Mixed Bag -

In the first place, this legislation is going nowhere. Ol' Harry may not be up for reelection in 2012- but a whole lot of other democrats ARE- and try are running as fast as they can from Mr. "the difference between 1994 and now is, this time, you've got me".

In the second place, Obama may have Reid on speed dial, and he may threaten to hold his breath until he turns blue, and Reid may buy it, but the rest of the country?

Not so much.

Take a gander at Gallup's daily tracking. Turns out the temper tantrum is not playing so well in Poughkeepsie..

It's Boehner's plan, or bust- no matter what Obama says. It's about time he learned what. "consent of the governed" means.

Past time, in fact.

If Harry got one message from Obama, it was to get that debt ceiling raised high enough and long enough so it doesn't affect the next election! These debt ceiling fights are losers for Democrats. First, they don't want to cut anything, no spending cuts at all, well maybe a few things, but mostly in the so-called "out-years". 2) With a big debt ceiling raise - $2.5 TRILLION!! - Obama can start some fine looking public projects, many no doubt in the swing states of the country, just before the election. And some of the money needs to be sprinkled on the Wall Street and world market types, let them know to keep those bond interest rates low.

Then Obama can campaign on Congress not cutting the deficit.

Independents take note.

Harry Reid is a moron. Always has been, always will be. He got lucky that the R's put up an even bigger moron in the 2010 election, otherwise, ole Harry would be cooling his heels in scenic downtown Searchlight, NV looking for alien spacecraft.

After all is said & done, there will be a "Clean debt ceiling" Vote & it'll pass!

Bank on it!

Keep dreaming NJ, about Boehner being the last word on this & btw, Stop bogartin the good Stuff you've been on!

Rick, Ky

Did you see anyone above that understands "majority" rule? I don't. We elected President Obama and a Democratic Senate. It is only the House the Republicans have control of. That makes them the "minority". But they don't understand that. They are the guys who still consider all us other voters, black and white, as worthless indentured servants not to be given serious consideration.

Stick to you guns President Obama, Harry Reid and Nancy Pelosi. Stick to your guns! The people are behind you as long as you protect us from greedy corporations ready, and willing, to rape our government.

Wow-

Is Harry Reid really proposing $2.4 trillion in spending cuts...with NO revenue increases whatsoever?

In exchange for a debt ceiling increase lasting until 2013?

The gambit is on. Snake Reid is trying to pull the wool over the eyes of everyone. Does anyone honestly think the democrats have any plans on reducing spending? It ain't gonna happen people. The $2.4 trillion is a boondoggle. A carrot. A slight of hand. A trickery of wording in the proposal. Keep your eyes on the ball.

AnnaBannana - Since when is it majority rule in this country. What makes you think 2010 never happened? It's only the beginning of things to come and for as much as you want to think the democrats are going to sweep 2012, take a look around. Obama's polling is dropping like a rock. For 6 years the democrats have had control... what have they done to avert the angst going on right now? Explain to me all the efforts the democrats have exhausted in compromise. Each and every negotiation involves raising taxes.

When Obama sends a BILLION DOLLARS to Brazil for their oil exploration efforts what justification is there in raising taxes on the American people? It's as if a Billion Dollars means nothing... a giveaway... Justify it for me... I can't grasp giving a Billion Dollars to a foreign country for THEIR oil exploration. If that's not raping the national treasury, tell me what is.

Brianb -- please show me where you see that President Obama has "given away" $1billion to Brazil. Perhaps he has given some money to US companies in Brazil? Or perhaps we are getting something in exchange for the money? There are all kinds of ridiculous statements made and fact checkers spend a lot of time trying to debunk them. If you google something like Obama Brazil Oil you will find snopes and other sites that talk about the situation.

Here ya go Kate: A non-biased source. The Wall St. Journal.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052970203863204574346610120524166.html

Nobody will suport a "Super Committee", a Harry Reid idea. The "Super Committee" idea is a thinly veiled effort by a few so-called leaders of Congress to make an end run around the Constitution of the United States circumventing dissent by Representatives in Congress.

Leaders will lead when they accept the votes that exist in Congress and stop wasting everybody's time insisting on a point of view that died, officially, in November of 2010.

Harry, a Senator needs the votes of the House. The House gave him Cut, Cap, and Balance, which he has tabled. Wishful thinking will get Harry nothing.

The headwind that the President and Democrats face is the will of the people in the form of the candidates they voted into place in 2010.

Brianb, Oh Brian, Thank you for bringing up the Billion for Brazilian oil exploration!!! Thanks for providing the link in the WSJ on line.The article was from the opinion section,not the news sections. It referenced Ex-Im Bank

WARNING: always check the sources used in any article. Most importantly, use PRIMARY SOURCES when found,(EMPHASIS IS MINE)

Export-Import Bank of the United States

Ex-Im Bank is an independent federal agency that helps create and maintain U.S. jobs by filling gaps in private sector export financing at NO COST to American taxpayers. The Bank provides a variety of financing products, including working capital, guarantees, export=credit insurance, and financing to help foreign buyers purchase U.S capital goods and services.

By charging fees and interest on all loans related transactions, EX-Im Bank is SELF-SUSTAINING. It is able to cover all its operation costs and potential losses while while also producing REVENUE. The Bank has generated $3.4BILLION FOR U.S. TAXPAYERS in the last five years.

Soruce: News Release: EX-IMBank approves$40 Million in Export Credit Insurance for MN Small Business.

Brazil and the Billion for oil exploration.

Fred Hochberg, chairman of EX-IM Bank, told Investinbrazil.bix, that they are working on a 3billion credit to finance good and services using American firms. He said that 2/3 of fund go to Petrobia for exploration of oil off Western Coast. 1/3 of fund will go for infrastructure projects for 2014,World Cup and 2016 Summer Olympics. Bank has not decided whether it is a direct loan or loan guarantee at this time.

Source:http/investinbrazil.biz/new/us

So, Brian, no tax dollars are being used in this deal. U.S product and services will be used by foreign end users. Look like a win/win situation.

Need another post to report on Duluth MN business got $40Million in Credit Insurance for their exports.

That is really SWEET....

Beware of Harry Reid, he is Obama's mentor and has more tricks up his sleeve than any of the usual suspects, including Christopher Dodd, Barney Frank, Charlie Rangel, Nancy Pelosi, Eric Holder, Max Baucus (Feisty's drinking companion?), Al Franken, Kent Conrad, Tim Geithner, and other 'prominent' democrats trying to put one over on the American Public. Consider this quote and try to name its author:

“We ask that the government undertake the obligation above all of providing citizens with adequate opportunity for employment and earning a living. The activities of the individual must not be allowed to clash with the interests of the community, but mat take place within its confines and be for the good of all. Therefore, we demand:..an end to the power to the financial interests. We demand profit sharing in big business. We demand a broad extension of care for the aged. We demand the greatest possible consideration of small business in the purchases (taxes) of national, state, and municipal governments. In order to make possible to every capable and industrious (citizen) the attainment of higher education…we demand the education at government expense of gifted children of poor parents…The government must undertake the improvement of public health. We combat the…materialistic spirit within and without us, and aqree convinced that a permanent recovery of our people can only proceed from within on the foundation of the common good before the individual good…”

Give up? Nope none of the above, it was the Nazi Party, Munich, February 1920

Don't worry Northstar,

If history is any guide Brian B. will be right back on these same boards tomorrow spouting the same debunked garbage again. He counts on an uninformed populace while he waits for his blog check from Koch Industries to arrive.

The RWNJ's (to use Feisty's abbreviation) ignore fact as a matter of course. They need to.

Uninformed populace? How about those who refuse to face facts staring them in the face.

Here is a sample of what Obama does with a checkbook funded by taxpayers

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/30/green-bundler-with-the-golden-touch_n_842863.html

That's just a sample. Westly, by the way, bundled only $500,000 In return for half a billion tax dollars.

I wonder what he is up for this go round?

Then people wonder how Obama could possibly run up four trillion in debt in two years.

Oh, and speaking of uninformed, how many know that the aptly named RAT board, that oversees stimulous funds, is staffed by . . .

Obama donors.

http://oversight.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=920:independent-stimulus-panel-stocked-with-obama-fundraisers-and-failed-bureaucrat-but-what-exactly-is-there-sphere-of-influence&catid=22

Talk about putting the fox in charge of the hen house.

I'd say that if a republican president dared such a thing, he'd get excoriated by the press, but a republican president would know in advance that this was true, and would net even entertain the thought of doing something so outrageous.

Obama, however, knows that the press is enthralled with him, so he could get away with outright murder.

After all, he got away with lying about his dying mothe, with no pesky press looking into the nasty details of his lies, so.what is the harm of paying off his donors?

Lord knows, the press will never look into it.

Geez nojo, it must be frustrating to you, having so much irrational hatred for our President you cant see or think straight, and you're still not getting much traction.

Reading over some of your posts here today, and the lies and half truths you keep pushing, why your a regular little ol' propaganda machine unto yourself. I do declare your frothing at the mouth in rabid mode and at this point not many pay you much mind.

You are, as they say, over the top in your fanciful posts. Time to step back and take a really deep breath.

A few VERY interesting points:

1) There are those in the Tea Party caucus minority who don't want the debt ceiling raised, period, even with a dollar-to-dollar solution. This is cause for alarm!

These are the ignorant extremists who were not vetted in time to be eliminated like Christine O'Donnell, Sharron Angle, etc. -- mostly because they are in the House so don't get as much scrutiny. But these Tea Party representatives are NOT constitutionalists, or Libertarians, or any legitimate faction. They are anarchists, pure and simple, who need to be brought to the attention of the constituents in 2012 and thrown out.

2) The other Republicans who have signed a pledge to lobbyist Grover Norquist are also disconcerting. First, the pledge is NOT to the voters, certainly not to the majority of Americans, and definitely does not represent ME and many, many others. These oaths to special interests outside the electoral process are unconstitutional.

Add to this Republican fear of Hate Radio shock jocks like Rush Limbaugh, Michael Savage--who have even less journalistic standards or credentials than phone-hacking Murdoch outlets like FOX noise-- who are no elected officials but are running the Republican Party. Another alarm!

2) What these far-right folks want is a one-party state that is a plutocracy (rule by the rich). Some would also like it to be a Christian theocracy, and possibly a fascist combination of both. We are witnessing much more than a deficit crisis. We are facing loss of democracy, liberties, and freedom at the hands of the far-right GOP/TP as much if not more than any other terrorist threat.

We MUST have a two-party system in which both parties compromise, and in which all Americans have a voice and representation. Any deal MUST be a compromise with a balanced approach of shared sacrifice in order to represent the nation as a whole. As the President asked, can Republicans say YES to anything? Can they understand the concept of representation of the entire nation, and that it's not just about them and what they want?

3) The debt ceiling should not, and cannot be used to hold America hostage, not now, not ever again. This alone is despicable anti-American behavior. This alone has further hurt economic recovery. There can be no more uncertainty with incremental ties to the debt ceiling. Triggers of other kinds are the only possibility.

Anyone or faction or Party that ignores the above is treasonous and must be dismantled if not by law than by the voters in 2012. Kick the Tea Party terrorists out! Look at the recall elections, look at the plummeting approval ratings, look at the rulings against social engineering legislation. It begins now!

Well said "TP". Folks are so blind on either side at times. But what is clear is that the republicans have since its inception has tried to destroy medicare and SS. I'm sick of Boehner getting close to tears when he talks about people in his district distraught that they may have to pay more taxes - these are rich people, not working class people. Basically every senator and probably close to 50% of congress comprise rich people, give me a break, they wouldn't know what its like to struggle for anything, they never have. Term limits for all politicians. Our founding fathers warned us of the "career politicians"...

I looked at Obama's Budget projections for the next 10 years (a), and here are the results;

Obama projects spending $47.315 Trillion over the next 10 years (2012 – 2021), an increase of $17.485 Trillion above the level of spending by 'Big spender' Bush in his last fiscal year in office (2008). That's an increase of 59% in spending above the 2008 level, and an increase of 98% above Bush's average level of spending.

Obama projects the National Debt increasing to $26.346 Trillion (vs $10.025 Trillion for Bush's last fiscal year in office - 2008), an increase of $16.321 Trillion.

Does it not seem strange that Obama, while saying 'We must be more fiscally responsible”, can't seem to find even 5% of that huge level of spending to cut, and demonizes anyone that tries?

(a) - See the White House Budget for 2012 – Tables S-1 and S-14. The link is below;

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/omb/budget/fy2012/assets/tables.pdf

NorthstarDFL "So, Brian, no tax dollars are being used in this deal."

While much of what you say is true, the Export/Import bank is an agency of the federal government, and any guarantees made by them make the American taxpayer liable for any losses.

But it still begs the question;

"Why is the Obama Administration guaranteeing a $2 Billion loan for Brazil to 'deep water' drill in the same general area that he has put under a 'drilling moratorium' for U.S. interests?"

That sounds very disingenuous, and what makes it really questionable is the fact that a huge campaign donor for the Democrats, George Soros, was a big investor in the Brazil drilling company, suggesting a 'payback' for campaign contributions.

If you had ten plans on the table and it did not agree with the Republican's plan then they would say that the Democrats didn't have a plan.If your plan is not what the GOP wants then you don't have one . I have seen at least 4 or 5 Democratic plans but the GOP keeps saying that the DEM> don't have a plan . What they mean is they don't have a plan that the GOP can agree with . We need a plain that requires some revenues and if we don't get it then I say let us default. I am tired of the DAM Republicans demanding everything .

You bring up some excellent points Jody...

You have morons in the House (tea baggers), who don't even understand the basic concept of 'debt' & 'deficit' & these rookies are holding the global economy hostage!

My concern is it might already be to late - we'll know if that's true when the markets open...

My 'stomach' tells me at this point we're in a lose/lose situation.

I pray I'm wrong...

Anyone else catch Sen. Chuck Hagle on MTP this morning?

He reminded me of the good old days, PRIOR to what's masquerading as Republicans today, you know the ones who have mainstreamed CRAZY!

The unnecessary crises, (yes, I meant plural) have been brought to us by your religious icon, a totally inept, incompetent narcissist who could not run a lemonade stand, let alone this country.

Ask some of the democrats booted out of office because there was a "crisis"- and they just HAD to ram through a trillion dollars of stimulous RIGHT THIS MINUTE. Of course, it could wait three days to get signed, because he needed to fly to Colorado to sign it- and these things take some time to arrange.

They did that against the will of the electorate- but, hey, Obama's bundlers had been promised a lot of money, and they had to get paid.

Then there was the HCR- another thing rammed down the throats of an unwilling electorate.

Not to mention the non-hostile "kinetic military action" in Libya- he did not even pause before hopping aboard SF1 to Rio. Hey, he had Samba lessons waiting!

Unemployment would be 12% had BLS not unceremoniously dumped millions out of the labor force. Even with that "help", it's 9.2%, and headed up, not down.

Growth for the second quarter is going to be worse than the first, and the third ain't looking too good, either.

So, you have your little book of speeches to help you over your doubts.

The majority of the country does not have doubts, however.

They know Obama is a disaster.

And a liar.

"I pray I'm wrong..."

___________________________

No worries, Betty, you are. Too bad you can't see the fact that, in the long run, capitalism wins and socialism loses.

Maggie Thacher said it best: "The only problem with socialism is that eventually you run out of other peoples money to spend."

Amen Jody.

Repubs are looking at this debt ceiling thing as if they are experiencing it for the first time. Repubs are also looking at deficits as if they were unaware of their existence before January 21, 2009.

Suddenly repubs have gotten religion they didn't know they had before the date cited above. It merely took a Democrat in the White House to alter their outlook. Now,....suddenly,....they're deficit hawks and "fiscal conservatives". Now,....suddenly,....the republican deficits that repubs voted into existence to enrich Haliburton's (and their own) coffers threaten the nation's economy. Now,....suddenly,....we gotta' do something: cannibalize the middle class! For their own good of course.

Milton Friedman's "Disaster Capitalism" has been implemented to exploit the economic situation for entitlement destruction,....I mean "reform".

I seriously think that repub heads will roll in November.

Feisty. Chuck Hagel is one of my favorite republicans; wish he was still in the Senate.

Always find the socialism rants to be darts thrown at a board in the hope of scoring a point without realizing the board is solid plastic and nothing will stick. They cannot name one country that is a pure democracy. I doubt they can explain what democracy means. The conservatives' problem is a failure to understand the difference between good socialism and bad socialism and there is a huge difference. Public education, public roads, fire and police officers, garbage collection, snow removal, NFL football stadiums, professional baseball parks, city parks, municipal swimming pools are all good socialism--we each pay small amounts for the benefits.

Ya no jo just because you dislike President Obama doesn't make you the majority. You are so sure of your argument you have to bring in imaginary people who agree with you to make your point.

I have no doubt in your circle of friends the majority agree with you. Everyone I have talked to are worried about what the crazy republicans are trying to do.

GOPExtinct. Good points from you, too. The most frustrating thing to me has been this complete amnesia by republicans who didn't pay for anything during Bush's presidency, raised the debt ceiling 7 times without a peep, added a huge financial burden to Medicare with their unfunded Rx plan and the list goes on. The Tea Party was nowhere to be found from 2001-2008.

Jody said: What annoys me most is the unnecessary crisis created by republicans

Tell me Jody... in all wisdom and insight, what have the democrats been doing for 6 years? Tell me what Obama has been doing about the debt ceiling for 2 1/2 years? Haven't the democrats held majority? Didn't they, for 2 years have enough votes to avert this? You blame republicans without cause. You blame republicans without seeing the big picture. The democrats own this! They aren't doing anything to help the situation... they don't want to reduce spending, all they want to do is increase taxes... meaning you pay for them sending $1 BILLION to Brazil for THEIR oil exploration. Money we didn't have in the first place but are more than happy to pay the interest on... FOR WHAT??? So you can blame republicans?

Americans First - The crazy republicans do not want to increase taxes on anyone. They want to reduce spending. This might be their only chance to force the democrats hands into complying with the wishes of those people who put them into office. Yeah, that's right... people voted for those crazy republicans do to exactly what they are doing. People you don't understand... and people that have the good of this country in mind. Spending must be controlled. It is out of hand...

I have heard that spending thing before. Do you realize that the tax cuts are increased spending? We don't have that money we have to borrow it.

So if you really are against increased spending the tax cuts should be the first thing to go, unless you aren't as concerned as you would have one believe.

That's convoluted thinking Americans First... the theory you are trying to portray is... since Americans aren't paying as much in taxes (for over 10 years) the government is going broke. You really think this, don't you? This is your hinging point on raising taxes...

In 2010, Tax revenues were $2.381 Trillion, Mandatory Spending was $2.173 Trillon and discretionary spending was $1.378 Trillion. Even if we raised taxes on everyone above the $250,000 threshold, we still wouldn't reach the discretionary spending amount. Not when you consider the government increased spending in over 38 budget categories. Mandatory spending was up 14.9%. Discretionary spending was up 13.8%, even though inflation wasn't but about 2.1%.

Let's face it, the government is wasteful. Why shouldn't they be? They are spending money they don't have to account for. Not when you are normally in a situation where the debt ceiling can be raised at will.

Another thing, we wouldn't be in this situation if Obama didn't go after stimulus money and porkulus money. They totaled approximately $1.3 trillion. The party is over... the stimulus is gone. The money has been spent and the national treasury is broke. Spending is out of control.

Excellent points BrianB. I've never met a politician that didn't like a spending program, especially those that assured him/her of re-election. What senator or representative from either side of the aisle hasn't come home with large pieces of the taxpayer pork for those that elect him?

Now we have the petulent President taking his ball and going home since the big kids won't play with him. The big kids can't agree on the simplicity of spending versus revenue.

Does anyone else not see a problem with big government reducing size and waste? Or big government being forced to support budgets like private industry must?

But we can all cry about which party is accountable for this mess we are in, and at the end of the day, one near day, the budget issue will be resolved. And each side will stand up for being the good guy to save the debt ceiling and budget, but the taxpayers will again have difficulty sitting down, for their posteriors will have felt another turn of the screw.

It's time to remove from office, those professional politicians who haven't a clue about who they are employed by, or who is supplying the funds they like to spend.

It appears President Obama, and the left leaning posters on First Read are the only ones still thinking increasing taxes is a good thing.

Steny Hoyer was on the radio Friday morning and he said: "No one thinks that raising taxes while the economy is fragile is a good idea." (paraphrasing)

Even Steny Hoyer gets it.

Brian B. Democrats have not been in power for 6 years. They won the House and Senate in 2006, took office in 2007, Obama won in 2008, GOP won back the House in 2010. The debt ceiling was raised 7 times while Bush was in office. So, tell us Brian, what did the republicans do for the 6 years they had total control of Congress and the White House (2001 through 2006) besides unfunded deficit spending and doubling the debt. The debt ceiling has always been raised as a "clean" bill. If we want to talk fault, why didn't republicans demand spending cuts from President George W. Bush? Not a peep, not a whisper, not a sound but crickets.

Geez, Brian--the debt ceiling is never raised UNTIL it is necessary--you don't raise it just to raise it.

If the democrats didn't want to decrease spending, why then have those in Congress and our President spent so much time talking with republicans on how to do it? Contrary to the right-wing propaganda machine, democrats understand that deficit spending must be controlled and decreased.

Well, Asian markets just opened in Sydney, Seoul and Tokyo with no Barry "grand bargain" in the U.S., and they are down about 0.5%, just another Monday blues day.

Say, what if the American Dem govt gave a big default party and the world "yawned"??

It would support my reluctant contention that America's "exceptionalism" is a 20th century relic and we are now well on our way to the socialist mediocracy of former world powers like Spain, France and England.

Sad, but likely true.

You blame republicans without cause. You blame republicans without seeing the big picture. The democrats own this!

No Brian. If you were at all intellectually honest you would admit that repubs popped this debt ceiling surprise nonsense at the first opportunity they had a voting majority in the House, which is where budgets originate per the Constitution.

Before this the repubs could not put the country into crisis.

Be honest. It'll suit you better.

Just because you spout some unchallenged fiction about your partisan fantasies does not make them true.

I'll challenge them.

You guys must REALLY have a high opinion of me, but I have to tell you, it's not JUST me

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/president_obama_job_approval-1044.html

Pay careful attention to what has come in in the last week.

I do not understand how it is that people will stick with a politician whose every single policy has exacerbated every single issue. . .

And I really don't understand worshipping a man- and a man who is so self absorbed he could cynically lie about his own dying mother.

You are in a shrinking minority- and I hope you never get another opportunity to foist someone this disastrous on this country again. I thought Carter was bad. . .

Just how economically illiterate-make that economically suicidal--do you have to be to launch the eye-watering expensive Obamacare program (not to mention the bailouts and the "stimulus" spending that's directed almost entirely to government workers-just what hard-pressed taxpayers need, more government worker to be kept wallowing in pork) in the midst of the biggest financial crisis American has seen since the 1930s? Just how does recklessly expanding America's debt to the point of near bankruptcy and raising taxes on the productive sector of the economy serve any useful propose? No wonder economist Arthur Laffer is predicting the double dip recession (I think its a continuation, not a second recession) The recovery won't begin till Obama is out of office and never let a liberal try to tell you otherwise.

Letting Harry solve this problem is like letting the fox organize the chickens!

The irony is that our current situation was largely created by the liberals with their obamacare, and failed- but very expensive stimulus bills... excuse me QEI, II, and III.... have to be politically correct here... but given the results they could easily been given the names Titanic I, II, and III. And here we debate the effectiveness dirty Harry will have in these negotiations! Poppycock!

Mark from Lake Tahoe, Bill T from USA, you are both wrong:

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=3036

http://www.wweek.com/portland/article-17350-9_things_the_rich_dont_want_you_to_know_about_taxes.html

http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2011/06/07/238653/animation-tax-cuts-deficit-debt/

The problem is the right-wing fringe, such as the KKK, or John Birch-type conspiracy theorists, or militia movement (think the Oklahoma City bombing), that are always out there under one name or another. Right now they call themselves the Tea Party. These people want to see a complete collapse with their misguided belief that they could then force their "new system" on the nation.

The majority of the nation rejected extremists like Christine O'Donnell, Sharron Angle, etc. in 2010, including moderate Republicans and Independents. Even now Palin knows she can't win, and Bachmann is going to go the same way. The voters, or per Norquist's reference to "taxpayers" don't want anything to do with his 20-year effort to destroy our governmental system.

Eventually things will correct (2012), but let's hope we can prevent these saboteurs from succeeding in the meantime.

TruePatroit pretty much just said that Republicans are terrorist, really dude?

Yeah, really. The Teabaggers are @#$%&! in the head.

Paul, pay no attention to "TP", he's just another misguided libtard that lives by Al Gore's premise that "We're all capable of mistakes, but I do not care to enlighten you on the mistakes we may or may not have made". lol!

Conservatives, on the other hand prefer George Washington's view that "Government is not reason; it is not eloquence, it is force. Like fire, it is a dangerous servant and a fearful master." Now George was a 'true patriot'!

Harry Reid is a bully and taxation is essentially theft by big bully government, We're for power to the people!

Taxation is now theft in wing land.

You mean power to the rich. As soon as they are done destroying the rest of America you are next. Our government is the only thing standing in the way of the rich raping America.

They claim to love war vets and then throw vets out on the streets, I watched them do it under Gov. Reagan and then elected him to president to spread the unjust pain all over American instead of just in California.

You just voted for them and you think you will be treated any better. Open your eyes this has never been about the people, just how much the republicans can fool the people.

I remember 2010 being all about the jobs that the Democrats did not produce. The republican answer is to try and cause a depression that will kill more jobs.

Somehow this got twisted in your mind that this depression would be good for the people. More lost jobs, more houses go back to the bank, more small businesses close, more people lose 401k money. The rich swoop in and get everything at bargain prices. I know us libtards aren't very smart, but exactly how is this good for America?

My thinking is, perhaps its time to bring back the Gullitoine. The new American aristocrats are due for a comeuppance.

______________________________

Amy: I thought liberals were opposed to violence as a solution, and against capital punishment??

Sounds like you would like to see some conservatives savagely murdered by a mob of liberals to satisfy your bloodlust??

Fiesty and Amy,

Yes I saw MTP this am. Hagel's look, while the new freshman Teaparty spouted his talking points, was priceless. It was a great contrast of then and now. the youhng guy couldn't admit what Hagel was talking about the value of compromise.His only answer was his commitment to the district he came from in IL.

Meanwhile, the debt ceiling is being held hostage by the teaparty in the Republican caucus. Their political caculation is blowing up in their face. We will have hint of what the markets will say the foreign markets open for business later on toady.

I thought liberals were opposed to violence as a solution

Not this one

I am against violence, but sometimes fantasy when it is about the right people can be pleasurable.

Jody & Northstar - Agree on Hagel.

Plus he's not hard on the eyes! ;o)

Obama's so-called raise in discretionary spending is MOSTLY the result of putting the cost of our wars back on the books,

Yeah No Jo. I'm sure your "fearless leader" didn't want to burden you with that information. It worked.

Fancy That- the costnof the stimulous is now $840 billion- headed to a trillion.

And, fears, the wars were funded with continuing resolutions, (like the entire government for the entirety of the Obama era), but they WERE counted at the fiscal years' ends. Go take a look at the deficits for those years-
They were, indeed, the good old days.

I realize that I have addressed this before, have posted links, and you continue to post the same lies over and over. Then again, your idol is a liar, so I suppose it is a central tenet of your religion.

It is not selling. You are losing followers by the hour.

Amy is now so far around the bend, she can no longer see it.

Guillotines? Tell ya what- wait until Obama starts telling you you can fly. You'll all break limbs jumping off your roofs.

Take a little gander at the latest polls- you'll find them on realclearpolitics. Your idol is at 42% approval on Gallup- and he is 9 points down on CNN, while BOEHNER is 11 points approval over disapproval.

Stick to making fun of the disabled, Amy. It's the only area where you have an competence.

Kind of like your hero.

Sounds like you are giving me permission to tease YOU No Jo, because you're certainly a few points shy of normal.

Republicans have given up pretending they care what voters think. That's what's really chilling.

You too Amy! I have been feeling this since the Koch/ALEC/Walker agenda came down in Wisconsin. Feels like the repubs know something that we don't. Takes me back to that video of Jeb and Dubya kickin' back on the eve of the election.

Dubya said that his winning was in the bag. You can see in a person's face whether it is just trash talking, or whether they really feel that way. Bush was 100% certain, and this was way, way more than just the standard pre-election statement of confidence. Bush knew that behind the scenes, a rigged victory was already being engineered for him.

Dubya' was ABSOLUTELY sure he'd win in 2004. Behind him a knowing smirk cracked Jeb's face from ear to ear. He was sure too. They knew about the rigged voting machines, and the rigged SCOTUS justices as their fall back plan. This thing was already over. Holding that pesky election was just a pesky theatrical formality.

I think that the repubs no longer need John or Jane Q. Public to vote for them. I think Citizen's United will give them all the fuel they need.

However, I think the huge groundswell of pent-up Progressive ire will produce a lob-sided number of votes for Obama. I know I'm infuriated, and motivated. I think repubs can rig and turn marginal races, but Progressive vote tsunamis like the one gathering on the repubs in 2012 will be impossible for them to stop,....even with their funding.

The poetic beauty of it is that the famous republican arrogance won't allow them to see it until the wave has already crashed over them. The gains the repubs expect in 2012 not only won't materialize, but they may actually lose quite a few.

Just my feelings, but the repub dismissal of the voting block unnerves me too.

One other thing. I think that the corporatocracy that runs this country are now taking the next logical step. They are learning how to install their agenda WITHOUT bribing politicians. They are doing it by installing their corporate representatives DIRECTLY into state offices.

You only need look at the large crop of ex-CEO's installed in governorships: Rick Scott, Rick Snyder, Carly Fiorina, Meg Whitman, lady wrestler CEO in N.C., etc...The corporatocracy is evolving PAST the need for politicians. What will repubs do when they learn they've been displaced?

Just my dos centavos.

GOPisExtinct

I gathered signatures for a petition to reinstate same day voter registration last week. The Republican legislature in Maine recently repealed the policy we have had for 38 years with no problems, of allowing people to register on election day. This petition is to put it to a referendum. I was heartened by the fact everyone wanted to sign it. Even my Republican co-worker, the only one I asked who didn't sign, said she "wasn't sure" how she felt about it, which I took to mean she knew the Republicans just changed the policy to keep down the number of young people voting, and that is wrong.

I'm a pretty shy person, an introvert, and asking people for their signature, or calling people from a phone bank, or ringing doorbells, is not my idea of fun, but gosh darn it, I will do it, because the Republicans on the state and national level are selling our country to the special interests, and they must be stopped.

Amy,

I find you to be a Patriot of the highest order! You passed hundreds of people on the street that day, but you had two things they lacked: a passion and a purpose. You used them both to effect meaningful change for people you have never even met. How many people will benefit because of what you dared to do? Probably a lot, and many may not give you the time of day in return, but know this thing: YOU CHANGED YOUR STATE FOR THE BETTER.

Rosa Parks was a reserved person too, but there dawned a day when she simply couldn't take it anymore. She fought in the same way that Mohandas Ghandi, Rev. Dr. Martin Luther King, Jr. and Jesus fought, and with the same powerful result. The seed of an idea was planted, and it grew.

One of the greatest tourist attractions in the Midwest is Henry Ford's Greenfield Village and Museum. A history buff, Henry Ford bought and restored many of America's greatest artifacts outside the Smithsonian in Dearborn, Michigan. In addition to the chair Lincoln sat in when he was assassinated, and the limousine Kennedy rode in when he was shot, there sits a bus, THE bus.

A few years ago they managed to track down the very bus Rosa Parks sat down in at a junkyard in Alabama. Nobody dared hope that it still existed. They restored it to original condition. You can sit in the seat that launched the civil rights movement in America. I MEAN YOU CAN ACTUALLY SIT IN THE SEAT!! Every person who is denied justice and equality because of their gender, race or creed should make a pilgrimage to that seat!

Next time I visit the Henry Ford I'm going to do it, before they put the seat inside the same type of glass case where Lincoln's chair now sits.

Humble origins. A tired seamstress, a Georgia preacher, a Jewish carpenter, a disgusted Indian, and a reserved lady in Maine.

Of such things movements are made.

What funding? The Republicans are lagging in campaign contributions, and for a very good reason. Even Wall Street is pissed.

You guys are so blind you can't even see that the free lunch is going to rich.

This smaller government you are so proud of supporting means @!$%# to you, I mean that is all you will get and the rich get to kick the government out of their way to rape America like you have never seen.

They want to end regulations of any kind. Who needs clean air and water, after all we don't need to breath.

They want to move in and cut the parks down of any valuable trees.

Drill oil anywhere, environment be damned.

Sell all national treasures, parks etc. to their rich friends.

Sell highways to the rich and make all roads toll roads.

End safety regulations on jobs.

They want to end unions and any other benefits earned in America. Soon their plan is to have a population so desperate they will work for what they pay the Mexican workers.

This is just the beginning of the list, is this really what you are dreaming of?

At the risk of being really redundant . . .

From 1970 to 2000, the average rise in compensation (adjusted for inflation, etc.) for all income earners was $0.05/hr over the entire 30 years. Over the same 30 years, the average rise in compensation for the top 1% of those same income earners was $646.00/hour . . . every single year.

It's obvious that we shouldn't ask those poor people in the top 1% of income earners to sacrifice anything to help this country, we need to make sure the other 99% bear all of the burden. After all, the bottom 99% get the equivalent of a whole nickle more an hour than they did in 1970, they can afford it more than the upper 1% who only got the equivalent of $19,380.00 per hour more than in 1970.

And its only gotten worse since 2000, due to the Bush tax cuts.

At the risk of being really redundant . . .

No my friend. You cannot underscore that point enough! You have my leave to publish those salient facts all the way through till next week. I will be "up north" as we call it in Petoskey, Michigan when all this goes down. I think I'm going to bring my shotgun. Maybe I'll take advantage of all those CCW laws repubs rammed through. Sorry repubs,..... but you armed Liberals too.

As you so artfully state in post #7 below, perhaps this is the artificially-engineered crisis the repubs sought to produce in order to pass their hitting the "RESET" button on America. They seek anarchy, chaos. How many riots will this hot summer produce?

This is where they get to remake America in their image: this time WITHOUT any social safety nets, or government regulation on our poor, poor oppressed noble business class.

I actually heard a Republican on MTP say the only thing that happened when Minnesota's government shut down recently was that people couldn't get fishing licenses. He implied it wouldn't be a big deal if the federal government shut down.
I really wonder if his constituents would have voted for him if they had known what contempt he held for the government they were electing him to serve in.

Not only that, Amy, a state economy is not even close to the same thing as a federal economy. I'll bet all of the state employees who were not working and were not getting a paycheck would have a very different view about 'the only thing that happened'. What a moron that person was.

Amy, that Republican tea party person is totally misinformed. During our 20 day of state shutdown:22,000 people were not working. Not only fishing licenses, but nursing, teacher, insurance, attorney, doctor's, drivers state licenses could not be obtained or renewed. All state parks were closed, state construction sites were shut down,no new contracts could be signed with pending businesses. Only essential services were still running. People had to go to court to petition that PCA for the disabled, state payment for child care, and group home attendants be funded during the shutdown. they did indeed receive essential service status.

It was not pretty. I can only believe what would happen at the federal level. People are clueless about the chaos it will create.

Thanks for that look through the crystal ball Northstar!! Minnesota's experience is a good "canary in a coal mine" to what is about to happen to us.

I myself am kind of glad this is happening in a way.

The Tea Party is a group of self-absorbed people who are bent on showcasing what they feel is the irrelevance of government and government function.

Instead of advancing their cause they may well showcase how many essential services and functions local and Federal government performs.

Sane people will grow to appreciate them more.

Like Joni Mitchell sang: "You don't know whatcha' got till it's gone...."

Thanks, Silver Flyer.

GREAT POSTS MATTHEW!!!!

Same as Silver Flyer and GOPisextinct, terrific posts Matthew.

GOP........t

Remember,

There is a class of people who, no matter how much they can give away to buy their votes and stay in office, no matter the detriment to America, will whine and cry and bitch (even though they had FULL control of BOTH houses for over 2 dismal years... oh yeah that was Bush's fault too) and jammed THE worst piece of crap legislation (Obutma care) to EVER get passed down the American's people throat, who will refuse to do whats right (how about a balanced budget... hell how about a budget to begin with?) and on and on and on............

We call those people - Democrats.

LAURA - - the only deal on the table is the one the GOP proposed....

your buddies have been AWOL in the entire responsibility, accountabolity, debt CRISIS....

Yeah...funny! The only deal the repubs have made is we get everything we want... and if we don't we let the country go down. President Obama agreed to more than what they asked for, but since he asked for something the deal was off the takble. The only ones repubs answer to are Norquist and his pledge and they forgot that they swore a pledge to the American people.

It's almost as if the Republicans don't want spending cuts, maybe because it will cut into their own pork. We're so used to hearing Republican politicians talk about cutting spending, we forget it was their spending that drove up the debt.

Gregor you ignorant slut. Each can have their own arguments, but facts or facts.

We do not get to change the facts.

"B King" - You're right, under GWB job creation was the worst since Eisenhower! Tax breaks abounded and he cut taxes on the rich, got rid of a lot of regulations and what did that get us? Where was the economic explosion that republicans always promise when they constantly cut taxes? All we got was a huge budget deficit, unpaid tax cuts and two wars. Corporations are sitting on almost $2T in capital now and continuing their strategies of downsizing and outsourcing and using their balance sheets to manipulate stock prices. You wanna get your stock price up? Cut jobs, consolidate management structures and outsource - Our system rewards "job killers"... Term limits for all politicians - our founding fathers warned us of the "career politicians"...