'Don't Ask' repeal -- what next?

From Jim Miklaszewski
Opponents of the "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" policy are celebrating today's Senate vote to dismantle the ban on gays and lesbians serving openly in the military, but the actual repeal of the law could take up to a year to go into full effect.

In its present form, the bill states that repeal will not take effect until 60 days after Defense Secretary Robert Gates, Joint Chiefs Chairman Adm. Mike Mullen and President Barack Obama "certify" that the U.S. military is prepared for implementation.

Secretary Gates has predicted that the process of certification could take up to a year.

So what happens next?

Under the expected procedure, the Defense Department will conduct servicewide training and education for all active duty, reserve and national guard forces, and make whatever adjustments in procedures and facilities are necessary. Only then would Gates and Mullen certify the military is prepared to implement the repeal.

During that process, the Undersecretary of Defense for Personnel would also issue a servicewide memo instructing any gay or lesbian servicemembers not to openly declare their sexual orientation because they could potentially be subject to separation from the military.

The reality is, however, that under the more stringent guidelines for enforcement of the law implemented in October, there have been no servicemembers discharged from the military. So it would be unlikely that anyone would be forced out of the military during the certification process.

Msnbc.com's Carrie Dann contributed.

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For those who want to let the rank and file service members vote, why not let them vote on moving out to engage the enemy? Think that would work? Or why not vote on whether you want a new commanding officer. Just doesn't work in the military. I was there and served four years. Never got to vote on a thing.

  • 3 votes
Reply#28 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 1:57 PM EST

Just relax folks, the UCMJ is well versed in dealing with anyone who violates another human being.

I will admit any service member that feels they cannot serve with openly Gay personnel should be granted an Honorable Discharge with full benefits.

Anything else is just another form of discrimination. Anyone against this is just as bigoted as anyone against the repeal of DADT.

  • 3 votes
Reply#29 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:00 PM EST

How about letting people out who don't want to serve with women? Or Jews? If they don't want to serve with Muslims, let them out. How about short people? People who smile too widely?

  • 3 votes
#29.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:14 PM EST

I wouldn't want to serve with people named "Fred". Get me out!

  • 2 votes
#29.2 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:15 PM EST

Soylent Grin

How about letting people out who don't want to serve with women? Or Jews? If they don't want to serve with Muslims, let them out. How about short people? People who smile too widely?

Moot points, women and as you put it Jews are nnot in this mix. Sexual Orientation is the subject here. Once DADT is repealed it a new ball game.

Those that do not want to play should be allowed to leave. After all people joined the Military knowing openly Gay people were not allowed to serve. Now that is changing so why not accommodate the few that decide they want to leave.

Or is it that Gays are demanding and forcing all people to accept them, Fat chance I am of mixed race and I am keenly aware that all people will not accept me.

  • 2 votes
#29.3 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:32 PM EST

Well, everyone should have to "sign up" again, and sign a new contract. If they don't want to do, see ya later-gator. They can put in their two weeks just like anyone else. It's a job, and any job should be EOE.

    #29.4 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 4:03 PM EST

    So Milo...

    If a person doesnt want to serve with a person of mixed race (what you say you are) should they be allowed to just leave their military commitment?

    I just think it is so funny that a person who experiences discrimination is willing to turn around and do the same thing to another group.

      #29.5 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 10:41 PM EST

      sreeeeminglib
      Serving with an openly Gay person is different than quartering with them. Serving is not the problem.

      • 1 vote
      #29.6 - Sun Dec 19, 2010 12:03 PM EST

      Milo, it must be tough to be consistently on the wrong side of civil rights, and on the wrong side of history. My sympathies to you.

        #29.7 - Sun Dec 19, 2010 3:36 PM EST

        skrekk Milo, it must be tough to be consistently on the wrong side of civil rights, and on the wrong side of history. My sympathies to you.

