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Subscribe to RSS“Even as they hammer Democrats for running up record budget deficits, Senate Republicans are rolling out a plan to permanently extend an array of expiring tax breaks that would deprive the Treasury of more than $4 trillion over the next decade, nearly doubling projected deficits over that period unless dramatic spending cuts are made,” the Washington Post says. “The measure, introduced by Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell (R-Ky.) this week, would permanently extend the George W. Bush-era income tax cuts that benefit virtually every U.S. taxpayer, rein in the alternative minimum tax and limit the estate tax to estates worth more than $5 million for individuals or $10 million for couples.”
More: “Aides to McConnell said they have yet to receive a cost estimate for the measure. But the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office recently forecast that a similar, slightly more expensive package that includes a full repeal of the estate tax would force the nation to borrow an additional $3.9 trillion over the next decade and increase interest payments on the national debt by $950 billion. That's more than four times the projected deficit impact of President Obama's health-care overhaul and stimulus package combined.”
"Sen. John Barrasso (Wyo.) has the endorsement of conservative stalwart Sen. Tom Coburn (Okla.) to become the next vice chairman of the Senate Republican Conference -- and that might be the crucial vote he needs to secure the post," Roll Call writes. "Barrasso on Tuesday declined to discuss his plans to succeed Sen. Lisa Murkowski (Alaska) as vice chairman, saying he was focused on doing his job as a Senator and helping to elect more Republicans on Nov. 2."
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The truth comes out. The GOP doesn't mind exploding the deficit if it interferes with reducing taxes. And these guys claim to be the party of fiscal responsibility? Sounds like GWB is still in charge of their economic policies.
I suspect some of their TParty subsidiary types will be running around with their hair on fire when this gets fleshed out....
“Even as they hammer Democrats for running up record budget deficits, Senate Republicans are rolling out a plan to permanently extend an array of expiring tax breaks that would deprive the Treasury of more than $4 trillion over the next decade"
Oh, those big bad Republicans.
Oops, it appears that Democrats in Congress also want to extend the tax cuts for $3.3 Trillion of that $4 Trillion too, and many Democrats also favor all $4 Trillion in extensions.
But then, it IS NBC doing the reporting.
Since about 83% of that $4 Trillion is tax cuts for the Middle Class, I'd like to see the Democrats propose doing away with all of them.
LOL
Roy:
Works for me. Return to the tax levels of 2000 for all. I'm a liberal, and I don't have any problem paying my fair share to live in the best country in the world. At least it's the best country until it gets TParty trashed.
As I recall, back in 2000, before the Bush tax cuts, I paid my taxes and it didn't bankrupt me. Nor did taxes bankrupt my employer. Granted, a lot of companies moved jobs out of the country to avoid some taxes, but that has continued unabated for the last 10 years despite Bush's tax cuts.
The tax cuts were passed under reconciliation (GOP could not get 60 votes in the Senate). Accordingly, those tax cuts MUST expire at the end of this year unless Congress acts. I say let Congress do what it does best: NOTHING. Everybody goes back to 2000 tax levels and we all feel a little more patriotic about supporting our country on payday.
I presume you'll agree with me on this....?
If these tax cuts expire in full in January, this will have a huge impact to our economy. Everybody will see there personal income go down, significantly. A middle class family currently making 150K with 2 kids and a home is going to see and annual tax increase of around 4K. That same family with combined income of 100k, will see an increase of around 2K per year. This is a huge hit to middle class families in todays economy. You wonder why folks are not spending and spuring the economy, they are preparing for this. It will take most middle class families 2 to 3 years to recover and get back to the income levels they are at now. Let these expire and you will see this economy continue to drag for the next 4 to 5 years. If they have to be eliminated, figure out a way to phase them out over a longer period of time to lessen the impact on the middle class.
Va Ind, not disputing your numbers but they sound a little off to me. Please provide a link to inform us further. I am seriously interested as I have never heard those numbers used before.
Thanks.
I agree wholeheartedly.
