All righty DBO:

Gassed up the beast this am: $102.00. Stopped at Walmart for some new flip flops and sun screen - that Walmart dude is right, prices are up.

Man this inflation thing-y is already starting to take hold. You all ready? Good news is interest rates will skyrocket, so good returns for everyones' CDs. You can make some serious coin at 12 -15%.

And yeah, I know this article ain't about inflation, but I'm headed out to HAVASU. Looks like 95 degrees, excellent water conditions, and oh, did I mention it's Spring Break? :)

ALL RIGHT, Giggity, Giggity.

You all have a great weekend. Especially you Drive By, especially you.

The Republican lawmakers in WI acted against the wishes of their constituents, to act like gentlemen instead of thugs, and now they are learning their REAL bosses are the Wisconsin voters, NOT the Koch Brothers.

PS The Koch Brother millionaires have their fingers in Maine policy making too. They are the ones financing a repeal of environmental protections, in order to increase the profits of their chemical and oil industries, while risking damaging Maine's ecology and children's health.

Spanky

stop pressing the alarm buttons....ok. the inflation is expected. all we need is to allow this govt. to continue with the rescue mission from the near death your kinsman, Bush got us in.

i didn't see any post from you regarding the 8.8% unemployment data. that's the bad news for you and your cohort.

gas is $102.00....ok that no news. Libya is not exporting.

Good for the democrats. The GOP/TP has over-reached and the sleeping giant of middle class workers intend to hold the republicans feet to the fire. The GOP deserve no sympathy, they could have negotiated; they did not listen to the people, they listened to the Koch boys. Koch and other wealthy donors cannot buy off the angry, middle working class no matter how much they spend on ads or anything else.

Go Wisconsin! Fight for your rights and our rights. Walker thought he was a king, reigning over his monarchy....that's the interpretation of constitutional rights according to the Republicans.

We are with you, we support you, and I hope in all the other states that are attempting to union bust, take away women's rights, cut spending on our schools and elderly and sick and impoverished, that the people stand up!

Mad Hatters are the only ones who support the T-Party.

Gotta love a guy that spends a buck-two on gas, then buys his footwear at the Mr Walton store.

(BTW- how many spring breaks you all get down there in the sunny southwest??)

he gets recalled first, that's harsh

That's great news, Pat. The GOPTP has been ruling like kings in Wisconsin--sometimes it isn't good to be king.

The good people of Wisconsin have every right to elect or recall anyone they wish, and if that means paying much higher taxes to allow public union employees to keep their outrageous pay/pension benefits, then they can sleep in the bed they make for themselves.

Too bad nobody ever reports how much average pay + benefits these public union employees get, compared with the amounts paid to the poor private sector taxpayers that have to fund them. If they knew the 'unfortunate truth', they might have second thoughts, but biased newspaper reporting will likely hide that information.

Roy, it isn't going to help the vast majority of Wisconsin residents in the slightest. Conservatives created this crisis by giving a giant tax break to business, so the average citizen won't see a dime. The GOPTP understands very well that their fealty is to the wealthy elite.

Roy Wilson is a Koch Troll.

Too bad nobody ever reports how much average pay + benefits these public union employees get, compared with the amounts paid to the poor private sector taxpayers that have to fund them.

Wilson, This comment is a blatant lie!!!

If nobody ever reports how much average pay + benefits these public union employees get, can you enlighten us with some factual numbers?

the poor private sector taxpayers do not fund public sector or any other unions they are not voluntary members of. Where did you pick up that lie and why are you repeating it?

goober -

Who do you think pays the public sector employee salaries, the tooth fairy?

nobody ever reports how much average pay + benefits these public union employees get

JOE, since you seem to know, why don't you enlighten us and tell us how the teachers, police, fire fighters etc. are taking advantage of Wisconsin citizens. Please provide figures for both public and private. If you can't. GO AWAY

Who do you think pays the public sector employee salaries, the tooth fairy?

Joe.

Why don't explain the weird logic of your whine. By that same warped logic who do you think pays for the billions in bonuses corporate execs stuff into their off shore tax free accounts???

Come on guys, go easy on Joe - he either doesn't think the services are necessary - OR has some delusional belief that if it was privatized it would somehow be MORE affordable,...

He is a resident of Beckistan and doesn't seem to understand HOW the system works; but is absolute in his belief that HE shouldn't have to pay into it.

Wouldn't it be great in Utopia that if I didn't want to pay for the wars,...I wouldn't have to contribute taxes for THAT folly? But alas,...most of us live here in the REAL world.

Eight, if you count Scott Walker.

Votes have consequences. When a state senator votes for stupid bills, that has consequences. If you are a representative of the people, you need to represent the people, even if those people do work in government offices.

The death of the Teapublican Party has begun.

We only need three to block the bargaining bill ... and most of the rest of Walker's agenda. He'll be a lame duck the day after the third senator is recalled.

So will Scott Fitzgerald, come to think of it, at least as majority leader.

Two arrogant, self-righteous, authoritarian birds with one stone.

What a SWEET day that will be.

But, boy, the Accountability Board is going to be busy. They've also got ethics violation charges against Walker to investigate. And these may stick.

http://www.greenbaypressgazette.com/article/20110308/GPG0101/103080530/1207/Democrats-file-ethics-complaint-against-Wisconsin-Gov-Scott-Walker

Anna Molly: will there be any repercussions against Walker and Fitzgerald for trying to do an end run around the Judge's orders?

They've already stopped trying to do it, as I understand it, and have agreed to comply. I think the judge will give them a pass unless they try it again.

http://host.madison.com/wsj/news/local/govt-and-politics/article_0abe773a-5ba2-11e0-a42c-001cc4c03286.html

That's how liberals do things.

To tell you the truth, however, I think the lower-downs in the Department of Administration finally figured out that THEY could be held personally in contempt, and that Walker and Fitzgerald probably have governmental immunity and would not go to jail.

It's always the guy who has the Michael J. Fox job in THE AMERICAN PRESIDENT who ends up taking the fall. I guess in Wisconsin they're either too chicken -- or too smart -- to do that.

Anna Molly

What a SWEET day that will be.

That is SWEET music to my ears. This news could not have happened on a better day for that crossed eyed fool.

Scott Walker is truly a joker. In the history of April Fools Day people were labeled fools by the general public. They were subjected to ridicule and sent on fools errands.

The Koch Brother will think of another scam for him to circumvent the law. I predict he'll be a Fool rushing in again.

Chris: I wanted to use that line. 1 down...7 to go.

Thanks for the info, Anna Molly.

It's so nice to get the scoop from someone who lives in WI. Thanks, Anna Molly.

Arrogance never pays off as these politicians are about to discover.

