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Subscribe to RSSQuestion: If the Rand Pauls, Ken Bucks, Joe Millers, and Sharron Angles make it to the Senate, for whom will they cause more problems -- the Obama White House or Senate GOP leader Mitch McConnell?
NBC's Ken Strickland reports that McConnell and Senate Republicans are already thinking about ways how they can work hand in hand with the Tea Party class.
Key to McConnell’s success, added a former GOP leadership aide, will be to harness and channel the Tea Party agenda “in a way that’s productive rather than destructive or harmful to Senate Republicans or the country in general.”
[snip]
McConnell's strategy could include offering new members coveted slots on committees that serve their constituents’ interests, Republicans said. GOP leaders could also encourage new members to take a leading role in introducing legislation that addresses one of their campaign agenda items, but in a more scaled-back way.
For example, instead of trying to pass a bill that would eliminate the Department of Education — a much-discussed ideal in Tea Party circles but an almost impossibly unpopular one in practice — old hands in the Senate could help the newcomers draft legislation that makes dramatic reductions to its programs, something that might attract conservative Democratic support.
“You have to go out of your way to assimilate people and give them roles,” the GOP strategist said.
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All aboard... the CRAZY train is leaving the station! lol
If these tea baggers get anywhere near DC you are gonna see unprecedented & historic GRIDLOCK!
There is NO wayMcConnell & Boehner are going to be able to reign in all these mavericks! lol
And chaos will reign for the next 2 years - while Americans continue to suffer!
Hey Feisty will you volunteer to pay my share of the national debt? I'm sure you have an extra $42K laying around, right?
Spanky. Ask Bush 43 to pay up, it is mostly a republican debt; Reagan added 189%, Bush 41 added 55%, Bush 43 added 89%. Let's see, compared to Carter's 42% and Clinton's 39% -- yep, mostly republican debt. Send the bill to the GOP.
That would be the Democrats that controlled Congress... that spent
With a the campaign spending the debt could have been retired.
The US National Debt increases at over $4 billion dollars a day. The amount of money spent on this years campaigns would last about 10 hours in feeding that debt.
And now you know why America supports the Tea Party.
Well it may not pay for the National Debt, but it would be a huge reduction to the deficit.
"
"Both faced concerns about government debt. Herbert Hoover decided that deficits mattered. Ronald Reagan did not. You know the rest of the story. ..."
So tell me how cam we cut taxes and pay down the debt without cutting jobs and social benefits.
Jody, obviously Bush sucked at spending money. We all get that, and that is why the election in '06 and 08 came out the way they came out.
So we agree things back then were bad. Things now, from a fiscal responsibility perspectve are worse. Blaming the past doesn't help. Things have to change. And come on, the "bill" doesn't go to repulicans, or democrats. It goes to you and me (assuming you pay federal income tax - it seems a lot of folks don't) and more importantly to our children.
Jody Iowa, Congress since 2006, has added 5 trillion $$ to the National Deficit. 2 Trillion since 2008.
As you know it is Congress that passes the budget, and since 2006 Congress has been under Democratic control. But of course you already knew that, you just refuse to realize it.
I hope this fits. Pietro’s did, so I think there is a chance.
First, I would like to offer J. Richter an apology for the “sphincter” rudeness I included in some other posts.
I would also like to acknowledge the following in relation to our discussions:
The Clinton administration’s final budget, drafted in the latter part of 2000 (his last year as president) and effective through the latter part of 2001, the first three quarters of Bush’s first year in office, produced a surplus. Bush was, in fact, the first president to pass a major tax cut in the context of a surplus.
As J. Richter has said, George Bush believed that the surplus should be returned to the people from which it came and this was accomplished by the first tax cuts in the Bush administration that were passed that year. So that year’s surplus went to tax cuts, not to reduce the national debt as did the previous two.
That being said, it is also correct to say that a budget starts at zero and that the surplus was still not a revenue item component of the Bush Administration’s first budget in the fall of 2001. It is also still correct to say that when Al Gore and George Bush were campaigning, they were also both campaigning on long term projections of surpluses that never materialized and weren’t realistic in the first place.
With that clarification, I am also withdrawing myself from any further discussion of the economy, at least in the context of “blame this, blame that, blame him, blame them”.
The reality is that even the right numbers only tell us what happened, not necessarily why. There are too many variables in the economy to ever specifically credit or blame a man or administration for its performance. There are too many lag times, too many extraneous influences, too much timing, too much luck, too many cycles, too many nuances, too many global inputs to simplify it into meaningless, divisive and cheap political points.
For every number, there is another number. For each balance, there is a counter-balance. For every coincidence, there is another coincidence. The economy of the last decade would probably have been Al Gore’s millstone, or success, depending on ones political leanings, but for three or four hundred votes.
You can look at the unemployment numbers for the last 60 years and interpret them politically any way you want to. If Democrat administrations enjoyed low unemployment numbers, the argument can be made that they inherited them when they were headed down. They can say they were going up when they took office. If Republican administrations saw high unemployment rates, you can make the argument that they inherited them, but that they were going down already when they were replaced in office by Democrats. This occurs throughout the last 60 years of unemployment statistics.
