Agree with you Pat. The silence from the "leadership" in the GOP is deafening. I suspect that the tacit response is consent. ...fear from the rabid TeaParty if they speak out against the radical "preacher" from Gainsville.

Hypocrits have no backbone for the principles that they wrap themselves around.....afterall, the principles only apply to them.....none others!

They sent a note to their offices and didn't get a reply. Sounds more like being ignored than a refusal to condemn. Basically all these politicians just ignor Olbermann. Keith just spins it that way.

Ray, this isn't a subject to be ignored. This is America and the GOP should stand up and say no to this, like they do everything else. Or is this acceptable behavior? If it's not, then say so. That's what LEADERS do.

The only thing I would disagree with Pat is; 'Republican Leadership'...

As far as I'm concerned there are WAAY too many clowns and NO Ringmaster for the Republican Circus!

I was contemplating that our fearless fascist leader would come out and defend the constitutional right to free speech as he did with his ground zero mosque first amendment admonishment.

But NOOOOOO!

Hypocrites!

it's acceptable bc it's allowed by our constitution. just bc you or i don't like it doesn't mean squat.

Hey man, what's up?

Nothing.

Oh, that's cool. Reaaaaal cooooooool man.

bboomer, I didn't know one single person who burned the flag. Not one. And I was from that era. And if somebody did burn the flag in front of me, friend or not, I would have walked away from that person, for good.

We all know that that "Pastor" has the right to express his opinion. BUT what about inflamming those who already hate us to do more hatred and violence to Americans? Is he trying to inflame those who want to see the United States falter?

I am ashamed that the GOP leaders are not standing up to this person. The GOP wants to lead this country....well lead!! If the GOP refuses to make a stand, they why should they be voted back into office? If their "leadership" is silence in the face of this affront to Islam, then God save this country if they get back into power. We will be fighting off insurgents on our shores in wave after wave! Talk about a tidal wave!!

Hypocrits have no backbone for the principles that they wrap themselves around.....

Hypocrits? Isn't it the left and the Democrats that pushes for free speech in our lives on a daily basis regardless of who it offends? Isn't it the left and the Democrats that speaks out in favor of gay marriage regarless of who it offends? Isn't it the left and the Democrats that speak out in favor of a womans right for an abortion, regardless of who it offends? Isn't it the left the Democrats that suppor building the Mosque so close to grownd zero it offends the families of those who died there? My point being, don't sit there and call the right hypocrits when the left is just as hypocritcal as the right here.

While I'm not really in favor of the church doing as it will further endager our troops lives in Afghanistan, I cannot completely condemn it either as we are all guaranteed free speech in this country regardless of who it offends! You can't have it both ways well, if Christians are offended, that's ok but don't offend Muslims becaus they might be offended and kill us?

Pat, the subject is not being ignored, just Olbermann. They have stood up. I saw three of those mentioned speak on the subject on Fox last nite and this morning. Again the subject is not being ignored, just Olbermann. Most of these politicians view him as a partisan crackpot and crank where won't get any objectivity. So they just ignor any communications from him. Therefore, you can't read anything into him not getting any response. The Republicans are just not responding to Olbermann, period. Many on the left do the same thing with Hannity and Beck. I would not read anything into the left not responding to those two. They just figure they aren't going to get a fair shake there either.

The Tea party was part of the counter culture in the 60's. The 70's were the drug culture and they forgot where they are.

Ray, this isn't about Keith. It's about the GOP and their lack of courage coming out and saying loud and clear that this behavior is unacceptable. Keith would have gladly read their comment on air. What, are these people only supposed to go on Fox when they have something important to say? Are they afraid Fox viewers wouldn't agree with them on this issue?

I absolutely would LOVE to defend his right to do this BUT, if it is going to affect those men and women who are over there right now risking their lives for all of us here, who are BTW comfortably enjoying the lives they protect....then I have to say that it is not IN any way shape or form...the same as burning a flag or building a community center that houses a mosque. If it were just a choice that happened to express an opinion that differs from others and was making a harmless statement then knock yourself out. But if you know it could engager our American soldiers then he should think twice. OR go ahead and burn the the Quran then hop his happy a$$ on a plane and go on over there to Afghanistan and stand with the same consequences our soldier are standing with because of his act. Now that would be a fun one for the media to cover.

C'mon, Pat. You want to talk about lack of courage you need not look farther than our POTUS. Based on recent actions, the only people that deserve to have their rights protected by our current administration are Muslims, illegal immigrants, unions, the New Black Panthers, and non-corporate entities. Where is the courage to step up and protect the rights of everyone equally?

Here's a crazy idea or two... Let's protect the citizens of AZ. Let's prosecute voter intimidation regardless of whether it is done by a black, white, brown , or green person. Let's work out a compromise that allows the mosque to be moved to a place less offending to the victims families of 9-11 while protecting the Muslim right to worship. Let's work with the business community on wall street to right the ship. Let's ask our president to live up to his campaign promise to "usher in a new era of b-partisanship". Yeah our POTUS has done a great job, if this were the special Olympics of politics where everyone is a winner.

Do I agree with burning of any religious book? No. Do I think they have a right to do it? Absolutely.

I would understand if all those GOP leaders chose to ignore Keith O.--they are not fans of his and vice versa I'm sure. I can see them not wanting to give Keith any publicity, etc. However, as of noon today we don't have general press releases from any of these people condemning the burning. What kind of leadership is this?

