To thrive in a complex 21st century world, we need Education that leads to power and jobs. We want the best education and the best possible standard of life for everyone.

GOP/Koch/Norquistians are intent on:
Demonizing the United States President, running the United States into the ground, and turning the good people of America into minimum-wage, broke, unhealthy, displaced, voiceless masses.

Shutting schools, firing hundreds of thousands of teachers, and focusing on privatized, religious education is part of that agenda.

Ahhhhh Joe, dreaming of the rich again, there are those who are rich (Romney), and those that wish to be (you). The majority are very happy with our lot in life.

You are toooooooooooo funny, NOT!

Backhouse---I much prefer to live in President Obama's neighborhood---where optimism in America's future and a positive outlook are found.

Joe,

Analyisis by one pundit on Morning Joe laid the blame for Romney's poor showing on his base. They were all on Spring break vacation with their children. :0)

Ben-636050

Mr. Rogers???? Children of the Corn???? Stupid little statements???? Good thing the rest of the world is not as insane as you guys.

Ben, you obviously have not been watching the CLOWN CAR carrying the GOP/tea bagger candyidates??

Backhouse---I much prefer to live in President Obama's neighborhood---where optimism in America's future and a positive outlook are found.

I agree 100% with you Steeler Fan.

When you are projecting what a world will look like, based on the policies that one group is pushing, in this case GOP, it is - a projection based demonstrated actions, non-actions, speeches and 30 years of pursuing the same failed policies on the part of that GOP party.

On "Face the Nation," Santorum said that environmentalists have a worldview that 'elevates the Earth above man.'

Most of us understand that if we disregard the environment we live in, we will pay the cost.
Just ask the Mayans.

So Romney calls Santorum a loser on Wolf Blitzer and tells him to go home ... I guess little Ricky is not rich enough to play with Mitt. Class warfare, I am stunned.

Gingerbread Mamma

Ahhhhh Joe, dreaming of the rich again, there are those who are rich (Romney), and those that wish to be (you). The majority are very happy with our lot in life.

You are toooooooooooo funny, NOT!

Morning Joke is funny too; sometimes. Most of the time he is nauseating.

I like your avatar too

Bev -- you make my point by responding with petty little name calling statements. They add no value to an important election but apparently the left has little more to go on but to resort to making themselves look like fools.

The majority are very happy with our lot in life.

______________________________________________

I guess THAT explains the incessant lefty liberal whining and complaining on FR, MSDNC, and the general lefty liberal MSM: you are all happy wallowing in your misery.

Hey, if it works for you, enjoy it.

Beverly in Chicago ... I see you're ready for St. Paddy's.

Backhouse, David Walker, you've certainly provided plenty of food for thought this morning.

Since Reagan, it has been difficult to watch the steady shift further and further right; the shift to embrace the Christian faith as the only faith and one that must be imposed on all and all politics must be filled with the Bible. Difficult to watch the shift that calls the educated "elitists" and "snobs"; the aversion to science; the aversion to society as a whole which works together and provides through taxes, those things which make us a civilized society; the "me first" attitude of prosperity that is being preached in churches as well. It is certainly not the kind of country our Founding Fathers envisioned. One can hope that somehow and soon, the GOP finds its way back to reasoned thinking instead of embracing extremist attitudes.

Attention all Obama Bashers or as you prefer to be known, anti-socialists, anti-birthers, or just plain Antis.

You claim the president is anti-capitalist, yet the stock market blew through the 13k marker yesterday. Apparently you believe low stock market levels are better representation of capitalism?

Gasoline prices, a traded resource, is going through the roof. What better display of capitalism than inflated gasoline prices with the proceeds pocketed by big oil. To call this president a socialist while allowing markets to dictate the price you pay at the pump is at best disingenuous. Surely, you don't support government regulations forcing lower gasoline prices, or do you?

Lending markets continue to improve. It is now possible to get a car loan, whereas when Obama took over, credit was so tight and banks were so insolvent, credit was not flowing. Capitalism requires credit. Is Obama a socialist owning the banks, or a capitalist supporting bank lending? Do tell, you Obama-bashers.

It is time for the Obama bashers to own up to the character assassination flaws. You have your 'free' markets and their isn't an ounce of Socialism or Marxism in the mix. Obama is a proven Capitalist, it is time to invent a new moniker.

Petty name calling Ben? Shame on you.

The Mayan civilisations collapsed under self-induced environmental degradation.

We have to learn from the past. Not erase it.

Did any one see the latest CBO (you know the organization the left swears by as true figures) report that the Affordable Care act will now cost $1.7 TRILLION up from the $900 BILLION we were promised??? It just can't get any better than this ROFLMAO!!!!

BH -- Apparently the left has learned too much from the past. You are still sacrificing unborn babies. Pathetic.

Mayans????? Now we are supposed to be talking to Mayans?????

That's right Ben, the Mayans. Only Morons refuse to look at the past, unless of course you are a religious zealot, and the entirety of humanity is contained within a few edited chapters of a certain book you worship.

Michael -- the left is in a quandary. Stock market up is good but wait a minute if the stock market is up the the evil companies and banks on Wall Street are making money and not really hiring anyone. Oh my Oh my What to do??????? LOL!!!!!!!!

Well, how about a Santorum-GOP-Romney neighborhood?"

There aren't enough Churches and vaginal probes to support that neighborhood.

First Read Challenge for the day;

Can someone point out a comment from one of the RWNJ's where they advocate for any of the GNOP candidates & what they would do to make America better if elected?

Am I missing something?

All I see are personal attacks, insane laughter from lunatics & the usual attention seeking whores...

Good luck winning in November on those 'platforms'! lol

Well, "Ole Cheesy Grits" took it in the shorts yesterday. I love it. Southerner's aren't always the sharpest folks in the world, but none of them are going to be fooled by a Yankee boy who's trying to pretend he's a "Good Old Boy". Romney just makes a fool of himself and his Party. Add on the fact that he's a Mormon trying to sway the South where the vast majority of the population is Evangelical and you just have a case where this dog won't hunt..

I have no love for Santorum either, but as you can see he's more favorable to the Southern voter than Romney the pretender. But, in the long run it makes no difference, President Obama will clean either of their clocks.

Obama in2012.

Ben-636050

Michael -- the left is in a quandary. Stock market up is good but wait a minute if the stock market is up the the evil companies and banks on Wall Street are making money and not really hiring anyone. Oh my Oh my What to do??????? LOL!!!!!!!!

Right on Ben, I think my previous post - 1.13 - illustartes that point as well.

It's called shame and they have none. But then again, how can you collect a welfare check, free wifi, AND HBO and claim to have a moral compass?

While the The Faux Conservatives here buzz like little gnats, and whine about "Barry", and the Jennifer Rubins' of the GOP establishment drone on about "delegates", real conservatives are talking about things like;

"Like sterile accountants counting pennies, the Romney camp keeps counting delegates. That can get them to a win, but it will be an uninspiring win. There is little enthusiasm for Romney with the base. In heavily Republican Madison County, MS, voter turn out barely topped 7,000 voters. In 2008, when the GOP contest was done and everyone knew McCain would be the nominee, 10,500 people still turned out to vote for McCain. Yes, more Republicans turned out to vote McCain in 2008 than Romney in 2012. That’s a problem. That’s a lack of enthusiasm."

http://www.redstate.com/erick/2012/03/14/not-closing-the-deal/

The one constant in this primary season is the low, low, turnout of the voters in every single state.

No one, and I mean NO ONE saw the current scenario coming, and no one can honestly say that ANY of the remaining "front-runners" will have the requisite number of delegates in Tampa. (J-E-B!)

Gas prices will rise and fall. Scandals will come and go. But, the Faux Conservatives here should mosey over to one of the ACTUAL Conservative sites to learn what THEY are talking about today. Hint; it isn't about the President...

Is it 7 AM, Tuesday morning Election day, November 6th yet?...................Time to end all this useless squabbling and get on with it!

Not sure if anyone caught Newt Gingrich last night making a snide remark about education, or at least implying it's a negative, but it sickened me.

What is it with these people and their anti-education campaign? Unbelievable. It makes this Country look like backward society. People around the world are kicking our butt in the sciences and math. Wake-up! We need an educated society not a dumbed downed electorate. Quit the war on education! Quit the war on women! These are losing propositions. Enough already!

RedPS -- who are you to judge me and call me names. You are nobody. You learn from the Mayans not to be a barbaric society sacrificing lives to false Gods. You should learn not to sacrifice unborn innocent babies. I am proud to be a Christians like our Founding Fathers and you should learn from that.

LMAO....post 1.35 - a sign of desperation!

DumbFux anyway ;)

Where were ya last week when it went down 200 points?

Silly me, I forgot some idiots don't have the brain cell capacity to remember anything beyond one week.

Good morning Backhouse

To thrive in a complex 21st century world, we need Education that leads to power and jobs. We want the best education and the best possible standard of life for everyone.

I still can't believe the southern women voted for Pope Santorum which proved the point I made yesterday we don't need Voter ID. We need Voter IQ. Maybe the tea bags they put in their ears got in the way. I guess they didn't hear what he thinks of women.

Neither, can I understand Gingrich's gaseous argument that he's the only who can beat President Obama in a debate. Shame on Newt for taking $2.50 from a person who is not working. he should give it back.

GOP/Koch/Norquistians are intent on:
Demonizing the United States President, running the United States into the ground, and turning the good people of America into minimum-wage, broke, unhealthy, displaced, voiceless masses.

Shutting schools, firing hundreds of thousands of teachers, and focusing on privatized, religious education is part of that agenda.

This why we need to tell Boehner to stop crying and Investigate the Koch Brothers' Business Dealings With Iran

http://www.thepetitionsite.com/11/sign-the-petition-for-boehner-and-other-gop-to-investigate-the-koch-brothers-for-crimes-against/

Feisty:

There is a medical explanation for your question. You will note that many of the right-wing crazies end their posts with some variation of LMAO.

Now, this is a rather delicate subject, but basically what they are saying is that they no longer have an effluent discharge port. Thus, they are suffering a sewage back-up. Medical shorthand is FOS.

I have had the pleasure of meeting some great people from Alabama. And I would love to visit the state someday.

But someone save us from the part of that population that would ever think Santorum is the answer for anything from conservatives.

A vote for Santorum, is a vote for Obama, but if it makes you feel better, you can run around saying you didn't vote for a Democrat, even if you did.

Note to all my red-faced First Read radicals from the left and the right, should you be willing to listen to my nonsense: You each have at least one very prominent figure on each side that questioned whether we should remain in Afghanistan a long time ago, yet during this administration's term. One we all know is Ron Paul. The other, if you remember, is Joe Biden. And remember all the heat Joe caught for questioning our 'conservative' military people at the time? (yes, funny how the faux conservatives flip flopped and conveniently forgot about it. Maybe fake libs don't bring it up because they do their own flip flopping?). But poor hated Ron Paul and poor hated Joe Biden will never get credit, except from their red-faced fan base.

Which is sad, really, because while I disagreed with both until Bin Laden was caught or killed, and while I still understand that the moment we leave, the Taliban will set up another base for Al-Quaeda and you can look for more civilian deaths in the US, I have to say, they were probably onto something there....as far as public opinion goes....

You know, though, can't admit when your opponent is right, though, correct? That would be a sign of weakness, and yada yada yada, all that blather that makes us want to just hate the person who doesn't happen to think just like us!

Our Tea Party governor's latest budget defunds Maine Public Broadcasting, lays off 45 employees of a major psychiatric hospital, reduces assistance to the poor, and cuts more taxes.

That's the rightwing agenda in action, along with attempts to roll back environmental protections, and divert funds from public schools to private ones. At what point does "saving money" lead to "costing money?" A less educated workforce means jobs go elsewhere, a diminishing quality of life means a shrinking population (always a problem in Maine) and sicker poor people mean more folks in the emergency room needing more expensive treatment.

The only message sent to Romney is "We are Uneducated and Ignorant"!!!! It shows that they don''t hate black folks as much as they fear intelligence ................

And as egotistic as Romney is ... he must be sick to his stomach to have to cater to the fools ....

You claim the president is anti-capitalist, yet the stock market blew through the 13k marker yesterday. Apparently you believe low stock market levels are better representation of capitalism?

________________________________________________________________

Not even close. Publically traded companies have learned to make profits and their stock prices rise based on those profits, DESPITE having an anti-business President in the WH. Especially when you are talking about the Dow 30 companies which are ALL global companies. What part of "global economy" do you not understand?? When global companies find an unfriendly business environment in the US, they simply deploy their capital in other countries that are more business friendly and that will yield the highest profits. Why do you think US GDP and new jobs growth is so pathetically anemic, because Barry is really "pro-capitalist"??

LMAO@U!!!!

Ben-636050

Bev -- you make my point by responding with petty little name calling statements. They add no value to an important election but apparently the left has little more to go on but to resort to making themselves look like fools.

Ben,

You posted...You people are pathetic and I feel sorry for your miserable little lives.

