Well said, IR. Paul Ryan's plan to make the deficit disappear would make David Copperfield hang his head in shame. There's nothing legit about it.

Same for the new "Cut-Go" rules. Promising the voters you'll balance the budget, then immediately enacting rules that will blow a whole a mile wide in it is fundamentally dishonest.

IR:

Kudos, great report. The "Roadmap for America" is really a code for "The roadmap for the destruction of the Middle Class" From a previous post this week of mine: (ThinkProgress)

– The Roadmap would lead to the wealthiest Americans paying a lower average tax rate than most Americans.Eliminating taxes on capital gains, dividends, and interest, as the Roadmap proposes, would overwhelmingly help taxpayers at the top of the income distribution, who receive most or all of their income from capital. For example, Wall Street financiers could shelter all of their income as tax-free stock options or carried interest.

– Middle-class families earning between $50,000 and $75,000 a year would see their average tax rate jump to 19.1% (from 17.7%) under this plan—an increase of $900 on average [...]

– Millionaires would see their average tax rate drop to 12.8%, less than half of what they would pay relative to current policy

This does not even take into consideration what he want to do to Social Security and Medicare, Education, Science and Medical Research, most Social Programs, Unemployment, Health Care for Veterans, Teachers, Fire Fighters, Police, and te list goes on.

That's an excellent article regarding the real cost of Paul Ryan's proposals, Independent.

I well remember this "free market" argument from George W. Bush's speeches. but the middle class LOST income during his administrations, those theories did NOT lead to prosperity. Furthermore, I also remember him opening the Iraq endeavor to private contractors, under the theory that "privatization always leads to lower costs, " but the exact opposite result occurred: private contracters soaked the federal government for every thing from laundry service to security personel. What taxpayer doesn't shiver at the name BlackWater?

Excellent post, IR. The right is tiresome. This morning Ari Fleisher, Bush guy, had the nerve to blame President Obama and democrats for the debt without so much as a glance in the mirror. Sherrod Brown took him to task for the 8 years that was Bush and GOP massive spending.

No one can drive the point home as well as you can IR!

Thanks!

Independent Redneck Va.

Paul Ryan is not what you think

I knew that just by looking at him. Any guy with a part in his hair and those ears like that looks like the son on Herman's Munster

Seriously though you not going to get an honest answer from the fiscal hawks. That's their job to obfuscate.

I read and unprincipled article today in Rupert Murdoch's Bloomberg where supposedly they fact checked that Obama was lying.

Your post was a nice gesture. I truly hope the righties get some principles and stop the lies.

Thank you

The gop cuts in domestic spending has consequences and rely heavily on trickle down economics that is stale when emersed in the world markets

Vodoo economics doesn't work and relies on cutting the middle class and the future of American youth who will be competing with other countries are falling behind. The cuts in education student loans and grants hurts our future in many ways and is strictly aimed at the middle class. Not repealing the tax cut for the rich is adding to the debt and causing states to go bankrupt. Can't rely on the middle class soley to provide education to our youth of today. Corperations need to invest in the future and that means education if we don't do that then we will be a third world country

KeeperTrout;
Touche', you nailed it.

I don't know where the article you cut and pasted came up with the numbers they did. But I do know what the CBO said about Ryan's plan. Do you?

"On balance, those changes [as specified in the Ryan Roadmap]would reduce federal budget deficits and the federal debt. Under the proposal, federal outlays excluding interest (so-called primary spending) would decline, from 26 percent of GDP in 2009 to 19 percent in 2020, 16 percent in 2060, and 14 percent in 2080. Revenues under the Roadmap would initially correspond to revenues under the alternative fiscal scenario and then remain at 19 percent of GDP after 2030, on the basis of specifications provided by your staff. The budget deficit would peak at 5 percent of GDP in 2034 and then decline. By 2080, the proposal would generate a budget surplus of about 5 percent of GDP." [p. 5, 7]

"Under the Roadmap, the ratio of government debt held by the public to economic output (the ratio of debt to GDP) would be lower than that under the alternative fiscal scenario in every year (see Figure 1). In particular, debt is projected to peak at 100 percent of GDP in 2043 and to decline thereafter, reaching zero by 2080. (Debt held by the public was about 53 percent of GDP at the end of fiscal year 2009.) The federal government would accumulate net financial assets equal to 17 percent of GDP by 2083. In contrast, under the alternative fiscal scenario, debt is projected to skyrocket over the next several decades." [p. 7]

"The flow of payroll tax contributions into the Social Security trust funds would be sufficient to pay benefits as specified in the [Roadmap] proposal. The ratio of assets in the trust funds in any year relative to the expected benefit payments for the following year, termed the trust fund ratio, would decline from a peak of just over 4 in 2023 to a low of under 2 in 2065. After 2065, the trust fund ratio would begin to increase again. By 2083, revenues would exceed outlays by substantial and rising amounts, leading to a growing surplus for the trust funds. By contrast, under the alternative fiscal scenario with benefits as scheduled, Social Security outlays would be close to 6 percent of GDP in the years beyond 2033. The trust fund ratio under that scenario [i.e. current policy] would be just over 1 in 2036, and the trust funds would be exhausted in 2042." [p. 9]

"In general, total annual benefits provided by Social Security are projected to be slightly higher under the proposal than under current law for each of the first 20 years and also in the long run. In the first 20 years, the increase in total benefits would occur primarily because of the increased amount of the special minimum benefit." [p. 9]

"The lower budget deficits under your proposal would result in much less federal debt than under the alternative fiscal scenario and thereby a much more favorable macroeconomic outlook….The Roadmap would put the federal budget on a sustainable path, generating an annual budget surplus of about 5 percent of GDP by 2080. According to CBO's textbook growth model…real potential gross national product per person would continue to grow over the entire 75-year period. The economy would be considerably stronger under the proposal (as analyzed by CBO) than it would be under the alternative fiscal scenario [i.e. current policy]. Real gross national product per person would be about 70 percent higher in 2058 under the proposal than under the alternative fiscal scenario." [p. 14, 16]

http://www.cbo.gov/ftpdocs/108xx/doc10851/01-27-Ryan-Roadmap-Letter.pdf

Shhh, Bill- don't confuse them with facts. They are much happier with some Obama worshpper's opinion.

