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"One of the first thing's I'll do as president of the United States is sign an executive order to wipe out as much of 'ObamaCare' as I can," he tells primary-state voters.
That promise unsurprisingly prompts cheers from conservative audiences -- and it, on its face, is more immediately realistic than an outright promise to repeal the law wholesale, which would require congressional approval.
But can he actually change the law in a meaningful way with just an executive order?
Yes and no, legal experts say.
A president cannot use an executive order to dismantle or nullify a law that has been passed by Congress, experts point out, but he or she could tinker with the execution of the law.
"What Perry is doing is saying he will use whatever authority is available to him to interfere with the law's Implementation," says Professor Kenneth Mayer of the University of Wisconsin, an expert on executive orders. "There are bits and pieces he could do but as far as nullifying a law, that wouldn't be within his authority."
The "bits and pieces" include the granting of waivers to entities that might have been affected by the legislation (something the Obama administration has already done), or the delay of issuing rules for states' insurance exchanges, Mayer says.
Professor Stephen Vladeck of American University says that a president could theoretically direct federal agencies to be "lackadaisical" in their enforcement of the law's regulations. Perry could order the Internal Revenue Service and the Department of Health and Human Services to "focus their efforts elsewhere," he added, although a president cannot directly instruct agencies to completely drop execution of a law.
But even those actions could face constitutional questioning.
"It falls into a really gray area of constitutional law about the president's discretion to NOT enforce a law," says Vladeck.
Assuming that the court has not already weighed in on the constitutionality of the legislation, a private citizen could sue the federal government for failing to enforce the health law. And it remains an open question whether a president has the constitutional authority to undermine an existing law from the White House alone.
"There's actually not a ton of case law on where the line is between the president's power NOT to enforce and the president's obligation to enforce," Vladeck says.
The question may be mute If the Supreme Court has ruled on the pending challenges to the law's individual mandate by the time (and, of course, if) a new Republican president is elected.
That's an outcome Perry wouldn't mind.
"Now hopefully, Lord willing, the 11th Court of Appeals has already found that that individual mandate is unconstitutional, and hopefully that will be gone to the Supreme Court," Perry said in South Carolina last week. "And I won't have to deal with that."
Leave a Comment:
It comes as NO surprise that the arrogant, ignorant, bible banging TX Governor thinks he can do what ever the hell he pleases!
Didn't we already suffer through 8 long years of that kind of ATTITUDE?
We are still paying the price from those exploits!
I agree with ignorant and arrogant but "bible banging" makes people like me, a Christian Liberal, cringe. I wish we could attack airheads like Perry and Bachmann without banging on Christianity. They aren't airheads because they claim to be Christians. They are airheads because of the items spewing forth out of their mouths. There is plenty of opportunity to quote scripture that Perry is not following with his policies and do it with nothing but respect towards Christians. I myself don't care for the picture of Guns and Christianity and speak about the contradiction often but I don't consider fellow Christian ignorant. A lot of Christians like me would love it if fellow liberals would stop with the negative Christian comments.
Apologies for offending you Ana.
I just feel that there is NO place in politics for religion period.
If these candidates want to wear their beliefs on their sleeves then I consider them 'fair game'.
PS: I also feel they represent the fringe of Christianity.
Nothing changed in your life over those 8 yrs. You nagged and b****ed and you are still nagging and b****ing about things YOU have no control over.
What is this "WE"? Bush did nothing that affected my life personally in a negative way.
BTW: Bush hasn't been POTUS for almost 3 yrs, why is he even in a conversation about the future?
As President Perry couldn't 'wipe out' the law by Executive Order......
...but as King, well, he could!
Feisty ; I just feel that there is NO place in politics for religion period
Yet you keep commenting on it or bringing it up.....
It was President Obama and his large Democratic Congressional majorities that passed and signed Obamacare into law with absolutely no bipartisan support or support from a majority of the public.
They did what they pleased while ignoring the consequences...implacable opposition to an unpopular law.
Well, I believe our current President is Cherry Picking the laws he wants to enforce, so how would this statement be any different?
Hey First Read - How about a fact check on some of President Obama's latest statements and Executive Direction?
For instance the whole Deportation fiasco? Not going follow the law on that now, eh? Wasn't that by the Presidents orders?
Feisty:
Perry is a liar and a fraud. This is just another example of a Party that thinks we are in 1930/1940 Europe.
The TP/GOP is out to destroy the very fabric of our society and replacce it with a neo-nazi/fascist State were the people exist only to serve the Power Brokers (TP/GOP).
This is not what made this country the Great Nation that it was. It is the same ideology that lead to the fall of the USSR, Germany and Italy etc., during the 30's and 40's.
Ms. Waters said it best when she told the TP/GOP to go to "hell".
Jesus was a liberal democrat, he had a bleeding heart for others, and he rode a donkey not an elephant. I think he served an apprenticeship as a carpenter so I guess that makes him a union member as well. It is strange how republican candidates want to bring Jesus into politics when they are against everything he was for. If you are Christian perhaps you should not worry so much about voting for Jesus, maybe you should worry more about if Jesus would vote for you.
IntheMiddle, TX: you are lucky that nothing has changed in your life. Its good to hear that, for some people at least, President Bush's time in office did not result in a down grade to their lifestyle, if not total devastation. Unfortunately, I was in the lending industry, which I had been for over 15 years.
Although the company I was with was responsible and did not get into the exotic mortgages, they had to close their doors as the market dried up. The total lack of enforcement of existing regulations and the outright stripping of powers to investigate from the CFTC by the Bush Administration pretty much led to the downfall of the industry and to the worldwide financial crisis.
I know Bush left office three years ago, but like a category 8 Hurricane, he left long lasting devastation in his wake.
This is just another example of a Party that thinks we are in 1930/1940 Europe.
__________________________________________
Code words for calling Republican's "Nazi's".
Pathetic.
Feisty Redhead,
No apology necessary. I just wanted fellow liberals to understand that we exist and cringe when airheads are associated with Christianity in one sentence.
Forrest Gump, dirp101--terrific posts.
President Perry can just give out permanent ObamaCare waivers. Obama gives out thousands to his friends and campaign contributors, no reason President Perry couldn't to the same for everyone.
AnaBanana I think most of those comments were directed not as Christians being airheads, but that teaching Christianity as science in a public school is air-headed. Being Christian means you have pure faith in things that can not be proofed or replicated, that is the exact opposite of science.
"That promise unsurprisingly prompts cheers from conservative audiences"
Just like Bachmann promised $2.00 per gallon gas..............con job activists preying on I love been stupid. One wonders if any of those bible passages ever taught anything about lying.
So true. Republicans come right out and call Democrats Nazis and fascists, socialists, and communists, heathens, atheists, Godless, antiAmerican and unpatriotic.
Why can't we be more like you?
And no reason to believe he wouldn't, either.
http://swampland.time.com/2011/06/27/the-cracks-in-rick-perrys-job-growth-record/
You see, it seems that Perry is just another guy who can't be trusted not to hand out all the cookies to all his friends. And with THIS Congress, you can bet your sweet life there wouldn't be any meaningful oversight, either.
Agree AM. The Teapublicans are so good at creating a lot of noise and outrage against everyone who doesn't agree with their core principles of supporting the super rich......character assination is the only way for them.....nothing principled.
Teapublicans are the gestapo wing of the party formerly known as Republican!
Those folks have a tenuous hold on reality!
Pius Emeka Nebu - The bible does mention something about bearing false witness against thy neighbor, but heck, why should any chrisitian thumper worry about false witness when they can make up any fact they want.
inthemiddle
Bush affected me negatively in many ways from his anti-gay reelection crusade when I was a young teen to his failure on 9/11 as an even younger teen, to sending my uncle to some desert hell hole when I was an older teen, to crashing the economy as soon as I go out looking for a job. Are you so detached that nothing of the last decade affected you at all?
It's pretty common for people seeking an office they've never held to imagine they are able to do things that in fact they cannot. And it usually always infects first-time candidates for President, but this is a syndrome much more likely to hit someone running for mayor, county supervisor, and so forth. Last year, quite a few folk who ran for Congress without having held prior office made some utterly ridiculous campaign pledges.
However, when Perry says he's going to issue that executive order, or Bachmann promises $2 gas (absurd on the very face of it) then we have to wonder whether these candidates will make the same ridiculous kinds of statements should they win office. Then we look at their other remarks, and pretty soon, there's a sizeable list to examine. And frankly, they already look like loons.
The difference is that Governor Perry has started his campaign by telling you he plans on unilaterally striking down the law if he's elected with an executive order...and it appears he can't do that.
Heck, ITM probably has the position that the Civil Rights Movement by Dr. Martin Luther King did nothing to change his life for the better..
Since he states that W did nothing to change his life in a negative way!
ITM and reality.......not much!
Why can't we be more like you?
___________________________________
Due to what liberals call their "dain bramage".
feisty and our children will be paying for the current spender in chief long after you and I are in heaven.
live within your means, do not ask for handouts, if you are in need of assistance visit your local church or charitable organization.
Good Morning to all and especially Feisty. Feisty you left off last night in a particularly ragged way, even for you. I hope today treats you better.
I think John A's last comment is pretty insightful, as applied to Obama, of course.
So it appears that so far the bashing will be directed at Perry and his religion. I'm sure it will shortly morph back into the libbie hate of all things tea party.
I have to wonder - you all are getting whooped. Hell, I saw a clip thins am of Obama in a debate in 2008 saying Bush was unpatriotic becasue he allowed the debt to rise $5 trillion in 8 years. Of course he is now the $4 trillion dollar man, in less than three years.
You libbies are getting whooped. Now rational folk would focus on their own side to figure out why that is to correct the problem. But not you all. Libbies would rather lash out at the tea party/Palin/Perry/Bush/ ABO.
Obama lowers taxes, its the tea party's fault. Debt soars, credit downgrades, yep, tea party. Never mind you have 2/3 of the government.
The term guys is Impotent Rage. Look it up.
"
... know Bush left office three years ago, but like a category 8 Hurricane, he left long lasting devastation in his wake."
And that is the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. Yet over and over and over, we are told 'don't keep reminding the citizenry'.
Why the hell not?? I thought we were supposed to learn from mistakes, not pretend they never happened.
"president Perry" Well, shoot- I never notice that JAS1 has such a great sense of humor. I like it!
Aw, come on Noid - you say tomato, I say tomoto.
Perry tells us he'll strike down a law he does not like. Obama told us he is no longer enforcing a law he doesn't like.
Either the pres has the duty to execute the laws as they exist or not. Which do you think it is?
@ Joe:
LoL Touche.
Paul S, NY NY
I thumped no christian nor any religion simply because it's in my DNA never to do that but it's simply gutting to see these bible clinging politician deceive in the name of Christ.......bearing false witness.
Rick Perry's Fringe of Christianity. Enjoy the story, these guys The New Apostolic Reformation, who claim to be modern day prophets and also claim that they, yes they cannot begin the rapture until they have control of the government and Rick Perry has been chosen to lead them to the rapture.
http://www.texasobserver.org/cover-story/rick-perrys-army-of-god
Case in point - impotent rage - our good buddy Drive By.
See Drive By, Bush sucked in the last few years. Grossly over spent. The republicans/tea party looked to our side and made some changes.
Those changes translated into wins in 2010, and almost certainly in 2012. Heck, we can use Obama's own words - he said in 2008 that Bush was unpatriotic because of all the debt.
So Drive BNy, other than making funnies about the Tea Party what are you doing to get the progressive congress critters to do you bidding?
Looks like you'd prefer to talk about Bush. Ok, but three years is a long time in congress critter years. And in debt accumulation - bush bad at $5trillion in 8 years, so certainly Obama is horrible at $4 trillion in less than three, right Drive By?
Of course.
ITM, this country cannot move into the future because of the 8 year disaster named George W. Bush. His failed policies, unsustainable tax cuts, two unfunded wars, unfunded Medicare Rx plan, his unfunded spending on everything will be with us for decades. The economic collapse was headed our way since Reagan was elected--trickle down economics, de-regulation of financial institutions, mounting debt because of unsustainable tax cuts, declining wages for the middle class. Bush 43 took several years of budget surpluses and squandared them, he was Reagan on steroids; the economic collapse is Bush 43's lasting legacy. Our future is hindered by the massive debt Bush left for this country.
Wow. I take a couple weeks off, come back and big surprise! The supposed Navy Vet is still here calling Republicans "nazis" and spewing his self-important, self-righteous puke. Some things never change in LaLa Limp Dick Liberal Land. And that is as it should be. It's whiners, pissers and moaners like them that will help the Repubs win the White House next year. Keep it up guys!
Oh bi%ch, bi%tch, bi^tch. This is a big problem with this country. When your guy decides not to enforce laws he doesn't like it's ok. When the next guy decides to use the same tactic you whine like a baby. How about enforcing "ALL" laws as on the books?
unsustainable tax cuts? We will never raise money to cover the debt. Try unsustainble spending. jody, Do you live under power lines?
