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In a phone call with Eagles owner Jeffrey Lurie, President Obama praised the team for giving Michael Vick a second chance, reports Peter King of Sports Illustrated and NBC Sports.
From the item:
Eagles owner Jeffrey Lurie was surprised to hear the president's voice on the phone. Barack Obama had two things to discuss with Lurie: the redemption of Michael Vick and the alternative-energy plans Lurie unveiled this fall for Lincoln Financial Field. I talked about the Vick story on NBC last night.
"The president wanted to talk about two things, but the first was Michael,'' Lurie told me. "He said, 'So many people who serve time never get a fair second chance. He was ... passionate about it. He said it's never a level playing field for prisoners when they get out of jail. And he was happy that we did something on such a national stage that showed our faith in giving someone a second chance after such a major downfall.''
Lurie said Obama and he talked football. "He's a real football fan,'' Lurie said. "He loves his Bears. He really follows it. He knew how Michael was doing. It was really interesting to hear.''
The Eagles announced last month they would run the first self-sufficient alternative-energy sports stadium in the country. They'll install 80 spiral wind turbines to the stadium and mount 2,500 solar panels. Together, those devices will power about 30 percent of the stadium's energy needs. In addition, a biodiesel plant will be built nearby and that alternative energy source will help power (along with natural gas) the remaining 70 percent of the stadium's power needs. In addition, the project to install all the devices will employ 200 people for a year in, obviously, a down economy.
Over the course of the stadium's life, the team believes it can save $60 million in energy costs. That was big to Lurie, who's aggressively conservation-minded. He told Obama he was happy to put a plan like this in place, but he wouldn't have done it unless it made some financial sense. "It's good business for us, which is the point,'' Lurie said. "We talked about policy and what he hopes can happen with alternative energy, and he raved about us being the first to put a plan like this in place.''
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Talk about "REDEMPTION"! That's what this country is all about. So what, he got caught up in a dog fighting scandal. There are some people in this country who have done WAY worse than what Michael Vick did, and for Tony Dungy to visit him while he was incarcerated at FT. Leavenworth, for the Eagles to take a HUGE chance with him, for Vick to NOT only play better but show a better work ethic, a better "CHARACTER" off the field in his personal life, and for President Obama to call stating that he's noticed an all around difference in Vick speak volumes about the work he put in to redeeming himself. I only wish that we could see such a redemption play out at the local level with our one-time, non violent offenders.
It looks like Jeffrey Lurie gets it because of the renovations he's putting on the Eagles' Stadium. Yes, it's going to cost him some "green" for going "green", but think about the "green" he's going to be making AND saving MORE in the future. If and when successful, this will serve as a template for Obama's energy plan.
I probably shouldn't admit this, but even after about 45 years of rooting for at various times the Phillies, the Sixers, and the Flyers, I've never once considered myself a fan of the Eagles (or the "Iggles", as it's pronounced around here). I think it's been partly a desire to disassociate myself from the rather loud, crude, foul-mouthed, abusive drunks that make up such a large part of their fan base; partly because while the names and faces change, they've always seemed to be a bunch of hot dogs when winning (see DeSean Jackson the last few weeks) and whiny cry-babies when losing; partly because their play-by-play announcer, Merrill Reese is a world class "homer" whose voice just grates on my ears; and partly because they have about the ugliest uniforms this side of the Cleveland Browns. It didn't help when Coach Andy Reid's two grown sons both turned into jailbirds who squandered their own second chances the last couple of years and the coach basically shrugged it off, and the organization's eagerness to sign Michael Vick (and the fans' to embrace him) before there was any evidence at all that he'd changed his ways was pretty much the last straw. While I applaud President Obama's passion for people getting second chances, I believe the time Michael Vick served in prison was simply the just punishment for his crime, not any indication of his supposed "redemption". And while he's admittedly spent many hours fulfilling his community service requirements and working with the Humane Society, to me it's all seemed very programmed and his words often sound like they're a script he memorized. He says and does the right things; I just don't get any sense at all that he actually feels them, and there's no amount of clutch touchdown passes that's going to erase those doubts for me. I'd really like to believe he's changed, but for me, the jury's still out on this whole "redemption" thing. Time will tell.
On the other hand, kudos to Jeffrey Lurie for his efforts to make the stadium as "green" as possible. To those who keep insisting that alternative energy is impractical and expensive, I think this is a great step towards proving otherwise.
But still - don't look for me in the crowd tomorrow night - it's still a lot more than a "so what" for me.
JoAnn- my son was an anthropology major at U of C- in the beginning, he tried to justify Vicks' treatment of animals as a 'cultural' difference. . .
Then he learned about what he did to his pet dogs. At that point, he admitted that the man is a sociopath. It is the difference between how the farmer feels about his pigs and his pups.
He returned his season tickets, and started rooting for the Jets.
There is no excuse for this man- who is now petitioning the court to allow him to have a dog! He says his plea agreement was unfair!
Talent is no excuse for cruelty . . .
It's up to the individual's character to make his search for redemption a success or a failure in the long run. Only history will tell if it's real or contrived, JoAnne. But from what I've seen, it looks like Michael Vick is taking steps in the right direction.