Steeler... I think they are taking a play from the dem playbook. They only make a move if it benefits them politically. They are all corrupt....dems and repubs. It's no different than the dems move on illegal immigration to go after AZ in place of protecting them. They are just trying to garner votes to increase their base to keep their jobs. That's all....nothing more.

The right to do something doe not mean it's the right thing to do.

Frankly, I see the issue as this- had the media not given this moron so much attention for his idiotic idea, no one but his 50 member church and the surrounding community would have been the wiser. He could have burned all the books he wanted without risking anyone's life in the process, but like always, the media loves a maniac because controversy makes them money. So if you want to blame anyone for endangering the lives our our soldiers, blame the media. One idiot with a stupid idea has no power. One idiot plus media attention is a recipe for disaster.

Bear in mind that many of these same Republican Congress members and other highly placed public officials had a great deal to say about the Terry Shiavo matter, which was much more a private matter than the burning of a religious book.

Jess, so now we're on to the immigration playbook. A playbook that was ignored for years and years and years and now all dumped on President Obama. What a joke. By the way, President Obama's record is better than GWB's on this issue.

Excellent post, Suzy!! I 100% agree.

Pat...I hate to burst your bubble, but it goes back way beyond Bush II. At the expense of being redundant, I'll say it again...

"They are all corrupt....dems and repubs."

Your view that all fault is that of one party is myopic and incorrect. If you want to blame someone to feel better, be honest, blame everyone involved. Each side blames the other and the truth is somewhere in between. People that blame only one side are spewing misinformation and should be called out on it. And yes...our President of the Unites States is a coward beholden to those special interests that got him elected. Just like Bush (if that makes you feel better)...

I would understand if all those GOP leaders chose to ignore Keith O.--they are not fans of his and vice versa I'm sure

I've heard this a lot lately, as it pertains to the Muslims, if they don't come out and vocally condemn Al-Qaida, then they must agree with what they are doing. I think the same rule should apply here.

If the GOP DOESN'T come out and vocally condemn what Jones is doing, they must agree with him with their silence.

Hey its freedom of Religion, or Freedom from Religion however you want to put it.

Why is it OK for a Muslim Imam to build a Mosque on Ground Zero ( I dont care what you say about it being two blocks away teh building was hit by one of the planes Landing Gear so it is G.Z) to express his views, but it is not ok for radical Christian to burn Copies of the Koran?

You cannot have it both ways.

Excellent post Jeramy. However, the generals concern is a valid one. I wish they wouldn't go through with it, but just like those idiots that protest soldier funerals because they think god hates gay American policies...they have the right to. It's a double standard, and it sucks...especially when politicians politicize it.

To those who say that President Obama and other Democrats should be speaking out against this--well, they are but to me one of the sad things about this is it shows the polarization of our country. This pastor wouldn't listen to any Democrat who spoke out against the burning. I'm not even sure he would listen to any Republicans, either but if Republicans spoke out loud and clear against this, at least the rest of the world would know that we as a nation do not support this man's lunacy.

The preacher has the right to burn the Koran. Should he do it? No. Should the Repubs condemn it? Yes. I would rather see them burning Islamic extremists, but that won't happen till the next crusades. Obams won't comment, because the wacko's would be calling him a Muslim again.

Amen, Steeler. (pun intended) ;)

Jeremy-you just answered your own question. You equated radical Christians with all Muslims. If it were terrorists that were planning the Mosque, than your comparison would work. This is just like Newt comparing these Muslims to Nazi's building something next to a Holocaust survivor monument. The comparison doesn't work, as these people had nothing to do with 9/11. It is apples to oranges.

SkepticalThomas, people were arrested for burning flags. There were laws against it and people said, "We don't think you should be able to be arrested for this. This is Constitutionally protected speech." The courts decided they were right. Now, people can burn flags. Doesn't mean that it isn't incredibly disrespectful. I certainly think people who burn flags are being disrespectful and it offends me, I just don't think they should be put in jail. That is what free speech means - can you be put in jail (or otherwise criminally punished) for the speech, not do people object to your speech.

The difference here is that no one that I have heard, certainly no government leaders, are suggesting that it is not their Constitutional right to burn the books or that they should go to jail if they carry out the burning. People are just saying that they're big jerks if they do this. And they are.

Good response Pat.

I was listening to "GOP propaganda radio" yesterday and was amazed how many of the talking heads and their listners support this pastor's right to burn the Korans.

True it is their constitutional right, BUT they are merely putting their idiotic opinions ahead of the well being of our troops.

I look at this the way I look at flag burning in IT is your right to do so, but when someone decides to exercise civil disobedience and kick your tail, you got what you deserved.

IF this guy goes with it and radical extremists violently target he and his church they reaped what they sew.

Unfortunately in this case their stupidity reflects on our country and puts additional risks on our brave troops who make the sacrifices for all our freedoms and not the nut job cowards within the church/cult.

And you sir/ma'am are a complete and utter idiot for even suggesting an American citizen should not exercise their right to demonstrate or protest or express themselves. A complete idiot!