The economy is dynamic, it never sits for a still photo in a moment in time. What you see it doing now is a product of dynamics in place months, possibly years ago. It reacts to wars, attacks, peacetime, apathy, attitudes, cycles.
Frankly, we give our leaders, or try to impute into them, way too much influence over economic events.
I’ve always liked to say that the economy does not act at the whim of politicians, rather, it is the reverse. Politicians and campaigns largely have been a joke when it comes to the economy (possibly more acutely with the advent of Carville’s slogan “it’s the economy, stupid”) which is used as a political bludgeon more than it is respected as the engine of our country’s prosperity and power.
It may be fun to argue and toss around here in this forum of political cheap shots and shallow gotcha analysis but it’s only an exercise. The argument is not winnable and usually only results in people who think they know something falling into the trap of sniping at and insulting each other.
Don’t think for a minute that I don’t believe that there are some general courses of action that are better than others, but in the long run I believe we will continue to improve and prosper despite the political arguments, not because they produce results. For the most part we the people overcome our “leaders” but simultaneously seem to want to ascribe our success or failure to their efforts, not ours. I think that’s what makes us look “stupid” to the “rest of the world”, not our actual performance.
I’m tired of the endless national inferiority complex, too. Despite the presence of more than our share of idiots, I also don’t believe our share of idiots exceeds that of any other country or population on this planet. Likewise, I don’t think we have a deficiency of talent and ability. I don’t think we’ve fallen behind. I don’t think George Bush destroyed this country. I don’t think Barack Obama is destroying this country. I do believe that there are forces in the world that want to destroy us.
Earlier today I attributed this quote from Shelby Steele:
“President Obama has put the Democrat party in the position of forever redeeming a fallen nation instead of leading a great one.”
I would like to offer the following bi-partisan paraphrase:
“We have put our leaders in the position of forever redeeming a fallen nation instead of leading a great one.”
Richard - good post.
Although I do engage in the practice of 'refutation of lies from the right', I too grow weary of the CONSTANT misinformation that is spewed. This is why I do a lot of my own research - regardless of partisanship - so that I can understand what the problem is before a solution is crafted.
I believe you are at that point.
After this election, no matter who has 'won', we are ALL still facing the SAME deficit issues and the SAME problems that needed to be fixed in OUR country BEFORE the election.
It really DOESN'T matter who is right; it DOES matter that we roll up our sleeves and put AMERICA FIRST for once. Richard and I may differ in our philosophies, but the 'fun' is over. We ALL need to 'man up' and 'woman up' and fix what ails us as AMERICANS.
Let's get to it, shall we?
AMEN to Richard and Pietro... i myself a a tea party member ad agree with you Richard, just wish the name callig and blame game would stop and whole heartidly believe putting one party in total control is not the answer to pass one belief and agenda is ridiculous, we need debate and COMPROMISE...... i applaud you Richard for your wisdom
Not really the problem. I suspect that they will be able to 1)pass a budget, and 2)let us all in on what are tax rates are going to be.
But sure, I can see how they will be viewed here, on this fine MSNBC website as "crazy" or extreme" which really doesn't say a whole lot for the candidates they will have defeated.
Yeah, good luck with that.
"To assimililate people"? Oh, no - the Borg are back! Go to Red Alert! Resistance is futile!
Though in this case, it'll be interesting to see just who's assimilating who. The Republican party should maybe consider putting the Enterprise crew on their speed dial......
Wonder how the Tea P candidates will like having the Grand Old Party Republicans pick their staff which will be made up of lobbyists and other loyal party repubs. Welcome, grass roots TPers, we love ya but don't bring your own staff with you.
Excellent post about the Tea Party on First Thoughts, Pietro. No doubt you spent considerable time researching and it showed. After Ronald Reagan left office, the republican party had split into three factions. In 1998, Jack Pitney, republican activist gave an interview to the Philadelphia Inquirer. Speaking about Grover Nordquist's Reagan Legacy Project (the one that rewrote Reagan's real legacy into the myth we see and hear about today) Pitney indicated that the purpose was to "reunite the increasingly bitter factions of the conservative movement: the probusiness tax cutters and immigrant-bashing isolationists, the imperial force crowd known as the 'neocons', and the Christian right." By hijacking the Tea Party, this is another attempt at reuniting the factions of the conservative movement by taking the focus off the damaged brand name of the republican party (damaged by neocons Bush and Cheney) and transferring it to this supposedly new grass roots party. If you look at the three factions referred to by Pitney, much of the rhetoric we hear today from TP candidates like Angle, Paul, Harmer, Buck, O'Donnell, etc. can be identified with one or more of those factions.
