Lame Duck Congress—I Don't Think So:

Even though we have a lame duck Congress, there are a lot of Conservative quotes that are worth repeating. Here are some examples:
Representative Rohrabacher (R-CA): "White people will 'lose our freedom' if the Dream Act passes". Someone needs to tell Rohrabacher that regardless of the outcome of the Dream Act vote, the demographics are changing—and not to his liking.
Soon-to-be Speaker of the House Boehner: "I reject the word compromise." John, how do you resolve differences of opinion?
Wisconsin Tea Party Governor-Elect Walker compels businesses to leave his state after he kills high-speed rail train from Milwaukee to Madison, Wisconsin. That is a loss of 1.2 billion dollars. He apparently wants Wisconsin to remain agricultural with dairy farms and cheese.
Newly-elected Representative Alan West: "We should be censoring the American news agencies which enable Wikileaks." Guess he never heard the phrase, "Freedom of the Press"
Senator John Kyl (R-AZ) demands a Christmas vacation. John, if you feel so strong about it. Go Home!

Among all this nonsense is a real story: Evidently the Tea Party is furious with GOP leaders as the T.P. is having a tantrum over the tax cut deal. They are complaining, not because it increases the deficit, but because the GOP leadership negotiated with the President. It is obvious from their perspective that the only course of action when governing is to continue to vote NO on all legislation.

The influence of the Tea Party should be noted. Romney, a Republican moderate, immediately pivoted to the right to be lock-step in line with the Tea Party. Good ol' Mike Pence (R-IN) broke ranks with Boehner by opposing the bill. His reason for the change in attitude is that the Bush tax cuts were not permanent. Message has to be, if you are a Republican and want to remain in office: Don't argue with our base. The Tea Party is in control.

Now approximately 60% of Americans approved the tax deal, so clearly the Tea Partiers are in the minority with respect to the overall population. But they are a large enough group to influence Republican thinking. Boehner should be careful what he wished for. Speaker of the House could be his worst hang-over.

US Navy Disabled Veteran - Retired

I could not have said it better.

You have a safe and Merry Christmas too I will remember our troops who are putting their lives on the line every day to keep this great nation safe;especially my son. sharing his quote. I don't mind taking a bullet so you can be free Mom.

But, what have these whiny Gop/Tea baggers done to merit not wanting to work after Christmas their people except purchasing debts from China and shameful scorn from the world?

The president will sign a $858 billion tax cuts package, including a two-year extension on all of the Bush-era Tax Cuts, a 13-month extension for unemployment insurance benefits, and approval of the controversial estate tax break that gives 6600 families a break worth $23 billion.

Agreeing with the glass half full rhetoric will of the aforementioned not only will bring about a horrendous blast-from-the-past but also A Tale of Two Cities. It will be the haves and have nots; thanks to power of greed, betrayal and obscene amounts of money used to blast the air waves and print media used to confuse, scare, and create anger at this President; Whatever the rhetorical difference, It’s now about the past vs. the future the religious conservatives, the media; particularly FOX NOISE that want to blast us back to the past. Every action taken in life bears consequences. Unlike in 1995, when our economic outlook was good, we are currently fighting our way out of the Great Recession and coming off of the worst financial crisis since the 1930s. The consequences of refusing to raise the debt ceiling would be even more costly today, given the precarious state of the U.S. economy and global financial markets, and potentially could be disastrous. Unlike in 1995, when our economic outlook was good, we are currently fighting our way out of the Great Recession and coming off of the worst financial crisis since the 1930. Especially, exploding the deficit to lavish tax cuts on the wealthiest two percent of Americans, suggesting where the GOP/TEA BAGGERS true priorities lie. “The Big Freeze” in 1995, the entire ordeal “cost the American taxpayer over $800 million and rattled the confidence of international investors in U.S. government bonds.”

http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/2010/10/big_freeze.html

Can Obama fight the progressive left, numbers of lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgenders, the rightist Democrats, independents and Republican( Neanderthals) swindle game?. I find it ironic that President Obama, won presidency despite being accused of being Marxist, Socialist, clandestine Muslim Terrorist, Alien, Empty Suit, Narcissist, Racist, Messiah, Global corporatist, Dumb, Inexperienced, etc. President Obama won without rigging votes, killing any oppositions and most important of all with a compliant spirit to do the deserving will of his coalition. . President Obama got disinterested and disenfranchised Americans involved in his campaign Now, progressives, numbers of lesbian, gay, bisexual, transgenders, the rightist Democrats, Independents, and Republican the same ones who voted for him want to portray him as self-effacing without acknowledging neither his accomplishments nor the time frame; 2 YRS. In addition to the obstruction coming from these same people and; of course, the media’s chasing Fox News lies which doing nothing more than mock, distort and attack President Obama; everthing seems overblown. No wonder these ex-so called coalitions are in denials. Someone should let those in denial know ostensibly it could be worst and will get worse if this keeps up.

Have you no thought about the real problem? The weak kneed rightist Democrats and the stall and delay two-faced GOP/Tea Party in Congress actions? The Omnibus bill had to be pulled due the hostage taking of

But who should we hold accountable for this self-effacing? The big corporate donors and his advisors, the enormous Bush II debt, Democrats in fighting, half wit, half term governor Sarah Palin’s criticisms (especially her latest slam to congressional Republicans for accepting a “lousy deal” to stop taxes from rising for all income levels next year), bullying from over zealous religious conservatives over DADT , extra tax cuts for the wealthiest Americans, the unemployed parents of hungry children, innocent children who benefit from the DREAM Act? .

Do American people need a "spoon full of sugar;" instead of a completely changed diet consisting of systemic change that does not serve the interests of corporations and their military partners. the Republicans and a little slower. centrist Democrats poverty, corruption, and diseases that.The International Chamber of Commerce, Wall Street, 2 unnecessary Wars, Fox News . If you yes you can bet your bottom dollar you are correct

http://www.americanprogress.org/issues/2010/10/big_freeze.html

All of the shining hope appears to be fading let the media tell it. What should Americans say now instead of Dear President Obama, I Quit You? I say give the President a change since it usually takes a President 2 terms to complete his goals.

Ron;

Way to end the week. I agree in that if we think the republicans are going to changetheir agenda of "Obstructionism" any time soon we are sadly mistaken. It should be interesting to see what happens now with DADT, Dream Act and START. The republicans got the tax cuts for the richest 2% and the estate tax cut that they wanted. Lets see if they hold up their end of the bargain now.

Good Morning Navy, Beverly and Feisty.

Great way to end the week. Excellent posts. Navy, thanks for allowing me to tag along.

Feisty: We received ours also. Great picture of the WH.

Fantastic posts to close the week, all. Real food for thought there.

I can't wait to see what the NEVER compromise, shut down the government, war on the middle class crowd produces in the House starting in January. That crank in the office who never ran anything but knows everything the boss does is wrong will show us all what he's really made of. It won't be pretty.

Excellent posts to end the week. The next two years will be nothing but gridlock but I think a lot of that will be between the GOP and its TP members. McConnell already had to cave on the spending bill because of ear marks many placed there by republicans. Except that it will hurt the country, it will be interesting to watch.

Ron Paul sometimes makes sense but his comments about shutting down government prove that pure ideology runs counter to logic and common sense reason; there would be a very real impact, no paychecks for the troops, no social security checks, nothing and this country would grind to a halt. I sometimes agree with a few things Paul says but on most issues, he is just wrong. Pure ideology cannot function or survive--things are not just black or white, they are many shades of gray.

Palin calls tax deal "lousy", would she declare it such if it was done with a republican president? Of course not, she'd be tweeting what a good deal it is for "real" Americans. Hypocrisy rules again.

Gingrich sent The Lodge an invitation last year to donate $5,000 and receive a plaque; he rescinded the award and returned the money when discovering The Lodge is a male only club for dining and entertainment claiming it was a mistake. Gingrich has been given a life-time membership card. This year, Gingrich again sent The Lodge an offer for them to donate $5,000 and receive a plaque. Once could be a mistake, twice is just being greedy and stupid at the same time.

Senator DeMint voices the purpose of the GOP, stall, stall, and stall again--anything to slow this ? down; read the bill word for word. If democrats were doing this on important issues like the spending bill and the START treaty, the right would be screaming bloody murder. There's a simple fix for DeMinted thinking, let the Senator demanding the reading of a bill word for word do the reading of the bill word for word, nonstop, 5 minute bathroom breaks only.

Bev;

Thank you and send my best to your son. He and all the others are what this is all about. God Bless them all and hope they are safe.

Feisty: We received ours also. Great picture of the WH.

Good morning to you as well Ron,

Very elegant if you ask me! Bo's paw print brought a laugh!

That's the only card that doesn't get hung with the rest, instead it's proudly displayed on the fireplace mantel ;0)

Bev: Ditto Navy's sentiments...

Let's also see what they do about the 9/11 Zadroga bill....It's amazing how the republicans run on patriotism but when it's time to help those that rushed to Ground Zero it's not their responsibility...and as some one else mentioned a while back where is the support from Rudy "9/11" Giuliani? another lame excuse for a republican preaching how they are more for the US than anyone else....

And oh - I bet if the goventment does shut down - the congress will still get theirs but forget about everyone else!

If the republicans were trying to pass two and three thousand page bills that no one had read, I would be as upset as I am with democrats doing it.

What the heck is wrong with reading a bill? Do you sign contracts you have not read? I sure don't.

Democrats could have brought these bills to the floor any time this year. They did not because they did not want that record following them into the mid terms. Their logic was sound- they would have lost even MORE seats had they passed a budget, raised taxes, or passed the DREAM act as written- never mind passing the START treaty, and running the risk that we would have to dismantle our missile defense system, should the Russians prove correct in their assessment of the preamble.

There is a new congress on their way in the door. All of these issues the democrats kicked down the road will be dealt with by the new congress. That you will not like the outcome is irrelevant. The electorate made a choice, and it chose to replace the liberal agenda with one that is more reflective of their priorities.

Good day to all. Interesting thread. I'm here mostly to post a note about the tax cut extension bill. Like others, I have mixed feelings but decided that the President exercised leadership in addressing this compromise.

This bill continues a long process of redistributing wealth through the tax process - from the middle- and lower-income brackets to the upper. The estate tax provisions ensure that that transferred wealth will remain in the hands of the wealthy for at least another generation.

This is part of the "class warfare" that has been waged against America's declining middle class since the Reagan Regime. Fortunately, the bill is a two-year package and there's hope for reversing the more onerous of its elements in the future. President Obama, recognizing the desire of the American voters that all parties work together to accomplish something, brokered the arrangement and the people will remember that.

At the level of estate taxes involved now, often very little is ever paid to the government from the estates. Between insurance taken out expressly to address estate taxes, sheltered trusts, charitable gifts, and numerous other devices, the wealthy rarely are hit by large tax bills, if any. A lot of the carping about that is moot, whether from the left or the right.

One of the purposes of an estate tax is indeed to prevent cumulative concentration of wealth in the hands of a few. Since the Reagan era, there has been a movement to create a de facto aristocracy in the U.S., an aristocracy of the monied class. Taxing inherited wealth is in fact NOT "double taxation" - because the heirs who receive the largesse of inheritances have in fact done nothing to earn that wealth and are paying taxes on it now (in theory, of course).

The President has set a tone for working with both sides of the aisle in this bill, and it is NOT rolling over to play dead. It is thoughtful, pragmatic political management.

Thank you all for the kind words. You all have a Merry Christmas and stay safe.

First, The Judge is not a truther. Your definition of a truther is not what he is so stop drinking the Olberman Kool-Aid. A truther is someone who believes that the government allowed 9/11 to occur so we could go to war in the ME. He has never once said that or implied it so please educate yourself. He may have said that government foreign policy lead to the attacks of 9/11 but that is far from being a truther - that's being a realist.

" Tell me again how the republican/tea party is in support of the Middle Class."

USNDV-Ret. Who told you that in the first place? By any chance, was it on an April 1st? Actually, the right WANT'S more people out of work and the ecomomy to get worse instead of better. This IS still Obama's watch, remember.

