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Subscribe to RSSThe tax cut deal negotiated between the White House and congressional Republicans is undeniably unpopular with some Capitol Hill lawmakers on both sides of the aisle, but one new poll shows that most Americans support the compromise as a whole.
Almost 70 percent of Americans in a new Washington Post/ABC survey say that they back the agreement, which would temporarily extend tax cuts for all income levels, tax large inheritances at 35 percent, extend benefits for the unemployed, and impose a payroll tax holiday.
The poll found similar levels of support for the package (68 percent) among Democrats and independents, a key target for Democrats hoping to woo those voters in the 2012 election.
Even when respondents were told that the deal would add almost $1 trillion to the federal deficit and that the nation’s very top earners would receive the tax cuts, over 60 percent of respondents still gave the proposal a thumbs up.
The broad bipartisan support for the deal as a whole comes despite sharp partisan differences on the major pieces of the compromise.
While 85 percent of Republicans believe that the tax cuts should be extended to both the wealthiest earners and middle-class Americans, only 38 percent of Democrats agree. Independents are split on the measure, with 49 percent agreeing with the GOP-backed position and 46 percent more aligned with the position taken by most Democrats.
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Hey, JoAnna- look at that headline!
They are talking about YOU!!
(oh, and speaking of Obama, and the fact that MOST Americans Support the deal: You mean he's listening to *gasp* the "will of the people"??)
There's a first time for everything. He can ignore economic reality, he can ignore the people for 2 years, but he cannot ignore political reality forever.
But you guys still can.
Many of us have been saying the problem isn't that the government taxes too little - it spends too much. Stimulating government growth is not stimulating economic growth.
70% of Americans seem to get it. I hope Obama finally gets it ...... even if you guys never do.
Bob, I have a serious question for you:
With all of your talk about the need for cutting governemtn spending, exactly where, and how much would you do your cuts?
Are you going to leave senior citizens out on the streets by cutting Social Secuity benefits?
What about killing people by doing away with, or severely cutting Medicare funding?
Do you advocate reducing hundreds of billions in Defense spending?
The US is already lagging in educational performance compared to the rest of the industrialized world. do you want to abolish the Department of Education?
How about some specifics on what you would do to cut government spending?
Why is it that we can get details on tax cuts, increased government spending, and increases to the deficit, but never can get any details on spending cuts of any sorts?
This bill is a mistake.... we cannot afford the cost of the spending, and we still refuse to address the $14 Trillion pound deficit gorilla in the room that is going to eat our country alive. I hope I'm dead wrong, but I don't see this helping DEMAND which is what will make jobs. Too much money is going to stay on the sidelines even with this bills passage.
This should not be surprising to anyone.
Most Americans are NOT far left liberals and they're the only ones who are getting their panties all twisted up in knots about this issue.
Sucks to be them!!!
Righties tear me up!
Obama doesn't want tax 'cuts' for the wealthy- he's a "commie".
He says "ok, for now- I give in"- He's an idot of some kind.
"country first, my ass"! They just want to complain, doesn't matter what about.
flynavy i tried to get you to do away with the military. keep the b52s, nukes and support. they can do away with war. ask japan. put america back to work with the 825 billion. blessed be the peacemakers.
70 percent of Americans are wrong! That extra $1 in their paycheck will cost their grandchildren $1.50. Based on the current National Debt, each of their children and grandchildren currently owe $44,768.70.
70 percent of Americans don't care about the future.
Tom,
That was my statement. From January 2008 we lost 8 million private sector jobs. He added 600,000 new government jobs at an average of $123,000, twice private sector average including benefits. Speaking of benefits, unfunded state and local public employee benefit liabilities are about $3 trillion and growing. All the stimulus money that didn't budge unemployment for over a year untill it went up! Asinine.
I don't care about specific cuts as much as I care about the way big government conducts itself. Take this bill. It started as a tax issue, then we added 13 months of unemployment, OVER A YEAR OF UNEMPLOYMENT, and that just got it started with everyone adding in their whatever. $5 billion is nothing, but it is an example of needless government spending. $5 billion in ethanol subsidies? Why are we still trying to subsidize something that doesn't work and hasn't for 30 years. And on top of that we have trade protectionism and mandates that force consumers to buy ethanol. Heck, Al Gore even admits it is boggus.
How about the first thing we do is to just put the damn shovel down and spend money like they do in the private sector without all of the political manipulations and agendas.
Tom,
Obama-care has already taken care of Medicaid Cuts. Wanna talk about how well that's going to work out? People are outraged that AZ is making health care decisions for it's Medicaid recipients based on budget decisions, wait until Obama care kicks in in full and Medicare cuts across the board starts happening.
Social Security- the republicans seem to be the only one's who've actually put ideas on the table for keeping it solvent long term. The dems only scream don't touch my benefits and screw those of you who are footing the bill for me but won't ever see a dime. My solution- partial privatization- Keep benefits where they are for current recipients and the baby boomers but allow the younger workers to optionally invest 4% of their social security tax into managed private accounts. No change to the employer contribution, it goes in it's entirety along with the remaining 2.2% of the employee contribution to the social security general fun. Make up the funding for the current retirees/boomers from general funds for the short term. at least there is a finite date when we could stop drawing private funds. It would allow the social security reserves to build back up and at least those of us still working would have something of a fund to fall back on for retirement if we should be so lucky as to live long enough to see it. At the same time, we need to start incrementally increasing the retirement age. Social security was not designed to support people for 20 after retirement.
As for spending cuts- I doubt there's a single piece of our federal government that can't be pared down, including defense. Consolidation is a great first step. Eliminate redundancies in agencies and equipment. Then we streamline. Heck, rewriting the tax codes to simplify things across the board would save a fortune in IRS agents alone!
As for education- typical liberal response is throw more money at it. Time to wake up and smell the bacon- we've been throwing money at our education system for decades and not only has it not improved, it's gotten worse. Time for a new approach. No Child Left Behind and the Race to the Top are both great concepts but in practice they are hindered by too much bureaucracy and protectionism on the part of the teachers union. The first step in improving classroom performance is demanding teacher performance. If a school needs to downsize it should be downsizing the least effective teachers, not the least tenured. Next we need to close schools that don't perform. They are a drain on taxpayers who are seeing no return for their dollars. Matriculate the students into better performing schools, again, eliminate teachers who are not performing and keep those who are. Finally, we need to find the miracle that increases parental involvement. Wish I knew the magic formula for that but until parents care, students aren't going to achieve to their fullest potential. Time to put our heads together on that one and get creative.