Why is Obama still in office if arrogance is a reason to get rid of someone

Numbers, Knave. Think enough folks think like you do? I'm guessing- nope.

I made my donation today to ActBlue.org to help with the costs. I encourage everyone to do the same. The dems don't have any Koch brothers on our side. It has to come from the people.

Me too, Kevin, but I bet Hopper's is coming.

I have to think that Hopper will be next. He won by less than 200 votes as it was.

I heard that the Hopper recall campaign has already collected enough signatures for a recall but want to continue collecting signatures in case some of them get thrown out.

Do you know what tyranny actually mean? This will backfire. When Republicans start re-calling Democrats will you say good for you?

There was an election back in November, Democrats lost; accept it and move on. If the Democrats would have won; I guarantee they would not be pushing a Republican agenda. Why should Republicans push a Liberal agenda?

Koch addiction is BAD!

Hit 'em where it hurts Wisconsin Dems!

In The Middle:

When Republicans start re-calling Democrats will you say good for you?

They tried. Hasn't worked out so well. Then they whined about not getting any support for their recall efforts (read: money).

Can't imagine why.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/03/16/conservatives-we-are-bein_n_836794.html

It's clear that Democrats and liberal organizations are engaging in an attempt to make recall more than a mere hypothetical possibility for some Wisconsin Republicans," said Liz Mair, Vice President of Hynes Communications and former RNC Online Communications Director, who has followed closely the work of conservative groups in Wisconsin. "Even though Governor Walker acted to end the impasse, Republicans and conservatives should not be acting like this is done and dusted."

A conservative activist working inside the state on recall efforts was even more explicitly distraught. The Wisconsin Republican Party, the operative said, was not lending resources to the recall campaign groups had launched against Democratic Senators, in turn causing those groups to narrow their target list down from eight lawmakers to just three.

"It would be nice if the Republican Party, operatives, etc, would step in with a little money," said the activist, who asked to remain nameless lest he draw the GOP even further away from the recall effort. "But they are talking about doing radio and I'm not sure that gets you signatures."

Now, do me a favor, ITM, and in reply, do something more than attack me personally, call me a name, or attack my source, which if you read closely enough, is actually the republican party.

Otherwise, if that's all you've got, begone.

Looks like Conservatives WAY underestimated the backlash from their authoritarian actions. They're fond of calling people who don't agree with them "sheeple". Looks like they believed their own propaganda.

Anna Molly, so help me, your closing line in the ITM reply is absolutely perfect. Straight from Bell, Book and Candle - a declaration of exorcism!

Interestingly, the recall effort facing the GOP WI senators is a home-grown event. The one later launched against the Democrats came from OUTSIDE the state.

We heard lately that in fact Scott under one provision of law might be elegible for recall this Summer. Is action progressing on that front? Is the report incorrect?

Anna - care to think before you post...

Two arrogant, self-righteous, authoritarian birds with one stone (post 2.3)

I read ITM post above and the one immediately below, where was the attack you claim?

I see yours, but not his.

I'm just going by history, american. He's called me more things than I care to recall, including some that were not very nice and way too personal for a public blog.

We're merely posters on a blog who should treat each other with civility. The others are public figures, who have deliberately placed themselves in the position to be criticized for what they do.

Based solely on observations of their recent behavior, I stand by what I said about those two. Especially Fitzgerald.

On the other hand, ITM calls all liberals names, whether he knows anything about them or not, and whether they've done anything to deserve it. You've even done it a time or two, yourself, including yesterday. It's mostly about poisoning the well, but words cut and have consequences.

Seems to me, we've had this conversation before. Same answer, american.

Anna,

No one can touch a worker's paycheck without the consent of the worker, or a court order.

Except unions.

Walker wanted to stop collecting the dues for the unions, big expense to the government. Why does the government have to provide account receivables for the unions? Why not let the teachers have their money to pay their agent?

Does this freedom given the teachers hurt the unions, union busting? Evidently, huh. Unions and libs can't trust the teachers to send in the dues? Evidently. Threatens the union political machine so the Dems run away. The union political machine goes into gear and orchestrates mass rallies, protests, etc. Legislation is passed so the union political machine goes into action with the recall vote.

And how does all this help Wisconsin's budget problems?

Does the GOP have a big political "activist" machine that only cares about its own self interests. Nope. Will the big union political machine win? Maybe.

But when the people finally wake up, whenever that is, and realize that unions are in it for their own self interests, not the interests of the children or the teachers - unions are done. They are worthless and as exemplified in this case - offer nothing to solving the problems Wisconsin is facing.

It is not about governing - it is about the unions, their self interests - their power to confiscate dues, their political power to use the dues to buy Dems who give them the power to confiscate.

Dems are the best at this game. To bad it doesn't serve the people.

bob-1805084

Anna,

No one can touch a worker's paycheck without the consent of the worker, or a court order.

Except unions

LIAR, LIAR, PANTS ON FIRE!!!!!!

I have posted previouslyly here, as have Anna and many others, the COMPLETE text of the contracts and regulations about union dues decudctions from paychecks in Wisonsin. IT IS A TOTALLY VOLUNTARY CHOICE.

Your filthy propaganda and outright lies disqualify you from EVER GETTING ANY CREDIBILITY ON THIS BOARD.

Just simply state you hate unions, get it over with and go back to your corner sleeping spot in the outhouse.

Bob, workers DO consent to all kinds of deductions: alimony, United Way, health savings accounts, loans, professional (or union) dues. If the government doesn't want to do any of this for its public employees, then it shouldn't do ANY of it. But what does cost money and waste resources is spending time deciding whether or not what an employee wants to have done with the money is something the government approves of.

They are worthless and as exemplified in this case - offer nothing to solving the problems Wisconsin is facing.

What this is based on is beyond me to figure out. Saying it doesn't make it so, bob. In Wisconsin, the unions agreed to all the monetary concessions they were asked for. What is that, if not an offer to solve the problems that they didn't cause? Why should they be forced to do everything?

It is not about governing - it is about the unions, their self interests - their power to confiscate dues, their political power to use the dues to buy Dems who give them the power to confiscate.

Dems are the best at this game. To bad it doesn't serve the people.

What this is based on is also impossible to figure out. Union solidarity in this situation has been overwhelming. We're not seeing any bolting by all these down-trodden union members being held for ransom by dues deduction. The unions have stood solidly together, and if anything, union support has grown through all of this.

And if anyone can be said to be bought and sold here, it would be Governor Walker and the republican legislature, who seem to be answering to dictation from voices that no one else in this state can hear.

You see, it's really no use bob. You say the same platitudes over and over again, no matter what else anyone says to you in response, and no matter how ill-informed you seem to be about what life is like for the average worker, public or private, or what unions are REALLY all about. You admit no modification of your opinion even when confronted with fact after fact after fact. And to you, "governing" seems to be about about getting your way, and if you can't get your way fairly, about changing the rules.