As for you comment, NJNB, I have to wonder if you would be this vocal if it wasn't Vick Or ANY other famous figure who was busted for cruelty to animals, but your next door neighbor who was.
Trust me on this, Kevin.
I would be.
I understand the difference between farm animals and pets, which was my original point. Your pet is a member of your family- a dependent who does not outgrow his or her needs. To visit upon such the kind of treatment Vicks visited upon his pet dogs is unspeakable- no matter who the culprit..
It bespeaks an inability to feel empathy, which is the very definition of a sociopath.
White, black, green or purple, it is evil.
As to your point- were it my neighbor, he would still be in jail. New Jersey has some,pretty strong animal cruelty laws. Vicks is a free man, able toply his trade because of his stature, which I do not begrudge- but his latest petition to the court is Inexcusable..
Kevin - I sincerely hope you're right - at least we agree that only history will decide. And while I rarely agree with NoJoe on matters political, I agree that one trait I've always heard that most sociopaths have in common (and NoJoe, being from NJ will probably recall the infamous "Mudman" and maybe Thomas Capano from Delaware) is their total lack of feeling or empathy for their fellow living creatures, either human or animal. I'm not a shrink, I never even took Psych 101 in college, so I can hardly accuse Vick of being a sociopath. But living in the Philly area, I've seen too many interviews with him where there just doesn't seem to be any real "there" there and it bothers me. This is one time when I really hope I'm proven wrong.
There are no excuses for what Vick did to those animals, none. There is no cultural excuse, no livestock vs. pets excuse; he took pleasure in the torture and slow death of animals. Those were acts of violence, no matter how you sugar coat it. Cruelty to animals is frequently the precursor to violence against humans. Vick's aggressive behavior towards humans was taken out on the football field. I believe everyone deserves a second chance, but I am dang tired of Vick crying about how he has been put upon and how terribly he suffered in jail - it was a situation of his own creation. How about the suffering he inflicted? And now he thinks, as well as a bunch of Vick sympathizers, that his suffering should lead to an MVP title for this year? Because he suffered so terribly, made a "come back", and played decent football for 10 or 11 games? A handful of games does not MVP make. He is still a selfish, self centered, egotist who is a decent quarterback (no, not the best ever, don't even go there), who will maybe play for a few more years if he learns to stay in the pocket and not try to grandstand every play.
Now Vick wants another dog. Maybe Obama should stand by his statement about "second chances" by allowing Vick to adopt Bo, the family pet.
No Jo, my Problem with Micheal Vick, was that and i have always told my son this,
No matter how bad its is you can't lie, Micheal Vick lyed his ass off from the beginning, he lyed to the owner, the comminiser, his union, every body. once everything came out, no one trusted him because of his lying.
had he come clean in the beginning he may have not spent time in jail, remember he was charged with trying to cover it up.
I Owned a dog when i had my house, and you right they are a member of the family, when my dog died we took it hard. the only dog i will never own is a pit, they are built for fighting and killing but like any breed, if they are treated right they are good dogs.
I own two collies. They are like members of my family. They love and protect all of us and ask for nothing but to be loved in return. And I can tell you from experience, just because the breed is a pit-bull means nothing. Some of the gentlest, sweetest pets I have known have been pits. Any dog can be made to become vicious if trained to be.
ANYBODY, regardless of "political affiliation" should be shocked and sickened by what Vick did. There is NO excuse for participating in anyway, in the mistreatment of an innocent animal that has no control over its life except what humans subject them to.
There is also NO excuse for condoning such actions either. I don't care what letter comes after your name on a ballot or what party you belong to or what politician you cheer for. Whether a politician's name is Bush, Clinton, Reagan, Obama or whatever. This should transcend politics. It's pure evil to be part of or condone such actions.
What Vick did is tantamount to participating in the torture of a defenseless baby. Anyone here who overlooks what he did or praises Obama for this accolade to the Eagles should be ashamed of themselves.
This makes me sick to my stomach.
I hate to break it to a lot of you her but, Your pet is not a member of your family. Now don't get me wrong i have a dog and i love him very much, However i have a son as well and i love him much much more and in quite a different way. Also what Vick did is horrible no question! However to compare what he did to a dog to a baby? This just demeans human life plain and simple. Like it or not they are not the same!!!!
Darryl Blackshear
Life is life. No matter what form.
And desreves respect.
This Vick redemption thing to me is nothing. Why are people concerned that he be redeemed? He has done his time. Leave him be. On the other hand, why was Big Ben(Steelers QB) never even brought to trial on 2 separate instances of criminal sexual assault? Looks like some players get protection while other get thrown to the wolves....
Liberals and LaLa Land,
Funny that Obama/liberals see everything in terms of some social play. The Eagles could not have cared less about the social redemption blah, blah when they signed Vick. They signed Vick because he is a very uniquely gifted and talented quarterback (hard to find) that Andy Reid thought would help the team win football games. He has and in a sensational way.
And because this is a sensational story, Obama has to weigh in for the PR value. (Obama a Bears fan? Probably like him being a devout, long time White Sox fan on opening day, but couldn't name a single player when ask who he liked.)
But Vick is the story. Yet, there are hundreds of wonderful, more socially conscious players that have worked every day as opposed to slacking off due to their gift, stayed out of trouble, devote more time and money to their communities, are more worthy and deserving of recognition than Vick.