Personally, I'd eliminate a whole lot of subsidies and endowments as well. The free market can decide what the best alternative fuel source will be because Ethanol is not it. It decreases engine performance causing higher fuel consumption and causes more pollutants than burning fossil fuel alone, yet we subsidize the industry because it's a popular pork project. And what's with the National Endowment for the Arts? You want to support the arts, go for it, give them all the money you want, but I'd like mine to go to historic preservation. Oh,and it should be my choice what causes I support, not the governments with my tax dollars.
So there. Just a few thoughts I've had on cutting government spending. Yes, I know, eliminating redundancies is going to land a lot of government workers on the unemployment line but that's something I'm willing to deal with- costs fewer tax payer dollars to pay them unemployment than it does to pay salaries and benefits to keep them in government jobs which means tax payers might get to keep a few more bucks to put back into the economy and get it growing again which means jobs will open up and we won't be supporting them for long.
Sorry Suzy the floozy......the vague cuts you describe are a table of contents. NO specific programs, no numbers no way to judge if it would make any more than a small drop in the deficit bucket. I know you pulled this out of your rear, because your Tea-TArd and GOP malcontents DONT HAVE A PLAN for anything you are wishing for. FAIL
HR 4853 Has been passed by the Seante. There are already over 60 votes so anyone of the Senators votes after 4:13 pm EST are just a show.Again HR4853 is passed in the Senate.
Synopsis of the Suzy defcit reduction plan:
Spend less on stuff, cut some stuff, consolidate some stuff and were done......DUHHH!
Actually, before the agreement on taxes between the President and the Republicans, a much smaller number of people wanted the tax cuts for the top 2%. This number has recently gone up with the selling by President Obama, Clinton and the Republicans. Prior to this agreement not many wanted this and so far it's the only deal in town.
Tim, Sleeping in Seattle:
Much of what Suzy has outlined is encompassed in Paul Ryan's Roadmap for America's Future 2.0. Look it up before being so quick to resort to the name-calling that posters like you typically fall back on when you have nothing of substance to offer, other than strawman arguments and all-or-nothing litmus tests...
Tim also seems to think I have some sort of looking glass into the government. I'm just an average working shlub sick of being asked to pay more in taxes without any accountability for the spending. I couldn't pretend to suggest cuts to Tim's family budget because I don't know the details of their needs, but I can offer suggestions like shop the sales flyers, clip coupons, etc. But then I am betting Tim wouldn't like anything I suggest because I fall under the general header of Conservative and like most liberals, even when given exactly what he asked for, he finds fault because its not what he wants to hear.
I do understand that tax rates will need to be revisited but I do believe first we need to get the economy on more stable footing (as in more people working, growth in the market place, etc) and we need to closely examine and reduce spending. Lets get a grasp on what's necessary and what's ideal when circumstances are better but unfeasible at this time.
I appreciated your suggestions Suzy and thought they were well thought out. I would add that agencies like the FCC and FDA should also be drastically cut and scaled back. Since we already have an agency called the ATF why does the FDA get more power over tobacco while the T in ATF stands for tobacco. The FCC is a total waste of taxpayer money because people should decide for themselves what content is appropriate to watch or hear on TV and Radio. I would also totally dismantle the DEA because the war on drugs is a total waste of taxpayer funds. Legalizing and taxing drugs makes far more sense. The money saved on incarceration alone would be a step in the right direction as far as budget concerns then with additional tax revenue for the sale of the drugs you are making quite an improvement. Now lets look at the department of education and see what cuts can be made. Administrative costs are by far the biggest concern I have in the education system, while money keeps getting pumped into the system it seems to not make it to the students and that is a travesty. I am for charter schools and privatization of the education system personally but it is a far too capitalistic solution for most people these days. It makes sense to me that if a school is a poor performer then you can simply take your child to one that performs better even if it costs a bit more. I don't think it is fair for those who have no children to pay to educate other peoples kids. Just a few suggestions to shrink the size of unelected bureaucracies that are funded by our taxes.
WHAT, but all the LIBERALS and Progressives that i have heard say NO Americans want this TAX EXTENSION!
oh well, to be a PROGRESSIVE/LIBERAL is to live by the LIE!!!
libsrballsack -
While I agree that the FCC could be cut back, it can't be done away with because they also deal with frequency allocations, signal strength issues and the like that modern electronics has to consider. As en electrical engineer, I understand why we can't do away with them entirely as they are a necessary evil, so to speak. The same could be said of the FDA and a number of other agencies, including the department of energy (another failure of a department), the EPA, FEMA (useless as witnessed by Katrina response and other responses since then).
The thing is, there is over-regulation in many areas and no teeth to many of the regulations that are actually helpful. There is also duplication and contradiction between regulatory agencies as well.
I think a good first step would be to get all ot the regulations into a computer and let the computer parse them down to the essentials. With that, they could actually get rid of the trash and just keep what works. It would actually help to streamline things. That in itself would help to identify where the waste is.
Who is going to "spend" to pay the rich man's tax deficit? Oh, yeah, that's right, WE THE 98% OF THE PEOPLE, you know..... the ones that at this time only own 4 to 6% OF ALL U.S. DOLLARS. Because we need to give the rich even more, thereby leaving WE THE 98% OF THE PEOPLE with a combined total value of what????? 1%? They are in cahoots... The Dems are pacifying their constituents (except for a few like Senator Sanders) with very flimsy and purposefully weak arguments for what they know the people want to hear... we hear you, you don't like, well we don't either, but they won't bring the figures into it.... because they don't want to infuriate you. These are the figures. YOU SHOULD BE INFURIATED. The rich had a record profit in the Trillions this year. Did they open up and create jobs? No... they didn't, and they still WILL NOT. They want total control, and the congress is going to give it to them... while they make it look like they don't want to... they do. We are screwed.
Tom Strange
"Bob, I have a serious question for you:
With all of your talk about the need for cutting governemtn spending, exactly where, and how much would you do your cuts?"
Oh, let me answer. If you have been following where the employment spike was because of the stimulous, you would have seen that the government increased about 10% in size during the first 2 years of this adminitration, because of it. That would be the first place to start. Shink government back to where is was before Obama. While at it, eliminate a couple dozen Czar positions and their staffs.
There is no valid reason to grow government 10% when the the country has lost 10% of the producers.
this will work for all i say again do away with the military. keep nukes and b52s with support. these can stop war, ask japan. spend the 825 billion to put america back to work. secure borders. social programs. pay off deficit. if needed i can work out the details for us but it will work in my favor. merry christmas! blessed are the peacemakers.
You can only work with those who are willing to work with you. And I would like to thank those Republicans who worked with President Obama on this. There is a lot of good stuff in this legislation. Again, thank you for working together.