Va Ind - really? The lack of demand since 2008 has been due to the preparation for a 4% FIT increase in 2011? Yes, it will further squeeze the belts of the middle class, but the middle class is still buying, though they are saving/paying down debt at a higher rate than they were a few years ago. The slack demand comes from a significant loss of jobs and fear of the employed of losing their jobs.
Matthew - I saw the 4k number somewhere as well. Sadly, I don't have a link available at the moment.
You can calculate the added tax at:
http://www.mytaxburden.org/
And don't forget, the increase comes straight off of disposable imcome. So the hit is much more than 4%, its more like 8% - 10% of disposable income.
Heck of a job, Republicons.
What hypocrites...as if 30 years of throwing money at the already rich, has done anything more than resulting in a Second Depression.
Despicable.
How about cut spending. SPENDING adds to the National Debt. The tax levels (revenues) are fine if anyone had the backbone to cut wasteful, unneccessary, inefficient, pork filled, special interest projects and spending. That won't happen until the the career politicians whose pockets have been lined by special interest lobbying groups are removed and replaced with those willing to do the job regardless of party affiliation.
For all the ire pork causes, it is a rather insignificant portion of our nation's spending, not that it isn't worth cutting. While the past two years have been an anomaly, with the stimulus and TARP, etc, three programs take up 75% of the nation's spending - defense, social security and medicare. Essential program spending is 17% or so, and interest on our debt is 5 or 6%. While I've no doubt that inefficiency in government exists, do you really think that there is enough "waste" to cut? I mean, there was a great hubbub recently over the defense budget being cut by 100 billion over 10 years? If we can barely agree to cut 10 billion per year of "wasteful" spending, do you think it's realistic to assume we can all agree on another 750 billion or so per year to cut? (I'm assuming that, when prosperity returns, increased tax revenues will cover the other 500 billion annual deficit.)
Until the Federal government is putting money back into the Social Security System, from which it has been stealing money for decades, I don't think it is fair or accurate to lump SSS expenditures in with Medicare or Defense spending. SSS is self funding and solvent well into the future.
Well, wasn't it Ronald Regan who said : Deficits are good? why, yes indeed, I do believe it was. Funny the republicans think their deficits are ok but the democrats deficits are not. They think it is ok to have a deficit if it benefits the mega wealthy, but a deficit that benefits the poor, working poor, or middle class is taboo. That is not a very Christian attitude to me.
just couldn't wait to agree with you on this subject. I saw a report on which party added to the deficit the most they all add some to it . but starting 1976 carter added 42% to the deficit,Ronald Reagan added 189 % to the deficit. George HW Bush added about 35% Bill Clinton added 13% george w Bush added 65 % to the budget. As for Obama we will have to wait to see what his is . Some of the Deficit for Obama is part of the George Bush added to the deficit . the way I see it is 218% added by the GOP who don't like to pay their share of taxes .but sure like to add to the deficit the GOP cuts taxes this is just another way to have a stimlous ,if you don't have get the money going into the treasury it is revenue lost just the same as a stimlous. it is the same just in a differant . the Democrats added to the deficit . I doubt if it will be as much as GWBushwas . the Republicans will jump at the chance to give the President the money for a war even if we start it . 105%. to the budget deficit for the Democrats. I no the republicans will deny this . these are not my figures but some reporter that is not on fox because if he was on fox I wouldn't believe it. the part I don't see how fox will report news differant than cbs,abc,nbc or cnn. media matters ,and huffington post ,the new york , fox's news will be just the opposite. and then they will addto it . then they will whinn and cry that the others are making it up . when in really it is them making it up.
I can see why the Democrats want to get their hands on more tax revenue from those that earn alot. They know how to spend high earners money better than the high earners (job creators) do. Let's punish the job creators some more
Fiscal responsibility could possibly mean cutting spending and reducing the size of governement.
tunanut:
Exactly how have Democrats "punished" job creators? Please provide a link to facts (names, dates, specific actions) demonstrating your assertion.