        Since when is it a civil right of homosexuals to force heterosexual males to quarter with Homosexuals. Again working along side Gays is one thing, sleeping and showering with them is totally different. All will have to acept working with Homosexuals, they do not have to socialize or quarter with them. What is it that you don't get about Heterosexual rights?

        • 1 vote
        #29.8 - Tue Dec 21, 2010 7:40 AM EST

        Milo-2 Since when is it a civil right of homosexuals to force heterosexual males to quarter with Homosexuals.

        The bigots 60 years ago were also upset that blacks and whites would shower together and share living quarters.

        FYI Milo, gays currently quarter with straights. DADT repeal doesn't change that.

          #29.9 - Thu Dec 23, 2010 1:44 AM EST
          Reply

          I am happy that gays will finally be allowed to serve the armed forces. For many people believing that gays will create a breakdown in unit cohesion, I am still trying to see the logic on that one.

          There are many gay people in the military who are professional in character and demeanor and do a heck of a great job in serving our wonderful nation. You just never hear about them because they are forced to abide by the Don't Ask, Don't Tell act. This act has booted 14,000 professional gay military members from the Armed Forces, and for what?

          The Don't Ask, Don't Tell act was just another Salem Witch hunt event; gay military members could be minding their own business and still get ratted out by fellow co-workers. If there was evidence that the gay military member was found to be homosexual, off with his or her head.

          We have to put a stop to the discrimination and learn to love one another. Gay people have feelings as well as their heterosexual counterparts; they hurt, bleed, and love just the same.

          There is a famous quote by Sergeant Leonard Matlovich, who proudly served in the Air Force. On his tombstone were the poignant words:

          WHEN I WAS IN THE MILITARY THEY GAVE ME A MEDAL FOR KILLING TWO MEN AND A DISCHARGE FOR LOVING ONE

          • 4 votes
          Reply#30 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:03 PM EST
          Comment author avatarRichard-337771Expand Comment Comment collapsed by the community

          What a friggin idiot, your using a quote by a fag that died from aids.

          • 1 vote
          #30.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:08 PM EST

          Keep it classy, Dick.

          • 2 votes
          #30.2 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:09 PM EST

          WHEN I WAS IN THE MILITARY THEY GAVE ME A MEDAL FOR KILLING TWO MEN AND A DISCHARGE FOR LOVING ONE

          Floridaguy32 - Thank you for sharing that poignet quote! No truer words have been spoken... would you mind if I borrowed it in the future?

          Richard337771 - And thank you for PROVING that your a homophobe & reading COMPREHENSION is not your strong suit!

          • 3 votes
          #30.3 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:12 PM EST

          ouch, Feisty Redhead .....maybe before you start calling people homophobe's and telling them they have a reading comprehension problem you might want to brush up on the difference and use of the words YOUR and YOU'RE so you can use the correctly.

            #30.4 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 10:02 PM EST

            For RICHARD and his ilk...thats about as classy as they can be.

            • 1 vote
            #30.5 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 10:45 PM EST

            ouch, Feisty Redhead .....maybe before you start calling people homophobe's and telling them they have a reading comprehension problem you might want to brush up on the difference and use of the words YOUR and YOU'RE so you can use the correctly.

            HA HA HA!!! Straight out of the right winger playbook... can't dispute the fact SO.. pivot to a spelling or grammar error!

            Find some new material will ya... that's one of the oldest tricks in the book! lmao

            PS: sreeeminglib - Thanks for the kind words earlier! ;0)

              #30.6 - Sun Dec 19, 2010 12:46 PM EST

              Straight out of the right winger playbook...: And exactly what is the authors name? Where can this “play book” be purchased?

              “…can't dispute the fact”I believe I did. You used the word your in place of the word you’re. That is the fact I pointed out. You also accused the other person of having a reading comprehension problem. If you will notice I left the word, “word” out of my post and you did not even notice it, so it could also be said that you have a reading comprehension problem also. And just so you know I said nothing about spelling.