All of you.
Here's hoping we can get DADT. Another bi-partisan piece of legislation.
They didn't need a poll to figure this one out.
The fact that President Obama and the Republican leadership came to a compromise (or reached common ground in Speaker Boehner's vernacular) on a temporary extension of tax benefits and UEI benefits and 70% of the American people support it must really chafe the buns of Weiner, Van Hollen, Bernie Sanders and Nancy don't you think?
It's all fun and games until the cuts become permanent, which most likely they will. Most Americans have no clue as to what's real and what's political spin anymore. I wonder if the 70% will still be as thrilled when the real austerity measures hit when the rest of the world truly sizes us up and stops loaning the U.S. money.
K man
There is no such thin as a permanent tax rate
Tax rates and the entire tax code can me amended or replaced at anytime by legislative process
This compromise is hopefully the first step in a series of deal, compromises common ground (whatever you want to call them) that will refine and reform tax codes, reduce and reform spending across the board and reduce, reorganize and improve the structure of government itself
Must make you liberals crazy to think it might happen doesn't it, because ideology is more important to you folks then getting things done for the people.
So logical. Too much so for most. These rates need to go away. We need to stop borrowing and spending. And, I think these percentages are pulled from someones mind and are not fact. I have asked no less than 10 people of mixed incomes and backgrounds and they all say let them expire. Let it all go. It is a ploy to make them permanent and we are headed down the wrong road.
History repeats itself. The same self serving people trying to get ahead of the game.voting against there own best intrests, in the name of money and race. I have lost all faith in the general population of flip floppers, and vultures. Republicans have destroyed democracy. Where are the jobs? Where is health care for everyone? We are supposed to set the precedent for other countries. But the herd will follow the money off of the cliff. Lets talk about the Republicans and democrats posing as such. Lets talk about the lobbyists. For the people??? When these people affect your life and it will, people will be singing a different tune.
Robert in Ohio,
A: I'm not a liberal (not a conservative, Dem, Repub or Tea Partier either)
B: You're dreaming if you think Washington will reform and reorganize the tax or government structure until there are term limits and public funded national elections. Until sucking up to the Big Money interestes that have utterly corrupted our democratic system has been taken out of the equation...nothing will change.
Quite true, Robert
Its Funny...the Tax Cut is the easy thing to do. No wonder the GOP wanted to do it 1st or nothing at all. Now they have to come up with specific plans for job creation and balancing the budget.
The Debt Commisiion came out with a plan...where yours GOP? You got the easy win with tax cuts, now how are you going to pay down the debt? What programs? Across the board including Military, right? How deep a cut? When? How are you going to do it without raising taxes on anyone as you are saying now?
Time to put your money where your 'less govmint' mouth is.
Oh, and we can also expoect those billonaires to go on tv and say they are taking their tax cuts and creating jobs because uncertainty has been renoved, right? So next month expect this question from all of us, GOP....Where are the jobs?
Tim -
FYI - It's still December, 2010. The new Congress doesn't start until January. The democrats are still running the show for now and some of them are still not listening to the American people.
 This package of bribes to buy votes is exactly what I voted against in November. "Can" the extension until next year, bring back a clean "as is" extension that doesn't spend millions more of money we don't have and make it retroactive. No more freakin' pork, you pigs.
Can the extension completely. Can it all and get responsible.
ARealist
I am with you on that
I think the tax rates on all the "middle class" and everyone else should go up, that all the tax perks (child credit, Earned income credit, tuition credit, making work pay and the AMT exclusion) should go away, that UEI should not be extended and that the estate tax will go to the level required by law.
Sell that to your liberal base
I am a liberal, but an Independent. I lean Democratic as I feel Republicans are not at all 'One for All, and All for One'. There should be a straight percent, no deductions, all income is taxed, and loans to states for what used to be pork. One term for all and a third party.
Sell that to the GOP.
ARealist
One term for all in government wuld be chaos
A reduction in federal government with responsibility for what should taken care of by the states returned to the states (a pesky thing in the Constitution about states rights)
Drastic spending cuts across the baord (defense, size and scope of government, entitlement programs and social welfare prgorams) are needed as well as tax reform - we have a spending problem not a revenue problem.
Third parties have come and gone and never gain the traction needed to survive, I think a viable third part would be good, but doubt it will happen anytime soon.
So then you're not really an Independent.
Still not an independent.
I advocate a consumption tax over a straight income tax. If those that don't make as much shop at thrift stores or consignment shops, no tax, so they can keep more of their income, vice the senator who spends millions on a new boat and pays a hefty tax accordingly.
www.fairtax.org
They would buy it as easily much as the dems would.
I don't believe one term, years enough to be stable, would be a problem, especially if they were not the type of politicians we have now. They would not have the pensions and benefits they have now. They need to be people who care about the country and not themselves. Lobbyists have to go. A third party needs to gain traction and maybe the 'No Labels' group will take hold. I am going to follow them closely.
Chef Darrell
Your interpretation of how I am Independent or not is yours alone. I think you just like to try and pick things apart for your own behalf. You don't bother me in the slightest. You'll have to pick on someone else to get a reaction.
you sound a little ifie chef.
Arealist,
Saying you're an independent who espouses liberal ideals and despises republicans doesn't sound like an independent, or a realist.
Gerald,
I don't get what you're trying to say.
And other right-wing fairy tales like....
"Im a Tea Bagger and I always vote GOP, but Im an Independant"
"Im a conservative, but Im not a Republican"
Nice try, man...but pretty weak
There's really nothing surprising about these poll numbers.
People have been talking about the need for cooperation and compromise all along, and the percentages of people who support either the Republican or Democratic side of the negotiations are essentially the same as they have been for years.
The interesting issue is the fact that the biggest imediment to cooperation and compromise are the two major political parties themselves.
American politics has been made into a huge profitable business, run mostly by rich folks. The two major parties are essentially controlled by big money from corporations and labor unions, and there is not much of a discernible difference between the rank and file voters of both parties.
Party officials spend money like it's grown on trees while Republican and Democratic taxpayers are worried about where their next meal is coming from because of the economic situation in this country.
Perhaps the "No Labels" get-together in New York today is a signal that the country is starting to be fed up with the rich folks and lobbyists running everything.
That would be an excellent change, but It's going to be hard to wrest control away from the entrenched power brokers, because they are going to fight to keep their lucrative political ponzi schemes alive.