On Thoughts I commented about getting a robo call from repub gov Chris Christie urging me to support our GOP team. Enjoyed your responses, some wondered how or why NJ's Christie got my name. Possibly every registered Iowa voter is getting these calls but so far, no one else I've talked to has gotten the Christie call. I'm thinking that I remain mistakenly listed as a republican on a mysterious list. I say mysterioius list because in 2007, Mitt Romney's campaign called me constantly despite my repeatedly telling them I was a registered democrat, NO I would not caucus for Romney or any repub and please remove me from their list. Romney sent me a Christmas card thanking me for considering to support him, caucus day is Jan...! His was the only GOP campaign to call me.
Feisty Redhead, We're back to free enterprise and Americana and exceptionalism
As you go to Walmart and buy your cheap Chinese made goods, while supporting (rewarding) 'free tader' corporations exporting American jobs to India and China.
Whats exceptional about America? Not much anymore. We dont make anything . Corporate America has outsourced us (maufaturing, Steel, Information Technology, Customer Service, Cloting and even HR! to the point of being a service economy. Yeah, thats some exceptionalism. Some free market. Where is the trickle down promised?
And as a sidebar, get this: I just got a sales call from an India-based Outsource company that wants to outsource...wait for it.....Company Morale! Now if that isnt insulting to the American worker, I dont know what is.
For the record... I have NEVER shopped at Wal-Mart due to their employment practices which are equivalent to slavery!
A couple of years ago - Playboy did an undercover piece about what goes on behind the scenes at Wally World and it's nothing MORE than a cult!
Not to mention that I'm not a big fan of cheap cr@p made in China!
Jon Stewart, in his interview with Eric Cantor a few weeks ago, made an observation that Cantor could not dispute.
In a true free market system, jobs will shipped out of here left and right faster than you can say, "Where are the jobs?"
Fiesty, so you have a problem with pep rallies and coporate worship. I know they use to require their executives to attend Church and tell them where to live. In the 80's many companies were studying San Walton and the culture of Walmart.
Guess I'm guilty as charged Salt Grass! ;0)
Feisty,
I shop at Wall mart all the time. Also at Target, Home Depot, Lowes, Pennys. Not much is made in the USA anymore. When I was a teen, we used to refer to something made in japan as cheap junk. Their products got better and better and eventually surpassed the American Quality. Automobiles, TV's, motorcycles, optics., just to name a few. I believe the same scenario will be played out with China. Wall Mart is the largest employer in the entire U.S., maybe in the entire world. People don't have to work there, but at least it's a job.
When these Tea Baggers are sworn in, the entertainment begins. Just wait for that 1st crazy. uninformed proposal that goes too far, embarrases the GOP and we will see just how 'effective' these folks are.
The beauty of a Tea Bag house is that they will now be co-responsible for the wars, the economy, taxes and budget cuts. No more just saying No as a strategy. They will have to deliver. They will not have a big majority and they wont have the Senate so they will have to compromise on legislation or it wont get done.
The Tea Baggers have already said they wont comnpromise or seek bi-partisan support. So in the end, you have elected ....more gridlock. Good luck selling that as an accomplishment in 2012. Get ready to have an answer to that nagging question 'where are the jobs?'. Because after Nov 2, the GOP/Tea bAg coalition have to have an answer for that question.
A year or more of these Tea BAggers and GOPers and not a one of them has a specific plan for job creation or specific cuts for 'smaller government'.
And then there is the press who just wont ask these people what they will do. Instead, they are just trying to out do each other in coming up with more creative ways and worthless statistics like their 'VCI' bullhockey to say the DEms are 'doomed' before a single one of us vote.
Crazy.
Good points, Tim, Seattle. The problem isn't that the press isn't asking these TP candidates questions, it is that many of the won't talk to the press, won't do interviews, won't answer questions.
Good point, Jody! You cant ask those who run away. I still am asking myself in this day and age why people will vote for them when they dont know where they stand on the issues. When did that become acceptable?
Makes no sense does it, Tim. Why would anyone vote for people who refused to tell people their plan, their ideas or the ones they express such as repeal the 17th Amend or privatize social security, medicare and the VA, allow private business to discriminate and on and on. Strangest election I can remember.
Tim,
If they spend the same amount of $$ that the Dems spent and dont have any results. Then we will fire them also. However since the policies of the current congress have failed, we have to fire them first, which we will do next tuesday. We appreciate your support.
Tim,
You do realize that every new job has a learning curve associated with it??
These new conservative folks will do just fine. They will learn the ropes and be a great contribution towards controlling the socialist agenda that will now never happen. They are like the cavalry riding to the rescue just in the nick of time. We must now concentrate on getting rid of anyone in congress with a "D" after their name. They just take up space and serve no useful purpose. I'm not talking about President Obama. He is already history but just doesn't admit it yet. He will be a lame duck for two more years and be even more worthless than he has been for the last two. (if that's possible).
I guess it would be most effecient to just have the Republican party...and that's it. A one party system. No need to debate anything when your right all the time.
Edward: that post is HYSTERICAL! You go from using "socialism" incorrectly, because the "teabaggers" are too ignorant to know what the word means, to hoping for one party rule in America! You must be the guy Benjamin Franklin was talking about when he said (paraphrasing) "you have a Republic if you can keep it." Your last sentence says it all: "No need to debate anything when your (sic) right all the time." Really? Your is you're. So I guess you're not.