              And thank you for PROVING that your a homophobe & reading COMPREHENSION is not your strong suit!” And which one of your play books does this statement/trick come from? The “Gays Insults to Straights Agenda 101”? Reminds me of the old saying, "Do as I say, not as I do".

                #30.7 - Mon Dec 20, 2010 9:54 PM EST

                LoneRangerTroll is Trolling...

                  #30.8 - Tue Dec 21, 2010 11:30 PM EST
                  Reply

                  This is history being made. How many times will John McCain find himself on the wrong side of the issues. Just as he was with the Civil Right Bill, that he voted against and years later he came back to apologize for his wrong when he was searching for votes while he ran for President of the United States.

                  • 3 votes
                  Reply#31 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:09 PM EST

                  Life or death. What's your preference? A Gay who stands and fight or a Straight who runs and hide?

                  • 2 votes
                  Reply#32 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:23 PM EST

                  My vote goes to the guy who does his job and I don't give a crap about his sexuality.

                  • 4 votes
                  #32.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:24 PM EST
                  Reply

                  Those that don't learn from history are bound to repeat it. We're gradually forgetting the lessons of war and reducing our military capacity. The senate again put special interest groups over the military.

                    Reply#33 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:25 PM EST

                    "The day that the leadership of the military comes to me and says, 'Senator, we ought to change the policy,' then I think we ought to consider seriously changing it." - Senator John McCain, October 2006

                    Well, earlier this year Admiral Mullen and Secretary Gates told Senator McCain that we ought to change the policy. I guess the old man's hearing aid wasn't working very well that day.

                    • 2 votes
                    Reply#34 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:25 PM EST

                    I'm a vet. I served in Iraq. I support the repeal. EO policies will remain in effect and sexual harrassment will not be tolerated. End of story.

                    No one asked the racists for permission to allow blacks to serve, therefore I'm really not concerned about the paranoid rantings of the homophobes. Get over it. American service members have more important things to worry about.

                    • 6 votes
                    Reply#35 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:26 PM EST

                    ...and "Thank You" for serving, Kate!

                    • 3 votes
                    #35.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:27 PM EST
                    Reply

                    its gonna take a year to order pink rifles and uniforms. new general star is gonna be a friggin tulip. democrats managed to even f-up the military god help us please. dont forget the special liveing quarters for the military partners whoo hoo maybe barney frank will join now....................................................... wake up col klink thats not your wife rubbing your junk.......................................

                    • 3 votes
                    Reply#36 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:30 PM EST

                    I would rather not know if you are gay or not, this is just going to lead the need of a gay barrick or lesbian barrick because I dont want you in MY barrick if you are gay, I don't care if I am not "your type" they don't house men and women together why should I have to share a barrick with a gay. Also I have no problems with you being gay I have several friends that are gay but I still wouldn't share a room with them.

                    • 2 votes
                    Reply#37 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:32 PM EST

                    If you have no problems with someone who is gay then it really shouldn't matter if they are in the same barracks with you, now, should it?

                    Oh, and to answer your question...why should you have to share barracks with them? Because you are ordered to.

                    • 3 votes
                    #37.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:39 PM EST

                    Come on and get serious. How long have women served in the military? You think maybe any of them were/are gay? Has there been a need to desegregate?

                    People have to face the facts of life, some are born different.

                    My youngest sister, now a happy 53 year old, come out to myself and one other sister a couple of years ago. We both told her the same thing. We always suspected, we don't care, we love you and know that you are the same person you have always been

                    • 4 votes
                    #37.2 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:43 PM EST
                    Reply

                    As a servicemember currently serving overseas I request that people do no speak for me. We can do that on our own just fine, thank you. In fact, we have been asked our opinion and we have spoken. Each and every servicemember has been given the opportunity to voice his or her opinions. Guess what? 2/3 of us didn't even bother to voice our opinions. Does that tell you how much we care? Despite being bombarded for months in the inboxes of our .mil email addresses, only 1/3 of servicemembers cared enough to have their voice heard. Of those, only a third said that unit morale and safety would be affected negatively. I'd say that is pretty indicative of our stance on the issue. We grew up with it and don't find homosexuality offensive.

