They share a lot in common.

Who EVER could you be talking about..? lol

PS: I'm Feisty & I approve your assessment! ;o)

LoL The problem, my old friend, is that there are so many possibilities.;-)

is that there are so many possibilities.;-)

They are indeed endless... ;o)

So, Brian Williams showed lastnight How to Moderate, by asking the crowd to keep thier Applause to themselves or during Breaks. Now we have Newt Moaning & Groaning that he did'nt get the chance to Jump down Williams throat, when Williams asked aquestion that Newt was'nt Happy with. I'ma guessing that Newt feels the sameway about 1st admendment Rights when Protestors showup to ask questions, but are escorted away by Security. But i'm sure that Newt will say that when Protestors showup at Public Forums, his Campaign is Paying for that & has the Right to Escort anyone away that is in disagreement with his views. With that being the Case, then i'm sure that NBC also had the Authority to Silence Any Crowd Noise that they wanted too, since they were hosting the event lastnight, & with thier Security in place, could've Escorted Out, anyone they so Pleased.

Ai'nt that Constitution Gr8!

Occupy SoggyBottom!

Feisty

You are really off your game. You been missing number one a lot lately. Wazup?

SO here t'is - none of it from wages - all profits at low tax rates:

"Mitt Romney offered a partial snapshot of his vast personal fortune late Monday, disclosing income of $21.7 million in 2010 and $20.9 million last year — virtually all of it profits, dividends or interest from investments.

None came from wages, the primary source of income for most Americans. Instead, Romney and his wife, Ann, collected millions in capital gains from a profusion of investments, as well as stock dividends and interest payments."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2012/01/23/gIQAj5bUMQ_story.html?hpid=z1

And how many jobs do you suppose Mitt created with that big tax advantage?

I suppose zero. He doesn't even employ household help, to hear him tell it.

He builds nothing, he creates nothing. He just pushes his money around.

He had some folks doing his lawn and then fired them when he started Runnin.

Dude got a scruffy lawn now.

Now Anna Molly---Mitt is going to create a lot of jobs when he tears down the $12 million ocean front mansion in California to build a larger house to accommodate his grandchildren (in his mind the "Western White House").

In my view, one of the really odd moments in last night's debate was the discussion between Romney and Gingrich about Romney's approximate 15% tax rate. Gingrich mentioned his flat tax plan would mean everyone paid what Mitt did; Mitt asked Newt what his capital gains rate would be and then said that means I wouldn't pay any taxes to which Newt replied, that's fine as long as you're creating jobs. For one thing, Newt missed an opportunity to remind viewers that Romney's tax plan also eliminates capital gains favoring himself to pay 0% but listening to these two wealthy men quibble over a 15% tax rate on multi-millions and then discuss that getting rid of capital gains so they can pay zero taxes was bizarre.

Jody,

We simple, lesser-spotted non-affluent viewers:

Are being Acculturated or Acclimatised to a very, very incredibly skewed tax plan being hatched in their Brain Department.

Okay, for jobs created by Mitt, so far we've got the highly paid lawn workers that he hired through that lawn service -- if only we could find them now, as they probably all had to flee after the last quarterly unemployment report was issued -- and we've got the people rebuilding his ocean-front mansion in La Jolla.

As for those workers, I assume they already have jobs. High-end housing -- at that end, anyway -- is not suffering a recession. But I still wonder how many people that will employ versus the number of jobs that would be created if you used $12 million to build houses at $250,000 apiece.

For those who are counting, that's 48 houses. 48 refrigerators. 48 garage door openers, 48 ranges, 48 washer/dryers, 48 vacuum cleaners, 48 sofas, 48 master bedroom suites, and 48 flat screen TVs.

You do the math.

So Anna Molly, what is your response to today's WSJ article setting out that Walker's policies as opposed to those in Illinois have actually worked? I know Fiesty can defend Illinois and tell us how the Obama modeled economic policies in Illinois of a 60% increase in tax on a rising GDP actually produced lower tax revenue and no cuts in spending and a government union unfunded problem of biblical proportions. While Walker according to the article has balanced the budget without a tax increase, saved thousands of jobs at the local level and provided the needed flexibility for local governments to balance their budgets. I know you are a big supporter of state government unions and their need for collective bargaining rights (even though fed union employees dont have them) and think the crooked alliance with the democratic party is a good one even if it bankrupts all the blue states, but it is an interesting contrast when Wisconsin's budget is balanced, no tax increase the smallest property tax increase in 30 years while here in Illinois, I just want to move to Wisconsin to avoid state bankruptcy.

