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Subscribe to RSSIn what sounded like the real opening salvo to the 2012 presidential campaign, President Obama, before a mostly union crowd estimated at 12,000, showed glimmers of the fighting spirit of 2008 with a Labor Day speech laying out the broad outlines of the jobs speech he will deliver Thursday before Congress.
Intimating he might “go big” in that Thursday speech, as his supporters would like, the president pushed for not only a renewal of the payroll tax cut but also construction jobs. And he said that while he is still willing to work with Republicans – and thinks that’s right for the country – he challenged the GOP to “show us what you got.”
"I still believe both parties can work together to solve our problems,” he said, standing in automaker GM’s parking, adding, “But we’re not going to wait for them. We’re going to see if we’ve got some straight shooters in Congress. We’re going to see if congressional Republicans will put country before party.
“We’ll give them a plan, and then we’ll say, do you want to create jobs? Then put our construction workers back to work rebuilding America. Do you want to help our companies succeed? Open up new markets for them to sell their products. You want -- you say you’re the party of tax cuts? Well then, prove you’ll fight just as hard for tax cuts for middle-class families as you do for oil companies and the most affluent Americans. Show us what you got. The time for Washington games is over. The time for action is now. No more manufactured crises. No more games. Now is not the time for the people you sent to Washington to worry about their jobs; now is the time for them to worry about your jobs.”
The AP leads similarly: “President Obama used a boisterous Labor Day rally to put congressional Republicans on the spot, challenging them to place the country’s interests above all else and vote to create jobs and put the economy back on a path toward growth.”
The top headline out of the Detroit Free Press: “Obama tells Detroit: I'll defend union rights.”
(There was controversy, however, with Teamsters President James Hoffa going before Obama and saying of the Tea Party: "President Obama, this is your army. We are ready to march ... Let's take these son-of-a-bitches out and give America back to an America where we belong.” That has drawn the ire of conservative groups, who want an apology.)
But here’s the new political reality Obama is facing, per our new NBC/WSJ poll: “When Barack Obama unveils his jobs and economic plan to a joint session of Congress on Thursday, he'll do so at the lowest point of his presidency, according to a new NBC News/Wall Street Journal poll. After the bruising debt-ceiling fight — as well as Standard & Poor's subsequent downgrade of the nation's credit rating — Obama's job approval rating has sunk to a low of 44 percent, a 3-point drop since July. His handling of the economy stands at a low of 37 percent. And only 19 percent believe the country is headed in the right direction, the lowest mark for this president.”
Here’s the Wall Street Journal’s take: “President Barack Obama this week will try to launch a political comeback amid the lowest approval ratings of his presidency and a growing sense of economic foreboding here and across the country among voters who are increasingly questioning their president's skills and priorities.”
The new Washington Post/ABC poll is pretty similar to the NBC/WSJ one. "More than 60 percent of those surveyed say they disapprove of the way the president is handling the economy and, what has become issue No. 1, the stagnant jobs situation. Just 43 percent now approve of the job he is doing overall, a new career low; 53 percent disapprove, a new high."
And here's the Politico/George Washington Univ. Battleground Poll: Capturing a rapid erosion of confidence through the summer months, the poll found 72 percent of voters believe the country is either strongly or somewhat headed in the wrong direction, a jump of 12 percentage points since May. Only 20 percent of voters say the country is going in the right direction, a 12-point drop in the same period.
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The country is not exactly headed in the wrong direction - it is stalled. And that's purely the work of the GOP right wing, intentionally blocking any progress, tearing at the very structure of the nation, and obdurately refusing to work with the President for any reason whatsoever.
And regrettably, this outcome was predicted before the 2010 elections. The Tea Party does NOT want to govern. It wants the government to practically disappear, to hand over public assets and public funds to cronies in private enterprise, to replace the United States as we have known it with a political cartel economy.
And all in the supposed name of "freedom," "free markets," and other terms that mask the real objectives of the far right.
Now the time to face the challenges is before the right wing. The President is bringing his game to them - and we'll see whether anyone from that coterie will have the honesty and courage to do what the voters actually elected them to do: Work on jobs and the economy, not their alternate-reality garbage.
John, Senate Republicans have been filibustering at 3 times the pace ever seen before in American history since Barack Obama took office as President and they repeatedly block Jobs bills. Here's a little sampling over other stalling tactics:
1. Republicans previously for a Bipartisan Deficit Commission. But when Obama was for it, Republicans turned against it.
2. Pay-as-you-Go was a Republican idea. As soon as Obama was for it, Republicans turned against it.
3. Palin on McCain's Cap and Trade proposal: "I support his position....he's got a good Cap & Trade policy...I support all we can do to reduce emissions and clean up this planet". Now she and her party consider this an outrageous idea.
4. Health Reform and Individual Mandate: This was Romney's implemented idea and dating back to 1990's, it was a Republican idea. Now it is considered a terrrible idea by GOP.
5. Patent Reforms was in the GOP jobs plan released early this year. Obama is proposing that plan, so Republicans oppose it now.
6. McCain's original Immigration proposal included a pathway to citizenship. It was McCain's own plan ~~ now he would vote against.
7. In 2003, John McCain was a co-sponsor of the Dream Act. This Republican idea was introduced by Orrin Hatch with 13 Republican co-sponsors. In 2008 after Obama supported it, former said co-sponsors opposed it via a GOP-led filibuster.
