

Renee, I think the employees at the Department of Labor and Statistics would disagree with you.

Yes, numbers, statistics and science are always mystical hocus-pocus to the right.

That's why they'll never understand climate change until it's FAR too late.

There are two reasons you can never tell what Romney's really saying.

1) He changes his stance for every audience (wide one with the base, narrow in public), and

2) He uses 'weasel words" like "I need a new accountant" instead of answering the question.

Notice what he said about his tax cut. He didn't say that he DOESN'T plan to cut $5 trillion in taxes.

What he SAID was that he doesn't plan to add it to the deficit.

Now, anybody who can do arithmetic knows there aren't enough "loopholes and deductions" to pay for $5 trillion in tax cuts.

So, what Romney is saying is that the REST is coming out of the FEDERAL BUDGET. From food stamps, unemployment benefits, infrastructure funds, Medicaid, education funding, Medicare as we know it for ALL of us, increasing the Social Security retirement age, the Centers for Disease Control, FDA, EPA, etc. etc. (Notice how he talks about the STATES providing services. With what money?) In fact, the Tax Policy Institute said that Romney's plan would REDUCE FEDERAL REVENUES BY 24%.

So we should ask ourselves - are we willing to give up all that to give millionaires ANOTHER tax break?

Because that's the bottom line, folks.

DB Akron

mygirl1

In terms of mediocrity, one can truly say that Obama is the poster child. Need a vote eraser here.

Think about how mediocre McCain was that Obama beat! These career politicians are not the answer.

the Bowles-Simpson Deficit recomnedation commission Report was out 3 years ago, and the career politicians finally look at 3 years later?

I don't really like Simpson-Bowles that much; it eliminates the AMT and lowers tax rates (which I think is just another supply-side gimmick) while shrinking the number of tax brackets. We need MORE tax brackets and HIGHER rates on the wealthiest Americans.

It went no where because it raised taxes, and enough politicians were smart enough to know that raising taxes will kill what little recovery we have seen. 2/3's of our govenment (Senate and President) refused the only viable alternative - CUT the spending!

No, Simpson Bowles went nowhere because Republicans absolutely opposed the revenue increases and the Democrats didn't like the entitlement cuts. And no, cutting spending is NOT the way to reduce the deficit. You need to grow the economy, cut spending, AND raise revenues in order to reduce the debt.

My deficit proposal would include the elimination of the Bush tax cuts for everyone in 2013 (saving $3.8 trillion), an automatic increase in tax rates by 3% for the 4th and 5th brackets and 4% for the top bracket ($501.2 billion), raise the capital gains tax to 21% ($291 billion), and the total elimination of the employer healthcare coverage deduction and the limiting of local/state tax deductions to 2% of AGI ($938.8 billion). I would also tax corporate income as it is earned worldwide ($114.2 billion), extend corporate depreciation ($241.4 billion), and reduce the mortgage interest deduction by about 75% ($161 billion).

For spending, I would freeze defense spending at 2011 levels for 10 years ($610.7 billion), decrease nondefense spending increases to 1% annual growth ($326.7 billion) reduce federal pay across the board ($50.3 billion), increase federal housing payments ($225.4 billion). As for entitlements, I would limit medical malpractice torts ($65.6 billion), increase the Medicare life expectancy age to 67 ($124.8 billion), increase the Medicare Part D premium to 35% ($241.2 billion), increase Medicare payroll tax by 1.4% ($911.9 billion), and increase the Social Security payroll tax cap to 90% of earned income ($456.7 billion). This would lead to a total of $9 trillion in savings over 10 years. And the economic effect of this reduction would be mitigated by a $2.8 trillion spending program, including $1.8 trillion for repairing our infrastructure, a $100 billion infrastructure bank, aid to the housing market, $50 billion for a green infrastructure bank, $150 billion in additional grants, loans, and investments in green and fuel-efficient technology, $180 billion for the creation of a nationwide apprenticeship program on the lines of the system in Germany, and a $400 billion investment in R&D over the next 5 years, just to name a few.

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

By his predecessor's economic "policies," Obama inherited staggering unemployment statistics. In October 2009, our unemployment rate was 10.1%. Our current unemployment rate is 7.8%. Obama is moving this country forward.

For the right-wing "captives of the conspiracy theory," you should be glad that more Americans have jobs.

To the right: Do not be so hateful of Obama that you are willing to continue a path of destruction, just to make one brilliant man "a one-term president."

Romney's behavior:

Before the American public, Romney boldly lied.

Before millions of our citizens, again, Mitt "flipped flopped. "

Mitt retreated from his campaign platform and website statements.

Posted: October 3, 2012.

Romney's lies:

1) Suddenly, he does not believe in "Trickle-Down" economics.

2) Suddenly, he states that he will not lower taxes for the wealthy.

3) Suddenly, he says that because people are "suffering," this is the reason that he is running for the office of the presidency.

4) Suddenly, he wants to help small businesses.

5) Suddenly, he wants to creates here in America.

6) Suddenly, he cares about public education.

7) Suddenly, he believes that Wall Street and banks should have some regulation.

8) Falsely, he states that only future Medicare recipients plans and benefits will be effected.

9) Suddenly, he ensures that under his health plan, insurers will not be able to dump the sick.

10) Suddenly, he is for Green Energy.

Romney still did not reveal any details about his economic, health care and educational plans for this country. Some television commentators state that he was "alert." However alertness does not translate into an equitable and prosperous plan for this country.

President Obama spoke the truth, ["Because he thinks his plans are so good for the middle class is not the reason that Governor Romney is hiding his plans."]

Independents: Mitt does not care about you.

Vote a straight Democratic ticket:

Obama/Biden 2012!!

#1.99 - Wed Oct 3, 2012 11:24 PM ED

That's why they'll never understand climate change until it's FAR too late.

Winter must be coming...global warming is shelved until next summer!

Jo Ann-666954 You cannot trust Obama.

Let me point something out to you, Jo Ann.

How many times in the debate this week did Romney say, "The President promised to cut the deficit in half" ??? At least 5 times.

How many times did Romney promise to cut the deficit himself? ZERO.

The GOP is really, really good at saying, "Look over there - they didn't keep their promise!"

And also really, really good at giving you NO promises that could ever be broken.

Talk about being suckered....

I have always wondered about polls and how really accurate they are. This is not the first time. Every so often, our phone will ring with one. One decides if they want to answer them; which....makes me think, they are only as good as who actually takes the time to answer questions on the phone. I remember my mother always refused to answer political stuff on the phone because she thought they were selling something. I have thought so too at times because I have gotten calls that pretend to ask political stuff then try to sell something (an ad disguised as a poll). This sort of thing may cause some to refuse to be polled. Others may not answer because they believe candidate selection is a very private matter. (I knew someone who refused to answer polls on that basis). If we are only tallying up persons who answer polls, it may skew to a particular sort of person and not a true cross section of people. Then, of course, may be the person who answered their intentions to vote a certain way but they somehow did not get to the voting booth for whatever reason. In my view it is pretty impossible to get an accurate poll.

I sense that Romney is now doing better because more people see him as competent after that debate. There is generally a more favorable impression of him now. Will he win? I do not know, but I do definitely think his chances just got a whole lot better.

As to that jobs report, all I can say that it was sure convenient for Obama to get that one now just before an election. The timing is just so perfect; I do wonder (not that I can prove anything amiss).

Gotta love the right wing crazies, lol!! If the facts don't
agree with your delusions they must be part of some left wing conspiracy.
Science = left wing conspiracy. Unemployment falling = left wing conspiracy.
Polls including Fox news and Wall Street Journal show Obama with a lead = left
wing conspiracy.

What gets me is for the last four years every Republican politician
has been rooting for America to fail, and even worse they've been working to
make sure that it does. How they can stand in front of the American people and
proclaim they care about putting them back to work and that Obama is the reason
for the gridlock is the greatest hoax perpetrated in the history of our
country. I will say however that the right is correct about the fact that the
country is going to @!$%# and there will be a revolt, the only difference is they
are going to be the cause of it.

How many times in the debate this week did Romney say, "The President promised to cut the deficit in half" ??? At least 5 times.

How many times did Romney promise to cut the deficit himself? ZERO.

So you would rather hear a lie? Interesting. Would it be more comforting to you if Romney were to promise that he will cut the deficit in half? Would that satisfy you?

Thanks for proving my point, Kornfed.

Kornfed - So you would rather hear a lie? Interesting.

No, I would rather hear specifics and see someone try to live up to them, even if they fall short in the attempt.

Instead of being gullible enough to swallow platitudes that mean nothing that no one can ever be held accountable for.

Actually, the outpouring of support for President Obama seems to have increased since the debate. Romney came across as a desperate bully, and who can blame the President for being taken off guard by the GOP Chameleon? More than half the nation was left scratching their heads wondering how any true American with integrity could stand in front of the nation and say things like "I will not cut education" when he has stated all along he was cutting Pell Grants for college students. And saying 47% of Americans are freeloaders one day, and then saying the next day, he was "completely wrong." Kind of like the thief that is sorry he was caught but not sorry that he stole.

As a former Republican, I had some respect for Mr. Romney up until the debate. But, any person that would intentionally put his own selfish interests ahead of the best interests of the American people, is unqualified to hold political office.

What are we supposed to believe?

Arthur 66,

One reason that the Rasmussen numbers look different is that they do not poll those whose only telephone line is a cell phone. That excludes about 30% of US Households.

On the unemployment number, this has been derived in the exact same way for decades. There is a poll of around 50K households and the same questions are asked.

One reason that the rate may have dropped while the private sector figures were around 114K jobs added is because there have been 2- 3 million unfilled technical jobs -- I'm not making this up -- so there were standing openings to be filled. Plus there were some governmnet jobs created, and many of the jobs were part time (which has ALWAYS played the same role in the calculation). One thing I find wierd is that the labor force lower age is 16 -- aren't they supposed to be in school? Why do they count in the unemployment rate at all?

The Teabaggers hate for anything to be heard except for their own rhetoric and propoganda. Check out the censorship war being raged on Craigslist Long Island NY Rants & Raves.

correction: 5) Suddenly, he wants to create jobs here in America.

No, I would rather hear specifics and see someone try to live up to them and fall short.

Well, if that is the case, then O'bama is your man to be sure. Instead of saying he can lower the seas, maybe Romney should say that he will not allow a drought to happen while he was in office!!! He may fall short, but the grandiose promise is well worth supporting this man for!

'Go back to your cave dug by the gestapo wing of the tea party'.

The "Tea Party" responses are made by people ignorant of history. You use it to make reference to the Republican Party. You are wrong. It should pertain to ALL people of the USA who still believes in the Constitution and the Bills of Rights. If not, YOU have a problem.

It is because of the "Sons of Liberty" and other American Patriots, that we enjoy the freedoms we do. Those groups was formed to protect the rights of the people. Their motto became, "No taxation without representation".

On February 27, 2009, the phrase "Taxation without representation" was also used in the Tea Party protests, where protesters were upset over increased government spending and taxes, and specifically regarding a growing concern amongst the group that the U.S. government is increasingly relying upon a form taxation without representation through increased regulatory levies and fees which are allegedly passed via unelected government employees who have no direct responsibility to voters and cannot be held accountable by the public through elections.

Not a Tea Party Supporter? Perhaps you should pack and move out of the USA....

If the stimulus had worked as the Obama administration advertised then unemployment should now be less than 6%. If control of the federal deficit had taken place the way that the President had promised then the 2012 deficit should have been less than 229.27 billion dollars and not more than 1.1 trillion dollars. The President has failed to keep his promises on the economy.

Amti science, evolution is a myth, numbers dont matter andl hostility towards investing in education in general. I dont get the repubs. I guess the Palin outlook on the world is the new consevatism. I would like to point out to the rank and file repubs that while your leaders say all this stuff is not needed, they all send their kids to the best universities so they can be the bosses of the future while your kids can be their worker bees.