Backhouse, so true. Couldn't help wondering last night if people bothered to think about what they heard during that exchange or if it went right over their heads.

Anna Molly, well done.

AM---I think you are confusing your out-of-touch millionnaire Republicans----you mean Mitt, don't you?

How great for Newt that his $3 million annual income seems like chump change next to Romney's $24 million.

Okay, for jobs created by Mitt,

Shame Willard can't hire someone to do his laundry...

There he was, the poor guy, slaving away over the Maytag on primary day!

http://www.mediaite.com/online/caption-contest-mitt-romney-does-his-own-laundry-edition/attachment/ajtltflcqaaqrvd/

My Super Pac of choice is Americans for a Better Tomorrow.

You been missing number one a lot lately. Wazup?

LOL!

I didn't know you cared... ;o)

Kirk --

So Anna Molly, what is your response to today's WSJ article setting out that Walker's policies as opposed to those in Illinois have actually worked?

As usual, you don't know what you're talking about. And neither does the WSJ.

First, Wisconsin LOST jobs in each of the last six months of last year. To the extent there was any positive job growth, it all occurred in the first six months -- i.e., BEFORE Walker's budget went into effect.

Second, and this is a BIG second, the chickens are about to come home to roost as to the rest of Walker's programs. In particular with regard to education, school districts were able to absorb all the cuts in Walker's budget by slashing teacher salaries and benefits, AND by using what was left of federal stimulus dollars. In other words, Walker didn't save those jobs -- President Obama saved those jobs. And STILL thousands were laid off. Or hadn't you heard? I'm willing to bet the WSJ didn't mention that dirty detail.

And it would have been more if so many experience, senior teachers hadn't chosen to retire and escape from Walkerville. Thousands of those, too. Just think how many jobs would have been lost if they hadn't all fled the sinking ship.

Because, after all, no one was willing to pay them to stay.

In any event, those stimulus dollars have now gone away, not to be renewed, thanks to Republicans in Washington. As a result, the education budgets of most school districts in this state are about to blow up completely, with no possibility of raising property taxes to cover the difference, thanks to Walker and the state legislature.

And who will Walker blame then, Kirk?

You've got it. Unions. The ones who have no bargaining rights anymore, remember?

but it is an interesting contrast when Wisconsin's budget is balanced, no tax increase the smallest property tax increase in 30 years while here in Illinois, I just want to move to Wisconsin to avoid state bankruptcy.

As I said, the chickens are about to come home to roost. I've already been hearing about it from those who know something.

You obviously don't.

And you shouldn't believe everything that Rupert Murdoch chooses to tell you.

Shame Willard can't hire someone to do his laundry...

I wonder what stain remover Willard uses on his magic underwear...

I'm sure he washes everything in Willite.

Oh I don't know AM and Steeler - but how about this. Can either of you two tell us why the legislature thought it would be a good idea to tax capital gains at the lower rate?

Now I know Steeler, our resident tax attorney can. Why I be Steeler has read the legislative history for the section.

You think it was related to their desire to stimulate investments? Huh. I wonder what would happen if they suddenly decided to ditch the capital gain rates and tax it all at regular income rates.

You all think that would positively or negatively effect job growth?

And hey there AM - Wisconsin has it's problems. but how about that shout out from Moodys? Sure was a lot better than poor Illinois and Conn, right?

Aw, well - always fun when they raise taxes [a whoopin 2/3 in Feisty's great state] but still find themselves in financial melt down.

Off the immediate topic, but have to ask:

The Repubs are going to ridicule the SOTU address after it is given.

The Repubs are going to ridicule the SOTU address before it is given.

The Repubs call the President the 'Divider-In-Chief'?

Do I have that right???

Oh, and after seeing the latest Noot tantrum, I have to say that one poster has his moniker exactly right:

Newt IS a Pig.

We've had this discussion before, Spanky. In fact there's a guy on Al's show right now who wrote a book about the two separate tax systems in this country, which are separate and unequal.

In short, the tax system has been rigged over a series of years, by the rich, and for the sole benefit of the rich.

I don't care what happens to job growth if Romney has to pay more in taxes because all of my money is out of the market. But I would like YOU to point to the jobs that have been created by Romney's method of earning income.

And I'm not talking about Staples because those jobs were created with heavy reliance on government assistance, which was bought with cronyism and campaign contributions.

I'm talking about pure job creation that can be attributed to Romney's living off his investments.

You can't, and you know it.

It seems beyond dispute that the current system HAS negatively impacted the job market. All the job gains of the Bush administration -- which were always ephemeral, anyway -- were dissipated beginning at the end of 2007. And, according to your side at least, the job market is STILL not all that great, which is especially ironic, given that we've been working under this tax system for many years now.

So, Mitt pays hardly any taxes. And exactly where are the jobs, Spanky?

I know where they are. I predicted this many years ago, and I am not surprised by the meltdown we've seen. You can't keep strangling the beast and expect it not to die.

The Moody's "shout-out" probably has as much merit as S&P's downgrade of the US. No one does research anymore, Spanky.

Anna Molly, your right I dont know Wisconsin but I do know Illinois and I know I would rather be in Wisconsin's fiscal condition than Illinois'. It has nothing to do with believing Rubert as your comment really applies across the board to all media as its all biased. I have no problem keeping an open mind regarding Wisconsin and Walker but I do think its helpful to put things in balance. Just as I am opposed to most of Obama's economic policies, I dont claim that he is 100% wrong and will give him credit where its due. For me to understand your points on Walker first I would have to understand whether the job losses were going to happen anyway sort of like the job losses under Obama that happened as a result of the Bush economy in 09. I doubt very much that a governor can impact the states gdp in their first year in office before their budget is even allowed to take effect no different than you can blame Obama for 09 his first year in office right?

You have to at least say that providing local community's bargaining flexibility has saved jobs and money. You might not think its worth it but its clearly allows jobs to be saved. Lets say Walker's plan wasnt approved, was Wisconsin planning on getting federal stimulus money forever or raising taxes to fund the obvious shortfalls or were they going to have to lay off thousands of government workers? If you say raise taxes, then you just start to fall into the Illinois economic problems so making static comparisons you well know dont necessarily support your conclusions.

Your right if Walker's plan fails he has no one to blame but himself. What is true is that the previous policies were not working so not sure why you arent willing to give these the same opportunity you are giving Obama's to work. Again, I am not sure why state government unions employees need collective bargaining rights but no one ever answers that question or the alliance with the state democratic parties.

What is really a shame is that no one is willing to budge an inch. You think anyone that wants rational spending and benefit discussions is an elitest which isnt true while you are unwilling to admit we even have a state government union problem both state and nationwide. Illinois proves the national point. I would be willing to bet that the vast majority of working wealthy or super wealthy are willing to pay more tax under a much simpler fair system if expense side of the equation was addressed. See what happens in Illinois when that promise is made but not kept. A 60% increase in tax, no decrease in spending, credit downgrades, economic disaster just down the corner.

And ain't that the truth? Sigh. ;-)

I wouldn't mind the constant Reagan name dropping if Reagan were representative of the politics today's GOP pushes. But the fact is that Ronald Reagan would not be welcome in today's GOP. He raised taxes many times, including on Capital Gains. He "negotiated" on all manner of things, and with Democrats!

The same thing goes towards wingnuts constant bible thumping. It is clear that as far as policy goes, Republicans care far more about the teachings of the devout atheist Ayn Rand than the teachings of Jesus Christ.

The Republicans are all lucky that Reagan can't come back and slap them all down.

nisl

You are one sharp dude.

I've been trying all day to articulate what it is that struck me as surreal about last night's debate. The Republicans just sound bankrupt. The four candidates up there looked like four aspects of today's Party: the filthy rich, out of touch with real people element, the quasi intellectual segment, the paranoid "Iran is the new Iraq!"part and the airy, Libertarian "just leave me alone, if you'd listened to me we'd have been fine" branch. Four aspects of one, losing whole.

I'm surprised people haven't been commenting today about how out dated Gingrich made himself sound last night, going on and on about Reagan.

Newt loves comparing himself to Reagan but he sadly bears a closer resemblance to Nixon. Take a moment to read about Nixon and the Franklin Society. It fueled the man's entire political vein and, sadly as a result, the entire political vein of the current Republican party.

The Republicans: "The Party of Lincoln" has become "The Party of Nixon"

Thanks Amy, right back at ya.

As to the Republicans being ideologically bankrupt, well, yeah, of course they are. What is the GOP supposed to stand for?

Small Government? They lost the right to pretend they are for small government with their Medicare Part D vote.

Government out of our bedrooms? No, they are all for government intervention in most every aspect of our lives. They've gotten so far to the right some of them feel comfortable discussing doing away with contraception. Contraception? Really?

I can't think of a single core tenant of the traditional Republican Party that the current Republican Party can make any credible claim towards. They have sold themselves out.

About the only thing the Republican party of today and the Republican party of 30 years ago have in common is racial animus. And given America's shifting demographics that is going to start hurting the GOP as much as it used to help them.

What's even more pathetic with Newt's Reagan romance is that Ronald Reagan would be the Jon Huntsman on the debate stage this year; he would be sent home quickly because he wasn't conservative enough.

Amy,

since your "saint " ( your word) is Obama, I can say that same thing to you that you say about Reagan.

We know you are in the Obama Adoration Society.

This means that you ignore unemployment and debt and you ignore that Obama made the country more ideologically divided than it's ever been since the Civil War.

You proclaim "Obama for a better future !"........to which we respond........the past 3 years is the best indicator of what Obama will do the future. ......MORE SPEECHES (800+ and counting).

This means that you ignore unemployment

Yeah, Amy, how dare you! It took the Dubya 8 years to drive this country off the cliff, how dare Obama not have it fixed within 4? You, Amy, should take the Republicans stance on unemployment: Unemployed people are unemployed because they are lazy. You see, by adopting the Republican mindset on the unemployed you don't have to feel bad about cutting off unemployment benefits so you can lower taxes on Mitt Romney and Paris Hilton.

and debt

Yeah Amy! How dare Obama add 7 trillion through his Medicare Part D plan to the debt? How dare Obama add 4 trillion to the debt via tax cuts for Mitt Romney and Paris Hilton? How dare Obama start two wars, at least one of which was a vanity war. I tell you what Amy, if Republicans had passed Medicare Part D, huge tax cuts for Paris Hilton and Mitt Romney, and started two wars THEY WOULD HAVE MADE SURE IT WAS PAID FOR AND NOT PUT ON THE NATION'S CREDIT CARD. Oh, all those things were done by Republicans? Really? Well then Leona must be a clueless wingnut.

and you ignore that Obama made the country more ideologically divided than it's ever been since the Civil War.

Yeah Amy, how dare you let Obama make the country more ideological with his constant attempts to compromise and his never changing rational, calm responses. And how dare you let Obama inflame the right be being, and I don't know if you know this, black?

Sound bankrupt?

Unlike actually being bankrupt.

$4 billion in new debt a day, a debt at $15 Trillion and an president that is requesting another $1.2 trillion.

Well at least you all are staying focuses. Good thing Obama is out there actually cutting spending, right?

And wasn't it last year he said he'd cut the budget in 1/2? Wait, no last year was about WTF - winning the future.

How's that going - we winning? Solyndra is done, and the Volt will now come from China.

nisl - is the response to Obama is bad because he ran up the debt really - but, but, BUSH!?

It's not fixed, which is bad, but worse is it [debt] is getting much worse.

The budget this year is more than ever. Yet he has gotten no cuts and he cut taxes.

And yes, he is responsible. He's the boss.

“What looks like politics, and imagines itself to be political, will one day unmask itself as a religious movement.”
― Søren Kierkegaard

Do not disturb the prayer meeting Dangerfield.

dangerfield,

After reading the article and comments, I do believe there is a big divide in today's GOP. The question is, which side will prevail? (And it does appear a lot of the conservatives here would enjoy some of the discussions at the NR.)

Alas, no one liked my little song.

Amen, ISTV...

My favorite (and I suppose you really have to be a nerd to have a favorite Kierkegaard quote) has always been (and it is apropos to the discussion)

"People understand me so poorly that they don't even understand my complaint about them not understanding me."

