In final public event before debate, Romney plays down expectations

 

DENVER – Mitt Romney used his final scheduled public appearance before Wednesday's first presidential debate to dismiss the expectations game played by both campaigns in recent weeks and to rally supporters with retooled economic rhetoric geared towards middle class voters.

"People want to know who’s going to win," Romney said of the debate at the nearby University of Denver. "Who’s going to score the punches and who’s going to make the biggest difference in the arguments they make."

"There’s going to be all the scoring of winning and losing, and you know, in my view, it’s not so much winning and losing or even the people themselves — the president and myself — it’s about something bigger than that," Romney continued, dismissing the parlor game of expectations-setting that has defined much of the political discourse in recent days.


In his own form of spin, Romney said he was "delighted" about the chance to debate President Obama three times in the next month and declared that the debates, taken in sum, would "be conversation with the American people that will span almost an entire month."

Before a raucous crowd of more than 5,000 supporters, Romney infused his economic talking points with a middle-class focus that perhaps spoke to the recent debate prep designed to refine his message to best appeal to undecided voters.

"Income is down some $ 4,300 dollars a family and with a median income of about $50,000 dollars that means things are really tough for the American people," Romney said. "The middle class squeeze has been unbearable. Gasoline prices way up; food prices up; electricity prices up; health insurance prices up. The American middle class is struggling under this president."

In interviews before the event, Colorado supporters uniformly told NBC News that if Romney needed to show more of a personal understanding of middle class life on Wednesday if he wanted to siphon support from the president

"I really think that Mitt needs to be more personal with the American people," said Renee Salza, a Realtor and Republican who is supporting Romney. "I think a lot of people feel he's somewhat aloof and disconnected from everyday Americans."

Romney, who referenced Colorado's defense community at NORAD and the Air Force Academy, was also joined by a state icon of a different sort, NFL Hall of Fame quarterback John Elway, who endorsed Romney in a brief on-stage appearance.

“I must say today has been a very good day, not only because of what happened yesterday," Elway said, referencing the Broncos' thrashing of rival Oakland yesterday, "because I get the opportunity to introduce to you the next president of the United States, Governor Mitt Romney.”

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Can you believe this story was one of the top ten new stories today? It must be a tradition, go back and check it out. Both Democrats and Republicans are guilty of this behavior.

  • 6 votes
#1 - Mon Oct 1, 2012 11:10 PM EDT
Comment author avatarArchStantonExpand Comment Comment collapsed by the community

"We can have democracy in this country, or we can have great wealth concentrated in the hands of a few, but we can't have both."....Justice Louis Brandeis

"…The administration has constantly sought to block all legal challenges to domestic surveillance programs by means of the authoritarian “state secrets” doctrine and references to the president's so-called “Commander in Chief” wartime powers. Earlier this year, a federal judge threw out a case that challenged domestic spying on the grounds that “any practice, no matter how abusive, may be immunized from legal challenge by being labeled as 'counterterrorism' and 'state secrets’.”

ACLU Report: Obama administration expands domestic spying

By Eric London

1 October 2012

Under the Obama administration, there has been a 60 percent increase in warrantless electronic surveillance by the Department of Justice, according to a report Thursday by the American Civil Liberties Union. According to the report, the DoJ monitored 37,616 phones in 2011 alone.

“The report shows a dramatic increase in the use of these surveillance tools… [m]ore people were subjected to pen register and trap and trace surveillance in the past two years than in the entire previous decade,” the ACLU explains, making reference to two tactics used by the Department of Justice (DoJ) to monitor and track phone calls, email messages, and social networking website use.

The 37,616 phones being tapped by the DoJ alone is a staggering figure. The sharp increase over the past two years, and the huge number of people being monitored, give the lie to any claim that this spying is related to ordinary criminal investigations. Without a doubt, this figure includes political activists, members of left-wing political groups, and other opponents of government policy.

The ACLU report serves as a further indictment of Obama administration, which came to power in 2008 by riding a wave of popular hatred of the Bush administration’s expansion of police state measures. The Obama administration has not only kept Bush’s domestic spying programs intact—it has also greatly enlarged them.

It is worth noting at the outset that the ACLU report only takes into account surveillance figures obtained from the Justice Department. Given the absence of figures from the Department of Homeland Security, Immigration and Customs Enforcement, the Secret Service, and state and local police forces, the ACLU states that “the reports likely reveal only a small portion of the use of this surveillance power.”…

….Irrespective of the content/non-content classification, the massively expanded domestic spying in either form is a blatant violation of the constitution’s Fourth Amendment, which protects the population from warrantless searches and seizures, as well as the First Amendment, which protects free speech.

The existing legal threshold for so-called “non-content” wiretapping is strikingly low. According to the ACLU report, the government needs only to “submit certification to a court stating that it seeks information relevant to an ongoing criminal investigation.” There is no requirement for a judge to actually “consider the merits of the request.”

The Eighth Circuit Court of Appeals explained that its role in the process is “ministerial in nature” in a 1995 ruling. The historic requirement of “probable cause” is no longer required for the government to tap into the phones or personal emails of a US citizen…

http://www.wsws.org/articles/2012/oct2012/spy-o01.shtml

  • 9 votes
#1.1 - Mon Oct 1, 2012 11:41 PM EDT
  • Democrats we MUST bring this home! Vote.
  • -
  • DON"T BECOME COMPLACENT for a SECOND. - WE NEED EVERY VOTE!
  • -
  • ONLY THE FINAL COUNT MATTERS!
  • -
  • Not yet registered? GottaRegister.com
  • -
  • Already Registered? GottaVote.com for early voting information in your state.
  • -
  • Don't allow Billionaires to buy our Democracy! VOTE!
  • 53 votes
#1.2 - Mon Oct 1, 2012 11:42 PM EDT

Definition Romney / an empty suit that caters only to the top 1 percent at the expense of the middle class.

Obama/Biden 2012

  • 39 votes
#1.3 - Mon Oct 1, 2012 11:54 PM EDT

Arch,

What type of coverage do you think this get? I remember when Bush was pushing for this, it was all over the place. It was wrong then and now.

“The report shows a dramatic increase in the use of these surveillance tools… [m]ore people were subjected to pen register and trap and trace surveillance in the past two years than in the entire previous decade,” the ACLU explains, making reference to two tactics used by the Department of Justice (DOJ) to monitor and track phone calls, email messages, and social networking website use.

Does anyone think this is good, and if so, please explain.

  • 2 votes
#1.4 - Mon Oct 1, 2012 11:55 PM EDT

"Income is down some $ 4,300 dollars a family and with a median income of about $50,000 dollars that means things are really tough for the American people," Romney said. "The middle class squeeze has been unbearable. Gasoline prices way up; food prices up; electricity prices up; health insurance prices up. The American middle class is struggling under this president."

I thought Romney believed middle class Americans made $250,000+ a year?

  • 30 votes
#1.5 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:00 AM EDT

ItsSimple ...

Democrats we MUST bring this home! Vote.

Agreed! We all need to vote for the upcoming councilwoman, for the judge that supports what we believe in, to the Congress-person that we either love/hate ...

We are given the greatest gift in this country. Our voices. Make them heard. No matter what you believe in, get out and vote for it and exercise the right that you can!!!

Obama/Biden 2012

  • 35 votes
#1.6 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:16 AM EDT

The GOP has made it clear that Mitt must decisively win these debates, and those sentiments are being echoed by high-profile Republican spokesmen such as Christie. It is his last and only chance to turn around his crash and burn campaign. If he fails, his campaign collapses, and he loses. Willard will then bear the full blame of losing this election in the eyes of the RNC. Mitt however, is clearly uncomfortable with the idea that his entire campaign hinges on these debates, especially considering his less-than-stellar performance in the GOP debates against a field bona fide idiots and window-lickers. He can try to downplay the high expectations being assigned to them by his party, but the fact remains, he has to knock the ball out of the park during each and every one of these debates or he will go back to his dressage horse and his hidden Bermuda assets a beaten man.

Bookmakers' odds of Mitt winning this election: 1 in 4, and those look like damned generous odds.

Here are the most current "skewed" polls showing Romney is trolling the bottom of the cesspool in his stumbling race for the presidency:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2012/president/us/general_election_romney_vs_obama-1171.html

Darn FOX and Rasmussen, anyway, right?

  • 21 votes
#1.7 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:43 AM EDT

All the polls in the battleground states are wrong, because they think that Obama is going to get the same kind of turnout he got in 2008.

But he won't.

Many of those college kids who went out to vote for the first time four years ago, are just going to sit this one out. Or they will forget to go to vote because they will be smoking their weed, and playing video games.

To put it simply: the magic is gone...

And some of the minority voters, who came out in record numbers last time, have been disillusioned during these past four years with the acrimonious and ineffectual Obama administration.

.

Obama supporters should get ready to be disappointed on Nov. 6! Then again, you've probably gotten used to being disappointed by now...

.

OBAMA HAS FAILED!