Chris, thank you!!! I just got through doing my EEOC reports which do a comparison of this year and last year at roughly the same time. We have to break down the jobs by codes and ethnicity's. This gives the BLS who get their information from a lot of sources some of the figures that they need to do these reports. There are also Wage Surveys that are NOT voluntary, that we have to do and give numbers for jobs and wages. I do at least four of these a year. I can say for the company that I work for , we have been hiring at least 2 people per week for the last 6 weeks for our MD/VA locations and the same for our Florida locations. Company's are hiring and it is not just for the Christmas season or to replace people that have left for other jobs. We are hiring new people for NEEDED positions.

I wish that people like the ex CEO and others would keep their uninformed and completely idiotic statements to themselves. It is no wonder we can't seem to get anything done.

And Fox news does depress it's viewers and makes them STUPID!!! I watched it in action with my in laws last weekend. God what a terrible way to spend your waning years.

If you're interested in an actual scientific-method, cross-checkable analysis of the supposed "oversampling" bias of polls, read statistician Nate Silver's article on FiveThirtyEight.com:

Poll Averages Have No History of Consistent Partisan Bias

I have a cousin whose had their unemployment benefits cut off. Does this mean that under the polls, this guy is not counted?

Anyone who is looking for a job right now knows this poll is full of crap. You can claim even 2% unemployment, but everyone knows that is not the case.

The Obama propaganda machine knows that no incumbent has ever won re-election with unemployment above 8%. How convenient its 7.8% lol.

OK, let's play a game called "logic." If Obama really were doctoring statistics, why wouldn't he have started much earlier, say, two years ago? He could be running his campaign with a cool 5% unemployment rate, if he has as much power over what the BLS reports as you think he does. Why is he being such a lousy cheater, when he supposedly is such a proficient cheater? Then again, he's also a very lousy socialist, a very lousy communist, a very lousy Marxist, very lousy at destroying America and taking away our freedoms, and very lousy at everything you extremist right-wingers accuse him of.

Ignoring the fact that there is an election coming up, the unemployment rate has been going down and it was to be expected that it would break the 8% barrier some time in mid-to-late 2012. It would have been anomalous for it to not do so. It isn't anomalous for it to have done so.

In you go back to previous reports, you'll see the numbers less than what was originally reported.

Oh, bullsh*t. If you go back to July's and August's reports, they were actually revised up -- which is one of the reasons why the unemployment rate went down.

Former director of the CBO Douglas Holtz-Eakin might be surprised to find out that -- regardless of the party affiliation of the President in power -- while barely 35% of the monthly changes in unemployment between August and September in non-election years from 1944 until 2012 have shown the rate to go down (compared to 45% going up), in election years that rate is shown to go down a whopping 70% of the time while going up only 12% of the time. Somehow the unemployment rate is "magically" twice as likely to go down in an election year than any other non-election year.

Since your high-school statistics teacher didn't seem to teach you this, please repeat after me: correlation does not imply causation, correlation does not imply causation.

Yes, the unemployment rate is more likely to go down from August to September in election years, let's say that's true. Might that be because of all the new jobs the election cycle creates, especially in the swing states? You know — media, journalism, pollsters, souvenir vendors, campaign staff, lobbyists, and every other industry directly or indirectly related to presidential, senatorial, congressional, state, and local elections? What hard proof would lead you to immediately believe the unemployment data are simply doctored??

Please explain how 114,000 new jobs equates to 8.1 down to 7.8...The only way this happens is for people to be dropping out of the workforce like flies. You libs say conservatives cant do math. So tell me how this equation works....and please, show your work! No calculators!

Mike in SA - For crying out loud man. You just posted 2,756 words! If you don't think that if being very, very excessive, than you need to start posting this stuff as an article on your Newsvine page and give us all a break. IMO, these forums are for posting brief arguments and responses not dissertations.

As for people thinking the polls are intentionally skewed, I can't conceive a reason why someone might think fudging poll data could give one of the parties and edge. Please enlighten me.

What percentage matters most to Citizen Romney?

47%.

That number from his infamous recent fundraising diatribe is the albatross around his neck that will doom him come election day.

I want the Republican Party back. Not this bunch of right wing loons that believe in conspiracies, creationism, guns and their bibles. Not this bunch of racists that threatens us with the destruction of America if the first Black President is reelected.

They haven't a clue of what the Constitution meant to the Founding Fathers who weren't Christian and who valued reason and science! They want to pick and choose what parts of the Constitution to pay attention to. They are all for Freedom of Religion if it means their RELIGION! Huge on the idea of bearing arms but not so clear on the context. Restrictions on Seizure, rights of the Accused, etc...well screw that nonsense! They freak out over Sharia Law without realizing how closely their own belief system aligns with it!

Right now the USA ranks something like 17th in the world on Math & Science. Well judging from Romney & Ryan's ability to do math and the emphasis on Religion/Creationism and ignorance of Evolution, I'd say we'll be a Third World Country in no time if the GOP wins this election.

And as for Big Bird, he's what's for dinner!

I finally figured out why the president didn't seem to make any effort at the debate.

He new he had nothing to worry about, because he had allready arranged for the unemployment report to be fixed with phony numbers to debunk Romney's constant harping on 8% unemployment.

There are absolutely no other economic data to support the numbers. As Welch said, all the other indicators show stagnation and weakness in most all economic indicators, and all of a sudden just after the president gets knocked off his perch, and the election is imminent, and nothing can be done to debunk the numbers in time, 873,000 jobs magically appear.

Just like the 4.5 million jobs Obama claims to have created, i don't know anybody who got one.

Do you?

Thieves are always afraid of being stolen from.

Liars are always accusing the others around them of lying.

Cheaters are always sure that others are cheating on them.

That pretty much covers the GOP/TP/Koch party.

If your cousin is still looking for work, he's still counted.

Unemployment has been counted as "active" participants in the workforce (employed or looking for a job) since 1994.

Which means that all increases and decreases in the "unemployment" rate since 1994 are valid measurements of the U3 rate, since they're "apples to apples" comparisons.

Best argument there is for not going back to the policies of the GOP:

Private Sector Payroll Employment

This was the CNN Money headline in Bush's last month of office:

Job loss: Worst in 34 years
Employers slashed 598,000 more jobs in January

'Nuf said!

The GOP has become so anti-intellectualism (starting with hate for academia, and then on from there) that conspiracy theories ARE their new ideology/platform. Wow, this is what happens when folks go so far to the Right that they go off the cliff.

Aside from their obsession with things like ACORN, Solyndra, Planned Parenthood, pubic broadcasting, and a LONG list of nontroversies, lies (Planned Parenthood does very few abortions), and idiocy (PBS is educational and therefore the mouthpiece of the Left, heaven forbid!)...

First it was the "truthers" than the "birthers" than the fake poll results, and now the fake unemployment report. The job reports were okay when the numbers were bad, just not the ones that help President Obama -- OMG, how does that work?! The absolute worst example of rightwing idiocy was Todd Akin spilling the beans about the QUACKERY regarding women and "forcible" or real rape that Paul Ryan and many in the Republican Party subscribe to.

We as a nation cannot elect ignorant people to office -- at the minimum -- and ultimately what we as a nation must do is improve our education system to teach critical thinking to overcome such ignorance. It is a very sad commentary that so many Americans, who live in this great country with so much technology, now in the 21st Century are SO ignorant. WTF?!

The employment numbers matters when they come in negatively and making the President look bad but when they are positive, they say they are jimmied. When polls numbers favor the republicans, they are "words from God" when they don't, they are skewed and the dems are being over sampled.

I suppose the "true" poll numbers reflecting the Great Master Debater Romney's show as coming from God if they are in his favor, but skewed if no change or in favor of the President. Romney made a complete 180 degree turn from what he has been campaigning on. He looked like he was on subbies. We know he wasn't over caffeinated, now don't we. Lie after lie. Or was it the truth after truth for a change. Only thing we know is most of what that man playing Willard Romney was saying was not what Romney believes. His strategy was to overwhelm both the President and the moderator. Some say he secretly brought in notes, then it was just a hankie. What was that paper he had in his hands he couldn't quite tuck in his jacket after the debate while his family was on stage? It looked like he handed it to his son. Oh well...we may never know, just like we won't know about his tax returns.

One thing is sure, whatever Romney believe the people want him to be, he will claim to be. And the right wingers will believe him. If obama wins, we all win, if romney wins, only the rich and china win. see u at the polls.

Please explain how 114,000 new jobs equates to 8.1 down to 7.8...The only way this happens is for people to be dropping out of the workforce like flies. You libs say conservatives cant do math. So tell me how this equation works....and please, show your work! No calculators!

No takers eh? I dont blame you

I probably pay more in income tax than most of the people on this thread...the government takes so much out of what I earn, that it makes me dizzy. I studied hard, very hard in school and graduated and got a good job...you might think that I am affiliated or at least identify with the Republican Party and would vote for Mitt Romney and the truth is, I do not. Let me tell you why...

Over the 10+ years, I have seen this party become the bastion of lunatics that candidates have to suck up to in order to get votes...I mean you have these raging lunatics like Michelle Bachman and Rick Santorum who demand so much attention from the base...I mean Rick Santorum couldn't even keep his job as an incumbent senator and yet he wants to run for president...huh????? Every Republican candidate is running a gauntlet to the point where they are so beat up and mangled, it is hard to put this person out there...Mitt Romney has been on every side of the field on just about every issue...I would have more respect for him if he didn't pretend he gives a crap about anyone who has an income lower than his. I admire and respect that he's been able to amass so much wealth in his lifetime...its not jealousy....if anything, its admiration...and I'm sure he's followed the law...but people have the right to know about the history of the candidate they are electing and if anything, he's been evasive. Anybody who after Wednesday's debate actually think he's sincere about wanting to help the middle class, lower the deficit, and reduce taxes will have flashbacks about the moment they pushed the button next to his name in the voting booth if he is elected. I voted for Chris Christie as governor of my state because I believe he was telling the truth...Although I disagree with some of his policies and statements, by and large, I think he's a good governor and probably would vote for him again. Though, I wish he would spend less time on the campaign trail and more on tackling New Jersey's issues.

While I believe Obama's policies may not have had all the desired effects in the way that people want them to, I do believe he is telling the truth and is well intentioned...He's made decisions that have cost him politically in order to do what many people believe is right, though would never admit it. I believe he will do everything possible to keep us out of another war while Romney looks like he's sharpening his knives to get us into another fight we can't get out of. Yes, Obama's debate performance totally sucked and he didn't call out Romney for the numerous lies and stretches he put out there, but he didn't attempt to lie to the public in that debate in order to gain a vote. The fact checkers were busy on Wednesday night and Thursday to show that much is true.

So in a month, people are going to decide and everybody will have to be satisfied with the result...just don't be surprised if the debt keeps climbing, high unemployment continues, wage stagnation increases, taxes go up, food and gas prices climb, etc...you just may not have that socialist, commi, marxist, fascist, muslim, food stamp, born in mombasa, arab, "not one of us" guy to blame before he's inaugurated...I wonder if the tea party will still be in existence on November 7th....

Also a note to the women who may be reading this...its likely that Obama/Romney will appoint several justices to the court in the next 4 years and they will be around long after Obama/Romney leave...just consider that Roe v. Wade (abortion ruling) by the Supreme Court is likely to be overturned...Justice Scalia has already said that it is an easy ruling for him to make to overturn your rights...a few more justices like him and it will be overturned...

Can't trust RR either since both can not give concrete figures of their calculation specially good ole Mity likes to grab any numbers from the sky

Hal, you counted this person's words?! That sounds like a long project.

Mike in SA - For crying out loud man. You just posted 2,756 words!

I always thought I spent way too much time on Newsvine...but...wow...

Kornny

It is not that difficult to find an explanation of the 7.8% number for anyone willing to look. Guess it is just too easy to jump on the conspiracy theory because that is the only thing you want to believe. There is no shortage of experts saying the numbers cannot be rigged, as there are of few saying for political purpose that the numbers are wrong, yet they are unable to back up their mouths with facts. Here is one explanation of the numbers if you want to know the truth.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/ezra-klein/wp/2012/10/05/september-jobs-report-debunking-the-jobs-report-conspiracy-theories/

Please explain how 114,000 new jobs equates to 8.1 down to 7.8...The only way this happens is for people to be dropping out of the workforce like flies. You libs say conservatives cant do math. So tell me how this equation works....and please, show your work! No calculators!