No one would notice except overpaid power drunk bureaucrats if they shut down the Departments of Education and Energy PERMANENTLY

Why not start there?

Why do we need a partisan hack Ann Duncan handing out BILLIONS to the states she "deems" winners?

Paul NY: Zadroga and his kind are merely collateral damage to the NEO-CON RE-peat-the-lie-to-the-PUBLIC-ans. In false-flag attacks good people get hurt. The repugs are just wishing that they would hurry up and die already. Much like Beck saying that he HATED the widows of 9/11 for questioning his government. "You people are not entitled to any of our blood money." , Dick Cheney.

NJNB- IF they spent less time obstructing, maybe they would be able to enjoy more 'reading' time?

Isn't it funny how we never heard from the right wing nuts about reading bills when the Cheney/Bush administration were systematically destroying the freedoms that we are supposed to enjoy?

"Big win??? That is why his own party was threatening to not even pass the bill? That is why he broke another one of his campaign promises signing it?

"The compromise tax agreement, which the House passed last night.... the deal was as good as Democrats could get, especially with Republicans set to gain control of the House and pick up extra Senate seats in January"

A last-minute submission to the Republicans just to have one last thing to say they passed before Republicans move into office is no more a "Big Win" than forcing through a healthcare takeover that has been found unconstitutional and is already being challenged by 20 states.

How sad is it that these are the "highlights" of this administration? and how sad is it that we have media that is state-run enough to portray them as "wins"?

Defining wins on capitol hill is like shoveling snow in a snow storm.

US Navy,

Gov't shut down - Since this 111th Congress is one of thw worst ever - Great. Everything they have done has either cost money we don't have, complicated lives and business, degraded national security, or all three.

Federal middle class workers - boo hoo. Not much sympathy for those that make twice what their private sector equivalents make. About private sector they lost 8 million jobs, federal guys got 600,000 new ones.

Social Security, Medicare - Bill Shut They aren't stopped.

They said they would not consider anything till the tax deal was done. That was the #1 priority. Kyle has said repeatedly how hard he will try to stop START and that it should be done in the next Congress. I'm thinking he will make good on his word.

Your right about one thing though - Gridlock is not over. The American people do not want Obama's big government agenda. Unless he changes to what America wants, there will be gridlock until 2012.

John A, yet another very informative and well-written piece from you at 1.12. One of the things we seem to have forgotten is that every law is there because SOMEONE, at SOME TIME felt it was important and necessary, and convinced a bunch of others to believe the same. We should be careful about throwing the baby out with the bathwater.

If there's a good thing about this bill, it's that next time we'll be talking about a permanent extension of tax cuts for the wealthy WITHOUT the ability to hold 98% of us hostage in the process. We'll also have 2 more years to prove we couldn't afford it in the first place. That's not a good outcome in my mind, but always look for the silver lining.

DBO;

I have never said that "I" think republicans support the middle class, "I" am of the opinion that they only claim that they do to get votes. All my posts have been consistent with that.

There is NO way that anybody is going to make be believe that the republicans really support the middle class. I have said over a hundred times on the site that the republicans support Wall Street over Main Street, Big Business over Small Business and the richest 2% over the 98%. That is my belief. They could not care less about the middle class. To them we are expendable.

Sorry if I confused you.

Both to my liberal and conservative friends on First Read, MERRY CHRISTMAS AND HAPPY NEW YEAR. May we all be back next year to continue the fun we have on here every day.

Both to my liberal and conservative friends on First Read, MERRY CHRISTMAS AND HAPPY NEW YEAR. May we all be back next year to continue the fun we have on here every day.

Bravo Tom! 2011 will be a VERY interesting year... that's for sure! ;o)

How is it that the new tax bill is all of a sudden a good thing when most of the liberal FR club spent the better part of a year bashing the Bush era tax cuts? So, since Obama and all his economist buddies now say its a good thing for economic growth, that makes it so?

Another thing, why are you people not on the other threads standing up for Harry Reid for arguing for the pork laden spending bill? Feisty was the only one I saw and I couldn't completely tell if she was being serious or sarcastic.

You have a safe and Merry Christmas too I will remember our troops who are putting their lives on the line every day to keep this great nation safe;especially my son. sharing his quote. I don't mind taking a bullet so you can be free Mom.

I thank you and your son for his service, but with all due respect - while you "are remembering our troops who are putting their lives on the line everyday", remember that 67% of those Marines and 50% of those soldiers are against DADT. One third of the troops in combat arms are so against it that they are seriously considering leaving their service if it passes.

Why give them such a cruel Christmas present that they DO NOT WANT in a lame smuck rush?

More wonderful news this morning regarding the U.S. finances. Majority Leader Reid has been forced by his own party to pull the Omnibus package. Seems he couldn't get his own party to vote for it. Now they are in the process of developing a resolution to keep the government running until the next Congress begins or 18 Feb 2011.

This is per the article on this website

"The House and Senate typically spend months on the 12 annual spending bills, but Democrats didn't bring even a single one to the Senate floor this year, an unprecedented collapse of an appropriations process. The House only passed two of the 12 bills and didn't make any of the other 10 public."

So according to MSNBC this Republicans can't be blamed for stalling this piece of legislation during the year, Reid would not even bring it up for purely political reasons.

Thank goodness the Congress (most members of BOTH parties) are finally starting to listen

USNDV-Ret

"Sorry if I confused you."

You didn't . It was another failed attempt at my being a little sarcastic.

As usual, you post was spot-on!

Booby, there were so many good posts wishing everyone well, even those we disagree with and then you spout off with this bigotted, lying cr@p. STFU, booby, STFU.

Thanks Matthew! I started to respond to Bobble-Head bobby... then decided it wasn't worth the time!

You said it BEST!

Yep, that's poor bobby. All rights for him none for the other guy. Wouldn't that be, let's see: NARCISSISM?

Bob, liberals bashed the tax cuts for 2% of the population. It is impossible to justify tax cuts when fighting two wars. It wasn't the tax cuts for middle and low income earners that was the problem for Bush and the GOP, it was the fact that they did so while passing legislation year after year that was not funded, they increased spending, they increased the size and scope of government and no matter how you slice it, that doubled the national debt. The problem we often discuss is the Bush tax cuts were for 10 years, not two or three which would have had a stimulative affect without doing such great harm and increasing of the debt. There were some of the Bush cuts that helped the lower and middle income earners--something liberals always support. The disagreement is and always has been over the unfunded spending by the GOP, the ever increasing disparity between the 2% richest and the rest of the country. Nothing wrong with earning as much money as one can, what is wrong is the more money a few have, the less gets contributed back into the economy--the middle class is the economic engine aided by business investing in its employees with better pay.

DBO:

My bad and I apologize. You and your family have a very Merry Christmas and I wish them all that is good.

And right back at ya, cap'n.

Hard not to have a Merry Christmas, when you live in what is STILL the best damned place on earth, huh?

Bob18

The word is "Schmuck" and you're still not very good at this.

Merry Christmas :-)

bob-1805084

Federal middle class workers - boo hoo. Not much sympathy for those that make twice what their private sector equivalents make. About private sector they lost 8 million jobs, federal guys got 600,000 new ones.

Prove it.

Hey Pickles, Houston, TX,

Did you see Feisty's post?

Bobble-Head bobby. Now that is good!

booby - Dude I told you that was embarassing if that's the best a grown man could come up (that's what my sister called me when she was 4). I told you to get help - Feisty would have helped you and could have given it to you when you girls get together in private to gossip about Candice.

BTW Pickles, I did wish you and skip a Merry Christmas and said I was voting for each of you 5 TIMES each because I know how much those big green stars mean to you. And in the spirit of Christmas you call me names (like a 4 year old little girl) and say STFU.

I am as deflated as your Bachman blow-up.

One more thing - I know what you are thinking and Bobble-Head booby doesn't work either. Check with Red. She was kinda uncomfortable with the pickles and Bachman stuff, but she still accepts you - your a liberal and have at least the intellectual capacity to fog a mirror.

John A,

I am glad that people like your comments, but I think that it is completely wrong to tax anyone, after they are dead. People didn't come to this country to pay the government after they were dead, they came to this country to prosper, to make a great life for themselves and their children, and even future generations.

Although the government does need money to provide for the basic essentials, protection, infrastructure, and even some regulations, they are "double" taxing with estate taxes. By your comments, you are saying that people have not paid taxes on their wealth, but they have, each year they pay income taxes--on their earned income. Every time they purchase something, they pay sales taxes--federal, state, county, & city. Unless of course you live in a state that doesn't have sales taxes. I think that might be New Hampshire & Oregon. And of course in most states people have to pay property taxes.

And then, after a person dies, you and many of your friends think that it is okay to take more of their money, even if they do all the documents, give away as much as possible, you don't have a problem with the government taking more hard earned money from people, just so that it can be given to those who refuse to work harder, refuse to save, and in some cases refuse to even work.

Even those who inherit the estates, they will in time pay taxes on income, property, and sales taxes again. So the taxation never stops. As long as the rich get taxed even more, and the less fortunate keep getting out of paying taxes, yet use the system more than the rich. It is so easy for people to sit here and take away from others, it is sad that we have become a nation of takers, not givers.

But then again, you believe in the progressive tax system, yet do the numbers, taxing everyone at the same rate on their income taxes in 2009, would bring in more revenue than we took in, based on the minimum tax dollar at the each level and the number of overall taxpayers in this country.

Well, Matthew, that didn't take long...ultra sensitive aren't they?

Jody, I think you were responding to me, not Bob. Time will tell about the two year extension and the stimulative effect. Most business plans are for five years and the unsurety might cause a problem. I offer no excuses for the Republicans and their spending. Other than to say, they lost their heads (almost literally in the previous elections).

I commented several times in the days leading up to the tax bill vote that it should have only contained tax issues and unemployment extensions, everything else muddied the water and provided each side with political ammunition.

I disagree to a point on the taxes for the rich. True money creation does not come from just taxes. Money is also created with savings and investment.

BTW, we are still fighting wars, even with the extended tax cuts.

skip,

You know - that didn't look right.

Thanks for the help. I'm such a schmuck.

And about my "You are not vet good at this" stuff. I saw you mention this and say how condescending it is in one of your post the other day. My apologies. I usually say that only after repeatedly cut and paste my statements with the other persons irrelevent responses to highligh the obvious.

If I jumped the gun on you, sorry. I will try to reserve it for the profoundly inept like newdaft - if I decide to ever waste time on her again.

Gee Ed, it's good of you to come around spreading the Conservative narrative about overpaid government workers, but it just isn't true;

With unemployment in the region lingering at record levels, and job security a wistful memory for many, it’s easy to look for scapegoats. Thus a familiar refrain--government workers are overpaid, and our tax dollars are going towards outsized benefit and salary packages--has come back again. But as with most scapegoating, there’s not much truth to the accusation: the reality is just the opposite. Once age and education are factored in, state and local workers actually earn less, on average, than their private-sector counterparts. The wage penalty for state and local government workers in New England is close to 3 percent.

http://www.physorg.com/news203874436.html

See, Matthew, there it is again...bobby calls you out for the same childish nicknames that he uses. What is the word for that again......

@VET

Once again your comments are not supported by any facts at all.

1. What the Republicans wanted was to make the Bush era tax rates permanent. They didn't get that.
While we are at it. You may need to research who actually pays the bulk of the Federal income tax in this country. 12% pay 66% of all of the Federal income taxes. While 47% of Americans pay 0.

2. Ask any accountant and they will tell you the current tax rate is the fairest it has ever been. Had the Bush era tax rates been allowed to expire the 'middle class' (which you say the Dems care so much about) would have been hit just as hard as the rich. Example:
A married family with 2 children at an income level of $50k a year would have seen a tax increase of $2100. a year.
If your not in a union, the Dems don't care about you.

3. The Dem's have known for 10 months that the issue of government funding needed to be addressed. And yet they did nothing until this week. So Harry could get up and grandstand about working over the Christmas break. So what has he been doing (with an overwhelming majority in both houses) since Feb? So much for your Republican gridlock theory.

