Read up, people. New restrictions have been imposed on the ability of these young people to sponsor their families (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DREAM_Act#2010).

In that Reid "tabled" the Senate version, and is looking at the House version - I'll have to look up the most recent verbiage of the bill... Wikipedia isn't the best resource when looking for factual information.

And I'd like to know how these people are going to prove that they've been in the country prior to age 16. Are their parents really going to fess up to that? Or are we just taking somebody's word for it?

pj...

They could never sponsor extended family members and they could not begin sponsoring parents or siblings for at least 12 years.

This is funny...isn't the DREAM act for children who were raised in this country by parents who came here ILLEGALLY? Therefore, the frikkin' parents and siblings are ALREADY here for hell's sake!!!

Senate: http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d111:SN03992:@@@D&summ2=m&

House: http://thomas.loc.gov/cgi-bin/bdquery/z?d111:HR06497:@@@D&summ2=m&

Extended family, look it up. That doesn't mean parents or siblings.

Yes, the parents and siblings are already here, but this bill has nothing to do with them... this is a path for the children themselves. The point of the 'chain immigration' thing is that this privilege cannot be extended to the parents (who, presumably, will not have obtained their high school educations in this country and are probably over 30 and can't fit the requirements) or siblings (who probably also qualify for the DREAM Act, so they're sorted).

you had better reread what you wrote...

They could never sponsor extended family members and they could not begin sponsoring parents or siblings for at least 12 years.

Your words...not mine!

Look, I get your point. However, my point is that restrictions are in place for them not to do it right away. Twelve years.

You really want to pass the perfect "Dream Act"? All of the criminals who want to become legal will be required to serve in public service jobs in their country of origin for 10 years (with their families) while earning one-half the US minimum wage. If they don't want to do a "Peace Corp-type" service...they can serve that same 10 years (with their families) in Iraq or Afghanistan with the military. During that time...going to college outside the US is your choice...as long as you pay for it. After that time...you can apply for a green card while completing the paperwork for citizenship.

Either way...you serve your sentence outside the country serving the country you claim is your home. In addition...if you have other children during this time...they don't become US citizens automatically. They will need to be sponsored...just like if they had not become the criminals they were.

What the F does it matter if they fit the mold or not...they'll either get their undeserved citizenship by "butting" in line and the parents and siblings will still be here illegally!

The only sensible answer is to send them all back...hell, I'd allow the feds to take more taxes out if I knew it was going to remove the criminals from this country.

I think that this will be a good thing for our country. Many people worry about not having jobs but they are not willing to work the jobs that the illegal immigrants work. Once these people are able to get citizenship then more jobs will pick up. They will be able to show their ideas and create new jobs. These people were brought here as children and know this country as their own. This act is to give the ones who are not "criminals" the choice of serving our country or going to school. In my own opinion the children who have been going to school, working the fields, and acting like a citizen should be the ones who should get the citizenship. It is the people who decide to have children and not work, and the people who put them selves in so much debt that they file bankruptcy that are putting this country at risk. Not the ones who work the fields for the fruits and vegetables that you put on the table every day. This will be one of the best things for this country. These children deserve to be citizens, they practically are just with out papers saying that they are.

OMG Sarah...you cannot be serious? Let me inform you of something...there aren't 20 million illegals woring in the fields. They're carpet layers, tilemen, carpenters, landscapers...the list goes on and on. Yes, they do take jobs that CITIZENS would like to have...especially, these days! Wake up and smell the coffee!

pj122

Restrictions, ha. 12 years, ha again. enforcement, ha ha again and again.

If enforcement was true then we wouldn't even need a 'dream act', there would be no illegals because the government enforced the LAW.

That's the complaint that all the common people like me have. They enforce the laws on us, but selectively enforce the laws on illegal immigrants

" the debate on the DREAM Act allows Democrats to vocally back a proposal favored by a fast-growing block of Hispanic voters"

Let the Mexicrats back criminals... it suits them perfectly. In 2012 Americans will continue backing Americans.

Sara - I am a certified welder by trade and I have lost quite a few jobs to illegals because they are willing to work for half of what the going pay is for that type of work. When they do that it lowers the pay scale across the board. In this state I would say that 30% of the construction crews are made up of illegals. Don't even try that "They only take jobs that Americans won't do" crap.

It's just wrong to reward people who steal innocent person's social security number in order to work, go to college and get credit and then ruin that innocent person's credit.

I just read an article by an agency that studied 295 million social security numbers and found that 1 in 7 had been used by someone else. I and another member of my family are ones who've had their social security number used and credit ruined by someone else.

It's just wrong and is an aggravated federal felony. These people should be prosecuted not rewarded.

All this country doesn't need is more felons especially when these felons take the jobs that out of work Americans need!

What's wrong with congress that they can't see how unfair amnesty is to everyone else.

If these people really wanted to be here, they would go to the post office, get a work permit form, fill it out and send it in. Then they would be legal but, apparently, their leaders encourage them to remain illegal.

In Arizona, many illegals claim this country belongs to Mexico and they have a right to be here illegally.

It's not right to be illegal and ignore our laws. If everyone was encouraged to be scofflaws, we would not have a country. It would be a land of horror, violence and murder.

Like Haiti...just saying...

I guess no one has read the bill that has passed in the House as it says nothing to the point of sponsorship of family. http://www.govtrack.us/congress/billtext.xpd?bill=h111-6497

PJ, please read your links and show me what section of the bill limits the time on when an individual can sponsor their family? You can't as it's just not there.

Once you are a legal citizen, you have the ability to sponser according to our current immigration law under Title 8 Chapter 12 of the US Code. http://uscode.house.gov/download/title_08.shtml

Research People and Wiki that is not a source!! Just because someone is making an argument that they "think" is true does not mean it is. I have at least provided my sources and they aren't wiki links or from some media outlet.

I would leave a comment, but the overwhelming amount of stupidity, dishonesty, prejudice, and hate posted above has me completely disheartened.

No wonder America is on hard times. We have turned into a nation of ignorant, selfish, addle-brained bigots, who wouldn't recognize our own national self interest if we sat on it.

getalifevirginia

I'm guessing your think it its so easy to get a permit. Please check the facts and them comment again about that. Yes I agree with you that this Land does not belong to Mexico. From what I have read all of y'all against the Dream act believe that the Dream Act is for "Mexican Criminals" y'all are wrong informed this is for all immigrants Russian, Asian, central American, and all the other minorities. You think because they have came here they are criminals? There is way more crime committed by those that were actually born here.

NVArt

I'm sorry to hear that you have lost jobs to illegals, but that's what happens when they don't have any other choice but to take the job at the price since they are here illegally. Maybe if their status was different then you would get the job since the illegal person would put their foot down and ask for what your asking also and then it could be a fair BID.

And I have worked for a couple of companies and trust me some of the American people turn the job down after the first day because they say they are better then that and its not that the job has bad pay its because its hard labor.

May the DREAM ACT Pass!!

Of course the bill doesn't say anything about sponsoring, because with its requirements, its well understood for anyone that ACTUALLY knows immigration law what this means

Ok Ready? Simple math:

Its well known it takes between 3-10 years for a US CITIZEN to successfully petition & bring a family member,

Those that qualify under the DREAM Act must stay under a temporary non-immigrant status for NO LESS than 10 years (Says so in the bill)

ONLY After those 10 years they can apply for PERMANENT Resident status. They must then be permanent residents for NO LESS than 5 years BEFORE they can apply for US Citizenship

So we have 10 years temporary status + 5 years permanent resident = 15 to become US Citizens

AND only then as US Citizens can they sponsor a family member, which as i noted earlier, takes between 3-10 years

So essentially you're looking at 18-25 years before they can bring a family member.

(For the sake of transparency, a non-citizen permanent resident CAN sponsor a family member, but much more restrictions & time)

I don't believe a thing that Wikipedia says (referring to pj's post) about the bill that Dream Act people could not sponsor other immigrants. Our laws don't stop them now so .....