That doesn't serve the people either.

But in short, I give up. You can have this field, as long as average workers hold all the others.

I haven't seen that. Pietro tried and failed. Besides - How many teachers in Wisconsin are free to teach without belonging to the union? If you want the job - sign the line .... the old union way.

Regardless, why should the government be the accounts receivable department for the unions. Should the government also pay the teachers' house payments, their utility bills, their Y memberships.......

You want the voluntary argument to obfuscate the issues I discussed. Typical Jackass.

Anna Molly,

The above was to John A.

Regarding your comments:

I basically made two points. Walker wants to give the money straight to the teachers. Gives them freedom. Saves money.

What is nefarious about that. Why walkouts and all the other stuff?

The second point was the self interest of the unions and their political power.

What argument have you made? ...... They stick together.

Changing the rules?

Who was walking out? Where is that rule? Who started the recall mess?

Bob, how does it save money? For whom? The money belongs to teachers. They have earned it. They have chosen to pay union dues OR to pay a pro-rated amount for the representation on their behalf. What Gov. Walker proposes is that instead of teachers bargaining for a contract, the state will give them a flat contract that reduces their take-home pay. To offset the loss in pay, Walker proposes that they could use their union dues toward other ends. It would be as if Walker said, "instead of paying for gas, you could use your gas expenses toward other ends." That's none of his business.

You say that unions are self-interested. Isn't everyone self-interested? Aren't you self-interested? Don't you think you should pay public servants less so that you get more money for yourself? Any decision to form a workplace union is done because the workers feel that they will get a better employment deal if they work together rather than try to hash out an individual deal. It is also in the public interest, because if a city pays one worker much more than another, without being able to explain the criteria for this decision, the city is subject to a lawsuit. There could be charges of nepotism, of favoritism, of discrimination (as is happening now with Wal-Mart for example). Having one bargaining agent for employees helps keep everything transparent.

Again, if you think employers should not withhold money for employees, or direct it to banks, etc., at the employees' request, then DON'T have them do it. Period. This is the same for the private sector and the public sector.

kate,

That's none of his business.

I agree - He should pay the teachers for the job they do and let them pay their owndues / bills or whatever they want to do with their money.

The unions are the agent of the teachers. The unions are agents of Dem political campaigns. The government is the agent collecting money from the teachers on behalf of the unions. See any problem here? Who looks after the interest of the tax payers?

You see, Bob suffers from SELECTIVE AMNESIA. IN case anyone wants to see the real exchange where I 'failed', here it is:

Bob make an untrue statement here, and I quote:

"Can they VOLUNTARILY be a teacher and NOT BELONG TO THE UNION in Wisconsin? Nope. The teachers never see their dues money. Walker wants to give it to them and if they want to voluntarily give it to the unions - fine. If you can refute that - do it with a link, Pietro."

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/03/09/6226627-first-thoughts-overlapping-battlegrounds?commentId=20526598#c20526754

I counter with a citation that CLEARLY proves him wrong here:

OK, Bob, have it your way.

There are provisions for those teachers who are NOT a part of the union, but still want to be a part of the 'bargaining unit' that the Union uses to negotiate. Here is the language in the contract:

Personnel in the bargaining unit described herein who do not voluntarily become members of Madison Teachers via cash payment or who have not authorized the deduction of dues pursuant to the conditions set forth in paragraph 2 above, are required to pay their proportionate share of the cost of the collective bargaining process and the administration of this collective bargaining agreement, measured by the amount of dues uniformly required of all members of Madison Teachers and in that regard, the Board, shall deduct such amount from each payroll check of the bargaining unit personnel involved.

Source: Madison Teachers, Inc Collective bargaining Contract Section 3a.

http://www.madisonteachers.org/teacherunit/Teacher%20CBA%2009-11.pdf

This tells me that a person does NOT have to join the Teachers Union to be in the Bargaining unit. If a person is not a part of the bargaining unit, they are required to pay their FAIR SHARE of the cost of the collective bargaining process. The person can still enjoy the benefits of Collective Bargaining (in this case) and NOT be a part of the Union.

So, Bob, you were saying...?

http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/03/09/6226627-first-thoughts-overlapping-battlegrounds?commentId=20526598#c20526820

Then Bob proceeds to say I was not correct even when I provided the ACTUAL AGREEMENT that proves Bob's assertions wrong.

Of course, I countered here - again: http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/03/09/6226627-first-thoughts-overlapping-battlegrounds?commentId=20526598#c20527263

Again, do NOT take my word for it. Look at the complete exchange yourself, starting at post 1.45. Here is the link: http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2011/03/09/6226627-first-thoughts-overlapping-battlegrounds?commentId=20526598#c20526598

Bob was wrong then and wrong now. Funny how these 'internets' can be used to find out what the REAL truth is.

Anna Molly, you don't have to give up. You have won your case against Bob more than once and I have provided the citations - and exchange - that shows that Bob will not relent with untruths, even if they slap him in the face.

Watching Bob hang from his own petard was pretty amusing. It is even more amusing that Bob didn't learn the lesson the first time.

Spin THAT, Bob.

Yawn

Yea, everybody read it.

Cliff notes: Pietro cites Madison alone - not Wisconsin or any of other many unions. Pietro doesn't cite the conditions referenced. Pietro doesn't qualify if these are temporary, exception, or other positions what they actually might be.

Nevertheless, as Pietro himself states

If a person is not a part of the bargaining unit, they are required to pay their FAIR SHARE of the cost of the collective bargaining process. The person can still enjoy the benefits of Collective Bargaining (in this case) and NOT be a part of the Union.

So, Bob, you were saying...?

Bob was saying that to teach in Wisconsin - you have to pay the unions whether you want to or not. Your money is confiscated. Your own quote proves it!

Can somebody maybe help Pietro?

Pietro: much as it pains me to say it, bob-1805084 is, effectively, if not technically correct on this one. The agreement you site states, rather plainly, that everyone has to pay the dues, whether or not they belong to the union. While technically, you don't have to belong to the union, you do have to pay the cost of the collective bargaining, as measured by the dues

If I charge you three dollars for three cokes or charge you three dollars for one coke and give you two free I still get three dollars. What you call it does not matter. One way or the other, under this agreement, the union is still getting its dues. While you technically are not required to "join" the union or pay union dues, the unions still gets the same amount.

As with any large organization, it is all about the money.

bobby are you joking? you wrote"does the gop have a big political activist machine that only cares about its own self interests? nope" take a day off from fox news and educate yourself. start by googleing "who's really behind republican legislation" it's called ALEC american legislation exchange. the've been writing the republican agenda at local,state and federal levals for forty years. did you notice how all the 2010 elected gop/tp governers all have the same agenda.

daffina,

Never heard of them. Do they confiscate money from teachers too?