Still....no takers...

These job numbers must be wrong... After all the obstruction from this GOP Congress, there's no way that President Obama could be month after month gaining jobs.,.. Can't be, congress still hasn't passed President Obama job's bill...

No... With all the obstruction from this "Do Nothing Congress" Girlie-man, Mich McConnell, How in the world could our president still be making progress???

The haters in Washington DC are losing the game... Ya gotta love President Obama....

On election day lets fire all those that signed the no new tax pledge and get this country working again...

By the way, if you do read the article, please note that there were actually 211,000 individuals that came into the workforce, not drop out.

The entire Democrat party spends every day coveting thy neighbors ox. What a bunch of little complainers. Life is not fair!! Work hard an make your own wealth. When I was just getting out of college I was making $30K. Never did I have the mentality that every person that makes more than me should have to give me some of their money. I did not hate the people that made more money than me. I did not demand that we redistribute their wealth to me. That is just not how I was brought up. I was taught at a young age that if you want something you go work hard and get it yourself. You do not steal from others just because they have more than you. You do not ask the government to steal for you. You do not look at people that have more than you and feel that there is no way that they could have possibly gotten to where they are without stealing from others. You gradually work your way up in life by making good decisions. I came from a lower middle class family where my parents combined never made over $40K. The values they taught me will never be forgotten. Work hard, give to the charity's that you believe in, give yourself to the community to help others, treat others as you would like to be treated, take personal responsibility, live below your means, etc.. Sorry, but never did my parents teach me to hate family's that have more money than us and steal from them to get ahead in life.

ir12

The article you posted did not do the job unfortunatly...but a post in response to this article hit the mark I thought. Here is part of it...

It is incredible that the July and August figures were revised upward by 48%
(from 96,000 to 142,000) and by 28% (from 141,000 to 181,000). Such dramatic
revisions two months in a row, is unprecedented.

And these revised
figures, more so than the much smaller 114,000 for August, are the reasons for
the sharp drop in unemployment rate to 7.8%.

It is naive to assume the
bureaucrats who prepare the job reports will distort the figures only when
directed by White House or any outside parties. These bureaucrats can be biased
and can distort the figures by themselves without outside direction. And they,
being government employees, would inherently prefer a president who
fundamentally believes in big government and growing jobs within government.

A brief sampling of Republican wisdom:

The polls are rigged.

The job numbers are cooked.

Carbon dating measurements are invalid.

Every accepted scientific conclusion about biology and geology is a lie.

Carbon emissions do not warm the globe.

Tobacco products are not addictive and do not cause cancer.

The Loch Ness Monster is real.

Liberals only talk in Romney negatives. The problem with that is... only the liberals are listening. Liberals can't talk in Obama positives, because there aren't any.

Soooooo. Since Obama has no positives to speak of for the past 4 years... what is he running on? What exactly is going to get him re-elected? His charm? His shoe size? This isn't 2008 when he was building up and offering hope and change... Hope and change has packed up and left.

Since the liberals are all boasting so much on how Obama is going to win... pony up and tell us why he's going to win... Considering the fact that on Wed night, the nation got to see Romney... and they voted for him 67% to 25%... remember perception is reality...

Just like the job numbers are jello... so are the past positive polling results for Obama..

"

Part time jobs is what they are doing in Texas, thanks to Perry.

The saying in Texas is, "Yeah, I have a job. Three of them".

Are you listening to yourself? You're validating my point. Texas is surviving Obamaville better then most states and according to you, part time jobs are all that is available in Texas. So am I to understand that part time jobs is where we have came to accept as great?

This is the problem. We have been so beaten down for so long, we have forgotten where we could be or where we were, and have came to view the current situation as normal and acceptable (the new "norm"). Very sad to witness this transformation of so many Americans for the sake of promoting liberalism and their failed POTUS."

so tell me again how is Romney going to make it better? I havn't heard anything from him other than he will cut every ones taxes and fill tax loopholes so in the end we all actually pay more.LOL hmmmmmmmmmm like Mitt is going to close tax loopholes he himself uses?? LOL OK!

Seriously how is he going to create Jobs, Good Jobs? Please point me to his words that say how he will do it?

Out of the Woods,

Yeah, I am sure those several Black people you saw protesting reflect the sentiment of all Black voters in America. /S

That is the problem with you Righties, you have the inability to stop over generalizing. So when you see one or five people going something then by God that is how the rest of the country must feel! Not so, that is how those few people feel and not how the rest of the country feels. Time for your reality check, everyone has been watching Romney long enough to know how he rolls and how he rolls is to steam roll over any past commitment made in order to pander to who he is in the room with.

Put Romney in front of a room full of Evangelicals and he will suddenly become anti-Abortion, anti-Gay Rights, pro-Theocracy. Put him into a room full of Moderates and he will become a non-tax cut, Medicare saving, Ryan-dismissing, against out sourcing kind of guy. Put him in front of a room of wealthy donors where he thinks he is not being recorded and see him become who he really is.

Romney will change his positions depending on the environment, he has done this enough and been criticized for it enough that people now look for him to do that.

After watching the debate with my family, my Uncle, who is a die hard Rightist, said he will not be voting in this election. He got put off by Romney's move to the center during the debate. He wanted to see Romney pledge to fundamentally alter Medicare like he said he would do via Ryan's plan, he wanted Romney to say he was going to be giving tax cuts to the wealthy. He wanted to hear Romney say that he was for repealing all of Dode-Frank and ending many regulations put into place by Obama as well as repealing Obamacare entirely and going back to the old system.

He did not like what he heard and he is tired of Mitt changing his mind so he said he will not be voting and he is going to make sure everyone in his gated community in Tuscon that he has dinner parties with that were also going to or thinking of voting for Romney are made aware of Mitt's apparent change of heart.

Republicans are sooo despirate to get the Black guy out of the White house, they grasp at any straws they can. Everythings a conspiracy except when they conspire to block citizens from voting. Most of that fraud has been shot down in court, but I suppose republicans think that is a conspiracy as well. In 2000, the 90,000 mostly black voters in Florida who were knocked of the voting role because their name was similar to some felon anywhere else in the country, that wasn't conspiracy, oh wait, it was. I could go on for pages but, I have a life.

Kornfed, July and August numbers were also updated. Many more than what was originally reported. This is done all the time. Sometimes the updated numbers show more, sometimes fewer jobs. These past two months happened to be upgraded. How do you suppose all the final reports can come in and have time to be analyzed in one day? The numbers are then averaged for three months to come up with the more accurate report. Septembers numbers updated numbers will be in October and Novemebrs reports. You still have one report before the election, so don't cry. The numbers will once again be updated.

Evolution And Big Bang Are “Lies Straight From the Pit of Hell” Says Congressman From House Committee On Science

Republican Congressman, Dr. Paul Broun, a member of the House of Representatives’ Committee on Science, Space and Technology, was caught on video arguing that evolution and the Big Bang Theory are “lies straight from the pit of Hell.” Congressman Paul, a physician and devout Christian, told an audience at a banquet of the Liberty Baptist Church in Hartwell, Georgia, that the scientific evidence leads him to believe that the earth is only about 9,000 years old. Theories purporting otherwise are “lies”:

"And it’s lies to try to keep me and all the folks who are taught that from understanding that they need a savior. You see, there are a lot of scientific data that I found out as a scientist that actually show that this is really a young Earth. I don’t believe that the Earth is but about 9,000 years old. I believe it was created in six days as we know them. That’s what the bible says!"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=eU4B86AL5Go

Never mind. You can't educate these people. Time to go on without them.

To YOU VeryFew and VERY, VERY, VERY, VERY Naive Voters: If You think in your little "me first" minds voting for republicanCrimeCartelCountDraculaMittTaxPittanceRommel is gonna' get you your "job" back, THINK AGAIN. So Pez O didn't have the Belly to fight The Count at the debate, Big Deal. You RocketScientist voters are forgetting what Prez O REALLY DID while TheCount was Sucking his Victims Dry: While Rommel sent OVER 200,000 jobs, Good CAREER Jobs, to china and india and POCKETING THE FEES; PREZ O SENT THE SEALS OVER TO BIN LADEN'S DUMP AND HAD HIM WHACKED. Or did you Ungrateful, Not worth fighting for, ego miscreants forget that. Prez O is keeping Social Security and Medicare so YOU can go to the doctor, TheCount? You can Go To Hell, as he pockets your SocialSecurity Checks to fund his PROFITABLE Wars with iran and ANYWHERE'S Else. Here is a Helpful Link for ALL of US to watch and Understand:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=og35U0d6WKY&feature=player_detailpage

out of the woods and other rightwingers --

Agreed that many jobs being created now are per the Bain Capital model of outsourcing to China, firing folks so the company can hire them back at lower wages and benefits, and general destruction of the middle class so the rich like Romney can get even richer. Wages have been stagnant for the last 30 years, with good-paying jobs disappearing the fastest during the Bush/Cheney administration.

Romney/Ryan and the GOP want to abolish the minimum wage, end labor rights such as unions, and have blocked legislation such as the Bring Jobs Home Act. If rightwingers don't like statistics like the unemployment numbers the last four years, than do something about it and throw the obstructionist Do Nothing Teapublicans OUT!

The Romney/Ryan's 59 point and not-wonky budget BS will do nothing to reduce deficits, rather the additional breaks for the rich, corporate welfare, and neocon Hawk defense spending will increase the deficit -- and they expect YOU to tighten YOUR belt do do it.

PS -- Also, Mormons are wackadoodles who believe God talks to their prophet, who baptize the dead, who still practice polygamy in that men can be "sealed" to more than one women, etc. I don't care what political Party they belong to, but anyone who believes such nonsense are the same types who believe the jobs numbers are fake. Someone like that cannot lead this great nation (haunting).

Romney/Ryan The 21st Century Robber Barons -- They aren't in it for you.

Ozzy, you are so wrong. I am from Massachusetts. I lived through 4 years of so-called "leadership" from Mitt Romney. Funny, isn't it, that he is trailing Obama by 25+ points in Mass? Why? Because they know him. Massachusetts trends Democratic, but that doesn’t explain it -- the state elected Republican Scott Brown to the US Senate in 2010. We have a long history of electing Republicans, especially to the governor's office. Massachusetts voters KNOW Mitt Romney best -- a one-term governor with an approval rating of 39% -- and they don’t trust him. If he was such a great governor and leader, why are the voters rejecting him?

I lived through Romney as governor. He says anything to get what he wants. This was obvious during the recent debate. He looks sincerely into the camera and takes any position likely to get votes, then takes
exactly the opposite position just as sincerely. This guy will stoop to a bald-faced lie, and turn on a dime to please his audience. He left the state in a financial mess and though he claims he didn't raise taxes, he raised every possible fee to plug the holes in his budget. That's taxation by another name in my book, he just wanted to hide it.

Romney said he was a moderate, then traveled the country bad-mouthing our “liberal” state, and now claims he was a “severe conservative.” Until he turned moderate again last Wednesday! He used Massachusetts as a steppingstone, spending 212 days out of state campaigning for President during his last year as governor, making jokes at our expense. Massachusetts voters have hard experience with Romney and resent being used by him.

He didn’t care about our state and he doesn’t care about yours – he just cares about winning.

I know what I am saying – Romney fooled me. Massachusetts will not be fooled this time
around. Don’t let him fool you.

Admittedly, Romney's surge in the national polls over the last two days is undeniable.

What is also undeniable is that his surge is predicated ENTIRELY on polls from three sources and three sources alone:

Rasmussen, reputable although historically right-leaning.

WeAskAmerica, entirely disreputable and funded in full by the Illinois Manufacturers Asscociation, a notoriously right-leaning entity which has contributed $1.5MM to Republican candidates since 2004.

Gravis Marketing, entirely dismissable for continuing to receive major funding from BAIN Capital, according to their own website. Enough said.