Per other news organizations, Reid tried a closure vote this morning - DEFEATED - 59 to 40 - and a cloture vote is:

http://www.senate.gov/reference/glossary_term/cloture.htm

cloture - The only procedure by which the Senate can vote to place a time limit on consideration of a bill or other matter, and thereby overcome a filibuster. Under the cloture rule (Rule XXII), the Senate may limit consideration of a pending matter to 30 additional hours, but only by vote of three-fifths of the full Senate, normally 60 votes.

I spent yesterday and this morning lobbying against the Dream Act. It is backdoor amnesty.

Not to mention, if a person has less than 3 misdemeanors, they can be a Dream Act immigrant. I don't know about you, but I don't have any misdemeanors. Why would we allow criminals into our country?

This Dream Act is a nightmare for Americans and needs to be quashed NOW.

I don't think the dream act is the right way to go. Some of us have taken the right and correct channel to wait in line, pay thousands of dollars to lawyers and the immigration office in fees to obtain a legal status for us as parents and our children. It has taken us ten years to be approved for a legal status not even citizenship yet. We still have to wait in line again for that. Some of us are working 2 to 3 jobs to be able to pay all required outstanding fees, not sending money back home to look after our ailing parents like some of those immigrants have been doing sending money back home to their homeland leaving their children in limbo. Now their children have grown with out a status. The parents have left them to fend for themselves after all America is a forgiving country. I think this is taking advantage of a kind country like America. I am not sure if I support it or not.

It's was only a matter of time before someone called another a bigots, just because they are expressing there right to say what they feel is wrong about this bill.

Sad that you can't except someone else's view point without calling people names. Now if you are claiming false information to make your case, then I have no problem stating your mistakes.

josephi...

What's wrong there, bub? Can't handle the truth?

It a good thing that I couldn't care less what you think...you're probably an illegal yourself!

One of a million...

Dream on...

It won't pass!

Many people worry about not having jobs but they are not willing to work the jobs that the illegal immigrants work.

This is soooooooo untrue. One of my NATURALIZED American friends (who emigrated here from Mexico) made the mistake of telling me that all maids/janitors were ILLEGAL ALIENS.

I worked as a maid/janitor in college and grad school. I am an American citizen.

My brother WORKS IN CONSTRUCTION. He too is an American who does not appreciate the undercutting from ILLEGAL ALIENS.

I am with cantakenomore. I too would be willing to pay more taxes to get these ILLEGAL ALIENS out of our country.

I am not sure if I support it or not.

I was surprised to see this as the last line of your post because the rest of the post made it clear that you did not support the Dream Act.

There is way more crime committed by those that were actually born here [than crime by illegal aliens].

It is super clear to me that you definitely do not live in Los Angeles, California, Texas or Arizona.

Daisy - yes they do have a choice. They can come here legally or stay home. I didn't invite them to come here as a criminal. It does not matter how long it takes to get here legally. If you want to come to this country then do it legally - PERIOD.

one of million - I buy American as often as possible. My car is American, my computer is American, My refrigerator is American, my beer is American. Also, the form of democracy we practice in America is not Greek. We have a representative republic. The Greeks practiced pure democracy.

I'm not complaining that my neighbor is an immigrant - I'm complaining that he is an ILLEGAL immigrant.

If you're wondering how a person can prove that they have been in the country for many years, even though they are undocumented, I will tell you because I am in that group. I went to elementary school, middle school, and high school in the united states. All of my schools have records of me being there. I have lived here and gone to school here my whole life and I have graduated from high school at the top of my class 20/680 students. I am currently in college and working very hard to support my studies. I have a job and I keep all of the receipts from my checks which are all dated. My family has to also pay taxes, bills, car repairs, credit cards, etc. all of these things are dated and serve as proof. Not to mention library cards, gym memberships, etc. I have lived in the United States my whole life. The only difference between my friends and I is that I can not obtain a driver's license or scholarships. This is making my life difficult because I have no idea how I will be able to pay off my next two years at Loyola or U of I. Please if you read this try to think about the situation me and many others are facing instead of just acting racist and selfish.

Just another way of ramming amnesty down the throats of the American people. The democrats are absolutely drooling at the prospect of having so many dregs available to vote for them.

anonymous-2779130

Question, how did you open a checking account or a credit card with no identification, sounds like a law was broken? Again, how am I acting racist and selfish, as it's my country and I do have a say (vote) in how I think it should be run.

'Depart from me, you accursed, into the eternal fire prepared for the devil and his angels. For I was ... a stranger and you gave me no welcome....'

Then they will answer and say, 'Lord, when did we see you ... a stranger ... and not minister to your needs?'

He will answer them, 'Amen, I say to you, what you did not do for one of these least ones, you did not do for me.'

And these will go off to eternal punishment...." Mathew 25:41-46

Christians beware.

There is way more crime committed by those that were actually born here [than crime by illegal aliens].

True statement, easily backed up by scientific statistical research. the average US citizen is five times more likely to commit a felony crime than the average undocumented immigrant. Undocumented immigrants from Mexico and Central America have exceptionally LOW crime rates.

I guess you don't want to be over run by those evil Mexicans huh?

Peter 2:13 says "Submit yourselves to every ordinance of man for the Lord's sake: whether it be to the king, as supreme; 14 Or unto governors, as unto them that are sent by him ....

Matthew 22:21 says "They say unto him, Caesar's. Then saith he unto them, Render therefore unto Caesar the things which are Caesar's; and unto God the things that are God's."

My family has to also pay taxes, bills, car repairs, credit cards, etc. all of these things are dated and serve as proof.

Who's social security number did your family use?

Sales taxes are pocket change compared to federal and state income taxes.

Federal and state income taxes pay for most government funded institutions NOT sales tax.

"And I'd like to know how these people are going to prove that they've been in the country prior to age 16. Are their parents really going to fess up to that? Or are we just taking somebody's word for it?"

Our schools have records of every-single student, so all you'd have to do is go back to the first school you enrolled in or middleschool and get your transcript.
hope that gets your question solved.

whatrudrinkin, there is nothing in Peter's epistle that argues against passage of the DREAM Act. Same for Matthew 22.

What's your point?

There is way more crime committed by those that were actually born here [than crime by illegal aliens].

True statement, easily backed up by scientific statistical research. the average US citizen is five times more likely to commit a felony crime than the average undocumented immigrant. Undocumented immigrants from Mexico and Central America have exceptionally LOW crime rates.

How many more US citizens are there compared to illegal aliens? THAT is the reason for your comment which is NOT true.

Accounting for that difference in the number of the percentage against the whole, according to my statistical research of the crime pages of the LA Times, ILLEGAL ALIENS are responsible for all the mayhem.

I didn't say the bible mentions anything, just that people are to obey the laws of man, but obey Gods laws before mans. It also mentions that lawlessness is sin.

1 John 3:4 Everyone who makes a practice of sinning also practices lawlessness; sin is lawlessness.

I love what someone said yesterday --- "America already has a "Dream Act"--- IT'S CALLED "LEGAL IMMIGRATION".

America's immigration system is the most generous in the world. We cannot continue to reward LAWBREAKING on such a massive scale. It is simply harmful both to American citizens and LEGAL immigrants alike.

Enforce the law NOW -- and this includes punishing the criminal enterprise corporations which hire ILLEGAL immigrants. A government which refuses to enforce the rule of law is INTOLERABLE

In the HOLY name of JESUS CHRIST which was given birth while migrating, pass the DREAM ACT~

I LOVE YOU MIGHTY GOD~

In the HOLY name of the FATHER, the SON, and the HOLY SPIRIT---------AMEN

We would not be able to do so until like 10 years from now. If you are not informed on the subject, I would suggest you don't make such remarks.

commonsense - again you show that you don't have any. If they are undocumented or illegal they already broke the law. So how can that be a LOW crime rate?

In response to the comments regarding going after the employer for hiring illegals - GUESS WHAT?

AZ's law that did just that was challenged and the US Supreme Court is considering the constitutionality of AZ's law.

