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Subscribe to RSSOne of the common misperceptions of American politics is that a great speech or a rhetorical call to arms can shape domestic policy.
In fact, the Founding Fathers established a system of governance -- with separation of powers, and checks and balances -- that makes it very difficult to get things done. The exceptions often have come after national tragedies (see: the Great Society after JFK's assassination) or when one party holds the White House and a supermajority in Congress (see: the New Deal under FDR, when Democrats once held a 75-17 majority in the Senate).
As presidential scholar Richard Neustadt once observed, the White House is actually a weak office when it comes to domestic affairs, and that successful presidents -- in terms of getting things done -- use their powers to persuade and bargain. Neustadt wrote:
A President, these days, is an invaluable clerk. His services are in demand all over Washington. His influence, however, is a very different matter.
But Drew Westen's harsh critique -- from the left -- of Barack Obama's presidency so far misses this understanding of separation of powers, checks and balances, and the difficulty of achieving major reform.
Westen's chief complaint of Obama in his much-discussed New York Times opinion piece: The president has failed to deliver a morality tale about who and what had caused the nation's economic woes, and who was going to fix them. "That story would have made clear that the president understood that the American people had given Democrats the presidency and majorities in both houses of Congress to fix the mess the Republicans and Wall Street had made of the country, and that this would not be a power-sharing arrangement."
In his article, Westen goes on to criticize Obama's economic stimulus ("he backed away from his advisers who proposed a big stimulus, and then diluted it with tax cuts that had already been shown to be inert") and the health-care law (Obama, Westen argues, failed to state what it would accomplish other than it would "'bend the cost curve'").
But would a morality tale -- in which Obama cast the Republicans as the bad guys -- have helped convince the three Republican senators Obama needed to break the GOP filibuster (Susan Collins, Olympia Snowe, and Arlen Specter) to vote for the legislation? In fact, those GOP senators demanded the extra tax cuts as a concession for their votes.
Would an us-vs.-them narrative have persuaded the Republicans it took to pass financial reform, repeal of "Don't Ask, Don't Tell," and ratification of New START? (Remember: Democrats enjoyed a filibuster-proof Senate majority for only six months, from July '09 to Jan. '10.)
And would it have galvanized the conservative Dem senators from GOP-leaning states (like Ben Nelson, Mary Landrieu, and Max Baucus) to pass the health-care law.
It's cliché, but it's also true: Politics is the art of the possible. And in a political system that favors inaction over action, it's extraordinary when major legislation is passed by Congress and signed into law, no matter the legislation's merits or the compromises therein. As presidential historian Robert Dallek -- who taught this reporter -- wrote in Dec. 2009 after the Senate passed health-care (before Scott Brown's victory in Massachusetts):
FDR had an economic crisis of unprecedented proportions in 1933 when he drove 15 major bills through the Congress, and super majorities in the House and the Senate in 1935 when he won passage of Social Security.
Johnson's mastery of the Congress in getting a revolutionary civil rights bill passed in 1964 partly rested on his use of President Kennedy's martyrdom...
Mr. Obama had a much higher mountain to climb in passing national health insurance. True, he won a convincing majority in 2008, and his party has a solid majority in the House and the 60 Senate votes needed to defeat any Republican filibuster. But these are pseudo-advantages: The conservative House Democrats and his dependence on unreliable Senate allies like Connecticut's Joe Lieberman and Nebraska's Ben Nelson forced compromises on the public option and abortion that made his liberal backers grudging supporters.
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"I could stand up here and say, 'Let's just get everybody together, let's get unified, the sky will open, the light will come down, celestial choirs will be singing, and everyone will know we should do the right thing and the world will be perfect." --mocking Barack Obama
Hillary Told You So
As Democratic disgust with Obama’s debt fumbling spreads, Clinton supporters recall her '3 a.m. phone call' warnings—and angry, frustrated liberals are muttering that she should mount a 2012 challenge.
At a New York political event last week, Republican and Democratic office-holders were all bemoaning President Obama’s handling of the debt-ceiling crisis when someone said, “Hillary would have been a better president.”
“Every single person nodded, including the Republicans,” reported one observer.
At a luncheon in the members’ dining room at the Metropolitan Museum of Art on Saturday, a 64-year-old African-American from the Bronx was complaining about Obama’s ineffectiveness in dealing with the implacable hostility of congressional Republicans when an 80-year-old lawyer chimed in about the president’s unwillingness to stand up to his opponents. “I want to see blood on the floor,” she said grimly.
A 61-year-old white woman at the table nodded. “He never understood about the ‘vast right-wing conspiracy,’” she said.
Looking as if she were about to cry, an 83-year-old Obama supporter shook her head. “I’m so disappointed in him,” she said. “It’s true: Hillary is tougher.”
http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/08/07/hillary-clinton-2012-calls-grow-with-anger-at-obama-debt-capitulation.html
Hillary 2012...
"...it's extraordinary when major legislation is passed by Congress and signed into law, no matter the legislation's merits or the compromises therein."
-Mark Murray, First Read-
It's even MORE extraordinary, Mr. Murray, when said legislation was passed without so much as one bipartisan vote in either House of Congress, and without majority support from the American public.
The latest chapter in the book "Why Nothing Is Obama's Fault".
Good grief.
Here is a newsflash, Mark- had either Hillary or McCain won in 2008, the U.S. would still have a triple A credit rating- because the debt would not be this large.
The recovery would be well and truly over, because the recession would have been so far behind us we would no longer be able to see it in the rear view mirror. We would be growing- perhaps, even, worrying about the economy overheating.
Unemployment would have gone down to full employment levels.
Why? Because either of them would have understood what was necessary to get past the crisis- not merely seen it as an opportunity for exploitation to pass HCR, and to appropriate billions so that their campaign donors could get the payoffs they'd been promised.
You gave me a little bit of hope in First Thoughts this morning- that maybe you'd put down the pom poms long enough to see what a disaster you'd foisted on this too gullible nation.
I see you're over it already.
Obama's REAL PROBLEM?
Once you take office voters judge you by your DEEDS not WORDS
And his deeds Madison, have been consistent growth in the GDP, he saved millions of jobs, and had Boehner taken the 4 trillion dollar deal we could have averted the Tea Party Downgrade.
@Eric-913730,
Thank you.
The stupidity by the first few comments has cause a danger to themselves and a danger to this Nation.
A routine vote turn into an economic disaster that only hate and bigotry could make happen.
I see that the Repugnants are having a field day on this "Bash Obama" thing. I suppose that it's not a surprise, considering how disappointing their field for the nomination is ("None of the Above" still leads in the polls).
Hey, Democrats, I really don't care if you want to indulge yourselves in your quadrennial "feasting upon your own" as the Conservatives, herein, are desperately seeking. It's just that "None of the Above" is still this Independent's favorite among the Republican desperadoes to "save the union". Take no jo, no bo (no truth) from nj up yonder; he says, "had either Hillary or McCain won in 2008, the U.S. would still have a triple A credit rating- because the debt would not be this large." He might be right; however, the part he didn't tell you is that unemployment would be as large as the debt, with debt to follow, if nobody tried to pull the economy out of it's crash dive (see some history, no jo, of 1929-1932).
If you would rather make no jo, dangerfield, and Madison happy by sitting at home rather than supporting your guy, don't complain when the ones who got us here get back in control.
We are screwed, America
1.5 Million IT jobs since 2001 have been outsourced to India and China. 2.8 Manufacturing JObs have been outsourced. Estimated that we have lost nearly 1 Million job due to automation over the last 10 years. And now, because of the 'skills' gap, we are importing foreign labor and paying them 1/2 what an American worker receives, while we defund re-training and Pell Grants and Reserach grants.
Why dont we have stories on that? Because CNN, MSNBC and FOX all OUTSOURCE and Automate. They wont talk about it because they are all guilty of it
Thats almost 5 Million jobs...GONE...forever. They are not coming back. What do we do about that? The trickle down failed us while the CEOs and Wall Street got rich on our backs.
Meanwhile, during the recession, the wage scale was significantly lowered. IT Engineers (for example) who were laid off for making $70,000 salary will be hired back @ $45,000 (if they dont hire an Indian worker in her place).
And for the middle-age factory worker or other displaced workers, what do you train them for? IT? Nope, its being outsourced. Green energy jobs? Nope, the GOP wants to defund it. How about going back to college? Nope, the GOP wants to cut Pell Grants. Start your business? Nope...nobody is loaning to the start-up guy whose assets, retirement, savings and credit rating were wrecked by the downturn. Not to mention comapnies almost always hire the healthier younger guy.
And during the last 15 years or so, the benevelant market has also turned the American Worker (an asset) into a Cost (liability); to be reduced, automated or eliminated.
They want Americans to work for 3rd World wages, with no health benfits, no safety regulations and no safety net and still expect we will buy their products . Big Business is not Americas friend, nor a benefactor. They have been given every break in this recession and they have not hired. It seems the 'uncertainty' is a moving goalpost for them. There will always be some excuse for their disloyalty to America and their Greed.
Welcome to the age of the permanantly unemployable and the beginning of Americans no longer being able to afford the products these Corporate pigs sell. Everybody loses.
As for me, I will stop my consumer spending on anything but the necessities because of MY 'uncertainty'. No trips, no dinner out, no new car, nothing but Food, Utilities and Mortgage. Good luck selling your goods , Corporate America, you and your Tebagging GOP special interest lackeys are pricing the American consumer out of our own Market.
It's interesting for the Republican supporters to fail to realize, A Republican President set this course of decline in motion. The Republican Congress filibustered just about every fix President Obama came up with.
The straw that broke the Countries back was the TEArrorist/GOP who beamed with pride about taking the POTUS and the Citizens as "RANSOM HOSTAGES".
You can NOT love your Country when you speak with GLEE of taking her and the POTUS HOSTAGE.
Obama's only mistake was NOT reminding the American People about the Plague that had descended on Capital Hill....in the form of Home Grown Tearrorists, and Ignorant ones to boot.
He was naive to think that the same people who had created the problems could help resolve them. It was Impossible to expect them to help because if they had that kind of wisdom, the Problem would never have been created to begin with.
As someone that voted for Obama, to me, it looks like he is completely over his head as president.
I get the impression he's a smart person and a gifted speaker, but he does not seem to have good leadership qualities, and I do not think he is able to work effectively with people that do not share his views (be that Republicans, world leaders, or business leaders).
There is no tea party downgrade. Obama owns this economy and this downgrade. Failed Keynesian policies caused this downgrade. John Chambers of S&P cited that the cuts simply weren't large enough.
Liberals spent the first three years blaming Bush and are now attempting to pass the blame for their own ineptitude to a minority party who are attempting to reduce the debt. This economy is the democrats baby. Stand up and take responsibility, quit blaming Bush and the tea party.
Seems there are still a few lotus eaters out there who don't have a clue who laid the ground work for the sub prime meltdown. If you don't learn from history you are doomed to repeat it.
Rick,
I blame both parties for the sub prime meltdown. It started as far back as regulatory changes in the 70's, really got going in the early 90's with housing for all push, and was allowed to go full-tilt with the late 90's deregulation. Both parties pushed for regulations that allowed it to happen, and even encouraged banks to make riskier and riskier loans.
I completely agree with this history comment. We need to look at this with "non-partisan" eyes and make sure to not repeat these mistakes in the future. Unfortunately, what I see here and with our political leaders is partisanship. Everyone wants to point out what the "other side" did wrong, but they won't admit to any mistakes by "their side". That attitude needs to change for the good of the country.
I believe this was written to try to insult the President and for no other reason. Morality should have a lot to do with politics, but sadly it doesn't. Money has more weight than morality because even though most of these people are already rich, they want to cling to power at any cost. Over half of them have outlived their shelf life and need to retire. Since when does being a good orator work against you. Ghandi, MLK, and Kennedy were great orators and we still remember their words. This president hasn't been given the opportunity to do what he wants because of obstructionists in Congress. The Repos are setting him up to fail at every turn. I have lost the little respect I had for any of those treasonous rats.
Bernanke will probably do another quantitative easing which adds to our debt burden. Obamacare and all Obama's new regulations have choked job growth. If they would delete all the new laws over the past 2 -3 years, companies would create jobs again and be able to pay our debts, but Obama is intent on ruining our economy so he can recreate it the way he and his backers want. Remember Carter and the CRA and Clinton and bank mandates creating the housing bubble? The people in charge will always eat cake and try to create class warfare. They are doing an excellent job.
We search for a national identity, and we can no longer convince ourselves that we are the same people who won the West or the War.... We do need a leader who can tell a story and who can teach us who we are... or should be. We cannot expect a professor of Constitutional law, or a reductionist pundit, or a profit-addled corporate striver (who might also be working for the network news as a reductionist pundit) to help us see clearly in the midst of terror, grief, and ambient insecurity. Our 'exceptionalism' does not exempt us from the deep human need to serve a purpose greater than ourselves. And, unless the Christian Taliban completely take over and legislate that purpose, we might have to find in our ranks a storyteller who can conjure the decency of Americans to rise up against war and greed and selfishness... for those are the forces whose beacon lights" the shining city upon the hill."
So now MSNBC has resorted to writing articles about other articles because they don't praise the messiah? And the "bad" article is even criticism from the LEFT.
Can you say denial?
MSNBC, here is some more reality you can't cope with:
Jobs: Worse than you think
"Last month, only 58.1% of Americans age 16 and over were employed, a significant drop from before the recession and the lowest since 1983.
That's especially worrisome to economists, who say a steady increase in those dropping out of the work force and not being counted in the unemployment rate is disguising just how bad the labor market really is."
http://money.cnn.com/2011/08/08/news/economy/unemployment_jobs/index.htm?hpt=hp_t2
Charls you might want to remember that if it wasn't for the republicans civil rights legislation would not have passed.
The American people evidently paid close attention to the debt ceiling debacle, as it is now being called. Obama's ratings have barely budged, but most polls show that less then 25 percent of Americans believe that any member of congress deserves to be re-elected. They understand that it is congress that holds the nation's checkbook. If we have a huge deficit, it is because congress voted for it, and allowed it to happen. The refusal of congress to compromise with the administration on this problem, is the main reason that Standard and Poor's downgraded the US credit rating.
Standard and Poor's also stated that congress needs to let the Bush tax cuts expire. They said these tax cuts are the main reason for our current problems. Spending cuts alone will not solve this problem. The time for the spending cuts should have been when these tax cuts were passed.
tweet,
I read the S&P statement on the downgrade, and a number of preliminary S&P statements - and I never saw them endorse any specific policy issues such as the Bush tax cuts. What I saw was they wanted to see a credible 10 year plan with $4 Trillion+ in deficit reduction.
If you did see them make this statement, can you provide a link?
Solution:
1. Let Bush Tax cuts expire. Period.
2. Drop corporate tax rates for 90% of businesses by completely eliminating all subsidies on the top
3. Accept that Wall Street shenanigans are not "innovation", regulate the hell out of them
4. Let in all the Guest Workers that want to be here and make them all pay taxes
5. Spend 1 Trillion on education and infrastructure over the next 5 years
6. Commit to social liberalism and transparent democracy
Liberals never have to back up their lies, you just have to take their word for it. All rating agencies made it clear that it is debt and deficits that are killing us, not tax cuts, not republicans, not the Tea Party. Obama and his democrat cronies are the designated kings of deficits.
"It's interesting for the Republican supporters to fail to realize, A Republican President set this course of decline in motion. The Republican Congress filibustered just about every fix President Obama came up with"
Wow, two fascist lies in a row. Compare the first six years of the Bush economy to the last two. Did Bush change? No, congress did. This entire disaster is on democrats watch. As a liberal above stated, it is congress that controls the economy. Or is it congress only when it's convenient for liberals?
Sorry, the filibuster lie was exposed the moment you shoved Obamacare down our throats. If you could pass that, you could pass anything you wanted.
You might read S&P's report rather than regurgitate Murdoch's last piece of propaganda.
Hey Mark Murray...go back to journalism school and learn to write will you please?
Or better, just go work for Obama's campaign staff and quit selling your BS as news or reporting.
The new defense of Obama's failed policies, his running up of debt is that it's because the president of the US doesn't have any power? What's wrong Mark, couldn't find anything to pin on Bush today?
You're a joke.
Great article Mark!
The Founding Father's were much shrewder then most give them credit for...
This is a good article.
Can't wait for Lieberlips to retire.
Yeas, Mark great article... if your idea of "great" is picking a few pieces of history to excuse the weakness of THIS president and the laughable hypocrisy of the "news" site that constantly repeats the rhetoric issued by the White House beginning an article with this sentence:
"One of the common misperceptions of American politics is that a great speech or a rhetorical call to arms can shape domestic policy."
Didn't you realize that you just highlighted your own uselessness? All the speeches, headlines, rhetoric, and propaganda isn't going to fix a damn thing.
President Obama hands down has been the most radical leftist in office at least since FDR.
The fact some Far Left zealot in the leftist NY Times wanted him to govern like Lenin means....nothing.
The moral of this story of course is now we must say Obama is a centrist....
Nope. He isnt.
Do you remember FDR, Bob? What about Richard Nixon? He was a pretty radical, leftist President, even though he was a Republican.
You have no context, Our perception of left and right is so skewed to the right these days that you could say Reagan was a commie. In fact large numbers of people have left the Republican party over the last few years, and even more have suggested that we should have completely nationalized our banking system. Obama is center right.
Yes, Kate, and Richard Nixon attempted to get universal healthcare insurance for Americans, like several Presidents before and since.
Excellent observations, Kate. To call President Obama a lefist is really a mis-statement. But those on the right, who have moved so far to the right that they live in caves, have no perspective by which to judge anything now.
Take Nixon, for example - what most of those on the right forget is how Nixon essentially nationalized the entire economy. He imposed wage and price controls on the nation in an arbitrary and ultimately unsuccessful manner. Many won't have known this, but the Big Mac came into being in order to escape the effects of Nixon's price controls - as essentially a new product entering the market, the Big Mac gave McDonald's a way to simply increase the price of its burgers. And that was not the only case of companies dodging Nixon's regulations.
President Obama's stimulus program did work, but it really wasn't as big as it needed to be, agree many economists. Now he is leading a nation in the face of the intransigence of the Tea Party movement, whose main agenda is to NOT govern. He has challenged that faction to act responsibly in the coming months so the U.S. can move forward.
Only the bitter die-hards who hate the President entirely, and follow an ideology of insanity will do their best to still block the way.
Spoken like a true fascist Bob.
Amy B.,
EVERY President since Lyndon Johnson have attempted some form of government healthcare. Even GW Bush, who supported the unfinanced Medicare Prescription Act and African AIDS protection played with the live wire.
But the insurance industry, where most of the profit in sickness and misery lies, cannot let go of their very lucrative purse strings, just like they don't want national regulation. McCain's transportable insurance would never have worked, due to weak state regulation of insurers and risk of non-payment to providers.
John, the Big Mac debuted in 1967. Nixon didn't take office until 1969. How do you account for that discrepancy in your post?
@Bob
In the USSR the Establishment was considered the RIGHT. Right and Left only deals with Establishments and NOT Political Persuasions.
The writers of the Declaration of Independence were considered Lefty Radicals by the Established Throne of King George.
Had the Revolutionists had thought as you do, there would never have been a United States of America.
We would be bowing to Queen Elisabeth, and rioting in England today!
Saint Reagan had one of the biggest scandals in US history happen during his term in office. Remember Iran-Contra anyone.
If the stimulus worked, where are the jobs? And why is unemployment over 9% (up to 25% in some areas)? No soup lines because people get checks.
MAW - "no soup lines"?
Homeless shelters were I live have been seeing record amounts of homeless for the past couple years and they are constantly pleading for donations. The soup lines are there, just like the tent cities.
And unemployment is worse than you believe.
Jobs: Worse than you think
"Last month, only 58.1% of Americans age 16 and over were employed, a significant drop from before the recession and the lowest since 1983.
That's especially worrisome to economists, who say a steady increase in those dropping out of the work force and not being counted in the unemployment rate is disguising just how bad the labor market really is."
http://money.cnn.com/2011/08/08/news/economy/unemployment_jobs/index.htm?hpt=hp_t2
Rankings by Liberals and Conservatives
Rank Liberals (n=190) Conservatives (n=50)
1
Abraham Lincoln
Abraham Lincoln
2
Franklin D. Roosevelt
Washington
3
Washington
Franklin D. Roosevelt
4
Jefferson
Jefferson
5
Theodore Roosevelt
Theodore Roosevelt
6
Wilson
Jackson
7
Jackson
Truman
8
Truman
Wilson
9
Lyndon B. Johnson
Eisenhower
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Historical_rankings_of_Presidents_of_the_United_States10
Even conservatives recognize that FDR was a great president. I'd put him in the top 5. He saved the nation on 2 fronts and changed society for the better. You are truly out of step with almost every reasonable intelligent person I have ever spoken with...
John Adams
John Adams
I'd go with FDR 1, Jefferson 2.
Put me down for being out of step, too, Dangerfield. Many other reasonably intelligent people, and you can include Nobel prize wining economist like Milton Friedman, think that FDR's policies unnecessarily extended and increased the severity of the depression.
The most corrupted Presidential Administrations in American history are:
U.S Grant, Warren Harding, Richard Nixon, and GW Bush....All Republicans of course!
So any criticism of Obama is quite laughable.
Republican Herbert Hoover cause the Great Depression and it took Democrat FDR 12 years to undo Hoovers Fiasco.
Obama has only been POTUS for 2-3/4 years and FDR didn't have home grown Tearrorists to contend with, and an Obstructionist GOP Congress.
http://mostcorrupt.com/Most-Corrupt-Administrations.html
From what I hear FDR was a great leader. He was able to soothe the countries fears and get the country to follow his lead. Seems like what we have now is a figure head that scares the crap out of people and leads from behind.
Wilberta, do you include the passage of Smoot-Hawley as one of FDR's accomplishments, or are you just echoing a bunch of democratic party talking points? Any economist worth his salt will tell you Smoot-Hawley GREATLY prolonged the depression.
Thomas Collet
Put me down for being out of step, too, Dangerfield.
_____________________________________________________________________________________
As you wish...
Do Nobel-Prize winners know best? The President has one...and then there's Nobel Prize wining economist Paul Krugman, and he has a SLIGHTLY different opinion. Historians, on the other hand UNIVERSALLY acknowledge Roosevelt's stature, as do those who lived through WWII and the Great Depression...
Washington, Lincoln, FDR...Three Greatest Presidents because they served during the 3 biggest crises in our history.
You believe your rewritten history books. FDR made the depression worse and longer by all his new regulations.
MAW,
No, Republican Senators, concerned about the rising national debt halted some of his programs and the Supreme Court declared others unconstitutional. On the other hand, the same Senators wer so smart as to block efforts to increase the size of the military and blocked new plane development. Right up to 1941.
I suppose you also supported the three great generals of WWII who suppressed the Bonus Army encampment for Hoover. Eisenhower was the administrative head, MacArthur commanded the troops and Patton was basically MacArthur's second in command. In the late 20's, the Republican Congress had voted WWI veterans a bonus, in the form of bonds PAYABLE ONLY IN 1946. When the veterans encamped on the National Mall in protest. Hoover sent MacArthur to persuade the veterans to leave. MacArthur used the persuasion of tanks and machine guns. The one-sided battle moved over to the site that would become the Pentagon where the Army burned the veteran's second camp. Remember, these were the men who fought who fought at Chateau-Thierry and Belleau Wood, being attacked by their own army. Even Hoover was horrified, but his handlers assured him it would all be okay.
But you would have preferred four more years of Hoover and the shadowy handlers who did all the real Presidenting.
When all the dust settles, FDR will go down as one of the worst presidents of all time. He is the one that corrupted the constitution by making the government an activist rather than hands off. The reason we talk about the depression is because his policies prolonged the suffering for decades.
Worse yet, he managed to convince many that government was the answer and could solve all problems. This has led to the huge expansion of government, and a huge expansion of corruption and cronyism, (because that's where the money is!).
Even today with screw up after screw up, scandal after scandal, failure after failure. liberals still believe government is the answer.
There is a place for government but it should be limited, not the be all end all of our lives. I'll repeat this until my fingers bleed:
The problem isn't that government let you down, the problem is you actually believed it wouldn't.
This coming from a career political speechwriter: Westen probably asked for all the criticism by writing a very sloppy piece, but I think political reporters are missing an important insight in his op-ed (which admittedly came very late in the piece.) Obama has a definition problem right now. The only people who seem to have absolute clarity about his goals and intentions are the haters on the far right who are convinced that he's a socialist/anti-colonialist/fascist/communist. Would more effective rhetorical framing have given us a bigger stimulus or a better health care bill or a better outcome to the budget standoff? In all likelihood no ... but at least then people would know what he was trying to accomplish with the stimulus, what exactly this massive HCR law without universal coverage is supposed to do and how this country can start dealing with our debt problem without throwing us into another recession. His lack of definition has consequences, it creates uncertainty, it leads to misunderstandings. All of these things feed back into the political system. So rhetoric does matter, it just takes a more roundabout way to enter the political bloodstream than the romanticists would have us believe.
Obama also has nothing to bargain with since all of the pork was cut out of the budget. Johnson used threats and other means to get what he wanted. When elected members of Congress are so selfish that they are willing to take down the nation they swore to defend , there is nothing a mere mortal can do. That's why we have suicide bombers. They do not care .They think they will succeed no matter what they do because of their echo chamber and hard liners who will vote for them no matter what they do. . Sadly that may be true.That is why Wisconsin is so important, not only there but for the entire nation.
Since unions are spending millions on propaganda, it wouldn't surprise me in the least if the fascists won in WI.
Funny how liberals want campaign finance reform, just not for them.
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Dan --
Thanks for the feedback; I enjoyed your take.
If you read Andrew Sullivan or Andrew Sprung, you see countless examples of these very speeches and rhetorical framing. But that message didn't break through (whether it was due to a more effective opposition, the high unemployment rate, our the shortcomings from my profession).
You are correct Obama -- right now -- has a definition problem. We'll see if he can correct it in the next 15 months.
Framing, like timing, is everything.
Mr. Murray,
It is unlikely you will see this, but I just wanted to throw in my dos centavos and say that I enjoyed you column also. I archived your column for later use. :o) Hope you don't mind, and yes I will use proper attribution.
Anybody can write, but it takes a really good writer to sculpt a succinct, lean message using appropriate words that relay a story. You have journalistic standards to conform to and you follow them.
I don't think your message was a partisan one. I think it is a sharp, descriptive piece that accurately describes our President's characteristics with a fidelity to accuracy. I feel Obama is anything but far left. Throughout his Presidency I have been frustrated by that.
Thanks again for a good piece.
This note and 50 cents'll get ya' a cup of coffee, but that's my sentiment.
Thanks for the kind words! And I can use a second cup of coffee right now. Thanks for reading and posting...
All of this so that the republicans could destroy a president...
The Republicans didn't try to destroy the President, the President is destroying himself. He does not have a clue as to what is going on in this country. If he does he is keeping it a secret. When he was running for President, the only experience and qualifications he had was a Junior Senator. Not very good qualifications are they for a President. His main object is to have this country become a Socialist country, and he is achieving his goal. Welcome to a Socialist country. I guess all of you who voted for him need someone to tell you how to run your lives. That way you do not have to make any decisions for yourself. Let the Government do it for you.
We don't want to destroy the President-we want to save our country. As Patricia said-he is doing an excellent job destroying himself. Why mess up the only thing he does so well? As for me, I will rely on myself. I don't need some overpaid socialist to hold my hand and tell me how to do and what to do with my life.
Fisher - Obama destroyed the nation so that Republicans could "destroy" him? And yet you still worship him?
Thank you, Mark! I read that opinion piece in the NYT today and I thought "The President is a story-teller? What are we, children?" It reminded me of that moment in the Clinton/Bush SR debate when a grown man got up and asked how the President would take care of him. Clinton is said to have scored points by "feeling the voter's pain," but Bush Sr. rolled his eyes, and I confess, I agreed with him.
Thank you for examining the role of the President in our government. I'm glad to see FR journalists thinking deeply and articulating these questions we all need to consider.
Memo to America: Timothy Geithner said Congress owns the credit rating because the Constitution gives Congress the power to tax and spend. The blame belongs to Congress, and Congress alone. The real issue is the debacle created by the TEA/GOP parties that was heard around the world. What should have been a "housekeeping chore" turned in the "Debt Crisis" created by the TEA/GOP parties. Anyone not believing this take a hard look at the repercussions heard around the world! Our politics has gotten too religious-minded.
Rudy...
BS! Are you trying to say that there would not have been the phony cuts if there had been a "clean" debt ceiling bill?
Just who are you trying to fool? Not me !!!!
Just Asking...
rudy: How so? Our politics has gotten too religious-minded. Are you kidding me? GMAFB! Obama OWNS this economy. He and the Progressive/Socialist Liberal Democrats.
"AnnieRich" we need to get you into republican rehab, the Koolaid was spiked too heavily for you. Too many labels, spare me the socialist faux news lines. If anything Obama is too centrist for his own good. Progressive thinking has nothing to do with his current agenda, he isn't that far off of GWB philosophically.
Nonsense. John Chambers os S&P cited the debt itself as the primary factor:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2023420/Standard--Poors-chief-John-Chambers-Dont-blame-US-credit-rating-downgrade.html
To blame the tea party for the downgrade is like blaming the police for citing you for DWI after you crash your car in someone's living room. Moronic.
AmyB,
Strange, I am an adult, but listen to stories of moral and ethical instruction every week; it's called CHURCH. Story telling has been the way of communicating messages, lessons, art; for centuries. But 24 hour news television and the internet has destroyed the art of speaking. I wonder if FDR or JFK could even get air-time today; they spoke English, not twittery tweets.
Stories lead to thought association. Association leads to ideas. And ideas can lead to action. Tweets lead to acceptance or rejection; with no thought required, or desired by the tweeters. Explain how Sarah Palin or Michelle Bachmann can be the darling of the Tea Party, in 140 characters or less. Now explain Credit Default Swaps, CDO's, the Medicare donut hole, Federal cash flow, the Federal debt ceiling, how Social Security really works, or what keeps us in Iraq and Afghanistan; all in 140 characters each. Good luck with that.
Oddly, the more news programming we receive, the less news we get. Headlines, with no detail, given each each fifteen minutes to one hour; the rest of the time is spent in commercials, cute internet feeds, and talking heads telling us what should have been said or done, rather than who actually said or did what. You literally can see more news coverage per hour on Jon Stewart and Colbert than on one hour of Fox or CNN.
Having reduced our discourse to 5-10 second sound-bites, we have reduced our politics to slogans and position statements rather than dialogue and action through compromise. And we used to understand that those willing to compromise and able to make deals were the ones with the power, the power to do things.
Jeff, there is more than one way to decrease the debt. You can only cut so much and then you have nothing left. Increased revenues (taxes) MUST be part of the solution. It was the tax cuts under Bush that contributed to this mess because we weren't taking in the money we needed to support two wars. I haven't read everything but I'm pretty sure that Mr. Chambers didn't say the debt reduction had to be using cuts only.
The Tea Party/GOP are the ONLY ones who are saying increases in taxes are off the table so I'd have to agree that it is the Tea Party/GOP's downgrade. Something that should have been routine (and was exceedingly so under Bush and Reagan) became difficult because of the Tea Party/GOP. Where were these folks when GWB was raising the debt ceiling and the debt?
Bill Marvell --- Nice post. Where are the great story tellers? If I had a million dollars I would solicit one to write a great compelling novel using the current "Parties" visions. A story that tells all the consequences and results of each of their "visions". Some have trouble thinking through propaganda and are content with slogans. Pitiful, in my opinion. They are the very ones that wouldn't read the book.
Rudy, you have no clue what you are talking about. Obama has spent and spent. S&P is being nice.
Bill Marvell-good post. I hate the fact that all we get are the sound bites. Where are the facts? All the rest is supposition.
The massive debt racked up over the past 3 years and the Democrats vote-buying "entitlements" are what drove the downgrade. Obama and his sheep own this.
"However, one of S&P's explicit criticisms of the compromise was that it didn't address the biggest drivers of the nation's debt -- Social Security and Medicare"
http://money.cnn.com/2011/08/07/news/international/sp_rating_budget_expert_analysis/index.htm?hpt=hp_t1
pjam09,
In Federal accounting, the debt of the past year's Deficit carries into the next calendar year, so a great part of that debt still belongs to GW. To compare apples to apples, Bill Clinton should be 1994-2002 and GW should be 2002-2010. Run those numbers.
Rudy, if congress owns the economy then, by definition, democrats owned the crash, not Bush. Right? You can't have it both ways Rudy. Democrats inherited 4.6% unemployment and a booming economy, in less than two years they completely destroyed that.
So Rudy, does congress own the economy or not?
Why do the Obamabots think that just ONE MORE fancy speech or bus tour will FIX EVERYTHING?
Obama's REAL PROBLEM is that ONCE YOU TAKE OFFICE voters JUDGE you by YOUR DEEDS not WORDS.
Isn't that why the Liar-in-Chief is such a FAILURE?
Personally, I look forward to the President's speeches, because it clears the airwaves of the incessant attacks by Republicans and right leaning pundits for twenty minutes or so. Twenty minutes of calm and reason, then, back to the right-wing demagoguery it is!
Personally, I was shocked that Obama didn't say the words........"jets for millionaires and billionaires" or "destroy Medicare as we know it" AGAIN. HAHA
This just goes to show that MICHELLE BACHMANN was ABSOLUTELY CORRECT as usual
The DEBT CEILING INCREASE "compromise" lacked MEANINGFUL SPENDING CUTS TODAY
She Properly Voted AGAINST the "Blessing of Continued Reckless Spending Through Election" (debt ceiling increase) Legislation cranking up the debt ceiling by $2.4 TRILLION so Geithner could BORROW OVER $300 BILLION the VERY DAY signed by Obama (over ONE TENTH of the NEW LIMIT IN A SINGLE DAY)
Good show Michelle
Obama sounds like a broken record. He has a broken record.
LEONA - "Personally, I was shocked that Obama didn't say the words........"jets for millionaires and billionaires" or "destroy Medicare as we know it""
He did say that the U.S. will always be AAA no matter what the rating agencies say... wasn't that pompous, foolish, and arrogant enough for you?
pjam09,
It was apparently good enough for those going out of stocks; they put their money into bonds.
If politics is perception then Obama better get on board and change the perception about himself. Obama got in because he seemed better than the alternative and not because he was in fact better. He also got in because the bad perceptions about Bush, and that he caused the economic crisis. Obama might go down like Carter, in that it will not be discovered until after the Presidency is over that he was the most intelligent President we had and he had good plans, but no realistic method of achieving those plans. However, Obama unlike Carter didn't realize the depth of the oppostion against him. Obama forgets he got under the radar of the Republicans while they were concentrating on thwarting Hilary. Did he really think this type of opposition wasnt' going to happen?
The MSM got Obama elected. And he is a figment of their imagination. He has no background; he has no past buddies who know him now; he has no college transcripts; he's got a false SS#; he's got no passport; his alias is Barry (what other Prez has ever had an alias) he has a BC that's nothing but fill in the blanks left blank...I mean. Who in the hell is he anyway?
The Democratic House passed, and President Obama signed, a Healthcare Reform Bill that shaves $130 billion of the federal deficit AND covers 95% of Americans with health insurance, an historic achievement.
I just love these "but, Obama, you haven't solved all our problems yet" little crybaby whiners. They are angry President Obama didn't beat Congress with a belt, forgetting it was the voters who gave him a Tea Party controlled House. Take some responsibility people!
How about......Obama just can't LEAD. He's a political sniper and has been bashing Repubs from day 1. That only engenders animosity and is NOT CALLED LEADERSHIP.
Obama is a democrat and had 2 house of Congress. He had a walk in the park. There are supposed to be checks and balances in the government, but Obama's idea is his way or the highway and he will twist the story to make it seem like the other side is wrong.
Amy - Don't forget that it was Obama in 2 years when this happens:
U.S. will pay for half of all health care costs by 2020 - July 28, 2011
"Total health care spending is expected to nearly double to $4.6 trillion in 2020, from $2.6 trillion in 2010.
Health care spending per capita is forecast to increase to $13,708 in 2020 from $8,327 in 2010, the report said.
By 2020, nearly 30 million additional people are expected to have health insurance because of reform.
Over the 10-year period, the report showed that the biggest annual jump in health care spending will happen in 2014 when health reform is fully implemented.
CMS estimates that in 2014 about 23 million uninsured consumers will gain access to health insurance, mainly through government programs such as Medicaid and through the creation of federal and state-funded health insurance exchanges.
As a result, the government expects Medicaid spending to surge 20% in 2014 and private health insurance spending to increase 9.4%.
Norwalk said the estimated sharp surge in Medicaid spending just in one year, is very concerning given that states are already struggling with their budgets.
As millions more gain access to health insurance, the government expects spending on prescription drugs, physician and hospital services to increase as well.
CMS expects prescription drug spending to jump by 10.7% in 2014 and to account for 11% of national health spending by 2020. Spending on physician and clinical services is forecast to rise by 8.9% by 2014, representing 19% of overall health care spending."
http://money.cnn.com/2011/07/28/news/economy/healthcare_spending_forecast/index.htm?source=cnn_bin&hpt=hp_bn3
P.S. Keep in mind these are even the government released numbers, the reality will be much worse. If any real recovery begins after Obama is gone in 2013, Obamacare will kill it in 2014.
Amy B your facts as usual are wrong. Here is a doctors take .
Obamacare facts, opinions
May 17, 2010 10:57 AM
By Dr. Richard A. Wiethoff
Some facts and opinions about Obamacare:
1: The Chief Actuary of Medicare, Richard Foster, on April 22 released the following analysis: Instead of lowering costs, Obamacare will increase spending by $311 billion through 2019, while federal medical spending will grow “by a net total of $251 billion.” He went on to say. “We show a negligible financial impact over the next 10 years for the other provisions intended to help control future health-care cost growth.” Oops.
2: The American Medical Association represents just 17 percent of American doctors. Their support of the health care bill was based upon the fact that they receive from $70 million to $100 million from a government-created monopoly. The monopoly is the AMA-administered coding system that every health care provider and hospital must use in order to get paid for their services. So much for “the high road” taken by the AMA.
3: Obamacare will cost $2.5 trillion over the first 10 years, and already entails $569 billion in new taxes. These will be taxes on everything from health insurance plans (though not on unions — they’ve been given a special exemption), medical devices, prescription drugs and even those evil capitalistic tanning salons.
4: Obamacare will create 159 new boards and commissions, the costs of which have been estimated to be around $60 billion over the next 10 years. These costs were conveniently left out of the cost estimates of the law before it was passed. The bureaucratic red tape and regulations which these new overseers will create will only further increase costs.
5: Many businesses that now provide health insurance benefits to their employees will opt out of the program and just pay the fine, because it will be far less expensive than providing those benefits for their employees.
6: That decision will leave these same employees uninsured, forcing them to enroll in Medicaid, the expenses of which must be paid by their states’ coffers. Coffers of which must be paid for by all the citizens of the states, not just “the rich.” (No new taxes?)
7: That same decision to opt out will be made by millions of young people who, rightfully, think that their chances of needing major health care are slim. A decision that will only further increase the burden on taxpayers.
8: Obamacare is still opposed by a majority of Americans. Eighty percent of people with existing health insurance like their plan and don’t want any major changes in their coverage. Under Obamacare, the premiums of all insurance plans are going to increase, many significantly.
9: The Obama administration has already confessed that there will be health care rationing under this law.
10: Obamacare is grossly underfunded and is destined to become insolvent, just like Social Security and Medicare. Numerous more sensible and fiscally responsible plans could be implemented, without further threatening our already dangerously anemic economy.
11: A quote from a writer who recently criticized me, stated, “The president inherited two wars, and the worst economic downturn since the Great Depression.” Precisely. So why choose now to force feed this ill-conceived, under-funded bureaucratic nightmare down the throats of the American people? Could it be that the real long-range objective is to force our nation into socialized medicine?
12: A pattern is evident in the actions of this administration. It’s one of slowly, but steadily, insinuating government control into every aspect of our lives. Socialism is an experiment that has failed in every country in which it’s been tried. If you don’t believe me, check out what’s transpiring in Europe right now. Yet Mr. Obama and his administration relentlessly march us along the same failed path that was taken by Greece and many other European countries, whose welfare-state economies are collapsing. If this continues, so will ours, and we will become just one more Greece, as in tragedy.
————
Dr. Richard A. Wiethoff is a Seymour resident.
I really like the message in this article. To me when government is weak things are working well and there is no need for discussion. When government is heavy and smothering citizens all the speech's have to come out and it is obviously not working.
Time to run the country like you have to as on an individual budget. No more moonpies and Disney vacations for awhile but it can be done.
I really hadn't thougt about it before but here's another point:
Administrative actions are already replacing legislative acts as the primary governance mechanism. Just examine the number of regulations emanating from the Environmental Protection Agency, Department of Justice, Department of Homeland Security, Department of Health and Human Services, etc, etc. Unelected officials (unaccountable to the citizenry) all around this land are producing laws we must abide by, or face some form of punishment, without ever coming under scrutiny by those we elect to represent our interests (and to protect and defend the constitution of these United States of America). By the way, governance is not government (as Americans know government). Governance is, very simply, rule.
You are the only one that seems to notice this.
How Can Liberals Govern with Morality when they have no Morals?
Great point.
@Liberals Lies
LiberalLies,
"How Can Liberals Govern with Morality when they have no Morals?"
The source of my morals consorted with hard-living tradesmen and fishermen, tax collectors, and women of the town. The only classes he could not stand were the hypocrites and false judges who condemned others while covering up their own crimes and sins. His name was Jesus Christ. He advised his true followers to shake the dust from their shoes when leaving the homes of the unbelievers. Consider yourself as shaken.
"he could not stand were the hypocrites and false judges who condemned others while covering up their own crimes and sins."
Does tweeting pics of your junk and then blaming someone for hacking your phone meet the criteria?
"House Majority Leader Eric Cantor said in a statement before Obama's speech that 'instead of bashing a rating agency, the President should finally recognize that our country faces an unsustainable debt situation and it will take real reforms, spending cuts and meaningful changes to fix it and get our economy going again'."
Â
Thank you, Mr.Cantor. Obama, meanwhile, is "fiddling while Rome burns"
The "unsustainable debt situation" will not be fixed without both spending cuts and revenue increases. Anyone who thinks it will is delusional.
"The unsustainable debt situation will not be fixed without both spending cuts and revenue increases. Anyone who thinks it will is delusional."
Soundbites like the one and only "Dirty" Harry Reid spews. Hey Heartlight3, are you sure you are not really Harry Reid ?
Leona,
Do you know what revenue means? Do you believe that everything is free?
If you believe this mess can be solved without higher taxes, do us all a favor, shut off the state and federally regulated utilities (that assured you would be served), stay off the public roads you don't want to pay for, stay off the publicly subsidized airlines, do not call the publicly funded police, fire department, or EMTs for help. And kill and butcher your own meat, not the Ag Department inspected stuff. And forget collecting Social Security, Medicare, or deposit insurance when the next bank tanks.
Heartlight, the more money you give this government, the more they spend. They won't use tax increases to pay off debt...they'll use it on new spending.
What we are looking at is several trillion dollars of lost wealth worldwide because we have a few eggheads who do not know the difference between political postions and governance. They failed to realize when they crossed the line from one to the other. Rep Joe Walsh (R) IL and Rep Michelle Bachman (R) MN both stated that there would be no consequences of not paying our bills. Boy were they wrong. Just the mention or thought of not paying the bills has sent the world into a downward spiral. The irony is that the very people that the "Tea Party" was determined to protect their tax cuts are the ones losing the most money. The Tea Party is a worldwide laughing stock and a worldwide threat.
Without the Tea Party, we would be heading for a $21 trillion deficit. We wouldn't even be considering lowering the debt. Obama was forced to consider the debt by the Tea Party because the Dems got a "shallacking" in 2010. Let's tell the truth.
Not really rick, but they sure have you moochers afraid. Keep it up conservatives, this country's future is depending on you.
Rick - In case you didn't notice the stock markets were doing much better when they were focused on "the thought of not paying our bills", when the distraction ended they went back to looking at the actual failed economy, the massive debt, and the unsustainable spending.... all courtesy of the Democrats.
We know you are terrifed of being replaced by the Tea Party and we know you have been instructed to "always label them extreme", but you could at least try to pay attention to reality and act like an adult.
 Interesting that Boner said he/they got 98% of what they wanted to increase the debt ceiling and S&P noted that spending custs WITHOUT revenue through ending the Bush tax cuts led them to the decision they made in downgrading our credit ratin.
Boehner/they now have 98% of the blame/responsibility for all ill effects of the downgrade!
Joe - someone has been lying to you. The unsustainable spending for vote buying "entitlements" and Obama's unwillingness to attempt to correct them was their chief concern:
"However, one of S&P's explicit criticisms of the compromise was that it didn't address the biggest drivers of the nation's debt -- Social Security and Medicare"
http://money.cnn.com/2011/08/07/news/international/sp_rating_budget_expert_analysis/index.htm?hpt=hp_t1
Obama and his yes-men posses 100% of the failure of this administration and the resulting consequences.
How about the Preesident W Bush, he's administration was enterely thor and for the Top 2% Richest and in favor of big Corporations, also never negociated with the opossision, he just governed with a Simple moyority of Votes 50+1 in the Congress, not with the Super 60% as is TODAY, on top of that, the policy at that time was: lbuying a brand new car, but, let the payments tor his grandkids.
That's the way to regurgitate the propaganda from bsnbc and other apologist media outlets. Now, work on your English! By the way, my wife and I work for corporations and love it. Money is great!!!
Estrada - Remember obama giving $8000 for new first time home buyers??? The plan was so devastating they had to stop and audit. All of the democrap welfare bums and illegal aliens had their kids and cousins sign up and the free cheese money was sent to all.
Remember - People for obama - Rev Wright, Al Sharpton, Marion Barry, OJ Simpson, Jesse Jackson, every person receiving welfare and idiots.
Don't forget about those that are currently unemployed and want to stay unemployed.
sonmanvb,
As someone who may have a job interview Wednesday or Thursday, the only thing that will give me greater pleasure than getting a job would be to hear that you lost yours. But I guess you can't piss daddy off enough to actually fire you. If unemployment rates were 2-3%, I could understand your point of view. But with government averages of 9.1-9.6% this year and a real rate running at 20+%, you are full of sh**. A diet of UI payments (1/3 or less of your working pay) should clean you out though. It's certainly done wonders for my bank account.
Good Luck!
Let us know how it goes...
It's Obama's economy. He's been President for a while now--didn't you notice?
I thought raising the debt ceiling would be the answer, hmmm. Let the fear mongering continue.
"no risk of losing our credit rating..." Tax cheat Timmy.
Bye bye liberalism.
This article is insightful, timely and frightening all at the same time. This is a time in need of great change. And the structure of government (at least at the Federal level) makes that extremely difficult.
A million jobs saved. You know liberals keep throwing that out there, yet, offer no proof of it. How does anyone measure a job changed as a new job. Obama really does have some magic cool-aid.
Hey Jim, I just snapped my fingers... and I saved a million jobs. Sweet! This is easy when you don't have to prove it. lol.
Keep snapping, it's not enough.
Jobs: Worse than you think
"Last month, only 58.1% of Americans age 16 and over were employed, a significant drop from before the recession and the lowest since 1983.
That's especially worrisome to economists, who say a steady increase in those dropping out of the work force and not being counted in the unemployment rate is disguising just how bad the labor market really is."
http://money.cnn.com/2011/08/08/news/economy/unemployment_jobs/index.htm?hpt=hp_t2
The Fact is Obama thought he could go to Washington and deal with reasonable people, he should have known better, when you have the Senate Minority leader stating that his only goal is to make you a one term president that should be a warning shot that they will do everything in their power to destroy you. I'd say at this point in time Obama has absolutely nothing to lose, I would go in front of both houses, give them a plan to rebuild the nations infrastructure, to extend the tax credits for middle class, and let the tax cuts for the rich expire, tell them were not playing chicken with the economy anymore, tell them we are pulling out even faster from Afghanistan and Iraq, and cutting the money we send to those countries and Pakistan in half, it needs to be used here at home, tell all employers they get a big tax break for hiring new employees and corporations if they created jobs here at home rather then sending them overseas they also will receive a big tax break! Then tell the trolls on the Right, either get on board or get the hell out of the way. Like I said he's got nothing to lose now!
skinflute -That sounds like utopia. Obama is a failed community organizer that was elected by idiots. He couldn't lead his way out of a line. And you are correct, he has absolutely nothing to lose, he is now the biggest most qualified loser the world has EVER known.
We should have known that Liberals throughout the world were drunk on the Obama kool aid when he was given a Nobel Peace Prize ( for doing nothing) and then Obama turns out to be PRO war ( i.e. 3 wars) . What is there left to uncover about Obama that hasn't already been realized as just a facade?
Obama had 2 houses of Congress majority democrat or didn't you know.
sfilutz - he promised many of these things during his campaign (remember Hope and Change?) and even with both houses of congress he couldn't get it done. Why? He's not a leader, he's a rank amateur and unprepared to deal with the vipers in DC. He's well on his way to ousting Jimmy Carter as the 'worst president ever'... Pretty speeches won't make it any more - we are in real trouble now. i don't care what party you identify with, sniping at each other is a waste of time. congress needs to be cleaned out and we need to elect leaders that do what they say they will. hold them accountable and if they don't get it done, vote them out. time for term limits and politics as a service to the country, as it was intended to be...
Wow sounds so impressive and powerful
Committee:
Individuals who can do nothing individually and sit to decide that nothing can be done together and now there are 12 of them and super too.
HUMMMM
Let see what kind of quick fix they come up this time.
When they make the "Obama Movie" , I think Joan Rivers should play Nancy Pelosi. They look alike. Charlie Sheen can be Anthony Weiner. Ummmmm.........who can play Debbie Wasserman BULL Schultz??
Leona,
I guess that you have run out of insightful and meaningful dialogue. Casting for the Obama movie? You must have been inspired by that self-paid, self-promoting piece of crap created for Sarah Palin. The only good thing I can say about that trash is that it provided a few jobs for a few weeks, but nothing of substance.
Hey Bill, lighten up. I can tell you're not in the movie business.
Leona,
Neither was the toadie that made the Palin pic. Although I hear the porn flick got reasomable reviews.
Yea Bill, that's "what you heard"....sure.
pjam09,
No, I've not seen it. It's still on pay-per-view.