#1.3 - Wed Mar 14, 2012 9:10 AM EDT

==================================================

Do you understand the adjectives miserable & pathetic are petty things to say about the left too?

I am proud to be a Christians like our Founding Fathers and you should learn from that.

Oh fun (not) .. a name calling fest. Ben, I'd suggest you pull your head out of your a$$, but I'd hate to deprive you of the pleasure of your flapping tongue.

David Walker

Yet another example of extreme condescension to people of faith and people that hold different values and beliefs. I have never been to Alabama or Missisippi but am certain that the vast majority are not racists. What I know for sure though is they are our fellow americans and as a liberal I think perhaps somewhat quaintly that we need to strive to come together in lieu of tearing each other apart.

Regarding your typical belittlement to all things regarding religion and faith, why do you an atheist feel so threatened by people of faith? Why the need to ridicule and point out the most extreme beliefs as what every person of faith prescribes to. Do we not have freedom of religion, where people are able to worship, chant, dance as they see fit? By the way contrary to your thoughts, my God does not discriminate when it comes to people whatever color they may be. You don't have to agree with me but you should respect my belief and or not mock the beliefs of others.

Enjoy some of your economic and political commentary, your attacks not so much. You are better than this?

With some noteable exceptions First Read has devolved and shifted into a two sided, slug fest, where no one is willing to talk or listen.

Lies and spin. That's all that left for the Obama cult.

This morning came the news that the projected deficit for this year was increased to $1.2 trillion dollars. Obama is spending it faster thanit comes in- but the cultists won't touch that with a ten foot pole. They'd rather make idiotic analogies.

Last night came the news that the CBO has taken a good look at Obama's HCR. Oops! The price tag is NOT $900 billion- its $1.76 trillion- almost double what we were told when we rejected it in the first place. Somehow I don't see that news attracting any new supporters.

The other news, from last night, was a survey of professional journalists. Turns out that 85% of them view the White House as practicing censorship.

http://www.spj.org/news.asp?REF=1099#1099

Be nice if any of the "journalists" on this site were members of that organization. Be even nicer if they did some kind of report on it.

ideologyspoilstheview

Beverly in Chicago ... I see you're ready for St. Paddy's.

It is one of my favorite holidays and my brother's birthday. I still have warm memories of the nuns calling my brother to give him the special treatment before Mass on St. Patrick's day. My mother always baked a green cake and make green Kool-aid on his birthday.

If I'm not on line on St. Paddy's day, Happy St Patrick's Day.

Now I want a green beer....

St. Patrick's Day merchandising;

Everyone should be able to get behind that part of a "green" economy, no?

Michael1969;

Congrats on what everyone will agree is the absolutely worst, most insulting to everyone, post of the day...

Oh, and dangerfield? I lost faith in RedState when they parroted a DNC ad- days after the Washington Post gave that particular story four pinnochios.

See, Red State saw the DNC ad- which cropped clips of different Romney speeches together to make it appear that he had endorsed a national insurance mandate- and ran with it as if it were gospel truth.

Minor fact checking could have debunked it for them.

A subscription to the Washington Post could cure their ills.

I have yet to see a retraction.

Therefore, I am done with them.

the states in question are in the middle of the Bible belt, of course Santorium would do well there, so did Wallace and Storm Thurman; the real surprise is Santorium did not get a higher % of the vote, the real eye opener is, the Republicans are turning out to vote in record numbers in these primaries, which shows a unified opposition to the present administration !

Since Barry’s real policy of driving up traditional energy sources prices so high that the lefty liberal fairy tale dust and flying unicorns of solar, wind and algae in your SUV gas tank become “competitive” is causing him electoral problems, look for lots of backpedaling from the Barry campaign.

However, if Barry does get re-elected, and has nothing holding him back, look for a war on traditional energy sources starting on 11/07/12 with prices skyrocketing (“for the good of the country” LMAO!!!!).

Chu walks back '08 gas prices quote
By: Alex Guillen
March 13, 2012 01:20 PM EDT

Energy Secretary Steven Chu on Tuesday walked back a comment he made in 2008 in which he called for higher gasoline prices like those in Europe.

“Since I walked in the door as secretary of Energy I’ve been doing everything in my powers to do what we can to … reduce those prices,” Chu said when pressed on the quote by Sen. Mike Lee (R-Utah) at a Senate Energy and Natural Resources Committee hearing.

Chu added that the “most important tool in DOE’s tool chest is moving off oil,” and referred to DOE’s backing of biofuels and electric vehicles as a long-term strategy.

“So are you saying you no longer share the view that we need to figure out how to boost gasoline prices in America?” Lee asked.

“I no longer share that view,” Chu replied.

I guess eating grits and saying y'all didn't connect with the conservative base in the south. I am sure Mitt can't understand it.

DCIA- Please provide a quote from Newt where he makes his "snide remark about education" so we few here with common sense can see it and explain to you what it REALLY means. I'm pretty sure it's close to the OPPOSITE of what you were hoping it was.

Since Barry's real policy of driving up traditional energy sources prices so high that the lefty liberal fairy tale dust and flying unicorns of solar, wind and algae in your SUV gas tank become "competitive" is causing him electoral problems, look for lots of backpedaling from the Barry campaign.

You mean "Since the price of oil is set on a global market rife with speculation...".

Can someone point out a comment from one of the RWNJ's where they advocate for any of the GNOP candidates & what they would do to make America better if elected?

Feisty, I'm with you on this. I have yet, in the past year, to find one post of a policy that would improve anything unless of course you support Bomb Iran or Drill Baby Drill. One would think with all this supposed brain power, we would have one idea that could turn a liberal head and say, oops, good idea. They are a party empty of ideas but full of negativity. What a way to lead a country, eh?

Ben,

You made a comment about "daring to focus on the real issues", well what do you consider the real issues and which of these Republican prospects have come forward with anything except pandering?

The deficit??? Get real. Romney's tax plan, according to Forbes, would add 3 trillion to the deficit, over the course of 10 years. Not to be out done, Gingrich's would add 1 trillion, in a single year. And Santorum's would have federal revenues declining by about 900 billion by 2015.

According to the CBO, on average our discretionary budget is about 1.35 trillion. Our defense spending is about 1.45 tillion. And, of course, approximately 1.56 trillion on entitlements.

So, basically, if you wanted to offset Romney's or Santorum's revenue decreases with spending cuts, we would have to not spend a single dime. On anything. And Gingrich's, well that wouldn't even be possible.

Now, put this all together with these three guys crying for more war in the middle east, how on earth, would we pay for it? What's their plan for getting out of Afganistan? Not one of them has given any details or provided any kind of plan in regards to the war we already have going, yet here they are talking about starting a second. Like two wars and tax cuts worked so well the first time around?

And yes, let's talk about healthcare. We all know they hate "Obamacare", but how would they fix the system we have? The system that sucks the life and finances, literally, out of both the insured and the uninsured. Besides repealing AHA, what would they do to stop the racket which is our health industry?

And, since they all hate spending so much, how do they propose we fix our infrastructure and education? Wave magic wands???

What about Wall St? How are they going to reform and regulate the big banks so as to keep this crap from happening again? What's their plan in regards to Dodd-Frank vs. Glass-Stegall?

What do these three suggest we do about China's currency manipulation, or the fact that they have MFN without abiding by the fair tariff policy? How are they going to compete with China's cheap labor market to bring jobs back here?

I've heard nothing of actual substance, or even common sense, from these guys. They do a wonderful job of pandering to the "Hate Train"... Hate immigrants! Hate Muslims! Hate gays! Hate abortion! Hate Obama! Hate the Federal Government! Hate Birth Control!

For Christ's sake, where's the "Fix Train"????

It was not built on forcing people to have insurance they don't want

That's funny, because to drive you have to have liability insurance on your car.

telling people what kind of car they must drive

SCOTUS has ruled that Congress can use tax incentives or withhold funding (like for drinking age) to "encourage" states or corporations to adopt specific policies. This has been going on for ages, you're naive if you think this is anything new.

or taxing them to the point of being broke.

Uh...what? This sounds a lot like crap. The way income tax works, you pay less the less you make. If you're referring to sales tax, necessities like clothes and food are exempt.

Why do people on these boards feel the need to demonize people with different views? I suggest trying to truly listen to alternative viewpoints - you may learn something...

To the politically ignorant, the platform will come at the convention. Now is the time for the candidates to seek the nomination among its party. The strongest will survive, the playbook will be set and then the unity will come in force to defeat the failure we have in office today. It is my prediction -- and I feel more confident each day -- the the desperate left will force Biden out and a woman and/or Hispanic will be put in as a running mate.

Yellowdog:

I have used the atheist label as convenient shorthand. I am not an atheist however, I am simply a non-believer. Which, takes me directly to your point. You write:

"Yet another example of extreme condescension to people of faith and people that hold different values and beliefs."

It's all about faith. We do not know with certainty that we will awaken, but we make plans because each and every day of our lives, we wake up. We have faith that our cars will start, that the lights will come on when we flip the switch, that our keys will unlock our doors. Yet, as human beings we will never know with absolute certainty that these things will happen.

Based on our observations we are fairly certain that one day, we will not wake up. One day, our car will not start, the light will not come on, and that the lock will fail. All of this is based on faith, but it is based on observation and repeated confirmation of what we expect.

None of that is true of faith in a god or gods. No one has seen a god, heard a god, touched or smelled a god. No one has ever observed a god create anything. It is only your faith that tells you that it is the Bible that is the truth and not the written and spoken words of others who speak of other gods, other stories, and other mysteries that are beyond the minds of mortals.

Yet, history is replete with carnage at the hands of people who insist their faith is superior to another's. Your Garden of Eden story says it all. If you read that book and that book alone, you would know all you need to know to practice your faith. You cannot know the mind of God, and attempting to do so guarantees expulsion from the Garden. That's from your own book. Yet, how many claim to know the mind of God?

No Mark, you couldn't be more wrong. I do not summarily mock all who have faith. None of us could survive a day if we did not have faith. However, my faith is not in a god. I do not pretend to have some sort of special insight into the "mind" of a supreme being. By the same token, I am not obliged to pretend I love those who would impose their will on me in the name of a being they do not and cannot know. Indeed, I mock, despise, and yes, I hate those people.

Yet, you speak of condescension. What could be more condescending than to have a mere human tell me that they are a conduit from god? That they know the truth, the way, and the light?

Have your faith in the god of your choosing, Mark. If it brings you solace, security, peace, joy, happiness, fulfillment, and serenity, that is wonderful. If by virtue of your faith you are able to understand love, that too is wonderful. By all means, if your spiritual needs are met with a God, that is wonderful.

As sure as one cannot define a spirit, neither can one define a god. That is sufficient for me.

It's amazing how much time and money is being wasted on a fight over who gets to lose in November.

Ben,

You don't think you should know these things before you nominate someone? You're from their party, so are you privy to what we aren't, or can you just not answer to a single thing in my post?

How do you know he can defeat that "failure" if you can't answer any of my questions? What exactly are you basing your vote on then?

TO: Backhouse who wrote:

"The Mayan civilisations collapsed under self-induced environmental degradation.

We have to learn from the past. Not erase it."

No kidding! It's 81 degrees in Chicago today, right in the middle of March when it would normally be below zero! I grew up in Chicago and this is VERY unusual weather! It once snowed in May in Chicago.

If this isn't a sign of global warming, I don't know what is!

Obama / Biden 2012

Sarah, give Ben a chance to get over your Cherubic (?) qualities first.

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL

Am I missing something?

All I see are personal attacks, insane laughter from lunatics & the usual attention seeking whores...

Nope girl friend,

Especially, the" idiot from Albany". He laughs like a hyena daily. He can't help it though. It's part of his psychotic condition. I wish that little Joee would take his meds more often.

Did you get my reply to your e-mail. I have not had time to check yet. I have election judge training this afternoon. Will check later tonight on tonight when I get back or will call you.

Gawd, I hope I'm not matched up with a tea bagger judge like I was last time. They are really, really, obnoxious

Sarah -- I'd call it selective hearing on your part. All your questions are answered but you just don't agree with the answers. Have a nice day.

Class Warfare, GOP-Style

If you are poor, uneducated and "evangelical" then you believe in intelligent design and Rick Santorum. You almost certainly voted for Santorum according to exit polls.

If you are wealthy (or even upper middle class), educated and religiously tolerant, then you probably accept the theory of Evolution and Mitt Romney. You almost certainly voted for Romney, according to exit polls.

What does this say about America and the GOP in particular?

Folks, this is class warfare, GOP-style. The poor and ignorant will buy whatever the first snake oil salesman will sell them to improve their lot. They cling to a religious dogma that exploits them and regard anyone who does not share their belief's as "satanic". That is a very frightening combination.

Romney has clearly lost the South. He never really had it, and without it his campaign will fail in November. The South won't vote for Obama because he is black. Pure and simple. But they won't vote for Romney either, because he is Mormon, Moderate and a Millionaire. The three-M trifecta. Southern voters, faced with the choice between a "heretic" and a black man, will stay home, in droves.