TIME TO KICK HIM OUT!

  • 9 votes
#1.8 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 3:06 AM EDT

You've just taken wishful thinking to an unhealthy extreme, Duqu. Your unfounded insane fantasies are peculiar to you alone and bear no resemblance to reality. Enjoy them while you can, though, because November is coming soon and with it will come President Obama's reelection.

Read 'em and weep:

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2012/president/2012_elections_electoral_college_map.html

President Obama in November! He is clearly our only rational choice!

  • 27 votes
#1.9 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 3:14 AM EDT

DuQu - You realize your party has gotten their dong caught in the tripod and they have pulled all of their last minute people to sign up voters

because of their dirty tactics - how does it feel to be the party of liars and crooks not that you weren't already were

Wait until the indictments come down - then cry me a river

Somebody is going to jail!

  • 22 votes
#1.10 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 3:32 AM EDT

taken in sum, would "be conversation with the American people that will span almost an entire month."

Translation: I am expecting to get my butt kicked out pretty good. Be gentle, please

Many of those college kids who went out to vote for the first time four years ago, are just going to sit this one out.

I doubt it, if they want to be able to pay those college loans. Obama is trying to avoid Mitt Romney to make a big business out of it. When have you ever seen a bank offering loans at 3 or 4 percent?

  • 13 votes
#1.11 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 5:57 AM EDT

It's kind of interesting that you say this because I've gotten the distinct impression from a few of the things Romney has done that he thinks this is over.

Romney wouldn't be a very good business man if he couldn't see the writing on the wall. And just some of the things he's said and done like the cloud comment a few weeks back make me think he's done. In his mind at least.

Maybe I'm misreading him. I don't know. It just seems to me in the last say 2 weeks or so he's been running out the clock.

I don't think he has the stomach to be a politician. Don't get me wrong. I don't like most of what he stands for but I just don't think he's up to the lying viperous game you have to play to win. I suspect in business he's so far removed he'd be shocked to understand what he was doing to people in his days at Bain. He's not too smart, or so it seems.

Why do Republican candidates always seem so clueless and out of touch? Nixon was the last one that appeared to know what was going on, much to his detriment. Actually Nixon was the last good Republican President.

  • 8 votes
#1.12 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 7:32 AM EDT

Which Mitt Romney will show up for the debates -- the pro choice or the anti choice Romney, the pro gun control or the anti gun control Romney, the Scrap all of Obama-care or the keep some of Obama-care Romney??? Pick your issue -- which Romney will we see??

  • 22 votes
#1.13 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 7:37 AM EDT

Some people desperately want Mitt to say something that would convince them that he cares for them so they can have a reason to vote for him. They are deluding themselves. The "real" Mitt was displayed in the 47% tape conversation with his supporters. Oh, please Mitt say something I can use as a reason to support you. Please say something that will allow me to put myself in the 53% that you like. While you are at it, how about releasing your tax returns today so I do not have to watch you get slammed about them during the debate. What kind of candidate can you be if you have to hid your true feelings and your financial details. What tax breaks are you going to sign into law that will benefit you personally. Inquiring minds would like to know.

  • 10 votes
#1.14 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 7:39 AM EDT

All the polls in the battleground states are wrong, because they think that Obama is going to get the same kind of turnout he got in 2008.

But he won't.

Dogu - you do realize that those are polls of likely voters, i.e. people intending to vote in November?

You'd better hope that all those college kids, minority voters, etc. do sit this one out, or Romney won't even be able to see Obama's tail lights at the finish line.

Aside from all the sports metaphors, and remembering that this is not a contest between two football teams from rival high schools, but rather a nation deciding who will lead it for the next 4 years, do you really want a leader who has never stood to a single set of [publicly expressed] ideals in his professional political life?

When Romney was governor of Massachusetts, he championed gun control, abortion rights and, best of all, almost the very same health care reform plan, which he now swears he'll repeal if elected.

He is a man who privately disparages the 47% of the U.S. work force who are either too old, too poor to pay income taxes, or who are in the military [those slackers!].

He is not a leader.
He is a follower, of public opinion.

  • 13 votes
#1.15 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:32 AM EDT

Romney plays down expectations:

that is what a Romney Presidency would be like as well...

always PLAYING DOWN EXPECTATIONS because nothing would be done for the middle class, the elderly and disenfranchised.

  • 11 votes
#1.16 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:45 AM EDT

How do individuals like Michelle Bachmann, Allen West, Sharon Angle, Christine McDonald, Herman Cain, Newt Gingrich, Mitt Romney etc, etc get the funds to campaign?

Everyday people walk into a casino and place a dollar bet on the roulette wheel. If their number comes up, they win 36 dollar bills. The question is would you make a hundred million dollar bet?

The Koch brothers have a combined wealth of 62 billion dollars according to Forbes Magazine. They are looking at a 21.7 billion tax bill when they die. Another way of looking at it would be they have 620 one hundred million dollar bills and have to give 217 of them to the government in the form of an estate tax. If the went to their friendly neighborhood casino and placed one of them on a number on the roulette table, they could win 36 hundred million dollars bills.

Now we have Citizens United and if they could buy an election by getting enough individuals elected, they would get a return of 217 hundred million dollar bills. That would be 6 times the payout of a casino bet. Not a bad bet at all. All you have to do is convince people that taxes are bad and get the estate tax repealed.

Before you start, I am not envious of the Koch Brothers. They are smart and have worked very hard to accumulate their wealth. I congratulate them on their success. Their success has benefited many Americans. What I have a problem with is they have accumulated their wealth under the current tax laws. Now their goal is to eliminate the estate tax. They used the current tax laws to grow their wealth and now want to change the rules on how it is taxed. Over the years, the top tax rate has been greatly reduced which allows wealthy individuals to keep more of their wealth while they are alive and pay the tax bill when they die.

Allowing someone or a small group of individuals to be able to influence an election is just wrong in so many ways. Don’t feel too bad for the Koch Brothers, even if they lose, they will still have 619 hundred million dollar bills.

Of course Mitt Romney will make out pretty good with the repeal of the estate tax as well. Maybe one of the qestions during the debate should be about the estate tax and how he would replace that revenue.

  • 7 votes
#1.17 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:49 AM EDT

Keep holding on to those polls dman, hold on tho them like you hold on to those broken Obama promises.

But all the polls are based on the premise that Obama will enjoy a turnout like in 2008, which any objective person will tell you simply isn't realistic. In some cases the polls sample 7% or 9% more Democrats to begin with, so of course Obama will be leading by about 7%. But don't be too disappointed on Nov. 6 if it turns out MSNBC and all the left leaning media have been lying to you. This is not 2008!

Obama has managed to disappoint everyone over the last four years, and all it will take is a few of those disillusioned voters to either stay home or vote Romney, in order to kick Obama out of the White House and tell him to start looking for a new job.

The magic is gone. He broke all the promises he made to the voters in 08.

.

Has Obama fixed the economy? No.

Has Obama cut the deficit in half? No.

Has Obama lowered the unemployment rate? No. (8.1% unemployment for 43 straight months)

Has Obama helped the middle class? No. (Household incomes are down 8% in the last 4 years!)

Has Obama improved people's lives? No.

Has Obama made America more respected around the world? No.

.

OBAMA HAS FAILED!

TIME TO KICK HIM OUT!

  • 6 votes
#1.18 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:52 AM EDT

Romney infused his economic talking points with a middle-class focus that perhaps spoke to the recent debate prep designed to refine his message to best appeal to undecided voters.

Well folks, the etch-a-sketch has officially been shaken. Someone must have informed Mittens that the average annual American family income is a lot lower than the $200,000 he thought it was.

Good luck trying to convince anyone with eyes, ears and a brain that you're for the middle class, Moneybags!

OBAMA/BIDEN NOVEMBER 6

  • 13 votes
#1.19 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 9:01 AM EDT

I think it worth every bit of the hypes. This is what I think I know so far about Mitt Romney.

He is one of the Bain Capital founders, who is very rich indeed! Have done so much to save on taxes with Swiss and Cayman Islands safe keeping his wealth so his beloved country which he likes to serve will not benefit from. And he is ready to rule US of A's 53% roughly and as President, will cut taxes for the wealthy, increase Defense spending and balance the budget. And yes, he will close some tax loophole to pay for those extra spending. AND congress will determine those loopholes. Currently he has no idea of which ones to close. Not to say too much about the fact that he is the biggest flip flopper known to man.

Now. If he actually win this elections on those basis, I will eat 3 whole banana wrapped for getting this wrong and I think it will be fair for all places of education in the US to be closed down. It would be pretty obvious that no real learning is taken place there. Why? Kids don't vote.. Adults do and No, money don't vote either.

So guys, get ready to lay your beds as you like it AND don't forget... nobody else will use your bed... YOU ARE GOING TO SLEEP ON IT... Not overnight.. For the next FOUR good years. Good luck to us all.