What is most astonishing is that Real Clear Politics would even accede to include findings from WeAskAmerica and Gravis Marketing in their daily averaging, but a closer race at the national level does serve to benefit advertisers on Real Clear....so 'oh well'.

When Real Clear returns on Monday to including polling from bi-partisan organizations, Obama's lead will once again begin to swing upward where it rightfully has been.

jeff, just so we know, how exactly does evolution work.

First, I would like to propose a 200 word limit to postings. Really People? Are you kidding? Are these narratives providing you some kind of weird pleasure or are you so delusional that you believe people are sitting at home reading every word, thankful for the enlightenment offered by yourself?

In response to not believing the polls---delusional much? The spread is really not statistically significant, why the hysteria?

all one has to do is read these posts by democrat supporters and you will be disgusted at the behavior of these people. all they do is ridicule the opposition, call names, insult, belittle, lie, insult some more, cover for their "guy" with lies, insult some more and finally they scream and scream till they get their way. you are a disgrace to humanity and terrible person to covet your political guy over the fellow citizen. right or left, you both need to grow up and stop letting politicians fool you and please stop with the BS lies. you really think politicians and political pundits/junkies are telling you the truth?

A democracy is a state in which the poor, gaining the upper hand, kill some and banish others, and then divide the offices among the remaining citizens equally, usually by lot.
--Plato - The Republic, VIII

A democracy is a government in the hands of men of low birth, no property, and vulgar employments.
--Aristotle - Rhetoric, I

The constitution, on this hypothesis, is a mere thing of wax in the hands of the Judiciary, which they may twist and shape into any form they please.
--Thomas Jefferson

Rebellion against tyrants is obedience to God.
--Benjamin Franklin

A little rebellion now and then ... is a medicine for the sound health of government. From time to time the Tree of Liberty must be refreshed with the blood of tyrants and patriots.
--Thomas Jefferson

The Constitution only guarantees the American people the right to pursue happiness. You have to
catch it yourself.
--Benjamin Franklin

As soon as government management begins it upsets the natural equilibrium of industrial relations, and each interference only requires further bureaucratic control until the end is the tyranny of the totalitarian state.
--Adam Smith

these authors above and many more knew what would happen if we left the safety of the republic and let government control everything, from what we eat to what we read, government is there when they should not be.

NHLucky - I am still trying to figure out how someone from Utah was elected your Governor. I can understand how Romney must have missed the name of the state at the top of his tax returns when he signed them, but why did anyone vote for him?

It's a Commie Pinko Liberal Plot!!! LOL. When was that last time you saw a liberal or a bunch of them with the ability to pull off such a stunt. That territory belongs to conservatives. They're the ones with all the schemes designed to make Obama a one term president. I'll be a happy camper when that gets shoved up their tight little right-wing sphincters.

Thank You NHLucky661693: Some NAIVE voters are FOOLED by TheCount's "Presidential Looks". Vampires ARE ALWAYS Beautiful Looking to their Victims INITIALLY, Then Whack!!!! While these Naive voters are Fooled and ARE ASLEEP as TheCount Hypnotizes them; Here is A Very Helpful Link to Watch and Understand:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=og35U0d6WKY&feature=player_detailpage

The Count wants your votes. The Count Needs a Wooden Stake

Kornfed

The article you posted did not do the job unfortunatly...but a post in response to this article hit the mark I thought. Here is part of it...

Actually the data you site was in the article. From the aritcle...

This is a good jobs report in a still-weak economy. The 114,000 jobs we added
in September aren’t very impressive. The revisions to the last two months, which
added 86,000 jobs to the total, were much more impressive. Those revisions also
suggest that September’s jobs could get revised up — or, of course, down. So be
careful about reading too much into that number. Still, these are, at best,
good, not great, numbers.

Everybody knows unemployment numbers are straight up bull@!$%#.

How about reporting employment numbers ?

I would like to see how many Americans are working as compared to whose benefits have run out. What a load of crap.

They won't stop.

In case anyone can't tell, math is not a strong suit when it comes to Republicans (unless it lines their pockets!), conservatives, and Christians (science and math evil!), and most American Consumers (math is for nerds, geeks, and losers!).

With that much stupidity on their side, no, they won't stop.

Jo Ann-666954

"You cannot trust Obama. He is not transparent as he promised he would be. The Libya terrorist attack cover up is a perfect example. Just look at what Egypt got away with. Egypt didn't even apologize to the US.

If people still want to vote for Obama after the Libya/Egypt fiasco well........there is a sucker born every minute"

This to me is interesting considering that Romney so far has said so many different things I believe he has lost track.You complain about Obama..did you complain about Bush when he handed out tax cuts to the wealthy..? Did you complain about the huge loss of jobs under his watch..thanks to his so called trickle down economics ? I have to assume you wish to return to the same ideas that the republicans used back then..and caused the huge loss of jobs that they now blame Obama for. Did you complain to your republican congress people about their not doing anything for this nation for the past four years ? HAve you complained to them about the fact that have done nothing toward creating any type of jobs at all ?

No president who has a congress as screwed up as the one we have today can get much of anything done. But I guess you believe Romney when he says along with Ryan..Trust me...and you are the one saying there are suckers born every minute..??

“I don’t believe what they polls are saying, they’ve clearly been Democratic-skewed,” said Daniel Zustek, a health care worker from Denver, at the same rally. “If you look at the numbers – such as Ohio -- they’ve lost a lot of Democratic voter registration in the city of Cleveland, which isn’t stuff that’s really examined when they’re running these polls.”

What the--? As if a health care worker in Denver knows diddly squat about voter registration in Cleveland! Next we'll hear from a pizza delivery boy in Omaha about the unemployment statistics.

Everyone has an opinion, but not all opinions are equal. An uninformed opinion is not equal to an informed opinion.

As for Jack Welch, he has nothing--NOTHING-- to back up his B.S. Nothing but an ego the size of his fat head.

The only way Romney can win the election is to buy, lie and now CRY. Romney is so clearly not presidential material! Lay off the koolaid and the conspiracies theories, righties. We don't have enough psychiatrists in this country to treat all of you.

Ooohh.. And for You HopeisGone:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=og35U0d6WKY&feature=player_detailpage

Checked the job numbers for September.

This is a CNN article.

Now if the revisions follow their normal trend and are adjusted Up as ususal. What is going to happen to the joblesss number then?

Will it ever be reported by the lame media the real jobless number? Not on your life. Everyone with half a brain knows the media is going to do all they can to get O'dumb dumb reelected.

What a Joke these libbies are. Obama has no record to run on, but since he is a Dummycrat he is the best thing since sliced bread.

Our schools are now ranked 17th in the would, and with the highest corporate tax rate. If I had a business I certainly would not look to expand in our own country.

Republicans have turned in the party of whiners. Romney says 47% think they’re victims?? That’s total BS. It’s Republicans who think they’re victims. Oh poor us – the liberal media is out go get us. Oh poor us – the pooling organizations are stacking the numbers to make us look bad. Oh poor us – the Bureau of Labor Statistics manipulates the data to make us look bad. On poor us – we’re such victims.

Hey republicans – stop your damn whining. Get a clue. Your problem isn’t the media. Ronald Reagan won 49 states with no Fox News and no Limbaugh. George W. Bush won 2 terms with the same media we have today. The problem isn’t that the polls are stacked, it not that the media is out go get you, and it’s not that numbers are being manipulated. The problem is Mitt Romney is a LOUSY candidate, with LOUSY ideas who is running a LOUSY campaign. It you want to win the White House – find a bitter candidate, with better ideas, with a better campaign who knows how to win.

ED - typical Liberal. Sees everything in skin color.

When you say "diversity" to a Conservative, they think diversity of beliefs, background, experiences.

When you say "diversity" to a Liberal, they think SKIN COLOR.

Nobody cares about the President's skin color, except for racists and Libs (often the same person).

The Robert Byrd wing of the Democrat party cares about his skin color.

Nobody else does.

Romney/Ryan 2012

The paranoid, the bigoted, the stupid, and the religious fanatics = 50% of the republican party. As a group, these morons are invaluable to the oligarchs - and they come cheap. All it takes is a conspiracy theory or two.

"Rasmussen Reports, consistently the most reliable polling service, has Romney UP 49-47 today."

Rasmussen Reports, consistently the most reliable polling service??? Arthur -- are you drunk, on drugs or have you been living on Mars for the last 5 years?? In 2008, at the end of October, Rasmussen had McCain winning in Ohio, Indiana, Virginia, North Carolina and Colorado. He LOST every one of them. Rasmussen is the rightward leaning pooling service, not the most reliable.

Ever notice that when the numbers aren't what the GOP want they cry that they were cooked but when Mitt Wormtongue Romney gets caught lying with his pants around his ankles again they it was just that people didn't understand or miss understood him. Sorry Mitt, when you get caught downtalking the general public when you're not aware that someone is taping then it means they got the truth.

It amazes, disgusts me and sometimes amuses me that since President Obama was elected - any time there is good news in the country or anytime statistics point to an improvement or anytime the Unites States does something good in the world, the Republicans disavow it, criticize it, call it a lie, or claim it is part of a vast conspiracy. They do this at the same time that they call themselves "Real Americans" and claim to love their country and their god. How can you rejoice at bad news, disbelieve good news and criticize anyone who plays a part in anything good just because there is a Democrat involved?

JimD - the bigots populate the George Wallace wing of the Democrat Party.

The party that fillibustered the Civil Rights Act for 82 days.

The party that had a former Klansman in the Senate until TWO YEARS AGO.

It hurts - I know!!!!

Romney/Ryan 2012

Real American... Obama makes empty promises. He "promised" to reduce the defit by 1/4 in one term. He "promised" to close Gitmo. He "promised" to have the MOST transparent administration ever. He "promised" to bring America together. He has done none of that. What he DID is the total opposite in every regard. You all wanted to hear he'd perform miracles, were suckered into believing him, and once he got your votes, he doesn't deliver...you've been HAD. I was initially very impressed by him, but the more I heard his slippery rhetoric, learned NOTHING about WHO he is, had all of his records of his education, his law practice closely guarded, learned of his friends and mentors and associates, saw the arrogant ways he treated Hillary Clinton. I saw a phoney with a huge ego...And who can trust someone who is so guarded and secretive. Also, you judge a person by the company he keeps, and Wright, Morris, Ayers, Rezko, Said and others with names I can't even spell...I was and still AM afraid for this country if he gets another term. I think he's planted too many seeds already.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Can't possibly see WHY GOP is suspicious of these unemployment numbers. The timing is just so convenient, right after Obama does takes a shellacking in the debate. That number doesn't reflect ALL of the people out of work...like those underemployed or who have given up on their job hunt. So why would anyone be suspicious of the most corrupt, lying, manipulative, secretive group who have raised the art of cover-ups to whole new level? Funny thing though, is that Obama railed and ranted about the 7.8% unemployment he inherited from Bush, and now we are RIGHT BACK TO WHERE WE STARTED FROM. So what he thought was just a shameful situation in '09...is now considered an accomplishment????

What's that FISHY smell?

Rasmussen predicted 52-46 for Obama in 2008, which was DEAD ON.

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/elections/election_2008/2008_presidential_election/how_did_we_do

Math is tough to accept when your party keeps passing TRILLION DOLLAR DEFICITS. I know!!!

Romney/Ryan 2012

Pity the fool,

You have a narrow and stereotypical view of who aligns themselves with the Democratic Party...if you think you story of hard work and perseverance moves mountains, I can gladly put you in contact with people whose stories would move planets...yes, they lean Democrat but they don't lump all lazy people into the party and then write them off as you just did. I'm glad your parents taught you the value of hard work and charity....mine did the same. It really is a shame that terms like "food stamp president" and "welfare president" are used to stereotype all the people whose views and values coincide with a political party. What is most ironic about your statements is that the states with the highest % of population on public assistance are states that are consistently red in presidential elections and need money from the federal government to balance their budgets..Texas, Mississippi, Alabama...need I go on?

Arty66 - You are lying. And you, and newt, and the rest of your ridiculous party of conspiracy theorists, whiners, and religious fanatics know it.

