More Republican brinksmanship:

"In his September 15th speech to the Economic Club of Washington, DC, Speaker John Boehner was very eloquent on the need for a new spirit of compromise in politics. "If we want to create a better environment for job creation, politicians of all stripes can leave the 'my way or the highway' philosophy behind," he said.

It turns out, though, that he didn't mean to totally leave it behind. He meant to tweak it slightly. "My way or the highway" might be out, but "my way because I'm on the highway" is in.

Earlier this week, House Republicans failed to pass legislation that would continue to fund the federal government. Last night, after some cosmetic changes and a stern talking to by the leadership, the bill squeaked through the chamber. But there are still major differences, particularly in disaster-relief funding, between what House Republicans passed and what Senate Democrats (want).

Normally, this would kick off negotiations. But not this time, says Boehner. This time, House Republicans are leaving town for a scheduled recess, so it's either this bill, or the government's lights go off."

"Boehner Tries to Jam The Senate", Ezra Klein, Washington Post.

After the bill failed first time around in the House, Sen Reid that it could not pass in his chamber. Now the House Republicans are spinning that the Senate is threatening shut down, playing politics, pass the CR ad fund FEMA.

That is how Boehner and Co. are spinning the latest hostage-taking over a looming government shutdown. This makes four threats in 2011.

Agreed, First Read...solid performance from Romney.

I'll bet Axelrod and Plouffe would vastly prefer to face Perry.

Although, if the President's job approval number drops into the 30's, it probably won't matter much who the GOP nominates.

President Obama is running against his record on economic growth and jobs.

Thanks for The Laughs

Romney tells the truth in 2 seconds

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4xV29B3Fudo&feature=player_embedded

I agree lots of reasons

I liked Herman Cain's 9-9-9 plan too.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x9LFwX7YfKg

LMAO, Cain just ain't able.

9 pizzas, 9 toppings for $9.99; WTH, does he think the White House is a pizzeria?

The freak show

Rick Santorum, apparently planning to raise an army of monks and kick all the married officers out of the military.

no sexual activity in military

I enjoyed the circus though. I had the time of my life.

Jody, IA & Newday…RETURNED!

BIG Birthday SHOUT OUT

May you have many more

Drinks are on me for you @ the Dew Drop Inn .

Amazing how some posters can post comments 5 minutes before the story is even available for others to read.

While all candidates -- including the dems candidates in 2008 Clinton and Obama -- have areas where there are changes in positions in their careers, one thing became very evident last night. Any one on that stage would be a better president than the current failed president.

All of them have ideas that will turn this country around from the precipice it has been plunged into now. Clinton and Obama duked it out four years ago and the Republicans are doing so now. As this race gets into the later rounds, you will likely see more fierce competition. That's what debates are all about.

Gov. Perry has always been a winner and as he has moved up in weight class, you can see him improve with each round. Although I don't believe he'll be the nominee, his role is to strengthen the ultimate winner. That is what debate is all about. The sound bite of the night came from the least likely nominee -- Gov. Johnson -- which rings so true and should be adopted as a campaign theme:

"My neighbors two dogs have created more shovel ready jobs than this president."

Thank you Gov. Johnson.

Bottom line. After the Republicans choose the nominee, all those on the stage and all factions of the Republican Party will join hand-in-hand to vote this current failed president out of office. There will be no more in fighting. The target is clear.

Thanks, Feisty and others for the b-day wishes; also for reminding us what a total jerk Joe Walsh is. Never occurs to him that voters across the country selected President Obama for his character and not the color of his skin because such an idea is beyond Walsh's mental midget capacity.

Happy Birthday to my fellow leftie liberal newdayDawning Returned!

Mixed Bag

Agreed, First Read...solid performance from Romney.

I'll bet Axelrod and Plouffe would vastly prefer to face Perry.

Although, if the President's job approval number drops into the 30's, it probably won't matter much who the GOP nominates.

President Obama is running against his record on economic growth and jobs.

Heard this one Joe?

The Obama administration says it’s green jobs program created or "saved" 44,000 jobs.

Turns out 7,391 were temporary construction jobs and 33,000 were ………. at Ford Motor Corp?

Seems Ford got $5.9 billion loan guarantee to re-tool a Ford plant to produce more energy-efficient vehicles and …….. suddenly …….. half of America’s most profitable automobile manufacture’s work force was “saved “!

Who knew?

(Oh well ……. At least $5.9 didn’t go down a Solyndra rat hole and we didn’t even have to buy a car company for the unions.)

bob-

That reminds me...how many Chevy Volts has GM sold?

also for reminding us what a total jerk Joe Walsh is.

This guy is like the energizer bunny running on stupidity!

Now he's threatening to run a primary challenge against Republican Randy Holtgren (sp?) due to redistricting...

Keep in mind he ONLY won his district by 296 votes - hardly would call that a mandate!

Plus, we have 2 STRONG Democratic candidates, one being Tammy Duckworth to send him packing...

Turn off the lights Joe & exit 'stage right'...

Mixed Bag

Although, if the President's job approval number drops into the 30's, it probably won't matter much who the GOP nominates.

President Obama is running against his record on economic growth and jobs.

Bag boy

Get Serious

The House approved a stopgap spending bill to keep the government running, setting up a confrontation with the Senate.

Republicans did not include enough money for disaster relief.

Boehner can't lead

McTutrle is constantly devising ways to hold country hostage

President Obama kicking t-nuts azz

I guarentte you are wrong

Yep. Perry struggles again. True. Obama has been struggling for almost 33 months. Also true. Which one who is struggling hurts America the most? Obvious answer -Obama.

One of the candidates hit the nail on the head last night. Said his dog produced more "shovel ready" jobs than Obama.

Geez, Bev...

Thanks for the re-posts.

Really liked the comment, did ya?

Not that I care who posts first but as someone who works in IT, exactly what is going here?

I'm posting at 9:34 and the story claims it was posted 19 mins ago, therefore it was posted at 9:15am.

How can the first reply be posted at 9:11am?

Well, No Jo- I guess as long as Obama is toast, I'm 'leaning' Bachmann this morning. See, It really appeals to me that I can keep 100 cents out of every dollar I earn, AND still have government services and programs!

That deal is like a sore dong- you can't beat it!

Alan, can't explain it except it happens to me, too. I think it has more to do with the speed of your own internet service.

fFeisyt

More people care about Gary Johnson's neighbor's two dogs and their contribution than Joe Walsh and your tired rant.

Keep up the good work.

Suffering America needs to see liberal dems' mindless drivel, deflections and irrelevant rants.

This is an incredible read!!!! Dems better wise up. A re-election of Obama will spell doom for this country if he vetoes legislation or doom to the progressive idealists on here.

http://hotlineoncall.nationaljournal.com/archives/2011/09/insiders-increa.php

@Alan -- I made the same observation above. I don't believe internet speed has anything to do with it since I have the fastest available.

Alan,

I have noticed that sometimes when an article is first posted it shows negative seconds. I have seen it more than -240 seconds (-4 min) so this is a good question for the IT people.

bob-1805084

Heard this one Joe?

The Obama administration says it’s green jobs program created or "saved" 44,000 jobs.

Sponge Boob,

Have you heard how many jobs the republicans saved or created?

I sure you didn't because there aren't any!!!

Happy 29th birthday Jody and New Day!

Happy birthday Jody and Newday.

And then there's Joe Albany. Still trying to distract from the real issues. You must have received Karl's troll check last week.

Mo ron: Jobs are not a "real issue"??

Really??

That explains a lot about lefty liberal stupidity.

Another great read and why dems are scrambling.

http://hotlineoncall.nationaljournal.com/archives/2011/09/dem-poll-obama.php

One of the Democratic party's leading pollsters released a survey of 60 Republican-held battleground districts today painting an ominous picture for Congressional Democrats in 2012. The poll shows Democratic House candidates faring worse than they did in the 2010 midterms, being dragged down by an unpopular president who would lose to both Texas Gov. Rick Perry and Mitt Romney.

Pollster Stan Greenberg released the poll with some sugary spin for Democrats, downplaying the results by arguing that the president's jobs plan will improve the party's fortunes.

"This is obviously not the best moment to judge the Democrats' eventual fortunes--with fewer voters identifying as Democrats, with Democrats themselves less enthusiastic about the president, and with his overall approval rating down 7 points and losing independents in these districts," Greenberg wrote in his memo. "We do not yet know the public's reaction to the president's latest initiatives, but there is reason to believe they can help him and the Democrats here."

But the numbers - at least right now -- are troubling for Democrats, and echoed some of the takeaways from the GOP special election upset in New York City last week. Instead of an overall anti-incumbent sentiment impacting members of both parties, voters are taking more of their anger out on Democrats. When voters were asked whether they're supporting the Republican incumbent or a Democratic candidate, 50 percent preferred the Republican and just 41 percent backed the Democrat.

Voters in these districts said they were more supportive of Republicans than they were during the 2010 midterms, when 48 percent said they backed the Republican candidate and 42 percent said they backed the Democrat. (Republicans won 55 percent of the overall vote in these 60 battleground districts, while Democrats took 43 percent.) In 2010, Republicans netted 63 House seats - their best showing since 1948.

Joe does not want to talk about the topic at hand, how Romney is overtaking Perry, and no republican wants to talk about Ron Paul, who is much more their immediate problem than Obama. Ron Paul is a front-runner in many respects and he is not even mentioned by Fox on their political web page, why is the republican establishment treating him like the red headed step child? (no offense intended Fiesty, it is just an expression!)

Backhouse, thank you as always.

However, it's not called "spinning". It's called lying. It's what the Republicans are in the business of doing.

Lying - 24/7. They created the mess we are in because they refuse to be adults. And instead do what all spoiled children do - pass the buck, point the finger, and blame anyone but themselves.

Unfortunately Americans on the whole don't mind being lied to.

*******************************

I as well send out Birthday wishes!!!!!

It's a shame they didn't have one of those 'applause-meters' at the past debates...

I'm curious which garnered the largest applause from the right wing nuts.

Perry on 234 executions?

Paul on letting a 30 year old uninsured man die?

Or, an openly gay man putting his life on the line for this country in Iraq?

PS: Did Perry pronounce nuclear as noocular?

As the clowns pile out of and into their car at one debate after another Conservative Republicans are once again threatening to shut down the government. This time it's over FEMA help for people needing assistance after this Summer's historic weather events and the hatred of the Right for energy conservation.

It took me quite a while to figure out why the Conservative Movement has such hatred for things that allow us to spend less money on energy. Republican Teddy Roosevelt was one of the fathers of the Conservation Movement, appreciating our natural resources and wanting us to use them wisely. How did we come this far?

Then I realized that much of the funding for modern Conservatism comes from the energy industry. Ken Lay, who introduced George W Bush to the Republican Party as a potential POTUS. T Boone Pickens, oil and natural gas magnate. Ed and David Koch, who've made 2 of the world's largest fortunes primarily off the oil industry. Don Blankenship, CEO of Massey Energy at the time of the Upper Big Branch mine collapse. BP Energy, major sponsor of the most recent Koch brothers secret summit of Conservative thinkers.

Conservatism is no longer an honest and honorable philosophical position. It's been perverted into a mouthpiece for industries that don't wish to play by the rules. No wonder our government is so screwed up.

@Pat -- characterize your upcoming defeat any one you like -- but it still will be a defeat. Enjoy the Hilly PIE!!!!!! Have an extra piece.

Very rarely would I stoop to this level, but the GOP hilarity over the dogs joke is irresistible. GOP dogs know how to dish it out (all that %&##) but do they know HOW to pick up the shovel, roll up their sleeves and clean the place up? Apparently not.

than Joe Walsh and your tired rant

The mere fact that mentioning his name causes your head to explode...

You can rest assured I intend to keep the dead beat daddy front & center!

Thanks! ;o)

Steve Benen/posted @ Obama Diary:

So, instead of trying to reach a sensible compromise, the Speaker and his team deliberately chose to invite yet another standoff that threatens to shut down the government. Indeed, GOP officials told reporters last night they would promptly leave town today to make the threat more explicit — either the Senate approves the House bill or the government shuts down in seven days, because House members won’t be around to even try to reach a deal.

Of course, Senate leaders are saying exactly what they’ve been saying all along: they’re not going to pass the House bill. Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid (D-Nev.) will kill the House version today, and will probably urge House leaders to stick around and do their jobs rather than leave town.

If House Republicans do promptly flee to the airport today, and the Senate rejects the House measure as expected, President Obama will likely call members back to Washington early next week. The shutdown deadline is Friday, Sept. 30, at midnight.

_______________________________

Do their jobs? Oh please. Republicans do their jobs? LoL!!!!

And they call the unemployed "lazy"? Why isn't anyone holding them accountable?

You know, we the people.

Hey Mixed,

They sold a 125 Voltys in July - nationwide!

What's even funnier is that Backhouse Disabled, is using the "hostage" drivel again about funding FEMA.

Instead of using the $4 billion to help people who suffered losses due to natural disasters this year - the libs want us to borrow more money from China so the American tax payer can continue to pay rich libs $7,500 to buy a worthless $42,000 car that costs more to make than it sells for .... that no one wants.

"Hostage"

Who is holding lib brains "hostage?"

I wasn't aware Feisty could donate, Joe,...

PS. Many men still prefer Ginger,...or so I'm told!

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Happiest of birthdays to Jody and Newday!

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Why do Republicans HATE our Soldiers? I wonder if the audience reaction to our honorable openly gay soldier last night sent a 'chill up' Cindy McCain's spine'?

Republicans only care about our troops if they are the monolithic, party line toe-ers,...otherwise - they'd spit on them, and beat 'em down. Why?

Every domestic and foreign car manufacturer you have ever heard of and some you have not heard of already has at least one electric vehicle on the market or claims they will have one or more on the market before 2013, Ford says they will soon have three different models. So what do these smart captains of industry, all of them, every last one them know that Joe and Bob don't know, surely every car company in the world is not building electric vehicles just because Obama said he thinks it is a good idea, and encouraged them to do so. One more question how many people bought cell phones in the first six months of their release, how many people bought CD players in the first months of their release, brand new innovations and products always face the same kind of adoption curve. To be sure, every car maker in the world feels they will sell electric cars, because they are all producing them, I did not think I would see the day when republicans would so seriously doubt the wisdom of big business and the free market. Frankly I'm glad to see it, perhaps you should doubt their wisdom more often.

