"Kudos for another fabulous week here at the best political blog on the web! ;o)"

__________________________________

And, if you'll Lean Forward I'll plant a big ole Nasty Redhead kiss you know where!!!!

"40 hours work weeks'

Is that all the time you spend here?? Seems longer.

Everybody likes a little ass, Joe- nobody lilkes a smartass.

And a happy weekend to you, too, sport.

Our FR hosts did another fine job of providing topics to discuss. They definitely need to rest up because next week will be a busy one.

A libertini sounds good. Think I'll head on over to the DDI and join in the toast to Labor Day.

Have a nice weekend.

Your right, it was another week of factual inaccuracies, hypocrisy and personal attacks and bigotry by the gang. Something I would know this blog must be proud of.

Joe in Albany

"Kudos for another fabulous week here at the best political blog on the web! ;o)"

__________________________________

And, if you'll Lean Forward I'll plant a big ole Nasty Redhead kiss you know where!!!!

Yea, on your glass d***

Probably because you are drugged and can't find the FOX Echo chambers blogs this explains why you repeatedly come back here.

Just for a few more giggles, maybe Obama can phrase his "Jobs Speech" in the form of a FY2012 budget.

Kirk, you do your fair share of inaccuracies, hypocrisy and personal attacks as does every other conservative poster so knock off the "holier than thou"--it won't sell. Have a nice weekend.

Just for a few more giggles, maybe Obama can phrase his "Jobs Speech" in the form of a FY2012 budget.

Smiff go plop your exploding hemorrhoids on someone else's porch - you are NOT welcome on mine!

Maybe Obama can talk a little about black unemployment during his "Big Speech". Seems it's the highest in decades, 16.7%. That's a constituency of Barry's, correct?

Source: http://money.cnn.com/2011/09/02/news/economy/black_unemployment_rate/

Maybe someone should restrain Maxine during the "Big Speech". Ms. Waters is not happy with Barack. Not happy at all. She's liable to so something "unprofessional". She might even tell someone to "Go to h*ll!!".

Obama will not be presenting his entire job plan on Thursday night. It will be just part of the his bigger plan. The rest will be addressed throughout September at economic events, and fundraisers.

So what's going to be the spin?

Too funny- everyone lightens up on Friday afternoon on here (Hell, even Spanky and Me), but there's Jowhanna Smiff, still plugging away, as though she's going to change anyone's views with her non-stop bleating.

Happy Friday, y'old snapper.

Jody, I certainly do my share of arguing my side or using facts in a way that best represents my view--never said otherwise as we all do that. But give me a post with hypocrisy or bigotry in it? I call people out to point out the hypocrisy but if you want to call that a personal attack I understand. I have not called Christians wackos or nut jobs and then fail to back up or defend my post. I have never said I was holier than thou--in fact quite the opposite I am fine with being a sinner. It would be nice for a progressive to admit that now and then. Jody, you have a wonderful weekend and by the way, I really like Iowa at least some parts. I have spent many weekends hunting and golfing in various parts of the state. Its a great state made up of wonderful people.

ttt: So what's going to be the spin?

Obama will recommend that every one get a union job in Chicago. This one guy got a $108,000 pension, for a $40,000/year job, a job he retired from in 2008 at age 56. Now that is a sweet deal.

Chicago. Just rolling in the money. And unions. What would we do without them?

So Obama will recommend those kinds of jobs for the unemployed.

Source: http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/watchdog/ct-met-pensions-villanova-20110902,0,1997273.story#start

Hey Buzz, we staying on topic okay for you? We know how fussy and distracted you get if we stray from the articles main point.

Kirk-2957282 Your right, it was another week of factual inaccuracies, hypocrisy and personal attacks and bigotry by the gang. Something I would know this blog must be proud of. And, we're sure this blog will e-mail you a huge thank you for all your contributions this week that have helped make it so proud, Kirk.

JoAnnaSmith1

"Hey Buzz, we staying on topic okay for you? We know how fussy you get if we stray from the articles main point."

Midol's out there in the middle of the left lane of I-95, Smiff.

GO for it!

" Maybe someone should restrain Maxine during the "Big Speech". Ms. Waters is not happy with Barack. Not happy at all. She's liable to so something "unprofessional". She might even tell someone to "Go to h*ll!!". "

Joanna, They should put Maxine Waters on trial for funneling tax payer money to her husbands bank (illegally) . This way she won't get a chance to shout "got to h$%" again in front of audiences.

This way she won't get a chance to shout "got to h$%" again in front of audiences

In case you have forgotten LEONA - this is still America & we are allowed to practice our first amendment rights!

Well, that is until the tea baggers go after that amendment as well...

I just love how you RWNJ's pick & chose the 'flavor' of the day!

Maxine happens to be right - the tea baggers DO NOT pass go & DO NOT collect $200 on their way straight to hell!

PS: Can someone call pest control for me? The steaming piles are starting to pile up...

Hey Feisty, I noticed you did not mention the fact that M.Waters needs to see her day in court ! That's all I am saying.

Double Libertini, please. Shaken a lot!

Thanks, Ms. Feisty!

'Twill be an interesting week, no doubt. I'm looking forward to the coming economic push. I think it will be historic.

Also, it's been a great week for America at the Track and Field World Championships in Deagu, S. Korea.

#1 & #2 in men's decathlon - #1 in women's 1500 (awesome race) - a new U.S. record in women's 400 hurdles and #1, #1 in men's high jump and 100 hurdles - #1 in women's long jump and 100 meter dash...Crazy good competition from some of this nation's best athletes.