4. A government shutdown would not effect essential services (which include government issued checks). Get your facts straight.

5. The START treaty is so far down the list of priorities, and such a one-sided waste of time, it's not worth talking about. With Iran, China, and North Korea out of control, your focus is on Russia, really?

You must be one of those who thinks that all rich people are Republicans. And all poor, hard-working middle class people are Democrats. Keep believing the fairy tale!

Ed,

I don't always agree with Bob, I am probably a little to moderate for him, but the federal government has grown under the Obama Administration, I don't think that Bob gets to claim all 600,000 thousand jobs. About 550,000 of those jobs were probably census jobs, that most have ended. And the census is required by the Constitution, so they should be budgeted.

But from most inquiries, the Obama administration has increased the number of non-military federal jobs to between 40K and 50K in his 2 years of office. That doesn't seem like a lot, until you start comparing salaries on the average. But Bush, in 8 years only increased the number of federal employees by about 50K-60K. And those numbers were heading down when he left office.

I personally would like to see federal employees have a salary reduction of 5% a year until the unemployment rate is under 5% again. I am not asking for their benefits to be cut, just the salary. Considering on the AVERAGE the tend to make more money, and because it is taxpayer money that they get paid with.

here is one article, I am still looking for the other article that had the real number of non military jobs listed.

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/feb/02/burgeoning-federal-payroll-signals-return-of-big-g/

Wisconsin Tea Party Governor-Elect Walker compels businesses to leave his state after he kills high-speed rail train from Milwaukee to Madison, Wisconsin. That is a loss of 1.2 billion dollars. He apparently wants Wisconsin to remain agricultural with dairy farms and cheese.

Ron, sometimes it's best not to take things at face value. The high speed rail deal that Walker is working to kill actually caused jobs to leave our state. Our illustrious sitting governor negotiated a no bid contract with a Spanish company to build the train. Indirectly, during the trip to negotiate this deal, 400 jobs left the state because another local manufacturer was looking for a reason to keep the jobs here or take them to LA. Jindahl put together an attractive tax package and his right to work state offered up a workforce anxious to get the jobs. Doyle was inking the no bid deal for promises while ignoring 400 jobs that left within the year. More directly, another company, already based in Milwaukee, was making trains for the L system in Chicago. Already set up with the assembly line and trained work force and ready to start rolling out equipment for Wisconsin- only Diamond Jim never gave them an opportunity to bid for the project. As a result, they've pulled manufacturing out of our state and are building a brand spankin' new facility in IL. Walker is attempting to halt a project the majority of our state understands is a boondoggle of unfunded spending when we've already got major shortfalls. Talgo was already under investigation for their hiring practices- the three or 4 people working in the state in the initial phases were instructed not to hire blacks among other issues. So you can think whatever you like about Walker halting the car-speed rail project but our current democratic "leader" has cost a he!! of a lot more actual jobs than Walker's theoretical job loss.

Republicans, were handed an elctoral landslide, in the election this year, not nmatched in 70 years.

The camp[aigned on repealing the insurance farce, reducing spending and opposing Obama.

A vote for this bill increased spending, funded the insurance farce and compromised with OBama.

If you are a conservative legislator and you voted for this bill, that's STRIKE ONE.

We removed a large number of republican incumbents last year int he primaries and we a will cheerfully do so again, in 2012.

You have two more chances another vote ro fund the insurance farce, increase spending or compromise with Obama in any way, will get you strike TWO and we are not in a forgiving mood,

The Government has grown ONLY because of the "war on terror" and that causes all of the money issues. You can't support things you do need when you have crap like Defense, HS, and the TSA spending money like it's going out of style.

And given that Government workers already make LESS than their private counterparts, why should they take a hit to service you?

http://epi.3cdn.net/8808ae41b085032c0b_8um6bh5ty.pdf

I realize it's fun to bash federal and state workers with BS lines like, "They make $30K more than their private counterparts", but it's just that... BS. Just because you say something is true.. doesn't make it so.

An equivalent government job that I qualify for (as a senior IT person) would pay me 40%+ less than I make. Benefits are not any better than what I get and I can get stock and a better 401K match. So how exactly are they making more? I realize that I'm at an upper pay scale, but still even if I came in at a GS 15 level (which you can't do since those go to 14s) I'd make a lot less.

I know this to be true since I have friends who transitioned to government a couple of years ago and still make $50K+ less than I do. True, they have less stress about losing a job in this economy.. but $50K less???

Kind of crazy for you to say they should take a pay cut.(But also expect it since you'd rather just shout talking points that are BS) As always it's the loud mouths that scream about how much the "evil" government worker makes that get the press even if it's not true.

Your right about one thing the GOP will do everything to stop Obama's agenda in 2011/2012. That's what we voters told them to do.

The Republican's "Filibustered" a bill that would have helped thousands of First Responder (remember 9/11) who have become sick (actually there all becoming sick). They won't help the heroes of one 9/11 but giving a tax break to millionaire and billionaires not a problem. Wake up America! There coming for your Social security, your Medicare, your affordable everything! These so called fiscal conservatives will only bring down the deficit if it makes life harder even unbearable for working Americans and the Middle Class while they all party and make a profit with their crony friends. They hate all of you - everyone of you! This is truly the beginning of class warfare on a scale never seen before. they are your enemy!

This is how you get a big "win"? pleading desperately with your own party for one last gift?

"White House hits back at outspoken Dem"

"The White House is putting on tremendous pressure, making phone calls; the president's making phone calls saying that's the end of his presidency if he doesn't get this bad deal."

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2010/12/15/dem-obama-says-not-passing-tax-deal-would-be-end-of-his-presidency/?hpt=Sbin

So much for his promises and the American Dream for the middle class jobs, homes, etc. The tax cuts did not provide for new jobs in the past. So why should it be any different now.It's politics as usual with promises that are continually broken right after elections.

Booby,

Unlike you, at least I'm old enough to drink and to know what to do with a blow up doll (hint: it isn't a floatation device).

Now run along little boy.

Obama makes this tax and spend deal, claims it is good for the economy (making him either a liar if you are a liberal and believe this only makes things worse, or a liar because he is now admitting raising taxes on anyone in this economy is insanity) and you liberals stomp your feet, call names, ridicule and accuse honest conservatives of every kind of evil. Quite an inclusive spirit you folks have going.

What is truly hilarious is the incessant claims that somehow 35% federal income tax (along with state and other taxes for most) is not only not enough, it is being greedy to not want to pay more. A NYC citizen in the top tax bracket pays 50%+ of their marginal income, California residents pay damn close to that, and you greedy liberals still want more.

Your drunken-president has been spending like a rockstar for 2 years, so why not take 5 minutes and really cut - how about 20% off of the military, 50% off of the departments that do nothing, and eliminate those federal departments that are completely unnecessary, completely incompetent or so corrupt as to be unfixable?

Then, put in a 3 step flat tax, eliminate the irs (along with eliminating all tax deductions) with the first $30k of personal income totally tax exempt so folks can live. Simplify, reduce, and start acting like grown ups.

Or you can keep up the hate, class warfare, lies, obfuscation and history modification and develop carpal tunnel for your troubles.

US Naval Disabled Veteran - Retired:

You had better hope that the republicans and Tea Party people recently elected can stop this runaway spending spree before our whole system crumbles and you won't be able to receive your disability check.

Merry Christmas Matt.

Just wondering if all you that post daily meet at McDonalds for your senior coffee each morning? Same story, different day. Quit complaining and get out and do something good for the country.

taxpayer1: There's a reason the lefty socialists are celebrating today: They know they snookered the repubs. Barry threw a little bone and the repubs pounced on it as if they have been starving for 4 years. The repub leadership apparently doesn't realize that they have the ability to stop the destruction of the country. Hopefully, come Jan. 4, the new crew will use their power wisely. This "deal" was no bipartisan compromise, it was a socialist shellacking of conservatives. That's the reason a lot of repubs lost in the primaries, they were really dems and conservatives saw through the disguise.

In order for the country to be saved from total destruction, the conservatives need to take over the repub party and stop of of this absurd spending of money we don't have. As I said, they have the power to do it. With control of the House, they don't have to pass anything they don't want. They don't even need to compromise (which is defined as the libs get what they want and conservs get a crumb). No spending can occur without the gop say so in the house. It's as simple as that. Propose a balanced budget and invite the libs to join the fray and make their own budget cut proposals. Don't worry about a veto or the Senate not going along. If no one else goes along, well the repubs would have made a valid, fiscally responsible proposal and it would be the libs that irresponsibly shut down the government. Can't get much more simpler than that.

If the repubs in the Senate had stood together and demanded an up or down vote on an across the board permanent retention of current tax rates, then it would be up to the libs to keep their promise to the middle-class and vote for the proposal, or vote for everyone's tax rates to increase. There would have been no additional spending (of money we don't have) and we'd have found out if they really love higher taxes for all. My guess is that they would have caved. But, they are better at playing bluff than the repubs are. We'll find out next year if that continues. My guess is that it will, unfortunately, because I've yet to see any indication that the repubs understand what is at stake.

buckwheat,

"47% of amiericans don't pay taxes"

yeah, if you include children in diapers and in school, retirees living on SS, housewives that don't work(outside the home). in other words, people that CAN'T pay taxes, and only a total imbecile (like certain right-wing commentators that are trying to say how unfairly the rich are treated) would demand that they do

that 47% statistic is a load of BS that is designed to get stupid people mad

Merry Christmas, Bob.

"Read my lips!" Obama needs to consult with Bush I to assess the impact. lol.

Feisty: That's one Christmas card list I won't make (the Obamas'). Fer sure. It's a tough job, but somebody's gotta do it.

Obama's Big Win????? Only the "typical brain-dead progressive liberal could believe such nonsense!

CLASSIC Liberal PMS-NBC spin... at best! Of course, coming from PMS-NBC, no one should expect anything else... but a continued flow of slanted, hyped, twisted SPIN from them!

Obama won NOTHING, but only acquiesced to PRESSURE from the MASSIVE DEFEAT of HIS SOCIALIST agenda in November!

Obama continues to prove every time he appears (or has Clinton appear for him) that he is a "pathetically inexperienced community organizer" who is "totally UNQUALIFIED to be President!"

Idiot of all idiots!

Fool of all fools!

Obama has already guaranteed his place in American and World History as the very, very worst President EVER to occupy the Oval Office!!!

"Liberalism truly is a Mental Disorder!!!"

BigBear62

John A,

I am glad that people like your comments, but I think that it is completely wrong to tax anyone, after they are dead.

What are you talking about, BigBear? Once you have been legally pronounced dead, you don't own any taxable assets as of that point in time. Your estate, then, legally passes to your heirs or whomever you have willed your wealth to. These people, in turn, inherit a windfall of money and possessions they did nothing to earn, yet you think this should be exempt from estate taxes? I think it is an affront to hard-working middle-class people, who pay upwards of 35% of their income to the government, without all the wailing and crying that the rich seem to do. And these people actually have to work for their income! The heirs to what you mistakenly call "your" estate should have to pay, at the very least, what we all have to pay for any income, be it earned or given freely. Your estate stops being "yours" once you have been put in the ground or burned to dust.

Both to my liberal and conservative friends on First Read, MERRY CHRISTMAS AND HAPPY NEW YEAR. May we all be back next year to continue the fun we have on here every day.

My sentiments exactly. I have enjoyed the vine and I am looking forward to great conversations next year.

The kids and grands are on their way home. This will be a great Christmas for me and I wish the same for everyone.

what I can't understand is the stupidity of enacting the Bush tax cuts in the first place. (which is what this extended)

with the taxes that were in place previously, we had what was essentially a balanced budget.

every war in US history has had additional taxes put in place to support it,until now. so Bush turns around , cuts taxes , and starts two wars, one that I think was necessary, and one that was totally unnecessary and incredibly costly on multiple levels (including running oil prices to obscene levels and destroying US credibility)

and all the "pro-war" conservatives think that the war should be painless to them and their wallets. just let the poor suckers "volunteer" because they aren't going to find a job any other way.

