REPEAL! REPEAL! REPEAL! That's all the Republicans have been screaming for the past two years. When are they going to give alternatives? Obama, Pelosi, Reid, etc... have admitted that the ACA was not perfect; All have stated that they are willing to work on improving the bill. But not a single time have Republicans offered a way to provide health care at an affordable price.

Was anyone really surprised at the ruling? For this SCOTUS to remove the millions of extra customers from the insurance roles would have surprised me more than this ruling did.

Fesity,

Spanky will claim that his internet was not working and we will not here from him today.LOL

"Out of country out of mind"

Looking forward to the President's statement later today.

And BTW where is Mr. Romney? I think he waws meeting with donald Trump today?!?

They may vow to repeal but that is much easier said than done.

They will need to hold the House, take the Whitehouse and the Senate with enough vote in the Senate to beat a filibuster (very, very doubtful). As of today it is questionable if they can even win the Senate and the Dems only need 25 seats to take back the House.

JDills, the Republicans are and have been for a decade, intellectually and morally bankrupt. Just look at the lack of attention they paid to double-digit increases in premiums going back to 2000, and the fact that 50+ million Americans were uninsured. There was nothing in reform for them or their corporate sponsors, so they ignored the fact that people went without care or lost everything they owned to pay for treatment. and they still have never put any alternatives to ACA on the table. They are utterly useless.

NorthstarDFL - remember Spanky KNEW that the Healthcare law was going to be unconstitutional because he KNOWS how these things work. My guess is his little paralegal work doesn't help him know much!

Michele Bachmann, come out come out wherever you are!

Interesting take -

Daily Kos:

The victory on health care reform is a victory against the Koch brothers, who spent massive sums to defeat the Affordable Care Act at the Supreme Court. It turns out the Kochs can lose and democracy can win.

***********

And Michelle Bachmann? Perhaps the biggest loser.

What ever happened to that lady who was crying that she wanted her country back?

She should be happy. We got our country back today.

NitWitMitt raised $200,000 within an hour of the announcement that the ACA had passed.

Gee; I wonder who's deep pocket that came from?

This would have been the time for the GOP/TP to make amends and show Americans that they support them. But no. The GNOP stanbds for one thing and one thing only: elitism

GOP, repeal? you don't hear them say replace with what?

repuks want healthcare to be a luxury and not a right.

Democratic aides on Capitol Hill said that Pelosi this morning called Vicki Kennedy, the widow of the late Sen. Edward Kennedy (D-MA), a longtime champion of health reform.

"Now, Teddy can rest," Pelosi told Kennedy.

Yes, indeed.......rest well Teddy your life's work has been fulfilled.

"They may vow to repeal but that is much easier said than done."

It's word smithing. Notice they don't say they will repeal, they say they will "vote to repeal". Republicans don't have the votes in the Senate nor do they have the votes to override a presidential veto.

Romney says his first day in office (like that's going to happen) he will repeal Obama care. That's nothing more than hot air. Again -- he doesn't have the votes because even if he wins, even if the House and Senate go Republican, he won't have the 60 votes to stop s filibusterer.

GOP, repeal? you don't hear them say replace with what?

Boehner has already assured the right that his concern is repeal only, not replacement. Said that yesterday.

sonny,

President Obama promised to not raise income taxes on anyone making less than 200K/250K

This is not an income tax.

Finnaly I can point to something did right. Appoint Chief Justice Robets

The whining we are hearing from the right wing lunatic fringe regarding the Supreme Court's landmark ruling is nothing like the wailing and sniveling we will hear from them when President Obama is reelected! Yow!

Gee; I wonder who's deep pocket that came from?

I'm thinking this cash came from those who were digging around Barc-o-lounger cushions in their double-wide on cinder-blocks!

You know... Willard's base!

Charlie-1915998

"They may vow to repeal but that is much easier said than done."

Especially, when you factor in what the Grimm Weeper said.

Mmmm wasn't it we're not going to spike the ball?

Yea, the GOP/TEABaggers have nothing but broken promises;
particularly where J-O-B-S are concerned. It's been 540 days since the Republicans have picked up the gavel; yet have failed to produce zero (0), nada, zilch jobs.

http://www.whenarethejobs.com/

Please cut the crap Mr Speaker; and get to work on those J-O-B-S

LMAO, you can't call our great President a LIAR. He's a community organizer so much to the point he has gotten many good things for America.

On the other hand, Boehnor and the t-bagger crew are lying, cold hearted hypocites.

Yes!! HaHa! In your faces conservatives! Get used to disappointment, there is plenty more on the way soon.

Quit bitching and pay your damn taxes, daddy has a Dr. appointment come 2014.

I actually was hoping that the mandate would be struck down but hey, conservative pain is my gain so I can look at the bright side.

REPEAL! REPEAL! REPEAL! That's all the Republicans have been screaming for the past two years. When are they going to give alternatives?

ObamaCare -is- the alternative. Mostly, it was their idea. A better name, perhaps, might be be RomneyCare. Of course, the real reason they are upset is that someone, somewhere, did something for the American people. It makes government look good, and we can't have that.

It's rather funny, if you think about it. They are so big on "government can do no right" and "government can never match private business in efficiency." Yet, they could never allow the public option where the government would also be in the business of selling insurance and competing with insurance companies.

If government can never match private business in efficiency, why were they afraid?

The simple truth is that private business can NEVER match a government in efficiency. Except that our system is broken. We have a system where we turn around and give a private contractor the job that government is supposed to do. The private contractor pays off a few Congressmen and then treats the government contract as a cash cow. All at taxpayer expense.

If you look at the actual number of Federal employees, it hasn't changed much over the past 50 years, mostly it's been around 4-5 million, give or take a million. The bloat is due to Federal contractors, all sucking the taxpayer dry.

That is why OUR government is inefficient. Our governmental inefficiency is the inefficiency of private business. It's also why every other industrialized country is able to provide healthcare through the government for much cheaper, and much more efficiently: we have the lowest life expectancy in the industrialized world.

If we are to compete, we have to have some more respect for our government, and the decent people who work there.

Beverly and Feisty - I don't understand - Spanky KNEW this was going to be repealed - remember, he made fun of me because "you don't know how these things work do you?" So how was his "inside info" wrong? I'm totally perplexed! NOT!!!!

@Finnaly I can point to something did right. Appoint Chief Justice Robets

Finally I can point to something Bush Jr did right

(hard to switch btw MSNBC/FOX/Newsvine)

12.8 million Americans will receive a refund check (before Aug 1) from the insurance companies who billed more than Obamacare allowed in 2011.

That's 12.8 million Americans (plus millions more family/friends) who will see that Republicans lied about this legislation.

Thank you President Obama and Democrats for standing up to insurance companies that over bill.

SeekingSanity

Beverly and Feisty - I don't understand - Spanky KNEW this was going to be repealed - remember, he made fun of me because "you don't know how these things work do you?" So how was his "inside info" wrong? I'm totally perplexed! NOT

Spanky is a f****ing imposter

On the other hand, our great President is a community organizer so much to the point he has gotten many good things for America together.

Spanky can barely tie his shoe without finding a problem.

Republicans are acting like Hitler -- full takeover to erase all Legislation that they do not like, repeal every law that they don't like, and kill every Department that they don't like, and give every Business their way with no regulations to impede them. Corporations and the 1%ers will totally rule this nation.

Bob,

You are 100% wrong. The SC upheld the mandate by defining it as a tax.

They did not uphold it as part of the Commerce Clause.

I just want to GLOAT because the evil Republicans deserve it.

They will be gloating even more if Romney wins and other Republicans win this fall.

So for no, I am GLOATING !!!!

As a former RN, this is a HUGE victory!! You guys have no idea how many people come into the ICU without insurance. They thought they wouldn't "need it"... and people were left with increased premiums to cover the uninsured. If people could be responsible on their own... well, this country would be a different place. Just like the requirement to have car insurance. Before I became disabled, I was bankrupted by medical bills. High deductibles, things not paid for that should've been.... it was a nightmare!! I watched people die because they couldn't get the day to day healthcare they needed and medication they needed. The insurance companies are out for one thing... to make a LOT of money for themselves. They don't care how much you pay in premiums. Anything that may end up meaning a reduction in their bottom line they've passed onto the insured for years and years.

Romney has NOTHING to say about this that's worth anything because HE was in favor of mandating health care in his state!! To complain now is beyond two faced. He needs to shut his mouth so he can stop lying. Pre-existing conditions, kids longer on insurance, keeping companies from fleecing their members, controlling rates, expanding medicaid...WHERE is the bad part? My only regret is that the President couldn't get a one payer system in place. However, this will keep the health care from bankrupting the US.

didn't obama say he would never raise taxes on anyone making under 200K, so what is this a tax or not? did he lie?

He did not SCOTUS did. I still say it is constitutional unde the commerce section and so do most people who are not stained by partisoan BS. This is a victory for 43 million Americans who have to make a decision most of the time whether to seek medical treatment because they cannot afford it. We should all be thankfu this worked and cannot be repealed unless we are stupid enough to ever give the idiots control of all three houses and super majorities. Now lets get down to the real battle for the election and lets see the plans both sides have. Democrats are ready and Republicans are running for the hills.

Hold on there, Willard... You have to get ELECTED first. And while we know that you'll lie, obfuscate, misdirect, and conceal, most people will hopefully see past that.

In any case, what are your alternatives for protecting millions of Americans?

And while I'm at it, why don't you explain to us why you don't want to help Americans have health care?

How can you claim to love America, when you clearly hate the average American?

Finally something good for the American people. Remember though, progressives, the country continues to be liberally populated with those whose senses are so warped by ignorance, hatred, bigotry and greed, they will never change, and probably cannot change their expressiveness, which has long steeped in those poisons of self denigration. These, and the entities and politicians, who stir and exploit their self infirmities can and will destroy us all, unless we hold forth with intense note, action, sacrifice, and labored determination toward the extinguishment of such mutations that are always present among free people. Regards, and congratulations.

The President has spoken, the Congress has spoken, the Citizens of this country, through their elected representatives, have spoken, and now the SCOTUS has spoken and confirmed the ACA. This bill has saved. and will continue to save, thousands of lives and help ease the burden of payment for unexpected medical expenses for, potentially, over 50 million U.S. Citizens now without health coverage. All this and yet the GOP and their masters the Tea Party want to repeal this bill and, if allowed to do so, will not only result in the deaths and financial ruin of hundreds of thousands of U.S. Citizens, of which, a VERY LARGE PERCENTAGE will be their OWN PARTY MEMBERS AND SUPPORTERS! Death, illness, and injury know NO party affiliation! Congratulations Chief Justice John Roberts, for voting to uphold this meaningful and merciful law!

Romney vows to repeal his own bill, on the national level?

"Hey, you know that health care bill that I worked really hard create... the one that has worked for my state? Ya... I am going to repeal it on the national level, even though I claim credit for the success it had in my own state."

So in response to the father of healthcare, Republicans are putting their faith in the grandfather of healthcare? Strange.

But at least we know that we can trust what Romney says... he is nothing but honest and consistent.

Only DUMB FUX cant understand that states CAN opt out.

As soon as Obama included the 'mandate' from which he had previously opposed, Re-pucks should have seen this as a cash cow for Health Insurance Co. and should have worked to make it stronger. Instead their goal is always to make Obama be a failure. SCOTUS gave Obama a couple big wins this week. This is a victory for America as a Nation and not victories for Republican politics in the regions of their control. When Bush was Prez, opposing the Federal Govt was seen as treason; when Obama as Prez he is seen as imposing on their 10th Amendment Rights.

Mr. Romney,

In America today, there are probably any number of people who might have just been diagnosed with a debilitating illness, such as MS, like your wife Ann has. Now some of these people may not have any medical insurance, or not covered because of pre-existing conditions. Your wife is very fortunate that she is in a position to have the best care possible. And now, thanks to the Affordable Health Care law, which has just been upheld by the Supreme Court, people like that cannot be denied the same care your wife enjoys. Why do you want to take that away from your fellow Americans?

I congratulate the President for his diligent efforts! This is a great day for all Americans! Thank you Mr. President and Shame on you Mr. Romney, Mr. Boehner and the rest of the GOP!!!

OBAMA/BIDEN 2012!!!

Mr. Romney,

In America today, there are probably any number of people who might have just been diagnosed with a debilitating illness, such as MS, like your wife Ann has. Now some of these people may not have any medical insurance, or not covered because of pre-existing conditions. Your wife is very fortunate that she is in a position to have the best care possible. And now, thanks to the Affordable Health Care law, which has just been upheld by the Supreme Court, people like that cannot be denied the same care your wife enjoys. Why do you want to take that away from your fellow Americans?

I congratulate the President for his diligent efforts! This is a great day for all Americans! Thank you Mr. President and Shame on you Mr. Romney, Mr. Boehner and the rest of the GOP!!!

OBAMA/BIDEN 2012!!!

Livingthewoods,

You my friend, get the prize for the best post of the day!

Quit bitching and pay your damn taxes, daddy has a Dr. appointment come 2014

Obama 2012!

The mandate,

requiring every American to purchase health insurance,

appeared in a 1989 published proposal by Stuart M. Butler

of the conservative Heritage Foundation

called "Assuring Affordable Health Care for All Americans,"

which included a provision to "mandate all households to obtain adequate insurance."

IN THE FUTURE

I GUESS THE NUCKING FUTTY GOP OUGHT TO KEEP THEIR BIG IDEAS TO THEMSELVES

SO "COMMUNIST, SOCIALIST COMMUNITY ORGANIZERS" DON'T STEAL THEIR GREAT IDEAS

& GET ALL OF THE CREDIT FOR THE LEGISLATION...!!

Watching Congress fumble all over itself while they can't agree on anything is almost comical at this point. Now Republicans will start this whole repeal campaign that has "ZERO CHANCE" of going anywhere while our Nation falls apart. Honestly these folks can do nothing but blame each other anymore. Very Sad.. Hopefully this will be the death nail for incumbents..

@ JDills,

I heard the insurance companies weren't going to take insurance from those that this bill help get. If that is the case what other reason would this court have for ruling the way it did?

Redhead Ranting:

RE: your post #1.44

I'll be real brief in my reply! You don't know what in the hell you are talking about! But, for starters, IT IS NOT Free! Everyone has to PURCHASE health insurance. The bill just makes it easier for EVERYONE to be covered and reduce the monthly payments on their health premiums. Now, if you really are interested in the facts I suggest you read the bill in its entirely, as I did over a year ago! Good Luck, it takes some effort but at least you will be fully informed and NOT spouting the BS line. With a computer there is NO EXCUSE, other than not being able to read, for not KNOWING THE FACTS AND TRUTH about almost any law! THEY ARE ALL PUBLISHED!

Why are Republicans complaining so much when we all know that Republicans are among the few who have their own insurance, and they've been bragging about that for months while at the same time they can't stand the thought of their doctors having any more patients (because Republicans are just too important, and they MIGHT have to wait a few extra minutes to see their doctor which in the Republican mind is totally UNACCEPTABLE!).

The ONLY time any tax is imposed is if you DON'T have health insurance.

I guess Republicans have once again gone off on one of their "misinformation tours" spouting hatred for no good reason.

Obama/Biden 2012

If Romney had a spine, which of course he doesn't, the cracking sound you would have heard would be it snapping as Mittens tries to twist away from the health care bill he implemented in Massachusetts. Really a model for the current bill, if they were smart the democrats should be calling this Romneycare. Mr. Etch-a-Sketch's head would surely explode as he tried to formulate a BS story as to why it was OK for Massachusetts but not OK for the rest of the country. The more this guy opens his mouth, the more pathetic he sounds and looks.

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL,

I'm with you and I have always been... Looks like the trolls have collapsed you yet again... Only makes you that much more readable... But you already knew that.

Well, we won this round, and did so quite handily I would say... This was a BIG win as big as it could have been... Today and for the years to come, Republicans can eat crow on healthcare.

Now, it's on to November, full steam ahead.

To all you Republicans that wanted to deny Americans healthcare, grab your behinds and RUN! Don't look back because it will only slow you down.

RR,

Your outrage is that we will have to pay more!? Boo Hoo!

What about the millions of people who will have to file bankruptcy, lose their homes to foreclosure, and/or die because they cannot afford health insurance?

I think many need to bear in mind that quite a significant number of 'Liberals' were opposed to this law as well.