Both sides have activists. Nothing compares to the power of unions. Nothing is more corrupt.

GE, Goldman Sachs, etc. may give a ton of money to Obama, but they don't confiscate the money from their workers and their workers aren't organized protesters, raliers etc.

Well bob, ALEC is trying to destroy public sector wages, so I guess you could say they are trying to confiscate money from teachers. Their model legislation page is here. http://www.alec.org/AM/Template.cfm?Section=Model_Legislation1 Don't bother to do a lot of looking around, however, because nearly everything on the site is open only to ALEC members.

Actually, dirp01, the contract snippet is clear:

Personnel in the bargaining unit described herein who do not voluntarily become members of Madison Teachers via cash payment or who have not authorized the deduction of dues pursuant to the conditions set forth in paragraph 2 above, are required to pay their proportionate share of the cost of the collective bargaining process and the administration of this collective bargaining agreement, measured by the amount of dues uniformly required of all members of Madison Teachers and in that regard, the Board, shall deduct such amount from each payroll check of the bargaining unit personnel involved.

If you are NOT a part of the union and you ARE a part of the bargaining unit, then you MUST pay dues.

THAT is the statute. That is the agreement (and why I posted it).

Bob is still wrong, technically or not.

IntheMiddle, TX

So is this what our electoral process is coming to? Whenever a party we dislike wins an election, we will just collect enough signatures in an attempt to overturn the election

What part of 'representative form of governmenet' do you not understand? The people can't change their minds? It's a recall VOTE, not a recall HEY-WE'RE-TICKED.

Funny, ITM.

You didn't have those words when your GOTPers claimed Congress last November, NOW DID YOU?!?

Nooooo, YOUR PARTY'S mantra was "Jobs, Jobs, Jobs!!!!"

Or am I exaggerating?

Just how secure are the Democrats? Any of them narrowly squeak by? GAME ON!!!

Recalls have been around for over 100 years.

not a recall HEY-WE'RE-TICKED.

"Tricked," more like it. ;-)

What ITM always fails to acknowledge when he crows about how republicans won these elections is that they had to hide their true agendas to win. What they're learning now was the wisdom of that strategy because they never would have been elected in the first place if they had told the truth about their intentions.

And that's why recalls exist in the first place -- not to re-do the election, but to address circumstances that have changed.

What ITM apparently doesn't know about the political process would fill up a political science textbook.

In-the-Middle, it's not about the fact that a party we don't like wins an election, it's about truth in advertising. If Gov. Walker had campaigned on doing away with collective bargaining, people would not have voted for him. Yet that is almost the first thing he did (after announcing tax breaks to lure in new business). So clearly, he had planned to make that a centerpiece of his agenda, but hid that from voters. Secondly, In-the-Middle, it's also about destroying a kind of civility that people from Wisconsin hold dear.

ITM....Understand that it's not about the Republican or Democratic Party Agenda.

It's about the Peoples Agenda....the Countrys Agenda. People (the individual, middle class, poor, children, elderly, handicapped, white, black, brown, old, young, men, women, employed, unemployed).....PEOPLE!

Not the fake "Citizens United" aka Corporate Agenda!

Understand?

ITM, you either have no memory, or use it selectively.

The popular movement to insert in state constitutions the rights of initiative, referendum, and recall began close to 1900 - in Wisconsin, promoted by the REPUBLICAN progressive LaFollette family. Hiram Johnson took up the same cause in California, and the success of his campaign placed him in the Governor's seat. And thus elsewhere around the country. It was considered at the time a GREAT victory for the people that enabled breaking the power of the railroads, the trusts, and the banking cartels.

In 2002, a pair of extremely wealthy, conservative (ultra-right) Republican people in Orange Country, CA, decided they could throw out Democratic Gov. Grey Davis, consequent to the devastation caused in the state by Enron's illegal manipulation of power supplies and prices. They created a phony "people's" committee and poured thier own millions into the recall campaign. They got the petitions they needed, and then put up one of their own ultra-right candidates to run in the accompanying election for a replacement.

Just as the Koch Brothers did in Wisconsin's 2010 balloting, these two bought an election. But they failed in buying the State House - in a shocking turn of events, Arnold Schwarznegger won election.

ITM, your empty spin and whining simply create a setting to embarrass you with the FACTS and the history. You expose yourself as a thoughless propagandist beating a single-tone drum. Crawl back under your rock. NAWO.

drive by - interesting....

What part of 'representative form of governmenet' do you not understand? The people can't change their minds? It's a recall VOTE, not a recall HEY-WE'RE-TICKED.

Seems that the recall WAS ONE of "hey-we're ticked". Would be interesting to read what the printed petitions actually said and what verbal spin the petition promoters put on it as they sought signatures.

You know, is the recall specific to his support of minimizing collective bargaining or to a variety of complaints.

It would also be interesting to see that if a recall is held, will the recall ballot list the specific reason for recall and why he voted for the measure, or something else?

It would also be interesting to see that if a recall is held, will the recall ballot list the specific reason for recall and why he voted for the measure, or something else?

Why should it, anymore than the regular election ballot lists a candidate's platform positions?

There's an election. Pick a candidate. Period.

These guys have plenty of opportunities to defend themselves with advertising, should they so choose, but instead what I see mostly is out-of-state advertising attacking democrats and unions.

Really, they need to get a positive idea for a change, but to be fair, it's hard to run a campaign against recall when the position you're defending is largely indefensible.

IntheMiddle, TX

Why should Republicans push a Liberal agenda?

Because Republicans say they listen to the American people.

2012 & collective bargaining

opportunities for Democrats emerging from the fights taking place in Wisconsin, Ohio, Indiana, New Hampshire and beyond over collective bargaining rights.
http://elections.americablog.com/2011/04/2012-collective-bargaining.html

The budget battles should also ring a bell to you.

Hey there ITM, TX; Missy, TX here. Texas is a fine place but you must have been out in the suin for a bit too long. That precident you're talkin' about was set some years back out in California recalling Governor Gray remember? That would make recalls in recent history a Republican precedent. Us "libbies" are just tryin' to keep up the tradition y'all set into action.

What's good for the goose or elephant is good for the gander or beast of burden.

But hey, the 2010 election was about...what now? Oh, yea, JOBS! That's what the Right ran on. Shoulda known they had a half dozen or so social conservation maxims to shove down our collective throats before they lift a finger for JOBS. They made the "Shoving down our throats" charge against Obama when it came to the healthcare law but what the Religious Right really expects is for the entirety of the rest of the country to fall in line with their "moral compass" imperatives and help "Take their country back!".

