"LOL"

That's a perfect backdrop ....

Obama's massive crushing record high debt .... "LOL"

but the masses still won't get it

Romney was right about one thing. Our national debt is a culmination of both partys over the years.

What he is wrong in doing is trying to blame Obama for not being able to keep his promise to cut the debt in half. The GOP/TP has done everything they could to tie the presidents hands behind his back in their effort to make him look bad.

The problem with their unpatriotic act is that it came back to roost very quickly; against them. There has never in our history been a Congress that has been seen as unfavorably as the current Congress. People across the country know what the GOP/TP has been doing and they don't like it. The Congressional ratings are so abysmal that it would not surprise me to see a great number of these freshman GOP?TP people thrown out in the coming elections.

Obama couldn't fiscally manage a wiener cart .... "LOL"

Tuesday, May 15, 2012

Voters now trust likely Republican nominee Mitt Romney more than President Obama on all five issues regularly surveyed by Rasmussen Reports, especially when it comes to money.

A new national telephone survey finds that 51% of Likely U.S. Voters trust Romney more than Obama 39% when it comes the economy .... "LOL"

I wonder how much each of the old folks sitting behind Romney have contributed to the debt? I would be willing to bet $10,000 that they have received hundreds of thousands of dollars more in health care benefits than they paid in.

No one could fit Obama's debt on an Etch-A-Sketch .... "LOL"

No one .... "LOL"

Now Romney is using props because he's got nothing else. How pathetic is that? Next he'll be up there telling "what I did over summer vacation."

huey - poor little man - same old drivel over and over. Romney has no plans, no nothing so he's perfect for you!

Talk about the same old drivel over and over insane, your worse than a broken record.

Rocco - You - the king of nonsense spouting off about someone else! Comical but sad. Kind of like all of your posts! No sanity in the GOP - EVER!

Obama's predecessor (President Whats-his-name?) was actually responsible for $6 trillion of the Federal debt - but - hey, fuzzy accounting and not understanding fiscal years is not relevant.

Our Federal debt is $0.27 of every dollar of the TOTAL national debt. Our TOTAL debt is $58 trillion (public and private debt). Our nation's total taxable income (wages, gains, benefits) is $5.7 trillion.

Our TOTAL national debt is ten times (10x) our national income - but - hey, no problems there. Just throw more money at the wealthy and inflation will eat that debt in no time.

Typical Republican politics - focus on the smallest problem - and - still offer no solutions. Romney certainly avoided any chance at flip-flopping - it is EVERYONE's fault - except Mitt Romney's. Maybe Romney can balance the budget by holding an aspirin between his knees?

So the unsustainable debt the Obama has racked up is a Prop? No it's just the facts. Even when they see they do not believe.

Liberals are out of touch with reality.

Romney is going to have to face the economic facts. The only way to pay down that Federal debt is to grow the economy. The economy is the only place to generate the money to pay the debt. There is no other magic source of money.

The liberal economics of the Republicans are NOT going to work this time. People are reluctant to create debt to pay for inflation. The Republicans are going to have WORK for it this time.

Here is how the Republican liberal economic policies over the last 30 years has created the mess we are in. Does any of this sound familiar?

- lower taxes for the wealthy to free up capital for investment
- reduce regulations to spur investment
- promote 'free enterprise', 'free trade', and provide incentives to offshore jobs
- end unions - lower wages and increase productivity
- encourage private sector borrowing to create artificial demand.

Here is what the Republican liberal economics accomplished.

more capital (money) = speculation = inflation = debt = more money (capital)

Rinse, spin, repeat.

That is why our dollar has been devalued over the last 30 years. That is why our public and private debt has increased dramatically over the last 30 years.

Republicans really do believe we can borrow our way to prosperity.

Ah, his Ross Perot moment. How nice :)

Next he'll have the dancing elephants! Sorry - couldn't resist!

From the Washington Post " On Wisconsin recall election (off topic I know) But I brought in the Romney tie.

There appears to be an enthusiasm gap: 91 percent of Republicans say they are “absolutely certain” they will vote in the recall compared to only 83 percent of Democrats.

Democrats in the state are reportedly angry with the national party for not investing more in this race. Walker has spent more than $20 million so far.

The same survey finds Walker’s job approval staying steady at 50 percent, with disapproval at 46 percent. That’s despite continuing negative views of job trends in the state.

Thirty-seven percent of likely voters like what Walker has done, 38 percent don’t like it, and 22 percent “like what he’s done but not how he’s done it.”

The same poll finds Romney has moved into a tie with Obama in Wisconsin among likely voters in the fall election.

Just remember a few months back how many people here were saying .......... he's gone?

Seeking, are you mental? That debt clock is moving by millions of dollars a second. ALL Obama debt. It is a perfect back drop to show how reckless Obama and the democrats are with tax dollars

I guess they vetoed using the Etch-A-Sketch.

I think the debt clock is an effective prop. Romney is not a very charismatic speaker and the debt clock emphasizes his point. I think that Ross Perot did an effective job using his props. Perhaps, if the American people would have listened to him, things would be different now (he was the only candidate against NAFTA).

People claiming that lowering taxes on the wealthy did not promote investment in jobs and growth fail to accept that this is a global economy and the investments were made where the potential growth was the greatest. Once the decision to off shore jobs was made, we endured a very slippery slope. We lost manufacturing to Japan and allowed them to dump steel at a price that caused the job losses of thousands in America. The jobs exodus continues to this day. But...something is changing. The wages in our country have stagnated for more than three decades because there was always somewhere else that it could be made cheaper including being shipped back to the US for consumption. But, alas, the economy has reached a point that it is no longer worth the expenses to produce those items somewhere else.

The solution is to give tax breaks to multi national countries that repatrionize their operations to the US.

Sell federal assets that are not being used (the asset value is in the trillions not including military assets).

Get off gasoline and switch to natural gas (we have enough to sustain us for more than 100 years and it all comes from the US). Also, it puts a little extra money in all consumers to spend each month.

Stop all nation building except for our own. Unless we are being paid by other countries to help build them, it's time to bring the troops home.

The healthcare fiasco needs to be addressed. But the ACA is not an answer and neither is the expansion of medicare.

If we don't take some measures, the debt clock will be the least of our worries.

Those old people as you call them worked 40 years or more paying into the SS system. How many years have you worked? Those old people could not even get medicare for healthcare until they turned 65. And they pay a minimun of almost $100 a month for that medicare coverage. It goes up from $100 depending on your benefits. How much do you pay? They also fed and clothe you or someone just like you for a minimum of 18 years and probably paid some of their college costs. In fact this generation of old people is up to their ears in college loans for their kids.

I laugh when I hear the Obama Camp criticise Romney's plan! At least Romney HAS A PLAN!!! My plan to take out the garbage this evening is more than Obama has!

Sorry folks- it's over for the immaculated one. Time for new blood all across the board- R & D's alike!

@bigbenalaska,

Rasmussen is right leaning and does not interview anyone from age 18-21. Which slants their polling towards Republicans.

Gallup has this out: "By a 56% to 36% margin, Americans think Barack Obama rather than Mitt Romney will win the 2012 presidential election."

http://www.gallup.com/home.aspx

As for the Walker recall, the Koch brothers are putting millions into the race. If Walker survives, he's likely not going to survive the next election. Regardless, look for changes in the house and Senate in Wisconsin in this next election. Wisconsinites indeed did not like "how Walker did it".

Romney doesn't have a plan, as he never explains how he is going to accomplish his promises. Please post links if you think he has explained specifics, cause I can't find it.

Obama had a plan, a 4 trillion dollar deficit reduction plan, and Boehner walked away from it causing the Tea Party Downgrade.

Boehner is warming up the debt ceiling talks again, in hopes of stalling the economy like they did last summer so their chances in November are better.

Vote out the obstructionists in 2012!

If Romney has no plan then you liberals should be for him.

More of the same then. The problem is he has a plan and it scares you. Someone might have to do something.

What is his plan to pay for 4 trillion dollars in tax breaks for the 1%?

Please detail it for me.

Romney doesn't have a plan, its PAUL RYAN's PLAN!!! Plus he's lying about Obama's record!

It includes tax cuts across the board for everyone equally. Pretty well laid out- but it is fairly long.

WAY longer than Obama's plan- which I recently ran across: BLAME EVERYONE!

and really?? that's the "new reality" you're dealing with? Blame the Tea Party for the Obama Downgrade??!!

wow... just, wow...

Would enjoy asking Romney and other reoublican heads men just where they all were when Bush ran up the debt Obama inherited ?Just what has the republican party done to help this country the last 3 years. other than nothing ? Oh yea...they brought this country to a stand still in congress to protect their wealthy friends.

LookForTheTruth...just where are all the other cuts coming from..tax cuts are nice when the country is not deep in a debt that the republican president Bush brought about. Bush LOST jobs all the years he was in poffice...Obama is at least gaining them back...with NO help from the republican party.

nomoresameo -- In addition to the premeditated conspiracy of obstruction by Republicans, people forget that when President Obama made that promise it was before anyone knew the severity of the economic crisis. In fact economists like Paul Krugman are no longer referring to it as the Great Recession, but as an outright Depression. And we know it took a lot of government spending to get us out of the Great Depression.

It looks like Congress is finally going to get rid of the filibuster. Overall, I believe it would be for the best, so I hope so. But in the meantime, the obstruction by Teapublicans was basically reinforced by Romney when he said:

"If I`m fortunate enough to become president, I`ll care very deeply about the
economy getting better in a big hurry" --

Lawrence ODonnell pointed out "which, of course means he [Romney] really
doesn`t want the economy to get better now."

And that's it in a nutshell, obviously the GOP/TP have been willing to throw the American people under the bus in order to win the 2010 elections, and they hope the same plan will work in 2012.

ivan, NC -- Even more a distinction, aside from job creation barely keeping pace with population growth during Dubya, is that government jobs grew even more than the private sector. Under President Obama, the job growth is coming completely from the private sector, while as we all know, government jobs like teachers, first responders, etc. have been cut.