                    There have been and always will be homosexuals serving in the military. The repeal of Don't Ask Don't Tell doesn't purport to give anyone the right to have sex with a member of the same sex in the barracks, nor does it give anyone the right to sexually harrass a fellow servicemember. These are discipline issues which I assure you the military is very adept at handling. I guarantee that no one is going to start make unwanted passes at you in the shower once the repeal is "certified." And yes, you will shower with gays, just like you've always done. But the minute someone invades your personal space or makes a comment you don't like, it will be reported to the chain of command as an act of sexual harassment or sexual assault.

                    Further, anyone who believes that our professional Soldiers, Sailors, Airmen, and Marines are going to all of a sudden become these hedonistic Sodomites, take a look at how well women are integrated into the military. In the current era of conflict and for the foreseeable future, there are no "front lines" filled with grunts. What we have is a dynamic battlefield where female civil affairs operators with an expertise in agriculture are teaching Afghan villagers the principles of crop rotation while a Marine platoon pulls security on the perimeter. Is she accosted and treated as a sex object by the straight males? No. I can assure you that if you are not gay yourself, you will not all of a sudden be accosted by swarms of lecherous homosexuals just as our peers in the civilian world are not subjected to such treatment.

                    As for religious objectors, no you will not be given free rein to leave because you object to serving alongside other Americans, just as other bigots are not allowed to quit because they are forced to serve alongside Muslims, or Wiccans or Hispanics. As long as they don't infringe upon your individual liberties, you will be forced to serve alongside them, eat in the same dining facilities, and bunk right next to them.

                    GEN Amos ought to take a look at the history of the Battle of the Bulge where thousands of whites and blacks served together in integrated units on the front lines. Military leaders expediently plussed up segregated units with black Soldiers as casualties mounted. There were no sensing sessions or panels convened to assess how we could integrate. It was just done and Soldiers of all colors did a fine job because they had a job to do. The Marine commandant wants to wait until we are no longer at war to do this integration because he doesn't want to "stress the troops." I would argue that this is the best time to do it because we are singly focused on the mission right now and a speedy and successful integration will show just how progressive the military is.

                    Truman's statement before the NAACP in 1947 as we sought to integrate African Americans into the military was as relevant then as it is today: “It is my deep conviction that we have reached a turning point in the long history of our efforts to guarantee a freedom and equality to all our citizens, and when I say all Americans -- I mean all Americans.”

                    • 6 votes
                    Reply#38 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:34 PM EST

                    You are obviously not a Marine.

                      #38.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 5:16 PM EST

                      NJ

                      Your comments are truly inspiring. Very well said. Thank you so much for your service.

                      • 1 vote
                      #38.2 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 9:50 PM EST
                      Reply

                      As far as I know it has not passed yet, so aren't some of you counting your chickens a little early.

                        Reply#39 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:51 PM EST

                        Chickens have hatched setter! How come you have commented (numerous times) on every DADT thread on this site? Is big bad marine really that much of a homophobe? If you ever read you would know that gays have been involved in national defense in many countries since the beginning of civilized time. How it matters that it is known or not hardly seems to matter...except to prejudiced bastards like you. Why can't you live and let live? I'm awaiting my lesson on setter morality...and to be called a homo.

                        • 1 vote
                        #39.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 5:52 PM EST
                        Reply

                        Great..now we get a bunch of peter puffers in uniform. How do they stand at position of attention with a limp wrist? So glad I am not in anymore. Can't imagine having to sit next to thwwet little ole thteve in the offith.

                          Reply#40 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 2:55 PM EST

                          What, you afraid one would probably beat your ass...pun intended!

                          • 1 vote
                          #40.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 5:59 PM EST

                          not sure it is his ass that worries him.... pun intended id say your a little belowaveragejoe pun also intended.