That's the reality. The reality of the NFL, but also the reality of political opportunity.
Darryl Blackshear
Life is life. No matter what form.
And desreves respect.
Yeah and i guess we really respect, Cow's, Chicken's, Pigs and all the other animals we brutally slaughter!
Hey - how about Obama does something about the cost of good old traditional energy costs. You know like gasoline, which keeps going going up and up. Might really help.
The President, like the rest of us, is still waiting for it to go down, because GW said it would!
Spanky:
The President does not control the price of oil.
That would be the greedy speculators (friends of oil barons)!
, but shutting down new production in the Gulf, knocking down production in shallow water to 1/10th, shutting down the east coast, more areas in Alaska, leases in the continental states, etc., etc., etc. sure does nothing except help send the price of oil up.
At least we don't need all those energy industry jobs, or have a trade deficit and reliance on foreign sources.
Domestic oil production goes onto the world market. It isn't earmarked for America. It' value is established globally, we pay the global price or the oil goes to whomever is willing to pay that price.
That's right, Paul.
And American production boosts supply. Funny how prices go up when Hurricanes hit, yet now we shut off new production for the whole Gulf and you think prices are not going up?
How about those jobs - you guys always griping about outsourcing, right?
Global oil supplies either have peaked or are peaking. What we need is to get on a crash course of alternative energy. Of course, we can thank the Senate for blocking legislation on this front. Meanwhile, don't hold your breath waiting for $40 oil or $2.00/gal gasoline.
This coming from someone who continually brags about buying a brand new gas guzzler! lmao
Here's hoping it gas hits 5 bucks a gallon especially for you...
No bob it doesn't. The more we produce and put on the world market, the less others will produce. Every barrel they can hold in reserve they will get more money for later.
I would suggest that you start thinking about our domestic reserves as little more that our nation's strategic oil reserve underground. It will do us no real good unless the rest of the world attempts to cut us off entirely, and in that case it won't be made available to the public at any price that would make you want to burn much of it in your car.
Fiesty, why do you hate poor people? Certainly you agree it is the poor that are disproportionally effected by high energy costs, right. Take me, while it is absolutely true that I did recently take advantage of IRC code sec. 179 and get me a huge refund/write off on a very large SUV, I, unlike the poor have several cars, some of which, although sporty, also happen to get good gas milage.
Now my boat and motorhome, not so much. But they sure are fun.
So how about it fiesty, what do we got to do to have Obama open up ANWAR? Do it for the poor.
Thanks again Spanky for proving my point and in the meantime all I can say is... GFY!
Put on your big boy panties for a change and SUCK it up!
Remember - gas hit $4.00/gallon even before the BP debacle. It then receded to about $2.50 (depending on where you live), and now is rising again. Obviously the price is dependent upon a lot more than whether or not we are drilling in the Gulf of Mexico. Equally as obvious, gasoline is never going to be cheap again. We need to drive more fuel-efficient cars, increase our use of public transportation, drive less, and develop renewable electricity generation.
And Spanky - trade your stinkpot for a sailboat.
So Feisty, you appear to be an animal lover. How do you feel about Vick's behavior and Obama's praise for his "second chance?"
This should prove very revealing if you have the guts to answer it.
slimsignet
So Feisty, you appear to be an animal lover. How do you feel about Vick's behavior and Obama's praise for his "second chance?"
Feisty i will answer that, I'm a aminal lover, Micheal Vick has done everything he can to redeame his self, thats all we can do when we make mistakes, remmber we are human and not perfect.
Obama praising him was not the purpose for the phone call, the call was to the owner about a energy project he installed in the staduim. hell i know guys that have done much worse in life and have been praised by family and friends about turning their life around. i guess your problem is that it came from the president, I guess Bush 41 and his wife should not praise thier son neil for turing his life around. Right.
I guess Bush 41 and his wife should not praise thier son neil for turing his life around. Right.
Not if he's an adult who's guity of participating in the torture of an innocent and defenseless creatrure. No! They should not!
Obama praising him was not the purpose for the phone call,
then why did he use it for that purpose?
hell i know guys that have done much worse in life
Anyone I have known in the past that I found out had been part of such an act was no longer my friend. But Good for you. Birds of a feather...
slimsignet
Please believe me i'm, in no way forgetting what Vick did, and WOW so you telling me that if your son did this, you would never forgive him ? Lets hope Not,
the Owner put the news out, and what was lost was the main purpose for the call. heck if i got a call from the president I would have done what the owner did.
I said i know guys that have done much worse, yes, but that is what jails are for, unless you want to prision system to house and not let any body out, but that not what there their for, believe me, my cousin was sent to jail for selling drugs on a major scale, he was not a street seller is was high up, we in the family wanted nothing to do with his as long as he earned a living like that, he got caught, he served his time (10 years) and today works full time with the college degree he earned while in and on weekends he still does community service even thought he does not have to, prision changed him for the better the same as micheal vick, and we accepted his back in the family because he turned his life around, same a mike Vick.
Its all about money, vick should have done at least 10 years for what he done, an average person would still be doing time for the cruelty administered by vick he should be hung up by his ba77s like he did those animals , a man get sentanced to 5 years for dealing drugs.I guess obama feels for him cause he smoked crack when he was younger even though all the statistics show once a crack smoker allways a crack smoker.
