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Former Republican National Committee Chairman Michael Steele has said on MSNBC on various occasions that Florida's GOP primary is not winner-take-all.
That's not the case. Florida is winner-take-all. But it is true that Florida might potentially wind up being proportional. But a lot has to happen for that to be the case.
Here's why there is some confusion -- this is all based on the current RNC's interpretation of the rules (more on that below).
The only way how delegates are allocated changes is if an aggrieved Florida resident challenges the interpretation and the RNC's contest committee rules in that party's favor.
So, (1) Right now it's winner take all, (2) It's potentially possible that at some point the way the delegates will be allocated is overturned.
But again: (1) That's not the CURRENT rule, and (2) If there was a change, it wouldn't happen until the August convention.
"The Florida state party submitted a plan to the RNC that included Winner Take All delegate allocation," an RNC official told First Read "They lost 50 percent of their delegates because they submitted a WTA plan before the stated April 1st rule date. The only way for Florida's delegate allocation to change from winner take all at this point is for a resident of Florida to bring a contest to the RNC meeting in Tampa this summer and the contest committee will review it. Just because a contest is brought to the committee doesn't mean the committee will rule in their favor."
To better understand this, let's get into the details:
Florida violated two clauses within one rule (Rule 15b).
1. Going too early (before March 6), and
2. Submitting a plan for a winner-take-all contest even though no state that goes before April 1 should be winner-take-all.
The reason Florida was allowed to continue to have a winner-take-all contest is, because, according to the RNC's interpretation of the enforcement rule (16a), Florida only violated one rule (two clauses within the same rule, but still one rule). 16a talks about what happens if a state violates 15b, not two portions of 15b, according to their interpretation.
"It's a technicality, but, technically, it's one rule they broke -- not two separate ones," another RNC official said.
Again, it's POSSIBLE that the contest committee takes up a challenge, and it's possible that they would then revert to making Florida's allocation proportional. But it is incorrect to say that "currently" the rule IS proportional. It is winner take all.
RULE NO. 15
Election, Selection, Allocation, or Binding of
Delegates and Alternate Delegates
(b) Timing.* (Revised language was adopted
by the Republican National Committee on August 6,
2010)
(1) No primary, caucus, or
convention to elect, select, allocate, or bind delegates to
the national convention shall occur prior to the first
Tuesday in March in the year in which a national
convention is held. Except Iowa, New Hampshire,
South Carolina, and Nevada may begin their processes
at any time on or after February 1 in the year in which a
national convention is held and shall not be subject to
the provisions of paragraph (b)(2) of this rule.
(2) Any presidential primary,
caucus, convention, or other meeting held for the
purpose of selecting delegates to the national
convention which occurs prior to the first day of April
in the year in which the national convention is held,
shall provide for the allocation of delegates on a
proportional basis.
RULE NO. 16
Enforcement of Rules
(a) If any state or state Republican Party
violates The Rules of the Republican Party relating to
the timing of the election or selection process with the
result that any delegate from that state to the national
convention is bound by statute or rule to vote for a
presidential nominee selected or determined before the
first day of the month in which that state is authorized
by Rule No. 15(b) to vote for a presidential candidate
and/or elect, select, allocate, or bind delegates or
alternate delegates to the national convention, the
number of delegates to the national convention from
that state shall be reduced by fifty percent (50%), and
the corresponding alternate delegates also shall be
reduced by the same percentage. Any sum presenting a
fraction shall be increased to the next whole number.
No delegation shall be reduced to less than two (2)
delegates and a corresponding number of alternates.
Leave a Comment:
Leave it to FL to confuse things...
They've had 12 years to get their act together & they still can't git er done!
One things for certain, they will screw around until the GNOP establishment obtains the desired results!
Yea , but they can take advantage of Obama's food stamp enhancement program .....
Big Ben,
Respectfully, do you know anyone who has had to apply for food stamps? And how very little they actually get? I have known people laid off with families. They had no choice but to apply for food stamps. A family of four got $167.00/month in food stamps.
Please think before making blanket statements about those in need.
Everyone has needs ...phine.....few exceptions actually..
But Obama's lack of economics is choking us all....
Ooops another blanket....
sarcasm I love it
LOL Feisty, if there is a way they'll find, especially in the GOP. wanna bet someone will now do this? But not for $10K just a bag of popcorn...the carmel kind
GM,
No offense to you & your fellow FL residents.
But, seriously WHAT is it with your state when it comes to election rules & results?
Yeah, Florida's a mess.