Devil,

If the estate tax is not a tax after your death, what is it? And what middle class person out there pays 35% in income taxes? Really.

So you believe that even though your heirs are paying taxes on the inheritance, that the government should be allowed to take, at least for today--35% of that estate? Wanting 55% of that estate. When did it become fashionable for the government to get to tax every aspect of your life or death.

I guess if someone has enough money to tax--then the government deserves it so they can spend it to buy votes. Gotta love redistribution.

Well, BigBear62, considering the 'redistribution' of wealth has been upward from the poor and middle class to the top 2% for the last 40 years, it's about time that it came the other way for a while. Are you in the top 2%? If not, then they have been stealing from you and not even giving you a kiss afterwards. Not only that, they have convinced you to support them stealing even more from you.

bigbear, your heirs lose/pay nothing at all if the estate is worth less than $5 million, which covers 90% of the population (or more). and if you are a business owner, you can always rearrange the company to become a corporation and that will lose nothing on the owners death either, since it becomes it's own legal entity. then the business can be passed down to your heirs without estate taxes. of course if the business+estate is worth less than $5million, then it doesn't matter because no estate taxes are paid at all

When did it become fashionable for the government to get to tax every aspect of your life or death.

ar least since the 1930s....

you know, ever since the USA became a major world power.....

you seem to forget that the top marginal tax rate used to be as high as 91% for those making over 200,000 per year. of course, that should be adjusted for inflation (which it never is, but should be) which would put the top bracket at about 2 million today.

I will also readily agree that 91% is wayyy too high, but 40% is not unreasonable over 2 million per year.

and cutting the cap gains to zero would only benefit the fat cats on wall street that make as much as 5 billion (for the top trader) and it is all cap gains, not "income" so they will pay no taxes at all, leaving the middle class to pay the taxes

bigbear, I'm assuming that your "devil" remark was aimed at me, since the closest thing to that name was mine,

there are a couple of names like "devil's advocate" and the like around on newsvine, but I didn't see any at the top of this thread

RE-POST - Compliments of the COLLAPSE COWARDS!

Are you people for freakin real? Now your anti-Christmas cards?

Feisty Redhead Roselle, IL Comment collapsed by the community

Nice surprise when I got home last night in my mailbox...

Thank you President Obama, Michelle, Malia, Sasha & Bo for the beautiful Christmas card again this year!

Yeah, just remember, to the corporate media NAFTA was a big "win" too and so was financial deregulation.

To paraphrase Phyrrus: another win like this and we're done for.

Danwill....BigBear was reacting to my post (#1.68), where I was attempting to make it clear to him that his notion that the government was somehow taxing "him" after his death by putting an estate tax on his heir's inheritance was not making sense.

You know, here's what I have trouble understanding about these wealthy people and their feeling that somehow, the government is treating them unfairly by taxing them. They have access to all manner of loopholes, exemptions, tax shelters, etc. so that in the end, only a minute fraction of their total wealth ever gets taxed immediately. We, the middle class, have no access to these methods of legalized "tax evasion". They scream bloody murder about the fact that, once they die, their estate (if worth over $5 million) gets taxed 35%, even though the wealth goes to people who never did anything to earn it!

Don't you think it's odd that they want their heirs to get free money, without it being taxed, yet they are the first to whine about the poor getting government help, seemingly for doing nothing....sounds like a bit of irony there. I'm curious to find out what they think should be done about the poor and the unemployed welfare recipients, who live day to day on government support....should it be eliminated? If so, how do you think these people are going to live....charity from others?? Don't make me laugh.

I fear it's going to come to a head sometime in the next 2 years, where there will be an uprising of the middle class against the wealthy, the likes of which we haven't seen since the French Revolution. And I say, bring it on!

@1.74:

You know, the Beatles actually did a song about it.

Hi devil, I scrolled right past your name in 1.68 and missed you completely.

my bad :)

"Are you people for freakin real? Now your anti-Christmas cards?"

Of course they are, Feisty. They've proven repeatedly that any message other than one studied and proven by Frank Luntz is to be destroyed.

They've proven repeatedly that any message other than one studied and proven by Frank Luntz is to be destroyed

Thanks John! Sadly, your 100% on the money (as usual) ;0)

"The compromise tax agreement, which the House passed last night (by a 277-148 vote) and which will be signed into law sometime this afternoon, represents President Obama's biggest win since health care"

Do you mean the one where The Republicans got exactly what they wanted, but Obama had to concede defeat on the issue of tax cuts for everyone?

Nice 'spin' by msnbc. Now if Obama just passes some more of the Republican agenda, there's no limit to how many 'wins' he can have. lol

Well, it WAS an extension of the Bush tax cuts. That was always the question. Should the tax cuts run out or be extended. The BUSH TAX CUTS.

Joe,

So you are willing to let the tax cuts be known as the Democratic tax cuts of 2011? Okay, but it will be the large number of Republican votes for it that will be pointed out when it comes time to increase the debt ceiling. Good luck with that !

Joe has a good point, it will be a very merry Christmas for the rich in the U.S., and as far as I can tell that's how it should be in any Banana Republic, so I guess all is well.

"Anyone wishing to deny this is a Democrat tax cut by calling them the “Bush era tax cuts” or “an extension of the Bush tax cuts” is only fooling themselves and showing they are a fool by stating it publically."

So, Joe, the Iraq war is NOT the 'continuance of the Bush Iraq War'? It's something else altogether? Ain't words fun??

Anyone wishing to deny this is a Democrat tax cut by calling them the “Bush era tax cuts” or “an extension of the Bush tax cuts” is only fooling themselves and showing they are a fool by stating it publically.

That would be the entire Republican Party. They have been calling this "an extension of the Bush tax cuts" for a year now, with no exceptions. Not fooling themselves, or anyone with even half a brain.

I plan to follow Barry’s lead and the first thing I’m going to do with my Obama tax cut is look into a 10 day vacation in Hawaii.

How nice for you. I don't think I can get a 10-day vacation in Oklahoma for my couple hundred dollars in tax breaks.

They are and should be called the Obama Tax cuts. I was adamantly against these cuts. I would have rather they all fizzled away.

Unfortunately, the GOP will have another 2 years of their tax policy towards to rich to miraculously rebound the economy. Despite my leanings, I hope improvement happens, but I'm not holding my breath.

Even after these are put in place, it will be interesting to see that the economy according to the experts will continue to slowly heal. Most experts think even after these cuts are put in place the economy will see a paltry 2.6% best case with a decrease of unemployment to 9.2%. In my book that is an awfully big price tag, especially since we are drowning in red ink.

As the omnibus spending bill was pulled, I will be very interested to see if Republican led house will continue to be hypocritical about the deficit.

Regarding the cuts, and their negligible effects toward improving the economy, I'm waiting to hear the GOP say; "We'll if we didn't extend these cuts unemployment will be much worse. If we didn't give tax cuts to millionaires, economic activity would be much worse." When I hear this for the months and months during 2011 with limited economic improvement, I will think of the song by Allianas Morrissette - "Isn't it Ironic."

As for me, with my meager tax cut, I'll take a que from Dave Ramsey and put the extra cash into additional principal payments for my house.

Joe in Albany-1902257

I plan to follow Barry's lead and the first thing I'm going to do with my Obama tax cut is look into a 10 day vacation in Hawaii. I'm just curious what FR lefty liberals plan to spend your Obama tax cut on??

Will you visit the Hawaiian hospital where the President was born? I'm curious. If you are told he was born there by the hospital administrators will you let the birthers know it's time to refute the claim?

I do believe Issa will bring this to an investigation. Just think of all the tax dollars you could save as a great American.

This leftie liberal believes President Obama got the best deal he could and so did republicans. I'm just fine with what happened. Why? It is called compromise--you know, when neither side gets everything they want but both sides get something they want. Compromise in the World According to the GOP has been relegated to the dust bin because their version has been, until a brief moment of reason this week, our way or nothing. Boehner prefers "common ground" because using the word compromise suggests losing. Funny thing though, a huge majority of people WANT compromise. According to the Nov 2 exit polls, Americans said they want both sides to work together.

Since the extension of the Bush tax cuts maintains the status quo, it won't change much of anything. The only added money will be the one-year payroll tax holiday and my guess is most of those middle and low income earners will use the money to buy things they haven't been able to afford and it won't be a vacation to Hawaii--that is reserved for elitists like Joe in Albany. Enjoy your trip, Joe, you deserve a vacation and if you can afford it, great; but just remember many will be buying food with their tax cuts.

Fuzzy thinking Joe. Think about what you've said. Makes no sense. By the way, why would you go to Hawaii with all those Democrats. Try Texas, it fits you more.

Beverly in Chicago

If Issa brings Obama's birth place up - we can bring up Issa's dubious younger years as an alleged car thief. Everyone have a happy and safe holiday.

"By the way, why would you go to Hawaii with all those Democrats."

Excactly why it's a nice place to visit for a couple of weeks in the winter for the sun, sand beaches and beautiful scenery, but, I sure wouldn't want to live there!!

I’m just curious what FR lefty liberals plan to spend your Obama tax cut on??

The extra $1200.00 a year I'll be getting that I did not want or ask for will go straight to savings. Spend money in this economy? No way! At least for myself, "Demand" has left the building. Once more, pennies for the middle class, billions for the rich. And yes, from this point forward, these are the Obama tax cuts.

California Tom, please do not encourage Joe to come to Texas, even for just a vacation, we have enough like him already. Look what the idiots here did, they reelected Perry governor. One more low information/low IQ person in this state, even temporarily, may cause disaster here of epic proportions. Texas may never recover.

I'd hate to run into you on a beach you're probably a big fat mess. I'll bet the chair you sit that fat tucus of yours on won't be very merry this xmas.

I second that, Matthew, Houston. Joe don't know Texas. I would like to keep it that way.

Sports is my only TV respite these days with all the bad political news lately.

Not sure if you follow NBA but I was sorry to hear about Yao Ming's possible career ender. With my Mavs winning 9 out of 10, I can't believe they are still behind San Antonio. What does it take to pass those guys?

Yellowdog,

Not really much of a sports fan, I do like watching and going but do not really follow it. It seems, from the game I went to on Nov. 24th, they don't absolutely need him (they beat Golden State 110 - 101). I do, however, hate to see anyone lose their career from an injury. Plus, Yao is a good person and a good citizen in this community so it is even worse when that happens to someone like him.

Quit talking like you gotta be rich to visit Hawaii. Right now, our tourism is doing quite well if you look at the numbers. One reason is the hotels slashed prices long ago to entice visitors to come when things slowed down and the prices have not risen again. The liberals commenting how poor they are here will always be crying about something, so let's not pay too much attention. The other thing happening here is more Japanese tourism and that's because of our dollar is losing strength. How come you liberals aren't crying about that. That will only get worse unless the Repubicans start down the fiscal responsibility trail that those of us that changed the liberal course of the Obama administration last month. If they don't follow through, their political careers will also be in jeopardy.

Democrats have been claiming that Obama's Trillion dollar bailout / stimulus "saved or created" millions of jobs. Now suddenly you want real results from a bill that spends more money, and simply keeps in place the existing tax rates? And if not it's a failure?

This is the stupidity of the left. Saved or created has never been used in the history of our nation when it comes to measuring jobs. The liars who made up this politispeak started it early, because they knew their trillion dollar payoff would do nothing to grow our economy. These liars are criminals of the highest order, like the late night tv preacher claiming he will heal you if you just send enough money and have enough faith.

The king has no clothes. The dog not only don't hunt, it's dead.

This compromise is simply more liberal crap, 3 years of unemployment benefits? Seriously? And now we are going to rob Social Security for a year? What the hell does that do except to bankrupt SS earlier, and hurt working people come retirement time?

Unbelievable. The Republicans didn't get the message, the Democrat controlled congress just passed exactly what they said they wouldn't. They are all scum and every damn one of them needs to be unemployed.