Joe in Albany

Last night’s De Rev. Al’s...

And you wonder why people perceive so many on the right as racist?

John B., wonderful post. The Republican Party is one big scam to screw us all. It began under Reagan and people are too ignorant to see it. What's it going to take for them to give a ####?

I honestly don't know. All I do know is we have a Republican Party who refuses to work for the American people, and the American people don't see it.

Our own media doesn't see it. Romney is a Wall Street lover. He hasn't a clue about poverty or working class. Or middle class.

He's not a moderate. He's an extremely white rich panderer with no core values when it comes to "kitchen table" issues. He's in the pockets of Wall Street. Or vice versa.

Hey John B - how's that Buffett Rule coming? Any movement or actual language drafted yet?

Come On John we all know it's just silly and will soon be long forgotten.

You know Mixed and bob - I'm kinda thinking of getting a Volt. It's sure to be like the DeLorean - a totally horrible idea that some knuckle head, in that case a coke head, actually made.

Speaking of which Both Todd and Jansening's programs are actually covering Solyndra.

To review - WE gave Solyndra $535 million. WE have a couple of questions to ask about how they spent our money, and what do they do? Why they take the 5th - because they are afraid of criminal charges.

But Obama has said everything was all good, so what gives?

John B speaks of honor and honesty in the conservative movement.

This of course comes the day after Charlie Rangel was honored in Congress.

Too funny.

Yep John B - all the democratic politicians are fine and upstanding rock stars that Amy B would no doubt walk over coals for.

You guys are the best.

A g** damn dog joke gets an applause line (from a clear goon, looking like some schmuck who sits next to the director in an office meeting; clearly he lifted that joke; "Red Comedy Jam- queue the applause app) while poor people in the country grow in absurd numbers. You want my vote, earn it. Just because you're NOT Obama doesn't mean I want you to represent me by playing to fear and mediocrity. Be the best or go home! You know what REAL conservatism is? Efficiency, fairness, righteousness and reality! You can't pull jobs out of your 'arse' with tax breaks or government "see if it sticks" spending; and you can't have a society if the new generation will be dumb and poor.

Innovate, work together, and pick up a shovel.

Forrest,

What an idiotic post.

every last one them know that Joe and Bob don't know, surely every car company in the world is not building electric vehicles just because Obama said he thinks it is a good idea, and encouraged them to do so.

Obama didn't say he thinks it is a good idea - HE MANDATED AN A TOTALLY ABSURD MPG! - they go out of business if they can't sell cars due to the dictator's dictates!

Doubt the wisdom of big business and the free markets

Nothing free about Obama's markets.

Big government social engineering again. The same reason we are in the crisis we are in and ...... morons keep wanting to double down on it.

Simply Unbelievable.

Honestly, I just cannot fathom any Congress member leaving for a week at this point. With the world economy in crisis mode and the real threat of another recession here you would think they would stay in D.C. and come up with some solutions to the mess they created. Hello....

Seriously Joe, you have no business calling anybody a moron, personally I really resent you referring to me as a moron, and you sure as hell would not like me to describe on this blog what I personally think of your brainpower, I guarantee you it would be more colorful, more funny, more devastating, and more truthful than your description of me as a moron. I try not to go to that place Joe, but if you really want to play that game I can play it Joe. BTW just curious why do have such a fascination with sperm banks, this is the third or fourth time you have brought them into the conversation, frankly I think it is kind of weird, extremely weird actually.

Happy birthday to us! Thanks to all for the good wishes! See you at the Dew Drop Inn!

Alan,

Know watcha mean. I get that too.....it's just Sod's Law.

Thanks for the great posts, Pat, John B, Feisty, Bev +

Hey Backhouse - Navy Disabled,

How come the name change?

Ah Bob and Spanky,

FYI The Volt tax credit was enacted 2008 and signed into law by Bush. Back under the first stimulus plan Bush introduced.

Obama is on the teevee right now saying "pass the bill."

Why does Harry Reid hate him?

ANyone catch Debbie Downer on Todd's show this am? She's upset with Boehner about the Jobs bill, but not so much for Reid. Huh?

Forresst - a private company wants to invest its own money in electric cars, great. GM's design is a failure cause it was directed to get the volt out by the White House. You ever see the Volt Concept car? That was cool. That was before it became Government Motors.

Obama is a venture socialist, and that is horrible. The government need to get out of business- cars, whatever the hell green energy is, all of it. It's just no good at any of it.

Don't_carry:

The real slap in the face is they've only been back at work 12 days since their last hiatus, that lasted five weeks. These jerkwads don't know the first thing about HARD work; but they sure feel entitled to point out the 'deadbeats' that accept Unemployment.

The Congressional 'calendar' is an affront to the American People and the Congress should be held accountable for it.

White Collar,

Navy.. to.. Backhouse?

Pure protonic reversal.

WCA - I think Backhouse ate Navy, who was cyber-bullied into being banned.

Don't Carry - The "Volt tax credit"

Really, that's what you think it is, eh? So is there a Prius tax credit, a EV tax credit and a Insight tax credit.

Hey libbies if you find yourself about to include the words: tax, tax credit, tax shelter, tax rates or anything else related to something you know know nothing about, and have never read, just stop.

Check yourself, before you wreck yourself.

Joe in Albany

Counting “Green Jobs” for Dummies

Judge Joe, Are you counting how long it'll be until Darrell Isaa's Solyndra WITCH HUNT will cause us to say buh bye you sleazy crook?

Last week, the liberal American Family Voices filed a complaint with the House Office of Congressional Ethics seeking an investigation to determine if Issa’s business interests conflict with his work as a government official.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/campaigns/gops-top-investigator-rep-darrell-issa-finds-himself-in-spotlight-as-target-of-critics/2011/09/22/gIQAooRtmK_story.html

Oh and don't forget his CREW INVESTIGATION or the fact that Issa is refusing to investigate Murdoch's phone hacking

Btw how's fast and furious going; nowhere; right?

Things that really "stuck out" in last nights debate.

1) Fox did an exceptional job squelching Ron Paul, the dismissive questions were beyond tacky and juvenile.

2) It was very disturbing seeing corporate banners displayed prominently at a political debate.

3) How increasingly difficult it is flipping through the channels to distinguish a political debate from Dancing With The Stars

4) How Romney continues to appear disingenuous, plastic, and robot like.

5) The Republican debates have an almost narcotic ability to put one to sleep, I have yet to remain conscience though an entire event.

Clara -- Could not agree with you more.

SPANKY -- I guess all the news orgs including car dealers are wrong too. Google Volt TAX CREDIT joker.

http://www.thecarconnection.com/news/1060841_update-dealers-pocketing-7500-chevy-volt-tax-credit

Clara, don't you know? It's only bad when the president takes a vacation that it's bad. Republicans can do anything they want. The media has their back.

The GOP should be traveling all across this country, seeing which states need what.

They aren't doing anything. Absolutely nothing.

Only the president has to work. And solve every problem on his own.

Did you know there is protesting going on down on Wall Street?

Those Americans matter. Those Americans are holding people accountable. Republican supporters don't hold their party accountable. They never have.

They are cowards. And even worse, they're sell outs to the American people.

Happy Birthday Jody and newday!

BTW for everybody's info the Chevy Volt is currently only available in a very limited number of states, seven states I believe, at least some of the cars were bought by people who flew to one of those states and then drove their Volt home, so some of the early adopters are pretty excited about buying an American made electric car.

Bob did Obama force all the foreign car makers all over the world to build electric cars, did he tell the American car companies to build electrics to improve fuel economy or do you think their engineering department decided that was one way of accomplishing that task.

So Navy exploded?? That's a shame.

Who ya gonna call?

NewdayDAWNING,

Happy Birthday!! The first pint is on me, and don't be scrimping now.

Here's another link right from Chevy SPANKY

http://www.mychevroletvolt.com/chevy-volt-federal-tax-credit-form-8936

You need a few more.....just let me know

I get so much entertainment out of the folks here talking about the Auto Industry. Especially, electric and hybrid technology.

Ya all are such experts. Keep it up. I could watch this all day.

Could someone break down the fine points of "Range Anxiety" v the environmental factors on electric technology? Highlight - Temperature, wind, road conditions, elevation, etc, please. You know just the basics.

Cause ya know, Range anxiety is a real problem. Ask someone who bought a Nissan Leaf.

Kind of reminds me of all the "Bridge" experts we suddenly had here yesterday.

"Hiya kids, hiya, hiya." Froggy

First things first, happy birthday to two of my favorite people, Jody and Dawn. You brighten my day when I see you among the posters on First Read.

Secondly, I'm always a little queasy posting on a thread headed by the Feisty one for fear she will be collapsed by the GOP/TP/LDS trolls at some point taking my deathless prose and pearls of wisdom with her. Oh well, such is the price of freedom. NO guts, no glory.

Speaking of trolls, I've now got well over 60 of them on "ignore" and the bliss this brings me is immeasurable. It offers me a view of what the world would be like without propagandists like FOX and Rush Limbaugh turning the mentally weak and lazy into mindless ditto-head zombies repeating the days talking points and sincerely believing they are expressing their own opinions rather than the programmed propaganda garbage they have been fed via the direct brain link to their zombie masters.

I have a dream.....to borrow a phrase from another great man.....

I imagine a world where intelligent discussion and middle-of-the-road politics, not knee jerk, partisan, rhetoric, would guide us all. A world without FOX or Rush or any of the hate-mongers. Where we could come together and rationally discuss the issues without name-calling and mud-slinging. A world where we can reach a consensus through compromise, not bullying. It gives me hope that someday we will be able to rise above all this nonsense and make decisions with intelligence and compassion.

And finally, speaking of hope, I see the dominoes continue to fall into place as I predicted. Perry is faltering more and more and it will only get worse as the tempo quickens. Romney has been there, he has learned the lessons and he will be the GOP/TP/LDS nominee. It will come down to the two of them and Romney will get the GOP/TP/LDS blessing. He's still my second choice. He's a moderate. He will do less harm than any of the rest of the frothing at the mouth crowd.

But I stand by my prediction that he will fail to get the full backing of the christian right (I use the small "c" because they are neither Christians or "right") and President Obama will be elected in an historic landslide. Take it to the bank folks. It's a done deal. Nothing you see in the so-called "news" today will have any bearing on the election 13.5 months and half a billion dollars in adversting from now.

That said, welcome Autumn. Happy Birthday girls. Sit back and enjoy the show, the circus is in town and the clowns are especially entertaining this time around. The greatest show on earth. Just don't take it too seriously. It's like professional wrestling, the outcome has already been decided.

"Tis a tale, told by an idiot, full of sound and fury and signifying nothing." Shakespeare

"Plunk your magic twanger Froggy."

America held hostage, day 266.

Obama/Biden 2012

Yep,

Navy has that *stellar* quality.

wbush

The Republican debates have an almost narcotic ability to put one to sleep, I have yet to remain conscience though an entire event.

Libs don't know the difference between a sense of right and wrong ..... and being awake?

thanks for confirming it.

Check yourself, before you wreck yourself.

HEY SPANKY PRACTICE WHAT YOU PrEACH

I won't hold my breath for an apology your posts say a lot about your character.

Don't Carry - can you really be this clueless? [it the Volt form, is it? oh my!]

I would first suggest you read those links. But to be honest I think it will not help.

Again - you should probably need to stop talking about taxes, in any form.

Wait, what am I saying, don't do that. Don't ever do that - keep making me laugh Don't Carry - you are doing a great job so early on this Friday.

DCIA - that link for a form is not Direct from Chevrolet.

Spanky made a good point earlier that if you all start to type the word "tax" in your post, you should stop an check yourself.

I would also apply that to anything to do with the Auto Industry.

Backhouse

"Boehner Tries to Jam The Senate", Ezra Klein, Washington Post.

After the bill failed first time around in the House, Sen Reid that it could not pass in his chamber. Now the House Republicans are spinning that the Senate is threatening shut down, playing politics, pass the CR ad fund FEMA.

That is how Boehner and Co. are spinning the latest hostage-taking over a looming government shutdown. This makes four threats in 2011.

===============================================

Backhouse

This excellent information only proves what a real fool Boehner is. All the drunken Grimm weeper does is seek to spread discontent and failure.

On your next lottery tickets scratch the fool. It 'll have Boehnor's face under it.

If it doesn't it should; you can bet on that!!!

Per Capita Income; a year. This is the miracle Worker Perry's real record for Texas job creations.

Mr Jobs Creator Rick Perry. No wonder theses folks can't pay taxes

Starr County Texas $7,069

Maverick County, Texas $8,758

Willacy County, Texas $9,421

Presidio County, Texas $9,558

La Salle County, Texas $9,692

Dimmit County, Texas $9,765

Hidalgo County, Texas $9,899

Brooks County, Texas $10,234

Zapata County, Texas $10,486

Bee County, Texas $10,625

Webb County, Texas $10,759

Cameron County, Texas $10,960

Duval County, Texas $11,324

Culberson County, Texas $11,493

It appears that the country's presidential candidates will include a "conservative" and a "liberal, Marxist, commie, pinko, progressive" brown guy. Actually, that's not true.

Those labels fail, BECAUSE the right-wingers DO NOT have a "conservative" candidate. That term has been abused, butchered, and twisted to the point that no one even knows what a "conservative" is any more. These are Republican candidates to be sure, but like the Democrats, the G.O.P. is just a club, so you can be a murderer, a pedophile, a crook, a butcher, baker, candlestick maker and still be a Republican or a Democrat, but one needn't be conservative or liberal.

However, among the Republican candidates for President, there is not one single "conservative" from which to choose. Let's just stick with the media-anointed front-runners, Perry and Romney. Since no one seems to be able to carry on a political conversation without resorting to labels, let's use accurate labels.

Perry can be described accurately as: An opportunist, a hypocrite, a reactionary, a liar, a politician for sale to the highest bidder, a delusional, a misogynist, a control-freak, and many other terms. Each of those labels/terms describes Perry far more accurately than "conservative". While I make no claim to have the ability to see beyond the temporal realm as does Perry, I am confident that I am correct that William F. Buckley, Barry Goldwater, Dwight Eisenhower, Bob Dole and a host of true "conservatives" would agree with my assessment.

As far as Romney, a fellow who fancies himself a conservative, he is not fit to shine the shoes of the aforementioned conservatives who espoused the great traditions of true conservatism. Romney also is a delusional, an opportunist, a liar, a hypocrite, and the polar opposite of a capitalist. I digress here to point out that a capitalist creates wealth. Romney buys businesses and destroys them. This man is most assuredly not a conservative.