I wonder how Illinois is doing these days? Ooh, not good. Credit downgrade and billions in debt, and they are not paying their bills. My.
Might be time to raise taxes again. Need to get to that socialist Utopia of fairness the Libs keep talking about.
Yeah, Florida is a Mess! 16(maybe 20) consectutive years of Republican Govenors & at least that long of a Republican State Legislature & they wonder why they still have 9.9% UnEmployment.
Crawling up into a Womens Vagina & planting a Flag, will NEVER reduce UnEmployment.
Occupy SoggyBottom!
JAS1 -- Many Republican governors across the Country are raising taxes as well. Are you suggesting they are socialists too? Was Reagan? We know he raised taxes several times.
At least all Floridians are smart enough not to give Obama a single vote today....I hope the trend continues...
New abortion technique from Planned Parenthood? Their technology is on the cutting edge.
Governors of Florida since 1979:
Bob Graham (D) 1979 -1987
Bob Martinez (R) 1987 -1991
Lawton Chiles (D) 1991 - 1998
Jeb Bush (R) 1998 - 2007
Charlie Crist (R) 2007 - 2011
Rick Scott (GOP/TP) 2011 - present
I'll guess Bob Graham was the best.....just my guess.....phine....
Any plans to re-call Scott?
JoJo ... I posted this yesterday as a joke response to a fellow poster, but now I re-post it as a condemnation of you
by Charles Bukowski
"beware the average man the average woman
beware their love, their love is average
seeks average
but there is genius in their hatred
there is enough genius in their hatred to kill you
to kill anybody
not wanting solitude
not understanding solitude
they will attempt to destroy anything
that differs from their own
not being able to create art
they will not understand art
they will consider their failure as creators
only as a failure of the world"
Job1,
Florida does not have a law allowing for recalls. We really wish we did. Even the tea party of Florida is disgusted with him.
Big Ben,
I wasn't crazy about Martinez and I really, really dislike Scott. But the rest, for the most part, were good for my state. Bob Graham was popular to go from the governor's seat to the Senate, where he did a good job for us.
I'm heading to Key Largo next week....going to be fun.....
I love Florida.....river riding in inner tubes through the wilderness in central northern Florida for hours , is a blast...
So much to do there....to have a great time....
You libs and your penchant for recalls is really sad.
Even here in Michigan, where even Backhouse thinks things are getting better, their is a move to recall Rick Snyder.
Elections have consequences, so I have been told.
No sooner have the Dems lost an election that they are printing out the recall petitions.
Deal with it and change it the way the system was set up to change it. Vote in the next election.
Good Lord, you people need to stop whining!
WCA,
As I pointed out in my post, even the Republicans in the state are fed up with Rick Scott. We realize that we do not have a recall in this state and are trying to work around him (both sides of the aisle are). Rick Scott is the most unpopular governor in the country. There are good reasons for that.
Big Ben,
Tubing is something we love to do too! One of our favorite runs is the Ichetucknee River. The other is Blue Springs.
Good day WCA ... and the righties calls for the impeachment of Obama are in that case equally sad. You clean up your side first and then complain.
I went last year.....I also rode , what I thought was called , or I call it the Ichnetucknee...I guess I've been saying it wrong...
I have more fun in Florida , than anywhere else I go....
Best diving water in the keys...than anywhere else in the country...also
BigBen ... Rouge River just outside of Montreal in the spring if you want to try the wild side. Or you could surf the rapids on the St. Lawrence in Montreal and stay in the same spot for hours.
Hey..ideologyspoilstheview...good to see you again.....
I can't take those rough rides ..
I'm getting lazy , I guess...
Ideology,
Is that white water rafting there? The hubby and his brother love doing that. Usually go to West (by God) Virginia in the spring. They might like to try a different venue.
Big Ben,
I love the diving in the keys, too. I usually go to Marathon or Islamorada. And you say Ichetucknee like this: Itch a tuck knee.
Itch a tuck knee.......my knee is a touch itchy........thanks phine....
I'm going to look up that Rouge River ride though....
Still may not be for me...
Yes it is Phine, I'll send you a youtube video link.
ideo, I can't remember the last time someone wasn't calling for the impeachment of a sitting President. Their are plenty of whacko's on both sides. (Maybe GHW Bush?)
But this obsession of the left to undo the 2010 elections with costly, painful recalls is just ridiculous.
Just look at Job1's comment. Job1 obviously knows nothing about Florida, but since it is a Republican Governor, let's recall him.