You might want to read up on the most recent (8/24/2010) stats on job creation:
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-08-25/obama-s-economic-stimulus-program-created-up-to-3-3-million-jobs-cbo-says.html
tell me how many jobs were created by the wealthy during the cheney/bush years with their tax cuts? how many jobs have been lost due to wealth not trickling down but budget deficits we see in every state? i'm sorry, i guess when obama came into office, there was full employment. my mistake.
The statement that high earners create jobs is often repeated but not supported by any evidence. The reality is that companies hire people, not CEOs. Taxes on individuals have nothing to do with job creation except that they can INCREASE consumption by decreasing inequality.
tunanut, you are really the nut that you think you are...keep repeating those rethuglican slogan, until you dumb yourself down enough to believe it. DUH~!!! Demand creates job.
No demand = no job creation;
Masses don't have money = no demand;
Rich people with more money = they hoard (save) it.
Masses with money = exponential demand = increase in job growth.
Fear of economic downturn (republican mantra) = less spending by the masses = increased job loss
That's economics 101 for your baby... straight facts, and if you dont understand it, keep repeating your republican talking points (it will make you sleep better at night being ignorant).
even when Republicans are the ones perposeing the 4 trillion. some jack leg republican that don't no his ass from a hole in the ground blames the democrats. is a wonder some people no how to get out of bed every morning.
I don't know about all the misquided statistics, but I do know most of my business revenues are down 25% from 07 and I've had to lay off quite a few really good employees. I don't see demand increasing, but I do see a government that wants to put more regulation and enforcement in my businesses costing me more money and requiring me to do more with fewer employees.
I can't help the ignorant, ya'll will just have to figure it out on your own.
For all those Republican blowhards and Tea Party individuals. The Republicans have shown their hand, they are not for smaller deficits and smaller government.
I have stated this before and will continue, what are the Republicans going to change that is different from the time they were in control of the government during the Bush Administration?
Hint------NOTHING!
Doctors take a Hypocratic oath. I guess the GOP take a Hypocritic oath.
these statements bear repeating: More: “Aides to McConnell said they have yet to receive a cost estimate for the measure. But the nonpartisan Congressional Budget Office recently forecast that a similar, slightly more expensive package that includes a full repeal of the estate tax would force the nation to borrow an additional $3.9 trillion over the next decade and increase interest payments on the national debt by $950 billion. That's more than four times the projected deficit impact of President Obama's health-care overhaul and stimulus package combined.”
so tell me again how the gop is for deficit reduction; or is it to hell with the deficit (and for that matter the country not to mention the middle class) if it helps the wealthy and the powerful?
What do you mean nonpartisan? The GBO only predicts numbers given to them so it always depends on who is giving the information so it is never nonpartisan. The DEMOS control the HOUSE they feed the INFO they want the GBO to review! How is that nonpartisan? Besides when in the history of America has the GBO ever been right bout anything. They have never once got the true cost of a GOV program. Not once! The problem I will say to the hard of hearing is not the amount of taxes! IT IS THE AMOUNT OF SPENDING! For the heard of hearing or the brain dead liberals. Stop spending you will not need more taxes. Is that to hard for Liberals to understand?
CBO........not GBO............the CBO is accepted as nonpartisan by most rational people. The GBO is a freudian slip on your part; GOP much?
The CBO does not only depend on the number and information given to them unless they are specifically given those parameters by the requester. They are truly an independent operation set up by Congress to ensure they get non-partisan evaluations. BY LAW they are required to independently score bills being considered by the legislative body.
Now, all that being said, Representative Paul Ryan asked to have his proposed bill scored by the CBO. This was not a bill that was under consideration by the full House or Senate so it did not fall under the rules that said they had to do an independent scoring. In fact, Rep. Ryan dictated the data they were to use and has been touting that score ever since.
HOWEVER (and it's a BIG however), the CBO decided to also score the Ryan bill in a more honest fashion that took all available data and forecasting parameters into account, including those Rep. Ryan specifically told them not to use. The finding was that the Ryan bill DID NOT reduce the debt or the deficit but actually increased both by many BILLIONS of dollars.