Backhouse, thanks for laying that out. In the posts below, the right-wing writers balme of the president for the very pproblems you described. They claim he "divides" the country - when he has been the person all along working to find means of getting along.
And as for Hoffa's remarks, there's nothing to apologize for. The Tea Party is indeed a deadly enemy to the union movement - and to the American worker in general.
And it is the Tea Party's attitude, expressed often in sometimes very disturbing and violent terms, that this political struggle is indeed battle to the death.
John thanks for all your posts.....in general.
Seems to me Hoffa's a big guy and responsible for his own remarks, like everyone here.
As for this 'Tea Party'. We know it was created to increase profits and cut taxes for corporations.
good job John. There are none so blind as those who will not see... I am afraid that many people can not get past their own personal issues. If Obama paved the streets in gold; TP would complain about the glare. Obama should use reverse psychology on these idiots. Tell the average TP that richest 2% deserve a bigger tax break and they would rush to raise their taxes.
John A - Great post as always. However, only the "masters" knows the true game plan. The "puppets" really believe in free market philosophies, which they really believe will help the American worker. Why they do, after experiencing the economic meltdown, I'll never understand. Or considering history--the days of early industrialism, or even the last decade -- How they can continue to believe in "trickle-down" (the new term being "job creator"), deregulation, etc. is mind bending. Supply side "voodoo" economics has been debunked. They fear change, that's probably part of the explanation.
Even those who want to inject religion into politics will swear they believe in Separation of Church and State. Sadly, they are very misguided. The failure to connect dots, to see the unintended consequences, etc. is all part of the current low-information voter phenomenon.
If the right-wing would use Rule of Reason (and they don't know how BTW), they'd realize the writings of Adam Smith and others have been perverted by modern Libertarians and extolled by corporatists to amass power and privilege. And you are correct, John A., that the "masters" have no interest in governing. Governing by nature means belief in the social contract and the general good. The "masters" only care about profit, not people, so they obtain and hold power with machinations -- Other ways that are much easier than actually governing.
The reason we can't spread democracy per the Bush Doctrine is because there are so many variables that must be in place for democracy to work. For example, a middle class, civil rights including a women's right to choose, well-informed public via a free press (not FAUX Noise/Hate Radio), freedom of religion AND from religion, the right for labor to organize, an educated healthy populace, etc., etc. The Teabaggers are undermining our own constitutional democracy with every turn. They should be in the fetal position overcome with shame.
Don't show them your hand Mr. President. Sabotage is the only thing on Cantor's and Boehner's mind.
I guess in your opinion the stalling of the economy has nothing to do with obamacare, dodd frank, various other laws, and the EPA's new regulations. Companies don't know what else is coming down the pike so even if they have money, they won't hire. Isn't it the Cloward Piven strategy obama is using to collapse the economy and rebuild it the way he wants? He's doing a very good job of it.
Why the heck would anyone be against the Dodd Frank financial reforms after the Wall Street scam that nearly destroyed our nation? What about Too Big To Fail? Are conservatives incapable of learning anything?
And in this time of recession, companies are abusing customers like crazy, most notably landlords, utility companies, and cable companies. Even credit cards are billing people on pre-approved credit cards without the consumer's knowledge. Does anyone really want to go back to "buyer beware," false advertising and unsafe products?
The reason companies won't hire is because consumers aren't spending. Consumers aren't spending because it is the American workers who have been thrown under the buss and feel uncertainty. It's supply and demand. No matter how many more tax, regulation, or litigation amnesties we give to corporations that Perry, Romney, et al, are blathering about, it won't create jobs.
Throw the Grand Obstructionist Party out. Then the president and Dems can get the economy back on track, and even get back on track to balance the budget and pay down the debt as things were at the end of Clinton's administration. Everything was going great until Bush/Cheney were elected.
We are heading rapidly in the wrong direction with no one capable of steering this out of control ship. Hoffa's comments yesterday, declaring war on Tea Party is akin to a terrorist threat, and this President didn't denounce the comments, in fact he fed on them. That is appalling, plain and simple. He is a disgrace in his conduct and his agenda. He will be lucky to end with 28% of the vote in November.
THM07, "That is appalling, plain and simple". It is pretty hard to swallow regurgitated puke isn't it? It was ok when the TP and Republicans focused that language toward the President but "not nice when it is directed back at you. The President should not denounce it, remember this is a country of "free speech". Besides, he didn't say it.
Lets just sit back and see what happens. The voters will decide what they want.
TJM07 - Hoffa's repsonse is completely justified. The TPer's and their representatives in congress and in the states have systematically attacked union workers as the source of all that is evil and wrong with America. Yes, they have to be taken down and the way to do that is to go to the ballot box and get rid of them. That's exactly what Hoffa said when right before the comment he said, "you have a vote". Then he said "Take the SOB's out". It was quite clear he was talking about at the ballot box if anyone had the honesty to actually hear what he was saying. And, yes the TPer's are terrorists. Their plan is to rework our country into their own image and wipe away the gains by average Americans that has happened over the last 100 year.
well said laura...TP, by their own admission wants to return to Jim Crow. Intelligentsia must rise from the college campuses and vote these terrorist idiots out for good.
Boy, look who's overreacting now...
Good for the teamsters!!! All he met was to vote them out. But it's okay when Palin puts bulls-eyes on state maps in democratic territories?