It's no longer just the whacko's on the left (although I think Job1 may qualify for that) it is the mainstream left.
As others say around here, pull up the big boy pants and deal with it.
Thanks, Ideology. BTW, how's the shopping around there? My sister-in-law and I prefer that to the rafting.....
Big Ben,
We have a lot of Indian names for towns and rivers around here. Just let me know and I will help!:)
WCA,
While I normally would agree with the idea that you have to accept election results, you really should have to put up with Rick Scott for a while. He would try the patience of a saint!
Thanks phine....
You live in an amazing state.....ecologically .....
You can walk on your west coast beaches and find shark teeth......how cool....sand dollars...
Great fishing....
Best beaches.....
Nice winter weather.....to warm your bones....
Everyone should try your river rides sometime in their life.....5.6....7...hour drift down river through the wilderness....how cool..
phine, I put up with Jennifer Granholm for 8 years.
I have done my time!
Phine, shopping is excellent but you will have to save your receipts to get the 15% sales tax back.
WCA,
When your own party would like to see you go, you know you are in deep crap! One afternoon, I will have to tell you some of the things Rick has tried to play here. It would not please you. Heck, as I have said, it pleases no one. And it doesn't have to do with taxes and budget cuts! (or unions)
To have an impeachment, you have to have committed crimes in misdemeanors. Obama hasn't done either. He's just an incompetent president.
Just keep throwing those strawman arguments up ideo. Very entertaining, and also, like you say, sad.
A recall election in California gave us Arnold. Now, I am a fan of that big gallumph when he is on the silver screen but as governor of California? Ohhhh, c'mon. My state needs better.
I know there are those here who object but recall elections are just too much democracy. Elections are terrifically expensive and disruptive. The electorate needs to vote smarter during scheduled elections.
joanna,
I have heard and read of people on the right talking about impeachment. Maybe you should direct your comments to some of your fellow conservatives regarding what is involved in the impeachment of a president.
Mark,
I actually agree with you on that. We get what we voted for. I was just pulling at my friend WCA. He was right, but I can't help but tease him a little, now and then.
Gotta name, or two?
Maybe you should knock off the innuendo.
Grover Norquist for one.
And I suggest a little civility towards others who disagree with you. I simply made a suggestion. You could always try to get a point across without being ugly.
Oh, please, the hypocrisy is insane. Here in CA it was REPUBLICANS who staged a recall. It always does come back to bite you in the ass. Quitcherbitchen.
Grover is wrong.
Sorry if I hurt your touchy feelings, but I do remember your first insulting and ugly response to me, and you did indicate you had me on Ignore. With that in mind, I suggest you re-evaluate your position.
JoJo, just one of 6.2 million hits on google:
www.impeachobamacampaign.com/
jojo,
I had taken you off (as a matter of fact, I took everyone off ignore, not that I had many) ignore. If you wish me to place you back on there, why I will be happy to accommodate you.
That's up to you sweetie. I don't have you or anyone else on Ignore, I mostly scroll by your one sentence posts, there really isn't much to them.
Hey look, I found a website that says flying saucers are real: http://www.ufodigest.com/news/0608/fsar.html
You really need to try harder ideo.
A one sentence post for JoJo, no inuendo, just upuendo.
You really need to try harder ideo. I suggest you try something hard, it might put a smile to your posts.
Got to keep it simple for you and phine. Else you get confused.
...dumb.
Well they might as well just make sub points to all Rules. So in other words, there is just Rule # 1 and then everthing else can be presented A - Z and then any State can only break 1 rule. Voila!
We can call it the "All States Technically Really Are Only Breaking 1 Rule GOP Primary States Plan"
I'd be willing to bet that someone will challenge this unless they are bought off by being offered a position by whichever candidate gets the nod. Of course we all know that is Romney, and the sore loser is going to be Gingrich, but let the parties remain nameless just for sake of argument.
I suppose they are still using the butterfly (hanging chad) ballots too. I know things move slowly in large groups and by governments but this seems a tad too slow. Didn't anyone anticipate something like this might happen? I only hope Florida Democrats have it more together than Republicans do.
The FLORIDIANS are to HUMID in the BRAIN. They are BRAINWASHED into believing any DEVIL that crosses their state.
What sponge-brains !!!
While we like to welcome anyone coming to visit our beautiful state, I do believe you are the exception, Alain.
Florida is one of the greatest and best playground states in the country.....Alain....foolish comment...
In DeFlandre's head the poppies grow ...