Well lets cut to the chase. Perry or Romney can't beat him in the presidential election irregardless of the latest polls. Young and old will turn out in droves for the election and republicans have nothing but misery to offer these groups, not to mention they won't get any minority votes, Republicans can obviously win local and state elections but the tent is too small for a national race. He beat McCain and Palin in an electoral landslide what makes you think people will now go for Perry or Bachmann. If the republicans turn down the presidents jobs bill they will have instantly let Obama and Democrats off the hook and politically they will own the bad economy and high unemployment. Argue the numbers and time-line all you want that is the politics of the situation, all the anguish about unemployment will be instantly laid at republicans doorstep if they block the jobs bill. Do you think they polled all those little old republican grannies and grampys that now look to Obama to save their SS and medicare from the Ryan plan. Do you think 40 -55 year olds will vote to have SS benefits cancelled when they have paid into that system for years. If you believe in the polls do you think that the polls that show 80% of the people wanting taxes to be raised on the wealthy mean something. It is going to take some better candidates and some new ideas to beat Obama in the presidential race, he already beat these exact type of candidates that had exactly the same ideas, he beat them bad, he beat them like a rented mule.
Spanky, if you mean DOMA, it is still being enforced. All Obama stopped doing was defend it in court and allowing Congress to do that. He never stopped enforcing it, don't lie Republican.
Spanky, and you talk about debt, but Obama has cut 2.5 trillion from the budget baseline. Bush went from a surplus to deficit. Bush's last fiscal year had a 1.4 trillion dollar deficit. Obama actually reduced that and in sum, Obama is a net cutter. It isn't like Obama spent 4 trillion in new programs (like say Iraq+Afghanistan+tax cuts+Medicare part-D) without finding a way to pay for it.
Think about it, Bush went from a surplus. We weren't supposed to have any deficit at all during his term and in fact we were supposed to have 2.5 trillion more dollars. Looks like Bush is on hook for way more than his 5 trillion.
Spanky: don't count on it. I don't care who the Reps run, Obama is OUT as is all Progressive/Socialist Dems. You're done. You've done enough damage to the country. Thanks to this administration business has come to a screeching halt ie no jobs. Business has already said they'll not do anything until this man is gone. And 'gone' he will be 2012 along with all the rest of the incumbant Progressives and RINOs.
Welcome back Annie... tick tock...
Enjoy it while you can... lol
tyler
I could use a lot less of this phenomenon, but better late than never. AnnieRich banned, long-term multiple accounts with annirich, also banned.
#1.63 - Mon Aug 22, 2011 12:34 PM CDT
dante - I'm talking about immigration. Where you been?
And yeah Forrest you bet I think Perry and Romney will beat Obama.
The "new" jobs bill, which will be nothing other than circling back to the iceberg that was the Stimulus will go over, as have all of Obama's plans, like a lead ballon.
There is no money, and he certainly will not lay out in his new plan, where the money for the stimulus will come from, and of course the congress will not approve more debt.
Sure he won last time, see now he has a record, and that record sucks.
It'll be ABO. Polls don't mean a lot, but they do clearly show the tipping point on Obama has been reached.
Tell the truth. You have this programmed on a hotkey, correct?
You obviously don't know the power of "Patent reform" and how much corporate jet owners have stolen from the people of this country. Big ticket items - both of them.
Annirish, actually, when the Dems took over we went from losing 750 thousand jobs per month to gaining a hundred thousands. The screeching halt came when the Republicans tried to default the country. I still wonder what the Republican jobs plan is... I'd vote for them if they actually had one.
dante - love your "math."
Sure, Obama is a "net" cutter. He's the $4 trillion dollar man, my man.
Oh and those wars and medicare D were all in place before Obama took over. He could have ended the wars and fixed Medicare. How come he didn't?
That's 3 million per minute. Nice work, except it is not.
There's that campaign slogan again..."Vote Republican Or We Won't Give You Any Jobs!"
Da Noid- You forgot the the liberals slogan, - "Vote Democrat Or You Won't Give Your Welfare Checks!"
The general public does not look at the numbers like you Spanky, they are broke and could give a damn where the money comes from, they do understand that there is still money for tax breaks for the wealthy and subsidies for insanely profible oil companies, they know they bailed out wall street. They understand all this debt has not affected the wealthy, their incomes continue to climb, they know Spanky still lives the good life. The republican house better poop some money if they have to or they and the repub pres candidate are doomed in 2012. You can argue the about the balance sheet I am talking the politics of the situation.
drive-by-observer
It's sad that the Republicans are so ashamed of Bush that they don't even want to talk about him less than 3 years later. It's even more sad that they bring Clinton ('s BJ) up every chance they get.
Applying for any job (even at McDonalds) you must put down your work history (or lack of). The Bush resume = the Republican resume and vice versa. Bush=Republican Party and Republican Party = Bush. So why not talk about what a Republican party has accomplished through Bush? Why are you people so ashamed of him (it's a retorical question because we all know the answer)?
Spanky-
Spanky, just like that, right? Just because Bachmann says she could fix the economy in three months, you're convinced that all that is just that easy? You think pulling out of a country we totally destroyed is that easy? You should have this conversation with the top military officials - obviously you know something they do not. Too bad you did not suggest it during the previous administration.
It's a real shame that nearly 3 years into the Obama presidency, that's all the Left can do is talk about Bush. It was supposed to be all rainbows and unicorns by this stage of the game for the Left. Millions of jobs being created, a GDP in the 4-5% range, low unemployment, massive and effective social welfare programs, the deficit cut in half, and more tax revenue than the government could even dream to spend.
It hasn't worked out that way, now has it?
So what do the Liberals want to talk about? That's right, Bush.
I agree with you completely Forrest. The general public doesn't look at the numbers like I or you do. But they do look at the numbers that are important to them - they are broke and it's getting worse.
It really is a simple question - are you better off now than you were then? That's not the question Obama wants anyone to ask.
And Spanky does live the good life, as do his employees and their families. People seem very grateful for their employment. They also now see the debt and deficit and the effect, particularly at the local levels. Many cities are going BK and cutting back drastically. They see that's because of prior overspending and it effect them directly.
They are not dumb and can make the connection to the national debt.
Tipping point on all of it Forrest. It's all and only about debt, even for Obama now. H'll be touting wide range tax CUTS, not increases.
GimDan
This liberal has never received a welfare check, subsidy check, etc. Now your fellow Republican Bachmann cannot say the same thing, can she?
But alas, bayllie - it was Obama who was going to shut down the wars, close Gitmo and all the rest.
He said he'd make it better. He has made it worse, and hence he will be gone.
It ain't anything new or special, it's just the way it is.
Presidentin' is hard.
John A - Agreed. When President Obama was running for office he made a lot of promises that could not come true. He found out after entering the office that he just couldn't do certain things... like close Guantanamo among other things. He was going to reverse a lot of Bush's policies but he couldn't do that either. He did keep some of his promises... so anyone running for president will make promises that sound good but in reality they won't happen.
If people were more reasonable, they would understand this. As it stands, all the promises made by the republican candidates are ridiculed. Most of these promises should be overlooked because ALL candidates of all denominations make them. Some of the comments made about the promises are absolutely over the top and those people making the comments have totally forgotten about the promises made by Obama. It's funny how a double edged sword cuts on both sides.
JoAnnaSmith1
Joanna, Bush was a Republican, right? All Republican candidates TODAY share the same views the Bush policies, right? McCain was known for agreeing with Bush most of the time (until it started to hurt his numbers). So until you can prove to me that the Republican Party has changed, we need to talk about what Bush has done because it might affect us in the future.
Again - and this is very important Joanna - why are you so ashamed to talk about Bush? Is there anything that he did that you would be proud of or is he a total tabu subject for you people?
P.S. Joanna, you have no problem bringing up Clinton every chance you get -why is that? Do you not realize he has not been in office since January of 2001?
You guys are really funny.......what a bunch of whiners.
How about getting back to the reason Perry would even TRY to do such a thing......the affordability of Obamacare. Business gets it and so does Perry. We can't afford Obamacare and he knows it. I would like to hear his exact words on what he wants to do. He may be incorrect in his method, but the idea is absolutely correct.
The bottom line is we need to stop Obamacare in totality. Piecemeal puches at it will only make things worse. If you delay the exchanges, more working Americans will be without coverage. This will only make the problem worse than it is now. Already, Obamacare is causing problems, including larger premium increases than before. Mandates are costing more. Delays in instituting important parts are hurting everyone too. (The portion to limit increases in premiums over a certain % with out review by the agency should have been instituted IMMEDIATELY, not in Sept. 2011, as of the last bulletin I received. We're already suffered through 2 renewals since Obamacare was signed to the tune of 31% and 20.8%. Before, we were at 6-14% increases on the average. We had NO RECOURSE as the agency was not in place, well, now we are now non-Grandfathere and at maximum deductible and less care. We have no lifetime limits "on some things" but less care overall. ) Thanks, but no Thanks, Washington needs to find a way to end Obamacare before it is too late.
IntheMiddle, TX
"What is this "WE"? Bush did nothing that affected my life personally in a negative way."
REALLY?
Spanky-
as I recall, the Republicans did not want to bring the prisoners to this country so unless we release them or shoot them, we gotta keep Gitmo.
again, if it is that easy to end the wars, Spanky, why didn't the president WHO STARTED them end them BEFORE he left the office???
Obama is / has done the same thing already...
DOMA
Slick Rick:
Perry won't have to deal with it regardless of what the Supreme Court does. He's too much of a kook to get elected president, even with a bad economy. He's not even that popular in bloody red Texas, where he has a job approval of only 45%.
Harry Reid was very unpopular in Nevada and the unemployment rate there is worse than the national average, but he still won handily because his opponent was a kook. Obama is much more personally popular than Reid, and I think the Kook Factor would carry Obama to victory if Perry is his opponent, which seems likely since the kooks dominate the Republican primaries.
CaptainObviousSays
No he hasn't. Not defending a law in court is not the same as not enforcing the law.
Are you paid trolls done yet??? Feisty, USNavy, Ana...etc. and Feisty, you have inside info somehow? How is that????
so if perry does not "defend" the law?
Nope!
But, YOU will be shortly... ;o)
Enjoy it while you can honey...
tick...tock annie... tick...tock...
HUH?
I only reposted what was published on a public forum - then again YOU already know that.... lol
As usual you make good points Spanky, but we just disagree, I think NY district 26, and people not even waiting for the next election to recall republicans in WI is a tipping point. We got to wait till the election to see who read it correctly, it is pretty risky business for both of us in as much as about every other person Jay Leno interviews in the street can't even name the vice president of the USA. Ha so which one of us will claim an uneducated electorate as their party's greatest asset. Oops cynical Forrest popped out there for a moment.
Hey if I am supposed to be getting paid I want my money and my backpay I have been posting quite a bit for quite awhile, who is the shop steward here at FR! I need you to go with me to the payroll department and get some things straightened out about my pay.
Republicans seem to think they have a lock on Christianity. I not only find that attitude to be offensive, but it is also another example of their unmitigated ignorance.
Forrest - I see a few problems with your argument. First, you are looking at it through the lens of the democrat side only. The arguments you are basing your opinion omit certain things. The main difference between this election and the last one is Obama himself. For as much as the Democrats feel Obama is the cats pajamas and deeply devout liberals see no wrong in him, there is an entire population group you aren't considering. What do independents think about him? They are always the driving force in modern elections. We know the republicans don't want him back in office, that's a given. How has he appeared to independents? Consider his record... and that's exactly how independents will vote for him.
I realize you don't see any alternatives, but here again, you have to consider the thought processes of what independents think. It used to be a lot easier in the old days when the majority of voters were either R or D. Add the I into the mix and it throws off old conventions. Just my 2 cents worth.
I have hope for them yet Forrest.
If nothing else Obama, the debt and the down grade, and the wars and all the rest have highlighted the economic doom. Used to be the public could ignore it. Not anymore.
In fact Obama has played a large role. He got out all the Hope and Change-ers, many of whom were not into politics. Bush id too, just for the opposite reasons mostly.
But take Ill. Other than Feisty Industries, which is doing gangbuster business, the state as a whole just shed thousands of jobs. I just saw a graph that shows the losses began IMMEDIATELY after their recent tax hike.
People will do anything to stay employed. The results of Ill, and Texas will play a huge role in the election.
Which is why it'll be fun and entertaining. Besides the smart and motivated always find a way to stay ahead, regardless, or in spite of who is in power.
What's funny is, anytime there is a thread with the words Fact Check in the headline, it sets the RWNJ's hair ablaze... lmao!
And what is Perry's plan? Nothing. Tort reform? That will do nothing. Out of state insurance? That will just make it impossible to get care if you get sick. Republicans do not care about anyone but the richest 2%.
Which ones would those be bayllie? Paul agrees with Huntsman? Bachmann agrees with Romney? You say all of them agree? I think there are differences bayllie.
For what purpose bayllie? Is he running? You live in the past, don't you bayllie? Also recall bayllie, Bush had a 20-something approval rating. I wasn't one of the 20 bayllie.
I don't recall the last time I brought up Clinton bayllie. Can you refresh our memories? Many thanks.
Spanky, Obama can't get rid of medicare if he wants to... I don't think you know what a president is. In order to cut the budget you need 60% of the Senate and 50% of the House. If you sum up all actions Obama has taken, he has certainly cut the budget from where it was when he took office. Bush created trillions in unfunded programs, Obama did not. There isn't a comparison. Obama can't just cut 40% of the government by fiat.