Edward, thanks for stating outright what anyone who's really studied the issue knows. Today's Conservative Movement has no intention of GOVERNING. Their intent is to RULE. It is an inherently undemocratic movement with a goal of turning the United States into something that most of us won't even recognize.
Two years of tea baggers in charge, and they'll be gone. Once the public see how radical and inept they are, they'll be voted out. Let's hope the damage they do is minimal.
Good luck with that Repubs!
Dr. Frankensteins Monster is alive, but not very well..... The Repubs used the Teabaggers, and now they aren't sure how to put them in their place.
Yesterday, Mr. Kofinis (sp) described it well. ..The Teabaggers are NOT MAINstream, they are EXtreme!
Glorious weather here in South Texas...high 70's, sunny clear blue skies. Play nice everyone!
"Tea Ba**ers"
"Extreme"
"Monster"
"Not Mainstream"
Gee, what exactly is "main stream"? Right now, it's a bunch of Washington Insiders that spend $1.45 for every $1.00 the government takes in. Is that the kind of government leadership we're looking for from our "main-stream" leaders?
Is it extreme to want someone in government that can figure out how the government should make due with what they have?
But to the Liberals, this type of person is a "Monster".
You on the Left really have a few screws that are loose.
Extreme is wanting to repeal the 17th Amendment, wanting to allow private business to discriminate, a national religion, recommending 2nd amendment remedies if they don't win; the list of extreme views is long--I'd suggest people pay attention because those extreme views affect republicans, too.
Jody, please, why do you on the Left continue to embarrass yourselves? The 17th amendment will be there when you wake up next Wednesday, no one is establishing a national religion, and no guns will be drawn in anger over politics.
The major principle of the Tea Party is a smaller and fiscally sound government. That is not an extreme position.
You on the Left really need to get a grip on reality. Quit scaring yourselves. It's not healthy.
I am not scared, I am embarassed for my own country! And I wonder why the Republican Party cannot find some responsible, reasonable, and Statesman like candidates to run instead of their current cast of marginal lunatics with their narrow and ridiculous agendas that will go NOwhere and accomplish NOthing.
I would contend they have. Because it seems the "Responsible, reasonable, and Statesman like" people we currently have in DC have certainly made a huge mess of things.
You are right JoAnna, its not a position at all....its a SLOGAN! Why dont you get that slogans do not = policy. What are the Tea PArty POLICY PROPOSALS for creating JObs? Dealing with the wars? What cuts are you proposing? How are you going to pay for your tax cuts for the corporations? How do you maintain product and environmental safeyty by cutting the EPA and Consumer Protection agencies from Government?
So JoAnna, we need to know specifics. When thry take the reighsn of powewr, you are going to look mighty silly spouting slogans and having no proposals to solve the problems we face.
Got policy solutions?...or just slogans?
Good luck with that...especially since the RNC forget to send poor JoAnna the right wing nut squawking points this morning! lmao...
Notice how JoAnna and her uninformed ilk cant respond on specifics and run away from rational questions quicker than Sharon Angle runs from journalists.
FAIL
Noticed it for sometime, Tim. What is puzzling is that JS1 can't understand that she is pretty transparent.
"Jody, please, why do you on the Left continue to embarrass yourselves? The 17th amendment will be there when you wake up next Wednesday..."
Hey, JoAnna- I like this. Good post. Let me hear you sing it to the tune of "the 2nd amendment" in place of the 17th? Think it would sell with most of your friends in the Tea'd Party?
I know a great slogan: Hope and Change. But as we have scene slogansdo not equal policy.
And Tim, has Sharon Angle failed?
No, it's a charter.
A slogan is something like "Hope and Change" and "Yes We Can". Not many policies written on those two things.
And you're right, now policy has to be generated from that charter. The Republicans/Tea_Party are being given an opportunity, handed to them on silver platter by the Democrats. They can either make the policies and write the legislation that achieves those goals and be successful, or not do it and not be successful. It's up to them.
Hody is it Extreme for the US goverment to Require you to purchase a Product, for no reason other than you are alive? Since it has never been done in over 200 years, I am thinking so.
As far as Govt. spending it is extreme to add 5 Trillion $$ to the National Deficit, as the democratic congress has done since 2006.
This extremest congress and others before them have placed our country in peril. Did not happen over night and we are all going to have to contribute. With 46 % of the households not paying 1 cent in Federal Income tax, that will have to change. Surely since all of us receive benefits from the Govt. it is not asking to much to ask for 1 cent for every 1 dollar earned.
"No, it's a charter."
Yo, Smiff woman- 'chatter' doesn't have an 'r' in it.
So again....they have no solutions but will make it up as they go along. Got it.
Assimilate the Tea Party???
