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After threatening this morning to hold a procedural vote on the bill containing repeal of Don’t Ask Don’t Tell, Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid’s office confirmed late Wednesday that he will postpone the vote as negotiations continue with Republicans who support lifting the ban on gays and lesbians serving openly in the military.
The Senate will also not hold a test vote on the DREAM Act tonight.
The delay will allow more time for Reid to negotiate with Republican Sen. Susan Collins, who supports repeal but has demanded a "fair and open" process on debate and amendments to the Defense Authorization bill that contains the DADT repeal.
Shortly before the postponement was made public, Republican Sen. Susan Collins said she would not vote to bring the bill containing Don't Ask, Don't Tell to the floor if it the vote happened tonight.
"Everyone on the Republican side wants to see the tax package completed first," Collins said in a nod to the GOP caucus's promise to block legislation until the Senate addresses the Bush-era tax cuts or government spending. "So I have urged the Majority Leader to postpone the vote ... which he is threatening to hold tonight so we could get the tax bill considered first."
"Why not take the path that would lead to 60 votes?” Collins asked.
During negotiations Wednesday, Reid made an offer to address Collins' concerns, proposing to allow Republicans votes on 10 amendments and up to 17 hours of debate on the bill.
Collins rejected that deal.
Collins said she made a counter offer, requesting double the time for debate and more freedom for Republicans to choose the amendments they address.
But when asked what Reid's response was, Collins said "he does not seem interested at this point."
"There are many people in my caucus who disagree with my position [to repeal DADT],” Collins told reporters. “They deserve an opportunity to offer amendments to strike that provision, to modify it, and also to address other important controversial issues in the bill."
Msnbc.com's Carrie Dann contributed
Leave a Comment:
DADT is unconstitutional....get on with repealing it already.
I really hate all the political games.
Republicans ran on "listening to the people". The polls are clear on this one 72% of Americans want it repealed.
No one should be forced to serve with openly gay service members. This will result in the end of the United States military as a viable fighting force.
Galactus - as opposed to now when the are fighting with closet gays. This can only strengthen our military. Any thought otherwise is ignorant.
Galactus, the majority of armies in the civilized world allow gays and lesbians to serve openly (Including Germany, Russia, Israel, Britain, France, Spain, Australia, Sweden, Canada, Japan, Switzerland etc. etc. etc.), and they're all doing just fine.
Amazing that the rest of the world can handle it without any problem, but that we're all so delicate that it would DESTROY OUR ENTIRE CIVILIZATION.
Good grief, you're all such heterosexual pansies.
Really People? Open or not, Gay Americans are serving in the military! About 10% of the population is Gay. This is no different in the military, I hate to tell you! Unfortunately, Gay Americans can be discharged for being who they are! I'm sure we can find something about each of you that someone would love to discriminate against. How about we fire you from your job for that reason?
72% of Americans don't care about DADT. What counts is the opinion of our soldiers that must serve with openly gay people. Many combat soldiers do not want to repeal DADT. I can't see how openly gay service members can be a good thing and be conducive to unit morale. Why would gay soldiers want to flaunt their sexual perversion?
Galactus, no one in the military should be forced to protect you! You are a total ingrate! These men and women are sacrificing for us, for our country! Show a little gratitude!
yo ms. greek princess.....who said anything about flaunting? is there something maybe you'd like to share?
Thirty percent of those on combat arms have said they would consider leaving if this passes. If that number turns out to be just 20%, that means we lose 250,000 troops, 250,000 of the guys that do the actual fighting.
Think 72% of Americans are in favor of that happening in a time of war.
There is no pertinent military reason to pass this.
Individual equality doesn't save lives on the battlefield, unit cohesion does.
This is nothing more than a politically correct social agenda issue supported only by a simplistic slanted survey that liberals are trying to cram through in a lame duck session.
Needless. Do it the right way and allow for discussion and study by the elected representatives, not lame ducks.