                            #40.2 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 6:36 PM EST

                            Like I haven't heard that joke? insult? before. Sore yet, Mr. Joe?

                            • 1 vote
                            #40.3 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 10:10 PM EST
                            Reply

                            Monumental and LONG over due. I am a former U.S. Marine. I served with the elite, 1st Recon, and I served with a gay man. He was intelligent, courageous, committed to serving his country, and as tough as any man I ever served with. He bravely confided his homosexuality to me and I respected him even more for it. I am proud to have served beside him, proud to have been his friend, and glad others like him will in the future not have to cower in corners and deny who they are in order to stand on the front lines to defend the very people who would shun them. Semper Fi!

                            • 6 votes
                            Reply#41 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:01 PM EST

                            Thank you for serving your country.

                            Semper Fi!

                            • 2 votes
                            #41.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 4:15 PM EST
                            Reply

                            To all of you that are saying that this is a sad day for American, that we should
                            let our troops decide what is best, and that this is a victory for gay's rights
                            activist and a defeat for the US military. Well, for all of you take it from a
                            military member, this is a good thing. We often encounter people that are
                            obviously gay, that do the job the same way others would, but they can be
                            kicked out no matter how good they are just because they are gay. Come on, all
                            the money on training wasted because of their sex preference? Give me a break!
                            Also, I don't like the idea of anybody monitoring my sexuality. I am straight
                            but what if I was gay, who gives a @!$%#? But as a straight guy I tell you this
                            is a good thing because now I can avoid gay folks in the showers. To
                            all of you that are eager to say that this is bad for our troops and all that,
                            take it from a soldier: you need to chill and shut up!

                            Also,
                            I hope this is an opportunity to get rid of all the stupid rules in the UCMJ.
                            Did you guys know that oral and anal sex between a man and a woman is
                            considered gay? So if my girl goes down on me that makes me gay? everybody does it and it is supposed to be gay? Then 100% of the US military is gay...

                            • 4 votes
                            Reply#42 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:05 PM EST

                            If they are willing to come home in a coffin why can't we let them out of the closet?

                            • 4 votes
                            Reply#43 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:12 PM EST

                             The Pentagon may have done a poll that supports their position but last I heard, the real soldiers, the combat troops who do the fighting are opposed to repealing DADT.  Don't their voices count or do the cooks and typists count more?  So what's the rush to repeal this during time of war when there is no consensus among our combat troops.  Everything always has to be crammed down our throats.

                              Reply#44 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:12 PM EST

                              Do they get to vote on where and when they get deployed?

                              Do the get to vote on who and how and when they get to shoot?

                              ...or do they follow orders?

                              • 2 votes
                              #44.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:17 PM EST

                              Seems to me if the Pentagon is going to use opinions of cooks and typists to justify their actions, they ought to consider all opinions, especially the combat troops. They will follow orders like good soldiers but it doesn't make it a right decision for the pentagon. It's all political payback to the lefties . . . . the lameduck Congress is going full bore to appease the loons on the left. Can't wait till January.

                                #44.2 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:59 PM EST
                                Reply

                                This is a great day for the United States of America as other form of discrimination is coming to end!!

                                As current polls indicate the public is way ahead of the curve on this one and the Senate finally did the right thing on this issue. Once again John McCain is on the wrong side of history along with the majority of the Republican Senate caucus that only has one priority: "Make sure Barrack Obama is a one term President" that has nothing to do with moving our country forward.

                                • 1 vote
                                Reply#45 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:16 PM EST

                                Wow...it is truly disturbing to read some of these comments and grasp the rank ignorance and fear of gays that it seems so many people still have. Some of you people are really, really sick and in serious need of professional help. Can't handle getting approached by a gay man or woman? Don't know how to deal with it? To the point where you'd get violent? Again...wow. It's you people that are really scary. You're like frightened little children playing at being adults, still afraid of "things that go bump in the night" or something. Don't fool yourselves - you can't even handle your own sexuality, never mind somebody else and theirs. You sound like you're scared to death that you might be gay, or perceived as gay, and be subject to the kind of persecution you're so willing to heap on others. Grow up, or please keep YOUR sick, twisted, paranoid fears to yourselves. Your lack of basic humanity is frightening beyond words. And, ironically, you most likely need not fear any gay person wanting anything to do with you, anyway.