No offense to our President, because I love me some Barack... But, I LOVE my chocolate Dark :-)
Love and support to Michael.
MPEVANS/Ravens Fan "For Life"!
President and the NFL are all wrong . Vick is a killer he killed for fun. if he thought he could get away with killing humans he would have done it. True he served his time I believe in redemption but not 100% when you committed the ultimate crime of killing. The NFL should not of given this guy back the top spotlight in sports being an NFL quarterback. But yes he did deserve a second chance just not at the top of the heap. He should have been given a job (maybe groundskeeper) and lived a quiet life.
downhillracer:
All killing of animals is for fun unless you eat the kill. Every hunting season thousands of deer are killed and not eaten. That is what you call killing for sport or to thin the herd (fun).
I don't condone Michael Vick being caught up in the dog fighting world but that is a part of the under side of the urban environment much like upper-class killing deer, quail, etc.
It all makes me a little queasy.
@downhillracer
If that is your position, then he really didn't serve his time. His punishment for his crime was serving time in prison and he did that. The terms of his punishment was not to be a groundkeeper post his prison stint or starting at the bottom of the heap.
You're being upset at the current state of his life is more of a reflection on you than it is a reflection on him somehow cheating the system. He was given the opportunity to physically succeed on the football field. Don't blame him for that. Blame the Owners, blame the fans who continue to go.
Welcome to America friend...where those with the greenbacks carry the biggest sticks in the yard.
what does this say to our children,go ahead and kill animals for pleasure you will get away easy and our president should look at his dog and amagine it being done to his childrens pet, mabe he would have a second thought.
2 scumbags who love getting away with murder, obama and vick. doesn't he have anything better to do? the whole country is coming apart and our commander in chief is drinking and dialing. how's that war of yours going mr president? more people died in 1 year in your war than died in 2 years of bush's war. where's the body count? where's the jobs? where's the transparency? the only time he's the smartest man in the room is when he's taking a dump,and that's a close second.
I think the statistic you were inartfully attempting to cite was the death count for American troops. Unless in your mind they are the only "people" on the planet that matter.
Vick did his time. Try not to punish him more harshly for what he did to dogs than you are willing to blame the white folks' ancestors and progeny who did and do, the same to blacks and dogs, but never got or get, jail time. It's all in the past, right?
Wow!! Someone got up from the wrong side of the bed this morning. Or are you always a miserable son-of-*******.
I am an animal lover and it was terrible what Vick did. However, he did his time in jail and is now speaking at schools trying to teach children not to follow in his footsteps. He is now doing the right thing and should be supported. It's just very sad that there are too many people like you who can't seem to forgive.
As for calling the president a scumbag........... if I were you you I would take a look in the mirror. You may be surprised but a real scumbag will be looking back at you.
Merry Christmas.
Paul
In either war you are right....the ONLY people killed that matter are American troops.
Afghanistan housed Al-Queida and the Taliban. The Taliban and Al-Queida flew planes into buildings on American soil killing AMERICAN citizens.....
Ergo whatever hapopens to Afghani people during the war is on them. If they kill one American soldier we should be killing 10 of their people.
Think they'd start getting the point that you don't mess with the greatest country in the world?
This is what liberals fail to realize. We are the greatest country in the world for a reason. We didnt get where we are (were?) by saying how unfair it is that other countries dont have it as good.
Obama's war? Isn't that the one that Bush started but didn't finish because he, The Deciderer, chose to chase windmills in Iraq instead?
If it's "Obama's War", it is because Bush chose not to fight it.
...but I'm not supposed to blame Bush, right?
Da Noid if YOUR President wanted to end the war he would just pull all the troops out of Afghanistan and Iraq right? But last thing Obama did was a mini-surge of his own?
So yes this is his war now..... maybe if he had the cajones to pull the troops out completely then we wouldnt be having this discussion....but instead he ignored his top Generals and it took his HANDPICKED General falling on his own sword (Im proud of you Gen McCrystal) to get Barack to pay any attention to the wars.
Larry: Your ignorance astounds. Our enemy is Al Qaida. Bush let them escape from Tora Bora. The Taliban came to Crawford Texas and had a sit down with G.W.Bush.
The Afghans only fight with us because we have invaded their country and "failed" in our mission. To them it looks like we are never going to leave. Killing innocents to get what we "want" is not the American way. At least not what I remember us to have been.
Larry, why do you want to bring the US down to the same level with Al Quaida, North Korea, and Iran? Your mentality fits in with their way of life, not with America. Only the lowest on the food chain think killing more of them then they kill of us gains respect, you could not be any more wrong. Violence breeds violence - they escalate when we escalate, and there is no winner in that race. America needs to be the grown up on the world stage, not the snotty nosed bully.
