So Don't what does that have to do with the stinky loan Obama made?

Did the Koch's cause the terms of the loan to be re-written so George Kaiser got priority over taxpayers?

What do you think about that Don't? Would you loan money to a company that sold it's only product for $6 when the same product was available elsewhere for $3?

Shoot Don't you won't even support the industry at all, right Don't?

But I bet you are all in on you support of the evil gas and oil industries, right?

The Kocks say you are welcome.

That needless disclaimer says quite a bit about the quality and leaning of the site we are viewing. The story is not even about a clean energy company, it is about defrauding the American taxpayer by giving money to a company that is destined for failure.

The disclaimer has nothing to do with why the ad is running, the story line has nothing to do with this being a "clean-energy company". It has to do with fraud. And none of these "Clean" companies can even put a dent in the business of Koch Industries anyway, so I doubt they really care of their existence. The "clean" energy cannot be be efficeintly manufactured as of yet. Do you think the ad would not be in existence if it were not a "Clean-energy Industry"? It could have been a loan to a pig farm (and might as well have been) and the ad would still be funded and run as it is about the waste of taxpayer money on projects doomed to fail.

It is just another shameless display of the liberal leanings of this website and its founders. It was not needed to be said, or germaine to the topic.

So, Mark, do you get a big ole bonus everytime you include partisan digs in your reporting? I bet you do...

ABO 2012

This story will have no legs. It's about complex things like government loans, and pay offs, and contracts, and e-mails with acronyms that are hard to understand, and Democratic fundraisers getting preferential treatment. Journalists don't like those kind of stories, especially when it's for causes they support, like "Green Energy". All these things are too complex and way above their pay grade to figure out.

It's better to talk about sex scandal stories. That's what journalists understand.

What a pointless, biased disclaimer.

It should have read "The Koch Brothers have never been found to be recipients of Dollars to Donors".

By the way, oh you of the "not so up on the scandal du jour" mentality-

It's that aspect that is causing all the scandal.

It's called ripping off the taxpayers to benefit your contributors. It has other names- fraud, theft by deception, payola. . .

Dont_carry_it_all

(Note: Koch Industries is heavily involved in the petroleum business, and thus is hardly a champion of clean-energy companies.)

Dont_carry_it_all,

Not only is the Koch's money a filthy oil stain on green technology but the Kochs committed a treasonous act and sold petrochemical to Iran.

Worst, they got duped by their own oil stained money in a survey kinda like Snot Walker. Climate change deniers get punk'd by their own Koch-paid-for study

Here's the punchline.

Well, guess what they found?

The project concluded the earth is warming, roughly one degree C over the last century or so. And that’s not all! After collecting and crunching the data, the study got results statistically identical with those produced at NOAA, NASA, CRU, and a bunch of other organizations

Guess who helped fund this? One of the Koch brothers, Charles Kochz (via the Charles G. Koch Charitable Foundation)! A bit of a red flag, but, okay.

In the press release announcing the results, Muller said, "Our biggest surprise was that the new results agreed so closely with the warming values published previously by other teams in the US and the UK." In other words, climate scientists know what they're doing after all.

(sigh)

After results from the study were partly released last week? Totally different tune:

I consider the paper fatally flawed as it now stands, and thus I recommend it be removed from publication consideration by JGR until such time that it can be reworked.

Goddam hypocrites.

http://www.eclectablog.com/2011/10/climate-change-deniers-get-pwned-by.html?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+Eclectablog

==========================================================

Ha Ha

$150,000 that is the pocket change that didn't go far for the oil stained Koch money. The earth is getting warmer.

)
Mon, 24th Oct '11 10:38 AM

All you have to do is mention Solyndra on a blog and the RWNJs flock to it like a moth to a flame.

Well this should make nojo and co. happy. Now maybe she'll apologize to Mark and team........nah, i'm guessing that would be a no on both counts.

Who would have guessed a sword has two edges?

Here's a link from the year 2000 and there's so many more. This one details record fines against Koch Industries for pollution. http://www.uswaternews.com/archives/arcrights/tkocind2.html

Son of one gun, they get to write off those fines as a cost of doing business. Don't stop now boys and girls. The Kochs are almost lily-white when it comes to complying with the law. Yes, of course, and pigs fly.