(Their focus, dedication, and sacrifice would put many a Pol to shame.)

I noticed you did not mention the fact that M.Waters needs to see her day in court !

I believe Ms. Water's is currently facing ethics charges, and yes I agree, she should have her day to either prove her innocence or guilt.

Double Libertini, please. Shaken a lot!

NO - you have to go with stirred - shaking bruises the vodka! ;o)

Leona,

Is the new civility of the Democrat Party?

Then we have Waters telling the Tea Party Movement to go to hell, and now this.

CARSON: This is the effort that we're seeing of Jim Crow. Some of these folks in Congress right now would love to see us as second-class citizens.

CARSON: Some of them in Congress right now with this Tea Party movement would love to see you and me -- I'm sorry, Mr. Chairman -- hanging on a tree.

Nothing like a little race baiting, how low can they go. These are elected officials, class act.

NO - you have to go with stirred - shaking bruises the vodka! ;o)

I defer to your expert advise! :>)

So, Totas - How long have you been enjoying 'white' privilege?

Still have grandad's sheet in your closet?

Low hanging fruitcake...

What a vile little person you are, goes to show you that you do not have to be white to be racist

I think we all deserve a good drink after the week just closed...and in anticipation of the week coming up.

Thanks FR crew, you've done a great week as always.

"...goes to show you that you do not have to be white to be racist"

And, you don't have to be bright to be basest!

feisty, when Obama has that colonoscopy you can recover your lost wig. But I'm afraid that a second term may be out of the question now, sorry!

Please no more racist comments and let's all become friends! I seem to remember you also gave Weiner the benefit of the doubt over his sexual misadventures! lol, and now you're doing the same now with Waters? GMAB!

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL

This way she won't get a chance to shout "got to h$%" again in front of audiences

In case you have forgotten LEONA - this is still America & we are allowed to practice our first amendment rights!

Feisty - If this is America & we are allowed to practice our first amendment rights, why did all the Democrats get their panties-in-a-wad when Rep. Joe Wilson yelled "You lie!" to Obama during his health care speech in front of Congress?

Isn't that a little hypocritical? Just saying.

Weak, Ben....Weak.

But, you've probably heard that before.

Rep. Joe Wilson yelled "You lie!" to Obama during his health care speech in front of Congress?

There's a little thing call R E S P E C T and for some strange reason, the tea baggers will not afford any to this President!

I didn't realize Maxine said that during a speech before Congress?

Do you have the source or link for that?

I could swear she said that while addressing her constituents...

So has Joanna always been such a bigoted C$%T on this site ? Just wondering

Joe simply has no sense of decorum, Glenn.

But then, that first amendment doesn't exclude the oblivious.

Your fully in that curve - no lie.

Richard, you are right.... I have resorted to using feisty's tactics of insult and smear.... I would prefer to avoid such trash talk, but pretty sure she won't!

Richard - I didn't say Wilson was right, but Waters showed as much or actually as little class.

I guess the only "R E S P E C T" Maxine has is an old scratched 45 of Aretha's

Don't diss Aretha, Glenn.

"You're runnin' out of foolin' (just a little bit)
And I ain't lyin' (just a little bit) "

Maxine is speaking truth!

And, I agree - Wilson has no 'class'.

Joe simply has no sense of decorum, Glenn

Joe Wilson & his cronies must persist to put the boy in his place...

Just ask Pat Buchanon!

Or Glen Beck...

Or Rush Limpballs...

Or Joe Walsh (R) IL...

Well you get the idea!

PS: JohnB - GOOD to see you at the Dew Drop Inn! ;o)

Richard - I am sure there are some who would say Wilson also spoke the truth.

Diss Aretha - Hell no! Listening to her belt out a soul right now.

Richard - I am sure there are some who would say Wilson also spoke the truth.

I'm not Richard, but, regardless, of whether or NOT it was the truth - it was unprecedented to have ANY member of Congress shout something during a Presidential speech!

If Joe didn't have enough self-discipline to control his outburst - then, he should of been censured!

What was even MORE despicable, was the klan member raised $$$ off it!

I am sure there are some who would say Wilson also spoke the truth.

Yea, but the sum is a zero.

But, heck yeah, crank up the Queen!

Richard, really zero? After the comments I have read today here on MSNBC from Democrats upset over Mr Obama's announcement that he was ordering the Environmental Protection Agency to shelve a proposal to tighten smog standards, I am sure the number is a little higher than that just in the Democratic party.

But, anyway nice chatting, time for for some more Aretha

Richard-348249

"You're runnin' out of foolin' (just a little bit)
And I ain't lyin' (just a little bit) "

Maxine is speaking truth!

And, I agree - Wilson has no 'class'.

Richard Amen

Leave it to the lynch mob to be up in arms over a black man speaking the truth.

Tea Party Wanksters want the Congressman To Resign because he said they want to see Blacks “Hanging On A Tree”????

Can you say POT – KETTLE!?!? These fools are the main ones making crazy comments and now they want to get mad because Black politicians can dish it as well as they can take it.

What he said sounds about right to us… These fools stay on some “take our country back” and they stay using racist rhetoric about our nation’s President. They got some nerve calling for this man to step down for speaking the truth when most of them ought to be tried for treason!!!

It ain’t hard to tell what time it is.

Joe Wilson is a damn fool and probably wears a white sheet. I read somewhere he did not just say YOU LIE. It was said Joe Wilson said YOU LIE; BOY!