I was driving by a military graveyard a few days ago with my son in the car. He pointed out the crosses to me and said, "look Dad, the regular white crosses are the American solders, and the ones that are not white, but stone colored are the French soldiers, and the ones with the other symbol on them are the Moslem soldiers from Northern Africa who fought alongside the Americans and French in Alsace Lorraine in WWII. Then I thought of the protest against the mosque in New York and got sort of sick. Then I went to visit some of my Moslem friends graves to apologize.

Salt,

you couldn't be more full of sh!t... the entire world knows that the libs are the stoners, thats likly whats wrong with most of them

What would Jesus do? It is very clear to me, either the Pastor doesn't know the Book of Luke or more possibly has found a way to fame.

Luke 6:27-36

[27] "But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, [28] bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you. [29] If someone strikes you on one cheek, turn to him the other also. If someone takes your cloak, do not stop him from taking your tunic. [30] Give to everyone who asks you, and if anyone takes what belongs to you, do not demand it back. [31] Do to others as you would have them do to you.

[32] "If you love those who love you, what credit is that to you? Even 'sinners' love those who love them. [33] And if you do good to those who are good to you, what credit is that to you? Even 'sinners' do that. [34] And if you lend to those from whom you expect repayment, what credit is that to you? Even 'sinners' lend to 'sinners,' expecting to be repaid in full. [35] But love your enemies, do good to them, and lend to them without expecting to get anything back. Then your reward will be great, and you will be sons of the Most High, because he is kind to the ungrateful and wicked. [36] Be merciful, just as your Father is merciful.

ouch Birdman. Did I pull a little too hard on the chain? Good thing you think the only good opinion is yours and those who think like you. I really regret serving this country for more than 21 years because of idiots like you who are soooo one sided and always right and always right to criticize others who don't think and act like you. You all make me ashamed and sick. I'll be glad when 2012 gets here. Hopefully the asteroid will hit this country first.

We keep hearing comparisons between 2 issues. If freedom of religion allows this mosque to be built, then freedom of speech allows this pastor to burn a book that is sacred to millions of people. Following the letter of the law, this statement is correct and prohibits our government from interferring with either act. I would call this a catch-22 that has happened many times in the past.

I believe that most patriotic and fair-minded citizens are more interested in the intent of the law and how it is used. How many of us honestly believe that this mosque is being built out of spite with intentions to harm the American people and her government? How many of us believe that it is being used as a wedge issue to further the careers of many politicians that wish to lead our country as they busily mislead it's people? Remember the key word here is "honestly" with no regard to political affiliation or pundits.

How many of us honestly believe that the actions of this "pastor" have anything to do with justness, righteousness or Christianity? No need to go into the many likely self-serving reasons for his actions. How many believe that his foolish book-burning will cause serious harm to those brave Americans most vulnerable? If I deemed his activity worthy, patriotic or just, I would defend his right to free speech to the max. Instead, I feel certain he serves only himself with no regard to the harm that may come to others.

Tolerance of Bad Behavior

When does the tolerance level for bad behavior become high enough for the Republican Party leaders to say enough?

Although bad behavior among politicians is as old as the hills, the past few years has really seen it raised to a level never before reached on an everyday basis. Starting during the 2008 election we have seen the following:

When Sarah Palin started on the national stage, she raised a few hackles with her nasty diatribes on then Sen. Barack Obama, questioning his loyalty to the country, spreading divisiveness with half truths wrapped in racial overtones……No GOP leader said enough

When Rush Limbaugh said after the Inauguration, “I want the President to fail”, there was no outcry, a couple of Republicans who criticized him were hastily walking their words back….No GOP leader said enough

When Rep. Joe Wilson cried out during a special address to Congress, “you lie” ……No GOP leader said enough

When Rep. Michelle Bachman calls the President anti-American and wraps herself in the Tea Party philosophy and gleefully encourages their ugly side…..No GOP leader said enough

When Fox, masquerading as a news outlet, allows and encourages its employees to undermine and insult the President in so many egregious ways…..No GOP leader says enough

Now, we have this lunatic Pastor Jones in Gainesville, Fl planning a Koran burning……NO GOP leader says enough

There are so many examples, it would take all day to list them and they continue everyday on state and local levels, publishing home addresses of those one disagrees with, mentioning using the 2^nd amendment to resolve issues.

When will enough be enough?

When, if the leaders don’t show the way, will the followers say enough, no more will I be identified with lies, hypocrisy, racism, greed and hate.

The craven silence of the leaders of the Republican is sickening and cowardly.

Remember this lack of leadership when you go to the polls in November, remember this tolerance for bad behavior diminishes all of us.

Chainpuller, Just because you served does not mean you are not a douchebag. Perhaps you should take advantage of your GI BILL and see if education might help you improve your bitter life.

If that does not work perhaps the VA can help you with your delusional way of thinking?

We must not subordinate liberty to the sensitivities of Mahound followers, regardless of the consequences. That's what having principles is all about. If our leadership is not willing to stand its ground on this issue, we need new leadership. The message is simple: Muslims can not impose religious dictates upon others.

What a bunch of bloatedness. I mean the fact that some blame all islam for a few radicals? And then some blame all americans for a single church's ambition to burn the koran?

Whatever

Leave extremism to extremists if they get out of line than take them out of the line.

In America you are supposed to be free to burn what ever religious items you posses and build whatever religious facilities you like. End of STORY. It is America for Americans. No matter your religious views. Follow the laws and pay your taxes.