We are not opposed because we don't want healthcare for everyone. Instead we are opposed because this law essentially forces people to become consumers of a private industry and will not benefit the people as much as the alternative that was offered but tossed away out of the desire to 'compromise' with the party of no who then turned around and fought the idea they had been championing for decades.

The 'Personal Mandate' is an affront. We are being forced to become consumers of a private industry that holds profit above health.

So, just because the law was upheld is NOT a reason for all liberals to celebrate and all conservatives to shake their fists at how awful liberals and Obama are.

That we weren't offered a single payer system like our elected representatives continue to have is the travesty. We do not have the longest life span in the world, we have an unacceptable infant mortality rate, our general health and access to it is not as good as most every other G20 nation in the list. We're one of the only (actually THE ONLY) 'advanced' nation in which people who get sick can lose their houses and everything through bankruptcy paying for their medical expenses.

Its better than nothing, but it was not the best solution. It was the compromise put up to try to get the party of no to go along with it since it was their idea in the first place.

So were they crazy then when they came up with it (Mr Romney implemented it in MA) or are they crazy now when they oppose it? And what is their better solution? Don;t tell us you'll repeal without telling us how you are going to make our costs and results comparable to the other G20 nations.

Now, it's on to November, full steam ahead.

Hey Just Wondering Aloud!

I've got my new running shoes ready & waiting for Labor Day & will be pounding the pavement where ever Team Obama needs me!

You noticed the collapsing thingy to... huh? lol

Let's move this country forward with President Obama... 4 MORE YEARS!

When, O When, will enough independents realize that all this posturing, all the naysaying, all the witchhunting going on - is just another way to stop the nation from recovering - so they can blame dems and grab power again. FDR had it right - when america is facing a crises - you vote out the party that obstructs for the sake of electioneering, and overwhelmingly vote in the party that gets things done! We had 40 years of corporate greed - now is the time to regrow the middle class. Yeah, class warfare - the same thing that the GnOP has been doing against the middle class for 40 years.

Wonder if you buy insurance for month of December do you get 2500 tax credit. You can buy a $10,000 deductible plan for about $100 a month so no one should ever pay this tax. There are some other taxes in the law but I don't really care about that. The real problem with this law is it doe not provide for health care, because if you don't have the $40 copay the doctors won't see you. It will make lots of CEO really rich so it is a loss of working poor people, because what they need is free health care. If you make 20000 the tax is $500 for not insuring. About what they screw you out of for a red light camera violation, if you don't keep your address up to date. Did you know the bastard have shorten the light to create and 80% increase in violations.

@Rod_Father

I don't mind paying more for good healthcare, that wasn't what I was talking about. When I said 'WE' I was referring to the government that will be paying more for the 30million who can't afford to pay this new tax.

I'll type really slowly so you can understand me...

WE DON'T HAVE ANY MONEY. WE CAN'T AFFORD THIS.

We, as in We The People, The United States, we are out of money. Did you see where Stockton, CA filed for bankruptcy yesterday? That's going to happen more and more.

@TCro #1.63: Although I am happy with the SCOTUS ruling today, I too, share much of your sentiment regarding this health care act. I have to take heart though, that we now have the beginning of the building of a "single payer, universal health care system". There's enough here to peel away much of the "blinding lies of the conservatives" and will allow proper assessment of the real structure and effectiveness of a universal system. It also is all the more reason to work for and elect, good fiscal minded progressives to the Congress and Presidency. An enduring nation cannot stay upright by continually walking backwards, even while attempting to go forward. Additionally, I am pleased when I consider the help so many heretofore ignored, and unattended good people will gain from this particular act. Best regards

I have visited a number of news vines and except for the ocassional pile of troll pucky the majority of postings are in favor of this decision.

This is the greatest advance in health care in the history of America and Romney VOWS to repeal it. Romney and his Neanderthal Republican allies are so far out of touch with average Americans that It’s almost like their from another planet; who knows maybe they are In November any middle class American casting a vote should stop and think about the political party that is REALLY on their side……. One thing's for sure, the Republican Party certainly isn’t…

Ranting Person ... I believe your quote was this ....

It's so frustrating that you people don't understand how this works.

If there is one phrase that I absolutely CANNOT stand ... it's YOU PEOPLE. So demeaning and yet only used by people like you.

YAWN.....Just will make it harder to balance the budget when a fiscally responsible prez. occupies the White House in November. Bye bye epic fail Obama.

@ Redhead Ranting
Where do WE have to pay for anything...? It doesn't say that WE have to pay for anyone's health insurance, it says YOU have to pay for YOUR OWN. And if you choose NOT to, you'll be assessed a fee at the end of the year.

I'll type slowly so YOU can understand. READ THE BILL.

What a great victory for my Comrades today. We shall celebrate!

With nationalized health care out of the way, let's focus on destroying the one thing that limits our country from really being progressive... capitalism! What an exciting time to be in Greece, Russia... uhm, the United States.

To the few on this F.R. who are complaining about the fact that they are going to be paying more through this hated A.C.A. It is faintly possible,that at first that might happen,unlikely,but we have probably the worst record in the developed nations for our most expensive,yet worst Health Care .This is only the first stage in one of the best pieces of legislation's that we have had in a long time.All of the other countries that have enacted this have had to make amendments to it to improve,but never repeal it. Throughout it's history it has always prov-en to be the best of any of the Medical Reforms to any nation. The only true losers,in the long haul, is the exploiting insurers.That doesn't mean that all insurers are,but private medical plans pass increasing costs to its customers ,where the tax payers will expect better efficiency and less costs.

RR,

The fee is based on the ability to pay.

Welcome to the the newest communist country - - - - - USA ! Now, there's your 'Hope and Change' ....

Well, for me, I'm so lucky that I own a beachfront home in Costa Rica, paradise that's paid for and a place that even Obama can't f'k up!

Why worry about terrorists, Obama is doing a fine job of ruining the country, but good luck Obama suckers and please don't bring your 'Hope and Change' down here .......!

*face palm

We are all having to live with Citizens United so Republicans will just have to learn to live with ACA. It bumfuzzles the imagination to try and understand how the GOP thinks the healthcare act is bad for America. Anyone who has a pre-existing condition and has priced insurance policies can tell you how impossible a task that is. If Republicans really and truly want what is best for ALL citizens then they would either get behind this law or offer a viable alternative. I mean, the way they are acting you would think they had already made promises based upon the SCOTUS throwing ACA out....

This ruling almost restores my faith in the Supreme Court just a little bit ;-)

"What the court did not do on the last day of its session I will do on my first day as president," Romney said. He called the court's opinion both bad law and bad policy.

Finally, some truth from Willard Romney (which is his real name). The Supreme Court did not deny millions of Americans of healthcare; Romney will, if elected.

(1) It increases uncertainty and decreases confidence when recovery from the Great Recession requires more confidence and less uncertainty. The ACA isn’t highly popular; the Kaiser Family Foundation finds that 44 percent of Americans now view it unfavorably and 37 percent favorably. Given the ACA’s complexities, people can’t know where they’ll get insurance and what it will cost. In 2014, the ACA requires all employers with 50 or more full-time workers to provide insurance or pay fines (“the employer mandate”). On the one hand, formal economic studies conclude that most employers now offering insurance will continue to do so; on the other, in direct surveys of firms, 30 percent or more say they might drop insurance and pay fines. Uncovered people must buy insurance (“the individual mandate”) or face penalties, though government will subsidize households with incomes up to four times the poverty level ($92,200 for a family of four in 2012).

Business uncertainty is a price we must all pay for a more efficient healthcare system. I frankly don't care if 500,000 jobs are lost over the next 10 years because of this bill; not because I am a heartless lefty, but because unfortunately reforms require sacrifices. The results of this bill are yet to be seen, but it is forecast to have minimal economic costs.

(2) The ACA discourages job creation by raising the price of hiring. This is basic economics. If you increase the price of labor, companies will buy less of it. Requiring employers to buy health insurance for some workers makes them more expensive, at least in the short run. Particularly vulnerable are low-skilled workers, notes economist Diana Furchtgott-Roth of the Manhattan Institute. Because the employer mandate exempts firms with fewer than 50 workers, there’s a huge incentive for firms to stop at 49, she says.

Not necessarily. Businesses will use less of labor if and only if they can afford to do so. And by afford I mean their production capacity. If they can squeeze more productivity from existing workers, than they simply won't hire, but if demand is too high to be met by current capacity, they will hire more people.

(3) Uncontrolled health spending is the U.S. system’s main problem — and the ACA makes it worse. Spiraling health costs crowd out other government programs and squeeze wage increases by diverting compensation dollars into employer-paid insurance. Because insured people use more health services than the uninsured, the ACA (covering an estimated 30 million more) raises spending. As for the ACA’s cost-control provisions, even the government’s own actuaries don’t believe they will do much. By their latest projection, total health spending — government and private — rises from 17.9 percent of the economy (gross domestic product) in 2010 to 19.6 percent in 2021. In 1980, health care was 9 percent of GDP.

Technically, the ACA reduces premium increases by a small but still substantial amount. Obamacare isn't in itself a new program; it is merely a new regulation of the healthcare industry that expands existing programs. And total health spending would most likely have risen even if the bill wasn't passed, and maybe by a higher amount. The best way, in my opinion, to reduce healthcare spending is to go to a government-run healthcare system, like in Europe and the rest of the industrialized world. Hopefully, if Hillary Clinton is elected in 2016, that might just happen.

(4) Obama’s program also worsens the federal budget problem. Driven by Medicare and Medicaid, health care already exceeds one-fourth of the budget and is headed toward a third. It’s the crux of the problem. So Obama creates another huge health program.

Not true. The ACA isn't a new program; it is merely a law expanding and regulating existing programs and institutions. It may have a few new projects, but the bulk of it is merely a mandate/regulation.

The administration’s retort: the program lowers the budget deficit. This is rhetorical hocus-pocus. Here’s what happens. From 2012 to 2022, the ACA raises federal spending by $1.762 trillion, estimates the Congressional Budget Office. However, all of this and a bit more is offset by tax increases and assumed cuts in Medicare. But these tax increases and cuts could have been used to shrink the huge budget deficits that pre-existed Obamacare. Now they can’t; moreover, the Medicare cuts might be repealed or reduced.

The bill does increase government spending over the next decade, but offsets it via Medicare cuts and tax increases. The CBO estimates that it will reduce the budget by roughly $200 billion over the next decade. And the Medicare cuts can be repealed or reduced, but there is a committee established by the bill to find savings within the Medicare program. In addition, anything can be repealed or reduced. Repealing the entire bill will increase the deficit. It all depends on who wins in 2012.

(5) The ACA discriminates against the young in favor of the old. Government policy already does this through payroll taxes that have young workers subsidizing Social Security and Medicare benefits. The ACA compounds the effect by forcing some young Americans to buy insurance at artificially high premiums that would pay for the care of a sicker, older population

But the purchases of insurance would also benefit the younger Americans. The uninsured are essentially free-siders on the healthcare system, and cost us dearly. I frankly don't care if it discriminated against the young; I'm young, and I am a staunch supporter of Social Security and Medicare. Healthcare costs have often been discriminated against the young and against the healthy, as the majority of costs (that aren't waste) come from the old and the sick.

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

JDILLS... For this SCOTUS to remove the millions of extra customers from the insurance roles would have surprised me more than this ruling did.

surprise guess why they will still be insured?....incase you didn't hear the only way it would work was to mandated that everyone must be insured....which only tells me we're stuck with the bill. thanks mr obama for doing me such a big favor...I'm soooo greatful i could die. which only tells me you're out of there come 2013...that's when i will be graetful for the big favor you did for me.

*******************************SAD DAY FOR ALL US CITIZENS*********************************

The President (Executive Branch), US Congress (Legislative Branch), US Supreme Court (Judicial Branch) have all been turned into door to door Insurance Salesmen; as buy our Insurance or we break your legs..er fine you.

Then there is their "Let The Peasants Eat Cake" , in that they got their Real Affordable Health Care ($42 per month for their Real Affordable Health Care; while income of over $174,000 a year), so screw you, our actual constituents are the Corporations (Insurance):

From the Article: House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi of Calif. relays the breaking news to her staff that the Supreme Court had just upheld the Affordable Care Act, June 28 on Capitol Hill.

The Actual Fact: About half of the members of Congress, including House Speaker Nancy Pelosi, use the Attending Physician benefit. For $42 a month, they can get all the primary care they need - physical therapy, X-rays, minor surgery, specialists and a pharmacy for emergencies - no appointment needed. - CBS News, http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2009/10/13/cbsnews_investigates/main5382699.shtml?tag=currentVideoInfo;videoMetaInfo

Like I said "Let The Peasants Eat Cake" is their Mentality, and all of you thought they were going to hand out Free Cakes. Open your own purses, wallets, withdraw your life savings to buy Insurance, pay the bonuses of the Insurance Corporation CEOs, pay the Salaries of the Insurance Adjusters to deny your Claims, or be fined; by the way the Insurance Corporations already stated that those that did not have previous Insurance will be placed into the very expensive "High Risk Category".

You get the Insurance Corporations out of Medicare so that they cannot fraud the US Citizens (Taxpayers) of $17 Billion to $18 Billion per year - President Obama, Face the Nation. By getting the Insurance Corporations out of the Medical Profession you too can have Unlimited Medical for $50 per month like US Congress. Please stop confusing the guy in the suit and tie as an Insurance Corporation Insurance Adjuster as the Doctor, Nurse, Physician's Assistant, other Medical Professionals in "scrubs".

Jakrabt_Oxford MS - We are all having to live with Citizens United so Republicans will just have to learn to live with ACA.

Master of Science from Oxford in what? You need to do the Real Research and use the Scientific Method with zero emotive opinions (Logic Failure). Why?:

Because the first clue should have been, How long does a Case like the Citizen's United Case take to get thru the layers of Bureaucracy of the US Court System? This alone should have caused you to reasearch further.

Second, as President Obama was pushing his Health Care (Insurance Corporation) Reform Law with the February President's Proposal to US Congress, his Buddy "Mr. Corporate America" was Legal Briefing the US Supreme Court on Unlimited Corporate Campaign Contributions, as either Rule the 2008-2009 Elections Invalid for his admitted violations of the US Law, McCain Feingold Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act prior to and during the 2008-2009 Elections, or Rule in Favor of Unlimited Corporate Campaign Contributions. This is known as "Leveraging" to obtain the desired outcome; as either the US Supreme Court would be held Accountable and Responsible for ousting a Newly Elected Popular President or tell the loser Presidental Candidate McCain too bad for the McCain Feingold Bipartisan Campaign Reform Law.

The Result of President Obama's Buddy "Mr. Corporate America's" hard work, "Mr. Corporate America" gets a slap on the wrist fine of $200,000 for his admitted violations of the McCain Feingold Bipartisan Campaign Reform Act; while President Obama gets $1 Billion in Unlimited Corporate Campaign Contributions from the Insurance Corporations, Medical Device Corporations, Pharmaceuticals Corporations, as the Insurance Corporations get $67 Billion of US Taxpayer Money, Medical Device Corporations get $23 Billion of US Taxpayer Money, Pharmaceuticals Corporations get $20 Billion; the US Taxpayers get screwed with the bill of $1.7 Trillion to $2.1 Trillion (adjusted for Inflation) and required purchase of Insurance (more suckers for the Insurance Corporations to deny Claims to make Bigger Profits); and US Congress must cut previously Budgeted for Programs and Projects for US Citizens to pay for the ACA (what is/has been happening, take Billions USDs from the Old People on Medicare, take Billions USDs from the Poor of Medicaid, eventhough the "intent" was to have more US Citizens that could not afford Medical Care to have access to Medical Care NOT INSURANCE CORPORATIONS GREED and Salaries for INSURANCE CORPORATION BUREAUCRATS)).

Like everything else eventually the truth comes out (Lots of References for the above as Verified by multiple sources not funded by any Political Parties as Facts, not emotive opinions).

Ranting Redhead:

RE: your post #1.44

First, let me say very clearly your moniker fits - exactly; you do a lot of ranting! It would be better were it critical reasoning based on FACT and TRUTH!