If they could think for themselves, you would not have to post here. On the other hand, if they could think for themselves, we would be on here complaining about McCain and his spending.

Although it would be about half of what Obama is spending.

Bill,

The CBO numbers only work for those willing to spend money, not save money:)

Ok, so now quoting the CBO is ok, but when it favored President Obama's HCR Law is was not, and when it said that the repeal of the HCR Law would cost us 230 Billion, it was not. What a hypocrite.

Careful IR, there's no hypocrisy here at all. Regarding HCR, there were blatant attempts by the Dems to game the system which have been pointed out by several posters on other occasions. For you to make the hypocrisy charge, you would have to document how Ryan also gamed the system to get a similar good result from CBO. Ball is in your court, pal.

Bill
Thank you for the input
Yes I was able to get a copy of the CBO report while I was considering this question. Decided not to include it for two reasons
First it looked like to me I'd already gotten a little wordy this morning.
Second I was not able find the numbers that Mr. Ryan had the CBO use. As you can see some folks think they were a little suspect. The CBO report also assumes Congress will take certain actions that even the Republicans admittedly are not willing to take. So rather than get into a discussion of the relative merits of the CBO scoring which we have all had on several occasions I elected to keep a focus on the salient point.
So all that being said as F.R.'s leading conservative voice let me ask you a question. Are you comfortable with those numbers and would you call them "Fiscally Conservative" Increasing our debt load to the levels shown and waiting till 2080 to balance the budget doesn't seem so to me.
BTW yes I have read all of Mr. Ryan's Roadmap and there are several interesting parts that we could look at in conjunction with several other proposals that could be helpful in taking us where we want to go. Since you seem to have better access along those lines why don't you put them up here for the fine folks to peruse and discuss

BTW Bill Navy is a Yankee. I would have thought you would have noticed the difference in accent. However rather than leave the ball in the wrong court I'll refer you to the original posts and my reply above. As I said there is ample evidence that Mr. Ryan insisted on the CBO using his numbers which is why I didn't go there. Looks like to me even using his numbers that Roadmap is not going to take either you or me where we want to go within our lifetimes.

IR, I REALLY like what you said! Thank you.

Thank you fielden It's always nice to know there's some folks like yourself that are willing to take a little time to wade through my Southernisms. Time and consideration is the best gift that we can give each other and I thank you for your gift today.

"Roadmap for middle-class-killing America"?

I thought we were going to hear the SOTU. Instead, we were in OZ with a man behind a screen blowing smoke. The American people are not brain dead nor stupid. When he said he'd veto any bill with earmarks, I was ROTFLMAO. He said that in 2008 and before he had even warmed up the chair in the Oval Office he signed the Stimulus with about 5000 earmarks, including Nancy's $1M "mouse house". He said he'd freeze spending but then goes on about how many gazillions he plans to spend. Which is it...freeze or spend? He said they were going to "downsize". I remember in 2008 he said he was going through the budget line by line and take out any unnecessary items. Has he done that? No. He's just added more to it. And, if he's going to downsize, does that mean he's going to fire his 75 czars? And, if we all have to "cut back", will he and his wife stop this ridiculous, outlandish trips? Yes, he deserves a break/vacation but renting out an entire hotel, taking hundreds of people with on our dime is insulting.

I watched a focus group after the speech. Of the 13 in the group who voted for Obama, six of them will not vote for him again. Why? Because he "doesn't follow through" you "can't believe him." You see, trust lost is very difficult to regain. I close with "I'm off to see the wizard..."

Lies, innuendo and voting for yourself impresses no one, dirt.

@JoeNY

How about printing up some handouts and t-shirts (like at the recent wake in Arizona), makes people look like they are onboard right??

Your comment is despicable to the family and friends memories of those who died and are still suffering . Like I said in a previous post Tea baggers are no good for this country when they promote vile words and actions.

So, according to George, it was an opportunity to be on the record as a reformer, while setting up his opponents (whom might actually try to change the government for fiscal responsibility) to loose their favorable ratings by trying to reform the system.

Goody, Goody

Hmmmmm. Makes me think that reform is only a word in the dictionary...... like indentured servants(us to China).

A word to the unwise; free your mind and you won't have to worry about your hypothetical fruitless labor.

Freedom's just another word for nothing left to do.

Na Na Na Na Na Na

Janis Joplin

No, bev, it was the TEE SIRTS that were despicable.

I blame them on the college- as well as the pep rally feel for the whole thing.

Why defend the indefensible? Just because Obama was involved? Supposedly, he had nothing to do with the tee shirts nor the organization. I take his word for it- why don't you?

Care to share with us just where you watched the focus group Dirt? I thought so it's secret right. Your making things up again Dirt.

Well what do you know, the biggest jackazz of them' all....MO....is bottom feeding again.

Beverley:

I see you're still talking with your mouth full. You have become the resident TEABAGGER along with your buddy Fiesty. We all know she is nasty anyway with all of those cats walking on the counters licking out of the bowls, kissing her in the mouth after licking their azzez, etc....

The focus group was in Atlanta and was very diverse. Mo is correct about his statement.

Did anyone miss the hysterical reference to our Sputnik moment? I found this particularly amusing considering how they are so hot to trot on cutting NASA's funding.

A 5% spending freeze would be a good start and we need to start somewhere. However, a 5% freeze does no good after you've already raised the spending bar so high that it is out of control. That's like saying you bring home 4,000.00 a month and increase your spending to 5,000.00 a month then say, okay that's enough, we can't spend anymore than the 5,000.00 a month.

This speech was flat. It did not have the energy of the speech in Arizona, although that entire debacle bothered me. I've never before in my life been to a memorial where people hooted and hollered and cheered. That audience should be ashamed of themselves and each one should write a letter of apology to the families. I'm not a supporter of Obama, but you know he had to be cringing at the behavior of those in attendance.

*** The GOP response: As far as the Rep. Paul Ryan’s (R-WI) GOP response, it was a fine speech -- and certainly much better than Bobby Jindal’s from two years ago. If there’s criticism of his rebuttal, though, it’s this: The speech was gloomy, especially compared with Obama’s positive and forward-looking address.