This is NOT the law that was recently passed about asking for proof of citizenship. This is the law that penalized employers for hiring illegal aliens.

The fact that it was even challenged squarely points to the fact that doing something about employers who hire illegals is really not an option is it?

Here is a link to a LA Times article discussing my comment in 3.49 that we seem to have issues with states who go after employers who hire illegal aliens:

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/wire/sns-ap-us-supreme-court-employer-sanctions,0,1105127.story

Art, there are only two ways a person can be in the United States without authorization. One is to cross a border without inspection, the other is to overstay a visa. Neither is a violation of criminal law and neither is a felony. Both are misdemeanor civil infractions, like using the middle finger or bad words in public.

The highest crime rates are for males aged 18 to 39. The rate of incarceration for felonies is FIVE TIMES HIGHER for male US citizens aged 18 to 39 than it is for male unauthorized immigrants aged 18 to 39. Not because I say so, but because it is a measured fact.

See "The Myth of Immigrant Criminality and the Paradox of Assimilation: Incarceration Rates among Native and Foreign-Born Men." by Ruben Rumbaut and Walter Ewing.

When the Nazis made it a crime to be a Jew, all Jews were criminals.

The left says that the Dream Act is a fair way to handle children that were brought into this country illegally by their parents. You can't punish a child for the actions of the parents. Great! For every kid that this Dream Act is granted, make it mandatory that their parents be deported first. Why should the parents be rewarded for the good actions of their kids?

You can't have it both ways. If the kid get his pathway to citizenship, then the parent gets the pathway to the border.

I hope they table the DREAM act forever....When you can't support your own Legal citizens and give them the additional help they need to succeed why in the hell would everyone else want to push for more illegal immigrants? Doesn't the United States already have a path to legal citizenship? What is wrong with the laws we have now? Why not enforce and follow what is on the books....I don't care when you got here....apply for citizenship the way millions before you have....otherwise, go back to where you came from.....No matter what your age!

Hey Big Mac..... Bite me!

What's your point Big Mac? If they listen to the American People it will die!

"millerz" when a baby can apply for citizenship or stop their parents from entering the country illegally i guess will be the day you will stop being so ignorant (:

Well said Millerz.

"When you can't support your own Legal citizens and give them the additional help they need to succeed why in the hell would everyone else want to push for more illegal immigrants?"

Simple- they are votes. Like all politicians, the democrats are playing games with this. To hell with the people that are already here, these are new votes we want - so lets pander to them. So sick of politicians and their lies and agendas. Where is a politican that actually represents and fights for the average American?

You are awesome KingBigMac! I like your idea :)

Hey Sconebutter, their parents came here and helped their kids get integrated. They can go back home and do the same thing. That is a baseless arguement.

And if they are a baby, then their parents can take them home when they leave anyway.

They can wait LEGALLY like everyone else has to. There is a procedure for it.

Next time you do your Christmas shopping (or other religious holiday) get into line to pay and then let the next 50 or 100 people get ahead of you in line. Bet you don't do it.

It will not pass the Senate. It will be filibusted. We will close the borders and they will be sent back. Congress will reform immigration, 2012 is coming, if those who are elected now don't reform immigration and get rid of the illegals, rest assured those who will be elected in 2012 will get er done. The grass roots movement that swept 37 state legislatures is an overwhelming force. Many Democratic Senators up for reelection in 2012 are facing this changed political landscape. I doubt Pelosi or Reid will be successful in throwing them under the bus like the last batch that just got the boot. Our Democratic process is working again.

A vain publicity event by Dems to curry favor with their only remaining supporters, foreign criminals.

You were right Bigmac, the republiracists are out in full force today.

The truth is eventually you will have to deal with this matter, and sending people back is not a viable option. I see no problem giving the best and brightest of the illegal immigrant community a chance to become part of this great nation.

Dem in Texas - Sending them back is an option. It was done before and it can be done again. As far as the rest of them go - Why don't you open your door to the flood of illegals and provide food stamps and health care for them? Let them live with you.

No, Patty-581750 it's the other way around, Big Macs are meant to be bitten. It's true, if it doesn't pass this time, it will eventually pass in the future because nothing is stopping illegals from coming here. As long as the gov lets them work here and provides them benefits, why would they not sneak through the border?

NVArt,

I have yet to see someone of Hispanic decent begging on a street corner.

Also, I do remember the last time we deported scores of immigrants? We created MS13.

Close the border, Go after employers who hire illegals, cut off all aid , deny citizenship to children born here to illegal immigrants, deport all illegals that are in our jails. That should do it. The rest will leave without anyway to make a living, no entitlements no more automatic citizenship, what else could they do but to leave.

thetotas

I say GO FOR IT! And when that happens tell me where this country Stands.

Dem in Texas

I'm with you this morning it wasn't a Hispanic person begging for change. But do you see these people are ignorant they think the Dream Act is only for Hispanics. Hello there is Russian, Asian, and other races here illegally.

Dem in Texas - MS13 is just one more reason to deport them all. Did I mention Hispanics? No - I said ILLEGALS. If you are the one equating illegal with Hispanic, well then that is your problem.

No to the Dream Act, No to Health Care, No to the extension of Unemployment Insurance, No to DADT Repeal. I guess every republican must be so proud to be associated with these people. And just think America, you all believed their lies and now you all will have 2 years to repent for your choices. Oh yes, and lest you forget, Bank Bailout (now owned by the DEMS) nets a 12 Billion dollar surplus, GM and Ford gaining momentum and loans repaid and lest you all forget, National Debt DOWN 8% last year. Whose working harder for middle class AMericans? Take a breath and think.

There are so many errors in post 4.17. Let's start with the first.

GM and Ford gaining momentum and loans repaid

Ford NEVER took a loan. It was GM and Chrysler. At first your messiah Obama DID NOT WANT to bail them out.

And just think America, you all believed their lies and now you all will have 2 years to repent for your choices.

This is pretty much what I said when Obama got into office. When he entered office, the unemployment rate was 7.6%. Today it is 9.8%. WHAT HAPPENED?

Obama paid more attention to passing health care reform but no one has a job so they don't care.

That is why the Republicans got into office, but frankly, the Democrats are ticking me off. BOTH SIDES ARE TOO DAMN RADICAL.

Whose working harder for middle class AMericans?

Right now - I'd say middle class Americans who are contacting their representatives with their opinions.

Obama capitulated on tax cuts. The Republicans are for the tax cuts. The Democrats are trying to push through legislation they know no one wants and it costs too much. The Republicans will filibuster.

It definitely is not anyone in the government.

Dem in Texas:

If you're not seeing them begging on a street corner, then that means they have a job they procured illegally, as in they broke the law.

How would you feel if you found out that your Social Security number was taken and used and now you couldn't buy that house you wanted? What if your credit was trashed and you couldn't fix it?

It happens all the time. A court just deemed in Idaho or Oregon (I can't find the article directly right now...) that since they don't actually know the victim, illegal immigrants can't be charged with fraud in misusing your SSN. What is that?!

Also, MS-13 was created when the Salvadoran gang members were sent back home where they recruited battle hardened recruits shortly after the civil war there.

It mixes the American gang system with the remains of Civil war soldiers who have nothing to lose.

We don't need to deport them all. If we enforce laws already in place and prosecute those businesses that hire illegally, then we will alleviate the problem. If we take away the jobs, they will leave.

and...Who invited YOU here?

I didn't, and my ancestors have been here for thousands of years.

hahaha Sarah Palin is that you? haha good one, really.

It isn't a matter of ancestors or who was invited. It's a matter of we are a country with laws, government and an economy. Reagan gave amnesty and said it was never to happen again. The problem is, by doing so he set a precedence, one that the Democrats are trying to force through again. I personally work with 12 Indians (from India) that are all going through the correct legal process of becoming citizens. They speak English and have assimilated into our culture. That is the way is should be done in a nation of laws. Even talking about amnesty (which the DREAM act is) is a slap in the face of not only the citizens of this country, but the thousands of immigrants who ARE going through the correct process to become a citizen of this country.