My My all the liberals are truly venting this week! Hoffas calls out the Tea Partiers as terrorists and son of bitches. Maxine Water's recently told them all to "go to hell" and she would help get them there. All in the name of Obama's call for civility? ... NOT! The Unions and Liberals are running scared and can only fall back on rants and name calling! ... The GOP is not out to hurt working Americans... just to remove the outlived influence of the Unions on the business and governmental activities and climate in this country. Unions have become despicable in today's jobs environment. They are chocking on their own koolaid! Hoffa can rant all he wants to, but all it proves is that Obama is bought and paid for by the Unions.
Alternate reality? I think most of the earlier posts clearly show that these Liberals are still livng in an alternate reality. Quit asking for a handout, take some responsibility for your own life and well being, and start being part of the solution for this country's future! Milllions have done that on their own. It is about time we stood up and took responsibility back from the Government for what we do and how we are to live!
Hey folks, I was there. He did not mean to vote them out. He was trying to inspire old Union thug tactics. Something I am very familiar with. If you had been there, you would have seen that it worked on the mob mentality of the people that were there.
Screaming, yelling obscenities, threats. I didn't say a word against the comments, even though I found them ridiculous. I feared for my safety and those of anyone else who may have disagreed at that point.
If you weren't there, your opinions are just that, your opinions.
Fed Up Senior - Who's asking for a handout??? Not union workers....They have strength in numbers and that infuriates the likes of you and those that think like you. The fact that average people can actually have a voice and be able to push back against uncontrolled corporate greed so that they can live a good life for work they provide is part of the American experience. Vilifying average workers is what makes these TPers and their corporate backers terrorists. What we're experiencing now is a war on Americans by corporate elite and politicians beholding to those interests.
I too, am waiting for President Obama to denounce the "taking the s.o.b's out" comment from his introductary speaker, Mr. Hoffa. It's long past time to bring some civility back into the national political scene. With no condemnation forthcomming, I can only conclude that this is how the President feels about many people in this country. Whatever happened to bringing everyone together?
The Democrat response? "You guys did it first !!!" Like a bunch of kids - Where is an adult leader?
Laurie_— When you cannot distinguish between corrupt union leaders and the actual workers, then you probably do drink all the union koolaid. When you cannot distinguish between a true leader and a bought and Union paid for President, you deserve the one you currently have! There is no war aganist workers... just the Unions that continue to use the workers to give themselves (not the workers) more power and influence. The days of the ole sweatshops are gone, and workers in many non-union locations have free access to address any of their legitimate issues. And within the Government, there are ample avenues for any employee to surface concerns, so why are unions needed in Govenrment arenas? Take a look at every Union leader. They are all fat, filthy rich SOBs who bask in luxury on union dues while the workers are just doing their jobs. They live in their alternate universe where the mean ole corporate leadership had their police thugs to force workers to do their jobs for low salaries and no work privileges. No sane corporation today does not take care of their workers, so why are unions needed again? Keep drinking the aged koolaid that Union leader are spouting. Keep wasting your money! YOu deserve what you get! Nohting!
Interesting concept, that unionists are "average" workers. In another of these blogs about the unions' future under this administration, the comment was made repeatedly that anyone actually trying to perform above average was taking their life in their hands in a union shop.
How about reopening Ellis Island, but running it in reverse? The whole union thing seems pretty Old World to me. Maybe it's a good idea when there is a different language being spoken every fifty miles, but in a nation claiming to be "united", I have never seen anything more divisive (and elitist) than organized labor.
And it certainly doesn't help the "average" worker, not by my calculation.
Been waiting since january of 2009 for obama to show us what he has.
The challenge isn't for what the right has, but what the supposed leader of America has. Will he become a unifier or continue on his path of divider?
Will he forego his partisan training and rhetoric as a legislative rep and finally move on to one of executive stature as POTUS?
Past presidents have always found ways of working with congress regardless of poltical majority, why can't obama?
american-2051576
"Past presidents have always found ways of working with congress regardless of poltical majority, why can't obama?"
Because congress does not want to work with the President, plain and simple.
If I hear one more idiot call Obama a"divider" I will lose it. he has made more compromises than he should. He has conceded too much already. I say, not one more inch until GOP tards step up and make some concessions... period. Obama needs to be more like bush/cheney in that regard.
Divider.
John - Another idiot without the ability to think for themselves.
The president repeated calls names and it's his way or the highway. Then he goes on TV and says whatever he likes to get a reaction. Clinton was way better than obama. Obama doesn't have a plan. Why didn't he deliver it before his vacation? The stimulus was supposed to take care of everything. He clearly doesn't know what he's doing or he's brought in obamacare, dodd frank, and the EPA in hopes of collapsing the economy so he can rebuild it the way he envisions it.
John A: I agree! I think the country is stalled, as well, but not because of the President. The gridlock in Washington falls directly on the shoulders of the Tea Party and the GOP who stonewall every attempt to get the economy and job creation back on track. Haven't seen one jobs bill since the GOP and their Tea Partiers took over the House and I don't have hopes that that's going to change any time soon! They'd rather spend time and energy on rhetoric and blather. Time to get over themselves and work on the things that matter to US -- the American people Boehner is so fond of exploiting!
I really hope people see the republican party for what it is - Actually it's the tea party now, the republicans are gone...