Gloomy? Try truthful. Ryan put it on the line for the American people that there are problems, and those problems do not have easy solutions. That's in stark contrast with the happy bs rainbow and unicorn speech given by Obama. So, according to Obama, we're going to get ahold of the deficit, but at the same time make more and more "investments"?

Any response to Obama's speech should begin with the words "Get real!!".

FR: How do you achieve getting 80% of America’s electricity from clean-energy sources? How else do you reduce the deficit besides freezing non-discretionary spending? How much will consolidating federal agencies save?

The Green Energy canard of powering the country is nothing but a fantasy. Power one, just one, small to medium to size US city with Green Energy, and make it cost efficient. It cannot be done. The technology just is not there. Addressing the entitlements is the only way to get to a balance budget, the Republicans realize this, Obama and the Democrats not only want to ignore the entitlements, they want to add more spending to them!

The White House is surely saving those details for his upcoming budget.

Obama will come out with a budget that shows $1.5 trillion in deficit spending. He doesn't have the guts, or the ideology, to shrink the government spending.

Obama lowers the deficit 9% in 2010 from the record of 2009

http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2010/10/democrats-shrank-spending-deficit-fiscal-year-figures-show/

Navy Disabled: Obama lowers the deficit 9% in 2010 from the record of 2009

You really don't have a clue about understanding the problem, do you?

Here, do this, go read the Obama Debt Commission's Report, and when you're done, come back and maybe you'll be able to have a somewhat intelligent conversation.

The 2009 federal budget deficit (the 2009 fiscal year ran from Oct 1, 2008 to Sept 30 2009) was shared by President Bush and President Obama, and totaled about $1.4 trillion.

A subsequent 9% reduction in the 2009 federal budget deficit still leaves a deficit of substantially more than $1 trillion...with similar large annual deficits projected well into the future.

That is why the Washington Post asked, in response to President Obama's State Of The Union address:

"But where will the money come from?"

You folks on the right must be thinking of W. Bush's last State of the Union. Now, that was a no where speech. But, in watching President Obama last night, I have to say that he knocked it out of the park. GREAT JOB, Mr. President and Thank You, for saving our country.

So Ryan acknowledged that there is a problem from .. the deficits don't matter to uuuh we got problems.. Hold on to your arss middle class here it comes cause their rich buddies aren't the problem it's those union workers with their almost livable wage or immigration or social security or it's medicare ..not the rich corperations ducking tax codes and that huge tax cut to the rich that they don't need

JoAnnaSmith1

Obama will come out with a budget that shows $1.5 trillion in deficit spending. He doesn't have the guts, or the ideology, to shrink the government spending.

Funny you should mention the 1.5 trillion dollar figure, for once your are right, the CBO just put out a statement that the deficts for this year will be 1.5 trillion, its up from the 1.1 trillion they estimated a few months ago, the reason for the increase, 400 billion for extending tax cuts and unemployment benifets a deal Bohner Cantor and the president signed off on.

I said it in my earlier post, and I will say it again: when it comes to spending, Obama is like the drunk who promises his wife he will not drink "any more"- meaning, any more than the two bottles of vodka he drinks now.

He simply cannot be trusted with this nation's economy. Period. He has proven, over and over, that he lacks the discipline, education, or intelligence to know the difference between budget priorities and foolish, wasteful spending.

He is an economic disaster that needs to be stopped before we go the way of Greece.

no joe, no bo, nj

I said it in my earlier post, and I will say it again: when it comes to spending, Obama is like the drunk who promises his wife he will not drink "any more"- meaning, any more than the two bottles of vodka he drinks now

No Jo aren't you the one who told me that during the Bush years they were the once who spent like drunken sailors. Now is it the president or was it the previous administration, or both?

You need to give the blame to both parties No Jo instead of putting this all on one person, remember we went from operating surplus to deficts during the bush years that fact will never go away.

the new CBO estimate for the deficts this year is now at 1.5 trillion, the increase is due to the extention of the tax cuts and unemployment benifets. a extra 400 billion toward the deficts that Bohnor, cantor and McConnel all signed off on. so its safe to say neither party is innocent when it comes to controling the deficts, right?

Last ,your Governor decided last night to not give the 271 million back to the feds he TOOK in good faith for the tunnel project. i guess all the spending cuts he made must have Jersey broke, right ? but you said your self yesterday that jersey is tax up to the limit, so increasing tax to GIVE the money back is out right.

"He is an economic disaster that needs to be stopped before we go the way of Greece."

About Greece: did you know the leading cause of Greece's fiscal crisis was it's citizens habit of not paying their taxes? It seems citizens considered it a game to evade paying their share and the government was lax in collecting it. Something for Tea Partiers to think about. After all, what the orginal American colonists objected to was taxation with representation, not just to paying their taxes.

The Euro is another major cause of the problems found in Greece. When they had their own currency it would float, finding an appropriate value in the world market by devaluation. It's a mechanism that causes some disruption, but it works. In this case the stronger economies such as Germany are keeping the Euro at a stronger value that works overall, but creates a serious problem for Greece. Without the ability for their currency to find an appropriate value for their economy on the open market they're left with only two alternatives--punishing taxation or default on their debts.

It's the same reason we went off the gold standard during the depression years--the dollar needed to be decoupled from other currencies in order to properly value the economy. Other nations are off the gold standard for the same reason.

About Greece: did you know the leading cause of Greece's fiscal crisis was it's citizens habit of not paying their taxes?

And given the number of tax cheats holding high level positions in this administration, this should give you a good indication of just how bad our situation really is...

"But where will the money come from?"

-The Washington Post-

Sorry, Navy-

The savings generated from the items you mentioned are chump change compared to the ongoing projected deficits the nation must deal with going forward, let alone any new spending the President is proposing.

"But where will the money come from?"

Funny, you didn't ask when we borrowed a trillion dollars to extend the Bush Tax cuts to the wealthiest 2%?

So your new found fiscal conservatism isn't very credible...

Fiesty, my dear-

Wouldn't any questions about the compromise agreement to extend the Bush-era tax cuts be better addressed by the architect of the deal...President Obama?

