If you think this is bad, wait for part 2: after their budget cuts cost nearly a million jobs, they'll blame president Obama for not creating more jobs.

This is remarkably similar to the strategy they've used since the 2008 elections -- use the filibuster to block EVERYTHING the democrats try to do, then blame the democrat-controlled congress for not getting anything done.

For that matter, this also reminds me of their age-old strategy of de-funding a government program until it no longer works, then argue for privatization because....you know....the program doesn't work.

Sigh....

Zandi is not an economist he is a numbers provider to whoever signs his paycheck. This guy work's for Moody's, the same company that handed out AAA ratings for all of the junk mortgage backed securities as long as they got paid. Zero integrity.

"Zandi: Financial rescue and stimulus responsible for saving or creating 8.5 million jobs"

Read the interview with this nitwit, he is about as credible as dirt.

http://voices.washingtonpost.com/ezra-klein/2010/07/zandi_financial_rescue_and_sti.html

Read the interview with this nitwit, he is about as credible as dirt.

I would suggest you do the same nitwit! What part of:

discredit Zandi (who was an economic adviser to John McCain's campaign),

Or are you implying that was ANOTHER bad choice by McGeezer?

Failed stimulus? The GOP must be smokinng crack again.

Yes, the cuts will cost jobs. However, we can not continue to spend money we do not have. The cuts are necessary to try and get the budget under control. As for the Wisconsin issue, I think the unions have outlive their usefulness. The unions are no longer needed to protect workers rights or ensure people receive a fair wage. The unions, with there increasing demands for benefits and ridiculous work rules, are hurting our economy. The cadillac health plans and absurd pension rules need to go. In any places union workers can retire from their union job, collect a full pension, and then go back to work as a consultant in essentiallythe same job they just retired from, thereby double dipping. These types of arrangements are bankrupting municipal, state and federal government. It took the car companies filing bankruptcy to get out from under the union retirement benefits that were killing the industry. And lets not even talk about the union rules whereby someone who was laid off continued to collect their salary for a period of time even when they were no longer working. Or how about unin rules where employees are guaranteed a certain amount of overtime, whether they work it or not. It is these types of union abuses that has driven manufacturing out of the US.

I do not wish on anyone that they lose their job, however we need to get spending under control and that means certain sacrifices must be made. We can argue all day long about the timing of these cuts when we are in a very fragile recovery. The problem is that the longer we put off the cuts the deeper those cut will have to be. Every dollar increase in the debt means more interest payments in the future taking up a larger percentage of the available fund.

This is correct. There are an awful lot of folks that prefer the US go completely down the toilet financially that make any budget cuts now. I fear we may already be passed the point of no return.

And every job lost means more payroll taxes are lost. So we take a double hit, when you add in the new cost of paying them unemployment benefits.

It's voodoo economics, courtesy of the GOP.

It is better to lose jobs that have been created off the backs of tax payers. Cut the spending.

pjam09

Uh... I'm not sure what article you read.. but the link you posted doesn't discredit Zandi at all... in fact, quite the opposite. He created an equation that could be used to show the effect of changes in the economy on businesses and the economy as a whole..

What exactly was it in the article that makes him "credible as dirt"? The fact that he's worked with both parties? To me that makes him more credible because he's obviously not just on either side's payroll.. They just pay him hoping he gives them the numbers they want.

Or... is it that you don't like that he disagrees with your opinion?

The Republicans have convinced people that budget cuts to social programs -- and now job cuts -- are necessary, as if their tax cuts for millionaires had nothing to do with it.

I agree that budget cuts are needed, and they are going to hurt. We have a lot to answer for our living the way we did the past 20 years.

I would have a great deal more respect for the House, though, if their budget cuts started at home. Like, not getting a salary increase automatically. Like raising their contributions to the retirement package. Like them paying more for their medical plans. Like Congress joining the medical plans that most Americans have. Like not being eligible for retirement until they've worked 30 years.

How do they have the gall to stand in front of microphones and say they "feel" for the American public? That they feel the pain people are going through because there are not enough jobs, that our medical costs rise every year, and usually our income doesn't?

Js in Jd It is almost always non union/management employees who retire then come back as contract employees. This is a problem but don't blame the unions for this

I agree JS... cuts ARE necessary to try and get the budget under control.

I just wish the Republicans would start by shutting down our 2 unfunded wars, and taking back the free-money tax cuts handed out to the super-rich... Then, if they still feel it necessary to go after we poor souls and social programs down here on earth, we can talk.

Yes, Zandi was a McCain mistake, for that matter, McCain was a McCain mistake, and certainly not a conservative by any stretch.

That said, of course cuts are going to cost some jobs.

And to the loon who went on about Republicans as the party who filibustered dems, the democrats were criticized not because they did not get anything done, quite the contrary. These democrats did so much, many of them got fired, as they did exactly what the majority did not want them to do.

It's like liberals really do not get it. Cutting government means cutting jobs. We know this. But the good news is that these jobs are a net drain on our economy. These people need to get real jobs. Now this might mean they work at Walmart, but an honest days work is an honest days work - something that many in government know nothing about.

Chief architect of President Obama's "failed" stimulus? Let's not forget the stimulus was an important component of the steps the Obama Admin. took after taking office that very well prevented a double dip recession or even worse, a Depression.

And someone needs to tell Cantor and his staff that the US unemployment rate never reached "double digits".

These guys are so far out of touch with reality, how can any rational American count on them to actually provide workable solutions to the economic problems this country continues to face?

Yes, the cuts will cost jobs. However, we can not continue to spend money we do not have. The cuts are necessary to try and get the budget under control

We can solve our budget problems if corporations were forced to pay their fair share!

The Government Accountability Office said 72 percent of all foreign corporations and about 57 percent of U.S. companies doing business in the United States paid no federal income taxes for at least one year between 1998 and 2005.

More than half of foreign companies and about 42 percent of U.S. companies paid no U.S. income taxes for two or more years in that period, and during that time corporate sales in the United States totaled $2.5 trillion the report said

Sen. Byron Dorgan in a statement called the report "a shocking indictment of the current tax system." Levin said it made clear that "too many corporations are using tax trickery to send their profits overseas and avoid paying their fair share in the United States."

The study showed about 28 percent of large foreign corporations, those with more than $250 million in assets, doing business in the United States paid no federal income taxes in 2005 despite $372 billion in gross receipts. About 25 percent of the largest U.S. companies paid no federal income taxes in 2005 despite $1.1 trillion in gross sales that year, he said.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2008/08/12/us-usa-taxes-corporations-idUSN1249465620080812

There is only one solution to America's problems and that is end these insulting, stupid one fricking way Free Trade policies that have shipped millions of good paying jobs out of America, while making the Wall Street crowd filthy rich..... Simple, Next vote out every career politician.......

Hopefully the first job lost is Zandi's. How much did the taxpayer pay this clown to be an analyst?

I agree that lost jobs will hurt our economy be it private citizens or the federal employees. The house and senate do nothing to lower their costs paid for by the tax payers and most or all of us know what they get for free and it ain't that way for the taxpayer.

Their ideaology to cut spending reminds me to tell the story about the oil companies. The speculators and the oil execs raise price at the pump and will continue to do so. I hope they will because they will force the drivers to switch to other energy sources eventually putting them out of business. In the meantime they will continue increases at the pump. Harry S. Truman would never allow the gouging of any company at the expense of the people in this country.

Both houses continue to believe they are doing their best for us. That's BS they do whats good for themselves.

The Repubs have been doing the Divide and Conquer act on the American middle class and poor, just like any army of paid mercenaries, for well over the past 30 years since Reagan. The rich have not only been bankrolling these nefarious ones, they have been doing the looting and raping afterward, sending business out of the Nation, lowering wages and benefits, plundering the middle class of all gains that the Unions had bought them with their blood, sweat and tears. The Repubs, and the FAR right fringe Tea Party, at the behest of their Already-Too-Obscenely-Rich-To-Fail, have, since the Bush Regime, given up all attempts at subtlety, working openly to remove the protections to the Workplace, Worker's Rights, Ecology and any sort of Financial Restraint in the Marketplace. The Rich and Corporations have gotten obscene tax breaks, which has severely cut income to the Government, which is spending less, as a % of National Wealth than it has since the Gilded Age of Robber Barons. Now that the Repubs, Tea Partiers and their Rich Bankrollers have quit trying to even be sneaky about it, they have woken up the Sleeping Giant of The PEOPLE of The United States and The World. We see The People shaking off the shackles imposed upon them by the Super Corporations World Wide. We see that the Rich and their Corporations are paying a far smaller share of their income in taxes than "The Little People", assaults on our Civil Rights, Attacks on our Unions and all of this AFTER the biggest con game ever with the bank Crash.

The People will not stand for this any longer, the brainwashing and propaganda from the Corporate Controlled Media and Faux Neuz not withstanding. People all over the US, and the World, are rebelling against the super rich and their bought and paid for mercenaries and just like during the French Revolution, the rich who are abusing us are going to fall, it is only a matter of time now. The Repubs working to cut programs that are direly needed by the people that have been disenfranchised by the rich is only throwing fuel on the fire: We The PEOPLE and not going to stand still and take it anymore, we have NOWHERE left to go, while the rich have been gathering a larger and larger portion of all true wealth unto themselves. They and their corporations are sitting, just sitting, on top of at least $2 TRILLION in CASH, this does not even account for the the wealth they have invested in the stock, money, bonds and futures markets, that is just the CASH. And yet they are NOT hiring at anywhere near the pace that they could be. They WANT to totally break the middle class so that we will be their 'willing slaves', willing to work just so that we can eat, let alone buy their products. We are already to the point where everybody BUT the rich, and their corporations, are severely hurting, and now they are trying to take even MORE.

The Sleeping Giant is now wide awake, and is, frankly very mad, finding that his home, car, food for the table, job, savings, healthcare and very nearly all of the furniture has been taken away from him whilst he slept. The corporations, the rich and those who have done their bidding are going to reap the fruits of the whirlwind, and it is NOT going to be pretty as all of that wrongfully gained wealth will be removed from them and those guilty of fomenting this class war are imprisoned, or worse.

The ONLY way out for them is for them to allow their taxes to be raised, to hire back the greater majority of American taxpayers at REAL, Living Wages, stop ALL corporate tax giveaways and quit trying to balance the budgets on the backs of those least able to pay by cutting the very programs that allow them to barely survive. Otherwise the results are going to be very similar to what happened to them in the French Revolution and they end up with an appointment for Dr. Guillotine for them and their families.

