These tea baggers are playing a very dangerous game of 'chicken' with the fate of our country!

What the hell - let's default and see how 'sunny' things are on August 3rd, shall we?

Guess this is why no Republic in history has survived more the 200 years...

Tick Tock!

To the little birdie that just e mailed me the insightful and very funny info on our gang, the Libs r Us mafia:

Thanks, but I'd just a soon not know about stuff like that. It really takes the fun out of it. To think all those libbies getting together an literally plotting out responses, involving the hosts, and this is all they can come up with?

It really just highlights how silly and utterly powerless they are. Of that gang, Fiesty, NewDay, Navy, Ron, etc you got a bunch of unemployed/retired/under-employed folk who have likely never earned anywhere near $100k in one year in their lives. They employ no one, and have created nothing.

It really is just sad. And again, in-spite of their coordinated efforts they still get rocked everyday in here by several people.

Good golly. Weak and silly is no way to go through life.

Don't raise the ceiling.

Who cares if our economy crashes and burns completely?

Hell, the wealthy can afford to sit back and just watch. They're not gonna suffer. Acutally, I bet they could profit from it even more than they have during other depressions, where the only ones that could afford to pick up the pieces....(I mean, BUY the pieces)... that were left at fire sale prices were they themselves.

Funny, though, how no one ever thinks of this scenario being a distinctly real possibility, and continues to vote against their very own well-being.

But hey- what do I know? I'm just a 'drive-by-observer'.

Feisty - Guess this is why no Republic in history has survived more the 200 years...

Well nearly 235 and counting for the good old USA. If the Dems would quit printing/giving away money, I dare say we might make it another 235 years.

Greatest country in the world for the past two centuries, for those of us that can appreciate it rather than denigrate it like the regular libs on this board.

Oh, Spanky- are you saying that the hosts of this site are in cahoots with the liberal posters?

I never would have guessed.

I dare say we might make it another 235 years

If they refuse to raise the debt ceiling we won't make it to Labor Day!

Eh NO BIGGIE!

Yeah Feisty, if they don't raise the ceiling the world as we know it will come to an end.

Panic in the streets, floods, famine....real end of the world stuff right?

Surely you don't buy into that garbage?

Panic in the streets, floods, famine....real end of the world stuff right?

WOW!

I never took your for the drama queen!

White Collar Auto

If the Dems would quit printing/giving away money, I dare say we might make it another 235 years.

Learn Something. The Dems don't print money. The treasury prints and mints all paper currency and coins

@ Feisty the jack a@@es in the GOP/ T-BAGGER party think Labor Day means the day a woman gives birth.

Just give it up you can't fix stupid and that is where these democrats live. They will lie cheat and steal just as long as they can continue the lies their party has promoted for years.

Bev - @ Feisty the jack a@@es in the GOP/ T-BAGGER party think Labor Day means the day a woman gives birth.

Actually Bev Republicans recognize Labor Day as a celebration of people who actually work for a living rather sit at home living off of the government.

White Collar Auto

Bev - @ Feisty the jack a@@es in the GOP/ T-BAGGER party think Labor Day means the day a woman gives birth.

Actually Bev Republicans recognize Labor Day as a celebration of people who actually work for a living rather sit at home living off of the government.

Actually, that is what public workers do; except that right wing nutso jacka@@es think they are thugs.

Gee Beverly, I know you can't type, spell or use correct grammar, but don't you think you would be just a tad more credible in your posts if you could refrain from the vulgar language and name calling?

BTW if you are going to do it, do it right, it's jacka$$es, not jacka@@es

Lets remember, the Republicans-Tea Baggers are stuck on stupid, and many don't know what a Debt Ceiling is.

Actually Bev they are thugs... all supporting Obama since he bailed them out. What a monumental purchase of votes.

The debt ceiling is a debt ceiling. It doesn't mean we will fall down some hole like the liberals are claiming. If we reach it, it means the government can't borrow any more money. It doesn't mean that bills won't be paid... unless you are a liberal and borrow all your income. It's amazing how the liberals want to keep on borrowing money and allowing this country to fall DEEPER in debt. No wonder we have a problem. The tax and spend liberals just don't get it. So Job1 your barb is completely shot down and headed into the ground in flames.

Brian,

I normally wouldn't defend Beverly under any circumstances, but when you claim someone else is undereducated and "irratic", (erratic) your own education comes into question. Spell check, it's a wonderful tool.

@ Job1

I'll agree with you there. Republican's do not know what a debt ceiling is. Which is why so many fiscally conservative people like myself have been voting Democrat over the years. However, being fiscally conservative, I do understand the concept of debt ceiling. And that it was raise recently to unprecedented levels.

To me, it is somewhat like asking your credit card company for another serious limit increase to pay your mortgage. While maintaining, even increasing your discretionary spending. At some point, we will have to match revenues with expenses.

Ever since Free Trade and a global economy we have been exporting our wealth. This will at best enable our GDP to be a disappointing flat to 3% annual pace during good times. Meaning, unless we get spending under control we are not saved.

Some suggestions in order:

1. Tariff Chinese goods (Obama is already doing it be artificially deflating the $$)
2. Charge tax, any tax to large US companies. Big oil, GE (paid ZERO tax on $15B in earnings, and got a refund)
3. Make the 47% that pay zero federal income tax pay something.
4. Tax the wealthy. Solely taxing the upper 2% without taxing the other 1/2 of the country, and US billion dollar corporations is not an acceptable long term answer. It pits one group of people against the other, and lets corporate donors to corporations off scott free.

Bev, Fiesty and White Collar,

Interesting banter but useless. I'll wager that none of you qualify as being a jacka$$. Simply passionate about your positions. There is nothing wrong with that. Different views are different views, not right, not wrong. Financing those views has always been my concern. Republicans are not anti education and anti health care, they don't protect the rich. The rich need a solid middle class to sell to, and hire.