This was not bipartisan and I need to find where all the poll numbers came from and who from. Phone call polls only come from people with land lines, they can't quick dial cell phones. This was a hold up by the GOP and once again the Dems folded and tried to get what they could. So now we have huge deficits being created by both sides.This is what our government is and we are hostages if all of them. These are tax rates and not tax cuts. If they rolled over, and later were put back in, they would be cuts. If these rates created so many jobs in the past where are they? The extra money just stays where it is, it isn't used to employ. And, why should they, the general public doesn't have any money to buy their goods if they did. Round and round we go.
ARealist
You do realize that Pres Obama brokered the deal with the Republicans, probably because he didn't trust the Dems in Congress to do it.
The poll you hate was by ABC/Washington POst (I agree with the problems with phone polls but.....)
Economists on the left seem to think that the deal will result in a 1% jump on 2011 GDP and at lest a million jobs which is a start, a small step but a strt none the less.
More comproise and working together will get us out of this mess through tax code reform, business regulation reform and drastic spending cuts
Get on the bus
If this bill doesn;t pass, the deal for the elft will not be as good aftr Jan 1
The key word is 'deal'. Deals are what gets us further into these messes. When you sell your values down the well, you lose.
They certainly didn't call me. This legislation is crap. It has more pork than a sausage factory. I hope it fails to pass and is reintroduced in the next session without all the congressional wet dreams attached. Something as important as tax code and budget legislation should be able to stand alone.
The reason the tax rates aren't creating jobs is because of the HCR battle looming in the distance. We were able to barter a pretty good deal for our employees in regards to healthcare but beyond this year...all bets are off.
Robert
If you believe these Economists and Polls, you need to think. How many times have they made predictions recently and been way off? Unemployment predictions - Job starts - the Market. Believe none of what you hear and half of what you see.
AReaslist
I agree with you about the accuracy of polls
I disagree with you about compromise - it is much more important to get things done that benefits the American people then it is be be sanctimoniously pure to ideological taching
We need to solve the economic crisis in the U.S. -- it is about jobs and not about ideology!!
Jobs it is and nothing indicates or has indicated accurately that these tax rates being extended will create any jobs, as a huge percent of America has no money to spend so jobs to produce goods won't be created in this manner. I don't profess to know the answer to jobs. I just don't see this working. If it does the GOP should be congratulated for their stuborness on this tax issue. I would very gladly be wrong.
Arealist
The CBO said that the compromise bill would likely result in a bump in 2011 GDP growth and creation of a million jobs
Not as many as we need but a start
If we do nothing we will likely get nothing
I agree that extending the tax rates will not directly create jobs...however, it will put confidence in the consumer as they will not be forced to have a reduction in their available spending starting 2011. I see consumer confidence improving over the next few months and December is just the start. Now the real question is by how much as the more responsible consumer will not use their credit card they are still try to decrease or maintain their debt.
ARealist-1697809, it's right here;
http://www.langerresearch.com/uploads/1119a1%20The%20Tax-and-Benefits%20Package.pdf
Don't trust in polls where only 1,001 respondents were included.
Thanks
Just more smoke screens.
Who were the people represented in the polls(the wealthy) You can always take a poll until you get one you want. No tax cuts for the wealthy!!!
david
ideologically sound argument
now are you satisfied that the tax rates on the middle class go up and UEI is not extended
that is the reality if this bill is defeated (it is not perfect for either side but it is progress for the moment)
your voice ideology or help for the middle class
you make the call
One would think that the tea-vangelicals would be having an absolute fit over this. The best compromise Boehner the Liar and McConnell can come up with adds $900 billion to the deficit? Why aren't they storming the Capitol with pitchforks and torches? You would think they would tar and feather Boehner and McConnell over this direct slap in the face.
Shame on the "tea" party for being a bunch of phonies.
shockedanddisgusted
and also mis-informed I might add
the original position of the Republicans was to extend all tax rates and UEI nothing else
then the Pres added the additional perks, deductions and breaks for the middle class and the Republicans added the estate tax deal
so to say that Speaker Boehner and Minority Leader McConnell created the deal is inaccurate
also bear in mind that the majority of the $900 Billion you speak of are to pay for the tax rate extension and tax benefits for the middle class
shame on the liberals for putting ideology in front of the needs of the middle class
Robert
Were you in the meetings? Do you know who said what? This he said, he said is ridiculous, not just by you. Unless it was recorded and we can hear it, no one really knows.
ARealist
So you think that the Republicans would propose the continuation of Child Credit, Earned Income Credit, Tuition Credits and Making Work Pay Credits
SOme things you infer and I think I did so i fairly responsible manner
I should have said "Pres O likely added ....
Robert. Speaker "elect" Boehner stated during the elections that he would vote for a bill that extended the middle class tax cut - even if it did not include tax cuts for those making $250,000 and over. That bill was put through the House. Boehner is on record as saying that he would vote for it, and now he is on record voting against it. Period. By the weakest definition of the word, this makes Boehner a liar.
Boehner and McConnell tell everyone that nothing will pass through congress until we extend the tax cuts to the $250,000 and above people (which, I'm sure, includes themselves). McConnell deals with the President - and now it's OK to put 900 billion on the defecit. I do understand that the tax cuts to the wealthy are not the bulk of the bill, I would just like to know why it is OK now, but the bill Pelosi put through the House a couple weeks ago was not?
I actually agree with the bill, but you can not tell me that Boehner and McConnell are in any way willing to practice what they preach. Obviously they were both blowing a whole lot of smoke up the "tea" party's nether regions, and the "tea" party should be furious with this bill - that is, only if they are willing to practice what they preach. They should be demanding both Boehner's and McConnell's resignations if they have any integrity whatsoever.
I realize Boehner is "your" man and I do think it is unfortunate that your fine state now has to defend the actions of a liar. It never feels good to be duped by one of your own. My condolences.
ShockedandDisgusted
Actually Speaker "elect" Boehner said that "....if all he could get was an extension on the middle class tax rates, he would of course not vote to raise anyone's taxes in a recession."
The Republicans were is a position to get more and it was apparent to the President (if not the Democrat leadership in Congress) that a deal was needed and he got one that neither side liked completely. When both sides of a compromise feel they have given in on part of the agreement it means the process worked.
If people resigned from Congress for furthering their own ideological agendas at the expense of the American people, then Nancy and Harry would have been gone long ago.
I am sure that it is lost on you, but you know that there is no such thing as a permanent tax rate right. The President and the Republicans have moth expressed and interest in working on meaningful tax code reform in the new Congress, but I haven't heard much on the subject from the left.
You do remember that the President is the leader of the Democrat party right, and a big givernment liberal right? You got the best deal he could, made progress for the American people and began to govern rather then posture and campaign.
I hope that there are more deals and meaningful government, tax and spending reform in the very near future and if Obama gets the credit so be it.