Regarding my reading your post #1.44 incorrectly, let me quote your first paragraph and see if your intended meaning to anyone who can comprehend, is that the healthcare in the ACA will cost us, the U.S. taxpayer and/or government. Again, this is your verbatim words. "...you are wrong...this will cost us more, more that we don't have, and the care will suck." Now you state that it will cost us (the u.s. taxpayers) more but you state in your subsequent post #1.64 that I read your post wrong? Missy, I will repeat, The individual will have to buy his healthcare, unless it is provided to him by his employer for free, which is fast becoming a thing of the past, as you should know. I repeat it will not cost the U.S. or any taxpayer a dime as it is mandated that people PURCHASE insurance. As is stands now, those without insurance show up at the emergency rooms throughout the country and the bills are footed by the, you guessed it, U.S. taxpayers. If you are going to have a serious discussion with anyone, you best have your facts straight because there is a fact check available. It is called Google.com! Last, the care will not as you state "suck" any more or any less than now. Care will be given to those with insurance policy by the same healthcare personnel and facilities available now. I would agree that our care should be better. We are ranked 17th out of the top 20 industrialized countries, and 37 overall in quality of healthcare provided. Check out my numbers provided by the World Health Organization, the recognized authority for overall healthcare on planet Earth.

Excellent comment scrambolo .....

For all those berating Ranting Redhead, Just remember these posts and in 7 to 10 years you better be looking her up to apologize for your ignorance and short sighted vision of where this monstrosity will lead the USA.

Our great leadership has botched every social program they ever got their fingers on. ACA will suck PERIOD. This bill is a TAX. just another way for the government to get their hands on more of the money you work for. Just look at Social Security the money paid in was to be set aside in a lock box and distributed at retirement. WELLL that didn't work out to well for me seeing as how I recieved a notice that stated " my disbursements will now only be 75% of what it was just a short 12 years ago" and the kicker is, I now have to work 3 more years to get the full benefit.

If our government can now tax us for an activity or life style (which they can according to ACA). WHen will enough be enough?

I have visited a number of news vines and except for the ocassional pile of troll pucky the majority of postings are in favor of this decision.

And listening to several talk radio stations, the sentiment was about the same. Those who can't stand any Obama achievement were their same venomous selves. Most people were relieved it stood as is, and are ready to move on. Too bad those on the right can't do the same.

Romney says his first day in office (like that's going to happen) he will repeal Obama care. That's nothing more than hot air. Again -- he doesn't have the votes because even if he wins, even if the House and Senate go Republican, he won't have the 60 votes to stop s filibusterer.

Thank goodness he dont need the votes! He just needs to be smart enough to give every person and state a waver the day he gets in. Romney may not be much better then Obama, but, he is the only hope we have of getting rid of this "TAX" as well as this BS of liberals forcing us to live as they think we should. THIS IS THE EXACTLY the type of crap our founding fathers fought against. taking things from them by force and over taxation. nIt is time for everyone to make sure your neighbor is registered to vote! There are more conservatives then liberals and it is way past time to quit letting them take more and more from us and telling us what is good or bad for us. It is time to let them know we are tired of working to support those that wont, when it means our families have less because they are taking from us!!

garcher ....

For all those berating Ranting Redhead, Just remember these posts and in 7 to 10 years you better be looking her up to apologize for your ignorance and short sighted vision of where this monstrosity will lead the USA.

Looking her up to apologize? Good laws! Because she is such a fountain of facts?????? I apologize to those I have offended and I do my best daily to not offend. Her comments are nothing but rants and raves from Fox News without any kind of credible source. I saw a poll today on those that are planning to move to Canada because of the Supreme Court (where they do have government sponsored healthcare) and also another commentary by Rand Paul stating that the Supreme Court of this great nation doesn't get to call what is or not Constitutional. Get a grip, and while doing so, take out your reading glasses and read up on the ACA, and after doing so, go find a civics 101 class that you can take ... take the Ranter with you.

scrambolo

I repeat it will not cost the U.S. or any taxpayer a dime as it is mandated that people PURCHASE insurance

Get a Damn clue. It will cost taxpayers because those who do pay taxes will have more money stolen by the government through the irs to help SUPLEMENT those who cannot "afford" it.

Health care reform would have been much better served by passing things such as tort reform, allowing the importation of drugs, and reducing the fda's ability to block treatments and drugs that have been in use in other countries for decades without problems.

We also could be forcing illegals who keep running to the ER to have to pay for their services and ONLY allow them treatment in true medical emergencies. anything else they can run back across the border and get treatment.

There are also many natural things that help with heath problems such as walnuts, yet the fda bans them from listing scientifically proven benefits as they would then classify it as a drug and be regulated by them.

WE NEED TRUE MEDICAL REFORM , TAX REFORM SO NO CONGRESS AGAIN CAN REGULATE LIVES THROUGH TAXES, AND THE ABILITY TO REMOVE JUDGES FROM THE SUPREME COURT!!!!

@scrambolo I'm not trying to come at this from a partisan position. If I have offended you I apologize. However, and very respectfully, I don't think you understand how this will play out. How it has already played out. You see the insurances companies have been eroding your medical care for the last two decades. Your doctor wants to help you but unfortunately is more concerned about getting sued. Because getting sued will bankrupt not only him but his practice and his family. He is a doctor, he wants to help you. He or she is also not making any money anymore because the health care administration is sucking up any profit. If there is no profit to be made by the doctor you will find that the doctors are no longer board certified or educated in the US. This legislation is putting what has happened in the last 20 years on steroids. If you think your care will get better you are high and I want what you are smoking.

I get your point, you want to be sure that everyone has access to health care. And, that's a noble thing we should all strive for. The thing is, by mandating it or taxing it we degrade it. My father was doctor. He made a lot of money. He never once turned down a patient until the insurance companies told him he could no longer accept payment by way of a new fence or a side of beef. Even then he didn't turn them down, he just didn't record it. He saw AIDS patients when no else would see them, and he wasn't paid for it because they didn't have insurance. And he went broke. He couldn't practice medicine because he couldn't make any money doing it. His staff, which he needed desperately just to figure out insurance forms, sucked up all his profits. There are a few doctors of his generation who will still see any patient no matter what. And if you go to any ER they will see you. There is no person in this great nation of ours who is not getting or has access to great health care.

It is the insurance companies who have won today, and you fell in line to make them rich.

Layton-3733410 WTF are you talking about? I spewed no facts. This is about your freedom and mine being sold to the highest bidder. And you are lining up to give it away.

Ranter .....

Layton-3733410 WTF are you talking about? I spewed no facts.

Exactly ... no facts ... just your theories and opinions. I believe in facts and have faith ..... and this ...

This is about your freedom and mine being sold to the highest bidder. And you are lining up to give it away.

Belongs in a different post. Our freedom was not sold to the highest bidder over this Court ruling. I believe in the Supreme Court and the Justice system.

This is about your freedom and mine being sold to the highest bidder. And you are lining up to give it away.

Give it away to who? Romney's super PAC's????? Seriously ... give it away to who?????? My freedom is not bought by the NRA or any other lobbyist. I am totally free in that I can walk, talk, enjoy a lovely life and know that MY President is making sure that my life as my grandchildren's is going to be okay by making sure that we have the healthcare we need. And for that, I am thankful for what this country's Supreme Court ruled on today.

For those people stating ACA will not cost the USA income tax payer a cent, they are wrong. Read the ACA. All legal residents of the USA will be required to purchase an qualified insurance policy.

In the past week, both Alec MacGillis and Sabrina Tavernise have written articles touching on how little the uninsured actually know about the Affordable Care Act. Given that pollingshows the law remains unpopular even as its component parts — with the notable exception of the individual mandate — are very popular, it seems they’re not alone. So here’s a refresher on some of the law’s most significant policies and consequences:

1. By 2022, the Congressional Budget Office estimates (pdf) the Affordable Care Act will have extended coverage to 33 million Americans who would otherwise be uninsured. Here’s the graph:

2. Families making less than 133 percent of the poverty line — that’s about $29,000 for a family of four — will be covered through Medicaid. Between 133 percent and 400 percent of the poverty line — $88,000 for a family of four – families will get tax credits on a sliding scale to help pay for private insurance.

3. For families making less than 400 percent of the poverty line, premiums are capped. So, between 150% and 200% of the poverty line, for instance, families won’t have to pay more than 6.3 percent of their income in premiums. Between 300 percent and 400 percent, they won’t have to pay more than 9.5 percent. This calculator from the Kaiser Family Foundation will let you see the subsidies and the caps for different families at different income levels.

4. When the individual mandate is fully phased-in, those who can afford coverage — which is defined as insurance costing less than 8 percent of their annual income — but choose to forgo it will have to pay either $695 or 2.5 percent of the annual income, whichever is greater.

5. Small businesses that have fewer than 10 employees, average wages beneath $25,000, and that provide insurance for their workers will get a 50 percent tax credit on their contribution. The tax credit reaches up to small businesses with up to 50 employees and average wages of $50,000, though it gets smaller as the business get bigger and richer. The credit lasts for two years, though many think Congress will be pressured to extend it, which would raise the long-term cost of the legislation.

6. Insurance companies are not allowed to discriminated based on preexisting conditions. They are allowed to discriminate based “on age (limited to 3 to 1 ratio), premium rating area, family composition, and tobacco use (limited to 1.5. to 1 ratio).”

7. Starting in 2018, the law imposes a 35 percent tax on employer-provided health plans that exceed $10,200 for individual coverage and $27,500 for family coverage. The idea is a kind of roundabout second-best to capping the tax code’s (currently unlimited) deduction for employer-provided heath insurance. The policy idea is to give employers that much more reason to avoid expensive insurance policies and thus give insurers that much more reason to hold costs down.

8. The law requires insurers to spend between 80 and 85 percent of every premium dollar on medical care (as opposed to administration, advertising, etc). If insurers exceed this threshold, they have to rebate the excess to their customers. This policy is already in effect, and insurers are expected to rebate $1.1 billion this year.

9. The law is expected to spend a bit over $1 trillion in the next 10 years. The law’s spending cuts — many of which fall on Medicare — and tax increases are expected to either save or raise a bit more than that, which is why the Congressional Budget Office estimates that it will slightly reduce the deficit. (There’s been some confusion on this point lately, but no, the CBO has not changed its mind about this.) As time goes on, the savings are projected to grow more quickly than the spending, and CBO expects that the law will cut the deficit by around a trillion dollars in its second decade. Here’s its graph, which covers the period between 2012 and 2021:

The ACA's taxes and spending cuts make it a slight deficit reduce in its first decade. (CBO)

10. In recent years, health-care costs have slowed dramatically. Much of this is likely due to the recession. Some of it may just be chance. But there’s also evidence that the law has accelerated changes in the way the medical system delivers care, as providers prepare for the law’s efforts to move from fee-for-service to quality-based payments.

11. The law’s long-term success at controlling costs will likely hinge on its efforts to change the way health care is delivered, most of which have gotten very little attention. They include everything from encouraging Accountable Care Organizations to spreading medical homes to penalizing hospitals with high rates of preventable infections to creating an independent board able to quickly implement new reforms through the Medicare system. A partial list of these efforts can be found here.

Acknowledgments: Much of the information in this post comes from the Kaiser Family Foundation’s excellent summary of the Affordable Care Act’s provisions.

Layton

Belongs in a different post. Our freedom was not sold to the highest bidder over this Court ruling. I believe in the Supreme Court and the Justice system.

I bet you wouldn't if it went the other way.

"There are none so blind as those that will not see"

Ranting Redhead:

RE: your post #1.90

Lets stick to the topic we were discussing before you switch to all your "down-the-road" OPINIONS about several topics. We were discussing (not arguing) about who would pay for ACA insurance, remember? We discussed briefly the quality of care which would be given under ACA, remember? Now, one time, I will repeat these FACTS! The Affordable Care Act (ACA) DOES NOT PAY FOR THE INSURANCE! Under ACA each individual or group, including families, areREQUIRED TO PURCHASE HEALTH INSURANCE. If you do not purchase insurance you are subject to a fine beginning in 2014 of $75.00. This fine increases to $675.00 in 2016. HOWEVER, ALL these fines are NOT the least bit enforcable and NO leins can be placed against even $1 of your personal property. These fines are TOTALLY NON ENFORCABLE, PERIOD. The care eaach insured will receive will be EXACTLY AS IT IS NOW, SAME DOCTORS, SAME FACILITES, SAME SERVICE, PERIOD. Instead of changing the topic or introducting several topics from doctors being sued, to insurance company profits, to the past medical practices of doctors and insurers to your PURE SPECULATION about the future, then, O.K., we can discuss. But, not all at once to divert from the current topic of: "Who will pay for the insurance policies under the Affordable Care Act", Also, I am not offended by your comments, I just KNOW they are not FACT BASED, based on the ACA! As to my being noble for wanting everyone insured, THANKS for the compliment. Although you state you didn't want to make this political, all I can say that you and I and anyone with a pulse knows and should admit that this is a hugh political football with hugh implications for every citizen of this country. I will also state that although I am agnostic, I firmly believe that we should ALL follow Christ's second greatest commandment: "LOVE YOUR NEIGHBOR AS YOURSELF"! If WE follow this simple rule, then we should COMPLETELY KNOW and ACCEPT that everyone should be ENTIITLED TO: food, clothing, shelter, medical care, and educational opportunitiies. In a nation as wealthy as the United States, how do you justify denying anyone these basic human NEEDS?

So you have Romney vowing to repeal everything in "Obama Care," and the GOP is trying to reframe their argument, now saying that the mandate is a TAX -- and they're saying it's all "unconstitutional" -- according to their polling of right-wing viewers of Fox News, through several, private marketing-surveying companies they hired to do this job.

Article XVI.

The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration.

(...and)

Article. I.

Section. 8.

The Congress shall have Power To lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States

----------------------

Meanwhile, you have the Regressive Right offering NO alternate plans for nationwide health care that are communicated consistently, except for their mindless, ultra-idealistic and economically naive mantra of, "let the free markets decide," of which history proves time and again that unregulated, medium-sized and large-sized businesses narrow down the markets to end up in oligarchies, and they will choose to engage in collusion with each other to do things that harms the customer and the public at large.

And you also have the Regressive Right in this country offering NO workable plans to create JOBS. What I do see is every proposal of major job creation being shot down or filibustered by the conservative Republicans in Congress, because a politically centrist and secular man of a mixed race sits in the Oval Office. What I do see is the Regressive Right eliminating middle class jobs in the public sector, thus keeping unemployment rates high in some states that are strapped for cash and can't help their citizens; they're forced to raise their state taxes to keep from going deeper into debt because their own Republicans in Congress categorically cut parts of the federal budgets going to their own states.

This is a classic example of unenlightened leaders acting against their own electorate's interests.

And who is to blame? Ask the propaganda-brainwashed people in their states that voted for regressive leaders that vowed to take away public sector help for their own citizens!

Scrambolo regarding #1.94

First of all, I'm not trying to confuse you or divert your attention buy bringing up other topics. I haven't gotten the hang of how these conversations thread and I can never find where I once was. Plus I get distracted easily by the name calling and feel the need to speak up. Call me a noob but it takes a bit to figure this out.

With all due respect I think we will have to agree to disagree. I don't have numbers and stats for you but on principle and theory this can't work because we don't have enough money as it is. Again I suck at math but I know that if I can't afford insurance now the fact that the government mandates that I do it won't change that fact. I understand that the fee/tax/penalty can be waived and that's where I think we will have a problem because someone still has to pay for the services rendered (I don't know who that would be, probably like it is now where the docs eat a lot of the loss as does the gov).

I too am an agnostic, though leaning in the direction of Atheism, which is neither here nor there but I am not one of the Jesus freaks that fill the right wing and am honestly ashamed and a little afraid of them. Having said that and probably po'd a bunch of people I am still fiscally conservative and believe if we give people everything they lack they will more often than not do less and less because there is no motivation. Doing an honest days work is a huge motivator, collecting a check only motivates one to continue getting a check.

Sadly I know too many people collecting unemployment (for nearly 2 years now) who are also working under the table which means they don't declare that money, don't pay taxes on (don't pay child support based on it) and still get money from the government because they can. I also know several people who have used welfare as the safety net it was designed for and gotten off of it when it they got back on their feet. I'm not sure but I think the difference between those kinds of people is how they were raised to take pride in their work.

I've been in a position to accept all that the government gives. I considered food stamps at one time but declined them because I didn't want to take them from someone who really needed them ( I didn't understand how they worked and thought if I took money from the pot there would be less money in the pot). I have family I can ask for help (which sucks) others do not.

I know there are a lot of people out of work right now but I am really surprised that more people didn't start their own businesses. I did. It wasn't easy but I couldn't bring myself to accept help from the government. Now I have been lucky because my family did help me out when I have needed it, something others don't have. I know I am blessed (funny thing to say as an agnostic/atheist). But I've worked hard and if I can others can too. If I had been eligible for unemployment for two years I don't think I would have worked as hard, just hard enough.

