"Corporate masters", is that what it is to you Feisty?

It's not about massive debt? Not about massive spending? Not about massive government expansion in the middle of a huge recession? Not about THREE record deficit spending budgets? Not about over TWO YEARS since Democrats have even put forward a budget for this country? Not about a massive welfare program that was passed based on lies, locked doors, and "social justice" that not only is going to cost us Trillions of dollars but also takes away your CHOICE on your own health care and CHOICE on your own doctor? Not about massive payoffs to public employee and teachers unions? Not about bailing out auto unions? Not about the massive intrusion of government into our lives, to the point that even now it's being discussed in the White House to put forward "mileage" legislation that will FORCE every American that wants to drive to buy a battery powered vehicle within the next 20 years? Not about the lies, bribes, payoffs, paybacks, and out and out corruption the past two years?

Nope, it's all about "corporate masters". You know, the "corporate masters" who provided the MILLIONS of jobs in this country before being forced out by over-regulation, over-taxation, and over-unionization. The "corporate masters" that people like you demonize for actualy doing what they are supposed to do, make money for the millions of people that own stock in those companies.

And why would you have ANY problem with showing identification before voting Feisty? Do you have a problem showing identification when you write a check, or use a credit card? Oh wait, that's not the "same" is it? After all, having to show identification to spend money is different than voting and having the possibility to actually CHANGE who "represents" you in government.

Are you that full of hate for this nation Feisty that you actually AGREE with people voting multiple times in elections, or having people that aren't even supposed to be in this country actually voting on who is going to represent YOU?

MCM....In just two years Democrats have not only added over 5 Trillion dollars to our debt, they've committed this country to another TWELVE TRILLION dollars more in the next decade.

Name calling does not show how "intelligent" you are by the way. It just shows that you have NO ability to actually debate with any success.

But of course I'll be standing by for your "brilliant" personal attack on me. After all, that's the ONLY thing you on the left have left anymore. Hate, filth, racism, and lies is the only thing you think works.

Hi Feisty,

There is going to be a march by thousands to deliver the over 700,000 signatures to overturn the antiunion law (SB-5). They gathered 3 times the number needed with nearly a month to spare before the deadline.

John Kasich attempted to have the Republican SoS, john Husted (same as above) break the measure into 5 different issues on the ballot in an attempt to confuse voters but the SoS told the Governor that would be illegal.

Feisty,

You know, as well as anyone with an ounce of common sense, that, it's not about voter suppression, it's about "illegal" voter suppression. .............and it's about damn time.

See You Next Tuesday!

Dave,

That is factually wrong. The number of people get past voter registration to cast a fraudulent vote is nearly zero.

The Republican SoS of Ohio: “I would rather have no bill than one with a rigid photo identification provision that does little to protect against fraud and excludes legally registered voters’ ballots from counting.”

The Ohio SoS also makes it clear that there is no problem with voter fraud in Ohio.

Let's put it this way. If I went to any city in any state that passes voter ID and said I'd stand on the corner of Main and Elm and give $100.00 to anyone who could provide me with a state issue ID that didn't already have one before, I'd run out of money very fast, everywhere I went.

It's all about priorities.

I live in Columbus, and even if this legislation gets passed, it will be OVERTURNED either in a repeal, OR tossed out by the State Supreme Court. A petition to repeal Ohio SB5, (legislationpassed by the Republican legislature in an effort to end collective bargaining for fire, police, and teachers) has ALREADY collected nearly 4 times as many signatures of Ohio voters than it needs to get on the ballot this November.

Most Ohioans KNOW that this lame attempt by the Republicans is SOLEY intended to DISENFRACHISE voters as a pretense to solve a voting fraud issue that doesn't even exist. Even the Republicans own Secretary of State says so........

Dennis, what do you mean by "nearly zero", 500? 1000? 2000? The majority of voters, in the U.S., consider it a privledge to vote and have no problem showing proper ID. The number that have a problem with it? I would guess, nearly zero.

CherylLM

Congratulations on making one of the most coherant, poigniant posts I've seen on First Read.

Elvis doesn't think so, but from his posts, thinking isn't his strong suit.

ID is required to do almost anything. I don't know why it was never a voting requirement before. Why are the democrats so against this? What did the left expect as a reaction to the widespread voter and voter registration fraud in the 2008 elections? Shall we just bury our heads in the sand and forget ACORN and the multiple states that filed lawsuits because they were democrats?

If Citizens United was out registering republicans in the same manner, Feisty would be screaming about it. The hypocritical double standard from the left is jaw dropping.

Dave,

While everyone would want it to be zero we all know that is a great goal but will never be achieved. As for the number or percentage you should ask the Republican SoS, he made that remark as did our last SoS. What I recall from the 2008 election they believed there to be less than 1 fraudulent vote for every 1 million votes cast (0.000001%).

Voter ID requirements hit the poorest since they are also the most transient people of all. How? Address doesn't match their current one exactly. Maybe they moved from Cali to Oregon recently and had no money to get new ID. Will provisions be made to provide the poor with free birth certificates and IDs. If not you have a poll tax don't you? How about the Latin Americans? Their names are very long and they have to cut their names short because of State IT issues. So their names never match and are often times misspelled by the state, not they themselves. Either require the "whole" name and quit allowing states to use IT as an excuse. Also with Latin Americans you disenfranchise the Middle Eastern, Russian, Ukranian, Asian and some European citizens because Americans just don't seem to care to spell things correctly when registering. You know I'm correct about this. People get tired of arguing all the time with clerks about getting their names spelled correctly. I've given up many times with my maiden name. Glad I married a short American named individual. This is why Republicans want strict ID laws. They disenfranchise all American Citizens who are not Smith or Jones.