Meh. Hawaii is beautiful, but over-rated and grossly overpriced! I'd rather drive to a B&B in a pretty little small town and enjoy just walking around with someone special.

Any money from the tax cuts gets set aside to help friends who may need it in the coming year with expenses. It's just the way I roll...

Many of us that live here would like more people to think what you do about our home Sorceress. Unfortunately, many people work in the tourist industry so it's a 2-edged sword. Nothing in my mind wrong with the way you roll. Happy Christmas.

Same Post Different Day

This post was Deleted Yesterday on First Thoughts.

First my apologies to the numerous friends and Neighbors who’s attached comments were deleted along with it. It would never be my intention to put a piece here that would lead to the negation of your efforts. That would be a waste of your time and mine. I don’t know about you’ll but I’m getting to old to waste whatever time I have left on this veil of tears on such foolishness and I value your thoughts to much to do that to you’ll either.

For those of you that are not aware there exists within some of the more technical aspects of our participation here a hole shall we say. You can go to the Report function and click the right statement on the pull down. All you have to do is collude with four more of the Willfully Ignorant and the post is automatically deleted by the Newsvine system without possibility of review by any of the Monitors. How do I know this? Well if you’ll have been paying attention we have actually had several of the Willfully Ignorant come here and brag about their ability to do it and how Brilliant they feel they are for having figured it out.

Now if I’m mistaken about the actual circumstances here I feel that my active participation here over several years should earn me (and by extension all my fellow Posters) a better explanation from our Monitors than silence. If I have somehow violated the Code of Honor or even the bounds of Decency then edify me. I can take and welcome legitimate criticism especially if it clarifies and adds to the general fund of Knowledge within our Community here.

Fair Warning. Don’t pee in my ear and try to tell me it’s raining. They call the last fellow that tried that Nubby.

Thanks IR - that's a classic! ;0)

IR:

Glad you put this back up. They continue to yap about earmarks while they ask for earmarks. I think McConnell alone is looking for over 100 Million in earmarks while the other side of his face is against them.

The Tea Party has been sold a bill of goods by the republicans. They made their bed now they get to lie in it.

Well if you’ll have been paying attention we have actually had several of the Willfully Ignorant come here and brag about their ability to do it and how Brilliant they feel they are for having figured it out.

All the flagging feature does is allow the inmates to run the asylum!

As I mentioned yesterday, according to Deputy Tyler he as the ability to to track who the abusers are and it would be nice if he started doing his J O B and discipline them accordingly...

There is NO WAY 5 yahoo's should have the ability to bring down a post... especially one that has more than 5 votes! So much for majority rules!

If something is so egregious it should be reported directly to the moderator!

Letting these right wingers run rough shod is growing tiresome & counter productive!

Dang IR, I got to the party late yesterday and missed it. That's a classic!

Sorry to say the "new" TP candidates were just the same old hard Right dressed up and given a new name.

IR:

Kudos. When they cannot argue the facts or do not like the message they will try and censore the source. This is what those that have no new ideas or the ones they have suck, will do. Nothing more than keyboard cowards and bullies who think they are being cute. They are not. They are just demonstrating their own hypocrisy and they should go the way of CU if Tyler would do his job and stop this crap. There was NO violation of the CoH.

IR: I am honored to follow you on any post you make, and equally honored if the righties can't take the feedback and collapse it. What does that make them, what is the word...ah yes:

COWARDS!

Good post IR, your wisdom is not lost on this person.

"Nubby" Oh the pictures that went through my mind! That is way too funny IR, thanks for the laugh.

does it surprise you that the tpers and other republicans turn their back on their constituents most of these republicans come from states or districts where like in the words of Edwards" the only way I wont get re-elected is if I get caught with a dead women or a live boy".The american middle class has voted against thier own best interests for 50 years and a lot of them are on their way to becoming poor.But they would rather vote republican than let a minority mother of 3 get food stamps.Dont worry another 50 years of this and the south will have reverted back to the old days where you were either a plantation owner or a sharecropper.

Those that are not a part of a party really should refrain from judging early returns. Here is the reality. The Tea Party is a group, not an official political party. That unofficial group has had more influence in less time than any other group in American History. Look how long the independents, socialists, and libertarians have been around - with little to no influence at all.

That is not to say that it is all good, or that there is coherence. The party is what, 2 years old?

I think the reason that liberals can't stop talking about them is that they are jealous of their influence, their common sense, and the true grass roots nature of the majority of the movement. Yes, I know, there is money involved in influencing the group - that makes no real difference, as the money pales when compared to the billions that democrats and republicans have access to.

Many of the fundamentals of the Tea Party are good and honorable. Most of the participants are middle America - people who are not bigots, who are not wealthy, who believe in equal treatment of all citizens. They believe in smaller government and more personal freedom.

Those who want to criticize and inflame will succeed only in being angry and finding other angry people who agree. What the liberals will not succeed at is convincing reasonable Americans that what is going on in DC with the Democrats over the last 4 years has been anything but irresponsible insanity.

And what the liberals want to believe is that Tea Party members got snookered. Nice try. Good luck with that. As you saw some change in 2010, you will see more change in 2012. This is a process. Liberalism is on the decline as it is driven by fear, greed, laziness and class warfare, which, over time, people grow tired of.

America was built by the middle class. The richest 2% are not going to by enough goods (even they can only buy so many yachts, second, third homes, how many cars can they drive etc). To even remotely try and say that 2% of the people will buy more goods to support this nation than the other 98% is stupid. No middle class, no need for many products and services. Trickle down has not worked. The richest think too much of themselves.

John B, Des Moines, IA

This is AMERICA, dammit, and we've never worked that way. We've had a strong middle class, with enough wealth to drive the economy and enough ambition to make things happen. Over the last 30 years that middle class has been starved, all the new wealth directed to the very top of society.

So we're at a crossroads here, a place where either we reestablish the middle class or we start bowing to Lord Koch and hope he gives us a good job. It's up to us.

What's it gonna be, America?

Great Article, John

Somehow I don't think it'll be Lord Koch. Americans are resilient and have an aversion to feudalism. Yesterday's anniversary of the real Boston Tea Party of Dec. 16, 1773 proved that; not the fake astroturf Koch Brother's one .

Exactly USN. My Dad, a life-long Republican from the old school, started asking probably 20 years ago "what's going to happen when wages drop so low NO ONE has any money?" Well, he's a pretty smart old guy and he saw it coming. Now the rest of us are finding out after he's well into retirement. How many Applebees are 2% of the population going to keep afloat? How many Fords can they drive at the same time? How many Old Navies are going to keep their doors open when only 2% of the population can afford much in the way of new clothes?

John B.

Agreed, we are on the same page. Your Dad is a wise man.

The people have already spoken, best stock up on the Bengay to help ease the pain in your back from bowing to your masters, the voting public is stupid and will get the Banana Republic they seem to want.

John B. - It is also the same/similar rhetoric used by the rich during the US Gilded Age at the end of the 19th century (just before the recession at the beginning of the 20th) and during what might be termed the second US Gilded Age of the 1920s, just before the depression. There are other examples throughout history of this but the difference now is that the rich are funding institutions to back up their preferred story line. Look at all of the people who are voting for and advocating the very policies that hurt their economic lives. I'd be willing to bet that the poster you quote is not part of the top 2%, let alone the top 5% of income earners in this country.

Very true, Matthew. It just seems to be in the nature of most of the very rich to try to establish themselves as the new aristocracy. It'd protect their position in society very nicely, as well as their heirs. Already social mobility in America is below that in many other nations and in decline. I think John D Rockefeller expressed it in the most timeless way possible. When he was the richest man on Earth he was asked how much more he needed.

"Just a little bit more."

I just looked at the occupations of the signers of the Delcaration of Independence. These were not working class people. They were people of means - the upper crust if you will (lawyers, land speculators, plantation owners, merchants, and a physician / minister). These were not the middle class, they were the upper class.

Makes me wonder about several things... Makes me wonder if their intent was to "protect" their own interests? Makes me wonder if they were trying to protect the interests of their servants (slaves or bondsmen)? Makes me wonder what their mindset was in 'who would pay for government'? Makes me wonder about the true meaning of "DEMOCRACY"?

I know it might be unfair, but there were accepted tiers embeded in the population in regards to the "haves" and the "have-nots". Things are different today, but honestly, there used to be second and third class citizens. The "pain in your back from bowing to your masters" we broke away from was only a release from a foreign master. We adopted our domestic masters from the founding of this nation. Whether you are from a red state or a blue one, you are serving a master to this very second! It is how we survive as an organized nation.

Does the end justify the means?

Transferring more wealth to the government is patently Un American. Transferring wealth to the government slows the movement of that money, and hurts economic growth. Otherwise, why did a democrat controlled congress and white house continue the existing tax rates rather than raise taxes?

Can't have it both ways. Either the Democrat party is a complete sell-out, or your belief that taxing rich people at a higher and higher rate is simply not true.

And please, if higher taxes on the rich worked, explain why the Kennedy 1990 "Tax the rich" plan not only didn't work, it was rescinded after the tax plan all but destroyed the yacht industry in the US. CBO numbers were really good, and completely wrong then too.

Are you kidding? I wonder if the American people forgot those Czar years and the trillions when the

country was going to bits. If it wasn't for the Tea Party and the American people, I wonder where we'll

be today? Perhaps, the Bama would have been passing Enabling laws to impose his socialist utopia like

his brother Chavez. I think.

Thanks for sharing Pat, you have a great eye for what we need to see. That's about as close to praise as Krauthammer is likely to get for ANYONE on the Democratic side.

Lighten Up. The Holidays are upon us.

It's a Marshmallow World In the Winter - The cutest of all Christmas songs - turn it up loud - this song will put a smile on your face & leave you humming all day.

Dean Martin

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-VUKlPjwHWs

Hello John. Sometimes you have to search out the other side for perspective. Unfortunately. It was an interesting article. Down with the oh woe is me people. Boo Boo!!!!!! {smile}

Pat Boston MA

First Read: Obama's Big Win - Yup - Even Charles Krauthammer agrees with this.

Don't forget David Broder...

[snippet]

In opting to accommodate reality by acceding to the Republican demand for maintaining all the Bush tax cuts and obtaining a better price than many expected for his concessions, Obama has done almost all that is possible at the moment to create a favorable economic environment for the 2012 campaign. Add in a South Korean trade pact of help to the rebounding auto industry, and the Midwest, that key battleground where Republicans romped in 2010, begins to look salvageable.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2010/12/08/AR2010120804224.html

Thanks Beverly. I hadn't seen this article. What we have learned is sometimes you just can't listen to one side any longer. It is the responsibility of all of us to take a look around the media to get a wider perspective. If you stick with just the negative, then you end up thinking just negative. All the time. And that is not only unhealthy, but it drags you down to their level. And you fail to see all sides.

If people are disappointed in President Obama, fine. He can't personally grant every wish to everyone. He has to govern.

DADT. Won't it be something if it passes? It will be worth raising a glass of champagne for all those who fought diligently to put this policy to an end.

Senators Reid & Lieberman I think will get this done this weekend.

Bev, Broder rarely says anything sensible anymore, but he's got it about right on that one.

Pat: It will be something if DADT repeal passes. One more day of denying a group of citizens full equality, especially those willing to put it on the line in the military, is one day too many.

John B, Des Moines, IA

Bev, Broder rarely says anything sensible anymore, but he's got it about right on that one.

Neither does Krauthammer.They are both bloviators.

Pat Boston MA

DADT. Won't it be something if it passes? It will be worth raising a glass of champagne for all those who fought diligently to put this policy to an end.

DADT will prove to most sensible people we do have a President who cares about people. President Obama was the "One" to grant hospital visiting rights to same-sex partners, and allowing them to take family and medical leave to care for sick or newborn children of same-sex partners.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/06/22/us/politics/22rights.html

No other President would even articulate those issues Pat. I believe we voted for the right person,if they would just give him a chance.