I can't justify denying the things you mentioned like food, clothing education. I have provided all of those things to my children and will continue to until they can provide for themselves. And then I fully expect them to provide for me when I am old and broke :)

I am all for making these things available and I think if you knew me you would know that I would give you the shirt off my back if you needed it, even if I don't agree with you. I just don't want the government to tell me that I have to do these things and then have them tax/penalize me when I choose not to. I truly believe as humans we must take care of each other, I just don't agree that the government is the best way to achieve this.

*I just reread this and realized I got totally sidelined. Sorry.

excellent post rradiko. Nail on the head.

Redhead ranting, to lower costs everyone either has to be covered by some form of health care coverage. Obamacare taxes will not apply to anyone who has health care coverage already or gets it when they are able too. If you are not able to afford health insurance but want it anyway, then part or all of it will be subsidized at a sliding scale, only those unwilling to get health care coverage will have to pay the tax. How else do you suggest getting everybody into the insurance pool?

Unless everyone except for illegal immigrants are covered the health care crisis will eventually reach critical mass. I get that you don't like the government telling you what to do. You have been very clear on that point, but you do what the government says you have to drive I'm sure.

One thing is absolutely clear, we are all going to die someday, though hopefully not on the same day. Unless we die instantly, we will succumb to an illness that requires medical care. If you are against mandated health care coverage, then I suggest you sign a waver that releases the emergency room from all responsibility if it refuses to treat you due to lack of health care coverage. Every year my premiums go up because of the uninsured getting coverage in emergency rooms. While I have no objections to that for now, I don't want that to continue indefinitely.

Ranting Redhead:

RE: your post #1.96

Girl, you covered an awful lot of 'ground in this post. I have always had the ability to agree to disagree. Liberals, should always listen to and understand differing opinions, afterall, coins always have two sides! My only suggestion to you would be to research the topic thourghly and understand, as much as possible based on the FACTS and CRITICAL REASONING (logic). This, fact gathering, is often tedious and time consuming, but if you are to understand and comment on ANY topic, in an intelligent manner, you must devote the time and energy to gather YOUR OWN information from many available sources. In the case of the ACA (Affordable Care Act/Obamacare) the best source is the ACA itself. Long, difficult, sometimes tortured text, in often obfuscating language, it is the most ACCURATE place to gather and digest the FACTS concerning this landmark legislation. As for your being new to the blogosphere or IT, good for you. I hope you find your journey exciting, inspirational, and most of all, educationsl. Also, I would be remiss if I didn't tell you that I hope, some day, you will agree that medical care, in our extremely wealthy country, is an entitlement. As you know our Declaration of Independence gives everyone "the right to life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness". I believe it would be very difficult for any cronically or severely ill or injured person to pursue "LIFE" without the benefit of the best HEALTH possible. Also, you don;t need to "believe-in" Jesus Christ to believe that the idea or concept o "Love your neighbor as yourself". Personally believe that this is an ideal and idea worth practicing--daily! Have a GREAT July 4th Holliday Week!

Repeal it !

While they're in the repealing mood they can repeal the Bush Tax Cuts for the wealthy, The Patriot Act in total, The endless anti-abortion legislation, the war against women's health rights,the cuts in programs for the poor and repeal their health care packages as well.

ORomney care is here get used to it. It's far from perfect since it sucks up to Big Pharma, the Insurance companies, and The AMA. ORomney care, hopefully it's a step towards single payer.

If our government can now tax us for an activity or life style (which they can according to ACA). WHen will enough be enough?

They already do that; you get deductions if you have a mortgage on your house, have kids, or go to college. It's not new.

Freshieee:

RE: your post #1.101

Your post is true to ANYONE who can ferret out the FACTS and think logically! Sadly, there are many on both the left and right who cannot and care not to spend the time and energy to be informed FULLY. These people are led around by their collective noses and are truly the 'sheeple' we now hear mentioned so often!

Scrambolo,

I've been part of the blogosphere for the last five years. I have several blogs including redheadranting(dot)com and kidsofqueers(dot)com (I haven't had time to update that one in the last year while I write my memoir which comes out this fall (before the election if I can get my s**t together. I'm sure you would approve of it (not sarcasm)), I just don't understand the comment sections of most of the news sites. I also don't get all the yelling and screaming at one another.

See how we started off and how civility and reason worked out, even if we don't agree with one another? We can all do that if we try and shut the eff up sometimes. We are part of the problem, hell, we are most of the problem. We have a lot more power now because of the immediate nature of the internet/blogosphere but because everyone is so busy trying to be heard (and get in a zinger first).

I really do believe we are closer on many of these issues and what we don't agree on we could find a compromise if we just sat down and listened to each other, not name call, but listen, discuss, learn. This is not the place for that to happen because the site is biased and the mods are biased. It isn't about reason, it's about selling ads. No one would come here if there wasn't this ugly discourse and name calling going on.

I say I won't be a part of it but it's really easy to get swept up in it because it's like rooting for your favorite Football team. This is like the Packers/Vikings(even though they always suck I still fight for them) or the Cowboys vs the Steelers (I totally had to Google Football Rivalries to get the second one). I know the Vikings will always choke but I'll be damned if I support the Packers (that wasn't a comparison to either political side).

I guess what I am saying is if we can learn to get past that then anyone can, maybe even Feisty who so likes to stir things up. Okay, probably not.

I hope you too have a great Independence Day and that you get to spend it with friends, family, food and fun. Even if we don't agree on health care we can both agree that this is the best country and if we didn't have our independence these boards wouldn't be so active.

We should be extremely proud, even if we don't agree.

Rick, you betcha! {wink}

Hardly JCB

@ Unhappy --

Healthy people who can't afford insurance are, at least, still healthy. But don't forget that cancer and other diseases strike otherwise "healthy" people, too, and often without any warning. In many cases, those people won't be able to get insurance then, either, because the Court gave their state an opt-out on the Medicaid expansion provision.

The states that opt out are likely to be the ones with the most poor people, who don't pay much in taxes right now, and probably can't afford private insurance. The irony in that case is that those people will be forced to pay the tax whether they are sick or not.

Bob --

This means that in the future when crime is high enough and congress passes a law that everyone MUST own a gun for protection and take shooting lessons, the precedent is now in place to uphold that law.

Plus you will be told what caliber to own. .357 ACP sounds about right.

Ironically, the founding fathers already did that by specifying what weapons citizens were required to keep for militia purposes.

That was, in fact, the first federal mandate, and ironically, may be the last.

Anna the 2nd amendment does not require you to own a gun, just allows it.

As passed by the Congress:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

As ratified by the States and authenticated by Thomas Jefferson, Secretary of State:

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.^[

Those are the two variations of the 2nd amendment.

Steve R.-1932888

How can democaracy have won when 65% of the people don't want it ?

You're making the same false assumptions Fox feeds to their viewers. If you look closely at that 65%, the majority of those think the law as it stands doesn't go far enough.

Bwhahaha....Hey Mittens, this healthcare law was based off of yours.

JBC,

That is interesting. Obamacare ruled unconstitutional means Obama loses. Obamacare ruled constitutional means Obama loses. He just can't catch a break with you can he?

Co,

Because before it was a fine which was unconstitutional. Is that too hard to understand? If something is unconstitutional you change it to become constitutional, you do not just scrap the bill.

The pros for "Obamacare" far outweigh the cons. In the long run, this will help us all save money, drive down the cost of health care, allow students and children to stay on their parents insurance until 26, force insurance companies to stop discriminating against people with "pre-existing conditions," etc.

Romney couldn't even get his facts straight in his response to the ruling! If he doesn't approve of Obamacare, then that must mean he also doesn't approve of his own creation Romneycare. What a joke.

Obama 2012

so is this a win for obama or romney. can't romney say, I told you this healthcare was good since obama apparently modeled it after romneycare. just a question.

@ justicenonexistent

So, what you are saying is that if Romney win, this country will change to "Corporations of America"?

Or will he split up the US and sell it one small pieces as a time to the highest bidder just like he did in BAIN?

Full repeal??

So the GOP wants people with pre-existing conditions not to be covered??

How nice of them...

hillbilly-genius...

Yes, first world countries require something called taxes to sustain the country...

:)

SUBLIMINAL is also SUB-intelligent & SUB-standard....!

The mandate,

requiring every American to purchase health insurance,

appeared in a 1989 published proposal by Stuart M. Butler

of the conservative Heritage Foundation

called "Assuring Affordable Health Care for All Americans,"

which included a provision to "mandate all households to obtain adequate insurance."

IN THE FUTURE

I GUESS THE NUCKING FUTTY GOP OUGHT TO KEEP THEIR BIG IDEAS TO THEMSELVES

SO "COMMUNIST, SOCIALIST COMMUNITY ORGANIZERS" DON'T STEAL THEIR GREAT IDEAS

& GET ALL OF THE CREDIT FOR THE LEGISLATION...!!

justicenonexistent

and if Romney gets in the WH, let's change our country and motto to "We the Corporations of the United Corporate States of America". After all, corporations are people too.

As long as Obama remains in the White House it's "We the People of the United States of America".

Rick-3416939, President Obama's health care law didn't KILL anyone, as opposed to Bush's REAL lie that got 3,000+ American soldiers killed by illegally invading a country who posed NO threat to the U.S., not to mention the 200,000 citizens IN America who died WITHOUT insurance during his 8 years. But don't let THOSE facts get in your way and ruin your day.

Mitt Romney is misleading about medicare. "Romney rarely lets the facts get in the way of his rhetoric, but these oft-repeated accusations ring particularly hallow — and are hardly rare. The savings achieved in Medicare through the Affordable Care Act will help stabilize Medicare by eliminating overpayments to private insurers and slowly phasing in payment adjustments that encourage greater efficiency. As a result, the law extends the life of the Medicare trust fund by eight years and allows seniors to retain all of their guaranteed Medicare benefits. Medicare beneficiaries are already paying less for prescription drug coverage and receiving preventive care as a result of the law, while enrollment in Medicare Advantage has increased and premiums have fallen. The law, in other words, does exactly the opposite of Romney’s claim: it expands Medicare “as we know it.”

source: think progress

Uh oh! Someone is going to call you a bigot now Subliminal. :P

forget it Mitt, you're just talking out your ass as usual... Another 4 yrs of Obama, then Hillary!

Just another nail in this countrys coffin. He is doing a great job bringing this country down, with the help of, who he likes to call the idiot Americans. Hold onto your hats, we are about to take another nose dive in our jobs and economy situation. Something he has ignored from day one in office.

One word: JOBKILLER. So much for that belief more ppl will be paying in to cover everyone who can't afford it. Wish the Left would have read between the lines before you thought this was good.

Nothing from Nothing Leaves Nothing - Obama Re-election Song!

The Republicans sound like a broken record. Really? Is that all they ever have to say? I'm afraid it is since they have no solutions to help this country with the jobs problem their party created.

Shut your pieholes until you have something constructive to say for once. We're all sick of you.

You mean Socialism not Democracy. Next stop "COMMUNISM"

This is going to death to the millions of Americans who can't afford health care but who are healthy. Now they are forced to carry some kind of insurance in order to subsidize those who are sick.

Unhappy, I'll agree with you if you agree that people who have no insurance (regardless of their financial status) will be denied any and all health care unless they pay case for it. That includes repealing the laws that require emergency rooms to treat anyone, as well as eliminating Medicaid.

No payment, no medical care whatsoever. Is that OK with you?

What part of "insurance" do you not understand?

All hail to the cremlin (formerly known as the white house) and Dictator Obama! YEEHAAAA!!!!!!!

Spreme court my As*! the court is now on the take just like the restof our government.

Steve R.-1932888

How can democaracy have won when 65% of the people don't want it ?

Steve- most of those 65% don't know what the law states and have only listened to Faux News or liars like Baner and Romney. When asked in polls, 60-70% or better like things such as no more automatic rejections due to pre-existing conditions, children can stay on your policy until 26, the list goes on. Most Americans like the various parts of the bill of which they are familiar, however, the are unaware that the ACA is what gave them these bennies. It seems obvious, given this, that most of that 65% you refer to, therefore, really don't know what's in this bill. Furthermore, when it kicks in fully, people will love it. 5 years from now it will be as politically suicidal to mess with this as it is right now to touch SS. Further, the repugnicans may have their hands full defending their desire to gut SS this November. This is truly a great victory for most Americans, even if they don't yet know it. I am happy for my country today and full kudos to President Obama. This is just ahead of popping OBL. Today, he and his supporters deserve a victory lap. Kudos!!!

TO: mikedesi0804 who wrote:

"so is this a win for obama or romney. can't romney say, I told you this healthcare was good since obama apparently modeled it after romneycare. just a question."

Whenever you have Republicans "cussin' and spittin'" you KNOW it's NOT a win for them. LOL!

Republicans can't STAND the Average American and can't STAND the thought of their neighbor having quality affordable health care.

So, it's an unbearable loss for Republicans, and an unprecedented win for the American People.

Obama/Biden 2012

You mean Socialism not Democracy. Next stop "COMMUNISM"

Tim, you should probably do a little reading about the definitions of each of the three. But I doubt you will.

Democracy did not win...I'm sorry....A law was passed that was phrased in such a way that it would deny Americans their freedom of choice, yet justifying it as the Congress's power to tax. It's very backhanded in that regard. This bill was passed in an overzealous fashion. DC did not listen to Americans, they listened to their base and party. Our President did not act like the leader of our country, he acted like the Top Democrat. To lead you need to rise above party ideology in order to unite a nation. People will always have differing views on issues, but when I see people, especially senators, gloat, it disturbs me greatly and makes me lose faith in the integrity of the White House and Senate. As an IND, I've voted DEM for the most part, however, today, I'm switching my support...Today the democrats have lost 3 votes, my vote for President, my vote for Senator, my vote for House Rep...I put faith in Barack Obama in 2008 when I cast my vote for him...He's proven based on his actions that he is not the leader I thought he was. Americans can vote whichever way they wish, that is our right, but for this American my vote will not be to re-elect this president.

CoRavensFan

If this is such a great plan, why did they have to make it a tax in order to make it constitutional?

The better question is: if this is such a great plan, why aren't the folks in Congress on it & why have they exempted so many of their crony supporters?

I see Hugh came back for some more today. Hi Hugh. I thought maybe you would read a little before you came back to advertise your education. FYI, there is no country on earth that has a pure form of government, whether that be communism, socialism, democracy (which we are not), republic, theocracy, plutocracy, oligarchy ,Marxism (remember that one?) or anything else you can name. Every country has a combination of this and that and tries to tweak it in such a way as to best serve the people of their country (hopefully- if they have a good government. If not, it's tweaked to serve the masters). The US has been part republic, part democracy, part socialist for a long time- not years, but decades, over a century. China is not pure communist. They are, in fact, more capitalist than we are. Furthermore, nowhere does the US Constitution embrace capitalism, free enterprise, of free markets. It is, in fact, about securing freedom for ALL of our populace and trying to set up an adjustable framework that will serve the best interests of the most people. You really need to crack a book. Socialism is not a bad thing. Most people are social animals- except the teabaggers.

BTW, even Adam Smith, if you know who he was, stated that capitaliams would have to be restrained by businesses' sense of morality and fairness. I don't believe that is any longer on the table.

Incidentally, you may be interested in knowing that Citigroup gloated in a stockholders report in 2005, I think it was, that the banking industry owned the government for all practical purposes and that the US was, in fact, a plutocracy, not a democracy any longer. They stated further that they saw nothing on the horizon that would change that unless a catastrophe occurred to galvanize public support against them. Did you know that the group you're supposrting thinks you're a fool because you still think the government works for you?

What a terrible decision. What else do you expect from a group of people who do not know what an illegal alien is or that killing babies is wrong.

Pitiful really. Good job Libbie's. You took an exceptional nation and destroyed it to fit in with all the looser nations.

Romneycare was the model for the HCR you goof-ball. Why don't you go back and repeal and replace your own law you hypocrite!. Flip-flop, Flip-flop!

Romneycare pass in Massachusetts with the majority support of its population. Obamacare pass against the will of most Americans. That is why Democrats lost the House and will lose the Senate and the White House. What is ok for one state is not necerarily okfor the whole country. That is the mistake from Obama, we don't want Obamacare. You libs can cheer for the rulingfrom SCOTUS a rule that give the status of taxes to the penalty for not to buy heath insurance , something that Obama lie one more time when he said that the penalty was not a tax.