  • 7 votes
#1.20 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 9:02 AM EDT

Before you start, I am not envious of the Koch Brothers. They are smart and have worked very hard to accumulate their wealth. I congratulate them on their success.

Charles and David Koch 'did not build that'. They inherited the business from their father Fred.

For them, it's not about money. When you're a billionaire the money is a number. It's just a way of keeping score. No one can spend a billion dollars unless they throw their money away (like Sheldon Adelson is so blithely doing).

For the Koch brothers, it's all about power. How much power can they buy with their billions?

Once this election is over, we need to work on getting the ridiculously-named Citizens United repealed.

OBAMA/BIDEN 2012

  • 10 votes
#1.21 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 9:29 AM EDT

OK, so they had help from their father. I wonder how the teaparty feels about Stalin funding their movement.

http://exiledonline.com/a-peoples-history-of-koch-industries-how-stalin-funded-the-tea-party-movement/

Those damm commie %$#%$#$.

  • 3 votes
#1.22 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 9:53 AM EDT

mattfromwash

Definition Romney / an empty suit that caters only to the top 1 percent at the expense of the middle class.

I hate to break this to you buddy, but under Obama the 1% are still the 1%.

Even worse than that is 23 million of the 99% are either under or unemployed.

We sure won't see Obama mentioning anything about:

Unemployment
Job creation
Debt
Economy

But maybe he'll talk up his stellar job on:

Food stamps
Welfare checks
Illegals

  • 4 votes
#1.23 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 10:01 AM EDT

kaybeetoys

For them, it's not about money. When you're a billionaire the money is a number. It's just a way of keeping score. No one can spend a billion dollars unless they throw their money away (like Sheldon Adelson is so blithely doing).

Or give it to CORZINE to do it for you!

  • 2 votes
#1.24 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 10:04 AM EDT

Or give it to CORZINE to do it for you!

I hope you didn't have your money invested with Bernie Madoff, Steve.

  • 5 votes
#1.25 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 10:22 AM EDT

Once this election is over, we need to work on getting the ridiculously-named Citizens United repealed.

Good luck with that. Libs seem to forget that Senator Obama opened the can of worms with this issue way back in 2008. Getting it repealed is hypocracy in its most primal form.

  • 1 vote
#1.26 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 10:56 AM EDT

-- Romney Mittwitt : I will say zinggers to deflect from showing my tax returns

-- Romney Mittwitt : I will say zinggers to deflect from the actual question

-- Romney Mittwitt : I will say zinggers to deflect from giving a position on anything

-- Romney Mittwitt : I will say zinggers to deflect from me knowing basic concepts

-- Romney Mittwitt : I will say zinggers to deflect from me calling the President the N word

-- Romney Mittwitt : I will say zinggers to deflect from me hating black people in general

-- Romney Mittwitt : I will say zinggers to deflect Fiesty knowing more than me on anything

-- Romney Mittwitt : I will say zinggers to deflect that I'm a fake RWNJ

-- Romney Mittwitt : I will say zinggers to deflect that I am really STUPID.

-- Romney Mittwitt : I will say zinggers to deflect that I think America is STUPID

-- Romney Mittwitt : Please vote for me please I want to give you cake because I know you like it

  • 3 votes
#1.27 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 11:23 AM EDT

DOes playing down expecations mean that he's going for the SIlver Medal in November? Second Place seems about right for MItt.

  • 2 votes
#1.28 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 11:58 AM EDT

Duqu

Keep holding on to those polls dman, hold on tho them like you hold on to those broken Obama promises.

You crack me up Dugu...the Republican Party (well at least the only part of it that matters) has already written off the Presidential election. You must not be important enough to have gotten the memo. Carl Rove has shifted his money to the Senate races and left Romney to flounder.

What's left for the Republican party should be interesting. After the election there will be three factions left standing...Neo-conservatives (currently making a comeback), Tea Party (loosing power and influence) and what's left of the moderate (Bob Dole) Republicans (Libertarians are pretty much done with the Republican Party). The main fight will be between the Neo-cons and Teabaggers. Since the Neo-cons have the corporations behind them they will win the fight and the moderates will do what the moderates always do and ask what direction the leadership wants them to march in.

  • 2 votes
#1.29 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:13 PM EDT

Duqu - Again I'll point out that many of the polls reference "likely voters", as in people likely to vote, not marginal participants at either margin of the political spectrum.

Sure, some of the coalition of college students, and minorities may not participate in the same numbers this November, but this is also true of the Tea Party, many of whose members have drifted away from political activism.

November is close, and I'll grant victory is not beyond reach for Romney, but it will take one heck of a performance in the upcoming round of debates. He won't be able to just bet Obama 10,000 dollars on the outcome, and bluff his way to victory.

  • 1 vote
#1.30 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:19 PM EDT

"In final public event before debate, Romney plays down expectations."

Impossible! My expectations for Citizen Romney couldn't possibly be any lower.

  • 2 votes
#1.31 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 4:46 PM EDT

My expectations of Romney were already ZERO.

Can you have negative expectations?

.

  • 2 votes
#1.32 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 5:33 PM EDT
Reply

I think the empty chair from the GOP convention has a better shot than Obuma of winning these debates.

  • 7 votes
#2 - Mon Oct 1, 2012 11:22 PM EDT

Obuma, Obummer, Odumbo, Obozo – don’t you think that these cute names for Obama are better received at your white supremacists group meetings than in an open forum?

  • 29 votes
#2.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:44 AM EDT

Be easy on them, Jim... it's all they got left.

  • 20 votes
#2.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 5:34 AM EDT

If you really believe that you obviously have NO grip on reality. But I guess you're one of those who think that because Obama is black he can't possible be more intelligent and better informed than lily white Romney.

  • 11 votes
#2.3 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 7:28 AM EDT

They say you can't fix stupid and people live Rev get on computer message boards and prove it.

  • 11 votes
#2.4 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:03 AM EDT

More to the point, it would be refreshing if both participants (Obama and Romney) would share their vision for the future with us in a honest and forthright manner.

Most of us have made up our minds, the debate isn't going to change that. We've know which candidate we would vote for since before the conventions.

It would be nice if our candidates (both) would take a firm stand and tell us what they would do with four (more) years in the White House. Petty bickering and one-liners will not help the country. We need substance.

I have never wavered in my support for the President. I know many of you are strong Romney supporters and that's fine. They have very different views of the role of government and the future of the United States. I'd like to hear those views expressed, honestly and without all the hot-button rhetoric.

Don't you think it's time we returned to some level of civility? I sure do.

Obama/Biden 2012

  • 18 votes
#2.5 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:21 AM EDT

Indeed, skip. But with all those "zingers" Mitt is rehearsing, doubt that will happen.

Do the debates matter like they used to with all the early voting? I don't know.

  • 9 votes
#2.6 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:30 AM EDT

Skip, President Obama tried civility...he tried reaching across the aisle, he tried getting Republicans on his cabinet...all to no avail because the Republicans were having none of it. No matter what he has tried to do in the last four years the Republicans have fought him every step of the way...they aren't concerned about the country, just power. It won't be enough to just vote in the President, we have to make sure that the Democrats also take back the House. We need to move forward not get mired in political BS...People think that America is going down the tubes and maybe they are right...they will be right if we cannot move forward and stop playing childish silly games.

  • 11 votes
#2.7 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:32 AM EDT

Look at the racist democrats having to pull race in to defend obama again. You all just can't face the fact that some of us don't like obama because he just sucks as a president. Hell, I didn't like bush his second term either, but that must make me racist too?

ignorant @!$%#s.

  • 4 votes
#2.8 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:58 AM EDT

Dawn and Equality,

Good morning folks, nice to chat with you. Dawn, I just watched Bill O'Rielley's interview with Barbie on Today (I miss Ann Curry) and he said the "zingers" coming from Mitt would look rehearsed. He didn't think they would work and I agree. The whole world knows he's been working on them. The only way a zinger works is if it's (at least appears) off the cuff.

Equality, first of all, a disclaimer. I am an atheist, but that doesn't mean I don't appreciate and admire the teachings of the Rabbi from Nazareth called Jesus. I don't believe he was divine, but I do believe his teachings have worth. Ok, that said, let's remember what Jesus said, "Turn the Other Cheek." Just because he was met with hostility by the GOP on the hill it doesn't mean he should'nt maintain his dignity and the dignity of the office. He's ahead, he's going to win, he is the President of the United States and the most powerful man on the planet. He should act like it with dignity, humility and rise above any attempts by his opponent to drag him down into the dirt.

If Romney wants to get all combative and hurl those manufactured and rehearsed one-liners at the President of the United States, I think he will come off the worse for it. Oh, his base will love it and that's who he has been courting all along because they still have doubts he's a real conservative. But if he doesn't have the GOP base vote by now, he's in trouble. He's got to court those undecided voters out there and being disrespectful to the President of the United States and combative will not win him any votes.

Romney's natural demeanor, as we've seen in past debates, is "courtly", it's dignified and I believe he will continue to be polite and professional. If not, he will lose.