US Navy Disabled Veteran - Retire, thank you for your kinds words. I will let my son know when I e-mail him.

Well said newdayDAWNING. This moment has been a long time coming. The DREAM Act I'm hoping as well will pass. If so, it will have been worth all the uproar of the last few weeks. Well worth it.

Wow Beverly, another informative article. I think what we have gotten used to is 50% negative towards the GOP & 50% negative towards the President. Rarely anything positive. Either the GOP is wrong or the president is wrong. Rarely anything positive.

For some reason, stories like this one rarely see the light on the internets. I read something yesterday that really made me angry. Evidently someone on a well known liberal site admitted that they were instructed to write over the top articles, just so their clicks would increase.

So here they are calling President Obama a corporte sell out, when he is trying to listen to everyone in order to get legislation passed instead of dying a terrible death, yet this site screams bloody murder - just to get clicks.

Exactly who is the sell out?

Pat: Charles Krauthammer's opinion is invalid no matter what fence he sits on. His nonsense is so far off balance that it makes me wonder what bridge he lives under.

I think Krauthammer is terrific, when Clinton called him a brilliant man he was spot on.

But I disagree with Kraut in this piece. Yes it's true that if the Republicans had dug in their heels and waited until the next Congress they probably would have crafted a tax package more to the liking of some conservatives. But I think there would have been a political price in using that tactic, namely many folks who have been demanding that the two parties work together to solve our problems may have been alienated by an intransigent, hard ball Republican approach. It's one thing to dig in your heels to stop the Obama leftist agenda. But it's quite another thing to do that and force people to see their tax witholding increase in January, temporary though that might have been. The safer approach politically was to do the deal they did, particularly since it's so easy to make the case that the left got screwed in the deal much more than the right.

Also, I acknowledge that if the economy (enabled by the tax compromise) improves that would strengthen Obama's prospective candidacy in 2012. The challenge for Republicans will be to make the case that it's their policies that substantially contributed to the recovery in the economy, not anything Obama did (or wanted to do, but was thwarted). With Republicans in charge of the House in the new Congress, they will have ample opportunity to propose a fiscally conservative agenda that their eventual presidential nominee can point to as the basis for the Republican approach to governance. If that agenda is stopped by either the Democratic Senate or Obama, so much the better for Republicans. They can say that extension of the Bush tax cuts was critical to reviving the economy, and but for the naysaying Democrats the economic recovery would have been even more robust. So while running against Obama in an improving economy may well be an uphill battle, it's by no means an impossible task -- particulary since a center-right electorate will have been disabused of any notion that Obama is a centrist president. Kraut was seeing the Republican glass as half empty instead of half full. But after the November results, there's no way anyone should be looking at that glass as half empty.

How are they doing a wonderful job? they just blew a $700B hole in the deficit to save the top 2% of America some extra cash, and they put the government on the edge of a shutdown over a spending bill that they helped write.

If that's your idea of success, then no wonder you like the Tea Party so much - no thinking is required.

Congratulations Juven, if that's what's called for after the TP proves themselve to be the same old borrow and spend Conservatives.

JuvenBachan

Well, Dems and Libs how do you like the Tea tax cuts. If it weren't for the Tea party movement it would not

have been possible. The Repubs are doing a wonderful job. Enjoy the extra cash next year Libs.

The shrieking Tea bagger Queen, Sarah Palin, wanted more Tax cuts for the rich. Get serious!!!

some pretty angry people in the Dem Party today

Especially. at dolts like McCain and empty headed Kyle who wants to see the world thru a mushroom cloud before he relents.

John B.

And all those TP folks that claim to be against earmarks but guess what, they are asking for earmarks as well. Time will expose them for what they are. Again the rhetoric does not jive with the deeds. When is America going to learn??

If it weren't for the Tea party movement it would not have been possible. The Repubs are doing a wonderful job.

Juven, this shows how little you know. By compromising and spending with no way to pay, the Tea Party and Republicans have broken two of the biggest promises they made in November. And they have lost any trust they may have built up and any victory they may have claimed.

If the Republicans want to call this the Obama Tax Cut Extensions, then they also give the Democrats credit for getting the bill together and passed.

How do you like it indeed?!

Considering the Republican/TP Inc. candidates haven't even taken office, it's kind of hard to make that claim, JB. I will thank President Obama for the extension of the tax cuts and curse the Republican/TP Inc. party for continuing the unfair tax advantages of the top 2% of income earners.

You see JB, it is much more complex than your simple mind can handle.

USNV-R, from comments like JB, it seems that America may never learn. That being said, we must continue to fight the usurpers and educate those that we can.

Borrow and spend conservatives? Since when? The last two years have been a democratic lovefest, legislation passed without any input from the other side of the room and a president in lockstep with the democratic agenda. They've had a pretty good run, seeing as how the cards were all stacked in their favor. Harry Reid's backing down on the 'omnibus' 2,000 page spending 1.3 trillion plus bill is, perhaps, an indication that that even he is beginning to realize that democratic borrow and spend policies are no longer viable.

And to those of you nattering away about inhertance taxes being about benefiting rich people, guess again, many small family farms have had to be sold to pay inheritance taxes and those people weren't rich, merely caught in a situation where their land was valued higher on the books and taxed accordingly. The democrats seem to think that the citizen's money is their money regardless of how hard a family worked to have something to pass on to their children. Taxing an estate that has already paid taxes on said money is double and triple dipping.

This class warfare motif of rich vs poor is an old and well used tool. Obama has so successfully engendered this talking point that people buy into it without thinking about what is really at issue here. Is $200,000.00 per annum wealth? Really? Depends on how it's earned and if its part of a small business. Those attacking the wealthy have bought into to the old and rather tired 'rich lord of the manor vs poor, starving serf ' stereotype. The truly rich don't even pay taxes in this country nor do they live here year round. The 'rich' that Obama is scapegoating are actually the upper eschelons of the middle class.

I will give Obama credit, he's a smart politician and knows how to manuver.

many small family farms have had to be sold to pay inheritance taxes and those people weren't rich, merely caught in a situation

mygirl1...where are these farms..name some names...i think thee doth bloviate...

Agreed, please name some names. Agricultural Economists at Iowa State University (farm state) studied the issue and couldn't find ONE. The vast majority of family farms, in fact, are exempt.

mygirl1 can not provide anything to back up her post because it does not exist. History and actual facts have shown everything that she said to be fallacious, at best.

Move along, nothing to see here. mygirl1 has no facts, no logical thought, no information and no intellect, just some talking points fed to her by Rush, Glen, Sean and Faux Noise.

I'd love to see a show of hands of all the liberals who believe that if taxes go up, all that revenue automatically would roll into the IRS. Do you people not have any sense at all?

$700 billion my butt. I don't know about you, but history certainly shows us that when taxes go up, people with money and high incomes adjust - moving their money / income into lower-taxed or non-taxed vehicles.

My guess is that your miracle tax increase would produce maybe 10% of what you think. How about you look at history before you rant about this mythical "cost" you so heartily believe in.

I have looked at history (lots of it and focused on economic and early American history) and find your statements to be almost totally wrong. You are correct in that the rich will adjust by moving into tax free instruments but it has never been to the extent you suggest. And, golly, don't you think that if those tax shelters were also eliminated they wouldn't be able to do that?

That is the problem with you one note conservatives, the economy is much more complicated than a household budget and taxes are only a small portion of that complexity. The reason conservatives want to defund education is because they would not then be the most misinformed people anymore. It will save them a lot of embarrassing moments like Paul F just had.

Matt fellow Texian.

They want to kill the department of education, because it part of their war on the federal government. It is death by a 1000 cuts. This war goes back to the time of the federalist and why original constitution means the Constitution as originally written with no more than ten amendments. They are relentless in their goals and are more resilient than the Taliban.

Exactly so, SG, and those 10 amendments are to have limted and selective meaning as well. It's a full court press to remake the nation in their preferred image.

Agreed, JB and SG. The ironic part is that the founders meant for the document to be a living document that could be adapted to the times. Otherwise they would not have provided for the ability to change it.

Tsk, I knew there would be some serious backlash. from the progressives here. Try Texas vis a vis inheritance tax. Property taxes not paid take land from landowners. I also find it amusing that those of you proposing tax increases as a means of balancing the budget never suggest ways of cutting spending or tapping into those sacred cows so loved by liberals. How much was earmarked for inner city development? Why? Who really benefits? How much will go over budget and require more trips to the well and how are developers chosen to create these developments?

Who benefits from inner city development?!?! Seriously?!?!

1) It reduces crime, 2) it creates tax revenue from increased economic activity from existing businesses, 3) it attracts more businesses that improves the economic activity thereby increasing tax revenues without raising tax rates, 4) formerly unemployed people putting strain on the government safety net leave government roles and become gainfully employed . . . increasing tax revenues without raising rates. Those are just off the top of my head and I am tired.

Matthew-isn't that what you Dems have been telling us for the past 40yrs but still the inner cities are still a failure.

"It is the disadvantaged who habitually elect Democrats yet remain disadvantaged". unknown

For the last 40 years, the Republican/TP Inc. party has managed to cut funds and block passage of funds for inner city development. There has been almost no inner city development going on. Try to keep up there, Wayne.

And I'm not a Democrat.

Matthew: I'm not a democrat: whatever your political leanings...putting it all on republicans at every turn tells a different story. As to the inner city...go look at Detroit, Chicago and a few other cities where the money has gone for the inner city and see how well that money was spent. Then, in the case of Chicago, go look at the history of Obama and who he supported and then go look at the proposed new inner city development and ask who benefits

Keep telling yourself that Scott, no matter what the facts say;

Sixty-two percent of voters name the economy as their most important issue this year. Health care ranks a distant second, at 19 percent. Illegal immigration and Afghanistan follow at 8 and 7 percent.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2010/11/02/first-exit-polls-economy/

I think FR meant a "win" as in an improvement for the country and Americans in the long term, rather than a short term political "win".

Doctor No,

Don’t expect many cuts because this is the 2011 budget which started October 1, 2010 so by the time it is passed and goes into effect half of the fiscal year will be over. It’s hard to make retroactive budget cuts.

no joe, no bo, nj

Good Morning,
No Jo, it depends on where the cuts come from. people want cuts but not from the programs they are intitled to. I saw a poll last week saying that 60%want budget cuts but not from their SS, medicade, medicare.
During the last republicans victory, they cuts welfare programs, remember welfare to work, Phill grahm saying that we need every to help pull the horse. they made massive cuts in those programs, Can they do back there ? Education, No Jo i know some in the public want to get rid of our public school system but how much can you get from that, Education funding from the feds has held seady for years. can you go back there ? we are living now with the fall out from the Reagan cuts in Education, when he took office i think we were in the top 5 world wide in education, its funny now 29 years later we are near the bottom. should we go their again?

Your Governor cut his budgets, because he had to, just like in Illinois, New York, CCalifornia and every other state in the country. every state had budget short falls, due to the housing melt down and foreclosures, and over the bush years less coming from washington. so don't act like he stood out as a hero to fiscal responsibility. states Must submit balance Budgets, this is something you know. some choose to borrow, like california and Illinois, which i don't agree with.
so back to my original question, where will this come from.
also lets remember, there are still a number of republicans, the ones who made thisdeal, did this deal now and want this passed NOW because of the new incoming senators and congressmen who would never agree to this.
so No Jo the only place these massive cuts can come from is Defense, but this is going to be hard considering we are in a war in a half. Now if I'm missing something please let me know, and Please don't bring me little things and i don't want to here about unions. unions are not the reason why we went from a operating surplus in 2000 to defects in 2008.

Keeping funding at 2010 levels with no increases is a start. If there were no increases in government spending for 10 years we would be in a great place fiscally.

BTW I disagree with you NJNB, I don't think the tax deals is a good one either fiscally or politically. Fiscally, I would have preferred a millionaires tax and would have had no problem seeing a number of tax credits expire. Politically, Charel Krauthammer was right, the Republicans could have passed their own cuts in the new congress and dared President Obama to veto them.