@eric. He could do what Obama did in ignoring immigration law and issue an executive order. Why do you think it is different? I cannot wait for the 170,000 pages of regs, estimated, to deal with this law. They should have kept it simple.

TO: Steve R.-1932888 who wrote:

"How can democaracy have won when 65% of the people don't want it ?"

Because 65% of the American People DO WANT IT.

You must mean "65% of REPUBLICANS don't ACCEPT it.

Obama/Biden 2012

Romney states he will repeal the Health Care law, that is BS, it's like saying he would repeal the income tax laws, the GOP all said it was not Constitutional and the Highest court just said it is, so really can anyone believe Mr.Switch Romney, this guy has NO morals and would lie just to get elected, is this the kind of President We want for America. Not Me! American girl, Steve is using that new math " LOL" they do it all the time that is how they can spend on two Wars and not show it.

I see the gun lobby via a post by Bob-1622113 has weighed in essentially proposing that health care be administered with a .357 whatever. It would certainly be cheaper however the right to life, liberty and pursuit of happiness comes before the second amendment. But to his point, I think the gun lobby would be very unhappy if every adult were required to carry, just imagine all those liberals armed and dangerous. We have the ACA because signal payer, extended medicare and a lot of other schemes smacked of socialism to the GOP and the individual mandate was hatched out of a conservative think tank. Now you're stuck with it. Go lick your wounds.

I find being called a "looser" when they mean loser is rather ironic. Who is the loser? The one that doesn't know basic grammar?

I think people really don't get that the tax part of this only comes into play with the individual mandate and the penalty for not taking insurance. However its not an enforceable, republicans choose to remain ignorant on the basics of health care. They would rather go without insurance than to accept anything a black man passes. Mind you this was originally a very republican plan, and honestly it is forcing Americans to take responsibility for their health care. Right now we have an insane universal health care that only allows the uninsured to get healthcare when they have become so ill that they require long hospitalizations.

Romney cannot repeal this and states cannot be forced to take it, so if you live in Texas, those morons don't ever want help so you are likely safe. States will only take on 10% of the costs and that won't be until 2020. So much misinformation by republicans that is makes me sick. Small business owners will be offered tax credits to help cover this.

If Christ came today, Christians, esp. Right-Wingers, would renounce him and call him a Heretic. Reason, they reject his Words and those of his Prophets, Mark, Luke, and Matthew especially about the Poor, the Needy, versus the Money Changers and the Rich.

You mean Socialism not Democracy. Next stop "COMMUNISM"

Tim, you should probably do a little reading about the definitions of each of the three. But I doubt you will.

Well, Head in a jar, once again you show your ignorance. I am a political science major (just so you know, I hold a degree in the study of governments and their workings) so I believe I have done some reading on the three. I think you should actually sit down and read the Constitution (use a dictionary since there are a lot of big words) and see how this law is unconstitutional as is the supreme courts judgement and the taxation they claim this bill holds.

BTW, all the lame-o posters on here citing "this is the largest tax increase in modern history" are simply regurgitating Rush From today.

Poor peeps couldn't think for themselves if their life depended on it.

redvirginia

I heard romney condem obama'care' today, but strange...he didn't mention what he would do to 'fix' health care either. Can you share with us what Romney's plan is? Maybe he will just change the name of Obama "care" to Romney"care" so that it's more appealing to the GOP?

This is one of the largest tax increases in modern history, and it is aimed directly at the poor and middle class since the rich already have health insurance.

Rick, Why do the rich have health insurance but the poor do not? Does that mean that the poor don't need it?

Some of the rich are young, so it can't be that all the poor are young and don't need health insurance (I'm still curious how anyone knows whether they'll need health care or not).

All this negativity and slander from the opposition with no specific mention of what properties of the bill they disagree with and why, farther perpetrates to rational the correct thing was done and that the opposition is strictly political based and a regurgitation of TV politics with no basis of having read the actual law.

Pat Boston MA. "Democracy wins."

And the Middle Class loses.

Before the Democrats take their 'victory lap', they might want to keep in mind that this will be a $700 Billion tax increase on Middle Class families (that's the estimated revenue generated by fines and penalties).

The rich will be unaffected because they already have health insurance - no additional cost.

The poor get free medical care through Medicaid (courtesy of the taxpayers) - no additional cost.

That leaves the tax burden to be carried by the Middle Class, and each family will have to prove to the IRS that they have health insurance 'acceptable to the government' or pay a fine (tax).

What was that Obama said? - "I pledge that those families making less than $250,000 per year will not have to pay any additional taxes - not one dime"

Remember that in November.

Amazing!!!!

Yesterday Mutt was calling the ACA unconstitutional, today he is calling it bad policy and a bad law.

Mutt is an airhead minion.

Well then let all of congress have the same insurance that we have to contend with. Let them have the same retirement most hard working citizens have. I bet they wouldn't pass the laws they pass if they did.

I don't see whats so hard to understand if you have health insurance you DON'T PAY, and if you can afford health insurance... other functions like medicare is extended to you to make you able to afford it... the only way u end up paying tax is if you sit on your ass and refuse to pay into the health care system until the day comes you need to use it.

Everyone that doesn't have their life ended prematurely needs healthcare at one time or another its something we should all pay for no matter if your sick or healthy at the time. This bill prevents the people paying into the health care system from flipping the bill for people that get sick that never paid into it.... I thought individual responsibility was a conservative idea.

Roy Wilson-you are so right. Makes you wonder what has happened to people being able to think for themselves. We really have an ignorant society. What gets me is that the states will have the right to chose if they want the medicaid expansion and if they say no-then the poor and middle class are the ones who suffer. The ones that don't want to work already get free medical care and the rich can afford, but what about those who are just above poverty level by a few bucks and can't afford the insurance. If the state does not acept the medicaid expansion which they don't have to, then the poor and middle income will have to pay a penalty-not the rich or the ones who don't work-it will be the poor and middle working class that will have to pay the penalty-so the government will be taking money from the poor and middle income-money that these people need to provide for their families-how can anyone call that a victory. Obama again deceived the American people by lying and telling them there would be no taxes. Gotta think what else he is going to do next. I sure intend to remember that in November. I wasn't stupid enough to vote for him the first time and surely wouldn't now. Can't wait to see him gone.

1. Whether he becomes POTUS or not, Romney can't repeal sh!t! That's up to the Congress.

2. Does he understand that the Supremes are dominated by Republicans (very pro-corporate, conservative Republicans). Why do you suppose they decided the way they did? Because it's good for business. Romney is pandering to the Tea Party and won't do more than go through the motions. He'd piss off the insurance industry...won't happen.

3. If he actually were to work successfully to repeal the law, and the insurance rates would do what the insurance rates are projected to do...he would be a 1 term president (and he knows it)...Pandering!

4. Romney is a lot of things (and very few I personally admire)...but he's not stupid!

I didn't want to, but I will have to vote Romney. Whether he wins or not, there is no way in Hell that I will allow the a$$holes in charge to make me purchase health insurance. I will not pay IRS penalties for not having insurance and I will not shell out thousands of dollars a year for insurance premiums when I have not spent $1500 on health care in the last two decades. Socialist Liberals want healthy people like me to pay premiums so that our money can offset the medical costs for the morbidly obese, diabetic, 2 pack a day smoking, alcoholic drug addict who has congenital defects that the parents passed on to them. How about some personal accountability?

You'll notice that this only affects U.S. citizens who pay taxes because illegal immigrants (who don't have a taxpayer I.D.) will still go to hospitals, get their treatment (because they can't be refused treatment) and then never pay a dime.

YAWN.....Just will make it harder to balance the budget when a fiscally responsible prez. occupies the White House in November. Bye bye epic fail Obama.

@Charlie, what 65% based on what survey given in what state. They don't usually take a survey after the fact on somthing like this. What is a FACT here is people only are for or against something like this on the surface read. FACT, once they open the book and start reading it provision by provision. They start to do a lot of Huuums and Aaaaahhs. Texas announced that they are expanding the Medic Aid to help more people on the News at noon. They raise the income cap up to help more people with a little higher income. The positive effects are starting to get going. I suggest you start reading the provisions you might even be pleasently surprised. As for a trillion dollars it's nothing, I can rememder when we went into debt for 2-3 Billion, I was flabbergasted.

Bob-1622113

Anna the 2nd amendment does not require you to own a gun, just allows it.

As passed by the Congress:

A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed.

As ratified by the States and authenticated by Thomas Jefferson, Secretary of State:

A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.^[

Those are the two variations of the 2nd amendment.

Actually, Anna is right. According to the Militia Act of 1792, does states, specifically, that all "able bodied white men between 18, and 45" are to be available for use in the militias, and are required to own a rifle, and the required equipment. It was rewritten in 1862, to include white, and black men. It was altered again, in 1903, and the National Guard was then established. However, the requirements that "all men" be ready, and equipped, not excluded in the 1903 act. So, if read the way it is written, including the preceeding acts, all able bodied men over the age of 18, are REQUIRED by federal statute to own a service ready rifle, and the supplies needed to accompany that rifle.

MireVo3,

You are so wrong. Let me ask you, why do you think that insurance companies should be paid billions of dollars to do nothing more than pay your medical bills (when they choose to)? If every person saved money for health care that they would pay in premiums then the average person would spend less on health care than what they saved throughout their life. Insurance companies figure the costs for the average person and then put a generous 20% (at a minumum, because some companies add 40% or more) gratuity on top of the cost for themselves.

You don't mind paying someone 20% extra to pay your bills for you? If you have a $1200 mortgage then you can pay me $1440 and I will pay it for you.

You're an obese, diabetic, chain smoking, alcoholic drug addict with many health problems as a result? That should not be my problem and I should not have to pay extra through socialized health care because of your poor choices.

Joe Johnson-438582,

Thank you for that correction. I was not aware of that and find it most interesting.

Under todays ruling, as I understand it, a tax could be imposed on those not following the 1903 law as it is written.

Since nobody could answer this question when I asked in another thread I will try it here:

Someone please defend this for me in a rational sense. Here is what Obama said (and sources are given at the end of my statements):

"I can make a firm pledge. Under my plan, no family making less than $250,000 a year will see any form of tax increase. Not your income tax, not your payroll tax, not your capital gains taxes, not any of your taxes."

Here is how this law was upheld in court:

Roberts re-framed the debate over health care as a debate over increasing taxes. Congress, he said, is “increasing taxes” on those who choose to go uninsured.

So how is this a win for America, Obama, or the Democrats if Obama just went 180 degrees on his promise not to raise our taxes? He lied to everyone. He lied to you Democrats to the Republicans to the middle class. I have no respect for that from ANY president. I certainly would not call that a win for any of us.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/promise/515/no-family-making-less-250000-will-see-any-form-tax/

http://nbcpolitics.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/06/28/12457822-supreme-court-upholds-health-care-law?lite

If Obamacare is so wonderful, why did Nevada and many of Pelosi's cronies get waivers? I don't want the incompetant government in charge of anything relating to my healthcare. This has got to be repealed! The fight is NOT over yet.

didn't want to, but I will have to vote Romney. Whether he wins or not, there is no way in Hell that I will allow the a$$holes in charge to make me purchase health insurance. I will not pay IRS penalties for not having insurance and I will not shell out thousands of dollars a year for insurance premiums when I have not spent $1500 on health care in the last two decades.

Your healthy now, but what about tomorrow? What about aging? WHat about ACCIIDENTS? A broken leg can cost you $14,000. Cancer can cost you $250,000. What you are asking for is freedom to be irresponsible, wreck your familiy's finances on some stupiod anti-gobmint tirade. Your kids and familiy must be so secure knowing you are gambling your economic ruin and your life.

BUt I am guessing if you got cancer you would be 1st at the Medical Insurance website trying to get a policy...and you would...thanks to the ACA pre-existing conditions provision. Or maybe you would stick to your principles and go to the ER and WE ALL get to pay for you.

So tell me, who is the 'freeloader' now?

Roberts, you sly dog! You have saddled the Obama / Democrats with the biggest tax increase in history. We know how America reacted to Clinton's huge tax increase. And you did it in a presidential election year.

OK. I do not watch TV. I regret not being more informed on this whole thing. However, my husband listens to all sorts of talking heads and informed of the vote taking place today. The only thing I need to know about this is that the Supreme Court just ruled that it is okay to impose on the American people certain things that are not necessarily for the safety of all and to punish those that do not or are not able to comply. Yes, there are some people who tend to stay healthier than others without ever seeing a doctor, and there are others who steadily ill while seeing a doctor regularly. Some of these people can afford health insurance while others can not. Isn't this the way of life? Some people can afford a car that barely gets them back and forth to work while others have brand new vehicles. Some can afford brand new cars but choose to not live to edge of their means while others buy brand new vehicles when they truly can not afford to. I understand owning a car is different than having health insurance, but isn't this just one of the many options we as Americans should be able to decide upon for ourselves? Not that I agree with this, but unless the health care is completely free, how can you force someone to partake of it? How can someone be forced to spend money on something that they either can not afford or do not want or need? I spent a bit of time early in life trying very hard to survive as a young single mother. Did I rely on Medicaid through that time? Somewhat. Most of the time, it was only available for my son. I had times of illness where the ER was my only option because I knew I could be billed and pay it off a little at a time. I worked hard and paid off what I could when I could. Now, I teach and monthly pay out for health, dental, and vision insurance for my family. My husband is on my insurance plan because it is better care, although not necessarily cheaper. Did we need to invest in it? No. My husband is a truck driver and is rarely able to see a doctor even when he is sick on the rare occassion, however, we made the choice to cover him anyway. Now, I would need to pay for it regardless of the fact that he is not even able to see a doctor because of his work. This should be an individual decision, not a mandate which could fine you should you not comply. But, like I said, I'm not fully informed on this law, so maybe I'm wrong. I can say I'm not fully satisfied with the extreme lack of representation by the government these days, which is not simply with any one party or person. We shall see what the future holds for us as it approaches.

2-lane Gypsy,

I never called anybody a 'freeloader' so you can shove that comment up your smarmy a$$.

When I was married, I carried health insurance. As a single man with no children I can make this choice for myself, without affecting others. I do carry life insurance to cover costs of burial, to pay any outstanding debts that I may incur (currently have no debt) and to give to siblings to do with as they see fit.

I did not go off on an "anti-gobmint" tirade. Just because I don't believe the government should force me to pay for somebody else's medical expenses, as well as make insurance company execs weathly, does not make me "anti-gobmint".

What if I break a leg? Would it require surgical repair? (if not then $2500 would be the average cost) Where did I break this leg? Would it be covered under an outo accident policy, homeowner's policy or policy held by a business? Was I walking down the sidewalk, fell because of clumsiness (not tripped on a defect in the sidewalk) and somehow broke my leg? Well, I guess I would use some of the cash that I put away. The $15,000 is what a hospital would charge your insurance for an emergency visit. As a person with no insurance, you can negotiate the bill down and make payments. If I were conscious at the time I broke the leg then I would call a doctor to get x-rays and a cast rather than visit the emergency room where costs increase by at least 400%.

If I got cancer? Not likely, as there is no family history and I don't smoke. Let's say I did get cancer. Guess what? I had a great life, traveled the world, saw and did many amazing things. No regrets. I would not put myself through chemo for a small chance at survival.

Ohhh Ron B- you almost got me! Right up to the point where you posited, ad naseum, your nirvana fallacy...Fact is- you would be a very rare case if you have been lucky enough to avoid any and all health catastrophes. Putting aside the obvious number 1 and 2 killers(cancer and heart disease which cost tons of dough to treat), you would have to be a complete imbecile to think that you will never need some form of healthcare that would require financial assistance of some kind(ie. insurance). But I guess you'd rather just die of starvation after your funds are depleted from any number of diseases that are not genetically derived, and also happen to be not immediately life-threatening. Perhaps a neuro disorder caused by accidental poisoning, or a flesh eating bacteria that has your doctors slowly amputating your limbs or maybe slowly going blind from a virus you caught on your "world travels"....sound good? Hey-let's say that you are correct and you just die from "old age" -you are still missing the point. The people of this country and government tend to place the weight of their moral and ethical decisions on the benefits of the majority of it's people- not the minority(I know that is tough to swallow- but that is a government's purpose). Therefore, for those of us that are not from a perfect gene pool and don't have enough financial comfort to avoid utter poverty from a chronic health issue, there is now a law that makes this country a little more advanced in terms of it's majority of it's citizenry's well being. So, feel free to die instead of live because you didn't feel like paying a couple thousand bucks a year for insurance(great logic), but allow the rest of us "non-perfect" human beings to have a choice to not go that route, just because you choose money over health...don't confuse personal freedom and bad decision making with the good of the masses.