Thats dumb, people in the military are forced to do a lot of things they don't necessarly like. Its called being an adult. You made a decision to join the military fully knowing that you have to obey lawful orders. Its not like they would have to deal with sexual harrasment from the gay service members in fact it will probubly will be the opposit for a long time to come. Frankly its an all volunteer force nobody is being forced to do anything. Oh and your fear of us being a viable force, look at all the top Military Forces in the worldl Britain, Isreal, Germany, and Japan all state of the art strong military forces all allow Gays to serve openly in the military.
Slow your roll Bob.... the actual fighting?!??!?! Those "combat" troops are a misnomer now. We all do the fighting, whether or not we're designated as combat. They've done the study. And gay troops are already serving. It hasn't harmed cohesion, it just scares a bunch of old white homophobes (with, like a name like Bob, I assume you fall into that category). If you think we should go back to pre-emancipation, pre-civil rights, pre-women in the work force, maybe you should visit a country that does not honor Freedom and Democracy for ALL! Let's stand up and show that we are an all inclusive nation. We are not Uganda who discriminates against gays, we are more like our more civilized bretheren who already advocate and include in their armed forces (WHICH WE HAVE ALREADY SERVED SIDE BY SIDE WITH)
I simply suggested respect for the opinion of the 67% of Marines and 50% of Soldiers in combat arms. I simply suggested we respect the 1/3 of combat troops that said they would consider leaving if this passes. I simply questioned whether 72% of Americans would support this if 250,000 combat troops left because of it. I simply suggested we take time and do it the right way.
What's your problem?
About that "combat" troops is a misnomer, "We all do the fighting". Funny I imagined the guys in firefights, walking patrol and worrying about IEDs/mines, loading buddies on Blackhawks, etc. had more stress and more things on their minds than Brad Manning sitting at his desk lip sinking Lady Gaga.
Not a study. It was a slanted survey.
It hasn't harmed cohesion. You're right, DADT is working fine, why mess with it in such a hurried way. As I said above - no pertinent military reason to repeal it - irrelevent liberal social issue.
Not a homophobe, Jackass. Pathetic attempt to marginalize my argument, though especially in light of not addressing or challenging what I actually said.
Bob, it's already been ruled unconstitutional, it needs to go away or the courts will see that it does go away. The discussion was about implementing the policy.
Troops aren't going to leave, if they felt that threatened they would have already left.
The military serves the people of the US that want this repealed.
Why do you have such little faith in our military members? By the logic shown above, you think that people will want to leave the service. You mean to say that our soldiers are less professional than Canada, UK and our other allies? Those nations had no issues integrating the troops, but you have such a low opinion of our service members.
If we really felt that our soldiers cannot serve with openly gay service members, then we should withdraw from NATO because every day our soldiers serve side by side with gay allies.
There are certainly passionate arguments on both sides of this issue. I've yet to see, however, a discussion that focuses on the safety of our troops. Let's face it, our military are serving in places that, in our perspective, are culturally out of whack and we are fighting foes who live their lives based on ideas and values we find barbaric.
Are we so self centered that we (who are not on the battlefield) demand that our gay soldiers express themselves...? (I don't know what that means exactly)
As I package up boxes to send to our troops overseas we have restrictions. It troubles me that we can't send certain things like bibles, Christian items, certain magazines, books, even pork jerky to our troops in the Middle East. We don't want to offend the citizens of the country the soldiers are fighting for or protecting. We don't want to put our soldiers in a worse situation than they already are. Like it or not, our soldiers are smack dab in the middle of cultures whose punishment for adultery is stoning, torture and execution. What they do to their gay citizens is beyond barbaric.
So my question is, while we are standing up for the rights of gay military - because we, as Americans will do that, are we also forcing a situation that puts our gay soldiers at greater risk? Will the "enemies" be incensed and do greater harm to our guys and gals - especially the openly gay? I'm not for appeasing the "enemy" by any means, but they hate us already. Will DADT make it worse and more dangerous for our troops?