Humph, or as my Pappy used to say "P'shaw!"

Well we "libbies" want a country that leans forward not back. We learned well from the California recall. Got goooooood mem'ry. Pay back is a female dog, you know. Just ask our fellow Texan Mr. Tom "gerrimandermeister" Delay!

ROFLMAO!

Missy TX

Awesome post! Please post more often! I lived part of my super youth around White Settleent way (yes, that is STILL the name of the town, too - only in TEXAS!) I hope you at least have other Libs in your voting district,...

The reason why union shops force people to belong to the union when there is an union if from the law declaring unions are ruled by majority rules. This means someone has to get 50% of the shop employees to vote to be an union in order to even start and keep an union in a shop. If they would drop this law to allow people to form unions when they like you wouldn't need to force people into the union, because 50 people out of 800 could form their own union without getting 400+ employees to vote for an union. Union law was setup to be majority rule, if you don't like it then change the law to 25% can form a union and you don't have to belong to the union.

All they needed was each other.

Thank you for the reminder Pat!

"All they needed was each other."

AND- Obama KNEW it! Why should he have gone out on a limb that he didn' tneed to go out on?

It's true Feisty. We have to depend on each other. You can move mountains that way. Never never ever ever give up.

To All: Does anyone know if activist Adam Green played a role in getting these signatures? Is he still in Wisconsin? Does anyone know?

Just like elections have consequences’ so do votes. That is our democratic process to ensure the people don't get it shoved where the sun does not shine.

To All: Does anyone know if activist Adam Green played a role in getting these signatures? Is he still in Wisconsin? Does anyone know?

Anna Molly probably has a better handle on it than I do. What I do know is, he was instrumental in fundraising for running ad's up there and organizing boots on the ground.

Not sure if he's still around... Anna?

PS: Pat - you should know by know that I NEVER give up! lol

".... big, dumb clown boots..." Whoop- here they come!

".... big, dumb clown boots..." Whoop- here they come!

Here come the trolls... 1...2...3 - taking part in the collapsing spree...

Feisty, my dear - you are not a quitter. It's why I love you and so many other D's here.

Anna, have you seen or heard about Adam Green still being in Wisconsin? I'll go and check out the Wisconsin newspapers in the meantime to see what I can find.

1.7 million new jobs in the last 15 months.

RVZ555

"Also, given liberals history of getting illegals and illiterates to vote,..."

MONSTERS UNDER THE BED ALERT!! MONSTERS UNDER THE BED ALERT!!

The cuts are going to have to come from somewhere. Maybe you can be like CA and raise taxes so much that you drive all the businesses away from the state. Morons.

Stop calling people names. You only make yourself look like a moron.

And maybe it's about time that businesses faced the new reality and agreed to pay their fair share. I don't have them to hand right now, but there are statistics out there about how the decline in business tax revenue has contributed in substantial part to our current deficits situation.

As a wise conservative pointed out yesterday, raising taxes on business just raises prices that everyone else pays. And sometimes we have to face the fact that this is okay in order to reach a common goal.

It's the common goal that has been lacking in this country since we landed on the moon.

But here's the deal -- if you raise taxes on corporations EVERYWHERE -- i.e., through FEDERAL taxation, businesses would not benefit by moving from state to state, and they could not hold states up for ransom to get concessions as they do now. And that would help everyone.

Trouble is, Congress sold its spine long ago.

Anna, have you seen or heard about Adam Green still being in Wisconsin? I'll go and check out the Wisconsin newspapers in the meantime to see what I can find.

I tried, Pat, and the last mention I find of him in Wisconsin is in early March. Sorry. Maybe you can do better, being much better sourced than I am.

Pat

That should be the new slogan into 2012 "depend on each other" against the wolves

"All they needed was each other"

That, and tens of millions pilfered from Wisconsin taxpayers by crooked unions...

Answering RZV555 just increases his troll paycheck. He's another of them little mousies we've heard of, come by to nibble at the cheese and see who they can frighten.

Well, ignore the mousies, and what happens? They stamp they little tiny feet in frustration and void all over the carpet!

Some little mousies need the attention, don't y'see, and can't hold they bladders.

"Love to eat them mousies,

"Mousies what I eat,

"Bite they little heads off,

"Nibble on they tiny feet!"

- B. Kliban

drive by - you called it

"big, dumb clown boots", sure have been thumping. good one dbo!

posts 6.8 thru 6.12

Bob:

That, and tens of millions pilfered from Wisconsin taxpayers by crooked unions...

Tender your proof or NEVER say that again. You realize that's defamation, do you not?

Love to eat them mousies,

"Mousies what I eat,

"Bite they little heads off,

"Nibble on they tiny feet!"

- B. Kliban

LoL One of my all-time favorites. Love Kliban. Thank you.

drive-by-observer

You can add today's Maine teenagers to tomorrows' Democratic voter base, as the Republican controlled state legislature in Maine is debating changing child labor and minimum wage laws so that businesses can require teens to work longer hours for less pay. Up to 11 o'clock on school nights, as opposed to the current 10 o'clock, all for a "training wage" of $5.25. What a way for Republicans to build their future base.

Democrats dont favor work, that is obvious.

They want the next generation to be Democrat zombies and wait around for the government check in the mail.

AmyB - What? Maine mandates child labor!!?? Bet the maine youth will really be ticked when they find that the increased wages puts them in a different tax bracket. Shame that where they work wants to stay open latter to serve the youth not working. lol.

Guess if the government would sponser free university educations the maine youth wouldn't need to work, right?

Bob:

They want the next generation to be Democrat zombies and wait around for the government check in the mail.

You know, Bob, I don't know where you live, but in Wisconsin we mostly got rid of the welfare check years ago, with a republican governor working in cooperation with a democratic legislator. My own experience -- admittedly anecdotal -- when I was working as a teacher in an economically challenged community in this state was that the welfare "zombie" families tended to be the redneck conservative "families," usually non-nuclear and involving one or more children from various fathers who were often neglected by their parents who spent their time in redneck bars drinking up the welfare check.

So there's freeloading on both sides of the equation -- make no mistake about it. And we all pay for both. But that's not the norm -- on either side.

Anna - bet whomevers side the "zombies" are on and if they do vote, it will be for the party who promises to keep the $$$ flowing.

Anna Molly: with the changes you described that WI made to its public aid (a/k/a "welfare") rules, I bet the Zombies went down to Chicago to vote for Rahm Emanuel. Chicago has a long tradition of the dead voting ; )

Good point, Texas!

I fogot about the recall of Democratic Governor Gray Davis in California

Darrell Issa got that ball rolling and lost control of it when the Governator swept in and cleared the table. Hopefully, some of the dumb stunts he wants to pull in congressional hearings will work as well.