There is hardly any voter fraud going on by people voting that shouldn't be. There have been studies which show that fraud by voters is not a major problem.

States Rigging 2012 Elections?
James Joyner · Monday, June 20, 2011

E.J. Dionne has written an incendiary column titled “How states are rigging the 2012 election.”
"An attack on the right to vote is underway across the country through laws designed to make it more difficult to cast a ballot. If this were happening in an emerging democracy, we’d condemn it as election-rigging. But it’s happening here, so there’s barely a whimper.
The laws are being passed in the name of preventing “voter fraud.” But study after studyhas shown that fraud by voters is not a major problem — and is less of a problem than how hard many states make it for people to vote in the first place. Some of the new laws, notably those limiting the number of days for early voting, have little plausible connection to battling fraud.
These statutes are not neutral. Their greatest impact will be to reduce turnout among African Americans, Latinos and the young. It is no accident that these groups were key to Barack Obama’s victory in 2008 — or that the laws in question are being enacted in states where Republicans control state governments.
That Republicans are passing laws that they have long favored is hardly shocking. It’s true that there’s little evidence of voter fraud, at least in the form of people voting twice or showing up claiming to be someone else in order to vote. But it’s also true that there’s real fear of these things and that there’s wide support for making those theoretically easy things harder.
So, what, precisely, is happening?
The laws in question include requiring voter identification cards at the polls, limiting the time of early voting, ending same-day registration and making it difficult for groups to register new voters.
Sometimes the partisan motivation is so clear that if Stephen Colbert reported on what’s transpiring, his audience would assume he was making it up. In Texas, for example, the law allows concealed handgun licenses as identification but not student IDs. And guess what? Nationwide exit polls show that John McCain carried households in which someone owned a gun by 25 percentage points but lost voters in households without a gun by 32 points.
Besides Texas, states that enacted voter ID laws this year include Kansas, Wisconsin, South Carolina and Tennessee. Indiana and Georgia already had such requirements. The Maine Legislature voted to end same-day voter registration. Florida seems determined to go back to the chaos of the 2000 election. It shortened the early voting period, effectively ended the ability of registered voters to correct their address at the polls and imposed onerous restrictions on organized voter-registration drives.
Student IDs are simply an indication of being in school; they don’t signify residency. Indeed, university towns have long taken measures to make it difficult for students to vote, since the massive number of people who are only transient parts of the community can easily overwhelm the resident population at the polls.
Similarly, registration drives sponsored by organizations with a specific political agenda (as opposed to League of Women Voters-type civic groups) raise some red flags. They can yield massive numbers of spur-of-the-moment registrations, often under peer pressure, and are harder to vet that traditional in-person registration which require formal proof of address. But it’s hard to get too excited about them in an era of mail-in registration, which eliminates those safeguards, anyway.
Registration requirements are more problematic. We’re one of the few countries that make registering to vote and voting distinct processes. Having to take the time to get registered used to be an onerous barrier, although Motor Voter more-or-less eliminated the obstacles. And there’s an argument to be made that registration lists ought be set in advance–thus some cut-off is needed; but digital information systems should really eliminate that as an objection.
Are these reforms are aimed at suppressing the black and youth votes? I’d have to see substantially more evidence. But they seem to be aimed at theoretical problems that those who study such things can’t find in the wild."

There is hardly any voter fraud going on by people voting that shouldn't be. There have been studies which show that fraud by voters is not a major problem.

States Rigging 2012 Elections?
James Joyner · Monday, June 20, 2011

E.J. Dionne has written an incendiary column titled “How states are rigging the 2012 election.”
"An attack on the right to vote is underway across the country through laws designed to make it more difficult to cast a ballot. If this were happening in an emerging democracy, we’d condemn it as election-rigging. But it’s happening here, so there’s barely a whimper.
The laws are being passed in the name of preventing “voter fraud.” But study after studyhas shown that fraud by voters is not a major problem — and is less of a problem than how hard many states make it for people to vote in the first place. Some of the new laws, notably those limiting the number of days for early voting, have little plausible connection to battling fraud.
These statutes are not neutral. Their greatest impact will be to reduce turnout among African Americans, Latinos and the young. It is no accident that these groups were key to Barack Obama’s victory in 2008 — or that the laws in question are being enacted in states where Republicans control state governments.
That Republicans are passing laws that they have long favored is hardly shocking. It’s true that there’s little evidence of voter fraud, at least in the form of people voting twice or showing up claiming to be someone else in order to vote. But it’s also true that there’s real fear of these things and that there’s wide support for making those theoretically easy things harder.
So, what, precisely, is happening?
The laws in question include requiring voter identification cards at the polls, limiting the time of early voting, ending same-day registration and making it difficult for groups to register new voters.
Sometimes the partisan motivation is so clear that if Stephen Colbert reported on what’s transpiring, his audience would assume he was making it up. In Texas, for example, the law allows concealed handgun licenses as identification but not student IDs. And guess what? Nationwide exit polls show that John McCain carried households in which someone owned a gun by 25 percentage points but lost voters in households without a gun by 32 points.
Besides Texas, states that enacted voter ID laws this year include Kansas, Wisconsin, South Carolina and Tennessee. Indiana and Georgia already had such requirements. The Maine Legislature voted to end same-day voter registration. Florida seems determined to go back to the chaos of the 2000 election. It shortened the early voting period, effectively ended the ability of registered voters to correct their address at the polls and imposed onerous restrictions on organized voter-registration drives.
Student IDs are simply an indication of being in school; they don’t signify residency. Indeed, university towns have long taken measures to make it difficult for students to vote, since the massive number of people who are only transient parts of the community can easily overwhelm the resident population at the polls.
Similarly, registration drives sponsored by organizations with a specific political agenda (as opposed to League of Women Voters-type civic groups) raise some red flags. They can yield massive numbers of spur-of-the-moment registrations, often under peer pressure, and are harder to vet that traditional in-person registration which require formal proof of address. But it’s hard to get too excited about them in an era of mail-in registration, which eliminates those safeguards, anyway.
Registration requirements are more problematic. We’re one of the few countries that make registering to vote and voting distinct processes. Having to take the time to get registered used to be an onerous barrier, although Motor Voter more-or-less eliminated the obstacles. And there’s an argument to be made that registration lists ought be set in advance–thus some cut-off is needed; but digital information systems should really eliminate that as an objection.
Are these reforms are aimed at suppressing the black and youth votes? I’d have to see substantially more evidence. But they seem to be aimed at theoretical problems that those who study such things can’t find in the wild."

