He isn't Christian but at least he is not Muslim! Romney 2012

Kind of funny, isn't it, that the story proclaims "2/3 GOP are comfortable with Romney's religion" as though that was supposed to be commendable or something??

Yup.

We are.

You betcha.

But...

Ya gotta watch out for white "liberal electoral racism" from Democrats who want to hold President Obama to a higher standard than other Democratic Presidents.

What are we going to do with those folks, gang?

This one has me stumped.

Any ideas about how we...as the First Read "community" (of course)...can deal with the problem of white "liberal electoral racism"?

Anyone?

Don't all answer at once...orderly fashion, please.

Now, who's first...?

Mittens faith must have been very difficult for him to do the usual, flip flop and claim he's a Christian just to satisfy the Saints on the Right.

Are the Democrats comfortable with Harry Reid's faith? Harry is supposed to be real important too you know.

Anyone uncomfortable with Obama's faith? Does anyone know what it is?

Mixer: Ya gotta watch out for white "liberal electoral racism" from Democrats who want to hold President Obama to a higher standard than other Democratic Presidents.

They hold Obama to a standard? I get the impression Obama could get on national tv and be strangling a puppy, and the Libs would say "So what - besides the puppy was asking for it." (Kudos to AM for the "So what?" line).

Obama 2012 - If you love me, you'll vote for me.

Too bad they didn't love you when the Senate rejected your bill the other day Barry.

"If you love me, you've got to help me pass this bill!" - Obama 2011/09/14

Don't all answer at once...orderly fashion, please.

Now, who's first...?

I will bite, excuse me for not following you of late, but have seen you write this a couple of times. What are you talking about?

edit - Ok starting to get your comment after reading JAS1.

So you are saying that white democrats are going against Obama because he is black? Could it be that some Democrats whether they be white, black or like me, brown, happen to be more progressive than Obama?

It's real easy MB we elect a candidate that is half black and half white, then everybody gets what they want!

Mark-

Read Professor Melissa Harris-Perry's piece for The Nation entitled "Black President, Double Standard: Why White Liberals Are Abandoning Obama."

Then, read her follow-up Nation piece, "The Epistemology Of Race Talk."

All will be explained.

And...thanks for helping keep the topic alive.

Few at First Read want to discuss it...even though Professor Harris-Perry is a darling of the the MSNBC prime-time line-up and an MSNBC contributor...and even an occasional MSNBC host.

Go figure.

I thought her comments were interesting...to say the least.

Is First Read possessed by the Devil? Not only is the motorcycle guy jumping into the comments, but the headlines of the Front Page turn red (like blood!) when you roll over them AND the top comment blue box on the right hand side of each post is GONE.

Forrest said: It's real easy MB we elect a candidate that is half black and half white, then everybody gets what they want!

Wait Forrest.... how come you are excluding the yellow race? Tisk, tisk tisk....

Okay Brianb if we can be politically incorrect for a moment I'll agree, I skipped the Asians, which I'll say one thing they are better at math than Cain seems to be, and you know I have never seen an Asian bum, I have never seen an Asian sleeping on a park bench.

"Is First Read possessed by the Devil?"

Until now, I hadn't considered the possibility, Amy B.

It would explain a lot though...

Oooohh, Forrest...those comments about Asians were most definitely politically incorrect.

I've got your back, though.

I'll draw some fire for you.

As a Vietnam vet...I saw more than a few Asian "bums".

Come and get me, lefties...

lol

Melissa Harris Perry - "The 2012 election is a test of whether Obama will be held to standards never before imposed on an incumbent. If he is, it may be possible to read that result as the triumph of a more subtle form of racism."

Mixed Bag - Interesting, article. As Ms. Perry says above we will see if there is some lack of support for Obama from this constituency group. However, even if there is, the claim couldn't be proven. As I said, some democrats may feel comfortable sitting at home due to their belief that Obama hasn't been progressive enough. Despite my critique of him, I know that won't be the case with me because, in my opinion, the other candidates are far worse.

Another point I would add is that the times between when Clinton was running for election and now are very different. All things being equal perhaps we could see this type of "white flight" as indicative of electoral racism, but times are way worse then in 1996.