                                • 2 votes
                                Reply#46 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:16 PM EST

                                As a former active duty Marine I can now say with pride that finally my country is practicing the consituional principle of equality for all citizens's by repealing an institutionlized form of bigotry that has no place in the year 2010. Moreover, America can now join the legion of every other modern, industrialized country in the world that recognized long ago that the military is strengthed, not weakened, when it allows all citizen's to serve regardless of their sexual orientation. Not a shred of evidence has ever supported the ill informed perspective that the repeal of "Don't ask, don't tell" would somehow prove harmful. In fact, all over the world the morale of troops and cohesion of units has improved when a doctrine based on equality, not discrimination is put into place.

                                • 2 votes
                                Reply#47 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:22 PM EST

                                So you would like our Military be as weak as the Rest of the Worlds Homo's militarizes....I SEE!! Name just one other Military on this planet that is as powerful as ours.....NONE. So keep the Fags in the closet!!!!!!!!!

                                • 2 votes
                                #47.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:37 PM EST
                                Reply

                                I thought people joined the military to do a J-O-B, not discuss their romance or sex lives, no matter what you are. At least that's the way it should be.

                                But as usual, leave it to homosexuals to go around whining and stomping about what's not fair in their lives. Waah. I'll tell you what's not fair: Having to take up precious congressional time over bullsheite matters when our country is going down the fa@@in' tubes, time that could be used on important issues. HELLO. But then again the lowbrows running the senate wouldn't know what those would be anyway. Don't bother replying to me, I won't be back to read it, assuming it even gets posted.

                                p.s. Merry Christmas!! :)

                                • 1 vote
                                Reply#48 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:23 PM EST

                                If you hate gays is because you are a little homo yourself.

                                • 2 votes
                                Reply#49 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:24 PM EST

                                This has always been an issue of official sanction of homosexuality, and pressure to fulfill a political campaign promise. It has never, ever been about an effective end-state of the Armed Forces. DADT was a political solution, not a DoD regulation or policy. But it worked for seventeen years. It was abused by some. In both directions. Most laws are. If you were gay and joined, and decided you didn't like it, DADT was your get out of jail free card. But it is deep hypocrisy to say now, 'if you don't like the repeal, get out of the Armed Forces'. If you didn't like DADT and you're gay, then why did you join the Armed Forces to start with? The law was clear, but to join voluntarily with you eyes open and then say 'I was stripped of my integrity'. Please. You might as well join, have issues with Basic Training and then demand that Basic Training be changed. Serving is not a 'right', not matter how many times someone uses the phrase. The Armed Forces for good reason discriminate in every direction on who can't join; single parenthood, medical issues, issues with the law, lack of education, height, weight. The list goes on. The 'right' to serve doesn't exist. Gays can join under DADT. No questions about your sexual preference (it was an excluding factor before) and no answers either. But the 'right' to join with your eyes open and then declare abuse and loss of integrity over DADT doesn't exist either.

                                I don't care who is or is not gay, anymore than I care who is or is not exactly six foot tall. Service is about collective performance of duty, not innate personal characteristics. But the set of rights granted to Joe Citizen under the Constitution do not match the rights you can expect to exercise in uniformed service in the Armed Forces. If you think it does, walk out to a unit formation and start talking smack and see what happens, or get on TV in uniform and spout some nonsense. Make sure you claim abridgment of your First Amendment rights while you do. See if that covers you. DADT was never about rights.