Romney is a rich man. Why can't he buy a pair of pants that fit?

And - the folks lined up in the back - a typical cross section of a Republican tea party in sunny Florida.

Obama has no plan. He had a democratic House and Senate and couldn't pass a budget. The debt is what Obama ran up and with his health care it will be even more. Obama has just lost the people who were looking for work and gave up. The housing market hasn't recovered. He threw money at the problem to make it go away but borrowed all the money to run us deeper in debt. He didn't solve anything and couldn't lead a horse with a bucket of grain. I voted for Obama but what a disappointment he has become.

Look: how is it that it is Obama's downgrade? He proposed $4T in cuts and revenue (mostly cuts). Boener and Cantor ixnayed that. Again, how it that Obama's downgrade?

$4T in tax cuts proposed by Romney. Paid for how? Like Eric, I don't see it. somebody explain it to us.

rukidding47

If Romney has no plan then you liberals should be for him.

More of the same then.

Hahaha, rightwingers never cease to amaze. More of the same would be the current Bush tax cuts, deficit spending on war, deregulation -- All the failed GOP voodoo economics that have plagued us for decades. The Romney/Paul Ryan plan wouldn't even be more of the same, rather the same on steroids. The right wing has no Rule of Reason, so conclude that voodoo economics (trickle-down tax cuts, deregulation, etc.) hasn't worked because it wasn't severe enough, yeah double-down -- WTF?!

Milton Friedman's hypothesis was tried, failed, and debunked. Supply-side economics was tried, failed, and debunked. So far when Keynesian theory has been tried, it seems to work. This is the Dem's plan, you fool. Stop doing the same failed GOP policies and try something else.

SmBusOwnerinNY -- Exactly. Not only did S&P say that the downgrade was due to the stalemate caused by Republicans, but we have it on tape Tea Party supporters cheering the downgrade. Of course threats of not increasing the debt ceiling is the same as threats to default. Gawd the rightwing has no logic, none.

Devdoc12able

Seeking, are you mental? That debt clock is moving by millions of dollars a second. ALL Obama debt. It is a perfect back drop to show how reckless Obama and the democrats are with tax dollars

I am sooo tired of the repugnican lies. There is no "Obama debt", you pathetic shill. A considerable part of the present budget deficit is servicing the debt that was rung up by Raygun and the Bushes, and, yes, Clinton. How much of his 1.4 trillion this year is from the gift that keeps on giving, 8 years of bush? You weasels are entitled to your own opinions but not your own facts. When you make up your own facts, that's what reasonable people call "lying".

@SmBusOwnerinNY...nice post...

@ Beenthere...stop lying. How do you know what his plan is? Further, it wouldn't matter what his plan was because your treasonous party had already conspired against us to take down Obama. And just to prove how "smart " you are, you give them the thumbs up for boning you. What a guy...

dave20121

I think the debt clock is an effective prop...

Those who read my posts regularly know I am the one who said visual aids are necessary for low-information voters. I referred to Reagan's charts and graphs up to Glenn Beck's chalkboard. Paul Ryan had his handy-dandy colored graphs the other day as well. Apparently their staffers read FR!

Too bad about the rightwing Echo Chamber and Cone of Silence that is FOX Noise/Hate Radio. The righgtwing never sees the Vulture Chart, the Bikini Graph, and other charts that show how much GOP voodoo eocnomics suck. And of course reading and comprehension, knowing what a credible source is, critical thinking and logic -- the rightwing lacks these abilities too.

Mitt "Corporations Are People, My Friend" Romney is now making things up right before our eyes. In addition to being one of the most prolific flip-flopping political candidates in the history of the U.S., Romney has now become a pathetic little man who is routinely dishonest in showering the American people with misinformation and disinformation.

About eighty percent of the amount which has been added to the national debt during the Obama Presidency is the direct result of Pres. Bush policies or the direct result of the Great Recession which began during the Bush Presidency. During the Bush/Cheney administration almost five trillion dollars was added to the national debt.

Since Pres. Obama took office, the continuation of the Bush policies[unfunded wars in Iraq and Afghanistan, the unfunded Bush income tax cuts(2001-Jan. 2011) which were extended in January 2011, Bush's unfunded prescription drug benefits program, debt service on these unfunded endeavors and etc.] have added an additional 1.5 trillion dollars to the debt.

At the same time the the financial crisis and the Great Recession and the aftermath for the years 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011 & 2012 have cost or will cost the federal government at least 2 trillion dollars in lost revenue, this has also been added to the debt since Pres. Obama took office.

In addition, Since Pres. Obama took office well over one trillion dollars has been added to the national debt to combat the effects and aftermath of the financial crisis and the Great Recession and forestall a second Great Depression. Action taken includes the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act(the stimulus), the extension of the Bush income tax cuts, the payroll tax cuts and expanded unemployment benefits.

So policies and events which began during the previous administration have added at least 4 trillion dollars to the deficits and debt since Obama took office. President Obama has not been on a spending spree at at all, in fact, the vast majority all the deficits and debt which have occurred since Obama took office are a result of the policies of the previous administration or are the result of the financial crisis and the Great Recession.

Romney knows know bounds in his distortion of the facts!

@True Patriot: you have to consider your target audience as a speaker. The majority of all Americans are not college graduates. Most conversations occur at the 10th grade level. The use of a very basic visual aid like the debt clock is understood by everyone. Educated people zero in on what is being said. But, unless you have been through a few economics classes, it is hard to have a real debate about courses of action regardless of education levels.

For instance, you are a staunch advocate of Keynes theory based economics. Yet, the US (neither party) follows the theory as described by Keynes. On our current path, there comes a time when we no longer have the ability to print our way out of our predicament.

Eric,

I hate posting links but for Gods sake read some Romney plans, then come back and start tearing them apart. Don't be your usual liberal self who refuses to read or learn anything other than a headline of NYT or MSNBC and then bitch to everyone; "please tell me what Romney would do"

Here! Once you're on pick a frickin' topic. While you're at it lay off the stupid ass pole numbers, you just can't let it go, nobody cares about your opinions about opinion polls.

I swear you liberals should carry a spoon with you because you are obviously not capable of digging in for information yourselves and you expect everyone to spoon feed you everything...oh wait, yeah that makes sense...liberals, I almost forgot.

http://www.mittromney.com/issues/spending

http://www.mittromney.com/issues/tax

http://www.mittromney.com/collection/foreign-policy

http://www.mittromney.com/issues/social-security

http://www.mittromney.com/jobs

http://www.mittromney.com/collection/smaller-smarter-simpler-government

http://www.mittromney.com/issues/national-defense

http://www.mittromney.com/issues/national-defense

Theres a bunch more.

Pick one, read it, then bitch about it if you want. If you don't want to read any of it then stop making ignorant requests and please quit acting so stupid. This should be enough reading for the average liberal to get through in 18-20 months so have fun...and don't drool on your keyboard.

anaxgnosis

Stop picking on old people. Someday you will be old and some one will be bad mouthing you. Shame on you.

Romney's prop debt clock and the debt it represents are the Legacy of Pres. George "W" Bush and V.P Dick Cheney. A team which paid homage to the "decifits don't matter" philosophy of governing.

When Clinton left office the country was in good shape with a budget surplus and no deficit.

Pres. Bush & V.P.Cheney went on a spending spree the likes of which had not seen seen since the days of World War II. When Bush/Cheney left office after their unfunded Iraq War, and their unfunded tax cuts and the rest of their unfunded budget spending, the country was a financial disaster. All the unfunded spending along with the Great Recession has put the country in the worst financial shape since the Great Depression of eighty years ago. This is the utter financial disaster that was handed to Pres. Obama when he took office. He has done a reasonable job and good job of saving the country from what could have certainly been a second Great Depression.

Romney with his prop debt clock is hoping the American people won't remember it was the previous administration which left the U.S. with this legacy of debt. I'm betting the American people are too smart for Romney.

"[Obama] was very critical of his predecessor for the debts his predecessor put in place," Romney said at a campaign event in St. Petersburg, Fla. "He was very critical of his predecessor because the predecessor put together $4 trillion of debt over eight years."

CNN reports that Romney used the word "predecessor" in place of Bush's name five times during the address.

Romney Flanagan (SNL's pathological liar): And for Pete's sake let's not talk about me, my record, my policies...what ever those are, and definitely don't expect me to talk with the press or on any unfriendly program. Just vote for me, President X -- Yeah, that's the ticket.

The only prop Mr. Romney needs is a picture of Mr. Obama looking up at the ceiling with his face full of anger and pointing a finger at the floor.

Or better yet, just play the following clip before a speech:

• http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UErR7i2onW0

Now, who is the "pathological liar" ?

getthefacts-1122565....."I'm betting the American people are too smart for Romney."

Yep, Mr. Obama's "Boots on the Ground" supporters are really, really smart:

• http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCXot2HQT00&feature=related
• http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bg98BvqUvCc&feature=related
• http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z5tqH7UrzOw

Romney wants more capital ships and weapons and troops for the biggest creator of debt-the defense budget. Why? There is no naval threat and troops are not needed when we end wars-only when we start new wars. Don't let the debt clock distract from those statements. The debt will never shrink unless the defense budget and the bush tax credits shrink, first. We want less spending and waste in the defense budget and no new wars.