This isn't anti-immigrant by any means, it's wanting people to obey the laws of this country. This is not a gray area, nor is it a difficult concept.

Hey Jimbo, those ancestors you are talking about, are they the one's that came here from Europe a couple thousand years before the one's that crossed from asia?

Hey Jimbo,

In case you didn't notice, we don't live in primitive times anymore. We live in a world with nations and borders. These borders exist to protect the quality of our lives and to sustain effeciency. We Americans live in the greatest nation on earth albiet with a checkered past. By your train of thought, we should just give the land back to the caveman haha. Anyone can become an American the proper way..but you need to fit the qualifications and wait in line PERIOD.

That's what the Native American Indians said before the English invaded this land.

Then the English said the same thing about the Germans, Irish and Italians.

Now the English, Germans, Irish and Italians who are the real invaders of this land have forgotten where they came from and are saying the same hypocritical thing. LOL

Windtalker, Well said. Those who run this country need to remember that they were not the first ones here either. Selective memory, selective history, selective ancestory all means the same thing........BS!

When my ancestors came here in the 1800's they followed the laws as they were then. They learned the language, they assimilated themselves into the culture. They didn't call themselves Germans or Italians. They called themselves Americans. Is it too much to ask that the people that want to come here now do the same? I don't think so.

What a phony hypocrite. In the 1800s there were no restrictions, no such thing as a visa, no quotas. Plenty of people complained about the Germans and Italians refusing to assimilate and refusing to learn the language (Ben Franklin and Teddy Roosevelt to name just two). But they were welcomed by my family, who came here in the 1600s.

The people coming here today are doing at least as good a job of assimilating as your ancestors, whom you so disgracefully dishonor by refusing to extend the same warm welcome that THEY (not you) deserved when they arrived.

My family was among the first generation to call themselves Americans. They welcomed those who followed. Is it too much too ask the spoiled brat decendants of those who followed to do the same? I don't think so.

Commonsense - I said the laws as they were then. If there weren't any laws then they were still abiding by the law weren't they? There are laws now, aren't there?

How is removing the American flag from a school and placing a Mexican flag above assimilating?

First you said they followed the law, then you admitted there was no law. The truth is, you have no idea one way or the other, and you're just looking to make yourself feel important by putting someone else down. That's not very nice and I can tell by the other things you say that you are a better person than that.

The DREAM Act is about giving kids a chance to make something of themselves. Nothing is being given away. All we ask is that they be given the opportunity to succeed or fail on their own merits. Right now the law says they are not allowed to even try. How is that good?

You people are PATHETIC and very much IGNORANT....I VOTE FOR THE DREAM ACT ALL THEY way. First off not ALL immigrants are CRIMINALS (o.O) how STUPID do you sound, Second if i recall it was IMMIGRANTS who STARTED/ made this Country PROGRESS....So if you aren't Native Americans(indians) then you AN IMMIGRANT YOURSELF. you people are really just Selfish! I attended middle school and high school.....and GRADUATED 2nd out my class. I have NEVER committed any crimes whatsoever( and I dont intend to,DOnt have time for stuff like that).So if trying to Be successful is a crime then i guess EVERYONE is GUILTY of it and should be in JAIL..... ALL im saying is There are GOOD IMMIGRANTS HERE WHO WILL GIVE ANYTHING TO BECOME A CITIZEN AND THE DREAM ACT IS A GREAT IDEA FOR (IN THE WORDS OF THE PRESIDENT) "TALENTED KIDS" TO Get a BETTER/GOOD Education{LIKE MYSELF}..i DIDNT come to america over NO BOAT OR I CROSSED THE BORDER....I flew over here with my family from the Caribbean......SO technically im not illegal(in terms of crossing/jumping over the border)......STOP BEING RACIST AND IGNORANT ....WAKE UP AND REALIZE HOW AMERICA CAME TO HOW IT IS TODAY ughhh I hate seeing such STUPIDITY. I BET THAT YOUR GREAT GRANDMOTHER OR YOUR ANCESTORS WERE IMMIGRANTS. .....Think about it........ HAHAHAHA IDIOTS!

DREAM ACT ALL THE WAYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYYY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D

Commonsense - you are the one that said that weren't any laws then - not me. I remember seeing films of people lined up to register or something at Ellis Island when the ships docked there. If there weren't any immigration laws then - what where they doing?

I'm not trying to put anyone down - you are the one that is being contradictory. All I want is for the people that come here - do so legally, assimilate themselves to the culture and not be a burden on the system.

Sounds like you need to work on getting some common sense.

People lined up at Ellis Island to REGISTER. They did not need a visa to get into the country. They did not need permission from the government before coming here. As soon as they got here, they were allowed to seek employment. The process of becoming a US resident did not take decades, it took hours. It was a sensible system that worked quite well.

I'm not trying to put anyone down

Maybe you're not, unless you define immigrants as human beings. Unless you think that human beings have an unalienable right to work, better themselves, and enjoy the fruits of their own labor. Or did you mean that you're just trying to KEEP people down?

Art, The DREAM Act allows people to be here legally, assimilate themselves to the culture, and not be a burden on the system.

Your either for legal avenues, assimilation, and people providing for themselves, or your against it. I'm FOR, and that's why I support the DREAM Act.

This is about the Rule of law. We have laws and aliens do not have the right to be here illegally. I don't care how long ago your ancestors got here, it doesn't change the law. Yes this is my home, I was born here to legal US citizens, who btw happen to have a pedigree going back to the 1600's here on one side and back to the land bridge crossing during the last glacial period in North America on the other side because they are related to Eastern Native Americans who were here BEFORE Navajo and Apache tribes based on archaeological evidence. None of this is relevent when it comes to people invading our country and demanding to be citizens just cause they were able to sneak into our country.

As for being Sarah Palin-- lol thats a good one. I do not own a gun, I am agnostic, have a science degree, none of my children have had kids out of wedlock, hate being cold, independant voter and I CANNOT see Russia from my house..

323232-1496119

And how did your ancestors and the founders of this country get here?????

Rest assured they did not get here by "Way of "Legal Immigration".

This country is made up of nothing but illegal immigrants.

Your post is nothing but "innuendos".

That means you have "No Supporting Facts.

The Dream Act will only be helpful to those either serving in the military, or obtaining two years of college. Since the unemployment rate for college graduates is only 4.5% how are they competing in a tight labor market? Is 4.5% a tight labor market? Or are you republiracists going to argue that a college graduate will compete in the unskilled labor market? Or will you do what you always do and try to hide that fact as it does not suit your racist agenda?

Josephi - most of thepeople that came here from Europe 1-2 hundred years ago did follow the law. Where are your FACTS? My ancestors came through Ellis Island. That means that they did it LEGALLY.

Dem in Texas---- The 4.5% unemployment figure is based on a college degree---meaning a Bachelors. Two years in college means an associate's degree which faces a much higher unemployment figure.

Additionally, does the DREAM Act require the person earn a degree or just "attend" two years of college? If you're using the "best and brightest" argument as a means to pass this bill, perhaps we should seek out the "best and brightest" and require a minimum of a bachelor's degree in a critical area (such as medicine or engineering) with a company sponsored work permit during the ten year waiting period.

josephi is a illegal alien sympathizer. He cares little about the laws that are broken by these criminals each and every day. If the truth be known, he'd be a benefactor of the DREAM act himself and wants that free ride into this country. And no, josephi...the majority are not illegal...most of us have our birth certificate and VALID SS #...

Now, go cry me a river for these criminals...

The truth is, all you nativist bigots acting superior to others have done NOTHING to earn your place here. cantankerousnomore has a birth certificate. Big deal. That was your mother's accomplishment, not yours.

The people you spit on have more character, and more in common with the Founding Fathers, than you do; and therefore are more American than you are.

All men are created equal and endowed by their Creator with certain unalienable rights, among them, the rights to Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness.