“your assumption that an ID is required for just about every transaction we do today, with the exception of voting.” I agree except for the elderly and young and don’t forget that everyone must be registered to vote so …

Who would be eliminated by requiring a picture ID at the voting booth?

Seniors that forgot to renew their Driver’s License

Seniors that surrendered their Driver’s License

Young people 18 and over that have not received a Driver’s License

Talk about BS Dave:

Dave D-1046643

You know, as well as anyone with an ounce of common sense, that, it's not about voter suppression, it's about "illegal" voter suppression. .............and it's about damn time.

The majority of voters, in the U.S., consider it a privledge to vote

So far none of of these efforts have produced any evidence of systemic voter fraud. It's a shame and a cover story for grabbing more power along with the redistricting effort. Just like the Republicans running FAKE democratic candidates in Wisconsin now and Arizona a few months ago.



I must say it's been a nice surprise lately in some of these threads to see the liberal take, take, takers getting their okoles handed to them. Here in Hawaii, a state totally controled by the Democrats for more than 40-years, it is a requirement when going to the polls to show a photo ID before they hand you a ballot. There has never been an outcry from anyone about that here. What the hell is it about you liberals that makes you fight against anything that makes a citizen prove he is one? True a fraudulent photo ID can be gotten, so let's find an even more fool proof way to check a voters status instead of trying to make it easier for those with special interests to get votes from those who should not be voting in the first place. There are real traitors amongst us.

1. A drivers license, military ID, student ID (ops, sometimes not allowed), Employment ID...these are all issued as a Privilege - not anyone can get one. This turns the Right to vote into the Privilege to vote. Its palain and simple...

1a. Do the States provide a free photo ID to any citizen and make it easy to get such an ID? If not, Voter Photo ID is unconstitutional!

1b. Do all absentee voters need to send a Photo copy of their Photo IDs?

1c. Who is actually asked to show their IDs at the polls? Everyone not known in person to the poll workers and at every polling place? HoHoHoWhoWho...it's going to be a jungle out there.

All the states that currently have photo id requirements (including new ones this year) also have an avenue for getting a free ID.

Howy, let's not forget the liberal support group Acorn, where some of their employees systemically registered voters that were dead and did not exist. Go to link below for more info. Aloha.

http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/the-complete-guide-to-acorn-voter-fraud/

Howy61,

Regarding your first comment, if there is no problem with voter fraud, what are you worried about?

Secondly, voting is a privilege we enjoy living in a free society. Do you have a problem with that?

Ronnie Retard - inherited a deficit that was under a trillion dollars , and added more than $2 trillion to that.

Yeah, but for every dollar of additional revenue his tax cuts produced Congress added almost three dollars of additional spending. Congress consisted of a House that was controlled by the democrats for all eight years of his administration and for the years in which the republicans controlled the senate they never held more than 55 seats, and we all know what gets done when the majority party holds less than sixty seats........nothing.

I'm sure it will be very difficult for you , but why don't you make at least an effort to be considerate of those who post here who have special needs children or family members.

This is a targeted nationwide agenda by the GOP, to make it harder for young voters, older voters and anyone else that might be Dem. leaning, to actually vote. Wis. passed a new law this year with Gov. Walker, the Koch Bros. shill, making it much harder for young and first time voters to register, and also shortening the early voting time, so more people will have to make it to the polls. Making it harder for working people to vote early. They have a very sinister agenda, and it will just get worse the more power they get. Wake up America.

You Kochers are soooo cute. Can I interest in one of these:

http://zapatopi.net/afdb/

To keep those nasty ol' Koch brothers away?

No, wake up, Michelle. What a moronic post.

I think you got everyone in there, but Bush.

"a bill to require voters to show a form of photo identification when they go to the polls."....um don't they already do this?

I vaguely remember voting in 08' and I'm pretty sure they asked to see my id, if not then I don't get why they wouldn't want to verify you are who you say you are.

"But Republicans argue the ID requirements are not burdensome and ask people to do no more than they'd have to do to rent a car, board a flight, or check into a motel."

There are a LOT of seniors, and a LOT of young people, that do none of the above.

This is clearly a stunt by Republicans. Hope it gets killedt there, and in the other states with radical, shallow, narrow-minded governors that yearn for "the good old days"

stunt or not this should have been a requirement since the very first election.