I have noticed a trend, lately, the right wing is trivializing the CBO as being to narrowly focused or only using data given to them. Both accusations are very far from the truth. The right wingers tried in the past to dismiss specific reports as wrong when they did not agree with them but now, since the CBO is showing everything they are saying or trying to do is actually bad for the economy, they are actually trying to trivialize the CBOs ability to even evaluate anything.
SBV:
Rhetorical question...and a good one. It answers itself. GOP is NOT for deficit reductions (see, e.g., Bush, George W.). They talk a good game, but hey...it's just talk.
Typical Liberal press lies. They fail to say it is the DEMOS that control the congress and most of them want the same measure and that the increase revenue from the economic growth could well offset the tax cuts and that the problem has never ever been the collection of taxes the problem has always been the SPENDING by the DEMOS. Any five year old knows you can not buy something from a store if you do not have the money to pay for it. The DEMOS keep making all these programs we simply can not pay for. The American people tell them we do not want them they ignore us and then force us to pay for them with more taxes. So we get poorer and they get bugger and we pay their salaries so they can take our money. NO MORE SPENDING CUT THE DEFICIT BY REDUCING THE SPENDING NOT BY RAISING TAXES ON ANYONE! No AMerican should pay one more dime in tax money until the Fed Govt agrees to cut 800 billion from spending. ANd rteduce the deficit back to 5.3 trillion dollars as it was before the DEMOS took control of the congress in 2007. GIVE US BACK THE MONEY YOU HAVE STOLEN!
Typical Liberal press lies. They fail to say it is the DEMOS that control the congress and most of them want the same measure and that the increase revenue from the economic growth could well offset the tax cuts and that the problem has never ever been the collection of taxes the problem has always been the SPENDING by the DEMOS. Any five year old knows you can not buy something from a store if you do not have the money to pay for it. The DEMOS keep making all these programs we simply can not pay for. The American people tell them we do not want them they ignore us and then force us to pay for them with more taxes. So we get poorer and they get bugger and we pay their salaries so they can take our money. NO MORE SPENDING CUT THE DEFICIT BY REDUCING THE SPENDING NOT BY RAISING TAXES ON ANYONE! No American should pay one more dime in tax money until the Fed Govt agrees to cut 800 billion from spending. And reduce the deficit back to 5.3 trillion dollars as it was before the DEMOS took control of the congress in 2007. GIVE US BACK THE MONEY YOU HAVE STOLEN! Sorry failed to do spell check I know how that makes the liberals crazy!
hey bilweeler: Creating GOV jobs dose not count moron we have to pay for them. That takes money out of the economy of the private sector because we have less to spend. This is the truth of Obama: And by the way the GBO only predicts based on what information they are given so what ever they say is always to be taken in light of who is feeding them the information. In other words totally meaningless. They have yet ever to be right about the real cost of any GOV program for example.
The number of people in the US. who are in poverty is set to increase on President Obama's watch, with the ranks of working-age poor approaching 1960s levels that led to the national war on poverty.
Obama has created an antagonistic environment with Business and Business will not hire for the uncertainty of the taxes and health care and regulations Obama is pushing that drives their cost up and prevents them from investing or even to consider adding new employees.
Wade:
Stimulus created a lot of jobs, not just government jobs. Try construction and autos for example.
Took money out of the economy? Hardly. It's basically borrowed money. A loan, if you prefer. You didn't pay a dime more in tax or any other cost. Of course, we have to repay it, but I guess your alternative would be that the federal government do nothing at all. No stimulus, no spending, no action whatsoever to create jobs. That actually sounds more like a GOP program.
I will grant you that government cannot, by itself, restore the economy to what we saw from 1994-2000. But neither can it accept the status quo. Recent polls should amply demonstrate that the electorate expects action, not abdication, from this administration.