If Romney doesn't win tomorrow nights debate here is what will happen. His funding will very quickly dry up. Big donors will begin redeploying their funds to local house and senate races in an attempt to hold the house and maybe take the senate. They will write off Romney and justifiably so.

That means the the President's lead in the the 9 battle ground states will go unchallenged and will probably grow. If so, Senator Schumer's prediction of a 52-48 Obama victory will be LOW and that will mean the President will have a coat-tail effect (Which I've been predicting for nearly a year) and those big GOP donors are going to be NEEDED in the congressional elections to hold on to what they have.

If Obama has a coat-tail effect the Senate is safe and the GOP control of the house becomes questionable. I doubt seriously that we'll take it back, but we could certainly reduce their numbers which would force them to start compromising and working WITH the folks on the other side of the aisle.

Say Buh-bye Grover.

So, that's my read. We can only wait and see how it turns out and I really think, at this point, it's ridiculous to get all hot and bothered about it. It is, what it is, and it will be, what it will be.

Obama/Biden 2012

  • 10 votes
#2.9 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 9:36 AM EDT

Apparently some people literally hate anyone who disagrees with them.

This is America, where our forefathers died for our right to express ourselves freely. We owe them something for that. There's a lot of value in learning to disagree without being disagreeable.

We fought a civil war in this country 150 years ago, and judging by some of the rude, ugly and inflammatory rhetoric, there are people who want another one.

If we have no peace, it is because we have forgotten that we belong to each
other. ~Mother Teresa

Good morning, skip!

Just because he was met with hostility by the GOP on the hill it doesn't mean he should'nt maintain his dignity and the dignity of the office. He's ahead, he's going to win, he is the President of the United States and the most powerful man on the planet. He should act like it with dignity, humility and rise above any attempts by his opponent to drag him down into the dirt.

Barack Obama is a man of great personal honor and integrity. I would expect no less of him than to maintain his dignity in any and all circumstances.

  • 9 votes
#2.10 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 9:53 AM EDT

Nicely said KB.

Obama/Biden 2012

  • 9 votes
#2.11 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 10:01 AM EDT

Equality -

Please tell me when Obama reached across the aisle to the republicans? The republicans were locked out of the health care 'debates'. The one time Obama invited republicans to come to the White House to discuss the already passed House bill, their comments were ignored as the democrats did not want to go through a true reconciliation process - they knew it would not survive as their own democrats had to be bought to even get the votes to pass it the first time.

The democrats very first comment to the republicans was that they had won and to get over it.

Face it, Obama has not reached across the aisle to the republicans except to tell them to sit in the back of the bus.

Oh, Obama doesn't even know how to reach down the aisle to his own democrats lately either.

  • 1 vote
#2.12 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 10:16 AM EDT

If Romney doesn't win tomorrow nights debate here is what will happen.

In all honesty, I'm expecting the first debate to be a draw. I think that even if Romney flubs badly, he'll have his minions shouting, "Romney won!"

The real test will be how ugly the rhetoric about Obama will get as GOP supporters see it all slipping away for their side.

However, I agree there will be financial consequences to his campaign for a poor Romney performance.

Everything is riding on this debate for you, Mittens. Sleep well tonight, no worries... :)

  • 5 votes
#2.13 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 10:18 AM EDT

Barack Obama is a man of great personal honor and integrity. I would expect no less of him than to maintain his dignity in any and all circumstances.

"Elections have consequences, and I won." That doesn't sound like dignity or honor, it sounds like schoolyard gloating. The only thing worse than a sore loser is a poor winner.

Apparently some people literally hate anyone who disagrees with them.

And we see it here every day.

    #2.14 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 11:10 AM EDT

    @AlexM-2364525

    Let me guess you are a white male.

    Well I'm Black and know a dictionary full of code words that say I hate you MF N-word.

    And you just said it. Stupid. Go home clown.

    That's right FUX UP NOISE don't have a comment section.

    STUPID = GNOP

    • 1 vote
    #2.15 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 11:29 AM EDT

    A hint to racist posters - first, start alll your posts, "I'm not a racist, but...." THen you can trot out whatever tired racial sterotypes you want and mo one willl suspect you're tainted with the racist taint.

    • 1 vote
    #2.16 - Wed Oct 3, 2012 6:21 AM EDT
    Reply

    Mitt (dog-on-the-car-roof) Romney has to deflate expectations since his man, Gov. Chris Cristie, inflated them on "Meet the Press" this Sunday. President Obama has been doing the same thing. It's the nature of the beast.

    Either way, I expect Willard to sling some well rehearsed one-liners, while President Obama outshines him with ACTUAL KNOWLEDGE about the Federal Government. To expect GREAT THINGS to come from such a prepackaged and marginalized event is certainly One Foolish Idea.

    • 19 votes
    #3 - Mon Oct 1, 2012 11:24 PM EDT

    As opposed to Barry (dog-on-my-plate) Obama, right? Obama in his "commercials" have been slinging the one liners just as much... And you have to give credit to the American dream...if a community organizer can become president, anyone can!

    • 5 votes
    #3.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:08 AM EDT

    The President was a SENATOR and a Professor JK .... and he understands the American Dream as he's lived it.

    Obama/Biden 2012

    • 24 votes
    #3.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:18 AM EDT

    And Mitt Romney is a successful businessman, so what's your point?

    • 6 votes
    #3.3 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:20 AM EDT

    JK1963 ...

    Define success.... he's certainly not bragging about his successes. Nor should he. VULTURE (Bain), handouts (Olympics), and a sagging job-losing economy as a one-term governor (MA). And he so relates to the average American. What's that??? Oh yes, he created Romneycare states that he's the grandfather of Obamacare, and then wants to repeal it on day one.

    Your candidate is a HOOT!

    Obama/Biden 2012

    • 25 votes
    #3.4 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:29 AM EDT

    Layton,

    How Obama's "shovel-ready" jobs going? And how did that cost us again?

    Your candidate spends OUR money like a drunken navy!!

    • 7 votes
    #3.5 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:42 AM EDT

    JK1963 ...

    The President spends "our" money like a drunken navy? Last I heard he put the UNFUNDED wars that your boy wanted (remember WMD) on the books .... the shovel ready jobs were just that.... ask your boy, Ryan about how those went in his State and whether or not he took advantage of the stimulus.

    The DOW is up, the housing market is improving, and private sector jobs are growing. We're operating with a slow and steady increase rather than a sliding decline. This country is on the road to recovery and we will get there. We do not need "Shoot and Aim Second" nor more "Doubling down on Trickle Down."

    Romney has $$$ why hasn't he invested in this country to promote job growth? He had the benefit of tax cuts for businesses. What have your beloved Koch's and Adelson done to assist the working class other than benefit those in the media world by paying for a lot of ads???? It's not working for you now but you think with your figurehead Ken doll in office, it's going to magically make sense?

    Get real.

    Obama/Biden 2012

    • 19 votes
    #3.6 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:54 AM EDT

    WMD?? You mean like all those Democrats that believed they existed even before Bush came into office? Or perhaps you forgot about the Kurds that were gassed by Saddam?

    So you want to tell me how the DOW helps (which by the way Obama has as much as effect on as he does on the price of a gallon of gas) the still MILLIONS of unemployed people?? You mind telling me how many more are on government assistance now than four years ago? You mind telling me if Obama is doing such a great job, why is running only negative ads funded by your boy Soros? Why isn't he running on his accomplishments? Where is that unemployment that is under 8%? Yeah...we all bought into that hope and change thing...too bad we see no hope and still very little change in our pockets...

    • 5 votes
    #3.7 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:18 AM EDT

    JK1963 . . .

    So you want to tell me how the DOW helps

    Fairly apparent that you don't have a 401(k) or any kind of savings. That is how the DOW "helps." The DOW is affected by the President and the global economy. Difficult word for your side ... TRUST!

    And truthfully, the President's ads running on the 47% comment of Mitt's are doing a mighty fine job without saying a word other than those that spewed out of Romney's mouth.

    The President IS running on his accomplishments. He has pulled this country out of a HUGE Republican abyss. Hope and change, you're right, we thought we'd have it. Unfortunately all you TEASTINKERS in the Congress and Senate thought it was about them. They never ever understood it was about this COUNTRY. Go align yourself with all of that big pack of garbage. They've done more damage than good and still continue to spiel their hateful sh!t.

    FORWARD ... which is where this country is going. BACKWARD would be with your trickle down economics.

    Obama/Biden 2012

    • 19 votes
    #3.8 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:26 AM EDT

    Really?? Accomplishments?? Like continuing the oppressive Patriot Act?? You mean like that, right?

    And like the Democrats that ramrodded the biggest boondoggle in history with Obamacare, right?

    Vote Romney!

    The Mormon vs. The Moron

    • 5 votes
    #3.9 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:05 AM EDT
    Comment author avatarelliot-3020456Expand Comment Comment collapsed by the community

    Layton, stop lying about the cost of the wars. You are absolutely pathetic to keep repeating this lie.