As another pundit, one from Clinton's era said - "Its the economy s..."

On another note, surprised to see you read the Nation. Don't you just love Katrina Vanden Huevel?

MIXEDBAG

Get you and do what? Anyway, by no means is the debate on race a winning topic for GOP/TP and you sure don't want to be having this discussion during this election period.

What's the split on this obnoxious United Healthcare ad?

100% hate it.

Thanks MB, for taking some heat and reassuring me that we are all the same we all have a propensity for good and we all have our flaws. There really is no good race or better race, we are people and in the end we all share the same good qualities and the bad. It probably depends more on if your a republican or a democrat HA.

Yd-Mark: Another point I would add is that the times between when Clinton was running for election and now are very different.

But that's not really the point she is trying to make. She's claiming that even though Obama, like Clinton, has disappointed the base "white liberal" voters, that not voting for Obama would be a racist act even though up until now she's detected no such racism. The conditions and who Obama is running against have no bearing for Harris-Perry, to her if you voted for Obama before and fail to do so again, that is a racist act.

lol, Mark.

Absolutely.

Melissa Harris-Perry's views are nonsense.

How can anyone possibly imply that Salon's Joan Walsh (who voted for President Obama and has consistently supported him) might be a white "liberal electoral racist" simply because she criticizes the President from time to time?

But...here's the deal, Mark.

Accusations of racism leveled at white liberals are intended to silence legitimate policy-based criticism of President Obama.

Just as accusations of racism leveled at conservatives are intended to silence legitimate policy-based criticism of President Obama.

In fact, Mark...since President Obama is a liberal/progressive, conservatives have even more ideologically-based reasons to criticize his policies than liberal/progressives do.

But some are suggesting that racism is behind any criticism...whatsoever... of President Obama.

Liberal OR conservative criticism...it doesn't matter to folks like Professor Harris-Perry, does it?

MB: Melissa Harris-Perry's views are nonsense

Very much.

Harris-Perry is setting up the excuse already for Obama's defeat in 2012.

Harris-Perry is attempting to guilt the white 2008 voters that voted for Obama into doing the same in 2012 by calling them racists if they do not. The racism club used by the Left though is getting a little worn out, especially when people start asking questions about the Lefts claim of such.

In real life, it's just not that simple though, now is it? But like Obama, for Harris-Perry to appeal to her base, she has to make it real simple for them. And there is nothing as simple as the claim of racism.

Check out the parallel, JoAnna.

If you're a conservative, and you offer policy-based criticism of President Obama...you're a racist.

If you're a liberal, and you offer policy-based criticism of President Obama...you're a racist.

Your political ideology no longer matters.

Criticize President Obama...you're a racist.

Time to burn the race card, folks.

It's been played and abused to the point of irrelevancy.

The conditions and who Obama is running against have no bearing for Harris-Perry, to her if you voted for Obama before and fail to do so again, that is a racist act.

That is flat out ridiculous. It has nothing to do with race and everything to do with competence.

If you're a conservative, and you offer policy-based criticism of President Obama...you're a racist.

If you're a liberal, and you offer policy-based criticism of President Obama...you're a racist.

Mixed Bag/JAS1 - You know I don't share your political ideology, far from it, but you bring up a good point. I agree, some people have policy differences, different ideas about how Obama should've spent his energies or they believe he is too left, too right, whatever, but it doesn't mean that they are necessarily racist. As a liberal, I believe that accusing people of knowing what's in their heart is wrong.

However, that is not to say that certain individuals are not racist. In fact by frequenting this site and by reading First thoughts and the threads about the rising outsider and "green, star" Cain there are some who appear to disagree with these individuals based solely on their race. It could be said the same for some people who criticize the President.

By the way I know that my post will not get a green star.

Just for the hell of it, I'm going to remind everyone that the United Healthcare ad belongs to one of the most rapacious health insurance companies of all time. This is the company that has been raising rates in the double-digit range for quite some time.

This is the company that paid its CEO more than $124-million for ONE year. Check out this link to see other outrageous payouts. http://hcrenewal.blogspot.com/2005/05/how-can-1248-million-year-ceo-make.html

That's just to help remind us why we must have single-payer and to remember that it was President Obama who put us on that road to affordable health care FOR EVERYONE. Man, that must piss off the rich.