It's hard to understand the Republicans with all their uber fake patriotism, isn't it? Only when they're in power?

To me this represents a threat to homeland security and this pastor, and his flock, should be warned that if there is an attempt to burn the Koran that they will be arrested or aiding and abetting the terrorists and thrown into Gitmo!

Enough of these nut jobs with their own narrow agendas, no matter who is hurt by them.

When Palin was talking about President Obama palling around with terrorists and inciting people to violence and hatred, that should have been considered not only hate speech, but treasonous. Between her, and the talk radio nuts, and the Republican leadership nuts, what a wonderful country we have become! Where is soldier McCain, the hero? What a bunch of losers.

Our infrastructure is falling apart, we can't keep up educationally, we farm all our jobs overseas yet are expected to be a consumer society, and the Repubs think we will believe that it will all be taken care of if we can just give the rich a further tax break. Bull puckey!

Thank you, Igloo. What a concept - tolerence, understanding, forgivness, acceptance of the differences among us.

I say the media should not go near that place on Saturday. That would defuse the entire situation. But that's way too much to hope for in this day and age of instant news, immediate information craving. Too bad - this guy and his unfortunate followers are getting way too much attention as it is.

Leave these people alone, pay no attention to them, and they will go away.

And the other thing I find appalling, even though I understand it, is that we all stand around sucking our thumbs instead of making such an uproar that we would drown out the nut cases.

It is my fervent desire that we have all just been resting, waiting for November, when we can drown it all out then with our votes.

Just as the libs say its ok to build a mosque near ground zero and stand behind the constitution to do it, then by the same token, this pastor has the same right. WHO is the hypocrite? You cant have your cake and eat it too!

I am not saying he is right or should do it, but perhaps we take offense to public beheadings of Americans, public slashing of throats, public stonings, or public burning of the American flag. Why is it that we must continue to bow down to the muslims, but they never bow down? This is America and Americans should stand up for America, not run around apologizing for America as our president does.

Dear Pat,

The silence will be deafening when the party who has poured gasoline on the fire consuming this country gets tossed out on their collective butts. Welcome to irrelevance.

The silence of conservatives over the ignorant, fanatical actions of a tiny misguided church in Florida is no more defeaning than the silence of liberals when Christians by the thousands are imprisoned, tortured and/or murdered in other parts of the world.

That said, I hope the media will heed Secretary Clinton's appeal to ignore the planned Quran burning...

and I hope it will be ignored with at least as much righteous indignation as when they ignored the murder of 10 Christian aid workers in Afghanistan, the shooting of a Christian pastor as he left his church in Degastan and the severing of a young Christian professor's arm in India. In case these events are all news to you, they're just a handful of the ignorant, misguided atrocities committed against Christians in Muslim countries every day. These few occurred this past July and August.

First, aren't Christians supposed to "love their enemies?"

Secondly, knowing that burning the religious texts of a faction that we are at war against, will probably result in increased deaths of Americans, isn't this rather un-patriotic?

Thus, this pastor's plans are un-Christian and un-patriotic.

Cathy M,

You are absolutely correct, this particular burning of the Korans must be seen as Aiding and Abetting the Enemy in that it is making perfect propaganda material for them. The fact that they would be allowed to by our Government, which few of the Muslims from that part of the world understand to begin with, would look like our Government sanctioned it. Jones SHOULD be stopped by our military, the FBI or the CIA/Homeland Security, and told that burning the books would amount to Treason as it would give material gain, in the way of Media Coverage as propaganda to the Taliban and Al Qaida.

While our Constitution gives people the right to Religious Freedom, it does NOT give us the right to Intentionally put our Military in greater danger with a brash publicity stunt designed to inflame the hearts and minds of the enemies AND friends that we have in those regions. This is Wartime, and as many Reubs have said about other subjects, some things MUST be looked at differently during war. Such a move as burning the Koran could lose us great volumes of support and turn people who would have sat on the sidelines into determined fighters against us. Such an action would cement the hearts and minds of MANY Muslims against us as Infidels and fan the flames of Jihad against us.

While I support the Right to Religious Freedom and the Freedom of Speech, this act would go way too far into the realm of Aiding and Abetting the Enemy during the time of War and MUST be looked at in that light. In fighting a war you do NOT hand more weapons to the enemy to be used against you.

The silence from the conservative right is the same as assent in that if they do not speak out against this travesty, then they tacitly accept it and should be held responsible for that fact as well!

bird I will say this for you. You are as dumb as it gets. I hope I dream of you tonight! BTW, I would never even consider using a GI Bill or the VA for anything I can pay for myself. FYI: Both of my masters were obtained while on active duty in the United States Air Force. IF you are an American, then I hope you print and show to your family the trash you spew towards a fellow American just so you can try to look big on the web. Tell you what I can offer. My address is 116 Penmoken Park, Lexington, KY 40503. Pay me a visit some time and be sure to mention this blog. We'll have a beer before I spank you.

Ijust dont understand why the musalims are pushing to build this mousque and our pres says they can because it;s their property so how can anyone stop this man. this is a man standing up to the gov.screw the mus.if they want to push this thing.its already proven that the developer is a slum lord and cant even take care of the properties he is renting to americans.somtimes you have to fight fire with fire.