    The cost of the wars were not budgeted but they were added to the debt as the money was spent.

    For you to imply that once that weasel 0bama got into office he just "put it on the books" is total BS.

    How much does Axlerod pay you 0bama leg humpers to come here and spout constant lies?

    • 10 votes
    #3.10 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:06 AM EDT

    Wow elliot, how mature of you! Pathetic.

    • 13 votes
    #3.11 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 7:48 AM EDT

    "And Mitt Romney is a successful businessman,"

    It's a whole lot easier to be a "successful businessman' when daddy gives you a milti-million dollar head start.

    • 12 votes
    #3.12 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:05 AM EDT

    Hey, Layton? When I lived down in Texas, there was an expression I liked a lot: "Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time, and annoys the pig."

    When it comes to, um, individuals like JK1963 and Elliot, know that you're up against the kind of blind, insensate hatred that's utterly impervious to logic, evidence, and facts. They're so wound up with rage against the Obama of their twisted imaginings that they'll never see the Obama who's actually our President.

    If President Obama had managed, in his first term, to accomplish 2% unemployment, free ice cream for life, and abolishing Monday, they'd find ways to be against all of those things.

    For what it's worth, regarding Mitt Romney's supposed business acumen: Anybody who starts out life with a $60,000,000 bankroll would have to be tremendously stupid not to make money with it. I think a much fairer way to judge his managerial skill would be by his single term as Governor of Massachusetts (low job growth and a huge multiplication of "fees") or by his stewardship of the Salt Lake City Olympics (give me a few billion in other people's money- federal tax dollars- and I'll give you a successful Olympiad in Fresno, ferGawsakes.)

    • 13 votes
    #3.13 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:40 AM EDT

    Fox,

    Hatred? Well...anytime that we people use class warfare against each other that would be great example of hatred, don't you think?

    Perhaps you would like to post a link to your "supposed" fact that Romney had that kind of personal wealth when he started? And let's look at leadership shall we? How about a congressmen that didn't even finish one term before he decided that we all needed hope and change? How about a candidate that the country felt "compelled" to vote for because of his skin color? (remember...Hilary was a MUCH better candidate). Are we talking about those kind of qualifications?

    Vote Romney!

    • 1 vote
    #3.14 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 9:57 AM EDT

    Mikeo76

    Wow elliot, how mature of you! Pathetic.

    We have to give the RWNJ's a little slack. They're feeling anxious and irritable right now because their candidate looks less presidential than a Halloween scarecrow.

    After President Obama wins re-election, we'll need everyone rowing the boat in the same direction in America.

    • 6 votes
    #3.15 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 10:08 AM EDT

    If President Obama had managed, in his first term, to accomplish 2% unemployment, free ice cream for life, and abolishing Monday, they'd find ways to be against all of those things.

    But he didn't. Heck he hasn't even tried. He wanted to create a $600 billion infrastructure bank but didn't follow through with it. How many jobs would that have generated? What happened to it? What would UE numbers be if it were even started in 2010?

    But I don't begrudge the president for not being 100% perfect on every little thing, that's what he has advisors for. So how are his advisors doing and why hasn't he fired them already for their collective lack of performance?

      #3.16 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 11:21 AM EDT

      elliot your clueless. conservative rant about the national debt. it's pathetic.

      www.offthechartsblog.org/what%E2%80%99s-driving-projected-debt/

      • 1 vote
      #3.17 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 11:30 AM EDT

      @JK1963

      President Obama has created more jobs in 3.5 years than bush did in 8 years and that's a FACT

      I know you don't like facts, yeah yeah I Know.

      GOP = STUPID

      • 2 votes
      #3.18 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 11:41 AM EDT

      President Obama has created more jobs in 3.5 years than bush did in 8 years and that's a FACT

      What are you using as a source for this alleged FACT? And are you using net jobs? Or actual jobs?

        #3.19 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:09 PM EDT

        Fox ...

        Hey, Layton? When I lived down in Texas, there was an expression I liked a lot: "Never try to teach a pig to sing. It wastes your time, and annoys the pig."

        Loved it! I gave up on JK last night and fortunately have had elliot on ignore since I read one of his Briebart epistles a LONG time ago!

        Fun evening!

        Obama/Biden 2012

        • 2 votes
        #3.20 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:25 PM EDT

        Created?? It's funny how the liberals use that word...not hardly "created", as if they didn't exist before...

        Layton,

        You are good for a laugh... I would wager that its tough for you to walk and chew gum at the same time...

          #3.21 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:42 PM EDT

          JK1963 - you are just another poster who resorts to personal insults to the poster rather than the post. Coming from you, any insult to me is nothing short of a compliment.

          Obama/Biden 2012

          • 1 vote
          #3.22 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:32 PM EDT

          Layton,

          You are the one that started this juvenile discussion like some middle school child... But's its all cool, since you are worth a small laugh, but now you are just boring and predictable...

          Vote Romney!

          The Mormon vs. The Moron

            #3.23 - Wed Oct 3, 2012 12:15 AM EDT
            Reply

            Hey Foolish Idea. Are you clueless? You have to be a complete tool to think that Obama has done anything. 8% unemployment is the bar for geniuses like you? Glad to see you're enjoying your food stamps. Great coverup for the sodomizing, murder and dragging of an American ambassador so his fundraiser in Vegas isn't messed with. Why meet an Israeli PM when you can be pampered on the View. Are all Americans as bright as you? If so, no wonder your dollar has depreciated over 30% since Obama took office. (I'd explain it to you but I doubt you'd be able to comprehend the truth).

            • 5 votes
            Reply#4 - Mon Oct 1, 2012 11:38 PM EDT

            Better be careful there Jonathan. If elected Romney just might include you in the 47% of Americans to forget, even if you happen to have a job.

            • 11 votes
            #4.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:01 AM EDT

            Jonathan, at least we still have a currency no thanks to the Party of No and W.

            Obama 2012

            • 14 votes
            #4.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:02 AM EDT

            Insults from the right that is all they are capable of since they don't bother to verify real facts and just spew nothing but talking points.

            • 13 votes
            #4.3 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:13 AM EDT

            Jonathan Collins - The 8% is a fake number that all the talking heads have fostered - however this depression does not conform to that number - why - because it is antiquated and does not represent reality

            This is a different era - we have not experienced this sort of melt down of the banks - nor any other exposure of what we can do - and we did not have the tools of 1930 - but we have now

            So stuff your 8% it's bogus in the scheme of things

            • 9 votes
            #4.4 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 3:44 AM EDT

            OHhh, Johnathan...

            So you'd rather be a tool for the GREEDY SUPER RICH, the folk who WRECKED the world economy, than work FORWARD toward a better tomorrow for your children AND grandchildren? The "flush with cash" TOP 1% is doing quite well with the booming Dow and NASDAQ but there is little joy on Main Street, with the exception of those who hold a healthy 401k.

            President Obama is working for more HAPPY DAYS on Main Street AS WELL as Wall Street. To expect GREAT THINGS from the Party of H*LL NO is certainly One Foolish Idea! The American voter paid to save the "TOO BIG TO FAIL" BANKS while still spending money to assist Mom & Pop on MAIN STREET. I suppose you don't care about them, either?

            Vote OBAMA/BIDEN 2012 and ANY non GOP candidates down the ballot. POTUS deserves a second term with a CHASTISED minority party who work WITH him and not AGAINST EVERYTHING!

            • 14 votes
            #4.5 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 5:12 AM EDT

            Why is it that Republicans have such short memories and can only remember what not happening NOW and which party voted NO each time a jobs bill came up in Congress? Who was that previous president when the country almost went bankrupt from 2 unfunded wars and the unfunded "no child left behind" and the unfunded expansion of drug coverage and the unfunded tax cuts to the wealthy???....................must have been a Democrat because we would NEVER have a Republican do ANY of those kinds of things.......right? errrr but I guess the previous Democrat did leave a surplus in the budget so what happened to that????

            So lets all vote for Romney and have 4 more years of those good times we can quickly forget about in the future

            • 6 votes
            #4.6 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 7:41 AM EDT

            "You have to be a complete tool to think that Obama has done anything."

            Or perhaps you have been living on Mars since 2009 and haven't noticed the changes.

            Job losses per month in January 2008: 800,000

            Job gains last month: 97,000

            30 straight months of private sector job growth

            GDP growth in 2008: negative 6%

            GDP growth last year 2.9%

            Dow Jones Average in January 2008: Under 8000

            Dow Jones Average today: 13,400+

            Record domestic oil production

            GM – all time record profits

            Near record corporate profits across the board

            Osama Bin Laden --- dead

            Iraq war --- over

            • 8 votes
            #4.7 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:09 AM EDT

            NC -

            Have you 'forgotten' that the biggest stopper in Congress is Harry Reid?