The Black repub T-bagger Allen West says he want to leave the CBC. How about this fool leaving the country?

On Obama: West calls Obama "the dumbest person walking around in America right now," and says "I can't stand the guy. I absolutely can't stand him."

BTW: Ted Nugent suggested that then-Senator Barack Obama “suck on” his machine gun?

host Sean Hannity joined a chorus of conservative objectors to rapper Common’s invitation to a White House poetry event. In particular, Hannity objected to a line from a Common poem that said “Burn a bush for peace,” and said that “If this was somebody who used the same type of rhetoric about violence against President Obama I would be against it.

That’s right, when Bob Beckel asked Hannity if he was “prepared to disavow this lowlife,” Hannity’s response was “No, I like Ted Nugent. He’s a friend of mine.”

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/common-hater-sean-hannity-defended-ted-nugents-violent-anti-obama-rhetoric/

Leave to the FOX hounds to stir the pot of racism.

This hate has been brewing a long time. It's inappropriate and very disrespectful

BTW: Ted Nugent suggested that then-Senator Barack Obama “suck on” his machine gun?

GF -- I have a much better place for Ted to rest his gun - like up his ass while I have my itchy finger on the trigger.... just sayin...

Until the right wing nuts can admit the raciscm... there will be NO turning back!

Moral of the story is -there is a plethora of information out there screaming for the N*****'s neck!

Rush was sooooooooo right.

Before Mr. Obama even got elected, he predicted that racial tensions would not subside but would get worse....(Beer Summit...lol)...Disagree with Obama? Racist! Disagree with Clarence Thomas? Patriot!

Bev "Resist We Much" Sharpton and Crusty prove Rush's prophecy....lmao

Lean Forward!

Rush was sooooooooo right..

Right. So fat and oxicontined.

What a load!!

Pegged a hell of a lot more right than Mr. Obama.

Even you'd have to admit that...lol...I know it sucks, but such is life.

He also predicted ObamaCare would be sh!tcanned and look where THAT'S headed....lol

As Raych says....Lean Forward!

"CARSON: Some of them in Congress right now with this Tea Party movement would love to see you and me -- I'm sorry, Mr. Chairman -- hanging on a tree.............. Nothing like a little race baiting, how low can they go. These are elected officials, class act."

thetotas, Without race baiting, the Congressional Black Caucus members (M.Waters and her cronies) have no way to "rally the troops." They get their constituents worked up over a non-issue ( i.e. " the tea party is racist") to hold them in place and get them to the polls. Otherwise, these people would stay at home on election day. Their unemployment rate is even HIGHER than the national average. Simple as that.

I'm having a hard time distinguishing racism between the left and the right. Simply put, racism is racism! Maybe Bev, Feisty, and Richard can explain to me (an independent) why racist views and statements from the CBC are alright. To me racism is the single worst brand you can put on someone, yet you constantly brand those whose points of view don't match yours as this terrible word. Bev says that 'the hate has been brewing for a long time. It's inappropriate and disrespectful'. I agree, but maybe in the future you can contribute positive points of view that don't propogate the point of view you are lamenting. Have a great Labor Day weekend all. Peace, out.

Bigotry is a better word than RACISM. I am a bigot because I perceive that Republicans (almost all) are narrow minded itiots.

I don't really care what race they are. Please note the distinction. Thank you.

Nice perception. You might want to learn to spell the word idiot though, especially before using it in a sentence to demean someone.

Feisty, given your religious bigotry, come back to us when you have any credibility on discrimination.

Kirk,

You should come back when you have any credibility {period}.

Kirk,

You should come back when you have any credibility {period}.

Thanks Dennis!

Kirk's lack of credibility earned him a spot on my very select ignore list... ;o)

Looks like Kirk's facade of reasonableness is falling away.

John, what does my reasonableness have to do with Fiesty's clear religious bigotry and disrespect for all things Christian. She cant even defend herself nor could anyone else except to personally attack me just like Dennis did. My credibility with you guys is irrelevant in the face of her bigotry that can easily be found

It's not your Christianity that she doesn't respect. That's something, incidentally, that you've not even mentioned in the past. I'm very firmly Christian and don't feel disrespected in any way...never have. Your steadfast and unshakeable devotion to Conservative dogma is another matter entirely. Come to think of it Sociologists refer to that level of uncritical belief as religious even though it's ostensibly a secular matter. Call it the Church of Libertarianism.

I have never mentioned it because my religious beliefs are irrelevant and I am not on the same page at all with the views of conservative christians on issues like gay marriage or abortion. However, I would respect their views no different than I respect the people who worship the environment in a manner that I find not consistent with my views. To call someone bible thumping and other religious bigotry labels is reprehensible in my book and if we went after faithful followers of Islam and Koran thumpers can you see the outcry from progressives on here? In addition, I asked Fiesty or anyone else to give me an example of where Perry has tried to use his religious beliefs in an inappropriate political position or law? Being prolife or against gay marriage doesnt count because people's backgrounds always frame their beliefs and their are plenty of nonreligious people who feel the same way. Catholics arent bible thumpers and are pro life etc. Fiesty couldnt come up with anything on Perry. If you dont like his political positions then dont vote for him but to criticize someone or personally attack them based on religion is reprehensible sorry but it is.