                                So now what? Male from female is fairly easy to discern, but DADT is about sexual attraction, not gender. The rules separating the genders in certain situations in the Armed Forces are in place to ensure an effective force, not to ensure effective ability to execute individual personal preferences. If you can't tell who exactly is sexually attracted to whom (or you would rather pretend it does not matter anyway because everyone is on their best behavior to not let sexual attraction fog their command responsibilities or performance of duty, or you simply live in Cloud Cuckoo Land now anyway), then I want you to do two things. First, actually join the military. Most can't, but if you can, do so, and then advance yourself into a position of authority over others. And be personally responsible for effective production of collective results under extreme conditions that are hard to imagine. Not effective execution of individual preferences, rights and feelings (all gay ex-service members about to blog how effective they were and how everyone in their unit knew they were gay, until someone outed them for personal revenge, stop now. Everyone who ever got discharged for any reason has their personal story of prejudice, command bias, abuse and a brilliant career cut short by bigotry and hate when all they ever wanted to do anyway was serve with honor. See? I get it).

                                Second, since sexual attraction does not matter in the scheme of things for those who want to repeal DADT, when mass billeting and showering situations occur while deployed (military service isn't always duty at Camp Swampy, or much like anything you've experienced in civilian life, you just think it is), then I want to shower and sleep with the females. Under your perspective, it should be A-OK. I rpomise to be good. Since we have all decided to live in Cloud Cuckoo Land.

                                PS - I serve, I believe DADT will be repealed, and as always I will execute the lawful orders given me and ensure those under my authority do likewise. But see sentence one; this has never been about rights, fairness, or anything other than political agendas. And using the Armed Forces to advance political agendas, particularly in wartime (and afterwards the Armed Forces will be forgotten and left to muddle through once the agenda has been achieved and the next objective is in sight) is shameful.

                                • 1 vote
                                Reply#50 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:33 PM EST

                                Agreed.

                                Thank you for serving.

                                  #50.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 4:23 PM EST
                                  Reply

                                  I urge everyone to Throw up (Preferably on them)when they see a Fag couple to show the sickness they have.

                                  • 1 vote
                                  Reply#51 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:35 PM EST

                                  Your father had how many millions of sperm?

                                  ...and you were the one that made it?

                                  • 4 votes
                                  #51.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:42 PM EST

                                  Your father had how many millions of sperm?

                                  ...and you were the one that made it?

                                  Thanks da Noid... LMFAO! :0)))

                                  • 3 votes
                                  #51.2 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:56 PM EST

                                  Yeah, I'm probably getting banned for that one but, what the hell, it was worth it.

                                  • 1 vote
                                  #51.3 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:57 PM EST

                                  Right Da Noid, I made it. What if your Daddy was a Homo and another Man swallowed You,or he put you in another mans poop shoot, MMMM You would not be here now trying to change the laws of nature. For the record I do not think anal sex between a man and woman is right either...So deal with that.

                                  • 1 vote
                                  #51.4 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 4:34 PM EST

                                  What if your Daddy was a Homo and another Man swallowed You,or he put you in another mans poop shoot, MMMM You would not be here now trying to change the laws of nature.

                                  If it meant not having to put up with you there are worse things that could happen to me.

                                  • 2 votes
                                  #51.5 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 7:24 PM EST

                                  Da Noid

                                  Yeah, I'm probably getting banned for that one but, what the hell, it was worth it

                                  Sometimes you got to know when to fold them LOL

                                  As for Ron... from what I can see the best part ran down his Daddy's leg... and if his Mama was any kind of a housekeeper... into a Kleenex!

                                  • 2 votes
                                  #51.6 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 9:20 PM EST
                                  Reply

                                  Firstly, if you have never been in the military you shouldn't even be allowed to comment on this thread...

                                  Now...having served in the first Gulf War I can say that I personally am uncomfortable going into the line of fire next to a homosexual man. As combat troops have limited females from their ranks to reduce the distraction level during combat situations I can see that the end of DADT has the potential of creating serious trust issues amongst the troops on the front lines.