"Ahhh, poppies" (Wicked witch of the west in the Wizard of Oz)
DeFlandre is a Walloon name from Belgium ... it means from Flanders
phine,
Nice comeback to a ridiculous assertion. I empathize, Californians put up with shovel-fulls of hackneyed nonsense tossed in our direction.
I wish our primary was relevant.
Mark,
After the nonsense of the past 10 days, I would gladly change places with you!
Ideology,
You are a constant wonder to me in the facts that you can come up with. Sir, I stand in awe.
President-Elect Gore did win Florida. The problem was the Gore votes were not counted and the Supreme Court appointed Mr. Bush. (Butterfly Ballots)
For the first time in American History, the elected President did not serve and we got Mr. Bush, and we all see the results. Pretty sad.
wrong, interesting Gore was a sore loser
Gore won by over 6000 intended votes that never got counted, and that is a fact.
For God's Sake Job1. Let it go.
Were you even old enough to vote in 2000?
"Gore was doomed" with any recounts
"The only way how delegates...." wtf over?
Recent poles show that Newt will get every vote from all of the residence of the moon...
The comments sums up the stupidity of how we elect a president - I'm discounting the idiotic remarks above that have no reference to the given article.
To summarize, it may or may not be until or close to the convention that Florida's primary election is tallied.
Other comments are at best inane.
I think the Florida primaries is an example of a need to change the entire process.
Why does everyone still believe that the peoples voice matters? They just keep all of this trash talk going trying to distract us while they are setting everything up for the next person in line to continue the job they want done. And obviously it is Romney. The Media keeps pushing him down our throat. Didn't the Iowa debacle tell us anything?
I think Florida felt they didn't want to be left out in the cold when they saw the field of Republicans that were running. They wanted the money and it worked out well for them. Say thank you to Mr. Romney and Newt Phine they came ready to battle and spent a whole lot of dollars hahahahaha.
Some say Newt is real up to date on History. Facts dont support that info. Bashing the Liberal news media and reporters is a disaster for any politician. Did Newt forget what happened to Nixon ? Hilary? BUT WAIT, The repubs LOVE the Liberal news media when it discloses bad news on Dems, Ask Clinton. John Edwards. Thats just a few examples. For an old experienced politician Like NEWT to bash the Liberaal news media was plain stupid. Didnt his ex wife do the same BS that Newt has been doing for years, MAKING MONEY from Liberal news reporters and the media. The news media didnt create his EX wife or anything else Newt doesnt want reported.Newts problems cant be blamed on the MEDIA, Same as Bill CLinton. Its their inability to control their sex life. So stop bashing the NEWS MEDIA,How else would we know what the un employment rate is. Who laid of 1000 people, What comapny moved to China? Etc etc. Thank God for the LIBERAL news media, How else would I know Barney Franks is Gay ? Think on that my repub friends that JUST HATE the Liberal news media.
I have figured out why they hate the news media. Because they say something and the media replays it. It is hard to deny what you said when it is on tape. Although they do argue sometimes that is might be doctored. I think it is funny that they would think someone would try to doctor live stuff although it has been done by them when they deleted frames to make it look like Obama was checking women out.Or they tried to deny the headstomping and make it shoulder stomping. Remember? But then again when some played the real tape they were busted and they just can't handle that. The best tapes actually are the ones of them running, trying to escape the media when they know they will be questioned. Wouldn't you think they would want to be questioned? To get their message out? Well no. They do that after they get elected and vote to obstruct. But aren't people catching on to that too?
Jeesuz! These people are really inept. Thanks for giving Nuke another opening.
Yes the republicans are trying to imitate what happened with the Democrats last time. But duh! Hillary lost. They seem to have not noticed that. I use to hunt mushrooms a lot. And as soon as someone found one everyone would rush over. The problem with that is in that spot those mushrooms were already picked. You needed to explore other territory. The republicans are repeating the mantra like anyone who won SC since 1980 has been the nominee so Gingrich just had to win to be the nominee. See what I mean? Hint. Obama won because he didn't do the status quo he went another route. Just like now they are sizing up everything the republicans are doing. Kinda like watching the other team play a sport team so you can use their tactics against them. Meanwhile back at the ranch with the smug republicans they think they can get all this money pouring in and that just having money to throw around wins. Did Newts 10 million from Adelman really win him anything? I guess those receiving the 10 million won somehow. Like Meg Whitman too. Republicans need to realized money works when you have a candidate that is acceptable. Newt isn't and Romney isn't either. But he needs to win for a short time to get Newt out of there.