            The mandatory budgets do not even get introduced to the floor of the Senate for debate as Reid sets the calendar! Every piece of republican-sponsored legislation is stopped on Reid's desk, and you refuse to see that.

            Are you so blinded by your adoration og Obama that you can't see the truth?

            • 1 vote
            #4.8 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 10:20 AM EDT

            My name is FUX UP NOISE & Mittwitt: I will call President Obama every name in the book since I don't know you the American public is NOT BUYING the Tax Cut for the Rich routine. DAM Internet it has made them smarter. Sh!t let's have them not vote so more of our people vote. Sh!t again the judge in PA threw out our bogus Voter ID Claim. Dam it again we just got caught hiring a firm who was committing real voter fraud for us. Let's fire them and cancel voter registration in KEY swing states. Dam it again we lost the election. What they say about us must be true: GOP = Stupid.

            • 2 votes
            #4.9 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 11:49 AM EDT
            Reply

            Poor little Rombot ...

            Romney said he was "delighted" about the chance to debate President Obama three times in the next month and declared that the debates, taken in sum, would "be conversation with the American people that will span almost an entire month."

            Of course you're still trying to look for a way to connect with this country. You've been campaigning for 5 (FIVE!) years and still haven't figured out a way to make the people you want to represent think that you care about them. Chris Christie has your number and we're all waiting for Mitt version .... 1000 to come out on Thursday morning ...

            Obama/Biden 2012

            • 11 votes
            Reply#5 - Mon Oct 1, 2012 11:59 PM EDT

            A Crown for you and a Jack for me, clink, gulp, ahhhhhh.

            Obama 2012

            • 6 votes
            #5.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:03 AM EDT

            Thank you skyparrot! ahhhhhhhh is right!

            Obama/Biden 2012

            • 8 votes
            #5.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:19 AM EDT
            Reply

            Debate eve jitters for Romney, knows it will be a no win for him and the thugs backing him. He's over loaded with all his spineless flipping and it will show. Any real specifics on any of his plans? He'll have to put up or shut up, zingers aren't going to cut it. show time folks, Wednesday the 3rd, stay tuned.

            Obama 2012

            • 10 votes
            Reply#6 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:01 AM EDT

            If Romeny doesn't show a little sign of intelligence on Wednesday night, come Thursday he may find himself even futher behind Obama than he is now.

            • 13 votes
            #6.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:03 AM EDT

            But David, Chris Christie promised a new campaign on Thursday morning! :) I want to see the new "Sketch!"

            Obama/Biden 2012

            • 11 votes
            #6.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:21 AM EDT

            Romney hired a lady to teach him how to walk and talk like a human. We will see Wednesday night if she has been successful.

            • 5 votes
            #6.3 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:50 AM EDT

            Romney tried to intimidate by having his people say he'll cream the President in the debate. Now, a day before, he's trying to lower expectations because he knows that he needs an absolute home run to counter his dwindling numbers. Even the Hedge Fund and investment managers are betting against him, and they're the ones who advise their clients whom to back. Unless he comes out with SPECIFIC plans for the economy and foreign policy that are believable and doable he's finished. With his record with dogs he won't even find a position as dog catcher. Now it's time to start concentrating on Congress. That majority of Obstructionist Republicans has to be broken so our president is able to do what's necessary to fix our nation.

            • 3 votes
            #6.4 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 10:14 AM EDT
            Reply

            Hey Collins. Are you clueless? First, the recession just ended was just shy of being a Depression and you complain about an 8% unemployment rate? Moron. Yeah, am sure Pubs would have spun the Libya incident regardless of whether the video caused it or terrorists caused it. Who the hell cares who caused it? It happened. I guess Mitt's solution would have been to have security forces fire on all these protesters and have them kill every single sole in the embassy, right? Moron. Hey, I ran $1.00 in 2009 through an inflation calculator through 2012. So what cost $1.00 in 2009 would cost $1.07 in 2012. That's 6.5% depreciation of the dollar in 4 years, not 30%. Moron.

            Get back to listening to Beck and Limbaugh for all your facts. Moron. Other than the top 10-20%, the balance of you Pubs are complete and utter imbeciles.

            • 13 votes
            Reply#7 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:03 AM EDT

            Robin - this is the slowest recovery since the great depression. Give Obama another term and we will be beginning to compete with the great depression. I've read articles already where investors are preparing for Obama to win. It wasn't about spending more and creating jobs, it was about hunkering down for more expensive regulations to survive them.

            • 4 votes
            #7.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:11 AM EDT

            I've ready plenty of articles over nearly the prior 4 years where both the Republicans and business were preparing for Obama to lose. This downfall of this country has clearly been engineered by the Republicans and big business so they can take complete control, dismantle protections currently afforded its citizens, and pillage to fill the coffers of foreign banks with whom they invest their American dollars.

            Regarding growth, suggest you consider that GDP was down 14.6% in 2009. That was a result of the prior administration, not Obama. Since then, GDP has been up every single quarter, although growth has slowed. It hasn't stopped. Is this unique to the U.S., check on the GDP worldwide. This is a worldwide problem, not an Obama problem. This is a rich (who manufactured this entire mess) versus middle class and poor problem.

            • 11 votes
            #7.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:27 AM EDT

            this is the slowest recovery since the great depression.

            After 4 years in office, FDR had gotten unemployment down under 18%. It took a long time to fix that republican economic disaster and it will take a long time to fix this one. Bush's wars and tax cuts are still adding to the national debt.

            • 8 votes
            #7.3 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:53 AM EDT

            Robin-hood you neeed to stay away from that Obama crack. It's clear your math is from your welfare education.

            I am sure you didn't get the news but it wasn't a movie dumb asx it was a terrorist attacked under Obama..

            Obama promotes hate , race, war on women and calss warfare so it's no suprise.

            America has already kick Obama to the curb. Just waiting for Nov. 6, 2012.

            • 6 votes
            #7.4 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:17 AM EDT

            Unemployment 15% to0 21 % Turds.

            It's all on Obama and he will be gone on Nov. 6, 2012.

            • 7 votes
            #7.5 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:18 AM EDT

            It's hard to understand why the right wing lunatic fringe would vote against their own interests and support such an obvious liar and cheat as Romney. Still, when you read this page from the Republican's play book, it becomes clearer:

            "All propaganda must be so popular and on such an intellectual level that even the most stupid of those to whom it was directed can understand it...through clever and constant application of propaganda, people can be made to see paradise as hell and the other way around, to consider the most wretched sort of life as paradise." -Adolph Hitler

            This would explain how the right wing lunatic fringe have been made to swallow the hateful policies of the GOP/TP even when they are against their best interests.

            • 7 votes
            #7.6 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:39 AM EDT
            • Sailcat - When have you ever not seen the Republicans not try and take down a Democrat President ?

            Not in my lifetime - heard tweetie - ask today - why? - Simple - Power - Money

            The Republican Party has always been owned by Corporate - love the term "Right to Work" alias right to get minimum wage maybe catchy phrase - ?

            • 7 votes
            #7.7 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 3:54 AM EDT

            Robin - this is the slowest recovery since the great depression.

            What you fails to say is Bush and his Republicans gave us the worse economy since the great depression and Romney wants MORE of the Bush policies. electing Romney to fix this economy would be like smoking to cure lung cancer. The reality is no president since Kennedy had the keys to the White House turned over to him from the former president with the nation in BETTER shape than did George W. Bush and no president since FDR had the keys to the White House turned over to him from the former president with the nation in WORSE than did President Obama. It will take this nation a generation or longer to dig ourselves out of the economic disaster caused by George W. Bush and his Republican controlled Congress.

            • 5 votes
            #7.8 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:12 AM EDT

            Here is the Republicans “contribution” to the recovery… and this is just since the Midterms.

            45 bills on Abortion
            99 on Religion
            71 on Family Relationships
            36 on Marriage,
            446 on “Govt. Investigations”
            68 on firearm/Gun Control
            372 Filibusters
            Declared Pizza a “Fruit”
            Banned human fetus’s from food (whatever that means???)
            Re-confirmed the UNCHALLENGED national Motto, and…

            ZERO bills on jobs creation

            • 7 votes
            #7.9 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:47 AM EDT

            @Charlie-1915998

            Dam Charlie the GOP record is devesating.

            Let's Vote All those MF"S OUT OF OFFICE because GNOP = Stupid

            President Obama 2012

            • 2 votes
            #7.10 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 11:56 AM EDT

            I've ready plenty of articles over nearly the prior 4 years where both the Republicans and business were preparing for Obama to lose.

            I've read plenty of articles detailing the mothership coming with an invasion force ready to take over the earth. Doesn't make them true.

            Regarding growth, suggest you consider that GDP was down 14.6% in 2009.

            I shouldn't assume that you understand, but Congress had a lot to do with that GDP being down. Remember Dodd and Frank, Pelosi and Reid? The dems had control in 2007 when this mess reared its head.

              #7.11 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 3:46 PM EDT

              The difference, Chef, is that I read reputable articles from reputable news organizations, whether with a liberal or conservative slant. You obviously get your news from comic books or Beck/Limbaugh/Hannity if you are reading about motherships.