Correct me if I'm wrong, but did not we vote on civil rights already and do not gays own these rights as heterosexuals do?
It is a true conflict to have men and women serve, fight and die for a country that fails to allow them simple human rights. Further mroe the Military Code requires honor yet demands they live a lie. Let this terrible thing be repealed and get on with living honorable lives and honoring those who protect ours. PLEASE.
as a gay marine myself, if DADT is repealed (which i hope it is), i would still not come out. why? cause i dont need to. but believe it or not, DADT still hurts me. how? when i go out with everyone on weekends, i constantly get asked why i never bring any girls home with me, i constantly have to turn my buddies down when they ask me to be their wingman, and i always have to find different reasons to turn down all the girls my buddies try to hook me up with. my best friends in the unit know about me, but thats only a select few, and they have no problem with it at all because i can still get my job done. not to mention, at 6'3 220lbs, i can outlift and outrun 99% of the population. i have near perfect scores on my physical fitness tests and have even deployed with 3rd recon out to iraq. unless you really know me, youd have no idea i was gay. i constantly hear guys talk about explicit detail about women they hookup with (behind their wives or girlfriend's backs), they all joke and have a good laugh with it all the time, yet when they ask me what i did over the weekend, i cant give them any ounce of truth. and when their wives find out (which they always do) all their training stops so they can go to counseling and all that other nonsense that keeps us from being combat ready. who gives a crap about adultery when we have us gays threatening to destroy everything.
sorry my argument was all over the place, just ranting.
Galactus, can you offer us some EVIDENCE to support allegation or do you just make stuff up?
100% of all junior enlisted are, at some point, going to hate doing something that they are told to do by their senior NCO's and officers. As a currently serving officer, I am less concerned about their opinions and more concerned on if they can complete their mission. We, in the military, are made of stern stuff and repealing DADT is not going to be much of an issue. There may be some people who leave the service, but they are the ones who apparently cannot be team players and I would rather not have anyone under my command who I couldn't trust to be part of my team.
Galactus is a bit off on his assessment of the future of the U.S. armed forces. He thinks our guys are pansies like him. Sorry G, but gays would enhance our military considerably. You're just too sick in the head to understand the issue at hand. Have you ever seen a buffed gay man? I guess not.
Gay Devil Dog: Thank you for your continued service. As a 20 year member of the military (National Guard with one tour in Iraq...former commissioned officer) and gay man I know exactly how you feel. Listening to fellow soldiers (or officers) rave about "banging this chic or that"...and knowing married commissioned officers were having sex with female enlisted soldiers while in Iraq (while wearing women's undergarments none-the-less), I know how much B.S. this crap about "flaunting" is. Don't "flaunt" your homosexuality in our face they say.....well how about why do you need to "flaunt" which "chic you banged" over the weekend in everybody elses?
When I finally retired I had many soldiers in my unit who asked me to stay in, they respected me as a commander and wanted me to remain (though I was an NCO at that point...long story...no degree at the time, etc.). The majority I spoke to that last weekend told me they knew or suspected I was gay and they didn't care. I never once made it an issue during my command, platoon leadership, etc. I was finally fed up with the old Army B.S., and the double standards. I did my duty for my country...and didn't feel the need to continue to participate in a profession where I was valued less than the others. Again...I'd done my duty.
With a brother who retired from the Corps I think I can safely say...Semper Fi Devildog!
Uhm, why would we need 60 votes? Doubt this would be fillibustered, or vetoed. Stop holding middle-class folks hostage, republican lap-dogs!
yo joshua, be serious, the republicans would filibuster changing a roll of toilet paper. they're so stubborn they'd walk around with ........oh yea, they would.
The rich can afford to be taxed.