In truth, there is more support for the stimulus than we are generally led to believe: http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2010/07/22/secretary-lahood-republic_n_655916.html
At any rate, I'd love to hear your solutions to unemployment. I don't see any in your post.
Finally, please note that I did not insult you in response. Your first line refers to me as a "moron." Name calling and insults do not advance the discussion.
Wade, the number of people living in poverty is going to increase because of the recession we are in, which has nothing to do with Obama. The bailouts and stimulus packages, passed by both Bush and Obama, helped the situation in the short term, not hurt. Businesses are not hiring because consumers are not spending, that is a simple fact and anyone who says otherwise are doing so to push an agenda.
Regarding the deficit, what do you propose cutting? You also like to keep saying our deficit is because of a democratic congress, when in fact the majority of the deficit is from policies in place before they took back the majority. The biggest being the wars in the Middle East.
I find it Amazing that even a brain dead liberal could argue that the 5.3 Trillion deficit Bush had before the DEMOS took control of Congress and pushed it in just two years to 8.7 trillion and then Obama comes in and two years later we have 15 trillion three times that of the Bushes 5.3 Trillion as some how anything other than DEMOS insanity.
One could argue because because we had let me see.
1. 9/11 that cost us 1.3 trillion
2. huracane Katrina 760 Billion
3. Two wars 878 Billion
4. Perscription aid to the seinors 356 Billion
That 5.3 trillion was to high. One could argue that. But how the hell can you compare that to 15 trillion under the DEMOS control. With no 9/11 the war in Iraq won by Bush already, no Katrina. Just spend spend spend.
I mean really even a brain dead liberal has to see that is insane.
Wade:
More name calling. Insults instead of arguments and facts. Not convincing.
wade, you are nowhere close to getting facts right.
edit: bilweeler beat me to the punch
Wade: For god's sake man, there is this thing called the internet. It is full of readily available information. Some of it is true, some of it is false. You have to crosscheck a lot of it. Stop watching "FAUX NEWS" and listening to Rush while out on your sales route.
Wade, you are trying to talk sense to liberal zombies, it won't work. Listen to MSNBC sometime and you see the liberal zombie version of the world. Logic, reason, reality just get in the way of liberal socialist dogma. The living dead do not care about common sense, they have no sense. The party that created the KKK now calls everyone else racists. The liberal Democrats hate America so much that they look down their noses at patriotism. We had war protesters demonstrating during the Bush administration. Now only the groups supporting the troops are on the streets. Democrats are the definition of hypocrits. This November say HELL NO to the destructive, hateful, divisive policies of the Democrats.
UncleSam-2242573 - Such misplaced hate based on lies and a superiority complex. It must be a sad life you live.
Wade-512031 - So much misstatement of factual data. $15 trillion? Really? Prove it, Wade.
STTS
how in the hell can you say won by bush already. the problem with you republicans is that you can't see past your nose.. unless it is give to the wealthy. the 15 trillion is the total amount we are in debt . this 15 trillion has been accumlated over several years . this is not totally anybody's debt . this debt been accumlated from all of congress es of all time not just republicans or Democrats. you need to go back to school or tune your TV to another station. the only brain dead in this country are you people that don't check up on the things you say are the fault of one party or the other. I don't like to hear anyone call me brain dead. I had rather be brain dead instead of stupid because brain dead can be fixed but you can';t fix stupid. as for the war just who brought our troops out of Iraq,dam sure was not Bush . you guys are something else if the liberals say the policies of bush are the problems then you say don't blame bush ,but if something goes right then you want to take credit for that . nothing but a hipocrite . I was pullin for everything to go good under Bush if he did good then we all did good . but you republicans say if it aint your way then it is wrong. if you had the sense that GOD gave a goose you would work with any President to help make this a better place to live . It is already the best country on earth,but it could be better.
