First Thoughts: A game of leverage

After Boehner’s failure last night, do Democrats now have more leverage in the debt fight?... What we learned last night: 1) The final House bill will need both GOP and Dem votes; 2) The old rules no longer apply in twisting arms for votes; and 3) Can Republicans govern?... Another question Democrats are asking: Do House Republicans really want to do this again in six month?... And Pawlenty and Huntsman escalate their rhetoric.

*** A game of leverage: Yesterday, we said that who’s up one day in this debt debate can quickly go down the next. And that’s precisely what happened on Thursday night, when House Speaker John Boehner -- who had appeared likely to get his debt legislation through the House -- had to postpone the vote. The reason: GOP leaders simply didn’t have the votes to pass it. Why does all of this matter, even though Boehner's bill is supposedly D.O.A. in the Senate? It’s about leverage. Had Republican passed their bill last night, it would have put pressure on the White House and Democrats, even though Senate Dems had vowed to oppose the Boehner bill. But with the GOP’s failure last night, Democrats suddenly have much more leverage than they did yesterday. Expect Mitch McConnell and a band of frustrated Senate Republicans (whom McConnell is simply trying to keep calm) to give Boehner a couple of hours this morning to try to pass his legislation again. But if that doesn’t happen, Senate Republicans might end up cutting a deal with Harry Reid and the Democrats -- moving things faster than any of us thought possible.

*** Final House bill will need GOP and Dem votes: Here’s another reason why Democrats suddenly have more leverage in this debt debate: We’ve heard that House leaders weren’t trying to flip just the last 10 or 15 votes yesterday. GOP leaders had already moved DOZENS of House Republican votes from "maybe" “no” to “yes.” What does that mean: There just aren’t enough House GOP votes -- by themselves -- to raise the debt ceiling. The eventual compromise bill is going to take 105 to 110 House Republican votes, as well as 105 to 110 House Democratic votes. So message to Kevin McCarthy and Steny Hoyer: Time to roll up your sleeves; Monday could be the REALLY long day.  

*** Do House Republicans really want to do this again in six months? Rhetorically, Democrats now have additional leverage in their fight to have a single debt-ceiling hike through 2012 (as opposed to the GOP desire to have another hike early next year). As White House Communications Director Dan Pfeiffer tweeted last night, “Someone remind me why @speakerboehner is dead set on doing this again in December?” And as a top Senate Democratic aide emailed First Read, "If this isn't reason enough to avoid doing all this over again in six months, what is?" Some Republicans might believe doing this again will make the president look weak at a time when Americans are actually beginning to tune into the election. Is that possible? Maybe, but it's just as possible that it turns into a total youknowwhat-show, and has more of what last night highlighted -- Republicans attacking Republicans and a party in disarray. So it's hard enough to imagine gambling with the U.S. economy at this point, but it also means gambling with your own political future and relevancy.

*** The old rules no longer apply: There are two more lessons we learned last night. First, the old rules to twist recalcitrant arms no longer apply. Tea Party and conservative House members don’t really care about important committee assignments. They don’t place a value on fundraising help. And earmarks and extra pork for their districts? Forget about it. As the Washington Post recounts, GOP Rep. Jeff Flake -- who opposes Boehner’s bill -- “praised the lack of horse-trading of the type that marred passage of Obama’s health-care legislation. ‘It is the most refreshing thing in the world to see what’s going on in there,’ Flake said. ‘This kind of negotiation a couple years ago would have cost about $20 billion.’” It is refreshing. But it’s also a curse if you’re trying to get things done.

*** Can Republicans govern? A second lesson we learned: It’s a legitimate question to ask if the Tea Party-fueled Republican Party can govern. Last night wasn’t just about Boehner failing to get the votes. House Majority Leader Eric Cantor and House Majority Whip Kevin McCarthy were united with their speaker in trying to get votes for the bill. Some folks are trying to make this a referendum on Boehner's speakership, but could anyone else have managed this group? Bottom line: The entire GOP leadership doesn’t know how to manage the Tea Party and their conservative members. Boehner and Republicans have spent the last several weeks accusing President Obama of not leading. But as one GOP member told NBC’s Luke Russert: "Our message has been that we lead and Obama doesn't. That didn't happen [last night]." Obama himself referred to Boehner’s challenge earlier this month: “The politics that swept him into the speakership were good for a midterm election; they’re tough for governing.”

*** Today’s House tick-tock: Late last night, House Majority Leader Eric Cantor's office released a list of the bills that will be considered today, and Boehner's bill is listed as one of those bills, NBC’s Frank Thorp reports. While it does not say when they will vote (because they don't know exactly what they will be doing/how much time they will need to whip the new bill), they say that it will not be earlier than 11:00 am. They are only expecting one series of votes. Thorp adds that a different bill is likely to be proposed, and because of the same-day rule that was introduced at last night’s 11th-hour emergency Rules Committee meeting, they will be able to introduce the new version of the bill and vote on it on the same day. Usually, the House will wait 72 hours after a bill has been introduced to vote on it.

NBC's Kelly O'Donnell and Chuck Todd report on the failure of the House to pass a debt-limit extension.

*** Pawlenty and Huntsman escalate their rhetoric: As far as the action on the 2012 campaign trail, things are continuing to heat up. In Iowa yesterday, Tim Pawlenty went after his GOP rivals (and it’s pretty clear he was referring to Michele Bachmann here. "It's not much of a consolation prize for Iowa to have somebody who's right for that moment, who's exciting for the day but really can't be the nominee of the party, really can't beat Barack Obama," he said, per NBC’s Andrew Rafferty. While stumping again today in Iowa, Pawlenty echoed that line: “The main way we're going to goof this up as a party is to nominate the wrong candidate.” And on FOX last night, Jon Huntsman said this about the current debt debate, per NBC’s Matt Loffman: “My opponents in this race haven't even come up with what they support."

*** On the 2012 trail: As mentioned above, Pawlenty is in Iowa… Rick Perry and Rick Santorum address the Western Conservative Summit in Denver, CO… And Jon Huntsman, in DC, keynotes the College Republican National Committee

*** Friday’s “Daily Rundown” line-up: Sens. Kent Conrad (D-ND) & Bob Corker (R-TN) on the state of play for a debt deal… Bestselling author Daniel Silva (who made #1 on WSJ’s list today!)… NBC’s Mike Viqueira, National Journal’s Reid Wilson and the Washington Post’s Jennifer Rubin on 2012, debt, and more.

Countdown to Wisconsin recall general for GOP senators: 11 days
Countdown to Iowa GOP straw poll: 15 days
Countdown to Wisconsin recall general for Dem senators: 28 days
Countdown to NV-2 and NY-9 special elections: 46 days
Countdown to Election Day 2011: 102 days
Countdown to the Iowa caucuses: 192 days
* Note: When the IA caucuses take place depends on whether other states move up

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Maybe if Obama had a good idea the GOP would not have to be on their toes all the time. Obama unchecked would cause a lot of damage - even checked he is causing a lot of damage. Oh I am sorry I am sure it isnot his fault.

  • 2 votes
Reply#103 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:08 PM EDT

wq--An unchecked Tea Party will also cause a lot of damage. That is why we have the separation of powers and checks and balances in the U.S. Constitution--to ensure political moderation and compromise and prevent radical ideologues like the Tea Party (who refuse to listen to anyone who thinks differently then they do) from taking down our country or creating a dictatorship.

    #103.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:26 PM EDT
    Reply

    Finally we have a group of individuals go to Washington to change Washington and aren't just throwing up their arms and getting sucked into the backroom deals and corruption. When it comes to us ordinary citizens, most Republicans and a large portion of Democrats know the lawyers in Congress (both parties) don't know how to manage our money. Hang in there guys and gals. We'll send re-enforcements in 1 1/2 years!!

    • 1 vote
    Reply#104 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:10 PM EDT

    Richard - I agree with you. Most of the liberals on this web site are critizing the tea party because they are sticking to the promises they made to the people that elected the. The libs are mad because the tea party is not caving and they can not be rolled or bribed with threats, campaign money or committee assignments, like many libs were in the healthcare debate. How refreshing to have a group of politicans keep their word.

    • 1 vote
    #104.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:26 PM EDT
    Reply

     Right or wrong the Republicans are at least bringing something to the table. The President and the senate have not been able to produce an actual budget in the last two years. If you don't like the House bill let's take a look at the Senate bill. That's right there isn't one. How about the President's proposal. There isn't one of those either. Looks like the Republicans are the ONLY ones trying to get something done.

    It is time to give up on politics and focus on the issues at hand. Figure out a way to raise the debt limit and cut the spending by at least the same amount! Demand an actual budget before an additional extention cane be granted next time. Six months should be enough time to create at least one budget for this President.

     

    • 2 votes
    Reply#105 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:16 PM EDT

    BOB: Yes, the Tea Party is most certainly bringing something to the table, pure, unadulterated insanty.

    I almost wish that they force us to default, destroy our nations credit and generally make a shambles out to things. These people are ignorant children who are playing with fire, holding the nation hostage for them to get their way.

    Can you imagine Bob if say, a Democratically controlled the House when either Bush needed an increase in the debt ceiling to fight his UNFUNDED wars or how about the patron saint of your party, The Gipper. A Democratically controlled Congress raised the debt ceiling EIGHTEEN times for the supposed champion of "smaller government". I take it you're OK with this???

      #105.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:32 PM EDT
      Reply

      Hmmmmm. "There just aren’t enough House GOP votes -- by themselves -- to raise the debt ceiling." True, and of course, a plurality of Republicans in the House think still think that lacking is a good thing. So will Boehner deal further in order to win over enough Democratic votes to swing things? He can try, but his bill as it stands is DOA and he's unlikely to have the time to both revise it AND assemble a majority coalition. His first instinct was the exact opposite: Making his bill even harsher and less likely to gain Democratic acceptance. I think we are screwed.

        Reply#106 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:16 PM EDT

        NBC and CBS News need to compare notes. While Todd and company for NBC say here that freshmen teabaggers are skpping earmarks and pork barrel projects, CBS News just ran a piece this week demonstrating exactly the opposite. Just because teabaggers SAY they're against such appropriations doesn't mean they actually are resisting them.

          Reply#107 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:17 PM EDT

          The Democrats and the Republicans are well known crooks that get fed daily by the super rich but the new Tea Party takes this crime to an entirely new level, they are out to remove all our freedoms and rights with one clean swoop. NOT only will America become the newest third world country but if they get their way we will be the new Iran minus only the head gear and the stoning.

          • 2 votes
          Reply#108 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:21 PM EDT

          Iuvenia - I think you need to do a little research on the tea party. They are not tied to anyone but the people who elected them. They were elected on the promise that they would cut the spending in Washington. If you want the US to become a third world country lets just keep on spending. You do realize that for every dollar that we spend we have to borrow .40 of it.

          • 1 vote
          #108.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:36 PM EDT

          Right on luvenia. They would love to tun us into an absolute theocracy, where their "god" dictates every aspect of our lives.

            #108.2 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:50 PM EDT
            Reply

            While I agree with the TP in demanding more cuts, but they have ignored to the simple logic that all the cuts necessary must be carried out segmentally! some this time , more next time!I'm afraid the TP may lead to a big win for BO and the dems in 2012! many people have become tired of that debate that has gone long enough! the TP does not understand a basic fact in life, one can not always get what they demand 100%!! the speaker of the house has failed to lead! the dems have created this situation by not doing theor job when they had the congress, the WH, and the republicans are going to blamed for whatever!It's a dirty politics by the liberals!!!

            • 1 vote
            Reply#109 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:21 PM EDT

            The Republican bill only cuts 32 billion in the next year.

            The Democrat bill might cut 22 billion in the next year, but has no firm cuts listed.

            Both bills only cut the amount of INCREASE, not from current spending levels.

            Neither bill actually does anything to reduce the deficit, only the amount of increased debt.

              #109.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:45 PM EDT
              Reply

              The ball is now in Reid and Obama's court folks ! You have a choice. Balance the budget or default. If you default because you are not willing to balance the budget then its on YOU !!!!! Of course you haven’t' passed a freakn budget in over two years. Talk about incompetence. Only career politicians can't get themselves to balance budgets.

              • 3 votes
              Reply#110 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:25 PM EDT

              SHOOBY: Would you have been OK with the Democratically held Congress refusing Bush's SEVEN debt ceiling increases and thus defunding our military while fighting Bush's war in Iraq???

              I hope we do default, it will teach you ignorant slobs a lesson about economics you won't soon forget..

              • 1 vote
              #110.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:34 PM EDT

              Yes. . .

              But Dems need the money to buy votes so they would not have done it.

                #110.2 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:01 PM EDT
                Reply

                To the Liberals: Can I have your money? I promise I will do with it what I want. I wont even tell you what I am spending it on. I am honest, You can trust me.

                • 1 vote
                Reply#111 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:27 PM EDT

                mphill,

                To the Republicans: Can we lower the taxes some more for the wealthy? We all know how many jobs it's created over the past 11 years. And let's not forget...the God who told us to give to the poor, to protect the poor, to help the needy, and to feed the sick is always on our side.

                • 2 votes
                #111.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:33 PM EDT

                Vipp - The war on poverty was started in 1964 by LBJ and we have spent 16 trillon on it. Proverty has increased since the Federal government became involved. Do you think we need to throw money at a program that has failed so miserably?

                • 1 vote
                #111.2 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:40 PM EDT

                Doris, and of all developed nations USA has still the lowest minimum wage, highest health care cost (not best!), least employee benefits, and least wealth distribution.

                I guess the Republicans' way of dealing with poverty must CHANGE. Maybe the tax cuts to the wealthy should be eliminated, and the taxes for the ordinary people lowered, and maybe we need a public option when it comes to health care, maybe the OLD Republican way sucks.

                • 2 votes
                #111.3 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:47 PM EDT

                Vipp,

                This has went way beyond helping the poor and helpless in this country. We spend to much money as a country. If we do not get this under control there is going to be more poor and needy people. I am sure you are like me. You have to live within your means. Both parties are wrong for what has happened. The two wars have taken there toll on the economy. Neither was funded by a Republican President along with a Democratic Congress and Senate. I say again it is both sides fault. Right now we have to make some tough choices between fixing the problem or passing it along to the next Generation.

                  #111.4 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:14 PM EDT

                  Thank you Decibella,

                  I would answer Doris but you summed it up well.

                  • 1 vote
                  #111.5 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:15 PM EDT
                  Reply

                  IT'S NOW TIME FOR DEMOCRATS TO RAM THE IMMEDIATE REPEAL OF THE "BUSH TAX CUTS" DOWN THE REPUBLICANS' COLLECTIVE THROAT. Certainly, there can be no better time than now as we have a failure of leadership on the part of the Republicans in the House that has played out for the whole country to see. No matter what Democrats do now, they will look much better than the GOP to the American people as long as they stand united. President Obama should be made to realize that there is no need to exclude tax increases, especially repeal of the "Bush Tax Cuts", in any compromise presented to Republicans. Why? Because Republicans have to vote for such an agreement or take full blame for the destruction of the economy and all the harm that entails to the American people. Having watched some great politicians during my 59 years on earth has taught me that knowing when to strike the opposition and what to hit them with is part of the art of governing in our democracy. Now is the time to hit Republicans with a repeal of the "Bush Tax Cuts".

                  • 2 votes
                  Reply#112 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:32 PM EDT

                  Yes! Why won't they do that!!! It's an easy argument to win, a right argument to push, and would most certainly show Republicans for what they are.

                  • 1 vote
                  #112.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:34 PM EDT

                  Sure-let's raise rates on the poorest Americans by 50%

                  let's raise rates on the middle Class by 35%

                  that's what repealing the Bush tax cuts will accomplish

                    #112.2 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:47 PM EDT

                    Larry, NOT true.

                      #112.3 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:50 PM EDT

                      I wish they would becuase I want to come back on here and read your comments about how the prices of every thing has gone up so much making you libs even poorer then you think you are now.

                        #112.4 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:04 PM EDT

                        Sonmanvb,

                        Buying into Fox news again? You a Hannity listener? Sonmanvb...did prices rise on anyone when Reagan increased taxes? During Clinton's administration when he raised the top marginal rates?

                          #112.5 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:17 PM EDT

                          @Decibella

                          You just proved you don't know what was in the Bush tax cuts except for what your leftist spin masters tell you.

                          The Bush taxcuts lowered the bottom marginal tax rate from 15% to 10%

                          The middle class rates were lowered from 28% to 25%.

                          However, the taxcuts also DOUBLED the child tax credit from $500 to $1000

                          the taxcuts eliminated the marriage penalty that the Democrats had implemented

                          5 million families poor and middle class families no longer paid any income tax due to the Bush taxcuts

                            #112.6 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:22 PM EDT
                            Reply

                            GOP knows the truth but they refuse to react to the fact; instead they pay the political game in the midst of the sufferings of the Main Street people.

                            Their actions have consequences for the coming elections of their own seats.

                            Have they known that if they continue to cut the programs, it also means more people are going to be laid off, and the gov't services are going to be inadequate.

                            GOP is going to be responsible for the semi-paralystic government. And they themselves have fully-functional office and salaries.

                            • 1 vote
                            Reply#113 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:33 PM EDT

                            MWD, WYH are you using 6 years for DEMS, Clinton sat 8 years, and you cannot use Obama's "proposed" numbers in a calculation that use historical facts. Obama might sit 2 terms and that will greatly impact the numbers.


                            MWD, the historic fact is:

                            Republicans 8 Trillion dollar DEBT increase in 20 years - 400 billion/year

                            Democrats 1.5 Trillion dollar DEBT increase in 8 years - 187 billion/year

                            As you can see, the Republican Presidents increase our National Debt with a more than double amount than Democratic Presidents.

                            MWD, you like to twist data in favor of the Republicans, I understand where you are standing. I no longer trust your posts.

                            MWD, your way of posting false numbers and calculations is frightening and disgusting. Please, refrain from even typing the word honest.

                            • 2 votes
                            Reply#114 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:39 PM EDT

                            Debt under Obama has already increased $4 trillion, your figures are wrong.

                            Just look at: http://www.usdebtclock.org/index.html
                            Debt was at $10 trillion in 2008 and is now at $14.3 trillion

                            • 1 vote
                            #114.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:48 PM EDT

                            Comrade, you failed to READ my post - you just want to make a Republican point - which of course is based on NO FACTS.

                            I am comparing facts not fiction. And the fact is that Republican Presidents, over a 20 year period, starting with Reagan, have added 8 TRILLION to our National DEBT. Clinton's two term added only 1.5 TRILLION, and by that, Clinton is the President who added LEAST to our National Debt.

                            For any President to reverse the CRAZY DEBT increase trend that W BUSH put us on, is close to impossible and such an effort will take TIME, TIME, TIME, ESPECIALLY after W BUSH ran this nation into the ground.

                            • 1 vote
                            #114.2 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:58 PM EDT

                            Here is a cold hard fact you obviously overlooked-your boy in the WH has spent over 4 trillion in 2 and half years and wants to spend another 2.4 ARE YOU EVEN FOR REAL

                            • 1 vote
                            #114.3 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:30 PM EDT

                            Fact is that we are +$4 trillion deeper in debt now then we were in '08.

                            Funny how when Prez- O sez its someone else's fault (and not his), the loony, lemming liberals believe him.

                            If they cut ObamaCare & they will have eliminated $2.5 trillion in spending immediately.

                            • 1 vote
                            #114.4 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 4:07 PM EDT
                            Reply

                            Without compromise you will find a bridge to far. A lession for the Tea Party.

                              Reply#115 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:39 PM EDT

                              Democrats have leverage cuz Boehner is dangerously irresponsible. He has elements of President Hoover, Weiner, Herr Fuhrer and current Tiger (they all have "er" at the end of their names). He has tanked stock markets, home sales causing Trillions in losses worldwide. Private savings have shrunk since he opened up. Snuff him out.

                                Reply#116 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:44 PM EDT

                                This will actually be a great time to make some real money in the market if they will drag out this a little longer.

                                  #116.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:09 PM EDT
                                  Reply

                                  In the 8 years GWB was in office, the debt increase by $4.3 trillion - in 8 years.

                                  Since Obama has been in office (~2.5 years), the debt has increased by $4 trillion - in 2.5 years.
                                  It is projected that debt will increase another $8 trillion by 2015.

                                  Why is the debate about 'how many times have previous POTUS increased debt limit?"

                                  We are so screwed unless spending get cut & under control.

                                  • 1 vote
                                  Reply#117 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:45 PM EDT

                                  Comrade, Spending on what? should be cut? Buddy projects or needed services? And you forgot to mentioned to eliminate the tax breaks for the wealthy.

                                    #117.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:01 PM EDT

                                    Cut ObumaCare for starters.

                                    Taxes will be going up at the end of 2012 already...what? Raise 'em now and raise 'em again?

                                    Needed services? Like welfare checks & free housing to illegal aliens who have anchor babies?

                                    ...maybe, just maybe we have finally run out of other peoples' money....

                                    • 1 vote
                                    #117.2 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 4:12 PM EDT
                                    Reply

                                    The big Boehner bill is very limp, perhaps oral stimulation on the house floor by house Repblicans will lead to eventual consumation of the bill with tea party Repulicans.

                                      Reply#118 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:46 PM EDT

                                       It seems to me that all congressmen, and women should start going after all the tax evaders that work for the Federal Government  (1) as of 9/9/2010 the Employees on Capital Hill owed $9.3 MILLION in back taxes. (2) Federal employees nation wide owe $1 BILLION in back taxes. And they want to punish the ELDERLY!!! Give them a short time to pay up or get rid of them. They should not be aloud to even talk about budgets. THIS IS TOTALY INSANE

                                        Reply#119 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 1:58 PM EDT

                                        The republian House have never been in command of the debt crisis as the democrats have the last say in the Senate and they own the White House so there is no such thing as a bipartisan compromised deal between the House and the senate. The prolonged delay has only happened because the democrats in the Senate have waited for the House to send them a bill so it could be declined and substituted with one of their own.

                                          Reply#120 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:01 PM EDT

                                          Boehner should tell the Democrats in the Senate to vote on the bill that the house sent them because that is all they are going to get. If the Democrats want to shut down the government then just vote it down. I would also tell the Senate they can forget about sending a bill of their own unless it is more than smoke and mirrors. Like the one Reid proposed where his 4.2 trillion saving was a result of acknowledging the 2 wars winding down.

                                          • 1 vote
                                          Reply#121 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:05 PM EDT

                                          The bottom line is, the House Republican Caucus has been hijacked by a group of ideological extremists who will not settle for anything less than the total crippling of the federal government by financially starving it to death -- and to hell with the consequences.

                                          Make no mistake. these Tea Party-backed GOP freshmen are ideological extremists who don't give a damn about the health of the U.S. economy -- let alone their own political futures. These Tea Party Republicans in the House have been blinded by their ideological extremism to all fiscal and political reality.

                                          They are clearly demonstrating that their ideological extremism trumps everything else. They pose as clear and present a danger to our country as great as the religious extremism of the Taliban and al-Qaida.  

                                          The Tea Party Republicans are proving themselves unfit to serve by demonstrating a willingness to plunge the U.S. -- indeed, the world -- into a second Great Depression with their bullheaded opposition to raising the national debt ceiling under any circumstances.

                                          By so doing, the Tea Party Republicans are willfully committing an act of malfeasance in office, which is punishable by their forced removal via impeachment or criminal prosecution (Under House rules, convicted criminals are barred from serving as members of Congress).

                                          • 1 vote
                                          Reply#122 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:12 PM EDT

                                          Ideolgical - An ideology is a set of ideas that constitutes one's goals, expectations, and actions. An ideology can be thought of as a comprehensive vision, as a way of looking at things in a worldview, as in common sense. (Yes I copied the definition)

                                          So they are ideologically trying to cause a movement to reduced government spending, oppose increase taxation, reduction of the national debt and federal budget defit and adherence to an original interpretation of the US Constitution.

                                          It's a sounds like a pretty good end goal.

                                            #122.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:27 PM EDT
                                            Reply

                                            You Marxists at NBC are living a fantasy. When the Communists took both House and Senate in 2007 unemployment was 4.4% on 1/1 2011 it stood at 9.4% after Obama's two summers of recovery. Eight and one half million additional people had lost their jobs since comrades Pelosi and Reid took control. The 2006 budget deficit was 160 billion dollars. Since that time the Communist Party has stolen almost 6 trillion dollars from the citizens of the USA. With GDP numbers of 0.04% for the first quarter and 0.14% for the second quarter it should be obvious that the Communist Party is a total failure at managing the country but very successful at Looting,Bribing, and Lying. Since MSNBC is the mouthpiece for the Communist Party I hope you all got paid a fair share of the money freedom and liberty that was and is being stolen by this affirmative action dunce Obama.

                                            • 2 votes
                                            Reply#123 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:13 PM EDT

                                            K2mn, Are you stating that as a negitive thing?

                                            From Wikipedia:

                                            The Tea Party movement (TPM) is an American populist political movement that is generally recognized as conservative and libertarian. It endorses reduced government spending, opposition to taxation in varying degrees, reduction of the national debt and federal budget deficit, and adherence to an originalist interpretation of the United States Constitution.

                                            The name "Tea Party" is a reference to the Boston Tea Party, a protest by colonists who objected to a British tax on tea in 1773 and demonstrated by dumping British tea taken from docked ships into the harbor. Some commentators have referred to the Tea in "Tea Party" as the backronym "Taxed Enough Already".

                                            They are against socialism, big government, goverment control over the citizens of the country (Obamacare), capitialism and huge government spending; so yes everything Obama stands for.

                                              Reply#124 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:13 PM EDT

                                              I am In. I believe in a smaller government. I also believe in states rights.

                                              • 1 vote
                                              #124.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:27 PM EDT
                                              Reply

                                              John Boehner is a fool. He cares more about his position than the people he represents. A true leader fights for what he feels is right not what is best for himself. If he really cares about this country and creating jobs, he needs to work out a compromise with the democrats in the House to pass a reasonable bill to raise the debt ceiling with a caveat that a bipartisan tasks force be created in the House and the Senate to put together a deficit/revenue bill that is to be voted on within the next 90 days. Take the politics out of it as much as possible and get it done so more jobs can be created and we can move forward to improve our economy for all of us. If it takes putting the inexperienced ideological Tea Party in the back of this discussion so be it. They are too focused on making things worst so that they have a chance of defeating President Obama in the 2012 election that they show no concern about the real potential crisis going on in the present. We will continue to fight against those who want to move this country in the direction of libertarianism and use lies to foster their cause. Mainstream media does not really seem to see what is going on in this country or maybe they are just concerned about their well-being.

                                              • 1 vote
                                              Reply#125 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:14 PM EDT

                                               The Dems have offered the original GOP demands. And still they want more. Children.

                                              • 1 vote
                                              Reply#126 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:16 PM EDT

                                              Like your boy in the WH who flys his dog and handler on corporate jets, child no AH yes.

                                                #126.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:32 PM EDT

                                                I need some of what Dave is smoking: Republic sadly keep going back to the table giving up more and more not getting hardly anything in return.

                                                How is it that the media has labeled the Republicans as the party of NO? They are the only ones that were talking into the joint meetings with a plan on paper and the President and Democrats are saying NO, each and every time. This must be bizaro world; yes, yes it is per the Democrats we can spend our any out of debt and financial crisis.

                                                  #126.2 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 4:44 PM EDT
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                                                  Don't worry, the credit card limit will be raised so they can spend more of the American peoples money on crap we either don't want, or need. As long as the sheeple of America think that the same morons who have spent us into this insane debt amount can get us out, we are doomed.

                                                  Here's a plan, we should go ahead and let men marry men, and women marry women, and let women keep aborting their children. In 3 generations there won't be any Democrats left.

                                                    Reply#127 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:20 PM EDT

                                                    another communist wanting to tell people what they can and can't do

                                                    • 1 vote
                                                    #127.1 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:24 PM EDT

                                                    Like Michelle telling us what we can, and can't eat.

                                                      #127.2 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:28 PM EDT

                                                      did she try to make it ileagle to eat it? Not like people trying tell you who to love (next you want be able to have a fat or skinny girl friend) because it dosen't fit your standards

                                                        #127.3 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:37 PM EDT

                                                        No, she hasn't made it illegal, yet. I care less about whether your girlfriend is fat or skinny, than Michelle cares about what you eat. As long as she has her ribs, and ice cream.

                                                        • 1 vote
                                                        #127.4 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 2:49 PM EDT

                                                        I don't understand, I have several gay friends and I'm all for the getting the same rights as married heterosexual couples. But government says there is it be a separation of church and state. The state keeps telling the church what it can or can not do. Well marriage was and is church domain long before there were governments so the state should say out of their business and just declare civil unions equal to but different under the eyes of the state. The laws can declare the same rights to a church marriage which then is filed with the state as civil unions which are submitted to the state. Same in eyes of the state and under the law but not a church marriage. If you want the ceremony, just call it a life commitment service or in this day and age of creating words on the fly, make up your own new word for it (maybe gayriage). Do you really in to take and use the word if you get the rights?

                                                          #127.5 - Fri Jul 29, 2011 5:10 PM EDT
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