The American people will be the winners after all
Thank you for admitting that Boehner is a liar. He said he wouldn't and then he did.
I'm sorry that you can only use catch phrases and stereotyping in your response. No where have you responded to the main theme of my posts. Where is the "tea" party? Why are they not furious?
You talk of idealogical agendas? Why was adding an unemployment extension and an extension of the middle class tax cuts to the deficit not OK two weeks ago, and now it is OK? Can you, in your obvious infinite wisdom, please explain that one to me?
I will love to see meaningful tax reform come out of the new House. I also can not wait to see an astounding jobs bill come through the House in January. I'm not getting my hopes up. Boehner has already proven himself to be a liar and, obviously with this bill, McConnell can not be trusted with the deficit. You some to have some secret inside information...perhaps you can give me some hope?
shockedanddisgusted
I did not admit that Speaker elect Boehner lied because he didn't and if you can't figure that out from the texts of both our posts, sorry. No need to discuss that point further.
The Republicans always wanted to extend UEI but used leverage to get the tax rates extended for all citizens - leverage a tool used in negotiations.
Your name calling calling of the Republican leadership is in place of logical discourse so I understand. I could go on and on with name calling and nicknames for Ms Pelosi, Mr Reed et al, but would rather spend my time disagreeing with their policy agenda and procedures instead.
As to the astounding jobs bill - you do realize that jobs are not created by an act of Congress right. The Congress puts in place laws, taxes and regulations that make it profitable for businesses to expand and grow creating jobs in the process.
Mincing words does grow tiresome. Boehner is from your state, so I understand your contention.
So how 'bout that "tea" party? Play word games if you want, you still fail to explain why they aren't calling for Boehner and McConnell's resignations over this bill. Does it not go against everything they stand for? I find your silence on this point quite interesting....
shockedanddisgusted
My silence was due to the fact that I went to dinner
Sorry crazy habit of mine
There is no reason that anyone would call for anyone's resignation over this compromise.
By your logic, the liberals shold be calling for the Democrat leadership to resign for failing to take advantage of their initial super majority to get this taken care in 2009
Pelosi and Reid have said they would never allow the tax rate extension for the "rich".
Does this make them liars in your world?
Let's talk about where "we the people" go from here rather then continue calling names
What do you say?
Truth be told, I think we have more in common than not. About ready to wrap things up for the night myself.
Thanks for ending on a civil note - and, yes, I, too, can only hope that this new congress will move us forward. (I actually did vote for the Republican candidate in my local race for the House).
Something to keep in mind.....
If a million jobs can be created, it's pretty reasonable to expect there will be less of a deficit because the projected deficits are based on continuing high levels of unemployment, and the resulting losses of tax revenue that go along with them.
A million more people getting a paycheck who currently don't will have a highly positive effect.
excellent point
How can a fiscal conservative go along with this? If taxcuts created jobs, we would be importing labor legally to fill them starting in 2003. We've shipped too much of our manufacturing jobs abroad. We can't manufacture jobs without manufacturers using home grown workers.
RPM
I am sure that the reasons that off shoring of manufacturing occurred are of no relevance to you and your liberal argument, but after a career in human resources and finance here are some
high cost of labor driven in large part my over involvement of unions
over regulation by the government
tax system not conducive to domestic business expansion
NAFTA (signed by slick willy as you remember)
We need an atmosphere created in the U.S. that encourages businesses to expand and create jobs (taxes, regulation and labor reform)
a compromise is a place to start don't you think
You think you can compete with China and India in terms of wages and costs!! Wake up where've you been the last 10years. They don't care about unsafe drinking water, polluted air, and sick children over there...thats why their costs are low. China is a Communist dictatorship that'll shoot one in the head if they dare speak up against their miserable wages and living conditions. We have been financing the rise of a Communist dictatorship through outsourcing of our jobs and our businesses only to benefit the wealthy elite in this country and the time has come to say NO!!!!
MS
I agree with what you have to say about China, but it is fairly important to realize that off shoring also occurred in great numbers to Mexico, Indonesia, Brazil, India, Thailand and Viet Name
Some are better regulated and governed then others but American businesses went to all of them and others
Robert,
“NAFTA (signed by slick willy as you remember)”
Yes Clinton signed it but it was started by Reagan and negotiated by GHW Bush.
History reflects: “U.S. President George H. W. Bush, Canadian Prime Minister Brian Mulroney and Mexican President Carlos Salinas, each responsible for spearheading and promoting the agreement, ceremonially signed it on December 17, 1992.” And “Before the negotiations were finalized, Bill Clinton came into office in the U.S. and Kim Campbell in Canada, and before the agreement became law, Jean Chrétien had taken office in Canada.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_American_Free_Trade_Agreement
I think once the "justified" anger subsides over the way this deal went down and the public looks at this situation through a more "rational" set of eyes, more people will "begrudgingly" support this Bill because it avoids leaving most unemployed citizens dangling in the wind-which is "exactly" what the Republicans would "still" like to do given enough "leverage"-as well as giving 98% of working people a well "needed" tax break...
I also think Boehner and the gang are going to end up hanging themselves with their own rope in the long run for the way they just "exposed" the utter hypocrisy of the GOP and "literally" forced the "unnecessary" extension of the top 2% by once "again" using the "obstruction of everything" tactic regardless of "what" they were obstructing to get their way.
Gotta just "love" the irony here...
A political party runs a "bogus" campaign under the guise of restoring "fiscal responsibility" and job creation and the importance of "helping" the "middle-class" and unemployed families in America-definitely a "noble" agenda if they are actually "serious" about living up to those words.
However...
Once they actually manage to "seize" control of a branch of the government-"based" on their campaign rhetoric-the "first" action they take with their "new" piece of political power is to in fact "willingly" hold "f.u.c.k.i.n.g over ALL of the middle-class and unemployed" and to use blatantly "partisan" obstruction tactics to hold up the renewal of a "Nuclear Arms Treaty" over the head of the current administration as "leverage".
And what was their "noble" reason for taking such "patriotic" action?
To put an "additional" 700 billion dollar "drain" on the American people solely to line the pockets of the wealthiest 2% of households in America after already giving those same households a 10 year tax cut under a previous administration without "ever" intending to actually pay for it...Because that reflects "The Will Of The People"...
Brilliant!
Cheers
Actually the Republicans should have said no to this bill and waited until January and let the House come up with a bill that just extended the tax reductions for everyone and not agreed to all of these extras that were added on by the democrats.
That way the American citizens would see if the new congress will do what is needed reduce the deficit or just continue the same old same old.
And for all the people who think that all that is needed is just transparency let me tell you transparency does not reduce the deficit. What reduces the deficit is stop spending money we don't have.