Paul,
I think I heard about that. George drove them around the ranch in his new Ford Tuff F-350 and after a few Shiner Bocks, busted out the new commercial grade Echo chainsaw and let them have their way with a bunch of virgin Mesquite trees. They loved the truck and Bush hooked them up with his truck guy in Waco. George had put a pig in the smoker, he is a real joker, after the Taliban got drunk and shot all the beer bottles with their AKs, Bush had the Secret Service guys bring out their .50 caliber Barrett sniper rifle and they had a real hoot vaporizing squirrels. Meanwhile Miss Laura was back at the ranch fixin the pulled pork sandwiches (covering the pork with Bull's Eye BBQ sauce) and beans. The Taliban came back, loved the Texas Barbeque, and agreed to turn over Bin Laden for a couple cases of Shiner, the Echo chainsaw and Cheney's porn collection. Everything was going great - done deal. Problem was that Cheney didn't know Bush had thrown his porn collection into the deal. When the Taliban were getting ready to leave they thanked Cheney for his collection. Cheney realizing George had punked him and was livid and to get back at George, told them that the Texas BBQ wasn't real Texas BBQ (brisket) it Memphis BBQ - pulled pig - PORK! Well after they got through poking that little hang down part in the back of their mouths and getting rid of the pork - they were mad, called off the deal and we have been at war for 10 years all because Cheney's wouldn't give up what.....
his porn collection. He is an evil genius that found a way to out-punk George.
Dang that Cheney!
Is that the same sit down in Crawford you were talking about?
Do you understand the relationship between domestic oil production and global oil prices on the world market, now?
Bob, there are few people who can take on the tin foil hat crew-
You did it. I laughed till I cried.
Thank, you, thank you, thank you.
Paul will not get it, but those of us who are sane do. Have a glorious New Year!
I got it. I was amused by it. I don't think it changes the reality that Al Qaida and Afghanistan is about lithium, oil and an oil pipeline from the Caspian Sea basin, and the death of 3000 Americans on 9/11 was an orchestrated "collateral damage" pretext for surrounding Iran. Read the GRAND CHESSBOARD, it should be enlightening.
Talk about laughing until you cry & sanity.. coming from the QUEEN of the tin foil hat crowd!
Better be careful there playboy Bob - NJNB sounds like she'd be willing to bl* w ya! You remember the good old days there Bob, dontcha? WAAAAAY back when...
After all... she deosn't subscribe to NJNB for nuttin!
Paul................. what a great insperation you are to our troops to bad you were not in one of those jets so you could have seen for yourself who was to blame.or mabe a family member in one of the towers I bet you would sing a different tune.
Simpleton carlyss_man: The word is inspiration.
Our troops are, sadly, misguided tools of the NeoCon geopolitcists. Once committed to "war" the greatest of political peace-honoring humans will struggle for an honorable end to a conflict generated from a falsehood. How do you end a "war" in which every casualty is a sacrifice to a false premise?
I didn't need to be on the jets to know who was not flying them. The odd issue is that you, who were not on the jets, think that you do know who was flying them. That would seem to be a contradiction, if you aren't very bright. You were told something that had no basis in fact, and you failed to question it, because your mind was "traumatized" by the 'event' of 9/11. My mind was never traumatized by 9/11, even though I did lose a family member to the false-flag attack. It is a matter of rationality over emotionality. You have been turned into little girls who value emotion over logic. A man you are not.
James and downhillracer...you are both idiots.
I guess it's OK for Ben/Steelers to rape women and get a freakin slap on the hand and come back to play. But I guess a dog's life is more important than a woman's in your view.
It figures...Ben's white! Hate to play the race card but it is what it is.
@ James - Your comment is TOO DAMN IGNORANT to even comment on...
MP, some agreement with what you say, but those young women took settlements instead of pushing the rape cases through court. That is the difference, money talked. Dogs don't get offered settlements to drop charges or change their stories. Several charges against Vick were never pursued, like multiple charges of cruelty to animals at the state level. If he had been charged, tried, and convicted on each count of cruelty to animals, he would be in jail until well after his playing days were over. Vick was treated better by the system than an "ordinary" person would have been, so please don't pull out a race card, there is not need. Maybe the celebrity card, but not the race card.
Sorry but the race card needs to be played. It is only non white athletes that get into trouble that ever make the news or are punished in a way fitting the crime. The Kobe Bryant incident is very similiar to the Big Ben incidents, yet it took years for that to be settled and it was settled, but Ben? What was the settlement besides a 6 game suspension that the NFL commissioner reduced to 4? Was it even reported upon in the news?
Does that seem correct and unbiased to you?
"Forgiveness does not change the past, but it does enlarge the future. " ~ Paul Boese
I'm happy for Michael Vick and how he was able to come back. I have seen him speaking on tv about his past with much shame & humility. So many professional athletes we have seen over the years are not ready for the responsibilities that come with being a highly paid athlete. They're not prepared for it. And we have seen more than our share of athletes having it all with little thought to the price they won't have to pay just for being who they are. They become spoiled and assume nothing bad can/will touch them. It's called immaturity & arrogance. We've seen it over and over and over.
It's all part of that nasty process of growing up, in which some have to pay a higher price than others. As said by Kevin, having an individual like Tony Dungy taking the time to visit Michael must have had a huge impact on Vick.
Sometimes it does take a village. Very kind words by President Obama which must have meant everything to Michael. What would this world do without men like Tony Dungy?
Pat, Vick was what 27, 28 when he got caught? He was already "grown up", and as an adult needed to take responsibility for his actions, not make excuses.