Congratulations Republicans, who ran on fiscal conservancy, you've added 900 billion to the debt, the same size as the stimulus you griped about in the elections !
Eric: Last I checked, the democrats are still in control of the House, the Senate, and the White House. The amount added to the deficit will be listed as the increase that occurred on the Obama watch, while the legislative branch was controlled by the democrats. And as to the amount, letting someone keep what is theirs to begin with doesn't cost a dime. There is no actual cash outlay.
Gay Americans die in our service, let them serve in honor and truth!
If they repeal this law then, I think they should allow any service member who does not want to serve with openly gay people to get out of the military with an honorable discharge. They signed up for service with DADT and now we are changing the rules on them.
@Galactus: Indeed. We don't need bigots who don't know how to follow orders serving in the military.
Galactus999,
You need to wake up and join the rest of the world.
-- Twenty-five countries allowed military service by openly gay people as of June 2009.
-- They are: Australia, Austria, Belgium, Canada, Czech Republic, Denmark, Estonia, Finland, France, Germany, Ireland, Israel, Italy, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Netherlands, New Zealand, Norway, Slovenia, South Africa, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, United Kingdom, Uruguay.
Bottom line: The United States would not be alone in allowing gays to openly serve in the military. As of 2009, there are no fewer than 25 other countries that follow an open policy.
I totally agree with Galactus. Let them leave...hell I'll even host a party for each one. The military does not need anyone who cannot look past their own PERSONAL beliefs and prejudices. When you join the military you fight for the COUNTRY, and NOT for youself. It's not a democracy, it's the military. If the COUNTRY dictates (finally!) that DADT is done....then, by the oath we all swear to, we'll follow the orders of those appointed above us. So I say "Goodbye, and thank you for your service." but our military will be just fine....if not better, minus all the bigots/zeolots. The military "survived" intergration, we "survived" allowing women to serve.....we'll do just fine after DADT too.
I think when their enlistment is up, if they really want to leave the military, then let them! But they enlisted and swore an oath just like the rest of us did. They are bound to that oath to obey the orders of blah blah blah and etc...
Why should they be allowed the choice to get out of the military just because they don't like the orders they are given. If it were that simple, there would be people getting out for some of the most stupid reasons.
I think these guys (and ladies) need to "man-up" and stop complaining. Gays are in the military now and will continue to serve in the military for generations to come. I think it's time we, as Americans, step into the 21st century and join some of our allies. Isn't it great that I volunteer to serve to keep you free and equal and yet, I myself am not really free or equal!
Politicians continue to drag their feet on this. Time for the courts to do their thing.
that's not the way. listen to the Prez. the legislature makes the law. the courts job is to interpret that law. capish?
"listen to the Prez"
Why?
The only people dragging their feet are people like Senator Reid whose policy has always been "his way or the highway." Why shouldn't both parties have a chance to debate the bill? Why shouldn't both parties have a chance to add amendments?
But Reid refuses to allow both sides to cooperate and discuss.
He obviously wants to make another opportunity to call the other side more nasty names like the "party of no" when he refused to allow them a chance to speak or take part in the debate.
Things would be much better in the Senate if Reid had not been reelected. He's the problem, not the solution.
Now DADT is being held hostage for the 2 percent of rich people. So now we have to pay a price to end discrimination shame on them all!
Casey, Collins, Amos, Skelton, Mixon, McCain, and Conway are total morons. The people lifting the ban will affect is gay Americans, and I'm pretty sure they're OK with it. And I don't think changing a policy that should never have been in place in the first place is exactly rushing things. And if people would quit the military because gays are allowed to serve openly, I say good riddance to them. Let those bigots go find a company in the private sector that segregates workers by sexual orientation, race, religion, gender, etc.. Good luck finding that. They'll all have to go work at Catholic churches. And the chances they’ll find unacceptable behavior is way greater at a Catholic or Mormon Church than in the military. And what if gays left the military or didn't join because heterosexuals are allowed to serve openly? Where will they find replacements for the hundreds of thousands of brave gay Americans serving now? Bigots are such disgusting, repulsive cretins. And it is patently unfair that gays and their loved ones should suffer the devastating effects of discrimination while the bigots and their loved ones go about their daily lives as if nothing is wrong. Bigots need to start being made to face severe consequences for their actions. Maybe once bigots and their loved ones are made to pay for their repulsive behavior, they'll think twice before engaging in it again. Anyone coming into contact with Casey, Collins, Amos, Skelton, Mixon, McCain, Conway, or their loved ones (except McCain’s wife and daughter), should take any action possible to make them pay.