Let's see,,,,,Less than 2 years ago every Tea Party candidate was a Republican, They joined the Republican primaries, They accept their funding from,,,,The Republican Party, They live to hear the Republican Parties last VP candidate speak, I think we can be pretty sure it will be business as usual for Republicans
Wish I had written this: http://gocl.me/brnhPv
Maybe we should just call this 'The Fox Election'
Everyone keeps saying the coming election is a referendum on President Obama.
I beg to differ. I'm beginning to believe that it's actually a referendum on Fox News.
Because, well, let's be honest: The Republican Party would be dead in the water right now were it not for Fox and its ceaseless efforts -- primarily through lying and propagandizing 24/7/365 -- at reviving the conservative movement brand.
This is just about the endpoint of the campaign that Fox has been waging for the past two years -- beginning the day after Barack Obama won the presidency in 2008. Think about it:
-- The engine of their comeback, the Tea Parties, is almost wholly a Fox concoction. Without Fox's endless promotions of the various Tea Party events -- and Tea Party figures, including its corporate overseers like Dick Armey -- the "movement" would have been nothing, a brief blip on the screen.
-- Congressional Republicans managed to maintain their discipline in uniformly voting "No" on every Obama proposal that came down the pike because Fox was there as a threat to anyone who strayed. And Fox's ceaseless propaganda against every Obama proposal certainly gave PR sustenance to anyone who stayed within the fold.
-- Every Republican candidate on the planet -- with the exception of the truly execrable Dan Maes in Colorado -- has gotten lots of free airtime on Fox to promote their campaign. Their opponents -- not at all. And what's been interesting is how these candidates have been able to use Fox to get airtime while refusing to speak to their local reporters at all.
-- The entire narrative of this coming election has been dictated by Fox. Is it any wonder that the conventional wisdom now perfectly reflects what Fox has been dictating?
Maybe it's just me, but I'm not quite there yet. I'm especially not ready to hand over governance of the country to a propaganda news network.
But it's obvious that we don't really have a Republican Party anymore. It's now a wholly owned subsidiary of Fox News. And that's who this election is really about.
Terrific post, Colorado Crenshaw. I agree completely. The once grand party now wholly owned by a right-wing media conglomerate--say something out of line or make a wrong vote, risk the wrath of FOX.
Wow.
Fox is more powerfull and influential than Obama, Pelosi, Reid, Dem controlled Congress, and MSM? Obama and the Dems are going to be whipped because of a cable news channel on Tuesday?
Obama, Pelosi, Reid must really be inept.
and they are inept.....
I have a different view---the enemy of my enemy is my friend. They will be united in their opposition to President Obama and since they don't plan to do anything to govern anyway, it doesn't matter if they all get along or not. As long as they make life difficult for the President, their mission will be accomplished.
And nothing will get done and the people will continued to suffer, sounds like a great plan!
Proves my point. Nothing gets solved and they think America is going to be okay with that. Wow, these Tea BAggers are even more idiotic than I thought.
Good luck with that Steeler fan. You have less of a brain than Ben Rottenburger (or whatever your rapist quarterback's name is)
"And nothing will get done and the people will continued to suffer" The suffering has increased under the EXTREME radical congress and President. If no additional suffering is created by the Federal Govt. as it has been since 2006 when the Democrats took over congress Then we will be better off.
If no more socialist extreme budgets and laws are passed, then things will be better than they are now. That is how bad this Congress and President have performed.
FrankUSA,
Try going after the real problem instead of the delusional and meaningless talking points. When Corporations collude on price fixing and competitive lock outs you have Corporate Socialism which is far more insidious and destructive than any political socialism, if we had any, which we don't. For blatant examples of Corporate Socialism check out the Insurance Industry, the Airline Industry, the Oil industry, to collude on price fixing all they have to do is turn on their computers, no longer any need to meet in a dark smokey bar! You want to see competive lock outs just try and start your own business in any category where you have to work with a centralized common supplier!
First they took our Paychecks, Then Our Homes, What Next?
http://motherjones.com/politics/2010/11/galbraith-social-security-middle-class
Americans wake up to what is going on. No more carrying the tax burden, while GOP let wealthy and corporations get away with Paying No taxes or very little. That is why we have such a high tax burden. No more saying Nay to not investing in America, which creates Jobs, Jobs, Jobs, while our jobs go to China and India. Realize that less Government, means No Regulations and no one to get in the way of their fraudulent schemes! Say no the Party of No on November 2nd! And, if you do not vote, and you lose Social Security benefits because of privatization or if Unemployment Benefits are put on Freeze, or more jobs shipped overseas, and all you get in Congress is Gridlock and Fillibusters, so that nothing can get accomplished, and America further decays into a third-world country, then there is no one to blame but yourself!
The Pretenders, GOP/Tea Party's, "mission" is to sell to the American people the "bill of goods" that we Need less government, after all, government will only get in the way of their fraudulent schemes and try to hold them accountable to people and not to corporations!
Then, they pretend that they want to lower taxes for the American people knowing full well that the loopholes they created for the wealthy means that Corporations and wealthy Americans pay very little taxes or No taxes at all, so that every-day Average Americans have to carry and Shoulder all the tax burden.