Woo hoo Mr. President! 114,000 new Jobs!

“The report from the Bureau of Labor statistics shows workforce participation remained essentially flat in September, at around 64 percent, with an uptick in workers who took part time jobs for economic reasons, such as not being able to get full time employment”.

Would those be low wage holiday retail jobs hawking clothing made in China to strapped Americans who who will have to use their credit cards to pay for them? Is that the best you can do Mr. President? Apparently so.

Hi Jefferson, yes,

Rasmussen, you call right leaning, has been the most accurate pollster in recent years. I'm not sure how being the most accurate indicates leaning right, but I'm sure you have some idea what you meant.

Gravis, if they do get money from Bain (here I will take your word for it since it doesn't matter if your word is true or not in terms of my reply), could still produce a viable and reputable poll result. See, and this might be shocking to you to know since you apparently don't know, but Bain has many liberal or leftist or Democratic partners too. In fact, many of them are giving money to Mr. Obama. So, would a firm that has partners who support Mr. Obama then fund a polling firm in order to produce slanted results in favor of Mr. Romney? Logically speaking, you make no sense.

ir12 -- the short answer is that he lied to us and we fell for it. We thought he was like other responsible Republican governors we had had; it turned out Governor of Massachusetts was just a notch on his belt and he tossed us aside like a bit of lobster shell from a clambake. I can go into more detail if you like. It is all recorded on video!

Eric-913730:

Despite Republican obstruction, the economy has grown each and every quarter under Obama.

Wrong! Here are the official rate of growth since January 2009 to September 2012: -6.7, -0.7, 1.7, 3.8, 3.9, 3.8, 2.5. 2.3, 0.4, 1.3, 1.8, 3.0, 2.0, and 1.3. You are not even close to being correct. That being stated, the USA’s economy is not bad nor is it good. The real issue is the lack of new company startups. That is what drives new job growth in the USA economy. The War on Posterity is having its enormous negative impact.

Presidents of the USA do NOT drive the economy - for-profit business do, as does the free enterprise system. The president of the USA does NOT have that power. If they did, the USA would always have a robust expanding economy. Their policies can and do have a positive or negative impact(s).

OK liberals... step back 8 years... Remember what you were saying back then about the two candidates running... Pretty much the same things you are saying today... Republican - BAD.... Democrat - GOOD.

Step back 4 years. Republican - Bad.... Democrat - VERY GOOD! So Obama won... did you?

JimD - the bigots populate the George Wallace wing of the Democrat Party.

• Wrong again Arthur --- those bigots that populate the George Wallace wing to the DemocratIC party in the late 60s and early 70s moved to the RepublicAN party beginning in the last 70s. That's why the south is a republicAN today.

Job statistics don't change voters minds, jobs change their minds. Ronald Reagan said it best, A recession is when your neighbor loses their job and a depression is when you lose your job.

Phantom,

You might be interested to know that the Mittster's duplicity is more than skin deep.

He dyes his hair.

No subterfuge is overlooked.

"Rasmussen predicted 52-46 for Obama in 2008, which was DEAD ON."

One more time Arthur --- In 2008, at the end of October, Rasmussen had McCain winning in Ohio, Indiana, Virginia, North Carolina and Colorado. He LOST every one of them.

Math is tough to accept when your party keeps passing TRILLION DOLLAR DEFICITS.

History is tough to accept for Republicans like you. You to forget that the first trillion dollar deficit happened under George W. Bush. You seem to forget that George W. Bush and his Republican Congress who brought us two unfunded wars, a massive, unfunded, new entitlement, the largest expansion of government since LBJ, the largest increase in energy prices in any 8 year period in our history, along with a net loss of jobs over 8 years all while turning the largest surplus of all times into the largest deficit of all times and leaving office with the worst economy since the depressions.

I'm a conservative but I think polling is very often extremely accurate. But this is in the context of the sample. That is where most problems in polls can be found. A sample that improperly weights one group over another is still accurate for THAT sample, but it isn't indicative of how the general population will respond. Still, I'd prefer we knew more about the polls taken by the candidates themselves. Believe it or not but they are probably among the most accurate of all since it does absolutely no good for a campaign to be on the wrong track with voters because your sample was badly flawed. Most campaigns tell reporters about their findings, but won't release them for publication. Too bad.

I suspect that if we knew about these polls we'd more easily be able to explain what seems like some wild and irrational comments by Mr. Obama's campaign team. Why go out and make all sorts of claims about lies if your campaign is really as far up as you claim? So it comes down to logic and reason. Polls, whether about how the voters like candidates or whether about how many people are now employed, have to be viewed in the context of logic and reason.

So, two simple questions for the majority of leftist posters above. First, does it appear to you that our economy today is so much better than in any recent period of the last 30 years to be producing nearly 900,000 jobs in one month? If you think so, great. Then we shouldn't need all the additional stimulus spending you leftists keep whining about anyhow. If you think not, then you can't credit Mr. Obama, as you are now, with all the progress he claims is his, in which case you should rethink how you vote.

Second, you leftists demand proof that some conspiracy is at work here. Frankly, I don't know what is at work here but I am very sure that our economy hasn't strengthened to the point that over 800k people found work in one month. Still, why do you not present any proof which supports, say from an economics perspective if nothing else, such massive hiring following weaker GDP quarter over quarter, for the last several quarters? In other words, why not make the case, rather than just accept numbers that seem unreasonable, for why those numbers are reasonable?

It is this lack of thinking on the part of the left that I think makes American success more difficult, over time. It would be less important, certainly it would have less impact on the USA, if leftists thought as they do but we had a government truly constrained by the constitution.

Charlie said: History is tough to accept for Republicans like you. You to forget that the first trillion dollar deficit happened under George W. Bush. You seem to forget that George W. Bush and his Republican Congress who brought us two unfunded wars, a massive, unfunded, new entitlement, the largest expansion of government since LBJ, the largest increase in energy prices in any 8 year period in our history, along with a net loss of jobs over 8 years all while turning the largest surplus of all times into the largest deficit of all times and leaving office with the worst economy since the depressions.

While your perception of the GOP is so skewed it's not funny, I notice you never mention democrats in your diatribe. Who was in charge of congress since 2007? This when the largest expenditures in government under the Bush administration occurred. While you blatantly blame the GOP, you close your eyes to the democrats. Somehow you forget about the economic turmoil of 911, the dot.com bubble and other financial disasters that were overcome by the republicans... Democrats won in 06 and we have been going downhill ever since. Put that into your partisan pipe and smoke it.

Charlie it might be helpful to realize the first trillion also was agreed to by Democrat dominated Congress. As far as the wars you forget four of the previous five were started by Democrats. Also you forget the projected budget was 1.2 trillion amounting to $8500.00 per person, what is it four years later? You use good numbers to defend Obama but fail to use his numbers to be critical of him. When you do you will open your mind.

While your perception of the GOP is so skewed it's not funny, I notice you never mention democrats in your diatribe. Who was in charge of congress since 2007?

OK --- name me one single Bill that the democrats passed, that Bush vetoed, that Congress overturned, between 2007 and 2009 caused the the first trillion dollar deficit.

Somehow you forget about the economic turmoil of 911, the dot.com bubble

On -- so now when something happens under a Republican's watch such as 9/11 -- he gets a pass? You seem to forget -- Bush inherited a strong economy. the dot-com bubble passed and it wasn't a financial disaster. It was a bump in the road. The reality is no president since Kennedy had the keys to the White House turned over to him from the former president with the nation in BETTER shape than did George W. Bush and no president since FDR had the keys to the White House turned over to him from the former president with the nation in WORSE than did President Obama. It will take this nation a generation or longer to dig ourselves out of the economic disaster caused by George W. Bush and his Republican controlled Congress.

"If the labor force participation rate was the same today as it was in January 2009, when Obama took office, the unemployment rate would be 11 percent."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-insiders/post/obamas-3-part-message-for-the-sunday-shows/2012/10/06/4d70abb6-0fba-11e2-ba6c-07bd866eb71a_blog.html

The fact is that this sudden "dropping" of unemployment rates is extremely suspicious! I will guarantee that at the next '"revelation" of unemployment rates it will rise to well above 8%! I am sure that when this happens the liberal establishment mass media (or LEMMINGS as I affectionately call them) will ignore the new numbers and trumpet only the numbers that support their Dear Leader's election. How many times did we hear in the last four years how some disappointing economic number was "unexpected"? Then if there was a decent number reported it was knocked down, quietly, in the next week or two! I fully expect that this number will be "restated" to a lower level very soon.

Democrats won in 06 and we have been going downhill ever since. Put that into your partisan pipe and smoke it.

Yet another distorted view of history by a Republican. The election was in 2006 but the Democrats didn't take over Congress until January 2007. The Bush depression started in the spring of 2006. Why do you thinks the Democrats won -- because the economy was in such great shape??

Funny how the Repugs relied on the very same "job reports" when it was hovering around or above 80% and suited their agenda...Now that it's slightly below the 8% mark, they want to cry foul!?!?!? You can't have it both ways "boys".....

"I don't think the Democratic turnout will be as high as it was four years ago,"

Therein lies the problem.

But, if Obama is re-elected you're really going to hear the pigs squeal! It'll make 2000 look like a church quilting bee. Everyone must get out and vote.

Charlie-1915998

While your perception of the GOP is so skewed it's not funny, I notice you never mention democrats in your diatribe. Who was in charge of congress since 2007?

OK --- name me one single Bill that the democrats passed, that Bush vetoed, that Congress overturned, between 2007 and 2009 caused the the first trillion dollar deficit.

He didn't veto any of them... but do you remember why? They threatened to remove the funding for the troops... In effect they blackmailed him. Look it up if you don't believe me...

On -- so now when something happens under a Republican's watch such as 9/11 -- he gets a pass? What pass? It was a very costly event. It disrupted our economy, played havoc with the stock market... but I can tell you have a convenient memory. You seem to forget -- Bush inherited a strong economy. Created by a republican controlled congress... OH... The GOP is soooo bad! the dot-com bubble passed and it wasn't a financial disaster. Dot.com hurt the economy but you forget about it... like it never happened. It was a bump in the road. The reality is no president since Kennedy had the keys to the White House turned over to him from the former president with the nation in BETTER shape than did George W. Bush and no president since FDR had the keys to the White House turned over to him from the former president with the nation in WORSE than did President Obama. While you conveniently forget that 17 months after democrats took over Congress, everything went to hell. I guess the democrats just couldn't keep it under control, could they?

It will take this nation a generation or longer to dig ourselves out of the economic disaster caused by George W. Bush and his Republican controlled Congress.

Still blaming Bush... 4 years later... Totally forgetting the make up of congress during the last 2 years of his term... totally forgetting it was a republican congress that gave Bill Clinton the surplus that wasn't really a surplus at all... it just looked good on paper.

It seems that skewing information is in your forte... why don't you go and become one of Obama's press agents... you'd do well there.

The bottom line to all this is 21^st century Republicans hate good news and love bad news. It's been going on since 2009. An American wins the Noble Peach Prize. That's a feather in the cap not only for the person that wins it but for the nation that wins it. Yet Republican whined and bitched about it. America doesn't get the Olympics – a chance to spotlight the US to the rest of the world. How did Republicans respond after Brazill got the Olympics --- they cheered. GM makes a profit. That's good for all Americans. In the 1950s, the Secretary of commerce said "What's good for GM is good for the America." But 21^st century Republicans were angry whne GM made a profit. They wanted GM to go broke. Gasoline prices go up and Republicans cheer. Gasoline prices drop and Republicans hate it. The unemployment rate goes up – Republicans cheer. It goes down – they bitch about it. Back in the 60s, Republican Spiro Agnew said, "In the United States today; we have more than our share of the nattering nabobs of negativism." That's what the 21^st century Republican Party has become – a collection of nattering nabobs of negativism

Freshie

Obama NEVER got behind it until This year. He should have pushed it then. Not 3 years later like he is now.

Still blaming Bush... 4 years later.