I'm guessing he would refer you to his rising poll numbers, Feisty.

lol.

Feisty;

He is just spouting the party line this morning. President Obama did not say if would be a free ride to move this country forward. Some tough cuts will be made and priorities will be set for what they spend money on. President Obama said that we should invest in JOBS, maintain the growth of the economy and Education. No this is not free but just cutting to the bone is not the solution either. He also wants to tap the 2.5 Trillion Dollar infrastructure problem that will create tens and tens of thousands of jobs, generate tax revenues create other supporting jobs that will create more tax revenues,etc. But, it will take money to get that started.

THe GOP does not think inthe long term or what is best for this country, It is more about instant gratification and what is in it for them and Wall Street, Big Business and the 2%. Pretty much the he!! with everybody else.

Feisty;

Did you notice the corrupt SCOTUS judges were absent last night? Thomas, Scalia and Alito. They must be hiding in shame somewhere and their contempt for President Obama has been duly noted.

THe GOP does not think inthe long term

You're giving them waay too much credit Navy! As demonstrated daily on this board they don't think at ALL!

Notice how bag boy intentionally neglected to mention that President Obama had NO choice but to negotiate with the Republican'ts since they were holding the country HOSTAGE?

As for those two activist judges - they need to be investigated to the fullest extent of the LAW!

Ignorance is NO defense!

Feisty, dear-

Barack Obama is the President of the United States.

He always has choices...more choices than anyone else, as a matter of fact.

Your depiction of him as a helpless bystander doesn't help your argument...nor is it flattering to the President.

The problems with most fiscial hawks is that they know the cost of everything but the value of nothing.

Just curious...

What's the value of $1 trillion deficits as far as the eye can see, Johnny...

I can see the costs...but where's the value?

Feisty;
Same old, same old from the same people. No new ideas, no intenton of being part of the solution just more "Obstructionism" and more NO, NO, and He!! NO. President Obama asked them last night to stop the crap and help. He pointed out that no one party is going to be able to solve this mess, either work together and get it done, or not. If they continue to stall, talk about things that the people are not interested in (like HCR Repeal, 280 investigations, etc), we will go nowhere and the ideas that our President laid out will die. The GOP will then claim that he did nothing, ignoring that they are in a position now to govern but elected not to and then blame somebody else.
None of the rebuttals talked about how to create jobs in this country, none spoke about how they were going to keep the economy growing, none spoke about education etc.
Just more crap by a party that has no intention of stepping up and being part of the solution. That is the bottom line, forget all the other stuff.

US Navy Disabled Veteran - Retired

He is going to take away subsidies from Big Oil, he wants to improve education and get rid of the dead wood, he is freezing government spending, wants to double the effort on infrastructure jobs, tort reform, tax reform, work with the GOP on making the HCR better (that got the biggest applause - GOP were you watching?), work to shore up Social Security and reduce the waste and fraud in Medicare/medicaid, consolidate departments within the Federal government, reduce the DOD budget, and on and on.

Navy, your point is well taken.

I don't understand why they were GUNG HO when Reagan asked them to cut back and they had no problem.

Ronald Reagan Interview
August 7, 1989

"That never again would we live at the level that we had lived as Americans, that the world was different now and we must be willing to tighten our belts and not have the things we used to have."

Ronald Reagan quote

http://www.pbs.org/newshour/debatingourdestiny/interviews/reagan.html

The tea baggers are a distraction. The GOP doesn't want them.

Headlines: GOP NOT HAPPY WITH MICHELL BACHMANN

Sorry, Navy-
Obstructing unpopular elements of President Obama's agenda resulted in a gain of 63 House seats and control of that chamber, along with an additional 6 seats (7, if you count senior "obstructionist" Mr. "41", Massachusetts Senator Scott Brown) in the U.S. Senate...including President Obama's former Illinois seat.
By the way...
When Senate Democrats block Republican House legislation...is that "Obstructionism"?
In that case, will Democrats then have become the "Party Of No"?
Sort this out for me, Navy...
Explain the subtle nuances of liberal hypocrisy.

Good job Johnny Q Public, you bated Mixed Bag and he fell for it. Their just too easy.

John Q: Good post. True. As for the right, they are a tiresome lot. Sort of like trying to drag a petulant screaming brat through a store. It isn't easy. But the gloom and doom the Republicans speak of constantly does not in any way reflect Ryan's grasp of "American exceptionalism". Their dark and dismal picture for our future certainly does not rouse anyone from their stagnant stupor and comfort zone regarding what they (the Republicans) have done under the previous administration. And if we don't rouse ourselves to do what is right and necessary, that we all (including the rich) need to participate and sacrifice in rebuilding our "shining beacon", then shining it will be no more, and we will have gotten the politics and the policy that we deserve. This President is trying his best to do what is right, and you have a bunch of mental midgets hollering loudly their slogans and bumper stickers, not even realizing the harm they are doing to themselves, let alone our country. I daresay that no one posting here is one of those top 2% that the Republicans must defend at all costs.

IR: Great as usual.

M0-681343

Good job Johnny Q Public, you bated Mixed Bag and he fell for it. Their just too easy

lol Coulda fooled me.

 Looked like ol' Johnny Q got his clock cleaned from where I'm sittin'.

Mo-

Still having spelling and grammar issues, I see.

Bated-baited...

They're-their...

Be careful, or dangerfield will drop in to smack you around a bit.

Ah...those were the days, eh Mo?

The conservatives will criticize the President no matter WHAT he does. Even if he is giving their own ideas back to them.

We can look to Mitch McConnell for affirmation of this. "If the president is willing to do what I and my members would do anyway, we’re not going to say no."

Navy,

Your posts today were informative. i watched the dude-in-chief's speech and thought it was recycled from previous ones. But you, the keyboard queens and a few others must get the word out about the second coming of Obama, rightfully so or not.

"But where will the money come from?"

-The Washington Post-

"But where will the money come from?"

Funny, you didn't ask when we borrowed a trillion dollars to extend the Bush Tax cuts to the wealthiest 2%?

So your new found fiscal conservatism isn't very credible...

While I don't agree with Rep. Bachmann's political positions, I understand that she WAS looking at the camera.