The Sleeping Giant is indeed awake, yet the Rich and their mercenary forces in the Statehouses, legislatures and media are asleep, counting their money in their dreams, thinking themselves untouchable. Won't they be surprised when their bank accounts are frozen and confiscated and they, themselves rounded up and facing trail....just like Mubarak and his family and cronies in Egypt and across the Middle East...they said that it could not happen to them, but they found out that they are wrong. The same will happen here in America as well, the clock is ticking and the previously gentle, sleeping giant is wide awake, with it's eyes wide open, and ready to take back it's life!

You were warned, many times, now feel the whirlwind and reap what you have sown!

Cut jobs... the GOP Governors Association has been doing that since they started at the beginning of turning down Federal Stimulas money to CREATE jobs in their states... And all at the expense of their un and under employed citizens just to try to discredit our President and to position themselves in 2012.

This is a brain trust the USA can not afford... Where are the jobs Mr. Speaker... the heralded upper 2% job creators got their tax bonus... where are the jobs??? The absolute only thing the Republicans can do, and do well, and have ever been able to do, is... LIE!

settle down, everyone. The republicans were sent to washington with a mandate to dismantle SS, HCR, any job gain, socialism and anything obama said he likes. Right? Isn't that why they are there? to destroy jobs?

700,000 jobs? SO BE IT!!!

Economist predicts GOP cuts would cost 700,000 jobs!

As long as those jobs are in the federal government I have no complaint. It will lessen the burden on the taxpayers to pay the salaries. When a business encounters a turndown the first thing to go is people. Is this any different than any other time in capitalist history?

I love the way the morons at MSN make this a headline. Tell me they aren't tryiing to discredit the republicans. Anytime the worshipful master Obama does something they blast the horns, drop the confetti, send out the marching bands and spin the news with spotlights and banners! Hell, they even spotlighted the stimulus as if it actually did something to help America... what a bunch of morons!

I laugh at MSN and their bias... pretty much like I do with the regular posters on FR.

I want to ask the liberals what their idea is to solve the nation's debt. Can you afford $25,000 per family member to pay it down? No? You can't? Then why do you support liberal politicians that spend money like water ($4 Trillion in 2 years). Are you crazy or is that number just too big for you to comprehend?

700,000 jobs? Where do these economists find those broken crystal balls?

HEY! I have a headline for you!

AMERICA COLLAPSES UNDER IT'S MASSIVE DEBT.

Riots in the streets as citizens loot every grocery store in their city in order to feed their families. Washington in complete disarray as former members of congress and the senate flee! Former President Obama is missing as is his family. Rumors have it that he and his family have left the country.

It has been reported that the heads of states of countries that have loaned trillions of dollars of money to feed the government are conviening in an undisclosed place. Military movement has been noted all over the globe. Battleships have been tracked heading towards the US....

What do you think liberals? Keep on supporting morons that don't know how to handle money.

Rapture 2010,

You are correct...unemployment did not get to double digits...9.9% is so far from it I can't believe that they would have the balls to say double digits!...Sheesh what were they thinking?

Chrissy, you need to read your history. Some of the largest parts of the stimulus were signed by Mr Bush. Remember the banks failing and some were to big to fail? How you forget so fast.

So what is easier and less painful?

Losing weight when you are 10 pounds over, or 100? At some point if you get too fat things start breaking down and you can't lose the weight.

Same goes with our economy. Painful cuts now, or brutal ones later. Only 375k people making over a million per year, so taxing the rich isn't going to fix it. Within a few years 100% of the federal revenues will go for entitlements and interest on the debt.

The problem is that there simply are too many people who cost more than they contribute to society... is really that simple.

As far as making companies pay more, you might as well just say make people pay more. No customers = no revenue... higher taxes = higher cost of goods and services. Businesses don't pay taxes, their customers do. Pretty simple stuff here people.

I am constantly amazed at the number of liberals who want to bring home the jobs, and then buy foreign junk. Buy American, and companies will stay here. The problem is we all want the best buy, and it is simply much cheaper to make most things in countries like China that pay a dollar an hour.

Finally.... Obama is COMMANDER AND CHIEF he can bring home the troops AT ANY TIME!!! we still have trps in Iraq, and he INCREASED troops in Afghanistan. So why don't you libs complain to your Messiah to end the wars...hmm?

So when a Republican is in the White House huge deficits are bad and they need to be cut or the country will be ruined

Whan a Democrat is in the White House huge deficits are good and if they get cut the country will be ruined.

Smacks of party partisanship as usual. No way can an intelligent reasonable individual take any of your comments seriously.

Was it just me, or did the repugs win last year's elections on "jobs, jobs, jobs"? Hmmm, oh, I get it, they mean laying off public government workers so they can get those high paying (add sarcasm here) jobs at Mal- Wart in "right to work" states! Classic Reaganomics or, as Bush Sr. said in 1979, "voo-doo economics."

We can raise taxes to 100% no deductions and Washington will still run a deficit.

To get spending under control, leaving more money in the private sector to create real jobs, cuts must occur. They will hurt.

But it is what it is. Get it done.

Every time I read the comments on here I realize that America's best days are behind it.

There is only one goal this current generation should have: Improve our education system. We've become a nation of morons. Maybe the next generation can do better.

B Honest, Could you get all the $ from Wall St and the big banks first.

ron scheer

I agree that lost jobs will hurt our economy be it private citizens or the federal employees

Interesting, when did those federal employees become NOT private citizens? I guess you think all those people working in public jobs were all imported from another country. Whoever up thread said we have become a country of morons hit the nail right on the head!

chrispalmer71

well just one question do you want jobs, or do you want to be a slave to china because if we go further in debt and reach a point that we cannot pay them back that will happen. So if anything blame obama for accepting aid from china beacause no we are seriously in debt because of his bailouts that he signed!!!!!!!!!!

So that's the choice the repubs/teabaggers are giving us...slave to China...slave to Corporate America. I'll bet there's a third choice...I'll bet it's a choice that scares the hell out of the corporatocracy!

Solution: Fire 700,000 Federal Gov't employees; start at the very top. There. PROBLEM SOLVED.

...NEXT...

Too bad Paul F doesn't have his facts straight.

I am really having a hard time with people who will vote for/support a party that is willing to destroy 700,000 lives - and livelyhoods - as a means to get power.

Has anyone asked those 700,000 people who will lose their jobs how THEY felt about it?

Jody - to paraphrase a line from "A Few Good Men" - The republicants can't handle the truth" they have to make up lies to keep in power. Their goal for the US is to have the "Yes Massa" and the rest of us.

We now see the republicants job creation strategy - less is more.

Has anyone asked those 700,000 people who will lose their jobs how THEY felt about it?

We're getting a little taste of that here in Wisconsin, and I have a suspicion that more is about to come.

Some on here think this is great- 700,000 jobs going away. How does the loss of 700,000 paychecks buy MORE local goods and services, which helps keep the local ecomomies going? Don't give me that 'but WE taxpayers pay those salaries", crap, either, when you consider- your taxes will NOT go down when these jobs are lost.

Somebody's not playing with a full deck, here.

Pietro, they do not care when they think that the potential 700,000 people are all democrats, but I assure you once the common folk republicans are are swept up in the maelstrom, they will sing a different tune. This belief of you will be rich one day, so help us hide our money now from the government, so when you regular folks get rich, you don't have to worry about paying so much taxes. That's like telling every young athlete that they are going to go to the pros and make a lot of money. The reality is that most of the populous will not be rich/wealthy and that is fine, because we cannot all be. The problem is getting the regular folks, who are hurting to agree that the very wealthy earners should have a tax break as well. (I really think no one should get a tax break at this time, but I digress). It's nice to dream, but I always give my children a dose of reality. Reach for the moon, but make sure you know how to hold on to a few stars, if you come up short of the moon. Life is not all or nothing, it's takes a series of trials and errors to get solid hold on who you are and what you will be.

Jahmekan

Pietro, they do not care when they think that the potential 700,000 people are all democrats, but I assure you once the common folk republicans are are swept up in the maelstrom, they will sing a different tune.

.... at which time they're sure to be expecting the rest of us to have their backs. Then we'll all be Americans. Until then, they're the Americans and the rest of us just suck.

Gotcha. I understand completely.

Pietro, they do not care when they think that the potential 700,000 people are all democrats, but I assure you once the common folk republicans are are swept up in the maelstrom, they will sing a different tune.

Your words are prophetic, Jamekan. Excellent post and I agree 100%.

The Repubs have been doing the Divide and Conquer act on the American middle class and poor, just like any army of paid mercenaries, for well over the past 30 years since Reagan. The rich have not only been bankrolling these nefarious ones, they have been doing the looting and raping afterward, sending business out of the Nation, lowering wages and benefits, plundering the middle class of all gains that the Unions had bought them with their blood, sweat and tears. The Repubs, and the FAR right fringe Tea Party, at the behest of their Already-Too-Obscenely-Rich-To-Fail, have, since the Bush Regime, given up all attempts at subtlety, working openly to remove the protections to the Workplace, Worker's Rights, Ecology and any sort of Financial Restraint in the Marketplace. The Rich and Corporations have gotten obscene tax breaks, which has severely cut income to the Government, which is spending less, as a % of National Wealth than it has since the Gilded Age of Robber Barons. Now that the Repubs, Tea Partiers and their Rich Bankrollers have quit trying to even be sneaky about it, they have woken up the Sleeping Giant of The PEOPLE of The United States and The World. We see The People shaking off the shackles imposed upon them by the Super Corporations World Wide. We see that the Rich and their Corporations are paying a far smaller share of their income in taxes than "The Little People", assaults on our Civil Rights, Attacks on our Unions and all of this AFTER the biggest con game ever with the bank Crash.

The People will not stand for this any longer, the brainwashing and propaganda from the Corporate Controlled Media and Faux Neuz not withstanding. People all over the US, and the World, are rebelling against the super rich and their bought and paid for mercenaries and just like during the French Revolution, the rich who are abusing us are going to fall, it is only a matter of time now. The Repubs working to cut programs that are direly needed by the people that have been disenfranchised by the rich is only throwing fuel on the fire: We The PEOPLE and not going to stand still and take it anymore, we have NOWHERE left to go, while the rich have been gathering a larger and larger portion of all true wealth unto themselves. They and their corporations are sitting, just sitting, on top of at least $2 TRILLION in CASH, this does not even account for the the wealth they have invested in the stock, money, bonds and futures markets, that is just the CASH. And yet they are NOT hiring at anywhere near the pace that they could be. They WANT to totally break the middle class so that we will be their 'willing slaves', willing to work just so that we can eat, let alone buy their products. We are already to the point where everybody BUT the rich, and their corporations, are severely hurting, and now they are trying to take even MORE.