Democrats are not pure socialist. They have very solid emotional positions that are valid, such as Medical, social and educational concerns.

There is not a single one of us that doesn't agree with 80% of the middle. Often we simply disagree with how to fund it.

Brian,

Our deficit, what we borrow, is greater that all discretionary spending including defense. So even if you eliminated all of the Federal Government departments there would not be enough money to service the debt.

Then there is the Ryan budget that adds $6 trillion to our National Debt. Why does his plan add to the debt if were as simple as you indicate?

Because the Ryan plan doesn't kick in for YEARS. The main strategy in his plan is to get a bill approved that really screws the middle-class but not inact the bill while any of these people are voters -or - while Ryan and his clan are in Congress. People 55 and under are affected by the plan. They will get Medicare in 10+ years and find out that the vouchers don't cover the actual costs of healthcare.

By that time, Ryan is a novelist and special guest on the Rush Limbaugh show

Hey Nojo, sadly yes it appears to be true.

But let's do this, lets let the Libs r us "mafia" have a chance to come clean. Might be fun, right.

Sure does clarify why Feisty can talk about your family members and reference guns and not get banned or even suspended.

Maybe the little birdie will send you the information also? Again, I'd rather not be a part of this. It is just too stupid. In fact you should get it directly from the source. You are after all such a VIP to these sad and pathetic folks.

No matter what Nojo one thing is clear - you own them.

I hope your little birdie does contact me, Spanky. It would answer SO many questions, and put another to rest-

This site is curiously absent professional journalists. They are proud paid propagandists.

I guess this is a low rent JournOList organization. It explains a lot.

Living in L.A. I'm so happy you can read! Considering that where you live is the left of the left. I typed irratic on purpose. I so appreciate you taking the time to attempt to correct my spelling... how school teacherish of you. Truly, it's not needed, nor necessary. But aktually sumtimes my keiboard gets outta kontrol and cauzes me to tipe in funni waze.

Why the kabuki dance by Conservative leaders? They've ALREADY voted to increase the debt by over 60 TRILLION dollars before bringing the budget into balance 50 years from now. That's the Ryan plan that they've already approved.

If it wasn't their intent maybe they should have made a different budget.

So why is it that our resident libbie mafia [Liberals r us] are all unified against something as obvious as the need to live within our means.

Come on gang 'splain it to me. WHy is it we all have to do it, but the government does not?

Oh and Drive By please explain how the world ends if the ceiling isn't raised. We pull in $2.6 trillion. Our debts are far less, so al the debts get paid, with out any issue.

If you need time to confer with the cabal, by all means. IN fact it'd be much simple to just have one of you respond.

cdahl:

Have not seen you in a while. Hope things are going good with your business.

I thought just a short time ago the Republicans were asking for $75 Billion in cuts. I was out of the country for a month. How did it suddenly end up being $4 Trillion? How can anyone think that cutting $4 Trillion all at once during a recession can possibly be a good thing? That would be like a family saying "oh, we're in too much debt. We need to stop buying food and paying the mortgage." That would put the family on the street in short order. Have any of you actually been in debt over your head? The way you get out is slowly and methodically reducing spending, increasing revenue, and applying any savings to reducing the debt. If you try to do it all at once you end up worse off than you were. The Progressive Caucus Budget is the only sensible solution that I have seen.

DCO said:

Brian,

Our deficit, what we borrow, is greater that all discretionary spending including defense. So even if you eliminated all of the Federal Government departments there would not be enough money to service the debt.

Then there is the Ryan budget that adds $6 trillion to our National Debt. Why does his plan add to the debt if were as simple as you indicate?

Who said I indicated anything about the Ryan plan. Who said I support it. Do you believe I'm a Republican? It's about time the liberals on this board start to realize that a lot of the conservatives are NOT republican. I'm a conservative independent.

So Navy, tell us you a white wine or red wine kind of guy?

3 glass and that's it? Well it was a Saturday after all. Too funny.

Brian,

You said: “The debt ceiling is a debt ceiling. It doesn't mean we will fall down some hole like the liberals are claiming. If we reach it, it means the government can't borrow any more money. It doesn't mean that bills won't be paid... unless you are a liberal and borrow all your income.”

The main point was your statement “It doesn't mean that bills won't be paid” in fact yes it does for the reasons I stated.

You have stated many times that you are not Republican. The reason I brought up the Ryan budget is because even his aggressive debt reduction plan recognizes that we will have to continue to borrow for several years before we can get the deficit under control.

V.P. Biden and has gang of five should take a close look at Fl. Connie Mack's plan or just go with the Deb't comm recomendations.

Dennis - You know what? The interest payments need to be paid first. They can figure out what to do with the extra hundred dollars or so that's left over. I suspect there will be a lot of people pissed off then their welfare checks or SNAP cards don't arrive. I can imagine the military will be rather miffed too when the checks aren't deposited on the 15th and the 30th... suppose a lot of retired military will be ticked as well.

It seems the government is in a pickle. Continuing to spend money they way they have in the past 2 1/2 years will come home to roost. Let the democrats answer for it. They're the ones most recently in power completely... so they can tell the American people why they added $3.2 Trillion to the debt numbers while they were in charge. Maybe a day of reckoning is what's needed for the politicians to feel that hot tar and those soft feathers.

Okay, then, we'll just have to pass the hat.

Starting with any governor, republican or democrat, who used borrowed stimulus money to pay down their own state deficits.

Ante up, everyone. Now is the time to prove your true American values.

Brian, you're looking at the wrong target. The debt as a percentage of GDP has been increasing since Reagan became president. In fact that trend only accelerated during the Reagan and GW Bush administrations. http://zfacts.com/p/318.html

John B ~ It's no use. The debt to GDP ratio also tends to increase in and after wars, but they don't believe that, either. Apparently, these wars were free.