Oh Red Virginia... Please grow a set and do a little reading. Do you honestly think EVERY President and EVERY party has not used the coercion method to get votes for decades? Bush and the Reps were experts at this to keep their men in line. I have always said they are better at controlling their party than the Dems even to the detriment to the people they represent.

As for those who keep saying obama lied... please explain why HE lied if SCOTUS is the one who decided it is in fact a tax. Did anyone else call him out on this before the ruling? He, along with the party who passed it, thought it was a penalty free and clear. It was ROBERTS who now claims it is a tax... Get over yourself.

at skip @ it is too a tax since you are retired i will be paying more of it than you will for a longer time and nice picture of you and your wife .......wooo ... doggies..ass

Rick-3416939

Funny how often liberals complain that Bush lied to get us involved in Iraq, but are now celebrating the fact that Obama lied to pass a healthcare law. You can bet one ad after another will show Obama saying this is not a tax, followed by the words OBAMA LIED. This is one of the largest tax increases in modern history, and it is aimed directly at the poor and middle class since the rich already have health insurance.

Well, at least Obama isn't costing us money or lives. On the contrary, chances are that it will save both money and lives. Unfortunately, sometimes lies are the only way to do good. In addition, I don't really care that it is a tax increase. If it will improve healthcare in this nation (which it will) and hopefully lead to further reforms (which I hope it will), then I'll pay a higher tax. People in "socialist Europe" are happy to pay higher taxes, as they are guaranteed education, healthcare, and a safety net to rely on if fate strikes. I even say let the Bush tax cuts, as they only benefited the wealthiest Americans. And actually, the bill does not affect the poor, as chances are that they will either be accepted under Medicaid or will be exempted if they cannot afford the costs of health insurance.

This is a tax on behavior, if you decide not to do something the Democratic Party thinks you should, you can now be taxed.

So are the mortgage deduction, the child tax credit, and the tax credit on going to school. The tax code is filled with credits and deductions that offer incentives that can be good for the economy, like purchasing houses, having kids, or going to college. Having health insurance keeps costs low for everyone (including yourself) by preventing the imposition of your healthcare costs on everyone else. You really need to read up on the tax code, dude.

Against Union Thievery

I don't want the incompetant government in charge of anything relating to my healthcare. This has got to be repealed! The fight is NOT over yet.

Then I guess you're not going to accept your check from Medicare to help you with your medical costs, eh??? You remind me of that Tea Party dunce waving that sign saying "Government: Keep your hands off my Medicare."

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

I bet Howard Fineman isn't going to be pleased.

Ed Schultz, I have gone after him many times. But he has been a man speaking on behalf of core democratic principles. He has fought hard for the working people of this Nation and I applaud him and his outstanding work. He is a fighter.

Denver...HuH? Don't you have a few fires to put out.

Someday you will be grateful for this law, and will thank President Obama in creating this for all the American people.

There have already been several people posting on the Denver Post's article thread calling for the immediate arrest and trial for treason of the Justices who ruled in favor ot ACA.

And one poster who claimed that the basis for this demand was that the court ruling was unconstitutional!

What ever happened to people who had a basic understanding of how the US government was designed to work?

Pat Boston MA.

People are happy about this outcome, yet people are asking across the internets why David Gregory continues to smack down any President Obama successes.

Why does he continue to be a voice for the GOP? Why? He's supposed to be a journalist. He always bends towards the GOP.

Because David Gregory is a tea sucking bagger; I suspect.

Gingerbread - Yes on the fires - Since they are closing in on the U.S. Airforce Academy - The Federal Government has decided to step in and fly some of their C-130s to try and put it out.

Yes - Healthcare for all is a good thing. I argue with how it was voted into law and what it contains.

It is Massachusetts prerogative under the 10th amendment to vote in their healthcare package.

It is NOT correct for the Federal government's to utilize the 10th amendment and a silly "commerce clause" because you might have to buy it - to circumvent the U.S. Constitution's 10th amendment.

So far this Administration and Congress has trampled the U.S. Constitution's "Bill of Rights" - the 1st, 2nd, 4th & 10th. are being trampled. Just try to go and protest anything in front of a government building that the "Secret Service" has established as a "No-Protest zone" - Do you know that the reason the first amendment is there so you can redress (protest) government actions. So why would the U.S. Congress and the President vote into law a law that directly abridges the right to free-speech.

Gregory is a Republican. That's why MTP is such a lousy program now. He hard balls the Democrats and slow balls the Republicans.

Denver, did you not read the article, or the court's decision? The Court held the law could not be upheld via the commerce clause, but could be upheld based on Congress's Taxing Authority; therefore, this Administration did not trample on the Constitution. That said, I've never been a big fan of this law because I was a public option proponent, and still would prefer a Medicaid for all system which allows people to supplement their universal single payer coverage with private insurance at very affordable rates, like what they have in Australia, which is very liked there.

Denver - With respect, I view the whole "states rights" thing differently than you do. I believe that should have been settled, to a certain extent, with the American Civil War. The basis for that being if states are going to accept all the benefits of being in the Union (there are too many to even try to list), then it seems logical, and fair, to expect those same states to play by the Union's rules when it comes to certain things.

The "certain things" part is the only issue really up for debate. I believe health care is a universal problem, not a state issue.

Who cares about Mitt Romney the "Outsourcer and Chief" anymore. He's irrelevant now.

First he was Against Universal Health Care before he was Against "it", before he was for "it" back in Massachussettes.

Everybody sees that Romney the "Outsourcer and Chief" is a Flip-Flopper, a poser, a wannabe, a Liar.

Remember, Mitt is from the Party of George Bush, Dick Cheney, Karl Rove, Haliburton, Blackwater, etc. etc.

Vote a straight Democratic ticket come this November 2012, to make sure Mitt Romney does Not Destroy the Working and Middle-class.

Pat Boston's quote "yet people are asking across the internets why David Gregory continues to smack down any President Obama successes. Why does he continue to be a voice for the GOP? Why? He's supposed to be a journalist. He always bends towards the GOP"

Sorry to break the news to you Pat, but David Gregory is a registered Democrat, and a progressive democrat at that.

Beverly in Chicago, you could not be more wrong.

JCB - you're a liar - David Gregory is a hard core Republican.

Tim Russert was a Democrat but you could never tell when he was on MTP. He was truly objective and a great journalist. He is sorely missed.

Thank-you God and thank-you President Obama for Keeping my Family Safe and the Families of all Independent Voters, Dems, honorable Ron Paul supporters, and minorities and people of color, Safe from the likes of those Domestic Terrorists, crazy-wacko Teabaggers, gun-toting Neandrethal, knuckle-dragging Republicans, and of course Mitt Romney who wants to Destroy the Working and Middle Class.

That's why everybody should mvote s straight Democratic ticket to make sure Mitt Romney and the Republicans end up on the "Dung Heap of History" where they rightfully belong.

Remember, Roney's GOP party is the party of George Bush, Dick Cheney, Karl Rove, Haliburton, Blackwater, etc. etc. did I mention Karl Rove.

That enough to make anybody vote a straight Democratic ticket, wouldn't you Agree?

God Bless you, President Obama.

This is a blow to Republicans that think they know "the will of the people" and "the constitution" but prove time and time again that they don't.

This was a victory for democracy.

Romney campaigning against Obamacare is NOW a waste of time.

Eric, if you remember the 2010 elections were about Obamacare.

The tea party was formed because of Obamacare.

Dems are in serious trouble if they support the largest tax increase in the history of the world.

This tax increase will not be on just the wealthy, it will be on anyone who has a job.

SeekingSanity's quote "JCB - you're a liar - David Gregory is a hard core Republican. Tim Russert was a Democrat but you could never tell when he was on MTP. He was truly objective and a great journalist. He is sorely missed"

OK Sanity, BACK UP your quote smarty. Proof it! Your just a another comic behind a keyboard, everyone in Washington DC knows David Gregory is a democrat. His wife is Beth Wilkinson, a well known activist liberal lawyer.

Here is a direct quote from the Huffington Post "Just as Russert had been before him, Gregory was viciously and voraciously hostile toward Bush, Conservatives and the GOP Presidential candidates in particular"

Hardly a conservative InSanity, now apologize for your post, liar!

Bob-1622113 - as usual, you spout your lies over and over again with no factual data to back them up.

JCB - just because someone is married to a Democrat doesn't mean they are. Look at Matlin/Carville.

Gregory is a hardcore Republican.

Thank you, President Obama, for getting other people to pay the bulk of my medical bills!

Gregory is a hardcore Republican.

prove your post, oh you can't because it's a lie.

Here is a direct quote from the Huffington Post "Just as Russert had been before him, Gregory was viciously and voraciously hostile toward Bush, Conservatives and the GOP Presidential candidates in particular"

Denver:

You have car insurance, don't you? Bet you are glad everyone is required to have it so now you don't have to pay for all damages yourself. The same can be applied to Health Care. We will all be grateful for it in the end. It is about time we caught up with Europe and Canada, anyways.

All this proves is that Obama is a liar. Obama claimed over and over this was not a TAX, and yet it has only been upheld as a TAX. This will go down as one of the largest tax increases in modern history, and one of the biggest lies to ever be uttered by our president. People are opposed to this law on almost a 2-1 margin, and now more then ever Obama needs to go. This is a terrible bill rammed down the throats of all Americans, and now we learn what Obama tried to hide, it is a major tax increase!

Constitutionality doesn't equal good legislation.

All this proves is that Obama is a liar. Obama claimed over and over this was not a TAX, and yet it has only been upheld as a TAX. This will go down as one of the largest tax increases in modern history, and one of the biggest lies to ever be uttered by our president. People are opposed to this law on almost a 2-1 margin, and now more then ever Obama needs to go. This is a terrible bill rammed down the throats of all Americans, and now we learn what Obama tried to hide, it is a major tax increase!

Constitutionality doesn't equal good legislation.

good gosh Harley Chick... can't you find something better to do with your time besides bashing President Obama? I mean, like ride that piece of garbage you call a scooter... better hurry though, you'll be having to sell it soon in order to comply with the new Affordable Healthcare Law, after all... you need health insurance more than you need a leaky, oily, noisy vibrator on two wheels! It's all good... just another 4 yrs of Obama and then you can enjoy a Hillary administration

Romney's election has now been sealed and secured :-)

Harley, but you went lock-step with and gushingly fawned all over Bush, over the lie that was the Iraq War because of emotions being the driving force with ALL Americans after 9/11? You salivated over the continuous cuts in taxes Bush passed, which right now are at a historic low, and NOW complain that taxes 'may' go up because of health care for ALL? Didn't you complain over the 200,000 that lost their lives because they DIDN'T have insurance during the Bush years? Don't you ALREADY get taxed via your insurance plan and take a deduction for medical exspenses you've paid thru out the year? If MOST Americans knew how much of a safety net they will have because of this health care act being upheld, compared/opposed to the GOP/Romney/Ryan backed plans that would also devastate those who are insured now, including those who are ill-informed/uneducated, the GOP-run House would be a ghost town. And as a side-note, for the NRA to publicly state they are 'targeting' officials who don't vote their way, as in the Eric Holder fictitious and fabricated contempt over nothing but their/GOP way to usurp democracy as a whole, is nothing more than blackmail, threats, and treason towards AMERICA as a whole. But you don't mind THAT type of legislation, eh?

Fantomdog, what Harley dog isn't smart enough to understand is this. Us liberals just found some minor appreciation with the choice of Supreme Court Justices President Bush appointed. Justice Roberts cast the decisive vote making Obama Care constitutional. See... there's a silver lining behind every dark cloud. Oh and as usual, she's wrong about Mitt... that flip-flopper is toast. Now if we can just get some more repugs outta the Senate and Congress, we'll see what President Obama can really get done!

I loved Tim Russert but impartial he was not. You could always tell he was a democrat.

Rosupi

Denver:

You have car insurance, don't you? Bet you are glad everyone is required to have it so now you don't have to pay for all damages yourself. The same can be applied to Health Care.

Car insurance is not a tax & apparently you don't need it to operate a motor vehicle, otherwise I wouldn't be paying for "underinsured motorist/uninsured motorist coverage" on MY policy. If the person doesn't have sufficient/any insurance, my policy takes the hit, therefore driving up my premiums even though I've played by the book.

They are two totally different things.

The GOP has been on the wrong side of so many issues and been road-killed so many times you would think that sooner or later they would want to do the right thing just to remember what it feels like and to show that they can. But apparently not. I guess we must all admit that at least they are consistent.

No Harley, it just proves John Stuart Mill was right when he said: “… I did not mean to say that the Conservatives are generally stupid. I meant to say that stupid people are generally Conservative.”

lmao! very good quote Marc!

Marc, you do realize that John Stuart Mill was commenting on British Conservatism of the 19th Century, right? Mill actually embraced many facets of Libertarianism, including fiscal conservatism. He very much believed in limiting the power of government. If he were alive today, he'd likely think Obamacare was an absolute disaster in the making.

Constitutionality doesn't equal good legislation

What do you say about Citizens United?

It is NOT correct for the Federal government's to utilize the 10th amendment and a silly "commerce clause" because you might have to buy it - to circumvent the U.S. Constitution's 10th amendment.

Try to keep up. Roberts decided based on the Congressional power regarding taxation, not the commerce clause. Try the 16th Amendment:" The Congress shall have power to lay and collect taxes on incomes, from whatever source derived, without apportionment among the several States, and without regard to any census or enumeration." Since the "fine" is progressive rather than regressive and it disappears with a low enough income level, Roberts considered it a tax.

@Pat Boston, rightly put, but if someone thinks I'm a poker pot up for grabs, they have another thing coming and the same can be said for you. Romney has showed me 3 things 1 he can't play Poker and 2 he can't play politics. 3 He can't produce his Income Tax Forms.

I really can't believe people still use the car insurance analogy. It isn't even close. You have a CHOICE to own a car, and with that CHOICE comes the added expense of insurance. You are not being forced to buy a car with insurance and then told if you don't buy that car you will be taxed for not buying said car. this insurance mandate says you must either buy insurance, or pay a tax. you have no choice.

I guarantee unemployement will rise as employers shed those employees in excess 50 to avoid the excess costs associated with this act - the cutoff to be excluded from the employer mandate of providing health insurance or pay a penalty per employee. At an average of $1500 per employee for family coverage - that's an added $900,000 cost to employers of just 50 people.

I hope you all enjoy your unemployment.

I don't disagree with many of the rules placed on insurance coverage, i disagree with the forcing of people to purchase something or be penalized - including small businesses.

Insurance rates will increase as well. The mandage that says that the highest premium cannot be more than a certain percentage of the lowest premium will cause the low risk single person rates to increase in order to satisfy that mandate.

Unfortunately when it comes to Citizens United it proves it goes the other way too. Good legislation isn't necessarily constitutional. CU needs an amendment in order to do away with it.

Apparently my comment was removed from the Vine; I wonder why?

Here it is again:

Someone please defend this for me in a rational sense. Here is what Obama said (and sources are given at the end of my statements):

"I can make a firm pledge. Under my plan, no family making less than $250,000 a year will see any form of tax increase. Not your income tax, not your payroll tax, not your capital gains taxes, not any of your taxes."

Here is how this law was upheld in court:

Roberts re-framed the debate over health care as a debate over increasing taxes. Congress, he said, is “increasing taxes” on those who choose to go uninsured.

So how is this a win for America, Obama, or the Democrats if Obama just went 180 degrees on his promise not to raise our taxes? He lied to everyone. He lied to you Democrats to the Republicans to the middle class. I have no respect for that from ANY president. I certainly would not call that a win for any of us.

http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-meter/promises/obameter/promise/515/no-family-making-less-250000-will-see-any-form-tax/

http://nbcpolitics.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/06/28/12457822-supreme-court-upholds-health-care-law?lite

Rosupi,

Auto insurance is not required everywhere. Even in states where it is required, people do not always have insurance. An old stupid b!tch failed to yield right of way, totaled my truck, she had no insurance, I maintained full coverage (even though the truck was paid for) so my insurance took care of my truck. I will keep auto insuance because I cannot control the actions of stupid people. I will not maintain health insurance because I can control my own actions, manage my own risk and remain healthy by avoiding: smoking, drinking to excess, doing drugs, etc.