Extra's you say?
Oh please, do tell!
Lay out the "specifics" of these "extra's" added by the Democrats which you feel were "unnecessary" and contaminated the "fiscal purity" of the "Republican's" attempt to reduce the deficit by "spending" $700,000,000,000.00 which, as you "correctly" stated, we "don't" have "solely" to give it to people who "don't" need it-and more importantly "didn't" ask for it either-all based on the "same" trickle-down fantasy despite the now "decades" worth of evidence and data-including some coming from the "original" architects and supporters of the concept under Ronald "The GOP Deity" Regan-that has clearly "proved" this concept simply does "not" work in the "real world"..And the Republican's are doing all this with NO intentions of ever even paying for it because they don't see the "need" to do so...
Cheers
Extra's like the extension of Section 1603 Renewable Energy cash grant. What many do not know is that Reid wants to give China a helping hand, headline from NBC "Powerful Democrats help Chinese energy firm chase stimulus money":
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/40565987/ns/business-going_green/
"For example, most renewable energy projects in the U.S. would create jobs for installation and operation but not as many would create jobs in production of equipment" from:
http://greenenergyreporter.com/policy/guestblog-will-the-recovery-act-section-1603-cash-grant-be-extended-beyond-2010/
Senate Dems add to tax bill:
http://climateprogress.org/2010/12/13/senate-adds-key-clean-energy-program-to-tax-bill/
hypernova, I am a registered democrat and a Union member for over 33 years so don't lay that conservative - republican B.S. at my feet. whatruthinking gave you one example I'll give you just one more, how about all the millions of dollars that they threw in to support ethanol production in order to get Tom Harken to vote yes. Why don't you look it up yourself instead of mud slinging or are you just a socialist/commie with an anti American agenda; see I can lay a lot of B.S. at your feet.
The election in November was about repudiating the democrats spending and taxing this country into bankruptcy. Evidently you don't get it, some politicians on both sides don't get it but the American voter did get it and will wait, watch and send another message in two years.
OMFG!
I encourage EVERYONE to go to the supplied links above supplied by "whatrutinkin" and actually "read and comprehend" what these articles are talking about...
A few excerpts but "please" read them in full to understand what's being done.
"Top Democratic fundraisers and lobbyists with links to the White House are behind a proposed wind farm in Texas that stands to get $450 million in stimulus money, even though a Chinese company would operate the farm and its turbines would be built in China"
Providing $2.5 billion more for 48C would cost relatively little compared to the $858 billion tax package – it’s one-third of one percent of the total. And its only two percent of the bonus tax cuts to the wealthiest Americans.
So...
THAT'S IT?
A F.U.C.K.I.N.G "WIND-FARM" PROJECT IN TEXAS WITH MACHINERY "COMING" FROM "CHINA" RAN BY "CHINESE" PEOPLE!
AND A "CLEAN ENERGY" PROGRAM WHICH ALL COMBINED ADD UP TO BASICALLY 2% OF THE $700,000,000,000.00 "THANK YOU" CARD FROM THE REPUBLICANS TO THE TOP 2% WEALTHIEST HOUSEHOLDS-FOR WHICH ABSOLUTELY "NOTHING" IS BEING DONE IN RETURN...
...AND THESE "PROJECTS" ARE "YOUR" EXAMPLES OF "WASTE" BY THE DEMOCRATS WHICH SOMEHOW OFFSET THE 700 BILLION DOLLAR "ASS RAPE" THE GOP JUST "EXTORTED" FROM THE "COMMON FOLK" BY OBSTRUCTING EVERYTHING TILL THEY COULD GET THEIR WAY?
And as for "Jon Exner"-are you really this dense and detached from reality?
You say "November was about repudiating the "democrats" spending and taxing this country into bankruptcy"
...And apparently America "repudiated" by handing the House back over to the "Party" who has pretty much "blocked" everything including a damned "Nuclear Arms Treaty" to make sure they get to shove an "additional" $700,000,000,000.00 of "unnecessary" tax cuts for the wealthiest 2% of households up the asses of the other 98% of households after running a campaign under the guise of "fiscal responsibility".
Does "any" of that $hit strike you as being in accordance with "The Will Of The People"?
Is "that" you idea of the American voter "getting it"?
BTW: Unless the GOP planning to somehow "funnel" that 700-BILLION DOLLARS into some offshore account for Tom "Harkin"-you could at least learn to spell the man's damn "name" correctly-as a "payoff", you sighting that crap like he's some kind of "smoking gun" that's going to balance out this hypocritical BULL$HIT the "fiscally responsible" Republican Party just "pulled" on America "again" is ridiculous.
If you believe it does-which you "clearly must-then the only thing you've laid at my feet is your "democratic dignity" right along with any basic common sense if you think throwing out something as "weak" as that is somehow "justification" of this fiscal "clusterf.u.c.k" of blatant hypocrisy by the Republicans...As a "registered Democrat" of course.
So if my stating of those "facts" about the overt hypocrisy of the "actions" of Republican Party vs. the "lie" they just ran on "seize" power makes "this" registered Democrat a "socialist/commie with an "anti-American agenda" in your eyes then I am glad to be "GUILTY AS CHARGED"
PS: Based on your comments you also might want to take the time to stand in front of a mirror and simply ask yourself "why the f.u.c.k. am I a registered Democrat"
...And I seriously doubt I am alone on that thought!
Cheers
There is no free lunch. At the end of the day a trillion dollars will be coming out of the pockets of the middle class through less benefits....reduction in social security and medicare. That is the big plan envisioned by the great American wealthy elite and their selected and phony politicians in Washington. They get their tax cuts and run with their money to invest in emerging markets...no investments will be made in America. Say hello to the beginnings of the great American Banana Republic north of Mexico....
Really?
High cost of labor driven by labor unions? What about the gazillion dollar salaries and benefit packages for executives? Those had nothing to do with it? NBonsense!
Over-regulation by government? Were you aware that de-regulation of US industries has CONSISTENTLY resulted in disastrous scams. Can you say ENRON and Wall Street without cringing at the idea that your "Conservative" heroes are the ones who laid the groundwork for the crookery and shenanigans?
Tax system not conducive to domestic business expansion? You're kidding, right? It was DOMESTIC businesses that shipped all of their jobs (manufacturing included) overseas to create mythical cost savings so executives could reap exorbitant bonuses for reducing costs - reductions that didn't even actually exist.
NAFTA? Only a truly ignorant individual would try to blame this on Bill Clinton. This was a left-over from G.H.W. Bush, and if you'd done any homework, you'd know that.