Gee bending over on that Tax bill really worked out well on everything else, when is this Prez going to learn the GOP don't deal unless it's dealt in their direction!
Gay soldiers have fought and died in every war including the American Revolution. It is unAmerican to insult gay Americans who have given their lives for this country. The same straight soldier who is trained to blow another human beings head off can't handle someone of the same sex finding them attractive? I have more faith in our military personnel who have vote 70% in favor of repealing DADT.
aw yo......watch when you use that word "blow" during a conversation like this. some of these phobes may get aroused and have to run in the closet.
Galactus: So you think that military personnel should get honorable discharges if they want to quit after DADT gets repealed because they signed up while DADT was in effect?
Would it have been similarly okay with you if military personnel in 2003 got the same deal because when they enlisted it wasn't "within the rules" for a president to lie about the reason for going to war in Iraq?
So, in addition to unemployment insurance for millions without jobs as a result of ten years of the Bush economic policies, and the nuclear arms treaty, tax relief for the middle class -- up to $250,000 -- Republicans are now holding DADT hostage to their demands that millionaires and billionaires not pay more taxes. Wonderful. Obama is being rolled like a log. They are showing they have no respect for him and know he is now a one term, unable to do anything, president. And I say this as one who gave him thousands of dollars and walked precincts in another state to get him elected. I wish I would have worked and voted for Hillary. She would never allow this to happen. She has, excuse me, balls.
Greek???? You might try actually researching the poll results that came from the actual SERVICE men... Almost 70% didn't think it would matter at all if they repealed this policy. Only the marines had a majority who opposed, but the overall poll was way in the majority.
Also hate to burst your bubble, but men have been having sex with other men while in the service since the beginning of time. Grow up. They would have to follow the same rules as us heteros. Period. I'm amazed at some of you who think, omg... they are going to start making moves on men in the shower, etc. REALLY???? while dodging missles, bullets, etc, I just KNOW a gay man will get a hard-on in the middle of this while looking at Sarge standing next to him.... NOT.
that's not nice .......you're crushing the poor Greek Princess's fantasy.
As a proud member of the USAF, I fully support DADT's repeal. The most ridiculous part of the debate is John McCain completely reversing his previous position of "when the military says it time to repeal, then we'll do it." Well, Senator, the five service chiefs, CJCS, SECDEF, and CINC, not to mention an overwhelming majority of servicemen and women, all agree that DADT can and should be repealed. What happened to you, Senator? You were once an independent voice of reason, but now you're one of the worst ideologues.
@bob-18 etc. An extensive study of other militaries that have gone through the same process also had surveys which seemed to indicate that droves of servicemen/women would leave once gays were allowed to serve openly. Gays were then allowed to serve openly.
Nothing. Happened.
Open your mind, read, think critically.
 Perhaps the next step for McCain and company will be to not allow the American flag to be draped over the casket of a gay service member.  You have to admire those who are willing to serve and die for a country that talks about equality but the Republican Party led by McCain and others really don't believe in it.  If Mr. McCain and friends are afraid if they turn their backs the gay soldiers would be checking out their scrawny butts they need not worry, they are just watching the homophobic Repubs turn their  backs again on a segment of our society.  I bet the men held hostage with McCain were glad he didn't know any were gay, he'd probably turn them in to their captors.  "Old Glory" doesn't have to worry about Wikileaks, the Republicans who want to vote against DADT are the ones who are making it mean not as much as it once did.  McCain and the others should be required to tell the parents whose gay sons and daughters died in the service of this country, that they weren't as good as their straight counterparts, and their deaths had less meaning because they were gay.  McCain needs to leave his wife's seven houses and get out into the real world more.
being gay is a perversion of nature
How do you figure?