You Republicans have a very short memory. From 1976 to 1992 you whined and cried, moan and groaned and complained and complained more and bitched, carried on and on and blamed President Carter of everything wrong in the entire universe. Then from 1992 to 2008 you whined and cried, moan and groaned and complained and complained more and bitched, carried on and on and blamed President Clinton for everything that was wrong in the entire universe. So – using the standard you set – the left has another 29 years to blame Bush for everything just to pull even with you.

Charlie-1915998 said:

The bottom line to all this is 21^st century Republicans hate good news and love bad news. It’s been going on since 2009.

There is no bottom line Charlie. This is your opinion and it differs from the facts I showed you. While you may not like facts because they distort your version of things, facts rule the day every time. Your opinion of republicans and/or conservatives is based on skewed views, and they don't hold any water... You stand there blaming republicans for all the ills in the world while completely ignoring anything the democrats have done. This skewed view of the world only aids the divisions in this nation. I hope you are very happy to present your contribution.

Now let me lick my pencil, 11% minus 7.8% is equal to, um, 3.2%. Quite a few have given up haven't they?

Maybe, they're doing as Droopy said, "If you can't beat them, join them." Poverty for all, the socialists dream.

Romney should be glad the unemployment rate is 7.8 %, But this Dirtbag wants us to fail so he gets elected, this Clown is beyond a Loser. This is why President OBAMA is still ahead in the polls, America doesn't like Phonies Mr. Romney so get the hell out and don't let the door hit you in the A$$ on the way out !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Charlie - parsing my statements is the exact same thing as lying.

You are both wrong. The first trillion-plus dollar deficit didn't occur under Mr. Bush with a Democrat House approving of it. It came under Mr. Obama with both houses of Congress approving of it. I know, trust me, that most people think it came under Bush, and there is good reason to make this case. It just isn't so. Why?

Well, much of that last FY's deficit was TARP spending. TARP, which I think hurt us more than helped us (that is another debate) was mostly, but not completely, repaid. Those repayments should be credited againt the debt that was incurred to generate them. Hence the deficit in FY 2008-2009, absent the Stimulus bill, would be around $450 to $500 bn less than people now claim it was. It was only after the stimulus money was included, therefore, that the deficit for that FY surpassed $1 trillion. It was Mr. Obama and the Dem Congress that did this, not Mr. Bush.

And what is most interesting about the stimulus is that it was passed and began to be spent AFTER the recession was declared over. No one then thought it was over, just as many people today think we remain in recession. In a real sense we do. GDP growth rates are lower than the rate of increase in prices (save housing), and so we have, for all practical purposes, net negative real GDP growth. Not just the last quarter either. For several quarters. Which is why the idea that with real (as opposed to nominal) negative growth rates it is unlikely that the economy actually fueled the hiring of nearly 900,000 people in just the last month alone.

Empress-409341

Hal, you counted this person's words?! That sounds like a long project.

No, no, no... I just pasted all that hoo ha into Word and it told me. I have a little bit more of a life than that- not much but still...

Patriotic American... maybe you should take the same advice as you vomit all over these boards.

I suppose you can be suspicious of the numbers all you want. But suspicions aren't worth much with out any kind of evidence of which there is none. And really no reason to be suspicious when it comes right down to it. Seems no stooping is too low to stoop to try and redirect attention away from Romney's lack of a plan.

He didn't veto any of them... but do you remember why? They threatened to remove the funding for the troops... In effect they blackmailed him.

Oh -- I see how it works. If the Democrats control Congress and they go against a Republican president -- that's black-male. But if a Republican Congress has a record number of filibusterer, votes against a bill even one of them sponsored as soon as they find out the presidents favors it, says no to just about everything just about all the time, that shows a lack of leadership by the president.

According to obama, “The future must not belong to those who slander the prophet of Islam.”

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/2012/09/26/media-ignore-obama-attack-on-those-who-slander-prophet-islam/?intcmp=obnetwork#ixzz28Yxr7f8l

Reckon who he thinks that it should belong to?

Jefferson Yes, Hamilton No

Bain Capital is run by Levine these days, not Romney. Levine is an Obama bundler.

Gravis may still be a republican poller, but I have not evidence that is true. I had to reload my acrobat reader to read the Gravis report today. Gravis is using about an average of 2004 & 2008. That is what the polling companies SHOULD be doing. Here is the party affiliation nuts and bolts

2004 Dem 29% Rep 38% Other 33%

2008 Dem 30% Rep 31% other 39%

Ave. Dem 29.5% Rep 34.5% Other 36%

Gravis Dem 28% Rep 32% Other 40% Results Obama 46 - Romney 49 +3

Diff Dem -1.5 Rep -2.5 Other 40% Adusted Results Obama 47.5 Romney 51.5 +4

Let's look at Public Policy Polling, an outrightly Democat Polling company from 9-23

PPP (D) Dem 34% Rep 34% Ind 31% Results Obama 51 - Romney 45

diff/Ave Dem +4.5 Rep -.5 Ind -5 Adjusted Results would be Obama 46.5 Romney 45.5 Obama+1

diff/2008 Dem +4 Rep +3 Ind -8 Adjusted Results would be Obama 47 Romney 43 Obama +4

diff/2004 Dem +5 Rep -4 Ind -2 Adjusted Results would be Obama 46 Romney 47 Romney +1

Given Democratic Registrations were Down 10 times more than Republican Registrations, There is no reason to use an increase in democrats in a poll for a realistic count. Add to that the majority of polls have shown that democrat's energy isn't near as high this year as it was in 2008.

The Media Polls clearly are not real. They are at best an optomistic prograstication, and at worse tampering with the election process by playing with people's emotions.

There is no bottom line Charlie.

No Brianb -- you just can't admit to the facts. Since 2009, if it's good for the US, Republicans find a way to whine and complain about it. You're telling me Republicans didn't cheer when the US didn't git the Olympics? Rush the junkie was so excited at the announcement that Brazil won I thought he was gong to have a stroke.

@Mike in SA "The economy tanked in 2007-2008 because of the housing market collapse not "two tax cuts to the wealthy, 2 unfunded and unwanted wars, unfunded prescription benefits program of 2004, and on and on"...or haven't you heard."

Why were people unable to repay all those "toxic" loans in the first place? Maybe had their pay went up at the SAME rate as their bosses did they could have paid off those loans, but that is not what they wanted. They wanted black people to stay in the ghettos, not to move in next door to them. Why did so many jobs get shipped/moved overseas and what did effect did that have on a person ability to pay back a loan? Why stop at the housing things and not bring up Nafta, Gafta, or the Glass Steagall act? What effect did those have?

What effect did "two tax cuts to the wealthy, 2 unfunded and unwanted wars, unfunded prescription benefits program of 2004, and on and on" have on the debt that you all love to cry about? Did it add or subtract from it? Therefore, WTF effect did it have again? If you need a calculator for the answer...

Why do people love to see other people fail? Does it get people off or what? Why do people hate Americans? Why do people hate old people, poor people, and those who might be less fortunate then they are. Maybe they were blessed with different gifts then you. Why does everyone have to be exactly like you? (Does it scare you?) Why can you not be smarter like me for example? That sounds like a chit thing to say to someone huh? That is how you sound when you cry about people "working hard", that "I am so much better then you are".

Is it better or worse to be part of a society? Do you or can you know everything that might threaten you or put your life in danger? Why do you insist on using/preying on society if it is a benefit to you? Sure it is easy to prey on society, it is easy money. The problem is you have preyed to much and you are lacking food/starting to go hungry. There are too many predators versus the sheep. If you do not take care of the sheep then you cannot eat. How about making a living by not being a predator and preying on your fellow humans? Why do you need workers again? Don't want to, or are you to good to do it yourself?

REPUBLICONS...THE PARTY OF UNICORNS, SASQUATCH, UFO'S, AND LOCH NESS MONSTER!

When repubs found out the nation was doing better they booed as Paul Ryan pledged to obstruct and vote against every bill that would make president Obama a one term president 4 years later from that night.

Repubs call an emergency meeting to deny the facts, then create a bill that says Santa Claus, The Easter Bunny and the Tooth Fairy are real!

Vote Obama/Biden and Team America 2012...REAL Americans for REAL Americans!!!!!

GEE, if there was not so many WANT ad's I'd tend to question the poll but no matter how much the REPUBLICANS attempt to hold back our country it keeps moving FORWARD, guess OBAMA picked the right slogan for his campaign ..... LOL NOW LET"s KEEP IT MOVING FORWARD >>>>>> OBAMA 2012 <<<<<<

"On Friday, Romney refrained from discrediting the government data. But plenty of conservatives did that work for him.

Conn Carroll, an editorial writer at the Washington Examiner, tweeted: "I don't think BLS cooked numbers. I think a bunch of Dems lied about getting jobs. That would have same effect."

http://www.cbs42.com/content/localnews/story/Officials-reject-conspiracies-on-unemployment-rate/gL7F10i_n0SGCoiFegFglw.cspx

Some democrats lying about getting jobs?

Come on now, you don't really think the democrats are smart enough to figure that out, do you?

Gallop research records national unemployment at 7.9% seasonally un - adjusted and 8.1% seasonally adjusted.

The only man who is running campaign on "promises" is Mr. Obama. Romney talks facts.

Sure, facts do tend to change, as in new arrive, some become dated. Mr. Obama supporters attempts to demand some sort of "perfect", "unchangeable" political policies is not the worst we can expect.

Rich

The first trillion dollar deficit actually belongs MOSTLY to Obama. First Bush submitted a $3.1 Billion dollar Budget to Congress which voted it down. The congress built it's own budget based somewhat on Bush's, but with additional spending. Bush Vetoed the budget. Next Congress sent Bush a continuing resolution for 800 Billion to cover everything for 6 months and not including that did not include Military spending. Bush signed that. Congress then sent a full year military spending bill of $600 Billion to Bush who signed that too. The TARP fund were approved in October, and the Bush adminstration saw fit to use only $300 Billion of it. Add up what Bush approved by doubling the domestic portion, and you will find that Bush would have spent maybe 2.7 Trillion. Actual spending ended up at $3.5 Trillion.

Why? The Democratic congress Added $50 Billion of the $150 Billin added to Tarp for 2009, Obama added about $150 billion of the 800 Billion Stimulus Bill, Obama added $50 Billion in other spending vetoed by Bush, and signed the final Continuing Resolution Which for 6 months was 1.2 Trillion or $400 Billion more than Bush would have approved.

The Deficit was 1.4 Trillion, of which Obama and the Democrats and Obama added $750 Billion to.

ROMNEY THE FLIP FLOPPING LIAR WILL GET TO HAVE TWO PODIUMS NEXT DEBATE, ONE WHEN HE IS FOR AND ONE WHEN HE IS AGAINST THE ISSUE!

Romney doesn't know who he is. His staff says he is not who or what Romney said he was for. They simply don't know what plan is his plan anymore.

So repubs don't know, what they don't know. And..they admit they don't know , what they don't know, that they don't know. How can they don't know, what they don't know about what they don't know? We do know that they don't know, what they don't know. But they don't care that we all know, that they don't know, that they don't know. If repubs did know, what they don't know, about what they don't know, we would know what they don't know about what they don't know about.

starsailing said:

ROMNEY THE FLIP FLOPPING LIAR WILL GET TO HAVE TWO PODIUMS NEXT DEBATE, ONE WHEN HE IS FOR AND ONE WHEN HE IS AGAINST THE ISSUE!

Romney doesn't know who he is. His staff says he is not who or what Romney said he was for. They simply don't know what plan is his plan anymore.

So repubs don't know, what they don't know. And..they admit they don't know , what they don't know, that they don't know. How can they don't know, what they don't know about what they don't know? We do know that they don't know, what they don't know. But they don't care that we all know, that they don't know, that they don't know. If repubs did know, what they don't know, about what they don't know, we would know what they don't know about what they don't know about.

So Obama made his plan so very clear... he spelled out to an exacting specificity of what he plans on doing for the next 4 years.

All this vitriol about Romney but you can't even defend Obama one bit... nor can you state for certainty what his plan is... Hypocrite!