The Sleeping Giant is now wide awake, and is, frankly very mad, finding that his home, car, food for the table, job, savings, healthcare and very nearly all of the furniture has been taken away from him whilst he slept. The corporations, the rich and those who have done their bidding are going to reap the fruits of the whirlwind, and it is NOT going to be pretty as all of that wrongfully gained wealth will be removed from them and those guilty of fomenting this class war are imprisoned, or worse.

The ONLY way out for them is for them to allow their taxes to be raised, to hire back the greater majority of American taxpayers at REAL, Living Wages, stop ALL corporate tax giveaways and quit trying to balance the budgets on the backs of those least able to pay by cutting the very programs that allow them to barely survive. Otherwise the results are going to be very similar to what happened to them in the French Revolution and they end up with an appointment for Dr. Guillotine for them and their families.

The Sleeping Giant is indeed awake, yet the Rich and their mercenary forces in the Statehouses, legislatures and media are asleep, counting their money in their dreams, thinking themselves untouchable. Won't they be surprised when their bank accounts are frozen and confiscated and they, themselves rounded up and facing trial....just like Mubarak and his family and cronies in Egypt and across the Middle East...they said that it could not happen to them, but they found out that they are wrong. The same will happen here in America as well, the clock is ticking and the previously gentle, sleeping giant is wide awake, with it's eyes wide open, and ready to take back it's life!

You were warned, many times, now feel the whirlwind and reap what you have sown!

Be Honest what about a strict fair tax everyone pay the same no matter how much you make. This would eliminate the IRS because their be no need to file a tax return. because the tax would be just like a sales tax.

Steve C, as long as that tax was applied to stocks, bonds, money market and futures, for EVERY trade, that might be workable, as it it, those items get taxed at a far lesser rate. Donations to politicians should also be taxed as should ALL advertising. As it is, advertising is tax deductible, meaning that the rich actually get tax Break for getting the word out on their product...of course, the media, who depend on those advertisements, and thus the rich corporations, would scream bloody murder that Their income was being attacked.

I agree very much with you. Don't the government say kill a few to save many??? It's so sad how the country is becoming. And I feel sorry for those 700,000 which could include us

Keep spinning MSNBC, your sheep will keep bawling.

Chris Palmer;o K so your the first one let go from your job and there are no funds for you to feed your family.The manufacturing jobs you talk about are not coming back here because big business does'nt want to pay a living wage.Here's my solution tax the rich the way they should be taxed and start rebuilding our infrastructure,you know the infrastructure that keeps blowing up and breaking down all around the country,manufacture the material here and put Americans to work.This cannot be done with out the governments involvement,all companies involved in the rebuilding must be American and must hire legal citizens,this would employ anywhere from 8 million to 12 million people immediately,more taxes collected from people working, less debt when we make our officials pay the damn bills.Politicians don't want to tax the rich because they are the rich

Cooch...

It's not that big business doesn't want to pay a fair wage... ITS YOU AND YOUR FELLOW AMERICANS who want the cheapest product. Go to Walmart and tell me I am wrong.

Do you seriously believe that if everyone starting buying only American products that big business wouldn't come back?

As far as taxing the rich... there are only 375k Americans who make over 1 mill per year. Not enough to pay all the bills, and besides, the States are already raising taxes on the rich (and have for years). HCR is being financed by increased taxes on those making over 250k. The problem is too many not paying anything, and too much spending.

I don't believe that 700,00 jobs will be lost for 1 second!

But hey if they are that's good for the economy. Remember Nancy Pelosi saying 'Unemployment Insurance STIMULATES the economy. For every dollar paid in UI 2 dollars are put into the economy'

Just look at the math 700,000 gosinda $4,000,000,000 $5714.28 times. You really think that there are jobs that pay $5714 per year??? That's ILLEGAL not even MINIMUM WAGE

hopefully the 700,000 will all be federal government employees...they have added 200,000 since our king took over (that means you are paying their benefits now too)...they were at 2,748,978 civilian federal employees as of January 2009, and.....that doesn't include security agencies (CIA , NSA , etc)...and....

97.6% of civilian federal employees work in the executive branch of government

Please supply us with some references for those numbers. You put them out there with no links as proof and to expect anybody but your buddies to believe them is absurd.

I agree hopefully they are 700000 fed job. government workers-overpaid= underworked- overcompnsated= we really need to get a hold on the sucking machine called government.

If we don't you can kiss this country goodbye. No work-no pay dump unemployment compensation after

two weeks- welfare( one and done) =not a citizen-no money---most of all governments employs same system as the rest of us -- 401k no preferred benefits plan-no different health plan--then u know what

all this will get fixed. takes the spoon from the babies mouth and the baby finds a real job.

Those "jobs" should never have been created in the first place.

The "Stimulus" was just an excuse to add more weight to the wagon.

Face it folks, it's time to knuckle down.

Cut government overkill, cut corporate taxes.

And let the private sector do things the American way, HIRE.

I am bewildered and confounded to say the least when I read these posts. Skipping over the poor grammar used when writing by most posters, I must say that the political right and left have done a fine job of snowing the American people. Upper middle class Americans think they are rich, lower middle class Americans think they are poor. Quotes have been made stating that there are only 375k people who make a million or more a year. Well guess what, the top 10% controls over 90% of the wealth in this country. There is something intrinsically wrong with that. America used to be the land of freedom where anybody could be anything they wanted but somewhere along the way we have lost our way. More is better, enough is never enough and greed is good seems to be the mantra of the wealthy. There is no social responsibility (and I'm not talking about donating to charities which is TAX DEDUCTIBLE) I'm talking about Americans making sure that other Americans have a decent wage, health insurance and some comforts. Large corporations and have given us distractions to quibble about (cell phones, HDTV's, autos, ipods, computers and you get my point) Costs for consumer goods is forever rising (although we are told competition lowers prices, for example, I have a choice of 3 cable providers not counting satellite and the prices for all continue to rise and have NEVER gone down) WE will as a class of people (the true middle and lower middle class) continue to be screwed by the wealthy until we rally and put a stop to it.

Dennis Price

..And yet the loss of 700,000 jobs stated by an economist whose predictions about the stimulus have never been right is gospel.

Dennis

wiredworkplace.nextgov.com/2010/09/too_many_federal_workers.php

there is one...see how easy that was? ...just use one of the search methods made available to you and magic happens...there are several others, I looked at quite a few and looked for trends in the numbers give or take a few tens of thousands...even stopped at a couple of .gov sites...you may be able to use this kind of technique yourself and have a lot of fun

in fact, the number of Executive Branch employees per 1,000 population is down from 13.3 in 1962 to 8.4+ in 2009 , but I wonder what inflation would have to say about the overall effect

you can look up the rest (or anything)

Raise taxes to 100% no deductions and Washington will still run a deficit.

Getting spending under control is step one to real economic growth. 700,000 fewer workers has happened in private industry many times and the sky did not fall.

We just gotta do what we gotta do and the sooner the better.

Most of those 200,000 jobs that were added were only to complete the 2010 census and were temporary. Where are these other 700,000 jobs going to come from? The private sector or public sector?

Hey Pietro ...

Of course we don't have to even think that you would have supported a Tea Party or GOP candidate under ANY condition now would we? In your opinion you'd probably just keep on spending until the whole system collapses and everyone starves! Yeah, that's the lefty way!

How about maybe those 700,000 government jobs get replaced with REAL productive, revenue generating, private sector ones? Maybe small business growth when the Feds quit sucking the life out of the economy!

We ALL know who the REAL people are who deserve the blame for the loss of 700,000 jobs that the Republicans want to get rid of --- it's the VOTERS who VOTED for the REPUBLICANS.

Those voters BELIEVED the Republicans when they campaigned on the PROMISE that JOB CREATION WOULD BE THEIR TOP PRIORITY.

Silly voters, TRICKS are for REPUBLICANS..........you FELL for the GOP scam, AGAIN..............

Indepdon,

The number seem weird because of the multiplier effect. Of the 700,000, only 100-150,000 would be direct federal employees. The rest are PRIVATE sector employees who depend upon the business/trade of the federal employees. Think of doctors, lawyers, mechanics, waiters and waitresses, retail sales clerks and so on. The very same people that you and I do business with each day. The point is that when you dramatically reduce the demand for goods and services, the capacity to provide those goods and services will also be reduced (layoffs). Then the goods and services that that capacity required will be reduced, further reducing another level of capacity (more layoffs). Each layer generally is more basic, automobile to steel processing to steel production to mining.

Overtaxedagain,

Most federal jobs are executive branch because that is how the Constitution reads. Congress makes the laws. The Judicial Branch (distinct from the Justice Department) rules on the laws and criminal or civil acts. Both have relatively same staffs. The Executive, ie. the President, is responsible for enforcing the law, collecting taxes, regulating commerce, paying the bills AND maintaing the military. Further, the Census Bureau is part of the Commerce Department. The added 200,000 federal employees that have been widely quoted included the temporary Census Takers hired for the 2010 Census. By the way, the Census is also a Constitutional requirement, to apportion the House of Representatives.

So much for "JOBS are the GOP's #1 priority." More money for the wealthy is the GOPs #1 priority.

I notice none of the Right wingers here really want to discuss the article and the GOP DESTROYING JOBS!!!

Both parties have helped to destroy the economy. Obama's Green energy job bill is providing a wind-farm in China for China and an green engine factory for GM in Mexico. The problem is that our politicians on both sides of the aisle are for sale to the highest bidder, and the general population is not the highest bidder. We need true campaign reform and not the usual window dressing.

The 2011 Federal budget is $3,834,000,000,000 with a deficit of $1,267,000,000,000. The claim is that by cutting $50 billion out of that that 700,000 jobs will be lost. By that logic, balancing the budget will lead to a loss of 25 million plus jobs. I cry BS!

Chrispalmer71,

I am calling you out. Tell us where those 700,000 jobs are coming from. Tell us now, and name the companies and products.

Tell us how much of WalMart's product base is American. Remember when each WalMart was full of red, white and bunting? That disappeared in 2001. Ohio Arts made the Etch-A-Sketch IN OHIO, until WalMart forced them to move to China to keep their contract. Remember when a Ford was made in Detroit? Now a Ford may be built in Mexico, but a Subaru will be built in Indiana.

Truth, Manufacturing jobs are pretty well gone. We are screwed. You cannot run a successful "service economy" or "information economy" because neither create wealth, they both leach off other people. To create wealth, you must extract it from the earth (agriculture and logging, mining, drilling) or convert it (manufacturing or construction). Adding 700,000 to the unemployment rolls will simply return us to about 10.5% UE nationally.