Come on man!
I would not blame the unions I would say blame all Americans as even $40,000 is too large compared to foreign labor. The consumer wants prices to be low, but in order to provided this, you have to find ways to reduce cost for products. Not all executives have "large" salaries as look at most pay plans as they generally are under $250k anyways. Their pay plans are stock, so the company has to be profitable for them to make some big money.
The tax cuts should be left to expire.
There should be a review of all government agencies and drastic cuts should be made. The wars in Afganistan and Iraq should be ended. The entitlements that congress has awarded to themselves should be reviewed and cut. Foreign aid should be reviewed and cut. Noone who is wealthy or working should get SS. The deficit should be paid down and it should be a requirement there be a balanced budget.
There is no guarantee the tax cuts will stimulate the economy.
Fishydigit
You have some interesting ideas, let's talk about them.
Letting all the tax rates revert to the higher Clinton era levels --- sounds good to me and will likely cause more chaos in the lower middle class then in the upper middle and upper classes of income in the U.S.. Of course along with this is the ending of the tax deductions and perks for Child Credit, Earned Income Credit, Tuition Credit, Making Work Pay etc. I am okay with that, but the lower middle class may have some objections as they get all of these tax credits.
Drastic spending cuts and reduction in size of government agencies - 100% agree and also drastic spending cuts to the social programs they manage okay?
Ending the wars and bringing all the troops home - I guess we could do that but we will need something for the soldiers to do since we don't want to add them to the UE roles. I know we can secure the borders, send the illegals home and successfully keep them out in the future with the soldiers on the borders.
Eliminate foriegn aid - let's give it a try as most of the world hates us anyway.
No one wealthy gets social security, then they really shouldn't have contributions for SS come out of their checks because this is an entitlement program after all.
Reduced deficit and balanced budget -- 100% agree
There is no guarantee that the tax cuts won't stimulate the economy either.
Not as simple as it sounded is it?
That's because we are finally growing up and finding common ground, besides what's wrong with the unemployed and sinking middle class supporting tax cuts for our billionaire job creators. When the reality of the positive, but marginally deployed, effects of targeted stimuli get flipped with tax cuts focused on the upper echelons of society you know our best days are yet to come and what a @!$%#in sad place you put every citizen Mr. President.
Polls being Polls, when they are taken, how they are structured and who responds are all nuances under the headline. How many of you have been polled and how often? I'm never really sure just what the majority of The American People want at any given time and then there's also the worry of mob rule . I am clear on what I think is important and try to align myself to those with similar ideas. To lead is to pull from the front not push from the back. I think we could get a better deal, estate tax is an if and when [a wealthy person passes away] some folks trying to save face. People who earn 500,000+ that's a real money to go towards deficit reduction. We are still spendig tons to fight terrorism and protect our way of life, we still need stimulus to create good, secure jobs and reduce unemployment. A better education system to produce a workforce that competes in the 21st century. There is no free lunch.
I don't believe this for one second ...the poor people could care less about the wealthy ....
blessed are the wealthy! dream on.
They don't poll the poor people, the people who agree with this bill are only looking at the extended taxes as they currently are. When they figure out how much the other pork barrel projects will cost they'll go nuts.
When the Social Security and Medicare accounts are reduced because of this bill people will go nuts.
Big surprise: Americans want to keep the same tax rates even if it does contribute to the deficit.
The deficit apparently is only a big issue when you're getting yourself elected, once you are, give tax breaks and Americans don't care where the money comes from.
There are no tax cuts because of this agreement, in reality the world I live in is only a continuation of the current tax rates so by itself there will be no impact positive or negative on the deficit.
The only impact that will be felt is when the budget programs known as the porkbarell projects also called earmarks are increased or decreased.
so by itself there will be no impact positive or negative on the deficit.
Even Alan Greenspan said he doesn't support tax cuts with borrowed money, which is what this is.
The only impact that will be felt is when the budget programs known as the porkbarell projects also called earmarks are increased or decreased.
Earmarks and pork barrel spending only account for 16 billion dollars. The continuation of the tax rates as they are now will result in about another trillion dollars in deficit.
So yeah, obviously earmarks and pork barrel spending is the big issue here.
FactOfTheMatter, you're wrong the continuation of the reduced tax rates will not add to the deficit, continue to spend money for the pork barrel projects called earmarks will add to the deficit. The only way to reduce the deficit will be to stop spending money on unnecessary projects that the Federal Government should not be paying for in the first place.
Here's an example one of the items they threw into this bill was millions of $$$$ to support ethanol in order to get Tom Harken to vote yes. If the ethanol industry is to be successful they need to work with the auto industry to build an engine that will run on ethanol and increase mileage. As of now they don't and it is not the responsibility of the Federal government to pay their bills with my tax money.
FactOfTheMatter, you're wrong the continuation of the reduced tax rates will not add to the deficit, continue to spend money for the pork barrel projects called earmarks will add to the deficit.
Um, no. Continuing the tax rates as they are will add directly to the deficit. I think you are grossly misinformed about where our tax money is spent. Over half of discretionary spending is spent on military. Within 5 years the amount of money we'll spend servicing the 'deficit' that doesn't exist according to you will exceed the entire amount we spend on military.
The problem isn't pork barrel spending, it's ALL spending.
Your only choices dealing with the deficit is to raise taxes, cut spending, or growing the economy fast enough to start whittling away at it.
Raising taxes isn't going to happen. Growing the economy is a laughable proposition. So your only choice is to cut spending...which no one wants to do.
We agree on one thing cutting spending is the only thing that will begin the process of reducing the deficit. However, your assumption that the pork barrel earmark system is not the problem is absolutely incorrect.
The money that pork barrel earmark spending takes up would go to the defense budget or other necessary Federal Government responsibilities.
Reducing the deficit is not an overnight fix, it took us a long time to get where we are it will take a long time to get us out of this mess and the pork barrrel earmark system is the absolute right place to start.
The president did what he had to do, given the outcome of the midterm elections which showed again that the majority of Americans can't figure out how to vote in their interests.
TRICK down economics has been refudiated!
December 13, 2010
The President of the United States of America
The White House
1600 Pennsylvania Avenue
Washington DC, 20500
Dear President Obama,
I am your base and you are losing me.
You have agreed with the Republicans to extend the Bush Tax Cuts for the richest of the rich for two years. These are the same people who have benefited already so greatly from the hardships their greed has brought down upon middle-Americans, your base, me. Now you plan to allow them to benefit even more. They did not pay their fair share of taxes on the money they already stole from us, and now if this compromise is passed they will continue to steal from us virtually tax-free for the next two years.