President Obama has disappointed many folks who voted for him in the last election, but his new approach - you know, calling the Republicans out for the obstructionists they are - has brought new vitality to the left.

Ray lotsanumbers: Your post is getting very old. How many times have you re-posted that tripe? You really need to read what others have to say when they respond. Another poster pointed out that one does not jump into a precipice. One jumps from a precipice. When you keep making the same mistake, it makes people think you aren't paying attention or have a serious problem in the mental horsepower department.

Forrest - why would a company make a car then sell it in such a limited area?

Only one that does not have to make it on its own.

Fact is Hybrids have been out for well over 10 years. I don't know about you, but I had DVDs, VHS, computers and a bunch of other stuff that were at one time new well before the technology was 10 years old.

I suspect you did too.

The Volt just suck. Bad design, worse performance, and even worse value. A entry level Hyundia is cheaper, gets better gas milage - AND DOESN'T COST YOU OR ME A DIME.

A very Happy Birthday to our good friends Jody IA and newdaydawning...RETURNED

Looking forward to celebrating this evening, I hear IR has quite an evening planned....see you there.

Happy birthday to Jody and Newday. See you at the DDI. I 'll buy a round. On politics I think that John Huntsman did the best in last nights debate. Have a good weekend

They Forget to blame Union's AGAIN...?

You Know when Democrat's & Union's Had power ..!

They Ran The country without the This HUGE National Debt.

that Fiscal Conservatives BLEW SKY HIGH During 2000--2006........!

And NOW want You the People to PAY FOR ,..................Suckers...........................!

Ok Don't Carry - you figure it out yet?

Let's try it this way, cause I'm here to help you understand [people person and all] - google the actual form - IRC 8936.

Now show me when in that form [or in the actual code section] the word Volt appears.

See -it's like I have been saying here - it really, really helps to read the actual code. Hell, in your case Don't Carry I settle for you just reading the actual articles you cite.

No apology needed - you are welcome. :)

Wilberta, looks like the real miracle is that Texans are actually able to feed themselves. Then again many of them can't, which is part of the reason why Texas is one of the largest net importers of federal tax dollars.

Meanwhile it looks like Spanky has become my special friend. Anyone else notice he hasn't actually addressed the advisability of anything I've said? Instead he just chants "it'll never happen", just supporting my comments about the obstructionist GOP and the damage their tactics are inflicting upon the USA.

The conservative candidate is Romney. If you think, regardless of which party you typically vote for, you should cheer this on if you want to have an election that matters.

Douschebag Party members provide a base of votes for the a-hole arm of the Republican party, a mirror to the ecoterrorists of the Democratic party, but nobody wins a Presidential election with a DOUSCHEBAG candidate. That's why conservatives with a brain separate themselves quickly from the Douschebaggers who like to shout things out from the audience during a debate.

@Wilberta -- Would you please provide the link for your figures. If not, then you are either making them up or using old data. I believe this link gives a better overall picture of Texas:

http://coydavidson.wordpress.com/2011/03/23/texas-ranks-23rd-in-per-capita-income-among-us-states/

State personal income rose an average 3.0 percent in 2010 after falling 1.7 percent in 2009, according to estimates released today by the U.S. Bureau of Economic Analysis. State personal income growth ranged from 0.3 percent in Nevada to 4.2 percent in New Mexico. Inflation, as measured by the national price index for personal consumption expenditures, increased to 1.7 percent in 2010 from 0.2 percent in 2009.

All three major components of personal income (earnings, property income, and personal current transfer receipts) grew in 2010. In 2009 only transfers grew as lower employment reduced earnings and lower interest rates and profits reduced property income (dividends, interest, and rent). The 7.6 percent growth of transfer receipts in 2010 was larger than the 2.4 percent growth of earnings and the 0.6 percent growth of property income.

Oops, my bad on Chevy link here is another from USA Today, it seems they call it a tax credit and so did CNN money, not sure where you are coming from Spanky, really explain.

http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/2010-07-28-volt28_ST_N.htm

http://money.cnn.com/2008/09/24/autos/plug-in_tax_credit/index.htm

@John & Wilberta -- You might want take the time to look at these figures.

http://www.texasahead.org/economy/indicators/ecoind/ecoind5.html

Or maybe these:

http://quickfacts.census.gov/qfd/states/48000.html

PS. Don't_Carry: Spanky IS a character, he doesn't have character. Remember that for future dealings,...

Or How about this link:

http://www.txcip.org/tac/census/morecountyinfo.php?MORE=1011

So Wilberta, do you have the integrity to post your source?????

Spanky: So is there a Prius tax credit, a EV tax credit and a Insight tax credit.

Yes, Spanky, there WAS a tax credit for Prius sales. And Civic Hybrid sales. You should have known that. Or at least researched more before posting.

For you to then lecture the rest of us on talking tax is simply arrogance. And hypocrisy.

Most of us are sick of the Republican games. So sick, in fact, that we've given up and are saying "let the idiocy go on... close the damn government".

The GOPers that still have guts to defend such ignorance, claim that their purpose is valiant and that they are protecting us from this "false" and misguided green jobs bill... and that they are just being "genuine" in insisting FEMA be paid for before funding to save the people... and all this tied to the budget bill just to add more "incentive"... just a convenience thing, you know... and totally NOT related to taking recess immediately after the bill is passed. What garbage!

Okay, GOP posters. Did you read the above paragraph? How on earth can you defend such crap? This is pure insanity! It takes "the end justifies the means" to it's bitter extremes! This antic (and that's all it is), will inevitably cause yet another hit to consumer confidence, yet one more hit to our economy, yet another free-fall on Wall Street, a loss of American net worth, fewer jobs, less tax revenue, and, yes, more f#$%ing debt.

You morons. If you don't like the green loans, argue against them based on merit, don't hold America hostage. If you want to pay for FEMA before funding it, argue on it's merits, don't hold our unfortunate Americans hostage. If you don't want our government to work or our economy to recover, just f'ing say so.

We will not be taken hostage. We will not negotiate with such a hostage taking crowd (I didn't use the "T" word). We should let the government shut down. If that is what it takes to stop this non-sense, so be it.

bob-1805084

wbush

The Republican debates have an almost narcotic ability to put one to sleep, I have yet to remain conscience though an entire event.

Libs don't know the difference between a sense of right and wrong ..... and being awake?

thanks for confirming it.

booby trap

You tea-nuts don't know “O “ stands Obstructionism

Thanks for confirming that tea baggers are bonkers.

Really Spanky how about the government supporting the $25,000 dollar tax break you brag about taking on your gigantic over 6,000 pound GVW foreign made SUV you purchased, that little incentive would fully cover the tax breaks on three Chevy Volts. Did you call your State Rep and bitch about the fact that the rebate was being offered, did you notify the tea party that a $25,000 tax credit on what many consider to be a bad idea of a vehicle must be stopped, did you do that before or even after you personally took advantage of that rebate. Do you have a lot of self conflict with your decision to take a huge tax credit (3X what is offered for the Volt) are is it just a damn shame when other people buy a damn silly vehicle and take what is offered them.

BTW I drove a Volt (just a little bit around the block a few times in city traffic) they are neat, they really are, very nice inside,and they accelerate unexpectedly fast. I'm pretty sure a few will be crashed into the car in front before their owner gets used to that. They are very quiet, virtually silent when running on the battery charge, some people will love that as they are driving through the countryside. Ha but I'm thinking Bob will want to put some baseball cards in the spokes of the wheels of the Volt that King Obama is going to force him to buy when he personally bans the sales of combustion engines.

Dont_carry_it_all

Ah Bob and Spanky,

"FYI The Volt tax credit was enacted 2008 and signed into law by Bush. Back under the first stimulus plan Bush introduced."

Is this true, "counselor"? IF so, please comment (endlessly, per your MO, of course).

Brought to you by our resident gangster -- 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue

http://patriotpost.us/edition/2011/09/23/digest/

Chicago-Style Government

The Era of Obama was supposed to be a time of Hope and Change, transparent and accountable government, and bipartisan song-singing -- indeed, as Obama himself put it, "the moment when the rise of the oceans began to slow and our planet began to heal." Reality has been wholly different. A recession that, according to the National Bureau of Economic Research, ended in June 2009 but has given way to crippling economic stagnation, with no end in sight. Promised transparency quickly gave way to unaccountable czars and closed-door dealings, and bipartisanship was cast aside for the Democrat partisan ramrodding of hard-left legislation through the chambers of Congress. We don't pretend to speak for the planet, but nothing much seems healed.

Amid that bleak picture, there are (at least) three administration scandals that continue to simmer, despite the fact that the Leftmedia and Obama Re-Election Outlets (but we repeat ourselves) have given them scant attention. First is the story of Solyndra's bankruptcy following a $535 million federal loan guarantee from the Obama Department of Energy (part of the 2009 "stimulus"). The hastily issued loan to the California-based solar cell producer was greater than the amount given to 35 states to complete their respective lists of "shovel-ready" infrastructure jobs. When even that wasn't enough, Solyndra sought another $469 million. "Green energy" sure does seem to require an awful lot of green.

Solyndra went bankrupt when its unworkable business model collapsed. Yet, consistent with leftist cronyism, certain creditors who happened to be Democrat donors were placed in front of the taxpayers in the line of recovery -- much as unions were placed in the front of the line for the GM and Chrysler bailouts. Lost in the cover-up are the 1,100 workers abruptly laid off in August who will have a tough time finding jobs, as California is already reeling from high unemployment and is hardly a climate conducive to economic recovery.

Former employees are beginning to tell all, too. "After we got the loan guarantee, they were just spending money left and right," said former Solyndra engineer Lindsey Eastburn. "Because we were doing well, nobody cared. Because of that infusion of money, it made people sloppy." No wonder Solyndra CEO Brian Harrison and CFO W.G. Stover Jr. have announced that they will invoke their Fifth Amendment right against self-incrimination when they testify before Congress today.

Second is the administration's widening venture socialism scandal involving wireless network company LightSquared, which is financed by billionaire Democrat donor Philip Falcone. Military, civilian and government experts are objecting to LightSquared's potential to interfere with the military's GPS network. Air Force Commander Gen. William Shelton blew the whistle last week, claiming that the White House pressured him to modify testimony before Congress to make it more favorable toward LightSquared. He didn't.

LightSquared executives insist that their proposed system's wavelength won't interfere with the adjacent wavelengths used by the military's GPS on the available broadcast spectrum. Despite industry-wide protests, however, LightSquared received fast-track approval for an FCC waiver granting them the right to construct a 4G wireless network for far less capital than the billions the government would extract from its competitors. To address the industry's concerns about GPS interference, LightSquared proposed that everyone else pay to retrofit their GPS devices instead of revising its network to avoid broadband spillover.

Prior to its current incarnation, LightSquared was known as Skyterra, and its ownership included major Obama backers going back to 2004. Obama sold his Skyterra stock in 2005. Along with so much in the president's background, the Leftmedia seem content to characterize such connections as coincidental.

Finally, and most serious, is the continuing cover-up of Project Gunrunner and Operation Fast and Furious. As our readers well know, this project of the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives has resulted in more than 2,000 American weapons illegally crossing into Mexico, not only under the nose of the ATF, but with its consent, fueling the raging drug war south of the border. Reports this week indicate that a third gun linked to Fast and Furious was recovered at the scene of Border Patrol agent Brian Terry's murder in December. Furthermore, according to Darrell Issa, Chairman of the House Oversight Committee investigating this scandal, Fast and Furious guns were used in at least 200 murders in Mexico -- and that's a conservative estimate. The administration is in full rear-covering mode, and the Leftmedia have, predictably, remained virtually silent.

Is it too much to ask that the media start doing their jobs? It's high time the Chicago thugs in the White House are held accountable for their actions.

PS. Many men still prefer Ginger,...or so I'm told!

__________________________________________

Clara: I always was, and always will be a Mary Ann man.

Old GOP 1960, you are dead on brother!

These young folks forgot about that "we want our country back". In the 1950's, 26% of this country's labor force were in unions. In 2010 9% of the country is in unions. In the 1950's A family could live like kings with one person income but today it takes 2 working members sometimes with extra jobs just to keep up.

In the 1950's the south was ruled by Democrats who relied on conservative moral principles and socialism in the form of government subsidies to support poor farmers and retirees who were disproportionately poorer than their northern counterparts; that is until socialism helped African Americans. Southerners were wooed by Nixon and company on a platform of "States Rights" in a revolt against Lyndon Johnson who signed the Civil Rights Act of 1964 into law. The platform to woo the south was called "The Southern Strategy". Over night, Johnson posters were replaced with Goldwater posters and the South has been red ever since.

Republicans used to be about efficiency, then they became about ideology in order to "rule". Today's conservative is yesterdays Liberal but with a twist: Big government is only wrong when the other side gets a hand out.

Spanky-

Obama is on the teevee right now saying "pass the bill."

Obama is a venture socialist, and that is horrible

Spanky-

Isn't that a shame? The President should not have to tell the lazy bums in Congress, you so admire, to do their damn jobs.

The reason you say the President is a socialist-- is because you got sucked into vortex of right wing world LIES from professional hacks-- such as yourself.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Public_Law_110-343 Scroll down to

Energy Improvement and Extension Act of 2008

Some conservatives were for "green energy" before they were against it.

Hunter - What we have here is pure neglect of a spoiled generation.

Our children have been handed everything and didn't have to work for what they've got.

I have seen many 2nd generation businesses fail because the founders children threw out the very qualities that made them great. "I know that dad used that special ingredient, but it just costs too much, and so we'll just make it the way we want." Our children were given the golden goose, and instead of collecting the eggs, they have decided to pluck him and eat him.

There is no real difference between our political parties. They are both bought and paid for by corporate interests. The political wrangling portrayed to the world is nothing more than a dog and pony show.

By the way, Love those EERS!