S. Kierkegaard

Phine-

And it gives you a more representative perspective on what conservatives are thinking than anything you will see here too...It looks like 1968 in the Democratic party to me...

Just waiting on WCA to accuse me of being anti Danish as he will not get the humor ... bs, spell it like a Canadian ...humour

It looks like 1968 in the Democratic party to me... Steal This Convention

dangerfield,

I was thinking the same thing about the GOP and their current divide.

Ideology,

J-E-B (as dangerfield would say)

A little off topic, have you seen Dr. Z. Brezinski's new book? Heard an interview with him this morning and plan on getting it. One interesting thing he talked about was how superpowers go into decline (fall). Some of the reasons: government dysfunction and wealth disparity. The book is called "Strategic Vision"

Phine-

One sure way is to hire him to consult on foreign policy...sorry, couldn't resist...

Before reading his book, might I suggest reviewing his CV?

------------------------------------------------------------------------------

...Using this atmosphere of insecurity, Brzezinski led the United States toward a new arms buildup and the development of the Rapid Deployment Forces – policies that are both more generally associated with Ronald Reagan now. In 1980, Brzezinski planned Operation Eagle Claw, which was meant to free the hostages in Iran using the newly created Delta Force and other Special Forces units. The mission was a failure and led to Secretary Vance's resignation.

Brzezinski was criticized widely in the press and became the least popular member of Carter's administration. Edward Kennedy challenged President Carter for the 1980 Democratic nomination, and at the convention, Kennedy's delegates loudly booed Brzezinski. Hurt by internal divisions within his party and a stagnant domestic economy, Carter lost the 1980 presidential election in a landslide...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zbigniew_Brzezinski

-----------------------------------------------------------

I admit to not being a fan...

as to my J-E-B obsession...

Draft Jeb Bush
A charismatic and accomplished governor can save the Republican party.

To be sure, the Jeb scenario will need more instability in order to flourish. The likeliest path involves Gingrich's momentum carrying him through Florida; the February races in Arizona and Michigan dividing between Romney and Gingrich; Romney rebounding in March in moderate-leaning midwestern states such as Illinois and Wisconsin; Gingrich winning easily in the Deep South on Super Tuesday and Texas in early April, with Romney proving equally strong in New York and the rest of the Atlantic coastline, while states like Ohio and Indiana fail to resolve the split.

http://www.nationalreview.com/articles/288986/draft-jeb-bush-artur-davis

The drumbeat begins...

can you sing your song to it?

dangerfield,

I do believe the good doctor has mellowed and grown wiser with age. I know he is really against all these "Asian" wars, and believes it is past time to being the world's policeman.

Or, he is just trying to appeal to the masses and sell books!

And I will reset my lyrics ! lol

....and Obama's 1 billion??

No mention of Obama's super pac money??

lol

... that's Obama's socilaist billion Leona ... try to stay on track.

ideologyspoils,

That "socialist billion" (your words) will be put to good use to fight the Republicans. I understand Socialists like George Soros donate big to Obama.

Bill Ayers (terrorist) & Van Jones (communist) are rooting for Obama too. What is their slogan ?? "Go Socialism " ??

Leona, those of us who live in what you would call a socialist country laugh when you call your President a socialist.

Ideology,

She might not understand your "Danish" humor!

One can only wonder at what 'sins' Leona committed in her youth and the cross she has to bear for eternity.

The only cross I see is the one in a box adjacent to "ignoring author"...but that might just be a plus sign...;-)

re your Kierkegaard quote above ... he could well have started with "I get no respect, ..."

ISTV-

haha..exactly! He is the "Dangerfield" of philosophers...

if Romney paid his due under the law, what is your complaint?
If you want the tax system reformed, so do Republicans.

If Romney gives millions to his church and to charity, why attack him?

I defy you to find a Democrat who pays MORE of a percentage than Romney on capital gains. You think Democrats are writing checks for MORE than they owe? ( hey, Warren Buffet ! Get out your check book or shut the heck up !!!!!!!!!!!!!)

Your reading comprehension needle is stuck on zero. Taxes and lying are not the same thing, although some do both at the same time.

Romney has lied about Huckabee, McCain, Obama, Santorum, Gingrich, and himself..

You shut up.