Do some homework.
This is not going to work. Have not seen the plan, so now we have to accept it or we have caused the complete fall of our economy. When he does send it to the house I am sure there will be many part of it that will work for all. But he has to know it will get put to the test and he will have to move to the center if he wants to survie.
Dude, he's been center since day one, where have you been??? Too far to the right I suppose.
I concur. It's past time for the President to show us what he's got. We need him to step up. Enough with the speeches and playing nice. It's time to play hardball. Too much at stake now. Not just for your presidency but for the sake of our country, please DO SOMETHING.
People just do not trust this President. He is a "do as I say not as I do" type of politician. This latest issue of Hoffa calling the Tea Party "sons of Bi$%^#@" is a perfect example. Obama lectured and admonished the country, when Giffords was shot, about the dangerous rhetoric (his words). He asked for civility. WHERE IS HE NOW ??!! .....HYPOCRITE.
Leona: The Tealiban have been saying they're takin' back our country since 2008. Now that we know that they want to take us back to 1859, sane Americans are reacting and saying, no you won't. The Tealiban lost all chance of civility when they started to use ropes and nazi symbols depicting President Obama. Hoffa was right, it is long past time these clowns were taken out of office.
dirp...the rules only apply for Democrats...duh wake up.
Please "Leona" the republicans never play fair and will slam the president or labor any chance they get and spew BS all the time and now they can take it when the president and the unions talk back?
Leona - The Republicans play "dirty" politics and get away with it each and every time. It's about time Democrats and their allies fight back on the same ground that Republicans play on. I for one agree with Hoffa and I say more of this needs to be said to these unpatriotic, anti-American terrorists.
I repeat.................Obama lectured and admonished the country, when Giffords was shot, about the dangerous rhetoric (his words). He asked for civility. WHERE IS HE NOW ??!! .....HYPOCRITE.
well the gotp has gotten exactly what they wanted; namely, destroy the economy twice - first from gop induced lassez faire greed on wall street and now from gotp gleeful obstruction and "no compromise." the weakened economy has tanked again while the gotp is convinced this is good for them politically. sure a majority of americans blame the gop for this mess; but they are still convinced this is a political positive for them and encouraging for their successful outcome in the 2012 elections.
these latest poll numbers would suggest a majority of americans are saying, "yeah, we understand what the republicans have done but we are still going to blame the president." go figure.
Both parties are out for 2012, not just republicans. Why will the president not accept any of this mess as his doing. Congress has been under his control and now he lack just the house. He needs to accept responablitiy for most of this. Nobodys hand are truly clean.
sbv 418808,
Polls are all about how the questions are phrazed, or how the sample is derived. We're not told.
But because the polls come out differently, we know they were conducted differently for different purposes.
BAM - nail on the head! People vote against their own self interest all the time, I just don't get that. Screw ideological - vote for common sense people! Common sense will tell you that the "wacky pack" republican wannabees have nothing to offer this country.
sbv - I agree...isn't it a cooincidence that just as the stimulus startes to wind down the economy slows to a halt. This is the most convincing evidence that the stimulus did work as we can see without the stimulus jobs will continue to be lost.
The economy never did get moving. How can the government keep supporting the economy? The private sector has to come in.
Yeah, just like it kicked in for GWB...
DNC Chairwoman Unfazed By Hoffa's 'S.O.B.' Rant
Debbie Wasserman-Schultz dodges questions about union leader's contentious Tea Party remarks.
The democrats or in this case just RATS seem to think it is OK to call fellow Americans traitors, terrorist, racist etc... whatever low life scum bag remark the hateful hate mongers of left wing liberals can think of. This is who you want in your GOV Thugs with no respect for the American people, foul moth hate mongers who declare war on their fellow Americans. As Hoffa's remarks state they are the Army of Obama. By being silent about Hoffa, Maxine Waters, and many, Many other democrats and their supporters up to and including VP Biden Obama has clearly shown his utter contempt for Americans that disagree with him. Demos have become the Filth of America so do you stand with the gangster filth or with real Americans? Last I checked it was OK to voice your opinion and opposition to leaders in Washington without being viciously attacked or threatened with war. I guess the Obama CLASS WAR is really starting after all.
The Tealiban Republicans refuse to increase the tax rate on those earning the most. The top 10% earn almost 46% of all income, yet they own over 80% of all the countries wealth. The bottom 50%, those who "are not paying taxes" are earning 1/3 less than the top 10%, yet the Tea Publicans want to tax them more.
John Stewart's show (which I think was a repeat from August 18 ?) demonstrated that the Tealiban's policy of taxing the poor would work, if you took 50% of everything they own. That is the problem. It is not a matter of rhetoric, it is reality. The Tea Party truly is out to destroy the middle class and kill the poor.
Dirp101, Tealiban Republicans, really? If you want what you are posting here, you can live in China, Cuba, Greece and half of Euroupe. Leave and know you will be missed. Or move and find yourself somewhere not safe to walk outside. You sir, spew hate.
MRWSR. Oh, OK, the TeaPublicans are all in favor of free speech, for Corporations. But when someone points out the hate they have for the middle class and the poor, then we should leave the country. Give me a break. Since when is expecting to receive what you have paid your whole life into the wrong thing to expect ? Rick Perry is right when he calls Social Security a ponzi scheme, he should know that the Republicans have been planning to close it down for years, now that they have been caught taking the money out of it.