Commonsense...

yea, at least I'm adult enough to use your vine name...I'd really like to tell you what I think you are but Tyler may have issues with it. Hey Tyler...why not silence Commonsense for a day...breaking the COH?

Life, liberty, and pursuit of happiness in you own country, thank you! And the United States is NOT their country!

Take your bleeding heart someplace else...look at the posts...YOU ARE IN THE MINORITY!

Yes - cantakenomore, Commonsense likes to turn things around. How can someone coming here, knowingly breaking the laws, as they are now, be more like the founding fathers then US citizens? They can't. He tried to acuse me of being a hypocrite when he knows full well that he is the one spouting nonsense.

I have done something to earn my right here. Number one - I was born here and so were my parents and grandparents and great-grandparents and so on and so forth. I served in the military, I pay my taxes, I DON"T ask for hand-outs, I don't expect this country to bend to my wishes because I refuse to learn the language. I don't demand that there are TV stations that broadcast in a foriegn language because I refuse to learn the language of the land.

Commonsense believes that because there were NOT any laws governing immigration 200 years ago that everyone that came here then broke the law. If there were no laws against it then, then it was not illegal. There are laws now , but commonsense is lacking in his screenname.

there is one big difference between the 'then and now' 'immigration' argument i keep hearing. THEN, there were no free bennies and perks. no slide into the hospital emergency room for free medical care. no tax credit for popping out anchor babies. no welfare for immigrants or anyone else. you had to make it on your own or you and your family most likely died.

i could be wrong, but actual legal immigrants still have to prove they will not be a burden on society. that seems to be the part of 'immigration' that, yes admit it, mainly hispanic illegals and their supporters have a problem with.

there is another complaint iam tired of hearing. just because someone has 'native american' ancestry doesnt mean that their ancestors ever lived here in what we call the united states. and though hispanics are united now, their native ancestors were not united previous to european 'immigration.' they were not the 'noble redmen' of myth. they battled over land and territory, killed others and took their land and enslaved their neighbors, just as hispanics claim europeans did to them.

i too am part native american. so why does hispanic/native trump my german/native?

the 'dream act' and any other form of 'amnesty' is an insult to american citizens and all legal immigrants. one of the complaints i hear most often from 'dream act' supporters, is that these poor illegal students arent eligible for grants. so its all about the freebies perks and bennies. and right now all about the democrats buying voter blocks.

until we can take care of the citizens of this country, we dont have the time or the money to worry about illegals who's biggest concern seems to be taking our overly generous system for one expensive ride after another.

for those who might want to throw the 'race card' at me, iam also tired of supporting israel, pakistan, afghanistan, iraq and any other 'cant manage to make it on their own' country or peoples.

and speaking of cant manage to make it on their own, tax the churches.

aunty

I know personally of someone who has immigrated here legally, and they're having just as much trouble as undocumented people. Many of them wait in line for years and years (the person I'm talking about was approved for permanent residency in 1998, but is STILL waiting... in the process, she aged out of the application and now has to find her own path to citizenship) because of bad paper pushing. The immigration system is so backed up that even people who do it right and follow the law are penalized.

So, what's your point? We should just let everyone in? What a senseless comment.

Read, Dave. My comment's bottom line: EVERYONE is having trouble and the system is broken. That's all.

What everyone who is opposed to this does not understand is that these are children we are talking about. These are not their parents. This shows your lack of understanding of OUR immigration system. In order to immigrate to the united states you need to have reason for the government to want you. In other words, if you do not have a degree or some special skill that the USA can benefit from then you cannot come to America.

That being said, parents see the disparity that their children will face and want to have a better life for them. So they migrate illegally. It's not right yes but that is what THEIR parents did.

If you were a child and you just followed your parents to another country would that be your fault? You say go back home to their mother countries. OBVIOUSLY that is stupid and shows ignorance. What will they go back to? No home, no money nothing. They probably don't even speak the language.

Most of the sentiments expressed is due to the media promoting an infectious wave of immigrants into the country. Half of the illegal immigrants in the country CAME on tourist visas and overstayed that visa. YES they came in legally on a tourist visa. Why did they do that? Because they knew that they could not qualify to come to America any other way. Most people don't have access to education or even post secondary education. What is wrong with wanting that for your family?

FINE, penalize the parents. Take it out on them. But don't attack innocence because these children did nothing but exist. Their parents brought them here and they have to suffer for THEIR mistakes. They are Americans. most of them have been here for at least a decade and would be considered citizens by their stay but the laws are no longer like this. Stop being racist for 2 minutes and look at your kids and ask yourself what lengths would you go to for them. THEN put yourself in the place of those illegal immigrants and think about what you would do for your children.

Most of you don't even think. You just accept what you see on tv as the truth. Do some actual research. Read the Bill. These kids can't even sponsor their family members for at least 20 years. Its just for the kids, not for future generations. And that whole crap about not being able to document how long they have been here?! How about school records? how about immunization shots? Propaganda at it's finest.

You really do not understand "commonsense." We have over 15 million Americans unemployed or underemployed. I am not concerned about illegal immigrants kids, I am concerned about my own family. Please put the responsibility where it belongs, on there nations of origin, stop putting there health and welfare burden on me. We have an immigration procedure, it needs to be followed.

Great post common sense

I also want to add that the comment that it gives rights that even citizens don't have is complete BS by the republiracist machine. Any citizen in this country has a right to pay instate tuition, if they went to high school in that state. This bill in no way says an undocumented immigrant who went to high school in California now qualifies for in state tuition in New York or anywhere else. They would still have to go through the process of gaining state residency to qualify for the reduced in state tuition. What is the problem giving the best and brightest an opportunity. I have yet to see any of them on street corners begging for money.

Dem in Texas - we are talking about the right to receive food stamps, subsidized housing and free medical care when most unemployed and underpaid AMERICANS can't receive the same.

Every couple of years a new amnesty act gets put up for a vote, ENOUGH IS ENOUGH. There are too many AMERICANS out of work and unable to make ends meet because the state and federal governments are more concerned about the ILLEGAL aliens in this country and their ILLEGAL votes. There are not enough tax dollars to go around anymore.

I don't care what country or planet you come from - if you can't do it LEGALLY - then you are not welcome here.

It doeas not matter what the bill says - it is amnesty for people that broke the law or a backdoor for their children. Next time I get caught for speeding or anything that is ILLEGAL I expect to pay the price not get amnesty for it. God knows I would like to but the law is the law.

Sorry about the typos.

Art, next time you get caught for speeding (what! are you ADMITTING that you're illegal?!), you'll be allowed to pay a fine and get on with your life.

Imagine if your only 'crime' was that you exceeded the speed limit 15 years ago, and your child was in the car with you at the time, and 15 years later you admitted to the 'crime'. The penalty for YOU would be immediate incarceration, separation from your family, separation from any property you might own that you paid for with your own money, loss of your job, and ultimate exile to a country you hadn't seen for 15 years. Imagine that your child was also punished, even though your child did absolutely nothing wrong. Your child would be incarcerated separately from you and exiled to a foreign country SEPARATELY from you in a country your child might not even have any memory of ever having lived in, possibly being landed a thousand miles away (because ICE likes to split people up). But if your child was neve caught, he or she would still be banned from ever attendng college or serving in the military or holding down a job, all because of what YOU did.

If that passes for justice with you, you deserve to be treated the same way yourself, but I hope nothing so horrible ever happens to you.

Chilo, that's baloney and you know it. The parents are already here, so are their millions of kids.

That word NEVER doesn't mean squat to liberals.

Baloney? That's what the bill reads... Look it up. I think it adds up to 25 years for a sibling to get on the Visa sibling Backlog.

You have a typo in your post.