There were two cameras. The one she was looking at was streaming live video over the internet. The other was the media "pool" camera. She chose to direct her eyes to the people listening.

I agree, Jody. I thought the President was exceptional. He extended an olive branch to the Republicans, stating a willingness to compromise on issues that are important to them. Hearing Senator McConnell say that he'll compromise as long as he gets everything he wants makes me doubt whether this will happen, but at least the President tried. I do think that after the tough times we've had we forget all that this nation can accomplish if we put our minds to it and work together---it was good to be reminded of it.

And I liked the format where it was less of a pep rally and more of a realistic look at where we have come from, where we are and where we should be going. All in all a great job by the President.

Saying and doing are two different things.....

Great Job?? Its the same old crap....Investments = SPENDING..We did that already with "shovel ready" jobs and look where that got us.....Its the same old speech....

Feisty,
Somebody is stuck in replay mode. No ideas just one talking point that makes no sense coming from a party that passed two unfunded tax cut bills, two unfunded Wars (one based on lies and the other total mismananged) and a unfunded drug bill. These alone have cost this country hundreds of billions of dollars and we are still paying for them, They had no problem back then did they? And how about all the lives that were wasted? What about those soliders that need medical help, the GOP solution is do do away with Health Care for Veterans.

Somebody is stuck in replay mode.

Today is any different HOW? lol

Not an idea out of a one of them - just more Obama bashing... *yawn*

I said yesterday - if you thought they were p!ssy then... JUST wait until today!

I mean come on... you would be too when the 'best' they could do for a rebuttal was Ryan & Bachmann? lmfao!

"Funny, you didn't ask when we borrowed a trillion dollars to extend the Bush Tax cuts to the wealthiest 2%?"

Apparently, Feisty...President Obama didn't ask either.

And...he had quite a bit more to do with extending the Bush Tax cuts than I did.

Again...you really need to take this matter up with the President, Feisty.

It seemed appropriate to make references to Sputnik, the space race and American exceptionalism. More and more, President Obama feels like JFK version 2.0. He reminds America of its potential to be great again, if we make the right choices and commit to the hard work ahead.

When he quoted Bobby Kennedy I got teary-eyed. He was, by far, my favorite Kennedy, and the thought of everything this country lost when we lost him, is so painful. He was really an amazing man.

Good job Feisty, you've got Mixed bag stumbling all over himself and stuttering this morning.

Good Morning Mo!

Bag boy reminds me of a 'bad chewowa' I once knew... he has the same propensity for running from thread to thread p!ssing all over the place! ;o)

Nice too see that you've summoned the courage to reappear at First Read, Mo...

Your predictions for the outcome of last year's midterm elections proved to be so spectacularly wrong (and, I might add, embarrassingly wrong as well), I wondered if you'd ever return.

I can therefore understand your reticence to re-engage, all things considered.

Anyway...welcome back and better luck next time, eh?

Mixed Bag. Excellent posts!

Intelligence beats name-calling everytime.

Too bad the liberals here will never realize that.

Did it not occur to those handling Bachmann's address to place both cameras in close proximity of each other? It's called staging.

And I would add..."the mess we're in" because of the Republican philosophy of deregulation, government non-intervention in the world of "bidness, "an airy-fairy belief in the mystical might of free markets.

Republicans have made a religion out of letting banks and corporations operate without oversite. And they want to continue down the same path that lead us into this recession! President Obama doesn't have all the answers, but so far his administration has been stellar in doing what government is SUPPOSED to do. The Obama cabinet is filled with competent managers who have done twice as much to improve our country already as Bush 's cabinent did in two terms.

DBO;

Right on. I thought the President approached this as a CEO would. Here is were we are, here are the roadblocks that are in front of us, here is how we are going to address them, and here is our ultimate goal.

That is not fancy, it is not a pep rally but is is important to lay out the goals, where we are and how we plan to get there.

I thought it was solid. As for the details, the budget comes out in Feb. and the details will be in that document. I look forward to see exactly what is going to be cut and what the priorities for spending (investments) will be. The GOP will then have the opportunity to express their opinion and hopefully they will come together with a meaningful plan to move forward.

I have to respond to my own post- sorry.

I said I thought the address was 'about what I thought" it would be. BUT- having read all the responses from all the usual detractors on here this morning, I'd have to go back and say "it MUST have been a huge success". They just don't get so stirred up and nasty about nothing. Well, most of the time, anyway.

Looks like our man is on his way to that 2nd term McConnell keeps talking about.

Newday:

I heard all of that crap Matthews was spewing yesterday. Apparently he DOES NOT KNOW the history of slavery either. He was quick to jump on Bachmann and disrespect a sitting congresswoman (he is not on a blog) but I know he wasn't prepared to get the backlash that he received this morning on black radio stations. Every station I tuned into they were correcting Matthews take on slavery as if he was there.

You seem to be the only one who brings up any mention of a teleprompter. Is that a fetish for you?

OK, you're right, I need to cool it with the teleprompter. BUT- the address WAS pretty good. Maybe I need to switch to 'job-killing' or 'birth certificate' or something else of REAL substance, so people will revoke Obama's cred.

Good morning drive-by-observer

Maybe I need to switch to 'job-killing' or 'birth certificate' or something else of REAL substance, so people will revoke Obama's cred

The birthers will need some credibility now

Record of President Obama's birth in 1961 is 'in the archives': Hawaii Gov. Neil Abercrombie Found It.

Gov. Neil Abercrombie, who took office in December, told Honolulu's Star-Advertiser on Tuesday that "our investigation" indicates there is a recording of his birth.

"It actually exists in the archives, written down," he said.

Read more: http://www.nydailynews.com/news/politics/2011/01/19/2011-01-19_record_of_obamas_birth_is_in_the_archives_hawaii_gov.html#ixzz1C9orfxmh

Holy Cow this is gonna drive the birthers even nuttier.

Ya know, Bev, it is interesting that you brought that up.

Last night, while watching his speech, I got the idea that I know why Obama will not release the ling form birth certificate, and it has nothing whatsoever to do with where he was born, (that is Hawaii, dear, in case you were wondering).

No, I think it has to do with his real name.

I think his real name is Oscar Mayer- baloney salesman par excellence.