WAC once again you seem to better illustrate what you don't know better than what I don't know, there is no range anxiety with the Volt, it has a nine gallon gas tank that you can go 340 miles on, you do not get stranded if the batteries get low. It has a small combustion engine which generates electricity if needed, the wheels are always powered by the electric motor, which is why even if you are running on gas you get such good gas mileage without sacrificing performance as you felt it under battery charge. This is series hybrid technology, where the car always operates as an electric, which can be charged but can generate its own electricity for long trips. Spanky the old parallel hybrid technology is much more complicated because both a combustion engine and an electric motor simultaneously provide power to the wheels, which makes transmission extremely complicated and inefficent. I guarrantee you Spanky that the Volts series hybrid design is a not a failure and is a vast improvement over the older parallel hybrid technology. I will agree with WAC on this much your range on any vehicle whether it is an electric or a combustion engine will be affected by wind, driving habits, terrain, extreme climates, wheather conditions, that is true on a bicycle ride as well, some that is true for an airplane ride too, whats your point WAC.

Let Fiesty rant about Joe. He deserves the headline. Any father that puts his personal life ahead of his children will most likely put his personal ego ahead of those he represents. Weiner went, and now it is time to go Joe. Continue the purge of the parties.

Any father that puts his personal life ahead of his children will most likely put his personal ego ahead of those he represents

Thanks cdahl - just so you know if Joe had a (D) after his name it wouldn't make a bit of difference.

If someone fails at his FIRST job of being a father, he sure as heck isn't qualified to serve his constiuants.

Have a nice weekend! ;o)

We have a WINNER!!!!

Congratulations fielden - you "got" it.

It a credit for ALL hybrids, it is not a "Volt Credit" as was my very point in comment # 1.54. Fielden you re-iterated exactly what I said. Problem is People like Don't Carry, rive By and others just don't get it.

But don't tell Don't Carry - he/she will never learn unless and until he/she does their own work.

Again libbies and tax just don't mix.

Forrest IRC Sec. 179 [the one that has allowed me and so man others to enjoy HUGE tax benefit on luxury SUV] applies to ALL equipment that qualifies. Trucks, CNC machines - the whole shebang.

It is therefore totally different than the hybrid tax credit. If you are arguing it should not apply to certain equipment, which is wha you appear to be doing, it ain't gonna fly. That is the fundamental misunderstanding you libbies try to apply to oil and gas companies and is exactly why this Buiffett Rule Crap is just plain dumb.

I'm starting to see a trend. In each debate, the Republican audience reaches a new low.

First, we had the debate where good, "Christian", Republicans rose to a thunderous applause over the mere mention of executions. Not a solemn acceptance, not a realization that this is a necessary evil that contradicts their religious tenants... no, a thunderous applause.

Second, we had the debate where the question about "what to do?" with those who can not afford medical insurance. The Republican audience chants "Let him die!" Again, displaying those strong, "Christian" morals.

And last night they came through once again. A soldier, fighting for their freedom, risking his life so that they can maintain theirs, asks a question about DADT... and those good Republicans "Boooo" him. That's right, they DO NOT show support for this troop, they DO NOT show thankfulness over his sacrifice, they DO NOT show pride for a man risking his life for our freedom... NO, they "Boooo" him. They mock a soldier, on national television, just because of his sexual preference. They completely ignore his sacrifice, his service, his loyalty to the country, and instead mock him.

So to recap... cheering for executions, shouting to let people die, and now mocking our soldiers. The Republicans here should be so proud of their peers, so proud.

joe in albany, re your first post dismissing anything "green";

why is China pouring $30 billion a year in government subsidies in order to corner the solar power market?

Happy Bday to Jody and Newday!! And Feisty - don't worry about no redheads at the sperm bank, it just makes you more special! Besides your hair is absolutely beautiful!

See the gang at DDI - play "Cry Me A River" for all the GOPNOPES!

Have another great week off Congress.

Lawyers.... : P

As to the merits of the technology - no argument.

But it is a failure economically. No one wants it, yet Caddy is now going to make one. Now what truly private company would say -"Yeah, those Volt sales are great, let's re-badge on as a Caddy?"

Plus the technoloy of the Betamax was just as good as VHS.

Volt - grossly over priced [particularly in real, unsubsidized costs], and not as fuel efficient in the long run as a Sonata.

Plus - what happens in 6 yeas when the battery dies? $10-15k to replace. Really?

But no matter Forrest - the market has already decided, just like it decided on Solyndra. Big picture is all of this has wrecked team green, just like Obama has wrecked Keynesian theories - cause in practice they all totally suck.

Newly-Independent-

Are you similarly seeing a "trend" as President Obama's job approval level continues to reach new lows?

C'mon...

You must be "starting" to see it.

Relax. It's not your imagination.

And...

Hmmm.

Are you sure you're really an "independent"?

No matter.

Seems like everyone's an "independent" these days.

Even rednecks.

Me too, actually.

Can you tell?

What private companies would invest in electric/hybrid technology?

Tesla

Nissan

Ford

Mitsubishi

Toyota

Honda

Mercedes

Fisker Karma

Volkswagen/Audi

BMW

Fiat

And those are just companies with their eyes on the US. There are more in Europe. http://www.cleanfleetreport.com/clean-fleet-articles/top-electric-cars-2010/

Looks like the market has decided that the Volt is just the tip of the iceberg.

Let's see what happens to Caddy's "Volt" project when the subsidies disappear.

Of course, GM's shareholders (like the federal government, for example) might insist on the continuation of this most excellent idea.

And...the technology is a failure as well.

Gasoline engines AND cars powered by electric motors date to the end of the 19th century.

Nearly a hundred years before space travel.

Hybrids?

Gas engines married to electric motors?

"Cutting-edge" technology?

Really?

Don't make me laugh.

Mixed Bag -

Nice attempt at trying to change the subject. Personally, I could care less about Obama's approval rating. The GOP candidate I want is not even allowed to debate, because he is against the corrupt, corporate money from lobbyists.

Back to my original point, why don't you just join the Westboro baptist church and start protesting military funerals? At this point, there is hardly a difference between them and current Republicans. You both love when people die, you both mock and "Boo" soldiers who fight for your freedom. Seriously, you are one step away from funeral protests... might as well just join them.

But, I believe that if Walsh had a (D) behind his name, you would wait until the judge ruled against him in the case.

@John -- drum roll please. Now how will the electricity be generated to power all of these vehicles?

Spanky, I will be happy to explain some of the reasons why it is being released in a limited area and slowly rolled out across the nation. The technical reasons are going to turn some people on a political blog off, but it is what it is. First it is all about infrastructure, every rechargeable car from every manufacture comes with a standard 120 volt power supply that can be cord connected to an outlet but draws enough current that people will soon find that they will want this on a dedicated circuit. In many cases they might need one installed in their garage, or car port, and what about apartment dwellers. The standard 120v charger takes a long time to charge the car compared to what all the manufacturers are calling level 2 charging. Level two charging is available for all electric cars, but it involves a 240v up to 80 amp dedicated hard wired circuit, level two charging is completed in 42% of the the level 1 charging time. There are people that are excited about these cars but the public does not necessarily understand the infrastructure charges that will be required, when we start to branch out and talk about the added infrastructure to provide public charging, and the obvious loading of an ageing and often inadequate electrical distribution systems it makes the marketing guys nervous on a slam bang roll out of something that has this much potential impact. They are smart guys these marketing wiz kids and these electrical engineers they want to take it slow and easy so people can get used to what it takes and give everybody the chance to make the necessary infrastructure improvements. The big advantage for America is that 55% of all the oil we use is for personal transportation, so you slowly shift from using oil for transportation to using more electricity. We have to spend enormous wealth for foreign oil, we never buy foreign electricity. We can control the generation of electricity, no foreign government can squeeze our supply of electricity, we can build all the generators we want, and run all the wires we want, nobody could ever stop us from generating electricity but us. As you might guess there is all kinds of political opposition and lobbying by the oil company's to muck up any transition to electric cars as much as possible. The big three auto manufacturers are all on board and working together with many other industries because we have a self inflicted shortage of electrical power generation capability, and the infrastructure to deliver it. The president is doing what many said they wanted, reducing our dependency on forgein and precious domestic oil sources, he is trying to put all kinds of people, equipment manufacturers, and private contractors to work building in America. He trying to provide a way of spending some wealth in America on Americans instead of Saudi Arabia, it sounded good when every president said that since 1974, and now some people are suddenly dead set against it.

Anyway there is lots more I can tell you about the slow roll out any time anybody wants to talk about electric cars, I guarantee you it has nothing to do with the Volt being a lemon, it is quite the opposite they are actually worried about too selling too many too soon as it turns out.

you would wait until the judge ruled against him in the case.

Thanks for reminding me - you see, ol Joe hasn't shown up in court to defend himself to date.

Wonder why that is?

Wouldn't a innocent man want to clear his name?

Kind of strange if you ask me...

Matter of fact IF the dead beat daddy doesn't show up for his next court date he's facing contempt charges... lol

Here's hoping the judge throws away the key! ;o)

PS: Did I mention he also writes bad checks?

I'm a Vietnam vet, Newly-Independent.

I'm not going to be going to any Westboro Baptist Church protests.

If you don't know what you're talking about, at least try to be aware of who you're talking to, OK?

You've made my point better than I did.

Thanks for that, anyway.

Thanks Forrest for an enlightening post. Some people embrace change others have a hard time. Stanford's campus has dedicated lots for charging with a few different charging outlets...one of the few I have ever seen. I hear Tesla has made significant progress in their design. Keep on my friend.

Mixed Bag-

You're a vet and you support a party who "Boo's" a fellow soldier? Are you serious?

You support people who "Boo" one of your brothers?

What kind of person are you?

Oh yes, you are completely different than the Westboro Baptist Church... they are civilians who disrespect soldiers. YOU are a fellow soldier who disrespects other soldiers. Yes, that makes you SOOOOOOOOO much better.

MB - Seems like everyone's an "independent" these days....Me too, actually.

Mixed Bag, I'm glad to see that your positions are changing, perhaps for the better?

Newly Indie I agree with Mixed Bag perhaps you have chosen to vent unwarrantedly at him. The types that displayed the cheers for execution, and denial of medical service seem to be at the very far fringes of the Tea Party. I can let MB speak for himself but my view is that does not describe him.

MB - I know that you would not participate in the hateful cat calls, booing etc. prevalent at the last three debates, however how do you feel about them?

By the way thanks for your service.

All well and good Forrest, but the fact is t Ford sells more F-150 in like five minutes than Chevy sells volts in a month.

F-150 - there is a reason it has been the number one seling vehicle forever.

It's what American actually wants to buy. The Gov, Al Gore, slow roll outs ain't going to change that simple fact.

So which gets better milage the Volt of the Cruz? How about overall cost per gallon over the life of the vehicle.

Bad economics Forrest - just look at Sloyndra.

Spanky

Forrest IRC Sec. 179 [the one that has allowed me and so man others to enjoy HUGE tax benefit on luxury SUV] applies to ALL equipment that qualifies. Trucks, CNC machines - the whole shebang.

It is therefore totally different than the hybrid tax credit. If you are arguing it should not apply to certain equipment, which is wha you appear to be doing, it ain't gonna fly.

No I was not arguing that at all, I was arguing your phony outrage about the government essentially supporting one industry over another be it heavy equipment or electric cars by unnecessarily handing out tax payers money as incentives, money taken from people who earned it, except in the case where it is handed to you.You are the one who seems to be making a distinction of when this is okay and when it is not. I don't get it what is the difference between the heavy equipment manufacturers and the electric car manufacturers other than you don't plan to buy an electric car.

Nope, Newly-Independent.

I'm an "independent" just like you.

Who's showing disrespect for a soldier here...

You...or me?

Hi, Mark.

And...thanks.

With regard to the catcalls related to the death penalty...I live in California.

I can relate to the anger over the systematic rejection of the will of California's juries and jurors where the death penalty is concerned.

I hope that you might forgive an emotional outburst from me had I been in one of the audiences you're referring to.

Again...

Thanks, Mark.

Mixed Bag-

You are right, I have no respect for you because you obviously support people who "Boo" fellow soldiers. And don't even try to tell me you are independent... a real independent would not try to change the subject, bring up Obama, and skirt the issue of people disrespecting our soldiers. A real independent can recognize this vile behavior, and not try to justify it or change the subject.

As someone who has family in Afghanistan right now, I am completely disgusted by the Republican reaction towards our soldiers. I support any person who risks and sacrifices his/her life for our freedom, and I will defend them against ANYONE who disrespects them... including a former vet.

Yellowdog-

Newly Indie I agree with Mixed Bag perhaps you have chosen to vent unwarrantedly at him. The types that displayed the cheers for execution, and denial of medical service seem to be at the very far fringes of the Tea Party. I can let MB speak for himself but my view is that does not describe him.

Well we disagree, because in my view those people absolutely represent Mixed Bag. He has not spoken out against them, instead he tried to change the subject and twist it into a discussion about Obama. This is a typical debate tactic where a person (MB) does not have a logical argument against a point, so this person attempts to change the discussion so that he does not have to address the original issue.

I would have a lot more respect for him (MB), any of the candidates, or any Republican who stands up and condemns this type of behavior. Unfortunately, no one on the right is willing to stand up to these people.

A real independent can recognize this vile behavior

Bingo Newly-Independent!

The bag boy & dangerfield both like to play both sides against the middle!

When the truth is neither are nothing more then wolves in sheeps clothing.

Be careful, when cornered they like to bite or threaten to punch your teeth out!

PS: I enjoy reading your comments! ;o)

Newly-Independent-

Can I assume then, that you'll join me in supporting President Obama's effort to defeat the Taliban in Afghanistan?

Perhaps we can find common purpose after all...

Even though you view my bonafides as an "independent" with suspicion...as I similarly view yours?

Let's agree to support the President's policy to defeat the Taliban.

Ha Spanky your right the F150 has been a classic, and Ford has mach ups off a series hybrid electric F150 it has torque more akin to a diesel electric locomotive than anything a traditional F150 has ever produced.

The series hybrids will get better gas mileage than the small combustion engine only vehicles, it is more efficient to use gas to make electricity and then use electricity to drive the wheels. This will get even better as battery technology improves, but it is already the case. If you do 50 mile trips you won't burn any gas in the Volt for instance and most people will save a lot of money, because the electricity costs are cheaper than gasoline, of course that will vary for everybody depending on your local energy costs, but the electricity is cheaper than gas, unless too many electric cars someday cause the price of gas to drop, wouldn't that be a lucky break for a guy with all your toys.

Spanky: Volt - grossly over priced [particularly in real, unsubsidized costs], and not as fuel efficient in the long run as a Sonata.

And personal computers initially cost tne times and more what they cost today and were unreliable. The first Sony VCRs were huge and expensive.