As for my devotion to conservative dogma, is that similar to your devotion to progressive views? I am definitely devoted to fiscal conservatism and I have never said otherwise. This concept of not critically thinking through the issues is somewhat laughable in that at any time I provide a view that others cant or dont like, I get put on ignore. Do you see any conservatives on here ignoring you guys? The fact that every once in awhile you can point out once sentence in a long post in which I may have embellished no different than you guys or use facts to support my positions but couldnt be interpreted in a different manner too is not evidence of critically thinking when in general you guys never respond to the ultimate outcome its one fact you pick on.

We can have our differences but until you guys are willing to admit to the progressive hypocrisy when you guys are the majority of this blog, do you really think any conservative is?

I'm not the one who made the accusations of religious hypocrisy...that was you.

As for that "progressive hypocrisy" line, I'm not a bit sure your address is at all conducive to throwing stones. You of all people have an unequaled history of simply dismissing any evidence that doesn't conform to your preconceived notions.

That's why so many here have you on ignore. I don't use the ignore function, but certainly don't feel obligated to remain entangled in one of your typical circular arguments.

I know you didnt make accusations I made them of Fiesty when she started a blog with a post about bible thumping Christian fanatics supporting Perry and Palin in a very derogatory fashion. I told her that comment was reprehensible and a form of bigotry that I would think that a progressive like herself was against. She refused and others jumped in saying that it was wearing their religion on their sleeve and I said thats not what she said but I also said what is wrong with that as we are not allowed to attack feminists or gays who wear their views or sexuality on their sleeve. They also made reference to political positions based on religion and I said please give me some positions that Perry has that are inappropriate crossing of religion into politics (such as putting the ten commandments in the court house) but no one seems to be able to do that. So instead I was told I am being put on ignore because they have no response.

As for throwing stones, I never denied it and I generally use the same methods of you progressives to make my points which I generally dont find helpful but do it to try and bring it back to the substance. As for an unequaled history of simply dismissing evidence is just plain wrong. There are many times I have agreed with you, Anna Molly, Clara, Jody but I am still waiting for any of you guys to admit when I make a good point. As I have stated before, you guys love to take one sentence out of the whole or embellish the extreme to point me out as wrong while totally ignoring the substance of our discussion. I dont find that circular I find that as irrelevant which is why it makes you guys mad. For example, Anna Molly is great at providing a fact on a Wisconsin union issue but ignoring the facts she doesnt like and if my overall premise is why do we need state government unions in the first place and what protections do they provide compared to the labor market in general that we need compared to the private sector, she doesnt debate or want to and gives me where I am wrong because I had some stupid percentage off. How is that debate?

As for why so many have me on ignore that sort of befuddles me as the more militant conservatives they debate with because they seem to like the give and take of witty personal attacks but I noticed those that dont like their facts to be challenged or dont have any ability to personally support an opinionated conclusion cant stand me. I get it. Fiesty and Navy dont want to defend the indefensible and John A wants to be able to lecture everyone without challenge thinking he is the smartest guy in the room and its just a matter of his intellect winning us over and most of the others are just idealogues. I think you and I come from a total different perspective that drives different conclusions based on what each of us feels are the motivations of people. I guess I am less willing to think those who are successful are evil and those that have had less fortune economically are the salt of the earth. However, in any event, I would offer an apology if you think I have ever crossed the line personally with you as I dont take anything you say personally. Someday there could even be common ground who knows.

Perhaps. There is plenty of time to find out.

Ha not that much time. I cant imagine what this blog will be like if Obama were to get defeated so not sure I could stomach anymore. One thing that I have found to be the truth whether you believe me or not is that you learn more from those who think differently than you than those who are like you. Its why I come here rather than some conservative site in which everyone is preaching to the choir. But I am certainly in the minority in that view in this blog thats for sure.

Well Kirk, I agree that there's a great deal to be learned from those with a different point of view. It's for that reason that I listen to Conservative talk radio. I don't agree that the Right isn't represented here, though. There seem to be plenty of Conservatives to post here on a daily basis.

I don't remember 'The Duck Song' but it sounds appropriate for Boehner.

Seems appropriate, somehow, to play a children's song during these trying times in Washington.

Forget about DC Buzz - it's more then appropriate for the RWNJ's right here at First Read!

Just look at poor kirk? LMAO

I think the RWNJs have poor memories, poor Kirk has a bad case of it. He complains about what he reads, doesn't he realize he doesn't have to come here, go somewhere else Kirk where the material will be better suited to your fantasy world.

Thank you to our hosts, as Feisty says, rest up for the weeks ahead, wonder will anyone there be covering Miss Sarah and her caravan. You know she would miss you guys.

I'm headed over to the DDI, have some delicious homemade salsa, and homemade guacamole with chips, they'll go well with the libertinis or maybe a marguerita. Have a great weekend everybody, I'm headed to the beach for some suntime and fun with the family.

he doesn't have to come here,

No, Ginger, that troll DOES have to come here in order to get his RNC paycheck for spewing their spin and talking points. I wonder if he is being paid by the word or by the post. Either way, he just can't help himself.

Yesterday, in response to another poster, dbo said this

"But he did make a huge mistake thinking the economy would be cruising along by now at a 4-5% GDP with 6% unemployment by now..."

That's right. And you knew better yourself back then, didn't you? But- can you tell us HOW you knew?

Now, I know for a fact that I have, on many occasions, explained the fallacies inherent in Keynseian economics, but, perhaps, I was too technical to be understood. So, let's try it this way.

Suppose, on an 85 degree summer day, the temperature in your house is 80 degrees. You lower the thermostat, but the A.C. does not kick on.

Using the advice of your brother in law, who works in HVAC, you call a contractor and have the condenser unit replaced, at the cost of $3000- plus labor, bringing your total expenditure up to $3900.