"And yeah Forrest you bet I think Perry and Romney will beat Obama."
Perry AND Romney? What are they going to do, 'tag-team' him? Who are they running as thier vice president- Palin and Bawkmann??
I pitty the foolish...those without faith will be forsaken
HUH?
What about job creation?
What about reducing the deficit?
What about defeating Gay Marriage?
What about the big illegal alien crisis?
Oh, sorry, those were yesterdays wedge issues.
When I read this blog I always come away shaking my head and wondering how anyone can be as stupid at the GOP/TP/LDS faithful. They don't even know what the law will do, but they are against it, simply because Rush Limbaugh and Fox News are against it.
Dupes, you are all dupes of the GOP/TP/LDS propaganda machine. I swear you'd believe Michelle Bachman is Christ returned if Fox and Limbaugh said so.
Gimme a break. His first act will be to cripple the health care law by executive order? Are you kidding me?
I can think of a couple of dozen, more pressing issues that need to be addressed. And people are cheering for this nonsense?
Well, you can't beat Shakespeare: "Lord what fools these mortals be."
Or Forrest Gump: "Stupid is, as stupid does."
Why do I think I hear the strains of the Horst Wessel quietly playing in the background?
"When facism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross." Sinclair Lewis
America Held Hostage, Day 236.
I always question the sincerity of those who proclaim their religion with bravado instead of reverence, especially politicians. The lying goes without saying. Perry is not ready for prime time let alone presidential material. God bless America for sure if he was elected.
They think they have a lock on everything. Patriotism (and the reason for my moniker) -- "Taking our country back" crap as if they are the only citizens in the nation. They think only they understand the constitution. Only they can defend the nation, or get our fiscal house in order, etc., etc. Yet it is the Republican Party that has failed in ALL these areas repeatedly. It's easy to get your message (lies) out to low-information voters. Why do you think they want to destroy education?
Read the study done on the Tea Party -- It is very revealing.
skip Nicholson: Not quite following your post..... All those issues you talk about, the Democrats don't want to change those things, they think they are perfectly OK as they are. It's everyone else that wants them fixed, not just the Republicans.
Incidentally, when you consider all the gaffs are current President has said, you think you would overlook one instance from someone else. I'm still LOLROF over the President STILL wanting to cut the Capitol gains tax for small business so they can create jobs. Small business doesn't pay Capitol Gains tax! Let alone he wants to get us more credit to create jobs. Credit doesn't create jobs, increased orders create jobs.
You need to stop listening to the incredibly stupid things the Democrats in Washington are saying... for example.... "The Tea Party are terrorists because they want to make Obama a 1 term President." At least this (female) legislator gave a reason, incredibly stupid though it may be. Everyone else is just parroting the same thing, with no facts to back themselves up at all. (Sorry I don't have time to get her name, break time too short. Fact is, now a majority of Americans want to make Obama a 1 term President, most because he has made things worse than they were in the Bush era. A small % of Liberal Democrats want him gone because he hasn't gone far enough down the road to the Left.
Point well taken about independents Brianb but If they are the deciding factor then they seem to be siding with democrats recently, and if I can assume they want a more moderate candidate that will compromise and use elements of republican policies using a more steady reasoned approach, they will take Obama over the current repub field. That is the same reason why some devout progressive liberals no longer see him as the cats pajamas, but they will not flip on him not for these guys and dolls, not like recent republican districts.
Spanky it is not that people will do anything to stay employed, it is that they will do anything to make a living, that is why you have so many smart and motivated gangbangers in CA. How do millions of young couples get a child from the cradle to the point where they are "smart and motivated" on 12 bucks an hour and no benefits, you could barely do that 30 years ago. If there was some place those young men could work and make a decent living many would do just that, until then the smart and motivated people look out for themselves and find a way to make some decent coin.
Grump - That is the same reason why some devout progressive liberals no longer see him as the cats pajamas but they will not flip on him...
Sounded like my cue. Obama is center right in my opinion. I would think that if you looked at his capitulations/concessions er wait (think like an independent) if you looked at his compromises... He compromised on the stimulus and weighed it heavily with tax cuts, compromised on HCR, compromised on Wall Street Reform, compromised by refusing to eliminate the Bush tax cuts, compromised on a debt deal favoring all cuts and no new revenue.
As an independent at least for the remainder of this post, I would rather vote for a politician that works with the other side in an attempt to deal with problems over a group that yells no way no how! So be it if we default!
Must be confusing to be an undecided, independent. I can't understand how someone doesn't understand what type of philosophy and policy they believe in and care about.
Unless the economy kicks in significantly between now and the election Forrest, not sure where Obama is going to get enough electoral votes to win. Its likely that around 8 states will decide the election and check out the jobless rate in most of those states and you will see the that Obama will fair even worse than you think. If Perry/Romney pick someone like Rubio to be their VP, and with the unemployment and continued housing issues in Florida, that is likely to be a big state for the GOP. You have Pa, Ohio, Mich, Nev, NC, VA all states that are clearly leaning GOP especially with GOP governors in those states. Wisconsin from all polling perspective has actually been a loser for the democrats. After polling showed that the two republicans were recalled for reasons other than the union Walker issue as most voters were already entrenched in their positions long before the unions spent 30 million to beat them. Walker is actually going up in approval ratings as his economic policies are starting to bear fruit especially in Milwaukee and various school districts that were able to avoid laying off teachers because of him. The catastrophe that the unions predicted never happened. As Perry/Romney stop pandering to the right base during the primary and start moderating to the middle and focusing on jobs and the economy during the national election, Obama is going to have a real hard time. No true independent (not the so call indendent idealogues on this board) is making a voting decision on social issues and it will come down to the economy and at least to date, Obama has nothing to brag about. Blaming it on Bush or saying dont worry Obamacare really will work as it continues to get pummelled by the electorate and GOP candidates are going to make it hard for him to win.
Instead of attacking Perry for all the reasons you guys wouldnt vote for him because lets face it not a single one of you would vote for a GOP candidate that literally agreed with each of your positions as you guys made up your minds along time ago, if your going to change any hearts and minds, your going to have to tell us why Obama is the better candidate. You should be telling us all the things he will do that will make the country better over the next four years now that he screwed up the last 4 years. I think most GOP will agree that the end of the Bush era didnt go so well and he was no fiscal conservative with his government spending spree so get off him and tell us why Obama is the better candidate.
That is how I see independents take on Obama as opposed the the current republican field. Obama has been too conservative for the liberals and too liberal for the conservatives, sounds like an independents type of guy to me.
Forrest, here in Illinois a socially conservative GOP candidate came within 2500 votes of beating the democrat machine incumbent governor (yes there were extraneous issues such as ethics etc) but the GOP candidate was able to put forth his successful business career and use that to almost win in a traditionally democratic state. The things that Obama has been too conservative on for liberals like dont ask dont tell, gay marriage, anti gun laws, guantanamo, the wars etc are not the issues that independent voters are concerned about in the states that will decide the election. His fiscal policies putting aside partisan politics are progressive and more liberal. Many of the policies are being implemented via czars, cabinet positions, regs and government function execution. Everyone argues on here as to when, why or why not they are working and wants to blame Bush, Obama or tea party nut jobs or Pelosi loons but the bottom line is that there is no current visible evidence that they are working as planned. Obama's approach to jobs and the economy might work before the election but it better start soon or its going to be tough on him to sell it to the people in Ohio, Nevada, Florida, Penn that its working.
Forrest said: Point well taken about independents Brianb but If they are the deciding factor then they seem to be siding with democrats recently, and if I can assume they want a more moderate candidate that will compromise and use elements of republican policies using a more steady reasoned approach, they will take Obama over the current repub field. That is the same reason why some devout progressive liberals no longer see him as the cats pajamas, but they will not flip on him not for these guys and dolls, not like recent republican districts.
I do understand where you are coming from... believe me I do. This is why I am wondering if a dark horse will emerge. The strategy of a dark horse is to spring him/her at the right time, closer to the election. Let all the usual suspects raise money, spread their ideas around and get the base field interested... this does not include, for the most part independents... and definitely not democrats. The dark horse steps out just before the last couple of debates where the exposure from opposition criticism will not have an effect on their electability.
This election is not like the last one because you don't have 2 partys going head to head in primaries. A dark horse can be more effective against an incumbent. If I were in charge of the republican strategy, this is the route I would take... and who am I, just a nobody, there are a lot of people smarter than I am running things in the RNC... I think....
He came close but lost Kirk, my guess is that if he was on the ballot in 2012 he would have lost by a bigger margain, my opinion is that the higher the voter turnout the worse it will be for republicans, I just don't see their tent getting bigger, but I certainly do not make a living at political predictions.
They might need a dark horse or just a different horse with a more harmonious tune because republicans obviously are not thrilled with their choices because the front-runner changes every day.
AnaBan how can a Christian be liberal dont you know what liberal means, it means anything goes, i.e gay marriage , abortion, eveloution theroy, and the list goes on and on, think about it, look around the corner theres the end.
Perry is the typical Texas politician. Scissor toed boots. A lively wind and a bible. Access to an ample supply of lard and a bullhorn, and the man will promise everything anyone might want to hear. Braying among the cattle, nothing more.
You could be right, although in these states a higher turnout doesnt necessarily benefit the democratic candidate as it would in Illinois, NJ or Vrginia. In NC, Florida, Ohio and maybe even Michigan a higher turnout could benefit the GOP and certainly would in Ohio and Florida. Obama is an excellent campaigner so I wouldnt bet against him as he showed against Hillary but I do think its going to be hard to campaign on Obamacare and the economy without some job growth and GDP growth.
Doesn't really matter - he'll never get elected.
Perry is the typical Texas politician. Scissor toed boots. A lively wind and a bible. Access to an ample supply of lard for the tongue, and a bullhorn, and the man will promise everything anyone might want to hear. Braying among the cattle, nothing more.
I hope all of you God hating people on here that love to hate Christians and what is moral have Fire Insurance, one day you will hear these 8 words that will seal your fate, Depart from me for I never knew you!
@ Kirk, you are right. In the case of Ohio, Obama doesn't have much to stand on. We are in the group of 26 states suing about the mandate to purchase insurance in Obamacare. We also will be voting on a Issue 3 in November to exempt Ohio residents from the National mandates. Combine that will our job losses, he doesn't have much to pat himself on the back about.
Forrest - You've heard the expression, once bitten, twice shy... Even though they will hardly admit it, republicans are running scared. There's two alternatives... they win, or Obama wins.. and they are more scared of the latter. They are definitely scared of the appeal Obama has on the left... even with all that has gone wrong over the past 3 years, they don't have any confidence.
I, as an independent can't vote for Obama because of my ideology... but I don't see anyone out there that is gaining any real support yet. Each one of the current crop has liabilities in my opinion, but from the left's view, each one is either a moron, a buffoon, an airhead, a zealot, or a number of other adjectives that describe a lack of respect. Of course this isn't anything unusual considering they already know who their candidate is. The left stares at the republican field and throws stones. I don't know if this helps Obama's case or it hurts him. In the end it may not matter and the one indicator of an incumbent president may take precidence... and that is the unemployment rate. No modern president has ever been relected when the unemployment rate is above 7.2%.
Hey Wayne lets not go there because we are talking about a guy who never married, and was always with 12 other men who were supposed to be fishermen but never did much fishing, and when asked about that they said we are "fishers of men". As a matter of fact one of the few women they were known to associate with was a known prostitute. So don't act like liberals can't be Christain Wayne they sound pretty liberal for their day. This is why we should not mix government or politics with religion, it never makes much sense.
From my side of the fence I would say if Bush could get re-elected Obama certainly can. I got to go, it has been fun everybody, Thank You All.
Kirk-2957282
Obama isn't going to try to repeal universal health insurance, Medicare and social security as Slick Rick Perry wants to do according to the book he allegedly wrote and had published only 9 months ago (or has Perry distanced himself by the opinions expressed by his ghost writers?).
Obama won't repeal regulations to help prevent corporate crooks from repeating the grand larceny they perpetrated under Bush's lax oversight that led to the Bush Recession. Perry would, and so would Mitt Romney.
Obama won't starve the federal government of funding to get rid of the above mentioned programs that all the Republicans want to get rid of.
Obama's "smart power" foreign policies have had a significant measure of success in Egypt, Tunisia, and especially Libya. Perry will no doubt follow the usual Yosemite Sam foreign policy of shoot first and ask questions later that resulted in miserable failure for the last bumbling Texan to occupy the Oval Office.
Those are a few reasons. So, what's a reason to vote for Perry, other than his "miracle" record of job creation -- GOVERNMENT jobs, many of which were created with the stimulus funds Perry pretends to deplore.
Jesus may have been liberal socially but I dont remember him ever advocating that the his followers reach their hand into the pockets of the unbelievers to fund their lifestyle whether it be for charitable or for the common good. He expected the rich to donate on their own, he didnt reach in and take it. In fact, he would be a huge supporter of personal responsibility and accountability and people's choices in life (sin or not) would dictate their place in heaven as long as they asked forgiveness. So if you chose to be drug addict or chose to be a teacher or chose to be a doctor, Jesus didnt expect the roman government to balance the inequities of your income choices out for you but had different moral expectations from your success that might hinder your path to heaven.