Come on - sing along-

My baloney has a first name, it's S T I M U L O U S

My baloney has a second name, it's I N VE S T M E N T S

Oh, I love to sell it every day, and if you ask me why I'll say

Cause I don't have a clue how to save the economy in the USA!

According to CNN, Bachmann was looking at a different camera. The camera of the "Tea Party Express" was used to stream her remarks live to their web site. It was right next to the real camera.

It looked really, really odd though. It also (unintentionally) showed that Bachmann is not interested in America, only her base.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2011/01/26/bachmanns-camera-blunder/

"No, I think it has to do with his real name.

I think his real name is Oscar Mayer- baloney salesman par excellence.

Come on - sing along-"

Boy, and I thought I posted some childish s**t some days.....

I think his real name is Oscar Mayer- baloney salesman par excellence.

Not too obvious someones valium prescription needs a refill... STAT! lol

Her head is about to explode! ;o)))

Come on, No Joe! Aren't you the one always asking us to be serious? So much for that...

Repeating the promise of no earmarks and then signing thousands of earmarks at every opportunity is not leadership.

The Republican lead House of Representatives already promised spending bills sent to the President would not have earmarks in them. Obama promised not sign bills with earmarks 2 years ago, that promise turned out not to be true. Democratic Senate Lead Harry Reid just yesterday said he'll defend earmarks to his last breath. It's the Republicans that will be eliminating earmarks, not Obama.

JAS1,

Sorry, the correct answer was "Teleprompter".

" Leadership is setting budgets, guidelines, rules, direction and vision for everyone to follow."

Which is exactly what President Obama has done. During his administration, more Medicare fraud has been investigated, money recovered and perps put in jail than at ANY time during Bush's terms. Obama's administration has excelled at competency, and he has inspired educators, entrepenuers, scientists and allies, to believe that the U.S. is on track to recover our role in the world as innovators. "Can do" is the American way!

Nadeem:

Me too, but I am not going to hold my breath. From what I have seen this AM on several of the media outlets, the GOP agenda will be the same.

And so will the Democrat agenda... Reid already said they'll ignore his threat on pet projects.

President Obama said he would veto any bill with pork in it. If he does not live by his word then shame on him. I do not care what Reid, McConnell or Boehner says, but I do care what my President says. He made the rule and now he has to live by it.

maggie,

The Coast Guard in Maine is making a big push to use renewable energy to power base housing and faciliites. My local paper had an article about Coast Guard families living in homes heated by pellet boilers, and using energy generated by wind power. The Coast Guard in Maine is leading the nation in developing these practices. This is how such technology advances and becomes more affordable. I think the federal government can play a decisive role in leading the nation in this regard.

Amy
I am aware of that and I guess I just want to know how long we baby sit the start ups? This company was given 500,000 from TARP and another 25,000 in low interest loans if I have read this right. Then a big percent of the cost is again picked up by the Government.
When does the taxpayer get off the hook?

I didn't hear Bachmann's speech -- too bad, I guess -- but what facts were there in Ryan's speech to check? It's all just fear, fear, fear, cut, cut, cut, danger, danger, danger.

St Louis:

Where is the detail review of the Republican and Tea Party responses? What about fact checking their speeches?

I was thinking the same thing. And I also was thinking it's too bad that the corporate media won't fact check Republican presidents' speeches. Maybe someone would have noticed that Bush's claim about Saddam Hussein buying uranium in Africa was bunk. Might have saved us a few trillion dollars and a few hundred thousand lives lost in Bush's pointless war.

I think Joe Wilson did that, and the thanks he got for it is history.

The perps, on the other hand, got off free. I take that back, they got off free and rich.

Anna Molly:

I think Joe Wilson did that, and the thanks he got for it is history.

True, but Wilson was a diplomat, not a journalist. "Journalism" meant the same thing as "stenography" for most of the Bush administration.

AnnaM:
Both lied about the stimulus being a total failure.
http://www.usatoday.com/money/economy/2010-08-30-stimulus30_CV_N.htm
http://economix.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/06/11/wait-did-the-stimulus-work/
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/07/31/AR2010073100092.html
http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=2870 5 myths of Stimulus:
http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=2910

Just out of curiosity, what "leader" would you prefer?

Tony, that was what I kept thinking through the whole pep rally last night. He gives a great speech. It's really not hard to understand why so many want to buy in hook line and sinker to everything he puts out there. Heck, even I wanted to believe him through most of the speech last night (I only flipped off my television once!) but in the end I can't. It was much the same as his campaign- hope and change sound good, but where is the substance? I don't pretend to think that the republicans have the right plan on their own either, but I know as long as we continue to wander in this same rut we fix nothing. Everyone needs to put their sacred cows on the table and talk about spending cuts and accept that everyone's going to walk away from the table losing something they want but in the end we all gain for compromising.

Well, you obviously got the part right about my being too dumb. Everyone knows that. My 401(k) balances prove it.

But I thought the plan also had the advantage of giving us smarter kids, more people to teach them, clean energy, and more jobs. Which of those things will the republican plan give us?

superlogi

IF FDR hadn't forced Congress to extend electricity into non-urban areas, farmers in the midwest wouldn't be using laptops today to send out invitations to their Tea Parties.

Back in the 30's the argument was that only the rich and private industry should have electicity, and that extending the grid to the rest of America was the road to socialism. Knowledge of history is a useful thing.

And what about the debt the GOP put my children in with the two unfunded wars, two unfunded tax cuts and an unfunded drug bill. You guys on the right seem to forget that a lot. Cutting spending is just a part of the solution and will not solve it in of itself. Never has and never will. Either help move the country forward of move overseas and get out of the way. We cannot afford you types anymore.

In which case, I suspect we'd better all go hide in our basements. Because the government employs the police. And obviously, that makes the police defective. And they're armed.

And the next time there's a fire, don't expect any help because firefighters are employed by the government.

And nurses who work for the VA ... and heck, obviously the military because they're government employees, too.

Or would you rather leave it all to mercenaries, like Blackwater, who charge way too much and are accountable to no one?

But who pays them, again? Oh, yeah .... government. Because it's hard to stage a war without one.