It's amazing how every Republican has conveniently forgotten everything that happened before January 20th 2009. The lies and hypocrisy coming from the GOP and their serial liar Romney are truly stunning. It's disgusting when a major political party in America has to lie about everything just to justify their existence. Romney's like an arsonist watching a fire he started while throwing rocks at the firemen trying to put it out...... This guy is totally worthless. REPUBLICANS SURE KNOW HOW TO LIE BUT THEY DO NOT KNOW HOW TO GOVERN !!!!!

dave20121

@True Patriot: you have to consider your target audience as a speaker. The majority of all Americans are not college graduates. Most conversations occur at the 10th grade level. The use of a very basic visual aid like the debt clock is understood by everyone. Educated people zero in on what is being said. But, unless you have been through a few economics classes, it is hard to have a real debate about courses of action regardless of education levels.

For instance, you are a staunch advocate of Keynes theory based economics. Yet, the US (neither party) follows the theory as described by Keynes. On our current path, there comes a time when we no longer have the ability to print our way out of our predicament.

Good points and thanks for bringing some constructive comments to this discussion. I agree that props such as the debt clock are a great way to communicate a message. An example I've always liked is the "Sesame Street Simple" approach used by a Proctor & Gamble CEO. Here is a link to a blog that talks about it:

http://bobsutton.typepad.com/my_weblog/2008/09/sesame-street-simple-ag-lafleys-leadership-philosiphy.html

Concerning the target audience, we also need to remember that a large percentage of college graduates also do not have any economic training. Graduates with degrees in areas like science and liberal arts may be very knowledgeable in their respective fields, but they may be no better than high school dropouts when it comes to economics.

"There is no "Obama debt", you pathetic shill. A considerable part of the present budget deficit is servicing the debt that was rung up by Raygun and the Bushes"

Listening to these Republicans, one would think that on January 19, 2009 the country was in great shape with a massive surplus, record low unemployment, a booming economy, increasing wages -- everything was just outstanding. Then -- Obama took office on Jan 20, 2009 and everything immediately came crashing down.

Now -- how about a reality check? The nation was much closer to that ideal on January 19, 2001 when Clinton left office but on January 19, 2009 when Bush left office, we were on the verge of a depression.

@Charlie: The economy didn't sneak up on Obama during the 2008 campaign. He knew the challenges of the position to which he was applying. When I interviewed for promotions, I never promised anything that I couldn't deliver. Under promise and over deliver. Obama is the one who stated that he would cut the deficit in half by the end of his first term. Nobody else said it. He did. A man needs to own his words, not make excuses. After all, he was a senator at the time. He should have had a clue as to what he could and could not deliver. The bad part about it is that none of his proposed budgets have been about reaching his stated goal. Face it...he is another lieing politician. He has done nothing but continue many of the policies that Bush II had. He had a filibuster proof Congress for almost 18 months and chose to waste all that time on passing the ACA which will be overturned in 45 days. Even members of his own party said he should have passed other legislation that all the democrats could support. He just couldn't believe that there were members of his own party that would be against universal healthcare. To me, that is all the reason I need to give someone else a chance.

Dave PBO went in hoping for a Congress that would work with him to get the country back on it's feet. He did not expect a do-nothing Congress. As to filibuster proof, no, you are flat out wrong on that statement. There have been more cloture votes in the past 3.5 years, than almost the last 100 years. You, Sir, are what I would call a low I.Q. voter. Just Saying!

@cmbmsquick: I highly doubt I am a low IQ voter. But, to prove you wrong, when Al Franken was declared the winner of the Minnesota senate race, the democrats obtained a filibuster proof majority. Even Barney Frank has spoken on the record that party leaders told him to spend more time on items that could be passed. I will refrain from the name calling as it has been my experience that people who resort to putting down someone else lacks self esteem and I don't want to contribute to your depression.

"[President Obama] was very critical of his predecessor because the predecessor put together $4 trillion of debt over eight years," Romney continued. "This president however - oh by the way, he said that doing that was unpatriotic, irresponsible and unpatriotic. And he said he would cut the debt in half if he became president. Instead he doubled it, alright, he doubled it."

Not true. Romney was right when he remarked on how Obama promised to control our fiscal problem, but he said that about the deficit, not the debt. And technically, I believe in 2015 the budget deficit will be around $700 billion, approximately half of what it was in 2009. So if Obama is re-elected, the deficit will be halved under his second term. And as for the amount of debt added by Obama, he hasn't doubled it. Debt was $11.6 trillion when Obama's fiscal policies (FY 2010) took affect, and so technically he only increased the deficit by $4 trillion. In addition, Obama actually increased the debt by somewhere in the range of $1.3 trillion, as his only major spending initiatives were the Afghanistan surge and the stimulus. All the rest are attributed to either the Bush administration's policies or the Great Recession.

The presumptive Republican nominee did not mention his plan to reform entitlements here in senior-heavy Florida, but repeat his plans to increase military spending -- a portion of Romney's fiscal vision not easily squared with his plans to cut spending broadly.

Technically, Romney is in no shape or form to assert that he is fiscally responsible. His major spending proposals would actually increase the debt substantially. If Romney were to extend the Bush tax cuts, add his $3.4 trillion in new tax breaks, and increase defense spending by, let's say, $400 billion, he would increase the debt to $10.8 trillion over the next decade. Essentially, he would have to ax, on average, a third of the budget every year just to break even. If he were to adopt the Ryan plan, and increase defense spending by $400 billion, he would essentially increase the deficit to somewhere in the $7 to 8 trillion range over the next decade, as Ryan's roughly $4.6 trillion tax cuts would cover the $3.8 trillion in actual savings that the plan would produce (I reduced the original $5.4 trillion figure to $3.8 trillion, as the Ryan plan would repeal Obamacare, which saved $230 billion a year, and so I eliminated $1.6 trillion to compensate for that). Either way, Romney adds trillions to future deficits. And without targeting defense or entitlements, Romney would literally bankrupt the country.

"I'd like to take shipbuilding from 9 to 15 a year, by the way that will help put people to work.

So did the stimulus, and yet you say it didn't help the economy.

And I want to buy more aircraft and I want to have more active duty personnel and I want to make sure we give our veterans the care they richly deserve," Romney said.

Are you @!$%#ing insane??? We have approximately 2.3 million people serving in the military, with at least 1.4 million in active duty. We have over 5,500 military aircraft in our Air Force, over 3,000 in our Navy, and are planning to buy at least 2,000 expensive F-35s over the next few decades. We have a navy largest than the next 13 combined, and the most up-to-date defense systems the world has ever seen. While I do agree that our veterans deserve better care than they have now, but what your talking about is insane. Apparently you conservatives hate big government, unless it comes to the military. The Defense Secretary even rebuked any increases for defense at the cost of social programs. What more do we need??? We are the most powerful military in the world; who are we trying to invade?? Mars???? The Moon???? Maybe show the Sun who's the boss???

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

FISCAL RESPONSIBILITY 2012

dave20121

@cmbmsquick: I highly doubt I am a low IQ voter. But, to prove you wrong, when Al Franken was declared the winner of the Minnesota senate race, the democrats obtained a filibuster proof majority. Even Barney Frank has spoken on the record that party leaders told him to spend more time on items that could be passed. I will refrain from the name calling as it has been my experience that people who resort to putting down someone else lacks self esteem and I don't want to contribute to your depression.

Unfortunately, they only had the filibuster-proof Congress for half a year. That's not a large amount of time to fit in a whole term's worth of policies. They chose that healthcare reform was the most important item to be addressed, and so they used it.

And dave, would you care to explain to me why the GOP initiated an unprecedented 360 filibusters in the past few years??? That is practically one every five days. The GOP, even as a minority, now control Congress. Would you care to explain why our democracy, in which the majority rule but the minority are respected, has been reversed, making the minority the dominant party??? The wealthy control everything: the economy, the stock market, the wealth and income in this nation; why must they control our government????

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

Rightwingwac

Eric,

I hate posting links but for Gods sake read some Romney plans, then come back and start tearing them apart. Don't be your usual liberal self who refuses to read or learn anything other than a headline of NYT or MSNBC and then bitch to everyone; "please tell me what Romney would do"

Here! Once you're on pick a frickin' topic. While you're at it lay off the stupid ass pole numbers, you just can't let it go, nobody cares about your opinions about opinion polls.

I swear you liberals should carry a spoon with you because you are obviously not capable of digging in for information yourselves and you expect everyone to spoon feed you everything...oh wait, yeah that makes sense...liberals, I almost forgot.

Alright, Rightwingwac, I've taken a look at most of these websites, and what Mitt Romney outlines as his policies. For the most part, I'm not impressed. Let's take the tax issue, for example. Romney rails against Obama, who wants a balanced effort close the budget gap, and refuses to raise taxes. What he proposes is to cut spending to 20% of GDP by 2016. That is insane. We are still in a fragile recession. You'd have to focus on defense and entitlements, yet he plans to increase defense spending. We cannot rely on cuts alone, unless your goal is going back to 1810. We NEED tax increases. I am also not impressed with Romney's healthcare positions, as he doesn't address the fact that the private healthcare industry is destroying us. Numerous countries have universal healthcare, and even if you factor out the obesity and diabetes factor, they are far more healthier than we are. Obamacare isn't even socialized medicine; it's private medicine with government oversight. And he embarks on a massive anti-union crusade. I mean, yes, Big Labor has its problems, but cut them some slack!! Not a lot of people are union members. He wants to ban union money going to political practices. Not a bad idea, until you realize that corporations will still be able to game the system. He also blasts Obama for filing a suit against Boeing for building a plant in a Right-to-Work state. What he neglects to point out is how Obama and the NLRB actually filed suit because Boeing moved the plant from a non-RTW state after the workers there went on strike (you cannot fire workers for striking, FYI). I do admire his ideas for expanding and enforcing trade and human capital, but that is overshadowed by his lack of real economic and government expertise.

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

Freshieee, I'm not a republican or conservative, but I will answer your question. The rules of the senate can be changed by a simple majority at the convening of a new Congress. Democrats elected not to do this as it would have taken the use of the "nuclear" option to circumvent an attempt to filibuster the rules change.