These wars were NOT free... but yet they continue. And even more today than a couple of years ago. No end in sight... Troops deployed in 3 theaters now. Let's not forget the money the government spent to bail out private enterprise... at the cost of stopping a depression? Seems like we really haven't stopped anything when you rob from Peter to pay Paul.

Ooops... sorry for the religious reference... wouldn't want any of the libs to get offended.

John, the problem is TODAY. Who cares how it increased? It's a little late for the blame game from 20 years ago. I really do blame this administration for not taking the bull by the horns and doing something to reverse it. They haven't even approved a budget for 2011. They waited until Bush got out of office in 2009 to approve their increased spending plan. There is NO excuse for adding $3.2 Trillion to the national debt in 2 1/2 years. They were unchecked, unfettered and spent like crazy. There were no controls. Do you realize how much money that is?

Robbing Peter to pay Paul?

Would that be like Rick Perry and Tim Pawlenty using BORROWED stimulus money (which we'll ALL have to repay) to pay down his own state's massive debt, and save his own sorry behind, while creating not one new job with that stimulus money?

And then running for President on their claim to be effective budget-balancers?

Actually, the religious reference might be very appropriate for those guys. They're behaving just like the moneychangers that Jesus threw out of the temple, aren't they?

And this little dirty secret is just one of many reasons why people like you claim to not care how the debt:GDP ration increased. Claiming not to care is sort of like saying "get over it." The one who says that is usually the one who did the "it" in the first place.

We care, Brianb, so that we can prevent these kinds of things from happening again.

Hey AM - pass that hat over here. Us Californians could really use the dough.

Say job1 please use your big brain and explain to use uneducated and stupid conservatives what the debt ceiling is. Remind us while you are at it what the project debt service costs will bi in 2016, and then compare that amount to the amount of anticipated revenues.

That would be super job1, and rememebr to use small words for us small minded folk.

AM, if you care so much, why don't you ever comment on the $3.2 trillion the democrats spent while they held full control? They started out with just over $10 trillion, and that was AFTER the dems took control of the house in 06. You do realize that adding that much to the debt increased it by 32%... No administration in history ever added that much to any debt... You wonder why I detest the democrat leadership? They never met a tax dollar they didn't love to spend or a tax increase they didn't have plans to spend. The republicans haven't shown any fiscal responsibility either, but at least they never added 32% to the debt in such a short time.

Brian,

Check out the deficit chart a page or two down on the site at the link below to see what major programs cause the current and projected deficit problem.

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/?fa=view&id=3490

The lead for this discussion was also reported on radio as I was driving home from work. The Biden group meeting behind doors are still far apart. If nothing is agreed upon by end of June, Obama will have to step in personally. and negotiate a deal. The aug 2 debt ceiling date is the absolute end date.

Somewhere else, I heard that the Congress has been warned that their pay and per diem accounts will stop in July without a deal? Sorry, I can't site my source at this very moment. Maybe some else can help?

thanks

Afternoon Navy.

Thanks for the hello. Business is good, we have added approx 25 new employees in the last 6 months and continue to hire. We are, like most other people a little nervous about the US economic future, but believe in our leadership and core purpose. As long as we stay true to the cause we should continue our momentum.

And a big thank you to all of our employees to work their tails off every day making us what we are today. That is the real secret.

Medicare, medicaid, social security and military make up about 85% of the budget. It aint rocket science to see that is what needs to get under control.

The last 30 years our revenue as a percentage of GDP averaged 18.3% Bush topped out at 20% and Obama is spending an astounding 25% of GDP. If Washington spends more than about 19% of GDP you can count on a deficit. Doesn't matter what policy, tax rate, or anything any party institutes we will be borrowing or printing money to make up the difference.

Nobody can defend either party as they haven't been very good stewards of our money.

cdhal:

That is great news and I wish you continued success my friend. Sooner or later our Politicians will do something to get the ball rolling.

My brother in law works for a government contractor (CFO) and they are waiting to see how things go. They also are hiring as well, but he claims they need to hire more but are waiting to see if they can.

Anyway I am very happy for ya and wish you and yours the best. Be well

Since repubs don't wanna raise taxes and dems don't wanna cut spending, is anyone really surprised? Heaven forbid either side lose their talking points.

Indy lib - former senator alan simpson made and interesting observation about that very same thing on bloomberg.com

http://www.bloomberg.com/video/70166506/

Great clip american. Everyone should see it.

Former Senator Alan Simpson made very relevant points about the situation.

If only his Republican colleagues would wake the hell up, and realize that this really isn't the time for cheap political games.

Government spending does need to be intelligently trimmed in all 4 mentioned areas, and the tax breaks to big Corps and the top 1% elitists need to be revoked.

But NJ, they all think the problem goes away if we just up our credit limit a few trillion.

So see, there really is no problem for the left. They can fix it with a simple vote to print more money.

What I want to know is how is raising the debt ceiling going to help the 15,000,000 people that are out of work. Our employment numbers are at pre 2000 levels... meaning that all the jobs gained between 2000 thru 2008 have vanished from the face of the country and our rate of employed individuals are the same as the year 2000. Now to the liberal mind, this isn't a problem... even though we have gained an additional 30 million job seekers since 2000. Hell, what's a few million workers seeking jobs? Didn't you know it's all Bush's fault?

Bush's fault... that dog don't hunt. 2 1/2 years into the Obama administration and we are headed headlong in the wrong direction. I guess that's what you get when you elect a Community Organizer to run the country.

Steeler Fan,

Congress has become so dominated by ideology over the last decade, that they can't agree on the weather, much less any ideas of importance. Blame for this accrues to both parties, but credit for resolving the impasse would go far if President Obama were willing to make the effort. While I voted for Obama in '08' (gasp, a Republican that admits voting across party lines, what is this world coming to) he won't get my vote in '12' if he's sitting on the sidelines yet again. Frankly, at the moment, he really isn't in contention for my vote, unless an unelectable Republican is nominated (you may choose who you think is unelectable, I have my own list), and even then, a "no vote recorded" might be my final answer. I agree that a compromise would be the best outcome, and I'll concede that Defense should be pared back significantly, but agreeing to slaughter my (Republican) sacred cow is going to necessitate that you (Democrat I assume from prior commentary) gore your ox as well (Social Programs). Unless and until both parties act like adults, and admit that we as a nation have to come together for a solution (I'll even put additional revenue on the table), compromise is probably out of the question.