The GOP is singularly assessing how they can monopolize the issue and benefit from it. Everyone is recounting the overall attack vectors the GOP has been employing since the Obama Administration started work.

@bboomer #1.4

I don't think our current government leaders (establishment as you accurately call them) were part of the counter culture of 40 years ago. They were most likely what we called L-7 (spelled with fingers form a square for the youngsters in here). Good point though!

One very important Republican spoke out: Glenn Beck.

That guy's as slippery as an eel, but technically, he spoke out against this.

They are just wise to the libs set ups, so they aren't giving them anything to throw in their face, but alas, you do anyway. Let the lib administration handle the problem they are the power now. Tell OBO the clown to go there. They don't listen to anybody anyway. Bunch of backstabbing liars. They didn't listen to anybody about the health care so screw them. I can't believe Hitlery Clinton isn't suing this guy and putting him in front of the UN.

And someone in the media will cover the event.

I hope this pastor does not go through with this though. Idiot

This guy's probably not only put American troops overseas in danger, he's probably putting his congregation in danger too. That effigy that was burned had his face on it, I'm sure some freak extremist will target his following too.

That pastor is an idiot.

Hilary and our government are "worried" about a guy who is going to burn a book but they are not

alarmed at the Imam's statements about Islamic extremists? Below is what he said.

The imam behind a proposed Islamic community center and mosque near ground zero cautioned Wednesday that moving the facility could cause a violent backlash from Muslim extremists and endanger national security.

If the Imam is wholly disconnected from extremists, such as Hamas, then he needs to stop speaking for them and let them speak for themselves. The Imam is definitely acting as a mouthpiece for the terrorists and is subtly threatening America.

Islam knows no boundaries between church and government and most Islam countries, if not all, do not support freedom of expression nor freedom of religion. Islam, in it's core teachings, is not a peaceful religion. That doesn't mean all Muslims support violence but we had better tread wisely and not allow the "fear factor" to drive our decision making.

In other news, terrorist insist that if Americans continue to breathe oxygen and swallow saliva that it will incite violence. The Democrats are working on a plan that would stop anyone from ever perpetrating these egregious and unjust acts by insensitive Americans.

my impression is that these are savage people with the IQ of a flea

Now Pat... why give fleas a bad name...? lol

Didn't ya hear... bed bugs are the new craze'

On another note... the 'troll bridge' is now open... STS

So the mom ask the son” why did you jump into that mud puddle” The son replies “because everyone else was doing it”

Or in other words two wrongs do not make it right.

And another way to look at it is “he hit me first” Eye for an Eye, tooth for a tooth.

Least us not forget the Hatfields and McCoys.

Feisty is on a roll. Thanks for your comments.

The pastor's constitutional rights ended when his planned action will cause the endangerment to the lives of our military and ordinary citizens. He is aiding the cause of all extremist who want to do harm to America. This will boost recruitment for them.

So why is the GOP silent? They hope this will increase terrorist attacks and then they can sit back and say "See? The Democrats can't protect you!"

@laughing; I suspect you are one of those who think they can decide when a Constitutional right ends or begins? As for the GOP or republicans in general, if olber is your only source of info then you truely are sheltered. Most have spoken out against the burning. They just have not spoken to olber. And do you really think anyone wants terrorists to attack? You're a sick, sick puppy.

@salty; Leave my family out of it. We like a good fight.

@yourchainpuller; I stand by my statement. At the time it was written, it was accurate. I look at many different sources. If it happens to match Olbermann's or heaven forbid Beck's, then so be it. Most have spoken out? I doubt it. It would make universal headlines if the Rebublicans agreed with with the Democrats. When your actions imperil the lives and safety of others, then yes, you have chosen to give up your rights.

Hope I never get banned. I just try to have some fun with the right wing extremists. I’m convinced that their problem is eating too much red meat. The country would be better off if they would all change their diets to fish and lots of vegetables. Cut down on the heart attacks too.

No such thing as too much red meat. Besides, if we stopped eating the cows then the world would be overtaken by the greenhouse gasses and we would not want global warming and mad jihadists at the same time, would we?

Let us not forget that Reagan tripled the national debt and Bush doubled it with nothing to show for it except the worst recession since the depression. Republicans are for a balanced budget except when they are in power.

JimS-459172

"Let us not forget that Reagan tripled the national debt and Bush doubled it with nothing to show for it except the worst recession since the depression. Republicans are for a balanced budget except when they are in power."

Remember the national debt like may other things is a lagging indicator. Reagan cut spending & raised taxes resulting in a large drop in the national debt beginning just as he was leaving office. What did Clinton do?

like taping the sounds in an airport restroom and playing it back.

I just LOVE it when the righties speak from personal experience... Larry is that YOU?

they will find recruitment tools whether these guys burn these books or not.

And this behavior helps, how? As someone on Think Progress said, "the 2008 election was about Country First per John McCain, when in actuality, it's about Party first."

Let's not confuse burning of our flag by our citizens (a protected First Amendment right, even though I personally don't agree with it) with our citizens burning the sacred book of millions throughout the world (including some of our fellow citizens). They have the right to do this but is it wise? Does it help our troops? Does it further our interests as a nation?