How does helping our country by "leading" it to the largest (1.5Trilliion) annual deficit ever have anything to do with "moving the country forward"? Next year it will be even larger due to Congress' ability spend borrowed money (40 cents for every dollar) and his "exceptional" yet empty speech.

My preference would be for you, your liberal ideas, and others who are happy with the current state of affairs to move to another country. Maybe a competitor like China and you could disable their economy and the future of their children.

We cannot afford your types anymore.

No Anna, we pay them. Right now our elected officials pay them with money borrowed from the future. Republican and Democrats alike that "we" voted for have led us here.

The only way out is to start cutting everything and not spend more.

Democrats: "Spend more and we'll have more tax revenue." Republicans: "Cut taxes and we'll have more tax revenue." I'm sick and tired of both parties and the people who support faulty logic.

Actually, Bob, what we need to do is BALANCE the equation.

We need to cut spending and SIMULTANEOUSLY raise Revenues.

As you can see, just cutting is not working because we do not have sufficient revenues to offset the cuts. We will NEVER attain a balance because we are always in the hole due to insufficient revenues.

Cutting taxes is LOSING REVENUE for the Government, and that does not always translate into 'money in your pocket' due to the fact that it may cost MORE for goods and services because Providers/businesses that will supply our needs will have to offset THEIR rising costs by raising their prices due to governmental budget cuts, which is revenue lost to them.

Spending more will definitely raise revenue, but there is a 'break-even' point where spending will offset any revenue(s). The trick is get more revenue in than what you spend. Attaining that delicate balance is something that I am waiting to see.

This is a vicious circle and it will NOT be easy to remedy. It will also take some time to remedy.

The President laid out his plan for gettng us out of this mess. Let's see if Congress follows through with their support.

Well then, Bob's Right, maybe YOU should move. If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the problem.

This is what many do not understand … people are still not spending and businesses are still not hiring in sufficient numbers thus to keep the economy from sliding backwards, like in the 30's the government needs to continue to spend but at a slower rate.
In the 80's when we were sliding deep into debt as we were trying to pull out of a recession many were concerned about our growing debt and deficit but President Reagan announced the Star Wars program and our Congress approved the billions in spending and helped the recovery.
Will our Congress be as insightful as in the 80's or as regressive as in the 30's?

This moron has put our country on the brink of collapse, we are more divided now than we have ever been, he has placed our children's economic future in severe jeopardy and he is trying to destroy the best healthcare system in the world. We are going to stop that from happening in Nov 2012.

But we now have a new slogan to march to: win the future. Didn't the Chinese of the 50 and 60's also go big time into slogans?

Win the future: WTF????

Ah, dangerfield, I can always count on you to brighten up my day. When pitchers and catchers report, I believe that there will be Summer.

Then I buy my tickets for grapefruit league games. If you are a baseball fan, you owe it to yourself to take one in sometime. The stadiums are little jewels, and the players interact with the fans in a way they do not in their regular season stadiums. Mostly, I think, because the yahoos are absent.

When I was a kid, the first baseball annual on the newsstand was my "first robin of spring"....Been going to Florida for spring training since I was 13. It (Spring Training) was even better 40 years ago...of course everything was better then, because I was 40 years younger...:)

Baseball is so much better than politics....

" He looked like an emotionless robot saying whatever he had to say to get his rating up."

Get out of here! You need to go into public relations or promotions or something. You mean you can 'get your ratings up' by being 'an emotionsless robot" with 'dead-looking eyes'?

Get out of here! You need to go into public relations or promotions or something.

Keep in mind DBO - this crowd favors drunken glow in the dark men who can turn on the tears at the drop of a hat!

Hey, that reminds me- I didn't get to catch much of a buzz last night. Boner only welled up twice that I could tell. That old softie!

It is one thing to talk the walk, but it is a whole other thing to walk the talk. We will need to see if the issue will be dealt with the way it should be or not.

The president has said many times he agrees that nuclear plants are a option for our energy problems, but the problem with that is and the reason why we don't depend on nuclear plants is the waste. No one want the waste to be stored in their state. Now you can write to the president and tell him the nuclear was can be stored in your state and I'm sure we will get the fleet of plants you are suggesting.

my option would be to rebuild our dam system to provide power the way we use to. there are thousand of abandon dams in the US that should be brought back on line to provide energy, inaddition to wind power and utilize the natural gas we have more than enough of.

Mark,

You're correct about the nuke plants, Germany is doing this right now.

Jeff: my option would be to rebuild our dam system to provide power the way we use to.

So what's the Department of Energy, you know, the department that figures out how to power the country, the department we spent $23 billion on last year, what's their Road Map To The Future?

<Crickets>

Jeff,

I'm for hydro and gas. I tried to find a graph showing that the amount of radioactive waste from the US military is much greater than commercial. But, waste is waste. If you don't know, one popular way to deal with waste is Vitrification -- sealing waste in a glass. An example is to have a bottle that is tinted green. You break the bottle but the green doesn't leak out. Vitrification is like that - if the glass is broken, the waste doesn't leak out because it is part of the glass.

I'm just a guy that sits in a cube and have no say on Yucca Mountain.

My point was simply that building new plants would be a huge step in getting the US back to work - especially if most of the components were made locally.

I'm unemployed as of August 2010. I was working on the design of a new reactor and the DOE loan guarantee was found to be "unworkable" with unreasonable conditions. I was not involved in high level meetings of this nature. To be fair, I don't know if the regulations in place were "in place" from previous years or if the Obama Admin put them in place. Either way, the project (for now) collapsed and hundreds were let go.

First, good morning libbienuts, especially the Queen of the Keyboard and her pal. The civility with the Attack Queens is amazing.

Another commented on recycling, and I agree. I heard parts of the same speech during the past two years: no earmarks, ntransparency in government, blah, blah, blah. Haven't these promises been broken by this guy before, and before? How can you libbienuts by into truthfulness from our Dude-in-Chief?