The point is, all technology starts somewhere. Initially it is often very expensive and sometimes requires some help to get going without immediate public support or market. But we have to start. Particularly on items that depend on a non-renewable resource like oil.

America is all about technology and invention. We always have been. Would you have denied Edison a grant? Steve Jobs?

Oh no Joe tell me you did not go there - trying to imagine that you are Forrest Grump having a wet dream, Joe I find it real spooky that you have been having these kinds of thoughts ever since you lost your job as the teller at the sperm bank, you might need counseling buddy.

Thanks Fiesty. I recognize I am going a little overboard with this, but with family currently fighting for our freedoms, I take this behavior personal.

I guess it's too much to ask for anyone to hold the behavior of their own party accountable. It's sad that lives are on the line, and people determine their support based on their party or the private actions that take place in someone's private bedroom.

with family currently fighting for our freedoms

I thank them for their service.

I guess it's too much to ask for anyone to hold the behavior of their own party accountable

Never gonna happen with the bag boy - he's really nothing more than a snarky professional instigator!

Have a nice weekend!

lol, "Newly-Independent".

First Read isn't HuffPo or DailyKos.

The conservatives here don't roll over.

Surprise!

That said...

Best wishes to my fellow veterans in your family fighting to defeat the Taliban.

"snarky professional instigator"

Why, Feisty...

How autobiographical.

First Read's #1 blogger.

What's your payroll number, baby?

They can't have convinced you to work for nothing...although, Chuck Todd might have insisted on paying you what you're worth.

Good for Chuck.

fielden-

How much did Thomas Edison get?

MB parallel hybrid technology is fading, series hybrids are still considered hybrids because they do have a very small combustion engine, but it never drives the wheels it just generates electricity if needed for range. I agree trying to marry a combustion engine to an electric motor simultaneously delivering torque to the wheels was a difficult engineering proposition to solve, they did it and they learned a lot, the series hybrid is a much better solution to the range problems an all electric vehicle would have for many people. We can increase the range, we can shorten the charging times, but what if I told you that you had to change the electric panel in your home to provide the extra 100 amps load capacity to fully charge your car in one hour, that has a lot to do with the slow careful limited release. All problems that can be solved, if we only had the desire and the money to solve them, they have to be solved sooner or later, because oil is a finite world commodity, but we can make all the electricity we want we know all different kinds of way of making electricity. Some people like the idea of solar panels because nobody has figured out how to charge them for sunlight, yet. How about we build some power houses and fix an electrical distribution system that goes down every time the wind blows a little too hard. Would you vote for spending money on something like that, say more electricity for California, instead of a 4 billion subsidy for the oil industry, kind of spread the wealth to some other area in need, and cover our bet a bit with the long term viability of dependence on oil for all our transportation needs. I agree electric vehicles have been around a long time as long as combustion engine vehicles they worked then, they work now, the cars work way better now, and we did not have electric power past the big cities back then. We are immensely more electrified now, but our grid and many of our local power companies need an upgrade and in many areas an overhaul, everybody is starting to realizing just how bad it is.

Mixed Bag - I hope that you might forgive an emotional outburst from me had I been in one of the audiences you're referring to.

MB are you trying to make me reconsider my earlier post?

Other than when attending a sporting event, or other entertainment venues, I raise an eyebrow when overexubarant voices are raised. I understand that you and many others support the death penalty and have different ideas than me. However I would consider a silent protest a more respectful way to conduct yourself during a debate dialogue discussing such a weighty subject.

Newly indie - I would have a lot more respect for him (MB), any of the candidates, or any Republican who stands up and condemns this type of behavior. Unfortunately, no one on the right is willing to stand up to these people.

Pulling MB out of the equation for a moment, I would love one of the GOP to have a Clinton - Sister Souljah moment. I agree there are not many people that speak up when one of their own cross the line. Welcome to First Read sir.

Also, I thank you and your family and sons for the sacrifice they are undertaking while most of the country chooses to takes little heed to the ongoing oft time escalating wars.

Forrest - Jumping in late on the hybrid car talk but you did a pretty good job. I'm one of those Tree hugger types that bought and received a $1500 tax deduction for a Honda Civic hybrid back in 2007. I love me my Hybrid - 48 mpg when I use hypermiling techniques. Next car, hopefully circa 2015 or so may be an all electric if the ranges increase, if not I will probably try a plug in.

LMarkT wrote: "This is pure insanity! It takes "the end justifies the means" to it's bitter extremes! This antic (and that's all it is), will inevitably cause yet another hit to consumer confidence, yet one more hit to our economy, yet another free-fall on Wall Street, a loss of American net worth, fewer jobs, less tax revenue, and, yes, more f#$%ing debt."

That's because this is precisely what the Teapublicans want--economic failure--otherwise they have zero chance in 2012. But the American people are catching on, as various polls are showing. And try as they may, the GOP/TP leadership knows damn well if there is a government shutdown they will be blamed far more than the Dems. But the uncompromising Tea Party Raucous in the House are so extreme they are willing to take Boehner and McConnell down with them.

We are "addicted to oil," and for generations every administration, whether Republican or Democrat have been trying to end dependence on foreign oil. Why are conservatives so against "green technology?" And talk about trade deficits, China is getting all the contracts for manufacture of wind turbines, for example.

The right-wing is such a sorry lot these days. All they can do is criticize instead of offering solutions of their own (and no, more tax cuts and deregulation are not new ideas for the future, and in fact have been proved as detrimental to our economy). It's bad enough to obstruct, but that's really the biggest disappointment about conservatives, is their complete failure to roll up their sleeves and get to work on viable solutions, even their own if they had any.

Gang: First of all, WHY is everyone up in arms over Solyndra? Ex-President Bush subsidized quite a few new businesses himself; unfortunately, none of them tanked. It happens...get over it. Quit blaming President Obama for EVERYTHING. God, if your dog got hit by a car, would you blame President Obama for that TOO???

Secondly, I CAN'T believe Congress is going out on another "vacation." Didn't they just come back from a month off? And, the GOP righties keep complaining that President Obama takes too many vacations (although ex-President Bush had him beat by a long shot). Is this what we pay them to do...take vacations? Oh sure, I know...they're going back to their home states to talk to their constituents. Fat change of that happening....if they ACTUALLY TALKED to their constituents (and not the ones that pay to get into their storefront meetings), they wouldn't be dragging their feet like they have been!

Lastly, I wonder how Gov. Perry feels about the budget deal on subsidizing FEMA....didn't he just recently ask for aid for fire damage in Texas (partially caused by his lack of understanding when he cut back on the Fire Departments in his state)? I wonder how HE'D vote on this one! Maybe it's better if I remain in the dark on that one!

It also seems to me that those who keep harping (on other vines) about the lack of experience that President Obama had when he was elected President seem to forget that being a Governor of a state, such as Texas (which is a died-in-the-wool Republican state), Perry lacks just as much experience (if not more) than President Obama!! He scares the beejeezus out of me everytime he opens his mouth!

Okay....I'm done with my ranting for today. As a note, I'm an ex-WAC, and I think the soldiers toda are getting a really rough deal from our government....they're treated with as much distain as we Vietnam vets were treated by the public when we came back stateside! Makes you wonder why attitudes have changed over the years, and I chalk it up to those spoiled children that we raised! The ones that run around with cell phones in their ears or texting as they walk down the street! Ridiculous!! Guess I'm just getting old...oh well!

Thanks JohnB, I was not exagerating when I said every manufacturer is producing electrics. By the way in April of 2010 Toyota sold it's 1 millionth Prius hybrid in the US, I have no idea what they are up to now.

Let me add that is One million of just one model, from just one company, there are far more foreign electrics out there than you may think. You know American Companies used to be first with this kind of thing not the last. We are giving corporations the benefit of tax breaks so they can be innovative job creators, I thought that was what republicans like best. So now why don't you like, what you always say you like.

Apparently, nost of the Democrats I have read on these sites are BLINDLY faithful to NObama. Is it a party thing? I have been a Democrat all of my life, but even I could see from the beginning that this man was talking through his a$$ from day one. Now that there is an election looming and he is once again on the campaign trail, we are hear all of the same BS that got him elected in the first place. I know that everyone likes to blame the Republicans for blocking all of the bills that come from him, but do any of you think that maybe he is presenting ideas that completely suck? Just look at the new jobs bill. The first one did nothing but pay for HUGE bonuses to the dimwits on Wall Street who helped to cause this mess. And this one will do nothing more than line the pockets of the corrupt Unions. Please!! Give us another choice!!

Forrest -- Traded my Jeep for the Prius last year. Will add the Jeep Wrangler Sahara in next year as I really loved my Jeep. (Not to mention that 4 wheel drive comes in handy during winter.) Can't complain about the Prius in fact it reduced our gas bill by two-thirds and we were able to use the savings toward paying for the ever increasing costs of an education. Which now is almost more than the cost of two vehicles combined per year! Again thanks for your insight.

No, no, no, Forrest...

You've completely missed the point.

Gasoline engines and electric motors are both, individually OR cumulatively, OBSOLETE technologies...or certainly ought to be, given that both originated in the 19th century, for heavenssakes!

How much coal-fired or oil-fired electric power will be required to power hybrid or all-electric vehicles?

C'mon, Forrest...

The answer is a completely new form of motive power...just as gasoline engines and electric motors were compared to steam power and beasts of burden more than one hundred years ago.

I would not vote to spend one dime of taxpayer money on electric cars.

You really can't grasp what I'm saying?

Gasoline/electric hybrid autos?

The future?

Please.

MB I think a Cadillac Badged hybrid is just the ticket from a marketing standpoint. Cadillacs are expensive, really neat electric cars are expensive. People that buy Cadillacs have a little money to spend, the earliest adopters of new technology tend to be young educated professionals, who make good money. lastly because Cadillac is traditionally been the innovator cutting edge badge for GM, and you can already get sustained world class sports car performance out of an all electric, (Tesla and Fiskar has proven that beyond a shadow of a doubt), they only have begun to explore the bells and whistles that are possible on an electric car, and that makes it a good marketing fit in my opinion.

Ha wait to you see the aftermarket stuff that starts to pop up with crazy bastards like me that know just enough about cars and electricity to be damn dangerous. No seriously this is where you will see individual entrepreneurs pop up, and they already have there is a shop that will convert your roof on your Prius to a solar array and you get a bit of free energy courtesy of the sun. The amazing thing is it still looks like a stock Prius, people will think of a lot more neat stuff if we encourage them, at least we used to give our kids coming out of engineering school a chance to think about neat stuff and a place to do it.

MB Obama seems to try and be pragmatic and work in the present, I believe it was Dubya that wanted a car like George Jetson's.

Great series of posts on hybrid technology, Forrest. New technologies have always had doubters who are absolutely certain of their rightness. In 1945 an "authority" wrote an article about locomotives that survived in the Encyclopedia Americana into the 1960s. The author believed diesel/electric locomotives had a place in railroad switching but would never supplant steam in intercity travel. Know what happened? Steam locomotives in the US went entirely out of service in mainline service within 10 years. Know what happened after that? Diesel/electric locomotives have just gotten better. Know what resembles a diesel/electric locomotive in a lot of ways? A series hybrid.

What we're seeing here is the tendency of some to think a problem only has one solution. Not true. For myself, a new Mustang GT looks just about perfect, but hybrid tech is just about perfect for the large number of buyers who view their car as just another appliance, one that supplies transportation instead of playing DVDs, heating food with microwaves, or keeping things cold so they don't spoil.

As for the belief that we need a totally new technology, people have been predicting the demise of internal combustion for a long time. Today direct injection and more advanced turbocharging is giving the "obsolete" internal combustion engine 20% more power and fuel economy at the same time.

Something like Hydrogen fuel cell propulsion would fit the bill for something totally new, but people have thought that one is right around the corner for about 30 years now. There's no indication that's about to change, so that opens the door to other new technologies...from incremental like direct injection to more radical like hybrids. If and when fuel cells are ready for prime time they'll face many of the same issues as plug in hybrids...lack of infrastructure for fueling, lack of user familiarity with the technology, consumer resistance to change, and initially very high costs.

Meanwhile we're back where we started WAY up the thread. With massive funding of the Conservative Movement coming from oil, gas, and coal tycoons they've created a movement with the strangely odd characteristic that conservation isn't Conservative.

Bad economics Forrest - just look at Sloyndra

spanky, solyndra?

you mean the company that was run out of business by the $30 billion annual subsidies that the Chinese government is using to put our solar manufacturers out of business?

the Chinese are expanding their solar production as fast as they can , and you are happy to let the rest of the world pass us by.

so much for "American excellence" with the right in charge, we will be the great britian of the 21st century

Thanks JohnB, I could have described the transition problems in more detail but the car manufacturers and a lot of other people are seriously worried about the nations electrical grid, plenty of people are willing to buy electric cars, but our ability to supply the increased demand for electrical power is a huge potential problem, it is not a new problem, but the rechargeable electric cars have brought it to the forefront. I might have mentioned this before, in fact I know I did, but the first electric car is credited to a man named William Morrison from Des Moines, IA in 1886. What I don't understand is republicans claim corporations need tax breaks so they can invest and be competitive job creators, so a tax credit is offered as an incentive for the purchase of an electric vehicle, which takes tax money away from the government and effectively transfers it to the corporations, which supports their attempt at new products and innovations and creates jobs, and now they are dead set against it. Notice how they center their outrage around the Chevy Volt and not the foreign cars that qualify for the incentive, you get the feeling they just don't want GM and it's unionized workforce to catch any breaks. Notice how Spanky can justify his $25,000 tax break on his giant pecker extension, Ha I meant SUV, but is outraged that a $7,500 tax credit is offered on a Volt. Republicans can't keep their story straight, they don't know what they like anymore, they have no stable rationale, they change it as it suits them, and they have no plans on how to improve the situation in America except tax breaks for and deregulation of industry, now when an American industry is supported by a tax credit for it's customers they don't like it. I can't see them getting anything but hammered in the next election, they don't even like their own presidential candidates and the republican controlled House has never been held in lower esteem, never, almost 9 out 10 people think they suck, that can't be good for them.

Great points Danwill and Forrest. Particularly in that Conservatives are all about the tax breaks. Particularly significant I think is their support for the 100+ year old and highly profitable oil industry but not the emerging technology that will allow us to actually consume LESS oil. It's all about where the Right's money comes from.

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL

Just an observation.