If I recall correctly, recalling Davis was as much about Enron as it was about any other particular political agenda, or electing any particular candidate. California might be in a much different position today had they not done that.

Davis' problem in California was his inability to work effectively with the legislature. He was caught in the effects of the economic downturn early in the cycle and could not react quickly enough. By the time Mr. Schwartzenagger jumped into the fray, the recall was almost a foregone conclusion. The only real question was who would replace Gov. Davis.

Governors all across the country whose states allow recalls will find that if they don't act to respond to the economic climate, but only pander to their base they will quickly lose support. "Cut taxes to busienss, cut taxes to the wealthy, cut spending on domestic programs, cut "waste", cut, cut, cut" does not resolve the issues associated with our current economic climate. Solutions are only found by all members of the government working together. No one part of a plan will get us out of the economic mess. The debt is bad, an economy which is not growing is worse.

From my earlier post 5.7 above:

In 2002, a pair of extremely wealthy, conservative (ultra-right) Republican people in Orange Country, CA, decided they could throw out Democratic Gov. Grey Davis, consequent to the devastation caused in the state by Enron's illegal manipulation of power supplies and prices. They created a phony "people's" committee and poured thier own millions into the recall campaign. They got the petitions they needed, and then put up one of their own ultra-right candidates to run in the accompanying election for a replacement.

Just as the Koch Brothers did in Wisconsin's 2010 balloting, these two bought an election. But they failed in buying the State House - in a shocking turn of events, Arnold Schwarznegger won election.

That post also gives a thumbnail history of the recall, referendum and initiative campaigns of about 1900 - which BEGAN in Wisconsin under REPUBLICANS!

dirp101 - like your analysis. Cuts alone will not resolve our economy/debt issues, but cuts must be made as well as changes to our tax laws.

In a recent Charlie Rose interview with several large city mayors the point was made by all that the public wanted certain services, the city workers wanted certain perks and the mayors only had a certain revenue to work with while the state and federal government mandated requirements to be met all while they (state and feds) could reduce funds at will.

The mayors and city budgets are caught in an untenable position all because the public and city service workers refuse to think about what those services cost today, tommorow and further down the road.

I don't recall which mayor said it but he made the comment that new city hires were not going to see the benefits current city retirees had. No way, no how and no money.

Wisconsin may have gone to the extreme with collective bargaining, but how many tax payers and government workers don't want to look far enough down the road to see that todays expectations are not sustainable.

JohnA - what is your point in reposting what you already posted. Does it make it more factual? Did it prove any illegalities or just that campaign contributions are bad?

dirp101 -

Although there were several issues Grey Davis had to face, in particular an attempt to increase revenues to face deficits when the state legislature was deadlocked (as it largely was since the time of Pete Wilson), it was the uproar over the rolling brownouts, blackouts, and skyrocketing energy prices caused ENTIRELY by Enron manipulation that set the stage. Now, I've known Gey Davis since he worked as a campaign aide to Jesse Unruh in 1970, and truthfully after getting back-stabbed in the process never liked him much. But that recall was completely a put-up job by two John Birchers from Orange County.

Your comment about the economy seems a little misplaced, too, in light of recent news. It has been growing at a faster rate than that of Europe or Asia (absent China).

One of the problems, as was chronicled yesterday in another story, was that the economic growth is not accompanied so much by job growth. Yes, there's been job growth thanks to the president's efforts (the GOP has been chopping jobs in recent weeks), but not at a pace to match economic growth. One of the main reasons for this is not really the productivity issue - it's the tax "reforms" and labor law reforms Ronald Reagan pushed through in the 1980's. The tax reforms changed emphasis from rewarding returns of long-term investment to quarterly capital gains - I've documented this in a "Vine article posted long ago. combined with labor law reforms that changed the basis for overtime pay and allowed hiring of "permanent temporary" workers, there is an incentive to cut staff, squeeze pay, exploit employees so they work longer for less, and chop up businesses.

If the Prsident and Congress really want to create jobs, they could change those and a few other things and really get things moving again.

JohnA - quite the conspiracy theorist I see.

Thruout 2010 what did obama and company do to create jobs other than denigarte businesses as being bad? Obamacare? Wall st reform? Consumer protection law changes? Insisting on free trade?

The only economic stimulas I recall in 2010 was the FED continuing low interest loans and the FEDs QE2 stimulas. Even Pimco credits the FED monetary policy as being the real creator of todays jobs.

So what did obama do in Dec 2010? He started promoting Republican ideals of tax breaks and credits to businesses for retooling and future expansion, he started projecting that he was now a friend of business, not an enemy, not a denigrator. Heck, Obama even went so far in early 2011 to invite business leaders to tell obama on what business needed from the government to create jobs.

Gee if obama moves to the right far enough he will become the republican candidate in 2012.

Honeywell CEO David Coat said in a recent bloomberg interview, "The best way for government to create jobs is to build an environment amenable to hiring" How astute of Mr Coat.

John A. , I did miss your points the first time around (at 5.7) but did catch them now. Very informative.

I guess my general point about the economy and how it relates to State level activities is that politicians have to face the reality just pandering to a base that only looks to one side of the budget equation will, eventually, run out of options. Cutting off both hands makes it difficult to build a new foundation. I think it will still be several years for the effects of this downturn to be reversed at the local governmental level. I don't think now is the time for government to be making job cuts. If that means not giving business tax cuts, then that is how it must be.

I also think that now is not the time for tax cuts to be made. With the additional demands made on government as a result of the economy, additional revenue is needed to pay for that.

American: I missed that interview, but thanks for pointing out that some of our local leaders are aware of the realities. Union leaders (as evil as they are) have been aware of this as well. That is why, even in WI, they were willing to concede to paying part of the cost of health ins. and pensions. Reminds me of potluck dinners at my church. When the table is full, its easy to pass out extra gravy. When the table is half empty, everyone needs to bring a little something. The problem is that Gov. Walker and some others are limiting what they say can be brought.

And the percentage of Baggers in the electorate is...?

Huffington Post ran a post this week on Republican governors and buyer's remorse. One of the people mentioned in the post lives in West Chester, OH. Prime Boehner country!! A lot of independents seem to be re-thinking their positions!

@DDC: Using your numbers (I'll accept them without source) if 20% of those who don't bother to vote hat the Democrats, etc., etc.; then that must mean that 80% of those who did not vote like it. SO, 80% of the 60% who didn't vote support the general agenda of the Democratic Party. 80% x 60 % = 48% of the people on top of which you add, just for the sake of argument, lets just keep your 20% of the people who did vote. So, you add 20% to the 48% and you have 68% of the people who are in favor of the Democratic Party agenda and that would mean the the Teapublicans could possibly in be supported by just 32% of the people.