James-
Can you tell us President Obama murdered? You would be wise to back off of that statement. The constabulary does troll websites and your comments may be considered inflammatory towards the Commander-in-Chief.
Secondly, more troops are bing killed because there more of them in combat in Afghanistan. Did you forget that President Bush abandoned that war of necessity to launch his ill-advised foray into Iraq? At one point there were only 4000 troops in Afghanistan while there were over 100k in Iraq on a fools mission!
Sheila much like you liberals blame Pres. Bush and Cheney for murdering innocent Americans due to the two wars....now that this is Obama's war we can now say that his inaction as commander in chief has led to the deats of thousands of American service members....
There I just explained to you how Obama can be classified as a murderer..... (of course using liberals' twisted logic)
Cheney and the Bush Clan are guilty of the murder of American civilians on 9/11/2001.
Larry,
Did somebody walk right into one?
Shelia,
133 troops were lost in 2008 in Afghanistan due to hostile action. 266 were lost in 2009. Obama announced his surge in December 2009, so for all practical purposes, losses doubled while Obama tried to come up with his plan.
So far this year alone, we have lost another 437, which is more than the total lost under Bush in 87 months.
The real tragedy is that with Obama's plan/announced withdrawal, there is now - no chance of a success much less winning the war like Obama vowed. All these lives for Obama to kick the can down the road. Tragic.
The ill-advised foray into Iraq? Bush ended up winning that one, remember Obama talking about that success?
BTW - Why don't you Wiki the Afghan war, it would improve your understanding of what happened a 1,000%.
Why don't you google Architects and Engineers for 9/11 Truth, it would help you understand why they are dying over there.
bob-1805084:
We are not on the same page.
The foray into Iraq has resulted in deaths for over 4000 Allied troops and hundreds of thousands of Iraqis. Millions more displaced and you're talking like these wars are the same and congratulating Bush for "winning" the war in Iraq.
Are you serious?
Equating what happend in Iraq during an adventure to troops killed in Afghanistan during a war that was 'just' and should have been over by the time Bush left office. He and Cheney took their eye off the ball and now you want to "Blame Obama " because the Afghan war is not over yet!
Hater!
From my experience I've learned that the people who believe that Michael Vick doesn't deserve a second chance are the same people who believe that nobody deserves a second chance.
...until it's their turn, of course.
Da Noid:
Amen.
It is by the Grace of God that we all get multiple chances.
Um, no.
Most of us,thankfully, will NEVER be charged with cruelty to animals.
Or children.
Or any of our fellows.
Mistakes happen when we do something we believe to be right, but turns out to be wrong.
It is NOT a mistake when we do something wrong, and get caught.
Making a bad investment on what we believe to be good advice is a mistake.
Driving drunk is WRONG.
Get it?
Good. Most of these idiots who get caught do not.
"no joe" = Mary Poppins ("Practically Perfect In Every Way")
BWAA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA-HA!!!
Right, you just can't do any wrong, can you, Pollyanna?
I just explained the difference. What don't you understand?
Or are you the kind who engages in activity you KNOW is wrong, and plead that it was a mistake when you get caught?
I thought so.
Take this under consideration:
Judge not, that ye be not judged.
2: For with what judgment ye judge, ye shall be judged: and with what measure ye mete, it shall be measured to you again.
3: And why beholdest thou the mote that is in thy brother's eye, but considerest not the beam that is in thine own eye?
4: Or how wilt thou say to thy brother, Let me pull out the mote out of thine eye; and, behold, a beam is in thine own eye?
5: Thou hypocrite, first cast out the beam out of thine own eye; and then shalt thou see clearly to cast out the mote out of thy brother's eye.
- Book of Matthew 7:1-5
Kevin-458252
Sorry. When it comes to torturing defenseless animals or children, I judge and I judge harshly. To me there is NO worse offense that a human can be guilty of than to cause the suffering of a defenseless creature. Anybody who can't see that is fcked in the head.
And anyone on here accepting Vick's behavior or this "second chance" bullshlt from Obama are showing there true colors.
and yeah, I know it's "their" not "there."
Typo. Sue me.
Causing suffering to a defenseless creature is worse than murdering an adult human? Let's try to be rational here. Even Liberal activist judges haven't made that same determination.
Does the name "Leonard Little" mean anything to you?
In October 1998, Leonard Little was leaving a birthday party when he crashed into a vehicle and killed Susan Gutweiler. When tested, Little's blood alcohol level registered 0.19. He was arrested, charged and eventually convicted of vehicular manslaughter. He was sentenced to 60 days in prison, 4 years probation and 1000 community service.
At no time did the NFL take any action against Mr. Little.
He KILLED another human being and they did nothing to him. Michael Vick was suspended by the league and had to apply for reinstatement for what he did to dogs, not people.
Da Noid - I'll admit I wasn't familiar with this case, so I did some research and found a couple different sources that say Little was suspended for eight games after that incident.
On the other hand, I also found that he was later arrested again for DUI in 2004. An AP story said:
"Little, freed later Monday on $7,500 bond, was suspended without pay for the first half of the 1999 season after he pleaded guilty to involuntary manslaughter in a 1998 accident that killed Susan Gutweiler. In that case, Little's blood alcohol level was nearly twice the legal limit.