By the way, This is history repeated. Look at the Great Depression. FDR's recovery projects (WPA, TVA, etc) were deemed too expensive or unconstitutional. So halfway into a decent recovery all federal support was dropped. The Depression found whole new depths of human suffering. Only WWII in Europe and renewed FEDERAL spending brought the economy back.

Okay, those of you who think 700,000 unemployeed are going to stimulate the economy because they will be on unemployment are insane. Unemployment will be cut because it is a "entitlement program", so these poor folks will get canned, go to the unemployment line only to find that there isn't enough unemployment insurance for them to have a check, so they go straight into the poverty line. Now explain to me how that will make the middle-class prosperous again?

Simple solution. Eliminate all income tax.

1.7 trillion dollars are traded DAILY on wall street. A flat 5% tax on that would net well over 24 trillion in federal revenue yearly. Problem solved, next issue please.

Wasn't it the repubs who were attaching "job-killing" to anything associated with the Democrats? Most of it was fantasy. That was only a month ago. Now the repubs are proposing killing real jobs. Do they really think everyone is as ignorant as their fox watching supporters? Who's killing jobs and the recovery. This is just a blatant attempt to destroy the economy because they have no candidate with any chance in 2012. How patriotic of them to destory the country so they can get elected.

Anybody interested in changing the exsisting tax code, check out Fair Tax.org. I did and using their calculator in the end I would be better off. I believe that many of you would be as well.

Yes wake they DO think everyone is that ignorant. And it works for them, their ignorant faithful put them back in office. My wish for all those dimwits, I pray they are part of that 700,000. I hope they get EXACTLY what they voted for. And when that happens, just sit back and wait, the crying will be so loud and incessant it will be unreal. They all deserve just what they asked for. And then some.

"Ignorant Faithful"? i don't think so, the Democrats were spending and printing money so we got sick of it. This blaming one party or the other is just stupid, we are where we are and now tough decisions have to be made. Living wage - this may change. We need to manufacture our goods. How long can we keep borrowing money from China? AND importing all their cheap goods? Only thing we have is Wall Street and Banks. We have to get down to the future and where do we go from here.

How about maybe those 700,000 government jobs get replaced with REAL productive, revenue generating, private sector ones? Maybe small business growth when the Feds quit sucking the life out of the economy!

Astonished - First of all, those 700,000 jobs are NOT all Government jobs. The truth of the matter is that over 67% of those 700,000 jobs are PRIVATE SECTOR JOBS. You have just cut off your nose to in spite of your face just to try and make political points against my post.

This is TYPICAL of the GOP/TP and if you support them, you are just as bad as they are.

There is NO MERIT - NONE - to destroying the livelyhoods of 700,000 people, no matter if it is in the public or private sectors.

Pietro...you aren't embarassed to be throwing your whole self behind this one economist who was so wrong about the stimulus? Wow!!!!

If there's a republican left in Wisconsin today, you can sure bet they own a business. The workforce have crossed over.

Goldman Sachs' study also said that the GOP House spending cuts would result in a 2 point drop in the GDP, cost jobs and be a drag on the economic recovery. You would think that as one report after another say the same thing, the GOP would listen instead of making excuses.

Jody, I don't get the part about the GOP "thinking, instead of making excuses" ;-)

You would think that as one report after another say the same thing, the GOP would listen instead of making excuses.

LoL Not if they're made in the Scott Walker mold.

Or should I say "pod"?

Funny you should say pod. When I look @ Gov Walker i really get the eerie sense that his soul is missing like in the movie invasion of the body snatchers. He just has a somewhat blank not mindless but definately soulless look about him. He has no emotion to speak of. Just a side bar I know this isnt on topic, but does anyone else get that sense about him?

Walker could/should be a CEO. He's not qualified for that either.

ucg ~ Yes. I have the same feeling about Michelle Bachmann and Sharron Angle, Sarah Palin, Jan Brewer, and Bobby Jindal. I had the same feeling about Bush even before the 2000 election.

It's the class of the Stepford candidates. Easy to control and manipulate.

Jody, Iowa

Goldman Sachs' study also said that the GOP House spending cuts would result in a 2 point drop in the GDP, cost jobs and be a drag on the economic recovery. You would think that as one report after another say the same thing, the GOP would listen instead of making excuses.

Gee Jody don't you know that unless Fox endorses that poll, You know, the only Network in history that had to go to court to defend it's first amendment right to deliberately lie to it'it's viewers:

Fox News gets okay to misinform public, court ruling
03/09/10 11:48 Filed in: Media Reform
UPDATED:Many news agencies lie and distort facts, not many have the guts to admit it...in court...positioning the First Amendment as their defense!

The attorneys for Fox, owned by media baron Rupert Murdoch, successfully argued the First Amendment gives broadcasters the right to lie or deliberately distort news reports on the public airwaves. We are pushing for a consumer protection solution that labels news content according to its adherence to ethical journalism standards that have been codified by the Society of Professional Journalists (Ethics: spj.org).
A News Quality Rating System and Content Labeling approach, follows a tradition of consumer protection product labeling, that is very familiar to Americans. The ratings are anti-censorship and can benefit consumers.

Its a lie. it's all just an Islamo-fascist lib Conspiracy?

my question to Eric Cantor--where was the republicans when it became mandatory for everyone to have automobile insurance? Does anyone remember that? Was there any squawk about how unconstitutional that was and it seemed liked "big brother". American we are being played. First, there are so many jobs that will be brought back because those positions no longer exist. We have become a virtual service society. We just want to download and text of what it is and what it is not. There is really no work of hands and sweat of the brow to produce goods and services.

How can the Republicans hear anything over the TEA PARTY drums and loud-speakers blaring "CUT, CUT,CUT and DRILL BABY DRILL" We have to make goverment small enough that it can never keep us from stealing or killing each other again.

I remember Nixon's "Silent Majority". It only worked until Nixon got caught in his lies. The TEA Party will last as long as it can maintain the lie that tax cuts for the rich and total deregulation will grow the economy, rather than continue the path to banana republic (third world status, not the store).

As I recall the Fox suit, was Fox was not distinguishing between "news" and "news commentary" and "commentators" (not news readers or reporters) selling gold under the guise of financial news/commentary. Chief in this perversion was Glenn Beck. Oh, the gold firm Fox was promoting was then shut down by the SEC for various securities violations.

Tragically, CNN has now adopted the same strategy.

Jody, Before you quote Goldman Sachs I suggest you see the movie Inside Job. They are partially responsible for this financial meltdown. Actually, largely responsible.

John Boehner says its about jobs and then a month later its about spending cuts? Oh well if Americans lose jobs for spending cuts. But.... lets take it to the next level. Reagan and the two Bushes account for over $11 trillion of our current national deficit based on the formula of tax cuts to millionaires and billionaires plus excessive military spending. John is allegedly a spending cuts expert after 8 years of voting for all Bush expenditures in route to nearly doubling the national debt and nearly tripling the longterm unfunded fiscal commitments. Bush grew government and the federal payroll to gargantuan size and left us with two multi trillion dollar quagmires on the other side of the planet to help bankrupt America. With John's help.

Excuse me for asking but....... where is Boehner's credibility for addressing spending cuts???

Republicans are grandstanding about spending cuts while protecting their two sacred cows from slaughter, tax cuts to millionaires and billionaires plus totally over the top excessive military spending for the sake of the American Empire and oil access.

What we need in America is jobs, jobs and more jobs. And make sure that they stay in America instead of outsourced by billionaire corporations committing economic treason against the American people.

republicans want you to have a job: as long as they can pay you $5-6 a hour, no collective bargining, no health insurance, no retirement, no overtime, no vacation, no benefits, no union, no nothing....YA GET WHAT YA VOTE FOR !!

Allow me to share with you the real "Republican Job Plan".

They want to "Outsource State Jobs To India, Mexico, China, etc,". The only way they can do this is by ending "Collective Bargaining". This situation has already happened in Indiana. Just ask any of the tens of thousands of furloughed State Workers. This is why the Governor of Wisconsin is holding so firm. This situation will happen in many other states and at the Federal Government if Republicans/Tea Baggers get their way. The Left must hold firm.

It saddens me that the States and the Feds are jumping on the "Outsource Band Wagon". Not really as the Republican Party, Chamber of Commerce and the Koch Brothers owe these countries "Big Time". Afterall they have to be repaid for the 2010 election.

I say boycott any items made in Indiana. Also in Wisconsin if the Gowernor gets his way.

our king has Goldman Sachs guys in his admin...think there is a connection their Jody?...don't know maybe we should find out

"I say boycott any items made in Indiana. Also in Wisconsin if the Gowernor gets his way."

hahaha...Michael, what third world ghetto do you live in?...just wondering

"Not really as the Republican Party, Chamber of Commerce and the Koch Brothers owe these countries "Big Time". Afterall they have to be repaid for the 2010 election."

hahaha...more laughable idiocy...hey Mikey....I thought libnuts hated "conspiracy" thery crap when it was leveled at our king? is that still true?....just wondering

Over Taxed Again

our king has Goldman Sachs guys in his admin...think there is a connection their Jody?...don't know maybe we should find out

Wow, no pleasing you is there? Yes, the president saught advice from them, much to the chagrin of the republicans, who were harping about not having qualified people to advise him.

Another flip flop by republicans... whatever the president does you can sure count on republicans turning the opposite direction.

Over Taxed Again

I think you should change your ID/Handle. Its apparent from your posts that you don't pay any income taxes. Why? Because you don't have a job.

Why not talk with your buddy "The Tan Man" to help you find work and get off of welfare.

And if you disagree with comments in my posts, then please tell me why and don't just leave sarcastic remarks, it further displays your immaturity and "Stupidity".

If economists knew up from down, we wouldn't be in this mess in the first place.

Anna

Anyone who believes that economists caused this problem doesn't understand either economics or business. Politicians and greedy wall street financiers caused this problem.

don97524,

Alan Greenspan had a hundred or so economists advising him during his tenure and Big Al still came away with the belief that regulations were not required on Wall St UNTIL the Great Recession hit, then he changed his mind and admitted his mistake.

When did "Big Al" ever listen to even one other economist?

One was enough. My point is made.

By the way, if you have some idea that republicans understand either economics or business, then why are we in this mess today?