“Over the last 50 years, we have broken down barriers to voting,” she said, “We have eliminated literacy tests..."

I'm not so sure that's something to brag about. If you can't read, how can you make intelligent choices?

By the way - since Democrats claim that their voters are more 'educated' than Republicans, why should they have a problem with it? Hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm.

Just ask yourself this question: WHO would be excluded from voting by a requirement to show a photo ID? The answer should be obvious. It will mostly be poor people that don't have a driver's license because they can't afford a car. Now consider the fact that virtually every policy in the republican platform hurts the poor and helps the very rich. NOW do you see why republicans are suddenly so strongly in favor of voter ID requirements?

Then they should get a free ID from the state. Or is "free" to expensive for them?

In fact, I'd imagine to function in society they would need some form of ID.

Junicon

I can also see why the Democrats are in favor of NOT requiring any proof from voters that they are eligible to vote.

There were dozen of stories of people from other states registering to vote in the key state of Ohio to vote for Obama because it didn't require any proof of eligibility.

michelle-1073610

This is a targeted nationwide agenda by the GOP, to make it harder for young voters, older voters and anyone else that might be Dem. leaning, to actually vote. Wis. passed a new law this year with Gov. Walker, the Koch Bros. shill, making it much harder for young and first time voters to register, and also shortening the early voting time, so more people will have to make it to the polls. Making it harder for working people to vote early. They have a very sinister agenda, and it will just get worse the more power they get. Wake up America.

So let's see....responsible people that register to vote on time, have an ID, take voting seriously enough to plan ahead to make it to the polls vote republican.

People that don't have ID's, don't bother to register until the day of an election, can't be bothered on election day to go vote so need time to do it at their own convenience are the democrat supporters.

Oh, and the argument that it discriminates against the old and the poor is absolute BS. How do the older people pick up prescriptions without ID? I can't even buy over the counter cold medicine without a valid ID. And the poor??? They don't ask for identification at the welfare office? Or unemployment?

All this boils down to is democrats relying on the illegals voting for them.

Kasich is another Teapublican rewarding his corprate masters by any means possible, including VOTER suppression!

Let's face it Feisty, asking for a simple I.D. is not voter suppression, it's common sense. But that would interfere with helping the democrats win elections with the "illegal alien vote." Since your party wants to give illegals housing, food stamps, free education and such....you have to have a way for them to reciprocate and assist your party in it's goals, wasn't that the plan from the very beginning?

Making it easier for voter fraud to happen is un-American, and not having to prove who you are at the polls does just that.

So what about those persons who are physically disabled and are not able to get up and out to obtain an ID they will be disenfranchised.

The pre-civil rights era is OVER...get over it. Stop trying to return the country back to the bad old days!! Life was not so simple then and if you think it was, then it will never go back to being that way.

This is anti-American and anti-freedom.

I'M A DEMOCRAT, we need to check ID's before you vote... it just makes sense, this is not a partisan thing by any means! it should be law!

You'd think it would be in the interested to keep elections as fraud free as possible.

Voter ID, paper trail for electronic voting, etc. are all good as far as I am concerned.

Tell us why having to show ID is suppression Noid?

You get pulled over by a cop - you have to show ID.

Want to buy a beer - you got to show ID.

Hell around here you want to buy certain over the counter medication or video games, you have to show ID.

Of course, as with your point Mickey Mouse apparently tries to vote, but he can't because he has no ID. I also suspect he can't buy a beer.

What is the counter argument? We shouldn't have to show ID to vote because ________. Absent ID how does the poll worker verify age, address, or identity?

I seen arguments that this would disproportionally effect blacks or the old. How is that possible? Do they not have IDs? Do they not otherwise get along just fine in society?

What is the deal Noid? I'd ask Feisty, but I know better.

If your homeless you might not have an ID. If you don't drive you might not have an ID, If you are old and no longer drive you might not have an ID.

This is just a way to suppress democratic votes.

We shouldn't have to show ID to vote because ________.

Because as a US citizen, voting is not a privilege, like driving or buying a beer (or as my idiot politicians argue, to "rent a car, board a flight, or check into a motel"); it is my guaranteed RIGHT and I should not have to do anything extra to access my rights.

In New York, when I go to vote, I don't have to show ID. I am asked to sign a page next to my name and there is a copy of my signature from my original voter registration next to where I sign. When I use my credit card I don't have to show any other ID. My signature is sufficient when matched to the signature on the back of my card. Why should my signature not be sufficient when I go to vote?

Rather than framing the argument around blacks and the elderly, let's frame the argument this way...

The most common form of photo ID is a driver's license. Well, what if you don't have a driver's license? What if you have your license revoked? What about the person who can no longer get a driver's license due to a medical condition? What do they use?

What becomes the standard for acceptable ID? Who issues it? What does it cost?

...and for bonus points, please frame the argument within the boundaries of Conservatives wanting "less government".

Eric, so all homeless people are Democrats, is that what you're saying?

And by the way, an ID is REQUIRED BY LAW in EVERY state in this country. Even the homeless are required to have some form of identification on them, and generally most do. The ones that don't are arrested, charged with vagrancy, and GIVEN an ID when they are released in this state.

And discontented, voting is a PRIVILEGE that you can either take advantage of or not. There are REQUIREMENTS to be able to vote, and it is NOT a "right". If you are felon, in most states you can't vote until you are given the right to by the law. If you are NOT a citizen of this nation, you can't vote. If you don't register, you can't vote. If you are not of resident of the area you're in you can't vote.