I've spent less than $1500 on doctor/hospital visits in the last 2 decades.

I should not have to pay high health insurance premiums to cover the medical costs for people who make poor lifestyle choices.

Romney's election has now been sealed and secured :-)

Hermetically sealed and buried and secured in a compost pile. HArley, its sucks to be a LOSER like you today. I must admit Im enjoying this.

2-Lane - Can you answer my question at 3.38 then? I am just curious how you're viewing this as a win considering it was passed by lying about how it affect taxes. Thanks.

Pelosi can breathe a sigh of relief. her botox injections will resume and her waxed figure face will stay intact, hey Nancy, don't forget to stay out of the sun.

Now Teddy can rest? He was a drunk that got away with murder, he's resting alright, hopefully in hell.

LMMFBBON !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Obama is a bald-faced LIAR. He always asserted that this was not a tax. The law was written as it being a penalty. Every single time a reporter questioned this as a tax, OBimbo and the DemocRATS screamed that it was not a tax, but a penalty or fine.

ODumbA$$ in an interview with George Stephanopoulos ridiculed George about looking up the definition of a tax in the dictionary. OLiarLips repeatedly rejected calling this a tax.

Roberts, after properly rejecting the Commerce Clause arguement, basically re-wrote the law as a tax and then ruled that a tax was constitutional.

This is the biggest sellout of the Supreme Court I've seen in my lifetime.

November can't come soon enough

6dogs,

OLiarLips can't produce any of his school and college records, any thesis that he wrote, any of his grades, show where he got the money to travel the world and then go to some the most expensive colleges in the country when he admitted he spent his high school years in a daze. Smoking pot, doing cocaine, drinking heavily, etc.

He has sealed all his records and yet the liberals don't seem to mind that at all.

Can you say "Double Standard"?

If Obamacare is so wonderful, why did Nevada, Harry Reids state, and many of Pelosi's cronies get waivers? I don't want the incompetant government in charge of anything relating to my healthcare. This is a tax and will hurt the middle class most of all. This has got to be repealed! The fight is NOT over yet. The Supreme Court does not levy taxes. Congress does. They went out of their jurisdiction.

Yep, spike that football.....wait a minute.....Flyeisty trief to do that with the first post. I wonder why her first post seems to always be collapsed.

It ain't over till it is over.

Mr. Obama, stand by for a Presidental election loss by a landslide.

One and GONE.

@JCB

Sorry but as is frequently the case with other claims of 'fact' that comes from the lunatics on the right....you couldn't be more WRONG about Gregory being a democrat or even leaning democratic. Any idiot with an Internet connection and a search engine can verify this...easily....multiple reliable sources.

What are your sources.....besides propaganda outlets like the relentless conservative blotter....putz.

Hmmm... In some ways, this is like the Motorcycle Helmet Laws that require motorcycle riders to wear helmets. Many motorcycle riders do not approve of this. However, ask any firefighter, paramedic, police officer, or hospital emergency room workers, and they will tell you why helmets might be a very good thing.

I am a moderately conservative Republican. However, I do not follow Party "group think." I realize there is a basic bottom line to this matter:

Everyone needs some form of health insurance plan.

Therefore, all U.S. citizens should have access to the exact same health and dental coverage plans as the members of Congress. What is good enough for the members of the U.S. Congress should be good enough for anyone else.

With 30 to 50 million more subscribers, the costs should be much lower, and, more manageable for all.

I am retired. Between MediCare and private insurance, I pay about $950 per month for health and dental insurance. It would be great if "ObamaCare" could help lower that cost.

Can you say BLOWOUT in Congressional and Senatorial and Presidential elections !!!! Republicans will ROMP !!!!

Romney is just shooting some BS, if the highest court upheld the Health Care there is nothing he can do as President, face it it's over and he just wants to be like the rest of the GOP good for nothings, diddly squat but I'm sure the heard will try their very best to steal the Election.

@Against Union Thievery

Congress passed the affordable health care act, not the supreme court.

Congress therefore is levying the tax.

Supreme Court just verified that it was constitutional.

But hey, don't let the facts get in the way of that angry rant you have going on.

History in the making....Wow!!!!!!!!.... Some day we are all going to thank the present administration

for taking us to the future.Change is needed, change is good.Get use to it.Maybe no one will have to buy medicine from a neighboring country any longer.

So Mitt Romney has vowed that should he become the next President of the United States of America he will repeal the very same kind of health care package he gave to Massachussets. Bravo, Mit Romney, you double-speaking forked-tongue son of Satan.

The USA is getting more communist by the day..

President Bush appointed Chief Justice Roberts. So, when Obamacare further tanks our economy, everyone can STILL blame Bush. Well played, Democrats, well played.

Hey Mutt,

Try acting like a man for once! I know it might be difficult.

This is a victory for America. Why do welfare recipients get cover 100 percent while the hard workers have to pay for insurance, deductible etc..... I have lived in this country for 35 years and trust me accident can happened to anyone, I am the proof of it. Lost all my saving when I broke my shoulder 10 years ago. yes, the insurance fixed me up but barely paid for physical therapie , it cost me my saving. I have seen too many people that do not want to pay the expense of insurance even at my work, they choice not to but have no problem going to movies, goihg out to eat, buying expensive shoes etc.........because they know that if something bad happen to them, hospitals have no choice then taking care of them . Enough is enough lets all pay our share. Everyone should be cover, this the richest country in the world.

thanks mr obama now that you mandated we all have to be insured so we can pay for all those millions who would have otherwise soon be without. i am so greatful knowing i will be paying for the kids to be insured on thier parents til age 26 thanks for that big favor. maybe if they got off their ass and worked as i have since high school they could pay it thierselves. thankfully this will lose you another 4 yrs to ruin all our lives...and that's when i will be greatful to you for this.

and the only reason anyone on here feels victorious about this are already insured thru work or a spouses employer or on parents. so keep up with your rightous coments about ones responsibility to have ins because you have no clue what this is going to do to everyone else and this economy.

thanks obama for taxing us to death.

It's funny that the so-called good Christian people of America,who don't like this health care act are the ones that don't need it because they're rich!So is it about helping the less fortunate or holding on to your real God,money?!I was embarassed to find out that countries like Switzerland, Venezuela,and Thailand had universal health care and big-bad America didn't based on the top 1%'s greed,greed of the doctors/insurance companies/hospitals,and politicians!Shame on anyone that would deny a sick child medical treatment.I'd love to be there when you try to explain that to your maker!

Okay Lusitania....please explain what you think communism is because you obviously have no clue. Communism is the catch-all phrase for anything that makes you uncomfortable- like change. You should start applying those same conspiracy theories to some thought about what Citizens United is going to accomplish...and I hope for your sake you are filthy rich.

By the way...the mandate will not be enforced. The fine will not be imposed. Some of you need to read for yourselves and quit listening to idiots like Rush and Palin.

they refused to do the budget all these years so now they have to steal it from us being the desperate irresponsible worthless ones i've yet to see. and he dare mention personal responsibilty. hell now he wants anything else you may be recieving of value from your marriage to your birthday gifts. i bet not one person is going this and if you hear about it it's a lie just like the billion dollar campaign he bragged about having. i do not know what dems see in a liar and a thief.

Whats up with the Repeal Replace Sign in front of Romney. He knew this was coming. And what is he going to Replace this with. Some questions and straight answers from him would be nice. Check him out in 2006 defending Social health care. Its close to the same plan he is planning to GET 60 votes to repeal and 60 votes to replace. Good luck with that.

Oh and chartsweb Romney says the same thing in the video I linked. No B.S. Watch it Personal Responsibility

http://blogs.wsj.com/washwire/2012/06/28/videos-from-2006-show-romney-defending-health-care-mandate/

.

sonya...good to know you are so rich and afford ins for yourself and the millions now able to keep ins because of this mandate you are paying to support. great you are happy to pay. let us know your feelings when all this kicks in. you may be surprised how you feel about affording this.

It seems wrong to me that this law is legal only because it is a tax. any other view of it legally is unconstitutional. Something this far reaching and costly that directly affect each one of us should be put before the voting public for approval. The will of the people has been eliminated it seems in the last few years . No body knows what all is in this tax bill.. Not even the judges who upheld it.

Can you only imagine what the supplement insurance premiums will be for seniors on Medicare when the HUNDREDS OF BILLIONS OF $$$$$ are cut from the Medicare program? I just thought it was Obama that threw the seniors under the bus but Justice Roberts by letting the law change from the time it passed until the Supreme court decisions just got in the driver's seat. The decision was NOT made on the law that was passed. My supplemental insurance premium already increased and my company stated that it was because of Obamacare.

for all of you Obama lovers (worshippers) who desire him to totally control your lives, well baby you got it today.

Romney has said that if (I say when) he gets elected in November, his first order of business will be to repeal Obamacare.

Romney's first order of business should be to order that the IRS NOT ENFORCE any taxes imposed by the health care bill by EXECUTIVE ORDER. You know, just like Obama and the immigration law.

Such a sad, sad day for what was once the greatest country in history.

Here America.... look at my (oops, I mean your) victory:

U.S. will pay for half of all health care costs by 2020 - July 28, 2011

"By 2020, nearly 30 million additional people are expected to have health insurance because of reform.

Over the 10-year period, the report showed that the biggest annual jump in health care spending will happen in 2014 when health reform is fully implemented.

CMS estimates that in 2014 about 23 million uninsured consumers will gain access to health insurance, mainly through government programs such as Medicaid and through the creation of federal and state-funded health insurance exchanges.

As a result, the government expects Medicaid spending to surge 20% in 2014 and private health insurance spending to increase 9.4%.

Norwalk said the estimated sharp surge in Medicaid spending just in one year, is very concerning given that states are already struggling with their budgets.

As millions more gain access to health insurance, the government expects spending on prescription drugs, physician and hospital services to increase as well.

CMS expects prescription drug spending to jump by 10.7% in 2014 and to account for 11% of national health spending by 2020. Spending on physician and clinical services is forecast to rise by 8.9% by 2014, representing 19% of overall health care spending."

http://money.cnn.com/2011/07/28/news/economy/healthcare_spending_forecast/index.htm?source=cnn_bin&hpt=hp_bn3

P.S. Keep in mind these are even the government released numbers, the reality will be much worse.

Good job obama, if you would have called me i would have gave you the advice not to push your bill till after you got re elected but now since us poor americans who are basically holding up our economy but barely scraping by are going to be forced to pay for some strangers bills you basically should just resign because now you have no chance of being re elected.

Why should I have to buy insurance when I'm lean and Healthy to Pay for some fat cow that go's to the doctor twice a day..

Obama and the people that have crammed the Obamacare down our throats need to study the history of health insurance. Health Insurance was not started to pay for all the health costs that it now does it was meant to cover major medical and people still paid their health care provider out of their own pockets. Health insurance is now more expensive than it was then and will as a health insurance company admitted on the news tonight go up with the expenses that will be covered for those who take health insurance instead of the TAX that our DICTATOR IN CHIEF is forcing on us, good job BO I will of course as a person who has several insurance designations and have worked for years in insurance not only do not buy your crap but will work for ROMNEY 2012. I do question what BO or his ugly wife will get out of this in the form of an incentive.

Let's see now;

The nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office now says that Obamacare, which was supposed to be 'revenue neutral', will likely cost $1.76 Trillion (link below), so who's going to pay for it?

The 'rich'? No, because they already have health insurance, so they don't have to pay the fine/tax.

The 'poor'? No, because they get free health insurance from the government thru Medicaid.

Let's see now, who's left to pay for it? Oh yes - the Middle Class. This could be the biggest tax increase in history on the Middle Class.

When they find they've been 'snookered' by Obama, I doubt that they will be very happy.

Remember how Obama said "I pledge that any families making less than $250,000 per year will not have to pay any increased taxes - not one dime"? Well guess what - the Supreme Court says Obamacare is OK because it's a TAX.

Remember this in November.

http://washingtonexaminer.com/article/1175831

Forget all the politician drivel being put forward by the posters, on both sides. The facts are that more American like it, than those who hate it. As for Mitt Romney repealing it on his first day, first, he has to win the election. The he needs the Republicans to keep control of the House. Then, he needs a veto-proof majority in the Senate. None of these are locks. If there is a lock in there, it's that the Democrats will not lose enough Senate seats to get that veto-proof majority. After the last threee-and-a-half years of Republicans blocking legislation because they had forty plus Senators, who honestly expects the Democrats not to follow the example of our my-way-or-the-highway pattern the Republicans have used so often. So, let me putit another way, Mitt Romney is crazy if he thinks he's got a real chance of repealing this law.

Victory?!? Some victory, they will now gut social security without a viable alternative, so the elderly will go without. Cost will go through the roof as with every government program that has ever come down the pike. All you young folks who don't have insurance will now have to buy it or pay fines until you do. A panel of bureaucrats will decide what and how much treatment you will receive before it becomes too expensive for the state.

Ahh yes, If you love the DMV or standing on line for any government service, you'll love this crap. A victory, yeah for the elitists who opted out of it the second it passed, that would be Obama, Congress, Senate and all of his white house lackeys. They will continue to get free everything, no co-pay, no deductible, no exceptions. While the rest of us get treated live cattle at the slaughter house.

You think the medical stocks shot up after this victory was announced because they aren't going to squeeze Obama-don't-care for every last dime? Sure they will and "O" will say it good for the country, more deficit, no jobs, and fines for those who can't buy insurance and the end of social security, What a victory. ALL dirty, ALL the time.

And Justice Robinson, What the hell were you thinking????? This is Constitutional??? Foisting an unfunded mandate on the people, when you routinely won't allow doing the same for the state?!?! Seriously??? Might I suggest a re-read? This is Quite probably your most inexplicable and disappointing ruling, ever.

Anyone can have an accident at anytime, I am the proof of it. I lost my saving 10 years ago when I brooke my shoulder. The insurance fixed me up alright but only gave me around 15 physical therapie vists . I had to empty my saving without doing this, I would not be able to use my shoulder.The problem is that insurance companies are so greedy and people that work for then as well, including hospitals ad doctors. If the government can pay 100 percent for welfare recipients, why can they make it affordable for everyone.......Please stop bringing people from differents country that we have to support.

Mike O Pierce;

Please allow me to point out the fact that until the 2010 mid-terms your hero's had a super majority in both houses and could get nothing done because they couldn't get their ducks in a row. So two of those years are the fault of the left and their mindless contempt for the American people. How soon the left forgets or they employ their usual selective memory. The left has as much dirt on it's hands as the right over the last four years.

And by the way, The Polls show 60% of Americans don't want it. Look beyond the DNC drivel for your information. We'll see who's right in November, if 60% oppose it as the polls say, then we can expect to see a like number of Dems losing their cushy jobs.

As a nurse, i will guarantee you that many doctors will opt of this electronic social nightmare of a system. You will become a number, not a patient, and you better make your appointments well in advance... maybe a year or two.

David Gregory...danced with Karl Rove.....Gregory is a repub....end of story........

Harley Chic....I believe you...so....can I make an appointment with you..?....My Angel of mercy....Supply room?

If you have any money quickly invest in health insurance companies. they are the winners today, stock should be up up up tomorrow!

Biggest tax increase in the history of ... of course it will be if you compare the amount at the end based on the past 10years and not the full history of the United States especially while purpossefully ignoring the rate increases in percentage measures in the few hundred years we have been developing. However, include the increase of percentage and then refelct in comparatives, what we see today as a trillion would in our founding years been about hundreds and comapratively this supposed increase is, based on percentages, equal or less then many reforms of the past. The same rule that applies to why a soda that cost 5cents 50years ago and now costs more then a dollar for the same amount, but the republican machine does not want you to be that educated in your evaluations, they only want to terrify you with big numbers far beyond the comprehension of either middle class or poor people. As to harleyChic, you have lost your mental faculties if you equate good legislation to the loss of constitutional value, and you abuse your own policy of thought by taking advantage of the 1stamendment to spout your filth. As to the loss of america as the greatest nation of the world, we have yet to achieve that status but for in the minds of irrational would be mouth pieces for a disgruntled rich who see the horizon eventually equalling their fall. Americans will destroy this nation's chances at greatness by their sheep like following of a hound instead of the wolf. If however you are all so frieghtened by this minor tax leap, get off your macines and go change the system, start by extorting the rich as they have for generations now extorted the livelihood of the american middle class and poor. Unless of course you are afraid to take on the big dogs and only settle for mouth piecing on obscure news threads to get your jolly, "I am tough read it!" fix. American Revolution is on the rise and the rich are arming the weak minded against the practical, blood will continue to spill so long as we support the rich, the quasiamerican heirachy working so deeply to establish a legal Kingship of Authority. Obama is one president, many more to come and all I can hope is that American's will continue to put these rebellious souls (such as Obama who enjoys bucking the trend) into office. For good or for ill, politicians are all the same and eventually the People will finally strike back, yet unlike most of you and the majority of politicians, we will do so within our Constitutional Rights. Have a good day no knowledges nay-sayers slaving yourselves to rich mouth rhetoric and fear.