Are you really serious.???? I am one of the many Latinos that were brought here to this wonderful country when I was younger, to have a better future than my parents did. I particaly am part of this country all I need is something that says that I am a citzen. Clearly you do not know what all goes down in Mexico and how hard it is to live in a country that sufffers everyday. Living paycheck to paycheck, if I can even call it that. We come to this country to better off our future and to get an education. We are not taking any jobs away. Let me ask you something, would you as an american work out in the fields picking the strawberries that you eat? NO!!! How about this question, waould you go out in the blazing heat to work as a roofer? No you would not. Even if you are saying yes you would right now as you are reading this, you know you wouldnt. By this i am satating that we are not takijng your so called jobs, on the contrary we are leaving the good jobs to the Americans. Of course we would prefer to work in offices but yet we cant!!!!

Would you or your parents work to fix the mess you created or simply run to your neighbors and hope to benefit from his hard work? ...nevermind, you're existence here proves the answer.

America!-277249 - "waould you go out in the blazing heat to work as a roofer? No you would not."

Wrong! My husband is a roofer, has been in the business since he was 15 years old. He'd love to be out in the blazing heat, rain, cold, whatever weather, doing roofing. But unfortunately the illegal aliens in the labor market here have pushed the prevailing wage down to $3-4 per hour with no benefits or workmen's comp insurance. If a non-alien tries to work in spite of 3rd world working conditions, they are threatened or even beaten.

What about his former winter job of drywalling? Same thing there!! If you don't "habla espanol" as your first (and frequently only) language, you're out of luck.

To those people saying illegal aliens do the jobs US citizens won't - wake up!. They are destroying the working lives of millions of people.

If a non-alien tries to work in spite of 3rd world working conditions, they are threatened or even beaten.

Great comic relief. You weren't serious... right?

America!-277249- just because your parents brought you here doesn't mean you get to be a citizen. Go back to mexico and come back legally and you will be welcome. But as of now our tax dollars wont pay for you ahead of american citizens and legal residents. It isn't fair. We don't reward criminals here let alone pay for them to have more rights and privileges. You say you love America but you disrespect our law by coming here illegally. Thats not respect.

Do you keep forgetting we are a Nation that's broke. They have already wrung us out.

Yes humans my dear, and they have the ability to reason don't they? I guess they just don't want to reason that they broke the laws of this country and should go back home. My neighbor's wife was killed and raped by one of these humans and I guess you won't or can't reason enough about that until something or someone near you is affected. Liberal bleeding hearts are ruining this country.

As sad as that is, that's exactly what those restrictions are meant to do. They're meant to make people really WORK and deserve being a part of this country.

MORE POINTS TO CONSIDER!

THIS LAW...

Further limits eligibility for conditional nonimmigrant status by specifically excluding anyone who:

They are human and I do feel for the conditions in thier respective countries that cause them to decide to enter ours illegally, but the fact is they are criminals. Allowing their children to stay here and pay for their education is encouraging them to continue breaking the law. And the fact that they would not be allowed to sponsor a family member for x number of years is nothing more than bull@!$%#. Their families are already here.

This is a waste of money. If they are going to do something like this, I would complain a lot less if they applied it to ONLY citizens or LEGAL immigrant children.

I don't know about the colleges, but I can tell you that there is a significant percentage of "cholos" (legal immigrants and citizens) in the military and they do just as well here as any other ethnic group. The problem is, the military is downsizing and giving these "dream act kids" 2 years of service may not be a viable option unless the dream act forces recruiters to take these illegals over citizens. Then it becomes a racism issue.

pj122...

So did Obamas aunt meet the above guidelines? No! And she was granted amnesty.

To: are you wake yet??

If you are not a resident or a citzen you can not serve this country, therefore there is noone that is illgeal that is enlisted in any military branch!!!!!!!! And it is not a waste of money. On the other hand it will contrubute lots of money towards this country. Just filling out an application to become a citzen is a lot of money ranging from about 2500-5000. And that is not all you have to pay. So technically we, as in illegal immigrants, will be helping out this country get out of debt.

"Just filling out an application to become a citzen is a lot of money ranging from about 2500-5000"

What is your source on this other than your desire to rationalize your own criminally obtained situation? You are grasping at straws.

America,

I am also the product of this broken system we have in the U.S. I was adopted, but the racist immigration officer denied me citizenship, residency, and even a visa. Despite being adopted by American Citizens. I chose voluntary deportation when I was 18 as a way to fix my papers. Yes, at this time it was the only way I could obtain my papers. I didn't even speak Spanish when I returned to Mexico. Was I a criminal.... well technically yes. But no more so than the millions of Americans that speed to work everyday. Deporting individuals that want to and have contributed to this country is like cutting someones hands off that speeds. The punishment does not fit the crime. There needs to be a way for these individuals to obtain their citizenship, and right now there isn't a reasonable option. The Dream Act needs to pass.

@PJAM09

Here's your source, & how about you do your research & stop being so ignorant

(note the .gov domain, so don't give me any 'articles' from other websites in response)

http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis/menuitem.eb1d4c2a3e5b9ac89243c6a7543f6d1a/?vgnextoid=40a9b2149e7df110VgnVCM1000004718190aRCRD&vgnextchannel=40a9b2149e7df110VgnVCM1000004718190aRCRD

Dem in Texas -There needs to be a way for these individuals to obtain their citizenship, and right now there isn't a reasonable option.

The only option is to get in line, do the paper work and wait. Its not fair to jump in front of someone who have been on the list for years.

thetotas, you acknowledge that "There needs to be a way for these individuals to obtain their citizenship, and right now there isn't a reasonable option."

That's what the DREAM Act is for.

Dave, what difference does it make if the nation is broke? The DREAM Act does not give money to anyone. These kids have to pay their own tuition, just like everyone else.

America, apparently comprehension is not one of your strong points, so let me me repeat what I said in my post #11.4:

There is a significant percentage of LEGAL immigrants in the military. There are plenty who have legal residency in this country and are able to join. I know this because I have helped my subordinates to GET their citizenship. No where in that post did I say illegals were serving.

From what I have seen, the dream act will also help those who are here ILLEGALLY to join the service (if they choose that route), something you've already said is "illegal". So in effect you saying that it will be okay for those people who have already commited an illegal act (crossing the border) to commit another one.

The dream act will cost the govt money. How many children of illegal immigrants will be able to afford college? Chances are they will either get grants from the govt or they will join the service and get the educational benefits from that. As far as I'm concerned, the Dream act should be for benefitting the legal immigrants and citizens of this country, NOT illegals and their children.

That is the most inane statement made in support of this nightmare act.. The parent illegals should be jailed and sent back. The children of illegals should just be sent back to the big extended family in Mexico.

The supporters of this act are flooding the senate with calls supporting the act. Heck, most aren't even legal voters, I think the opposition to this act should do the same and flood the against of this insane bill.

Durbin IL and Reid NV suck

Rod isn't supporting the act, he is pointing out it's stupidity/absurdity.

Did you think that up all by yourself rodmart? Or did someone else tell you the DREAM Act authorizes children of immigrants to keep money that was stolen from banks?

So lets say your the child of bank robbers. They broke the law, but as their innocent children should you be allowed to

Serve in the military? YES

Go to college? YES

Work while attending college? YES

Those are the things the DREAM Act allows, mart. There is nothing in the DREAM Act that allows children to keep money stolen from banks. If you had read the bill, you would know that.

People scrimp to pay college tuition here too. The DREAM Act does not give financial assistance to students, it is just a pathway to get legal status. There are thousands of students that want to keep going to school, but can't afford it when asked to pay out of state tuition.

You say you think of your friends from China, India, and Pakistan, well think of the students from other countries who don't have it as easy to come here as those three countries. The US makes it harder for some countries while leaving the door wide open to people from India.

The door is wide open for people coming into the country illegally through Mexico or Canada. It's by far easier to come here from those countries than any other.

Ease of entry does not and should not equate to an implied right to be here.

You're wrong about ease of entry OCMI. It is far easier to come here with a visitor's visa from a country that is favored (Europe or Canada). That is the route chosen by the 9/11 and nearly all other terrorists (a few have come through Asia and none through Mexico). After that, it is a simple matter to overstay the visa.