They pretend they did not "bail out Wall Street, because they already had, the bail out was for the people so the whole economy would not collapse!
Then they pretend they want to Create Jobs in America, but to Create Jobs, you must Invest in America, not in China and India -- that grows their economy, not ours!
Well said, Angellight. Their vision is short-sighted because if Americans do not have well-paying jobs, they cannot buy the products these businesses make. One needs the other.
But Jody- here's where the wheels finally come of horrendously:
The companies DON'T CARE if Americans don'thave well-paying jobs and can buy the products. China and India are rapidly ememerging markets. the demand will simply come from there. Hell, our corporations won't even have to pay to ship the goods to them!
C'mon, Chamber of Commerce- let's push for more of THIS!
C'mon, somebody on the right- argue with my last post, above. Me First Bill? JoAnna?? NJNB??? Steve the yawner????
Forget the dig at C of C- sell me the part about how great it is for capitalism and the American people and these emerging markets. What? you WANT China to beat us down once and for all, even if they can do it without military might?
Anyone?
The Tea Party is going to be nothing but a problem and an embarassment for the Republicans. This is like inviting your loud mouth Bud swirling redneck truck drivin cousin to the Waldorf Astoria for dinner.
Focusing on the tea party when they will elect 30 maybe 40 total among Senate, house, and governorship, is again a distraction and will have about the same impact that the "blue dogs" in the democratic party have now. It is the long-term battle for the ideological soul of the republican party that is really at stake, and that won't take place until we get close to the 2012 presidential race.
The real short term question is how many of those elected with the tea party seal of approval will stay true to the cause or be co-opted by the traditional Washington power structure...
Finally an intelligent and pertinent original comment.
Thanks
Yep, ought to be interesting. If the "teabaggers" get into Congress, those who voted them in may reap the whirlwind when they find out that they have no interest in serving anyone but themselves. Why would ANYONE cast a vote for a candidate that refuses to answer questions put to them by the media? All of you who have so little interest in your country that you would do this may learn a valuable lesson. If they do not have to talk to you to get your vote...why do they have to talk to you afterward?
The genuine grass roots TPers will be once again disappointed because until campaign financing changing, big business, big money donors will continue to have outsized influence over legislation--their own candidates have already given in to the money machine.
Considering how manufactured the whole "Tea Party movement" has been all along, I am sure they will assimilate just fine. That was the whole plan from the get go.
Real change is coming but not without a battle. We the people are sending in new blood for a very good reason. It will be interesting to see how it all works out. I'm not making any predictions right now because no one knows what will happen. You bloggers have at it. All I know is real changes are needed on both sides of the isle.
Every time I see someone like Tim write about "we the people" I know he has no clue what he is talking about. The ugly truth is, Tim, that the "teabaggers" suffer from the misapprehension that they all want the same things. When they find out differently, it could be time for popcorn!
oops, correction, should be T not Tim.
Ditto head new catch phrase.
We the people.
Your headline:
"Mark Murray writes: Question: If the Rand Pauls, Ken Bucks, Joe Millers, and Sharron Angles make it to the Senate, for whom will they cause more problems -- the Obama White House or Senate GOP leader Mitch McConnell?"
I think the obvious answer would be "the American People"!
LMAO Drive-by....
That one's a sure fire screen cleaner! ;0)
That's funny drive-by. It will be the American people for sure but I think they'll also give McConnell and Boehner heartburn and mental anxiety--they'll need prescription meds.
Here's the sad part, Jody and Feisty- it ISN'T funny.
Agreed DBO - but you have to admit your delivery was! ;0)
We, on the center-right want the same thing. We want our country back. We must work together or risk losing. Remember Ross Perot a third party candidate. His votes took from Bush the Elder and elected 'Sick Willie" president. We must NOT do that again.
Back from WHERE? WHERE did it go?
Who says it's YOUR country anyway?
This country belongs to 300 MILLION people pal... and like it or not... this country going to move forward with or without you!
Isn't that appalling, Feisty? "We want our country back". If I am to understand this, the "teabaggers" think their corporate masters have purchased the country especially for them. Think they will be surprised when the corporate masters make it clear who is in charge?
Come on now Feisty get it right - the country will LEAN forward.
Seriously NDD - You would think by know at least a ONE of them would be able to answer the simple questions I posed...
Then again - we ALL know the true meaning of their code words 'We Want Our Country Back'...
Translation being we want our country back from the scary black dude in the WH!
Exactly, Feisty: and they don't even have the sense to be embarrassed at their prejudice.
Once again the GOP doesn't get it ...they dont want Mitch John or Eric in any position pf leadership !
Guess again!!
A progressive trying to deceminate the Tea Party must be like viewing zoo animals.
As a conservative I'll break it down for you. The Tea Party only came about after Republlican defeats in 2006 and 2008. Under the leadership of Bush/Rove, Republicans used liberal means to conservative ends. We spent like muther f***ers. And Obama simply shifted it into 5th gear.
The Tea Party is simply putting pressure on the Republicans to once again stand for the ideals of limited government. A government which governs least, governs best.