I have been saying this now for nearly a year. Romney is DOA on election day, bless all those bigoted little voters in the South. And don't misunderstand me, Romney WILL BE the nominee. It's his turn, the GOP hierarchy has already decided he's the guy.

But let's step back and see what everything looks like in bizarro world. In bizarro world Santorum gets the nomination through some kind of weird floor fight alliance between the Gingrich, Paul and Klan delegates. But it really doesn't matter. He's just as dead on election day as Romney but for different reasons. The women, the moderates and the independents either stay home or break for Obama in huge numbers and the outcome is the same.

The President can't lose. He will be re-elected in a landslide and hopefully we'll strengthen our hold on the Senate and retake the house. Trust me, it could happen. And it had better happen because we're going to need the House and Senate on our side in 2016.

So rejoice children, four more years of leadership and sanity before we face the Wrath of Karl, The Empire Strikes Back, when big Chris Christie will run for the open seat as President of the United States. Book it, lay your money down, we'll get four more years and then what?

You'd better be thinking about how we are going to keep that pendulum from swinging to the hard right in 2016.

Obama/Biden 2012

Ben,

Trust me, I'm listening. Please give me a specific cite, source, or post where I can find the answers. Seriously, I'd really like to know what they are.

Ideology,

Lol, objects in the picture are not as sweet as they appear to be. I feel like I should just always start with that disclaimer, and then maybe people wouldn't sh** bricks when I start cursing like a trucker with Tourrett's syndrome. No offense.

Joe in Albany:

Publically traded companies have learned to make profits and their stock prices rise based on those profits, DESPITE having an anti-business President in the WH.

So, when the stock market goes up to the highest level it's been at since the last time a Democrat was president, all of the credit goes to heroic capitalists and none to Obama. But when the price of gas goes up like it did under Bush, 100% of the blame for that goes to Obama (but none, of course, goest to Bush for the earlier price spike). No explanation is necessary for why blame and credit is assigned without any basis in fact. Who needs facts when you've got a case of Obama Derangement Syndrome as bad as Joe's?

It was not built on forcing people to have insurance they don't want

That's funny, because to drive you have to have liability insurance on your car.

________________________________________

And the difference is that car insurance mandates are imposed by states, not the feds, and are unquestionably constitutional under the 10th amendment:

Amendment 10 - Powers of the States and People. Ratified 12/15/1791. Note

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

What's funny reading the conservatives comments about the liberals comments on the stock market rise is that they are likely the same ones who kept pointing out how badly the stock market was doing after President Obama took the Oath of Office. Since 2009, I've read so many right-wing posts whining about the stock market and blaming President Obama yet now when it has been steadily climbing for months, suddenly they say no president should get credit for it. LOL.

Ben-636050

Did any one see the latest CBO (you know the organization the left swears by as true figures) report that the Affordable Care act will now cost $1.7 TRILLION up from the $900 BILLION we were promised??? It just can't get any better than this ROFLMAO!!!!

BH -- Apparently the left has learned too much from the past. You are still sacrificing unborn babies. Pathetic.

Ben, you should really NOT rely on the Washington Examiner for accurate reporting. They took the GROSS costs (before revenue and tax effects) and compared it to the NET costs (after revenue and tax effects) which the $900 billion was based on. BTW the NET costs actually dropped $48 Billion.

Typical wing nut garbage trying to lie to its sheep.

But when the price of gas goes up like it did under Bush (except higher), the blame for that goes to Obama

____________________________________________________

Lefty liberals blamed GWB for rising gas prices in 2008, and now want to claim it's not Barry's fault??

Sounds like you and they were all suffering from Bush Derangement Syndrome which continues today.

Sucks to be you, Houston.

Sarah, be as offensive as you like. I enjoy the shock and awe that can be delivered with good writing by a mind as sharp as yours.

Michael1969

Beverly in Chicago

And all this time I thought you were black

Yup, Micheal

I'm Black and I'm Proud. Everybody has it a little Irish in them on St. Pat's day.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4r_-NcCrXwM&feature=related

I had the pleasure of dancing on stage with him at the Regal theater when he was here in Chicago. He told us to come on up and I did. I had a ball.

no joe, no bo, nj, I see you fell for the same lie being perpetuated by the RW professional liars.

Joe Albany,

The 10th Amendment was written when the Bill of Rights wasn't applicable to the states. Once we enacted the 14th Amendment which applied the Bill of Rights to the states, the 10th pretty much became a moot point. In fact, I don't believe a 10th Amendment case has come before SCOTUS since the 1960's when they were trying to get out of desegregation based upon it.

To claim healthcare under the 10th Amendment, as a "states" issue, what is your legal argument? You're looking at limiting the federal government back to enumerated powers, that means anything that falls under the commerce clause, the supremacy clause, or the necessary/proper clause would be void. That's the only way to get around the commerce and supremacy clauses, so how would you fix the mess that would be left?

Ideology,

As always, thank you and ditto!

And the difference is that car insurance mandates are imposed by states, not the feds, and are unquestionably constitutional under the 10th amendment:

Amendment 10 - Powers of the States and People. Ratified 12/15/1791.Note

The powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people.

Sure. But the problem is that you can choose not to drive, thereby choosing not to get insurance.

Currently health-care facilities cannot turn you away for not having insurance, even though you will probably not be able to pay the bill and the states and hospitals will have to eat the costs, thereby raising the rates for the rest of us.

Should we just start turning people away that don't have insurance and let them die? Or should we mandate insurance? One of the two needs to happen to curb our rising costs.

Which one do you think?

Lefty liberals blamed GWB for rising gas prices in 2008, and now want to claim it's not Barry's fault??

Those "lefty liberals" were as misinformed and wrong then as those claiming it's "Barry's" fault now. That argument is based on extremely flawed logic.

Joe, I never really blamed Bush for gas prices going up in 2008, except for his decision to invade Iraq which cut the supply of oil down, and his only answer to the problem was more drilling. If we had listened to Carter in the 70s and started developing alternative energy sources, think how far we would have advanced by now.

So, when the stock market goes up to the highest level it's been at since the last time a Democrat was president,

____________________________________________________

The highest the close the Dow 30 has ever had in history was in October 9, 2007 when it closed at 14,163.53. Two days later it hit an intraday high of 14,198.10.

I guess I never realized GWB was a Democrat.

Thanks for sharing your version of stock market history with FR, Houston.

Moron.

Joe in Albany

But when the price of gas goes up like it did under Bush (except higher), the blame for that goes to Obama

____________________________________________________

Lefty liberals blamed GWB for rising gas prices in 2008, and now want to claim it's not Barry's fault??

And kooky connies like you are trying to figure how to blame Obama for high gas prices without any basis in logic while at the same time avoiding placing any blame on Bush for high gas prices during his presidency.

It must suck to be a moron like you, Joe.

To claim healthcare under the 10th Amendment, as a "states" issue, what is your legal argument? You're looking at limiting the federal government back to enumerated powers, that means anything that falls under the commerce clause, the supremacy clause, or the necessary/proper clause would be void.

__________________________________________________

I'm only saying that comparing a state car insurance madate to a federal health insurance mandate is comparing apples and oranges. The SC will be deciding if the federal madate is unconstitutional by June. I'll wait to hear their opinion on that issue.

I don't see how it can be unconstitutional because it falls under the inter-state commerce clause and the "general welfare."

Answer to Ruken:

Democrat: Tax the wealthy, save the people

Republican: Kill em

:D

Honestly, this is why quick answer politics in a TV clip driven world just doesn't make any sense. All politicians are, in essence, lying to you when they offer up simple solutions. Trying to elect a candidate on promises always fails for that reason. The promises are meant more to reveal the method of thinking of a candidate than any real agenda. Because your favorite Democrat or Republican will immediately back off the simple solutions at the time the rubber meets the road and they get elected.

Then all their radical fans get all jaded and ticked because they really aren't going to 'kill all the immigrants' or 'disband the military' or somesuch. Unless they are, and then what you get is Stupid Congress 2011. And then for being such a stupendously ignorant congressman, you get thrown out of office for being a stubborn git (which you will see in 2012, unless we, the people, have decided we prefer a country that does nothing and fails.)

Those "lefty liberals" were as misinformed and wrong then as those claiming it's "Barry's" fault now. That argument is based on extremely flawed logic.

________________________________________________

And when I hear that from lefty liberal zealots like Shemp Mathews, De Rev. Al, Mr. Ed, Larry O'Donnell, Outhouse, Bev, all the other FR LL's AND the Nasty Redhead, maybe I'll believe it.

Answer this question Joe. How is gas prices almost as high as they were in 2008, when a barrel of oil is being sold at between $105 and $120. When in 2008 it was being sold at over $150?

Raddave,

I'm with you. It's not unconstitutional. SCOTUS will uphold it. I'm calling it right now. Commerce, Supremacy, Necessary/Proper, General Welfare... Yeah, it's gonna stay just as it is. Of course, it would be nice if they got rid of the anti-trust exemptions and fee for service, but I'm not gonna rant about those today.

Furthermore, it really is one of only three options we have. Either some of us pay, all of us pay, or only those who do pay get care. I'm going with all of us pay.

And when I hear that from lefty liberal zealots like Shemp Mathews, De Rev. Al, Mr. Ed, Larry O'Donnell, Outhouse, Bev, all the other FR LL's AND the Nasty Redhead, maybe I'll believe it.

Don't wait for them to tell you.

http://205.254.135.7/pub/oil_gas/petroleum/analysis_publications/oil_market_basics/price_text.htm

Hope that helps!

Here's a quote:

Oil prices are a result of thousands of transactions taking place simultaneously around the world, at all levels of the distribution chain from crude oil producer to individual consumer. Oil markets are essentially a global auction -- the highest bidder will win the supply. Like any auction, however, the bidder doesn't want to pay too much. When markets are "strong" (when demand is high and/or supply is low), the bidder must be willing to pay a higher premium to capture the supply. When markets are "weak" (demand low and/or supply high), a bidder may choose not to outbid competitors, waiting instead for later, possibly lower priced, supplies.

Those "thousands of transactions" and "bidders" include speculators.

Raddave,

I'm with you. It's not unconstitutional. SCOTUS will uphold it. I'm calling it right now.

______________________________________________

Too bad neither of you have a vote on the SC.

Back to the article:

Democrat: Santorum = bad

Republican: Santorum = bad

And Dems better not tell me that sometimes a non-party-establishment doesn't sometimes win an election at the national level...sometimes even for President!

People need to screw on heads and actually want the most competative candidate possible, that yes, also happens to represent your point of view....as long as your point of view is not bats**t crazy, like 'birth control is bad, mmm hhmm.'

Too bad, Joe, we'd do a way better job than Scalia, at least.

When given the choice between Moon Base, Fat Cat, or Ass Juice, you all went with Ass Juice??? Really, south? Ass Juice?

Damage123

Maybe you all aren't getting it. Stopping Obama will make America better fight off the bat. This nation was NOT built on socialism, demonizing those that work hard and/or the successful. It was not built on forcing people to have insurance they don't want, telling people what kind of car they must drive, or taxing them to the point of being broke.

It was not built on letting people that aren't even US citizens, vote in our elections and it was not built on apologizing for our greatness.

Of course this country wasn't "built" on socialism, since the idea of socialism was founded over 40 years after this country was established. However, this country was not built on any economic system. And, since there were no insurance or cars back then, you are correct on that point. BTW, who is telling you what kind of car to drive? And who exactly is being taxed to the point of being broke?

David Walker,

VERY nice post! You are very eloquent and should think about writing if you don't already (on more than just a news vine). I think you would be interested to hear that neuroscientists are doing studies on the "Spiritual Experience" and are finding out that it's a state of mind that is much like sleeping wakefulness and is brought on by stress reactions from the body but with practice can be induced by the experiencer. Very fascinating stuff that furthers my belief that if there is a "god" it's not communicating to us through these experiences (or any other way I might add).

BTW, who is telling you what kind of car to drive? And who exactly is being taxed to the point of being broke?

No one and no one. I've discovered that ideologues, trolls, nutjobs, whatever you choose to call them, produce the most drama I've encountered since I told off the "mean girls" click way back in high school.

It's like there's a magic wand and a council of evil "libbies" underground somewhere that can transform the tiniest policy change into, "Holy sh** we're all gonna be enslaved by evil, robot, socialists, who are powered off of incinerated fetuses and Bibles!"

@MGates73: Silly science. God or an experience of him cannot be understood by man. If you took that on faith, you'd know your neuroscience is a lie you tell yourself!

If you couldn't tell, the above was brought to you by the letter 'S' and sarcasm.

Not that a neuroscientist would have any idea what spirituality is anyway, but yes, I get the point that some people still think the voice that talks to them in their head is actually God. Which is sad.

Sarah, that comment about "telling us what kind of cars to drive" reminds me of a ad that was played during the health care debate made by Ronald Regan in the 50 about medicare. In that ad Bonzo was claiming that if medicare passed, the government was going to be telling doctors where they have to live and work.