The A.C. Still does not kick on.

You again consult with your brother in law, who tells you that it must be the fan motor. You again call your contractor, have the fan motor replaced, (spending an additional $1600)- and the A.C. STILL does not kick on.

At that point, you give up, and purchase window units, ($5000), and finish out the summer.

Comes the cold weather, and the furnace does not kick on. Brother in law advises a new furnace, ($12,000)- and the heat does not, in fact, work.

You abandon the house.

A new owner purchases the house from the bank after it is foreclosed. This owner had the foresight to have a heating contractor look at the HVAC system- and is informed that the place needs a new thermostat- cost? $150. That resolves the problem, and the new owner enjoys the house you left as uninhabitable.

The problem with Keynes is that it throws money at a general problem- the differential in output during recession- but does not address any particular problem associated thereto. So, government spending is seen as the magic answer to economic slowdowns.

Unfortunately, this spending often takes the shape of more government employees, enforcing more regulations, further
exacerbating the problems the spending is meant to ameliorate.

The fact is that, dueling downturns in the business cycle, firms become more efficient- placing them in position to grow quickly on the upswing. Government intervention LENGTHENS the downward trend, rather than shortens it.

That's how those of us who knew Obama's policies would fail knew the economy would NOT be humming along at five or sox percent growth today- or last year, or, for that matter, next year.

As long as Obama continues to buy the twaddle of Krugman, et als, his economic policies are doomed to fail. Is he smart enough to figure it out?

I don't know- but it's encouraging that dbo is, finally, asking the right questions.

It remains to be seen if he will accept the answers.

As long as Obama continues to buy the twaddle of Krugman, et als, his economic policies are doomed to fail.

But I recall you wingnuts & Gingrich saying these exact same things about President Clinton in the 1990's...

Because of your short-term memory problems I will remind you that, even in the face of Newt's contract and opposition, Clinton WAS able to balance the federal budget and create a surplus to reduce debt. I feel it is a sin and a shame that you guys have redoubled Newt's type of obstructionism against President Obama; very un-American to my way of thinking. Truly sad for those of you who worship a dollar more than God and country.

You go on ahead "feeling".

The rest of us are THINKINg. Therein lies the difference.

You vote for anybody with a D after their name- and then are shocked when they fail.

You blame the predecessor, nature, uprisings in other countries.

You HAD a candidate who would have succeeded as president- why, for the good of the country, and your party, did you not support her?

Obama made you feel good.

Never mind that he did not have enough experience to get hired as assistant ,anger at a grocery store- give him the job as the chief executive of the greatest nation in history!

What could possibly go wrong with that?

Dbo is now sufficiently wised up enough to ask a question that has already been answered. You are not.

So, cote for Obama again. You and the few remaining worshippers can just keep on reading his speeches, scrape together enough money to go see him on the lecture circuit, and petition MSNBC to give him a show.

The rest of the country will be recovering from the disaster of his administration, if we make it that far. Iran is days away from a nuclear weapon.

The rest of the country will be recovering from the disaster of his administration

But first the nation must try to recover from the disaster of W's administration - oh, you forgot about that huh! President Obama could probably go a long way in that recovery, but it seems like you prefer Boehner, Cantor and McConnells idea of "hostage" holding and obstruction. Pretty silly.

Not as stupid as you think, We differ for this reason. Opposing the failing and destructive policies of the Obama administration is NOT "obstructionism". It's called PATRIOTISM.

Ah, we haven't seen the Conservative claim that they're the only ones who are patriotic around here for a while.

I love my country too. Deal with it.

I'm going with 'Job-Killing', but if you expect me to take a drink for each 'failed' something-or-other, I'm gonna have to drink light (yuck) beer, so I'm not walking sideways after the first 5 or 6 minutes.

Hard to pick, dangerfield but they tend to go overboard on Ronald Reagan.

Others to consider: tax cuts for business, job-killing regulations, repeal ObamaCare.

dbo and jody-

50% reading comprehension?

Nothing for the President's speech?

Why not?

"shared sacrifice'? perhaps?

I always listen for the phrase "millionaires and billionaires" when Obama speaks. It always rivals "Bush" (fault.) HAHA

df

downright SPOOKY that I just posted this over at the Dew Drop chat:

Democrat Drinking game for Tuesday night, chill plenty of cold beer (or whatever your pleasure), every time a Republican says "Reagan", take a drink. Every time a Republican says "Tax Cut", take TWO drinks. Every time a Republican says "Middle Class", slap yourself in the forehead to make sure you aren't dreaming! LOL

Happy Drinking and Happy Labor Day, all. We have a tradition in our neighborhood on the Monday evening of Labor Day, we gather in a neighbor's yard and we all make a dish to celebrate the Harvest of our summer. We try to use foods we've grown in our gardens or purchased from local farmer's markets. I am making oven roasted vegetables and home made gnocchi.

I am tired of all these Obama speeches. Can't we just listen to one of Obama's old speeches and skip this upcoming one? You know all his buzz words........"millionaires and billionaires" ( i.e. who hire people) , "on the backs of the most needy" (i.e. those who don't pay any taxes) , "clean energy jobs" (i.e. which don't exist yet) , "infrastructure" ( i.e. payoff for UNIONS) and Dream Act (i.e. amnesty).

Oh, Leona- you're on the right track, but. . .

Obam has an arithmetic problem. He defines "millionaires and billionaires" as those who earn over $200,000 a year.