In addition to Monday's charges, Little again could face another lengthy suspension from the NFL.
"Our only comment will be it will be reviewed under terms of the substance abuse policy," league spokesman Greg Aiello said Monday, before the charges were filed. "We have to wait until it works its way through the courts and there's a resolution, but players are accountable."
The NFL's guideline for a drunk-driving conviction is a fine of half a regular-season game check up to $20,000 absent aggravating circumstances. Subsequent violations result in increased discipline as determined by the commissioner, Aiello said.
Bob Wallace — the Rams' executive vice president and general counsel — called Little's latest legal troubles "an unfortunate situation that we're gathering information on."
"Obviously, this is a very unfortunate situation," Wallace told reporters. "Other than that, it's probably inappropriate for us to comment anything further while it's in the legal system."
All of which is to say I agree with you completely - "Players are accountable", it's a "substance abuse" issue, and an "unfortunate situation"??? And oh, yeah - apparently the judge told him in this second case that he wasn't allowed to drink any alcohol for six months.
I'm sure the Gutweiler family finds all that immensely comforting.
It's nice to know 'No jo ban-jo, nj' can pronounce with absolute certainty that a person who once abused animals (not people) cannot change and cannot be forgiven.
I think he's just against any positive thing the President does--like reaching out to the Eagles to congratulate them for giving Vick at least the chance at redemption.
As Shakespeare wrote--none of us would see heaven without mercy.
You've got NJNB's number, Fancy... If the caller had been Boehner, Cheney or a Bush, you can bet she would be singing perfect harmony with them... I usually skip her posts - they're all the same.
GOP = Great, perfect, awesome, etc... DEM = Evil, Really EVIL
Fancy That
It's nice to know 'No jo ban-jo, nj' can pronounce with absolute certainty that a person who once abused animals (not people) cannot change and cannot be forgiven.
Fancy That,
'No jo ban-jo, nj' believe it or not is a she. You and Lyn, KCMO have her number. Will she forgive Georgie Boy and Cheney for all the humans and animals they killed in Iraq?
I doubt if the Lady Saw that.
Wrong again.
See, i am not a liberal. They are the only people who can forgive ANYTHING! Provided the person has a 'D' after hisser her name.
Rational discussion with No Joe is impossible nearly all of the time; the world according to her is black and white, never gray and it has nothing to do with being a conservative or a liberal. Unfortunately, everything is not black or white but many shades of gray. The subject of Michael Vick has nothing to do with politics It never occurs to the No Joe's of the world that perhaps if every person who has done a crime and served their time were given a second chance by people and employers, there would be fewer returned to jails and prison. Every taxpayer foots the bill for the failures so why not try a hand up. There is an employer in the Quad Cities who does give people a second chance--some fail but many succeed. The point the naysayers here miss is simple, it is what the person does with that second chance that matters--they succeed or fail, it is their choice but in order to do either, the opportunity must be there.
Beverly in Chicago.
Your post #10.2 is sad.
I actually thought you would be able to see past politics in this instance and admit and condemn how wrong this is irregardless of Obama and his comments. Guess I asked too much. Apparently in your household politics transcends EVERYTHING else no matter how cruel or vile. Using political affiliations to defend this is about as low as it gets. And "yes" you did.
Speaks volumes about what kind of person you are.
Just food for thought
Researchers, as well as the FBI and other law enforcement agencies nationwide, have linked animal cruelty to domestic violence, child abuse, serial killings, and to the recent rash of killings by school-age children, according to Dr. Randall Lockwood, vice president of Training Initiatives for The Humane Society of the United States (HSUS).
It is no secret to us in this age of enlightenment that the likes of Jeffrey Dahmer, Ted Bundy, and David Berkowitz all delighted in torturing animals before moving on to human prey. Sadly, many adult serial killers may have also suffered abuse as children. In a study of 57 families being treated for incidents of child abuse, 88% also abused animals. In two-thirds of the cases, it was the abusive parent who had killed or injured the animals to control a child. In one-third, the children had abused the animals, using them as scapegoats for their anger. (Quoted from The American Humane Association)
Many researchers have found that a history of animal violence indicates a high propensity for interpersonal violence. Simply, those who abuse animals usually move on to human victims. Although not all animal abusers become serial killer, most serial killers began their killing spree with animals. The difference is that those who do not learn that it is cruel and wrong. In any case, repeated and extreme violence indicates a serious psychologcial violence that requires immediate treatment.
God didn't send Vick to the bottom. His greed and behavior did.
He can throw as many footballs as the league and paying customers allow him. But he should never, ever be allowed to have in his possession another dog as long as he lives.
i thank he does need a chance hell they hang negros for years they are far better than a dog maybe some of vick kind
and still today no one have been charged
Note: Yahoo will not post this!
Obama, this ass-hole you're praising doesn't deserve to play professional sports, he is not a roll-model, and this is just a slap in the face for all NFL fans. Your comments do not surprise me, it is obvious you and your supporters are working hard at keeping segregation alive in this country; your actions Mr. Obama will ensure you're a one term president. Have fun idiot. Hide the hound Vicks in town!
Pat.................. very good
Some of you say forgive!
Some of you say he did his time!!