Going green is a joke, for fosil fuel is still a requirement in much of our commerce. And I did laugh at the statement regarding millions of green cars in the nation, leading the world in annual production. I guess he had to get a plug in for Government Motors. Electric cars aren't ready for the average american to purchase. and the high cost of recharging the batteries isn't mentioned in any of the speech. With the average kilowatt hour in CA at 14.4 cents/KWH, the average recharge for an electric car would increase the average household energy bill by 60% - not my figures, but State of CA projections. And how do the utilities power their plants to produce electric power - OIL. Too bad the tree-huggers out there have such power to negate the building of nuke power generation facilities as many european countries have.

Wind- we have in our neighborhood over 250 wind turbins that generate power for about 30,000 homes. At over $1M each these turbins are purchased by companies and individuals who receive massive tax write offs from the gov. to produce this power. Without the tax incentives I doubt if such growth will expand.

Well yesterday I predicted that the Obama speech would be blah, blah, blah, the Congressional Crooks would be singing kumbaya together while positioning themselves for a great photo op. and I did predict the lowly-rated media pundits would create the image of the second coming after his speech. I wasn't dissappointed.

Mark,

I must Disagree with you about wind energy, I mean afterall didnt you listen tot he Presidents Speech last night . All Hot Air. He lied to the American People trying to Convince them he is Moving to the Right. More hot Air.. And look how his Hot Air has Powered the Lefties on this Boards this morning.. ..

Just one question for the expert: Exactly when did the word "conservation" fall out of our collective vocabulary?

Or, wait, you work -- or worked -- for the power industry, don't you? Meaning you're biased in favor of production, not conservation. And, my gosh, just imagine being told that it might help to use a more energy-efficient lightbulb. Oh, the communism of it all.

Never mind.

Jeff, Joanne, et als- if you want to see an evironmentalist's head explode, say hydropower. Same with methane plants- despite the fact that they are efficient, reliable, and proven to provide cheap energy.

You think Mr. "all it takes is a trillion dollars and a dream" is going to tick off that much of his base? Cause, if you do, remember that he got cap and trade in through the backdoor- and saved himself a lot of howling by having the announcement made on Christmas Eve.

Forget hydro, nuclear, natural gas, ( it has to be drilled for), or anything else that works while he in still in power. Maybe rainbows and unicorns will do the trick.

Mark Mazerski

Hey I'm a construction estimator, layed off last year for the first time in 18 years. I'm for doing what ever ti takes to get construction going again, the last 3 or 4 years have been some of the hardest years i have ever seen or heard of, nuclear plants, roads, bridges, schools, hospitals, do what ever. the best way to get the best return for your construction dollar is roads, schools, hospitals and infastructure upgrades IE gas mains, electic grids, sewers, new water mains, as we say yesterday with that 4 foot diamiter water main break and the gas main explosions in california and Philly, if we don't invest in everyday things we depend on the survive everyday live in 10 years we will not have save delievery systems for water, gas, goods and services.

Maybe rainbows and unicorns will do the trick.

Rainbows are pretty much frauds. But do you happen to know where the unicorns are?

Seriously, this "libbie" is not adverse to looking at hydro, natural gas, or even nuclear, for that matter.

As long as conservatives agree to strict regulations to ensure safety, environmental integrity, and conservation.

Are you in?

Anna -- you missed my point. We have big problems and yet the President is worrying about light bulbs.

Until someone invents a practical fusion device, we have to stick with what we know - and part of this is oil and nuclear.

Me an expert - nah, just a guy thats been working at field sites on nuclear, fossil and oil. Come on, of course I'm for protecting the environment, etc but everything has consequences. Those CFLs use mercury (they must) and we know how toxic the stuff is but, it is what it is.

why the sarcasm in your response?

Steve -

I had to read it twice... made me laugh. I'm just stunned at the idea of spend, spend, spend... If I lived like this I would come home one day and everything I own would be on the curb.

Because I tend to be sarcastic with people who unabashedly display their bias while being short-sightedly dismissive of conservation as a part of the solution and apparently believing there's nothing wrong with our insatiable thirst for more and more energy, environment be damned. We wouldn't need so much energy if we would all try to save a little. And "green" sources should not be laughed at, especially after the most recent Gulf disaster.

Anything we can do is better than nothing.

I have a little private joke that I like to use in situations like this one -- the day AFTER we use up the last drop of oil, we'll find out what it was REALLY for. Or do you believe there is a God who went to the trouble of putting it there millions of years ago just for human beings -- mostly Americans who believe they're somehow "exceptional" -- to squander in less than 300 years of the earth's history?

Because I don't subscribe to that view.

And if you think i missed your point, then you don't know me at all.

Of course I don't know you at all.

I'm not being short-sighted or dismissive... I'm realistic. Wind power is inefficient and the components are made in "you know where". If companies want to erect them, fine. Due to America's problems, we need to act fast.

You do know that all the electronic devices you own and use are full of toxic metals and the hybrid / electric car you may own could very well have a super toxic battery. How do we dispose of all this stuff? I suspect some ends up in landfills and the rest goes to China and India (who knows what they do with it).

I can't answer your oil question. If oil is abiotic (a theory), then the outcome will prove to be much different.

All I was trying to say is we need manufacturing, jobs and to build things. Nuke plants are one of many things we can do - and we know how to build them.

And Anna, I should add that no one (well, not me) is laughing at green energy, it's just that now is not the time to expect to run the country on it.

Let's start by making ALL the wind turbine components here in the US as well as driving down the cost of solar. Until then, we need to do what we know how to do well.

As for oil - your body uses oil for lubrication and all machinery needs to do the same. That fact may never change - what may change is a way to truly make a synthetic substitute.

The 1st speech of the 2012 campaign. Same old, same old. The same pretty words he used to get elected. He's a good talker but a horrible leader. Sputnik moment? How 'bout using the NASA chief to make the muslims feel better about themselves. He's a lying, incompetent, corrupt boob along with his wife, Marie who says let them eat what I say.

Waste of time, waste of 4 years. The economy is limping back dispite his best efforts to totally destroy it. He didn't fool me in '08, he doesn't fool me now and he certainly won't fool me in '12. My pity to those of you who buy into his dribble yet again. Some never learn.

Well said. This pathetic "community organizing" Islamic socialist needs to go back home to Kenya, and take his Angela Davis wife with him, where she can be proud of Kenya for the first time in her adult life.

(no offense, anyone)

There's that "civility" for which Conservatives are so well known.