Steeler Fan-380417
Let's not confuse burning of our flag by our citizens (a protected First Amendment right, even though I personally don't agree with it) with our citizens burning the sacred book of millions throughout the world (including some of our fellow citizens). They have the right to do this but is it wise? Does it help our troops? Does it further our interests as a nation?

You are right, lets compare apples to apples..

the Pastor buring the Kuran is no differen then a Afgani-muslim burning our flag.

The Pastor pisses off millions of Muslims, some who are Americans, the Afgani burning the American should piss of EVERY American, at last count that was a few hundred million people.

Why would anyone ask if they think it's wise? Doesn't that make you look like a complete idiot?

I haven't read any comments of people wanting to stop them from burning the Koran. As far as I can tell, people don't WANT them to do it, because it makes America look no better than Iran. They can burn whatever they want for all I care, but they're sticking both feet in the mouth by doing it.

ltp, you're a stone cold, right wing idiot. You want to give these radicals one more reason to attack us or our troops??? Really??? Whether this pastor and his flock have the right to burn the Koran is immaterial. Rather, it has everything to do with enflaming the passions of those who already hate us. Open your mind, moron!!! On second thought, that is probably asking way too much of you. You might as well just go back to watching your GOP (Grand Obstructionist Party) TV, aka FOX Noise.

I bet if some religion said they were burning bibles on saturday you libs wouldn't give a crap and neither would Hitlery Clinton. The Bible is sacred too, not just the Quran. The only reason why they shouldn't burn it is for our troops sake.

You have to be brain dead to believe that.

could you write anymore overused stupid anti conservative cliches in one sentence? it REALLY makes you sound smart....

That is right. Anything anti left or negative to Obama is hate speech. Of course, the left is the author of hate speech legislation to band any speech it considers hate.

Fox is nothing but hate. Sprinkle in some racism and a few raving idiots like Hannity and Becky, and you have a complete cast of A-holes. And don't forget Dick Morris, the over inflated GOP yes man.

Maybe they over used the DNC talking points on FOX, but noone can honestly say that FOX is anything more than a outlet for GOP propaganda. They should have just named it RUSH.

The media has its issues to be sure, BUT the GOP has a bigger issue in it's inability to see the truth. The truth is they talk about fiscal conservative principles, BUT what so many of them are is nothing more than social conservative facists.

First rule of being a facist is controlling the media. Impossible in America so they created FOX, and dominate the AM airwaves with RUSH, BECK, and others that promote their ill-guided extremists views.

This "pastor" is an extreme religious fanatic using dangerous tactics as he calls himself a Christian. He is sure to attract extreme religious fanatics that will retaliate with dangerous tactics as they call themselves Muslims. All of them shame the religion they abuse to further their own agendas. All of them are terrorists that threaten civilized men and peace.

Show me an incident here in the United States where a group of Muslims got together and burned bibles and churches. Sure, you can Google plenty of incidents...except they're happening in other countries.

Perhaps you can answer me a couple of questions:

1. Do we really want to lower ourselves to the level of other countries? "They're burning The Bible in Gaza so let's burn The Quran here!" Yeah, that's what we need...to be like other countries.

2. How will burning The Quran serve to honor those who died on 9/11? If you told the victims, "You're going to be killed by terrorists and we will avenge you by burning books," would they approve?

Do these jokers have the right to burn The Quran? Yes...just as I have the right to think they're making arses out of themselves for doing it.

The same goes for burning the flag...you have the right but I have the right to think you're an arse for doing it.

jmmosson

We are better than them.

Why get down to the level of uneducated, impoverished, and desperate people in other countries?

Their lives are hell, ours are not. We can uphold our values and show the world what it is to be American. We stand for freedom of religion.

@Da Noid...Excellent points...I think that we have been so overwhelmed (especially in this country) with 10,000 versions of one story that we don't know our head from our a&&...people need to wake the heck up and look at facts...and when you do, then you can stay above the insanity...having a right and the right thing to do should be synonymous...but they are not...

Its all about attention...let them have it...at the end of the day not all attention yields good response...I think I read that his church has like 50 members..he clearly sees this a a way to grow that membership...nicer car and bigger profits...

I don't think that we should force people like this to be silent...in today's society you need to know where people stand so you can make the informed decisions to not support those establishments that are out of line with your views...forcing them to be silent only allows them to operate under the radar and do things to you in secret...Not Good.

1. Do we really want to lower ourselves to the level of other countries? "They're burning The Bible in Gaza so let's burn The Quran here!" Yeah, that's what we need...to be like other countries.

Why not? the left wants to lower ourselfs and be like other countries in health care and social programs. Again cant have it both ways.

Jeremy

Someone like you can't get any lower. And we can have in both ways. It's just idiots like you that slow down the progress.

Where was Ms. Clinton? Probably, HERE IN AMERICA. There is no international law which states that nobody in the universe can ever burn an American flag.

Even if it was manufactured in China.

Christians have:

1. Burned "witches" at the stake

2. Sent opponents to the gas chambers

3. Sexually abused small children/ and or/ allowed those who have to go unpunished.

4. Participated in the genocide and cultural annihilation of Native peoples.

5. Had leaders who claimed to be holier than others until its revealed they stole money,cheated on their wives, and engaged in homosexual acts, while condeming gays etc.

6. not followed the core teachings of Jesus Christ, but continue to flaunt His name.