So is your mother but I didn't complain about her last night!
King Half-a-loaf (Pesident 2-slices?) will probably offer a compromise to allow bisexuals in the military.
Gotta admit, that's funny.
Agree or disagree with the repeal, lawmakers better get it together as if they do not repeal it, it is highly probable that the Federal Court of Appeals will, be it so ordered. Then, there will be no smooth transition, no time for education, no time for branches to integrate (whatever that means), and it will be forced upon everyone in a more intrusive way which was indicated by military representatives that an ideal repeal (as most agree with the repeal eventually) would include all of these things.
If this is not done legislatively, it is likely that it will be done judicially. Most of the Senators are lawyers and are well aware of this. Now, which would everyone prefer?
Denying rights to any American is the act of a terrorist, you've got it backwards Floyd. Gay men and lesbian women are willing to do a job that you wouldn't do so what's that make you? A coward.
Please, continue to speak up for the rights of these proud men and women who serve in our military. Many of them who are gay do NOT have a voice. Be that voice. Get America to do the right thing.
The RIGHT thing to do is to give the gays their constitutional rights. Ever heard of the constitution Floyd?
DARA, "Don't Ask a Republican Anything" it will just be bigotry or hate and ignorance, or Religious, not governess.
M. Bachmann, Obama isn't using the word "God" enough come on Repucks please join the 21 first century or shut the hell up.
P.S. I'm sure Duggjr will attack me any second he hates my posts, so don't care butt-head. DADT is not about your moral code Right wingers, its about doing the right thing for society as a whole and individual freedom.
Why should the American people expect the Congress to solve this problem. They have not even addressed the big problems so why should they care about the members of the armed forces?
Gays have been in the military since the crusades for gods sake. Get real.
being gay is a perversion of nature so i dont understand why we are wasting our time on this
Perversion of nature Really and the scientific proof you have for that outrageous statement is found where?
Then maybe jolly... you can explain to us HOW straight people keep birthin gay babies?
After all according to you Adam & Steve cannot physically accomplish that feat!
Twenty five countries, including Australia, Britain, Canada, Denmark, Finland, France, Germany, Ireland, Italy, The Netherlands, Russia, Spain, Switzerland, The United Kingdom and Israel’s battled tested forces presently allow gay members to serve openly. Iraq, Iran, North Korea, Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and the United States do not allow such. Of the 26 countries that participate militarily in NATO Turkey and the United States are the only two of the original members that have bans still in place. Personally I believe this speaks for itself! Not a single one of the countries that allow gays to serve have experienced an increase in unacceptable behavior and not a single one had to do a survey. Here in the United States, more than 14,000 service members have been discharged under Don‘t Ask - Don‘t Tell, including many hundreds if not thousands with critical skills in foreign languages, military intelligence, counter terrorism, weapons development and military medicine. Meanwhile, the military is having such trouble finding qualified recruits that it issuing “moral waivers” to convicted felons and has lowered its educational and physical fitness requirements. The original rationale for “don't ask, don't tell” was that it would enhance unit morale and cohesion, and thus military preparedness, by shielding heterosexual soldiers from any knowledge that some of their colleagues were gay. That rationale has not held up in the real world. All branches of the military have routinely delayed investigations and discharges until suspected gays complete their deployments on combat missions. Their service has been deemed vital in the war zones, not detrimental. The federal court has ruled, based on persuasive evidence, that “don't ask, don't tell” is unconstitutional because it infringes the due process and free speech rights of gay service members, who are forced to lie about central elements of their lives. The courts have also made a powerful case that the law is harmful to military readiness, the opposite of what its authors said they intended. Our military leaders train our troops to be professional and at the same time teaches that lying is not only acceptable, it is mandatory. Many of the nations that have lifted their bans heard the same arguments that doing so would undermine unit cohesion, hurt retention and recruitments, None of the problems that were hypothesized materialized. Our own military has resisted racial integration, it resisted gender integration. In both cases, our military leaders kicked and screamed saying it would undermine effectiveness. Once the decision was made, soldiers saluted and followed in line. The Uniform Code Of Military Justice (UCMJ) applicable to all branches of US Military Service presently covers unacceptable behavior including sexual conduct, it should be equally and fairly enforced for all members regardless of their gender or sexual orientation. It is unfair to persecute valued service members under an outmoded and harmful law that should have been scrapped long ago. As a 12 year honorable discharged veteran of military service. I can assure everyone there are thousands of gay soldiers already serving honorably and have been since the inception of military service. Many have died defending our way of life. It is unfair to persecute valued service members under an outmoded and harmful law that should have been scrapped long ago. The time has come to throw Don't Ask, Don't Tell onto the scrap pile of American history.
Frankie,
Nice list - now which one of those battle tested armies on your list of openly serving gay militaries could kick USA's a@@? Uh.... none. If the best military the world has ever known has a DADT policy I'm good with that. The military isn't there to be a social experiment to see if we're ready for pillow bitters to come all the way out of the closet. Let's start with letting people with flat feet in the military first and we'll ramp up to gays in a bit.
BTW, of those 14,000 discharges you mentioned, 87% opted out of service.... meaning that THEY went to their chain of command and asked for the discharge - they weren't forced out as most of DADT proponents want everyone to believe. Soooo, long deployment, bad duty station, don't like the food, bed's lumpy.... "um... can I talk to you a minute?"
Alright then, let's go back and kick those colored people and women out of the military while you're at it. Remember when the minimum height requirement used to be 6 feet tall? But thanks to social experimentation, it's now reduced to 5 feet tall. Why don't you ask your congressman to revert back to the old rules and kick out everyone under 6 feet tall?
SimpleDoneRight is completely high. You think the U.S. has the most effective military? You been smokin' something bad. America isn't near the most effective fighting forces in ranking. Why do you think the Taliban is throuncing the U.S. with AK's and RPG's? Guys in dresses beating the U.S. technology that is trillions in the making.
Hey Simple (can I call you bonehead?) I agree that our military is probaly the best in the world but id still hate to go up against the Israelie Army (one on one)
Decorated Veteran: Is that eye-liner and lip-stick your decoration? It's a voluntary military. If gays don't want to serve they don't have to. If you repeal DADT and straights opt out then instantly we have another 1.2 million unemployed. Do you people ever think?
Sounds like a personel problem. If someone would rather risk their families going hungry, or their home foreclosed, and give up a steady paying job because they might see two gays hold hands, or <<gasp>> kiss, then "Goodbye and thanks for your service".
Conversely...if "straights" don't want to serve....they don't have to. Ones sexuality isn't a condition of service....hence all the gay men/women currently serving.
Equal opportunity employer, that's what the federal government is. If we want a progressive fighting force then the neanderthals should leave, quick. We don't need them. Unemployment is the least of our concerns. The bubbas got to go. Show 'em the door and don't give 'em an extra dime.
its a perversion of nature because we are not meant to have sex in that way, if we were gay men wouldn't have to have surgery on there anus's all the time to fix the damage they have done to themselves
Trollers gonna troll
Surgery? What on earth are you talking about? More FAUX news rhetoric? Beck, Limburger? Plain? No that's Palin? Whatever. You are really twisted. Keep the junk out of your butt and you won't have to see the surgeon hommee.