Mark in SoCal - A disclaimer stating it was funded by Americans for Prosperity will render the same conclusion.....this ad was funded by those in the petroleum business. Since when is truth biased?

For those that care about source and bias this is relevant.

Bev -- Well I certainly believe in global warming! ; )

Americans for Prosperity is Koch Industries. It is Rove is Cain.

So the oil bidness has never done research, never updated its approach to all the ways to extract from the ground, never stopped pursuing all the ways it can make the $billions?

New technologies take time, research and money. Some fail. Some don't fail. And ALL research needs funding. Rich oil companies aren't the only ones who research & pursuing research takes funding. Many future investments in new technologies will fail....Solyndra started under President Bush.

Let's hope we can one day get away from all the conniving So-and-sos in the oil bidness that want to control our country, our vote, our government, our lives, our chances of employment and education & our future.

These are the guys getting massive subsidies from the American people, while making the biggest profits in US history.........while we are recovering from a catastrophic recession.

Americans for Prosperity et al. ain't the good guys here.

Backhouse -- Great post.

These are the guys getting massive subsidies from the American people, while making the biggest profits in US history.........while we are recovering from a catastrophic recession.

Could not of said it better! Thank you.

Spanky,

You asking about the stinky loan originating with the Bush administration? You must be hallucinating if anything but a question regarding a venue for a campaign event was being solidified or changed according to whatever the department loaning the money stated. A bad venue is hardly Obama's fault. If that is what you guys want to use as a sticking point then lets go back to 2000 and start keeping score like that with the Bush and Cheney administrations. Lots and lots and lots of stuff to keep Issa busy for years and years. We can even add Issa to the list of loan abusers in exchange for campaign cash. Let the games begin. I'm in!

AnaBanana,

What I read was the loan was asked for during the Bush administration, without approval. The current administration is accountable for funding this company.

When ever the Kochs are mentioned, why do the liberal lefts go crazy, changing the topic from the shame of the Obama loans to shame on those evil oil guys?

Read and learn

http://www.factcheck.org/2011/10/obamas-solyndra-problem/

Oh- Solyndra was turned DOWN in early January, 2009. Obama rammed it through- to repay George Kaiser for his campaign contributions.

Try to remember that this is a man who lied about his own dying mother. He will stoop to anything.

Hahahaha, the right-wing is going bonkers over this because the campaign bus is like the bus McCain used and the GOP/TP candidate will use, and the $16 muffins didn't really cost $16, and Halloween isn't detrimental to children other than a sugar high...

Too bad Perry has dropped like a painted rock in the primary. If you think the Koch brother's ad about Solyndra is something, could you imagine the one that would have aired about Perry's "jobs plan" to drill, baby, drill?

If conservatives are really concerned about dependence from foreign oil, we need to do a NASA-style program to develop wind, solar, bio fuels, expand electricity and even natural gas. We need way more investment in making these alternative and cleaner sources of energy successful--NOT drilling more oil that would be sold on the global market thereby lining the pockets of Big Oil and creating a measly amount of jobs, not to mention further polluting the Earth.

Also, alternative energy is a better way to create jobs. Currently we are losing wind turbine business to China, bio fuel to Brazil, and on and on. The concept of Solyndra is correct, the company itself not so much. But the right-wingers will throw the baby out with the bath water like they always do.

So how about it? What do you right-wingers think of Perry's "job plan?" Come on, let's hear it.

As I recall from High School history, a similar thing happened near the turn of the century. The suppliers of natural gas objected strenuously to Edison wiring a portion of New York City for electricity. We all know how that turned out.

The Koch brothers are heavily invested in a 20th century type of energy production that has proved to them to be a cash cow. It is little wonder that they will do anything to keep the oil flowing and stop competing technologies.

However it is in America's interest to invest in new and cleaner forms of energy production for the health of our citizens and in order to be competitive on the world stage. I see nothing wrong with government assisting potential new technologies as long as it is above board. Many will fail, some will succeed, but in today's climate the far right has simply made the issue a political football.

I think that man kind need to reach for higher goals rather than simply obtaining outlandish financial gains as if playing some type of giant monopoly game.

Dozens of GOP representatives sent letters asking for Clean Energy Grants and subsidized loans.

"'"A report showing 62 Republicans filing letters requesting money from the Department of Energy for a range of clean energy programs, from the loan subsidy program tapped by Solyndra to other related programs disbursed by the agency. Many of the following lawmakers have since either taken transparently political votes to cut clean energy programs or have denounced all clean energy grants as fraudulent:

Sen. Jeff Sessions (R-AL) sent a letter to the Energy Secretary Steven Chu requesting a Renewable Energy Loan Guarantee from the U.S. Department of Energy for the company Coskata Inc. to establish a cellulosic ethanol plant in Alabama. Sessions wrote that the plant would "assist our nation in advancing our energy security and reducing greenhouse gases" and that renewable energy would "reduce environmental pollutants that threaten our natural resources." The facility, Sessions said, would provide "as many as 750 jobs through the region of its proposed rural site." The letter was sent Feb. 5, 2009.'

The letter from Sen Sessions (R-Alabama) above, is just one example of letters sent from GOP congressionals. We all know that green energy technologies are the future. Whichever country captures those - wins the 21st century. Does GOP care about the future of America? New techs don't arrive by magic. It takes research and investment and risk.

http://thinkprogress.org/report/clean-energy-cons/

btw:

View a copy of Sessions' letter asking for a taxpayer subsidized clean energy loan here. The company was later awarded with a $250 million loan guarantee from a clean energy program offered by the Department of Agriculture. The press release from Coskata Inc. thanks Sen. Sessions for his support.

[Americans for Prosperity TV ad hits Obama on Solyndra]

Did Spanky, Mixed Bag, NoJoBloMo, and Smiffy "star" in the ad?

BUUUSSHHHHH. Right Feisty.

'Cept of course BUUUUSSHHH cancelled the loan.

But say, any BUUUSSHHH involvement in EnerDel, Beacon Power, or Sun Power?

Hey are you libbies excited about Corzine going to the can? Ah, Corzine. It was just two months ago he attended all those secret meeting in the White House, was part of Obama's campaign, and ...wait for it... was touted as

"our guy on Wall Street"

That's Obama's guy, who just happens to have shamed his regulators and 'lost $700 million of investor money.

Oh and Feisty - why did Kaiser, another big Obama supporter get priority over the tax payers in the loans?

It was BUUUSSSHHHH's idea, right?

Spanky -- I could argue that Bush screwed up there thus allowing China to take the ball and run! But I won't. : ) Yes, the program has had the same type of problems all programs this size encounter. I bet the total loss is nothing compared to other programs that continue to enjoy government guarantees and subsidies. I wonder if there is data on all programs and business recipients of subsidies showing winners and losers? I bet the list is a few miles long counselor.

--The DNC should be up with a counter ad tomorrow pointing out JUST THAT

Fiesty that would be a great ad in my opinion, lol.

If the right wants to run a smear campaign we better be prepared to get 'dirty' ourselves!!!

and this is a "smear" and "dirty" how exactly?

Corzine did for MF Global what he did for New Jersey and what Obama has done for America

Gotta love those demmies

Don't - real simple: do you have solar panels on your house? China is a separate country. We cannot compete with their manufacturing - a lesson learned by Solyndra.

Beside global warming is over - the BEST study confirmed no warming in last 15 years. Al Gore did it!

A bad government program, running at a loss - like Social Security?

Don't the government is terrible a picking winners and losers. In fact it is bad at everything it does.

Are you in favor of the loan pay back priority to Kaiser, a Obama supporter?

Ain't no defense for that one Don't.

There appears to be a vast divergence of what constitutes the "High Road" If the umpire calls a foul ball on the liberal team, then the ump is blind and needs glasses.....However, the liberal team will get out the microscope, the slide rule, and a laser level to determine if the ball thown by the conservative side was technically in the strike zone.

Great idea Tom.

So let's hear it - how you all going to kick the Koch?

Were they behind Solyndra, SunPower, EnerDel or Beacon?

At what point do you libbie cheerleaders have to admit that these where bad loans to begin with and made worse through crony capitalism?

Give us some ideas on how you all plan to fight back. Also, since you are tax payers tell us if and why you think these loans were ever a good idea.

Ok to give millions to companies that are destined to fail?

Wait, I get it, to you the failures were unexpected right?

Hey Spanky, Maybe he was just trying to bail out the Waltons, the largest of the investors in Solyndra.

How about this little tid bit Spanky?

You’d never know from the media coverage that:

1. The Bush team tried to conditionally approve the Solyndra loan just
   before President Obama took office.
2. The company’s backers included private investors who had
   diverse political interests.
3. The loan comprises just 1.3% of DOE’s overall loan portfolio. To date,
   Solyndra is the only loan that’s known to be troubled.

Because one of the Solyndra investors, Argonaut Venture Capital, is funded by
George Kaiser — a man who donated money to the Obama campaign — the loan
guarantee has been attacked as being political in nature. What critics don’t
mention is that one of the earliest and largest investors, Madrone Capital
Partners, is funded by the family that started Wal-Mart, the Waltons. The
Waltons have donated millions of dollars to Republican candidates over
the years.

Source: Clean Technica (http://s.tt/13giD)

Devie - really. The loan was cancelled by Bush. It is a fact. Look at the e mails to the Obama admin by Solyndra.

The biggest investor, and the one that got priority was George Kaiser - Obama's man.

Your point #3 is stupid. There are several - Beacon, SunPower, EnerDel, and others.

Just be patient grasshopper. Or you coould go to another website.

Spanky, Speaking of stupid that was a direct quote. I didn't write it.

Just where exactly did you go to Law School? Grenada? Oral Roberts?

Oh I see devie - if it's a direct qoute it must be true.

Or is it that you actually believe it?

Either way, just stupid. Beacon is a Billion. Now I know you libbies are not strong in math, but that might effect the percentage, eh devie?

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL

(Note: Koch Industries is heavily involved in the petroleum business, and thus is hardly a champion of clean-energy companies.)

The DNC should be up with a counter ad tomorrow pointing out JUST THAT & the FACT this whole thing started under 'W'!

Come on libbies - we have to fight fire with fire!

Indeed we can and will do more.

Attach watch. com

Fight the smears& lies.

http://my.barackobama.com/page/s/join-attack-wire-today

Feisty, did you get my note I left you in FT? I'll call you before 9:00 PM tonight.

I'll call you before 9:00 PM tonight.

Thanks Bev! I'll be waiting!

Spanky-

Don't - real simple: do you have solar panels on your house? China is a separate country. We cannot compete with their manufacturing - a lesson learned by Solyndra.

Spanky- Whenever I read your comments you never fail my expectations. I know you are hypocritical, even more so now, what happened to risk taking; you so advocate?

Spank-er, when I want to know what the intellectually deficient have to say, I always turn to your posts. They are very much a source of amusement.

Thank you very much

"Oh I see devie - if it's a direct qoute it must be true.'

Like "I read it in the paper", right, 'counselor'?

Oh I see devie - if it's a direct qoute it must be true.

Ah no, that is not what was inferred Spin Meister. As usual you took my posted quote and link and apparently thought I wrote it. Then you attack the source and blame me for taking the writer at his word. Why don't you go to that site and read the post. It's quite informative and short. Or would that just cloud your wild speculations with facts. Just sayin'.

You mean erase jobs right Amy.

All this $ wasted.

How is this a failure of corporate america Amy?

This is pure venture socialism.

So Amy, what have you done to save the planet? Got solar? A hybrid?

You sure are not helping Amy. Maybe you can kick in some extra taxes this year. You know to 'save the planet.'

Amy,

What we learn is that BHO is as irresponsible with our money as we assume he is. That instead of using the money from Stimulus 1 that could have been used to create jobs, he prefers to dump it into this stinking mess of a company and get no benefit.

I certainly dont get that he was trying to create jobs by loaning money to a comany that was all but ensured to fail and be out of business in a year.

Corporate America didnt fail the nation. BHO failed the nation.

ABO 2012

President Obama's contributions to the environment and American industry are merely collateral damage...unintentional, completely serendipitous to his purpose which was to solidify his financial base, reward large contributors, and give lip service to getting American back on track via green energy industry. Solar panels have been around for a long time-at least 30-40 years that I can recall....and I am sure that there are other companies out there that produce them, and possibly have more experience at running such a business. Yet they didn't receive of the government largesse.

Tom?

Bush's Solyndra - please explain. Oh wait, like the current tax rates are 'Bush's" as well, right? Obama takes no responsibility at all.

Corzine - Obama's "Wall Street Guy" who just should the utter failure of Obama's regulators.

Not a story though, right? Dodd-Frank is that worthless?

Gosh Tom, if they trace some of that 'lost' $700 million to Obama's campaign, still just a squirrel?

Oh and the allegations against Cain - totally not a squirrel, right Tom?

I don't suppose you care to define "squirrel?'

Yeah, I didn't think so.

You want to talk about wasted money? One trillion on weapons since 9/11.

The cost of the wars in 8 years under Bush was $760 billion. Obama is borrowing more than twice that amount this year alone.

BTW - Bush's average annual cost was around $95 billion. Obama's cost $165 billion.

About jobs and spending and weapons - at least Bush's spending on weapon systems supported jobs. Solyndra and a bunch of the other Obama green abortions don't even do that.

Kind of makes Bush's Solyndra loan look puny don't ya think?

Bush's loan committee unanimously declined the Solyndra loan.

Obama is the Solyndra baby daddy.

Are you really that ill informed or just a liar trying to deceive the clueless.

[Yeah, I didn't think so.]

The idiot has spoken!

Attorney General Eric Holder has agreed to testify to the Senate Judiciary Committee on November 8 to answer questions about Fast & Furious. This after having already agreeing to testify before the House Judiciary Committee on December 8.

He sure is Dennis.

But see the last time he lied about what he and his department knew, and when.

It is going to be fantastic.

Payoffs and political favors, cronism, patronage......all learned at the knee of the Chicago Democratic machine...why is this a surprise to anyone????

Mark in SoCal - A disclaimer stating it was funded by Americans for Prosperity will render the same conclusion.....this ad was funded by those in the petroleum business. Since when is truth biased?

For those that care about source and bias this is relevant.

Don't_carry,

I am not quite sure what your point is. Of course source is relevant.

The bias of the ad, all by itself, is obvious. I believe it is the job of the reporter to present the piece, regardless of bias, without editorial comment.

That being said I understand ALL news sources are slanted in one direction or another and the fantasy of purely objective reporting is just that, a fantasy.

So I guess you feel the same way about George Soros. You do know he funds MoveOn.org and owns or controls several television stations and newspapers right?

OK Susan,

Now run the poll across those same Americans and ask them if they would support with tax dollars a loan to a company with business model that sells their product for less than it costs to manufacture and uses technology that has already been replace by a better method.

Let me know the results. You comments are not germaine to the topic. It is not that he loaned taxpayer money to a Solar company. It is that he loaned taxpayer money to a Solar company that had a loi=usy business model and no plans in place to be profitable. He loaned money to a company to further expand on a manufacturing method already proven to not be cost effective. He loaned money to company that all records indicated would most definately fail.

I doubt a very large percentage of Americans would be for THAT. I like solar energy. I would love to see it mature and succeed. But I dont want us to borrow more money from the Chineese to subsidize its development. If we had excess revenue to support such a plan, then no problem. But to continue to borrow money to support things such as this is insane.

It would be nice to be able to continue to print money for every pet project known to man without consequence. But there are very real consequences to printing and borrowing. You libs just dont want to admit this. You would prefer we become Greece rather than actually look into cutting spending now while we have a chance.

Currently the tax revenue income vesus our debt is more than 7 to 1. That is equivilent to a family making $150,000 a year being $1MILLION in debt. And if you add in unfunded liabilities on SS and Medicare, it is much worse. And every year it gets worse. And under BHO it gets MUCH worse.

So while funding such nice things such as Solar energy speculation would be nice, it is the equivilent of that family in debt above deciding to go out finance a new boat. They dont need it. It would be nice. But the fact they cant afford it does not even enter their mind.

So BHO has bought the boat and he needs a raise to tax revenue so the gap is not so stark. Never considers cutting things he does not need (such as funding Solar companies that are destined to fail) in order to afford such a new purchase. It is keep all the stuff we have and add to it. Never cut, always add.

Thus is the mind of a liberal.

ABO 2012

Also ask Americans if they support giving tax dollars to Solar Companies whose investers are bundlers for Obama?

I would truly like to know the source of your statistics regarding public opinion on solar power, as I understood that the general consensus was that it wasn't viable across the whole nation of energy consumers, it was unwieldy, it wasn't cost efficient, and had been pretty much abandoned even by the "green team" The more recent buzzwords seem to revolve around windfarms, and hydroelectric....So please share your source.