BTW Using Nancy Pelosi's logic that unemployment benefits are the best form of stimulus, why don't we raise the benefit to say a $1000 a week and the recession will be over in 6 months, right?

"....every state had budget short falls,."

Iowa didn't. And the voters just tossed the Dem governor to bring back a re-tread Repub one.

See- money really CAN buy elections, but for the wrong reasons sometimes.

NJ NB.

Like cutting your nose off the spite your face? According to your religion cutting solves all problems. Llke bleeding cured many diseases.

Alan, you and I will have to agree to disagree on the tax cuts.

As to extended unemployment benefits, there are a lot of people who misunderstand the situation, and the impact on both recipients and the economy.

During this recession, the average length of time spent collecting these benefits is 36 weeks- up from 24 weeks in the last recession. There are not too many maxing out the benefits- but there are some.

Nancy Pelosi does not understand that there is no multiplier effect from unemployment benefits, any more than there is from welfare. Although people receiving either spend the funds, because the funds come from borrowed or taxed monies, they have, at most, an increase on the velocity of money- that is, how fast it moves through the economy.

I would love to have a discussion with you about it, but will not take the amountmof space required to explain the difference here. Not many would understand the difference, and I have no time to rebut then outlandish criticism itmwould be sure to generate.

I'm off for the day, now. Have a good one!

So true, dbo. A huge amount of money was spent to create a perception among voters that Iowa was badly run even as an investment-oriented group named it the third best-run state. http://www.bleedingheartland.com/diary/4265/investor-group-ranks-iowa-third-bestrun-state

That same money worked hard to establish Republican Terry Branstad as a reliable, experienced steward of government. The last time he was governor the manufacturing base was decimated, hundreds of farmers lost their farms, incomes plunged, education was badly damaged, partisanship was injected into the state hiring process, and Iowa lost population for the first time EVER. Thanks to his "stewardship" we just lost a congressional seat in the next redistricting.

The good news is that loss is concentrated in the districts of Conservative Republican Tom Latham and batshyte-crazy Conservative Republican Steve King.

Always look for the silver lining.

NJ in NJ is taking the day off so I guess that an admission that NJ is a paid poster.

dbo and johnb - Iowa did have budgetary problems in 2010 and will still have potential problems in 2011. I won't blame Culver for lack of leadership or say that Branstead was my pick either. I will say that I have lived in Iowa for over 40 years and have considered Iowa to generally lean slightly left of center and I don't recall the republicans ever sending a majority to the house of reps. At least in the district where I live the democrats pretty much have a lock on politics.

One thing for sure about Iowa voters is that they are just as likely to vote across party lines as with them.

Johnb - branstad hasn't even been sworn in yet and you say...

Thanks to his "stewardship" we just lost a congressional seat in the next redistricting.

I just hope that Boswell gets the short end of the stick when it comes to redistricting, and no i wasn't impressed with his last opponent either. I will have to recheck branstads terms to see why you claim he was responsible for the 1980's farm crisis or the loss of in state jobs. While Iowa can no longer be considered as a "hick" state, I know that many graduating students couldn't wait to graduate and move to the more populated and diverse environments of the east and west coasts. Also that branstad and other state leaders did look for ways to entice business to relocate to Iowa.

As I said I had no problems with Culvers leadership and my only misgiving about Branstad is that he would want a pay raise.

american, the poor stewardship of which I speak refers to the decline in Iowa that started with Branstad's previous term. We still haven't recovered.

I don't know about that johnb -$8000 +/acre for farmland vs ~$1500/acre in the early 80's. Iowa's education ranks ~#5 in the states (both items recently reported by the Des Moines Sunday Register) and the fact that Iowa has come thru the current recession in better shape than most states. I would hardly say that he had any worse stewardship than Culver or Culver's predecessor. Any politician is going to have faults and misteps.

american, I never liked Terry Branstad when he was previously Governor, but I'll meet you at the point where he can't be called the worst governor ever, nor were there any accusations of dirty tricks or crooked dealings. Branstad has always been a very savvy politician, so much so I was amazed that Doug Gross ran a thoroughly incompetent campaign for Terrace Hill. I always thought Gross was Branstad's Rove, so to speak.

Aww, now there you go drawing attention to what Conservatives don't want you to know. Rush and Glenn will be on shortly, I'm sure they have a good explanation.

I already know what their explanation will be: Whargarbl!!!

GMJ:

Kudos, see below copied from ThinkProgress. Hypocrisy again.

http://thinkprogress.org/2010/12/16/omnibus-hypocrisy/

Senate Republicans have spent the last few days acting shocked and outraged over this year’s omnibus spending bill, which would fund the government through next Sept. 30. Republicans are threatening to derail the lame duck session and shutdown the government over the “disrespectful” measure.

Leading the Republicans’ reckless campaign over the omnibus spending bill, Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-KY) took to the Senate floor this morning to publicly denounce the 2,000 page bill. Aghast over its physical enormity, McConnell parroted the GOP talking points on the bill: it was dropped in the dead of night, it “runs just under 2,000 pages,” and “it spends more than half a billion dollars per page.” McConnell dropped his own one-page continuing resolution that would hold the government at current spending levels until Feb. 18.

Overhearing McConnell’s tantrum, Senate Majority Whip Sen. Dick Durbin (D-IL) came to the floor. Acknowledging that the omnibus does indeed cost over a trillion dollars, Durbin offered one small helpful reminder to assuage McConnell’s “horror” over the figure: that $1.1 trillion number was “exactly the amount” he asked for himself:

DURBIN: I’m a member of the Appropriations Committee. And I remember what happened…this is the reality…It’s true it’s over a trillion dollars. In fact, it’s $1.1 trillion in this bill. But what hasn’t been said by Senator McConnell and Senator Kyl, that’s exactly the amount that they asked for! Senator McConnell came to the Senate Appropriations Committee and said Republicans will not support this bill unless you bring the spending down to $1.108 trillion. That is exactly what we bring down to the floor to be considered.

So to stand back in horror and look at $1.1. trillion and say where did this figure come from, it came from Senator Mitch McConnell in a motion he made before the Senate Appropriations Committee. It reflects the amount that he said was the maximum we should spend in this current calendar year on our appropriation bills. He prevailed. It’s the same number as the so-called Sessions-McCaskill figure that’s been debated back and forth on this floor, voted repeatedly by Republicans to be the appropriate total number. So we have the bipartisan agreement on the total number, and now the Republican leader comes to the floor, stands in horror at the idea of $1.1 trillion, the very same number he asked for in this bill. You can’t have it both ways.

US Navy Disabled Veteran - Retired

Here's more hypocrisy coming from the so called patriotic Americans in the party of "NOPE"s who love playing the crying Game...

Jon Stewart Interviews Four 9/11 First Responders That Deserve Our Attention

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryRZ3SxifWk">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryRZ3SxifWkhttp://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ryRZ3SxifWk

USN - was the total involved the entire problem, or a part of the problem? Was another part of the issue WHERE the money was going?

On target as usual, Da Noid.

Da Noid

Spot on; you beat me; but it bears repeating "The Crying Game" fake republicans play.

No doubt all that money for the top 2% will do as much for the economy as it has for the last 10 years, dbo. Of all the things I'm thankful for this holiday season, the fact that I already have a job I love ranks high.

<singing>

All I want for Christmas is the Trickle Down Miracle!

...the Trickle Down Miracle!

...the Trickle Down Miracle!

Gee, if I could only have the Trickle Down Miracle,

Then I could wish you Merry Christmas!

Business is booming at SAKS.

da noid - if you subscribe to the notion of $1 spent by the unemployed creates $1.64 return to the economy you already believe in the miracle of trickle down/up.

Trickle UP is based on the concept that money in the hands of the poor and unemployed gets spent.

Trickle down is based on the falsehood that money in the hands of the rich will be reinvested in the same nation's economy which has already allowed them to have too much of it by undertaxing them.

they both rely on the same principle of multip[lying the value of the money supply as it goes thru the system. Not on the misconstrued idea that you state...

Trickle down is based on the falsehood that money in the hands of the rich will be reinvested in the same nation's economy which has already allowed them to have too much of it by undertaxing them.

Just ask yourself how much of the money spent by the unemployed/poor leaves the US to overseas markets as well. Then ask yourself how the multiplier effect (trickle thru) is affected by wealth re-distribution? Don't see it unless you want to imply that the poor are spendthrifts or that they have boughten into the concept that they need to keep up with the joneses.

Stimulas occurs in either direction, albeit perhaps in different multipliers, and depending on the view point of any given economist.

CRAP!!! What you wrote is complete crap.

The poor and unemployed spend 99.999999% of every dollar they receive. And they spend 99% of it domestically.

The wealthy spend and invest their money globally. For god's sake man, they import their water!

The multiplier effect is already calculated for you. The difference between the stimulus effect of unemployment benefits being allocated and tax cuts for the rich isn't close or even disputable.

Your point that any given dollar going up or down in the economy is the same trickle effect isn't the point being debated or discussed. There is no policy involved in that argument.

paul - ROTFLMAO!!! No doubt they spend within the local economy but... Where are many of the the goods made that walmart sells and they buy? Target or Kmart? When you buy fresh produce at the supermarket ever read the signs or attached stickers stating a country of origin other than the US? Ever check out country of origin for canned mushrooms.

I use the Brita water filter myself for drinking water. If you want to put the rich on a pedestal and bow down to them that is your choice not mine.

Why shoul the rich be denied a tax cut while those earning less get theirs? Their tax rate is still higher. Work with your elected officials to change the tax rates if you don't like them.

What is "The Real Tea Party"?

I don' t know, but when I learn to type, I'll let you know what I find out.

Really, Buzz- "Tea Perty"??

Battle of the Bulge in 1944. And how about Carter saying the U.S. was certainly ready for its first Gay president. According to many noted historians President Buchanan "A life long bachelor" was the first gay president of the United States. Granted Buchanan didn't come "out" but everyone knew he was gay and even referred to his partner as Mrs. Buchanan.

Oo, oo, oo, I know, I know!

The year was 1773 and it was a cold, dark night in Boston harbor. The weather and darkness, however, did not stop this rag tag group of businessmen from completing their mission to send a clear message to Mother England that they wanted to make more money . . .

. . . or something like that.

They attack anyone with whom they disagree, which, it turns out, is most people.

Liberals represent the smallest minority in the country, according to Gallup

http://www.gallup.com/poll/145271/Conservatives-Continue-Outnumber-Moderates-2010.aspx

They represent about 21% of the people in this country, yet believe that their pie in the sky, perfect world, no unintended consequences world view should be forced on the majority, who do understand reality.

They had their own way for two years, a period that can only be categorized as an unmitigated disaster for the country.

They cannot accept that it was the policies that failed; it must be the fault of those who told them that the policies would fail.

no joe, no bo, nj

"They attack anyone with whom they disagree, which, it turns out, is most people."

Well, now, THERE'S a pot calling a kettle black!

Mornin' there, sunshine. How bright is YOUR little, small world this fine morning?

thetotas, it's because the Tea Party is really just a rebranding of the same old, failed Radical Right. Many of the candidates are the same;

Christine O’Donnell may have burst onto the national stage this week as the tea party’s latest challenge to the Republican establishment, but she’s hardly a new face in Delaware, where she lost two previous bids for the Senate, in 2006 and 2008.

And O’Donnell, the upset winner over Rep. Mike Castle in Tuesday’s GOP Senate primary, is hardly the only Republican with a losing record who has found success in the anti-establishment tea party. Across the country, many of this year’s tea party candidates are outsiders only because they have failed in previous attempts over the years to become insiders. In fact, some lost multiple Republican primary or general election campaigns before recasting themselves as tea party champions.

Read more: http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0910/42313.html#ixzz18Nni9pDz

It's represented by the same tired, old faces from deep inside the Republican Party, like Dick Armey and Grover Norquist.