              GDP was down because of Pub policies 2001-2009 that allowed corporate America and lobbyists to rape and pillage this country. Nothing more, nothing less.

              You might be a chef, but me thinks you might be cooking some hallucinogenics.

                #7.12 - Wed Oct 3, 2012 10:32 AM EDT
                Reply

                Electoral College - 270 NEED TO WIN.

                Real Clear Politics - Obama 269 Romney 191

                • 6 votes
                Reply#8 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:07 AM EDT

                Larry - nc - Wrong Obama 316 Romney 181

                • 6 votes
                #8.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 3:57 AM EDT

                Kick it up to 278 --- Colorado is going for President Obama.

                • 3 votes
                #8.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:14 AM EDT
                Reply

                The heck with "expectations", the questions asked should be tough ones. I think the most embarrassing statements by each of the candidates need to be addressed by them in these debates.

                In Romney's case, he has to explain exactly what he meant when he said "There are 47 percent of the people who will vote for the president no matter what. ... "There are 47 percent who are with him, who are dependent upon government, who believe that they are victims, who believe that government has a responsibility to care for them, who believe that they are entitled to health care, to food, to housing, to you name it."

                In Obama's case, he has to explain exactly what he meant in this exchange with Russia's President:

                Obama: On all these issues, but particularly missile defense, this, this can be solved but it's important for him to give me space.
                Medvedev: Yeah, I understand. I understand your message about space. Space for you...
                Obama: This is my last election…After my election I have more flexibility.
                Medvedev: I understand. I will transmit this information to Vladimir.

                • 6 votes
                Reply#9 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:28 AM EDT

                Mitt Romney is an excellent debater with a commanding knowledge of every situation and glistening stage presence. If he does not completely dominate the debates then it will be a devestating loss for him and all Republicans. Come on, Mitt! You can do it!

                • 5 votes
                Reply#10 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:33 AM EDT

                lakerman ...

                every situation and glistening stage presence

                GLISTENING stage presence????? OMH!!! You owe me a monitor! FUNNIEST thing I've read all night! Get those pom poms out and root root root for your home team!

                Obama/Biden 2012

                • 9 votes
                #10.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:03 AM EDT

                Layton: But it's true! So what if Mitt has to lie and twist the truth. So what if Ryan wants to throw old people and veterans out into the street. So what if together they stand for greed, lies and, well ... more lies. By golly he looks good! And that should be enough.

                • 4 votes
                #10.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:07 AM EDT
                • Layton --- Romney may have been an "excellent debater" in Republican primary debates when he was up against the likes of Rick Perry, Michelle Bachmann and Pizza Man, but he's in the big leagues now and I doubt the can hit the pitching.
                • 6 votes
                #10.3 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:19 AM EDT

                Dreamer...Snooze on!!!

                  #10.4 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:31 AM EDT
                  Reply

                  Rom;nuts reboot 9.0: Rom;nuts 1.0 = vulture Capitalist devouring the manufacturing sector of our Nation for his own benefit. Rom;nuts 2.0 = tax and spend Liberal from Massachusetts. Rom;nuts 3.0 = Big Government liaison for the U.S. Olympic Committee. Rom;nuts 4.0 = moderate Conservative . Rom;nuts 5.0 = severe conservative. Rom;nuts 6.0=business man. Rom;nuts 7.0 = war monger. Rom;nuts 8.0 = disdainful rich guy who talks bad about normal people behind our backs. Rom;nuts 9.0 = man of the people?

                  • 1 vote
                  Reply#11 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:44 AM EDT

                  rom;nuts will try to tact to the Center because that is his only chance. President Clinton, the Big Dog, clearly and very dominantly staked out the political Center for President Obama and now President Obama must block rom;nuts from trying to move to the Center. Rom;nuts hasn't helped himself by showing his utter disdain for 47% of the people and by appointing the little boy who never learned his lesson about not crying wolf.

                  • 4 votes
                  Reply#12 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:49 AM EDT

                  I wonder how many times Obama will have the buzzer go off.

                  • 5 votes
                  Reply#13 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:17 AM EDT

                  I don't think it's your year, Brent. Your candidate is weak and the Republican Party itself is imploding with all of the voter suppression scandals.

                  • 6 votes
                  #13.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:57 AM EDT

                  He'll think it's the lunch bell.

                  • 1 vote
                  #13.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:23 AM EDT

                  lucky,

                  If your post was aimed at me, I still have you on Ignore so you're wasting your time.

                  Oh....you do that anyway simply by taking another breath.

                  • 2 votes
                  #13.3 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:46 AM EDT

                  BrentZ At least Obama will not have to be wired like Bush Jr - never noticed the hump on his left shoulder - not to quick are you?

                  • 5 votes
                  #13.4 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 4:01 AM EDT

                  LUCKY .... romney (out to lunch bell) will hear the bell as he picks himself off the floor with 2 feet in his mouth ... round 1 to Obama !!!!!!

                  OBAMA 2012

                    #13.5 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:34 PM EDT
                    Reply

                    Romney may be downplaying expectations, but Christie made very clear Sunday these debates are do-or-die.

                    And frankly, Chris Christie has a hell of a lot more credibility than Mitt Romney.

                    • 1 vote
                    Reply#14 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:41 AM EDT

                    It's also in Christie's best interest for Romney to lose, as Christie has his eye on a run against Hillary in 2016.

                    Any time that Christie speaks on behalf of Romney, he speaks on behalf of himself.

                    • 1 vote
                    #14.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:56 AM EDT

                    The American Public deserves a serious debate and Mittwitt is going to say zinggers all night. Slapping the American people in the fact and say see I can call the President names and insult him to his face.

                    As if the American people should vote for someone based on that alone. Incredible Incredible.

                    President Obama 2012

                      #14.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:11 PM EDT
                      Reply

                      Yeah, Mittens, it's about the 1% you believe are worth governing, isn't it? The rest of the country can just borrow from their parents, can't they? Except for the 47%, who are a real drag on the 1%, right? But that's easy to deal with, since you've already said your "job" is to ignore them. What an inclusive sort of guy you are! That attitude, and your bullying behavior when you were younger, is exactly what people resent about the 1%.

                      • 3 votes
                      Reply#15 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 1:58 AM EDT

                      Obama -No teleprompter= done.

                      • 4 votes
                      Reply#16 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:02 AM EDT

                      Seriously? Is that all you've got, the almost 4 year old teleprompter saw? Pathetic.

                      • 3 votes
                      #16.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:00 AM EDT

                      Not only PATHETIC it's Stupid. GNOP = STUPID.

                        #16.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:13 PM EDT
                        Reply

                        I wonder how long it will take Obama to start talking about his slave roots and race. It's all he has.

                        • 4 votes
                        Reply#17 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:04 AM EDT

                        Obama's father was African and his mother a caucasian from Kansas, I don't think he has any slave roots.

                          #17.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 11:28 AM EDT
                          Reply

                          A few Facts about Obama before the debates that America should know:

                          Obama the former Drug user.
                          Obama who never had a job
                          Obama who never created a job
                          Obama who never had a business
                          Obama who Lies about where he is from.
                          Obama who Paid 4 million to hide his records.
                          Obama who has made his money stealing from the American Tax Payers.

                          Obama who has stole billions from the gone green fraud.

                          Obama who Hates America and Americans.

                          Obama who has added 6 trillion more to the deficit in just 3 years. After today add another 1.2 trillion.

                          Obama who doubled welfare in 3 years

                          Obama who is responsible for highest poverty level since 1960’sObama who
                          will increase to 500 billion in new taxes.

                          Obama who has sent 79 percent of the 2.2 billion dollar stimulus to out sourced jobs

                          Obama's War on Women

                          Obama who has put 28 million people out of work in less than 3 years.

                          Obama the Racist.

                          Obama the liar.

                          Obama who is the biggest threat to America we have ever had.

                          Obama who makes America hated around the world.

                          Obama who was preached to for 20 years to hate America.

                          Obama who promotes a race war.

                          Obama who promotes class warfare.

                          Obama who does not respect America

                          Obama who does not respect Americans

                          Obama who Got a free ride thru life off the America Tax Payers.

                          Obama who wants another 4 years to run American further into the ground with no
                          jobs, no homes and no future.

                          The choice is easy in Nov. 6, 2012. Romney/Ryan will get America back in
                          the right direction, by cutting taxes, creating jobs and cleaning out the lying
                          fraud in the WH.

                          • 6 votes
                          Reply#18 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:10 AM EDT

                          Obama's goal is to ruin America and live a celebrity life on the tax payers money.

                          The Obama family’s cost to the American taxpayers at $1.4 billion. The figure takes into account non-official staffing, housing, travel, entertainment, and paying for Obama’s re-election.