If you waited until someone else makes a post before you post at #1 spot, perhaps all of the other posts won't get 'collapsed' when yours does. It would be more courteous on your part.

Should I expect a profane reply? Time will tell.

PS - I don't believe in collapsing posts - they're often good for a laugh and helps to figure out which people are rational and which are not.

It would be "polite" of her to back down in the face of bullies? Yeah, that's the solution...

Then next week it would be "polite" of her to not post at all.

IR, nothing better than a look back to prove the GOP sounds like a broken record. 30 years of failed trickle down policies and Grover Nordquist and the best economic growth and job creation occurred with higher taxes and democratic presidents.

Jody, Interesting how you place blame and rewrite history, yet ignore or excuse the last 33 months of the Obama administration. But I bet you believe whatever happened during a Republican administration was their doing and only their responsibility. So how is it, none of this poor economy is Obama's responsibility? It works both ways, but not in your mind.

Independent Redneck Va.

GOP Recycles Failed 1993 Talking Points on Taxes

Excellent, IR, how come the crazy republicans can't see it?

I know; I think.

They got sucked into their FOX HOLE where they don't hear their evil or see their evil.

If the American people would just take the time to research the tea people GOP republicans over the last 30 years they would see their doing the same things over and over, they didn't work then and they aren't working now. But they do keep coming up with new buzz words that catch people's attention, they do nothing to create policies but they sure know how to deliver a buzz word. Good thing they have Frank Luntz to give them their buzz words.

Great post as always, IR.

All the Conservatives can manage is to lie as usual, denying that the economy has been growing since early 2009. http://www.bea.gov/National/nipaweb/TableView.asp?SelectedTable=264&ViewSeries=NO&Java=no&Request3Place=N&3Place=N&FromView=YES&Freq=Qtr&FirstYear=2007&LastYear=2011&3Place=N&Update=Update&JavaBox=no#Mid

If we reverse that momentum and slip back into recession it won't be do to the WH, it will be Tea Party brinksmanship, the governmental gridlock they've caused, and their insistence upon more of the Supply Side economics proven to be a failure over the last 3 decades.

Oooohh, Bev-

As the President's job approval numbers drop, your comments are getting increasing strident...bordering on hysterical.

You've even begun to call the President of the United States "Barry".

Get help.

So Independent Red - So republicans are all wrong, same old talking points got it.

So how about Obama and the dems - is this what you would hold up as right?

IR was blowing through $5 Trillion in 3 years the right thing? Sure doesn't seem to be helping out much. Gosh, even Soros thinks we are in a double dip.

John B - Oh, so this is what growth looks like. Thanks for the heads up my man.

Oh and IndependentRed - why was Obama in front of that particular bridge yesterday? Kinda seems like a bad choice, no?

Damn Spanks again with the bridge. Whats that all about. Guess it's just like the man says up there. Same Sh!t Different Day.

Golly Independent he's my president too.

He's trying to tout his jobs bill, which is fine. But then he goes out to a bridge that has nothing to do with that bill.

It's kinda embarassing - either he doesn't understand his own bill, and what it can and can't do, or ?

Help me understand why my president, in the age of huge deficits and 9.1 unemployment, the day before the company he gave 1/2 a billion to take the 5th, was in front of that bridge.

Just nothing else going on?

Oh, and IndependentRed - things are much different now than even just a few weeks ago, or are you not paying attention?

No Spanky, it was a pretty good idea. Did you hear the responses from Boehner and McConnell. President Obama scared the crap out of them by being in front of that bridge.

Mixed Bag

Oooohh, Bev-

You've even begun to call the President of the United States "Barry".

Get help.

Bag boy

Stick to the facts. Tea-baggers need help.

Spanky-

What makes you think "Independent" Redhead would prefer to discuss Solyndra, rather than the bridge?

Sadly Mo - it appears to has also scared the crap out of the market.

Come on Mo - it was a bad pick. One in a series of mistakes by Obama.

Mixed - you say Readhead, I say Redneck.

In the end, whether the head or the neck is red, the problem is the Blue, and Team Blue is is bad shape.

Redhead, Redneck...a distinction without a difference.

Interchangeable.

As you've noted...both red.

I used to think one was smarter than the other.

All the GOP Rhetoric is Repackaged

and the USA is #43 out of 44 Industrialized Nation Due to lack of Almost EVERYTHING

accept GREED..........................................................

Stay the CORPORATE == GOP LYING COURSE

Shoot for the BOTTOM ...Only The Worst left........................!

Independent Redneck:

Truly a super post. It's good to be reminded of history now and again. I'll be tuning in to Jody in a minute for the weekly wrap. Two things first.

John A. has been pitching a book that is a must read. Fellow liberal-types, you must read What's the Matter with Kansas, by Thomas Frank. His observations are not limited to Kansas. They accurately describe a huge segment of the Republican Party nationwide, and go a long way toward explaining why these people routinely vote against their own self-interests. John is also recommending another Thomas Frank book called The Wrecking Crew. This too is an excellent read and if you ever wondered why Grover Norquist and his fellow lackeys came to have such incredible success in selling ideas that promise to destroy those who espouse those ideas.......well, it's right there in the book. Republicans are some truly scary folks.

Second point. We are not going into a double-dip recession. The truth is, we never came out of the recession - THE CRASH - that began during the Bush Administration. There is no point in blaming President Bush for that disaster. It would have most likely occurred regardless of who had been elected in 2004. All the variables for disaster were there.

What is happening is that the majority of U.S. citizens cling to the notion that somehow or other we are going to return to an economy that is very similar to the one we had prior to the crash. That simply is not going to happen. We are in that dreaded "jobless recovery". That's the new norm. No one - Republican or Democrat - is going to change that fact.

To boom again, the United States MUST embrace reality. What a concept. There are not enough "high-paying" jobs to go around. We must rebuild our infrastructure. It's in horrible shape. We must educate our best and brightest and stop throwing money at kids who shouldn't be taking classroom space beyond the 8th grade. We must understand that we must lead the world in efficient "green energy" - for lack of a better term - creation, storage, and transmission.

IR, happy to report that the husband has healed and the repairs to the chandelier were successful. Much obliged.

I've got my own special plans for the Birthday celebration, so let's compare notes, okay? Happy Friday, buddy!

PS. Old GOP, your Freudian slip is so apt on that thread,...Accept Greed - that's who they really are, the acceptors of GREED. Good one!

Spanky, you obviously did not listen to the Presidents jobs speech.

One of his points was to rebuild the infrastructure of the country. The bridge is part of that infrastructure. The coincidence that it was a bridge between McConnell's state and Boehner's state didn't hurt...

Perhaps the subtlety is too much for you?

fielden,

You missed the point. The bridge that the President was in front of (no doubt to make a point) didn't qualify for the funding in his proposal. That bridge has been scheduled to be replaced by a new bridge a short distance away, but the proposal doesn't deal with replacements, it deals with repair and rehab.

The Republican naysayers were, of course, wrong on every count. Bill Clinton kept his job and presided over a rapidly growing economy, expanding incomes, new stock market highs and a balanced budget. Clinton, who authored one of the best eight-year economic performances of the modern presidents, bequeathed a CBO-estimated $5.6 trillion surplus to his successor, the man with the worst economic record. Alas, with his tax cut windfall for the wealthy, George W. Bush squandered it and derailed the American economy

"Well isn't that special?" The GOP may have morphed into GOTP but it's the same old gas...

I miss Bill.

Living in LA - perhaps that's just too much subtlety for our friend fielden?

Copied from the American Jobs Act:

(A) highway or bridge projects eligible under title 23, United States Code, including interstate rehabilitation, improvements to the rural collector road system, the reconstruction of overpasses and interchanges, bridge replacements, seismic retrofit projects for bridges, and road realignments;

Note that bridge replacement is mentioned specifically.

History tells us a lot.

Just look at Michigan. That state never recovered from the 2000 recession. In an attempt to create jobs and recover over the last 10 years, they CUT TAXES 99 times and CUT SPENDING by 70%... it did NOT create any new jobs. They tried it, and it did not work.

Now there is a lesson on how to take things out of context if I have ever seen one.

Devie,

How old is that article? I'm willing to bet that Obama's economic record has FAR surpassed Bush's. As a Democrat, I would just like a new candidate, because I really, on good conscience cannot vote for Obama and neither should anyone with half a brain. He doesn't know what he's doing, never has...

IR, and others--John, David, etc., excellent posts.

Tony C -- To answer your question, I am NOT happy with the continuation of wars or aid to countries like Pakistan, or the extension of the Bush tax cuts to prevent a government shutdown, or the spending cuts with no revenue to prevent default on our good faith and credit... If you ever followed left-wing pundits you would know they criticize President Obama just as much as the far-right Teapublicans, and progressives are not ignoring or excusing the last 33 months of the Obama administration.

However, we recognize three things: 1) The economic meltdown President Obama inherited was worse than originally thought; 2) it takes at least five (5) years to recover from a normal recession, and; 3) because of GOP/TP obstructionism and threat downs, we are still operating under Bush era/Republican policies.

So how about you and your fellow right-wingers get real and demand that your Republican representatives stop playing politics, taking vacation, and start doing the job they are paid to do and COOPERATE with the president and Dems to make this a better nation?

fielden,

My apologies, I was incorrect in my statement. The article I read yesterday (re-read a moment ago) said that the bridge didn't qualify. It went on to give the specific reasoning, unfortunately, I didn't read the entire article, again, my apologies. Summarized, it said that the bridge in the backdrop would not be a candidate for funding under this proposal as it is five years out in terms of construction, and it requires (in addition to federal funding) $500 million in state and local funds for construction to commence.

Touchdown as usual Jody!

Have a wonderful Birthday - I'll make sure the bartender has some of that cranberry juice your fond of over at the Dew Drop Inn tonight! ;o)

*hugs*

PS: I've also made sure to add a extra dose of the NJ nut job repellent on your porch - let her find her own property to stink up!

Fine as frog hair split as always Jody. Happy Birthday to one of my Favorte Ladies. Drinks are on the House and your reservation is already waiting for you at the Come Back Inn so you can recover from those paint fumes and working so hard this week.

Happy Birthday Jody! :o)

Thanks again for the b-day wishes. I'll definitely need that cranberry drink and the Come Back Inn to recover from my DYI efforts.

Here's the other way it was this week-

Last night, former New Mexico governor Johnson summed up the entirety of the Obama economic effect on this country with this pithy line-

My next door neighbor's two dogs have created more shovel ready jobs than Obama.

The truth is indisputable- the reasons are myriad.

Secretary of Labor Hilda Solis was before congress, testifying about "green jobs". Turns out that, unsurprisingly, the administration is too clever by half when describing the "success " of their initiatives. Seems if someone is employed as a bus driver, and his company buys a hybrid bus to replace his old bus, ol'Ralph Kramden has a new, "green" job!

It is in line with it's investment of over half a billion tax dollars in Solyndra, a company whose business plan had it making solar cylinders for $6, selling them for $3. Seems they thought they could make money on volume.

Brilliant.

About as brilliant as LightSquared- another company heavily invited in, and owned and run by, Obama donors. They want to be govern bandwidth currently occupied by GPS- used by our military, airlines, and just about everybody else.

Their technology will interfere with that function- so, the White House tried to get two witnesses before congress to LIE to
congress, telling them it could be easily fixed. I can't be- so, I'm calling for Amy and Pat to volunteer to fly on the day it goes live- if it ever does. You can report to the rest of us as to whether or not it interferes with air traffic control, okay?

Another great Obama job plan was bridge building. He appeared on the Ohio side of a bridge that is, actually owned by
Kentucky, and declared that if his spending bill were to pass RIGHT NOW, the bridge would be fixed.

Unfortunately, aside from getting the ownership wring, he also failed to realize that the bridge is already under consideration for widening by the Federal Highway Authority, the process is due to start next year, it will take four years for the process to be completed, only then can work begin- and, from start to finish, the work will not be completed until 2022.

No winder that no less a "conservative" than Bill Clinton has concluded that Obama is out to lunch. He weighed in this week on Obama's tax plan, and called it a waste of time and effort- guaranteed to make things WORSE.

Seems he does not think this latest spending bill will do much good, either- except for adding to the debt. He left out the repayment, tenfold, to Obama's donors.

Suskind's book, titled, appropriately, "Confidence Men" came out this week- to howls of protest. Seems the White House thought that his hit piece on Bush rendered him a FOO- that is, Friend Of Obama.

They thought wrong.

So, a whole bunch of people ran around claiming they did not say the things they said. Sadly for them, Suskind has tape recordings.

Oops.

In one of the strangest developments this week, on the heels of revelations of millions going to bog dollar son ors, Obama called himself a "warrior for the middle class"

Well, all I can say is, of that is how he sees himself, we desperately need a new General.

And a much better battle plan.

Obama shelved in 2012.

Make sure you get your "shovel ready" and "laser focus" as you don't want to miss next years 2nd anniversary of "recovery summer". The 1st anniversary this summer, seems to have slipped right by us withour a White House party. Where is that Biden when you need him? No party at the White House, how can that be?

Jody, Iowa

"And that's the way it is"......this week.

And that was the best summation yet!!!

I thought I read the repubs must see the Donald for a piss stop. I was wrong. Btw: The GOP House is annacondas

NoJo et al -- as I mentioned before, the Gary Johnson-dogs-shovel ready line is funny in more ways than one. The GOP seems to like the dogs and poop jokes (Gov. Romney's poor dog Seamus comes to mind) and it is clear that their dogs leave a lot of mess behind, just like the previous GOP administration did. But do they know how to roll up their sleeves, grab the shovel and clean the place up?

No Joe, did you flunk your writing class? You still need to work on delivery; you just haven't got what it takes--you see, blind hatred never produces good results.

Great compilation Jody. Happy Birthday to you and NDD!

Ms. Jody, what a great run-down, thanks and Happy Birthday!!

Bill O'Reilly has somehow forgotten that President Reagan's tax rate on income $106,000 to $171,580 and over from 1982 to 1986 was:

~~ at 50%.

~~ at 50%.

~~ at 50%.

Happy birthday, Jody. And many of them.

Jody-

You should thank no joe for providing details about the Brent Spence Bridge that you neglectfully omitted.

Your narrative about the bridge was inadequate, incomplete, and misleading.

The Cincinnati Enquirer was also compelled to chide President Obama about the bridge, pointing out that in no way could it currently be considered a shovel-ready project.

