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Subscribe to RSSWAUKEE, IA –- Republican presidential candidate Michele Bachmann yesterday attended a church here in Iowa, where the pastor called homosexuality "immoral" and "unnatural," and later showed a testimonial video from a man who claimed to have been gay before having a conversation with God.
Before the sermon at Point of Grace Church -- a non-denominational congregation near Des Moines -- Bachmann stood with her husband, Marcus Bachmann, before a crowd of about 100 people, clutching her personal copy of the Bible.
“This is a time that we need to be encouraged this week, not discouraged,” she said, referencing Friday night’s credit downgrade and Saturday’s news about the Navy SEALs killed in Afghanistan.
“Whatever is pure, whatever is lovely,” Bachmann said, reading from the book of Philippians, “think well on these things.”
The reading drew cheers. Pastor Jeff Mullen, standing next to Bachmann, took her Bible his hand. “There are some candidates who start running, and have this come-to-Jesus moment,” he said. "What I love about this Bible,” he said, “is how well it's used.”
Mullen offered a prayer honoring democracy. “We have a nation where people can still rise up and speak their voice, and say, ‘This is what I believe.’”
When Bachmann and her husband returned to their seats, Mullen began a half-hour presentation on his church's beliefs. Reading verses from the Bible to support his case, Mullen said, "We inherently know that homosexual behavior is immoral and unnatural."
“God shows his anger from heaven against all sinful, wicked people, who suppress the truth by their wickedness,” Mullen said, reading from the book of Romans.
Mullen’s sermon concluded with video testimonial from a man named Adam Hood, who claims to have been gay before experiencing a conversation with God. "I am so happy God has given me natural affection for a woman," Hood said in the video, adding that his wife is nine months pregnant.
"We need to have compassion for people that are bound by that sin," Hood added. "And it is a sin. Call a spade a spade."
The Bachmanns remained in the church for the duration of the service, and afterward posed for a picture with Pastor Mullen and his family.
In an interview with NBC News, Mullen called his sermon on homosexuality “a bedrock, just a Biblical truth we’ve taught over the years.”
“It just so happens they were here today,” Mullen said of the Bachmanns. “And we were teaching on both marriage and homosexuality.”
The Bachmann campaign released this statement on Mullen's sermon: "Michele was an invited guest, she always welcomes the opportunity to meet with parishioners."
The Point of Grace Church service was the second church event Michele Bachmann attended on Sunday. Earlier, they visited the Des Moines First Church of the Nazarene, where the presidential candidate discussed the origins of her faith and political life.
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HOLY COW!
You mean to tell me she's divorcing Marcus? lol
I don't blame you patHuntingtonNY, the woman belongs in a psych ward instead of running for President. There are others who should join her, Perry, Santorum, Gingrich, Palin, Pawlenty, and the list goes on.
Feisty, it was quite a weekend for the religious right, wasn't it?
The hypocritical Bachmann family, that charming collation of people who denounce government programs while depositing Federal checks, participating in a service that refutes Christ's "law of love," and dear ole Gov. Rick Perry in Texas headlining a day of prayer before a small crowd in a cavernous (mostly empty) football stadium.
What amazing gall such people have, aspiring to leadership of a secular nation.
All of sudden the "media" is concerned about what's said in the churches presidential candidates attend. That's a switch from 4 years ago. The "media" didn't much care about it back then.
Which media? I seem to recall Fox being all over it then.
"Fox being all over it then" AM? What exactly is "it"? I never mentioned any names. Did you have someone in mind?
Studies and research has proven that FOX Noise viewers aren't the brightest bulbs in the package.
You know dear, I have read your asinine comments for far too long, not to point out this one takes the prize!
You & the NJ nut job might want to think about a vacation or some time away for a little while - the two of you no longer come across as simply crazy...
YOU"RE CERTIFIABLE!
This are the kind of extreme illiterate politicians this country should be very wary of. The same ......... who said the country should not raise the debt ceiling at any cost but went all out over the weekend to accuse Obama as the cause of credit rating downgrade.
The same ....... that will preach Government is bad for you and good for her and her family. Perhaps, in the bible they read, there's no mention of Love thy neighbor as thy self or thou shall not judge.
I guess I errored - the "media" did give Romney's religion a pretty thorough going over in 2008.
JoAnnaSmith1
"All of sudden the "media" is concerned about what's said in the churches presidential candidates attend. That's a switch from 4 years ago. The "media" didn't much care about it back then."
Bullsh!t, Smiff. "All of a sudden"??
Hell, I can turn on AM radio and STILL hear Reverend Wright's name being bandied about. What the hell are you talking about- All of a sudden???
One thing that stands out in Bachmann is the vacant, brainwashed look in her eyes; the look you see in the eyes of cult followers. I may disagree with Sarah Palin's conservative views, her "red meat" tossing without regard to consequences but she does not have that brainwashed look. If one looks at Palin's politics pre-VP run with McCain, there was a centrist and reasonable governing side; she did some good things for Alaska. Bachmann is dangerous for democracy. Bachmann believes only she and her true believers are right--that's a dangerous road to travel down.
JoAnnaSmith1
"I guess I errored - the "media" did give Romney's religion a pretty thorough going over in 2008."
And, I guess you 'errored' when you opened your browser and went to MSNBC's First Read site, instead of the Fox Forums.
(again)
"Whatever is pure, whatever is lovely," Bachmann said, reading from the book of Philippians, "think well on these things." ...
I wonder what Marcus' mind went wondering to when she said that.
Yes, yes, yes. Whenever I'm in need of a spirituality pick-me-up, I go to a house of worship to find out who I should hate.
LoL David -- I gave that up after I graduated from high school.
I had had enough hatred to last me through eternity.
I think the woman should get her Christian priorities checked. Instead of homosexuality she should be condemning the top 2% who control the 85% of the wealth in this country while the rest gets by controlling 15%. It is shameful considering that the top 2% have been represented and protected by the policy makers. If she was such a Christian she would not be going against the needy.
Both Bachmann's simply have an unhealthy obsession with homosexuality.
Hummmmm, I wonder if Bachmann doth protest too loudly? Perhaps there's someone within her our family tree that she finds difficult to embrace, and/or to even acknowledge. Too many GOPee'ers claim the title of supporting their rendition of "Family Values", and yet after some outside discovery, it turns out that they were their own worst enemy. I wonder.......
words to Bachmann... "I doth think you protest too much"
Give me a break.. I don't like Bachmann, but there are millions of Christian evangelicals who will always believe homosexuality is a sin and unnatural. There is their religion and they are free to believe this.
I am also fairly certain that if you pinned Obama down to what he believes, as a Christian he would admit the same thing... if you could pin him down on the question.
This should NOT be an issue as long as these candidates are willing to admit that their religion will not cause them to discriminate to others based on how they live their life.
For instance Ron Paul, as a Christian, also believes marriage as a spiritual union and personally believes marriage to be man and woman only. HOWEVER, he defends the rights of gays to live as they want and to "marry" in a church that would recognize this. because Paul wants the government out of marriage period.
This is the REAL definition TOLERANCE... Tolerance does not mean we all think the same way... but that we are tolerable toward others beliefs and views and respect their differences.
So what's next -- requiring all Gay and Lesbian persons to wear the Pink Triangle? This Bachmann yahoo scares the crap out of me!
I give her one thing she sticks to what she believes in even though it is off the wall and behind the times.
It is actions like these which will leave her behind in the polls and deliver her as yet another washed up presidential wanna be.
The pastor said she just happened to be there.
Bachmann's people said she was an invited guest.
Someone's lying.
BIO of one of the Noted Tea Party House Representatives......AMERICA IS SCREWED NOW & FUTURE GENERATIONS.
Michele Bachmann Alumni of ORU graduated the same year ORU "lost" it's Law Accreditation.
Maybe Michele Bachmann's historical inaccuracies are insignificant to her because such minor facts pale in the shadow of her divine mission.
After all, Bachmann graduated from Oral Roberts Law School, which eventually closed and transferred its library to Pat Robertson's Regent Law School. The Regent Law School Review provides an insight into Bachmann's view on law - and history: "Regent University Law Review seeks to present academically excellent scholarship on relevant issues facing the legal community today from the perspective of a historic Christian worldview. It is committed to a jurisprudence based upon a Higher Law; that is, law based upon the Law of God."
That is why Bachmann, Palin, and others seem to make whatever they want of the Constitution, our legal system and legal precedent. The foundation for the US rule of law in their minds is secondary to whatever might be their interpretation of a "higher law."
Of course, that puts Bachmann in pretty divinely inspired company. According to the Regent Law Review, "Past contributors include United States Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas, Attorney General John D. Ashcroft, Judge Edith H. Jones, Attorney General Edwin Meese III, Robert P. George, George Allen, Charles W. Colson, Charles E. Rice, Phillip E. Johnson, David Barton, Nancy R. Pearcey, and James Bopp."
According to Christian extremists such as Bachmann, the Good Lord can't be bothered with facts. "He's" too busy putting the final touches on Armageddon
@JoAnnaSmith1 how does it feel to be dumb - Rev Wright, Rev Wright,Rev Wright,Rev Wright,Rev Wright,Rev Wright,Rev Wright,Rev Wright,Rev Wright,Rev Wright,Rev Wright,
No, they are NOT free to believe such nonsense. It is not factual and it informs their behaviors and politics in a way which results in oppression and harm to other individuals. They are no more free to believe and promote that homosexuals are an abomination in their god's eyes than the KKK is allowed to believe that it's ok to lynch Blacks or for pedophiles to believe that relationships with children do not cause harm.It is hate speech plain and simple.
Their beliefs are toxic and responsible for an incredible amount to damage both present day and historically. If I ever personally heard Bachman spout her hate speech in front of me I would punch her in the mouth.
No other 'sin' in these people's bibles gets as much attention as homosexuality. Think this preacher has ever spent a whole sermon on why it's "immoral and unnatural" to work on the sabbath? Why doesn't hubby Bachman has a treatment center to help you recover from that 'abomination'.
Oh...that's right...you're not focusing on that one because you're not covering up the fact that you are latent sabbath workers because christians want to be able to make money 7 days a week.
They are free to believe whatever they like. Just as you are free to believe it is ok to punch people in the mouth when they says things you don't like. You are free to believe it's ok to lynch anyone as long as you don't lynch anyone... that is stepping over the rights of someone else. In America people are free to think hateful thoughts or "stupid" thoughts. You are even free to do "stupid" things as long as it does not harm or infringe on the rights of another American.
You are just as fanatical about your beliefs it is clear.
She has to get her core constituents behind her. Those are homophobic evangelicals who decide what OTHERS should do - they are exempt, conveniently forgetting, "HE without sin, cast the first stone." as well as dozens of Leviticus directives they conveniently ignore in their own "worship of God" which would have them headed to Hell faster than anyone they condemn.
Personally, I wouldn't want to live in "Heaven" for eternity with these jokers - that's HELL in anyone's book.
Only other people have the capacity to lie. They are only lying when they get caught. Ask Jimmy Swaggart.
The hypocrisy never ends. Her husband is absolutely flaming - one doesn't need to have an acute sense of gay-dar to notice the obvious.
Marcus would make a fine First Lady though.
Biblicaly speaking, although homosexuality is a sin, it is not even listed in the top 6 six sins God hates the most. Pride and Gossip are actually worse.. although all sin carries the same penalty to the soul... death.
I don't have a problem with a preacher stating they believe this to be a sin, but I recommend American preachers focus more on the sins of Christians and worry less about the sins of non-believers while remember non-believers are under no obligation to follow the Bible.
As for the Sabbath, Christians are governed not by the "old law" or "old testament" but the new. Even still, most Christians in America are gentiles for which Jewish laws never applied.
And her stupid thoughts and actions actually harm people...which was my point.
If she kept the thoughts in her head and didn't broadcast through her incessant propaganda against gay/human rights, THEN she might be free to think them. Otherwise she is a menace.
Get a grip.
If you mean by voting for the patriot act then I agree... but I don't believe she has had any vote or say in any legalisation relating to the rights of homosexuals.
You need to do some googling...she's been very involved in anti-gay legislating.
I posted this last month;
Given Michelle & Marcus Bachmann’s proclivity for wearing their anti-gay views on their sleeves,
while bilking Medicaid under the premise that they can ‘pray the gay’ away!
Now you do the basic math here and this equals almost 5 teenagers per year in her district.
As an elected official WHAT is she doing to address this epidemic? Besides absolutely NOTHING!
If this isn’t outrageous enough:
I don’t care which side of the aisle you sit on – kids are dying while Michele & Marcus continue DENYING!
Mr. Rogers - "As for the Sabbath, Christians are governed not by the "old law" or "old testament" but the new. Even still, most Christians in America are gentiles for which Jewish laws never applied."
If that's the case then homosexuality is still no more of a sin than working on the sabbath. There are just as many specific callouts to both in the old testament and just as many minor references to both in the new testament.
It still points out the ridiculous nature of picking one sin over another to condemn.
From what I read the next president needs to be a poor atheist gay black female in the country illegally from Mexico.
Let's be clear, even in the old Testament the Jewish laws did not apply to anyone but the Jews. There is no commandment in the New Testament for gentiles to obey the Sabbath and a case can be made that Christian Jews today are under no obligation to keep the Sabbath... although there is some debate to that.
Homosexuality is still declared a sin in the New Testament quite clearly although it is directed toward Christian churches not at non-believers or for politics.
To some extent I agree in that there are far more sins of lust, greed, pride, and gossip in American Christian churches than homosexuality. If they are to preach against homosexuals they should do so in the context of their own church or Christianity as again, non-believers are under no obligation to follow the Bible.
Culheath (see above): typical "fascist" dogmatic ultra-liberal spew. This person is just as bad as any fundamentalist.
And guess what? I'm pretty liberal, but I believe in freedom of thought and of conscience, and the free and open exchange of ideas, and the U.S. Constitution supports this.
You stupid secularist motherf_ckers need to get over using the term "hate speech". You have no regard (or, perhaps, even an idea) of the history of belief and philosophy which have informed the development of Western civilization. Believe it or not, human history did not begin in the 18th century.
And guess what, again? I'm agnostic.
Well, Mrs. Bachmann is not my cup of tea (no pun intended ) and she has a right to her beliefs and to go to whatever church she prefers, but this was inappropriate , to say the least. Not sure what the goal was. Whoever booked her for this event didn't do her any favors and she didn't do herself any, either.
You know, you hear all the time about conservative gay men trying to cover up their homosexuality by preaching against it and protesting too loudly. You have to admit, it's pretty impressive when a gay man can get his wife to do it for him.
As was already mentioned in this thread....What do you suppose is a more serious concern for this country, two people of the same sex loving each other or the secretive, illegal, immoral and obscene amount of control "the power elite" has over the decisions that are being made for this country?
How can you compare gay marriage as being on the same list of problems that face this country to corrupt politicians, greedy corporations controlling these politicians, powerful men behind closed doors making decisions that benefit only themselves while leaving this country in ruins?
Whether you approve of homosexuality or not, that's not the thing that is going to ruin this country, as they want you to believe. Morality? You want to talk about morality? Look what is being done to the people of this country. This country is near the point of no return, and I don't really think the gays are the one's responsible.
I don't care if you are a democrat or republican, gay or straight, these issues affect ALL of us! Whether we have Obama or Bush in charge, they are about as in charge of this country as the Queen of England in that country.
I've said it many times here, don't fall into the red vs. blue trap. Don't be sucked into "Our team's good, their team is evil" That is all just a distraction that the politicians and rich corporations create to keep you from focusing on the real enemies of this country!
The only chance we have of saving this country is stop all the partisan bickering and come together as a nation to challenge the status quo of the rich getting richer while the poor and middle class continue to suffer and pay the price.
Why? She looks manly enough for him.
RedDude,
BS...maybe you would have a clue about my intolerance of intolerance from the likes of these bigots if you had a relative, a lover or a really good friend beat so bad by these programmed a-holes that they died. I simply don't put up with their garbage (or your armchair opinions) anymore. I operate in the real world not by some liberal philosophy even though I am a liberal.
You're also highly assumptive and don't have a clue about my education level or what life experiences have brought me to a place where I just don't take crap from bigots like Bachmann. Her type of thinking kills people and I refuse to give that sort of thing any quarter whatsoever.
It IS hate speech period and I hold everyone accountable who spreads it.
You apparently don't believe in or support the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.
Enjoy all of the ignorant PC buzzwords and phrases, along with your shrillness and hysteria.
People like you truly make me sick.
May I pass you a bowl? And then you can go off in the corner and spew your hatred into said bowl.
P.S. Thoughts do not kill people, and for that matter, neither do words.
If you believe that they do, you believe in some kind of magic that I haven't had the opportunity to observe.
Thoughts and words do kill people - after all, what was the Nazi's final solution but thoughts and words. Communist ideology a la Mao and Stalin - again just words and thoughts.
The Spanish inquisition - again, words and thoughts.
I do not believe that you are stupid, merely disingenuous
This person thinks illegal violence is okay if s/he's the one doing it.
Culheath (are you female or male?):

Mr Rogers...let's be clear...you reasoning for why Christians don't have to follow the sabbath, but they still have to follow the edict against homosexuality is that the sabbath rules are old testament whereas the edict against homosexuality is both old and new treatment, and since the old testament applies to Jews and not Christians therefore Christians aren't held to old testament laws.
1. Are you telling me that there is no mention of keeping the sabbath in the new testament?! Then why is Chick Fil A closed on sunday?!
2. I am glad to know that Christians don't have to follow the rules of the old testament.
3. I have never heard of a "Christian Jew" as you mention.
4. Sounds like you're bending the bible to meet what you want to hear and more importantly you sou d like you're trying to get off on a technicality.
That's absurd. Ever hear of slander? Ever hear of hate speech? Where do you think those concepts come from? Do you understand how rhetoric gets turned into propaganda?
People who use rhetorical propaganda are doing so with a conscious intent to shape the emotional climate or environment to which a listener is expected to respond. Using rhetoric as propaganda is a conscious act intended to cause a conscious response.
And that response is intended to be active, not passive. WWII Propaganda against the Jews was meant foment hate and fear based action against Jews, not a passive discomfort and dislike.
Phrases like "Tiller the Baby Killer" are an implicit, if not explicit, call to action . It was a means of demonizing Dr Tiller, reducing him to non-human status just as national propaganda does to its enemies, making an assault on him more likely and justified.
The fact that Bachmann and her ilk constantly labels homosexuals "perverts" or "abominations" is the same thing. Its an emotional appeal using non-rational Biblical authority to make homosexuals less than human and "unworthy" in the eyes of her God. The Biblical penalty for this sort of thing is of course death. She doesn't have to explicitly call for the death or punishment of homosexuals for this to be implicitly inferred by the text itself.
So that she and her fellow bigots can claim that they have never called for violence against gays. But in fact, that is exactly what their propaganda calls for because the authoritative basis of his rhetoric (the Bible) does it for them...the idea gets planted and made plausible. She is simply hiding behind God's skirts as it were and creating a climate wherein homosexuals are more likely to be assaulted because it is emotionally justified; especially to those who are already predisposed to believe in and shape their real world actions according to Biblical authority.
For that, she is culpable for the violence that flows from her propaganda. I lived it. Consider my punch to her mouth should I personally hear her spreading that propaganda a taste of reality biting back.
Believe it or not, religious speech, such as that to which you refer, is protected by the First Amendment. Sue her, try to bring a class action suit, and see how far you get.
I suspect that you, and others, simply do not comprehend the nature of religious conviction. It is as alien to you as homosexuality is to them. The use of the terms "hate speech" and "bigot", in this context, demonstrate this perfectly.
No more so than other form of speech.
Hate speech legally defined:
Get it? Bigotry doesn't get a pass because it has religion as its basis.
It's still clear that you have NO idea what you're talking about.
Bigoted speech is protected by the First Amendment. Don't believe me? Ask a Constitutional law professor.
And what you presented isn't a "legal" definition of hate speech.
If you think it is, please cite the statute and your source.
I'm gonna back off now. I think I've made my point.
The only point you have made is that you don't understand what hate speech is and the necessity for laws barring it.
If any of those people commits any crime against their targets, it will be considered a hate crime.
To the degree that you want to ban what you consider to be hate speech, parts of the First Amendment would be need to repealed or modified, which is not something that is easily or frequently done. That is the Constitutional, legal, and societal reality in the U.S.
Hate speech legislation exists and required no modification of the first amendment, nor did the restriction on slander, nor the barring of inflammatory speech like yelling fire in a crowded theater. All of these prohibitions on speech have in common the concept of "harm caused". It is not difficult to understand that some homosexual individuals and homosexuals as a group have been seriously harmed by some Christians who propagandize their belief in a Biblical censure of homosexuality.
There has been a reluctance and an inertia to label and act upon such religiously based hate speech because of the historical momentum that religion has in the culture, but just as the culture as a whole has progressed toward a greater tolerance and acceptance of the equal rights of homosexuals, so too will the beliefs of people such as Bachmann become seen as simple bigotry and falling subject to hate speech legislation.
Until then there are clenched fists waiting in the wings ready in self defense.
 I HATE this "woman" with every ounce of my gay blood!Â
I'm not fond of her either, with every ounce of my heterosexual blood.
Bob says I'm envious. Believe me, I'm not.
Bigotry is neither.
Philippians 4:8
Whatever is true, whatever is noble, whatever is right, whatever is pure, whatever is lovely, whatever is admirable--if anything is excellent or praiseworthy--think about such things.
Perhaps the Evangelical right and our government leaders could try to live by these words rather than mouth them at public prayer services.
...and the market is making a comeback at mid day..down 274
Ira
It looks terrible at initial glance but I think am one of the very few who strongly belief the US is still waxing strong. What we need to check is the solvency of these major corporation and from all indication they're strong.
The problem are the policies and politics coming out of Washington and this must be addressed.
Pius Emeka Nebo:
I wrote this post in response to David Walker:
I agree..
Look at corporate balance sheets...in good shape. There is more excess cash...idle cash...almost $2 trillion sitting on the books of the major corporations.
Despite the weak economic growth, corporate PROFITS, not losses are very respectable.
This market is not being priced for a recession and this in not a correction.
We...the royal we...keep shooting ourselves in the foot and wondering why things are not better.
If the investment public has doubts about our willingness to re-pay our debt...not our ability to pay...this is the result.
Thank you Pat_NY - I fucing hate her too!
She will get my vote. Your homosexual opinion is irrelevant since you are 44 times more likely to die of AIDS than the general population. It would be awfully hard to get a President that will have the country in worse shape than it is now. What exactly is wrong with promulgating fiscal responsibility and disagreeing with your aberrant sexual preferences? It is called free speech and is guaranteed by the Bill of Rights that also allows you to spew forth your venom.
Oh, you mean like the fiscal responsibility to take care of unwanted or needy children? How about educating all of them equally? Oh, that's right, the children have to suffer for their parents' mistakes! I forgot....
As far as aberrant sexual behavior, its only truly aberrant if you force yourself to have sex with someone you are not attracted to.
Stephace,
Read an anatomy coloring book. It's not that hard to figure out. As far as children are concerned, you can take care of all their needs without running trillions of dollars into the red.
@yzf600r
Spoken like a true right wing conservative hate monger. You need to evolve about 2 centuries before you can post comments that won't embarrass yourself.
The sad part is that there are so may people that hold your opinion, it's no wonder this country is in such the sorry shape it is. Why not concern yourself over the REAL issues instead of worrying about two guys being in love with each other.
BTW, I'm not gay, I don't really understand the gay lifestyle, but I certainly know that it doesn't deserve to be given this much concern when there is corruption, violence, greed and hatred to deal with. If gay marriage is truly a threat to the morality of this country, then it's probably about 200th on the list of issues that are more likely to cause the United States to fail.
patHuntingtonNY
I'm not gay. But trust me, you're not alone. Dominion Theology is something to be feared and hated in a free society.
@Devavo
That is funny to be called a hate monger since Pat and scatheist are the ones on this thread that freely state they do hate anyone. I never did. But that is ok. Go ahead and keep projecting your own idiocy on those that don't agree with you.
@yzf600r
It's called reading between the lines. Your words make it clear that you don't think much of gays and would not care if they all died. If that's not hate then it's certainly a lack of compassion and humanity. Either way keep on projecting your own dark bigotry and let people draw their own conclusions.
I'm shocked. SHOCKED.
Well....maybe not.
I sure hope Bachman is the GOP nominee. She's a Tea Party hero and a general election light weight.
Hate is the GOP's best friend.
It's their only friend al91206.
Hey First Read..
The Dow is down 330.
Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac have also been downgraded to AA+
We get another Bachmann story..
How about something on how the downgrade affects all of us and the impact on the market.
Yeah, it's geeky and boring but it s certainly more relevant than Bachmann.
This is not a dumbed down crowd.
They got off easy.
This "situation" is quickly getting out of control from the government. If there is a leader in DC, he/she better step up, and soon.
We don't need a rational person as president.
We need someone like Bachmann who's church stills thinks that gay is catching. Other comparable beliefs, the earth is flat and the sun rotates around the earth. Just how far back are the tea-partiers trying to take our country?
My appologies to every one. Iowans are not as hateful as this pastor and this sham politician make us out to be. Even if she wins the Iowa Caucus, it is not a true reflection on the state - it's just the manifestation of the beliefs of those who are blinded by their ignorance and hatred.
Ditto that arc-550134, from another Iowan. Sadly, it is the hateful and outrageous who get the most attention.
It's awful when a state is seen as being represented by one person. I know that feeling - I'm a Texan. I know that there are a majority of Iowans who are good, decent, and open-minded. Please know that there are almost ;-) a majority of Texans who do not support Perry and his kind, either.
arc, Jody, and Judy, I totally get it. I love in Alabama...nuff said.
August-2011 - Where is your Congress Represntative - while your 401K tanks
Over the three-week recess, 81 members — 55 Republicans and 26 Democrats — will take a trip to the Jewish state, the Jerusalem Post reported Monday. That breaks down to about 20 percent of the House who will spend a week of their August break in Israel
Likely on the taxpayer dime, too.
I hope it includes a trip to Gaza.
The churches have a lot of very strange ideas about sex in general. I wonder how many of these scriptures the Bachmanns and those in attendance follow.
If it is discovered that a bride is not a virgin, the Bible demands that she be executed by stoning immediately.
If a married person has sex with someone else's husband or wife, the Bible commands that both adulterers be stoned to death.
Divorce is strictly forbidden in both Testaments, as is remarriage of anyone who has been divorced.
The Bible forbids a married couple from having sexual intercourse during a woman's period. If they disobey, both shall be executed.
If a man dies childless, his widow is ordered by biblical law to have intercourse with each of his brothers in turn until she bears her deceased husband a male heir.
If a man gets into a fight with another man and his wife seeks to rescue her husband by grabbing the enemy's genitals, her hand shall be cut off and no pity shall be shown her."
Fun group we have here.
The question is, do we want someone like Bachmann as President? However, she will get the dumbass vote.
I just love those quotes and how it seems that the Christians like to pick and choose what verses should be accepted as fact and what ones should not. The more you read the bible the closer to sharia law it is. Let's face it, all the religions in the middle east are all the same just with different stories.
I wish someone would start a church that worshipped the Greek Gods again. At least the stories are more interesting.
...and I wish people would understand why the Founding Fathers did not incorporate an Established Church of America, like they have in England.
There point was to leave that crap behind. To establish United States free from ant kind of Religious Tyranny. Because all Religions are Tyrannical!
Michele Bachmann is living proof of a tyrannical personality.
Synonyms
1. despotism, absolutism, dictatorship.
All of which has nothing to do with...... FREE WILL!
Well, that's not too surprising, because Mohammed was strongly influenced by Judaism and the books that became parts of the Old Testament and the Torah. Same sort of intolerant bloodthirsty vengeance.
It strikes me odd that she is always talking about gay sex and master's and slaves ...then seeing the dancing bear she is married to ...and the pray away the gay ...just isn't working ...The poor dear is demented ! All those anti American statements she makes about the citizens of the USA.... I wounder if she is a" dominatrix" ? And just can't come to grips with it .. There is defiantly something going on here !
No kidding, homosexuality exists in a minority of the population, it only affects those who are oriented that way, what is it with this obsession Bachmann has? I guess, every right-winger needs a scape goat, if it isn't blacks, it's immigrants, Jews, Arabs, or gay people. They have to pick on somebody.
Now, now. Just because there are people who have the courage to stand up to the PC mantra of anything goes (including disgusting activities between those of the same sex), doesn't mean you have to hate them. Where is your liberal " everyones opinion is equal " stance? Where is you "openess"? Where is your "cultural diversity'? Right, you are just as, if not more; closed minded, hypocrital, and judgemental as those who dare oppose your activities. Only difference is, the pastor correctly interpreted the scriptures....like it or not.
What about "disgusting activities" between people of the opposite sex? And Rosco, see vwterry's comments. Why don't they mention those passages of scripture?
The Pastor doesn't speak for God. It's a good thing for him that God also loves Bigots.
Well, the old testament scriptures are the old law that Christ came to fulfill and are no longer required to be followed. As to the pastor, you are right, he is not infallible, but the fact that the New Testement scriptures speak clearly about homosexuality does speak for God. You can agree or disagree, It means nothing to me, I just dislike hypocricy and hatred from either side.
Being a Christian is challenging enough without bringing homosexuality into it. Honestly, why not focus on the teachings of Jesus, to love your neighbor, pray in private, turn the other cheek, and work for peace, isn't that enough?
So why does the old testament still belong in the holy bible if Jesus came to fulfill them all? Is it just to show the horrible ways people used to treat each other? Why not just cut the old testament out and just look at the new testament then? But there are passages where Jesus does not like certain people either. Like this one
"So I will cast her on a bed of suffering, and I will make those who commit adultery with her suffer intensely, unless they repent of her ways. I will strike her children dead. Then all the churches will know that I am he who searches hearts and minds, and I will repay each of you according to your deeds. (From the NIV Bible, Revelation 2:22-23)"
So Jesus was not always loving, he is very contradicting much like his followers of today.
Amy:
Actually homosexuality has to be brought into it now-a-days. It is a topic that political parties throw around constantly.
Look in Leviticus and it will give you all of the guidance needed in reference to homosexuality.
BTW: Show me where Jesus said pray in private and work for peace. I grew up in the church and I was always taught he said "SPREAD the GOOD NEWS".... that does not mean keep your religion a secret.
Rosco rojo's keywords are "interpreted correctly"--meaning interpreted the way that suits the person's views who is doing the interepreting and those of the person defending the interpretation.
BTW: Show me where Jesus said pray in private and work for peace. I grew up in the church and I was always taught he said "SPREAD the GOOD NEWS".... that does not mean keep your religion a secret.
I'll be happy to show you where Jesus said "pray in private"
Matthew 6:5-15
5
"And when you pray, do not be like the hypocrites, for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and on the street corners to be seen by men. I tell you the truth, they have received their reward in full. 6But when you pray, go into your room, close the door and pray to your Father, who is unseen. Then your Father, who sees what is done in secret, will reward you. 7And when you pray, do not keep on babbling like pagans, for they think they will be heard because of their many words. 8Do not be like them, for your Father knows what you need before you ask him.
For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins. "This, then, is how you should pray:
" 'Our Father in heaven,
hallowed be your name,
10your kingdom come,
your will be done
on earth as it is in heaven.
11Give us today our daily bread.
12Forgive us our debts,
as we also have forgiven our debtors.
13And lead us not into temptation,
but deliver us from the evil one.'
14
Matthew 6:5-15
14
For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly Father will also forgive you. 15But if you do not forgive men their sins, your Father will not forgive your sins.
OK, InTheMiddle, I will grant you, Jesus also said:
14“You are the light of the world. A city set on a hill cannot be hidden. 15Nor do people light a lamp and put it under a basket, but on a stand, and it gives light to all in the house. 16In the same way, let your light shine before others, so that they may see your good works and give glory to your Father who is in heaven.
So go ahead and "spread the good news," but please don't beat up the homosexuals doing it.
Isn't disgusting behavior subjective? Why is it not disgusting for two women to have sex with a man? Or have anal sex with a woman? Or peeing or defecating on each other? (Okay, the last is pretty disgusting!) Straight people do stuff like that all the time outside of marriage, and it seems to be okay! And, you're right -- the pastor did quote scripture exactly -- but skipped over all the other scriptures where God demands the deaths of people for any infraction.
Amy B, thanks for the passage, as the key to it is 'so that they may SEE YOUR GOOD WORKS' ... couple this with the admonition NOT to make a public spectacle of prayer, and it says clearly that your "light" is living YOUR LIFE as an example ... treating others kindly as Christ did, being generous to the needy, forgiving trespasses without reservation, and so on. How exactly does lambasting gays for loving differently than you do qualify? I find NOTHING inspiring, worthy of admiration, or serving as a truly Christian example in the actions of most of the Far Right ... these people have hypocritically appropriated Christianity for their ideological agenda and joined the ranks of the false prophets the Bible cautions against. The very book they claim to abide by soundly condemns them in their hatemongering.
So! Obama went to a church for twenty years that denounces the United States of America. So the point of this article is?
The point of the article is to give the nasty anti Christian bigots herein a platform to spew their venom.
The point of the article is to point out the christian bigots belief that gay is catching instead of how God made you.
This country was founded with religious freedom and freedom of speech written into our Constitution. What is wrong is for any religion to teach hatred of the other faiths and hatred of those who are different. The Bible also teaches tolerance, something too many radical evangelical ministers fail to grasp.
I was baptized at birth, and grew up attending and was confirmed in, the United Church of Christ, and I NEVER heard anything about homosexuality in my church, either for or against. Sexual orientation wasn't a topic covered in Sunday School or during Church. How in the world did this become a part of some church's dogma? Clearly, Jesus was not in the business of passing judgment on different types of people, he was sent to earth to redeem all our sins, and to teach us to pray.
Amy,
no wonder you are such a leftist...
you must have attended the Church of Goo Goo Liberals, where you all worshiped the God of Big Government...
And the ushers were unionized, and considered the collection plate 'mandatory union dues'.
Bob: You know your god is man-made when he hates all the same people you do.
Bob
Oh please, our minister asks us to pray for Governor Paul LePage, as well as President Obama, that's the Christian way. I do not recognize Jesus in the teaching of this so-called church.
Bob,
Did you finish high school?
Bachmann is evil incarnate in the same vein as GW - only worse!
And of course, she has the Bush Crime Family "Blessing"!
This is all about hypocritical Christian fundamentalism and its gospel of
prosperity that justifies the greed of capitalism. They always look so well
groomed and squeaky clean but their souls lack the love of humanity. Whadya mean, "what souls"?
Dana Carvey (Church Lady) / Bachmann 2012!
Now isn't that special - hmmm.
Naaah. The church lady had tons more charm.
Wow, that's breaking news that a church/religion may look at homosexuality as immoral - thanks for letting me know religious people might have this view. Next thing you know you'll be telling me homosexuals don't like religious people because of their view on homosexuality.
It IS news when the person perpetrating such intolerance is seeking the presidency. Of course, it was really just a "photo op" for Michella the Hun anyway, so the Right should be happy with the media coverage ... uh oh, I used the "photo op" line that the Right so loves to bandy about ... do I owe any copyright fees?
" ... Â the New Testement [sic] scriptures speak clearly about homosexuality ... "
And pray tell, where do they do so? Jesus says not one single word on the subject! If it were that important, don't you think he'd make at least one little bitty reference to it?
There are a very few references in Romans 1:26–27, 1 Corinthians 6:9–10, and 1 Timothy 1:8–11 that may refer to homosexuality. Or maybe not. It all depends on how one translates certain words from the Greek. (No, the Bible wasn't handed down from God in Elizabethan English.)
There are more than a few references to homosexuality in the Bible.
I'm not going to go back and forth on religion in this room. No matter how many references you present to these secular/un-saved individuals, they will still ATTEMPT to translate the WORD in a different context.
IntheMiddle, TX ~ Your last statement applies both ways. There hasn't been an agreement on how to translate the WORD or Christianity - EVER! However, I find it interesting that the Ten Commandments - which is what I consider the greatest words to come from the Old Testament- not once mentions homosexuality. And there's not one word from Jesus on it being such an abomination or a sin. You'd think that if homosexual acts were such a big NO, NO, that they'd be up there with "Thou shall not commit adultery" and "Thou shall not covet thy neighbor's wife." But, nope, not one word. All other references to homosexuality in the New Testament came from writers long after Jesus' death - along with their take on women covering their heads, NOT speaking out in front of men (Michelle, take heed.) etc. And until those who pull out the bits and pieces in the OT about Homosexuality also want to pull out the bits and pieces about mixing meat and milk products, not eating pork or shellfish, stoning the adulterer, etc, etc, etc. I'm not going to ever respect them or consider their opinions as being worth while.
Also amazes me that these preachers will preach until doomsday about how awful homosexuality is, but never preach out against adultery or divorce - and Jesus did considered these sinful. Of course, I believe that the percentage of homosexuals is only about 10%, so they wouldn't be offending too many people in their own congregations, BUT, if they preached out and condemned as sinners the divorced and the adulterers, they would be offending 50% to 75% of their congregation. And THEN wouldn't their congregations disappear, as would their offerings! What spineless, gutless hypocrites to attack one small group but turn their eye to the huge group denounced by the 10 Commandments and Jesus.
Brilliant analysis. Thank you!
This is just one more way the Left gets to demonize those who don't agree with them and it is just one more stone they cast at those who they eagerly call bigots and racists when they don't share the Progressive view.
Progressive view, try science.
Gay is not catching.
I do know that a book written almost 2000 years ago might not have the whole story. There are a whole lot of things that have happened in the last 2000 years that the christians might just want to catch up on.
Dan G. Their own words prove them to be bigots and racists, their own words call them what they are; liberals need only quote them.
Dan G: You mean like Michelle et al demonize homosexuals? Or like you demonize anyone on the Left? That's the very hypocrisy that makes so many people gag at the thought of the Far Right having any more power than it has already stolen in this country.
Newsflash - evolution is not closed to new applicants. Try joining the rest of the human race; it really is a lot better than staying in that cave you're living in.
The pastor called homosexuality "immoral" and "unnatural" but overlooks that fact that there are over 300 speices on this planet that display homosexual tendencies in the wild. If homoexuallity is 'unnatural' then why does it occure naturally in the wild?
This is just one more example of how this candidate can only represent a segment of the American people. Lets not forget that there are a marority of homosexuals that do not have childern yet pay for the education of everyone that does have childern. Lets not forget that homosexuals have more disposiable income than their hetrosexual counterparts.
It is morally right to allow Americans to die from sickness that can easily be cured? Well without healthcare that is what we allow to happen. Morally wrong?
Newsweak puts a photoshopped 'crazy eyes' cover of Michele Bachman. The same Newsweek whose almost-weekly worshipful Obama covers literally put a halo on their hero's head...
The once-mighty Newsweek magazine-turned-Beast is apparently so proud of its Democratic Underground-pandering Michele Bachmann cover and title that its editors are promoting the photo and pushing the hashtag #QueenofRage on Twitter.
And the left-wing press is eating it up:
Gawker, predictably: “Ha ha, just kidding—they don’t call her CrazyEyes for nothing.”
The Village Voice rejoices after receiving a high-res image of the cover (and dutifully cropping Bachmann’s eyes).
I commend her for where she stands on these issues. Our Country needs her or someone with similar ethical standards to get us pointed back in the right direction
And what direction would that be exactly? Religious intolerance? A State Religion? Which religion does the State pick? Those who are different should be what? Imprisoned, put to death? What exactly has Michele Bachmann promised? She promises to "take our country back" but she never tells anyone what she means: back from whom, back from where and to where does she plan to take it?
I commend her for where she stands on these issues. Our Country needs her or someone with similar ethical standards to get us pointed back in the right direction
Like I said, the votes she receives will be the dumb a$$ vote.
At least she won't receive your "JACKAZZ" vote.
No but she will get your dumb a$$ vote.
Job1:
You really don't how the ....k I vote. If she is the Republican nominee for POTUS, I will vote for her. I damn sure will not vote for a Democrat.
Liberalism (from the Latin liberalis, "of freedom")[1] is the belief in the importance of liberty and equal rights. Liberalism ended dictatorships and Monarchies, and created democracies, allowing the people to rule and govern themselves. Equality and Liberty for All is the general premise.
So, everyone should associate themselves with being a liberal. Tolerance will prevail in this country. I am all for an individual or group's personal beliefs. However, we will not be governed by personal religious beliefs in our country of great diversity, especially when a specific point of view about God excludes and dismisses another's beliefs and rights.
So what,who cares, find something that matters.
Who really gives a hoot? I could care less what a Pastor said at a service Bachmann attended regarding homosexuality. This is news? I suppose if he had made a biblical call to feed the poor it would have led to an explanation that Bachmann has denounced the huge increase in food stamp use under Obama - when in context she means it is more proof his economic policies are a joke.
The ad hominem attacks against Bachmann by the media jackals have boomeranged against the Left and hugely helped Bachmann.
Whenever the press attacks Bachmann, she "gets a flood of support and money. She becomes ‘Every Woman,’ a misunderstood Tea Party mother of five facing down an elitist, arrogant, Obama-leaning press corps." The dogs bark, but the caravan moves on.
8/2/11 Rasmussen Poll: Romney 44% vs. Bachmann 42% in a two-way race.
Derek - I wish she was a Gov. with two term track record of success. It's going to be tough to lean on a record as a 5 year member of Congress.
Michele Bachmann is unwavering when it comes to her principles and convictions despite the media's pathetic attempt to chastise her. Good for Michele. Never straying from the truth is a good position to take in today's current political climate.
"Nick" do you actually believe that? The truth from her perspective and you say you're worried about big government liberals - Michele wants to be in your bedroom...
Michelle Bachmann's "truth"??? Now that's a laugh! It just so happens that she lost one of her main aides due to her incredible inability to control her constant lying!
The Adam Hood that they are referring to is probably the "gayest" man you will ever see in your life (excluding Marcus Bachmann). You should check out his hilarious claim of being ex-gay on YouTube.
I can give you a 100% guarantee that there is no way Adam actually impregnated his wife. We also have no proof that the child in question is biologically his. Listen, you can pretend to be straight all you want. You can marry a women, fantasize about men while you're in bed with her, and somehow manage to get her pregnant. But that will NEVER change your innate sexual orientation. No one gets to choose their sexual orientation. No one. Including Marcus (self-loathing closet case) Bachmann.
Everything else in life is a choice, how is this different? It's not. It's a sin like any other sin. Anything that glorifies self and appeals to the senses instead of kneeling at the throne of grace and truth is sin. We can't battle the desires of the flesh alone. Christ is needed for that. Your comment about innate orientation is a lie. The culture has lied to you since you were born. You let the enemy win by falling into that trap. Show me how your orientation glorifies God and not self? Be specific and don't give hogwash generalities that you don't believe in God and love yourself. We are made to worship Him. Anything deviating from that is not of God and sinful. "
18The wrath of God is being revealed from heaven against all the godlessness and wickedness of men who suppress the truth by their wickedness, 19since what may be known about God is plain to them, because God has made it plain to them. 20For since the creation of the world God’s invisible qualities—his eternal power and divine nature—have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse.
21For although they knew God, they neither glorified him as God nor gave thanks to him, but their thinking became futile and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22Although they claimed to be wise, they became fools 23and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images made to look like mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles.
24Therefore God gave them over in the sinful desires of their hearts to sexual impurity for the degrading of their bodies with one another. 25They exchanged the truth of God for a lie, and worshiped and served created things rather than the Creator—who is forever praised. Amen.
26Because of this, God gave them over to shameful lusts. Even their women exchanged natural relations for unnatural ones. 27In the same way the men also abandoned natural relations with women and were inflamed with lust for one another. Men committed indecent acts with other men, and received in themselves the due penalty for their perversion.
28Furthermore, since they did not think it worthwhile to retain the knowledge of God, he gave them over to a depraved mind, to do what ought not to be done. 29They have become filled with every kind of wickedness, evil, greed and depravity. They are full of envy, murder, strife, deceit and malice. They are gossips, 30slanderers, God-haters, insolent, arrogant and boastful; they invent ways of doing evil; they disobey their parents; 31they are senseless, faithless, heartless, ruthless. 32Although they know God’s righteous decree that those who do such things deserve death, they not only continue to do these very things but also approve of those who practice them." Romans 1:18-32 Kneel before the throne of grace, repent, and be renewed.
Oh goodie ---- the economy is in shambles, we're in debt way over our heads, we're bogged down in two wars we cannot afford so this is just what we need -- a potential president worrying about what Johnny and Freddy are doing behind close doors. Tell you what --- ANYONE who votes for a candidate for any office based on what that candidates' stand is on homosexuality should be allowed to vote because you don't understand one of the most basic foundations of our governmental system -- the right to be left alone.
Funny -- Bachmann tells us she wants "smaller" government
They want "Smaller Government" when it comes to education, welfare or any other aid to the poor, science, medicine and medical research, but most of all, "Small Government" when it comes to collecting any fees or taxes.
Oh, but when it comes to enforcing their version of Biblical Morality, then they want the biggest government they can get! Come to think of it, they also want Really Big Government when it comes to Corporate Welfare, Military Industrial Contracts, and benefits to the rich.