Apparently school boards in Wisconsin are discovering that the Union owned health insurance provider, (WEA Trust) has been charging the schools millions of dollars more than private health insurance companies. The WEA Trust had a lock on the market because the schools had to purchase their health coverage from the WEA Trust due to the union contract. Thanks to Scott Walker and the Republicans that passed the recent law to allow schools to shop for their own coverage many School Boards around the state are finding a windfall of extra cash. We haven't heard too much about this from PMSNBC. The unions ought to be charged with a crime and ordered to pay restitution to the schools they have ripped off for all of these years.
Houston, that is the best post I have seen on here by an Obama supporter. I applaud you and respect your comments. You almost got the whole post without a single personal attack (unfortunately you said Slick Rick and had to attack Bush with bumbling but I forgive you for that). Because of that your post was credible and I think thats exactly the manner in which Obama and his supporters should put forth Obama's accomplishments, positions or vision for the country. Not all this anti Perry crap because whether I agree with you or not both candidates can put forth why they think they are right and the other is wrong and we can decide for ourselves.
As for your positions, I hope you do recognize that there are credible reasoned responses on some of those that would differ. But an objective person would give Obama credit where its due. I really havent read up on Perry's positions so I cant reply directly but I have a hard time believing he is eliminating social security or medicare so I assume thats an embellishment. As for repealing regulations to prevent corporate crooks, they need to be repealed and tougher ones passed because what was enacted does nothing but cause more cost in the system just like Sarbanes Oxley which has cost this economy billions and driven so many companies overseas to list on the London exchange as a result of it and it doesnt do anything to stop what it was intended to do. Same thing with Dodd-Frank but I have no idea what Romney/Perry would pass instead so not going to argue with you on that one. On starving the fed government, can you assist me and tell me what programs will be cut? Or do you mean slow down the rate of growth? I assume you realize that we have to rein in spending irrespective of the revenue increase side of things? I am not aware of any GOP candidate actually cutting anything as of yet. Obama has been successful recently overseas, not sure that will resonate for voters but I agree. As for Perry's job growth, I have found that when someone does something positive and the other person focuses on why the positive really isnt as positive as it looked, the whiner loses everytime. It just focuses attention on the positive. Leave Perry's job growth story alone because its a loser for Obama. Obama needs to focus on why his policies are better suited for the national economy and what he is doing that will be better than Perry. Attacking a positive is always a loser. Thanks for the respectful response.
anabanana
From your posts you're mostly a decent sort, but if you're butt-hurt about Christianity's image then you should write Perry, Palin, Pat Robertson & the other assorted vermin and tell them to STFU.
Touchdownplay, it has been extremely quiet from the Fiesty, Navy, Anna Molly crowd as the WSJ estimated that Milwaukee alone saved $25 million this year with the switch. Its why Walker's approval ratings are going up.
Someone actually touched Fiesty with a 10' pole lately. You can see the marks on her.
Lets see if we can bait her in with that.
dirp101 #1.10,
I suggest that you are off "a bit" for the time of the beginning of the "meltdown" which was demonstrated by the collapse of LTCM. This disaster started on WJC's watch.
If you care for a review of these problems, you may want to review Frontline's "The Warning".
Well, whom ever is the Republican nominee should have a walk in the park this election...seeing how Obama has already done all the work for someone to unseat him. And why are all of you wanting to reelect Obama anyways? Does anyone have a real answer other then hes not Republican...I know what I have asked of you must be extremely difficult, so take your time.
Well, you could have figured they were talking about the Western Allies, or the Underground Resistance, or even the Soviet Union - but instead you assumed it was "Nazis". Why?
Could it be that it was too close to the truth?
@InTheMiddle
Because he is part of our past. History is important in politics because we can look back and see what candidates, congressionals, and Presodent's really though and when they were giving flip answers for votes. It is also important so we do not make the same mistakes.
Many of Bush's policies still effect us even now that he is out of office:
No Child Left Behind
Bush Tax Cuts
Patriot Act
FISA Amendment Act (Unconstitutional Wiretapping law)
Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP)
As well as the Afghan and Iraqi wars.
All of these still effect the country, many of them in negative ways. Such Obama has not done much to correct these, but they were all passed by Bush or begun by Bush.
@ Geowil - Bush's legacy is not effecting us anywhere as negatively as Obamacare, the Stimulus, the Green Initiatives (carbon credits, and those crappy light bulbs, you do realize they contain mercury?) , and the anti-business environment he's created. These are far more reaching and far more devastating than ANYTHING Bush did.
Wilow, that is short sighted to say. No Child Left Behind is the single greatest education legislative issue in our country. It forces schools to teach through regurgitation instead of learning the proper way through creative and critical thinking. Tests, while necessary, should not be used to determine the standard of education on a national level unless we have a national education curriculum. Grad schooling needs to take the approach that almost all colleges use and kick frequent testing to the gutter embracing a system where students are required to participate in ways that provoke critical thought and produce creative reasoning behind their opinions and show that they actually understand what they have learned.
The current system does not do this and the damage it does is more dangerous then anything Obama has passed so far. Educated children ARE America's future.
TARP still effects us. It was a large part of the early deficit and a lot of that money has yet to be paid back.
I do not need to state how the Patriot Act is still effecting us, everyone knows it is a bad law and is restricting our freedoms. As everyone also knows that the BTC are a main reason why we ended up in a double dip recession as well as being a part of the reason why we were going to default.
Cutting taxes in a long recession is not going to help much. Cutting them for the rich definitely will not help. While the middle class workers will send the money, the rich just stock pile their cuts and do not spend them, or spend them in Mexico, China, or other places where people will work for pennies. You raise taxes during a recession so that you can fund Government construction jobs to create jobs and demand for materials which has a much better chance of sparking some GDP growth when coupled with a stimulus.
The two wars in Iraq and Afghanistan are also major contributors. You cannot just state they are irrelevant when they are the single greatest drain on the economy and country. We have spent nearly 150 billion every day on those two wars for the past ten years without any increase in taxes to cover those costs. You do not go to war and not raise taxes, it is just common sense that putting a war on a credit card, to use an analogy some like to use for HCR, without increasing taxes along side it is not how things work. Wars require funding and it is our duty during wartime to help fund our wars. Bush never rose the taxes, he even cut them.
Oh noes, CFL's contain 5 milliliters of mercury, ban them ban them ban them!!!! >:O
Well get this, that fish you ate, the last time you ate fish, contained at least twice as much mercury as CFL's do. Maybe we should ban fish now as well? There are also fish, like the King Mackerel, that are toxic to eat because they contain enough mercury to cause serious health issues. Look at Japan, their cuisine consists almost entirely of seafood yet they have life expectancies of 82.9 years, much higher then the US.
Smoke detectors and thermostats for coolers/AC/Coocking ranges used up until the 90's had much more mercury in them then these cfl's do.
I use cfl's in my entire house and I have these same ones for 6 years, I have never had one burn out on its own yet, only had one burn out due to faulty wiring of a lamp on the front porch. Beats having to buy and replace those incandescent ones nearly every 7 months.
Geowil - nice set of opinions there.....
No Child was created to try to regain ground lost in our Global standing where Education is concerned. Honestly, every State I know has similar prgrams in place as most see this as a big problem in the US. There has been a pretty large migration away from teaching core skills to teaching a glancing pass and wasting time on things that should be taught at home.
The majority of TARP has been repaid, (97% the last I heard) I didn't think much of TARP, but it is pretty much past.
How are your freedoms being squashed by the Patriot Act????? For me, other than stricter banking rules for the company I work for, no impact. Oddly enough, the rules actually make it harder for someone to steal from us.
Until we have a govt. that can live within it's means, there is no point to giving them more money, it will be squandered. Even if you took 100% of the top wage earners income, it would only fund the govt. for 40 days. We don't have an income problem, we have a spending problem. Do you give an Alcoholic a fifth and expect him NOT to drink it? Until there is a balanced budget amendment, there's not much to talk about.
As to the wars, I'm not going to comment much, as I've seen many anti-war folks come up with all sorts of figures to the cost. I'm sure no one thought these actions would take this long, let alone Obama would start a 3rd war. He didn't ask money for his action either, funny you didn't mention this. On the unfortunate down side of this. Wars create jobs...it takes companies to make everything our Service persons need to do their job. I know a local paint company that was able to put on another paint line to paint body parts for military vehicles. If we didn't have these wars, we would have thousand more on the unemployment line. When they come home, what are they going to have for jobs? Even if they have a job to go back to, it will mean the person who was doing the job while he was gone will be out of a job. Any way you look at it, someone is going to lose a job.
Don't know where you get CFLs, the ones around here suck. They break and last not much longer than incandescent. The choice to buy what we want shouldn't be taken away from the govt. I've avoided them much as I can so far. Was very disappointed with the light output when you buy what is supposed to be an "equivilant" wattage. There is simply less light than an equal incandescent.
I'm hoping that when Thomas of SCOTUS gets his wish and does away with the healthcare law that Obama and the entire Democratic congress push Universal Healthcare with Medicare for all. It will, with one swoop, both keep Medicare solvent because the young and healthy will be participating, and bring the United States in sink with all the other developed nations around the world. When it comes to healthcare we are a third world nation.
What republicans fear is eliminating our health traded on the stock market for profit. What they fail to consider, for all their talk about burdens on private business, is that Universal Healthcare or Medicare for All would make business more competitive and more profitable because they would no longer be in the health insurance as a benefit market.
AnaBanana, that is a great idea. I have heard today's young people called the "Start Up Generation." The old model of joining an established company and getting your health insurance there is over. Today's young workers are creating their own jobs, and we need non-employer provided health insurance like never before. Heck, some of the rest of us would like to create our own businesses out of interest or necessity, and non-employer based health insurance is essential.
We have some national healthcare, go to the airport and you get an X-ray, say the right things and you will get a rectal exam as well.
AnaBanana; If we are to understand right wing, fanatic, extremist, illogical, Christian evangelicals such as Rick Perry, Michelle Bachmann, Sarah Palin, Glenn Beck, etc. etc., we must look at the real world they tell us exists. That “real world” in which they live, they tell us, sets their lifestyle, their actions, the way they treat others. Either that real world is True every day of the week, or it True only when they stand before others of like mind and preach their Christian beliefs. Health insurance is only one example of the way they tell us Christian evangelicals deal with their fellowman. Let’s look at what they say.
First, they tell us America is a Christian nation, and they want to make certain it remains so. They go on to say their God is the center of all Reality, Truth, Justice, and Beauty, and they tell us our nation is founded on those Judeo-Christianvalues our founding fathers set down in the form of the Constitution of the United States of America. They tell us, if we want to know how we should treat the sick, the poor, the downtrodden, the down and out, the children, then we should consult scripture and ask “What would Christ do?” God, they always say, is in control. We are told all this by Sarah Palin, Michelle Bachmann, Rick Perry, Glenn Beck, and the rest of their ilk. They tell us it is good, and they tell us, that is what they believe and that is what they do. They tell us that is the “real world” in which they believe and live. But, is it?
Second, they tell us they follow the teachings of Jesus. Yet, as we listen to these people tell us these things, we respond by asking, “We thought Jesus preached we should help the poor, the down and out, the beaten down, and children.” We ask, “Where do you find God and Jesus coming down on the side of the wealthy and against the poor in the scriptures?” We ask, “If this is a Christian nation, as you tell
us, then doesn’t that mean we are all a community of believers who should be building the Kingdom on this side of the grave?” We ask, “Didn’t Jesus tell us to take care of each other, particularly the poor?” We ask, “If you are telling us you believe all these things, then why are you telling us you’re going to take ‘your country back’ from those who have provided some help for the poor, the down and out, the beaten down, and children.” We ask, “If you tell us our government is of the people, by the people and for the people, then why do you say you’re going to take ’your country back from the ‘bleeding hearts’ and make certain the people your Jesus told you to love and help are denied any help from the ‘Christian nation’ you say you want to put back into place.” If Jesus charged you with building the Kingdom of Heaven on this side of the grave, then tell us how you’re doing that when you come down against everything He charged
you to do.
Third, if you tell us your God is always on the side of right and you tell us your God is on the side of this Christian nation, then answer this. You tell us “God is in control,” then by your own admission, did He not put President Obama in the White House? If not, who did? Who is in control? We ask, “Why do you hate a President you claim was put into office by the God you tell us you worship?”
Fourth, keep in mind that you fanatic, extremist, illogical, Christian evangelicals have told us all these things about your firm and committed beliefs that you live godly lives. You have told us how we should live in your God’s real world, and yet you violate almost every command your God has given you and you want the political power to enforce your beliefs on the people.
I’m one of those who thinks you are little more than hypocrites who tell the weak of mind what they want to hear so they, in turn, will give you the political power to rule them. I’m one of those who believes, if your God exists and will “get” those who violate his commands, you are surely among those whom your God will “get!”
Finally, I’m one of those who will do everything he can to have every one of you defeated in the coming elections.
TJefferson - what a great truthful post - Jesus always said love thy neighbor.....
When it comes to lazy folks wanting to live off the hard work of others we're on top right?
All other GOP candidates move to the right to try to get votes... Perry is the only one that has to move LEFT... This extremist will have no chance unless the TEA Partiers get out en masse and kidnap every other voter in the country.