You ducked your duty as our sitting president, to explain this compromise, as we believe it is your obligation to do so. Instead, you turned over the podium to a former impeached president to do the talking for you. No sir! It is your duty to explain your proposals and your actions. Many of us still have no respect or trust for that former president for his unethical deeds. For you to place your trust in him diminishes our trust in you!
President Obama, I voted for you, campaigned for you, and even contributed money to your campaign. I couldn't contribute much, because I was unemployed at the time, but did what I could.
I'm still unemployed. Thanks in large part to the ultra-rich in this country whose personal greed has allowed them to ship jobs I could have qualified for overseas, or import foreigners with H1B visas to take the remaining jobs available here at much lower salaries than American citizens would have been offered. So the rich keep getting richer by cutting their costs at our expense, and you seem to encourage that by allowing them to keep more of their selfish profits that insure it will NOT be reinvested in any way to create any significant new jobs for Middle- Americans in The United States of America!
Anyone who has done any reading at all on the history of the Bush Tax Cuts knows that since they were passed in 2001 they have resulted in the decade of the slowest economic growth for America since World War II. If those tax cuts have not helped to build a strong U.S. economy in all this time, then why would anyone of common sense believe they would suddenly boost the current economy with a two-year extension?
I am sorry Mr. President, but common sense wins this argument and you are wrong to allow the Republicans to manipulate you for the benefit of their own personal greed. If you continue allowing yourself to be used by the Republicans for their rich benefactors, and ducking your responsibility by recruiting the likes of Bill Clinton as your apparent Co-President, then I believe you will lose me, and many many more of us out here in real-America who make up your base. Without us, your base, then Mitch McConnell will get his way, and you will be a one-term president.
If that's what you want then perhaps you could consider stepping aside now and allowing Vice-President Biden an opportunity at dealing directly with the problems this country and we the people are facing now in real-America!
I don't have a job, or any real prospects for a job, because in real-America today the rich people who own the jobs don't want to give them out to American citizens. Why should they when shipping the jobs overseas will more richly reward them? Why should they when they can import H1B workers here to take American jobs for much cheaper wages than they would dare offer American citizens?
We need a president who will fight for us, and punish employers who prefer mass exploitation than honesty, fairness and patriotism in the workplace. That's what we thought we were getting when we voted, campaigned for and supported you for president. Don't let us, your base, down Mr. President. It is time for you and the Democrats in Congress to say "No!" to the Republicans for a change.
Sincerely,
Me - Middle-Class America, Your Base
And just who will you vote for in the 2012 elections, Palin or Gingrich or whomever?? My guess is you will pull the lever for Obama no matter what you say now.
Bruce - I appreciated your post and whole heartedly agree.
It was ironic and troubling that Obama ended up compromising with the GOP, agreeing to a tax policy that he and his base rallied against for years. Even though he believed that the tax cuts for the rich didn't help improve the economy during their 10 year run he signed off on them. Baffling.
The only analogy I can use for this tax policy is if an unrepentant mortgage refinancer, borrowed equity they didn't have in their underwater, forclosed house to give their rich neighbors money to go on a Carribean vacation.
You state that Obama might lose you, we are in the same boat. For those that say a Democrat has no choice but Obama, he better not take the risk of more of his base not showing up at election time.
And to the GOP your boasts about fiscal responsibility is bunk.
Peter your "guess" would be totally wrong in asserting that either me, Yellowdog-Mark D or anyone else who previously voted for President Obama would automatically do so again if Obama is the candidate for the Democratic ticket in 2012. We would certainly NOT vote for Palin, Gingrich or any of the others as well just to vote against someone, unless they campaign in such a way as to gain our trust and confidence as Obama once did. (Fact is, I would not vote for either Palin or Gingrich no matter what lies they told, and not even if they paid me to! It would be dirty money!!!)
There are other options during and even after the primaries, as there are other candidates on both the primary and general election ballots, and there is always the option to not vote for anyone for President at all, if it comes to that.
So, don't just assume that because we voted for Obama before that we will automatically do so again. And, I really hope he, President Obama, is not assumimg that either, because come 2012 he might be terribly surprised!
Yellowdog-Mark D, a very appropriate analogy of the situation. Thanks!!!
Just another manipulated poll that is bull@!$%#. If anything proves that are Americans are totally idiiots to me anymore. No amount of tax breaks this time is going to create jobs. All overseas over 30% in good paying manufacturing. The new Southern slave owners moved to Asia after raping Mexico and USA
The question was probably "Do you support a tax increase or not"? That's how these things usually work, if the American people realized how much more well off the well off will be because of these breaks they would march in the streets, the media though doesn't want to be the one to tell them they are getting screwed once again, kiss SS & Medicare goodby part of the plan that reduces the payroll taxes is the first step in one of many to destroy SS under the Republicans. Good luck people were all going to need it.
Obamas $700 billion stimulus was bad or so we were told by the GOP ,remember none voted for it because IT WILL iNCREASE THE DEFICIT! Fast forward, GOP preaches their bullsh*t and gets re-elected. So what do they come up with a $880 billion stimulus (or in GOP TALK, TAX cut) With of course the biggest earners getting the biggest stimulus. Over the last 10 yrs they who make more always get more.
Funny thing about the Republicans, they are all for free enterprise and no taxes for corps and so on and so forth. But if you look at any corporation, any business that has a sizable amount of employees, workers. They are ALL RUN LIKE AUTHORITARIAN DICTATORSHIPS and ABOUT AS COMMUNIST as you can get. The CEO(Premier) and all his minions, Presidents,VP's and such. and the workers. Now if the company is successful the Premier and his co-horts get to decide what is good for the company (but me thinks they decide what is good for themselves first) then the share holders. And last just like any good communist country the workers. Who keeps voting for the premier to keep his job? Share holders, and board members. Workers are a dime a dozen so they do not need to vote on what happens to the company they work. We all know how well communism took care of the workers. Right now US corporations are sitting on over 1 trillion dollars in cash. When was the last time you got a raise? Good dictators do not share the bounty thats why they are good dictators.
Oh and if the corporation does bad and goes out of business (if the government would let them fail) guess who always walks away with the money that's left. Well they split it all up between the workers and the dictators get nothing. NOT
Free enterprise in America modeled after Communism and they praise it.
no way 60% of americans wanted the rich to stay wealthy, the government needs the rich to stay wealthy so they can found their military. articles like this is their way of makein us think we voted for all this @!$%# to happen. when we have no control.
ask this question in detroit.
the american people failed. just look at our police department, but we can always come togeather and take our country back, and start a new world order. like i dunoo, a democracy?
zack
no idea exactly what point or points you are trying to make here