Our national debt is not the problem. It is simply a symptom. A symptom of too much spending by our Federal government.
Nations across Europe are now taking steps to cut their spending. Progressives/liberals like to do what Europe does. Here is your opportunity ...
Cicero
Actually, Rob, your history of the Tea Party is not accurate.
The tea Party was made up of Libertarians who were upset at the REPUBLICANS for their spending and fallout from the Bush Administration's handling of the economic crisis (circa 2007 - you were right about that). This spawned many splinter groups - thousands of them - all over America.
The Republicans have STOLEN the Tea Party brand and made it a part of the Republican brand (mostly because President Bush ruined the 'traditional' Republican brand). Using this new 'party', which is NOT a 'real' political party, the Republicans are offering to the populace a new 'Party' to vote for - populated by the most rabid of the Conservatives.
The Tea Party is NOT putting pressure on the Republicans in the context you think. The Tea Party is putting pressure on the Republicans to become a more 'radical' right wing group, as evidenced by the 'Tea Party' candidates we have like Miller, Angle, O'Donnell.
Just like the McCain camp miscalculated how they were going to 'handle' Sarah Palin, the Republicans are making the same mistake with these 'Tea Party' candidates - it is going to rip the GOP apart. The GOP establishment will NOT be able to 'control' these 'Tea Party' people's message or behaviour. We are already seeing that now in the Rand Paul race (stomping) and the Sharron Angle race (slapping).
The rest of your post - about smaller government - I disagree with you on, because we need SMARTER government. You can have smarter government at any size.
As far as spending is concerned, America right now HAS NO CHOICE but to spend because the monies that SHOULD have been spent 10 years ago have not. We are catching up on what should have been taken care of in the first place.
“We want our country back” seems kind of elitist to me although they claim to be against elitism. They claim to be against elite educations as well. . It must be true. Most of their supporters on here can’t spell or use proper English. And they use the term elitist as a pejorative frequently. Yet it is somehow their country as if they were the only ones getting up and going to work and doing whatever must be done each day. The same was heard from the fascists and Nazis in pre- WW2. Just look what that lead to. Frack the Tea Party and the white horse it got rode in on.
You want to 'Frack' the Tea Party? Don't vote them in. You will be doing yourselves and the Republicans a favour.
TEA PARTY/GOP CHECKLIST
1.Re-peal parts of the First Amendment, ALL of Amendments 4 thru 8, 10, 13 thru 17 and 19, BUT keep harping about the 2nd Amendment: CHECK!
2. Employ and use "Swift Boating", the "Southern Strategy" and any and all voter intimidation tactics primarily geared at Latinos and African American Voters to deter them from voting at the polls: CHECK!
3. Allow corporations, both here and abroad, and foreign governments to funnel untold sums of money into the U.S Chamber of Commerce which is then distributed into the hands of the GOP/TP Candidates made possible by the SCOTUS Ruling earlier this year: CHECK!
4. Re-peal HCR, Finance, and any and all reforms that will prevent Wall Street and the Big Boys from being a burden on low and middle income families; Do away with the VA, the Department of Education and EPA; Get rid of Social Security, Medicare/Medicaid, foodstamps/WIC, Unemployment, Section 8/HUD, and any and all programs geared to help Americans that have fallen on hard times: CHECK!
5. Re-peal legislation and policies that will force oil rigs and mines to operate safely and environmentally sound; killing any and all policies related to "Green Jobs" and renewable energy resources by re-pealing environmental safeguards and pushing for more drilling in the National Wildlife Reservation and off the U.S Coast, especially in waters that are around, nearby, and/or directly inside environmentally fragile areas: CHECK!
6. Use any and all means to interdict and re-peal any and all legislation that President Obama wants to implement in order to get this country back on track, TO INCLUDE SHUTTING DOWN THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT if he and/or the American Public REFUSE to vote and/or see things their way: CHECK!
7. Find the most racist/bigoted, sexist/misogynistic, hypocritical, fraudulant, religiously extreme and otherwise ignorant cadidates the likes of which this nation has ever seen in abundace in the history of this country, and run on this platform and any other Far Right Agenda that chases away even the most moderatly sane Republican and Independents: CHECK
8. Employ plans 1 thru 7, and hope that they win on November 2nd, 2010: STILL IN PROCESS!
My PROLIBDEM Brothers and Sisters, Moderate Republicans who were chased out by the Tea Party, and Independents who are still on the fence, I present you a nightmare scenario should they win. Their mantra is " We are taking our country back". Back to what? Jim Crow and Slavery, redefining citizenship, denying a woman her Consitutional right to choose what she wishes to do with her body?
This "nightmare" can, will and must be stopped. But it will come to fruition- IF YOU STAY AT HOME AND DO NOTHING!
Let's make sure we DENY THEM PLAN#8.
Hey Kevin, just saw a CBS/NYTimes poll showing people with college educations favor the Republicans by an amazing 20 pts. It also shows that people who attend church more than twice a month favor Republican by almost 30 points. So if you are uneducated and don't believe in God, keep voting Democrat.