So DOH DOH..What you are saying is that when we had near full employment during the Bush years because of the housing bubble that those now thrown out of work are LAZY? Your Moniker should be DUH as in DUMB.
T.Jefferson, cheers to your excellent post. They cannot believe what they say they believe when their actions tell us otherwise. They are indeed hypocrits, believers in name only.
Evangelical christians are the least christ-like people you will ever meet. It is ironic that the average muslim acts more christ-like than the average christian. We live in a country that allows for every silly superstition known, but it does not allow for endoctrination on a public, government subsidized level.
Thank you Tjefferson. You are right if you do believe in Christianity then you must believe that hell will be full of these bible thumpers. I think Satan will take great pride in his "Clergy" section of hell.
DOHDOH: So, you have refuted the right wing, extremist, fanatical, Christian Evangelicals with your post, right. It's time you did some thinking, DOHDOH. Your post suggests you support the current right wing fanatics who worship and protect their wealth by saying the poor, the downtrodden, the beaten down, the sick, and the children are living off the backs of those of us who are fortunate enough to have wealth. The wealthy are oftentimes living off federal welfare when they receive farm subsidies (this form of federal welfare alone amounts to more federal dollars than goes to welfare to the poor); subsidies paid to big oil companies who pay us back by charging over $3.00 per gallon for gasoline at the pump; defense contracts that send billions and billions of federal welfare dollars to wealthy corporations and their board members; and, tax loopholes so large that many in the wealthy classes pay hardly any taxes at all. Those are only four areas of federal welfare for the wealthy. These people, including corporations, are flush with money today. So, don't tell me that those on top are not drawing billions and billionsof federal welfare dollars off the backs of taxpayers while a pittance goes to the poor. The Republican Party has become the political arm of wealthy, right wing, extremist fanatics, and FOX News is their Ministry of Propaganda. FOX has been given the wealth to hire the best "spin doctors" in the nation to manipulate people like you to support the Party line. You're being conned by the best in the business. Think about it........
Obamacare is simply a Spread-the-Wealth-Control-the-People mechanism. "Controlling the People' is key. That's why it was so important to this Regime and why it was passed in the middle of the night behind closed doors. That's not the way of our Republic which matters not to these Progressive/Socialist Democrats.
Forrest Gump: I am and I do! Thank you!
No Doh Doh (#2.6), where we're on top is the top 2% of the population sucking all the value out of the labor of the other 98%. THAT's where the real living off the hard work of others is going on.
T. Jefferson, an outstanding post. Thank you!
Annirch: Your post about spread-the-wealth-control-the-people mechanism is pure, 100%, 180 proof, BS. I've read your posts many times and every time you clearly demonstrate you're little more than a robot of right wing, extremist, fanatic propaganda. You can get no further intellectually than what you're told to recite.
WHEW!!! Thread 2 in this blog is full of complete lunacy. I think it's the process of the liberals to take a warped idea and bend it even further. Someone says that the right wing christians don't want to do anything but protect their money and another builds on it even further into wackoville... Do you ever listen to yourselfs and how much you bend things only to read your words and stare in wonderment at the awesome things you come up with?
OK.. I want to know who's spreading the drugs around... If this is the way you really think, then this country is in real trouble. If it's drug enhanced... then that would at least explain the far out there ideas that are being espoused.
Sometimes, being objective is a little more productive than trying to outdo the wacky ideas and the things you say. I feel like I just visited the Twilight Zone where brains were jumping out of human bodies and crawling around the floor... or maybe that would be The Outer Limits... hmmmmmm.
Brianb: Brilliant job of refuting has been said here. Drugs and the Twilight Zone. You really are an excellent example of the right wing, extremist, fanatical mind. Your answer.........Drugs and the Twilight Zone! What a mind! Call Perry and the rest. You've got the intellectual answers they've been searching for.
Meet Brianb who logged onto a blog and entered that dimly lit, hazy dream world we call the Twilight Zone!
Actually we call it FR where we push the Outer Limits, and each others buttons!
TJefferson - Who said anything about me refuting any of the lunacy. If you view what has been written in this thread as reasonable discussion then I have serious questions about your sanity. First of all, you are attacking everyone that disagrees with your opinion without even hearing what they have to say. Do you call that objective? Shall I quote your attacks? Will that make you feel better? Is everyone that disagrees with your personal thoughts a right wing with an extremist radical mind? My first question back to you... are you out of YOUR mind? Maybe you rage on and on with others like this, but you don't even friggen know me. Take your crap down the road and throw it in somebody else's junk pile.
You lack a lot of brilliance... The left wing, anti establishment, anti business, anti republican, anti conservative, anti reasonable thought you are exercising is not new. Frankly I'm quite tired of liberals like you that think your ideas are the only ones that count and the arrogance of believing you are the only one that is right. I will call your ideas BS. Your form of challenge isn't even worth my time to counter... I've argued with the best on First Read and I can tell you, you are far, far from the caliber of left leaning people I have enormous respect for. Take that and stick it where the sun doesn't shine...
TJefferson,
We can certainly debate federal "welfare" for the wealthy however I do object to the use of the reference to a "pittance" going to the poor. In 2009 the federal government spent $502.3 billion on Medicare, $373.9 billion on Medicaid and $686 billion on Social Security, for a total of over 1.5 trillion dollars. While not all of this money went to those that either of us would refer to as poor, without doubt a sizable portion of this amount did end up in the hands of (or paid for services received by) the poor.
I think your observations about the hijacking of the Republican party by "right wing, extremist fanatics" is correct although I would dispute that they are all wealthy. We must also acknowledge then that the Democratic party has been taken over by left wing, socialist extremist fanatics with MSNBC as it ministry of propaganda. There are no innocent here.
Forrest - Even this is beyond the pale. I noticed your jokes earlier so even you must be sitting there wondering where all the craziness is coming from. Sheesh! How do you even begin to respond to some of the nuttiness? I elect to ignore most of it... I'll wait until this evening when the sun goes down and it's more relaxed.
Maybe that earthquake yesterday had an effect on a lot of people's thinking process. We didn't feel it down here in Montgomery. I theorize that the shaking of the earth unhinged a lot of people. I used to wonder why people in California have such weirdness... I feel somewhat validated today.
Brianb a regular guy who entered a blog and came out on the other side. Damn it with the Twilight zone thing now I am obsessed with that line of Rod Sterling's, I will be aggrevating myself and everyone else until I get that line right. I'm afraid to google Twilight Zone who knows what kind of crazy stuff will pop up.
I got to go out and hustle up a few bucks tonight Brianb, I will be out of here soon, might see you later if your are up late. Religion and politics they go together like nitrogen and glycerin, another reason why they should not be mixed in government policies, and campaigns for government office. Too much religious talk should disqualify a candidate on that basis alone.
joemike: No, not all Republicans who support the right wing, extremist, fanatics are wealthy. There are still a few RINO's left in the Party. The job of FOX News, the Ministry of Right Wing, Extremist, Fanatical Propaganda is to convince working class Republicans that they should support the Plutocracy of Ayn Rand and her ilk. To do that, they hire the very best marketing experts they can find to "spin" the "news" in such manner to encourage working class people to support their cause. Keep in mind, too, that a Florida Appellate Court reversed a lower court decision in 2003 that agreed with FOX News attorneys saying FOX News right to lie is protected by Freedom of Speech in the First Amendment. The argument made the case FOX was an "entertainment network" not a "news network." To that end, the Canadians have refused FOX a license to operate in Canada because they have laws against commercial communications stations lying to the public. Today's GOP is not the GOP of years gone by. Listen to what they say........
Brianb: Well, if you argued with the best, then go to my posts above and tell me where I'm wrong. Please READ what I say and don't make up your own BS and then tell me that's what I've said. So far all I've seen from you are such items as "Twilight Zone," "drugs," "you're out of your friggin mind," "you lack a lot of brilliance," and then this one--- "The left wing, anti establishment, anti business, anti republican, anti conservative, anti reasonable thought you are exercising is not new. Frankly I'm quite tired of liberals like you that think your ideas are the only ones that count and the arrogance of believing you are the only one that is right. I will call your ideas BS. Your form of challenge isn't even worth my time to counter... I've argued with the best on First Read and I can tell you, you are far, far from the caliber of left leaning people I have enormous respect for. Take that and stick it where the sun doesn't shine..." Wow! Brilliant counterargument!
Here you go Forrest... two versions of it.. first the earliest version.. then the more popular one:
Ooops... a third one:
TJefferson - Your ideology is different than mine. I've tried arguing with people with closed minds before and it's completely unproductive. Saying the same things over and over again is not a way to pursuade. If you are interested in trying to figure out my ideology, then pay attention to my posts. It didn't take me but just a few seconds to figure yours out. You are unreasonable, don't want to discuss things in a rational way and are here only to argue. I don't have the time to spend arguing with you. Once you've invested enough time in understanding who I am... come back and maybe we can discuss things. If you do come back, shelf the name calling. Shelf the accusatory nature that you possess. I'm here every day and you will notice that I am hard right, but not radical. I can hold my own in reasonable discussion... once the name calling starts... and that includes tea party, RWNJ or any combination of dispariging names... I end it there. You will notice the left doesn't pick on me.. because they know I am reasonable... well maybe not Amy, she thinks I'm a nut... and of course there's always Fiesty... (winking at you Fiesty)... I'm interested in bridging the differences.. not causing them to grow further apart.
joemike: The government programs you cite going to the poor, i.e,. Social Security and Medicare are not "welfare programs" going to the poor. Companies and individuals have paid and continue to pay into those programs for retirement purposes. The poor receive almost no retirement SS benefits since they didn't pay into the program. (There are, of course, special programs for the seriously ill, handicapped, and children, etc. that are funded by Social Security. The right wing, extremist, fanatics, of course, want to end those programs.) Medicare costs each individual just under $200.00 per month for 80% coverage. Each retiree, then, has the option of deciding to purchase private insurance to make up the remaining 20% of coverage. The costs vary dramatically for the additional coverage. Some people pay more than $1000 per month total for Medicare and their additional, private coverage. So, Medicare is not really an option for the poor. They don't have Medicare let alone the additional coverage because they don't have the money even to purchase Medicare. That's where Medicaide comes in.
Medicaide could be considered a program for the poor, but it surely is not anything close to paying the 80% of coverage that Medicaide pays. Yes, there are abuses in this program, but do we want to straighten out the abuses or throw out the entire program?
There are some other federal welfare programs that make up a small amount of taxpayer money, but those generally last for short periods of time. Right wing, extremist, fanatics want you to believe the poor are living a life of luxury surpassed only by the wealthy in this country. It isn't true. You need to try and find a federal program in which you as a poor person can enroll. Then, inquire as to how much money you'll be paid and how long the checks will come to you. I think you'll get a shock.
By contrast, if you look at the federal welfare programs on which many of the wealthy depend, you'll see what I mean when I say they have made their money off federal welfare programs. These people often get very upset when they are called out. I really don't give a rip. I'm just retired at 73 years old, have never been on welfare, have always held private health insurance and still do, am living off Social Security and my investments in the markets, and never lived off the taxpayers in either a government civilian or military career (the key word here is "career.") I'm certainly no Socialist, Communist, or right wing, extremist, fanatic. I fought the left wing, extremist, fanatics in the late 60s and 70s, and I'm fighting their counterparts on the right wing today. By the way, the Democrat Party today is not nearly as left wing as it was when I left it in the late 60s and started voting Republican. I voted for Nixon, Ford, Reagan, and George H.W. Bush. The GOP is a political/economic/social disgrace.
Brianb: The left doesn't pick on you because they can see you are unable to answer them in language other than you're superior and they're not. You have not produced one iota of an argument to counter what I said in my posts above. So, we'll agree to drop our conversation.
American corporations, to satisfy their wealthiest investors, are shifting the burden of health care costs to employees on the lower half of the totem pole that can least afford the rising costs.
According to the insurance industry, U.S. corporations are also cutting job benefits that used to go to their employees. while at the same time, analysts say that the corps are enriching their upper management membership with higher pay and stock options plus buybacks to spiral their cash upward to the benefit of the CEO's.
Sadly, they're not reinvesting that record amount of cash back into their companies, nor to their employees.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Obamacare in deeper trouble as corporados cut benefits
prorevnews.blogspot.com/2011/08/obamacare-in-deeper-trouble-as.html
CEOs getting richer with company stock buybacks but what about jobs
Excerpts:
While the GOP keeps drumming the beat of "corporations are the job creators, we can't raise their taxes" those same corporations have been sitting on record stockpiles of cash that is not being used to creating jobs, new products, plant expansion or acquisitions. America's biggest corporations are however spending more and more cash on stock repurchase programs to keep their top executives and investors happy.
US corporations are reporting record profits over the last several years and are currently sitting on almost $1 trillion in cash. No time in history have companies had so much cash sitting on their books.
Stock repurchases by definition is cash spent to repurchase shares of company stock decreasing the number of stocks outstanding which increases the value of the remaining shares or earnings per share. What corporate executives don't like to admit is that they use the boosts in stock price from the buying pressure of the buybacks to lock in gains and then exercise millions of their own stock options. Moreover, not only do stock repurchases primarily benefit company management with handsome gains, they are often used to artificially inflate earnings per share to mask business slowdowns - a useful tool for meeting the company's quarterly earnings-per-share targets and not upset Wall Street analysts.