Your statement has been by far the most stereotypical and racist I have read on here so far. You dare to make stereotypical statements about a whole ethnicity by the mere encounters you have had??? You think you have enough information to make your ridiculous statements??? And in any case, there are millions who would love to be given the opportunity to have 2 years to complete the requirements to become a citizen, but what you propose is logistically impossible. The system is already broken and there are already thousands of people waiting over 10 for the system to do its job. Please get informed before making ridiculous statements. You sound like a backwoods redneck claiming superiority over the Mexican people.

Here's a better idea: Don't give em two years, we should throw them out now.

I am really sad; I don't remember any history book in which is explained what immigration requirements Europeans had to go through when they hopped off their boats and started to reside in America: I do remember if history doesn't fail me that most native-American were almost wiped out of this big continent because our ancestors wanted a better life for themselves and their children, also because we had queen and kings who were vastly greedy. Also this is a young nation if anybody is going to be talking about sending anybody home then the native Americans are going to have a big continent for themselves for they are the only ones who can really say they are Americans, I mean does anybody know why they don't pay taxes for their businesses and they are protected by this nation. There is this thing called white man's guilt, I mean we already have their land, killed most of them, and put then in their own camps. Shheesh We are screwed if we have to be send back to where we come from because even though we keep having Thanksgiving we never bothered to mixed much with the race hu? As opposed to most Latin Americans who are very much mixed, the skin tone- native genes-hu!

Talk about irony, this was once the country for immigrants, so that they could have a better tomorrow. I guess that only applied to Europeans.

Again if anyone is talking about sending anybody home, it is more logical that we would easily be accepted back in Europe than any Mexican, Dominican, Brazilian, or other Latin American, because lets face it even one of Latin America tiny tiny country's population has more American Indian blood than the entire US population.

Something else I want to say, The DREAM Act is not just for Mexican children but for others too. The children that are now asking for this privilege are children who do not belong either here nor where they were born at. They don't know other place as their home other than here and here they want to spend the rest of their lives. We say is not fair for us because it is unlawful, take away jobs, they are different, or because some had great difficulty to do things right to get here, surely we aren't saying those things because we are racist are we? They don't have where to go. Lets think this through and come up with a reasonable answer as to why children who want to better themselves shouldn't be part of this nation, think eloquently, sometimes our feelings have no better solution for what has got to be solve by our intellect.

I'm native American, and I want all illegals gone, so that dog won't hunt, I also have a dream, to win the lottery, but My dream has about as much chance of comming true as yours does. NO DREAM ACT, NO AMNESTY EVER

Give the kids amnesty in return for the deportation of the parents. You can't have it both ways. If you can't punish the kids for the illegal acts of the parents, then punish the parents.

For every amnesty granted we need a permanent deportation.

Why don't you go through the legal process and become a citizen if you love this country so much instead of feeling sorry for yourself?

Problem is how many ids does the illegal immigrant have? I worked, found out later, with illegal alien mexicans, as the business closed I learned they were really someone else and gotten someone else ids..

Or take as an example the 14yr old mexican fleeing to the US after beheading 4 people in mexico. All of the illegals should be deported. Our prisons are full of them at great tax payer expense. The gangs, the murders, the drugs all part of what is making american sick.

@ Don: there probably isn't a Legal process for this student. Everyone assumes that these kids have a way to do it, and most of them don't.

I have no objection to your ability to get an education but why should I have to pay for your education when I can't even help my Grandkids to get a College education. Pay for it yourself and good luck.

Martin,

You really think that's what's making America sick??? First of all, the prison system is ridiculous. It's supposed to be a "correctional facility", but it doesn't help these people at all except become involved in a cycle that will lead them back. And so many prisons are really just private corporations with government contracts making very few individuals wealthy at the tax-payers expense. You think your 1 example of Mexican criminally fleeing to the US is reasoning enough to deport all undocumented individuals??? "The gangs, the murders, the drugs all part of what is making american sick." Your right, now what does that have to do with undocumented student and the DREAM Act???? Are undocumented students the ones in these gangs, murdering and dealing drugs??? No, did we forget the KKK, all the mafia organizations, biker gangs, and countless others? And all of you please quit with these tired and unlogical statements like: "My neighbor's wife was killed by an illegal, they need to get deported" or "my local store was robbed by an illegal, they need to get deported". You're seriously going to disregard the countless overwhelming number of crimes committed by citizens?!?!?!

I do indeed know how it feels to be in your posistion. I am also an immigrant that was brought to this couontry at the age of 5, and like you all I need are proper documentation to let people know that I am American.

@Don: My family and I have being going through the leagl process for more than ten years now, and nothing has happened. If only this Bill could pass my whole life and many other peoples life would change dramitcally.

@Charles: Peoples tax money do not pay for my college right now. On the other hand I have worked hard enough throughout my whole life to get to where I am now. I am the thrid in my family to continue in college without dropping out. I do not know how I would have achived my goal if I did not have the support of my teachers and the scholarships that I worked hard for.

You put yourself in your position, not us. If you're not here legally, get out. You all say the reason you left your Country is because it was such a terrible place to live. If that's the case, fight for your Rights, don't come here and take ours. If you don't have the courage to fix your own problems, why should we want you here?

America!-2777249- Please just tell me why you think you should get to stay here over someone who waited their turn and came here legally? This isn't fair to them is it.

Superstar- you are one of the few. I am glad you want to be American. What gets me going is seeing the students in La Canada Flintridge High School taking down the American flag and putting the Mexican flag above it and then flying the American flag upside down underneath it.

Learn the language, assimilate into the culture, come here legally and respect this country and what it stands for. If you do that I will never have a problem with you.

Sorry, but the stupid papers are part of it. Play by the rules. They may not be fair but neither is life. I think some of the speeding limits are stupid but I still get in trouble if I get caught breaking them.

Superstar and America - Who brought you here? You and you family came here illegally. If you want to attend college, fine. Pay the same tuition as a foreign student. Why should you get the privilege of in-state tuition?

If you want the amnesty than lets deport the people that brought you here illegally. If you want to stay, they need to go. You can't have it both ways.

Are you sure of your facts? Is everything really automatic? Doesn't the bill have a provision eliminating the sponsorship of family members? I'm on the fence about the bill, but before bashing the whole Legislative branch of government maybe we should find out a little bit more about it. You seem to be casting a pretty wide net.

@patty-2579097

While you're on the fence about the bill, I must applaud your sense of fairness and justice about the proposed bill

So I'll try to address some of your concerns. The bill gives the students who qualify Temporary Non-immigrant status. They must stay in that status for no less than 10 years. Persons under that status, it is clearly defined they are NOT eligible for Pell Grants, Medicare, none of the benefits under the new Health Care law, welfare, housing, etc etc. In fact as part of the application requirements they must demonstrate they have a means of living (i.e a resident family member).
They cannot sponsor family members until they become US citizens, which they cannot do so for at least 15 years (10 years temporary status + 5 resident status)

& there are also those who imply we cannot verify the age they came. In fact we can, as a great majority simply overstayed their visas (within their passports) which have their date of entry into the US BY immigration authorities themselves.
I hope I can persuade you of the great good this act will do!

Support - You are correct about much of your statement. The great majority did not simply overstay their visas, the vast majority came here illegally without any passport. The only way to verify the age that they came is to see when the illegals enrolled in public schools.

Why should the students be granted in-state tuition? They are foreigners. Why aren't they required to pay the same tuition as a student that legally came here from overseas?

If the Dream Act passes, why shouldn't we deport the parents of each person that applies for the program? They are obviously here illegally and can't be sponsored by the student. You can't have it both ways. If the student stays, the person(s) that brought them here needs to be deported.

Many Americans prefer not to go to college. For example 10 out of 70 people in my graduating class decided to continue on to succeding in college. Three of those 10 people are illegal immigrants. Now if they passed this Bill those three teens that are illegal will be able to contribute in the American society, as doctors, lawyers,etc. And if they do not pass it all we, as in illegal immigrants, can do is go back to the country that we are origanlly came from and contribute what we learned here in America there instead of America benefiting the education that they gave us.