There is no absolute "guaranteed right" to vote, just the LAWFUL opportunity to take advantage of the privilege.

And Noid, your argument is just plain ignorant. A driver's license is NOT the only forms of identification, although you call it the most "common" form. Actually you can get state identification that has NOTHING to do with driving. And as for your "less government" stupidity, "less government" means LESS intrusion into our private lives, meaning NOT telling what kind of car we should drive, what light bulb we should use, what kind of health insurance we should have, or putting together little "lists" at the White House. But then again, you don't really care about less government in YOUR life, because the more that the government does, the more LAZY you can be about your own PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY, right?

So Eric are you saying that all homeless, old, non-drivers are Democrats?

Wow, I would have never guessed!

Noid, I don't understand the assumption that the small percentage of people that may not have Photo ID are all going to vote the Democrat ticket.

Can you explain that one to me?

Noid anyone can go to the DMV and get an ID.

I have a California driver's license. I have an Arizona ID. It was free.

Eric - that is probably not the argument you want to make. This ain't about homelessness.

And while voting is a right - yo only get to do it once, and it has to be done in the right place. So again, absent ID how do we ensure that it happens in the right place? This is not just about the Presidential election but all kinds of state, county and municipal elections.

Voter suppression is job 1 on the Republican agenda. When Republicans got the majority in Maine, they immediately repealed a policy that had been in place for 40 years, that had allowed same day registration, dispite the fact this policy has given Maine one of the highest voter turnouts in the country. Talk about a solution in search of a problem. Maine did not have one instance of voter fraud that was the result of same day registration. The purpose of repealing the policy is strictly an attempt to suppress the youth vote in Maine, which typically trends Democratic.

Actually, it is about fraud- and Ohio, with its same day registration, is probably overtaking Illinois as the voter fraud capital of the country.

Why are democrats against ID? You don't suppose they wink and smile as people go merrily from precinct to precinct, register, and vote, now, do you?

Nah.

Well, withnpoll numbers like these, it may be all they've got

http://maristpoll.marist.edu/wp-content/misc/usapolls/US110615/Obama/Complete%20June%2028,%202011%20USA%20McClatchy-Marist%20Poll%20Release%20and%20Tables.pdf

Can somebody get a message to Obama?

Job 1 Amy? Really, that's the highest priority they got?

Be that as wrongly as it may, I do like your point about the youth vote and historic trends.

Ah, the poor youth. Obama has given them health insurance through the age of 26. They get that right from their parents, just like they used to get the BINKIEs. How awesome and grown up they must feel.

Now if only Obama could got the a job. eh Amy. That's really hep.

Say Amy what is the youth unemployment rate up there in Maine?

Noid, I don't understand the assumption that the small percentage of people that may not have Photo ID are all going to vote the Democrat ticket.

Your assumption...not mine.

Now, my turn for a question...

Tell me, why is this a hot-button issue on the Republican side? Is there some rash of unregistered voters being allowed to vote or people going to vote under a false identity of which I'm not aware?

You don't suppose they wink and smile as people go merrily from precinct to precinct, register, and vote, now, do you?

Wow...you have a wild imagination.

Eric: If your homeless you might not have an ID. If you don't drive you might not have an ID, If you are old and no longer drive you might not have an ID.

And if you're an illegal alien, you might not have an ID.

Eric, in response to post, 2.2

Interesting comment. Please tell us why "it's just a way to suppress Democratic votes"?

Noid - note a hot button issue with me.

I am always surprised you don't have to show ID. Make it a mandatory requirement, like with alcohol, tobaccos, video games and everything else.

Simple and applies equally across the board.

Oh and JAS1 - any illegal alien worth their salt stole someone's ID a long time ago. They got papers.

The purpose of showing a photo I.D. at the voting booth, I imagine, would be to prove you are not attempting to vote under a dead person's registration.

What kind of organization would be required to find enough dead people still on the voter rolls and recruit people, of the correct gender, to go in and vote (the way you want them to vote) under these fraudulent names?

Talk about a solution in search of a problem. How does this prevent illegal immigrants from voting, when you have to be registered in order to vote? If an illegal has enough resources to get registered, he's got enough resources to get a photo I.D. This bill is just another way to make it harder for poorer and younger people, who trend Democratic, to vote.

Interesting what is left out of this story-

Indiana, (and Georgia), get mentioned as having voter ID laws-

But no mention of the SCOTUS ruling that Indiana's ID law was, perfectly, constitutional?

How very sloppy. You might think it was important to the story. . .

Unless you thought it would hurt your team.

Amy, you need to ask the democratic voter drive folks in Cook County, Illinois, your question,

They have the highest voter participation for corpses in the country.

AmyB, Do you even read your dopey posts, before you send them?

I suggest you try it.

Noid - note a hot button issue with me.

I am always surprised you don't have to show ID. Make it a mandatory requirement, like with alcohol, tobaccos, video games and everything else.

Simple and applies equally across the board.

Does it apply equally across the board?

First of all, there is no national voter registration and until there is one it's going to remain a States Rights issue.

Secondly, even with alcohol, tobacco, porno mags, etc. it's not a clear "across the board" issue. I'm rarely carded anymore. Why? Maybe it's because I'm on the brink of 40 and I'm starting to go gray and I'm developing some wonderful "crow's feet". As with all laws, we have developed some selective enforcement.

Which leads to the question...will they let me vote without showing the ID while they demand the card of Jose who is standing in line behind me simply because he is more likely to not be an eligible voter?