So more and more corporate executives may be protecting their own wealth by spending cash to buyback stock but at the expense of job training, opening new plants, and investing new products and innovation. In fact, they aren't even paying down debt, or paying dividends that will put cash back into the economy .
Then you have those in Washington who would argue that giving more tax breaks to big corporations that are already flush with cash is an investment in job growth. Indeed, more tax breaks for corporate America so the top dogs can allocate more cash to jack up their companies' stock prices for the next round of stock buybacks.
www.examiner.com/political-buzz-in-new-york/ceos-spending-cash-stockpiles-on-stock-buybacks-but-not-job-training
Annirich... Why don't you go out and find your own brain, really, it is tiring to listen to the same arguments repeated ad nauseam with the same words by all of your people! You haven't go the faintest idea of what you are saying.
It is much worst than most would believe!
The NEW APOSTOLIC REFORMATION is run by a diabolical leadership and bureaucracy that believe in witches and demons. Their goal is to manifest the End-Times. It is made up of delusional charismatic fundamentalists, desperate whackos, and politically active extremists who see the world through the eyes of madness, extreme fundamentalism, and charlatanism. Rick Perry is their political leader and regularly meets with the "apostles" of the cult in hopes to gain the POTUS in order to bring on the End-Times, ASAP. Perry with his finger on the bomb is NOT a good idea. Perry in ANY public office is not a good idea! Instead, he should be in jail for obstruction of justice when he tried to hush the investigation regarding his execution of an innocent man.
How a mediocre, homophobic, gay, cheerleader from A&M got to be a murderous and corrupt Governor of Texas begs for an investigation.
This is no joke, read between the lies of this dangerous man!
This just in...
Aug 20, 12:30 AM EDT, Charlotte Gazette
Rick Perry proposes "Faith based" healthcare and retirement systems.
By Karen Klingenhammer
Rock Mountain, S.C.- Presidential candidate, Rick Perry, responded to challenges by critics today about alternatives for seniors after the "Big Government" entitlement programs like Medicare and Social Security that Perry derides were slashed or ended by a Perry Administration.
"We need to transition away from a government run system to a private, faith based system", Perry offered.
"I will personally lead national days of prayer once a month to help the old and sick". We just have to stop relying on the federal and state governments to do everything for us", Perry declared.
"Prayer" is a viable option for seniors in need of food, shelter or medical care, Perry contended, instead of hand outs from the government.
"American's belief in God has always been their strongest and most shining quality" Perry continued. "We can't keep taxing the wealth creators, the people who create businesses and jobs, to pay for these things and still have a robust and healthy economy. The kind of economy we all want".
Perry stated that the pastor of his church had relayed many stories to him over the years of "miracles" that had occurred after the disabled or sick had put their faith in Jesus and prayed for divine assistance.
"One woman had 45 dollars left in the bank and won the lottery just as her rent came due", Perry noted, "and a retired man who had a social disease was cured after he washed the affected body part in water blessed by an evangelist.
"The evangelist wanted to wash if for him", Perry related, "but the guy thought that was kinda weird and declined the offer".
Perry will be addressing the Knights of Golgotha, in Raleigh, NC, tonight on a faith based Energy Policy and the Free-Market.
http://drdapo.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/08/Rick-Perry-2.jpg
TJefferson..I love when someone presents their point of view with pure LOGIC and a total referral to FACTS..not tea Party voodoo..THANKS TJ... IM A TOTAL FAN..
Thanks for the twilight zone intros Brianb.
The Feisty MSNBC shill gets the first post again, followed by the rest of the shills.
Doesn't matter. Perry will win, Obama is toast.
Healthcare for is a great idea but without jobs it means nothing. Without restraint it means nothing. The wrong passed a bill and never read it. The write was never heard in the debate. Attonment will come in 2012 regardless of the Illinois (most corrupt state in the union) shill machine.
Feisty and the rest of the wrong have backs to the wall, where they belong. This will not become socialist states of America. It will be stronger than ever once the wrong are put back in the toy box they escaped from a short few years ago. Sanity will reign again.
When the wrong lose next year I can only hope they will honor their commitment to leave the country better than George Clooney did by making a promise and failing to follow up. That is what the wrong always do. That is what Obama did and is doing.
Faith based health care may not be perfect, but it does work for some. I know a man who was diagnosed with a terminal brain tumor who, through faith, is healthy today after 15 years. No surgery. I can't say it always works but it does in many cases. Those who are nonbelievers will shrug it off. When they are in the same situation and saved, what will they say? A miracle or just go on with their atheistic lives?
The problem in America today is no from theists. It is from those who believe government is some kind of god. It is not a god. It is a bureaucracy that doesn't care about anyone except those few who are paid by taxpayers. Other than those who are perpetually paid to be lazy, what has it done for you? Nothing. Government pays the perpetually lazy to get votes. That is it. And what do the perpetually lazy and government produce? More perpetual laziness.
It doesn't and never has produced real jobs so that common people can support themselves. All it produces is dependence upon others. Blame the rich. They were smart enough to produce wealth. WHat about those to lazy to produce anything? I am not talking about the truly disabled. I am talking about the truly lazy who never worked a day in their pathetic lives. Who prey on those who do work so they can get freebes for doing nothing. Illinois is full of them, just ask Feisty, the MSNBC shill who lives on the welfare she takes from others. Bev, Toasty, other shills want to be taken care of because they exist. We all exist, but only the truly lazy think they are owed something they never earned.
When Perry wins and the dems are dumped next election, hope and change will be here. Hope that the lazy get off their asses and get productive and change that will only reward the able who do for themselves. The disabled will be taken care of. The lazy will roast in their own juices.
If Perry wins, you'll all find out just how deep in the pocket of Big Pharma he is. Not enforcing the minimum payout percentage of insurance premiums ("ObamaCare" stipulates insurance companies MUST pay a minimum percentage of premiums collected as payment on claims) is a priority for him. Your insurance premiums will become a total gift to the insurance company as they deny your claims and Pharma will charge what they please (as they do now) which you will be paying out of pocket on top of that premium gift.
Annirich-3906587
Weren't you banned in Newsvine? I can see why... WAY off base, buddy or buddett.
Take out the campaign BS, the demonization, your FOXnews talking points, and all conspiracy theories (like yours, above), and you're left with something closer to the truth.
The new health care law was a genuine attempt to get runaway health care costs and processes under control... both from a global standpoint and a personal standpoint. Argue the points all day long, but your post is BS.
I'm not sure why I bothered responding to your post, but there it is.
Bob,
Your delusions are getting the better of you, Please put down the bible, pick up the newspaper, and get a real education before you do any more damage. Your mythical belief system has had a hard time keeping up with the advances in knowledge, it is no longer useful or relevant. Voodoo will not make things better, let it go.
I don't think any President can overturn law made by the legislature. It's not in the Constitution but Bush Jr. pulled some weird stunts on his last days... so, I am not too certain.
Nonetheless, I think the US Supreme Court will deem the monstrosity as unconstitutional so any new President won't have to worry about it anyway.
Dude LmarcT
I see NOTHING wrong with annirich's post. It describes how I feel about Obama perfectly - he's a socialist.
What is the evidence for causality here? You absolutely cannot jump to that conclusion. It's been well documented for a long time that there are rare cases of cancerous tumors spontaneously disappearing. It happens to religious patients *AND* atheists. That being the case, it's just silly to assume that religious faith must be responsible in these cases.
How, exactly, do you know that it was prayer and not some poorly-understood natural phenomenon?
Obama is not a socialist. For heaven's sake take a course in civics. Good grief I'm sick of republicans that throw the word "socialist" around without having even the foggiest idea what it means.
It reminds me of the lie that countless republicans have been spreading about health care reform -- they claim it was a "government takeover of health care". The amazing thing is that they continued to say that even after non-partisan fact checking websites (Politifact) made that one their "Lie of the Year". These days republicans seem to go with the theory that, if you tell big lies often enough, people will believe them. Sadly, they seem to be right about that.
Junicon - let's see
Health Care mandate, buy insurance or be fined by the govt.
If a business over 50 employees don't have insurance for their employees, they get fined by the govt. (Though the majority of large employers are saying they're going to drop anyway, as the fine will be so much cheaper than the increased costs of the "New Plan.")
The govt. is telling the insurance companies what HAS to be in the policy. Companies can no longer choose.
The govt. is causing the cost of insurance to skyrocket, and will be able to take the cost of premiums directly from your bank acct.
Looks like a govt. take over to me..... they tried to package it as something else. The something else that has no hope of succeeding, so they will eventually step in and take over, just as it was planned from the beginning.
Who loses? The American Taxpayer, and everyone already currently on govt. plans.
I would like to thank Mr Obama for sharing his stupidity with America, your doing a real great job................yeah .right, sarcasam
Yes he is. He wants to take money from people who work and give it to people who don't work. He is reallocating resources AS HE SEES FIT which is why the Republicans got into office.
And I am NOT a Republican. I am a moderate independent and even I say Obama is a socialist.
Karen dear, you wouldn't know a socialist if one bit you on the behind.
Jamie R - do you actually think what you posted is an intelligent comment?
TJefferson, I've read every post from the top until now. Yours is by far the most thoughtful and, I believe, expresses the views of the majority of people in the USA. It's a shame that you are in your 70's. You would make a heck of a candidate in 2016 to follow Obama's win in 2012! There isn't one thing you've said that I do NOT agree with! Amazing! That has NEVER happened to me before! Please keep posting your well thought out, honest, and true comments. I look forward to reading more posts from you on News Vine.
If need be, due to time and effort constraints, I encourage you to copy and paste the lengthy one on other sites that the Right respond to, also. Perhaps an intelligent, reasonable, and well communicated comment will help others understand some very meaningful issues they should consider before casting their next Presidential vote.
To all whom may understand: Organized religion does not make a person a good christian. Being a christian is in the heart, the mind, and the spirit, and it empowers us to love for one another-- to embrace compassion for the least of us as Jesus exclaimed! These, the least, are the elderly, the children, the unemployed, the disabled, the veterans who can't find jobs; those who faced foreclosure through no fault of their own; the street dwellers; the mentally ill who do have a REAL illness, not their fault, and so forth. Keep in mind that you could be one or more of these people now or in the future.
Jesus, I'm sure, would say that we need unity and love; not extreme, radical, hypocritical and harmful politics, politics that is based on narcissism, and not for "We the People"-- as a loving nation!
Jesus said: "It would be easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle then for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God." Would U like to share heaven with very greedy, mean-spirited, non-caring people? Not me!
Furthermore, healthcare SHOULD BE a human right! Jesus never asked anyone if they would contribute to his healing of them! Got it now?
Considering the fantastic job the GW Bush Administration did in failing to enforce laws passed by generations of Congress, if Perry became President I could easily imagine him doing the same.
That's why it's so important not to believe the Conservative lie "Republicans and Democrats are almost the same thing, but you're safer with Republicans so vote for us." The parties are NOT the same and it's amazing that meme isn't greeted by laughter every time it surfaces.
The parties are generally the same. They all LIE and will do anything for a vote; they are POLITICIANS..... You can be naive and think the Democrat party shyt don't stink, but when reporters stop following Republicans and stir in some of the Democrats poop, I guarantee it will smell like what it is; shyt.
Excellent point, John B. Both parties are not the same. Democrats are not perfect but they certainly are more supportive of average working Americans, of the poor, the disabled, and minorities.
Another false narrative of the GOP is their we support our military 100% yet it was the GOP that refused to pass legislation to improve Veteran's benefits. It took President Obama and the democratic majority to sign into law the most significant improvement to Veteran's benefits since the GI bill became law. Check any Veteran's organization on line and one finds that consistently democrats voting records concerning military support are graded significantly higher than that of the GOP. John McCain in 2008 had a D-, Obama a B+.
No kidding, John. If there is one thing I have learned in the last three years, is that Republicans are none of the things they have claimed to be all my life.
Not better at handling the economy (see financial crisis at end of two terms of Bush)
Not more responsible than Democrats (see debt ceiling debacle - yikes!)
Not pro-business (they resisted bailing out the Automobile Industry, and were willing to see autoworkers lose jobs)
Not better at handling foreign affairs ( they urged President Obama to invade Libya, said he was "dithering" when he studied the situation instead of jumping in.)
It's tough for Republicans to claim to be all these things, when their actual performance proves otherwise.
Democrats are not pushing to kill social security while protecting the almighty rich from paying fair taxes. Pretty funny you think both parties are the same.
What Democrat has signed the Norquist pledge to kill America like all the republicans?
You are living in la la land if you think another republican president won't just continue where bush left off.
Obama 2012
I saw a video clip last week of a GOPTP House Presentative townhall. There were a lot of attendee complaints about Nordquist's Pledge. One asked if there were any other pledges that representive had signed that people should know about? Voters are paying attention.
Saw a clip last night of crowds outside GOPTP townhalls with signs and shouting "Where are the jobs? Where are the jobs?"
President Obama was very wise, despite the criticism of GOPTP candidates and others including some democrats, not to call Congress back into session--the GOPTPers are getting an earful and it isn't positive feedback on their job performance.