Living in LA -

Maybe we should just send you and Steeler Fan to Congress - they could use a few more adults. I would disagree that the President is "sitting on the sidelines" - Biden is his representative in this process and I would assume they're in constant communication. And as I've mentioned more than a few times here before, we out here in the world are completely unaware of most of the daily workings behind the scenes at the White House and in the Capitol - phone calls, meetings, e-mails, etc - so we really have no idea who's actually discussing what with who, unless they hold a press conference to announce something, and most of those seem aimed at saving face or posturing more than anything substantive. Finally, I think compromise begins with the paring knife you mentioned - no need to leap right into slashing and goring. But as long as both parties are stuck on their "all or nothing" mentality - which I'm convinced stems less from actual ideology and more from fear of any perceived weakness being used against them in the next election - then compromise is indeed going to be difficult.

By the way, I'd be interested in hearing your "unelectable" list. I would say the obvious ones are Gingrich, Santorum, Palin, Bachmann, and Cain, not necessarily in that order. Pawlenty seems to be trying awfully hard to get ON that list, and Huntsman is a little too early to call.

P.S. - I've voted against party lines more than once myself and I'm pretty sure my fellow Pennsylvanian from Steeler Nation has as well. Good for us!

I have crossed party lines, JoAnne, especially in local elections.

LA---I agree that social programs have to be looked at (although I don't think I would start with the complete de-funding of Planned Parenthood). I also don't think that the military should be decimated. I think there is a lot of unnecessary spending and pork there that could be cut. But at the end of the day, I just don't believe that the entire budget situation can be solved on cuts alone---I think it is going to take an increase in taxes and a realignment of our tax system as well.

This is the test for the Congress. I too hope their corporate dysfunction will not stand in the way of making the simple vote of raising the debt ceiling with a negotiated package of cuts and raising taxes. It is like a drunk saying I can stop drinking, just watch ;but never does anything different.

I too believe the clock is running out.

Hi JoAnne,

I can't get elected in California, I'm a Republican in a solidly "Blue" state. Even if I could, I wouldn't want the job, I don't know how to march in lock-step, and I tend to think for myself most of the time.

Gingrich, Palin, Bachman, Santorum, are all on the "unelectable" list. I'd leave Cain out, he doesn't rise to the level of having to be cut. That pretty much leaves me with Romney, Pawlenty, and Huntsman. Perry should probably stay on the sidelines, and unfortunately from my perspective, John Thune opted out early on. He probably would have been my candidate of choice, perhaps he was scared off by what appeared to be the beginnings of an economic recovery.

Steeler,

I was really just going for the visual effect, slaughter, gore (not Al) it's all so dramatic. I'm even on the hook for additional revenue, but here's a conditional statement, additional revenue if it goes to debt/deficit reduction, not increases in spending on pet programs by either party. Sounds sort of like a lockbox, but maybe a lockbox with an actual lock on it.

Been a pleasure chatting with both of you. Once upon a time I lived in Bethel Park, Pa, early 60's. Sonic booms were a regular event, can't remember the name of the airbase there (man I'm old), but as a kid, that was exciting.

Pleasure's all mine, LA - you, too, Northstar; this little exchange is a good example of what this blog could be if we'd all chill out once in a while and as the President says, "disagree without being disagreeable". LA, I think Bethel Park is more out Steeler Fan's way - I'm in the Philly suburbs. Come back and see us sometime!

Yep, BP is a suburb or Pittsburg. I used to have a girlfriend in Media (long ago, before I got married, just as a qualifier), which is one of the suburbs of Philly, but that was when I was in college. I also worked summertimes with several people that were Philadelphian's, at Haverford and Swarthmore colleges.

Probably won't be back soon, not much of my family is left in the east, we all went west, or south to Florida.

Have a great day JoAnne.

Oh, my gosh - I'm sitting in Media right now! Have worked here for at least 30 of the last 42 years. When I first started with the company (way back in '69!) the original office was in Swarthmore. Small world!

Have a great day yourself - hope your wife is doing well?

Pablo, I posted something similar and I agree with you. The other plan I thought was good was from your state Connie Mack's plan was simple and it would force lawmaker's to come to an agreement.

Damn those secret treehouses! They're EVERYWHERE! (ain't they, 'little birdie'?)

From the sound of a couple of them above - they're GREEN with envy!

When you have NO friends, it's understandable they're jealous of those who do!

What a SCOOP they have on they're hands - maybe they should give Briebart a call! LMAO!

Jesus- don't give 'em any ideas.

Jesus- don't give 'em any ideas.

I mean according to them we're so important and all... LMAO!

Why good golly Drive By they sure are. But then again you already knew that. It is the recipient lists, and the content that are some damn funny.

Sure does clear up how and why Feisty gets to be Feisty.

Good times.

Spanky,,

What are recipient lists and their content?

Care to share with the rest of us serfs?

'

Oh it really is nothing, just more amusement from our libbie friends. Or as I will now referto them as the "brain trust"/libbie mafia.

I asked the boiler room a question. Somehow I doubt I'll get a response.

Spanky,

You asked:

Spanky-

Question for the boiler room: how much outside contact do you all have with certain posters here?

Is it limited to just certain of the hosts, or do they all participate, i.e Murray, et al?

You saying that FR has contact with certain posters, perhaps gives them the topics or questions, coordinates a response that is meant to either generate a response or just talking points for the liberal point of view.

So you named a few recipients, sure does explain a lot, a heck of a lot.

Now I'm going to get deleted for asking!!!!