Eric is right that the "motor voter" approach will not suffice for everyone. Some seniors have not driven cars for decades. Folks in big cities like NY do not drive for obvious reasons.

In states like WI, a slew of rules: That end same-day-register-and-vote so that workers have to figure out how and when to run around and navigate waiting periods because of new ID and voting rules . New voting rules for hundreds of thousands of university students I.Ds who suddenly do not meet 'the criteria' as in WI, etc.

In Wisconsin, there were eleven fraud investigations after the 2008 election and only one turned out to be a mistaken mother/daughter case. Note that the new laws passed by Governor (Budget) Walker (R-WI) to counteract the non-existent fraud will cost around $5.7 million.

Spanky is right, this"ain't about homelessness". But if people say getting IDs are a problem then there is a problem. So instead of going into denial about it, and letting Governors litigate our backsides over it, let's find a way that really works for everyone. It is really all about citizens having access to the ballot box because it is their right.

And no, no, no, this is not about voter fraud.

Noid, not really a "Hot Button Issue" with me either. MSNBC and the Left seem all upset about it.

Not really my assumption either, one can derive from the posts of the Left that the "Voter suppression" they are so concerned about is Democratic, otherwise I think they would be all for Photo ID if it limited Republican votes. I just don't get it.

I agree, though, there are much more pressing concerns to worry about.

The bottom line is Republicans-Tea People don't won't people to vote because they don't vote the way they the Republicans-Tea People would like.

White Collar Auto,

You've posted up the "not really a Hot Button Issue for Republicans" response a few times today on different news articles.

The right to vote is a basic constitutional right for all citizens.

Da Noid, those I know that have lost their drivers license for DUI's or whatever have gotten a state ID instead so they can still go about their business. It's no big deal except to those that have something to hide or avoid.

I have a non-driver ID from NY state. You don't have to show ID to vote in NY City...

Being without proof of identity is a real handicap in our society; You can't fly, you can't leave the country, you can't even rent a hotel room. Shouldn't we be making it easier for folks to have something that is sort of a necessity so that the argument becomes academic?

Is anyone arguing that having some form of identification is bad?

Discontented Ohioan,

Voting is a privilege. You can't vote if you are in prison, have a felony, are here illegally, or, not registered to vote. What could possibly be wrong with having to prove you are, whom you say you are. Would you want someone voting under your name? I rather doubt it.

The issue with seniors who no longer drive is not really a valid argument either. My mother gave up her drivers license and she still has a state id. Most states have Division of Aging resources that can give you the information on how to obtain.

Also if Acorn can pay someone to register 72 times to vote multiple times, they should be able to pay for a state id.

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/politics/item_8dh7PaKRiPc0BFNPZVnGMM

http://www.nypost.com/p/news/politics/item_Ggcbqfy4iqN5aWlq3ozEoI

Dave D, Actually, I learned that felons can vote, at least here in this state.

Pls look up for me the data on someone voting in someone else's name....in all of US history of voting. Or even just in the last 10 years or 2 years.

RSVP. Thanks.

ksw62118, You said, "they should be able to pay for voter ID".

Poll Tax: Voter ID we're discussing may turn out to be a 21st Century poll tax. If we have to spend cash to obtain the ID permitting us to vote, then purchasing ID documents is paying to vote. This issue is addressed by amendments 14 and 24.

Which is why there are provisions for a free ID.

Badchess, to give you more info on photo ID,

In Missouri the new law, if passed, would have cost an estimated $6million for the first year, followed by $4million a year. Some states don't have sufficient federal assistance to meet the costs of photo ID.

The Georgia fee for a photo ID is between $20 and $35 unless you qualified for a waiver.

"Field investigations conducted by the voting rights groups found that eight out of eleven DHS offices surveyed were not providing voter registration applications to their clients at all, and that voter registration at the other three offices also was not being conducted in compliance with the procedures mandated by the NVRA."

http://www.atlantaprogressivenews.com/interspire/news/2011/06/19/naacp-gcpa-sue-georgia-for-neglecting-low-income-voter-registration.html

It looks like you all have a problem there in Georgia.......

Sorry, anything that has "progressive" attached to it makes it suspect to begin with and second -- filing a law suit is a long way away from proving the claims. People should prove who they say they are to be able to vote.

Maybe Eric can tell us the result of the investigations?

Also perhaps a little more detail of what happened might be helpful? How about it Eric, you want to help us all out?

Let's see if there is any room for interpretation:

“The result is that thousands of low-income Georgians have been denied the opportunity to register to vote,” Zeitler said.

Low income person: Please give me my food stamps and I want to register to vote.
Government worker: Can you please provide me with some ID so I can issue the food stamps to you?
Low income person: Here you go.
Government worker: Here you go ma'am, have a nice meal. I deny you the opportunity to register to vote.
Low income person: Really! WHY?
Government worker: Because I think you might just vote for a Democrat and I can't have that now can I?
Low income person: Well I'm just going to go down to my church, post office, city hall, DMV, police station or any other number of places to get a registration card. By they way, stop asking me to prove to you that I am who I say I am when I ask for my food stamps.

In Indiana, in order to apply for food stamps or any assistance you have to provide a birth certificate, marraige liscense, utility bills, bank statements, income tax return, any pay receipts and a photo id. I have my original voter reg. card and drivers liscense but I have also lived in the same location for almost 25 years and the voting precinct has not changed for me. However, it did change for those about 2 blocks away due to redistricting.