I say the man is a potential threat to all animals and should be monitored for the rest of his life. This man has blood on his hands and cannot be trusted, he should not and I repeat should not be allowed to play professional sports. Do you want your kids looking up to him?
I'm sure most of the people bad mouthing Vick were not Eagles fans to begin with.
So Vick gets a second chance, but the dogs he led to slaughter did not. Sports fans will cheer any murderer, rapist, or thug who can help their team win a silly game. It is a sad reflection of our society that scum like Vick will be paid far more than our firefighters, police officers or teachers because he can run fast and throw a ball far. Obama fumbled on this play. He would have better served our country had he asked our citizens to redirect half of what they normally spend on the NFL and apply it toward our pathetic education system. Maybe then our kids might have a chance of learning what Michael Vick couldn't figure out- the difference between right and wrong.
The man did his time. Let it go. What he did is terrible. He has to live with that. There is almost nothing sadder than a human who will abuse a dog or cat or pony. You are ready to crucify Vick for an act which is going on all around you each and every day. Our friends and foes around the globe eat dogs and cats. And they are not butchered with compassion. In their culture, the beaten dog is of better taste.
Vick has paid a price. If you aren't saving animals the same fate all around the world, practice forgiveness, we all share the blame.
SCREW VICK!!!
This is just Osama trying to look good for what he thinks are his people for votes ................ you know its true but are to scared to say it .
Funny, you people over at FAUX "NEWS" were determined to call bin Laden USAMA, for years while everyone else in media called him OSAMA (CIA code name Tim OSMAN ). Then Barack Obama rises to prominence in the Democratic Party and FAUX changes their mind about the pronunciation of USAMA.
If Vick was white Obama wouldn't have opened his mouth.
There you have it folks... the RACE card!
I have to admit... I'm amazed they don't even attempt to diguise it! Subtle is not their strong suit!
and If Obama was a Republican Feisty would be screaming about how he was condoning cruelty to animals.
I have to admit... she doesn't even try to disguise her willingness to overlook ANYTHING, even animal cruelty, if a Democrats says it's alright. Hypocrisy is her strong suit!
I'm learning so much about the liberal "regulars" on here today. They really are not very nice people after all. Not if they can overlook this.
If Obama were a Republican,?, he never would have made the call to applaud the installation plans for alternative energy sources and Vick never would have come up.
If Vick was white, he wouldn't have gone to jail...
If Vick were white,?, he'd be an assistant manager at Wal Mart.
Good one Paul...lol
Well...if he were white with the same skillset....lol
Ah........there-in lies the question. Would he have ever had anything to do with dog"fighting" if his friends had also been white, or less ghetto? That is where we are going with this, right?
Not really... let just take the situation as it is, except change Vick into a white person.
Do you think the nation would have felt the same outrage? Do you think the story would have gotten the same coverage. Do you think more of the blame would have gone to the others involved and not Vick himself? I personally think that his friends would have taken the brunt and Vick would have received a slap on the wrist. Not a 2 year stay in prison.
As much as lots of people hate to admit it...there is still racism in this country and you can find it happening everyday.
Which scenario is better - (1) Vick rotting in jail at taxpayer expense, or (2) Vick earning a living, paying taxes, and donating substantial time and money toward the humane treatment of animals?
2 is better - but not in the NFL.
Option 1 is not an option because he served his time.
Bingo:
Taxpayer, productive citizen beats rotting in jail or becoming another statistic anytime!
As has been, noted if we are still trading partners with Asia then the hyprocisy meter is off the chart on this thread! Other cultures kill and eat dogs and cats on a regular basis. So just because we in the West find it repulsive and offensive does not mean it is the worst thing ever!
Michael Vick offended our sensibilities and he has paid the price for that.
God has so noted this offense and by God's Grace Vick can move on.
I am an Eagles fan. Lived in Philly my whole life. I believe that Vick did his time according to the law of the land. However, I don't like that the NFL allowed him back in. The NFL has a history of allowing players convicted of crimes to return to the game and I think it is wrong. These guys had their chance at living a lavish life and screwed up. His "second chance" should be to return to society and become a better person, not to be welcomed back into the NFL with open arms, all is forgiven and here's millions of dollars to live a lavish life again.
Plus, of all the teams to welcome him back, it had to be my Eagles.
Dave. Rotting in jail has a nice ring to it. If Bush had come out and said that Vick should get a second chance, you libs would have wanted him impeached or worse. Animal cruelty is terrible, no matter who does it.
Just so you know - I'm mostly libertarian, not liberal or conservative (though I'm not even strictly libertarian - mostly I'm just dave-973).
Vick getting a second chance, he got a second chance because he's wealthy and connected, I would venture a guess most commoners would not receive that same "chance", in a society where nothing matters except wealth only the wealthy matter.
Vick is getting a second chance because he is TALENTED - not because he's wealthy. He's arguably one of the best two quarterbacks in the league. If one of the top two brain surgeons in the country committed a crime not related to his or her medical practice, would we say that they couldn't do brain surgery upon their release?
Everyone who is released from jail has the chance to do something with their life - a second chance. If they have talent and skills their outlook is much better than for those who have neither, which is too often the case.
Also, I'm not wealthy, but I like to think that I do matter.