Swagganaut-A little rebellion now and then ... is a medicine for the sound health of government. From time to time the Tree of Liberty must be refreshed with the blood of tyrants and patriots.
--Thomas Jefferson

What this says is that if the Republicans try to steal another election they should face rebellion. I have to agree with you there. In the past we have been far too accepting of tyrants.

And the partisan bickering continues, democrats are god and republicans are satan and vice versa. No one is going to change anyone's minds on this board, frankly, the minds were made up long time ago. If you want more of the same, well, vote for Obama. If you want the possibility of improvement, vote for Romney. I know who I'm voting for, I've registered and am prepared one way or the other for whoever wins.

If Obama does win, I have a certain set of things I'm doing and will proceed with them. On the other hand, if Romney wins and the economy turns around, then a whole nother set of things will go into action.

One thing I do believe is that if Obama wins, the country will spiral deeper into debt. Four years have seen no real improvement and government 'channeling' business in the direction it (Obama) wants it to go will see more businesses throw in the towel and unemployment (despite the magic numbering system) will become worse.

DB-The Deficit was 1.4 Trillion, of which Obama and the Democrats and Obama added $750 Billion to

What you are saying here is that over a Trillion in that budget was Bush's. So that means 65+ of that deficit belongs to Bush not Obama.

Please explain how 114,000 new jobs equates to 8.1 down to 7.8...The only way this happens is for people to be dropping out of the workforce like flies. You libs say conservatives cant do math. So tell me how this equation works....and please, show your work! No calculators!

Welp, I went and had dinner, and took a nap, and still......no takers

211,000 people left the workforce entirely over the past month. They no longer count for compiling the U-3 statistic. So, twice as many people stopped looking for jobs as found jobs, and that’s supposed to be good news. Ok, if you say so?

boltonbill

Republicans only believe jobs statistics if those statistics make Obama look bad.......

Bus they do not believe them, if the statistics make Obama look good.

Kind of like blaming the House of Representatives for everything bad that happens, and praise for O'bama if anything good happens? That kettle looks black as night!

brian...,,,,,.guess you missed the debate....Obama stuck to giving facts .......while Romney lied and flip flopped.....You are on here everday Brian to know the terms Romney the etch a sketch, flip flopper etc.....Now you pretend President Obama does not have a plan. How about the President Obama plan where they took all the money from healthcare that was waste and fraud and from streamlining and put it right back into more and longer healthcare for people. Romney and Ryan liked that money source so much they took out that same savings...and GAVE IT TO THEMSELVES IN TAX BREAKS FOR THE RICH!!!!!! ROMNEY RYAN THE THIEF BROTHERS!!! STEAL FROM HEALTHCARE AND GIVE IT TO THE GREEDY RICH!!!

ROMNEY FOREIGN POLICY EXPERIENCE: I can see France from my offshore accounts.

RYAN FOREIGN POLICY EXPERIENCE: I can see Milwaukee from my window.

Kornfed, If you would have read my posts to Ozzy you would know how that is possible. You didn't read the whole article or you read it on FOX, which left out a bunch of facts, which they so often do when they want to be "Fair and Balanced!' LOL The 114,000 jobs that were created had an adjustment upwards for the months of July, Aug. and Sept. of 300,000 more jobs. You simply add them together and get 414,000 jobs which translates into a .3% drop in unemployment.

Now before you start whining I want you to know I felt the same way when the June, May and April numbers were adjusted downward 160,000, but I didn't whine about it like you guys here are with your right wing republican extremists views. You just can't believe you've been lied to by Fox and Mitt+ Lying Ryan as we call him back in Janesville. You have!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It doesn't really matter; they are predicting that the unemployment numbers will be back to 8%+ tow days before the election, what will Obamabots do then, keep squealing, you sound like Obama did Wednesday night, that by the way was embarrassing, I can;t stand Obama, but I almost felt sorry for him, he was getting schooled by a businessman and get took out back t the woodshed for a good ole' school ass whoopin'!

I just goes to show you that without his tele-prompter he's not worth the toilet paper that stuck to the bottom of his shoe when walked out on stage, the guy's a bum and it's time to go. Obama brought a knife into a gun fight, he got punked! It was actually funny to watch!

But fear not my fellow Americans, basketball season is coming up here and he'll jump on Air Force One a t $186,000 per hour on our dime to catch a game.

The 114,000 jobs that were created had an adjustment upwards for the months of July, Aug. and Sept. of 300,000 more jobs. You simply add them together and get 414,000 jobs which translates into a .3% drop in unemployment.

Oh I read this in many publications. Now account for the population growth of 100,000 new employable people that enter the work force every month. Doesnt look right anymore now does it? Oddly enough, the news is bad considering the revisions, for we are adding jobs at a slower rate...the trend of new job growth is moving downward.

The left wing nuts believe anything their lyin sack of $hit pres tells them, How you guys feeling about the prices of gasoline these days or the price of food or anything else insane usama has added to your daily cost. hope he can figure out a cost of living for the welfare group. insanes foreign policy experience is great for you left wingers, your pres backs the muslims against the americans. Funny how he said he would stop subsidies to big oil and banks, guess what, he hasn't as of yet. This pres is a boring lazy a$$ failure. Couldn't even debate romney cause he didn't want to have his sheep catch him in more lies and make him look worse, so he just checked his travel plans to kenya for his homecoming

Does Obama even have any foreign policy experience, other than flying Michelle and Oprah to see if they could land the Olympics in Chicago? Another epic failure there too, he got his ass laughed at and send packing. He mentioned to Putan, that give me time, if I get a 2nd term I will have more flexibility. Flexibility to do what exactly?

However, Romney should have asked him about his 'promise' when he was running for President; he said that he couldn't make a difference he would be a 1 term President ...... I guess different meaning screwing things worse than ever and it's time to move 'Forward'; like towards the door!

I can't wait for Ryan to ruin Biden, if Obama was smart he would have Biden call in sick and that one..... Biden will lose his cool and get schooled by Ryan, can wait!

1.1

1.2

There is your POLL

Look at the votes on these two comments

Uncle Bob

Congress writes the spending, not the president. The president proposes a budget and advises congress on what he would like to do. Congress gives him what they wish to.

And the democrats in the senate have produced nada, zip and zero for a budget the ENTIRE TIME that Obama has been in office. Interesting little factoid there.

Once again, the Republicans cannot seem to step off the crazy train. In a nutshell, Republicans = lie, cheat, steal, suppress.

DB Akron

Freshie

Obama NEVER got behind it until This year. He should have pushed it then. Not 3 years later like he is now.

Personally, I don't like Simpson Bowles, and I'm not sure the President liked it either. For one thing, it cuts rates; call me a tax and spend liberal all you want, but I think rates are TOO low, especially on the top bracket. And it would shrink the bracket system by 50%, increasing the number of people per bracket and reducing any possibility of a major tax being applied on those making above, let's say, $1 million. Obama wanted to RAISE tax rates on the wealthy, not cut them. Secondly, Simpson-Bowles wasn't very popular even then. 7 Republicans and Democrats out of 18 voted against it, and neither party embraced the concept of either raising revenues or cutting entitlements. Having Obama sign up on it would only be symbolic, because neither party would shell out for it. The only reason why it is popular now is because those conservative idiots in Congress blocked the deficit deals that were hastily made before the debt ceiling crisis, and with the fiscal cliff coming they are desperate to do something to save themselves before the election. If you want serious deficit reduction, let the fiscal cliff happen; it will reduce the deficit by well over $6 trillion, and it will buy us time to deal with entitlements.

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

So, why weren't the republicons suspicious of the polling numbers when they said unemployment was ABOVE 8%? Wasn't that just a month ago? No wonder republicons support Romney. They flip flop as much as he does!

Being deliberately obtuse because you support Obama still doesn't change the fact that those numbers, coming after Obama's pitiful debate performance, are remarkably coincidental.

so the party of doom and gloom strike again

"You don't believe in science?" - B White

I absolutely believe in science and in science a discovery doesn't stand alone. It is only considered valid if it is supported by other known facts.

As I stated earlier GDP growth doesn't support the ridiculous and fantastical 873,00 newly employed number. The 114,000 jobs created doesn't support the ridiculous and fantastical 873,00 newly employed number. The ADP 169,000 jobs created doesn't support the ridiculous and fantastical 873,00 newly employed number. The factory new orders plunge of -5.2% doesn't support the ridiculous and fantastical 873,00 newly employed number. The -13. 2% off-the-cliff dive of durable goods orders doesn't support the ridiculous and fantastical 873,00 newly employed number. In fact while all of these numbers support the common conclusion that the economy is severely suffering, they also support the expectation that the newly employed number would be flat or negative, not be the highest since 1983 when GDP growth was at 7%.

To believe this number is in any way valid in the face of all the other individual and cumulative known facts has nothing to do with you being scientific and it is akin to believing leprechauns live under your bed on a unicorn ranch.

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.I AM BARACK OBAMA AND I SUCK!!!

PAID FOR BY TAXPAYERS!!!

Ticked off, you must really have a boring life if you took time to post that. Also, these Repugs not realize how incredibly desperate this makes them look? Instead of crying about the polls being biased and obsessing over the jobs report being bogus, why don't you admit it that you are losing and the reason you are losing is that most people do not buy into your extremist right-wing nutcase ideas? That is the reason you are behind in the polls - no one wants the Tea Klux Klan running the nation. I suppose when your favorite sports teams lose it was because the referees were biased or the commentators were against you. Grow up take responsibility for your own actions and admit that the reason you are losing is YOUR FAULT. Your supposed to be the party of "personal responsibility" well, take some personal responsibility and own the fact that you lost in 2008 and you are losing now, and in all likihood you will lose on November 6. And if President Obama sucks so badly, Ticked Off and company, then the past two Presidential candidates that you've offered up must really suck. He beat one of them decisively 4 years ago and he's ahead of the other one now. The polls are not fixed, you're just losing. Deal with it.

Why can't those of you on the Left posting here have a serious conversation rather than name calling? I don't believe in fudging the numbers.........but why do you choose to look at one number and dance in the streets? Do you truly believe the economy is better off? Don't come back with a Romney post or change the topic.......talk to me about the 456,000 people who quit looking for work, the fact that most of the jobs were part-time or seasonal and that Barack put a halt to thousands of pink slips being sent to Government Contractors to massage the numbers. These contractors are losing their jobs. Look at the whole picture and not some .3 percent decline.

In addition, you spew the same ol "Romney lies" routine. Why not scrutinize BO's performance the way you do Romney? Did he close Gitmo as promised? Did he reduce unemployment as promised? He promised 400,000 new construction jobs......1,000,000 lost to date. For those of you that think Obamacare is the cats meow......do you truly understand all the taxes imbedded in that baby? Well.....you are soon going to find out! Do you understand that Obamacare will be the largest tax increase on the lower and middle class in history?

No you don't.......you treat this like a football game. Won't it be nice if Barack wins for you to be dancing in the street.....for you to make Rombot posts.......won't that make you feel sooooo good. Social issues are one thing......but if you are voting for a better economy.......you won't be dancing if Obama wins and two days later you get your pink slip or your unemployment runs out! This guy hasn't even presented a budget that his OWN party will pass. You all claim he inherited such an economic mess. Silly me......why would we need a budget to get out of debt!! Silly me.

Lastly, you were all up in arms that GW didn't jump off that school chair in .34 seconds when he first learned of the 9/11 attacks. Welllll.......the current clown ignored 10+ requests for additional security before the Mideast attacks, he skips security briefings, he flew to Vegas hours after the attacks and he continued to blame it on the video. What a disgrace.

Let's see now.... the Republicans have the Birthers, the Pollers and now the Jobber's. The Odd thing is, the only thing they believe are the lies that they tell themselves.

Ticked off, you must be a real fan of OUR president....Your art work shows it...NO MATTER WHAT YOU SAY!!!! I notice you don't have any "fancy" artwork of your buddy Mitt.....