I would say the TeaPublican party is in deep doo and setting itself up for failure. The sooner the better.

Because they didn't vote, they support the liberal agenda? What the hell are you smoking? lol. You want a source, try the latest census statistics. Of course, you won't like that if you're under 30. Generation Y has some of the lowest education levels we've seen in decades. Kind of like the hippie generation you take your cues from (boomers by the way, have a 48% high school graduation rate and these are the idiots now ruining us). My generation is X by the way, which has the highest education levels. Make your baseless claims, post your nonsense from MSNBC, Huffington Joke, or even Fox. By the comments on here, most of you aren't smart enough to know what an unbiased source is.

Voter statistics are easy to find, do I really have to hold your hand? Try infoplease.com. Seriously. Also learn to do math. Generally speaking, 50 to 60% do not support either party. They may be registered as either, but do not bother to vote. It's been that way since this country was founded. We all know people like that.

Since the election, 20% of that 60% right now has joined the Tea Party. It's amazing how many people have come to an event and said "this group isn't anything like what I thought it was." The more you spout ignorant comments and misinformation, the more we grow. Once people are confronted with the fact that you lied to them, you've lost them. So keep it up.

That leaves 40% up for grabs, true, but good luck with that. No election in our history has garnered more than 70%. The previous numbers beat the left in 2010, but wait until you add the new members. To make it worse, add in the Republicans who haven't bothered since 2000 because they hated both Bush and McCain (f'ing RINOS). I, by the way, voted for neither. Discount it all you'd like. Liberals did in 2010 and were wrong. In 2012 they'll be wrong.

Larger than I think? C'mon big boy, pull that number outta your hindquarters!! Whatta ya mean, don't make the mistake of lumping the Tea Party in with the GOP? Who's making Boehner jump through flaming hoops? You see DEMOCRATS paying any attention to these nut jobs?

Tea Party did Angle and O'Donnell a fat lotta good, didn't they?

The Tea Party is made up of many people. You can sit there and make ill-formed judgments of a group that consists of Republicans, Democrats, and Independents all you'd like. Repeating lies do not make them true. Since you want to throw down the gauntlet, so be it.

1st, let's begin with the racist claims. These are pathetic. I suggest you watch this:

After that, I suggest you google Native American Tea Party, Latino-American Tea Party, etc. I for one am Blackfoot, or Native-American to the PC crowd. I despise such labels because no one seems to realize how they originated. Labels such as African-African and such were born out of the progressive movement as a slur to minorities, whom they felt were unfit to be called Americans; minorities were viewed as a subspecies that was less than human; unfit to be called American (hence the qualifier). In many ways we still are. For example, Planned Parenthood was founded by Margaret Sanger for the sole purpose of stifling the black population. What you probably view as choice is responsible for the single greatest ethnic genocide in history (75% of abortion clinics are in black neighborhoods, and they have the highest percentage of abortions)

Some freaks exist in the Tea Party just as with any movement, but how exactly do they compare to the communists marching with the left these days? How about the violence at rallies by the left, especially the unions? Sites that are littered and destroyed after a protest by the left? Spare me the self-righteousness. Establishment politicians on both sides of the aisle attack them and try to say the same nonsense as you. Delude yourself if you wish, but since you asked, 70% of Americans do support what the Tea Party stands for.

How about warmongers? Let's check the historical record shall we? Woodrow Wilson (D) - World War I. FDR (D) - World War II. Harry Truman (D) - dropped the atomic bomb on Hiroshima & Nagasaki, and Korea. LBJ (D) - Vietnam. George H.W. Bush (R) - Iraq. Bill Clinton (D) - Somalia, Yugoslovia, Bosnia, Haiti, Zaire, Liberia, Albania, Sudan, and Yemen. George W. Bush (R) - Iraq & Afghanistan. ALL modern wars in this country have been started by progressive politicians. Both Bush's were NOT conservative. Ronald Reagan was the ONLY conservative to ever be president of the United States. Why don't you research how much Reagan hated his VP?

To be fair, the GOP is a mess these days. The values Lincoln founded them on now belong to Libertarians. If you want to label an idealogy on the Tea Party, that would be more fitting. People are still waking up to what the GOP is, but at least they are. Can you say that about anyone on the left? I'd be more than happy to support liberals if they return to trying to achieve their goals while respecting the constitution and keeping government small, like JFK did. He tried to shut down the Fed, cut taxes, created jobs, and was no wuss. That I respect.

Progressivises are what's killing us. Progressivism is nothing new, contrary to the BS some choose to believe. Take a good look at ALL politicians. Rich boys and gals on both sides of the spectrum. How many normal people get into office? Of course, some idiots also think only the elite are qualified for the job. Rome had their politicians and their ruling class, Kings had their nobles, and on and on it goes. Always some dumb bastards who buy that concept. Funny, it was normal people that founded this country and ran it for almost 200 years.

The people championing Socialism these days are hilarious. Congrats on championing a system that's going to make the rich even richer, and strip you of every right you have to fight them. Doubt that? I'm sure you do, but perhaps you better learn economics. Our economy that you rail against is a Socialist economy, with a few Capitalist factors. The only true Capitalist economy that exists is in Hong Kong, and it's doing wonders for China isn't it?

We need to stop fighting each other and focus on what's really wrong with this country. Stop blindly following either party. Washington's like Pro Wrestling. It's all fake. Politicians act like they hate each other in front of the camera, then go out to lunch afterwards and laugh at how dumb Americans are. Until we clean out the corruption in BOTH parties, nothing is going to truly change. That's the Tea Party's real goal or don't you remember quite a few establishment GOP politicians losing their jobs in November?

Those you cite, don't get me started. Realize that some GOP dirtbags are trying to capitalize on things and use us (no names, but the scumbags in CA for example), but it IS NOT their movement.

You can verify what I've posted all over the net, but do yourself a favor and stay away from the media outfits like the Huffington Post. What a load of BS. Ironic you get your cues from Arianna Huffington and George Soros. You do realize they're rich, right? lol

Hey Moonbat bobby - care to share your source?

You'll excuse me if I'm suspect to right wing chain e-mails - there crediblity kinda leaves me cold!

In the meantime, what do you think about this?

For the second time, an Indiana public official has lost his job because of provocative comments made about the political brouhaha in Wisconsin.

Carlos F. Lam, a Johnson County deputy prosecutor, resigned Thursday after acknowledging he sent an email last month urging Wisconsin Gov. Scott Walker to discredit labor union protests by orchestrating a fake assault on himself.

Possibly, Lam suggested, the pretend assailant might even use a firearm.