Name one Republican with an honest plan to keep Social Security and Medicare solvent. I am not talking about changing the rules. I've paid into both my whole working life. When you pay into something, you expect the contract to be met. Changing retirement age and Medicare benefits are not part of the deal which I have been paying for.
Tealiban, as in a fundamentalist, religious, extremist group unwilling to accept any other alternatives. Perfectly willing to see other groups DIE rather than see a different point of view.
dirp101, As a tea party member and a part of the working middle class. I have paid into the same programs. "Tealiban, as in a fundamentalist, religious, extremist group unwilling to accept any other alternatives. Perfectly willing to see other groups DIE rather than see a different point of view." This is hate, plain and simple. Please read Paul Ryan's budget. You can find it at his website and on the house website. I don't expect anything from the government and never will. You depend on them and allways will. Get what's yours and leave.
MRWSR, I blame the liberal "journalists" and liberal Dem politicians for fueling this angry hate speech . The general public does not know enough about politics ( they don't have time) to really understand what's going on . The media and politicians put out these falsehoods about the Tea Party and the public picks up on it and believes it. It's time to call out the LIBERAL media and the LIBERAL politicians. Have you listened to Debbie Wasserman BULL Schultz ( her nickname)? She's a perfect example of the hate on the left ( all the while she condemns it on the right.)
Yes Wade,
I agree, Democrats have become the filth of America. It is now an insult to be called a Democrat. Like being called an idiot.
Some suggestions for cutting the budget:
First, eliminate the following programs:
United States Air Force. Strategic bombing has never produced a significant result since its inception in the 1940s. The USAF is a breeding ground for religious zealotry and hawkish counsel on foreign affairs, and is entirely a political force. Its capabilities could be distributed across the other branches, the ones who follow orders instead of praying for apocalypse to bring on the Rapture.
Internal Revenue Service. The birthplace of the security state. All invasion of privacy by both public and private sectors begins with examination of citizens' tax forms, a form of permanent interrogation that government has no right to commit on citizens. What business is it of government how we earn or spend or invest our wealth? Send me an invoice for what the Feds have ever done for me, and I will pay it. The problem is, they owe me. The cost of collecting and maintaining a mammoth database for spying on citizens, disguised as revenue collection, is inexcusable. The Constitution delegates the power to collect tax to Congress, not the Executive branch.
Federal Communications Commission. What do they do besides withhold use of the public airwaves from the public, while allowing media moguls to fill them with propaganda?
Subsidies to Israel, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia. (Our principal enemies)
US Army Corps of Engineers. How did the Army end up in charge of our rivers?
Occupational Safety and Health Administration. All they have ever done is enrich the paper industry by requiring publication of trillions of pages of idiotic and self-evident safety guidelines nobody reads, and create markets for products required by insurance companies that make small business unsustainable.
Further suggestions:
Pay Congress people minimum wage, house them in barracks and require them to use public transportation.
Legalize marijuana and charge a federal sales tax on its distribution. All the harm I have ever seen done associated with this herb has come from its outlaw status and not its chemical effects. If tobacco, alcohol and Prozac meet with legal approval why not pot?
Reinstate reimbursement protection for private energy producers. Imagine a nation where everyone's electric meter runs backwards. No more need for massive subsidies for profitless utilities. (While we're at it, how about losing the DOE, too?)
Now I'll sit back and wait for the hysterical attacks. Just bear in mind that all of these ideas come from people I have known in the work force over the years. I may be a crazy old hippie, but I am tired of living in a country where both parties act like enemies of democracy while refusing to respond to what people really want from their government.
Okay Mr. Paul...
Eliminating the IRS is a fantastic idea.
A simple tax system , whether a sales or consumption tax, is far superior. Fair, efficient , would jump start the economy.
Imagine if Obama came up with a plan to reform the tax system or his speech Thursday; great idea.
Won't happen. The Socialist in Chief is only interested in growing the Nanny State, hiking taxes, continuing with class warfare, and keeping special tax breaks for his corporate cronies at GE.
Despite the blathering class warfare crap about "tax breaks for corporations and Big Oil", the truth is the leftists want a complex tax system, with special favors for some ; they can play favorites and try to control the economy from the top down.
don't get out much do you bob. Can't figure out why the world thinks americas right wing are ignorant rednecks? Heres your sign. Read a little about socialism before you call an american president one. It only makes you look like a faux news fan. Fair tax system would be fine, but I can guaruntee it won't be Liberals that oppose it. Think for a minute who stands to lose if taxes were fair...?duh Not middle america The ones who enjoy the loopholes will have the most to lose. Poor people would not be hit hard. They already pay sales tax and they do not consume much....
gpotts, liberals bennifit from the same loop holes you speak of. The poor will always suffer from any tax shift that "shared sacrifice". They will become more dependent and the tax code will support it.
Let's take these son-of-a-bitches out and give America back to an America where we belong!
A little long for a bumpersticker, but this should be the Democratic mantra for the 2012.
More to the point: Democratic House 2012
Amy
You are stunningly off base. I don't care what your ideology is, left, right or alien. Statements like Hoffa's have been made with the leaders ( like Obama) approval in places like 1930's Germany, Stalin's Russia, Franco's Spain, Cambodia with Pol Pot and Venezuela with Hugo Chavez. As a matter of fact the same hates speech occurred back in 632 AD when Mohammed died and Abu Bakr and Ali and their supporters fought for control of the new Islamic faith. To this day Shia's and Sunnis are still killing each other.