The point that got me was when Romney said that The President "spent 80-90 billion dollars on green companies, all of which filed for bankruptcy (Solyndra, et al) AND they were staffed or owned by prior contributors to Obama campaigns." And the president of the United States didn't respond to that accusation! He just looked down on his podium. If Mitt was lying so much, why the F didn't the Pres call him out on it????

... PROOF ... a lot of people are saying there is no PROOF the unemployment number was juiced ... I am sorry but there is ... to move the unemployment rate from 8.1 to 7.8 Obama needed to create about 850,000 jobs not the pathetic 114,000 jobs. We have about 185,000,000 Americans working, for the unemployment number to move by 3 tenths of a % ( .003 X 185,000,000 = 555,000 jobs + 275,000 new people to the work force = 830,000 jobs. Of course if your Obama and have no problem lying to the American people you just stop counting about 700,000 people. You just claim they're not looking anymore. Sorry off to the ovens for you, it's only fair, some people have to step aside so others can step up.

Seig Hiel Der Furher Obama

No beelzebubb, all Mr. Obama needed is to find employment for 1/2 a million people, where they were collecting unemployment benefits. An accurate count still counts for something in America.

Are those jobs sustainable? Are those jobs result of economy improvement? This is not such a difficult question to answer, if you want to.

Looking at this forum I get the impression that no supporter of Mr. Obama seems to even wants to look upon this burning question. And why should they? Their champion mustered to watch his socks for 90 minutes last Wednesday and his poll numbers look as rosy as ever.

However, those poisonous words you should shovel back up... The question is not about "who" will be standing in that place 4 years down the road. It's about substance. And We don't need here people poisoning the well. Particularly when someone has got to go down and work on the wall reinforcements.

Empress-409341

I have always wondered about polls and how really accurate they are.

'Accuracy' is really not the right word to use in regards to polling. The true test of a poll is its scientific validity.

A poll is by definition a sample, with a focus on neutrality and methodology. Some polls are considered more reliable than others. Rasmussen, for example, is one of the least reliable polling organizations. The true test of a political poll is whether it predicts the outcome of an election, and that can only be assessed after the election.

The value of a political poll is in large part its measure of opinion trends. Each polling organization shows 'accurate' changes in opinion in a population if they continue to use the same methodology to poll from the same sample.

To all my fellow 'libbies' (we have been called much worse) we must remember that only one poll counts in the end: the poll that is taken on November 6.

Please get your feet on the ground and your fingers on the dial to re-elect President Obama! This is our country! Let's let a good man continue the progress he has made! Let's keep that lying vulture Romney out of the White House! The Presidency of The United States of America is not for sale!

OBAMA/BIDEN NOVEMBER 6 (OR EARLIER IF YOUR STATE HAS EARLY VOTING)

Charlie - parsing my statements is the exact same thing as lying.

• So Briand --- do you think Romney's parsing President Obama's statements is the exact same thing as lying? Or -- like many Republicans -- do your standards of morality vary greatly depending on political affiliation?

Now Kornfed,

Now account for the huge increase in public workers being driven out of their jobs by Walker in Wisconsin and the same thing happening in Florida, Missouri, Arizona etc and I think you see the early retirements account for the number you are talking about. You always have excuses! Are you part f the Reichwing of the republican party

Now Kornfed,

Now account for the huge increase in public workers being driven out of their jobs by Walker in Wisconsin and the same thing happening in Florida, Missouri, Arizona etc and I think you see the early retirements account for the number you are talking about. You always have excuses! Are you part f the Reichwing of the republican party

Rich-281385 -- Rasmussen is the most reliable poll? Where did you get this, FAUX Noise? Quinnipiac has been most predictive, and Pew is also more respected in comparison. Regardless, even Rasmussen has shown President Obama in the lead. As we keep saying, you can have your own opinions but not your own facts.

Aggie-345886 -- The small improvement in jobs including adjustments to the previous months, which historically improves at this time of year, and are NEVER known to be manipulated as this is not possible, is a nontroversy that sadly has become yet more red meat for rightwingers thrown to them by former CEO's of GE, or Donald Trump who is still trying to sell his "birther" snake oil, or others who know better or should know better. If you aren't deeply embarrassed by Todd Akins QUACKERY about women and "forcible" rape, you should be. Stop with the Glenn Beck guilt-by-association chalkboard as your method of deduction.

Arthur66 -- Your lack of historical accuracy indicates you probably can't remember what you had for breakfast, or worse that you spin it to be a 7-course meal. Turn off FAUX Noise and watch Rachel Maddow, who provides history in many of her news segments, and also Chris Hayes weekend shows are excellent, though it has a lot of big words.

Eric-913730 Comment collapsed by the community

All the "news" in the world can't change the fact that Romney changes his positions daily and told more lies during the debate than Heinz has pickles.

This is desperation by Republicans who want to believe what they want to believe despite data to the contrary.

Oh geez, now I just don't know who to believe because that's exactly what the right says about the left. What do you say to those people who maintain that the mainstream media has always leaned favorable towards obama and never much questioned any of his actions??

Tired-2176559 -- Thank you for bringing up the matter of wages. Every problem Romney and Republicans point to boils down to stagnant/decreasing wages.

The housing industry won't improve, not because of Dodd-Frank or that lenders aren't lending, but because the mortgage payment should not exceed 25% of a person's income. The economy will not take off, particularly the housing industry, until the middle class and upward mobility into the middle class is restored.

Romney/Ryan not only completely LACK a plan to grow the middle class, their plan would accelerate the gap between the rich and poor. The idea of corporate welfare and tax breaks for the rich as the way to grow the economy (thus "revenue neutral") is QUACKERY. This is Reagan's supply-side voodoo economics with a different name, and it is not only unfair but outright destructive. Look at the Republican jagoffs in Congress who were so intent on protecting goodies for the wealthy that they extended unemployment benefits before they would give up the Bush tax breaks for the rich.

Romney/Ryan the 21st Century Robber Barons -- they aren't in it for you (nor McConnell, Boehner, Cantor, DeMint, and the rest of the bought-and-paid-for Republicans in Congress).

TruePatriot-445959

Romney/Ryan the 21st Century Robber Barons -- they aren't in it for you (nor McConnell, Boehner, Cantor, DeMint, and the rest of the bought-and-paid-for Republicans in Congress).

On what planet have you been living........they ALL are in it for themselves AND they are ALL rich - the left side of the chamber more so than the right side. And if you think obama is any different....well then, you're just not as smart as you think you are. OR maybe you're just gullible enough to swallow their lies, too!

According to Nate Silver at FiveThirtyEight.com, Rasmussen consistently leans Republican.

Calculating 'House Effects' of Polling Firms

Rasmussen Reports, which has had Republican-leaning results in the past, does so again this year. However, the tendency is not very strong – a Republican lean of about 1.3 points.

If you are used to looking at Rasmussen Reports polls, your impression may be that their partisan lean is stronger than that. This is not wrong, actually. However, some of the difference results from the fact that Rasmussen is polling likely voters, while many other polling firms are polling registered voters.

Izzy - Sheldon Adelson has given $70 MILLION to Romney's campaign. $70 million. So far.

The Koch brothers have contributed hundreds of millions more.

And Karl Rove is the money-master.

Goldman Sachs is giving to the GOP 70% to 30% for the Dems.

Mitt Romney has hundreds of millions of $$ of his own stashed with Goldman Sachs.

Is that REALLY whose side you want to vote on?

Think about it.

RealAmericansFirst

Is that REALLY whose side you want to vote on?

Hmmmm,

According to Federal Election Commission figures compiled by the Center for Responsive Politics, Goldman Sachs' political action committee and individual contributors who listed the company as their employer donated $994,795 during 2007 and 2008 to Obama's presidential campaign, the second-highest contribution from a company PAC and company employees.

Only the PAC and employees of the University of California, which donated more than $1.5 million, topped Goldman Sachs.

Goldman Sachs contributions to the Obama campaign were more than four times larger than the $230,095 in donations to Sen. John McCain's presidential campaign.

http://articles.cnn.com/2010-04-20/politics/obama.goldman.donations_1_obama-campaign-presidential-campaign-federal-election-commission-figures?_s=PM:POLITICS

So, it was OK in 2007-2008 but not when it's reversed, right?

Hypocrite.

ROMNEY/RYAN 2012 FOR REAL AMERICANS©

Whether the 7.8% unemployment statistic is true or not does not matter. So the President is proud that unemployment is only two percentage points higher than what his administration said that it would be if the stimulus were passed. I would assume that he is also proud that he missed his commitment on the deficit by only about 900 billion dollars. Of course that 900 billion dollars will end up costing the tax payers an estimated 9 trillion dollars before it is all paid back in 180 years but who cares about the tax payers. Congratulations Mr. President!

Yes, Spence,

We would never find ourselves voting for a lying piece of crap like Mitt and his membership in a religious cult that says when in doubt the Book of Mormon comes first!

Izzy,

He's been living on the planet Kolab? The one Romney says exists!

You know we're on our own when God allows this many Obama supporters to show their ignorance by supporting the worst president in modern times.

May God have mercy on our Nation.

"The theory that many polls are under-sampling Republicans (and thus overstating the support for Obama) has become widespread on the right, as many supporters of Mitt Romney asserted this week during rallies before the first presidential debate."

Anyone can check this for themselves. In 2008, when there was a record high percentage of people who identified as Democrats and a record low percentage of people who identified as Republicans, exit polls showed that Democrats outnumbered Republicans by 21%. Many of the pollsters (including NBC) now claim that there are 30% more Democrats than Republicans to 'weight' their polls.

How believable is that?

The most accurate pollster in 2004 & 2008 (Rasmussen) has Romney ahead 49% to 47% for Obama, and Gallup (who had a average Democratic bias of over 3% in 2004 & 2008) has Romney ahead by about 1% among Likely Voters (after they make the switch from Registered Voters).

Unfortunately, an estimated 70% of democrats have been shown to be products of a broken single parent or dysfunctional home as is evidenced in many of these posts. Psychiatrists point out that dysfunction in the home leads to emotional instability, mental illness and almost always gross narcissism.

The net result is a mentally unbalanced and dysfunctional agenda; abortion (killing of a human for convenience rather than being sexually responsible), gay marriage (confusion and perversion they believe must be legalized and normalized), entitlement mentality (the belief that you are owed something), socialism (no father in the home creates the expectation that the government should be the daddy).

Barack Obama was a product of an extremely dysfunctional home.

Can't hide the truth,

Please sight the documentation that proves your 70% claim!!!!!! It doesn't exist, or is a figment of FOX, or it is something from the still existing John Birch Society! What sick minds the right possess!

kkwilsomn,

I think you are wrong as GW the bushacker has been cited as the worst and ranks near the bottom for ALL presidents. Why else would he have been hiding out at his Texas ranch for the last 4 years? I guess he knows that the Hague has an arrest warrant out for him for "War Crimes!

Arthur66

bayllie - you're obviously a Democrat.

Because you refute MATH.

I didn't refule the math; I refuted the source. Big difference. Before you make an attempt to put someone down, make sure you understand the difference between "source" and "math" because your silly reply just made you look ignorant.

I made fun of your claim that: Rasmussen Reports, consistently the most reliable polling service. Nowhere in my post did I even mention the word "math."

Critical thinking is not your strong suit, is it?

ROY WILSON-336103

The most accurate pollster in 2004 & 2008 (Rasmussen) has Romney ahead 49% to 47% for Obama

Rasmussen's polls were off by 5.8% with a bias of 3.9% in favor of the Republican candidates. You would have more credibility, Roy, if you said all polls are biased to a degree. But instead, you pick one that leans (R) to call "most accurate." Coincidence?

I think Jack Welch might be having sex with animals. Something about him just isn't right.

"I have no evidence to prove that. I just raised the question."

Hey, did ya hear that Romney manipulated gas prices in an attempt to win the election? If you get my drift...

Seriously moderator? You delete my post #1.40 (apparently for length), yet others like miklkit's 2464 word pro-Obama post is somehow allowed to remain??? Your blatant partisanship makes both you and this thread you arbitrarily "moderate" (read "censor") a joke. BTW, please direct me to where this phantom restriction to the number of words is detailed in any of your policies.