Spanky love the question to the Boiler Room. It does explain a lot including the end of week personal salutations and kudos, blah, blah, blah. My brother the newspaper editor would be so proud for this fine outstanding example of unbiased blog journalism.

Spanky, That's a great question but its not going to happen. I hope nojo does something with it.

I have been threaten by both Feisty and Clara or should I say Feisty/Clara that I better chill out or they will expose me by posting my history of comments. I am really over the evil twins and ready to move on, but after reading your post today, whats wrong with one for the road.

Clara

You are WAY out of your league, if you think you can intimidate people because YOU took offense. I find YOU offensive because you've decided to make a federal case of Feisty. You personally assigned yourself Sheriff of FR and you stalked her from thread to thread. What goes around comes around. You want to act pious and above it all. You've said NASTY things to other people and you don't even have the decency to accept your own baggage. I guess it is much too easy for you to point out the twig in Feisty's eye than remove the friggin' log from your own, eh? If you want to keep this going, I have material and I'll be here ALL week. You don't own outrage, you don't own decency and trust me YOU DON'T OWN THIS BOARD. When I said bring it, I meant it. If you think you can erase the crap you've spewn on a public forum,...by all means, work your profile like a Texas History book. We know you for exactly what you are:

A self righteous POSER.

I'll see you bright eyed and bushy tailed, chica. Your words, your dime. Oh, and I don't owe you context. If you don't have the courage of your convictions to SAY WHAT YOU MEAN,...you probably shouldn't let your fingers do the walking.

By the way, what difference does having MY HISTORY make? I already owned my BS,...it would really be a refreshing CHANGE if you'd go ahead and own yours, m'kay?

Feisty

One can ONLY hope you've taken that bra strap off you a@@ and moved it to where it belongs!

@NDD - NO matter how much cotton I stick in my ears this broad won't drop the bone! LMAO

Would anyone expect LESS from the holier than thou crowd?

Once they practice what they preach - they MAY regain on ounce of credibilty - Until THEN..eh NOT SO MUCH!

Then you have Skanky - running about and lifting his little leg on EVERY thread!

Feisty

Really honey - you come across as the junkyard dog WHO will NOT give up your piece of GRIZZLE!

Spit it out BABE - there is a whole nother life waiting for ya!

See you tomorrow - I WILL not disappoint darling!

Interesting NDD - this old dried up broad wants to comment on others sex om Newsine!

Does that not speak VOLUMES?

She's a SUPER FREAK alright & without her new BFF Skanky by her -side CLUE - LESS!

Just WAIT until tomorrow - the oldbroad - ain't gonna know what leveled her! Good Times!

The only thing that offended me was the old dried up broad reference.

So now that Spanky and NoJo feel they never get to post first or post with impunity, they feel there is a vast left wing conspiracy? Really?

Or have you invented a fake conspiracy to make you feel better?

Or are you guys just out of ideas?

Just get over yourselves and engage in the discourse like the rest of us.

And now you know. Say where's my little bird Amy? She was all alight last weekend. I figure I'll just keep it in and occasionally break off a piece of behind the scenes libbie gold.

Just remember that I just appeared in my inbox. I can only assume there ore several others out there with the info.

I assume they are still too busy laughing their asses off to comment yet.

I am really over the evil twins and ready to move on

Apparently NOT honey!

As for 'one for the road' you've posted nothing but the same WHINE for 3 days straight...

You might want to think about getting some professional help if you're so bothered by our comments, you just can't LET GO! LMFAO!

Did I mention how great it feels that you and the rest of the nitwits seem to think we wield some real influence around here?

So now somehow belonging to a "Private Chat Group" is a bad thing? I bet most ofthe posters here belong to some group where they share their ideology and and talk about what is going on in politics and did you see what Politician A just said or Politician B. I bet you even talk about politics, religion, etc at Thanksgiving dinner or Christmas or birthdays etc.

So what, last time I looked this was a free country and everybody here has the constitutional right to congregate with whomever they please. It is a basic freedom that we all share and now for some reason some are trying to turn this into some type of conspiracy or something.

I would be careful, what you are implying is a very slippery slope. You are basically calling for censorship of the right of people to get together and talk about whatever they want. That is wrong.

US Navy Disabled Veteran - Retired,

Apparently, you're not denying what Spanky has posted.

Can you please answer one question that Spanky posed in the Boiler Room:

Question for the boiler room: how much outside contact do you all have with certain posters here?

Is it limited to just certain of the hosts, or do they all participate, i.e Murray, et al?

Do you have contact with the hosts or moderators and is there a recipients list?

Makes all the difference in the world if certain people are given preferential treatment.

The difference is also that as a group you can collapse posts you don't like, control the conversation, etc.

It's not independent if what Spanky posted is true.

Is it limited to just certain of the hosts, or do they all participate, i.e Murray, et al?

I'm not Navy but I'll answer - NONE of the hosts/moderators were/are members in our PRIVATE chat room!

Notice the word PRIVATE? As demonstrated it doesn't carry much meaning with RWNJ's

It's time for Skanky to PUT UP OR STFU for once in his miserable existence!

NO ONE is given preferential treatment as hard as you & the rest of your paranoid partners try to spin this into some vast left-wing conspiricy!

I continue to LMAO at ALL of you who do nothing but bitch about FR!

HELLO! It's NO secret MSNBC leans forward! And all your chest thumping and POUTRAGE & indignation isn't going to change ANYTHING!

Here's a thought - you might feel better if you found some place where you could start your own group!

Rumor has it Fox is a real hoot! You might give it a spin...

Woim,

Its not if they get certain preferential treatment. Just go back and read Feisty's comments to nojo and not even a slap on the wrist. Yea, I would say they get plenty of preferential treatment.

I can speak for myself. I have never had contact with anyone from FR short of the Boiler Room question. That's it. This is much ado about nothing. Chat rooms are a part of the vine. I wonder that you are not more concerned that someone would hack into one? You can form a similar group. The collapse thing works mostly against Feisty and Navy.