His "green energy jobs" have been proved to be (a) millions of pay back to his hundred thousand plus donors and (b) venutres that have gone belly up, moved offshore, or, in the case of Evergreen- BOTH.

Those drunk on his questionable charm do not recognize this. The rest of us? We know.

Lord knows, we know.

Jody, Iowa

Labor Day is Monday, a day set aside to honor American workers.

Jody, why did you have to spoil it for the dummies? Righties think Labor Day is the day women give birth

See you at the Dew Drop Inn. I'll have my red, white, and blue "Labor is Not Free" tee-shirt on.

Happy weekend and Labor Day

Good one, Beverly, you have a great weekend, too!

I'll have my red, white, and blue "Labor is Not Free" tee-shirt on.

I'll be sporting my Obama 'Made in America' T-shirt! ;o)

no joe, no bo, nj

Should be an interesting week. Looks like Obama is focus grouping the Speech- and it's a dud.

If that's the case it's a good thing you're not in the group. Nothing is more of a dud and let down than your failure to communicate. You know how boring your meaningless rants are.

The "Dud" will be Speaker Boehner's speech the next week. Incidentally No Joe, speeches of this type are outlines of plans, bullet point lists, with some specifics. As for focus grouping, listening to the American people is exactly what I want any president to do. Boehner and his TP pals might try it for a change because they do exactly opposite of what voters want.

Jody, Iowa

Good one, Beverly, you have a great weekend, too!

Thanks Jody

TP pals might try it for a change because they do exactly opposite of what voters want.

Impossible, They are the here no evil and see no evil crowd. Tax cuts are evil. But, it sure is worth a try for them listen; at least.

"Boehner and his TP pals might try it for a change because they do exactly opposite of what voters want."

Jody, When The Dems shoved Obamacare down our throats (against the will of 70% of Americans) , did you call that the "opposite of what voters want" ?

Beverly, "... They are the here no evil and see no evil crowd. Tax cuts are evil. But, it sure is worth a try for them listen; at least."

Hey Beverly, Can you explain why you think tax cuts are "evil" ? I work hard and pay taxes and I like the sound of tax cuts.

LEONA-2986819

Hey Beverly, Can you explain why you think tax cuts are "evil" ? I work hard and pay taxes and I like the sound of tax cuts.

LEONA I sure can. Tax cuts for the top echelon who pay next to nothing particularly when the CEOs pay less than their employees are evil.

FYI: Unless you are a millionaire or had a brick on your check you got a brick you got a payroll tax reduction from the Obama administration.

Feisty, I'll be wearing mine, too! And highlighting the INK with those cute strappy sandals GBMama's daughter got me! See you there.

oh, and if you meet up with don't give me the penguin,...be sure and give him the finger (just kidding). LOL

we are due for a phone call, next week, I hope!

Jody, you are reiterating the history of unions we all know. Truth is, UNIONS got out of control over the years. The business sector went along with the demands for a long time. Unions have become, in the global economy, unsustainable. The world has changed and UNIONS must too.

Another Conservative fairytale. Unions continue to have board representation in Germany, a country that has performed better than the United States throughout the recession and since.

While that always sounds good, voters did put in a new team in the House in 2010, the Tea Party, and look where that got us.

Feisty, set up the bar.

Well stocked & loaded GF! ;o)

What ya having?

Feisty

I'm going all out to celebrate Labor Day GF. Make mine Chivas Regal. :)

I like things made in America like GE cars, for instance. Your tee- shirt sounds super. Herman Cain's tees were made in the West Indies. The President's were made in America.

Might be the only way to get rid of the large numbers of thugs that attend Dodgers games. Get caught acting like a thug and get some Chinese corporal punishment. Maybe families could start going to games again.

So, so doomed. As Americans find out the republican tea party plan is death to social security and medicare while Perry leads us to the rapture with his Army of God. You just know that will get the independent vote.

No one will miss you as you don't care about jobs or America anyway.

If you guys knew what you were talking about McCain would be president like you told us before the last presidential election.

Over-priced labor

Perks for the few

Jobs exported

Mafia domination of major industry

Thirty years of delays on energy reform

Bureaucrats doing nothing until retirement at public expense

Tax-evading elitism by an ignorant, flag-wrapped artificial middle class laughing at the rest of us who actually WORK for a living

Nation-crippling strikes

Incompetent, pederastic teachers who can't be fired

Daily threats to my grandfather's life before going to WORK

Six-months-on, six-months of HBO and bong hits by illiterate leftists who I wouldn't trust to build a dog house

Not taking this weekend off. WORKING FOR A LIVING AND PROUD OF IT. You can have your Stalinist paid holiday at my expense. I never asked for anything of an employer, or my country, that I didn't EARN. But then, I have a conscience. Never met a union man with one of those. Or calluses. Or an honest bone in his body.

Sure, I'm glad eight-year-olds don't work in sausage factories any more. But that was another millennium. In this one, you bolshevik unionists are trying to starve us all. Hope you collect those magnificent bennies you have broken all our backs with.

Hey Ron,

I think I'll outsource your job.

I found someone in China who'll do your job for $1.18 / hour.

I work harder on break than you do at your job. We are working to support the Socialist repubs like you that redistribute income to the upper 2%.

There is that certain class of people Ron, that no matter how many government programs you put them on, no matter how much taxpayer money you throw at them, no matter how much of their work you do for them, no matter how much these parasites suck off the government teat you can't get these people to get up off their fannies and find a real job, doing real work, at a real wage off the public dole.

We call these people republicans.