You failed to mention that as well, Jody.

Sloppy reporting, I'm afraid.

But...

Happy Birthday!

Kate, awesome; but whatever the dogs leave behind ain't NOTHING compared to what the Elephants leave behind!

(and of course they don't handle 'clean up'! They hire that done, you know, the common folk).

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

Jody, my friend, mighty fine job, mighty fine! I do hope you get that last wall painted this morning so you can relax and recover at the Dew Drop.

IR, I hear Cindy'll be making a right FINE appearance! Do have a GREAT weekend, all!

Happy birthday, Jody! And this round up was the best ever!

Jody, Mixed, Independent Red - can ANYONE tell me why the hell he choose that bridge?

Is it gross incompetence or just cluelessness?

When Obama gets called out on it by even the LA Times you know it was bad.

Dude who does not understand what a shovel ready job is should probably stay way from pandering about bridges that are deemed obsolete and already scheduled for REPlACEMENT.

Wow Jody, your post was excellent.

Perry meets with Murdoch. He needs their clueless viewers.

Romney hires Wall Streeters to assist in his campaign. In other words, he needs their dough.

Romney and Perry are dictating to President Obama that he shouldn't "dictate" to Israel.

Romney agreed with the invasion of Iraq. The killing of innocent civilians. The killing of thousands of innocent civilians.

Perry loses no sleep over possible innocent people being exeuted in his state.

And these two morons are "dictating" to the President what to do on foreign policy?

GWB as well didn't do the due diligence required when it came to executions. He too didn't mind invading Iraq and killing innocent civilians.

****************************************

And the country AND MEDIA stands for this? How is it possible here in America?

Pat - time to move?

Sooner or later ou wil have to admit to yourself just how out of touch you are.

Also you might want to look up the word "dictate" as it clearly does not mean what you think it means. OR how about you explain how Romney or Perry have dictated anything to Obama?

Can you do that Pat, you are you just content to spout off inane drivel?

Keep on keeping on Pat, it is Friday and all.

I understand states rights however, since this 'new Congress is always advocating states rights for everything, why are we calling ourselves "THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA"?

It seems as though that ideology does not exist any longer.

Let each state then become a country unto it'self 'like Africa" with it's own President and be done with it.

The Extremism coming frm this "new right wing tealiban/gop is outlandish.

More importantly the citizens that adhere to their ideologies are even more crazy than the politicians.

It's now become a "divide and be conquered by another Country!...what fools these mortal are!

"Is it gross incompetence or just cluelessness?"

Personally, I consider it to be a politically toxic combination of the two, Spank.

If I had President Obama's trademark detachment, I'd be able to laugh at the Administration's madcap hijinks...unfortunately the stakes are a little too high and the consequences a bit too dire.

Clara,

... whatever the dogs leave behind ain't NOTHING compared to what the Elephants leave behind!

I love it!

Wonderful post Jody, as always. Happy Birthday to a special lady.

You know you've done a good job, when the bitter squad tries to pick holes in it. Keep up the excellent work.

Rick Perry is getting more reminiscent of Richard Nixon with each passing day.

....and Nixon only had to debate one person! We all remember the results of that!

Jody, as always, another excellent synpopsis of "the way it was". Happy bithday to you and to New Day Dawning-Returned! Working late today,so have some hard cider on me and maybe a little REM on the jukebox? Shiny Happy People http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xNW809QqF1g

Jody:

Thank you, thank you, thank you. Your summaries are truly excellent. They're like that teacher review before the test. Very nice.

Here's a wish for many more birthday anniversaries for you.

Happy Birthday Jody and New Day!

Great post Jody, as always. I love the variety and the wit.

no joe, no bo, nj

Here's the other way it was this week-

Nevermind, whatever you say is a LIE!!!

Wilberta Berry

I understand states rights however, since this 'new Congress is always advocating states rights for everything, why are we calling ourselves "THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA"?

Wilberta

They don't want to be a part of "THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA". They are separatist and dixiecrats!!!

50 unequal states is what they want.

Clara - do you remember the old joke about the guy who had a job cleaning up after the elephants in the circus. When he complained about the job, someone asked him why he didn't just quit. He said, "What? And leave showbusiness?!"

Another great weekly wrap Jody. Loved it, as usual.

MKM.....Kaboom -- drum rolls please. GOOD ONE!!! One point for you!

Awesome, very comprehensive review Jody! There are only a couple of small things that might be added, such as the nuggets from Jim Demented: Sen. Jim DeMint: I Can't Work With The President Because He's A Socialist - http://www.newshounds.us/2011/09/15/sen_jim_demint_i_cant_work_with_the_president_because_hes_a_socialist.php

And the news about Elizabeth Warren already kicking Scott "Centerfold" Brown's arse. Let's hope all the money from Wall Street to support Brown is a complete waste!

Happy B-day and a good weekend to all.

It is funny that Perry thinks that Romney is Obama lite. Perry is Bush Lite. He has half the intelligence and integritywhile being twice a dangerous to the country as Bush Original. Hopefully he will continue to struggle with the debates and be counted out as a viable candidate sooner rather than later!

WE know that, but conservatives would vote for a monkey if that's all they have. Look at the Quinnipiac polls with Perry leading in Florida. Monkeys with a Southern drawl are even more attractive. Perry was laying on the Aw Shucks and the Southern drawl so thick I almost needed an interpreter.

To quote Peggy Noonan (I know, who'd a thunk), replace "monkey" with buffoon. My bad.

Thanks, Amy, it's a fun post to do.

Jody---another great recap---outstanding as usual. Happy Birthday to you and New Day---two special ladies sharing a special day. Hope you have a great day and a wonderful year ahead. There will be lots of politics to share!

Hey, California. Did you hear Solyndra had the contract for the solar panels to light up all the new Obama bridges? But the panels will now have to be made in China, you know, just like the decking for the new SF Bay bridge.

You can take the 5th on that question if you like.

Hey, Tony C, did you hear President Bush was the original Solyndra president, the one who pushed for the loans starting in 2007--guess he wanted that lighting for his Texas Ranch.

Tony you realize that the reason most things are currently manufactured outside our borders is because of laws and policies initiated by the Republican Party? Manufacturing was sent out of our country to enrich the handful of corporate entities that control the Republican Party. I believe I would have just kept my mouth shut about getting stuff made in China if I were you Tone.

Hey Tony C, did you hear nobody but you cares about Solyndra. But do keep trying to distract by using Karl's play book. You do know by having no new distractions this week your troll check will be less.

California,

I have a serious question for you. Should I re-register as a Republican and vote for Ron Paul in the Republican primary?

In Maine, last month, the head of the Republicn Party, Charlie Webster maintained that voter fraud among out-of-state college students was "widespread." A subsequesnt investigation by Maine's Secretary of State, Charlie Summers (R) reveiled that voter fraud in Maine is, actually, non-existant. Nevertheless, he mailed letters to all the out-of-state colege students warning them not to vote twice in any elections. (Although he found that no college student actually HAD voted twice in previous years.)

THis morning, I was thinking to myself, wouldn't it be a great way for college kids to get revenge on the Maine Republican Party, to vote for Ron Paul in the Republican primary? Then I thought: maybe I will re-reg as Republican and vote for Paul!

You need to prioritize what issues are the most important to This Country, and look at these candidates and ask: who has solid principles, who's a true leader, who has the education and background to do the best job for this country.

Learn to distinguish what is just "politics and campaigning", there's a lot of that going on.

Obama's made huge mistakes with not only ObamaCare, which Fails to address the core issue: COST;

but also made bad business decisions with Solyndra and Evergreen... taxpayers lose.

But Obama showed lack of leadership when he sued Az. for trying to enforce "existing" laws;

Obama ignored cries to secure the border for months if not longer.

Obama's track record so far is really bad, he's playing politics instead of solving problems.

Jody dear - you do understand that Bush ultimately rejected Solyndra?

It was 100% Obama that gave the money, Bush was gone.

paul-440967

I appreciate your rational approach to choosing a candidate, but I disagree with your conclusions

1) The Healthcare Reform bill passed by the Democratic majority Congress and signed by President Obama actually reduces the federal deficit by $143 billion dollars over it's first decade alone.

2) Solyandra was George Bush's pet project, it was Bush who set up the loan program and Obama's administration merely continued it.

3)Under Obama's leadership, all three AMerican car companies are profitable again for the first time since 2004!

4) Obama's administration has deported more illegal immigrants in two and a half years than Bush nearly did in eight years. http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/44599016/ns/politics-more_politics/

5) Qaddafy is out of power in Libya and Osama bin Laden is DEAD.

Tony's still ignoring the fact that the Solyndra loans were started by the Bush Administration in a process that crossed over administrations into the Obama Administration. Nothing to see here, Tony just doesn't want to admit that.

And there you have it - Amy has focused on like a laser beam on only the most important issues.

Amy - so it was Bush that approved the $535 million? Huh.

You really ought to tell that to Congress, they seem to be mistaken. Maybe a phone call today Amy?

John, you and misinformation are certainly friends. The Bush administration denied the loan. The Obama administration revived it. That fact is well documented and reported. The Obama administration pushed the loan through knowing the warnings that the Bush administration surfaced. I really don't understand how you can distort the facts surrounding this loan. Nothing to see. That explains taking the 5th. I guess you believe there is nothing to "fast and furious" either. You and Amy or whoever can reference all the liberal sources you like. But it won't change the facts.

Mo, no surprise is a liberal who can only resort to name-calling. Can't handle reality either.

Amy, it is time to get help for your problem- your worship of Obama is now leading you to lie.

Solyndra was TURNED DOWN for loan approval in January 9, 2009.

Did they submit loan applications to the Bush administration DoE? Yes.

Did they get the money? No.

They got turned down. Bad business model.

It was OBAMA that rushed through the approvals- in moves the GAO criticized over a year ago. No proper due diligence. Heck, no cursory due diligence.

Your delusional thinking about Obama's dubious successes is bad enough.

Lies?

Get help.

Spanky - The liberals like John B and Amy will find any way they can to blame Bush. It was the Obama administration that finalized the loan to Solyndra, the Bush administration was looking at it, but there were to many red flags. The liberals can't have it both way, they still like to refer to the Obama tax cuts as Bush's tax cuts because they were signed by Bush but were set to expire at the end of 2010. It was Obama that signed the bill into law extending the same tax cuts, so they are now Obama's tax cuts.

If the tax cuts are such a great idea, why do conservatives, Republicans, the GOP/TP keep trying to wash their hands of any involvement with them?

Could it be that tax cuts really don't work?!

Tony666-

Your comments are so boring. Never any value.

Tony, in your Conservative universe lies are fact and truth is lies. You continue to insist on this talking point just because you say so, while constantly dismissing any contrary evidence. It's partisan hackery at its worst.

Type in “Solyndra” and “Bush” at Google and you’ll get pages of media references (Fox, too, but not exclusively) to “Obama trying to blame Bush for Solyndra.” In the page I looked at, there was only one “Bush role in Solyndra…” From CNN to ABC to dozens more, the story is Obama Blaming.

Facts?

What emerges is that a bunch of Republican donors and allies had invested in Solyndra. That is probably the motivation for the Bush administration’s support of Solyndra. So the loan originated during the Bush administration and was passed along for renewal to the Obama administration.

http://themoderatevoice.com/122532/solyndra-and-bush/

sfcret, Republicans worked hard to get those tax cuts for the wealthy elites. They threatened to shut down the Senate entirely, endangering continued unemployment benefits and tax cuts for EVERYONE in order to make sure the rich got that special, extra splash.

If it was worth all that extra work why aren't Republicans bragging about it now?

Amy -

In answer to your question about Ron Paul. NO,I would not switch to the Repug Party unless President Obama chose not to run again. BUT, let me say that Ron Paul is the only Republican that ever makes any sense and offers proper and educated opions on our Nations problems, The rest of the Repugs are nothing but a joke. Obama in 2012.

Republicans will never recover as a party untill they take responsibility for the Bush years. Conservatives cannot continue to pretend their policies didn't drive up the federal debt and sink the economy. I think that's why the universe is setting up Rick Perry for a run against Obama - we need to get the Bush record out in the open and purged from the American system, once and for all.

Califoirnia Tom - Re: Obama 2012, how come it's never Obama/BIDEN 2012?....Isn't Biden important here? After all, he is only a heart beat away from being President?

• Amy B. Portland, ME

paul-440967

I appreciate your rational approach to choosing a candidate, but I disagree with your conclusions

1) The Healthcare Reform bill passed by the Democratic majority Congress and signed by President Obama actually reduces the federal deficit by $143 billion dollars over it's first decade alone.

2) Solyandra was George Bush's pet project, it was Bush who set up the loan program and Obama's administration merely continued it.

3)Under Obama's leadership, all three AMerican car companies are profitable again for the first time since 2004!

4) Obama's administration has deported more illegal immigrants in two and a half years than Bush nearly did in eight years.

5) Qaddafy is out of power in Libya and Osama bin Laden is DEAD.

1. The CBO projections are based off interest rates staying at or near zero, and theres only one place they can go... up. Once those go up, Obamacare becomes over a 1 trillion dollar drag on our economy, and will only put us further in debt. Im sure it will be struck down in the supreme court regardless, so i hope that the cost does not become and issue because it is unconstitutional.

2. That does not make it OK for obama to personally pick winners and losers.

3. After a massive handout to the union and a huge middle finger to the creditors and bond holders, which is illegal and beyond immoral. The company should have paid its debts. You say 3? Ford didn't take bailout money, they were smart enough to secure private financing prior to the fall out. I don't doubt that in a few years after people stop buying thier inferior products and shotty craftmanship that GM requires another bailout, except this time I don't think the american public will buy it. UAW will bankrupt GM with 5k Signing bonus's, seriously makes me laugh when i hear that.

4. True statement, nothing to add here.

5. Hey, more illegal wars! No declaration of war = not legal! Just like you bush bashers hate on him for Iraq/afgani - Obama did it anyway!! Obama is no different then bush. Was this the hope and change you voted for?

What a bunch of jokes Obama is, seriously.

brendan-4

I find it amusing, how anti-union Republicans are, and critical of high salaries for union negotiators, but they are OK with corporations spending millions and millions of dollars to lobby Congress. Paul Ryan being wined and dined with two bottlels of $350.00 wine - you're OK with THAT.