                          • 3 votes
                          #18.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 7:39 AM EDT

                          I don't mind the people who have legitimate disagreement with the policies of ANY President. I DO mind people like USA and lucky, who post nonsense without attribution, and make it clear that they simply HATE this President and his family for one reason.

                          And rational people know what that reason is. You both ought to be embarrassed, but that require insight, which you lack.

                          • 8 votes
                          #18.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 7:50 AM EDT

                          Facts?

                          If those rants are "facts", then back them up please.

                          What you posted was utter nonsensical uber right wing talking points. There's not a sliver of a "fact" in any of it.

                          • 6 votes
                          #18.3 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:03 AM EDT

                          "I DO mind people like USA and lucky, who post nonsense without attribution"

                          As my father used to say -- don't waste any time arguing with a crazy man. People like lucky simply run their yaps like the well trained parrots they are.

                          • 5 votes
                          #18.4 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:23 AM EDT

                          Good reminder, Charlie, thanks! : )

                          • 2 votes
                          #18.5 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:31 AM EDT

                          Thanks for the Great Post Lucky. Obama is the worst President we have ever had. He was by ne means delt a "rough hand", as proclaims. Bush signed TARP into law cleaning up Clinton de-regulation of the banks and the criminal neglect of Barney Frank and Chris Dodd. Bush also placed the first Bal-Out funds of $13 Billion into a working escrow account.

                          Oh, we get the Liberal mantra "we were bleeding 750,000 a month". Well no, it was one month, December 2008. And it was 720,000. Now we have 23 Million out of work. Geez, I'll take the 720,000 at this point.

                          Obama even had control of the congress, and even a $867,000 Billion stimulus filled with his "Tickle up" policies where he promised us a %5.5 unemployment, a green economy with five million jobs, and a cut in the deficit by half. What did we get? A measly $1 trillion added to the GDP in four years. That will barely cover the stimulus, it will not cover the deficit.

                          Obama Trickle up policies have translated to a huge failure and losses.

                          • 23 million Americans are out of work, have stopped looking for work, or are underemployed
                          • $16 trillion national debt (that's $50,000 for every American)
                          • 43 straight months of 8% or higher unemployment
                          • 4 straight trillion dollar budget deficits in a row -- more than any other president combined

                          More trickle up failues:

                          18.9% unemployment for Blacks
                          9.1% for woman,
                          685,000 woman lost their job and health insurance(who cares about FREE birth control when you do not have health insurance)
                          The poverty rate for woman has gone up to 14.2% from 7.6%
                          We have 6 million fewer jobs than 3.5 years ago
                          3.6 million Residential foreclosures
                          2.6 million Commercial foreclosures
                          Over 3.8 million business have gone out of business
                          38,000 US products moved offshore for manufacturing
                          The lowest number of patents in 35 years
                          The highest number of people receiving food stamps in 30 years
                          A 26% decrease in the value of the dollar
                          The fewest new prescription drugs in 25 years, 308 prescription drugs in short supply (as of 6/1/11)
                          Housing values drop 33%

                          It gets worse:

                          FOOD STAMPS
                          Obama – 46.2 million : Before Obama – 28.2 million

                          CREDIT RATING
                          Before Obama AAA - Obama AA+

                          GAS PRICES
                          Before Obama - $1.65 a gallon (End of term) : Obama - $3.80 a gallon (Current)
                          (Source: )

                          UNEMPLOYMENT
                          Bush - 4.71% (Average) : Obama - 9.4% (Average) – 8.1% Current
                          ( Source: www.bls.gov )

                          NATIONAL DEBT
                          Bush – Increased 4 trillion (8 Years) : Obama – Will increase 18 trillion (8 years, according to OBAMAS budget)
                          (Source: www.treasurydirect.gov )

                          DEFICIT
                          Bush - $0.5 Trillion per year : Obama - $1.8 Trillion per year
                          (Source: www.federalbudget.com)

                          JOBS
                          Bush – GAINED 3 million jobs over 8 years : Obama - LOST 6 MILLION JOBS IN 3 YEARS

                          INFLATION:
                          Bush +0.1% (End of Term) : Obama +3.6% (Current)
                          (Source: www.usinflationcalculator.com )

                          This is called failure. Shall we look at his foreign policy now? In light of current events, do we really need to go there.

                          • 2 votes
                          #18.6 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 9:35 AM EDT

                          You stated no creditable source of your imformation, which mean you are discredited

                            #18.7 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:22 PM EDT
                            Reply

                            America has the choice to move forward with a proven winner (Romney) or stay in the
                            destruction of the economy and jobs with a President that Hates America & Americans.

                            The decision is easy on Nov. 6, 2012.

                            Romney/Ryan. America's future.

                            • 5 votes
                            Reply#19 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:20 AM EDT

                            This one's for you lucky ---

                            All you teatards, birthers, flat earthers, religious fanatics, mindless dittoheads, evolution deniers, Fox noise cultist, conspiracy theorist, gun crazies and all around 15th century Republicans --- you better get used to President Obama because he's not leaving office until January 2017. Mitt Romney is one of the most worthless candidates in the history of this nation with no ideas to fix anything other than the failed policies of the past. Talking about In God We Trust on money, birth control, birth certificates, teleprompters, college transcripts and wars on religion while writing off 45% of the population and yelling socialist and Marxist over and over doesn’t attract many voters. And if you don’t come up with some new ideas and find an entirely new group of leaders, we just may have another President Clinton in 2017.

                            • 5 votes
                            #19.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:25 AM EDT
                            Reply

                            What Obama has done to this country is not by accident. You can't do this much damage to a Country
                            in only 3 years without American People seeing It is by design. This is Obama
                            plan for America.. Do all the damage he can.

                            Romney/Ryan on Nov. 6, 2012.

                            • 5 votes
                            Reply#20 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:22 AM EDT

                            Are you F-N Nuts?

                            Yes!

                              #20.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:24 PM EDT

                              President Obama 2012

                              • 1 vote
                              #20.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:28 PM EDT
                              Reply

                              Trying to figure out why the word "Realtor" is capitalized in the article: "said Renee Salza, a Realtor and Republican who is supporting Romney." Are realtors somehow special and deserve to be capitalized? Can't NBC News afford a proofreader?

                              • 1 vote
                              Reply#21 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 2:49 AM EDT

                              Maybe they can't afford a proofreader.

                              Evidently, their 'journalists' don't even know how to use spell check, let alone how to proofread an article. They have mistakes in what they write all the time.

                                #21.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 10:32 AM EDT
                                Reply

                                Don't worry Mitt,...our expectation of you is already pret-ty darn low.

                                • 3 votes
                                Reply#22 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 5:30 AM EDT

                                The emphasis on the televised debates is regrettable. Most people are just looking for that "gotcha" moment, a train wreck, a dramatic sound bite. The presidency isn't performance art, is it? Vote based on their positions on issues.

                                • 1 vote
                                Reply#23 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 5:34 AM EDT

                                Jason: the word "Realtor" is a trademark owned word by the National Association of Realtors, a lobbying group. Since it is a proper name, it must have a capital letter. Just an indication again of who supports Romney.

                                • 4 votes
                                #23.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 7:54 AM EDT
                                Reply

                                OK Mitt,...first question:

                                "If tax breaks for the wealthy create jobs,...and the "trickle down works",...

                                ..."why are there no new jobs,...and why have wages been stagnant for 15years" ?

                                The trickle down is a lie.

                                • 5 votes
                                Reply#24 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 5:36 AM EDT

                                My income and my lifestyle were GREAT under Bush. I have dropped from $250K to $30K a year under Obama. I am waiting tables to try and hang on to my house.

                                Obama doesn't understand business and he doesn't understand the economy. Hence, all of the ridiculous attacks against Bain Capital.

                                It's very hard to fix what you don't understand. How's that "Summer of Recovery" working out for everyone?
                                ROMNEY/RYAN 2012

                                • 4 votes
                                #24.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 7:27 AM EDT
                                Reply

                                Maybe Mittens will get the chance to explain to us why he was FOR a women's right to chose and then he was against it. Or how he was FOR the mandate for healthcare for everyone in MA and then he was against it but FOR it just a couple weeks ago on Meet the Press and afterwards his campaign said he was AGAINST it but then again FOR it when he was interviewed by Ron Allen on NBC and afterwards he was against it at a rally just hours later. His campaign keeps having to refute everything that comes out of his mouth. How can anyone trust him?

                                V ote

                                O ut

                                T he

                                E lephants

                                • 7 votes
                                Reply#25 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 5:50 AM EDT

                                To Perry/Bachmann/Palin To much inbreeding causes "jackass syndrome". After all, isn't that what the Democrat party's logo is? The jackass! One Big A-- Mistake America! And that spells OBAMA!

                                • 1 vote
                                #25.1 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 7:33 AM EDT

                                A more exact description would be the silent donkey.

                                A party of dumb asses.

                                • 1 vote
                                #25.2 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 8:33 AM EDT
                                  #25.3 - Tue Oct 2, 2012 12:30 PM EDT
                                  Reply
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