But this whole thing just makes me sad. If it has become so serious that a hacker went after a group, I don't think I will want to be a part of this any more. I have enjoyed FR, but this is ridiculous.

I do have other things to do, including some elder care coming up, and it seems like poor payback to our hosts to have my friends and I become the issue, rather than the issues of the day.

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL,

I asked Navy a very simple question and was very polite.

You lash back with your righteous indignation routine and suggest I find another site.

Why? If it is, as has been suggested, somehow rigged, we all should find another site.

Based upon your outrage and indignation and the fact that you want me gone, you seem to have made Spanky's case.

Navy, can you please answer the question?

I answered your question politely Woim.

newdayDAWNING10,

...and I thank you and do hope you do not leave.

It's fun "discussing" topics with you.

I'm thinking I may have to Woim. I have enjoyed this, and my friends, but this is a step too far for me. I don't want to be an ethical concern. And it depresses me mightily that something I enjoyed, meeting people and making friends has turned into this.

Ah, the warm fuzzy glow of happy fun times.

Funny thing is it appears that Feisty is now making demands on me. ME? But alas old gal, I am on ignore, so of what value could anything I have to say be to you? Besides, as previously indicated, I am but one person with some information. I'm merely a messenger of sorts. Why I was chosen I have no idea.

Me, just chillin' with the homies.

Oh and Navy - shhhhh I hear brownshirts and there are coming to get ya.

But I so so enjoy the "vast left wing conspiracy." I think I have been very clear - you libbies couldn't conspire your way out of a paper bag, which is exactly what makes this whole dust up so delightfully amusing. Especially Navy "two glasses of Merlot" Retired. Yep, he certainly invokes a lot of fear.

Oh - there is a conspiracy all right, a conspiracy of nitwits, lead apparently their queen Feisty. The sole issue is the permanent pass around the COH Feisty gets. But hey, mystery solved, right old gal - you throw out jabs about other people's family members and guns with impunity. They got your back.

But then again, it's good to be the queen.

Oh my totas - you getting a load of poor little NewDay?

Now compare the treatment she is getting here, with the treatment you got last night from the libbie mafia of Feisty, Clara and of course NewDay herself.

But yes and by all means Newday those ethical entanglements must be avaoided at all costs. It is almost like you have some idea what one would be. :)

Like I said - not even out of a paper bag.

Good GRIEF the Righties have a conspiracy fetish.

Spanky,

Just curious, you staying or leaving based on what you know and have divulged to the rest of us?

BTW, dude, my momma taught me that thing about honey and vinegar and to always be polite.

John B, Des Moines, IA..

You disappointed you weren't invited or were you?

The wingers want to know.

Staying or going? Now why is that an issue for anyone?

I come and go, chat and move on. Some days I spend a lot of time, some days none.

Truth be told the subjects have been somewhat boring here lately. They don't want to touch the real issues, which is why today was surprising - the article about the CBO. Plus, we all know where everyone stands on all issues.

But the bottom line is either it is entertaining and amusing or it is not. As long as it is I'll be around. Also I really have learned a lot about how the liberal mind works. I really had no idea how poorly they view themselves, how powerless they feel. That's why everything is always the Republicans fault.

Obama signs new tax cuts - republicans' fault. Wars still raging, deficits, no jobs, no jobs bills, all republicans fault. Dems had a super majority, nope - republicans fault.

It has been helpful and insightful to me. Helps me understand my liberal friends much better. Plus honing my typing skills.

Spanky,

I don't like the idea that a couple of people can direct the conversation, collapse posts that don't put Obama in a favorable light and are given preferential treatment. Sours the whole idea of an open political discussion of ideas. The responses are canned and consistent based upon talking points. Might as well listen to Fox News. It's not fair or equal and that just ruins the whole thing.

I like learning and talking politics. I enjoy talking to people who don't agree with me cause they may change my mind with a good argument. This isn't that. This is force fed talking points.

So, don't now if this site is for me.

In case I don't get to talk to you again, be well and give them hell!

Woim:

You seem very reasonable, and I enjoyed our discussion yesterday. I want to be very clear about this. There is no association between FR Hosts and any of us. There just isn't. We have always been clear on FR that our friendships had developed over time, and that we enjoy talking to each other. It is total relief to me, I quit working long ago, since I had a seriously disabled child. I also took care of my mom in her final illness, and I am about to enter round 2 with another elderly relative. Those contacts with people who talk issues are important to me. But not important enough to be accused of something that I have never done.

Wow Spanky you really know how to empty a room.

Spanky, you are officially a moron.

Looks to me like there is a right - wing conspiracy to destroy the comments section of First Read, the best political blog on the web. You can't argue yourself into the hearts of Independent voters, so you choose to vandalize the arena. So sad. So pointless. Why don't you crawl back to Fox News where you belong, or is it not so much fun to post comments among not-so-bright people who hang out there?

newdayDAWNING10..

I don't know what your experience with this group has been and really don't want to know. What I do know is that there is a constant beat of the same drum from many of the posters noted by Spanky. I do know that certain people have been given preferential treatment and that has been noted by many, many posters. If you read my post above, I am inclined to believe Spanky that there is an agenda here, whether sponsored by the hosts or the participants, that inhibits free discussion.

As I said to Spanky, as if anyone cares whether I stay or not, this sort of "fixed forum" is not what I was looking for.

You take care and have a good night.

BTW..Amy B. Portland, ME...that's twice in two of the groups posts that someone has suggested we move to Fox. Coincidence?

And the paranoia continues to run DEEP!

Into your soul it will seep...

Like I said a dozen liberal posters have somehow hijacked FR!

Who knew we were THAT influential! LMFAO!

Quick - check under the bed where the liberal mafia may or may not be lurking!