By the way Ron,

You are an idiotic, Right-wing, somnambulant, wage slave, Bush-bot.

Now go work in your contaminated factory, at sub-standard wages, with no medical benefits, and beat yourself dead so that some Socialist repub can get rich off of your dead, used-up body. There's a good boy!!

I'm going to spend the day with my family and loved ones, and pray no one else ends up like you.

What is a union?

The United States of America,.....ever hear of it?

, which preceded your IWW-inspired ultimatum clubs by over a hundred years.

More for your list:

Stores full of cheap chinese junk

Whole communities boarded up & abandoned

Inflated costs of manuf. goods passed on to consumers

Benefits paid to minority of workers regardless of profitability to employers

Reams of useless regulations that make no one safer & make small business impossible to maintain

Massive bailouts of industries by Feds to keep union endorsements for Dem. politicians

Permanent bureaucracies in every state govt. regardless of performance

Costs of cars & capital goods out of all proportion with reality

Athletes who can't make it on $2 mil./year without doping

Getting my drift? Ever wonder who ultimately pays for your inflated, subsidized, guaranteed, elitist lifestyle? Not the evil rich people you think have bottomless resources, but the defenseless consumers and the law-abiding taxpayers. Yours is a cult of economic hostage-taking. I don't know how you sleep at night surrounded by all these artificial perqs that real workers could never dream of. You couldn't turn the whole country to bolshevism before WW1 so you made an unholy alliance with the mafia to seize the most vital industries, wrapped yourselves in the flag (which ought to be the hammer & sickle) and almost ruined the war effort in WW2 with your strikes and your ungodly sense of entitlement. The trail of your victims is long, and the craters of former thriving industrial communities covers the map.

I don't have any of those ridiculous subsidies you listed. I never thought I needed them. I protect myself from harm by having the common sense not to get hurt on the job (for over thirty years). Nobody ever paid me for not working, because I didn't want them to. The union people I have known seem to think taking the whole society to the cleaners is some big joke, but one I never found funny while earning an honest living. Staying clear of union influences has been one of the key commitments of my working life. So far, so good. Please stay away from anywhere that people observe market economics, because you poison the well for everyone.

Nikki, what you were so brilliantly hinting at was this author's sentiments. To the "ME", "ME, "ME" crowd this might as well be written in Swahili. At the root of your analysis is the ultimate question: "Do we want to be a "Me" society, or a "We" society. I loved your post,....well done.

Tax Cuts: The B.S. and the Facts

By Larry Beinhart, AlterNet. Posted November 11, 2008.

That tax cuts stimulate the economy is taken as a matter of faith, but the brute facts suggest otherwise.

The Myth

Do tax cuts stimulate the economy?
Yes. Tax cuts allow people to keep more of their own money. Therefore, they have more to invest and spend into the economy, and they have more money to start business and create jobs, therefore also helping to stimulate the economy. -- Yahoo Answers
I think when people take a look back at this moment in our economic history, they'll r ecognize tax cuts work. They have made a difference. -- George W. Bush

The Realities
The brute facts are these:

• • Large income tax cuts are followed by a bubble and then a crash.
  • High income taxes correlate with economic growth.
  • Income tax increases are followed by economic growth.
  • Moderate income tax cuts are followed by a flat economy.
  • All of this is especially true as applied to the top tax rates, the amount paid on income that exceeds the highest bracket.

The Three Great Tax Cuts: Boom, Bubble, Crash

1. Hoover
During World War I, the top marginal tax rate went up to 73 percent -- not the highest ever, but pretty high.
In 1922, a series of rate cuts began. Down to 56 percent, 46 percent, and finally, in 1925, it went down to 25 percent.
The stock market took off. There was a boom. But the boom was a bubble.
It was followed by the Great Crash of 1929.
There were bank failures and the Great Depression.

2. Reagan
From Franklin Roosevelt's second term all the way through to Jimmy Carter -- from 1936 until 1982 -- the top rate was in the 70 to 92 percent range.
Then along came Reagan in 1981. In 1982, he cut that down to 50 percent.
The economy went into "the worst recession since the Great Depression."
His supporters argued that it was all Carter's fault and that the new policies would take time to work. The tax cuts stayed in place. In 1987, there was another round of tax cuts. They took the top rate down to 38.5 percent. It would stimulate the economy!
There was a boom. But it was a bubble.
Then, in October 1987, there was a crash -- the worst since '29. It was called Black Monday.
Much of the bubble money had gone into -- ohmigod! -- real estate.
Suddenly there were bank failures! More than during the Great Depression. There was a Savings & Loan crisis! There had to be a bailout.

3. Bush II
George Bush came into office with the healthiest, post powerful economy in American history.
He immediately cut taxes. The top marginal rate went down from 39 percent to 35 percent. He also cut capital gains taxes and inheritance taxes. A recession immediately ensued. But he persisted.
Eventually, the economy began to grow.
Employment didn't grow very much. Median income went down. The stock market was pretty flat. But the financial sector -- and only the sector -- grew.
Which should have made it obvious to someone, that it was … a bubble.
There was a crash.
Bank failures. A bailout.
The three worst economic disasters in American history follow the exact same pattern: tax cuts, boom, bubble, crash.

High Taxes Correlate with Strong Economic Growth
The four periods of greatest economic growth in American history, by pretty much any measure, are:

• • World War II (1941-45): top tax rate varied from 88 to 94 percent
  • Post-war under Truman and Eisenhower: top rate bounced around from 81 to 92 per cent
  • Clinton years: Clinton raised Bush's top rate of 31 percent to 37 percent and then to 39 percent
  • First two Roosevelt administrations (1933-40). When Roosevelt came into office, Hoover had already raised the tax rate in 1932 from 25 percent to 63 percent. Roosevelt raised it again in 1936 to 79 percent.