Brothers and Sisters, more like comrades. You must be talking to the half of the country who pays zero Federal Income tax but has all these great ideas about what to do with the money others contribute.
This crap about helping those who need help the most line. Yep, and the Democratic party will decide who needs the help and how much. It will of course depend on their lobbies getting the most with their entitlement voters getting the second most tax dollars. There will be complete disrigard to who pays what, if anything, into the federal system.
We all know that Democratic lobbies and voters need "help" the most. We saw your parties colors the past 18 months when every stimulus dollar when to saving federal jobs, Democratic Union pension funds, Union workers, or entitlement voters who pay no federal taxes. The only people who snuck in for a crumb were those who were lumped in with all the union employees on unemployment.
It was 18 months of the party of "ourselves". The rest of us have been labeled as "don't need help as much" so we don't get squat and never will. As a matter of fact we pay for most of it and get nothing back but a bunch of federalist sluffers on our backs.
None of the parties have a solid plan on how to get rid of all the unfunded programs, balance a budget and get rid of the debt. It is all about continued spending and endless debt creation for my supporters to buy votes. Every time someone brings up "what are we going to do about the $50 trillion in unfunded entitlements?" both parties put their hands over their ears and yell La La La La La. Like somehow ignoring it will make all the tough decisions and unhappy people effected go away.
To compare unions and the Democrats to ‘big money’ and the Republicans is ridiculous. First, unions have made financial contributions to both Democrats and Republicans, probably about 60/40. Second, the real costs to the country and to the average American for what the Republicans do for ‘big money’ is very drastic and there is nothing even close that the Democrats do for unions. Just looking at Bush-Cheney’s positions that constantly greatly favored, oil companies, Halliburton, insurance companies, pharmaceutical companies, Wall Street and so on, clearly shows the obvious. The argument is just subterfuge offered to rationalize and to manipulate public opinion.
They try to disguise everything as being ‘conservative’ versus ‘liberal’ but the truth is that it is all about money and an advantage to the money people who strongly support and ‘pull the strings’ of the Republicans. There is nothing ‘conservative’ about it as the profits to those few and the costs to the many clearly demonstrate. What we need is for the Republicans to return to being honestly and responsibly concerned for the majority and the only way we can ever accomplish that is by rejecting the con and what the Republicans have become - ‘puppets’ for Special Interests and the select few.
Baloney! The Democrats take in way over triple the lobby money. They take in just as much from the largest banks, Wallstreet, insurance and military contractors. If you notice they are all anti war but they DON'T TOUCH the corporate military contracts. They have not shaved a nickel from the military budget even while griping about unfounded bogus wars.
If you noticed the corporate bailouts were seamless going from Bush to Obama and a Democratic Congress. They just handed over trillions to the banks amnd Wallstreet without an AUDIT! They even added some of their own giant failed corporations.
The REAL reason Obama and the Democrats want to limit contributions by Corporations. Here are the total contributions by the 20 largest contributors over the last 20 years;
Democrats = $476,593,000 (79%)
Republicans = $128,068,000 (21%)
So the Democrats have enjoyed a contribution advantage of about $349,000,000. The vast majority of that advantage comes from Unions and Trial Lawyers, where the Democratic advantage is even more pronounced;
Democrats = $358,089,000 (94%)
Republicans = $20,611,000 (6%)
If you expand the list to the top 115 contributors, the Democrat's HUGE advantage increases to $350,000,000.
Corporations actually give nearly the same amount to Democrats that they do to Republicans. It's the union contributions that are so lopsided in favor of the Democrats. The Democrats don't want to lose any of their HUGE contribution advantage, so they want restrictions on businesses, but not on unions. They also cynically want to look for other contribution advantages - at taxpayer expense.
The source to verify this information is available at;
http://www.opensecrets.org/orgs/list.php
Sure Adams, if you filter it down to a small enough subset you're bound to find one that favors Democrats this cycle. If you look at total spending by outside groups http://www.opensecrets.org/outsidespending/index.php you'll see that outside spending by Republicans DWARFS Democratic spending. A huge proportion of that Republican spending is from anonymous donors, too. What are these donors buying? Why don't they want the rest of us to know?
Are you willing to say that anonymous funding of campaigns is a bad thing? Are you willing to say it should be eliminated? Congressional Democrats are on record with the DISCLOSE Act that they believe voters deserve to know who is funding campaigns. Congressional Republicans disagree. They like the anonymous money.
Lets just eliminate all the fighting about who governs better...how about all Republicans go live in Republican governed areas and all democrats go live in places like chicago ,,,,detroit ,,,,DC ,,,,,and all other slums that have been controlled by the dems for decades and decades with no hope of being anything but beholding to the feds for their monthly handout.
Do those of us in the blue states get to stop supporting the red states by sending more to the Federal government than we get back? Meanwhile it's the red states that feed at the Federal trough. I won't even ask for a thank you for supporting you all those years. I'll just be thankful to have all of the "get government off my back" people out of my back pocket.