Be a Democrat that's fine. But what you advocate is not Democratic, it is anarchy and it portends war and holocaust, not legitimate politics. Be careful what your partisanship causes you to ask for, you may actually get it.
Jerry please - Rush Limbaugh, Sean Hannity, Senator Demint and Cantor say BS all the time to get their base riled up - like this is any different.
Yup, glad to see a little Patton rhetoric and for those of you on the right overreacting he only met vote them out of office. He left the Palin bulls-eye map at home...
you only hear right wing rave when dem does it. Where was the outrage when Palin was putting bulls eyes on districts and TP with their obama/ monkey caricatures. The rules do not apply to Republicans.
Mav
You and gpotts are correct, of course. However, your assumption of ideology is incorrect, I am not any of those people. I do spend a fair amount of time in places that are more violent than you do and I hear the rhetoric there too. Hate is hate and it does bring action here or in the Middle East or any other place run by fear and despotism. Of course that could never happen here. Oh, by the way before you assume too much and make your self look foolish, I voted for Obama, but even a supporter can see that he has presided over too much change and leaves us with no hope at all. So keep the faith and snipe at people who see what is happening, you offer no substance, no reason and don't find Mr. Hoffa offensive. That says it all.
Jerry,
Remember writing this:
Obama and his regime of nation killing agencies drive another nail into the American culture they have never been proud of. There is no justification for killing the oil industry, the coal industry and the auto industry. Why are we just sitting here while Obama attacks every part of our society?
You are a conservative, and a hypocirite. And I seriously doubt you ever voted for President Obama.
I did Amy. I not only voted, but I am a registered Democrat. However I am not a socialist or stupid. I am simply to old to go along with what is disguised as democratic policy which is in fact anarachy and communist doctrine. So while you are judging me, give me facts about what Obama has done since we all voted. You can't because the facts and history will judge him as a President of style whose substance surfaced only when he got power. My vote was wasted the same way my breath is wasted on you. He operates outside of the law and that has encouraged me to wake up. Give me facts Amy, facts not personal attacks. You can't because any extreme is good in your eyes. Show me what you got Amy.
Jerry
As you recall, when President Obama took office during the financial crisis, it looked like we were facing another Depression. President Bush was convinced to bail out the banks, to keep them from tanking and taking our whole system with it. Bush didn't want to do this, because it went against his free market principles, but he did and President Obama continued this course of action, as well as sending money to the states to keep public workers employed, and bailing the American Automobile Industry out, which was on the verge of collapse.
Everything I have read, indicates the bail out of the car companies was a resounding success, and all four major American Automobile companies are profitable for the first time since 2004. I am sorry I can't give you links, but I'm on my ipad at the moment and that is not so easy.
If you voted for Obama in 2008 you know the two wars Bush started were put on the nation's credit card which contributed to the federal debt, along with ten years of Bush's tax cuts. Now Republicans have the nerve to threaten our country with default on debt THEY incurred. There are at least nine Republicans inthe spotlight campaigning to unseat Obama and none of them acknowledge the Republican role in creating the mess we are in. It is up to average voters to get the facts and stand up for the President.
BAM - But you know facts don't matter Amy. I am not enamored with the president's economic policies. However, the alternative is scarier. More of the same Reagan and GWB philosophy will get us nowhere. I sincerely hope he re-shape his economic team in 2012. He has got to break away from some of the Keynesian approaches - they are no better than supply side economics - neither address this new economy we find ourselves in currently - which has been 30 years in the making.
Mav, I have high hopes for the jobs plan President Obama is proposing Thursday. I never liked Larry Sumners and I'm glad he's gone. Geithner is pretty scary too, but if Obama trusts him, he must be OK.
And he said that while he is still willing to work with Republicans – and thinks that’s right for the country – he challenged the GOP to “show us what you got.”
Perhaps it is time for the President to do the same - with detail and not just broad-brush rhetoric.
This is the detail-less and clue-less President. Yes, Mr. President, show us what you have in detail and in writing. Thank you.
He has conceded too much already. Piss on the TP idiots. They have obstructed long enough. Do not even invite them. They can't understand the polysyllabic jargon anyway. Schedule it during NASCAR or the CMT awards and they will never know.
gpotts-1106111-
Wow, what political nonsense cometh from your mouth.
I assume you think Obama has shown us what he has. Give me an example.
He is a good teleprompter orator without a real plan; or the ability to formulate one. He cries wolf with the best of them. I just don't believe him any more. Thursday will be more of the same. Not good enough for thoughtful Americans.
My teenage son once asked me whether I was a liberal or a conservative. My answer was "no."
What are these factions besides massive fronts for special interests? The Democrats are owned and operated by the unions and organized crime, and the Republicans are dominated by these scary theocratic evangelicals and their allies in military contracting. Both are anti-democracy, anti-rule of law, and anti-American.
This republic was designed to promote civil liberty and the rule of secular law. What was the point of independence from Britain and the elimination of slavery, when now we function as vassals of corporations and slaves to the IRS?