Bottom line is you have a WILD UNSUBSTANTIATED claim and all of a sudden you're all over it like white on rice!

It's NO wonder Brietbart plays you like the SUCKERS you are! ;o)))))

GOOD GOD - you people are hysterical!

Is it any wonder you right wing nitwits are meaner than a JUNK YARD dog?

Always falling for the tabloid journalism hasn't worked out for you so well... it's understandable you need to LASH OUT at anything that doesn't fit your narrative!

Woim: if you come back to read this. In general, the rules apply equally. I have been called things like a "bag of pus" by JS1, and she was never banned either. There is no preferential treatment. Otherwise, people would be banned daily, and they just aren't. Collapses are done by flagging, but are often restored by moderators. If you read this constantly, you will find that the two most attacked people are Navy and Feisty. I am dumbfounded when people call Navy names like retarded and such, but they are not banned either. But, this is a more left of center blog, which may make it feel agenda driven to you.

Do the discussions get heated? Yes. Do people say things they shouldn't? Yes. My general philosophy is to put certain authors on ignore, like Spanky, no jo, JS1 and theotas, so I don't respond to them. They can do the same.

..

Oh my look who got all wound you and is rearin' for a fight - go Amy, go!

But Amy dear, I don't watch Fox. I love Rachel, and Larry O' and especially Big Eddy Schultz. Sadly, Tweety Bird is on too damn early for me to see, although I hear his opinions regarding Bachmann have "evolved."

But I do love how you equate expression of opinions that differ from yours to be "vandalizing the arena." It really speaks volumes, but then again, if I were in your situation, I'd be sad too?

NDD, Hi I have had many nice discussions with you and I hope you do not leave. We may not agree on all issues but we always have civil conversations. I think these are trying times and that brings out the worst in people. If you do leave i wish you well and I will miss our conversations, Lisa s

When I accuse you of vandalizing the arena I am referring to efforts to make everything personal. How quickly you abandon issues and go for yanking peoples chains - its stupid.

Come on everyone, group hug. Koombayuh and all that

First I have been collapsed on this board right up there on the leaders board for absolutely no reason. I do not believe in collapsing posts, I would rather they stay up and people can read some of he foolishness that goes on. Collapsing a post should only be done in violation of the CoH. But that is my opinion and I speak only for myself. You can write about anything that interests you on topic, off topic or just want to get something off your chest. I do not care. If I want to respond I will if I do not I won't. Trying to bully me into one of your pissy fits is not going to work. Been there done that and the conversations usually go no where.

Second, I have never ever had any contact or correspondence of any kind from FR except one time Tyler call me out on FT on how to use the block quotes instead of using "" which are harder to read and make my source more prominent in the posts. This was when I first started on FT about a year ago. Other than that I have never had any contact from anybody, period. If you claim different you are a bold face liar.

I find it a tad hypocritical that people are happy about somebody hacking another's "Private Chat Room". Are you guys so weak that all you got to do is spy on other people? Which one of you will own up to being the hacker and don't give me the little birdie told me sh!t.

I hope it makes you guys feel important is some way. It just demonstrates to me how low some people will stoop on this board. You guys never seem to disappoint me.

Love ya, lisa! I am thinking about it. But, will post a good by message if I do.

Same here lisa - we don't always agree yet we can converse!

One of these days I will in fact join you on the Jersey Shores!

Have a good night my friend!

There are many groups on the vine; liberal, conservative, socialist, libertarian, and my personal favorite, "The Great Funhouse Debate". These are mainly places where you can post articles if you don't want them to go out to the entire Vine. Relax folks, its hardly a conspiracy.

Feisty and NDD, Have a good night ladies. Lisa s

Like NewDay is going anywhere. Please.

Here I'll give you what you seem to be crying for: No, no please NewDay, please don't go!

Oh wait, I'm on your ignore. Oh well, too bad.

Woin - the call to "move to Fox" or "go back to Fox" is all they got. It's a simple and easy talking point raised on every one of their little websites - MoveOn, ThinkP, Kos.

What they just don't get is we are not like them. I don't need to go to MoveOn or Think progress to get a script. Hell, they don't even bother to hid the fact that they can't think on their own - they just cut and paste.

Nothing says uniformed/unable to articulate an original thought like a cut and paste. Case in point would of course be Bev. and Feisty. Al cuts and pastes, no actual comments. Awesome and insightful, all at the same time.

But hey as long as we have Amy as the decider of all things stupid and who is, and who is not "officially" a moron, well then all is well.

Hey, catch you all tomorrow. :)

Indy Lib,

How true there are hundreds of groups on Newsvine and 13
have over 1,000 members. The group “rightwingers” has over 700 members.
IntheMiddle, TX belongs to that group. I wonder what rightwingers talk about?

Spanky you include a personal insult or personally demeaning dig in virtually everyone of your posts to anybody that disagrees with you about anything. You don't have any room to talk about anybody you are certainly no different than those you accuse. I'm going to back off now because I know how you mean girls fight, you like to scratch and pull hair.

Hey, Forrest! How true! Good to see you!

Not sure if anyone will actually read this because of the late hour... or early hour I'm posting. The battle of wits is probably the most diverse aspect of FR. The problem is, we all do it. He with the best dig wins, so to speak. I've noticed pet names.. and I've created a few myself. If we all do it, who can point fingers?

When I first started reading and posting on FR, several months ago, the liberal cheering squad caused me to roll my eyes upward a few times. After awhile, I ignored it. My best guess as to why Fiesty gets on first is that she either stays on the board and happens to notice the "newer" tab faster than other people, or she gets alerts texted to her phone. So what? Who cares who's first, we all get to comment and sometimes the last laugh is best anyway. I just wish that people would stop collapsing the first post in a thread no matter how much they might disagree with the poster. That's annoying when you consider how slow it is to scroll through the pages here... not everyone owns a mac.