you guys out there blame Obama for the bailout of wall street byut it was done before President Obama almost a trillion dollars . then President Obama gave us a stimolous pkg almost a trillion . but what both Presidest should have done was let the country go into a depression because that is where it was heading . the republicans bailout of wall street was the begining of the spending to get us back on level ground instead of over the clift that we were heading for. . as for having control of congress we can settle that here . from 1994 to 2006 the republicans had control of congress and what did they do they cut taxes then 2003they cut taxes again then Bush let the Insurance companies decide what they would pay for the seniors then let them put a donut hole they decide where they wouldn't have to pay for any medicine . but you still had to continue to pay your premiums. then they tell us we had to take it . the only thing good about the prescription coverage is it was better than nothing ,not much but better . the worse thing about this is none of this was paid for before it was implemented. DUMB asses
we have the teaparty which is nothing but the Republican party at its worsed .everytime a republican is asked what do we have to do to balance the budget ,the first thing out of their mouth is cut medicare and social security .this is not the government's money we pay for that every pay day . this has nothing to do with the budget . this is the peoples money that most of us has paid into all of our working life so we can live and get by?it is hard to live on the amount you get from social security. I no what the republicans want to use that money to give their rich buddies a tax break . when you see the party of the rich the GOP holding up tax cuts for small business who are and allways will be the backbone of our ecconomy. so they can give a tax braek to the wealthy then you no that they don't give a dam this country they just want its milk and honey and don't want to pay taxes. the GOP is not any good for 95% of the people in this country then we the middleclass still go and vote for them then there is something wrong with us . I have never voted for a Republican and never will . if I had a choice to vote for the GOP or the dog catcher to run our country I would vote for the dog catcher ,unless he is a Republican
Let's see here, the bad Republicans would deprive the government of 4 trillion by supporting the Bush tax cuts. Are the Democrats saying that they would put that 4 trillion to pay off part of the national debt? Or are the Democrats drooling over the prospect of spending that 4 trillion on more bailouts, cash for clunkers, more money down the Fannie Mae and Freddy Mac rat holes, or the wonderful "stimulus" pork plans. The only thing Democrats have been able to do is expand government employees, government programs, government spending, and government waste and inefficiency. Democrats hate capitolism, business large and small and especially the successful people who are rich. Democrats are "pushers" of socialism and have wet dreams of a communist state. I can't understand why Democrats hate the US so much.
what about the bailouts that the Republicans did . they bailout wallstreet and it is blaimed on Obama . the republicans claim that they are pysical conservtive when they spend more than the Democrats And they don't claim to be anything . well at least they are not hypocrites like the GOP. I am getting sick of hereing about the gop handleing money better it just depends if you are rih or not . they sure no how to give taxcuts to the rich. is this not the same thing tax cuts versus the stimolous just useing adifferant methoid . at least if you give a stimolous some of it will come back in the form of sales tax in my state. but if you cut their taxes nothing come back
So the rich will keep on getting richer and the poor will keep on getting poorer. Anyone with common sense knows that IF the rich create jobs they are sent overseas so they can pay lower wages and have bigger profits for their shareholders! Come on what is wrong with the picture here? I am from Kentucky and despise Mitch McConnell. Here they talk about being fiscally responsible and they want to add further trillions to the deficit more that Obama has. What a load of crap! Small businesses create jobs the VERY people they did not want to help. Some people like to be used and abused and the Republicans are laughing all the say to the bank with their big business cronies who could care less about the middle class!! Dummies just do not see it or more pathetic do not WANT to see it.
Once more...where's the outrage regarding the proposed mosque at ground zero? Again, just what I thought once it was revealed that a mosque was housed inside the World Trade Center prior to the September 11 attacks.
"FREAKIN HYPOCRITES," First Read, CNN, Fox News, Boehner, Cantor, McConnell, Palin, Limbaugh, Beck, Kyle, et al
you shut thier mouths didn't you
some where along this line of tax cuts the government has to have money to operate on . that is what the republicans are counting on and it is the reason they want control of our social security .to pay for all those tax cuts . to the weatlthy . I ask the same question Why does the rich need with a tax cut . they just take the money and put it in the stock market and make more . if it goes to the middleclass then it will go back into the ecconomy. not if the rich get their way .