And to all those GNOPers who were running on the we can protect you better after 9/11 - where were they when the Zadroga Bill was introduced to help those first responders who selflessly risked their lives working in the rubble of the the Twin Towers - where according the Whitman led EPA the air was safe to breathe - and now bear the scars (and in many cases death) of those efforts - All they could say was a resounding NO you don't deserve a grateful Nations help.
first, you omitted the words "out in". They go between Obama and 2012.
Amy B you have put your finger on the current version of the Republican Party, as controlled by the Tea Party. They say they are for jobs, yet do things to end jobs (how many WI teachers will be laid off as a direct result of Gov. Walkers "reforms"?) They say they are for less government interference in our lives, yet insist on passage of the Patriot act extensions prior to moving forward on other legislation. They say they are for deficit reduction, yet insist that increased revenues can't be done.
The current crop of Republicans running to be the GOP candidate for President all say they love America and want it succeed..... kind of makes you wonder how quickly they will cause this great republic to fail.
The republicans want to kill my dream of having all of you pay my way cradle to grave while I become an artist. You must vote democrat if you want to enjoy all my stick figure art one day. I have a plan to reveal it to all the world after I am able to spend 30 years working on it and not having a real job. Please help me out and reelect Barack Obama so I can have the free health care I so desperately need. I'll even play an upside down bucket drum in downtown SF in my spare time in order to give something back until my work is done.
Dirp, it appears that hypocricy reigns supreme.
The constant 'cut taxes' is a failed receipe........but perhaps let's just cut all taxes....nobody pay nothing!
...and when the downsizing begins.....start with dissolving Congress, especially those who yell the loudest about smaller government.....
doh doh....if you are republican, I doubt you possess the skill to draw stick figures or play bucket drum. Try joining the ministry....
gpotts you sound like a liberal leach , I am republican because not all of us can be on welfare.
Wayne, not all of us can be on welfare. Few of us really want to be. It's your party's policies (like Perry's cutting education funding) that get average people in trouble and lead to more people needing help. Like Obama has said, Democrats want to give a hand UP, not a hand OUT. There's a big difference.
Inthemiddle,
There is a difference, you just dont have clear enough ears and eyes to recognize it. Rick Perry is a dangerous man if only for the fact that he is a supporter of the NAR crazies. New Apostolic Reformation idiots want to bring on the End-Times as soon as possible so they can enjoy the benefits. Look into it and get a grip before this maniac gets his finger on the button.
BTW, there are plenty of other reasons to vote against Perry, too, but I am afraid they are too hard for you to understand.
Perry wants to ax HC reform. We all know current HC system expensive, broken and needs to fixed. What is Perry's plan for HC reform?
Perry said S.S., & Medicare are "UNCONSTITUTIONAL".
DohDoh: you're joking, right. All Democrats are poor, starving artists on welfare? Do you even hear yourself? you actually think the health care debate is about "free" health care?? No wonder you're so misguided!
Rick Perry, Governor of Texas, which has one of the highest rates of uninsured citizens in the Nation, will use his power as President to nullify as much of the Affordable Health Care Act as he can--that way he can guarantee maintaining the high levels of uninsured. Perry is nothing but a greedy and uncaring jerkwad.
If we thought Bush 43 was a disaster, Perry will be worse. The caricature we had of President George W. Bush is exactly what Rick Perry is.
Yes maybe so but the numbers don't tell you that 75% of those uninsured are illegals. I know you don't have to deal with this problem in Iowa.
If you are not from Texas, all you have is second-hand and disgruntled opinions about the man. democrats dislike him because they can't beat him.
Illegals are a major problem in Texas. They drain resources and that is why our statistics are skewed. Mexicans in general have been quitting school for decades, that is nothing new.
Greedy...lol.....Show me a broke azz Democrat in Congress.......Show all of us.......do tell.
Thanks funny, ITM
This article says President Obama beats Perry in Texas. The same can be said for Obama beating Sarah Palin in Alaska. I guess no one knows you like your own home town.
http://tpmdc.talkingpointsmemo.com/2011/06/poll-perry-trails-obama-in-texas.php
Pay full price to get your roof fixed then if it's SOOOOOOOO bad.
ITM, you are so very wrong. There are many uninsured Iowans, we just have a smaller population. Incidentally, read Rick Perry's book "Fed Up" then tell us we don't know anything about the man.
Amy:
I'm quite sure that is legit coming from a Liberal opinion blog.
TPM....lol.......
Where did they poll? It has to be in Austin because that is the only Dem stronghold in Texas with all of those transients.
How many illegals does that include?
The Uninsured in Texas is currently at 26% of our population for this discussion: Per the University of Texas "Demographic Profile of the Uninsured in Texas" and that number does not include illegal immigrants. The highest population of uninsured by race is the Hispanic population but the Hispanic population here in Texas has boomed in the last several years and even legal Hispanics make about 18% less money than their white counterparts so the are less likely to afford health care. If you are wondering how Perry has helped the illegal situation here in Texas, he has passed his own version of the "Dream Act" much like the one the POTUS has proposed.
I just want to add my two cents on our Governor Good Hair down here in Texas. I am neither an illegal Mexican or, for that matter, a Mexican. I only have one child, a decent job and am not on welfare. I consider Rick Perry to be the worst governor our state has ever elected. And that's saying something considering Perry took over from W. Perry has decimated our educational system. Nearly 40,000 teachers have been let go and our classroom sizes are 50+ students per class this school year. Our air quality is beyond awful because Rick Perry is, and always has been, in bed with Big Oil. He allows the Texas oil refineries to clog our air with deadly toxic chemicals. The first order of business for a Perry presidency would be to abolish the EPA leaving our environment and air quality at tremendous risk. He won re-election with only 39% of the vote. How is that possible you ask? Well, the Republicans knew he would lose against a single opponent so they made sure he had two. I'm sure Big Oil and his wealthy backers will finance some slick campaign ads to make him seem like he's a hero but he's not. He's a hard right-winger who will destroy the very fabric of this country. He makes the Tea Partiers look like grade school kids. I cannot stress enough the danger this man poses to our democracy. I urge everyone to read his book "Fed Up". Perry openly discusses his extremist views and beliefs. No doubt his handlers will have him soften or disavow much of his books contents. So...please...read THE BOOK. It is Perry being who he really is vs. the man his imagemakers are trying to create.
Jody: no, those are not absoute numbers, they are percentages of each state. Texas has the highest PERCENTAGE of uninsured residents of any state in the union. Iowa may seem bad to you but you need to look outside your state. It's at the other end of the scale from Texas (Top ten states for percentage of those with medical insurance). And no, these numbers do not include illegal immigrants of course.
Former Chief Justice Warren E. Burger, "That clause (commerce clause) created... a common market..."
Presidents take an OATH to faithfully uphold and execute the laws of the United States. Should a president refuse to honor that oath, they should be impeached and removed from office. Plain and simple.
Well Pat,
It seems there are two standards at work here. President Bush signed hundreds of executive orders, defining how he would interpret laws passed by Congress and therefore how they would or would not be enforced. He chose to ignore the Constitutional requirements for court approvals of wiretaps and Habeas Corpus. The Republicans in the House have decided not to fund laws they don't like but don't have the votes to repeal. Their minority in the Senate has abused the filibuster to block even voting on any law they dislike.
To conservatives, that's all perfectly o.k. But let an elected majority in the House and 60 sitting Senators pass a law that gives more people access to health care and it's been "crammed down our throats by a dictator". You really can't argue with people who think like that. You just have to look at their choices and vote against them. Hopefully, enough of us will show up at the polls next time to send these yahoos home to sulk while we fix the country.
The rabid right wasn't itching and moaning about the abuse of power by W.....
......W never met an Executive Order or Spending bill he didn't like!...Over 200 Executive Orders signed by W!
http://www.archives.gov/federal-register/executive-orders/wbush.html
Rick Perry's comparing the Civil Rights Movement to the Republican/Tea Party fight for lower taxes tells me everything I need to know about this man.
He is not a serious person and therefore not worthy of serious consideration for the office of POTUS.
Excellent post!!!
Especially this part:
Texans love to say"DONT MESS WITH TEXAS".. The rest of the country says"DONT ELECT A TEXAN WHO MADE TEXAS A MESS"!!! Compared to Perry, Dubya was a Rhodes scholar...
Fact Check on Perry: I'm hoping someone else does my dirty work for me. Those activist judges.
 .
sorry to keep saying it but Perry is a Party Puppet and until someone tells him what to say and what his platform is he will continue to act like the cowboy and if you listen you will here "How we do it in Texas" in almost each and every statement he makes.
In the Middle We keep bringing up Bush because his policies are still in effect. 2 unfunded wars, 2 tax cuts, and unfunded medicare still adding to the deficits. He's the gift that keeps on giving.
Typical right winger--thinks the truth is no longer true if you insult the messenger and call him names. Pitiful
Looks like the republicans are running from taking responsiblity for anything.
Bush and the republicans broke our country with tax cuts and wars, but now think we should blame the poor. Republicans way to be responsible is by protecting the rich at all cost.
America be damed, our rich friends (contributions) mean so much more to us.
OmustGo--typical right wing nonsense. You've got nothing better than that?
Thanks for the reminder "Brundo" - The republicans forget GWB because its convenient to do so - how else can they explain what happened under their leadership from 2000-2008? Oh by the way, the democratic congress basically let his agenda roll. Too bad we didn't have "demabaggers" in those days and where were McConnell and Boehner on deficit spending then???
Everyone complains about Obamacare. Why isn't everyone complaining about the Patriot Act that effectively allows people to spy on other people to gather information about them to them use such information in political ploy of forcing the person to be the type of American that the Extreme Religious Right Conservative wants everyone to be?
Everyone complains about Obamacare trampling their Constitutional Rights. But what about the Patriot ACt that was established under the auspice of being a tool to use to gather intel about possible terrorists in the Middle East plotting attacks that is now being used as a political tool here in America to make people think that someone is a terrorist just because they are not a Tea Party religious list?
Why isn't America complaining about the Patriot Act and it's use to religiously persacute a person based upon their past when they have already paid their fines and served their time? Why isn't America complaining about the Patriot Act being used as a double standard to say a person is guilty for all times based upon religion saying that the person is guilty based upon what they find in their past?
The real degenerate in America is not Obamacare it is the Patriot Act.
Only when candidate Rick Perry says he would use executiive orders to try to limit ObamaCare, the leftists now notice that a President can't rule by executive order!
Obama's abuse of executive orders is fine by them.
Right because repukes have a tremendously clean record along these lines. How did halliburton/kbr know before the citizens of this country we were going to war in Iraq ..... again? Not too mention the 'patriot' act.
It's another example of how Republicans can spin words to create an impression that is totally at odds with reality. The Patriot Act actually strips rights that are guaranteed by the Constitution. The Clear Skies Act allowed increases in pollution. The Death Tax is not really an income tax on people who inherit wealth they did not create, but a tax on the person who died. [I guess it would limit their ability to take it with them.] Time after time, the Republicans will revert to Orwellian phrases to create a situattion that is exactly the opposite of what the name implies. By the way, if the health care law was passed by elected majoritis in the House and Senate, what exactly is wrong with it? Isn't that the way it's supposed to work; the people vote and the majority rules?
When major legislation is passed with NO input from the minority party and over the objections of the majority of the American people????? You are a babbling fool for even saying such a thing. Both houses and the Presidency will be in conservative hands in 2012 and let's see what you think.
john if that happens it will be proof positive...there is no god....
ObamaCare had plenty of republican support--until it came time to vote. The GOP is on record saying that health care needed fixing, that the system was broken. Over 130 republican amendments were added to the bill. I'm still waiting for a GOPTPer to explain why it is wrong to guarantee that every American should have the right to health insurance, that no one can be denied insurance because of a pre-existing condition, that no one's insurance can be cancelled because they become seriously ill, that no caps on lifetime coverage is legal. Perhaps the conservatives can explain why trading American's health on the stock market makes sense, why shareholders and profits are more important than care for the people paying the premiums. It's a good thing I didn't hold my breath waiting.
The only reason the GOPTP supporters are against HCR is because they've been told by their legislators that it is some evil take-over of health care. Instead of researching it for themselves, they believe what they're told.
Get your facts straight. The minority party was invited to participate. They refused and said no to anything that was brought up. Obstructionism at its worst.
Right on Jody!
Bob - If the President could rule by Executive Order, Obama would have fixed the economy and joblessness by now and overrulled Congress. Our bond rating wouldn't have been reduced and we'd been on the way to reducing the deficit.
Really? Really? This is a professional news organization, right? Paid editors and all that good stuff?
Mark in Austin -
I don't know your politics, sir, but since you not only read the entire article before posting (rare around here) but also picked up on that little slip and gave me a chuckle, you got my vote - however moot a point that may be...... :)
I really don't care who does it or how it's done...just get rid of this horrible piece of healthcare legislation. Period!!!
Juanita, I'm curious, how (specifically) did the health care bill adversely affect you?
it will raise her expenses as she will have to get her own insurance or be taxed
dont, do you realize that the health care bill increased her theoretical cost by 2% in 2011?
That compared to the 10% increase each and every year for the last 10+ years.
Obviously the health care bill is the least of our problems concerning the cost of health care.