I personally think it's extremely silly to put any poster on ignore. It's best to play along... even if the other person is nasty or hateful. Some great comebacks can arise if you use your imagination instead of your anger. If you don't like what they say, pass the comments up or get it on with your own snappy comeback... I realize insulting people may be the order of the day, but if you allow the insults to get to you, you'll never learn how to combat them.

I'm assuming we are all adults here. We all have our own ideas and I do like to be challenged, because I can hand out some good challenges. I'd like to see some more real responses, other than the name calling. Maybe I'm hoping too much though.

Brianb: Why don't you write like this more often? One of the better explanations I have seen.

I have some posters on ignore, simply because I don't want to respond to them. Insults don't really bother me, I have been called some names on FR that you can't believe.

I enjoy the people that I can have a discussion with, those on the other side who can put forth a cogent argument, not what is currently going on, which feels more like harassment.

I agree with you that it is silly to collapse posts. The posts I have wanted collapsed are the ones that simply go too far. Threats and the like. There have been times on FR that I have asked for support in collapsing those posts, simply because those kind of threats stop the free expression of ideas.

As to posting first....it can be as simple of function as what area of the country you live in, what server you have, and how willing you are to get up early and be patient. There is no conspiracy about it.

But hacking private information? And trying to use that to silence people? That is a step beyond. No one should have to put up with that.

No we don't all do it. I am brutal on political figures like Palin for example, but I never tell a poster, they are going through life weak and silly, or tell people they live sad little empty lives, call them ignorant, brainwashed, lemmings, sheep ect, ect. I have returned a few personal digs recently only to a single poster who when I gave you Brian some info on electric cars you seemed to have the wrong info on, I was immediately personally insulted by. Don't include me in this because like I said I am pretty rough on political figures they put themselves in the public eye they are fair game, sometimes I make jokes I like to make people laugh not make them feel bad, whether you think it is funny or not is one thing, but you can go back and look at any of my posts the jokes are directed at politicians or policies, I don't make another poster the butt of my jokes. I agree it certainly comes from many on both sides, but not everybody, Frank Grimey never insults anybody as just one example and there are many more. Everybody don't personally insult other posters and try to hurt their feelings, or make them angry or whatever that is about, but for those of us who don't want to go there it is getting harder and harder to turn the other cheek.

No, you never do, Forrest. I have enjoyed reading what you write, especially about unions and how they impacted your life.

Thank You ND, I try to be fair an honest in my personal dealings with people I have been in unions all my life I have held positions of responsibility in the union, for the last 12 years I work for both the union and owners on joint labor and management duties and projects. Some of the owners I fought and argued with when I was a younger man now choose me to represent them in certain capacities. I'm still in the union, I represent them as well, so I'm right in the middle of two sides, but our goal is the same, to make a good living in our industry. We often disagree on things, but you can disagree without making it personal. The thing is though these people in the industry have known me for years, and I have known them for years, so if I make a smart ass remark they know that is not all I am ever about. It is completely different in person, I would like to see somebody shake the hand and look into the eyes of some of the men I work with either labor or management, and tell them they are going through life being weak and silly. I like to see them call the union men lazy, greedy, thugs to their face. I'd like to see them tell a couple of self made millionaire owners they are chumps for paying us what they pay us. I like to see what happens next. Here we can become one dimensional real easy, and the anonymity leads to people saying things they would never say to a persons face. It is way easier to get carried away and if I have and owe somebody an apology I will apologize. It is why I tell things in a personal way sometimes, I am not just one thing that can be so easily labeled and insulted. I'm like everybody else, we are all the unique sum of our parts.

Thank you New Day. About me... I am an instigator. Not all the time, but sometimes I can't help myself. I try to make my expressions impersonal and I do attack Obama intensely. It's not because of his appearance it's about his policies. I have deep seated belief's, pretty much like everyone who enjoys this forum. Someone said earlier that we pretty much know where the others stand on the issues. This is true. I try my hardest to convey my knowledge to back up my positions. I don't rely on political talking points although some of my beliefs have been coined into talking points by others.

Forrest - Our discussion about the electric cars was interesting. I didn't try to come across as insulting... well maybe a little... but I was enjoying the back and forth. I wanted to continue that discussion but I had to go to work and couldn't. I work really odd hours because it was the only job I could find in this economy... at least I am working even though I am underemployed.

Just for the record, I don't watch Fox news, don't take in all the conservative news that can be consumed but I do have a 35 year history of being conservative. Unfortunately, the other liberal posters probably won't read this so I will continue to be accused of following Fox talking points. I can't help it that they shed a more conservative viewpoint.

One more thing - Although I realize that Forrest has a Labor Union history, I also have one. It wasn't a good one though. In my past, I've belonged to 2 unions because I was forced to join because of the job. The unions were useless in both instances. They took their dues from my paycheck and I received zero benefit from belonging other than to keep my jobs. I have a bad taste in my mouth from those experiences, so if I don't share your enthusiasm Forrest, it does have a reason. I was living in Buffalo where I grew up and Buffalo was a huge union area.

A lot of times personal history does play in how we respond to others. Unfortunately, we can't always articulate our biases due to lack of time in explaining or the explanation would take away from the meaning of the topic. I'm sure you know what I am talking about.

We can be reasonable, cognitive, and sometimes convey our thoughts in a manner where no ill intention is expressed. Those are the discussions that are the best.

I would love to talk about your union experience some time Brian, and electric cars, but right now I am under a time crunch getting ready for a trip to Pennsylvania, if the timing is right for you next week maybe then, I'll be on the road, I will be alone and bored in a hotel room in the evenings so I'm warning everbody I will probably be all over this place.

Tom, you're right about the game the GOPTP is playing. While Congress was playing the 2 week continuing resolution game Dick Morris and Sean Hannity were cackling on the radio about how they'd eventually get EVERYTHING THEY WANTED by just refusing to compromise and getting it ALL a couple of weeks at a time.

When the GOPTP says they're willing to compromise they're lying. That's all it is.