The minority party has no other choice but to filibuster bills that they are against when no compromise can be achieved. Never in our nations history has the Congressional body been more divisive not only along party lines but, within both parties.

Now that the Bush era tax cuts will expire on December 31, 2012 without a vote from any politician from either party, I will hope for some compromise since the polls show one clear thing...there will be no filibuster proof majority in the senate by either party regardless if Romney or Obama wins.

Honestly, I think that Bill Clinton did an excellent job of reaching across the aisle and hammering out compromises. I think Reagan and Tip O'Neill hammered out some compromises. Rhetoric from within the democratic party directly from the members have described Obama as condescending. Bill Clinton referred to Obama as an amateur. Personally, I don't know...but his rhetoric from his never ending campaigning is anything but unifying. I don't see leadership when I see Obama. I see a neighborhood activist with polished speaking skills. General Powell...now that is a leader. Loyal to a fault...but, he is a leader.

The minority party has no other choice but to filibuster bills that they are against when no compromise can be achieved. Never in our nations history has the Congressional body been more divisive not only along party lines but, within both parties.

Have you seen the Republican Party lately??? There IS NO COMPROMISE with them!!!! They didn't compromise when it came to fixing the debt (even when the offer was stacked in favor of them); they didn't try to compromise on creating jobs; they don't even compromise on regulating Wall Street!!! The reason why they are filibustering the Democrats is not because they can't compromise, but because they won't. They don't like any of the Democratic proposals, and so they simply filibuster them. They are probably doing this so that Americans will blame the incumbent Democrats and vote them to power.

Honestly, I think that Bill Clinton did an excellent job of reaching across the aisle and hammering out compromises. I think Reagan and Tip O'Neill hammered out some compromises. Rhetoric from within the democratic party directly from the members have described Obama as condescending.

And Obama tried to hammer out deals. He offered Speaker Boehner $4 trillion in deficit reduction, with a 3:1 ratio in cuts to tax increases. The reason why he couldn't compromise with them was because the opposing party didn't want to negotiate. They wanted him out, and so they sought to sabotage him at every turn. Even the Republican Party of the Clinton days was malleable and somewhat open to compromise. This GOP isn't. They are dominated by the anti-Obama Tea Party, who hate everything Obama has done or will do. They will ONLY compromise with him if they get 98% of what they want.

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

Freshieee: I think you missed the biggest point that I tried to make. Never in our nation's history has Congress been more divisive. Not only across the aisle, but even within their respective parties. The state of Indiana just voted out Dick Lugar (R) in the primary. Mostly because of his association with the president. Many retiring senators and representatives have cited this division as one of the reasons for retirement. I know DeMint and O'Connell have stated that it was their goal to make president Obama a one term president. But, the fact of the matter is their real goal is to get re-elected.

Boehner may be the Speaker, but the Republican party is so fractured that it is hard for them to gain consensus for compromise. But, to be fair, the Democrats lack unity as that was evident throughout the debate leading up to the ACA.

Your exuberance and fawning for the president tells me that you are very young. The president is not without fault and partial responsibility. If I was Obama, I would be picking up the phone and asking for some advice from Bill Clinton. I wouldn't be calling Wall Street Bankers, "Fat Cats" and turn around and hire a bunch of them to work in the White House. I wouldn't be hammering Mitt Romney on making his money as a venture capitalist and turn around and attend a fund raiser held by another venture capitalist. To me, it shows that his actions are different from his rhetoric. It shows me that I can't relate to his values. To be fair, it has been awhile since I have found a president that I could relate to when considering their values. I gave Obama a shot for 4 years. He hasn't earned my vote for 4 more.

I do applaud your enthusiastic involvment in the political process. Your posts are similar to those of my 19 year old niece.

The economy didn't sneak up on Obama during the 2008 campaign. He knew the challenges of the position to which he was applying.

What a fool you are! Do you realize how quickly things tanked? Here's a clue:

First we compiled the numbers for Bush's last three months. Between October and November, 597,000 jobs were lost; between November and December, 681,000 were lost; and between December and January, 741,000 were lost.

Do you get that? 2 million jobs in 3 months during/after the election! Moron! Nobody could have guessed the depths of Bush's idiocy at that time!

I gave Obama a shot for 4 years. He hasn't earned my vote for 4 more.

I did too! here's what happened:

...the numbers for Bush's last three months. Between October and November, 597,000 jobs were lost; between November and December, 681,000 were lost; and between December and January, 741,000 were lost.

April 2012 marks the 26th straight month of gains in private-sector employment, for a total of 4.2 million private-sector jobs.

and this:

DJIA Dec 1, 2008 = 8149

DJIA May 19, 2012 = 12369

and this:

Dec 29, 2008 U.S. corporate earnings probably fell for a sixth-straight quarter, the longest streak in at least 20 years, as consumer spending on automobiles, homes and retailers collapsed.

May 11, 2012 Fortune magazine released its ranking of the 500 biggest US corporations Monday, which showed that they received a record-breaking $824 billion in combined profits in 2011, up 16 percent from 2010.

and that's why he'll get my vote for another 4 years!

Now here in Florida The gov. and some of his friends are sending out lists of people who are deemed not eligible to vote. And, You guessed it! a huge majority of these people are registered Dems. several were interview on the local news. Apparently they were sent a letter telling them they must prove their eligibility.

And you wonder how Bush got elected?

"1%'ers like Romney", Obama, and all the rest of the leadership of both parties.

FIFY. Neither party is going to change that part of how our tax system works, because the guys RUNNING the parties are the same guys BENEFITING from the status quo.

So we have a choice:

A: stick with the Democrats and watch our nation be crushed by debt and our economy be smothered by entitlement spending.

B: switch to the Republicans and watch our nation be crushed by debt and our economy sucked dry by corporations who hide their wealth overseas.

They've been trading back and forth for a while now, so at least we get an interesting combination of both deaths.

Ahhhhhh they are illegal aliens and are not allowed to vote by law. Did you read how they found them, I dont care if they are the best people ever they are illegals. They found these people in more than a few states by bouncing the Juror excusal lists against the Voter lists. In some states 1 in 5 voters were found to be illegal. Do you really think a non citizen should be able to vote ?

"A local Florida station invented an unprecedented way to check for voter fraud: jury excusal forms. NBC2 compiled a list of jury excusals based on not being a citizen of the United States and compared it to a list of registered voters in two counties. They discovered almost 100 illegally registered voters, many of whom had voted multiple times. “I vote every year,” one woman told NBC2, despite the fact that she is not a US citizen. The woman had told the court that she couldn’t serve on a jury because she wasn’t a US citizen, but she doesn’t seem to have a problem voting like one. Source: The Rickards Review"

@ Amy-

That is most if the issue isn't it? The left want all the entitlements- but the right keeps asking, "How are you going to pay for it?" The left just waves it off and does it anyway. So the right feeling slighted- spend on something equally idiotic- and the games begins...

THAT is how we got here!

So now we are faced with- something's gotta' give! And it will be entitlements. Not ALL programs are necessary- and if a majority of people don't use it or need it- it should be looked at to be completely cut or reduced- period. It's going to be painful for a while- but that is what we are faced with.

It's time for new blood- R & D's alike!

Clearly Republicans in all states will try and prevent voting, it's how they always work.

There has yet to be evidence of widespread voter fraud ever produced. You say 100, yet the lists are 1000's long.

More crap from the right.

NOt all the entitlements are necessary. Revamp the disability eligibility - we all know someone that's on it that could work somewhere. If you can make money sitting on your butt, why work? We need to get the pharmacutical Co's in line with the pricing, drug test any entitlement recipients and make real changes.

There's three different kinds of fraud: voter registration fraud, voting fraud, and Republican fraud. Registration fraud has happened, mostly by Republicans (e.g., in California), whereas cases of actual voting fraud, not so much. Republican fraud is what we saw in Ohio in the 2000 election, for example, where Republicans tampered with voting machines.

fuzzy44 -- Florida as an important swing state, usually absolutely necessary for Republican victory, is and always has been rigged by Republicans in one way or another. We had "hanging chads," and now voter ID laws to suppress the vote. What's completely unacceptable is the inability to even register voters. The GOP/TP are for friggin' dictatorship--with them in control, of course.

No? Take a look at Michigan and the Emergency Managers. No democracy and elected officials for the citizens of Michigan. Gov. Snyder has one up on ya Rick Scott!

The importance of throwing out Teapublicans nationwide and at every level, from Congress to governors to state legislatures can't be emphasized enough. Any patriotic American who holds democracy dear must vote their conscience and hearts, and not by Party, and throw any GOP/TP politician who has committed acts against our constitutional democracy out. Let's hope Wisconsin starts by throwing "Divide and Conquer" Scott Walker out!

Thanks, TruePatriot, you'll have us in the same place as Greece in no time at all! Read about it and take a lesson: if the people vote for their own entitlements and to raise taxes on the rich - surprise - the rich go elsewhere and the entitlements will get no funding! If the rich leave the country, who is going to pay for all of these programs that you love so much? You? The nearly 50% of the country who pay no income taxes? Or maybe you think that Europe, who has been bleeding us for decades, will take pity and impoverish themselves further to help our welfare class? When pigs fly, my friend. Or China, which is experiencing its own economic downturn now - do you think they'll just keep handing over their own wealth to us, no strings attached? Ha!

Lane-the rich as a group are going nowhere. They need their saps and rubes to fleece and their country clubs and alma maters are here. They don't want to live in a second class country-it might not be safe and there would be minorities. The threat of the loss of job creators-just another Fox talking point.

@realist: a rich person does not need to leave the country or renounce their citizenship to avoid major tax increases. Creating foreign corporations and maintaining those profits generated overseas circumvents the US tax code legally. We see the same thing with rich people avoiding rising taxes in various states. You simply buy a home in a more tax friendly state. Since most of the income is from capital gains, it is simply too easy to circumvent state and federal tax codes legally. Rich people did not become rich by being stupid. 80% of millionares are first generation. People learn the rules and take whatever courses of actions that benefit them.

Bushes legacy will be a heck of a lot better then the current Presidents will be. At least by real standards anyway. The world you reside has its own reality so who knows or cares what happens there.

Have another cup of kook aid and it will be alright Fiesty.

rukidding47

Bushes legacy will be a heck of a lot better then the current Presidents will be. At least by real standards anyway. The world you reside has its own reality so who knows or cares what happens there.

Have another cup of kook aid and it will be alright Fiesty.------------

-------------------

Really...his legacy is as bad as Hoover's.

rukidding,

Can you explain what Romney's plan is to fix the economy? Site specific examples of what he'd like to cut and by how much..

Thank you

Fiesty I could care less about GW's endorsement only silly people from somewhere else consider him a Texan. But Kay endorsed Mitt now that has some weight with me at least when I e-mailed her she admitted she never read ACA before it came up for a vote. Honesty from a politician how refreshing.

I didn't even know Dubya endorsed Willard until this article. It was so fast I missed it. I can't wait to see George W. Bush attending fund raisers, standing proudly next to Willard. Clinton has been working hard to help Obama, so it's only fair!

I would take Hoover's record over Carbama's record any day!! Obama- when all said and done will go down as one of the worst 3 we've ever had! Carter is smiling a lot these days knowing he has moved up a notch...

You keep saying that Obama will go down as the worst, and he won't be a long shot. He got the auto industry up and running, he put policy in effect despite the worst obstruction in decades and got Bin Laden.

What has Bush got, "mission accomplished".

Carter is a better Presidential choice than Romney who is long on promises and short on specifics. At least Carter led an operation to retrieve hostages when Romney wouldn't have even taken the chance.

At least Carter led an operation to retrieve hostages when Romney wouldn't have even taken the chance.

quite the crystal ball you have there! How the heck do you know that???

and as long as the liberals don't try and re-write history, Obama will be one of the worst. Funny that he takes credit for the Auto Industry- when it was, for the most part- Romney's plan. It didn't go far enough- and I would bet a dozen doughnuts that within the next 10 years we'll go down this road again- they didn't take care of the real problem- the UAW. They promised too much yet again to the union and it will cause another failure.

OBL was found due to info that came from detainees at Gitmo from interrogation that was disapproved of by Obama (approved of by W). If Obamawas a man of honor- he wouldn't have used that intel. Romney got it right though- even Carter would have given the order. That was a no-brainer!

Look-stop the lies. Romney's plan was in writing and the title was "Let Detroit Go Broke". This plan would of looked for a corporate raider to ride to the dying auto industry-buy the assets cheap-split them up and sell them for a profit after collecting millions in fees. This would have started the second great depression-Romney was clueless.

Don't even bring up-controlled bankruptcy-no one had the money or the desire to make the loans to GM and Chrysler. Obama did.

Lookforthetruth, you my friend are a bit myopic. Romney's plan for the Auto Industry was "Let Detroit Go Broke." The intelligence to get OBL was ground work by our Intelligence Agencies when PBO made OBL a priority. Unlike Shrub who's comment was "He's not a priority anymore." Look it is time for you to go to the eye doctor. Just Saying!

and as long as the liberals don't try and re-write history, Obama will be one of the worst. Funny that he takes credit for the Auto Industry- when it was, for the most part- Romney's plan. It didn't go far enough- and I would bet a dozen doughnuts that within the next 10 years we'll go down this road again- they didn't take care of the real problem- the UAW. They promised too much yet again to the union and it will cause another failure.

Are you @!$%#ing kidding me??? The auto bailout was NOT a managed bankruptcy. I don't recall any bankruptcy that includes the government buying up around 40% of the company in order to get things done. Romney himself raged against Obama's auto bailout just a few months ago, only to make his trademark flip flop. And name me ONE credible shred of proof from a RELIABLE source that the auto industry is going to go down in another decade. With the boom that's going on over there, I'm not sure that that is going to happen, especially after they reformed the business model.

OBL was found due to info that came from detainees at Gitmo from interrogation that was disapproved of by Obama (approved of by W). If Obamawas a man of honor- he wouldn't have used that intel.

I would think that Obama would put the priority of getting revenge on the brain of the mass murder of 3,000 innocent lives above his own honor. Would you discredit credible info based on torture (if you opposed it) on a future attack on the US??? And if you did, and the attack happen, would you feel content with knowing that "maybe 5,000 people died, and the Washington Monument did collapse, but at least I am still a man of honor???" Because that is what you are basically saying.

Romney got it right though- even Carter would have given the order. That was a no-brainer!

No, it wasn't. If going into foreign territory, taking out a man who for all we know might be a double or just a look-alike, and risk setting off a geopolitical catastrophe of epic proportions is a no-brainer, than so was the decision to bomb Hiroshima and Nagasaki. And by the way, what's your beef with Jimmy Carter. I don't like the guy myself, as he was a joke when it came to human rights, but what's with the criticism??? Why do you think he was ineffective, especially at foreign policy??? I mean, for God's sake he sent American soldiers into Iran to rescue U.S. hostages in 1979. Sure the effort failed, costing 8 Americans their lives and giving the Iranians a wealth in military hardware, but it took guts to do that. You right-wingers are devoid of logic, of reason, of compassion, and apparently, of history.

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

Freshieee,

The auto bailout really had no different outcome from the standpoint of GM and Chysler surviving than a chapter 11 would have. The difference is the government and the UAW won controls at the expense of the bondholders (Pensions, IRA's and 401K's mainly owned by middle class people)>

But Bruce, would a company that participates with the bankruptcy of another company take control of that company???

Obama has already tanked the economy .... "LOL"

With his record high , massive , unstoppable , rocketing upward , disastrous , credit downgrading , Greece like debt and deficit .... "LOL"

Do we really need to "LOL" at everything? Why do people insist on using this idiotic acronym?

Obama supporters are usually very unhappy people ....

Cheer up ....

Romney saving America from Obama's disasters should make you happy too .... "LOL"

The GOP slogan: keeping millions out of work to cost one man his job. It is shameful.

It's now under Obama ....

That we have a 30 year low for employment participation .... "LOL"

Yes , a 30 year low ....

Yikes ....

That we have a 30 year low for employment participation .

Actually, that was under W. Bush.

Wrong answer, no soup for you!

You would prefer the whole country going ala California.

Hey, Alaska, a question for you: Article 1, Section 7 of the Constitution gives the House of Representatives primary authority for tax and spending issues. In fact, all such bills related to revenue and expenditures must originate in the House. House passed bills must then be approved by the Senate and sent to the President for signature or veto.

So, here is the question: Can any President be given credit for lowering taxes or reducing expenditures? And conversely, can any President be justifiably blamed for increasing taxes or expenditures?

I think the "LOL" in quotes is the new Rush Limbaugh code. It refers only to those people who are extremely "left of left", as opposed to most Democrats and progressives. They seem to like having a secret language, I guess.

Still, It's pretty accurate, since very few people are truly extreme left. Even President Obama is only moderate left.

@ Louis-

Barry already beat him to the punch...

You don't call a emergency room physician who resusitates a dying patient a failure; President Obama resusitated a dying capitalist system and now the patient is in recovery. A lot different than the conservatives who would have pulled the plug and waited to see if the dying patient would recover on his own.

Pres Obama didn't resusitate any dying system we're still in critical condition - and can't pay the medical bill.

flipper and the gop are so good at lying to their lemmings ....You know whats funny about statistics you can make them say anything you want them to say depending on the variables you use as input a practice the gop is very good at its not til you input all the variables and statistics that the truth rises to true reality and the right tries to convince their base that its Obamas fault all this spending and our debt is out of control Fact is bush came into office with a surplus left with 10+ trillion on the books in debt and most of what Obama has spent was spent to get us out of the largest recession in our nations history caused by bush and the gop policies of which they want us to go back to using flipper on steriods and the ryan plan.

One thing the gop doesnt bring up about Obamas debt and I know why is in feb 2009 the 2 unpaid for wars and 9 yrs of unpaid for tax breaks for the wealthy and Part B prescription meds all went on Obamas books you do the math...Obama 2012..Lets get our country back flipper hasnt laid out one plan in detail to let the experts look at the real numbers and we all know why it wont work.

Obama has already tanked the economy ....

Nope, sorry, Bush already tanked the economy. I know how much you Republicans would like to rewrite history BUT it just ain't so! Try again, Big Ben...

BigBen -

Not sure where you get your numbers... here's mine:

FOX News
Obama 46, Romney 39
Obama +7

Good luck with that!

Obama .... ??

We know ....

All of those people are dead behind Romney they were taken from Miami - Dade morgue for the photo shoot

How about a bit more of the article from Rasmussen:

But voters still trust their own economic judgment over either candidate’s.

Everyone should be fiscally responsible .... Dragon-1573721 ....

ben: Just making sure the entire quote was known....Americans do not trust either party with the economic issues facing us....Americans do not trust either party because they are both owned by wall street, billionniares, lobbyists, banks.

I wouldn't trust romney to watch my dog

frankiejrjr - oh definitely not the dog! We know about Mitt and dogs!

I would. He gives them rides but don't eat them.

Whats the problem?

Wow ! Back to the "dog" stuff again ? StillSeekingSanity ..... we also know about Obama and the dog. I wonder if he used Heinz 57 or A-1 ? Do you think he used Adolph's meat tenderizer since he said it was "tough" ?

Romney is so vain.
He forgets his days at Bain.

Romney raided pensions, to make billions.
Today, he wants tax breaks worth trillions.

Taxpayers had to bailout workers after Romney stole closed the business door.
Taxpayers will have to bailout America when Romney lowers his own tax rate some more.

franiejrjr, right and Obungler would eat your dog!

At least Romney wouldn't eat your dog.

Right. Romney would just attack gay children and cut off their hair.

You don't call a emergency room physician who resusitates a dying patient a failure; President Obama resusitated a dying capitalist system and now the patient is in recovery. A lot different than the conservatives who would have pulled the plug and waited to see if the dying patient would recover on his own.

I hope we don't base this election on dogs, high school stupidity, and a company that didn't make it 13 years ago. And again Obama didn't resusite anything, he gave it staph infection and the bill.

Clotho - You do realize that the family of the young man in question said the entire story was "factually inaccurate" and was being pushed for "purely political reasons", don't you? And you do realize the story about the steel company that failed happened 2 years AFTER Romney left Bain Capital? That the company re-formed, thrived and is still around today, along with the facts or the hair cutting case, seems to have missed MS-DNC and the rest of the White House propaganda arm, I mean Major Media.

With Obama we are on life support with the economy and 4 more years of his administration we will be FINISHED . if you vote for him be prepared to cry. If you vote for Mitt Romney life will begin amazingly with PROSPERITY. $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ that's Mitt Romney who will fix the economy, 000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000

That will be the result of 4 more years of the left administration and we'll fell sorry not voting for Romney an experience successful businessman, Romney 2012

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$(speech) the Romney/Ryan budget gives more to billionaires and takes $$$$$$$$$$(speech) away from social programs. Romney wants to spend more $$$$$$$$$$$$(speech) on the bloated defense budget by building more capital ships and adding more troops-his words in this speech. WTF-how do you cut spending this way? Mitt is only lying when his lips move.

realist: The truth about the Ryan budget is that it does not reduce the deficit. But, it does not take away from social programs either. It grows the social programs at a decreased rate. Slower than what was proposed by the president's budget.

Even as a retired military officer, I realize that defense spending needs to be curtailed. But, there isn't one federal department that should escape budget cuts. As established by recent stories surrounding GSA and TSA, they could easily find wasteful spending.

Bob you do realize that the economic policy of Bain is what lead to the closing of GST Steel. And no they are not around. I happen to know this because I am from Kansas City. People lost their jobs and their pensions, but that is so much BS to you Bob because fact are icky things that will give you cooties. Just Saying!

And you do realize that the company closed 2 years AFTER Romney left the company, right? Or is this just one of those "icky things that will give you cooties"? To blame Romney for this, 2 years after he left the company, is like blaming Bush for stuff 3 years after he left office, but I guess that's how you roll. So, in this we can agree, I do find what you said "so much BS", or just plain defelection of reality.

The reality is that many steel companies went bankrupt around the same time due to foreign steel being dumped here at prices that could not be matched by US steel makers. Also, Congress did not want to place tariffs on the steel.

The facts simply do not support that Bain Capital, as a point of policy, bought companies with the intent of bankrupting them. When companies like Bain Capital get involved, it is because the company can no longer find capital through normal channels. It is a "last resort". These companies are headed for bankruptcy without a venture capitalist stepping in. Some companies were saved and others went bankrupt.

BigBen -

Not sure where you get your numbers... here's mine:

FOX News
Obama 46, Romney 39
Obama +7

Good luck with that!

He does alot of volunteer work. look into that for Obama.

Been-Get serious-Mitt is faking there, too. He has no compassion for the poor or he couldn't back the Ryan budget. He has been against gays his entire life and his Mormon religion demands that attitude.

We will not be fooled by orchestrated charity work as part of his lifetime political campaign and photo shoot. Mitt has no personality and genuine contempt for the poor/needy/common people. Get real.

So you think Barack is any better?!? WHat a lying scumbag he turned out to be...vote panderer...I do not think the President of the United States should set down on the "View" or do the slow jam...what a creep. I wasted my vote in 08 because what he said did sound fresh...guess what ...stinky tuna...

Romney/Jindal 2012

Obama can't fool real Americans ....

You have to addMITT ....

At least Romney can add and subtract .... "LOL"

J: Romney putting pressure on President Obama....LOL...that is too funny. Romney doesn't have any solutions to our issues, he says "wait until I am elected, then I will tell you what I am going to do"....that is not pressure that is foolishness...LOL!

Romney has been running for president for years now....and still hasn't figure out what to do....LOL!

J.Wilson - aren't you just a little embarrassed to be pushing the same agenda as bigbenalaska? That should give you a hint you're supporting the wrong person!

bigbenalaska - we've seen that dopey post for about a month now. It's still not bright; not intelligent; not funny; not smart. Oh wait - it's sooooo you!

The only solution Obama had was hope and change. Why would you expect more from Romney?

Romney uses a prop to hide behind because his history and actions show a rich silver spoon elitist bully who grew up to become an elitist corporate raider who destroyed American companies American workers and American communities while posing for a magazine cover with money falling out of his pockets. If the Republicans get hot over this candidate without a personality and a demonstrated dislike of the average American I feel sorry for them. I'm pretty sure that a vast majority are just going to vote against Obama. They are not stupid-they know Romney is a terrible candidate and a corporate candidate-they don't care.

BigBen -

Not sure where you get your numbers... here's mine:

FOX News
Obama 46, Romney 39
Obama +7

Good luck with that!

We never had a balanced budged under (D) Clinton and (R) Gingrich. Social Security Expenditures were taken off of the books (reducing the "budget" deficit), and then we borrowed from the SS fund to make up the remaining difference in the deficit. Further budget "revenues" were based on "dot.com" revenue that never materialized (because of the "dot.com" bust).

We never had a balanced budget in the 1990s, let alone a surplus. It was all smoke and mirrors. The 1990s began the era of TWO sets of government books -- reality, and (ahem) government reality.

The truth is that we haven't had ACTUAL government surpluses (and ACTUALLY paid down our debt) since Calvin Coolidge.

You Republican and Democrat hacks might do well to get your damn facts straight. I've never seen a larger group of uneducated, indoctrinated hacks in a single room.

We're doomed, economically, and you dolts keep rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

Let the band play...

Gav: Finally, someone who actually understands the truth about budget surpluses. Thank you.

All other claims are biased partisan talking points.

Romney's Obama's answer has always been the same:

Q: How are you going to create jobs, Mr. Romney Obama?
A: It's George Bush's fault!

Q: How are you going to help the economy?
A: It' the Republican's fault!

Q: What about the banking and foreclosure crisis in America?
A: It's Fox New, the Tea Party, any one's fault but mine!

Bob, your Q & A is much more accurate!

Bob&Bruce-Obama got Osama and saved GM and Chrysler. Fox News doesn't tell you boys much that's true so I will review that with you on a daily basis-repeat along with me-Osama is dead and GM is alive.

Obama got Osama and saved GM and Chrysler.

realist pondering

yes Obama did those things

He also blew half a billion on solyndra, and billions on other failed green energy programs.

He got the US credit rating downgraded, rammed through the unpopular American health care act, and spent us in to oblivion.

Not to mention the economy is still in a stall, and unemployment is still at record highs.

Joy

La hater, you do realize that Solyndra was given a loan in which to combat the chinese from getting too large a foothold in the solar market. And that the downgrade was from the petulance of the GOP. And I am wondering why you would like to make sure those with a pre-existing condition can't get insurance. Or why you want the insurance companies to spend less than 80% on actual health care. Or for families to allow their children on their health plans until they are 26 years old. Why do you not want to receive a check from the insurance company when they don't spend 80% or greater on your health care? I am thinking that you do not care for America because you seem to champion someone who will bring us back to the failed policies that put us in this position. Just Saying!

"realist" - yes, Obama was in office when the Intelligence Community located bin Laden and when the SEALS "got" him (I do not believe Obama was on the op, but you never know what MS-DNC was reporting, or how the White House will edit Bush's biography to show how Obama was in uniform and pulled the trigger). Yes, Obama did give millions to GM and Chrysler to "save" the unions. (BTW Ford took nothing from Obama and is still doing well). Wanna talk Goldman-Sachs? Wanna talk JP Morgan Chase? Dems were all over the Bush Admin to prosecute in the Enron "scandal", is Corozine still free? Has the best Financial mind Biden or Obama ever known even been charged yet? I guess the "Justice" department is too busy dodging Congress on Fast and Furious to worry about investigating MF Global.

Might help if you read something other the White House press releases.

Yes, Obama did give millions to GM and Chrysler to "save" the unions. (BTW Ford took nothing from Obama and is still doing well).

That was because Ford was having troubles a few years before the auto crash and managed to establish a line of credit in order to help them restructure the company. And last time I checked, Ford isn't the world's number one automaker, is it???

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

Notice the by - line....that bastion of fair and balanced reporting......(NOT)

KingK - OMG, you ACTUALLY put in print that Romney is talking about the REAL ISSUES? Please Romney couldn't articulate a complete thought if it killed him. He has no plans, no ideas, no nothing but you think this "man" can lead???? Oh you're perfect for bigbenalaska - right on the same mental wavelength - both of them short - very short - wavelengths!

Typical liberal tactic. If you are loosing the argument on merit, change the subject. If you are loosing on facts, blame some one else.

Yes Fox did tell the story of Barry inserting his campaign commercials in the official White House biographies of past Presidents. Damn sure PMS-DNC won't talk about it. So I ask you, what does it have to to with THIS story? Just couldn't figure out how to counter Romney on the FACT that the President has out spent the last 43 combined? And in only 3 years? Great accomplishment that one is. How about inserting that into the WH website.

Barry's new campaign is "Forward" since he doesn't want you to look back and see after all his hope, all we have left of our wealth is our change.

Mr Obama how will you fix the economy? Obama chewing on his $35,000 steak with a venture capitalist Tax tax the 1% but don't check my $500,000 checking account balance

There really isn't any issue here. The main point made by Fox News is that "[t]he White House is coming under heavy criticism from conservatives..."

Big surprise there. I think Republicans are just terrified of the fact that President Obama's ideas are not radical or extremist, and have in fact followed in the tradition of many Presidents, including Reagan.

It's too bad Fox News never spends time talking about policy issues. What a waste of time the above propaganda is.

Come up for air-Glen Beck and Fox news is bad TV not news.

Bob, here we are again. You realize that the increase in the debt that has come under PBO's watch is placing two unfunded wars, the Medicare part D, The unpaid for tax breaks? These are all Bush economic policies. Pull your head out of your backside and come up for air. Hypoxia is a Bitch. Just Saying!

cmb - Hypoxia caused by inertion must be a bitch, as you obviously know. Just repeating the mantra does not make it true.

If you wish to complain about spending by previous administrations, as you appear to be one of the chanting crowd who just must do this, then do you excuse part of the debt incurred by the Bush Administration that was the servicing of debt deferred by the Clinton Administration in the late 90's? If you wish to complain about the MEDICARE drug program, then how does the debt this caused compare to Obamacare? (and please use GAO accounting, not the Obama Re-election team/White House numbers) And, using typical Democrat statements, if you have a problem with MEDICARE programs, you must want to push grandma off the cliff, since that's what you folks accuse Republicans of if they wish to reduce growth by even $1, even to the point of making commercials about it.

As for "tax breaks for the rich", THEY ARE THE ONES PAYING THE TAXES. How can you give a tax break to the 50% who don't pay anything? Morons keep sniping at the "1%" then wank they don't give enough. What, to your warped mind, is "enough"? 30%? 40%? 50%? If you keep taxing them and they move their wealth off shore (like the Kennedy's) then you have more to complain about. You should thank the rich - without them, who would you vilify? Oh, yeah, if you wish to really "get" the "1%", then quit taking their donations to your campaign. That'll teach them. Then they could have more to donate to you tax plans. But, no, must kiss up for the $15M in donations

No but we do have a President that is fond of using people as props. Every time he gives a speech he carefully has a group of certain hand selected individuals stand behind him as props to make it look like all Americans support him. And his speeches are nothing more than jokes, because what ever he says has to be done, he immediately ignores once the election is over,

as if the GNOP doesn't do the same thing....looking at some of the "fans" in back of Romney looks like they haven't missed many meals at "Golden Corral".......they were probably promised free tickets to the GC to show up ......

KingK, speaking of people, why is it that whenever Romney is giving a speech somewhere, there is never a cover shot of those in attendance?

I think the Dems are afraid that america will find out how much our debt really is under Obama.

Here is a message for the uninformed, short memory people on this thread. From what our President had to deal with when he took office until now, it's a no brain-er. He will be re-elected. Romney is beating a dead horse because he's got no where else to go. With the cooperation of the American people at the poles our deficit can be slowly reduced without destroying what made this country great. Time and time again we have had deficits more then surplus's in this country and have always come out of it. Eliminating the debt won't happen over night in a down economy that is slowly rising. Anyone that thinks Romney/GOP/TP is the silver bullet is surely mistaking and would be a grave mistake for the people of these United States.

Let's see, Obama has been in office nearly three and a half years and he has yet to propose a single budget, or any other plan, that calls for elimination of deficit spending and reduction of the debt. His deficit spending has been at a record setting pace and the debt now stands just under $16 Trillion and is expected to rise up to over $20Trillion if Obama is reelected.

So we know Obama not only doesn't have a plan, but if he is reelected he will, according to his own plans already put to Congress, seek to keep US at record setting deficit spending and debt creation.No end in sight. End it in Nov, vote Romney.

Let's see, KingK has no clue what he is talking about. The president submits a budget every year as required by law. The president had a big deal with Republican John Boehner that had $3 trillion in spending cuts with $1 trillion in revenue increases until Boehner backed out.

Therma,

If you put out a budget that does not get one vote in either the House or Democratic Majority Senate would you say that is a serious plan or just a waste of time. Please also note that a budget only needs 51 votes to pass and cannot be filibustered.

Irrelevant. Previous post said Obama had not proposed a budget. He did as required by law. I have never seen ANY president's budget passed, ever. The congress always trashes the president's budget and passes their own, and then goes on to pass more spending bills outside of the budget, such as the entirety of the Iraq and Afghanistan wars during Bush., neither were part of the budget.

Actually, the Presidents budget was changed by the Republican budget group in a Stunt

and that is why the Democrats voted against it.

That is not true because they put up their own plan which is the Ryan budget. It has passed the House the last two years. The Democrats voted against the President's plan because they did not want to give the Republicans talking points for the election. Add that to the Senate which has not put out a budget in over 3 years then there is nothing serious coming from the Democrats.

Therman it works more like the House passes a budget, the Senate passes a budget and then it gets reconciled in committee but until their is a Democratic plan we are left with nothing. The President should be working with the Senate to come up with a viable plan that can be voted on.

Irrelevent........ blah blah blah! Irrevelent.... What was the vote on the presidents last budget? I bet a lot of Dems voted for it! Wait for it.....wait for it........waaaaaait for it!

http://www.washingtontimes.com/blog/inside-politics/2012/mar/28/obama-budget-defeated-414-0/

The Cost of Obama

8:05 AM, FEB 14, 2012 • BY JEFFREY H. ANDERSON

President Obama’s fourth budget has now been released, which allows for a relatively full accounting of deficit spending during his four years in office. The picture isn’t pretty, but it is revealing.

According to the White House’s own figures (see table S-1 here for 2011 to 2013, and table S-1here for 2010), the actual or projected deficit tallies for the four years in which Obama has submitted budgets are as follows: $1.293 trillion in 2010, $1.300 trillion in 2011, $1.327 trillion in 2012, and $901 billion in 2013. In addition, Obama is responsible for the estimated $200 billion(the Congressional Budget Office’s figure) that his economic “stimulus” added to the deficit in 2009. Moreover, he shouldn’t get credit for the $149 billion in TARP (Troubled Asset Relief Program) repayments made in 2010 and 2011 to cover most of the $154 billion in bank loans that remained unpaid at the end of the 2009 fiscal year — loans that count against President Bush’s 2009 deficit tally.

Adding all of this up, deficit spending during Obama’s four years in the White House (based on his own figures) will be an estimated $5.170 trillion — or $5,170,000,000,000.00.

To help put that colossal sum of money into perspective, if you take our deficit spending under Obama and divide it evenly among the roughly 300 million American citizens, that works out to just over $17,000 per person — or about $70,000 for a family of four.

Currently the debt has ballooned to just under $16 Trillion under Obama and between now and the fall he will be asking Congress to raise the debt ceiling. Under Obama's past proposal the debt is projected to increase to $20 Trillion plus, spurred on by Obama's continued deficit spending, no end in sight and no plan to stop it.

End It In Nov, Vote Romney.

@Therman Merman,

Reading is fundamental, and it appears you DID NOT READ THE ENTIRE SENTENCE from KingK at #15.1 before making your futile posts at #15.2 and #15.4.

Obama's "budget proposals" are a bad joke and get no respect from within his own party !

@Thermen...you didn't do well with reading comprehension did you!?! Let me help you out. KingK stated that the president has not submitted a budget that called for smaller deficit spending or reducing the debt. You stopped reading after budget.

I wouldn't have a problem with him not submitting a budget that called for smaller deficits if he had not promised to cut the deficit in half by his first term. I wouldn't have a problem with his huge expansion of the debt if he hadn't called president Bush "unpatriotic" for the increase in debt under his administration. It sucks when you have your own words thrown back in your face.

get the facts,

Obama's recovery is anemic. When Hoover left office and FDR took over the economy grew by 8% to 10% each of the years 1933 - 1935. During none of BHO's years has the economy grown over 3%. This year growth has 2.2% with it estimated to drop to 1.9% during the third quarter. During recoveries, Ford, Reagan, Bush 1, Clinton and Bush 2 all had growth levels exceeding Obama's by close to or even more than two times.

The stimulus was a disaster. Yes it may have created 2.1 million jobs; however, it cost $400,000 per job. If targeted at the private sector it may have created 8 million jobs. If that was the case maybe we would all support BHO.

Taxing the rich is not the way to solve the buget. If we tax the top 10% of wage earners at 50% of income with no deductions or exemptions, we will still be tens of billions short of paying the annual federal budget. This will be money taken out of the economy since the federal budget remains the same and the top 10% no longer has the difference of what they keep now and 50% of funds to spend on other things.

We must control spending and increase the GDP to increase revenue. OHB has not done either.

Here are the facts. PBO has done an excellent job despite the obstructionist Congress. There have been a record number of cloture arguments since PBO has been in office. PBO tried to compromise with the GOP, but each time they storm off like petulant children. These same petulant children also caused the U.S. credit downgrade and have threatened to do it again if they don't get their way. SO feel smug that you keyboard cowboys can cut and paste from Fox, but you cut off your nose in spite of your face because PBO has done the job no rightwinger could do. Just Saying!

Currently the debt has ballooned to just under $16 Trillion under Obama and between now and the fall he will be asking Congress to raise the debt ceiling. Under Obama's past proposal the debt is projected to increase to $20 Trillion plus, spurred on by Obama's continued deficit spending, no end in sight and no plan to stop it.

End It In Nov, Vote Romney.

FALSE. Obama only raised the debt by approximately $4 trillion, as his spending policies started after Bush's budget resolution for FY 2009. In addition, most of the deficit was caused by the Great Recession or the Bush tax cuts, two things that he was forced to either extend (Bush tax cuts) or fix via spending programs.

Frankly, I think Americans are slaves. We are slaves to the Constitution. Yes, I know its our founding document, and its the basis of our entire government, but for God's sake it's 230 years old. You can't follow an old document word-for-word; if we did, we might as well have started preparing for the apocalypse before we discovered that the Mayan calendar doesn't end in 2012. We cannot remain chained to a document. We must balance our interpretation of the Constitution with modern logic and reasoning. Either we balance our views on both issues, or we are done for.

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

Currently the debt has ballooned to just under $16 Trillion under Obama and between now and the fall he will be asking Congress to raise the debt ceiling. Under Obama's past proposal the debt is projected to increase to $20 Trillion plus, spurred on by Obama's continued deficit spending, no end in sight and no plan to stop it.

End It In Nov, Vote Romney.

And under Romney, it will increase to between $24 and 27 trillion.

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

Obama 2012 Campaign, Blame, Demean, and Divert.

Obama 2012 Campaign, actually tell the truth, and point out what rats the Republicans are.

Thermen,

The idea was to increase revenues as more was spent in the private sector. The revenues increased unfortunately spending was un-controlled and except in a few years under Clinton and the early part Bush 2 was allowed to outgrow revenue.

That's too easy...its been debunked many times

http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2011/07/24/opinion/sunday/24editorial_graph2.html?ref=sunday

The debt is a distraction right now. Unemployment is what everyone is concerned about, not the national debt that has gone up steadily for 30+ years. The debt doesn't affect our lives, but having a job does.

It is probably an encouraging sign for the economy, that Republicans are talking about the debt right now. It might mean they realize that things are getting better. it was Darth Cheney himself who opined that "deficits don't matter."

Why won't Romney say Bush's name? He said Reagan's name. Why not Bush?

Oh yeah, Bush was a huge failure. Romney has the exact same policies as Bush. Romney doesn't want to remind people of that.

But But...... wait, is Bush still president? Has he been hiding in Crawford Again?

I REALLY HOPE THAT ROMNEY GETS TO BE PRESIDENT....

And then....all of you who voted for the CONSERVATIVE AUSTERITY PROGRAM THAT SHREDS OUR NATIONAL SOCIAL SAFETY NET with the money saved going to FURTHER TAX CUTS FOR THOSE WHO DO NOT NEED THEM and the BILL FOR THE RESULTING MESS will be paid for by

GUESS WHO??

I'll give you a big hint....NOT CORPORATIONS AND THE WEALTHY ONE PER CENT....

iheard this before.

Well its ashame you didn't comprehend the Obama speech. With Obama committing another $3.5 trillion to Afghan, that will mean that Obama will have to raise the debt ceiling to over $22 trillion.

Even an moron knows that this country can only sustain so much debt before it destroys us.

Excellent , awesome post ! thank you for the info. I think the same should be posted all over the blogs on the internet. Some voters don't really know about this president and his administration He thinks we are STUPID ! We will better off with Mitt Romney who has an amazing economic experience.

In Wisconsin the schools, townships, cities and villages are reeling from Failed Governor Scott Walker's tax cut for corporations and layoff of teachers and public service workers. He is trying to destroy all unions in Wisconsin so the Koch Brothers and his other financial backers can make more $$$$$$$$$$(speech).

Republican Governors in Wisconsin, Arizona, Ohio, Michigan, Florida, Virginia and other states are showing what Republican administrations do to common workers, womens rights, gay rights and taxes. It sure isn't pretty or democratic(see Michigan).

Everyone must help remove Failed Governor Scott Walker and then remove as many Tea Party and Republican officials as possible in 2012.

@Staneve: I love the irony of your post "He thinks we are STUPID"....you are.

"...Mitt Romney who has an amazing economic experience."

"VULTURE CAPITALIST" WHO RAN A HEDGE FUND....you find this "amazing economic experience"?? What an astounding example of economic naivete. YOU and your friends that are lost in space DESERVE Willard Romney.

Staneve

We will better off with Mitt Romney who has an amazing economic experience.

Are you @!$%#ing kidding me???? Are you even serious??? Romney has NO economic credibility. Sure, he might have been a businessman, and yes he created some jobs, but he also laid off many people. He didn't create companies that created jobs: he either destroyed them or helped them. If he had economic experience, than he would know that tax cuts, much less for the wealthy, don't create sustainable growth. And by growth I don't mean growth in profits or productivity or GDP (well I do, but they are only a part of it), but in the standard of living and in wages. The Bush tax cuts didn't create prosperity, nor did cutting regulations. They actually screwed us in the long-run, increasing our debt, ruining our economy, and forcing us to focus on cutting our deficits than on growth and important things like education. Romney is an idiot when it comes to economics: I bet I could beat him, and I'm just a teenager.

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

Willard's answer is to cut revenue and increase spending. How in the Hell did this guy get through High School?

He got through his school assaulting gays and not in math class. He would be the same one pointing at Obama if we went into default. His fist shaking is disgusting.

Ignore BHO's report card as it's indefensible. Just ATTACK, ATTACK, ATTACK.

Really, how does he plan on paying for all those extra ships and planes he wants? If we don't have it now, where are we going to get it then? All those seniors will sure be surprised when their monthly checks are cut to help bloat the military, the same military that already can NOT account for billions in their budget.

ummm, Obama did not add 6T to the deficit...that was mostly from Bush

http://www.nytimes.com/imagepages/2011/07/24/opinion/sunday/24editorial_graph2.html?ref=sunday

Great chart. Also, Republicans want to include the 2009 spending in Obama's figures, even though that was the Bush budget that had already been spent.

Bush created $8 trillion of the debt during good economic times, when we didn't need to bail out the private sector and we could have afforded to balance the budget. Any chance we can change the Constitution to elect Bill Clinton in 2016?

So true dal ,and the tax breaks for his 2%. Hey 2% can you spare a trillion.

The "Bush Tax Cuts", which Obama extended, reduced rates of taxation for ALL levels of income. It also phased out exemptions for higher earning taxpayers.

Sorry to break up your circle jerk of distortions.

Yes, the Bush tax cuts reduced everyone's tax rates. Unfortunately, they only benefited the wealthy, as the only people who gained any wealth were them. The middle class had their wages stagnant, and so the tax cut only gave them more money to spend.

Amen.

djj,

All of the above along with interest on pre-OHB debt is responsible for $400 billion or so. The remaining $800 billion is within OHB's control.

Legally, a corporation is the same as a person, did you ever take a business law class?

Also, Romney does not enjoy firing a person, what enjoys firing is a company that does not provide good customer service. If your insurer is always being difficult about your health claims you should have the right to fire them and hire a new insurer. Even the most liberal consumer advocate will agree with this.

Legally, a corporation is the same as a person, did you ever take a business law class?

Legally, yes. Until they overturn Citizens United and every other corporate personhood judicial ruling.

OBAMA BIDEN 2012

Freshieee,

This was in my business law class I took in the late 1970's, we were told that a corporation basically was the same under the law as person. Remember the Pinto manslaughter trial where criminal charges were brought against Ford and they were convicted, This is 30 something years ago that corporations were considered a person. The supreme court decision is nothing new!

Not so. Corporations were created a a convenience to avoid having to liquidate a business at the death of its owners. It could continue independently of the lives of its owners. Ford Motor corporation did not serve time in jail. It did not have to cease operations as it served its jail term.

The obscene thing about the Citizens Untied case is you have 1 CEO or 20 or so members of a board of directors inflicting their political views upon the public, regardless of the views of the thousands and thousands of shareholders who may own stock in the company, and can, with the turn of a pen, dump millions of dollars into a political issue or candidate. Robers and Co have created a super citizen without considering the radical consequences we are now seeing.

There are a lot of other reasons for corporations. First, rather than have a sole owner or a group of partners have to sign every contract, you have a corporate officer who has signing authority. They are not personally responsible, the corporation is. Under this condition the corporation is acting as a person, this has been done for hundreds of years.

Second, the owners only assume liability for the amount they have invested in the corporation. If Joe Smith has $10 million in other person assets and $10 million in stock and his incorporated business declares Chapter 7 bankruptcy, then he only loses the $10 million in stock, his personal assets not tied to the corporation cannot generally be touched. The exception is if he committed fraud, then the corporate vale can be pierced.

Third, as I stated above a corporation can be found in violation of criminal law. Of course the penalties imposed are civil, do we throw the corporate charter into a jail cell?

Regarding Citizens United, it levels the playing field. The unions have for years been contributing to the super PACs and influencing elections. If corporations cannot donate, then unions should not be allowed to either. They often do not represent their members viewpoints.

Regarding Citizens United, it levels the playing field. The unions have for years been contributing to the super PACs and influencing elections. If corporations cannot donate, then unions should not be allowed to either. They often do not represent their members viewpoints.

Unfortunately, Citizens United did NOT level the playing field. The unions have, for the past few decades, been declining in power and membership, and so they cannot influence campaigns like they used to. Corporations, however, are at their peak, producing hundreds of billions of dollars in profits. They can now influence elections far better than unions, for they have the funds to literally drown opposing candidates. In addition, Citizens United threw the balance in favor of corporate interests by throwing away the caps on campaign donations. That means that wealthy magnates like the Koch brothers, Sheldon Adelson, Warren Buffet, and George Soros can easily manipulate elections to suit their interests. Is that fair???? Oh, and unions may not be the most credible mouthpieces for workers, but at least they generally represent their members' views. Corporations don't; except for that of the shareholders.

And referring to your statement on corporate personhood, corporations are not people. They may be legally, but they are not by nature. Corporations are not meant to voice opinions, represent viewpoints, or even vote, which U.S. citizens tend to do. Corporations are meant only to raise revenues and benefit shareholders. Corporations may engage in activities that people do, but that does not make them people. Just because a car moves, does that mean that it is a person too??? Or is a house a person just because it exists??? And if corporations are people, why aren't they held accountable for the same rules that everybody else abides by??? The big banks caused the Great Recession; why haven't they been fined or their executives jailed??? Why are corporations allowed to flood airwaves with millions of dollars' worth of attack ads that can determine elections while most ordinary citizens have a limit on the size of their campaign contributions?? That, in itself, lies the answer: corporations are not people. If they are, than they should abide by the same laws as we the people do.

OBAMA BIDEN 2012