Then there are the outrageous CEO salaries, golden parachutes and the "safety bonuses" paid to executives of an oil rig that exploded off the Gulf coast - but, God forbid autoworkers make a decent salary. Republican values at work: pushing the nation's wealth upwards at every turn.

Amy,

I am a Democrat and am against high salaries for Union negotiators. They are the only ones who will be lining their pockets with stimulus money just like the Wall Street CEO's took home HUGE bonuses after being bailed out by the first stimulus. Please and Obamacare personally cost me the ability to afford health insurance for my son and I'm still employed! Please!! Please!! Can we get another Democratic candidate for 2012?!!!

paul-440967 wrote: You need to prioritize what issues are the most important to This Country, and look at these candidates and ask: who has solid principles, who's a true leader, who has the education and background to do the best job for this country.

It started off sounding rational, and then paul goes off the deep end. Who has solid principles? Gingrich? Who has the education and background? Perry? Who has either or both? Bachmann? She promises $2 gas and building a fence on the border with no taxes?

I just posted this in another thread to a wing-nut worshipping Sean Insannity:

He grew up in Franklin Square, New York ^[3] and attended Sacred Heart Seminary in Hempstead, New York during his middle school years and St. Pius X Preparatory Seminary high school in Uniondale, New York.^[4]Hannity dropped out of New York University and Adelphi University to pursue his broadcasting career.^[5]

During the late 1980s, Hannity was a bartender in Santa Barbara, California.^[6]

I could do this all day long about GOP/TP candidates and right-wing entertainers like Glenn Beck. They are all the biggest losers you could find, from drunks, drug or wife abusers, to sex scandals -- and not an iota of merit and life achievements. Here's another nugget we overlooked, Palin and now Boehner talking about "exceptionalism" like they have a clue what that is.

I'm watching Perry's response in the debate, and his brain farts despite index cards, and his comment on Pakistan and India, he didn't even come off as "likable" -- Texas Toast.

but they booed an American Soilder now serving Openly in Iraq when he asked the candidates if they would reinstate DADT/the Gay military ban. The man is literally serving his country and they boo him! They are no different than Hanoi Jane!

Really, how will hatred and bigotry of someone being who they are help this country.

If racism, ignorance and bigotry can solve this countries problems I am voting tea-party, trouble is they aren't.

patHuntington, well said. The GOP claims to be the party of patriot Americans yet boo a person fighting to protect them. With the applause of executions and the applause to allow a person without health insurance to die--it begs the question of what kind of people are they.

I didn't hear the booing, but If they did boo, they weren't booing the person... they were booing the question because most Americans are sick and tired of DADT, there are much bigger, critical issues facing this country.

I thought Santorum actually answered the question very well, though.

Liberals can continue to Divide and promote Hatred in this country with wedge issues ... more and more Americans recognize the liberal agenda, which unfortunately "uses" minorities, that's all they're doing.

Why do Republicans hate our military?

Let me count the ways.

Starting with ignorance,...and devolving from there.

So true Jody. They the Republican-Tea Potty only believe in Patriot Americans if you think exactly like them. They always preach liberty and freedom, except if you are a Gay American, or a Gay American serving in the military.

What a bunch of butt heads these Republican-Tea Potty are.

They booed because they heard the word gay and forgot stop and think that this man and many other men and woman like them are defending their right to be able to boo them in public in front of the nation.

Feel better soon, Nashville.

Thanks Nash, feel better!

I'm on my way with some chicken soup!

Can't stand to see my GF lose her voice - it's waaay to valuable!

*hugs*

Ya'll are so sweet . . . thanks.

Be well Nash, rest up

Apparently nojo is staying off your porch cuz' she thinks your contagious. I do hope you'll make the festivities tonight!

Nash---I have already lost my voice--hope I didn't somehow cyber-transmit the germs! Hope you feel better. For those of us in poor health today, at the DDI Birthday Celebration I will buy mimosas---the medicinal value of the orange juice and the fizz of the champagne will help us get better!

No Bob, Rick Perry's just not vary smart. But that's what you tea people GOP republicans like.

Romney should be spectacular, he's had years of practice; what is this, his third try at the presidential nomination?

Romney spectacular? Standing on a stage with Bachmann, Cain, Paul, Perry?

Creepy creepy candidates, including the flip flopper.

Pat - I was calling them Michele and the 7 dwarfs until Gary Johnson showed up last night.

Manufacturing creates more jobs than any other industry. It also requires a wide multitude skills and skill levels., from Finance to Engineering and production workers, and all the outside suppliers who supply the raw materials and machinery to fabricate the goods.

We have no one but greedy unions to blame for losing these manufacturing jobs. If I hadn't witnessed it firsthand, I wouldn't realize what bullies these unions were and how they literally backed these companies into a corner, with nowhere to go but either out of business or move the production

jobs elsewhere in order to preserve the other jobs in engineering, sales, finance.

Paul if it wasn't for unions you'd probably be working for 3 dollars an hour with no benefits.

Its not the 1950's or 1960's anymore., its 2011 and we now have a Global economy, which means we compete for business with the entire world now. We didn't have that in the 1950's and 1960's and much of the 1970's, even.

I witnessed firsthand, the corruption and greed with the unions. It was ugly and I wouldn't have believed it if I hadn't seen it myself.

Just about everyone in Ohio has experienced it, they've seen the jobs go overseas as a direct result of Union greed, and that's why I can't believe Obama can back the Unions and keep visiting Ohio.

Most of us in Ohio aren't impressed with unions, whether its in manufacturing or in schools.

Unions have hurt both manufacturing and our education system. Unions ALWAYS, always put themselves First.

"Its not the 1950's or 1960's anymore., its 2011 and we now have a Global economy"

=========================================================================

Why do we have a Global economy? Where is it written that we need or desire one? Who decided for us we were going to have a Global economy? If a Global economy is detrimental to the well being of our country and it's people why would we continue to participate in a Global economy?

I feel those are all questions that deserve an answer.

And Jesus Christ people the unions are not nearly as evil as you let on, corporate greed sent our jobs overseas, that is the root cause, you can slam the unions all you like but it is not honest to claim the only reason manufacturing went overseas is unions. Look around without unions people are being forced to work for low wages with no benefits, that is not going to support a robust economy, consumers can't consume without a decent job, and quite frankly Republicans seem to think it is quite all right for people to be dirt poor, as long as they are not one of them.

paul,

Sadly - that about sums up the problem. It isn't the UNION causing the problems,...it's the UNION BUSTING.

Allowing companies to continue to game the Global market causes decline. Allowing government to give TAX BREAKS to companies who move jobs overseas,...well THAT is the cause of the decline of the American worker. But giving up and accepting whatever they give you is NOT the American Spirit. Yes, there is a Right to Work; but there is also a RIGHT to not supplement corporate greed with tax incentives that further dissolve our middle class.

Believing that the Unions are the problem is exactly the propaganda the Republicans want perpetuated. Where are the jobs that 10 years of tax cut policies SHOULD have created? It is a myth. Just like believing American Exceptionalism means we don't have to work hard, study hard and fight for what we believe in. As soon as a populace 'accepts' this New Normal,...well, then I'll know we lost to the Corporate Interests. I reject that notion.

w bush, thank you!

It doesn't make sense does it? Keep our wages low. Fine.

Then how we do afford to buy a home, buy new furniture, buy an automobile, save for our children's weddings and college educations? How can we put something aside for our grandchildren? Can't afford to book a flight, can't afford hotels, can't afford to eat out, go to the movies, buy new clothing.

Spend money on music or ballgames/football games/basketball games/hockey games.

They want only the wealthy to be able to do those things, while we are paid unaffordable wages. And foot the tax bill.

Don't get me wrong. I'm all in favor of paying taxes. That's how you keep the country from falling apart. Unfortunately, the rich don't feel the need to help.

They're just fine with homes in other countries, with bank accounts in other countries.

They're not invested here in America. No one is. So businesses will fail because we aren't paid enough to keep businesses going.

Sounds reasonable. To a Republican.

It is not union greed sending the jobs overseas, it is corporate greed.

Many corporations were making millions and stated the reason wasn't enough profit, they had plenty of profit, they just wanted more profit.

Corporation have hurt our manufacturing system. Corporations ALWAYS, ALWAYS put themselves first.

A Race to the Bottom is NOT the answer.

There are so many ways to improve the economy and create jobs without asking American workers to become indentured servants. Fair trade, maybe some sticks and not just carrots like having to manufacture here to sell here, and most of all removing loopholes that allow the abuses such as headquartering in the Cayman Islands, and ending corporate welfare subsidies.

The other day there was a program about early industrialism in England, in which employees worked a seven day week and only had Christmas and Thanksgiving as holidays--without pay. Likewise how things were for the elderly before Social Security. The conservatives who are nostalgic for the good old days of the 19th (or even 18th) century obviously need some history classes.

And yet, Obama is IN the office and none of these Republican candidates are.

This is Romney's third try and Paul's second or third. And they STILL aren't in the office.

I agree with you fielden. If the republicans are so qualified, I wonder why the American public didn't elect a republican president?

Think maybe the problem might be the debt the republicans ran up by giving the richest tax cuts while starting wars, one of choice. Now rather than see their mistakes and raising taxes on the richest, the republicans double down on stupid.

Not only are the republicans determined not to raise taxes on the richest, they are now accusing the rest of us of class warfare. Attacking teachers and unions and social security and the people of America is not class warfare in the republican brain.

Attacking the poor and cutting every program to help the poor is just fine, but asking the rich to pay a fair share, well that is just over the top and creating class warfare.

Appears you will only deal with reality when it is too late. This nation is headed for a financial collapse and those programs you mention will really be cut. It will be due to liberal Democrats who can't seem to grasp fiscal responsibility. It is going to be a long painful trip back from the brink where Obama has taken us. I bet even then you "drones" won't admit it.

Only if Republicans succeed in manufacturing those crises, Tony. They're doing their best, but people are connecting the dots.

Pray tell, what manufactured crisis are you talking about? You mean the dots to 500 million dollars down the drain from Solyndra? Maybe the "fast and Furious" dots? The polls do shows Americans realize Obama is taking this nation in the wrong direction. I guess you can call that connecting the dots.

The polls also show the approval rating of the Republican party below Islam and Atheism...don't forget to tell the WHOLE story.

With a 59% disapproval rating (and falling) the GOPTP is going to need to work pretty hard if it wants to hold the office of dog catcher.

John, I see you ignored the question. The President runs as an individual. So does each Congressman. For whatever reason people tend to like their own representative. Lumping what you lumped together doesn't change Obama's poll numbers. I don't know what polls you are quoting, but your overall general conclusion is incorrect. Obama has been trying to "talk" his way out of his failures and will continue to do so. People will get tired of it. The polls do show that fact.

Romney picking bush's economic adviser that recommended tax cuts during war time sure sold me. Bush was doing so well and we need his economic advisers to lead us into the future.

Then we elected President Obama who just destroyed our economy after bush left it in such good shape.

In this republican written fairy tale, Romney is ready to lead us back to the successes of bush.

Do explain to us Bill S, how you know the American people are sick of President Obama. I'm guessing you can read peoples minds from afar.

Got any links to the poll that says Americans are sick of President Obama? Didn't think so. Another made up comment by the tea people GOP republicans.

Whether or not you want to deal with reality makes no difference. Most polls show that voters believe Obama is taking this country in the wrong direction. Obama's approval ratings are also around 40% depending on the week. His constant lectures loaded with misinformation do work for a time. People will get tired of his "talking" his way out of every failure. Plenty of time left and he will certainlt try to talk his way out of his failures.

The problem is we're faced with putting the same thinking, or lack thereof, that got us INTO this mess back in office. Anyone who didn't understand that whoever won the last election was in for the battle of his, and our, life. We need a new, aggressive attitude and all we've seen so far is Obama bashing and hairbrained ideas from folks that couldn't make the cut on 'Survivor Omaha'. Lip service and retro ideas are so far out of the realm of what we SHOULD be getting that future development is stymied just by the sound bites. The complete works are frightening. If the GOP can't come up with more substance than what we've seen so the next election might be our last. Can't put the genie back in the bottle, folks. There IS no bottle.

Polls show people think the country is going in the wrong direction. A good poll would show WHY people think this. A lot of people think the country is going in the wrong direction because of Republican obstructionism and hostage taking. Some think Obama should have stood by his base MORE, and are disappointed we don't have single-payer health care, they are disappointed in concessions coming only from Democrats in exchange for nothing but more Bush era economic policies that put us in the toilet in the first place.

Unless you cite multiple polls around the same snap shot date, and preferably average the results, a sample size of only 1,000 and error of margin of +/- 3 points means what exactly? Also, what does a snap shot in time mean? You have to track results over time as well. It's funny how conservatives will find one poll in their favor (though with the margin of error not as much as they think) and cling to it for dear life.

The plan is to magically start talking about hiring the moment they have regained the House, Senate, The White House and however many states they infuse with more ALEC governors.

This talk will go on until they are all placed in office.

Next up ...the ramming through of the destruction of the concept of a minimum wage. Only then will the hiring begin. You pick a number of $$/hour that might possibly satisfy them. Then when they have everyone 'ecstatic' over all the millions of jobs that appear, they will dump the Healthcare law and tell the American public they have everything they need to sustain themselves in the country they have 'taken back'.

You wanna know where the Republicans' PLANS are? They're sitting in the Senate, where the Senate Democrats are ignoring them, haven't read the bills yet. THAT'S where they are.

Democrats, put some pressure on those do-nothing Democrats in the Senate, tell them to do their jobs.,

they're sitting on their hands instead.

Paul, you demonstrate the concept of projection so wonderfully.

Just keep reading the sheeple's accusations folks, they keep us informed of what their masters are up to.

Thank you for your post - peace and blessings to you also.

And I thought you wanted "hope" and "change"...I guess not yet....to coin a phrase.

Give me a break.......you want to go from bad to to worst? I can't think of anything more scary or nauseating!!

you are not going to get the "drone" liberal socialist crowd to listen to any other idea but the one in which they subscribe. Just read the posts from these folks. Full of hate, jealousy and name-calling. This is usually accompanied by exaggerations, misinformation and misrepresentation of what someone said that disagrees with them. We are headed for real financial disaster due to 33 months of the Obama's administration massive spending and government growth. Yet, liberals want more spending. We borrow more than 40 cents of every dollar spent in Washington. The liberal solution just raise taxes on those who have the money. Like there is no end to that proposition. Reason and reality do not surface in liberal circles.