The money is coming from the same wealthy elites who've funded the Conservative Movement for decades;

The anti-government fervor infusing the 2010 elections represents a political triumph for the Kochs. By giving money to “educate,” fund, and organize Tea Party protesters, they have helped turn their private agenda into a mass movement. Bruce Bartlett, a conservative economist and a historian, who once worked at the National Center for Policy Analysis, a Dallas-based think tank that the Kochs fund, said, “The problem with the whole libertarian movement is that it’s been all chiefs and no Indians. There haven’t been any actual people, like voters, who give a crap about it. So the problem for the Kochs has been trying to create a movement.” With the emergence of the Tea Party, he said, “everyone suddenly sees that for the first time there are Indians out there—people who can provide real ideological power.” The Kochs, he said, are “trying to shape and control and channel the populist uprising into their own policies.

http://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php?title=Tea_Party

The only thing different is that they've sold a message designed to get Mom and Pop down to the local TP rally to wave signs and cheer on Sister Sarah.

Speaking of Sarah Palin, someone's spending a BOATLOAD of money to turn her from a nobody to a political star. I wonder who that is and what they want?

no joe,

Did you ever go back and look at Nixon's "Enemies List"?

Attacking those with whom you disagree? Newt Gingrich has mastered the art.

"Speaking of Sarah Palin, someone's spending a BOATLOAD of money to turn her from a nobody to a political star. I wonder who that is and what they want?"

If he wasn't so near death, I'd think Cheney has a hand in it. The Koch bros for sure, and probably Dick Armey. It would be just like when Bush was in office. They could get him to do and say anything they wanted, because he was DIM WITTED.

DBO

Why mention the wicked witch of the west?

John B, Des Moines, IA

Speaking of Sarah Palin, someone's spending a BOATLOAD of money to turn her from a nobody to a political star. I wonder who that is and what they want?

The Real Story Behind How McCain Chose Sarah Palin

They were just smitten by her. They described her wearing high heels and saying, "Hi, I'm Sarah," and introducing herself charmingly. And they talked, almost to a man, how gorgeous she was. They called her a "honey." Bill Kristol called her "my heartthrob." I mean, they sounded like guys with schoolboy crushes, practically.

http://www.alternet.org/story/105359/the_real_story_behind_how_mccain_chose_sarah_palin?page=3

in fact, Dick Morris sort of pulled her aside for a private conversation, which she then revealed later to the group, in which he said, "If you want to be successful politically, you've got to continue to hold onto your image as an outsider. Play up that outsider thing." And obviously, she has. But it's just so interesting to hear that really it's a calculated strategy. It's not just because she is an outsider; it's a ploy, to some extent.

AG: Dick Morris, of course, the disgraced aide to President Clinton, though usually with the Republicans.

AG: So, you have the cruises to Alaska, National Review and the Weekly Standard. How did that parlay into, well, Sarah Palin being chosen on the ticket? And if you could bring Adam Brickley into this.

JM: Sure. Well, alright, so the cruises come through in the summer of 2007. Fred Barnes goes right back to Washington and writes a glowing column about Palin and what a fabulous politician she is and a promising, rising star in the Republican Party.

http://www.alternet.org/story/105359/the_real_story_behind_how_mccain_chose_sarah_palin?page=2

===================================================================

drive-by-observer

If he wasn't so near death, I'd think Cheney has a hand in it. The Koch bros for sure, and probably Dick Armey. It would be just like when Bush was in office. They could get him to do and say anything they wanted, because he was DIM WITTED.

You could be right. Dick Morris said: "The GOP primaries of 12 will be held on Fox News"

http://mediamatters.org/blog/201011290040

After all,they appear on FOX NOISE'S ECHO CHAMBER almost daily

Thanks Bev, I appreciate the opportunity to study up on this.

thetotas

I think one of the main reasons the tea party isn't taken seriously is because they aligned themselves with the repubs. They are seen as nothing more than a right wing arm of an established party. Perhaps if they actually formed their own party, they would not be perceived as merely pawns of the big guys.

thetotas - Keep on using your brain to ask good fundamental questions that deal with reality. I sometimes wonder if the left wing radicals are just jealous that they don't have a catchy "party name" to call and identify themselves with or an attractive woman as a cheerleader.

Indylib - It wouldn't surprise me to see the tea party continue to grow over the years if the current philosophy of the republicans and democrats don't change to suit the independents. They will however need to become more moderate in their actions to successfully court the independents votes.

No, the plan was passed in spite of voters' complete misconceptions about the bill, thanks to a bad PR job by the WH and a lot of outright lies by the right-wing derp machine.

And if you did repeal it, what would you replace it with - Fake-tan Boehner's plan? Here's a news flash: It's the exact same plan but without the mandate, and without the mandate, insurers will simply raise premiums over 25% to cover the rest of it!

But, I suppose if Boehner sheds some crocodile tears on the bill, all will be ok, right?

The healthcare plan was passed in spite of US voter's opposition to government ran healthcare.

Telling a lie over and over again doesn't make it true. The Affordable Care Act is not government-run health care and US voters are about equally split in opposition and support of its passage with several polls indicating more people supporting it than opposed.

Unlike the tax deal Obama was forced into in order to free the Republicans' middle class hostages, the CBO projects that the ACA will decrease the deficit -- the same CBO that Republicans cited as the purveyors of the gospel truth when it projected that earlier version of the health care legislation would increase the deficit.

They're the RE-peat-the-lie-to-the-PUBLIC-ans, that's all that they know how to do.

no joe, no bo: This is the vine for MSNBC. MSNBC is liberal news media. Generally there is a more even distribution of posters, today the left is out, sometime later it will be the right. I like the vine, even when it looks like the Huffpo, which is something I also enjoy. Yup, I do look at both sides and form opinions after examining different sites and areas of information.

What is not repealed or thrown out by the courts will be legislated out due to affordability. It won't matter what party is in charge, the reality of the cost is going to send all facing the bill scrambling. The cuts Obama made to medicare and social security are going to overload the healthcare bill. Hospitals across the couintry are already closing, the cut in medicare payments to hospitals is already impacting. Even now, many hospitals are sending patients to other hospitals who can still afford the cuts the first hospital can no longer afford. Other hospitals have just closed there doors. The whole problem is the uninformed public who do not recognize a situation that is in its infancy but will become a major medical catastrophy.

How do you respond to a posting about diminishing returns and never cite a single statistic? Seems illogical.

"taxes don't cut deficits".

Yeah, it's like when you or the spouse overdraw the ol' checking account. Why make a deposit? Deposits don't cut deficits (i.e.- 'overdrawns'), right?

How do you overdraw your checking account?

By overspending.

So glad at least one liberal understands the concept.

If only there were ONE Conservative willing to admit that commitments must be funded. What should we stop doing to balance the budget, and how much will it save?

I've been asking that question for MONTHS and not received even one answer that gets us there. Most times the question is ignored. When it isn't about 90% of the time there are no numbers. When there are numbers they get us about 1% of the way there, like "cut earmarks."

Thanks FR for pointing out that "cutting earmarks" doesn't take money out of the budget, it just takes out the language steering it to a particular project.

Service fees, built in costs.

no joe, no bo, nj

"How do you overdraw your checking account?

By overspending.

So glad at least one liberal understands the concept."

So nice to see your response to my post, but where is your commentary on the REST of it?

So glad at least one liberal understands the concept.

Now if we could only get conservatives to understand "trickle-down" and how it does NOT work...

yea that's right, we want trickle up poverty to solidify our entitlement nation! ! !If a person has enough money to hire a gardener, a maid, maybe a pool boy and you take some of his money, he will not keep those folks on his pay roll, how do you not get it? If he buys a car every year and decides to keep his car for 4 years, he will employ a mechanic, but he will not dump a boat load of taxes on his new car purchase. I am just a dang old construction worker, but I get it! !

chuck todd is a lightweight jackass.

That number includes well over 50% of republicans, so apparently you still don't get it either.

What you incorrectly refer to as "trickle up" is actually more of an economic theory that pays as much attention to the demand side as the supply side. The so-called "trickle down" theory, which has been proven not to work, focuses exclusively on supply side.

In case it's not clear, gravity doesn't actually play a role in these economic theories.

True Clotho, but the case against trickle down is clear. The numbers paint a picture of an unmistakable falure. The only way to save it is to attack the language used to accurately portray a policy determined to route all wealth to the most wealthy. Taking the power out of the argument against trickle down by creating this PR mirage of "trickle up poverty" is the narrative chosen by Conservatives to do this.

Check the votes on 11/2 and see who don't get it.

Check the votes yourself.

Some races went Republican, some went Democratic. Most races were very close either way. The Republicans gained an advantage in the House. The Democrats still hold the Senate and the Presidency.

Despite what you may want to believe, not everyone in this country is a conservative Republican.

Morning Nash!

Been missing ya! Have you been busy stringing the popcorn & cranberries? lol

*hugs*

Been missing you too Feisty . . . things are a little more hectic than usual with the hubby traveling alot . . . but I'm still around . . . and yes stringing the popcorn is still job one! :o)

Thanks for checking in on me . . . much appreciated . . . *hugs* to you as well!

Don't know if you saw it yesterday, Nash, but

Merry Christmas!

Or, as the princess says, Ha, Ha, Who! (or Ho, Ho Ho for those not fluent in "toddler").

Nash saw it and answered you NJNB - go back and read it! Funny how you seemed to have missed that one when you manage to be all over the place otherwise!

And for the love of GOD quit pimping out the grandkid for votes & sympathy!

That little ploy of yours... is soooo yesterday!

Thanks nojoe . . . I saw it late last night . . . Merry Christmas to you and yours as well!

(Give the princess a hug from Auntie Nash!)

Feisty - Per usual, full of hate. Nashville and nojo, Merry Christmas. Its nice to see that people can disagree and still be cordial to one another.

Feisty - You should try it, I swear it wont hurt.

Will do, Nash.

Thanks, thetotas.

And, I do not want sympathy, or anything else. I just thought it was so cute, and wanted to share it.

I guess that makes me a boring old grandmother, but, so what!

Speaking of jokes, look who's up and at 'em already this morning, kids!

Is this a treat, or what?

Hey LD.....a week or so ago you pretty much told us all to go pound sand....said you were done with us and would never come back.

Yet.....here you are.....what gives?

Admit it....you missed us and all of our liberalessness dint ya!

Now you have to admit that it was great to see our President call the (R)'s on their bluff of no legislation until the tax bill was dealt with. And regardless of your ideology...it's good to see them "working" and dealing with DADT and START. Right? Surely we can agree that we want these folks to "work for us".

They're fired on Jan. 4 not Nov.2.

Mark Mazerski,

Did you forget that we elected them, all of them, to serve 2 full years, not 22 months?

If you want to change that then tell your Representative in Congress and your State Senators to introduce a bill to change the terms of the elected officials. I’m not sure but this might require a constitutional amendment.

Come on January 4th!!!!!!!!!! Happy New Year!!!

Well said, MD. Where are the Democrats who will stand next to the President and help with the heavy lifting?

Yea, that's all about hitting back, and giving high five to each other as McCane did with another Republican, screaming " Hurray we won". WON WHAT? What a bunch of kids that playing with our future.

I don't think you understand what Obama was given by Boehner, McConnell, and by the way statement McCain made shows how unqualified he is to be a leader! back to the question" the Big three in the GOP just handed President Obama A second term, He will be re- elected thx to this bill that they brokered with him to extend his Presidency, Now the veto "PENN" WILL KEEP THE RE PUBS IN CONTROL, AND THERE IS NO WAY THEY CAN STOP THE NEXT ELECTION !!!

You are dreaming if you think Obammy will be reelected.

You're not quite right there, dale. Mid-term election showed that the majority of voters aren't made up of mindless followers, they can didistinguish between fluff and substance and the substance won!

Too much pompous egotistical posturing has gone down during the past two years and it will not be forgotten. Every time he takes credit for beneficial actions done by Republicans, the voters become more and more aware that he is ineffective as a leader and cease to follow. If he vetoes bills that could and would be a betterment for the average citizen, even die-hard democrat voters will turn away from him. Basically, the man has done more damage to the democrat party in two years than they managed to do to themselves in two decades.