A lot of ink, sweat and ranting have gone into proving that the New Deal did not end the Great Depression. Nonetheless, the economy grew 58 percent from the time Roosevelt came into office and when the United States entered the war.
Some of that anti-New Deal rhetoric also claims that the recovery began under Hoover. Perhaps, but to say so is also to say that it began with tax hikes.
Likewise, many right-wing critics insist that the Clinton boom actually started under Bush the First. It is necessary to remember that Bush the First also raised taxes (from 28 percent to 31 percent) and was soundly thrashed by the conservatives for doing so. Stephen Moore of the Cato Institute called it "The Crime of the Century" and explained at length how it had brought ruin to America.

Tax Increases Are Followed by Economic Growth
Three of the four high-growth periods cited above followed significant tax hikes.
The fourth, the Truman-Eisenhower years, began with a top tax rate of 91 percent -- it couldn't get much higher.

Moderate Tax Increases Are Followed by Flat Growth
John F. Kennedy is generally credited with starting the tax cut craze.
He proposed it, but, as with all his ideas, it was Lyndon Johnson who actually got it enacted. The top rate was cut from 91 percent to 77 percent, then to 70 percent, on all income over $200,000 for a single person and over $400,000 for a married couple.
That's where it stayed, through Nixon, Ford and Carter.
The Dow Jones average was pretty much the same when that period ended as when it began. Median personal income stayed roughly the same.
These are the brute facts.
I call them that because there20doesn't appear to be any theory to explain them.
A noted conservative (a sane one, not William Kristol) recently wrote to me in a private e-mail exchange on this subject:
"I am unaware of any (or many) respectable economists (maybe I've missed some) who have suggested that higher taxes have proved to be a formula for better economic growth."
Actually, I am too.
Even now, in the midst of the Bush disaster, I constantly see and hear tax cuts, particularly at the top, described as "pro-growth." So I went and looked at the numbers -- tax rates, tax cuts and tax hikes -- and placed them alongside job growth, the Dow Jones, growth in the GDP and median income.
The brute facts say the opposite of the myth.
The belief in tax cuts is a subset of the belief in Free Markets, with a capital F & M, which is a theological belief.
How do we distinguish a theological idea from a scientific (or rational) one?
According to Karl Popper, the great thinkers in the philosophy of science, a scientific idea has to be capable of being refuted. There has to be some theoretical test that could come out the wrong way, which would then say the theory is wrong.
On that basis, Popper rejected Marxism and Freudianism, along with religious theology, because no matter how many times they didn't work, there was20always some explanation that said that the theory was right and if you just looked at the facts in some other way; you could make up some story that said your theory was still right.
The quintessence of theological thinking goes like this. The preacher says, "The world will end next Saturday night! The Bible says it must be so." Everyone in the congregation wakes up safe and sound on Sunday morning. They head off to church and believe whatever he says in that sermon, too.
In science, we come up with a hypothesis. Then we set up an experiment. We see what happens.
Economics is complex. It takes place in the real world where many factors are at play and we can't control for them all. Still, none of the major tax cuts since 1913 have led to significant, sustained growth. Two them were followed by instant recessions (Reagan and Bush), and three of them, when they were sustained, were followed by bubbles which were then followed by the three worst crashes and sets of bank failures in modern times.
It's time to throw out the theory, accept the facts, and come up with new ideas.
Coming: Part II: Why High Taxes Create a Healthier Economy and Low Taxes Don't

Nicki -- Excellent thought provoking post!

Got my vote!

Keep em coming!

GOPis, good thought provoking discussion, however your characterization of Clintons terms being one of the greatest periods of economic growth excludes the fact that the dot.com/tech bubbles were at their peak during his administration as well as the beginning of the housing bubble that was one of the prime causes of the current crisis.

Really, Sam? Then why, last October, did you post this

Sam-499819
Just only 23 months ago, Americans were crying for Democrats to rescue them from Republican's terrible policies that had resulted into a terrible economic situation.

Democrats came to Americans rescue by agreeing to inherit a horrible economic situation caused by Republicans' bad policies and mismanagement; a horrible economic situation that would definitely take any good government years to fix.

While Democrats are still in the process of fixing the mess left behind by Republicans, some Americans have already forgotten how messy Republicans leadership was just 2 years ago and are ready to vote them back together with their same failed policies that caused the mess.

Should Republicans win, just give voters only a few months and you will see them running back to the Democrats again, crying and asking Democrats to rescue them from Republicans mismanagement as they did in 2008; unfortunately the Democrats this time should not agree to do that.

Americans will have to look for a different party to rescue them from Republicans impending mismanagement and should never think that Democrats are ready to rescue them again.

Democrats are not in the business of fixing messes left behind by Republicans and then once they finish fixing the messes, Republicans come back and create the mess again.

1!
#13 - Fri Oct 29, 2010 11:23 PM EDT

There's a lot more in your archives.

Typical Obama worshippers. When all else fails, lie.

I will be a big idiot to vote for Republicans

NO Sam!

The BIG idiot here is the nut job from NJ - who couldn't recognize satire is it bit her on her fat a@@!

The large mouth a@@ fell for it hook - line & sinker... LOL!!

often referred to as The Rabbit Hole,...LOL