Recent polls show Democrats are good with President Obama, and are not defecting as FAUX Noise and Hate Radio would like folks to believe. And it is liberals who would be less likely to discriminate against Romney or any candidate based on religion, but they are going to vote to reelect President Obama.

So that leaves Romney with two-thirds Republicans, a couple of Independent swing voters, and that is not enough to get elected. I'll bet Perry will come back up in support from his Party, because no matter how bad he is, that's all they will have...OR...

I agree Feisty (below) about a third-party candidate who will split the ticket further. HI-larious. They all deserve each other.

David Walker, greetings! United Healthcare is only one of many that are gouging (e.g., Bank of America fees) while the gouging is good. I have a friend who did PR for United Healthcare and left because she couldn't stand it anymore--even in this job market!

The whole racism thing is about silencing criticism of President Obama, Mark.

Left...right...

Doesn't matter.

Criticism...period.

I'm simply happy to see that it's finally out in the open.

Conservatives have been targeted by the race card for far too long.

When a prominent African-American female academic (and MSNBC contributor) targets white "liberal electoral racism", I think it ought to be a topic of discussion at First Read.

Don't you?

By the way, Mark...did you notice that none of First Read's most prominent liberal voices responded to your remarks?

Only conservatives did.

And...we don't expect a response.

What's up with that, Mark?

Hey GUYS! I'm with you on the ad thing......its bad for my health at this point!

If I was the paranoid type I'd think this ad was done on purpose! LOL

By the way, Mark...did you notice that none of First Read's most prominent liberal voices responded to your remarks?

Mixed Bag, don't know. Still enjoy some of those FR liberal voices though. By the way some of the comments of late have put me off and haven't been participating or reading.

Other than sports conversations with WCA I've been pretty silent lately.

Good talking to you - Baseball to watch.

I gave you a vote Mark, I always enjoy your input, hope your ball club wins.

With 13% of the base concerned he can't afford any mistakes or that, badly needed, 13% will just stay home.

Yesterday I read an interesting article in the NYT which confirms what many of us have been saying about the Tea Party/Establishment split in the Republican Party, the possibility of a third party run, and Romney's general unpopularity http://www.nytimes.com/2011/10/16/magazine/does-anyone-have-a-grip-on-the-gop.html?pagewanted=1&hp

What surprises me is that the other GOPTP candidates have yet to go after Romney's Bain Capital doings; what he and his firm did to first rate and profitable companies when they bought them is just disgusting. If any of the others really looked at the info available on just Bain Capital, they'd find a great deal that most voters, even GOPers, would not like.

Fiesty, does this third party candidate smell better than these ones. They smell like cabbage cooking, does he smell like Chocolate Chip Cookies baking in the oven!

They smell like cabbage cooking,

The current bunch smell like time my Grama burned brussel sprouts & left me permanently scarred for life... lol

Still can't eat em to this day...

Either a third of republicans will stay home or they will put up a third party candidate and vote for God knows who. Bachman? Cain?

Yeah little baby cabbages are still cabbage.

"Romney's Bain Capital doings" -- Profit over people? Nah, they love that sh!t. Flip-flopping on the Teabagger's most important issue of abortion, now that's another story.

Yes, it is surprising. Those numbers do not add up, not numerically speaking but rather that 47% number seems almost a reflection of something else beyond his faith even though the question was about his faith. It's just weird. Usually the general population is less concerned about faith that the GOP.

Your math skills are just fine, dangerfield.

First Read has to consider how to make the numbers fit the overall "narrative".

That can be vexing...so, it can produce confusing results.

I simply ask myself:

"What's the overall First Read narrative with regard to reelecting President Obama?"

Hmmm...

I don' tknow- I kind of find the magic skivvies thing kind of intruiging....

Can you pee through those without opening that little trap door in front? That'd be handy on a cold day after drinking too many Buds.

I guess all those "I'm a mom and a teacher and a.... and a Mormon" ads are paying off for Mitt.