I think one focus would be college students that are not in their home state, and are now required to get an id with their current(school) address in order to vote. Isn't Wisconsin pulling some restrictive voting id change along those lines?

Can you imagine the uproar from Libertarians if it were the Democrats pushing for photo I.D. in order to vote? Libertarians don't want to be fined for not carrying health insurance, but they accept being required to obtain a state issued photo I.D. in order to cast a ballot?

Steve It isn't that Feisty missed the boat, her problem is that it is a Republican Governor who is doing this, if it was a Democrat Governor, it would be okay with her. I am from California, always votes democratic in the big elections and I am required to show id before I can vote, even though everyone knows everyone in our small town. You can go to dmv and get a state id for free.

In my experience only: I would say that Ohioans are a very diverse group of people from Farmer Mid-Western culture in the East , Appalachian culture to the south east and a New England culture to the Northeast (even all of the accents are very different) The one thing they all have in common is they are very smart, well read and they have a strong sense of civil liberties and freedom. THey have will not hesitate to call B.S. on politics/politicians when they are ------they pull no punches ( maybe Palin should have noted this) The only thing Ohioans hate more than liars and change is BIG BROTHER. They see this as more big brother trying to invade their lives. There are very few illegal immigrants in ohio btw. There is a very small latino population in general

It just never gets old.

I wonder how long it is until we start getting the montage ads of the Obama highlights. Like this one, or his hits on the war efforts.

Or energy.

But for me it comes down to the "Every dollar we pay in interest is a dollar that is not going to investment in America's priorities."

So true.

...and this is relevant to the discussion of voter ID because...?

I believe a great ad for the Republican nominee would be this: It starts by seeing Nero fiddling while Rome burns in the background. Then the shot fades into Obama playing golf while Washington/U.S. burns in the background. So true.

@DaNoid -- Are you serious????? Make that comment to others like Feisty, USN, Beverly, etc. who post with prepared remarks that are off topic. ROFLMAO.

@MCMetal -- I understand now. It must be a metal plate in your skull and tin foil hat.

Only a brain donor would think there is any other motive in wanting anybody and everybody, regardless of identity or legal status to vote. The term is "undocumented democrats". How long have you been a supporter of Acorn-like voter fraud?

the fact people have died to protect our right to vote should make you madder that as a "target" potential Dem voters have been repeatedly denied the right to vote. I never hear the rancor about state political parties going out of their way to deny voter rights.

"Deny voter rights" is nothing more than libspeak for refusing to look the other way and allow illegals the ability to vote.

MCMETAL If you are against voter ID to prevent voter fraud then don't complain about voter fraud.

And are you going to claim some kind of fraud wasn't foisted upon us in 2000 and 2004 ? Gimme' a break...........

I'm sorry if you don't like it, OL, but voter suppression is ILLEGAL.

There are people with no driver license, passport, or gov't issued Photo ID especially as they get older.

And if you are trying to figure out where the next meal is coming from, finding bus fair to go get a state issued id is not at the top of priority list.

In Washington State we can vote by mail - when I received my driver's license I was asked if I voted I said yes and voila my forms come weeks before the voting date with info on the candidates giving ample time to look into the various backgrounds

If you don't have a driver's license you can pick up a form at any post office or town hall fill it out, mail it in and you are registered

I've also lived and voted in New Jersey, my signature was all that was needed

I've lived in Virginia no big deal there just some form of ID not necessarily with a photo

By the way biggest voter fraud person is Mitt Romney voting out of his son's unfinished basement in Mass, why wasn't he arrested he voted twice there while really living in California

You may have forgotten, but in NJ the first time you vote, you must show your voter's registration card. Voting subsequently all you need is your signature, which will be compared to your signature the last time you voted.

But, oh my, what about the elderly whose handwriting has deteriorated? How unfair to compare signatures. We must stop this burdensome and illegal signature checking.

And out of state students. You know, the list goes on, and nearly all of the victims of this typically vote democrat. T

This is voter suppression, and this is illegal.

Toasty,

Are you suggesting out of state students have no photo ID? Bit of a reach.

Not photo ID for the state they now reside in. Trust me, I live in a college town, I see this all the time.

Not photo ID for the state they now reside in. Trust me, I live in a college town, I see this all the time

Toasty do they really reside in that state, pay federal and state taxes, or is their home of record elsewhere like where their parents live. Just because they go to school, does not mean that state is their home of record. Much like the military. If that state is their home of record, why then do they not have a drivers license stating they are from that state. I know because my daughter had to get hers changed from California to Nevada or risk getting a fine and a ticket. state ID's are free and I am pretty sure that school starts in August, plenty of time to get a current ID. Not saying a mistake could not happen but not all the time. Seniors also can get State ID, they usually have children, grandchildren, friends to help them. This is not about voter suppression or denying anyone their "Right", this is about making sure the right person is voting and voting where he/she should be. This affects both parties and for liberals to say it only affects democrat voters. Well I guess that says democrat voters are waiting on the democratic party to tell them what to do and how to do it. Pavlov's Dogs rings a bell.

Look Richard, I know what you're doing. You're trying to water down the subject at hand by putting out every hypothetical you can think of. But the fact is that if a student moves to another state for schooling, they are constitutionally entitled to vote in their place of residence. And this attempt at voter suppression will clearly hurt them. Along with the elderly. And the poor.This is illegal, Richard. It doesn't matter how many pretzels you twist your mind in to to think up ways to get around it.

This is voter suppression, and it is illegal.