Again we see all you people blaming everyone else for all our stupidity, we are all guilty of destroying our economy, we are all guilty for our corrupt and over payed government officials greed. Obama only made things worse by bailing out his special interest groups and the only way out is to make cuts. But the me myself and I mentality of this whole thing is, as long as it's not me, I can do it myself and I need more not you. So what if 700.000 more people lose their jobs. there are tens of millions who cant find a job and are facing living in the streets as it is. Cut government spending means lose of local and federal jobs,, I'm all for that, may give us a chance to ever find a job again and they just go on vacation with the millions they stashed away on Obama's bail out of the rich,, we seen no bail out or gain in the jobs here but government did

Hi newday

The question that thoughtful Americans must ask is this: Why do the Republicans hate this country?

They love it whenever they can milk it dry.

Thanks for the Keith Olberman info.

You are welcome Beverly! My daughter sent me the link and I was delighted to read what he had to say about Wisconsin.

Newday: I truly believe what you're saying. Unfortunately, people do NOT understand that by giving money to small businesses, people will get hired, then they will spend their hard-earned dollars on products; thus, companies that produce those goods will make money and hire MORE people and on and on and on. It doesn't take too many brains to see this. But, by taking it all away from the middle class and the poor....they are going to end up losing money. With no one working, there will be less taxes paid, less money available for ongoing programs, etc. And, with less money being made, more states will have to spend more money to pay unemployment to the unemployed workers. So, unemployment and cutting programs and people will ONLY cause more problems and will cost our government and our states MORE money in the long run. I don't understand WHY people can't see that. If no one is working, no one is spending money or paying taxes, and no money is being made.... what is so hard not to understand???

These politicians (GOP) make me sick. They give great big tax cuts to the rich, so they keep the money coming in for their re-election, and now they want to sabotage jobs in America by cuts. 700,000 is a lot of jobs to lose. Where were these old geezers when good ole Bush was in the White House spending money like crazy. In Az., the GOP will not let poor people get transplants (the state can't afford them). These shysters and the teabagger are going to be the downfall of America as we know it.

HI, Didi: thanks for your thoughtful response. My answer is that I simply don't know what people don't get about this. It does appear that an awful lot of people voted against their own best interests, and unfortunately, the folks in Wisconsin have found that out. They are making a heroic stand, and I honestly believe that they can win this fight. The favor the people in Wisconsin have done for the nation is that they are making it graphic, and clear to the American people what the issues are. We may owe them a debt of gratitude if they can win this one.

I believe I can explain the Republican thinking on this issue. If they can say they made cuts to the gov't. spending, and keep the unemployment rate at about the same or increase it, then they will be able to point the crooked little fingers at the Dems for being obstructionists, and Obama, saying they have done nothing to help the economy, just look at the unemployment rate, and the poverty rate, as both will have risen. The key here is to blame Obama and the Dems for the dirty work the Repubs will be doing. It has worked out pretty good so far. Look at the 2010 results. It is truly amazing at the number of gullible people that believe everything the Repubs say as the truth, especially if they heard it on FOX Noise, to re-enforce the notion. Sad really, but true.

damn Brent ...you sure did figure it out

ohhh...did you hear all that tripe on MSN-DNC or CNN-DNC or CBS-DNC or ABC-DNC or maybe NBC-DNC or Comedy (not funny) Central or James (mushmouth) Carville?...got news for you.....wait....wait...you got it... John Stewart is not a "journalist" and he is NOT funny...just thought you needed to know

Of coarse they are. "If you're not with us then you're against us". They must be the enemy. It's the GOTP credo.

Bob, fifty billion zillion is a theoretical number right? It doesn't actually exist and i believe the number was 4 million. I could be mistaken, but i don't think we're talking about an Austin Powers movie here.

Furthermore, i think matters of the economy are more serious than most on the right tend to believe. Playing "Pin The Tail on the Spending Cuts" is not a very fiscally responsible approach to reducing spending. Especially when defense spending is not in play.

I didn't know John McCain had hired a "lefty" guy as his economic adviser? If republicans had allowed the Bush tax cuts to expire on 2% of the population, the increased revenues of about $70 billion a year would have given republicans some credibility on that "fiscally responsible" claim they've been making--they haven't been fiscally responsible for 8 of the last 10 years and the only reason they have talked the talk the past 2 years is because a democrat is in the White House. Facts is facts.

You don't get it.

The people complaining about the government and fighting against Wall Street regulation ARE the 2% (plus the hillbillies that jumped in line when they screamed, "Socialist, Muslim, Male florists are burning American flags!"

Bob 1887910,

Funny, I always thought the GOP believes you can fix all economic problems by cutting taxes. [When your only tool is a hammer, everything looks like a hammer. ] And yet, half of the "failed" Stimulus was actually tax cuts. Have we found a tax cut that Republicans don't like? Any chance that was because it was not structured to the upper brackets? Any chance it was because they didn't want Obama to get credit for it?

The people complaining about the government and fighting against Wall Street regulation ARE the 2%

Which is odd when you consider that the cities of the US that have the highest population of the richest people in it, such as NYC, D.C., L.A., Philadelphia, Wilmington (DE), Boston, overwhelmingly voted for Obama.

Uhmm, that would be because those cities have some of the "highest" populations. Conceivable, there are a lot of other people (I don't know... lets say... maybe somewhere around 98% of the cities' population) that aren't in that 2%.

Have you seen the price of living in NYC, D.C., etc?

Read this from the Wall Street Journal:

Sen. Obama did best among two main wealth brackets–the bottom and the top. (The middle was split about evenly). According to the polls, Sen. Obama won 60% of the votes of those with family income of less than $50,000.

He also won 52% of the votes of those earning $200,000 or more. That compares with Sen. John McCain’s 46% showing for the same group.

http://blogs.wsj.com/wealth/2008/11/05/why-the-wealthy-voted-for-obama/

Or from Fox if you are so inclined:

Despite plans by Barack Obama to raise taxes on the rich, the wealthiest Americans supported him over John McCain Tuesday.

Read more: http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,447644,00.html#ixzz1FJZxdrBZ

Really funny. Liberals blame Wall Street for everything including their dog getting sick and now they want to quote and believe Goldman Sachs.

Tony C. Please tell us who caused the economic collapse and don't use the Fannie and Freddie GOP talking point.

Really funny. Conservative jump on the "government is a ponzi scheme" statement, but ignore the "regulations are laughable" part. Why? Because they don't mind if Wall Street is an unregulated ponzi scheme.

Tony C:

Really funny. Liberals blame Wall Street for everything including their dog getting sick and now they want to quote and believe Goldman Sachs.

Not really. The last economist I believed was Paul Samuelson. He said go left when Milton Friedman et al said go right. We went right.

And here we are.

Jody, If you really believe that Barney Frank, government pushing to lend to unqualified home buyers along with Fannie and Freddie had nothing to do with what happened in the financial markets then you just want to deny the root of the problem. When the mortgage default rates started to increase and what was actually in these CDO's came to light with the value of the instrumentst having to be decreased due to mark to market, the ball really started to roll. Barney Frank was really close to the guy running Fannie until he was removed for many financial violations of Sorbains Oxley. Wall street greed played a role. Greed catches up to everybody. That includes business leaders, dictators, congressman, private sector unions and public sector unions. Not surprise you can't deal with reality and only can place blame in one direction.

I hate to disturb the right-wing narrative but fewer people who got their mortgages from Fannie and Freddie walked away from them than regular mortgages and the problem with Fannie and Freddie came because the Bush administration allowed those mortgages to played with on Wall St, when Frank took over the committee in 2007 the collapse was already beginning.

Little old gay Barney stopped Republican majorities in both houses and a Republican president from averting the mortgage crisis .

And I'm the Queen of England.

"Is this the real life, or is this just fantasy?"

Nice to meet you, your majesty.

And yes, Barney Frank has some explaining to do. But at least he is on the right side of the fight about how to fix it -- to be clear, the right side is on the side of the people.

And what Disney world are you living in,, none of these governments care about the people today. Elections are corrupt and the American People are the elites puppets on a tax string and thats all

The difference in those philosophies is the distribution of the burden. That is what is being argued here. Maybe not in those words.

They don't hate America, they hate Americans who aren't like them. They have theirs. They're not in a union, so "busting" the unions doesn't harm them. They don't mind harming other people. They're not smart enough to realize that if the standard of living goes down for the little guys, it goes down for them too. They think they're immune to the repercussions of the end of the middle class. They're the same people who told us that, "Outsourcing is good and actually creates better jobs than the jobs we lose". Right. Name one.

Actions speak louder than words. Their actions tell that they indeed do hate this country with a passion.

Our Tea Party governor ended a recent speech on budget cutting by exhorting people who are on welfare to "get a job!" (Exact quote.)

The Maine Council of Churches responded by releasing these facts to the public: 92% of Temporary Assistance for Needy Families are single mothers with children under the age of two years old. The median length of time people are on assistance in Maine is 18 months. 97% of recepients had three jobs in the previous five years.

Whether its union busting or spending cuts, the Republicans can be relied on to demonize whole classes of people, spreading misinformation and protecting special interests over the Middle Class. I swear its a full time job, for a voter, trying to unravel the lies from the truth.

Right you are SAM, I am not in a Union and I do want them BUSTED. I don't need some Communist-scum-bag-Union to fight my battles. And I don't like laws that tell me I don't have the right to work unless I pay that Communist-scum-bag-Union monthly "dues". If I don't like my work environment or think I deserve better pay, I find another job. And you're right, I don't mind harming people, if those people think they are "entitled" to a job simply because they're breathing. Union members are no better than the kid who pays one bully to "protect" them from the other bullies. If you're that stupid and that cowardly, fine you pay the bums, but you have no right to expect me to PAY them too, so you can get a job you don't deserve.

They think they're immune to the repercussions of the end of the middle class.

Excellent point, Sam. They will look to each other with a stupid look and say 'what have we done?' when they are out on the street with no job and no income because of their short-sightedness.

Right you are SAM, I am not in a Union and I do want them BUSTED. I don't need some Communist-scum-bag-Union to fight my battles. And I don't like laws that tell me I don't have the right to work unless I pay that Communist-scum-bag-Union monthly "dues". If I don't like my work environment or think I deserve better pay, I find another job. And you're right, I don't mind harming people, if those people think they are "entitled" to a job simply because they're breathing.

Patricia Paulson - you have my respect because you have the GUTS to post exactly what you feel. I do not agree with you, and I think you are short-sighted to believe that you would not ever end up 'like those people', but I do applaud your vociferous defence of your beliefs.

However - If you believe that things will be 'the same' after you 'bust' the Unions, then you are deluding yourself. Like Sam said - you think you are immune to the repercussions of the end of the middle class.

Who will have your back then?

I agree @Chris Gillard. Actions do speak louder than words. They can play lip-service all day long, but the GOP's actions tell me that they DO HATE middle-class America!