I don't know, there's some pretty weird beliefs in other churches, too. Although believing about dying and being a God of their own planet is strange, is it any stranger than the apostolic evangelicals who believe God has chosen certain people, like Rick Perry, to lead? They believe in taking over Government and choose the politicians they want to lead us wherever it is they think we should go on this planet.

Jody- one of MY favorites is that out of ALL the people on earth these days, only 700 of 'em are going to 'make the cut' on judgement day.

Yet when you talk to them, it's obvious that WAY more than 700 are convinced they are one of the few....

DBO, I know, it makes you wonder about the logic. It's like the Rapture and the anti-Christ. We hear a certain group, Apostolic for one, who believe the anti-Christ is Obama or Oprah Winfrey and that foretells the Rapture and that they can speed up the process yet when Revelations is read, the anti-Christ comes after the Rapture not before. I think they make their own rules.

THAT'S what I'm talkin' about, Paul.

lol

First Read.

Drive-by, Jody - I'd guess only a small percentage of Christians believe that stuff, and I don't think it's part of any mainstream denomination. I could be wrong, as I'm a Catholic so speaking about other denominations from a distance.

The main Christian beliefs are captured in the Nicene Creed, which doesn't limit salvation to any number.

Mormonism is substantially different. It's polytheistic, with a whole host of Gods living on what they call the planet Kolob (or Kobol - I forget - basically whichever one wasn't in Battlestar Galactica, which is based on the Book of Mormon, though they changed the home planet's name).

Having all this "hey, we're just like you" outreach like Steelerfan referenced has created some confusion that they maybe are just a little different. And when more Christians learn just how different, there's going to be some more opposition to Mormonism. There's even the possibility of angry backlash at what could be seen as deceit by the current push to convince outsiders that Mormonism is Christian (the eternal progression thing alone will strike Christians as heretical, and in fact is the common perception of what got Satan originally cast out of heaven).

Whether that translates into opposition to Romney, only time will tell.

Maybe Romney can try saying "Yeah, I sat in the church for 20 years, but I really didn't pay much attention to what was going on, and I never heard anything that might have been intolerant or disrespectful of others".

That should clear things up. And after the media comes out saying "Well that explains it, no story here.", what else will people have to worry about?

You GO, Paul!

Tell 'em!

"Maybe Romney can try saying "Yeah, I sat in the church for 20 years, but I really didn't pay much attention to what was going on,"

Maybe YOU can suck a root.

[THAT'S what I'm talkin' about, Paul.]

[You GO, Paul! Tell 'em!]

Sheesh...will you two get a room already...and NO PDA'S!

Lol, I suspect Mixed Bag was in agreement so much as being entertained. But either way, I'm holding out for Fiesty.

Why would anyone want to put him in the spot that he failed to win the last time around?

You tell me Go USA, you're the one asking why anyone would when he lost the last time. In case you can't answer, check the GOP nominee history.

I was just saying that's why he won't win. That's my opinion. Money can't buy everything, contrary to popular belief.

"by trying to get dirt on the members"

Lucious.....great line!

The occupiers don't need help in that regard it's evident that none of them have occupied a shower in a long long time.

Once again, another conservative ignores the fact that it was President George W. Bush who began the loan process for Solyndra in 2007, he gave a speech at Solyndra, and he pushed to fast track the loan before he left office so he could get credit only DOE kept processing at a normal pace. Too bad, they didn't speed it up for Bush--what would you say then?

Had that loan been approved during Bush's term, you can bet that Darryl Issa and the GOP would not be holding hearings. It isn't about Solyndra, it is about trying to pin a scandal of Obama. That's all this investigation is about.

As for Reverend Wright, that's old news and about as relevant to the 2008 campaign as Romney's Mormon faith is to this one. You also have cherry-picked only what the media wanted everyone to hear in that sermon; it was taken out of context completely. While I do not agree with Wright's choice of words, having heard the entire sermon on Bill Moyers, there was a justifiable reason for his anger.

Jody,

No offense, but are you really ignorant of the fact that the Solyndra loan was unanimously rejected under Bush, are you ignorant of the fact that the scandal involves an Obama billionaire bundler, that the administration allowed the same bundler to put his claim before the American tax payers claim - in violation of a law passed under Bush protecting the tax payers money?

Or are your comments just a willful deceit?