It was Romney's State of MA, whose healthcare that served as the role model for this new Healthcare System. Now, the flip-flopper is saying that he will repeal it, it's immoral, etc., etc. Isn't Romney smart enough to realize that he is making a complete lying fool of himself??? Also, he is saying that the healthcare he helped to design and approved for his state is not any good, and now he is going to repeal the healthcare law for this Nation if elected. That sure doesn't say much for his policies, ethics, honesty, or concern for his constituents, etc. And the Republican Party wants him for a Pres. ?? Oh, I forgot, many of the Republicans do this all the time (lying and speaking out of both sides of their mouth). Plus, it's okay for them to do it, but not so for others. Do Republicans think everyone in the U. S. is completely oblivious of their manipulative side-stepping, behavior, etc. ?

For once this is something for almost everyone, and not just the elite, who can afford the healthcare payments.

To the Repubs/Tea Baggers:

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!! All of those months and months of talking trash about a full repeal, all of months of endless posturing and all of those millions of words wasted on rallying cries - - you LOST!! The next BIG LOSS for you Repubs will be in the upcoming election. Now all we will hear from you is sour grapes and how you will take over this country in 2012. Your goals to stage a political coup will be thwarted.

PRoberFantomdog, what Harley dog isn't smart enough to understand is this. Us liberals just found some minor appreciation with the choice of Supreme Court Justices President Bush appointed. Justice Roberts cast the decisive vote making Obama Care constitutional.

What libs are not smart enough to understand what Justice Roberts did is:

1. By Obama Administration defining it as a tax in court, the Administration now allows Congress to overturn the law with simple majority (50%+1) instead of a super majority (2/3) vote. So the bill can now be easily overturned.

2. With the majority of individuals against this legislation, like the 2010 election, voters who might be undecided right now, will ensure that this legislation goes away by deciding to vote Republican once again. Like the 2010 election, come Nov we might have another "historical" outcome.

3. Ensured the States do not have to participate. Without the States participation the program will not operate nor be paid for. Congress routinely makes federal funding of new programs dependent on acceptance of federal regulations. But for Medicaid to be constitutional, the States have to be able to say no. Without the mandate of the Medicaid expansion, the exchanges don't work. Without the exchanges, the employer incentives don't work. Without those four things, the tax increases don't make sense. At this point you've gutted all the major provisions of the act, and without them there's no way Congress would have passed any of the rest of it.

Libs may have won the battle, but in reality they lost the entire war. There is no way to pay for it unless all 50 States participate.

Romneycare was a STATE provision - Everyone that I speak to say it was their biggest mistake.

The 10th amendment allowed the State to do what it did. The 10th amendment is there for that reason.

The U.S. Congress - has decided that it can subvert the U.S. Constitution for the last time.

And what will you do when you finally get sick? And you will. Go to the emergency room and make ME pay for it? Typical free-loading tea baggin' fool.

Romney and repubs have no plan...except to take the economy down as they pledged.

The first economic plan from the republicans ...was to blow up the economy so president Obama would not have a second term. Newt said it was the first seed sown for the 2012 election. 14-15 republicans secretly met the dat after Obama took office to pledge to vote against every bill that would help the economy recover. They pledged this saying they wanted him to be a one term president. They pledged to take the economy down just to destroy the presidents plans for recovery. Bin Laden wrote down the same plan and executed 911 to take the economy down to destroy the nation. These repubs, Ryan, Cantor, DeMint, and Gingrich pledged to act like the Taliban, to act like the insurgents do,(their own actual words) to prevent President Obama from a second term. Acting like the supreme terrorist of all time Bin Laden. Traitors. Deliberately sabotaging the recovery. Ref Richard draper new book.

Ryan repub Plan...Kills socoial security and medicare. Repubs want to destroy the Post Office and privatize that also.......Take down America and give more tax breaks to the rich 1%. Romney for a worse tomorrow today!.

Vote President Obama/Biden 2012

Actually Bob, Massachusetts residents approve of Romneycare by over 60% and that number keeps going up. Massachusetts is also one (if not the only) state in which health care costs have been stabilized, even as they continue to skyrocket all over the country.

I believe Romneycare has been an enormous success. 98% of the state's residents have health care. Match that against any state in the Nation and you may be shocked at the comparison.

Denver Bob: apparently you have missed the news, the Affordable Care Act was ruled Constitutional by the US Supreme Court. Sorry to burst your bubble, but Congress did not act unconstitutionally.

Now when is the Replicon House going to pass a real jobs bill ?

SeekingSanity:

"Bob-1622113 - as usual, you spout your lies over and over again with no factual data to back them up."

What did I lie about? That this is now the largest tax increase in the history of the world or that there is now precedent allowing the govt. to tell you that you must buy something by calling it a tax?

Bob-1622113:

What about the car insurance everyone had to buy? Don't see you complaining about that, now do we?

It's important that people can stay on their parents insurance until the age of 26 mainly because with this administration in office people under the age of 26 don't have occupations.

Denver Bob is like Rand Paul, they both know that their interpretation of what the Constitution says is correct, and everyone else's (including the SCOTUS, whose job it is to interpret it) is wrong.

We should just abolish the Supreme Court and let Bob and Rand do the job for us. Problem solved!

redvirginia: A swastika may have been a better choice of an icon but hey both refer to the same thing - a Totalitarian Nation. PS: Most of the Neo-Nazis, Neo-Facists, and Libertarian factions are within the Republican Party.

Denver Bob is like Rand Paul, they both know that their interpretation of what the Constitution says is correct, and everyone else's (including the SCOTUS, whose job it is to interpret it) is wrong.

We should just abolish the Supreme Court and let Bob and Rand do the job for us. Problem solved!

Smartest thing youve said all day, get rid of that corrupt court. Oh, and while your at it take Obama with them. November is comming you whinning idiots!

I dod not have children. I pay property taxes to support the local government and schools. I do this as a responsible member of society. I am a liberal who thinks that the "greater good" is more important than the individual.

I applaud the SCOTUS today. For the "greater good" prevailed.

Selfishness, dictating to others how to lead their lives (DOMA, contraception issues) is what will destroy this country.

DenverBob

Romneycare was a STATE provision - Everyone that I speak to say it was their biggest mistake.

According to a recent local poll conducted in Massachusetts, 62% favored the state program. Apparently not everyone you spoke to was from Massachusetts.

The 10th amendment allowed the State to do what it did. The 10th amendment is there for that reason.

And the 16th Amendment allows Congress to enact the ACA. If you want to argue with Chief Justice Roberts...that's your call, but I suspect you'll lose.

The U.S. Congress - has decided that it can subvert the U.S. Constitution for the last time.

That is your opinion that the Congress subverted the Constitution. Congress passed the law, the POTUS signed it, and the Supreme Court upheld it...that defines Constitutionality. Perhaps Tea Party policy overrides the Constitution?

Rosupi:

"Bob-1622113:

What about the car insurance everyone had to buy? Don't see you complaining about that, now do we?"

I do not have to have car insurance if I don't own a car.

In the state of Illinois, where I live, I can post a cash bond in lieu of insurance if I so choose.

Tell the blind man he has to buy car insurance or the person who only uses public transportation or the elderly who has given up their driving privileges.

Bob- You also don't have to have life insurance if you don't have a life!

I'll never understand the mental disconnect between paying a small amount in now while you're healthy to cover for the fact that at some point in the future you very likely WILL need the insurance. If you could predict when you would get sick/injured then you'd only ever buy insurance the day before the illness or accident occurred.

Since hospitals have to treat everyone who comes in regardless of if they can demonstrate the ability to pay, then having everyone start paying in even when they don't need to makes sense. Now that it's been upheld, I would hope we can work towards making a single payer system/government option rather.

Drew,

If we didn't have to pay greedy a$$hole insurance companies at least 20% (for some, more than 40%) more than our actual costs then I wouldn't have an issue. We should not be required to buy health insurance from private companies and make the executives fabulously wealthy for doing nothing and taking no risk. All that insurance companies do is charge the public extra to pay the public's bills for them. Would you pay someone 20% - 40% extra to pay your rent/mortgage for you? No? Then why would you pay an insurance company to pay your medical bills for you?

I also should not have to pay the same premiums, being healthy and fit, as someone who is obese, smokes, drinks heavily, does drugs, etc. If people choose a risky lifestyle then they should pay more when those risks result in health issues. (Drivers who get speeding tickets and DUIs pay higher premiums than safe drivers.) That also goes for parents with genetic health issues who have children and pass on those costly defects to their offspring. I should not have to pay for the healthcare of those children when the parents should have decided not to produce children that have a high risk of being born with defects.

Since hospitals have to treat everyone who comes in regardless of if they can demonstrate the ability to pay, then having everyone start paying in even when they don't need to makes sense.

Illegals still do not have to have insurance and will continue to get treatment at hospitals without paying.

To those of you stating that it's about time we get in line with the European countries which have universal care, those countries do not require it's citizens to purchase insurance. Those citizens are covered through the taxes they pay becuase the health care is government run. Obamacare is not universal health care coverage. Obamacare is a federally mandated revenue generator for insurance companies. Insurance comanies can still deny claims, as they have always done, and you can still go without proper treatment.

Actually, I think it's more the case that Romney learns from his mistakes. Romneycare in Massachusetts has been fraught with problems, including cost control. From Doug Bandow, late last year:

Romney's legislation sought to extend insurance coverage. About 95% to 96% — the state claims 98.1%, but the actual rate appears to be lower — of Massachusetts residents now are insured. That is a genuine achievement but still not universal coverage. Moreover, as Peter Suderman of Reason observed, "the state's insurance coverage rates were already unusually high to begin with: About 90% of the state's population had health coverage prior to the law's passage." In short, Gov. Romney's accomplishment actually was rather modest.

Moreover, at what cost? Defenders of RomneyCare argue that its goal was to expand coverage, not to cut expenditures, but Gov. Romney was not alone in promising "affordable" health care. Anyway, the legislation certainly was not supposed to drive costs skyward.

However, paying for more benefits for more people inevitably makes medicine more expensive. Costs for Commonwealth Care, the Massachusetts government's subsidized insurance program alone are up a fifth over initial projections. Last year State Treasurer Timothy P. Cahill wrote: "The universal insurance coverage we adopted in 2006 was projected to cost taxpayers $88 million a year. However, since this program was adopted in 2006, our health-care costs have in total exceeded $4 billion. The cost of Massachusetts' plan has blown a hole in the Commonwealth's budget."

State finances have not collapsed only because RomneyCare spread the costs widely, forcing virtually everyone in and out of the state to share the pain. Cahill cited federal subsidies as keeping the state afloat financially. Indeed, a June study from the Beacon Hill Institute concluded that "The state has been able to shift the majority of the costs to the federal government." The Institute pointed to higher costs of $8.6 billion since the law was implemented. Just $414 million was paid by Massachusetts. Medicaid (federal payments) covered $2.4 billion. Medicare took care of $1.4 billion.

But even more costs, $4.3 billion, have been imposed on the private sector — employers, insurers, and residents. This estimate is in line with an earlier study by the Massachusetts Taxpayers Foundation, which figured that 60% of the new costs fell on individuals and businesses.

As expenses have risen, so have premiums. Noted Kuttner, "because serious cost containment was not part of the original package, premium costs in the commonwealth have risen far faster than nationally — by 10.3%, the most recent year available." Economists John F. Cogan, Glenn Hubbard, and Daniel Kessler figured that RomneyCare inflated premiums by 6% from 2006 to 2008. This at a time where the state-subsidized Commonwealth Care was displacing private insurance for many people, thereby reducing demand, which should have reduced cost pressures.

Unfortunately, noted the Beacon Hill Institute, "private companies have no choice but to pass the higher costs onto the insured. Some of these costs fall in the double-digit range." That naturally displeased public officials, since it undercut their claim to have solved Massachusetts' health care problems.

Gov. Deval Patrick responded like King Canute: he insisted that premiums not rise. Predictably, his rejection of proposed rate hikes required insurers to operate at a loss and placed several in financial jeopardy.

Robert Dynan, the career insurance commissioner tasked with maintaining insurer solvency, wrote that the state "implemented artificial price caps on HMO rates. The rates, by design, have no actuarial support." Last year Sandy Praeger, Kansas' insurance Commissioner, observed: "Right now, premium increase have never been more political. If there is any way to justify not granting the increase, commissioners are looking for them."

Thankfully, Gov. Patrick's price controls did not fare well when challenged in court and his administration eventually negotiated reduced rate hikes. But the governor then came up with a new legislative program to arbitrarily reduce medical costs.

Even weaker restrictions would be counterproductive. The Beacon Hill Institute warned that "Controlling costs will translate into capping services provided by physicians and other caregivers. These are, in effect, price controls that will dampen the incentive to provide services and lead to longer wait times and the rationing of healthcare."

Even worse, bankrupt insurance carriers would mean either no health care coverage or expensive government bail-outs. Yet John Graham of the Pacific Research Institute detailed shrinking margins and pervasive losses for Massachusetts health insurers. He warned "that if politicians refuse to allow health plans to increase their premiums at a rate commensurate with the increase in medical costs, health plans will plunge into financial crisis within a remarkably short period of time." Indeed, carriers "will stand at the precipice of insolvency if the political class in Massachusetts insists on continuing to follow the path that it has chosen."

Unfortunately, worse is likely to come. The Rand Corporation concluded that "in the absence of policy change, health care spending in Massachusetts is projected to nearly double to $123 billion in 2020, increasing 8% faster than the state's" GDP. Added Rand, continued cost increases of this magnitude "threaten the long-term viability of the initiative." Nor can the state count on an increasingly strapped federal government to continue its generous subsidies. Moreover, at some point people and businesses will flee the state rather than pay ever more to underwrite the state's health care program.

Finally, RomneyCare inflated demand for medical services without increasing the corresponding supply. The Beacon Hill Institute concluded: "The vast number of the newly insured residents in Massachusetts is responsible for bottlenecks in the primary care system that forces residents to utilize emergency room care at a significantly higher than expected rate."

A fifth of adults report difficulty in finding a physician to treat them. Earlier this year the Massachusetts Medical Society discovered "more than half of primary care practices closed to new patients, longer wait times to get appointments with primary and specialty physicians, and significant variations in physician acceptance of government and government-related insurance products."

New York internist Marc Siegel observed: "The wait time for an appointment is now routinely over a month for primary-care doctors and specialists. Internists and family practitioners report being so overwhelmed — too many patients, too much time pressure — that more than half are closing their practices to new patients." You'd think Massachusetts was a province of Canada.

The state's subsidized programs effectively drive away doctors. Explained Siegel: "More than half of primary-care docs in Massachusetts find themselves unable to work with Medicaid or Commonwealth Care (state-subsidized insurance), which both pay providers poorly." Acceptance rates are far lower than even for Medicare, and one Massachusetts legislator has proposed making medical licensure contingent upon acceptance of state-subsidized plans.

Although the expansion of insurance was supposed to reduce emergency room use, visits rose 9% from 2004 to 2008. Ironically, noted Grace-Marie Turner of the Galen Institute, "difficulties in getting primary care have led to an increasing number of patients who rely on emergency rooms for basic medical services." Thus, uncompensated care still costs more than $400 million annually.

The state also encouraged adverse selection, as predicted. Many healthy people chose to remain uninsured and pay the fine (or lie about having purchased coverage). They then bought insurance when sick, and dropped the policy when it was no longer necessary. Massachusetts was forced to institute an open enrollment period, limiting when people could sign up for insurance — an otherwise bizarre restriction when the objective is to increase the number of people insured.

Obamacare is not perfected, that much we all know. However, have you taken a look at ours healthcare in the past 30 years? Most people couldn't even afford it.

Any reforms are better than none. At least now more people will pay instead of few people cover for everyone else.

As for those who compared this to car insurance. You don't need to drive car your entirely life, however you will need to go to the hospital anytime in your life, who will foot the bill then?