Yeah, you just want the burden equalized! How many taxes did you pay this year, that's assuming you worked at all? You have to be mentally deranged to believe the that freedom hating ideologies like "progressivism" are going to create the "perfect equality" ! Does osama obama, George Soros, or Michael Bloomberg seem like they are your equals? These mouths never intend or will allow real people to become equal to them and their "czars! You idiots are going to end up equal all right if your "world revolution is ever successful, the whole world will starve, but we'll starve equally, we will be hot and cold, but we'll be hot and cold equally, but wake up dummies, where do you think obama, Van Jones, and the Michael Bloombergs will be? As in every socialist or progressive revolution that has ever taken place, the welfare of all people is not what it's about, it's about power and these "criminals" don't give a damn if you live or die! America has allowed Americans, starting with blacks to blame the system and anyone who has more than they do, for their failures! Sadly, after intentionally crippling blacks on "entitlements", the easy life looked so good to "lazy, non productive" whites and mexicans , that they demanded their FAIR SHARE, and then the most catastrophic affront ever was visited upon working Americans, the "unamerican" federal government began a program of "collusion" with mexico and its' illiterate, destitute millions! This one action by the federal government insured that we are going to be destroyed the exact same way that "progressive" radicals like Saul Alinsky, Cloward and Piven and Van Jones have planned by destroying our freedoms and forcing a free people to embrace government as our savior! Believe me folks, living in a "progressive dominated "society will not be the kind of equality you desire, and when some of you 'idealistic socialists" starve, I hope I'm there to watch your agony!

Legal Texasgal: You've been listening to Glenn Beck too long.....try listening to the REAL news, not the Faux News.

Patricia Paulson, "if you don't like this job, quit and go find another" only works if there are surplus jobs to be had. Try researching what life was like for most people before unions, then decide if you really want to go there!

Patricia, you can throw around the term "communist" all you want, but it only shows the weakness of your thinking and the paucity of facts upon which you are basing your conclusions.

I have NEVER been a union member, by the way, but I am smart enough to know that everything we take for granted as standard working conditions now were obtained through collective bargaining, such as 40-hour work weeks, workplace safety precautions, medical and dental benefits, protection from unjustified firing, paid vacation and sick days. Growing up, I heard my dad, an accountant for Chrysler, say many times that everytime the union won something for their workers, the white collar guys got it too, to keep them from forming their own union - which Chrysler didn't want.

The obscenely mislabeled "right to work" states have the lowest annual wages in the country, for union and non-union workers alike for that very same reason. It's a false premise to say that someone who doesn't want to be a union member shouldn't have to pay dues, because as long as they accept the benefits and wages the union succeeds in obtaining, they should pay. Even if they say they would reject fruit of the union's efforts, they would, like my father, benefit from them.

My son has a great allegory for those who won't pay dues but expect to still reap the benefits of collective bargaining. Imagine there's a workplace, he says, where most of the workers chip in to a pot to buy lottery tickets every week and take turns going out and making the purchase. When they win a multi-million dollar lottery, how is it fair if people at the workplace who did NOT contribute to the group purchase demand a share of the lottery winnings? How is it justifiable for them to be angry or envious of the people who worked together to produce a common benefit?

Following that comparison, how is it that the peni* envy of so many people ricia who either don't have a skill set around which they can unionize or who choose not to share the cost and effort of forming or joining a union causes them to see unions as evil or destructive?

The Repuglicans trying to wipe out pension plans and benefits are no different than anyone trying to welch on an agreement. The salary, pension and benefit plans under attack were NOT gained by the union putting a gun to anyone's head. Heck, in most places they aren't even allowed the threat of a strike. Government negotiators agreed to these benefits and you can bet they aren't as good as what the unions started out asking for. So how is it that elected officials in places with budget deficits are trying to justify going back on their word, and nobody cares that they are lying and breaking their word?!

The people who are claiming that state workers are paid better than public workers are plainly ignorant and haven't bothered researching the plight of the majority of state employees. I worked for a state government for nearly ten years and saw most of the clerks and secretaries paid $10 to $12 per hour. Many of them were eligible for food stamps because their salaries are so low. To lump them in with the patronage worker at the executive assistant and department commissioner level to make state workers look well paid is just another propaganda tool of the lying right who are trying to cause workers to divide via hate and envy fostered by intentional misinformation. A certain propagandist of the 1930s said that if you say something false enough times with enough conviction you will eventually convince most people it is true. This is what is happening and most of the American sheeple are buying it and proving him correct.

Republicans are the party of big business, not people, no matter how much 'sheep's clothing' they try to cover themselves in. They are using the economic situation to justify and push an agenda even they don't really believe in. Most of these Republican congresspeople and senators are the same ones who supported Cheney's assertion during the Bush administration that, "Deficits don't matter. Ronald Reagan proved that deficits don't matter." Their concern about fiscal responsibility is like the moon, constantly changing to suit their political agenda. The only thing that stays the same is their slavish devotion to the wealthy.

Legal Texanlegal said

Believe me folks, living in a "progressive dominated "society will not be the kind of equality you desire, and when some of you 'idealistic socialists" starve, I hope I'm there to watch your agony!

If things get to that point, what makes you think you won't be starving as well?

Legal Texan is ignoring the data that shows we have been on course for years to redistribute income forom the middle class to the upper class. This began under Reagan, had a temporary hold under Clinton and came back with a vengeance under Bush/Cheney. Conservatives would have us believe that the poor are stealing us blind, but it's clear who is getting richer.

Yep, but you have to admire Legal Texan. He/she managed to include every myth about progressives in one post. He/she even used all the big words about it, which are the only multi-syllable words the "teabaggers" know.

Cut back on the medical marijuana Beverly, really!

Ok, then when they say the stimulus didn't work, or didn't create jobs, shut up.

The stimulus didn't create any jobs. The Republicans and the Democrats both promised it would but it didn't, it just didn't. So if those same people are now saying 700,000 jobs will be "lost" if we cut spending, why should we believe them? Anyway, there can't really be an "unemployment crisis" in America, because if there were those bums lying around the Wisconsin Statehouse would get their asses back to work before their job was given to one of the thousands of unemployed I keep hearing about. Oh wait, wait, that's right !Those bums don't have to work THEY'RE UNION PEOPLE. Union People don't have to work to get paid and they can't be fired. Silly Rabbit!

Amy in Portland ME, since this "rescession" has been going on since 2008 and you say "92% of the people getting assistance are single mothers with children under 2 years of age", Answer me this, Why the hell did those women choose to get pregnant if they didn't have the income to support the children they were creating? And don't hand me any garbage about them having worked 3 jobs in the last 3 years. I can guarantee you that of that "92% of single mothers" 100% were raised on welfare themselves, have never held a job and never will. Why should they? When bleeding heart liberals like you believe the rest of us should be responsible for feeding them. Let them go hunt up the baby-daddy and get him to pay child support.

My best friend is a union sheet metal worker and welder here in California who was laid off last November. He has been hitting the streets to try and line up work. There just isn't any to be had around our area for what he does, and his union sure as hell doesn't guarantee him a paycheck if he isn't working.

So there are two times you were wrong, Patricia.

I'm sorry Patricia, what religion did you say you were?

Patricia Paulson said: "When bleeding heart liberals like you believe the rest of us should be responsible for feeding them. Let them go hunt up the baby-daddy and get him to pay child support."

Paula, whop do you think enforces Child Support orders, advocated for the custodial parent, and collects and distributes the child support payments? State Government workers, that is who. Laying off government workers that are actively trying to reduce the number of welfare recipients by collecting more child support hardly seems like a wise fiscal move, whether a particular state's workers are unionized or not.

economists are like climatologists. They can pencil whip numbers to say anything you want them to.

Hey, look. These climate change deniers are saying that temperatures haven't risen since 1997, but when I actually look at a temperature graph, it shows temperatures going up throughout the graph. But look, the temperatures from 1997 were really, really high, which can't possibly have anything to do with el nino. Therefore, I am clearly not being deceived by climate change deniers.

Patricia:

I can guarantee you that of that "92% of single mothers" 100% were raised on welfare themselves, have never held a job and never will.

Did you happen to see the Oscars last night? Natalie Portman, who is single (albeit engaged) was visibly pregnant. She won the Oscar for Best Actress, for which I suspect she got paid. She attended with her fiance and her parents, who I do not believe were on welfare, since her father is a physician.

But don't believe me; it's on all the blogs.

I think we could probably dig up a few other examples if we turn our minds to it. I'd love to turn my mind to it. You don't really know me. Be careful what you wish for.

By the way, you may be interested to know that neither public employee unions nor liberals cause unwed OR teen pregnancy, just in case you were thinking it. In fact, teen pregnancy tends to be highest in the red states. Most of these, including Texas, have no public sector unions Feel free to look it up.

As for giving jobs away to someone who will work harder, why do you think Scott Walker stayed home from the governor's conference? He knew better. Besides, he's making plans to fly to "Cali" with the Koch brothers, violating all manner of ethics rules. Talk about integrity. And SCARED? Sheesh. He's afraid of rabid librarians. Put your money on Walker, Patricia. I'll take the field.

Move over JoAnna -- this self-professed "silly rabid" will give you a run for your money.

Silly, indeed.

Well said, Anna. I'm from Texas, and I can tell you that the "abstinence only " approach to sex education, doesn't work. Things have truly changed for the worse since I was in school in Texas. They don't even require government/civics classes anymore, as it used to be, when I was in school. Great post. Keep it up.

Well, of course, McCain is not a "REAL conservative", even though they all voted for him. Bush was not a "real conservative" either, but they voted for him TWICE.

Sure they're creating jobs. Now that they have their tax cuts, they need a chauffeur, and an upstairs maid, and a nanny, and a new gardner. Don't bother applying if you speak English and your social security card has your own name on it.

Thank you Don. This is the issue. NO MONEY! What will it take to make folks understand this? Oh well.

Finally, someone who gets it! Forget all of this partisan Dem/Rep blame throwing. The country does not have enough money!

Is it bad for the people who may lose their jobs? Yes. But the private sector has been going through this contraction for years. It's painful to adjust ones own budget to reflect reality also, but it has to be done. The mortgage holder (China) is not going to buy any crap about how the children (employees) need their allowance.

The party's over, folks!

Or we could raise the taxes on the wealthy by MORE THAN $2,000 AND we could slap a little tax on corporations AND we could raise the capital gains tax to W2 wages levels AND we could raise the death tax .... you get the picture?

That would be a lot LESS painful than destroying people's careers and making them lose their homes and throwing people into poverty. We've already been waiting YEARS for people to "slowly reintegrate" into the workforce, and we've cut off unemployment insurance for the many who haven't because we don't have the money. Just where are we supposed to get more unemployment insurance money?