Students can file an absentee ballot request if they are in school in another state and is not convenient/possible for them to travel to their home state on election day.

Fortunately no matter how many times Toasty repeats "this is illegal" the courts will still not concur.

OK, I'll repeat my answer since you repeated the comment:

Let's see if there is any room for interpretation:

“The result is that thousands of low-income Georgians have been denied the opportunity to register to vote,” Zeitler said.

Low income person: Please give me my food stamps and I want to register to vote.
Government worker: Can you please provide me with some ID so I can issue the food stamps to you?
Low income person: Here you go.
Government worker: Here you go ma'am, have a nice meal. I deny you the opportunity to register to vote.
Low income person: Really! WHY?
Government worker: Because I think you might just vote for a Democrat and I can't have that now can I?
Low income person: Well I'm just going to go down to my church, post office, city hall, DMV, police station or any other number of places to get a registration card. By they way, stop asking me to prove to you that I am who I say I am when I ask for my food stamps.

Actually since we have the 2nd amendment as a right, perhaps the government should be paying for firearms for disadvantaged people, as well as not requiring ID.

But the 2nd Amend. doesn't give you the right to "FREE" firearms purchases, does it now?!

You mean, they can't? Never been to a gun show, have you?

OK, I agree, the government should not pay for guns for poor people. Or abortions.

I have enough shotguns and a trusty rifle..I could use a new pitchfork though..hey! A new startup company! Pitchforks may soon be in short supply!

Thank God somebody pointed this out. I have been homeless, unlike most of you trolls, and I can assure you that (1) those folks don't carry ID and (2) State ID is NOT free, we (homeless) wish it WERE free for those who cannot afford it. Requiring ID to vote is a poll tax, nothing more, nothing less. Also...and maybe this will show up farther down the comment thread - but this is a back door effort to impose a national ID card. Next, that card will come with an RFID (arphid, radio frequency) chip that will allow the government to track our movements 24/7. With the Patriot Act, we are moving ever closer to a police state. Shades of Weimar Germany.

Not a bad idea. How about this instead though:

You can only vote if you pay more in taxes than your receive in government benefits.

Sounds like a winning solution to me charley. I'm glad you came up with that idea.

And yet the 2nd amendment is also a right, and you certainly have to show ID to purchase a firearm...

The Second Amendment refers to "a well regulated militia". Regulated means ID and background checks. In fact, one could make a good case that this is limited to National Guard members only. But that surely wouldn't fly in America these days.

Casey Jones is at the throttle!!

Myth and legend. You can probably look at any closely contested election going back to our nation's founding up to 1960 and find that local political organizations played some role in who voted and what votes were counted. But this applied to both sides. Nixon is reported to have asked his aids whether he should protest the results out of Chicago in 1960. His aids reportedly advised that he didn't want to open that issue as both sides played that game. We are 50 years and many levels of technology removed. Do you seriously think that "illegals" are going to risk arrest and deportation by showing up to vote for president. If illegals were voting in large numbers, then Texas should be a Democrat state. The same with purging the names of convicted felons from the voter roles - sure you might eliminate the one LaShawn Smith, but in the process you purge 3 innocent others. But then that's the goal - eliminate potential Democratic votes in higher numbers than the few GOP voters. Why else make it so difficult for students to register and vote? It can't be because they are uninformed?

I think we have come a long way since 1788. And it took both parties to do it not one party.

It is estimated that about 8% of the population was able to Vote to form our country.

I need a paxil are you saying that we should revisit that vote, or should we just let Great Britain reclaim this great land. Don't see the relevance to something that happened over 222+ years ago.

FOX just declared the Earth was flat. I know a few posters that would believe that. Besides ACORN was too busy assisting pimps and underage prostitutes to have any time to steal an election.

Wm.-375815

FOX just declared the Earth was flat. I know a few posters that would believe that. Besides ACORN was too busy assisting pimps and underage prostitutes to have any time to steal an election.

Wow how brilliant if MSNBC, Rachel Maddow, Keith and the rest of those donkeys (democrats) said that, the majority of people who watch MSNBC (about 7500) and posters here would probably be posting that it was the republicans who lied that the earth was round. How inane.

That is the first thing they ask for but, since you are already registered, you can also provide a utility bill in your name at your address but if you moved since you registered that won't work.

I don't care; this is a different time and ACORN and the '08 election taught us better. PHOTO ID's.

Anne : we already know you don't care

organized voter suppression by the government as long as it is "your party" is ok but not ACORN

well back in 68 you didnt have to wear a seat belt but the times they are a changin

Oh, I was born in Newnan Georgia in 1952.

To indicate was country your allegiance is pledged to, non- American citizen's should not have the ability to vote and need to be eliminated. Americans have ID's, did you drive to the polls?

I have ID now and it is required. I still consider the requirement to have ID government repression though. I don't care about anybody's fear. Fear is the killer. It creates things like the Dept of homeland security and other government intrusion into our lives. Remember that freedom vs security thing ? It's still true. You want security ? You don't deserve freedom.

"Charlie" Wilson (June 1, 1933 – February 10, 2010) was a United States naval officer and former 12-term Democratic United States Representative from the 2nd congressional district in Texas. Wilson was able to get a driving permit at age 13, which enabled him to drive 96 voters, mainly black citizens from poor neighborhoods, to the polls. As they left the car, he told each of them that he didn't want to influence their vote, but that the incumbent Hazard had purposely killed his dog. Hazard was defeated by a margin of 16 votes.

There are places in this country that still have poor people with no driver license or any other gov't issued Photo ID.