I despise politics because the agenda is never about anything that matters or any proposals that would promote life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. All my life the best result I have hoped for is a balance of power between two vicious and useless gangs that fear and distrust freedom. Liberals left to themselves would create a party-state where privacy, free enterprise and open expression would cease to exist. Conservatives think that the only law is private property and would lead us into medieval feudalism. I hate them both.
MSN and Media Types
You must be out of your mind. Your article is silent on the biggest story of the day. Our politicians and people in power, such as Jimmy Hoffa Jr. have heated up the rhetoric to the point of exploding into a civil war based upon class warfare ideas that can only destroy our nation, it's history and the future for all those we love. Can you, news media, MSN, reporters such as Chuck Todd et al and other opinion makers not see the harm you are doing. I don't care if you are Tea Party or Socialist Party, you all love your children, you all bleed, you all hope for an American future, even if you disagree on what it looks like. You do all care about those things? Or, don't you.
Tea Party people are not all crazed terrorists, heart-felt Democrats in labor positions working hard everyday are not all anarchists mad for power. You are regular people, fortunate to have been born in the richest, most free society that has ever existed. If you want to spend your week-end drinking beer and watching sports you can. If you want to spend your week-end with your children at the beach you can. If you want to attend a political rally, fly a flag over your home, campaign for a local candidate or write a comment like this, you can. If you want to kiss your wife or girlfriend in public, you can! There are many places where money and political forces will not allow you to do any of those things. Still you don't adequately report news that should be known to all, or you ignore it and report nonsense such as the subject of Brittany's new tatoo or Lilo's latest parole violation. As I started this comment by asking if you are insane, I follow it up with, are you socially or individually insane?
This week-end, not one of my friends who drive and work hard, but a man at the pinnacle of the Teamsters power structure has suggested that his people are, "Obama's army" He followed that with the suggestion that it was " time to take the sons of a b*#:<&'s out." The same man's father was murdered and never seen again after living the same kind of loud mouthed, oppositional and bigoted life. But that is not the worst of it all. On the same program the POTUS, Barak Obama, declared that he was, "proud of the first speaker," Jimmy Hofa Jr. The POTUS was proud of the behavior and speech that he condemned after the shooting of Rep. Giffords. This is not civility, where is your long article on the danger of violent, hateful speech and the call to civil violence that it portends. Where is your article about why the President did not grow a pair and stand up like a leader of world class status and praise Hoffa for his hard work while calling him out on absolutely violent, hateful and unnecessary speech. The President did not have the spine to oppose it, for self interest he praised it and you the "mainstream media" did not report the danger that it represents. Are you out of your mind. are you insane or are simply so absorbed by your perceived self interest that you can dismiss this Nazi like behavior without comment and without a cautionary warning.
Why can you not report that our current leadership, including the sainted Mr. Obama are thugs and gansters with power hungry agenda's who really do not seek any welfare beyondtheir own. Tell me, looking me in the face, that the expressions this week-end mean anything less than a call for violent, resistance to opposing views. Go ahead, tell me, I need a laugh desperately.
No, maybe another option applies. DNC Chair D. Wasserman-Schultz simply talked louder and faster than the honest journalist who asked about the violent, hateful nature of the Hoffa-Obama moments and refused to discuss them by stating that jobs not language was the issue of the day. Incredible and blatantly, disingenuos. That is dishonesty, denial and a sociopathic outlook on life in power. I am just a little man and I will be cursed and humiliated for saying these things publicly. But, I will stand and I will say them. Pol's, Media, Union reps, left and right wing special interests you are all powermad, selfish and incapable of acting decently for the good of our nation. You are among the "haters" that you so often and so forcibly decry. For God's sake or if you don't, can't or won't believe for the sake of all those you love and hope for, report all the news, take the platform you control away from the true"haters", don't give calls for violence and for incivility any coverage. Please, be people who will suffer pain and disfavor for the sake of honesty and decency. If you who help create public opinion cannot act with goodness and integrity, you will be guilty and complicit in the destruction of a nation that for all it's warts is still the best hope for most of the people of this world. You will fail and be destroyed along with the source of your freedom, " The Constitution" of the US. No one living in chaos or enforced hostility cares what the news is. You will have helped to cause your own irrelevancy.
Your last choice, stand up for your nation with integrity or prepare to be closed down by the violence you have failed to condemn.
Relax Jerry and take a chill pill... It's not all that...
Please, ignorance is bliss Mav. Ever see a pile of dead bodies who were killed for what they believe? I will chill out when people with their eyes wide shut wake up. Both political sides should abhore this. But you don't seem to have a political side, only a side that knows it all. This will not pass, not this time, unless we demand that it stops. It is time for adults to stand up, but you go ahead and continue to play. No one will answer you anymore.
Jerry, the rhetoric on the right is worse. The tea party and the far right have been spewing this stuff for years - but for some reason they get a pass? Now why is that? The republican party is now the tea party, demeaning and ideological zealots. They don't stand for what our founding fathers believed, they have proven themselves mockeries of true patriots and a creation of the Koch brothers and other corporate interests - self serving and hypocritical to a fault. We deserve the type of government we get because we choose the people that govern us. When we don't go to the polls and apply critical thinking to our choices, we get the likes of the tea party.
Jerry you are so right. Well said !