All of them are losers except Ron Paul.

He is the only candidate who wants to end neo-Imperialism and the drug war. He's no savior, but its clearly a start to straightening out America's problems.

But clearly, the imperialist minded American public doesn't want that element in the Republican party.

Santorum - a bible thumping sexist, racist, neo-con.

Gingrich - a dishonest, race baiting, neo-con blowhard.

Romney - an Elitist, phony, neo-con.

It's not healthcare reform it's... DEATH PANELS!!!!!!!!!!!! (cue scary music and loud gasp)

It's not Planned Parenthood it's... BABY KILLING!!!!!!!!!!

MSNBC you should be ashamed. This is NOT a failure to connect, this is the direct result of deep religious and cultural differences that no amount of advertising or connections can change. Romney is a Mormon Northerner. Many Evangelical or Born Again's would sooner vote for the devil himself than a Yankee Mormon. Get your facts right. You can try to be as politically correct as you want, but it does not change the fact that quite a lot of southerners are not well educated, racist, and highly prejudiced against a large number of religions.

I'm tired of conservatives coming on this vine, screaming about how liberal the writers of the article are and how liberal all of us posters are. You call names and throw out Fox News talking points that we've all heard. I think the majority of liberals are pretty open-minded (if you understand what that means) so if you'd use a little tact and gentility perhaps you could help us "libbies" understand what it is you think is so great about conservative plans for the country for the next four years. But stop being so hostile because it's not getting you anywhere. You come on a liberal site and cry and whine about how we don't know anything but you're not helping your cause by instilling in us the notion that all conservatives are just name callers and bad mouthers.

And liberal's religion, Political Correctness, will be the death of Western Civilization if we let it.

First of all, why do you wing nuts love to call non religious things the "religion of the left?" And secondly, how is being considerate of other people, aka PC kill Western Civilization?

Hello, maybe Romney isn't doing so well in the south because we southerners know the scent of BS when we smell it?

Oh, MGates, you just bring out the sarcasm in me. Not a bad thing, actually.

Don't you know calling someone dumb is a really good way to convince them? lol!

Its sort of like forming a clique of people who are so afraid to be called dumb, they totally sell out everything else!

That, by the way, goes for any little group of extremists who likes to call other people dumb as their main strategy.

David Walker - One of the things that I think we can both agree is that people should be able to believe or have the right to not believe. If I mislabled you as an atheist and you are really an agnostic or follow a gnostic viewpoint I stand corrected.

Yes, I can not prove scientifically in the existence of God, that is the whole idea of faith. I can not argue with you I have no proof. Some ideas or concepts are too large, not able to be explained, they stretch the limit of our understanding. Although you might believe I prescribe to an anti evolution, anti science, 6000 year creationist timeline, I do not. As I can not prove all things that require faith. Neither can you or science prove or explain all things that are outlined in that all encompassing field. What was exactly before the creation of the universe, ie what caused the Big Bang? What is the nature of the universe is it expanding, contracting. If it expanded out in an expansion state why are other galaxies moving away from our own at faster rates. How is it that the vast majority of the known universe can be classified as dark matter? Why are we still finding and or theorizing about particles that do not behave as they should per newtonion nor quantam physics.

Can you or science answer or prove all of these questions? Are particles not able to be seen or understood supposed to be summarily rejected? Do they all need to be answered to prove that they are relevant and exist. Perhaps you would call it foolish for someone like me to see a possibility for God to be a willing and active part of the equation. Perhaps you would find it unnecessary or irrelevant to believe that there could be something bigger than man. My faith and belief aside, I for one on a personal note would lament if "man" is the best there is.

All that being said, my main point in my original post is that you delegitimize your often valid points and commentary by over generalizing the beliefs of others. I for one do not intend to speak for those who want to impose relgious beliefs on others or worse use government to do the same. I, like many others, merely find no offense when a candidate speaks of their faith/religion or personal beliefs.

Regarding your response to me, I also hope that your beliefs, your beliefs in self or the (false) inherent goodness of man allows you to be happy, fulfilled etc.

Yellowdog, Science never "proves" anything. It does however offer explanations based on research and evidence. Science also is used to disprove ideas as much or more than it does to support them. And given time, everything can be figured out scientifically. As for faith in God, it is convenient because it requires no evidence of support.

Hellohowareyou,

You are correct and more succinct than me. Romney will be the guy and he will fail. The South has spoken and spoken quite clearly, anybody but Mitt.

I wonder if Romney realizes just how pointless all of this is?

He's not a boob. He's college-educated and a smart man or he wouldn't be a millionaire. I just have to wonder what goes through his mind on days like this.

Poor Mitt, it must suck to be Mitt Romney and I really feel sorry for him.

Obama/Biden 2012

Mark,

Excellent points and things I think about on a daily basis. Too true that we can never know if there is a "god" who created the universe, but then what created it, if we're using logic. I (like David) don't claim to know the truth of a creator and I don't purport that science has or will have all the answers to our questions in my lifetime or my children's lifetimes or their children's lifetimes etc.

I know that I have logic and reason skills, if what you believe is true that "God" gave these skills to me then I will use them to the best of my ability in all aspects of my life because I think these are my best qualities. I grew up Catholic and was told that "God gives us each a special gift and we should each use these gifts to their potential or we are commiting a sin against God". I went to college and honed my skills so that I could further my own endeavors, whatever they may be.

What I do know is that the creator of the universe (should there be one) is not that of classical Judeo-Chrisitanity where "god" interfers in our lives. "God" does not communicate with humans.

There are a few things we can know that "God" is not: either "God" is not all powerful but is all good and all knowing, or he is not all good but is all powerful and not all knowing, or he is not all knowing but is all powerful and all good. This is only logical.

If "God" is all good and all knowing that would explain why it's unable to communicate with us, although, perhaps "God" wants to do so. Then the question comes of how did "God" create the universe which is pretty complicated and well planned I'd say. It stands to reason that "God" would need to be all knowing but then there are lots of problems with humanity, not just psychologically. Biologically we are prone to so many mutations and health issues.

Ok, so "God" is only very very knowing instead of all knowing so perhaps he's all powerful. Then the question begged is why doesn't he help people here on earth when they so desire and plead for his assistance like cancer patients (my aunt, a VERY devout Catholic woman who prayed every day and night and throughout the day and never formed a sentence after she was diagnosed with cancer without the word "God" in it, comes to my mind) and the victims in Syria? Ok, so "God" is not all good then.

I could go on but I know you're bored by now. All I'm saying is that I can tell those that have thought about their faith in "God" and those that believe everything their preacher or priest tells them, questioning nothing. Knowledge is power.

MGates, David, and Yellowdog....all excellent, well thought out posts, although varying in opinions at times. Too bad not all posts on this site are as eloquent. My problem with faith has been and always will be, that faith, in anything, should be based on something. I have faith that my car will start in the morning....only because I have observed on countless occasions, my car actually starting in the morning. I have faith that the sun will rise daily, all based on observation.

Persons of faith are generally 'blind faith' believers. They have no other reason to believe other than somebody told them to. That is not a justifiable reason to believe anything. While science can't tell me exactly how things came to be, it does offer a much more plausible view than 'an invisible being in the heavens' created the world.

The truly hopeless in life tend to turn towards that invisible man more than any other type, because they have nothing but hope. People in prison, lost souls that are at the bottom of their lives, the slaves from the south, and the poor trailer trash currently residing in many rural areas of the south end up turning to a god because they have so little, to not believe in an afterlife would make their existence here on earth pointless and a waste.

However...this whole subject should be personalized. I don't bemoan the religious for their beliefs....I do pity them, but they are allowed to believe what they want. My objection will always be that it should be truly personalized, and not put on the money I use, the school system my children would attend, or government restrictions to the way I choose to handle my life.

Stop intruding on my existence with your beliefs and I will respectfully allow yours to co-exist.

Backhouse (#1) Not to mention the fact that unless you're an evangelical christian, you get NOTHING! Let's forget being Jewish, Muslim, Presbyterian, Mormon, etc. I thought our Founding Fathers were trying to get away from England and the "one religion" problem....we're heading back to where we started, and I don't like it!!! Just my opinion.

Sarah- “What's their plan in regards to Dodd-Frank vs. Glass-Stegall?”

The Democrats had two years to solve that issue (and many more issues) and failed
to even consider a solution. I do agree that it needs to be addressed. We need
to go back to the Glass-Stegall Act. But it doesn’t seem like any of Congress
wishes to do so, it hasn’t even come up in 3 ½ years.

Sarah- “The system that sucks the life and finances, literally, out of both the insured and
the uninsured.”

Yes, but requiring mandatory Health Care Insurance is not the answer. Yes, regulate the insurance
industry, but reform the Health Care industry too! When mandatory liability
insurance was required for the privilege of operating a motor vehicle,
insurance companies enjoyed a boom in revenue due to the sheer volume of new
policies. The Affordable Health Care Act is no different. Insurance costs are
already rocketing higher than ever before. This is not “Affordable!” The
regulations put on the insurance companies could be done at no cost to
taxpayers and many states already have laws regarding such regulations.
Requiring an individual mandate to have Health Care Insurance is
unconstitutional without a public option, but a Democrat controlled House
removed it in order to pass the law. And you cannot compare it to auto insurance,
it is a privilege to drive, it is a right to live. Being required to have insurance
to live is unconstitutional!

Stopping drug companies from passing R&D costs to consumers is a start to creating
affordable health care. Investigating and prosecuting Medicare fraud more is a
start. Limiting Malpractice payouts and insurance cost is a start. There is
numerous ways to bring Health Care costs down by eliminating inflated costs and
fraud from the system, and reducing insurance costs. But the Affordable Health
Care Act does none of that. The money this bill will cost would be better
utilized in pursuit of these things, not to mention expansion of Medicare. But
all the expansion of Medicare this bill provided has now been cut due to
budgetary issues. The individual mandate, when it kicks in, will nail the
unemployed and underemployed the hardest. Basically, the ones who need health
care the most will be penalized the most. How is that going to solve anything?

So, is this really a priority worthy of such a fight right now? Shouldn’t a balanced
budget be the first priority? Shouldn’t job recovery be more important first?
Then rewrite the bill to actually have a real effect!

Derek, I love that my sincere attempt to point out the (seemingly to me) obvious leads to you sarcasm (my favorite form of humor aside from puns, they get me every time!)! Please keep it up!

Also, I thought you would think it was interesting that the neuroscientist whose study I mentioned earlier about spiritual experiences believes in a creator although he doesn't go into detail about that (intelligently) but leaves open the idea that these his results may be the effect of "God" on our brains but he's no logician and I know some who would have a field day with this information. I wonder if he leaves it open because of personal reasons, (i.e. people would be less likely to come to him with stories of spiritual experiences). He uses the classical indications of spiritual experiences in a religiously philosophic way (mostly focusing on the near-death experience), it's really quite well thought out and executed (pardon the phrase lol [see?!]).

Yellowdog:

Both MGates73 and raddave have offered excellent points in this discussion of faith. I would add only one point, which is basically an extension of what raddave wrote.

Science proves nothing. It offers theories and tests them repeatedly. That is the foundation of the scientific method. Even though theories are tested repeatedly and yield the same results, they are never treated as fact. The testing methods themselves may someday be shown to be completely incorrect.

That said, your god is infinite. The human construct of time is where you get into trouble on this score. You ask what caused the Big Bang? No one yet knows, and probably we will never know. Indeed, the Big Bang may not be the correct explanation from what we see today. The Big Bang, if there was such an event, may not be a singularity.

In an infinite universe there is no such thing as time. What would define time in a timeless universe? To your faith, what would define your infinite god? A god who has existed forever. Certainly not you. Certainly not a bunch of primitives who believed the earth was the center of the universe.

We cannot know these things. Isn't it enough to marvel at the mysteries around us, to spin through the stars that first prompted the question: How did this get here?

Non-believers are not atheists. We are not agnostic or gnostics. We are non-believers who know that we don't know. Yet we are labeled as elitists, we are arrogant, we are condescending. All this from self-appointed "missionaries" who claim to know of the existence of a god they could not possibly understand. We're arrogant? We're elitists? We are condescending?

No Mark, what we are, and justifiably so, is angry with people who pretend they are gods. Who else could know the mind of a god, but another god?

People who quote the constitution a lot confuse it with thinking it's supposed to be 1776 forever.

And I think the Republican goal for this country is to make it like Geidi Prime in Dune. Polluted and covered in grease and oil.

MGates73

Thank you for sharing your beliefs, history, background. As you stated it is difficult to explain or even talk about these issues.

Knowledge is power, indeed.

Jobless,

I like what you have to say, except for requiring insurance being unconstitutional. I already explained why in my posts above...

It's not unconstitutional. SCOTUS will uphold it. I'm calling it right now. Commerce, Supremacy, Necessary/Proper, General Welfare... Yeah, it's gonna stay just as it is. Of course, it would be nice if they got rid of the anti-trust exemptions and fee for service, but I'm not gonna rant about those today.

Furthermore, it really is one of only three options we have. Either some of us pay, all of us pay, or only those who do pay get care. I'm going with all of us pay.

Balancing the budget would be nice, but it won't solve the problem. The budget will forever be held hostage to big moneyed interests. Dodd-Frank, AHA, why do you think they've both been stripped of any real power? Why do you think the healthcare industry keeps its exemptions from the anti-trust laws? Multinational corporations that don't pay taxes and utilize labor in China, China keeps it's MFN regardless of currency manipulation and rigged tariffs, why? The money those corporations throw at the government. The money the insurance industry and big pharma throws at the government. Check out the amount that the financial industry has spent lobbying against Dodd-Frank, and that will tell you the whole story.

Without the ability to buy our politicians, ergo making our politicians beholden to them, all of these "interests" would no longer have a say in our budget. Things like big pharma passing on R & D costs to consumers would no longer be occurring, mostly because they could no longer buy their way out of the free market, and the consumers would have options for taking their business elsewhere. Imagine Lockheed-Martin having the same amount of say so, if not less, than you or I? Perhaps our DOD wouldn't be so bloated and redundant then?

The big issue here isn't balancing the budget, it's getting the money out of politics.

Jobless carpenter,

I don't understand the point you're trying to make although you made one good one: "it is a privilege to drive, it is a right to live".

You're absolutely right, but we all use health care at some point or another and doctors (due to the hypocratic oath) cannot turn away patients in true need. I agree that health care costs need to be lowered but this is the way to do it: pay for the health care that's being used. People who aren't covered get care no matter whether they can pay. They are billed later and dodge the bill, never answering phone calls (trust me I used to work in the billing department of a hospital). Many will give you a fake name, address, and social (or "don't know it") etc. so you can't track them down because they know they can't afford a trip to the ER (the most expensive visit you can make for this reason exactly). That won't stop them from coming and more than once.

We need for people not to use the tired and over worked system the way they have been and to do that everyone must have coverage. I agree, it will be hard on those out of work or underemployed. There are kinks in every policy but something HAS to be done about health care costs NOW! Obama did it and it should help. It's not a magic bullet and costs won't drop immediately but nothing is. The doctors, nurses, technicians (x-ray, blood, general) and administrative service personell have to be paid.

Romney increased his lead in the delegate count. That increase was small but on a night when Santorum is considered the winner he fell farther behind in the number of delegates. His lead is somewhere between 255 and 224 depending who's count you believe. The next four primaries are most likely Santorum wins but if as last night the big three finish almost statiscal dead heat he is done. Without Gingrich losing his big money contributors(owners) he is not leaving the race. CNN has Romney less than 100 delegates away from halfway there. Santorum's best bet to pick up a one state huge delegate win is Texas. Paul may eat into that. Too many Bloomburg/Guiliani moderate GOP members in California , New York, and the remaining states after the next 4. Romney is about 100 away from having half of what he need for a first ballot win and Utah will give him all 40 of their delegates.

Sarah, I whole heartily agree that getting money out of politics is a great solution. But have you looked at how much money the Health Care industry has given Obama?

And to address your comment- "I'm going with all of us pay."

Did I miss something? Where does it say the Affordable Health Care Act is a single payer system? Where does it say Medicare is going to be expanded to cover every one? How can you say, "all of us pay"?

I am really curious because a lot of people seem to read in more to the bill than what it written! Sure, its thousands of pages long, but it has nothing to to with a single system! How is it, you, are going to provide and pay for my health care?

If I don't have an insurance policy covering my family of 4 by June 2014, I will be penalised some $5000 in taxes when I file! And I still wont have health care! So, again, how is that, " I'm going with all of us pay"?

Please enlighten me!

TheRealChris.....nice post! I may use that line to my NASCAR brother-in-law! I really take issue with people that think our forefathers were infallible when creating the Constitution. At the time of it's writing, most of them owned slaves! It is our ability to adapt that makes us able to survive, and the view that the Constitution should never be revised is conceptually crazy. Our forefathers never dreamed we would have guns that shoot 200 rounds a minute, that we have landed on the moon, that the skys are filled with planes daily, and that skyscrapers dot the landscape.

The Republican ideology of hiding behind the Constitution is frivolous and severely out-dated. It could absolutely stand some changing. By the way....one thing that most of those bible-thumpers don't understand is that many of our forefathers despised organized religions. John Adams wrote that it was the bane of man's existence.

Will somebody Please tell me, how is the Affordable Health Care Act going to bring COSTS down?

I hear a lot of talk, but no real answer!

Devel's son- How? By denying health care to those who cannot pay? Then tax them for it too?

Jobless, You don't like mandatory insurance. Fine when you get sick or injured without it no problem as long as the doctor and hospital can just wheel you out the door and leave you at the curb untreated unless you can prove you can cover the estimated bill. Many said madatory car insurance would ruin things. Did it? NO.

@MGates73: Yes, I do see your point and well done.

Since Santorum is mentioned in the article, therefore driving forth all the 'nut job' version of religious discussion, here' my take regarding religion and science:

Either:

1) You take everything in the Bible (whichever one you decide is th IT Bible) and you take it literally. I sure would just like to hear about this person because while they my be honest, I think they might just have to live apart from any human beings whatsoever to accomplish their mission. And it would STILL be a feat of unbelievable proportions

2) You only take certain parts of the Bible literally, which makes you a hypocrite only if you pretend that you AREN'T. This is where your moronic evangelical comes in. Its the Santorum version, or the 700 club version, or just in general, the stark raving lunatic version. Lots of people only take certain parts of the Bible literally, but they don't pretend otherwise, because they know it makes no sense to pretend that somehow lying isn't as big of a sin as murder and then go around thumping that you are a Christian who believes in everything the Bible says

3) You take none of the Bible literally, and then yet you either find value in religion or the Bible or not. Kind of hard to sound like a hypocrite in this category, because you actually bothered to realize that the Bible is open to interpretation. That doesn't mean you aren't a Christian. That doesn't mean you aren't spiritual. And it doesn't mean that science is your big fat enemy.

If you are in category 2 and not pretending, or category 3, life, honestly, will be a lot calmer and make more sense. You don't have to sound like a flaming a-hole when you talk about things like birth control, and you can express your opinion. You'll even listen to others in some degree and maybe you'll actually try to convince them instead of that constantly ineffective thing called beating someone over the head with it.

If you are in category 1, you are an anomally and amazing slash potentially dangerous. If you are a pretender in category 2, you need to be called out on your hypocritical view because, frankly, you aren't helping anybody who is actually a decent person and also happens to be religious.

Jobless,

It's a universal truth, that at some point in time, every single one of us will seek out healthcare, correct????

Right now our system works like this...

Some of us have insurance, some of us don't. We all get care. The cost of those that get the care without the insurance are passed on to those who have the insurance.

With the mandate, we all have to pay into our coverage. So, people like me, who are young, relatively healthy, and not as likely to shell out the extra bucks for insurance, can no longer do that. There's more of us contributing to overall costs. This, presumably, will bring down the pricing of health insurance for everyone, but as I said, it would work a lot better if we no longer allowed the industry to hold monopolies. That's where the problem with pricing and affordability lays. They aren't held accountable to the free market, so you don't have options. You can't really go and hire the cheapest company that will keep you the healthiest.

Of course, a single payer system would be optimal. If you can convince the GOP of that, without being called a socialist, I'll be eternally grateful.

I don't know what the tax penalty you're paying is being applied to, but it would make sense if that went into some sort of government healthcare fund, but when has the government ever made sense?

David Walker -

Agnosticism is the view that the truth values of certain claims—especially claims about the existence or non-existence of any deity, but also other religious and metaphysical claims—are unknown or unknowable.

I thought that since you required a proof of God or have stated that before that it is unknowable to prove one way or another hat you were an agnostic. That said, I now understand you to be simply a non-believer. Fine by me.

However, although it has been interesting, the topic in my original post was misunderstood. I was not calling non believers condescending or elitists. I was calling your particular post and the words you chose condescending. Perhaps it seems a backtrack but in the words of a certain candidate "Those are not the words I would have chosen to describe..."

There are many believers, non believers of whatever political stripe who post commentary, discuss issues and disagree without belittling the beliefs or ideas of others. I think that we need to get away from hating those who believe different than us, those that are trying to legistlatively impose their beliefs on us.

Yes we should resist those who wrongly overreach and try to impose their beliefs. But as Christ would say - "Love those who hate you, Turn the other check, Forgive your brother when he offends you...,

You stated that few understand the Bible or know what is in it. I agree beyond the stories or fables as you might call them I see much more. My faith moves me to look to the Beatitudes, to the Sermon on the mount, the Golden Rule, perhaps in your mind they are not sacrosant, but certainly at the least philosophically they could be anyone's moral measuring stick to strive towards.

You bring up good points about a possible cyclical birthing universe, the possibility of the multiverse, (I digress but always enjoyed fiction, even comic books that utilizes the multiverse/ alternate reality meme.)

By the way, I enjoyed our discussion and reading the posts of the others who commented as well.

Jobless: what you don't understand is that if you don't have insurance, all of us taxpayers pay for you anyway. When you show up at the emergency room because you don't have insurance, the rest of us pay for your treatment, because the hospital is not going to turn you away. It was "keeping costs down" only in your imagination to have insurers have cmoplete and total control over who they say no to for any reason at any time. (Which is why at one time not that long ago, national health care coverage was a REPUBLICAN idea...back when Republicans were the party of fiscal concerns, not vaginal probes.)

Derek,

How right are you?!

I live in the bible-belt and I have met quite a few that I would put in category 1. I don't often walk away from conversation especially about religion (it fascinates me) but with these people I just have to stop talking and walk away because nothing you say goes in at all. I'm so amazed and disgusted that people can do this to themselves. It makes me wonder what goes on in their minds? I wonder if people are predisposed to be unquestioning. I would blame it on brain-washing but then I should be brain-washed. It's a wate of gray matter!

MGates and Derek....I myself, am quite amazed at the absurdity of it all. Anyone that has truly read the bible cover to cover and not asked themselves the question "what exactly am I to believe" then either is ignoring most of what they read (most likely) and only concentrating on the positive notes throughout, or they are blindly stupid and don't understand blatant passages showing the undeniable callousness of a supposed loving god.

I am fairly certain that one day, but of course, not in my lifetime, people will realize that worshipping an invisible being, much like the Greeks and Romans of yore once worshipped their gods, is really not in their best interest since no reliable help is ever bestowed on anybody by magically praying. However, having said that, if it makes them feel better, far be it from me to expose their ideology for what it truly is.

http://www.skymachines.com/US-National-Debt-Per-Capita-Percent-of-GDP-and-by-Presidental-Term.htm

Real numbers say that Republicans in the White House increases debt, defense spending, and cuts domestic program. That magic trickle down has a tipping point, in which, earners are under taxed. The result is an increase in national debt. Please refer to that Bush tax cut while waging 2 wars. Never been done and damned foolish. Romney declare that he can reduce the top earners tax rate to 15% from 35%. If you're truthful, you've noticed that the roads are in ill repair and education is becoming a luxury. Sweep the GOP totally out of the way and you'll see progress. President Obama inherited the worst economy in history and is turning it around--even with the obstinate right.

Michael1969

Libs live by emotion (kinda like an 6-year old).....you cannot "source" that.

"Libs live by emotion"? Libs? Are you serious?

Well, in that case... please, oh mighty Republican... how would you categorize these platforms?

1. Obamacare creates government DEATH PANELS - every Republican states this.

2. With Obamacare the President will come into your house and force you to have an abortion - Glenn Beck

3. Bailing out GM represents the complete government takeover of private business and the start of a completely socialist nation... even though they are paying the money back, thousands of jobs were saved, and stockholders still own the company. - every Republican.

4. Requiring companies to provide contraceptives in health care plans is a WAR on religion... a WAR - Hannity, Santorum, Gingrich

5. Even though rape is a horrible thing, there is still a baby created and that is a gift from God. Women should accept this gift. - Santorum

6. All women who take birth control are sluts. - Limbaugh

7. Obama is a Muslim... because of his middle name - every Republican

8. Obama supports gang members and murders... because that guy from the GAP commercial sang at the white house. - every Republican, Fox News.

9. Participating in cash for clunkers will give the government full access to your computer and your entire personal life. - Glenn Beck

10. Republicans "boo'ing" and mocking a soldier, who is fighting for our freedom, on national television just because he is gay. - GOP debate

11. Republicans chanting "let him die" in reference to someone who can not afford health insurance. - GOP debate.

12. Republicans claiming a mass of cells in the germinal stage of development is a "baby"... displaying a blatant emotional attachment to a glob of cells. - every Republican

13. Republicans claiming that preventing a fertilized egg from implanting on the uterine wall is "murder" - every Republican

14. Republicans calling Obama both a socialist and a fascist... even though both of those statements contradict the other. - every Republican

15. Obama passed loosened gun laws in a conspiracy to get us to put our guard down, so that he can turn around and take all our guns away. - NRA president

16. The poor do not pay any taxes... except for payroll and sales, but we are going to ignore that and focus our emotions only on income tax. - every Republican

17. If a woman consents to sex, then she consents to a trans-vaginal ultrasound. - Virginia Repubs

18. Muslims are trying to force sharia-law on everyone. - most Repubs

19. Comparing homosexuality to man-on-dog or man-on-child. - Santorum

20. We are against welfare, but we want to ban abortion which will increase the welfare population. Our emotional feelings on abortion are more important than the rational implications of increasing welfare. - every Republican

Shall I continue?

Every single one of those Republican reactions are based on emotion... EVERY SINGLE ONE. And you say that "libs live by emotions"? Libs? Every single one of your Republican platforms is based solely on your emotional response to an issue... you approach each issue alone, apply your emotions to it, and refuse to look at the overall impact it may have.

Jesus Christ, you Repubs are more emotional than 16-year old girls.

MGates73 - thank you for your posts today - very insightful.

To go back to your post 1.116, I do actually appreciate the supposed conservatives that post (or are being paid to post) on here. Watching FOX "news" makes me feel dirty (like looking at tabloid headlines at the supermarket check-out) and I just can't stand to listen to Rush for more than 10 minutes - so, by having the "conservative" posters on here, I can get the repeated daily talking points without having to subject my soul to the source. It's like using the reflective shield to defeat Medusa. (...and sometimes you get some real gems - like "ben" today screaching that he's "proud to be a christian" - apparently completely ignorant to the fact that pride is considered a sin in christianity...he may as well be championing "Adulterers for Jesus").

It makes me nervous when "christians" wear their religion on their sleeve when campaigning. The end of the "Christ" myth is very brutal. The entire goal of their religion is to bring about the extermination of all human life on this planet with the exception of them. Why would any rational person give a nuclear arsenal to someone that prays for everyone else to be dead??? Why should we vote in a fundamentalist christian when we could just simply hire a suicide bomber to do the same?

Regarding what I wrote about the stock market being the highest during a Democratic administration (Clinton's) I got that from a comment on the news I heard that it was the highest it's been in 12 years. The reporter may have been talking about the inflation-adjusted Dow average, which was the highest it's been since 1999 according to this article:

http://allstarcharts.com/dow-industrials-inflation-adjusted/

Whatever the case, the stock market has been doing very well, and not because of the flimflam that boosted the markets during the Bush administration.

Sorry I missed out today on some great discussions!

Sarah -- You said, and I agree:

Furthermore, it really is one of only three options we have. Either some of us pay, all of us pay, or only those who do pay get care. I'm going with all of us pay.

Derek -- You have some interesting thoughts, once again. IMHO - Science is not the enemy and much can learned from history and parables.

David -- You said:

Isn't it enough to marvel at the mysteries around us, to spin through the stars that first prompted the question: How did this get here?

On a clear summer night, looking at the stars with amazement, and realizing how beautiful this world is. Truly awesome! Can't wait for summer! : )

Shocked and Disgusted,

Thank you very much! I appreciate the feedback.

I can't watch Fox News for more than a few minutes either before I find my blood pressure through the roof and I'm screaming at the television so I can't even hear the next ridiculous talking point. My husband will often listen to the talk radio shows here in the bible-belt and tell me about how ridiculous some of their conversations are. I don't understand why they can't figure out they're not right and to stop talking. I'm not a yeller by any means but I get all fired up about politics because people refuse to truly educate themselves. I once got into a screaming match at work with a woman who claimed that Obama was a Muslim (among other ridiculousness) to which I said, "He's not, but so what if he was? He still prays to a god. Have you read the Koran. I did and it's a beautiful text and the religion is beautiful as well! What, only your religion can be the right one if your the POTUS?!" She recoiled in digust then changed the subject. I don't understand why it's "freedom of religion as long as I agree with it (aka it's similar to mine)."

Jesus was cool but so was Mohammed, Buddah etc etc. They all have good advice for the way one should model their lives. It's funny how when they're quoted in their respective sacred texts they sound so similar.

Derek: I was told by a friend of mine who was going to theological college that the bible is merely a book of "parables" to help us live our lives the way God (and Jesus) thought we should. Although it asks for us to have "faith" in many things, we have to also realize that the bible was written and re-written many times by many different religions (the Catholics totally rewrote a goodly portion of it). If you take the bible "literally," that's fine, but it's not meant to be taken literally....it's a guidebook in some ways of a way to live an honorable life. This made a lot of sense to me, and I try to find in the bible guidelines on how I should try to act in my life.....it works for me, but it may not work for you. Just my opinion again.

Sarah3043---Until I came upon your first post I was about to come out of this set of posts, which I think are really crazy. I thought that to-day must be st. paddy's day ,but knew that must be wrong as that is a fun day .My father's family was from Ireland and we always enjoyed that day. The folks to the right of the political spectrum have always been a little unusual , as far as this liberal is concerned ,but to-day they seemed to out-do themselves in their unusual view points. I guess that this was their day to hate anyone left of the far est -right of the right wing ,politically. I will try to continue with this at a later time to-night when I hope that the crazies have cooled down or gone to bed.

Didi, I think we are on the same page here. I was, in fact, pointing out how ridiculous it would be to take any Bible literally, and yes, you'd still have to pick which 'version' you prefer.

Where do I even start?

Imagine the demographics for The Children of the Corn. Imagine crossing a portal into a world immune to logic and reason; where ignorance is a virtue, where the South won the Civil War; where there is no history after 1964 because it hasn't happened yet. To paraphrase Rod Serling, you have now entered Alabama and Mississippi.

This is where convicted murderers wait the tables of the Governor and are generously tipped with pardons.

This is where "evangelicals" for all their names and appellations conjure up snake handling and speaking in tongues. Their gods do not like people who have dark skin. Their gods love pregnant teen-aged girls. Their gods created the earth 6,000 years ago. Science is an abomination, a creation of false prophets.

Wow, David, you feeling a little superior? I haven't seen Children of the Corn, but you obviously attempt to paint a horror scenario. Yet, oddly enough, some of us from Mississippi managed to become National Merit Scholars (I was one of several Finalists in my class) and to attend some of the nation's top universities. (My alma mater was ranked in the top 15 of all universities in the country last I was aware.) And I wasn't even first or second in my high school class. Our valedictorian had a 98.9 percent (our school didn't do the 4.0 system) four year high school average and wound up going to Harvard. One of my Mississippi friends was even a Rhodes Scholar. My college degree is a Bachelor of Science, BTW, which would be kind of difficult if I felt that science was an abomination-especially in a school that was ranked in the top 15 in the country.

I have never met a single person who handles snakes, nor have I met anyone who knows anyone who handles snakes. As far as I know that is a very small cultish group. The large majority of people I know who would call themselves evangelical do not consider race a factor in how God feels about people, though there are a few who hold onto old prejudices. You have obviously never been to Mississippi or Alabama to make the statement you do about pregnant teens. The problem is huge and has been for a long time, but no one believes it is because God wants it to be that way. If you think it is because of the latest contraceptive issue, you are sadly mistaken-the problem has been around far longer than this, and contraceptives plus the legality of abortion have not made much of a dent in it. Cultural factors play a huge role. It really doesn't work when people try to moralize and lecture about situations they know little or nothing about. I know very few people who value ignorance-though you don't appear to want to be educated beyond your own very tired stereotypes of people from the South and of "Evangelicals." I personally don't consider myself "evangelical" because there is much that seems to fall under that label that doesn't fit me.

Didi, just so you know, many of the historical parts of the Bible can be backed up with recent archaeological finds such as the Lachish Reliefs, which are currently in the British Museum; the Tel Dan Stele, which was mentioned in an article in National Geographic about a year ago; and others, which actually portray or refer to events which are told about in the Bible. The names of many of the kings of Israel and Judah have been found on artifacts from other civilizations which were trading partners with Israel. As for the Bible being written and rewritten numerous times, that's the DaVinci Code version of history. The Catholic Church could not have rewritten it since the Old Testament existed before the time of Christ as the Septuagint as well as parts in the Dead Sea Scrolls. The New Testament has been admitted even by atheists to have more texts to back it up than any other ancient manuscript in existence. You still needn't take all of the Bible literally-much of it is clearly intended to be poetry. However, ignoring the parts of it which are or could be real is not necessarily best, do you think? For others of you, Jesus was certainly real; despite the attempts of many to deny this, no true historian doubts that a man named Jesus of Nazareth existed in Palestine in the first century plus britannica.com certainly presents him as an actual person with a birth date and death date. If Jesus doesn't really matter or if he just said a lot of nice moral stuff, however, why would people want to deny his existence so badly? Don't we all want to be good and moral?

Sources for my comments above:

This alabaster panel was part of a series which decorated the walls of a room in the palace of King Sennacherib (reigned 704-681 BC). It tells the story of the siege and capture of the city of Lachish in 701 BC

The story continues from the previous panel (no. 9) of the relief. This section decorated a corner of the room.

Having been exiled from their city, the people of Lachish move through the countryside to be resettled elsewhere in the Assyrian Empire. Below them high officials and foreigners are being tortured and executed. It is likely that they are being flayed alive.

The foreigners are possibly officers from Nubia. The Nubians were seen as sharing responsibility for the rebellion. Much of Egypt at this time was ruled by a line of kings from Nubia (the Twenty-fifth Dynasty) who were keen to interfere in the politics of the Levant, to contain the threat of Assyrian expansion.

As Sennacherib's forces laid siege to Lachish, an Egyptian army appeared, led by a man called Taharqa, according to the Old Testament. He may be the later pharaoh of Egypt with the same name (690-664 BC).

Sennacherib's account claims that the rebels had called on the support of the kings of Egypt (Delta princes) and the Kings of Kush (Nubia). The armies clashed on the plain of Eltekeh. While Sennacherib claimed victory, he was still not able to capture Jerusalem.

britishmuseum.org

David is said to have been the greatest king in the history of ancient Israel. Now 3,000 years after his reign, an archeologist has uncovered the first reference outside the Bible to David and the dynasty he established.

Earlier this month at Tel Dan, the site of an ancient city in northern Israel, archeologist Avraham Biran found a fragment of a stone monument from the 9th Century B.C. that has an Aramaic inscription reading the "House of David"-giving evidence that there was a people at that time that identified with the legendary ruler.

articles.chicagotribune.com re Tel Dan Stele dated August, 1993

ARTICLE from the Encyclopædia Britannica
Septuagint, abbreviation Lxx, the earliest extant Greek translation of the Old Testament from the original Hebrew, presumably made for the use of the Jewish community in Egypt when Greek was the lingua franca throughout the region. Analysis of the language has established that the Torah, or Pentateuch (the first five books of the Old Testament), was translated near the middle of the 3rd century bc and that the rest of the Old Testament was translated in the 2nd century bc.

If one wants to undermine the reliability of the New Testament, one better not do it through textual criticism. The New Testament contains by far the best-attested and most reliably reconstructed5 texts of the ancient world.6
It is much easier to undermine the reliability of the New Testament using its own numerous contradictions and inherent implausibility.

from commonsenseatheism.com

seen too much:

That's pretty good stuff there. You ask:

"Wow, David, you feeling a little superior?"

So, what's the first thing you do to demonstrate YOUR superiority? Creds, baby, creds.

"My alma mater was ranked in the top 15 of all universities in the country last I was aware."

Goldman Sachs, Bank of America, AIG - Triple A ratings! If you can't trust arbitrary rankings, what can you trust?

"My college degree is a Bachelor of Science, BTW, which would be kind of difficult if I felt that science was an abomination-especially in a school that was ranked in the top 15 in the country."

George W. Bush has an MBA from Harvard, and a bachelor's degree from Yale. I'm bowled over, how about you?

Y'all go right ahead and defend Mississippi and Alabama, but I'm goin' ta tell ya, Bubba Ray, I'm goin' with the numbers that say both of 'em are at the bottom in that there intellectual achievement area.

Y'all ain't seen bigotry, Y'all ain't seen hostility directed at the "Others"? Y'all denyin' them numbers about the President bein' one of them Muslims?

Now, back here in the world of serious, I haven't denied the existence of Jesus of Nazareth. I am however, aware that he's had competition in The Messiah sweepstakes for many centuries. He just had better P.R.

Sure there's parts of the Bible that are historically accurate. Again, that is not a point of contention. However, to deny that the Bible hasn't been altered, revised, edited, and outright butchered borders on pure ignorance.

So, brethren, if the sandals fit wear them.

Thus endeth the epistle.

Ad hominem attacks mean you have no real argument, David (i.e., "bethren," "Bubba Ray," etc).

Ben - your posts are totally disgusting. The pro-choice people do not believe in killing babies. No one does. We do believe the mother should have the choice about her pregnancy. A fetus is NOT a baby. However, a girl/woman is but the GOP has no problem killing/sacrificing them. (Santorum - if you get raped and a pregnancy ensues you should just consider it a "gift from God.") Let me ask you, Ben, if you get raped, is that a gift from God? Oh wait - you're a man so you have different rights. I am so damned tired of the right wingers talking about "killing babies." YOU are the ones who kill babies. You don't give a damned if they starve to death once they are born. That's the woman's problem. Your sanctimonious posts are nothing more than poor attempts at nonsense. And, it shows!

David Walker - GREAT post!

How Long Is Too Long?

Newt Gingrich's refusal to quite proves he doesn't care about his party or his country. If only Mitt could use one of his remote control and turn Gingrich off. Willard can't get the required delegates. But, Newt wants his platform at a brokered convention.

Thanks Newt for giving President Obama his 2nd term.

4 more for 44

Nobody but Obama/Biden 2012

Hey Ya'll

Some of His Friends Own Pacific Islands!!!

http://www.balloon-juice.com/2012/03/14/some-of-his-friends-own-pacific-islands/

Bev,

Newt's ego is even bigger than his waistline! (Or Tiffany's bill)

Now that was a productive statement. Can't comment on the issues at hand so you throw out what you believe are cutesy little statements on someone's physical appearance or other personal items. Pathetic and pitiful.

Dennis -- shame on you. So it's bad if one party does not march in unison but also bad when they do march in unison. One is called division and the other obstruction??? Why don't you juveniles grow up.

Yep, that's me! Pathetic and pitiful. Also, trapped in a house with a sick hubby. I am losing what is left of my sanity!

Sorry about your husband. This damn virus going around is bi-partisan LOL!!!

Ben,

Actually in a way it serves him right. He was bragging about not getting sick while everyone around him was. Problem is, he is a rotten patient! I see another trip to the beach (of jail for committing mayhem, whichever comes first) LOL!

Dennis, good points. I saw that Boehner hasn't been able to pass any transportation bills. He really is not a good Speaker of the House. Scarey thought he's third in line for the presidency. I was a delegate to our Democratic County Convention Saturday. Our district House representative spoke and said he is home most weekends and many full weeks these days because the Boehner GOP majority House is a disaster with little control over their own caucus. They get very little done because of the disorganization and so much time off. He said it is a mess.

Damage123

Hey! Whaen are we going to see a First Read articale about the $10,000/couple dinner held at John Kerry's MULTI-MILLION $$$$ mansion in Georgetown the other night? You remember....the dinner where Joe Biden stood there and told the gathered millionaires that the GOP can't relate to the middle class???

That was even funnier than Sandra Fluke = Rosa Parks. Oh no! Here I go again!!! Bwahahahahahahahaha!!

Why should FR write an article about it, when we can read about it from Washington Times, where the writer admits his stupidity by saying he checked his refrigerator and pantry and saw no "grass fed New York Strip steaks." What does he think "middle class cows" eat?

Jody, talk about a mess, the Senate is the problem. The house has sent many, many bills over to the Senate and they do nothing. The house has passed a budget and it sits over in the Senate along with all the other budgets they have sent over there. I don't see how your democrat representive can complain when your Senators sit doing nothing. We would all be better off if they all went home for awhile without any pay. No salary until both Senate and House pass a budget.

arm-459442 -- Let's say there's a Party that controlled the House that has a bill requiring the government to kill all first-born males. We don't need to discuss whether the opposing Party participated with input, or whether polls showed popular support among voters, or what have you to know this bill is worse than absurd.

The few bills the Teapublican House has sent on to the Senate (often recycled with a new label), are almost that bad. And this is why the Senate hasn't wasted time pretending otherwise. So stop drinking so much Kool-Aid and spreading these ridiculous right-wing lies.

Back to the topic... Romney is the weakest candidate the GOP/TP has had in a long time, maybe ever in history considering how badly he is doing compared to The Field of Clowns. Gingrich wants to stay in the race until other southern states hold primaries, but everyone else knows he has no chance barring a major screw-up by Romney or Santorum.

If Gingrich wanted to restore his reputation to keep his speaking gigs and fees up, he should quit while he's ahead. With that said, I welcome Newtie to stay as long as he wants, 'cuz heaven forbid Spanish Inquisition Santorum gets any closer to the nomination (haunting)!

If you think tilting at windmills can turn into a primary win.....you might be Ron Paul.

If you think some of the more rabid FR trolls have lust in their hearts for Feisty Redhead ...

TOG,

OMG! That is too funny! *wiping away tears of laughter* LOL

I sure do seem to be a troll magnet...

The waiting list for admission into the Feisty Redhead Fan Club is now up to a year due to the sheer volume of applicants! ☺

PS: NO grits for me this morning - I went with some 'cheesy' hashbrowns!

Feisty, stay away from the poutine!

If you think you're inevitable when your base doesn't like you

I love the short term memories. I Seem to remember Hilary Clinton getting more votes in the 2008 primaries while Obama won delegates.

Tired Old Guy, thanks for the humor this morning; well done. Steeler Fan, nice addition. Too bad, the humor is based on truth.

Skup, Candidate Obama won many, many primaries and caucuses before the rust belt states which leaned toward Clinton.

All this talk about grits makes me want to toss a salad !....lol ..if your smiling right now you may be a real person !

Jody, Iowa - That's nice but it doesn't change the fact that Obama had less than half of the Democrats supporting him during the primary and only 102 more delegates. Romney is has 1.2 million more votes than Santorum and 235 more delegates and still the media is trying to portray him as weak. Everyone seems to think the Christian Conservatives are the parties base and the media is happy to re-enforce that view but the numbers tell a different story. There are more moderates in the party than anyone cares to acknowledge. We just don't get the media coverage because we aren't thumping a bible in front of a camera. It so much easier and profitable to point the camera at idiots like Limbaugh and say look at the what the Republicans have become.

Skup---do all the comparison to the Democrats in 2008 that you want but remember this---many of us were very torn between Hillary Clinton and Barack Obama. I strongly supported Sen. Obama but would have proudly voted for Hillary Clinton had she won the nomination. What I hear from Republicans is that they would "hold their nose" and vote for Mitt. Not the same at all.

Skup, delegates is all 2008 and 2012 have in common. What you cannot change is that in 2008, the democrats had two popular and well liked candidates running for President--their differences in policy were minuscule. Democrats who like Obama also liked Clinton and despite all the media chatter and hyperventilating about a brokered convention, a huge majority of democrats would have supported either candidate in the general election.

In 2012, the GOP has a candidate many republicans do not like and a candidate only the evangelicals like. The conservatives only rallied to Santorum as the others like Perry, Cain and Bachmann dropped out. There was no huge swell of passion for any of the GOP candidates as there was for Obama and Clinton. There is simply no comparison between the 2008 democratic and 2012 republican primaries except the talk of delegates.

Steeler Fan-380417 - I only pointed out the 2008 Democrat primary because of the way the press is trying to portray Romney. I have no doubt that the Democrats would have solidified behind Hilary with just as much support as they did for Obama. However, Romney is not as weak as he is being portrayed. As for Republicans "holding their noses" to vote for Mitt, I would guess they A. listen to Limbaugh and B. probably believe everything he says in which case they can stick their fingers up their nose all they want...

TiredOldGuy, you're more like OneSharpDude, I enjoyed your post.

Skup, your party is in war.

The Dumbasses with no ability to think for themselves or reason = We want Newt

The American Taliban we think women should be barefoot and pregnant and God agrees = We want Santorum

The Money is Everything, Me First, Don't touch it, it's mine! = We want Mitt

Good luck with that.

Skup, while I agree that Romney is not as weak as he is portrayed, it is Santorum, Gingrich who are painting the biggest part of that picture. It is republican analysts, pundits and the like who keep talking about Romney's weaknesses. It is Rush Limbaugh and some on FOX who ridicule Romney and cheer Santorum and Gingrich. The trouble with Romney is that he has helped the naysayers because instead of just being himself, he's busy trying to convince whatever states voters that he's one of them. He's the one who has continually put his foot in his mouth. All those things help his opponents.

Jody, Iowa - I agree. Fox and Limbaugh are nothing more that mouth pieces for the Christian Conservatives. I guess I'm just frustrated because the moderates in the Republican party get so little coverage. The squeaky wheel gets the camera. I went back and looked at the numbers again and had this been a race between only Romney and Santorum, Santorum would most likely be headed for the nomination. While there may be conservatives that would hold their nose and vote for Mitt I don't see any way I could ever vote for Santorum.

Skup - Yes, Gringrich is holding Santorum at bay. A head to head Santorum vs Romney fight, would lead to a Santorum explosion! At least in the primaries. Alas, if this were to happen, the general election would be a HUGE Obama landslide. They may even be given it a new name, Obama-slide!

Santorum in 1812!

And don't forget to unplug the phone

Oops! Forgot about that Deb. You are soooooooooooo right.

Newter vows to continue to Tampa. What for? The nomination? Nope. He is running For Secretary of State and will turn over his chits to whoever makes the promise.

Think of all the fancy places Calipso can wear here pretty bling.

phinephancy-4252115

To the citizens of Illinois from those of us who have already had to experience the GOP traveling show our heartfelt sympathy. (Oh, and rent a bunch of flicks is the best advice we send).

Thank you phine,

The ads and robo calls are driving me nuts. Romney is coming here to prowl around with the rich. Wish I had that remote control that could make his robotic butt disappear in the lake since he loves the lakes so much.

Mitt Romney’s son Matt veered a bit off message when he told a local TV station, “I’m not here to talk about President Obama I think he is great.” “I’m here to talk about my dad and what he would bring to the country,”

For once I agree with a Romney.

Does all the money the Super PAcs are spending on Romney constitute a stimulus? Could this be why the economy is improving and companies are hiring?

Romney's campaign strategy should be to keep his mouth shut. He'd do a lot better then.

Since I'm on a DO NOT CALL list can I sure their little a**es off????

03/13/12 - For the first time since early July, more Americans approve of the job President Barack Obama is doing than disapprove, according to a new Reuters/Ipsos poll that shows his approval rating now at 50 percent.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/03/13/us-usa-campaign-obama-idUSBRE82C1AN20120313

Jody---I think the divide in the Republican party between the moderates and the conservatives is apparent but I also think in the long run it won't make a difference. The conservatives will never vote for President Obama and will reluctantly vote for whoever their party nominates. And a ton of Super PAC money will be available to spread lies about the President.

Liar, Liar pants on fire:

According to a brand new "New York Times" CBS poll just 41 percent of Americans approve of the job Mr. Obama is doing, while 47 percent disapprove. Now just one month ago the numbers told an entirely different story when his approval ratings was at 50 percent.

Even worse news for the President are his approval ratings on the economy. Just 39 percent approve of his handling of the economy; 54 percent disapprove.

That NYT/CBS poll was not in line with any other recent poll so the pants are on fire belong to CBS.

They showed a 9 point (18%) drop in one month while all other polls show our President’s approval at or above 45%. Even the Gallup Daily Track has our President above 45% and right-side-up for the last 6 days in-a-row.

The issue isn't whether the conservative base will vote for Obama over the moderate Romney (if he gets the nomination); it is whether they decide to stay at home rather than have to select what they view as the lesser of two evils.

Sorry to put a damper on damaged and ben numbers but Gallup has President Obama's approval at 49%; Reuters/Ipsos has his approval at 50% which means these two polls had completely opposite results. Never take any poll seriously until the week of the general election; use them as a guide to look at trends but neither party should take them for granted.

If Landslide Willard only needs 48% of the outstanding delegates, does it mean the altar boys (the two Catholics) combined only need 52.5% to deny him a first ballot win? Why should Sanctimonium want Newter out? He is costing Romney delegates which is the only game Ricky can play now.

If the lead altar boy can deny Wiggles Willard a first round win, its back to the 1952 GOP convention food fight.

Wasn't it the left that said -- just the other day -- Gallup has lost its credibility in the polling world?????? Hypocrites???? YES!!!!!!!

How about the most accurate pollster based on the 2008 election who has the president at a minus 15 approval rating.

Steeler Fan, absolutely, the far right base of the GOP will never vote for President Obama or for that matter, any democrat. I do think the establishment GOP, the more moderate side of the party (which is barely visible these days) recognize that a Rick Santorum will fire up the conservative, evangelical base voters but likely turn off the moderates and independents.

Good point, Michael L. I think Santorum or Romney will be secure in getting the base of the GOP to the polls even in the South because their hatred of President Obama is beyond comprehension but it could matter for the many moderate GOPers out there--they may decide to stay home if Santorum wins but they'll hold their nose for Romney.

One thing for sure, it is interesting to watch and comment if you enjoy politics.

Ben, around spring every election year, Gallup begins to do its credibility polls; realizing that to be credible they must do a better sampling. No one is saying Gallup is perfect but the fact that other polls show a very different trends should make a person recognize that some polls are flawed and become outliers. The CBS poll is an outlier.

It's funny to see Ben floundering. Today he's a huge fan of the New York Times. You remember them, that liberal rag that lies all the time. Poor Ben, just can't figure out which way you are going can you?