What's more telling though is that she couldn't provide an answer.
Juanita is just a made up character trying to make people believe that hispanic people are against health care. You see those types of post fairly often. If you pick their story apart, some disappear never to be heard from again.
Obama 2012
don'tbethepenguin: ...."uninsured" doesn't mean there are no health care costs...it means everyone else PAYS for your health care costs when you show up in the emergency room. That may be your ideal for health care in America, but in the real world, where costs for medical care have been soaring past the cost of every other thing, that was the problem.
Mute is not a synonym for moot.
Obamacare is an unconstitutional mess, rushed through in secrecy and ignorance. It has to go, along with all the corrupt politicians who jammed this abortion down our throats.
The Affordable Care Act is the law of the land. It was passed into law well over a year ago. Didn't you get the talking points memo? This week is about the vacation.
do not muddy issue with facts....facts are republican kryptonite
Unless you are ignorant to the United States constitution It was passed the right way.
And just because a lower court says it is, it doesn't mean that they have the final say.
I live in Texas and health "uninsurance" is pretty normal here. Even trying to get kids insured under CHIP is pretty sad, because, due to Texas rules, parents have to reapply very often, and usually there is a time lag between reapplying and being re-approved. That works well for Perry, because insurance is not something he thinks people should be able to have.
Just who is the brilliant person you want to replace him with?
Romney and his magic underwear to protect the rich from fair taxes and corporations are people too or Perry to lead us with his army of god to the raptures and kill social security on the way or Bachmann who just makes up her own facts because her opinion told her she could who also voted to end social security?
Obama 2012 the only sane choice if you want to retire one day
The only reason Governor Hairdoo wants to get rid of the healthcare bill, is so he can continue to keep his grubby hands on the drug companies that load up his personal bank accounts.
Go ahead. Vote for this dumbass. Remember he was educated in the Texas school system. Number 47 out of 50 in high school graduates. Soon to be 50th with the 4 billion in education cuts in Texas.
Trust me... You don't want it done how it's done in Texas... And ban all organized religion. Does nothing but start wars and cultivate misery.
That's good, then you won't vote for Bush 3.
Liberals....welfare mavens and godless socialists.
stupid rep/TP always forget that the red states are the welfare states. Blue states are the educated, employed states (exception CA, idiot leaders)....duh hint: MS,AL,GA,FL,LA,ID,IO,AK,OK, etc....all red;all welfare...
"fact checks' on Perry are going to make some great copy for the campaign ads, if he makes the final cut.
(but then again, the same goes for whichever of these fools makes the final cut...)
3 years into his disastrously failed term as President, time for a fact check on Barack Obama.
Fact: one term and done, go back to Chicago with your crony crooks.
bob, how can a prediction be fact?
Mark...that is as close as they come to facts.
Shades of the last moron from Texas. No thanks.
dirp 101. If you think Bush left office with issues wait until you see the potholes left behind when O leaves office next year. I'm a Republican and I can't stand Perry. No place for religion in politics. Leave the Bible at home. We elect Presidents and Congressional leaders to solve issues regardless of who created them. O has accomplished nothing and in all likelihood will not be re-elected. I don't give a damn who over time was responsible for creating the issue, O was elected to make things better, not worse. He has been a failure by any measure to this point. Still time left but I don't hold out much hope. He has done nothing to pull this country together economically or spiritually. Even the Congressional Black Caucus has expressed muted disapointment.
Richard, I am just asking but what has the POTUS made worse, either he has done something or he has done nothing. If he has done nothing then he has not made things worse by this logic.
Robert-1960 I fully agree with you. But don't try to give a Republican facts or logic, that just confuses them. How else can you explain that they want the deficit to be reduced, but don't want to raise revenue.
because Liberals only want to instill cradle to grave Government nanny-ism with every nickel they rob from the electorate. Benefits for illegals? Child...please!
"Liberals only want to instill cradle to grave Government nanny-ism"
While Conservatives, like Paul Ryan and Eric Cantor, live out the nanny-dream for decades on the government payroll. Paul Ryan even used his father's Social Security benefits to go to college - funny how one person's entitlement benifit is another persons "nanny-ism"
Please John go take your meds and turn off the hate radio or televison you are listening to. It shows when people come on here with censored news talking points.
You don't seem to have a clue as to what liberals want.
Amy B. Portland, ME - it is crazy how the list and stories of "Conservatives" that have benefited so well from entitlements, bail outs, and the stimulus and legal loopholes
I love it: "It falls into a really gray area of constitutional law about the president's discretion to NOT enforce a law," says Vladeck."
Kind of like not enforcing Marijuana laws, or immigration laws or the defense of marriage law?
I love how some complain when their same tactics could be used against them.
Funny thing is, while not supporting the DOMA in court, the Obama administration is enforcing it. Likewise with the marijuana and immigration laws. The recent explanation of where the ICE is to focus their attention, on dangerous felony criminals instead of just across all individuals does not mean that immigration laws are suddenly not being enforced. Likewise, focusing on dealers instead of grandma's with glaucoma does not mean drug laws are not enforced.
THIS MAN SURE HAS A GOOD VIEW OF WHAT'S HAPPENING TO OUR COUNTRY!
'Heavenly Father, we come before you today to ask your forgiveness and to seek your direction and guidance. We know Your Word says, 'Woe to those who call evil good,' but that is exactly what we have done. We have lost our spiritual equilibrium and reversed our values.. We have exploited the poor and called it the lottery. We have rewarded laziness and called it welfare. We have killed our unborn and called it choice. We have shot abortionists and called it justifiable. We have neglected to discipline our children and called it building self esteem.. We have abused power and called it politics.. We have coveted our neighbor's possessions and called it ambition. We have polluted the air with profanity and pornography and called it freedom of expression.. We have ridiculed the time-honored values of our forefathers and called it enlightenment. Search us, Oh God, and know our hearts today; cleanse us from every sin and Set us free. Amen!'
With the Lord's help, may this prayer sweep over our nation and wholeheartedly become our desire so that we again can be called 'One nation under God!'
Think about this: If you forward this prayer to everyone on your e-mail list, in less than 30 days it would be heard by the world.
'One Nation Under God!'
To quote the great American architect and philosopher Buckminster Fuller, " I don't pray to God, because I don't believe he's looking for recommendations from me".
Oh, how sweet. But this country isn't one nation under God no matter how hard anyone tries to make it so. That isn't what it was and it won't be under one God...sorry, but not everyone believes as you apparently do.
I would agree with all you liberals but then we would both be wrong, the goverment that is big enough to give you everything you want , is big enough to take everything you have..........Idiots.
The above prayer was from Billy Graham the one person the media coulden't throw dirt on.
The media could & should throw dirt on him. He was recorded with Pres Nixon conspiring to blame a democrat for the attempted assassination of Gov Wallace of Alabama, a democrat running for president.
Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor means different things to different folks!
you need to change your handle, be careful of what you say
"The question may be "mute" If the Supreme Court." First Read editors wake up!!! It should be "MOOT"
moot
adjective
1.
open to discussion or debate; debatable; doubtful: a moot point.
2.
of little or no practical value or meaning; purely academic.
3.
Chiefly Law . not actual; theoretical; hypothetical.
Since when are we "muting" the SCOTUS?
And where are the right wing ambulance chasing poltroons who usually catch these things???
Go Figure.
Torpedo: actually, if the Supreme Court does rule, the issue will be mute, as in silent, not heard.... we can only hope..... ;D
"We can only hope"? Illegals and welfare recipients?
Let me guess you guys think the whole country of poor people are on welfare. WOW
RIck Perry Lies - from what I have gathered in these forums they think all non GOP/TP are on welfare.
Robert, Maybe they re not good at gathering information. Just because someone is not GOP doesn't mean they are not successful. Nobody ever gave the TP credit for literacy, though.
Robert -1960, I tend to agree with you on this. My spouse and I are very successful in the technology and financial sector. We are vacationing in Europe for 10 days and we just sent a child off to college, yet I agree with many provisions of the Healthcare Reform. In addition, I also believe that the extension of the payroll tax decrease for employees will be beneficial to working class and middle class families. I also believe that corporate tax incentives should tied directly to job creation. No job creation, no tax incentives.
Forest Gump & Judyaz, There are many on folks on these forums who do not seem to grasp the fact that Jesus would be considered a liberal. Too many want to sit in judgement because it is so easy and you don't to do anything really hard. Now what is really hard about being a real Christian is the "love" and "giving" thing. Matthew 5:42 Give to the one who asks you, and do not turn away from the one who wants to borrow from you. Now that is too hard stuff to do! And this is next to impossible!! Luke 6:29 If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also. If someone takes your cloak, do not stop him from taking your tunic. 1 Corinthians 13:13 And now abideth faith, hope, charity, these three; but the greatest of these is charity. Luke 18:25 Indeed, it is easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God."
Forget about it, Christian Lite = it is easier to bash the poor!
Hmm, I seem to remember some "God helps those who help themselves" passages too. But that involves taking accountabilty for your own actions and actually doing something about your situation.. which seems to be where Liberals and I part ways... We conservative are all for helping people who want to better themselves... voluntary giving.... (as in wealthy American donors and corporations are the most giving people on earth)... just not "givng" at the point of the IRS gun to be distributed by vote-buying Democrats... so that people can collect gov't checks to smoke crack all day... there are two kinds of Liberals... those that want something for nothing... and those that give it to them by stealing my money.... time to get back to the rule that Capt John Smith had to enact on lazy aristocrats at Jamestown... "no work, no eat".
Carrie Dunn and the other liberals at MSNBC are sure doing a lot of "fact checking" these days. I wonder if and when they will start fact checking Obama or any Democrats for that matter. My guess is never. These stories aren't meant to inform the public they are designed to persuade the public.
We have entitlements for the poor (Medicaid), we have entitlements for the elderly (Medicare) and now we have an entiltement for millions in-between (Obamacare). The problem is, there isn't enough people in our country to pay for it and there never will be. Obama is bankrupting our country and that is a story worth writing.
how true. This Progressive/Socialists have done enough harm. Perry or whomever takes offices needs to rid us of this travesty.
Annirich-3906587
Welcome back Annie... tick tock...
Enjoy it while you can... lol
tyler
I could use a lot less of this phenomenon, but better late than never. AnnieRich banned, long-term multiple accounts with annirich, also banned.
#1.63 - Mon Aug 22, 2011 12:34 PM CDT
isn't that just A-typical of the Progressive/Socialists Democrats. Anything they don't want to hear or read they put a cap on. Well guess what, the people of this country will be speaking at the polls in 2012 and you're not gonna' like it. So be it. We are done with the likes of this administration's destruction of our country. And Feisty, you along with your co-horts being the paid trolls of MSNBC are doing of fine job of character assassinations but then we're not at all surprised. That's always the way of the Dems. Are you sure you know what Honor is?
you have to possess character to have it assassinated... Funny that Rub/TP consider progress a negative thing. I guess it fits in with their anti-education positions...
@Lukewarm......We have entitlements for the poor (Medicaid), we have entitlements for the elderly (Medicare) and now we have an entiltement for millions in-between (Obamacare).
You've ignored one really big entitlement!....those pesky tax loopholes that the super rich enjoy, along with corporations!
Tell me Feisty, how is it you have such "inside" information????
TO: lukewarm who wrote:
"Carrie Dunn and the other liberals at MSNBC are sure doing a lot of "fact checking" these days..."
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
That's because Republicans are doing a whole lot of lying these days, and apparently instead of just "calling" Republicans liars, MSNBC is backing it up with actual facts.
We know that won't stop Republicans from making things up, but for those that need proof of the constant inaccuracies of Republicans, we have fact checkers.
For those who can't deal with facts, you can still close your eyes and plug your ears.
lukewarm - you may want to put things into perspective, if you want to know about entitlement read the article Wealth, Income & Power by William Domhoff.
I am a fiscal conservtaive but a social liberal, I believe government should live according to their [reasonable] means and waste not but. I am no great fan of the unions, they have made their share of mistakes but the rich for far too long have enjoyed the good life on the backs of the middle class.
Today 93% of the wealth is held by 20% of the population and 59% of income earned in the US went to the same 20% at the top. This situation is not getting better for those of us in the middle. The rich and conservatives keep telling those of us in the middle "you have the opportunity to be like us, you can be a winner if you only keep trying" but the sad truth is there is only room at the top for 20% so there always will be a lot of us at the bottom.
Now Perry and others like him want to take away health care reform but have no solutions to the problems we face. They want to keep giving the rich tax breaks because trickle down economics will create jobs which as proven to be elusive yet the middle class is paying 24% in taxes while the rich are paying 30% (and maybe less) and that is fair and just?
This country is in decline not because of entitlements but because we are becoming a plutocracy.
Well, Perry could do just like Obozo has done.... give waivers to his friends... as in, every state that goes Red in the 2012 election is exempt from Obozocare, and every one that goes Blue can keep it... and you hear a LOT of negative comments about the job creation in Texas on this site... Liberals in denial trying to put some negative spin on the job growth that results from lower taxes and regulation... why no coverage in the various Pravda rags (ie MSM) about the decimating effect the 67% tax increase in Illinois has had on jobs? Thousands lost each month... The new Illinois State Motto, "No really, he's from Hawaii!"