                                  Progressives...you can scream and call me names all day long....BUT...What happens when we are taking incoming fire and there I am next to someone who may feel the need to save his boyfriend next to me, at all costs, rather than saving me who is wounded more seriously?? Just like when to consenting heterosexuals are involved there is a deep seated need to save you significant other over all others. How can I trust two fellow men who are romantically involved anymore than I could trust a guy who is singularly focused on saving his wife/girlfriend over me??

                                  You progressives or liberals or whatever you prefer today have a complete lack of ability to think things through to the inevitable bad result. You do what makes you feel good and damn the consequences. As long as it's fair to everyone that's all that matters. But that is not true. It will never be true. Someone always has to get the shorter end of any deal. It is what builds character of self. It is what keeps people striving to improve. It is what makes life worth living. Striving...Struggling....Overcoming adversity...That is what makes a person grow... Not having the playing field leveled for everyone.

                                  If you're gay....how nice for you...now realize that life has dealt you a difficult hand and that you will have to struggle sometimes because of it....is it fair?? I guess not.... But you know what??? Even though I made it through my 4 years in the military as a young man....I was also dealt a crappy hand by life...my family is horribly genetically inclined to being obese...I fought everyday in the military to maintain a lie that I was not a tub of lard....I now have lost the battle with genetics that life dealt me and I weigh 425 punds... Is it fair?? I guess not...but now I have to struggle with the hand life has dealt me....

                                  Get over yourselves libs...Life isn't fair...

                                  DEAL WITH IT!!!!

                                    Reply#52 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:36 PM EST

                                    I always love the mentality that those who have never served are not entitled to an opinion. I'm entitled to my opinion so get over it.

                                    "We follow orders, son. We follow orders or people die. It's that simple." - Col. Nathan R. Jessep, A Few Good Men

                                    Well, if a soldier follows orders then his sexual orientation shouldn't matter, now, should it?

                                    Do you so little faith in the training of our military that you don't believe a homosexual male will be able to carry out his orders in the field?

                                    • 2 votes
                                    #52.1 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 3:56 PM EST

                                    And therein lies the root of the problem of the "progressive" mindset.

                                    You have an opinion.

                                    Or rather you THINK you have an opinion

                                    You have no opinion.

                                    What you have is an irrational, false judgement about something that you have no practical experience dealing with in person. You have decided that you are sooooo smart that you have the solution to a problem that you simply mulled over one day in a marijuana smoke cloud with your unemployed, artsy friends. You fired up that one last remaining brain cell and, by golly, figured out all the answers that will fix everything. Because you and you alone are so well connected to the Grand Cosmic Plan that the answers dropped out of the ethos and fell right out of your mouth. And since that day you have probably continued to spout your incredibly insightful revelations for all who would stand still long enough to listen.

                                    Good job.

                                    I bet you're a real fun date.

                                    To answer you question...Emotion has no place on the battlefield. Just as I would not trust 75% of women due to their ever evolving monthly emotional state I would not trust 75% of homosexuals to be able to protect in battle.

                                    However, now that you've opened this pandora's box...I have to say I've known some really brawny bull dykes that I would gladly serve shoulder to shoulder pads with!! (LOL...Sorry...but you brought that one on yourself!! LOL)

                                    And by the way...if you want to show some more of your incredible knowledge and quote from the film industry, of all things, perhaps the most fitting quote would be from the same movie:

                                    "You want the truth? You want the truth? You can't handle the TRUTH" - Col. Nathan R. Jessep, A Few Good Men

                                      #52.2 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 9:02 PM EST

                                      No, I have an opinion and my opinion is this...

                                      Did I serve? No.

                                      ...and because I did not serve I will not say to the man or woman who makes the choice to volunteer to serve in our Armed Forces, "No, you can not!"

                                      • 3 votes
                                      #52.3 - Sat Dec 18, 2010 9:20 PM EST
                                      Reply
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