I would hope the American muslims will have a bible burning of their own. Lets show the world we really do have the freedom to do it.

>And if you check his, you will see prior to Muhammad, the Middle east flourished in mathematics, sciences and medicine… And look at them today….. Just saying

I sounds like you are referring to the muslim golden age which lasted for 500 years and started after the time of Mohammed. Get your history straight and don't just listen to your own predjudices.

Amy B. Portland, ME

Ad-hominem attack much? The guy stated WHAT THE KORAN SAYS. Nothing you wrote has any base in Christian texts. Men will always commit crimes - but whether or not a religious text SANCTIONs it are two different things.

I swear - you lefties had better pay attention. You are only 20 percent of the populace. (And falling - after all you have very few loyalties ... as in 'no loyalty to the constitution').

None of you see a problem with an elected/appointed official using their position of power to intimidate a citizen from exercising his rights?

- instead you go along with the 'invalidation' of the First Amendment based on some unwritten social authoritative by an appointed official?

And you folks on the left don't see yourselves as the center of these issues? You have no backbone and no standard of consistency on your point of views?

Build a Mosque at ground zero? OOOOHHHH... they have a RIGHT to do it - even if its morally wrong we can't stop them, so we will SUPPORT ITS CONSTRUCTION BASED ON A RIGHT. But hey... that guy burning the Koran ... OOOOOH he has a RIGHT to do it - but we WILL CONDEMN THE PASTOR REGARDLESS OF HIS RIGHTS.

Yeah... 20 percent and DWINDLING. You lefties won't have a political pot to piss in when this cluster f*ck comes to fruition.

Actually, Andy, the Midlle East world flourished in mathematics, sciences and medicine after Muhammad. The Muslim world and it's, at the time superior, culture and education system is how the philosophy and science of ancient Greece was preserved and transmitted into European culture in the Renaissance. A repressive Catholc church is what was stifling science and medicine in the Middle Ages.

@Rich S-1900127: Following the sack of Baghdad in 1258 (more an obliteration than anything) by the ravenous Mongolian hordes under the generalship of Hulagu Khan, the death of the Abbasid Caliph who dwelt in the city marked the beginning of the end for the Golden Age of Islamic civilization. Continued invasions by Mongols and Turks throughout the area disrupted the Caliphate much in the same way early Muslim invasions decimated and disrupted the original Patriarchies of Catholic Rome.

Take heed: although one traditionally associates the Turks with Islam, one must do well to remember that the Turks did not convert fully until after the establishment of the Ottoman Empire. Indeed, one could say that the penchant for retributive violence endemic to modern-day Islam is a cultural leftover from this period of Turkish and Mongolian invasion, resettlement and conversion.

In many ways what the Muslim world suffered at that moment in history is akin to the fate that awaited Europe with the hastened crumbling of the Western Roman Empire following the heinous murder of Hypatia some years after the torching of the Serapeum in 391 and the combat between Flavius Aetius and Atilla the Hun at the Catalaunian Fields in 451. There are always blows from which civilizations may never recover - or take an incredibly long time to do so by the human reckoning.

BSFilter...are you nuts???

Andygrd: It's clear you've never read the Koran. All these accusations of yours, although true, have come from fundamentalist Muslims. This has gone on for fifty years.

You're condemning an entire religion for the actions of a fringe group. It's the Taliban that's responsible for all these heinous acts of stoning, assassination, beheading, and terrorism.

All the rest of you, it's not a mosque at Ground Zero, it's a community center. I so wish that people would get it straight in their heads.

Clearly Amy B. in Portland doesn't know how to use her brain but loves to mouth off. Comparing the "teachings" of one religion with the "actions" of humans is far from appropriate or even thought provoking. I am sure you patted yourself on the back for that stinging slam against Christianity although really you just showed your lack of knowledge.

Clearly Peridot doesn't understand reality either - there is a mosque in it. If I built a prison and surrounded it with a community center it would still be considered a prison. I do not know of a church that does not have a “community center” in it. See if you can get that straight in your head. By the way fundamentalist Muslims have been around A LOT LONGER than 50 years. . .

By the way. . .where are all the Muslim nation's leaders speaking out against violence? I bet you would have a hard time being able to name 5 that specifically condemned the actions of terrorists and tell their people to turn away from anyone who is or supports extremism. You can find a lot of "sorry for your loss" and/or "well it is your own fault" . . .not so much "this is absolutely wrong and no one that worships here will have those kinds of beliefs supported"

Absolutely, Peridot. You took the words out of my mouth!

This is about religion and wanting to bring about "The Apocalypse". Why would anyone speak out against an act that they believe is for God's glory? It's insanity at it's most extreme.

A preacher with a gun....

Radical Christianity, meet Radical Islam.

May you BOTH perish.

Resbot Nermo - of all the great arguments I've read surrounding this topic, Yours has been hands down the best. Thank you for sharing it!

Seeing that the so called leaders of the GOP are such a shy lot about this situation maybe we could do this:

Remove his tax exempt status, whatever happened to separation of church and state.

It is outrageous this little fly blow of a 'church' can turn the world on its ear and not have to pay a price of sorts. How shortsighted those are who side with this lunatic, when there is an immenent danger to our troops overseas. This should not be a Right or Left issue, we should stand together in solidarity for America's principles and values, to do less endangers all our safety.