And, even if you could get it, it's not gold bullion you know. Or maybe you don't. It won't save your house and it won't save your career. Just what do you think will happen when you dump even MORE people into that miasma AND cut off Medicaid and other benefits that might help them through it?

But, hey ... just so I can buy that Jaguar. Mercy me, how the selfish always manage to justify themselves.

Painful yes. Painful but necessary.

Sure, as long as it's other people's pain. I can hear John Boehner now. So be it.

Now, where do I go to line up for that cake?

Anna

You really need to do your research and understand basic math before you say anything. Even if you balanced the budget through tax increases on the rich, there's that still pesky $144,000 we each owe.

Oh why not throw that on the rich too?

While the rich do hold a large percentage of the wealth, a much much greater percentage of their paper wealth is tied up in other non-liquid assets. This means a smaller percentage of their income is actually liquid assets (money, gold, etc) In other words all their money is invested in keeping businesses going. Stocks, Bonds, small busines, coroporate shares, real estate etc.

The average american income is a little over $42K/year. At $2K/year additional tax, that's a little of 5% of their income. Even if you put 2.5% additional tax on the rich and stretch payments out to 144 years, you would break them. Because that's closer to ~34% of their liquid assets because the way they distribute their wealth. Basically you are encouraging them to not have any liquid assets. So they just shove more into more non liquid assets which is non taxable if it doesn't make money. (Cooking the books on a business to make it non profitable is way more easy than personal assets)

If you can show me how taxing the rich can solve ALL these problems and not shut them down with hard numbers, then I will personally lead the fight to make you president.

But all I see is you yelling "Tax the rich" without even knowing what that means or what it will fix or break.

I hate class warfare. The rich are not responsible for this mess. There are too many civil servents with benefits better than the public sector. One in three US jobs are tied to the government somehow. More than any other time in history.

The US government is the least efficient "company" in the USA because there is little accountability (turnover in congress). Vote the old guard out and make the new guard accountable.

I am a white collar middle class working person and I support the message, "The rich aren't the problem" The "Gimme" generation is.

BTW: What did you invest your $2000 rebate check from Bush with? A new TV made overseas, like most Americans? That new TV really just cost you $6,000 after paybacks.

The problem is not the rich. It's ourselves. We are our own worst enemy.

END OF STORY.

BTW: Taxing capital gains would hurt your 401K and regular IRA accounts.

YOU are my worst enemy if that's how you think. The rich ARE responsible for this mess. Both morally and literally. Especially the Wall Street rich. And yes, the rich have had all the benefit and none of the burden of the excess that created the deficit, so take it ALL off the backs of the rich. Take your time and take it all. Much better the rich than the middle class. How can you in good conscience defend THAT? Have you no moral compass whatsoever? Go read the Scott Walker thread and then come back here and defend it.

And don't be so smugly self-righteous. I saved my tax rebate, and later on I needed it. But I didn't get $2,000. Maybe some people frittered it away, but that's the whole theory of STIMULUS, isn't it? Some people probably used it to pay health care costs, putting it right back in the hands of insurance companies. Did you know that the #1 cause of personal bankruptcy is health care costs? How do you feel about controlling private sector health care costs? Don't bother. I'm pretty sure I know. Let the insurance companies keep raising the costs and then blame the people who have the insurance and take it away from them. As totally backwards and heartless a solution as asking public workers to pay for deficits caused by Wall Street driven recessions and the resulting high unemployment.

I'll ask you what I keep asking everyone. Why is it that Texas, which has no public employee unions, and has allegedly fiscally conservative government, still has a $22 to $27 billion deficit looming? No one here has even tried to answer that question. Well, I'll tell you -- it's the economy, stupid. It's the economy. It's not public sector workers. So lay off. By the way, I'm not one anymore, primarily because of condescending attitudes like yours. I'm a white collar professional, but I WAS a teacher and no one ever "gave" me anything. I worked hard for what I got, just like you. And even so, sometimes I struggled from paycheck to paycheck. Cushy it wasn't. How ignorantly insulting you are. In this state, just so you know, public employees make an average of 5 percent LESS than their private sector counterparts.

Gimme, indeed. That would be the Koch brothers, Don. Gimme your cookies.

As for your other point, we could exempt up to a certain level of withdrawals, and raise the rate to the W2 rate after that, again, putting the burden where it belongs. But that's not what I was talking about. I'm talking about all the investment money that is not held in retirement accounts. It's obscene that the people who can most afford to pay the taxes often pay the least.

Even Warren Buffett knows that, Don.

I have no problem with throwing out Congress and starting over. I've said that for the past 15 years.

END OF STORY. (You don't have to shout.)

You are mistaken, money doesn't just poof and disappear. It's still there, just not in middle America's hands. It was lost to banks in stock market "collapses" as well as people spending all retirements while banks stole the people's homes away. The money that was stolen is now being funneled into political campaigns to overthrow worker's/ people's rights for mass assembly and representation by a labor workforce/ Union. The Republicans are regressing America in the name of debt, which is a hoax with fractional banking. The elite's are just pulling the strings and we, the middle class are along for the ride. Why does Congress always ask the people for input, then do the opposite that is good for all Americans?

Don, I really liked your post. It was intelligent to say the least. Would I love to sit over a drink with you and discuss this mess our country is in. Though it looks like you will be busy for quite the while trying to educate Anna.

Yes thank you Don,,, the only common sense I have heard here,, are you running for president,, you got my vote.. Cut government by at least 3/4 and the real tax payers will win

UW - Business:

Though it looks like you will be busy for quite the while trying to educate Anna.

Tell Don not to bother. It can't be done. Better minds than his -- or yours -- have tried and failed.

But just wait till Scott Walker and Biddy Martin get done reorganizing you. Hold on to your cookies.

By your ramblings I'd agree, it probably can't be done. But, do yourself a favor and listen to Don a bit more with your mind open and your preconceived ideas left at the door for a moment. As far as Walker, he's doing the job that everybody else kicked down the road, I applaud his efforts. Maybe you could read some FDR quotes. If you think I am totally off base, blame the university teachers. And one more point please, dont write my comments off as the voice of a young college student, I went back for that Masters.

50 million in cuts to the Maternal and Child Health Block Grant that "supports state-based prenatal care programs and services for children with special needs."

$1 billion in cuts to programs at the National Institutes of Health

• Nearly $1 billion in cuts to the Centers for Disease Control

This is the same budget in which House Republicans voted to strip all federal financing for Planned Parenthood when the vast majority of what Planned Parenthood does is provide free contraception protection, breast exams, mammograms and Paps smears for those who can't afford it, and other medical treatment for those who can't pay.

However a bill was brought up to stop the Pentagon from sponsoring NASCAR race teams but failed, because we have to keep those rednecks happy.

Cuts to the IRS so the wealthy can float a few more tax dodges through.

Food and Drug Administration.

Environmental Protection Agency.

Why do we need any environmental protection when the Koch brothers are backing all this. Koch Industries during the 1990s, its faulty pipelines were responsible for more than 300 oil spills in five states, prompting a landmark penalty of $35 million from the Environmental Protection Agency (EPA).

In Minnesota, it was fined an additional $8 million for discharging oil into streams. During the months leading up to the 2000 presidential elections, the company faced even more liability, in the form of a 97-count federal indictment charging it with concealing illegal releases of 91 metric tons of benzene, a known carcinogen, from its refinery in Corpus Christi, Texas. Koch Industries was ranked number 10 on the list of Toxic 100 Air Polluters.

Koch Industries are behind the Tea Party, and the power behind the agenda in Wisconsin. Governor Walker's union-busting budget plan contains a clause that has gone virtually un-noticed. This clause would allow the sale of publicly owned utility plants in Wisconsin to private parties (specifically, Koch Industries) at any price, no matter how low, without a public bidding process. The Koch's have helped to fuel the unrest in Wisconsin and the drive behind the bill to eliminate the collective bargaining power of unions in a bid to gain a monopoly over the state's power supplies.

Look who these people making these cuts are in bed with, including Clarence Thomas and Scalia, THESE PEOPLE CARE ABSOLUTELY NOTHING ABOUT THE MIDDLE CLASS.

All those who are treating these cuts, as akin to cutting the secretarial pool, call me the next time you come down with salmonella poisoning, or we have a outbreak of antibiotic resistant TB and no one knows, or is warned. If you wife gives birth to a child with defects because there was no restriction or warning about mercury, lead and arsenic in her food supply. Let me know when your child dies of contaminated Tylenol, or the infant car seat strangles your infant. Then tell me we have no money.

Anna Molly

You don't have the answer.The answer is to cut spending.Earned income credits would be a good place to start.Why should we pay low income people to produce low income generations?You can't make a gorrilla eat a banana if he doesn't want to,and you can't make poor people motivate by giving them money to stay poor.Entitlement programs are what is causing overspending,beside war machines,and big government.People don't get richer by doing less,and entitlements encourage doing nothing.

UW - Business:

And one more point please, dont write my comments off as the voice of a young college student, I went back for that Masters.

Just goes to show your own insecurities. I didn't. I thought you might be faculty. I was just pointing out the possible bias of a UW-Whitewater business school professor or student. But then I figured you might be conflicted because Walker is leaning on professors, too. I'm related to two professors in the UW system, just not at Whitewater. From the tenor of your comments, I should have known better.

My degree is a J.D, by the way, and I went back for it. I paid my own way. I work in the private sector. Don't condescend to me, either. It would be a big mistake.

srsmith:

People don't get richer by doing less,and entitlements encourage doing nothing.

Congratulations on stating the obvious. People get richer if they have jobs that pay a decent wage and benefits for a decent day's work, if their health care costs don't eat it all up, and if they're not taxed to death on their small incomes. But instead, you propose to take away the earned income credit, presumably while leaving the tax breaks for the very rich. Now THERE'S some compassionate conservatism is action.

As for "entitlements," I paid for mine (social security) so yes, I'm entitled to them. If you're talking about Badger Care and Medicaid programs, people wouldn't need those entitlements if there were other opportunities. You probably don't know, but Badger Care was part of the solution for welfare in Wisconsin and works along side with Wisconsin's W2 program, which puts the poor back to work by making sure they are protected while they get there. A great socialist program instituted by our four-term republican governor and Bush's secretary of HHS, Tommy Thompson. Badger Care worked fine until Bush got hold of the economy. I find your insinuation that people are poor because they want to be ignorant, insulting, condescending and smug. Look an unemployed person in the eyes and say that, you coward. It's pretty easy from the cheap seats. People have committed suicide over this because they thought they had no other alternative. I suppose that's just the price they have to pay in your view of the world so that the rich can keep having tax break after tax break after tax break.