Lam's boss, Prosecutor Bradley D. Cooper, accepted the resignation. He called Lam's Feb. 19 email to Walker a "foolish suggestion."

On Feb. 23, the Indiana Attorney General's office fired deputy Atty. Gen. Jeff Cox after he suggested in blog posts and on Twitter that police use live ammunition on protesters who had poured into Wisconsin's Capitol.

The political fight in Wisconsin erupted when Walker, a Republican, called for eliminating collective bargaining for public employees. That bill passed March 10 and was signed into law the next day.

Lam's message, posted on The Wisconsin Center for Investigative Journalism's website, said, in part: "If you could employ an associate who pretends to be sympathetic to the unions' cause to physically attack you (or even use a firearm against you), you could discredit the public unions."

Lam could not be reached Thursday. Efforts to reach the governor's office in Wisconsin were unsuccessful.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CBQQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.postcrescent.com%2Farticle%2F20110325%2FAPC0101%2F103250556%2FIndiana-prosecutor-Carlos-F-Lam-resigns-after-recommending-Wisconsin-Governor-Scott-Walker-stage-fake-attack-against-himself&ei=UP2VTZyQIIOx0QHu__XxCw&usg=AFQjCNE3wWYvrXODFp6xW9XYu7HruH9gDQ

And your source for this is........?

But wait... here's more...

An Indiana state official who tweeted that riot police in neighboring Wisconsin should "use live ammunition" to clear out pro-union demonstrators has lost his job but says his comments were meant as satire.

The Indiana Attorney General’s Office said Wednesday that Deputy Attorney General Jeffrey Cox "is no longer employed by this agency."

The office made the announcement after reviewing statements Cox purportedly made in tweets and blog posts, including one in which he said he advocated "deadly force" against "thugs" who threatened state elected officials in Wisconsin.

The tweets that got Cox in trouble were made in an exchange with Adam Weinstein, a copy editor at Mother Jones who has been writing about the worker protests at the Wisconsin Capitol. Wisconsin workers and their supporters have been demonstrating for well over a week against Republican Gov. Scott Walker's plan to strip public sector workers of nearly all their bargaining rights. Walker says the legislation is needed to help solve Wisconsin's looming budget deficit

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=5&ved=0CCwQFjAE&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.msnbc.msn.com%2Fid%2F41736625%2Fns%2Fus_news-life%2F&ei=UP2VTZyQIIOx0QHu__XxCw&usg=AFQjCNFeFupXnfGfp-ZAhYFeU1VatoFEog

Real funny stuff isn't it? Especially in light of the events in Tuscon less than 6 weeks earlier!

"MSNBC as usual doesnt mention the death threats against Republican lawmakers in Wisconsin."

Guess you didn't look very hard:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42369823

Next assignment - find me any Democrat OR Republican who actually supports whack jobs like this making these threats against the other side. Just one.

Don't worry Auntie Fascist, Fiesty and her sidekicks are a really disappointed lot. Since Obamba joined the war club with Bush and others, disappointment has set in their ranks. All their dream of distributing the wealth of America has disappeared into thin marijuana air.

Who's worried? Better worry a lot more about whoever the sacrificial lamb is the Republicans nominate in 2012!

moonbat fiesty changing your colors from chihuahua fiesty? care to enlighten us on what a "Moonbat" is?

Oh look, Baghdad Bob is back at 12.5. I thought he only did 1 show per day here on FR.

Tell us more Birther stories, Juven. The last one was really funny.

Please..save your sarcasm, open the shades and take a look around. Big time tax breaks, costing millions of taxpayers dollars, dolled out without recourse and oversight, have destoyed our economic infrastructure just as much as anything.....Off-shore corporate HQ to dodge billions in taxes....funny how you skip that part in your ideological rant. Please-your fear-monging plea of socialism is a year late and really a bunch of dollars short.

You can give your money away to the local billionare if you want and blame everything and anything on the teacher, cop, or fireman next door. If your rich and greedy, Im sure you dont like what your seeing. But if your not, than your a joke. Take that venom you hold for the 46k average salary teacher in Wisconsin (with masters) and redirect to the billionare who just left the building...their laughing at your nievity. Wake up man!

Yeah! In the event of fire or crime, call the Koch brothers!

Andrew - care to consider why businesses are doing what they are doing?? No ideologies are even required... I will even start the ball rolling...

American consumers want the lowest cost goods possible while receiving the highest wages possible.

Your turn...

Really? I doubt it..."another" being the operative word...you conveniently don't mention who got us into the first one.

Hey JB! Don't know what neck of the wood you beckon from but round these parts (down big D way) it is strictly UNAMERICAN to disrespect our president. Now I know your mother raised a nice young man or woman to go out into the world and acheive all the success this great land of ours offers. Seems to me that having a smart, articulate, listening, thoughtful, uncompromising principles while making consessions for the good of all President would be something you could be proud of even if you disagree with him.

What was it during the Bush/Cheney years? A rabble-rousing call for kinder criticism with a dose of decorum came from the Right as Bushes' detractors screamed "RESPECT THE OFFICE!"

What happened to that most Republican of American values: Respect for the office of The President of the United States as OUR President? The JOKE is on you dude. The American people are getting the picture. LOTS of the TP/GOP are ticked off that we have a credible, no impressive, black President. GET OVER IT!

We'll all be better off when the TP/GOP accept the new reality that people's eyes are being opened to their tactics and we don't like what the see since last November. It not about recalling our error of voting for our own demise so much as stopping a serious pillaging of the middle class at this point.

Jump on board or get run over by the train bub.

Missy: I think the loss of respect for the Office of President of the United States has been generated by those who have held it:
JFK, for philandering.

LBJ, for lying about deaths in Vietnam.

Nixon, for using the office to hunt his enemies and the power of the office to cover up a burglary.

Reagan, for either using the office to illegally front a war or for allowing it to be used by his subordinates for the same purpose.

Clinton, for lying under oath about sex.

Bush, for lying to get us into a war in Iraq, which has cost us almost one trillion dollars and over 4000 lives, and countless injuries, ruined our prestige in the world and prevented us from being able to properly execute the war against those who did, directly, attack us.

Obama: for selling us on hope, change and jobs only to have the the political capital wasted by fighting for bipartisanship which will never exist. We're still hoping for change that the jobs will come, but it is starting to look like the same old political fights.

Bachmann is just plain out bat @!$%# crazy....

Here in Fl we have a crook for a governor who is cutting healthcare to the disabled while another fool is trying to spend money on golfcourses in the state parks. At the same time our governor is cutting benefits to patients he will be taking our system private which means no oversight for his "medicaid clinics"....some racket. And the Koch bros reputation is alive and well here in Fl too....I hope we here in Fl will have the same ambition to get these people out.