Sel,

American kids can't afford to go to college because they haven't figured out how to make money by playing X-Box and Playstation. I had mediocre grades in high school, still got into a state University and I worked my way through. I washed dishes, waited tables, took the bus everywhere and wore nearly rags to finish. It took me 5 years to finish a degree but I did it. And after working a few years and actually saving my money I went back to complete a masters degree. It's not for everyone, I understand that, but it certainly is for anyone who wants it. Undocumented immigrants that finish college face up hill challenges not even fathomed by America's youth today. They deserve to stay, much more so than the low lifes begging on the street corners for drug money.

America---Go back to your country and contribute what you learned in American schools. Make your home country a better country and then we should have less immigration problems. It's a win-win situation for both countries if the Dream Act doesn't pass and you must return.

Karen,

Ok, here are a few of the problems with your simplistic solution, as I have had personal experience with all of these scenarios.

If America does go back and happens to land a job that requires him to enter the U.S. on business he is screwed as he will have a 10 year bar against him/her.

If someone marries a U.S. citizen out of pure love and demonstrates so to immigration officials they still have to go back to their native country for 10 years. That's really fair isn't it?

More problems: If someone overstays a tourist visa and they marry a U.S. citizenship it is a simple adjustment of status. they don't have to return to their respective country. If someone enters illegally, marrys a U.S. citizen they have to go back for 10 years before they can re-enter. How likely is that do you think, that after living a broad 10 years they will come back? Ok, now think how likely it is that anyone will even start the process knowing it includes returning to their home country for 10 years while their spouse either stays in the U.S. or gives up their job, life, or family to go?

The system is broke, it doesn't offer a viable way for people to obtain legal residency. If the only viable solution is to return to your home country for 10 years guess what, people won't do it.

America!-2777249 If they are illegal immigrants they shouldn't have been admitted to high school let alone college. Its not fair that our tax dollars are paying for you

Dem in Texas - if you think that the system is broke - take it up with your rep and sen. The thing is, that is the law as it is now. I don't think that marijuana should be illegal but it is. I am not going to cry for amnesty if I get caught with some though. This whole argument is about the LAW, nothing else. It is not about what is right (even though it is wrong to break the law) or wrong, it is about what is legal and illegal.

What part of illegal entry do you people not get?

The American Dream you're talking about is something that belongs in a time that is not NOW. The American Dream spurs from the fact that you can come to this country and make something of yourself... except all YOUR family members had to do, back in the day, was get on a boat and pass a health inspection at Ellis Island. None of this crap that people have to go through nowadays. Please consider that and consider yourself LUCKY that your grandparents/great grandparents/whatever just had to hop on a boat. Probably with a sail and a crew to man it (not an inner tube, for example). You are LUCKY. Never forget that.

As a second gen American thats BS. My Grandfather came to this country on one of thoes boats you talk about and spent his time at Ellis Island. It wasnt a health check and your in. He spent 6 months there learning English and history. Just bacuse you came "over" on the boats didnt get you a free ticket to America. Look up and learn your history.

Six months of waiting is way shorter than ten years, twenty years.... which is how long many of these youngsters have been waiting. Legal immigrants too have been waiting for a long time. Both illegals and legal immigrants have been learning English and history THEIR ENTIRE LIVES. THEY KNOW NOTHING ELSE. We learned your history and your English, but we have nothing to show for it. I have nothing to say for illegals... breaking the law is inexcusable. But there are legal immigrants who have done the EXACT same thing as your grandfather, and we have nothing to show for it simply because the time is NOW rather than two generations ago.

We put two children through college without help, living on a tight budget for years, but it was our responsibility, not the States, not the Federal Government. Now for some reason that seems to be changing. Sad, sad , sad.

This bill is about a structure, enduring, fair pathway to citizenship... which will take years. Not about free college money. PLEASE DO EVEN THE MINIMAL AMOUNT OF RESEARCH ON THE BILL BEFORE MAKING JUDGMENTS.

"The truth is that despite a handful of successful reforms, the state of American education is pitiful, and getting worse. Spending on schools has more than doubled in the last three decades, but the increased resources haven't produced better results. The U.S. is currently 21st, 23rd, and 25th among 30 developed nations in science, reading, and math, respectively. The children in our schools today will be the first generation of Americans who will be less educated than the previous generation."

I say before we even think about The Dream Act lets get our Act together get these scores up, reform our education system. I cant believe they are even talking about this, let alone trying to pass a Bill.

"a bill be passed that waived the unlawful presence and allowed those in the country illegally to apply for an immigrant visa" ...I don't see any penalty here for their illegal acts. If they did what you recommend then a person should just come in illegally and ask to change status. They must follow the rules from the beginning to the end. They can apply for a visa from their home country like everyone else.

Very very nicely written. I totally agree with what you have presented, except for the fact that the illegals are still being pardoned and brought into the legal system without any penalty. Also, if they are not able to find a job after their F1 visa expires, would they have to leave the country, like all the current legal F1s are forced to do? Do you think they would do that? I mean, they were used to being illegal before, so they wouldn't think twice before overstaying the expired visa, thus becoming illegal again!

I came into this wonderful country on an F-1 visa, did my Master's in a reputed univ, have been working for the past 6 years on a H-1 visa, and I am still 5-6 years away (the backlog/queue is so long) from even applying for adjustment of status. If DREAM act gets passed, it would really be a slap on my face.... I did everything the legal way, have been paying my taxes, SS taxes, etc and yet, the "undocumented" students get to become permanent residents in a snap? I know immigration is not a right, but this is just not acceptable behavior in a country of laws. It actually makes me think that maybe I should have come into the country 5 years earlier (I came in when I was 21), so that I satisfy the 16 years eligibility for the DREAM act! So much for being honest and following the rules :-(

One thing your proposal does solve is this: the current version of the DREAM act gives these illegals an edge over all the legal students - they do not need any employer to sponsor a work visa to employ them, making it cheaper and easier to hire the illegal students than the legal students. So the government gives them a helping hand and then the employers prefer them over the others. What's up with that!!!!!

"I am so tired of these criminals getting FREE education..."

Haha Lady, you CAN'T get "FREE education, housing, food, health care... etc" if you're illegal! And it's good for this country to have smart, educated young people instead of people like you... no offense of course..

But really, the truth of the matter is that alot of these families (read heathen people by conservatives) actually DO pay taxes (you don't have to have citizenship to obtain a form and pay). Hell there are millions of U.S. citizens that don't even pay taxes..!

I totally agree with Jimmy lady. My father has been paying taxes ever since he immigrated to this country. And I know PLENTY of Americans that cheat the government so they wont have to pay taxes. Of course we would like to help change this country to be better than it already is, but the only way that we can do that is by becoming citzens or resdients. Like you said we do not have a saying in anything due to the fact that we are not from here. This is way we can NOT help CHANGE America!!!!!!!

This Act provides a route to citizenship to the children brought here illegally by their parents. They are here by no fault of their own and with immigration policies the way they are now, they do not have a way to become legal. This Act gives them that path. It only applies to people of "good moral" character and who have already been here for 5 years. About blending in, they already do - you probably wouldn't even know they are immigrants because they have been raised in the United States and have gone to primary school.

And how do you suggest they do it legally, if they've lived here their entire lives and ARE Americans at heart, but were brought here (not by their choice) when they were 1, 2, 3, 4 years old?

How long are you people going to have such closed minds, and realize that the young people in this country are the ones who will be running the country in the years to come? Give the innocent ones a chance to complete their drems; stop stomping on them.

Young people will be running this country in the years to come? True, but not young mexicans here illegally. Try to sneak in Mexico's southern border and see what happens to ya.

u.s. politics..^_^..you are too young to smoke or drink at 18, but old enough to go kill at war...you may pay, as an undocumented student, thousand of dollars at college, but may not receive residence afterward. is that even legal? i mean, come on:(