Cut spending, yes. Cut spending on tax breaks for the privileged that are demonstrably proven NOT to "trickle down" and NOT to create jobs. Just take back the extensions of the cuts for the top 2 percent and you have more than enough money to solve ALL the states' current deficit issues. Tell me again I don't have an answer. I have one -- you just don't like it.

On the other hand, you don't have the answer for why Texas has such a big deficit since Texas has no public employee unions, and Texas has a republican governor and legislature. It's the economy, stupid. And you won't fix it on the backs of state workers or by destroying another million or so jobs under the republican's federal spending cut proposals. Heck, their own economists say that. You'll just add to the misery. Be proud. At least you stood for something. You stood with the rich.

I think the first government workers to get fired from their job should be the firemen who would have otheriwse saved your burning home, the law enforcement agents who would have otherwise stopped the rape and murder of your loved ones, and the school teachers who would have otherwise taught your kids to read. That way you can personally experience the pain you are so quick to spread to others. If only I could make it so.

I was intending on posting an opinion, but after noticing all of the collapsed posts, the low intellectual level of discussion, and the people who seemed to have missed their medications on time, I'll just back out of here quietly. I love reading MSNBC, it's been my homepage throughout my college years, (just got my MPA degree), but really, some of you people are sick. :)

Takes one to know one U Dub Dub!

Or we could raise taxes a percentage point on everyone earning between $50-100,000; raise it 2% on incomes up to $1 million, 3% on incomes above a million but less than $5 million; 4% between $5 and $10 million; 6% above $10 M but below a billion, etc. We could raise the capital gains tax from 15% to 28% (the rate Reagan thought fair) and all those multi-million dollar hedge fund investors would pay a fair share and it wouldn't hurt them a bit.

Think, oneman, all those unemployed government workers would mean less federal and state revenues plus the cost of unemployment benefits; it would mean a slower economic recovery, less money spent in the private sector so the private sector will not hire but will likely cut jobs--what goes around comes around.

Why is it that a "government job" is somehow less important than a "private sector job?" Do government workers not have families? Do they not pay taxes? Are they somehow less important than other workers? Why use public sector workers as whipping boys? Why not make an attempt to solve this problem, instead of just pointing fingers? As long as the holy grail of the budget is to have services but not pay for them, it is impossible to even come close to balancing the budget. Remember, oneman, each one of those 700,000 workers has a family. I hope it isn't YOUR job that goes away. Really. But think about it .. if your job went away because of this GOP plan, what does it do to your grandchildren's future? If you go on unemployment and the GOP stops funding unemployment, how does this affect your grandchildren's future? Oh, you can always get another job. But what if it's one of the 700,000? Or the next 700,000 that have to be cut because, duh, there's less tax revenue when 700,000 people aren't working?

Jody - If the plan is to eliminate $60 billion, and the FTEs to be lost are 700,000, then the cost per employee would be $85,714. So you want people including those who are making less than the median of these employees ($50-85,713) to give more of their money so that someone else can have a higher salary and better benefits than they themselves enjoy?

Since the government workers are paying taxes from the checks they receive which are paid by other peoples' taxes, there is no net loss to federal or state governments if there are fewer government workers. In fact, it is a net gain. They pay $90,000 to a worker, receive $18,000 back in taxes from that worker, and so are out $72,000 for that worker.

And those taxpayers paying the taxes so that the governments can employ other people? That's $90,000 less than that group of taxpayers has to spend in their local economy. The private sector in their area could have $90,000 more that these taxpayers would spend on their own, were it not for the fact that this money is sent to an area usually far removed from the taxpayer to boost the economy of the area where the government worker is located. Ever wonder why Washington DC is having a booming time right now?

Where are the private sector jobs? You left out something, Zandi and other people who study this understand that when people are working, demand goes through the economy. Fewer people with money to spend means a weaker economy. Before one more worker, private or public, union or non-union loses a job, taxes on the rich must be raised, it is a moral obligation. Exxon, who paid no taxes and got a 400 million refund, has to pay their fair share. The Bush administration destroyed the middle class and shifted wealth and power upwards and that must be redressed.

The real problem is not whether the job being eliminated is a public sector or a private sector job. Cutting federal or state spending does not only impact public sector employment. The cuts in the space program spending cost hundreds, maybe thousands of private sector jobs. The federal and state governments purchase equipment, goods and services from the private sector. Listen to John Chambers from Cisco, "we did not meet our revenue goals due to a reduction in public sector purchasing here in the US and around the world". And lower revenues mean fewer new hires.

I know that "we the taxpayer" pay for all of the public sector spending, but unless you know something I don't know, "we the consumer" pay for all of the private sector jobs as part of the cost of goods and services. It's the same "we" in both cases. Part of the dilemma today is that "we" don't want to pay the cost of either job - we want low cost goods and high stock prices, so we don't seem to care that in order to get what we want, a lot of our jobs go to lower cost overseas workers. And we want roads, and fire service, and schools, and police protection, and lower taxes! - If these necessary things are no longer public services, instead of taxes there will be road tolls on every road, private school tuition, private security guards, and the list goes on.

For the last 20 years, we have gotten what we wanted (high wages, low cost goods, and low taxes)and now we are heavily indebted to China, have little or no manufacturing capacity in some sectors, have low college graduation percentages, and are looking all over for someone other than ourselves to blame. There is no easy way out of this problem, but not realizing that the true source of the problem is "us" isn't helping. We have to make the difficult choices to turn this economy around. Maybe a 30 hour work week, maybe greater penalties for hiring illegals, maybe a gradual increase in tariffs, maybe a tax on jobs that go overseas, maybe a removal of the cap for social security taxes, maybe a big label on the front of all products that are made by US labor.....

Arguing over which party is right is not going to solve anything.

just a question how many illegals are in wisc , sorry not ill. now there across the border gettin funds of some kind

I'm with you B Honest. The time will come when the "paper tiger" plutocrats least expect it. They won't be able to smooze or buy there way out of it.

Why is it that a "government job" is somehow less important than a "private sector job?" Do government workers not have families? Do they not pay taxes? Are they somehow less important than other workers?

Because government jobs don't produce anything. Without production there is no way to re-coup the money spent on paying the workers.

So you want people including those who are making less than the median of these employees ($50-85,713) to give more of their money so that someone else can have a higher salary and better benefits than they themselves enjoy?

Huh? They do that now -- e.g., the president, congress members, the Supreme Court, cabinet officers, lawyers, physicians, and a host of other people who make higher pay than that. So what? No one is "giving" money away -- they're buying services. Services aren't free, even in the public sector. Where do people get the notion that paying people for work they perform is a gift, just because they're working for the government? Get over it.

Ultimately, it seems to me that what you're proposing is akin to Communism. Even in the private sector you give "your" money through purchases to people who make a lot more than you do, like the Waltons, or the Koch brothers, for example. Not fair, but such are the vicissitudes of the capitalist system. The only logical solution to what you're complaining about is to pay everyone the same, so no one's feelings are hurt because people you pay money to make more money than you do.

There. Feel better now?

Because government jobs don't produce anything. Without production there is no way to re-coup the money spent on paying the workers.

Tell that to government scientists, just as one example, such as those who "produce" vaccines for the CDC. Or the scientists at NASA. Or the nurses at the VA.

By the way, what does a corporate CEO "produce"? Nothing. What does a sales person produce? Nothing. What do marketing people produce? Nothing. What does a warehouse worker produce? Nothing. How about a cashier at Walmart? Nothing. What does an NBA basketball player produce? Nothing. What do you produce?

Well, I'll grant you an exemption. You produce manure. Be proud. WAY more worthy than any public sector employee.

Like the police. Like firefighters. Like the FBI. Or the CIA. Or the military. Or US marshals. WAY more worthy.

The government recoups the money it pays its workers the same way the private sector does. It charges for them.

Why are the coffers dry? What caused such deficits and debts? What ideology led people to believe that tax cuts solve every problem? Why is there such an aversion to the richest 2% paying 39.9% tax rate (before calculating all their deductions which lowers the actual rate they pay)?

Nobody yelled in anger when oil company personel were let go by the thousands in fact most people felt they got what they deserved.

Uh, dude, what are you smoking? There was plenty of yelling, mostly about socialism and hurting the economy.

They will just move from the payroll to the unemployment line. The money all comes from the same source.

Do you support fewer fire and police personnel, fewer teachers? Do you like the idea of garbage collection once a month? Do you favor streets unplowed or unsalted in winter after storms? What about fewer FBI agents to prevent terrorist attacks? What about fewer border patrol agents?

Philip,

The article doesn't say they are all government jobs, private sector jobs would be included in that number. Everyone needs to remember, all these people who lose their jobs will no longer be buying groceries, gas, and everything else they are used to spending money on regularly. Balancing the budget can't be done overnight, it would wreck the economy and cost us even more in the long run. Making gradual cuts while growing the economy is the smart way to go.

Philip McAfee

"lower the debt and civilian jobs will be on the rise"?

Right. More voodoo economics.

Now take a hard look at just how much, and how often, taxes have been cut in the last thirty years - and how much of those tax cut promises were made on your credit card -- that is, unfunded?

We can lower the debt by getting the money back from the corporations who pay zero taxes, and by ditching those unfunded, credit-card Bush tax cuts for the wealthy.

Ever stop to think about this? It's the top 1-2% income bracket people who were raking in the bucks while the economic bubble was growing. They helped create that bubble. They were playing with Monopoly money in the markets -- and we picked up the tab for them when their game went sour. Those are the people who made big money investing in the futures markets, speculating on rising gasoline prices, while the rest of us tried to figure out how to afford the stuff.

They've more than gotten their fair share -- and then we're supposed to give them tax cuts on top of it? No. They're doing fine, better than the rest of us, and they can damned well put something back into the country that made their success possible.

Rorschach-558483 - the fact of the matter is that WE ARE NOT ASKING THE WELL TO DO TO HELP US. All of the elected officials are doing everything they can to give MORE breaks to the ones who need it the least.

Now why is that?

why does the well to do owe you anything? they worked hard for their money. you are not their responsibilty. they are the ones that provide the jobs. educate yourself, and go get one. quit looking for handouts! be a man!

These are not just government jobs, these are jobs that will be lost as RESULT of the cuts. These cuts impact a lot of industries.

@really??, so you think the Koch brothers, and Paris Hilton worked hard to earn their money? So inheritence equals working hard to earn money? That's impressive, did you get your degree in a Cracker-Jack box?