There is no accurate nor dependable sampling of Obama's popularity at the moment for there actually is no one to whom he can be compared with respect to the 2012 race. When there is a candidate selected to oppose him, then people will be making informed and reliable decisions. Of course, there are those who would rate Obama below any Republican nominee ~ even if the candidate was a pardoned Charles Manson. Its just their DNA to do so. But in light of all that has happened, ranking at 45% or better (in most polls), Obama is well positioned to be re-elected. People are not as ignorant as would be sufficiently convenient for the GOP in their attempts to hang the high gas prices on Obama. Hell, domestic production is running almost 10% more than at anytime during the Bush years when prices were actually higher at their peak than currently under Obama. Plus, there is about 40 hours of GOP propaganda film extolling the fact that presidents have no control over gas prices. If it was true under Bush, it is true today and the majority of people know and accept that as fact.

Not floundering. Just pointing out the inaccuracies of the statements. It's obvious that the left is in a tizzy, panties in a wad when the only way to combat facts is to attack the person.

Jim

Pardoned, Hell they'ed vote for Charles Manson if he escaped, let alone pardoned.

Not floundering. Just pointing out the inaccuracies of the statements. It's obvious that the left is in a tizzy, panties in a wad when the only way to combat facts is to attack the person.

Not true Taliban Ben, she simply pointed out your Willard like traits.. Remember, Reading is Fundamental

Ben, why are you holding what one, maybe a few, "liberals" say to every "liberal" you talk to? That doesn't make sense.

"The White House is sitting back and giggling uncontrollably...."

Yes because they are hoping they can get another four years to complete their clueless mission of completely screwing this country to the wall economically.

Tracy, the NASDAQ closed over 3000 for the first time since 2000. The Dow Jones closed over 13,000. Neither of these bastions of capitalism and free market seem as concerned about Obama's economic policies as you are.

Tracy, it was supply side economics that "screwed this country to the wall economically."

TO: Tracy1973 who wrote:

"The White House is sitting back and giggling uncontrollably...." Yes because they are hoping they can get another four years to complete their clueless mission of completely screwing this country to the wall economically."

It was Republicans who "screwed this country to the wall economically" and because Republicans "screwed up the economy" so badly, that helped get President Obama elected.

Obama / Biden 2012

"Neither of these bastions of capitalism and free market seem as concerned about Obama's economic policies as you are."

Selling off is easy to do in either of those markets and when our massive debt catches up to us like it has for the EU you and the jokers just might start to wise up and be concerned as well.

"Tracy, it was supply side economics that "screwed this country to the wall economically.""

Obamanomics is massive spending and massive taxiation which will not work. History has shown that the reason we finally came out of the Great Depression is because of WW2 NOT the New Deal programs.

Actually history shows us we were coming out of the Great Depression, until republiCONS forced austerity measures though in 1937, causing another recession. And, where exactly is this "massive taxation?"

Tracy: how's that "midnight in America" working for ya?

43 states added jobs...guess you're not going to be happy until we return to Republican rule and it's back to e job losses in all 50....

"Actually history shows us we were coming out of the Great Depression, until republiCONS forced austerity measures though in 1937..."

What caused the 1937 recession is debatable. Some say it was the tightening of the money supply while others say it was spending cuts. It's not a "settled" cause by a long shot.

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article16941.html

"And, where exactly is this "massive taxation?""

You actually think that Obama is going to be able to only increase taxed the "rich" if he is re-elected in order to pay for all of his new spending? Everyone will have their taxes increased.

Tracey1973 - your posts show no "meat." I love that you say nothing about what the GOP will do. That's because all the candidates are talking about is social issues. Birth Control; Planned Parenthood; Gay Marriage. The right has no plans, no objectives, no nothing.

Obama/Biden 2012

You know, Barnum has a circus museum in that area..........................

Can't wait to see them all sweatin it out in Tampa...ha ha

Good Morning Rooster!

Tampa is about as close as you can get to hell on Earth in August!

The Barnum museum is in Sarasota - there is also the Ring of Fame" on St, Armands Circle.

Mornin Red! my thoughts exactly! home of the summer circus

Guys, please. The circus deserves better!

Just a note Da Noid, Santorum won the "blue-collar, rank-and-file" REPUBLICAN demographics. The good news here is that the independents and democrats have not been heard from yet. Thank God!

Just a note Da Noid, Santorum won the "blue-collar, rank-and-file" REPUBLICAN demographics.

Duly noted.

Da Noid, well done analysis. You are so right, Romney's problem is that he isn't being himself. Trouble is, that as far right at the GOP base has shifted, makes him embrace what he doesn't believe. The longer the primary has gone, the less real and believable he has become. Romney needed to win early and win big. His pandering and foot in mouth disease prevented that from happening. The simple truth is that Ronald Reagan or Dwight Eisenhower would not be elected by today's conservatives--both would out of the race standing beside Jon Huntsman.

And Obama's favorable rating is down to 41%........

Barry Soetoro Most 2faced prez ever.

We never had a President named Barry Soetoro.

Then do you know what his name was before he changed it to Barack Husein Obama?

Rick -totally ignorant post since he NEVER changed his name. What was your name before you changed it to Rick?

Independent (you never were an Independent) His rating is at 49%

Independent, Obama's back up to 46.8 approval rating today....

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president_obama_job_approval-1044.html

Guess those polls change daily!

And Rick, are you still tossing your conspiracy theories around??

LOL

Maybe they are courting the Druid vote?

good one, phinephancy!

Santorum's supporters bear a strong resemblance to potted plants. Maybe that's why they're so insistent on having an abundant supply of carbon dioxide in the atmosphere.

After we've just come through such a mild winter, JoAnne, it is funny to me that Santorum debunks climate change. I've never seen a daffodil blooming in my garden this early but saw one this morning---even before the crocuses. I enjoyed it but that doesn't mean we have serious environmental issues to address.

Kinda hard to blame that on Americans and their SUVs and lightbulbs, isn't it?

No, but once I look at the evidence that concludes that there is currently a greenhouse effect going on, then I look at measurements of how we have more greenhouse gases in our atmosphere in any time in the last 650000 years, and then I look at how those measurements began to spike after the Industrial Revolution, then it's easy to blame that on "Americans and their SUVs and lightbulbs".

Of course, you undoubtedly never took a single college-level class on meteorology, climatology, or astronomy. So spare me your regurgitated denialist garbage.

JoAnne, shades of the GOP. Can't remember which republican lawmaker stood on the Congressional floor and made almost the same comment about carbon dioxide and plants. The reason they don't like science is they aren't bright enough to understand it. Bet they don't know why the leaves change colors in the fall and drop off the trees either. Santorum's explanation is "God's plan" while ignoring that man can and does intefere with Nature or God's Plan with regularity. Louie Gohmert maybe or that Virginia Foxx lady?

So Damage, are you saying that since "the left" is arrogant it causes you to doubt years of scientific research? And you call "lefties" emotional?

Aww...is poor Bobby's wittle candidate thweatened by the big, bad ewite media?

Bob -

There's no "could be" about it. How do you think an unknown guy with a name like Barack Hussein Obama got elected President of the United States in the first place? And don't even think about saying the word "Koolade". I spent eight months working in that campaign organization, and I will testify that those of you who underestimate the skills of a "community organizer" do so at your own peril.

Humor aside, Bob, that isn't spin.

A disciplined candidate with a good organization, solid message, immense campaign muscle (see also: MONEY) and victories already pocketed in places Ohio, Michigan, Virginia, Arizona and Florida should be cutting throught candidates like Santorum and Gingrich like a hot knife through butter. Instead, Romney finished 3rd last night in two primaries behind:

A) A former US Senator who lost his last bid for re-election by 18 points who had no chance before the primary season even began.

B) The only Speaker of the House to ever have ethics charges brought against him and who had his entire senior campaign staff quit on him over the summer.

Bob in Virginia:

"Most sophisticated in history"? C'mon now, Obama's approval is at 41%....but heck, we may not be the most sophisticated, but we do have an entire network in our back pocket!"

Go ahead and pick the polls that have the results you want and ignore the others. Both the Gallup and Rasmussen daily tracking polls have yet to show any big drop in Obama's approval rating. The numbers bounce around between 50% and 45% in both polls.

JoAnne,

I also was part of the Obama campaign volunteers in 2008. It was the best organized of any campaign I have ever worked seen.

GOP can count on the religious right to provide their everyday volunteers. Evangelical churches have great data bases and can rally their folks.

I am thinking that they will concentrate on the state and local elections instead of being Romney's die-hard volunteers.

Gotta love Houston: "Obama is TOO approved by less than half of Americans"!!! "Not uhhh, less than...er... less than half like you say!"

@Da Noid - Slow down with the facts ... You do know Bob is prolly blindfolded with his fingers in his ears by now.

homesick,

thanks for sharing some real experience about Santorum as a candidate.

That is why I love FR , sharing what really goes on in the countryside.

Mormons don't have much faith in the bible, as dictated by their articles of faith. But they do enjoy good gift of tongue.

We believe the [B]ible to be the word of God as far as it is translated correctly; we also believe the Book of Mormon to be the word of God.

We believe in the gift of tongues, prophecy, revelation, visions, healing, interpretation of tongues[

speculators have added about $.50 to the price of a gallon of gasoline.

as for me, my next car will be hybrid or natural gas. natural gas is the equivalent of $2 a gallon.

Have you looked at the numbers of women who fnd his stance on women at work, contraceptives and many others positions he holds? He has the highest negatives of ANY of the candidates among women. And because of his, Republican overall have a very high negative rate among women in the last few months. Remember 51% of the US population are female.

iamfree... why is it that moderate has become such a blasphemous thing in the republican party? Why are moderate republicans (the majority compared to the extremists) are so unacceptable? Its as if a moderate republican is the same as an extreme liberal.

I ask sincerely, not to bash you or anyone else who has that view, I just want to better understand it...

They are mad and they aren't going to take it any more! Stomp Stomp Stomp. And like most kids throwing a tantrum they will do something completely stupid. It's funny watching them push the middle away.

Can't resist. iamfree--Rick Santorum is no Ronald Reagan.

Bill... Romney will be the R nominee, but he will lose, and not because he's "moderate". By moving far right in an attempt to erase any last vestigages of moderation, the guy now has negative ratings from 67% of Hispanics (no not illegal hispanics. the legal ones, who can vote), women, who represent 51% of the country and 57% of voters, (gender gap is now 20% and growing...not in Romney's favor). Unions are mobilized now, thanks to the heavy handed thug tactics of Scott Walker and other Republicans who think teachers, state workers and anyone in a union is "the enemy"; Romney is rapidy losing independents, he never had seniors..."Moderation" isn't going to save him now.

Bill, according to my father, mother, all the republicans I grew up with it's because (not my words just pointing out what they say) they're stupid and can't make up their minds. My Dad used to put it this way: "A moderate is someone who stands in the middle of the road trying to figure out which way traffic is going, sooner or later they're going to get hit by a car." It's funny now that I think about it. They thought moderates were stupid but liberals, well, there's nothing more stupid. You would think they'd be kind of luke warm about moderates if anything. Oh well, none of their beliefs make sense to me.

Houston!

I love how you cut right to the heart of the issue,...

Gingrich is NOT all THAT and a bag of chips,...

Cheers to you, Houston. That says it all about Newt Gingrich.

Remember Obama's plans on unemployment? He said iot would never go over 8%. It's been over 8% for 33 months.

Remember Obama's energy plan? he was going to "get costs under control and develop "alternate resources." 500 million to solyndra gone 1.3 billion to an office real estate company to buy panels from solyndra gone. Algae, bio-deisel, gasahol, corn subsidies and all he accomplished was to drive the price of gasoline from that "unamerican" level of $1.78/gallon to $4.23 in just three years.

So, given that, just what were those Democratic candidates plans worth beside a load of manure?

Keep shoveling that stuff. The HNIC is on his way back to Chicago.

bfitz:

I do appreciate your taking the time to comment, however, President Obama never said that unemployment would not go over 8%, not that you care. Also, I do not see any plans in your post, just a regurgitation of the pablum that you have been fed. As far as your HNIC reference, I am glad to see that you acknowledge what your real problem with the President is, because it sure as hell isn't substance based.

Enjoy your ignorance . . . you wear it well.

Wasn't Joe Bfitz the Lil Abner character who wandered around under a dark cloud of dirt and stench?

Given his apparent racial reference, I can assume that the version of "America" he wants great again, per Governor Romney's pledge, is the America of the 1950's when women and people of color knew their place or were dealt with severely if they ever forgot.

Not only that, but gas was $.29.9/gallon.

bfitz

One more thing. I suppose you are all pissy because the 1978 caddie you got "like new" when gas was $1.78/gallon now uses too much gas to drive.

Reminds me of a lyric from a Greg Brown song;

Jesus loves the President (cross out The President and insert Rick Santorum), even though he is a Catholic.

bfitz's 1978 caddie glovebox can still store a brick of free guvment cheese.