Gingerbread Mamma

Values?? What values. This country is on its way out quick. Give Soros another 5 to 10 yrs.

Iran, apparently.

No "Muslim President" jokes, please.

Who's "they"? The terrorists on the planes, who died too?

all america hating terrorist who crash planes into buildings and kill themselves are dummys and cannot be god fearing nuff said

Unfortunately, burning Qurans in this case will kill people. It is a senseless act aimed at inflaming violence throughout the Muslim world. That, in all likelihood will get people killed. Probably American soldiers. It never pays to fight hate with hate. All sides end up losing when that happens.

Burning copies of the Koran instigates further violence when we should be trying to stop it.

Is there an epidemic of Bible-burning in this country of which I am not aware?

General Petraus has asked the church NOT to burn the Koran. Is General Petraus too "lefty" for you?

This isn't really a lefty/righty issue, is it? It's more like an intelligence vs stupidity issue. There are some terrorists in the world that hate America and they happen to be Muslim. So a preacher who knows nothing burns a book considered holy by billions of people in retribution. Those billions live in countries that don't have a Bill of Rights and have no understanding of ours. They see a Quran burning as sanctioned by our country because we did not stop it. It's not right that they do, but it is reality. And that perception harms America.

Along with the rights we hold as citizens of the US, we also have responsibilities. This pastor has a responsibility as an American to not condemn an entire religion because of the actions of a few.

You have that right, Jon.

This isn't bigotry; this is democracy - in action. The protesters of the mosque, like those of the 60's and the Rev. have/had the right to protest. However, there are consequences for protesting - depending on the situation.

Our democratic principles allow Muslims the freedom to worship and to build a place for worship, like all other Americans, and Obama was restating that principle when he spoke out. That's what leaders do. Hillary certainly recognizes the right to protest but now she is speaking out in hopes that common sense will prevail; she is concerned about the well-being of our troops and the tension caused in a very unstable part of the world.

This radical Florida cleric (that's the term used about Middle East religious leaders) seems to forget about our troops. They deserve not only our respect and our thanks, they also deserve our concern, support and protection. The Rev. shows his disregard for the troups in his hell bent charge to demonstrate his lack of good sense - and his right to act stupid.

Where are the flag-waving leaders of the right on this issue?

I was there during "desert storm", so I know the story, I was also told to watch my back in a fox hole. My point is he has every right to do what he wants, thats democracy as you said, I would hope logic kicks in. I am offended when obama and his legal team go after him, looking for any act to threaten him with for excersising his rights, It seems every obama supporter wants to slam the republicans for a no response, perhaps they took the advice they gave obama, "try to stay out of it"

He may be wrong morally by everyones opinion, but in the end, its his right. It seems there is a double standard when it comes to this administration. Both cases are legal by law, but morally not. Thats not my call.

More and more each day, it appears to me the government seems intent to protect foreign citizens more then the rights of our citizens. This is desturbing, ie, illegal immigration and now this.

Thank you for your service,,I definitely came back from Desert Storm with a different view on Freedom,,,so many have gave their lives to protect the rights of Americans to do some really dumb things, burn the US Flag, burn Bibles, burn Korans, but under no circumstances does the America I served cower to terrorost threats,,,I thought I would never see the day when Americans would be terrified of exercising their freedom of speech because of the American Government and foreign enemies,,,The Statue of Liberty, needs to close both eyes to the America we have become, and to all the vets who have ever served, I hope the country we have now stays worthy of your sacrifices, I am having my doubts--- US Army 10 years Desert Storm Vet,,,1/41 Inf 2AD(fwd)

323232 and Bill: Thank you both for your service. You certainly bring an important perspective to this discussion.

by Wisconsin Voter-530116 "she is concerned about the well-being of our troops and the tension caused in a very unstable part of the world."

LOL! what planet are you from and what liberal biased news channel have you been watching? hillary is concerned with one thing and one thing only; the agendas of the liberal democratic party! which are: 1. getting reelected, and 2. taking working peoples money and giving it to people who dont! neither hillary nor her worthless husband has ever cared less about the military!

No one is proposing the construction of a "9-11" mosque, and I wish people would become more informed before making such claims.

There IS a proposal to build a community center that will serve multiple needs of those who choose to visit the center. Included in that community center will be a "prayer room," no differently than there will be a swimming pool, janitor closets, meeting rooms, a library, et al.

Let's be informed, and let's not be part of the radical incendary masses who have no tolerance for anyone UNLESS they are like the same intolerant people.

Is that so called "prayer room" open to ALL religions? If so do they plan on not having any candles and statues in the building, because I am Baptist and we dont bow to statues nor do we light candles or any other crazy religious cult like behavior?

Muslims don't use statues. Good eye.

USA - Is that so called "prayer room" open to ALL religions?

The answer is actually yes. The community center will now include Chistian, Jewish, and I believe Hindu proyer rooms as well. As an educated person you are aware that the Muslim faith does not allow any artwork that depicts humans or animals. Hence, they get all of those nice carpets and mosaics with abstract plant designs. So you probably don't have to be worried about bowing down to statues.

I did not state that Muslim faith bows down to statues but Hindu/budda religion does and so does the Catholic faith. So there will different prayer rooms? can you site a link that shows the blueprints for this building, because as of yet they have not even announce who will be footing the bill for this culture center.