Mav
Tell me the personal experience you have with all you write. Cite the facts to me, with sources of your assertion that the Tea Party is all Republican or all white. The mocking patriots you refer to, how many of them gave of their lives to defend the dignity and freedom you and I have been able to enjoy. How many lost sons and daughter to conflicts that your comments mock. Or better yet, how many have you heard pledge alliegence to the Koch brothers or any corporate interest. You have no answer because you speak from what you feel and what you have been told and not from what you have actually witnessed. Remember where we started this morning in our exchange. A powerful man, sounding as if he were in a drunken stupor stood at the Presidents side and told his "followers" that it was time to "take out the SOB's" You seem to think. Why do you accept this. When Mr. Obama was elected I was a registered Democrat, I still am. I will however not stand by a man who has disregarded the rule of law and states publically that he is proud of James Hoffa Jr. for calling out the SOB's. No matter what my affiliation I can still think and I can still discern right from wrong. This is not a question of relative value or partisan politics. It is a question of the chief executive, charged with maintaining law and order, proudly supporting a call for anarchy. If someone doesnt ask for more character from those we elect soon, who will speak for us when we have lost our freedom to speak. Not Hoffa Jr. and not his proud President. Read Martin Niemeoller. Same outcome applies.
Mav
Before I sign off for the night, I did not address your suggestion about, "hypocritical to a fault". well this democrat attend the Tea Party locally. Most don't know who the Kochs are. Three themes are talked about:
1. Holding politicians of all stripes accountable under the law.
2. Expecting politicians to be more than a represntation of the special interests that they are paid by.
3. Smaller government with more individual responsibilty for family, educational, social and relational issue. Living life without expecting or tolerating Washington trying to control it all.
Thats all, no alcohol is served and I have never heard anyone call for "taking out" anyone. Any way you are a good debater.
Jerry, I love spirited debate (by the way I am a vet, so I fully understand patriotism in the true sense and my dad fought in Vietnam and my grandfather in WWII). I never claimed the tea party was all white or republican either. The truth of the matter is that it is funded by the likes of Dick Army and the Koch brothers, which is their right. But please don't tell me their agenda is bi-partisan. Their "little group of congressmen" in Washington basically pushed this country to the brink of default by blindly following and ideology instead of putting the country's interest first and it is no coincidence that they all signed the Grover Norquist pledge. No politician should surrender their right to compromise and the common good. They serve the American people, not Grover Norquist. A wolf is a wolf and the sheep's clothing won't hide that. Those themes you mention are just code for a conservative/corporate agenda. I believe in reason and critical thinking Jerry - not ideology. You are a good debater as well and I respect your opinions. The president (love him or hate him) is a rational person and in the face of people that won't compromise and wish him to fail would you just rather have him capitulate? Me, I'd rather see him fight and if rhetoric is a tactic that his detractors constantly use against him, then so be it, he has every right to call them on it and give some back. Unfortunately we loose as a nation when both sides have to resort to such tactics, but that is where we find ourselves and trust me political rhetoric wasn't that different from George Washington to today. You may recall from history, Lincoln's detractors were vicious in their rhetorical attacks against him.
O'Bama is nothing but a walking, talking "political game"
looking forward to Nov '12 so we can get closure to this miserable experience and actually get some real optimism again
Optimism from this republican "wacky pack?" They are all doom and gloom - unless you elect them and the skies will open and the celestial choirs will sing! - Great line from Hillary Clinton and apropos for these clowns...
We’re going to see if we’ve got some straight shooters in Congress.
Just like your laser beam for creating jobs. More blah blah blah. He is wearing that straight shooter phrase out.
Before you vote, look for the Union Label
That will tell you who made your candidate, who owns your candidate, and who wants a cut of your pay check if you have a job.
Union scale wage earners pay income taxes, FICA and Medicare taxes.
Such jobs are essential for the economy to support the 48% of the population who pay no income taxes and no or little FICA and Medicare taxes.
Now is the time for us to begin our strategy and planning. Now is the time to begin fixing blame on non-Progressives in Congress; they will be the ones we say are the cause of a weak economy and failed job creating "plans"
Wealthy people and companies with money in the bank owe us jobs. Even if they don't have a need for more employees, those are our jobs they are hoarding. Give us our jobs.
To the Tea Party loyalists: YOU should be apologizing to the American people for the chaos you have caused and the obstructionist thinking and for allowing Grover Norquist to run the party for you. Thanks, but no thanks on your call for apology. Put that in your teabag and drink it!
Cute Mystery Medic, I will say I am sorry for not being a slave to George Sorros or the long list of the presidents leftest loyal. Meet with some tea party members with an open mind. I have sat down with many liberals and democrates and debated and listened to them. It has been civil and we seem to agree on alot more than we disagreed. You sir will not ever agree and for that I am sorry.
'show us what you got" !!! the tea/republican party has the SOS !!! and it goes like this-cut taxes for corporations, eliminate or reduce capital gains taxes, de-regulate industry and gut the EPA !!! sounds a lot like a bush redo to me and look where that lead us-TO THE VERY BRINK OF A DEPRESSION !!! NO THANKS !!!
Our labor unions are not narrow, self-seeking groups. They have raised wages, shortened hours and provided supplemental benefits. Through collective bargaining and grievance procedures, they have brought justice and democracy to the shop floor.
JOHN F. KENNEDY, speech, Aug. 30, 1960
Dwight D. Eisenhower:
Only a fool would try to deprive working men and working women of their right to join the union of their choice.
Wendell Phillips: